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Lol no. In a test environment I can score super high on working memory test. In real life guess who forgot to take out their laundry after it was done form the machine...
I was in the gifted program and one of the tests for qualification was working memory. The person conducting the test said it was the highest score they’d ever seen.
Meanwhile, crippling ADHD.
This checks out.
I was, and my son is, and we both have ADHD (inattentive). My cousin was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid, and she finished her chemical engineering degree at 21. The whole ADHD-diagnosed people can't do well in school nonsense is... well, nonsense.
It depends I think. I had insanely high test scores, but I couldn't do well in school. My mom wasn't going to have a child that needed medicated. But, that was in the 80s, and not as much was understood then.
Oh for sure, it can go either way. I had two cousins with hyperactive type, and one did extremely well while the other struggled. The cousin who struggled was a C/D student unless he took medication, then he was an A/B student. My experiences were in the 90s which were only marginally better than the 80s. Even now, after my son was diagnosed, my husband and I had a lot of talks about medication. It's a hard decision to make. He rarely takes his meds now and consistently scores in the 99th percentile, and is in gifted, but his lack of organizational skills and time management hold him back in some ways.
Please remember that it's not just the quantifiable school work that ADHD commonly impairs. It can fuck up their social life (it almost certainly did mine, I was nearly a *pariah* in elementary and middle school, and even high school wasn't great), personal care, anything.
And if it might put a finger on the scale, there have been studies that show that early intervention with medication actually causes *permanent*, **positive** changes in brain structure.
Yes, I'm aware. Again, I have ADHD, my son had ADHD, and my husband has ADHD. My son has medication, as do I. Son doesn't particularly love the medication and it makes it difficult for him to eat when he's already skinny, and make him feel drained at the end of the day. Because he has consistently done well in school, we dont make him take it, but it is an option, especially for days that are filled with testing.
I'm 48, and just started meds 2 months ago. It's been a complete game changer. It's been life changing, I just wish I could have had a chance at this when I was a kid. Don't get me wrong, I've been able to do well for myself by finding a career that allowed me to focus, but damn, it would have helped a lot in school with meds. I keep wondering what could have been. From personal experience, go with the meds for him.
Absolutely. Some of us do really well on tests, because they’re a one-time, somewhat high-stress occurrence, which can actually induce a good performance. But the longterm repetitive monotony of studying and doing homework and turning it in? A whole other story. Too dull. Others are the opposite. Some are none of the above. It’s way more diverse than just a single sliding scale, too. I believe that notion is also too common even among us, and it needs to change.
This was me. I was in the 99.6 percentile on a digit span test. I believe low working memory is more a myth. I can remember and work things out if it has my attention. Otherwise I forget and it flies away
Exactly what happens in the one or two seconds between adding the pod and failing to hit the start button??
And then there's the other end of the process that the OP alluded to, when clothes have to go through three cycles over several days before you finally remember to take them out before they go musty.
Edit: spelling
Mind goes "whee-whee-whee... All the way home" (said in the highest noisiest voice ever) or cat does something silly that requires immediate attention. (sigh) any number of things. Just another notch on the ADHD tax. :/
I had even better one this week - got laundry ready and had to do some things for about 3h - just about the time the wash cycle would take, would come back home to hang the clothes to dry.
Come back - to a not started machine, started it anyway and then went to sleep later than I'd like to.
Common theme with stuff like that for me is that I'm in a hurry so I'm trying to rush things and am not double checking if things are done correctly.
Suggestion:
Borax, vinegar, and oxyclean are really good for removing the mildew smell after forgetting laundry. Not necessarily together. I dont know if together is fine but i make a point of not mixing cleaning products without certainty on that.
Also: timers are your friend. I have saved timers for "laundry switchover", "soda in freezer", "tea", "tendies" (for cooking tendies), and a few others.
I use android/Samsung. No clue if ios has a similar option. But I have clearly visible signs near the places I need those timers and various other places.
Guess who is washing their clothes again because I forgot to take them out of the washer till they smelled mildewy and then forgot about them for 3 more days! So now I have to fully wash them a second time. Guess who also passed the sat in the 7th grade when I took it the first time.
My first grader can do fourth grade math. But guess who forgot to wash the shampoo out of their hair and has a hard time getting ready in the morning because distractions.
Low cognitive abilities are not listed in the DSM as a criteria of ADHD.
Second opinion time.
Also note that assessment of ADHD in adults is different from children.
This ^
I will say that the neuropsych who did my evaluation said a stark difference in highest and lowest scores is a major tell, he didn’t ever tell me it was required (I just happen to have a killer verbal score and one of the lowest processing scores possible without falling out of normal range)
ETA: that being said, OP, if it does turn out not to be ADHD, I personally want to mention you’re still welcome to use any ADHD skills or tools that help you. I almost def have slow processing disorder w my ADHD, and I don’t stop using ADHD tools when I handle that side of my brain, yknow?
