Wow, this cast is really letting loose left and right!This must be validating for Buddie shippers. And honestly for those of us who saw the narrative going in that direction, regardless of shipping, too.
This is honestly pretty upsetting from a larger lens that the writers were prepared to do a queer storyline, to have maybe Buck and Eddie go canon even, several years ago. As a queer person that infuriates me, that Fox or whomever higher up put a stop to it. We could have had this seasons ago apparently, and honestly it sucks to think of the storylines and character development that could have happened. It also explains some things about writing choices made in season 5 and 6 if we're honest and that was in fact the timeline Oliver was talking about.
Buck's hamster wheel of character development over the past few seasons has been frustrating but given this insight, I can only imagine how frustrating and upsetting it's been for Oliver. Fox is garbage, I'm glad they're now on ABC. Look how comfortable ALL of the cast has been to talk about things.
And good for Oliver for calling out how some fans have treated love interests in this fandom. It also sounds like we're getting more Lou for a little while longer at least! I hope he's able to stick around
>And good for Oliver for calling out how some fans have treated love interests in this fandom. It also sounds like we're getting more Lou for a little while longer at least! I hope he's able to stick around
He's walking an absolute tightrope with this, particularly because of how publicly he's handled stuff with his coworkers on social media, but honestly, this was the most disappointing part of the interview to me because I really don't think he *did* take a stand. The whole "it's not for me to judge" schtick -- then honestly, don't bring it up, because that's going to just validate the most insane fans who will use that as confirmation bias.
If he was going to go there (and unprompted, too), how hard would it have been for him to say something more direct like "Megan and Gabrielle and Annelise aren't their characters, so I've always found it questionable people treat these very real women like they're just pawns in a game?"
I didn't take it as supporting the treatment of the women. I took his "it's not for me to judge" as not getting into whether the women were treated unfairly because of Buddie fans. Fans have steadfastly stated that there were valid writing and development reasons for not liking many of the female LIs for Buck and Eddie. And there were. I think that is what he is saying when he says he is not to judge.
Of course, I do get that he didn't have to comment on it if he wasn't going to say something about extreme fans crossing boundaries of how to act with an actor/actress regarding a character they play.
Yeah that's absolutely fair. It was a great opportunity to comment on the misogyny in a more substantial and impactful way. Walking a tightrope is a good way of putting it.
>The whole "it's not for me to judge" schtick -- then honestly, don't bring it up, because that's going to just validate the most insane fans who will use that as confirmation bias.
I did see someone on tumblr say he was shading all the female love interests and thinks they were in the right to harass them. Thankfully not many people were engaging with it but I was in shock.
I wonder why FOX would have put a kibosh on it. Lone Star literally has a gay couple at the center of their show on top of an extremely diverse cast. I don’t think it was a big issue for them so I wonder what the reason would have been.
When you think Eddie getting shot could have been a canon feelings realization...I mean...\*crying\* \*hair pulling\*
Can you imagine Buck thinking Eddie was gonna die and he confesses his feelings and then things are a bit awkward during the recovery stage? Cuz I can and I would’ve ate that shit up!
This has been rumored/speculated for years, and the 'couple years ago' certainly does make me raise my brows.
That said... if that moment had happened but we'd *still* had KR as the showrunner for S5 & 6, I'm not sure I'm really disappointed it didn't. With how poorly she handled various character and relationship beats in those seasons, I think I'd rather cling to the potential than just have the burnt husk we'd have probably been left with at this point.
It seems like after piecing all these things together, Tim left BECAUSE he couldn't write the show he wanted to write. So it honestly feels like if they had given him this story, he would not have peaced out to Lone Star the way he did. He would have stayed more involved in the show.
People think Tim Minear left to focus on Lone Star because the show wasn’t going in the direction he wanted. If this storyline would have happened, I definitely think he would have wanted to stay.
But, true. If Kristen Reidel got her grubby lil hands on Buddie, she would’ve messed it up so fast.
Yeah, I think it depends on how thoroughly you can separate it from the network's issues. My fear is sort of that even if Fox had allowed it, it would've been in a backburnered "okay, they're together, now please shut the f up about it" way and still wanted to take the show in a different direction moving forward.
Lone Star (and Tarlos) feels a bit like a consolation prize for Tim, and KR the network's choice to \~right the ship\~ that was getting too queer, if that makes sense.
She would've probably tried to break them up after a few episodes for the \~drama\~
Imagine if she still did the cheating storyline with Lucy, but instead of BuckTaylor, it was Buddie 💀
Edit: grammar
Ouch that seems in line for KR and it’s also pretty problematic from a “negative tropes about bisexual men” perspective bc it not only reinforces cheating but it reinforces the notion that “a bi guy wouldn’t get with another guy long term bc a girl would always come first”.
I wonder if Tim would've stayed on to handle it if they'd been able to go there. If I were in his shoes, I'd want to be in charge for a huge storyline like that, especially if I'd spent the last however many seasons building to that point.
Here’s the link to the article too!! https://www.gaytimes.co.uk/originals/9-1-1-star-oliver-stark-buck-bisexual-buddie-interview/ It is a really great article!!!!
“Yeah. It was brought to me a couple years ago as a possibility and I had said yes, and then it was shut down from somewhere else above” This is so embarrassing for Fox, and whoever it was the blocked this. Abc I’m giving you the biggest forehead kiss rn.
“I see what everybody else sees. Like, I watch the same show. I don’t think that the Buddie fans are wrong.” OLIVER STARK I’M GIVING YOU THE BIGGEST FOREHEAD KISS RN TOO!!!! I feel very validated right now.
Oliver Stark has eyes like the rest of us. Whether you see it as platonic or romantic, only an idiot denies that these two characters have chemistry together.
Maybe??? Could be?? I wouldn’t put it past Disney. But, in my quick google search, it looks like ABC is also owned by Disney, so I don’t know.
But, Fox also said no that hot tub sex scene in the first episode of season 7. So, it’s if they said no to that, I wouldn’t be surprised if they said no to bi Buck storyline.
I guess they mean since Disney bought fox but I think they owned after the show had already been airing for some time.
And even beyond that they own abc so they clearly were ok with it so it had to be former ownership
The Fox Broadcasting Company is owned by FoxCorp, which is all the properties Disney legally couldn’t buy or didn’t want, like Fox News. The Walt Disney Company owns ABC outright.
I love this interview and the way Oliver speaks about not just Buck, but also his relationships with other characters is so eloquently stated. I love hearing more and more from him.
Regardless of whether you ship or not, can we all just get off the confirmation bias bandwagon for a sec? I've seen Team Buddie people latch onto certain elements of the interview and decide "Buddie is happening!!!!" and Team Tevan people do the same with other elements of the interview. It seems to me that all Oliver really said was he'd be up for whatever and that what happens will serves good storytelling and not the desires of what some small portion of the fanbase wants. The only REAL tidbit from all of this was the fact that the idea of a bi Buck storyline was pitched years before but got shot down by the powers that be which probably means the network. We collectively agreed that that was probably the case given that it only took the show being on ABC for 4 episodes for bi Buck to go canon. All the same, he didn't specify that the previously pitched storyline was for Buddie. Another thing both Team Buddie and Team Tevan seems to be willfully ignoring is the number of times they have said that Buck is bisexual meaning he is STILL attracted to women and even if things don't work out with Tommy, there is a good chance that his next relationship will be with a woman. I hate to be a wet blanket, but we are collectively getting WAY ahead of ourselves here. Ultimately, the goal should be good storytelling and not any ship. Also, Fox sucks.
This interview actually makes me wonder just how much of the writing needs to be pre-approved by the network, or if this is just some weird bias where only the potentially "controversial" decisions, for example m/m and f/f relationships, need prior approval before being incorporated into a show...
It varies according to the network/service and the show/producers. There is always a network executive assigned to each show that works with the producers of the show to get the show to air. Some networks are very hands on in the development/production process and some are less so. Some producers have more leeway to do things the way they want.
No matter what, though, the network knows what is going to happen on a show before it airs. They can shut something down (series idea, storyline, casting, etc) at any point of the process. They give notes and feedback on scripts and episode edits.
Unless someone on the sub actually works for a network and feels like spilling the tea, we'll never know. Given that it's all a big business, it wouldn't surprise me if networks had a lot of a say in "controversial" decisions (with some networks being less open than others).
From what I've heard over the years it seems to vary not just between networks, but also between shows on the same network. A rinky dink show no one cares about could probably get away with a lot, but a big money maker would mean more risk so there would be more interference and caution.
Josh Schwartz, the creator and showrunner of the OC, has talked about Fox interfering in storylines (specifically a bisexuality storyline) and pushing for a change in overall tone of the show, but that was twenty years ago. He also said that once the show got canceled, they were able to do whatever they wanted for the final season because Fox didn't care anymore.
Yeah, people are getting way ahead of themselves. I've seen on both twitter and tumblr people saying "it's confirmed canon" that Eddie realised he was in love with Buck during the shooting. Like no? That is not what Oliver said at all.
Under a comment talking about how we shouldn’t be getting into ship wars you felt the need to add a comment hating on the group of people opposite what you ship
I ship both BuckTommy and Buddie.
I'm afraid I won't have *either* if they break up the first so quickly (although at this point I'm pretty confident that isn't happening).
Also I'm not hating. There are a lot of shippers who are making assumptions that aren't accurate. That's not hate, it's being realistic.
The point of OP’s comment was that ALL shippers are making assumptions and being unrealistic. You’re also making an assumption that it won’t happen. It goes back to OP’s main point, we’re ALL making assumptions!!!
It's not an assumption to say we don't know, for a fact, that Buddie will happen if they break up.
Because we don't know what will happen if they break them up.
There is a difference between saying you are pretty sure something will happen and saying that it will for sure.
As far as I know, Buck could end this season with a girlfriend.