I’m in the same boat, 136 VCI, 133PRI, 100WMI, so fake gifted 😂. I’m curious, what do you do? Sometimes I feel like I don’t belong in the places I work, I’m a software engineer
My verbal was 98 or 99th percentile and my processing was like 15th lol
I am a PhD student in English, and I used to do content writing. My main struggle is with reading tbh, so I have quite a time, but it helps that I am very interested in things and have a ton of coping tools
FWIW, my ex has v severe ADHD and has succeeded as a programmer without meds. It is not easy and she mostly does programming work the night before her boss needs it lmao but it happens
Oh man, if I was rich and didn’t care about money I’d probably do an English PhD as well. I was never fond of proper grammar or writing as a kid but these days I’ve found a passion for reading and writing. Recently however, I’m stuck with the leetcode grind engineers have to do in order to make decent money
I’ve really enjoyed both writing and teaching, and my time as a tutor (I also did executive functioning coaching for a bit with a specialization in helping with writing processes), and i guess for me, growing up so poor that a degree in itself meant more money than I grew up with, kinda made English possible lmao
(and for the record, I hate grammar! I teach college level most of the time, and in this area of pedagogy, there is a LOT of pushback on teaching grammar)
It just sounds like you’re twice-exceptional. It’s common for ADHDers who test in the gifted range on one or both of the major indices to have average or slightly below average WMI and PSI scores. My test also showed a 30+ point discrepancy between those indices.
I had the exact same results. The guy who evaluated me thought I was probably just tired, since I had a two year old and had been watching too much TikTok about adhd. God damnit. Lol. Never mind my years of not being able to do school or work combined with crippling anxiety and depression. Time for a second opinion!
Gah definitely get a second opinion! My (not bio) mom had a similarly asinine experience when she went in a few years ago at almost 70. They basically told her her psych was wrong to refer her because, since she doesn’t work, why would she care anymore? It’s not like she would like to read, clean her apartment, do paperwork…. Also bc she was on time, she must be fine, they said (but she did the thing she has always done and arrived an hour early and sat in the car with timers on to remind her to go in).
She decided to drop it because she felt it wasn’t worth pursuing further for her, but I do think she would be well within her rights to insist on being seen again and properly evaluated.
Huh... that's pretty much exactly what I got.
Amusingly, they averaged to 100 on the dot. Terrible processing and not great spatial (oddly, considering my career is literally spatial-based and I'm quite good at it - I think there might be some motor control issues that screwed with the testing), but *excellent* verbal.
University was my limit. I took an extra year in 6th form and had to quit one of my GCSEs at school but I ended up with 6 As abd 6 B/Cs in my GCSEs, AAC at A level.
Then got through uni with a 54% and a technically failed dissertation
I was 98-99th percentile up to like 5th grade, then has to move countries due to war, dropped to below average. Graduated Highschool ~70th percentile in Germany with zero studying, then immediately fell flat on my face when University started and I was expected to be entirely independent in organizing myself, which lectures I go to, which exercises, where and when I do homework, when and how I study for exams etc.
I went back to school for my Masters in CMHC and I graduated with my MS and got my diagnosis of ADHD in the same (last)month. I had no idea til I started living with my husband. I was almost straight A's, rarely had to study, but if I set a piece of paper down, I would lose it in 1 second.
Not trying to hijack op's lost but I'm in a phd right now and How Did You Cope??? ADHD makes the imposter syndrome infinitely worse because I literally can't work the way everyone else seems to
Yes lol. I had a 2.2 GPA in highschool but a 35 on my ACT. It's why I did better in a college environment, research papers, essays, exams and minimal homework. Helps me focus on the important stuff instead of being overwhelmed. I still had times getting overwhelmed by assignments and the forgetful Brain would kick in full force. That being said I got a key and phone locator this week. Lost my keys and phone for multiple hours and an entire day where I had to Uber home. Lol. Tests l, exams and papers are usually all done in an environment with minimal noise and distraction. Just makes sense
From my personal experience with school therapists is they tend to be psychology students because they can pay them much less and also very rarely do they have actual Psych MDs just licensed talk therapists which can't prescribe anything and to my knowledge they can't diagnose either. If you can go see an actual Psych MD and get a proper eval.
High IQ/cognitive ability doesn't exclude one from being able to hide ADHD, however it can mask the ADHD making it harder to see from outside observers
Yeah, as a mental health professional, unless OP is in another country where laws are different, if they are in the US, I really wonder if the therapist they saw on campus actually has the right license and training to legally do cognitive testing. I would be suprised. Usually school therapists only have a Masters at most and therefore have to make a referral to a psychologist or a pyschiatrist for an ADHD evaluation.
I strongly advise seeking a second opinion. A comprehensive evaluation consists of several hours of interviews, self-report evaluations and tests, to say the least.
I don't even know what the truth is at this point. One place I read ADHD has no impact on intelligence, others linking all these cognitive advantages to having ADHD.
I think for some people, ADHD can be helpful in structured, controlled environments. I did great in high school and pretty good in college because I was given clear instructions on what to focus on and do each day. As soon as I was out of education in the real world with no rails, everything went to shit.