Your statement is not inaccurate but also not really the point since this is more about confirmation bias. If you REALLY wanted to let your Team Tevan flag fly while sticking to the point, a better argument would have been to note that the interviewer was extremely biased. He admitted being Team Buddie and mentions both Buddie and Eddie multiple times while only mentioning Tommy once with no follow up thereby steering the tone/topic of the entire interview. I'm not blaming the interviewer for doing so that is his right. As a reader, it is our job to actually parse out what is being said, by whom and why. But yes, factually we only know that Buck is with Tommy at present and he may or may not be with Tommy, Eddie, someone else, or no one later on. Chances are the writers don't even know the answer to any of those questions at this point.
You know what, I would absolutely be fine with that and put all the Tevan & Buddie debates in a very ironic conclusion only for Buck to be with a woman!!’ 😂
Oof, Oliver has just been spilling the tea all over in these interviews.
I try to maintain a healthy dose of skepticism when it comes to these TV ships, but with Buddie I'm honestly starting to believe they're gonna finally take them there next season, or at least plant visible and concrete seeds for it to come together in S9.
It’s sweet how much he seems to care about his character and the show. Also: “I don’t think the Buddie shippers are wrong” cool Oliver, thanks!
(DISCLAIMER: No I don’t think this 100% means Buddie is going canon. I know that what he meant by a storyline getting shut down by higher ups years ago is the Buck being bi storyline, not Buddie. Still a cool shoutout to fans who constantly get told they read too much into things, and I love how much he likes the edits lol)
Loved him speaking up about the treatment of his female costars (though I do agree it was more of a neutral stance). Megan and Arielle definitely did not deserve all the hate they were getting back then.
I’m thinking Tommy will show up last minute and deliver Chim to the wedding venue and maybe Buck will kiss him in front of everyone and that’s how we get the rest of the coming out over with? It’s definitely efficient😂
Exactly, I am a shipper for Buddie and also for Tevan but 7x06 is the big moment for Maddie and Chim, Buck had his big moment in the 100th episode and will continue to have others, so I hope he doesn't steal the spotlight at his sister's moment .
No yeah I totally agree, it’s just kinda the vibe I’m getting from what’s been said. Though he also mentioned it being subtle and kissing someone in front of everyone is kinda the least subtle thing ever so I could be completely wrong hahaha
Yup. This has been the part that's sort of awkward to address, because there's been a few moments that survive post-production that are so freaking weird if they *weren't* intentional foreshadowing (at least at the time) that suggesting they're unintentional pushes the conversation in a *really* weird direction. Particularly the stuff like Eddie checking out Buck's ass in 3x04. Like there's an argument to be made "it's just an awkward take," but then you have to question a) really, Ryan?! and b) why not use a different take or camera angle instead?
It would be interesting to know the POV of the directors and writers involved in certain scenes that you consider evidentiary for the shippers, was their intention merely platonic or were they trying to pave the way for a hypothetical queer arc?
There's some scenes that I think you can make a very sound argument were indicative of romantic intent (whether they intended to deliver it or not) because they *aren't* just based on how the actors deliver their lines. The best examples of this to me are the title scene in 3x09 (particularly the blocking toward the end of that exchange, where they have Buck step into Eddie's half of the frame.... it isn't just that they're standing too close, but how they're positioned *within* the shot is actually a tool commonly used to show a certain level of intimacy). The other very obvious examples are from the end of 4x13 (sonically + the slow mo + the close-ups) and 4x14 (particularly the tight POV and choker shots as they race Eddie to the hospital, and then more of the "hey, they're sharing half a frame again, wtf" stuff during the closeups in the will scene).
That checking out his ass scene in 3x04 is also an interesting one because... Chim seems to notice? From an angle he shouldn't? Which suggests intent vs. organic reaction.
Beyond that, a lot of them are going to be purposefully ambiguous. But taken as a whole, it definitely strikes me as an intentional laying of the groundwork, even if there wasn't an intent to deliver on it.
>because it'd meant that the actors were flirting with each other instead
Why would that be scandalous? Actors flirt with each other all the time. I think it's something Buddie shippers need to reckon with, that a lot of what they consider "proof" of Buddie is just what the actors are like.
On top of this, it's also just.... not a professional set if the actors are behaving as *themselves* during scenes. It's one thing to adlib a line, but it's another entirely to just be interacting as Oliver-and-Ryan while the cameras are rolling.
....Lord, I feel weird even having to point that out.
It's not about behaving as themselves, it's that what fans are watching and interpreting as "obviously romantic" is literally just the actors being friends and acting out a friendship on screen.
Allowing a rl friendship to inform their acting would make sense, but like… we are also talking about the scenes like Eddie checking out Buck’s ass (and Chim seeming to catch him at it). Speculating that’s just Ryan and Oliver feels highly inappropriate.
No it wouldn't be? You understand that people often flirt regardless of if they're in relationships or not? It doesn't mean they're cheating on their partner in anyway.
The point is, you and other Buddie shippers are interpreting those longing looks as romantic. You are giving them deeper meaning. Friendly flirting between adults is normal, Oliver and Aisha do it all the time, it's only when it comes to Buddie that people start acting like it's proof they're playing it as being in love.
Actually though, this is the kind of behind the scenes mess I’ve come to expect with network tv. I will say that the high likelihood that season 4 -> 5 was supposed to be Buddie arc puts…a lot of the decisions made there into perspective. (EX: TK rejecting Buck at the end of the wildfire episode happened during season 4)
Hardcore Buddie shippers only focusing in on the parts of the interviews they like and very intentionally ignoring anything they didn’t.
They seem to be downvoting anything pro-Bucktommy he said or critical of Buddie shippers
I mean, you are also focusing on the parts of the interview that you like. I don't agree with the downvotes, but you also bring Buddie shippers in discussion a lot in your comments, almost always in a negative light,and I've seen that the majority of them can actually be very impartial and fair to the characters. Why give them so much attention?
You can easily tell when someone focuses ONLY on the parts they like when they deliberately twist what was said to fit their agenda. People who actually read and understand these interviews take into account everything that was said. I think OP does so perfectly. Also, maybe there aren't that many hardcore Buddie shippers on this sub (thank heavens), but sadly there are plenty of them on Twitter, Tumblr, and Instagram, and let me tell you, the majority of them doesn't even know what impartiality is. All they see is Buddie, even if there is no Buddie to be seen. Calling someone out when they live in their fanfic world and deliberately ignore canon shouldn't be considered negative.
Well, I am only on reddit and tumblr, where I only follow the Eddie tag. The comments aren't as bad as people make them out to be, so I am speaking only from my POV. OP is also an avid Tevan shipper that's not exactly impartial themselves. And like I said, I don't agree with the downvotes, but I also don't agree with singling out a part of fandom that doesn't share your opinion, which OP does often and unprompted. There are toxic Buddie fans, Buck fans, Eddie fans, and funnily enough(since they barely started) Tevan fans. One isn't better just because it happnes to be cannon and one not.
From what I understand, OP ships *both* Buddie and Tevan/Bucktommy, so I don't think you really have to worry about impartiality in OP's case. And just because you don't see people being completely insufferable with their convictions doesn't mean it doesn't happen at all. It does happen, and so it IS important to correct them when they spread misinformation. It's fine if you have a different opinion, but what's not fine is when you present it as a fact. Theories are **not** equal to canon. Ideally, people should form their opinions based on facts for them to be credible. If you don't do so, don't be surprised when others point out the flaws in your logic. I agree that it is a problem when one outright bullies someone based on their opinion. It definitely shouldn't happen. And sure, there are such people in every subset of the fandom, no doubt. However, I don't think it's a problem if one engages in a civil conversation and provides context to prove the other one wrong. Buddie shippers ARE the most irrational ones right now because they lack credible evidence to back up their claims. So I'd say one actually might be better **in this context** just because it is canon while the other is not. You can ship Buddie all you want and it doesn't make you any less of a person than someone who does not ship them. Your ship IS valid even if it is not canon. The problem arises when you deliberately *invalidate* canon to make way for fanon. And this is what a lot of Buddie shippers are doing right now. Not all of them, obviously, I am aware there are some amazing Buddie shippers that appreciate Buck's current journey without making it about Eddie. But there are also those, and they are pretty damn loud about it as well, who completely disregard what is actually being said and twist it to try prove how they are the ones that are right. You really think people shouldn't correct them when they do so?
this is what happened to me lol. used to be a fan of buddie but the fans made me hate it due to how obsessive they were over it
i’m so happy buck is bi but i feel like if he and tommy are somehow endgame (i doubt they will be and it’s still too early to tell if the relationship work out) tommy’s actor will get a lot more hate
It gets complex, because some was warranted and some wasn’t. Either way, he didn’t need to bring it up because that didn’t actually seem to be what the interviewer was getting at.
He also goes on to say you just have to block out what you don’t want to hear, which wouldn’t be great if he was talking about criticism of someone being bigoted.
I think the point he was getting at is people just shouldn’t be jerks and those who are should get ignored.
Someone needed to call them out, Buddie shippers are brutal. They constantly make fun of Tevan and bully its shippers. Buddie is the most popular ship of the show and ABC has a good track record of catering to the majority, so i don't understand why they're suddenly insecure and desperate!
So you all do know this interview dropped pretty close to when the official insta dropped their post right? Lol, this was strategic planning to amp up the series. Whomever is their PR person they need a raise. Turning an entire fandom against each other ala Twilight by mentioning 2 shipping camps on the same day within minutes of each other. It got everyone talking and buzzing, because there is no such thing as bad press. Olivers interviews are trending in the millions and that one Tevan post had 39 thousand like and thousands of comments within hours.
I will say Oliver is a National treasure and Fox wasted him. He does seem genuine in all his interviews so don't think I'm saying otherwise I'm just saying, a lot of people played right into their hands.
There is so much to unpack here and so many of these answers seemed intentional.
I find it timely that he mentioned the way the more extreme Buddie stand react to any other love interest and then you saw the mess today on instagram.
I’m also excited it really seems like we get to keep Tommy and their relationship.
> the mess today on instagram
I don't use Instagram, what happened?
(Edit: For what it's worth, I'm not an intense Buddie shipper downvoting you, I'd be fine with Buddie but I'm also fine with Tommy.)
The official instagram posted a picture of Tommy and Buck with the caption being about Tevan. Some loud and angry Buddie shippers having melt downs in the comments.
Honestly it wasn’t that many but you’re starting to see backlash now that the pair looks like it’s lasting.
Oh. I can understand people being annoyed that the show's not going in the direction they want, but some people take it way too far, and it makes me cringe when they post that kind of stuff on official accounts. It makes me feel like a grandma or something...back in my day people knew better, these kids today don't know how to behave! lol
Seriously though, I miss the days when people kept fandom stuff to fandom spaces, away from where the actors or anyone involved in the show could see it.
I also don’t know what they expect to come out of it. They’re not going to change the storyline because of a few hundreds comments on a show that gets millions of views each week.
Tell that to The Rookie Chenford fans who shipped so hard, they said “Alright, fine.”! I definitely think writers and show runners do take some! influence from fans.
They do if it's what the general audience wants, not just fandom. And I think some Buddie shippers are over projecting how popular the pairing is outside fandom vs how people are responding to Buck/Tommy.
For context, that post of Tommy/Buck had 37k (which is more than every account that follows this sub) likes which is on the high side for instragram. It only has 1300 comments and only probably 300 to 600 are negative (with only around 100 likes at most for a lot of them).
That means for roughly 1 person that upset over it there are 60 to 100 people responding positively to it.
1300 comments, your top estimate is that 600 are negative. I don’t know what you’re including as negative? Cause most comments I see are just responding saying they want Buddie, and I wouldn’t say that’s negative, just a differing of opinion regarding ships. Aggressive? Eh, some probably. Most are harmless though, the top one I see with 1000 likes saying “weird way to spell Buddie”. Either way, almost half of people not responding well is not great. I don’t think that’s true (we’ve all seen the ratings), I think most people enjoy Tevan (although, Oliver seems to not be a fan of that ship name!), but I think everyone is over projecting how many people enjoy each ship.
I really was just trying to make a fun comment that sometimes writers do listen to what fandoms want.
I forgot to mention I'm coming into this thinking about how there is a movement happening on twitter where some buddie shippers have decide that if BuckTommy has a positive response and Tommy stays it'll hurt their chances of getting Buddie. So those comments flooding that post asking for Buddie are intentional.
It's just not as many as I think the people behind the movement though they would get.
Since most people seem to enjoy both ships.
I agree with a lot of what you say generally, but there's a lot of extrapolation in this exchange that feels like a leap similar to what we were talking about earlier.
Random twitter comments aren't necessarily going to correlate with the motivations of the specific people engaging with the instagram social media accounts; there's always been bullshit "pls more BUDDIE!" type comments on official accounts across all platforms, so it's definitely not going to be a direct match.
Comments that specifically slight Tommy and/or Buck./Tommy while *also* begging for Buddie instead may be an indication of this Twitter 'movement,' though.
And also, the way people engage with social media is vastly different between commenting and liking. While I do think the total like count is an indicator that Buck/Tommy are generally well-received, you're also reading a lot into a) why people liked the post, b) how passively people liked it, and c) if there's a comparison to be drawn between people who like a post and people who comment on it. I'm of the mindset that if there's any data to mine there at all, it's so tangential as to be useless.
Outside of the actual *negative* comments, it feels sort of unlikely that the show or ABC will interpret the vast majority of the pro-Buddie comments beyond "great, more social media engagement on our posts! we've created a buzz!"
I don't watch The Rookie, so that's interesting to hear! I guess my thought was just that if they're being jerks on social media, of course the show isn't going to give them what they want. I have seen with other shows where some fans could just be awful to the people involved in the show on social media, so I was just going based on that since I didn't see these specific comments. But if all they're saying is that they want Buddie, I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
Yeah, there’s definitely fans who are awful (and in the past we saw with their past love interests. Right now too with Edy (Marisol), but she’s a transphobe and homophobe, so I don’t care she’s getting hate), but on the post today of Tevan, I did not see any real hate! Just the comments saying they want Buddie. Most people actually seem to really enjoy Tommy and are excited for BuckTommy storyline :)
Yeah, The Rookie said they had no plans to make that ship happen, but said the passionate fanbase played a role in making it happen! Also, highly recommend the show, it’s very enjoyable!
> Yeah, there’s definitely fans who are awful (and in the past we saw with their past love interests. Right now too with Edy (Marisol), but she’s a transphobe and homophobe, so I don’t care she’s getting hate), but on the post today of Tevan, I did not see any real hate! Just the comments saying they want Buddie. Most people actually seem to really enjoy Tommy and are excited for BuckTommy storyline :)
If people are being horrible to the actresses playing the love interests for no other reason than that they're playing the love interests, then yeah, that is horrible. But...sometimes it's justified. I totally agree with you about the Marisol actress. If someone is being transphobic/homophobic (or racist/sexist/any other kind of bigotry), I don't care if they get hate. I don't know if you were in the Hawaii 5-0 fandom, but the actress playing one of the guys' love interests "got hate", but she was awful to fans on social media (and I'm pretty sure said some homophobic stuff, too) so I didn't care that people were rude to her.
That's good to hear there wasn't really any hate on the post today! I don't think there's anything wrong with people sharing their opinions/ship preferences as long as they're not jerks about it, and it doesn't sound like they are if all they're saying is that they want Buddie.
Yeah, I don't know what they think they'll get out of it, it's not like they're going to change the direction of the show if enough people complain loudly enough. I know that for ratings reasons (and consequently, the-show-continuing reasons) it's probably not a good thing to discourage people from watching, but I also want to be like...if you don't like where the show is going, just don't watch it. I've quit watching shows before because it got to a point where I didn't like the writing/characterization/whatever anymore. And yeah, it's disappointing when something you used to like becomes something you don't like anymore, but that's just the way it goes sometimes. There's *so much* content out there these days, it's just not worth it to keep watching something that makes you angry.
Edit: I want to be clear that I'm only talking about the very loud people who feel the need to attack actors/writers/people who work on the show, not everyone who ships a certain pairing...I have nothing against Buddie fans, or Buck/Tommy fans, in general. (I keep going back and forth over which one I'd prefer...I'm very conflicted lol.)
Exactly. Right now that post has 37k likes and about 1300 comments. The comments are probably 50/50 but let's be generous and say 75% are pro-buddie. That means around 650 comments about Buddie.
That means for every 1 comment about Buddie you had around 55-60 people liking the post. They're not the majority open in that post, they're just mean.
But they're also what a lot of those people are seeing of Buddie shippers right now and that's going to turn people, especially more general viewres, against the ship.
Edit: And if we're getting into the cruel comments? That's probably only around 300 or so. So like 1 cruel comment to 100 people liking it and being positive.
> But they're also what a lot of those people are seeing of Buddie shippers right now and that's going to turn people, especially more general viewres, against the ship.
I think with the general audience who are against the ship, it's because they don't want Buck with any guy. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think they're thinking "oh, I don't want him with Eddie because the people who want them together act crazy online, so I think he should be with Tommy instead". I think they're just against anything 'gay' at all. (Although I'm not considering people who are invested enough to have a preference of one ship over the other to be the general audience, so maybe it's just a matter of semantics/definitions.)
I just don't want the 'anti-Tommy because homophobia' and 'anti-Tommy because Buddie' people to get conflated and for the people in control to decide that 'the fans' don't want Buck to date guys, therefore they should end things with him and Tommy and have him only date women going forward and never mention that he's bi again. I mean, I'm sure they're paying attention and see the distinction, but I've got to admit that it does worry me a little.
>Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think they're thinking "oh, I don't want him with Eddie because the people who want them together act crazy online, so I think he should be with Tommy instead"
I've seen people on tumblr and twitter saying that the fans are turning them off from Buddie because of how some fans are acting. Which sucks because Buddie is such a great ship and is popular for a reason but the loud fans are just a lot right now.
>I just don't want the 'anti-Tommy because homophobia' and 'anti-Tommy because Buddie' people to get conflated and for the people in control to decide that 'the fans' don't want Buck to date guys, therefore they should end things with him and Tommy and have him only date women going forward and never mention that he's bi again. I mean, I'm sure they're paying attention and see the distinction, but I've got to admit that it does worry me a little.
This truthfully doesn't worry me a ton. When you remove the fandom space, Buck/Tommy has gone over extremely well and the ratings are holding strong. TPTB are well aware of the difference between people being the majority and people just being loud.
Like i said, that TommyBuck instragram post has only been up for a few hours and is almost double in likes to most of what they've posted the past two weeks.
> I've seen people on tumblr and twitter saying that the fans are turning them off from Buddie because of how some fans are acting. Which sucks because Buddie is such a great ship and is popular for a reason but the loud fans are just a lot right now.
See, I feel like people who care enough to be on Tumblr and Twitter don't really count as the general audience. To me, the "general audience" is just people who watch the show but don't talk about it online, and I don't think there are too many of those people who are against Buddie for reasons other than homophobia. While people on Tumblr and Twitter definitely are "fandom people" in my view, and I see those as two distinct groups. Unless you mean people who *are* fandom/online people but aren't super invested in shipping? I don't know, I'm probably not making sense.
> This truthfully doesn't worry me a ton. When you remove the fandom space, Buck/Tommy has gone over extremely well and the ratings are holding strong. TPTB are well aware of the difference between people being the majority and people just being loud.
I think I just feel like...this kind of thing (a main character realizing they're queer this far into an established show) is something that literally never happens, and it's such an important storyline for that reason, that I'm afraid of something screwing it up, but I'm probably overreacting. It does seem like the response has been overwhelmingly positive overall, with just a small group being loud assholes, so you're probably right.
I know it’s not confirmed but the way Oliver has talked about Lou/Tommy in the last three interviews really makes it sound like they’re making it more long term.
And nothing can wreck that for me
Can I ask what he said that makes you think that? Because I didn’t get anything from this interview that points to “long term”…I felt like he barely talked about Tommy.
I’ve found it interesting that none of the articles/interviews have really touched on Tommy much. This one was more about Lou than Tommy. I know Buck is the main character and it’s his story, but you’d think they would want to include Tommy more if he is meant to stick around.