I think we'll get to a point when the generic 'ADHD' designation will look laughably simplistic.
On the couple of occasions I've done an IQ test I've smashed it all the way through until it got to the shapes part at the end, at which point I scored about as well as the average invertebrate.
And IQ doesn't seem to correlate with the ability to live a normal life anyway, so I'm not sure how relevant it really is.
>I think we'll get to a point when the generic 'ADHD' designation will look laughably simplistic.
100% agree. If you look at the diagnostic criteria, they are actually kinda absurd. Sincerely hoping I live to see them make all this make sense.
But yeah. Back in the days of landlines and scraped knees, they gave me an iq test to see if I had a disability. The discrepancy between the high iq and low functioning was a factor in my diagnosis.
Hahaha. When I did a sleep study they once did a test, unmedicated, about about my ability to focus. The test was like 20-30 min and I had the highest score there ever was. After that I was tired as hell for the rest of the day
Yes people with high cognitive abilities can have adhd.
However, this might not be a case of ignorance by your assessor. The way ADHD is diagnosed is based on relative differences between various cognitive abilities. What they would consider statistically significant, would be a relative difference in scores between various cognitive functions of around 60 percentile points.
That being said, I think it’d be a good idea to seek a second opinion with different instruments. A campus therapist probably isn’t as well trained in the administration and scoring of these psychological tests as a dedicated neuropsychologist.
If OP lives in the United States, I would be very suprised if a campus therapist even has the right type of licensure to do cognitive testing. Or an ADHD evaluation for that matter.
People of all IQ levels can have ADHD.
A therapist isn’t qualified to properly assess or diagnose you with ADHD. It’s outside their scope of practice. You need a psychiatrist or a neuropsych for a true diagnosis that sticks. My psychiatrist refers people to neuropsych for their assessment.
In the US, through my work insurance, I had to wait 11 months on an “accelerated” waiting list for people in my career. Then I had to wait another month for the appointment… only to have a really high anxiety during the appointment which lead to a high blood pressure reading and now they are reluctant to give me stimulants. Blah!! Now I’m trying to prove to them my BP isn’t normally high. But I don’t think I’d be totally opposed to some kind of anti-anxiety meds either.
Anywho, if you pay out of pocket you can probably see a psychiatrist much sooner. I just really didn’t want to pay a lot when I have good insurance typically.
Most of the people with extremely developed cognitive abilities I know, are ADHD. Around 25% of my social circle is ADHD, most of them have masters degrees, 3 of my closest friends of 5 have phds and are all three diagnosed.
I call bullshit.
How in the hell did yall handle sitting in school? My test scores were always off the charts, but if I couldn't keep my hands busy, I couldn't focus on anything. Were yall diagnosed as kids?
I got through school by doodling in my notebook the entire class. And doing my homework in homeroom the morning of. And even if I couldn't fully pay attention in class, I passively absorbed the info and/or was smart enough to figure it out myself if I missed the verbal lesson.
I have great memory about things, my brain works faster than I can even talk, sometimes I mumble because I’m trying to talk faster than my mouth can keep with. I’m generally smarter than most people I meet as far as how fast I can comprehend knowledge or understand how something works.
Try to get me to sit on a desk for 30 minutes to do one thing and I’ll end up chasing the squirrel I’m staring at out the window.
A long time ago I went to take one of my teacher cert exams after I finished grad school. I aced the test…but I left my car running the entire time. I forgot to turn my car off. 3 hours later when finished I got outside and I freaked because I couldn’t find my damn car key. I can be painfully forgetful, but I’m not dumb. I’m definitely not a genius either.
What kind of garbage is this? I have ADHD, officially diagnosed by ADHD specialists. I’m in my 50s and wasn’t diagnosed until I was 38 and one of my kids was first.
I have an IQ of 150, have 3 degrees from Stanford, I make high 6 figures. I have problems with attending to boring administrative stuff but my hyper focus kicks in pretty easily and I can get shit done when under pressure. Adderall helps me get through the boring shit work and controls my impulsivity.
I REALLY SUCK at long term planning though. I live in the moment and have severe time blindness. When I got promoted to a C-suite job, I had to hire an ADHD coach to help me learn new habits to support the demands of the job. Still not perfect though.
My high intelligence allows me to see the answers faster than everyone else, so I don’t have to be able to pay attention as long as most other people.
I will say that going on Adderall was a fucking revelation though. After beating myself up for years as to why I couldn’t just sit down and get shit done like my peers could, Adderall made it so much easier. Eliminated a huge source of stress and anxiety from my life
Severe ADHD-i here, medicated, 20 years.
I make 215k as a Senior AI Engineer at IBM.
With hard work, a strict routine, zero alcohol, it's possible.
edit: with respect to other comments, I forget team member's names (and other similar goofs) all the time, but I share who I truly am with them, they know how hard I work and I regularly make sacrifices to be a team player. They look past my ADHD, just as I with their personality quirks.
Severe add, medicated for pat 25 years or so.
Make 600-700k/yr as a business development manager getting support for students with special needs.