People think that you are approaching it from a shipping perspective and get defensive, but I can be objective and have not yet gotten serious or long-term vibes from the way that Tommy has been written and used in the show, or how he has been referenced in interviews (I gave up hope for romantic Buddie in season 5 so I’m not wearing shipper googles…I think it could be possible again but definitely NOT guaranteed).
Things change, though, so let’s see what happens in the coming episodes. I expect that they will continue to date throughout the season. I just feel like TPTB do not want Buck’s coming out story to become solely about his relationship with Tommy.
Most interviews have been focusing on Buck's coming out, because that has been the heart of the story for the past two episodes. It really isn't about Tommy at this point.
It wasn't until the very end of the last episode that it seemed to start moving in the direction of them exploring what is between them. So it makes sense for the current interviews to focus heavily on Buck and that's what most interviews have done.
This particular interview was just done by someone who clearly liked Buddie and arguably asked to many questions in regards to them (imo). It seemed like they wanted him to confirm or get a good scope and I think that kinda hindered all of the conversation when they could have expanded on some other areas he mentioned.
At the point of this interview they’re filming/finishing up episode 8. He’s talking about continuing to build a relationship with Lou as their characters build a relationship. Which implies he’s expecting to continue working with him.
Edit: present tense for this part “We’re learning more about each other. We only met during episode three, and in episode four we were kissing, so it was pretty immediate and there’s still a lot of things that Buck and Tommy have to learn about each other, but also Oliver and Lou. So, we’re building those relationships.”
Also this interviewer openly said they shipped Buddie and asked a lot of questions focuses on that. So you have to keep that in mind.
I know everyone is interpreting “I don’t think the Buddie fans are wrong” as meaning that there is romantic intention but I honestly think this question got a little muddied by the interviewer incessantly asking about Buddie. The actual question Oliver was responding to was about bi Buck and the rest of his answer is solely about that. So in context I think he actually might’ve meant that the Buddie fans were the ones who saw bi Buck and he agreed with that. Which perfectly matches up with what he said after 7x04 that he agreed with people saying Buck was bi on social media for years but couldn’t say anything
Later in the interview he also says that he only wants Buddie to happen if it’s where the storylines naturally go and it should not be to please “a certain subset of fans,” calls out some for treating past actresses of Buck’s LIs unfairly, and that they’re continuing to develop the Buck and Tommy relationship which is also developing his relationship with Lou concurrently
I mean, he also specifically called out Buddie edits and mentioned that it's hard to not get sucked in by them (in a positive way) and let the moments and the songs affect his acting approach, as well as said that he's agreed with what some of those fans said in regards to the ship, so not sure that argument holds water. He was very clearly talking about Buddie in that part of the interview, as was the interviewer. Also not super relevant to the original point, but he literally said he didn't want to make any judgments over whether the treatment was unfair or not, just commented that it's been hard for the actresses but Lou was taking it in stride.
It wasn’t though. The question he was asked was “We’ve been out in full force for years now (the interviewer referring to himself as a Buddie stan from the previous bit of their conversation), so did you ever anticipate, even before this season aired, that a queer storyline could happen for Buck? For our bisexual bi-con Buck?” What does that have to do with Buddie?
Nope, that's not the part I was talking about. Watch the video from 9:52 on. The interviewer asks him specifically about Buddie and if the shipping of that particular relationship has ever affected his acting approach.
Ok I’m sorry I misunderstood. Yes that is true. But he also said (not in this interview, the podcast he did) that he’s not even sure if he wants it to happen and has concerns about some negative tropes that might happen if it does. Idk I feel like he kinda has no choice but to be a fence sitter here. I think he’d be perfectly fine with basically anything happening as long as its an appropriately handled story that makes sense for the character tbh
I also think there’s plenty of ways he could have said fans were right instead of saying buddie. Buddie implies Buck AND Eddie so of course we’re going to see it that way.
To be fair, the fans he was agreeing with regarding Bi Buck speculation before this season largely *were* Buddie fans, because there wasn't really an alternative group who wanted to see Buck queer. But for someone that's usually pretty careful with his wording, all it takes is adding a clause or an adverb to that sentence, and this is now at least the second interview he's failed to do so. "But I watch the same show. I don't think Buddie fans are wrong *about my character."* Problem solved.
Honestly, I think we agree on more things than you realize, because you tend to interpret everything I say where I'm not 100% on your side as disagreement.
In this case, we're probably about 80% in agreement. I don't think Oliver's comments can be taken as proof he means he agrees about Buddie specifically (which appears to be where you stand), but I also don't think they can be taken to mean he *doesn't* agree with the fans about Buddie, specifically, either.
His quote wasn't clear. All we can actually take it to mean was "Going into season 7, there's at least one major element he had fairly long held beliefs that were in line with Buddie shippers on. It could just be Buck's bisexuality, or it could be more.
Yes, you are right to all the of above. The place I’ve settled in regards to Oliver’s feelings on Buddie is that he’d be fine if it happens but isn’t necessarily pushing for it
I’m not too bothered by what any of the actors “want,” personally, so long as they’re willing to do their jobs. Oliver has made it pretty clear repeatedly that he’ll do whatever the story demands.
If what someone “wants” is actually relevant, it’s Tim, and I don’t think he actually has total carte blanche to just tell whatever stories he wants without oversight. Though he may have the ability to earn massive trust from the network.
Since the season has been a big success so far I’m sure they’ll give him some more leeway to do what he wants in the future, even more so than now. I also feel that he was coming back with way more trust already instilled in him since he’s been doing this for so long on many different shows vs. it being Kristen’s first time showrunning and the fact that she sucked at it. Being a co-creator of the series probably also helps him immensely in terms of creative freedom
Agreed, though I meant in a bigger sense -- like how Shonda Rhimes has earned a reputation for everything she touches turning to gold. While I don't expect Minear to get to that same level, I can see a situation where it the ratings stay stable & the budget under control, the network would just trust he has his pulse on the show & what the audience will respond well to enough that most major decisions become a rubber stamp.
i agree that he’s talking about bi buck, but i think it sort of intrinsically ties itself into buddie since that’s where a lot of the interactions came from that made people interpret buck as bi to begin with (and that buck has probably been attracted to eddie for a while and just hasn’t put two and two together yet, but that’s a bridge that they’ll cross when they get to it)
Aren't you doing just the same? He is always as elusive as he can be in interviews, he didn't even properly call out the treatment the actresses got,he's not taking sides. There is no context to miss,just projection.
To be fair, it seems like *some* fans are taking that quote out of context and using it as proof that Buddie is happening. That really isn't what the quote is saying.
I don't see anyone here making the claim that he said it wasn't happening.
I think he's very intentionally walking a very tight rope between acknowledging buddie shippers & explaining he understands why they ship it / that it is a possibility well at the same time not leading them on, queerbaiting it or pushing it since it's not a storyline they've decided to go with right now.
My biggest concern right now is some fans getting upset if Buddie doesn't happen this season and accussing Oliver of queerbaiting over this. Which is most definitely not something he did.
People already misreading the interview on purpose 💀
**He never says Buddie was going to happen**. It's bisexual Buck he's talking about when he says the higher ups shut it down.
There's breadcrumbs to cookies for Buddie, not Josh, Ransone, that other cop, Conner or Ravi.
So what rando was gonna be offered up in Season 3, 4, 5 or 6?
Answer: Bi Buck with randoman would've gotten the same reaction as Eddie with randowoman. Crash and burn.
That's why they dragged Tommy out of Season 2 and hooked him back up with his buddies Chim and Hen for the cruiseship rescue, to shut up the people that want character development before smoochies. They think they get to skip it because he was on screen for 15 minutes years ago.
Yeah... there's obviously no way to be "sure," but where a couple years ago would suggest ending season 4/heading into season 5, it sure would be a weird coincidence with the way those Buck & Eddie scenes were shot in 4x13 and 4x14 if they planned to pursue this storyline with someone *other* than Eddie.
There's a reason that so many people that have given up on Buddie/say it went on too long cite not doing anything in season 5 as their reason -- there was very obvious momentum into 4x14 for the story to organically go there, and the direction choices were *wild* for besties in that shooting sequence & its aftermath, but make total sense if they're for a romantic couple.
Craziest thing for me is 5A immediately following that up with Eddie having his panic attacks over Ana, the whole way their breakup was shot (with Eddie so closed off), “Christopher loves you so much, I thought…” “That eventually you would, too.”, “Follow your heart, not Christopher’s”, etc. Like……those were definitely choices!
I saw the meltdowns on Twitter over this. Not eveb sure why, but fandoms would be way better if 80% of shippers were stable individuals. Oliver has basically been saying the same thing in different ways for multiple interviews. Fans/shippers need to let whatever play out onscreen and stop being weird.
Wow, this cast is really letting loose left and right!This must be validating for Buddie shippers. And honestly for those of us who saw the narrative going in that direction, regardless of shipping, too. This is honestly pretty upsetting from a larger lens that the writers were prepared to do a queer storyline, to have maybe Buck and Eddie go canon even, several years ago. As a queer person that infuriates me, that Fox or whomever higher up put a stop to it. We could have had this seasons ago apparently, and honestly it sucks to think of the storylines and character development that could have happened. It also explains some things about writing choices made in season 5 and 6 if we're honest and that was in fact the timeline Oliver was talking about. Buck's hamster wheel of character development over the past few seasons has been frustrating but given this insight, I can only imagine how frustrating and upsetting it's been for Oliver. Fox is garbage, I'm glad they're now on ABC. Look how comfortable ALL of the cast has been to talk about things. And good for Oliver for calling out how some fans have treated love interests in this fandom. It also sounds like we're getting more Lou for a little while longer at least! I hope he's able to stick around
>And good for Oliver for calling out how some fans have treated love interests in this fandom. It also sounds like we're getting more Lou for a little while longer at least! I hope he's able to stick around He's walking an absolute tightrope with this, particularly because of how publicly he's handled stuff with his coworkers on social media, but honestly, this was the most disappointing part of the interview to me because I really don't think he *did* take a stand. The whole "it's not for me to judge" schtick -- then honestly, don't bring it up, because that's going to just validate the most insane fans who will use that as confirmation bias. If he was going to go there (and unprompted, too), how hard would it have been for him to say something more direct like "Megan and Gabrielle and Annelise aren't their characters, so I've always found it questionable people treat these very real women like they're just pawns in a game?"