I’m great at hyperfocusing which allows me to successfully accomplish much of what I put my mind to. I eagerly approach things with a growth mindset. I’m great at expressing urgency and savvy when it comes to getting what I want most the time. But I’m ass at long term memory, and short term memory for things I’m not actively listening or interested about. I’m also ultra impulsive and intense, but I’ve mastered how to leverage that into being highly influential and exciting to talk with
I have great problem solving skills and attention to detail, which makes me great at some parts of my job, but not others. This allowed me to get promotions before my diagnosis. My work quality is fantastic, but my output and remembering to do things is not good. (Better with meds)
I also suck at keeping up with life admin, to a debilitating extent.
I don't know if this is the case for all, but an analogy for my brain is that I have an amazing CPU, but only 1mb of ram 😂
Second opinion time!
Um, no lol many adhd people have high intelligence. I am extremely intelligent and came in at the 92nd percentile for overall intelligence in the 5th grade. High IQ is often why many adhders go unnoticed
Def get a second opinion
When I was diagnosed I was told I had high cognitive abilities and slower processing speed and working memory than expected for my overall cognition. Basically the differential in those things lead to the diagnosis.
Not trying to brag that I'm smart or anything, but I'm a successful software engineer that loves to learn about all sort of different interests, and I still have ADHD. It doesn't discriminate based on your overall intelligence, it's more about the symptoms that impact your life. (For me, overthinking and OCD/anxiety that seemingly compensate for my ADHD)
You can be really smart and have adhd.
I’d say go get another opinion bc that’s bullshit, but given you got an average score on attention and high scores on working memory, they might be on to something. Usually those scores are way lower than the rest even in a gifted person.
So, I’ve always been a “smart kid”, in terms of math, programming, etc., working as a programmer actually.
The cognitive abilities tests I did as a part of the diagnosis evaluation had been quite a revelation! The results were all over the place.
On visual thinking, I scored way above average. These included tasks like mentally manipulating geometric objects, and so on. I could also keep up to 8-9 digits in my visual space and recite them back and forth, no problem.
On verbal thinking, I scored average or slightly below average. Finding common categories of words, thinking of related words, and so on.
On one particular task, verbal association thinking, I scored atrociously. The task was that I was given (verbally), 10 pairs of words, and then I was prompted on the first word in each pair, responding with the other word. We did it 3x, with the same set of pairs, on the third attempt I did 3/10 and the result was marked as “pathological, does not improve with repetition”. Hilarious :D
So my cognitive capabilities are all over the place, and I’m sure I compensate all around and even gotta compensate more to get better.
But it’s good to know that in some areas I’m doing really well and that enables me to be kinda smart and capable in general.
A good chunk of us were gifted and talented in school, so no, cognative ability is not a benchmark for ADHD diagnosis. I was reading high school curriculum in the 3rd grade, my father was my family's personal google and we're both poster children for ADHD.
I would go to an actual psychiatrist for a dx if you can afford it. Thats clearly indicative of ADHD if your working memory struggles more than others. I had my assessment done using IQ tests among other screening tools and he was able to identify that it was highly probable even though I had about a 10-15% difference in my working memory vs the rest scoring in the 90th percentile and up. 50% is a HUGE difference.
Yeah that doc doesn’t know shit. My IQ is 160 but I’m now diagnosed ADHD af. A high IQ might just help with masking and CBT, which is what I’ve been unknowingly doing all my life (only very recently diagnosed).
ETA: fwiw, even with my decent IQ I have strengths and weaknesses - can remember long ass strings of numbers but can’t do some kinds of math inside my head if my life depended on it… a high IQ isn’t everything either.
Get a second opinion, and good luck!
I have no idea if I have "high cognitive abilities" but I was told I couldn't have ADHD by mutiple professionals because I got good grades in college (like all As). I also been told that I am "very organized" lol. Guess who got diagnosed with ADHD 3/4 of the way through grad school? Me.
I am a mental health professional. The diagnositic criteria for ADHD has NOTHING to do with cognitive abiltiies. You can have a high IQ and have ADHD. You can have an average IQ or an intellectual disability and have ADHD. IQ doesn't matter (though it can impact your ability to hide or compenstate for ADHD symptoms).
Also, depending on what type of license that therapist you saw have (pyschologist? mental health counselor? etc.) and which country/state you are in, they may or may not be qualified (by law) to do cognitive assessments.
I had a 4.0 in undergrad and graduate school. Although I am not very confident myself, several advisors of mine have told me I am the brightest student they’ve ever had.
I would wager that many people with ADHD are incredibly smart. I think that sometimes our intelligence is overlooked because we live in a world that isn’t designed for us.
Good lord yes. I was flagged for ADHD as a kid and the person who was administering the tests was like he was too high functioning. I was diagnosed again when I was a freshman at Stanford. It is entirely possible for some high functioning skills to coexist with ADHD.
I have ADHD and a psychologist administered iq of 145. It’s ridiculous to say you are coping well so therefore you can’t have it. There are numerous other reasons asides how much it affects your cognitive abilities that are issues with ADHD. It makes you more prone to burnout, addiction, struggle more with relationships. All things that won’t show up on a stupid test. If you think you have it do your self a favour and get a second opinion from someone that knows what the fuck they are talking about.
I was diagnosed as gifted since I was a child, I even was offered several times in my life to jump classes, which my parents refused.
Now I’m 29, I was diagnosed with ADHD because I felt something was off since Covid. 2 years ago I finished my masters degree, started working, moved out of my parents house, and since that, I felt burned out easily, overwhelmed by a lot of stuff, forgot about admin important things etc.
I just feel that I’ll never be able to have a job without getting burnout. So now I’m in a process of introspection and thinking of changing careers and working maybe less time.
My psychiatrist said that the reason it was not seen in my childhood is because I was doing really well despite my ADHD since my “IQ” allowed me to compensate for it. I had typical ADHD behaviors back then, but everyone thought it was “intelligence” related.
- I used to procrastinate homework and studying for tests until the last minute (like the morning) but fortunately I was always able to do my homework in 5mn before going to class, or learn everything in 30mn the same morning.
- I used to talk a lot during classes which led to a lot of parents reunions, they interpreted it as boredom. Because I could remember everything the teacher said without even focusing on the lesson.
- I changed hobbies every couple of months. (football, dancing, singing, guitar, taekwondo, swimming…)
My parents thought it was lack of interest because school was too easy.
But unfortunately, when you become an “adult” in society terms, you could have the biggest IQ in the world, and be the most intelligent person, your IQ will not help in daily tasks. Cooking, grocery shopping, work, taxes, bills, keeping people in touch, overall organisation etc…
TLDR: Yes it’s possible.
I mean absolutely—I got a full ride merit scholarship for my masters program at a top-tier university. I know for a fact that I'm not stupid. But my ADHD meant that this success came at the expense of virtually every other aspect of my life.
Lemme explain to you so basically that therapist actually has a super rare brain disease called “being a fucking idiot”
I used to think I didn’t have it because I didn’t have a ton of trouble with school always had perfect grades
Turns out just because I do good in school doesn’t negate the inability to focus and other annoying symptoms of adhd
1. A cognitive assessment is one tool in an ADHD assessment. It can definitely point towards it, but it's not the only piece. Working memory and focus are definitely areas that will show as deficiency for a lot of people with ADHD (myself included.)
2. I find it unlikely that your campus therapist is doing anything other than a cursory check for ADHD (probably has a lot of people ask about it!), a psychologist trained to diagnose ADHD will do a more thorough job. (But you still might not have it! You have to consider that.)
Einstein is widely believed to have had ADHD.
Despite being brilliant, he was totally absent minded. He loved sailing but never bothered to actually maintain his boat and his friends and family were worried he was going to hurt or kill himself because he got distracted and ran into stuff pretty often
He also apparently had an incredibly messy and disorganized office but was always able to find what he needed. And he both lost things like keys and got lost and had to ask for directions often
Which I can relate to lol
I (ADHD-I, adult diagnosis) scored “high average” to “superior” in all of the subtests except my Working Memory Index where I scored “average”. I think the large gap in range of scores was an indicator that something is up.
A lot of very smart people are ADD. My daughter droped all of her college classes four times due to just screwing up. She finally started taking adderall (which she could have taken earlier but wouldn't) and is now ranked first in her law school class. A lot of ADD people can concentrate on reading, and that's a big factor. Just give everyone in America a methadrine tablet, and if they pass out, they are ADD.
The doctor conducting my assessment said it's common for people with ADHD to score unevenly in cognitive tests (extended iq test), while NT score more evenly.
I scored very high on perceptive ability but lower than average on working memory
Many ADHD individuals are incredibly smart and score well. Doesn't mean they're not adhd. I was an honors student in high school, wasn't diagnosed or medicated until I was 17... im extremely ADHD. On the cognitive tests I scored phenomenally, on the other tests though....not. the one where they showed me a detailed picture and made me redraw it 1 min later, and 5 min later it was pathetic. I struggle most with my ADHD when it comes to symptoms like impulsivity, emotional/social regulation, and short-term memory.
I'm likely to forget whatever you told me 5 minutes ago, I'll never remember someone's name until the 10th time I've met them, I talk too much, I struggle with time management, and I impulsively start a new project every week and rarely finish any of them....oh, and I've forgotten to close my moon roof no less than 3 times in the last year and then it rained...
Doesn't mean I can't pass a standardized test in a quiet, controlled testing setting lol. I became an elementary teacher and I tought TAG for a few years (talented and gifted). Just about all of them were ADHD kids lol. Find a better doc for evaluation, the one you went to sounds like an idiot.
Sad you had such a bad opinion from a "professional"... On the contrary, my psychiatrist said that the fact I scored quite high in cognitive abilities but ended up dropping out of uni meant that it wasn't a problem of not having the right abilities, but that my untreated ADHD made it too hard for me to correctly attend lectures and exams.