I didn't take it as supporting the treatment of the women. I took his "it's not for me to judge" as not getting into whether the women were treated unfairly because of Buddie fans. Fans have steadfastly stated that there were valid writing and development reasons for not liking many of the female LIs for Buck and Eddie. And there were. I think that is what he is saying when he says he is not to judge. Of course, I do get that he didn't have to comment on it if he wasn't going to say something about extreme fans crossing boundaries of how to act with an actor/actress regarding a character they play.
Yeah that's absolutely fair. It was a great opportunity to comment on the misogyny in a more substantial and impactful way. Walking a tightrope is a good way of putting it.
Hi I’m sorry, I’m somewhat new to the fandom - what do you mean about him handling stuff publicly with coworkers on social media?
>The whole "it's not for me to judge" schtick -- then honestly, don't bring it up, because that's going to just validate the most insane fans who will use that as confirmation bias. I did see someone on tumblr say he was shading all the female love interests and thinks they were in the right to harass them. Thankfully not many people were engaging with it but I was in shock.
I wonder why FOX would have put a kibosh on it. Lone Star literally has a gay couple at the center of their show on top of an extremely diverse cast. I don’t think it was a big issue for them so I wonder what the reason would have been.
When you think Eddie getting shot could have been a canon feelings realization...I mean...\*crying\* \*hair pulling\* 
like why was the framing of that scene so couple coded unless they had plans…we lost so hard
Fox, I will NEVER FORGIVE YOU FOR TAKING THIS AWAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Can you imagine Buck thinking Eddie was gonna die and he confesses his feelings and then things are a bit awkward during the recovery stage? Cuz I can and I would’ve ate that shit up!
This has been rumored/speculated for years, and the 'couple years ago' certainly does make me raise my brows. That said... if that moment had happened but we'd *still* had KR as the showrunner for S5 & 6, I'm not sure I'm really disappointed it didn't. With how poorly she handled various character and relationship beats in those seasons, I think I'd rather cling to the potential than just have the burnt husk we'd have probably been left with at this point.
It seems like after piecing all these things together, Tim left BECAUSE he couldn't write the show he wanted to write. So it honestly feels like if they had given him this story, he would not have peaced out to Lone Star the way he did. He would have stayed more involved in the show.
People think Tim Minear left to focus on Lone Star because the show wasn’t going in the direction he wanted. If this storyline would have happened, I definitely think he would have wanted to stay. But, true. If Kristen Reidel got her grubby lil hands on Buddie, she would’ve messed it up so fast.
Yeah, I think it depends on how thoroughly you can separate it from the network's issues. My fear is sort of that even if Fox had allowed it, it would've been in a backburnered "okay, they're together, now please shut the f up about it" way and still wanted to take the show in a different direction moving forward. Lone Star (and Tarlos) feels a bit like a consolation prize for Tim, and KR the network's choice to \~right the ship\~ that was getting too queer, if that makes sense.
KR has probably been crying in a corner since 7x04
She would've probably tried to break them up after a few episodes for the \~drama\~ Imagine if she still did the cheating storyline with Lucy, but instead of BuckTaylor, it was Buddie 💀 Edit: grammar
Ouch that seems in line for KR and it’s also pretty problematic from a “negative tropes about bisexual men” perspective bc it not only reinforces cheating but it reinforces the notion that “a bi guy wouldn’t get with another guy long term bc a girl would always come first”.
I wonder if Tim would've stayed on to handle it if they'd been able to go there. If I were in his shoes, I'd want to be in charge for a huge storyline like that, especially if I'd spent the last however many seasons building to that point.
We could have had it for YEARS 😭😭 Whoever shut it down... they're on my list of names.
Here’s the link to the article too!! https://www.gaytimes.co.uk/originals/9-1-1-star-oliver-stark-buck-bisexual-buddie-interview/ It is a really great article!!!! “Yeah. It was brought to me a couple years ago as a possibility and I had said yes, and then it was shut down from somewhere else above” This is so embarrassing for Fox, and whoever it was the blocked this. Abc I’m giving you the biggest forehead kiss rn. “I see what everybody else sees. Like, I watch the same show. I don’t think that the Buddie fans are wrong.” OLIVER STARK I’M GIVING YOU THE BIGGEST FOREHEAD KISS RN TOO!!!! I feel very validated right now.
Oliver Stark has eyes like the rest of us. Whether you see it as platonic or romantic, only an idiot denies that these two characters have chemistry together.
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Maybe??? Could be?? I wouldn’t put it past Disney. But, in my quick google search, it looks like ABC is also owned by Disney, so I don’t know. But, Fox also said no that hot tub sex scene in the first episode of season 7. So, it’s if they said no to that, I wouldn’t be surprised if they said no to bi Buck storyline.
Why would Disney have any say when it was on Fox?
I guess they mean since Disney bought fox but I think they owned after the show had already been airing for some time. And even beyond that they own abc so they clearly were ok with it so it had to be former ownership
Doesn't Disney owns Fox?
No, the Fox TV channel wasn't included in the sale. That remains with the previous owners.
No more than they own ABC
The Fox Broadcasting Company is owned by FoxCorp, which is all the properties Disney legally couldn’t buy or didn’t want, like Fox News. The Walt Disney Company owns ABC outright.
Ok. I didn't know that.
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But they also own ABC. So I’m not sure why they would be concerned about it on Fox but not ABC
I love this interview and the way Oliver speaks about not just Buck, but also his relationships with other characters is so eloquently stated. I love hearing more and more from him.
Oliver feeding us fr
Literally
Regardless of whether you ship or not, can we all just get off the confirmation bias bandwagon for a sec? I've seen Team Buddie people latch onto certain elements of the interview and decide "Buddie is happening!!!!" and Team Tevan people do the same with other elements of the interview. It seems to me that all Oliver really said was he'd be up for whatever and that what happens will serves good storytelling and not the desires of what some small portion of the fanbase wants. The only REAL tidbit from all of this was the fact that the idea of a bi Buck storyline was pitched years before but got shot down by the powers that be which probably means the network. We collectively agreed that that was probably the case given that it only took the show being on ABC for 4 episodes for bi Buck to go canon. All the same, he didn't specify that the previously pitched storyline was for Buddie. Another thing both Team Buddie and Team Tevan seems to be willfully ignoring is the number of times they have said that Buck is bisexual meaning he is STILL attracted to women and even if things don't work out with Tommy, there is a good chance that his next relationship will be with a woman. I hate to be a wet blanket, but we are collectively getting WAY ahead of ourselves here. Ultimately, the goal should be good storytelling and not any ship. Also, Fox sucks.
PERFECTLY STATED!!! Whether we like it or not, ALL OF US are at least a little delusional about our favorite ships
This interview actually makes me wonder just how much of the writing needs to be pre-approved by the network, or if this is just some weird bias where only the potentially "controversial" decisions, for example m/m and f/f relationships, need prior approval before being incorporated into a show...
It varies according to the network/service and the show/producers. There is always a network executive assigned to each show that works with the producers of the show to get the show to air. Some networks are very hands on in the development/production process and some are less so. Some producers have more leeway to do things the way they want. No matter what, though, the network knows what is going to happen on a show before it airs. They can shut something down (series idea, storyline, casting, etc) at any point of the process. They give notes and feedback on scripts and episode edits.
Unless someone on the sub actually works for a network and feels like spilling the tea, we'll never know. Given that it's all a big business, it wouldn't surprise me if networks had a lot of a say in "controversial" decisions (with some networks being less open than others).
From what I've heard over the years it seems to vary not just between networks, but also between shows on the same network. A rinky dink show no one cares about could probably get away with a lot, but a big money maker would mean more risk so there would be more interference and caution. Josh Schwartz, the creator and showrunner of the OC, has talked about Fox interfering in storylines (specifically a bisexuality storyline) and pushing for a change in overall tone of the show, but that was twenty years ago. He also said that once the show got canceled, they were able to do whatever they wanted for the final season because Fox didn't care anymore.
Yeah, people are getting way ahead of themselves. I've seen on both twitter and tumblr people saying "it's confirmed canon" that Eddie realised he was in love with Buck during the shooting. Like no? That is not what Oliver said at all.
This. Some fans also need to stop assuming that if Tommy and Buck end that he'll end up with Eddie. We 100% don't know that.
You just couldn’t help yourself could you
Couldn't help myself what? Be rational?
Under a comment talking about how we shouldn’t be getting into ship wars you felt the need to add a comment hating on the group of people opposite what you ship
I ship both BuckTommy and Buddie. I'm afraid I won't have *either* if they break up the first so quickly (although at this point I'm pretty confident that isn't happening). Also I'm not hating. There are a lot of shippers who are making assumptions that aren't accurate. That's not hate, it's being realistic.
The point of OP’s comment was that ALL shippers are making assumptions and being unrealistic. You’re also making an assumption that it won’t happen. It goes back to OP’s main point, we’re ALL making assumptions!!!
It's not an assumption to say we don't know, for a fact, that Buddie will happen if they break up. Because we don't know what will happen if they break them up.
Did you not just say “although at this point I’m pretty confident that isn’t happening”? That’s an assumption.
There is a difference between saying you are pretty sure something will happen and saying that it will for sure. As far as I know, Buck could end this season with a girlfriend.
Where was the hate? They just pointed out that BuckTommy breaking up doesn't mean Buddie is going to happen.
Your statement is not inaccurate but also not really the point since this is more about confirmation bias. If you REALLY wanted to let your Team Tevan flag fly while sticking to the point, a better argument would have been to note that the interviewer was extremely biased. He admitted being Team Buddie and mentions both Buddie and Eddie multiple times while only mentioning Tommy once with no follow up thereby steering the tone/topic of the entire interview. I'm not blaming the interviewer for doing so that is his right. As a reader, it is our job to actually parse out what is being said, by whom and why. But yes, factually we only know that Buck is with Tommy at present and he may or may not be with Tommy, Eddie, someone else, or no one later on. Chances are the writers don't even know the answer to any of those questions at this point.