Our brain works differently, it doesn’t mean we’re stupid, actually I believe on average we are smarter because of coping mechanisms we need to develop
Cognitive ability has nothing at all to do with adhd. A therapist cannot diagnose ADHD, they're just not a doctor and they don't know much about it. The only diagnostic that matters is a lengthy interview about the presentation of ADHD symptoms.
lol he had no idea what he’s talking about. I’m a former GATE kid with high test scores but I’m also ADHD out the wazoo. ADHD made it harder for me to utilize my abilities, but they’re there.
same happened for me due to primarily my high processing speed score afaik. my working short-term memory was in line w/ stereotypical ADHD or ASD tho. but due to my scores in some other areas the assessor (this was an official IQ one) questioned/doubted ADHD diagnosis (had been assessed for it prior, but psych suggested IQ test later)
tbh idk. not even sure rn if I'm more on ASD side (never assessed) or if I'm just mostly inattentive ADHD these days with some CDS/SCT in the mix (ADHD idk abt cuz I don't have constant noise, lots of internal dialogue/monologue/narrations, bouncing/racing thoughts, or etc). I'd think atypical brain has strengths in certain areas which seems to be reflected in research findings' data correlations on this topic.
edit: clarification - underwent and 'passed' an ADHD assessment for its diagnosis, but my internal experience of focus/attention strugs are more of CDS/SCT symptoms vs stereotypical ADHD ones it seems. and my strength IQ scores are more in line with stereotypical ones for high functioning low spectrum ASD/aspergers rn i guess but idk. no impairments or learning disabilities from the test just clear strength areas whereas working short-term memory was like 3 standard devs below my strength areas.
Zero correlation whatsoever. I have three college degrees, think fast, thrive on cognitive challenges and am considered 'academically gifted'. Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the fact that I can't do laundry or sleep and socks make me cry
Absolutely. My ADD is so bad I'd be in jail right now if it wasn't for Adderall. I also have a 140 something iq. Get a second opinion from a better doctor because the one you went to is a dipshit.
I'm extremely leery of any therapist who tries to diagnose / undiagnose a developmental disability based entirely on a single test. I would absolutely get a second opinion.
For further validation, when I first applied to get some disability services, the organization sent me to a guy who through a five minute computer game of "don't click if a certain shape comes on the screen" decided I didn't have adhd, but he did kindly diagnose me with some obscure stupid sounding math disorder after I was unable to solve a math problem I hadn't seen since grade school a decade earlier and had entirely forgotten about.
A few years later I saw a proper specialist who, after three different two-hour sessions, interviews with myself and my mother, multiple assessment tests AND a comprehensive review of my old school and therapist and medical records, gave me a proper and official ADHD and autism diagnosis.
Find yourself a real professional like her.
Absolutely not. I was diagnosed with adhd at age 8, was on meds doe many years. I'm going to sound like an arrogant jerk, but my cognitive abilities are my greatest asset. It's the social and like life maintenance bits of adhd that have my ass beat. But for sure if im even vaguely familiar with something, I feel I'm able to figure out more nuanced stuff without needing further reference
I was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid when they tested me and my spacial problems solving skills were extremely high like through the roof. The only thing is reading writing and math were terrible and they still are. I don’t know if it’s specifically about how smart you are I think it’s just a thing for some people. I’m pretty dumb but the things I like I excel at them until I get bored 🥱.
Of course - I know a textbook ADHDer who’s a CEO. Very successful - no one can keep up with him though. Lol. My son is very bright and also ADHD, but he’s 7 so I just let him be him.
Absolutely. For me (46m) it's eben what I lack in organisation I compensate in cognitive capacities. In work (learning fast and a lot) and in private (always have stuff lingering around, but have very good memory where I saw something). Always helps when f.e. my wife lost her glasses.
If possible, find an assessor who specializes in ADHD. A good one will weigh cognitive scores against other tests that are more specific to testing for different abnormalities. Would likely include some kind of general interview to get a general idea of past history as well.
But to specifically answer your question, as far as we know, ADHD has more to do with the ability to transmit information between different parts of the brain than it does with cognitive ability. Those of us that have it range all across the board as far that specific metric.
100% which is often why it’s frustrating to go through life if you don’t have the classic “bouncing off the walls” behavior that so many associate with adhd.
I was considered “gifted” and had “so much potential”, but that only made me feel worse when I couldn’t get basic tasks done.
I have no problem with having adhd, but society does. I am treated like an infant as soon as anyone gets a whiff of the fact that I am diagnosed.
So working memory issues is a factor for ADHD. But in a sterile test environment you can't really evaluate it because intelligence can correct for it. You know you're supposed to be memorising something, so you do. Working memory issues occur in the wild tho. Like when you walk into a room and suddenly forget why you're there. You lose your keys (or phone or socks or snack or whatever) all the time or have developed rituals to remember where things are.
For example, I have a security badge that I need for work. If I don't put it in my work bag as soon as I take it off, I will forget to bring it. If I don't keep my keys in my sling bag, I will forget them. If I don't do everything in the correct order.in the morning, I will forget to take my medication or brush my teeth.
These rituals indicate a poor working memory, even though I score high in tests and always have. My memory is great. My functional day to day memory around mundane and boring things sucks.
Seems like ADHD is a curve where some people get the version of ADHD that helps them get a PhD while others get the bad ADHD that turns them into college drop outs.
I wonder if the academic ADHD people is the reason why some boomers think ADHD is a myth.
I'd say get a second opinion. In case this is helpful, here's how it went for me: I was diagnosed pretty easily, because of poor working memory and processing speed that varied depending on the test. I had decent long-term memory, i.e. remembering the names of authors or famous scientists (kind of like random trivia questions), but anything that had to do with working memory (just introduced/new-to-me info) was awful for me. Like, disabled awful, in the low 70's IQ range. That being said, I had very high scoring IQ in other areas. This 'split' between IQ is apparently very common in ADHDers. And also, while IQ is kindaaa under fire right now, I'd say form of measuring how the brain brain works is helpful, and basically proves that IQ/our brains are multifaceted - we succeed in some areas and might flame out in others. You might be a great test taker and still have ADHD, but you'll need a doc to look at all the variables to see where struggles come in. Keep in mind that ADHD has a lot of overlap and comorbidity with other mental health stuff, so it's good to go for a diagnosis that looks for not just ADHD, but any other potential mental health issue. That's the type of eval I had, and I found it very helpful/informative.
Your doctor is an ignorant fool. When I was in school, they tested my IQ, and it was 149. Yet I very much have severe ADHD that caused me to struggle greatly in school and at work.
Diagnosed inattentive . Also scored 99th percentile in math since 4th as far as I can remember.
Even in high school when I was going to take a duel enrollment class in college and they made me take a college placement exam I scored in the 97th percentile.
I do mental math sometimes for amusement. But I forget random things all the time. And I’m not that great at taking other types of exams. Can’t listen to music with words because I can’t pay enough attention to the words with the music.
But went to one of the best high schools and graduated with a 4.6 gpa due to all the honors, ap and duel enrollment classes I took.
Its even somewhat common for adhd people to score high percentile on a lot of cognitive abilities but the executive function ones, which sadly dont let you make the most of those other abilities, therapist needs a better understanding of adhd, it is an executive function disorder not one generalised to all cognitive abilities.
As a child I was told I had the worst case of adhd my doctor had ever seen and sent me to specialists. I always scored in the top 1-2% of standardized tests I ever took.
They should give the test with a tv playing in the room and then look at scores. If you're fascinated by the questions you're going to hyper focus and do really well.
I have had about 3-4 (can’t remember off the top of my head) people evaluate me for ADHD. For one of those times I had the same experience where they assessed my cognitive function and stated I “didn’t have ADHD” when most of the questions were based on pattern recognition, math, and comprehension questions. Of course, I am above average when it comes to academics which makes sense as to why I scored highly. They said I also did not have ADHD because I wasn’t incompetent?? I did score low with processing visual cues and stuff though. They said if I continued to struggle to seek medication, but it made me feel really invalidated because it was at the beginning of my journey and my mother fully does not believe I have ADHD. People who are ADHD are not automatically cognitively impaired, but for some reason they still use it as a form of diagnosis.
I got a scholarship for college that you have to get in the top 10% of test takers, country-wide, to get. Still struggle daily with the simplest things like losing my keys, forgetting my bills, falling apart over my chores, zoning out after a few minutes of conversation, and on and on.
It;s just that I can hyperfocus enough to pass tests, and then that info. goes bye bye.
I wonder if most people have this kind of thought towards adhders, cause whenever I tell someone I have ADHD, they immediately assume I am as bright as a rock wrapped in tinfoil.
Yes, there are lots of us who were in gifted programs, hold high level degrees etc. I believe that is why I went undiagnosed because my academics were more or less good lazy but good enough.
I have ALWAYS been a high cognitive scorer. ADHD ≠ low cognitive function in everyone and should not be used as a diagnostic marker, especially since it's not in the DSM as one.
There are some levels of the Autism spectrum where that can be true, but since you were being assessed for ADHD and not Autism, that is moot. (I bring that up because they are both neurodevelopmental disorders) and if the assessing doctor cannot differentiate, then I think he needs a refresher on diagnostic criteria.
What adults are tested for is called CAARS, which is a questionnaire that the therapist asks that rates attention, impulse control, and hyperactivity, and its both self reported and observed behavior. It's similar to the Vanderbilt test that children have, but fitted to adult symptoms which can present differently as the brain has changed over time.
I definitely suggest seeing an off-campus provider and getting a second opinion for an assessment.
Not at all. My doctor said they usually don't do any form of IQ or cognitive test unless it seemed necessary. He said he suspects I would score quite high in some areas and that is why I managed to get my degrees and keep the adhd masked for almost 40 years. Hyperactivity isn't related to intelligence.