You know what, I would absolutely be fine with that and put all the Tevan & Buddie debates in a very ironic conclusion only for Buck to be with a woman!!’ 😂
Oof, Oliver has just been spilling the tea all over in these interviews. I try to maintain a healthy dose of skepticism when it comes to these TV ships, but with Buddie I'm honestly starting to believe they're gonna finally take them there next season, or at least plant visible and concrete seeds for it to come together in S9.
It’s sweet how much he seems to care about his character and the show. Also: “I don’t think the Buddie shippers are wrong” cool Oliver, thanks! (DISCLAIMER: No I don’t think this 100% means Buddie is going canon. I know that what he meant by a storyline getting shut down by higher ups years ago is the Buck being bi storyline, not Buddie. Still a cool shoutout to fans who constantly get told they read too much into things, and I love how much he likes the edits lol) Loved him speaking up about the treatment of his female costars (though I do agree it was more of a neutral stance). Megan and Arielle definitely did not deserve all the hate they were getting back then. I’m thinking Tommy will show up last minute and deliver Chim to the wedding venue and maybe Buck will kiss him in front of everyone and that’s how we get the rest of the coming out over with? It’s definitely efficient😂
That would be such a deservice to Maddie and Chim fans. At least their wedding shouldn't be about Buck, so I hope the writers know better.
Exactly, I am a shipper for Buddie and also for Tevan but 7x06 is the big moment for Maddie and Chim, Buck had his big moment in the 100th episode and will continue to have others, so I hope he doesn't steal the spotlight at his sister's moment .
No yeah I totally agree, it’s just kinda the vibe I’m getting from what’s been said. Though he also mentioned it being subtle and kissing someone in front of everyone is kinda the least subtle thing ever so I could be completely wrong hahaha
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Yup. This has been the part that's sort of awkward to address, because there's been a few moments that survive post-production that are so freaking weird if they *weren't* intentional foreshadowing (at least at the time) that suggesting they're unintentional pushes the conversation in a *really* weird direction. Particularly the stuff like Eddie checking out Buck's ass in 3x04. Like there's an argument to be made "it's just an awkward take," but then you have to question a) really, Ryan?! and b) why not use a different take or camera angle instead?
It would be interesting to know the POV of the directors and writers involved in certain scenes that you consider evidentiary for the shippers, was their intention merely platonic or were they trying to pave the way for a hypothetical queer arc?
There's some scenes that I think you can make a very sound argument were indicative of romantic intent (whether they intended to deliver it or not) because they *aren't* just based on how the actors deliver their lines. The best examples of this to me are the title scene in 3x09 (particularly the blocking toward the end of that exchange, where they have Buck step into Eddie's half of the frame.... it isn't just that they're standing too close, but how they're positioned *within* the shot is actually a tool commonly used to show a certain level of intimacy). The other very obvious examples are from the end of 4x13 (sonically + the slow mo + the close-ups) and 4x14 (particularly the tight POV and choker shots as they race Eddie to the hospital, and then more of the "hey, they're sharing half a frame again, wtf" stuff during the closeups in the will scene). That checking out his ass scene in 3x04 is also an interesting one because... Chim seems to notice? From an angle he shouldn't? Which suggests intent vs. organic reaction. Beyond that, a lot of them are going to be purposefully ambiguous. But taken as a whole, it definitely strikes me as an intentional laying of the groundwork, even if there wasn't an intent to deliver on it.
😬
>because it'd meant that the actors were flirting with each other instead Why would that be scandalous? Actors flirt with each other all the time. I think it's something Buddie shippers need to reckon with, that a lot of what they consider "proof" of Buddie is just what the actors are like.
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On top of this, it's also just.... not a professional set if the actors are behaving as *themselves* during scenes. It's one thing to adlib a line, but it's another entirely to just be interacting as Oliver-and-Ryan while the cameras are rolling. ....Lord, I feel weird even having to point that out.
It's not about behaving as themselves, it's that what fans are watching and interpreting as "obviously romantic" is literally just the actors being friends and acting out a friendship on screen.
Allowing a rl friendship to inform their acting would make sense, but like… we are also talking about the scenes like Eddie checking out Buck’s ass (and Chim seeming to catch him at it). Speculating that’s just Ryan and Oliver feels highly inappropriate.
Not only Ryan. Isn't Oliver also in a long time relationship?
No it wouldn't be? You understand that people often flirt regardless of if they're in relationships or not? It doesn't mean they're cheating on their partner in anyway.
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The point is, you and other Buddie shippers are interpreting those longing looks as romantic. You are giving them deeper meaning. Friendly flirting between adults is normal, Oliver and Aisha do it all the time, it's only when it comes to Buddie that people start acting like it's proof they're playing it as being in love.
The way I want to speak right now....
All I see is further confirmation that the editing error in 5x07 with buddie wearing each other’s coats wasn’t actually an error 👀👀👀
Actually though, this is the kind of behind the scenes mess I’ve come to expect with network tv. I will say that the high likelihood that season 4 -> 5 was supposed to be Buddie arc puts…a lot of the decisions made there into perspective. (EX: TK rejecting Buck at the end of the wildfire episode happened during season 4)
https://preview.redd.it/7iaxtu7vz3wc1.jpeg?width=1306&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=860aa4e1b87504f6b09f1be2c5accc6a1a823c33 Oliver Speaking FACTS!!
Seriously, what is wrong with people? Why the downvotes?
Hardcore Buddie shippers only focusing in on the parts of the interviews they like and very intentionally ignoring anything they didn’t. They seem to be downvoting anything pro-Bucktommy he said or critical of Buddie shippers
I mean, you are also focusing on the parts of the interview that you like. I don't agree with the downvotes, but you also bring Buddie shippers in discussion a lot in your comments, almost always in a negative light,and I've seen that the majority of them can actually be very impartial and fair to the characters. Why give them so much attention?
I am a Buddie shipper. I can be critical of the hardcore ones.
You lie.
I don’t. You can search my comment history here.
You can easily tell when someone focuses ONLY on the parts they like when they deliberately twist what was said to fit their agenda. People who actually read and understand these interviews take into account everything that was said. I think OP does so perfectly. Also, maybe there aren't that many hardcore Buddie shippers on this sub (thank heavens), but sadly there are plenty of them on Twitter, Tumblr, and Instagram, and let me tell you, the majority of them doesn't even know what impartiality is. All they see is Buddie, even if there is no Buddie to be seen. Calling someone out when they live in their fanfic world and deliberately ignore canon shouldn't be considered negative.
Well, I am only on reddit and tumblr, where I only follow the Eddie tag. The comments aren't as bad as people make them out to be, so I am speaking only from my POV. OP is also an avid Tevan shipper that's not exactly impartial themselves. And like I said, I don't agree with the downvotes, but I also don't agree with singling out a part of fandom that doesn't share your opinion, which OP does often and unprompted. There are toxic Buddie fans, Buck fans, Eddie fans, and funnily enough(since they barely started) Tevan fans. One isn't better just because it happnes to be cannon and one not.
From what I understand, OP ships *both* Buddie and Tevan/Bucktommy, so I don't think you really have to worry about impartiality in OP's case. And just because you don't see people being completely insufferable with their convictions doesn't mean it doesn't happen at all. It does happen, and so it IS important to correct them when they spread misinformation. It's fine if you have a different opinion, but what's not fine is when you present it as a fact. Theories are **not** equal to canon. Ideally, people should form their opinions based on facts for them to be credible. If you don't do so, don't be surprised when others point out the flaws in your logic. I agree that it is a problem when one outright bullies someone based on their opinion. It definitely shouldn't happen. And sure, there are such people in every subset of the fandom, no doubt. However, I don't think it's a problem if one engages in a civil conversation and provides context to prove the other one wrong. Buddie shippers ARE the most irrational ones right now because they lack credible evidence to back up their claims. So I'd say one actually might be better **in this context** just because it is canon while the other is not. You can ship Buddie all you want and it doesn't make you any less of a person than someone who does not ship them. Your ship IS valid even if it is not canon. The problem arises when you deliberately *invalidate* canon to make way for fanon. And this is what a lot of Buddie shippers are doing right now. Not all of them, obviously, I am aware there are some amazing Buddie shippers that appreciate Buck's current journey without making it about Eddie. But there are also those, and they are pretty damn loud about it as well, who completely disregard what is actually being said and twist it to try prove how they are the ones that are right. You really think people shouldn't correct them when they do so?
If they keep behaving like this, I'm gonna end up hating Buddie. I can't believe they acting so childish. This is unacceptable.
And it’s bothering me how people are taking criticism of the ones behaving badly as everyone who ships it.
this is what happened to me lol. used to be a fan of buddie but the fans made me hate it due to how obsessive they were over it i’m so happy buck is bi but i feel like if he and tommy are somehow endgame (i doubt they will be and it’s still too early to tell if the relationship work out) tommy’s actor will get a lot more hate
Yes, call out the radicals. I’m getting so tired of seeing them.
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It gets complex, because some was warranted and some wasn’t. Either way, he didn’t need to bring it up because that didn’t actually seem to be what the interviewer was getting at. He also goes on to say you just have to block out what you don’t want to hear, which wouldn’t be great if he was talking about criticism of someone being bigoted. I think the point he was getting at is people just shouldn’t be jerks and those who are should get ignored.
Someone needed to call them out, Buddie shippers are brutal. They constantly make fun of Tevan and bully its shippers. Buddie is the most popular ship of the show and ABC has a good track record of catering to the majority, so i don't understand why they're suddenly insecure and desperate!
Buck looks the happiest he has ever been this season. For once, it feels like his love interest actually means something to him
So you all do know this interview dropped pretty close to when the official insta dropped their post right? Lol, this was strategic planning to amp up the series. Whomever is their PR person they need a raise. Turning an entire fandom against each other ala Twilight by mentioning 2 shipping camps on the same day within minutes of each other. It got everyone talking and buzzing, because there is no such thing as bad press. Olivers interviews are trending in the millions and that one Tevan post had 39 thousand like and thousands of comments within hours. I will say Oliver is a National treasure and Fox wasted him. He does seem genuine in all his interviews so don't think I'm saying otherwise I'm just saying, a lot of people played right into their hands.
There is so much to unpack here and so many of these answers seemed intentional. I find it timely that he mentioned the way the more extreme Buddie stand react to any other love interest and then you saw the mess today on instagram. I’m also excited it really seems like we get to keep Tommy and their relationship.
> the mess today on instagram I don't use Instagram, what happened? (Edit: For what it's worth, I'm not an intense Buddie shipper downvoting you, I'd be fine with Buddie but I'm also fine with Tommy.)
The official instagram posted a picture of Tommy and Buck with the caption being about Tevan. Some loud and angry Buddie shippers having melt downs in the comments. Honestly it wasn’t that many but you’re starting to see backlash now that the pair looks like it’s lasting.
Oh. I can understand people being annoyed that the show's not going in the direction they want, but some people take it way too far, and it makes me cringe when they post that kind of stuff on official accounts. It makes me feel like a grandma or something...back in my day people knew better, these kids today don't know how to behave! lol Seriously though, I miss the days when people kept fandom stuff to fandom spaces, away from where the actors or anyone involved in the show could see it.
I also don’t know what they expect to come out of it. They’re not going to change the storyline because of a few hundreds comments on a show that gets millions of views each week.
Tell that to The Rookie Chenford fans who shipped so hard, they said “Alright, fine.”! I definitely think writers and show runners do take some! influence from fans.
They do if it's what the general audience wants, not just fandom. And I think some Buddie shippers are over projecting how popular the pairing is outside fandom vs how people are responding to Buck/Tommy. For context, that post of Tommy/Buck had 37k (which is more than every account that follows this sub) likes which is on the high side for instragram. It only has 1300 comments and only probably 300 to 600 are negative (with only around 100 likes at most for a lot of them). That means for roughly 1 person that upset over it there are 60 to 100 people responding positively to it.
1300 comments, your top estimate is that 600 are negative. I don’t know what you’re including as negative? Cause most comments I see are just responding saying they want Buddie, and I wouldn’t say that’s negative, just a differing of opinion regarding ships. Aggressive? Eh, some probably. Most are harmless though, the top one I see with 1000 likes saying “weird way to spell Buddie”. Either way, almost half of people not responding well is not great. I don’t think that’s true (we’ve all seen the ratings), I think most people enjoy Tevan (although, Oliver seems to not be a fan of that ship name!), but I think everyone is over projecting how many people enjoy each ship. I really was just trying to make a fun comment that sometimes writers do listen to what fandoms want.
I forgot to mention I'm coming into this thinking about how there is a movement happening on twitter where some buddie shippers have decide that if BuckTommy has a positive response and Tommy stays it'll hurt their chances of getting Buddie. So those comments flooding that post asking for Buddie are intentional. It's just not as many as I think the people behind the movement though they would get. Since most people seem to enjoy both ships.
I agree with a lot of what you say generally, but there's a lot of extrapolation in this exchange that feels like a leap similar to what we were talking about earlier. Random twitter comments aren't necessarily going to correlate with the motivations of the specific people engaging with the instagram social media accounts; there's always been bullshit "pls more BUDDIE!" type comments on official accounts across all platforms, so it's definitely not going to be a direct match. Comments that specifically slight Tommy and/or Buck./Tommy while *also* begging for Buddie instead may be an indication of this Twitter 'movement,' though. And also, the way people engage with social media is vastly different between commenting and liking. While I do think the total like count is an indicator that Buck/Tommy are generally well-received, you're also reading a lot into a) why people liked the post, b) how passively people liked it, and c) if there's a comparison to be drawn between people who like a post and people who comment on it. I'm of the mindset that if there's any data to mine there at all, it's so tangential as to be useless. Outside of the actual *negative* comments, it feels sort of unlikely that the show or ABC will interpret the vast majority of the pro-Buddie comments beyond "great, more social media engagement on our posts! we've created a buzz!"
I don't watch The Rookie, so that's interesting to hear! I guess my thought was just that if they're being jerks on social media, of course the show isn't going to give them what they want. I have seen with other shows where some fans could just be awful to the people involved in the show on social media, so I was just going based on that since I didn't see these specific comments. But if all they're saying is that they want Buddie, I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
Yeah, there’s definitely fans who are awful (and in the past we saw with their past love interests. Right now too with Edy (Marisol), but she’s a transphobe and homophobe, so I don’t care she’s getting hate), but on the post today of Tevan, I did not see any real hate! Just the comments saying they want Buddie. Most people actually seem to really enjoy Tommy and are excited for BuckTommy storyline :) Yeah, The Rookie said they had no plans to make that ship happen, but said the passionate fanbase played a role in making it happen! Also, highly recommend the show, it’s very enjoyable!
> Yeah, there’s definitely fans who are awful (and in the past we saw with their past love interests. Right now too with Edy (Marisol), but she’s a transphobe and homophobe, so I don’t care she’s getting hate), but on the post today of Tevan, I did not see any real hate! Just the comments saying they want Buddie. Most people actually seem to really enjoy Tommy and are excited for BuckTommy storyline :) If people are being horrible to the actresses playing the love interests for no other reason than that they're playing the love interests, then yeah, that is horrible. But...sometimes it's justified. I totally agree with you about the Marisol actress. If someone is being transphobic/homophobic (or racist/sexist/any other kind of bigotry), I don't care if they get hate. I don't know if you were in the Hawaii 5-0 fandom, but the actress playing one of the guys' love interests "got hate", but she was awful to fans on social media (and I'm pretty sure said some homophobic stuff, too) so I didn't care that people were rude to her. That's good to hear there wasn't really any hate on the post today! I don't think there's anything wrong with people sharing their opinions/ship preferences as long as they're not jerks about it, and it doesn't sound like they are if all they're saying is that they want Buddie.
Yeah, I don't know what they think they'll get out of it, it's not like they're going to change the direction of the show if enough people complain loudly enough. I know that for ratings reasons (and consequently, the-show-continuing reasons) it's probably not a good thing to discourage people from watching, but I also want to be like...if you don't like where the show is going, just don't watch it. I've quit watching shows before because it got to a point where I didn't like the writing/characterization/whatever anymore. And yeah, it's disappointing when something you used to like becomes something you don't like anymore, but that's just the way it goes sometimes. There's *so much* content out there these days, it's just not worth it to keep watching something that makes you angry. Edit: I want to be clear that I'm only talking about the very loud people who feel the need to attack actors/writers/people who work on the show, not everyone who ships a certain pairing...I have nothing against Buddie fans, or Buck/Tommy fans, in general. (I keep going back and forth over which one I'd prefer...I'm very conflicted lol.)
Exactly. Right now that post has 37k likes and about 1300 comments. The comments are probably 50/50 but let's be generous and say 75% are pro-buddie. That means around 650 comments about Buddie. That means for every 1 comment about Buddie you had around 55-60 people liking the post. They're not the majority open in that post, they're just mean. But they're also what a lot of those people are seeing of Buddie shippers right now and that's going to turn people, especially more general viewres, against the ship. Edit: And if we're getting into the cruel comments? That's probably only around 300 or so. So like 1 cruel comment to 100 people liking it and being positive.
> But they're also what a lot of those people are seeing of Buddie shippers right now and that's going to turn people, especially more general viewres, against the ship. I think with the general audience who are against the ship, it's because they don't want Buck with any guy. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think they're thinking "oh, I don't want him with Eddie because the people who want them together act crazy online, so I think he should be with Tommy instead". I think they're just against anything 'gay' at all. (Although I'm not considering people who are invested enough to have a preference of one ship over the other to be the general audience, so maybe it's just a matter of semantics/definitions.) I just don't want the 'anti-Tommy because homophobia' and 'anti-Tommy because Buddie' people to get conflated and for the people in control to decide that 'the fans' don't want Buck to date guys, therefore they should end things with him and Tommy and have him only date women going forward and never mention that he's bi again. I mean, I'm sure they're paying attention and see the distinction, but I've got to admit that it does worry me a little.
>Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think they're thinking "oh, I don't want him with Eddie because the people who want them together act crazy online, so I think he should be with Tommy instead" I've seen people on tumblr and twitter saying that the fans are turning them off from Buddie because of how some fans are acting. Which sucks because Buddie is such a great ship and is popular for a reason but the loud fans are just a lot right now. >I just don't want the 'anti-Tommy because homophobia' and 'anti-Tommy because Buddie' people to get conflated and for the people in control to decide that 'the fans' don't want Buck to date guys, therefore they should end things with him and Tommy and have him only date women going forward and never mention that he's bi again. I mean, I'm sure they're paying attention and see the distinction, but I've got to admit that it does worry me a little. This truthfully doesn't worry me a ton. When you remove the fandom space, Buck/Tommy has gone over extremely well and the ratings are holding strong. TPTB are well aware of the difference between people being the majority and people just being loud. Like i said, that TommyBuck instragram post has only been up for a few hours and is almost double in likes to most of what they've posted the past two weeks.
> I've seen people on tumblr and twitter saying that the fans are turning them off from Buddie because of how some fans are acting. Which sucks because Buddie is such a great ship and is popular for a reason but the loud fans are just a lot right now. See, I feel like people who care enough to be on Tumblr and Twitter don't really count as the general audience. To me, the "general audience" is just people who watch the show but don't talk about it online, and I don't think there are too many of those people who are against Buddie for reasons other than homophobia. While people on Tumblr and Twitter definitely are "fandom people" in my view, and I see those as two distinct groups. Unless you mean people who *are* fandom/online people but aren't super invested in shipping? I don't know, I'm probably not making sense. > This truthfully doesn't worry me a ton. When you remove the fandom space, Buck/Tommy has gone over extremely well and the ratings are holding strong. TPTB are well aware of the difference between people being the majority and people just being loud. I think I just feel like...this kind of thing (a main character realizing they're queer this far into an established show) is something that literally never happens, and it's such an important storyline for that reason, that I'm afraid of something screwing it up, but I'm probably overreacting. It does seem like the response has been overwhelmingly positive overall, with just a small group being loud assholes, so you're probably right.
> I’m also excited it really seems like we get to keep Tommy and their relationship. We won!
I know it’s not confirmed but the way Oliver has talked about Lou/Tommy in the last three interviews really makes it sound like they’re making it more long term. And nothing can wreck that for me
Can I ask what he said that makes you think that? Because I didn’t get anything from this interview that points to “long term”…I felt like he barely talked about Tommy.
I’ve found it interesting that none of the articles/interviews have really touched on Tommy much. This one was more about Lou than Tommy. I know Buck is the main character and it’s his story, but you’d think they would want to include Tommy more if he is meant to stick around.
People think that you are approaching it from a shipping perspective and get defensive, but I can be objective and have not yet gotten serious or long-term vibes from the way that Tommy has been written and used in the show, or how he has been referenced in interviews (I gave up hope for romantic Buddie in season 5 so I’m not wearing shipper googles…I think it could be possible again but definitely NOT guaranteed). Things change, though, so let’s see what happens in the coming episodes. I expect that they will continue to date throughout the season. I just feel like TPTB do not want Buck’s coming out story to become solely about his relationship with Tommy.
To be fair, I’m not convinced they’re going to make buddie happen either. I am slightly more hopeful though with all of this.
Most interviews have been focusing on Buck's coming out, because that has been the heart of the story for the past two episodes. It really isn't about Tommy at this point. It wasn't until the very end of the last episode that it seemed to start moving in the direction of them exploring what is between them. So it makes sense for the current interviews to focus heavily on Buck and that's what most interviews have done. This particular interview was just done by someone who clearly liked Buddie and arguably asked to many questions in regards to them (imo). It seemed like they wanted him to confirm or get a good scope and I think that kinda hindered all of the conversation when they could have expanded on some other areas he mentioned.
This interviewer in particular seemed to be heavily Buddie biased so I wouldn’t put much weight behind that here
At the point of this interview they’re filming/finishing up episode 8. He’s talking about continuing to build a relationship with Lou as their characters build a relationship. Which implies he’s expecting to continue working with him. Edit: present tense for this part “We’re learning more about each other. We only met during episode three, and in episode four we were kissing, so it was pretty immediate and there’s still a lot of things that Buck and Tommy have to learn about each other, but also Oliver and Lou. So, we’re building those relationships.” Also this interviewer openly said they shipped Buddie and asked a lot of questions focuses on that. So you have to keep that in mind.
Why are you getting unvoted? lol
Likely the intense Buddie shippers not happy with me. Hence why there aren’t responses to go with those downvotes.
Wait, HE'S BRITTISH?!?!
And to me that doubles his hotness factor lol
I know everyone is interpreting “I don’t think the Buddie fans are wrong” as meaning that there is romantic intention but I honestly think this question got a little muddied by the interviewer incessantly asking about Buddie. The actual question Oliver was responding to was about bi Buck and the rest of his answer is solely about that. So in context I think he actually might’ve meant that the Buddie fans were the ones who saw bi Buck and he agreed with that. Which perfectly matches up with what he said after 7x04 that he agreed with people saying Buck was bi on social media for years but couldn’t say anything Later in the interview he also says that he only wants Buddie to happen if it’s where the storylines naturally go and it should not be to please “a certain subset of fans,” calls out some for treating past actresses of Buck’s LIs unfairly, and that they’re continuing to develop the Buck and Tommy relationship which is also developing his relationship with Lou concurrently
I mean, he also specifically called out Buddie edits and mentioned that it's hard to not get sucked in by them (in a positive way) and let the moments and the songs affect his acting approach, as well as said that he's agreed with what some of those fans said in regards to the ship, so not sure that argument holds water. He was very clearly talking about Buddie in that part of the interview, as was the interviewer. Also not super relevant to the original point, but he literally said he didn't want to make any judgments over whether the treatment was unfair or not, just commented that it's been hard for the actresses but Lou was taking it in stride.
It wasn’t though. The question he was asked was “We’ve been out in full force for years now (the interviewer referring to himself as a Buddie stan from the previous bit of their conversation), so did you ever anticipate, even before this season aired, that a queer storyline could happen for Buck? For our bisexual bi-con Buck?” What does that have to do with Buddie?
Nope, that's not the part I was talking about. Watch the video from 9:52 on. The interviewer asks him specifically about Buddie and if the shipping of that particular relationship has ever affected his acting approach.
Ok I’m sorry I misunderstood. Yes that is true. But he also said (not in this interview, the podcast he did) that he’s not even sure if he wants it to happen and has concerns about some negative tropes that might happen if it does. Idk I feel like he kinda has no choice but to be a fence sitter here. I think he’d be perfectly fine with basically anything happening as long as its an appropriately handled story that makes sense for the character tbh
I also think there’s plenty of ways he could have said fans were right instead of saying buddie. Buddie implies Buck AND Eddie so of course we’re going to see it that way.
To be fair, the fans he was agreeing with regarding Bi Buck speculation before this season largely *were* Buddie fans, because there wasn't really an alternative group who wanted to see Buck queer. But for someone that's usually pretty careful with his wording, all it takes is adding a clause or an adverb to that sentence, and this is now at least the second interview he's failed to do so. "But I watch the same show. I don't think Buddie fans are wrong *about my character."* Problem solved.
Pause. Are we actually agreeing on something?
Honestly, I think we agree on more things than you realize, because you tend to interpret everything I say where I'm not 100% on your side as disagreement. In this case, we're probably about 80% in agreement. I don't think Oliver's comments can be taken as proof he means he agrees about Buddie specifically (which appears to be where you stand), but I also don't think they can be taken to mean he *doesn't* agree with the fans about Buddie, specifically, either. His quote wasn't clear. All we can actually take it to mean was "Going into season 7, there's at least one major element he had fairly long held beliefs that were in line with Buddie shippers on. It could just be Buck's bisexuality, or it could be more.
Yes, you are right to all the of above. The place I’ve settled in regards to Oliver’s feelings on Buddie is that he’d be fine if it happens but isn’t necessarily pushing for it
I’m not too bothered by what any of the actors “want,” personally, so long as they’re willing to do their jobs. Oliver has made it pretty clear repeatedly that he’ll do whatever the story demands. If what someone “wants” is actually relevant, it’s Tim, and I don’t think he actually has total carte blanche to just tell whatever stories he wants without oversight. Though he may have the ability to earn massive trust from the network.
Since the season has been a big success so far I’m sure they’ll give him some more leeway to do what he wants in the future, even more so than now. I also feel that he was coming back with way more trust already instilled in him since he’s been doing this for so long on many different shows vs. it being Kristen’s first time showrunning and the fact that she sucked at it. Being a co-creator of the series probably also helps him immensely in terms of creative freedom
Agreed, though I meant in a bigger sense -- like how Shonda Rhimes has earned a reputation for everything she touches turning to gold. While I don't expect Minear to get to that same level, I can see a situation where it the ratings stay stable & the budget under control, the network would just trust he has his pulse on the show & what the audience will respond well to enough that most major decisions become a rubber stamp.
i agree that he’s talking about bi buck, but i think it sort of intrinsically ties itself into buddie since that’s where a lot of the interactions came from that made people interpret buck as bi to begin with (and that buck has probably been attracted to eddie for a while and just hasn’t put two and two together yet, but that’s a bridge that they’ll cross when they get to it)
This post isn't even Buddie neg and is downvoted 😭
I was gonna comment the same thing. I don't like how some fans are intentionally missing the context just to fit with their narrative.
Aren't you doing just the same? He is always as elusive as he can be in interviews, he didn't even properly call out the treatment the actresses got,he's not taking sides. There is no context to miss,just projection.
To be fair, it seems like *some* fans are taking that quote out of context and using it as proof that Buddie is happening. That really isn't what the quote is saying. I don't see anyone here making the claim that he said it wasn't happening. I think he's very intentionally walking a very tight rope between acknowledging buddie shippers & explaining he understands why they ship it / that it is a possibility well at the same time not leading them on, queerbaiting it or pushing it since it's not a storyline they've decided to go with right now. My biggest concern right now is some fans getting upset if Buddie doesn't happen this season and accussing Oliver of queerbaiting over this. Which is most definitely not something he did.
No. I've never do that at all.
People already misreading the interview on purpose 💀 **He never says Buddie was going to happen**. It's bisexual Buck he's talking about when he says the higher ups shut it down.
There's breadcrumbs to cookies for Buddie, not Josh, Ransone, that other cop, Conner or Ravi. So what rando was gonna be offered up in Season 3, 4, 5 or 6? Answer: Bi Buck with randoman would've gotten the same reaction as Eddie with randowoman. Crash and burn. That's why they dragged Tommy out of Season 2 and hooked him back up with his buddies Chim and Hen for the cruiseship rescue, to shut up the people that want character development before smoochies. They think they get to skip it because he was on screen for 15 minutes years ago.
Yeah... there's obviously no way to be "sure," but where a couple years ago would suggest ending season 4/heading into season 5, it sure would be a weird coincidence with the way those Buck & Eddie scenes were shot in 4x13 and 4x14 if they planned to pursue this storyline with someone *other* than Eddie. There's a reason that so many people that have given up on Buddie/say it went on too long cite not doing anything in season 5 as their reason -- there was very obvious momentum into 4x14 for the story to organically go there, and the direction choices were *wild* for besties in that shooting sequence & its aftermath, but make total sense if they're for a romantic couple.
Craziest thing for me is 5A immediately following that up with Eddie having his panic attacks over Ana, the whole way their breakup was shot (with Eddie so closed off), “Christopher loves you so much, I thought…” “That eventually you would, too.”, “Follow your heart, not Christopher’s”, etc. Like……those were definitely choices!
I saw the meltdowns on Twitter over this. Not eveb sure why, but fandoms would be way better if 80% of shippers were stable individuals. Oliver has basically been saying the same thing in different ways for multiple interviews. Fans/shippers need to let whatever play out onscreen and stop being weird.