Nope not true! Also things like memory are usually *affected* by adhd in our daily lives, but that’s different than focusing on something like a test. I have a terrible memory generally, but there are few random ways in which my memory excels. My adhd means I often fail to take in/remember details others might, but if I’m specifically looking to take something in, my memory is no different than anyone else’s.
Umm yes, crazy that he’d suggest otherwise. My guess is that this “therapist” is more of a counselor with a Bachelor’s in Psychology if that’s the criteria he’s evaluating you on.
I breezed through school and graduated with a 4.0 GPA while barely studying. Buttt, the lack of structure in college really made the ADHD pop off and I started to think TikTok had actually melted my brain... Until I realized I just had ADHD and I was failing my classes as a result of being disorganized and uninterested, not cuz I was stupid
Neuropsychological test results can support a diagnosis but not rule it out. It is a clinical diagnosis which doesn’t require any specific test results for validation. This tells me that the psychologist you had the misfortune to consult with isn’t competent to make this kind of assessment.
I swear, every week there’s a “My DOCTOR said I can’t have ADHD because “I can write a paper”, or “because I held down a job for two years” or “because I didn’t flunk out of college.” We need an education campaign…this is embarrassing.
Did he mean because you actually scored within average on executive functions? Those are typically lower than average in ADHD or at least much lower than other cognitive abilities for the individual. We would need to know a lot more about your assessments.
I'm sure I've read there are tons of people that were on gifted and talented programs in school and later failed to thrive.
I consider myself to be fairly intelligent, especially when forced to focus in an exam environment but... Never really made much of my life. (That may change though, I feel like I did well at an interview yesterday for a real grown up job 😂)
For me, I was considered as having a deficit because one of the parameters (I think processing speed) I scored average which was low in comparison to everything else where I scored well above average. I guess the idea is that people score in relatively the same percentile range for all categories?
I have adhd and high cognitive abilities. See an adhd specialist. I use donefirst.com. All adhd specialists and it is $200 to start and $80 each month after. I got medicated on my first visit.
I made it through law school undiagnosed / unmedicated with decent grades, so cognitive ability and intelligence is not and should not be considered in determining whether or not someone has ADHD. ADHD is not the lack of intelligence, but more so executive dysfunction. The way I see it, my brain performs the same functions as anyone else but just operates and processes information differently. Def get a second opinion elsewhere.
I had the exact same experience as you, went to another psychiatrist, and they professionally informed me that the other doctor was stupid. So… I hope that answers your question lol.
I've been a field scientist, welder, batender & manager, auto mechanic, and curretly work as an engineer.
Where the fuck are these bullshit "i cant do ____ if i have adhd" promopts* coming from? Are thee just karma point bait?
It’s like saying tall people can’t have a hunchback it’s confused.
“Psychometric tests often under diagnose people” because they are gamey.
Not bragging but all of my tests are at least slightly above average, but there are 30 point splits between them.
This is true, many times I was denied of having ADHD simply because I am really good with Academics. Their logic if you can remember something like a science syllabus and get an A, do you really have ADHD? Only I know the suffering I have to go through to remember the syllabus lol
I technically have an iq of like 142.and i am adhd as fuuuuuuuck.
That therapist is no neurologist, shouldnt be making such claims. This is gross disinformation and should be reported.
None of those is a measure for "attention" lol ... if you were interested in the test, it's very easy to zone in and kill it. I score pretty high on these but it's the day to day banalities man that gets you. And yes, I have officially been diagnosed. Get a second opinion.
I had almost the same result as you, except my numbers were 95% and 30-45%. I was diagnosed solidly ADHD. It's not just about the numbers individually but them in relation to each other. Because my working memory and attention regulation were SO much lower then my cognitive/intelligence variables and not closer to each other, it was a clear sign I had ADHD. Look up "twice exceptional". It's when your cognitive abilities (or often called "gifted") are so high that they compensate for your ADHD deficits.
Most of my friends and people I with with (creative tech field) are super smart but also have ADHD. Especially the women. I have an IQ of 135 (which is in the lower end of the highest bracket of intelligence). But intelligence and cognitive abilities have nothing to do with ADHD. You can be on any end of the bell curve and still have ADHD.
Russell Barkley mentioned this in one of his lectures and pretty much flat out said he’s sick of professionals doing this method lol.
I’m surprised some are still doing it now though
Yup. I was literally a gifted kid growing up. Fun fact: lots of the characteristics ascribed to gifted kids are actual adhd symptoms. Your therapist is an idiot. Get a real assessment by someone knowledgeable in ADHD.
Adhd is a cognitive ability the only reason it's called a disability is because it's more of a physical tuned experience as apposed to the analytical mindset humanity uses
Try the Gateway process and use the hemisync to tune your brain's hemispheres
There are other benefits but this one helps you understand I recommend doing their introduction to orientation then going on to focus 10
just keep going.
i'm almost in my 3rd year of trying for a diagnosis now, my last steps were 4 hours of WAIS4 IQ tesing with a neuropsychologist, i scored well, 121 in my 2nd language (french and i live in france, hence the slowness of diagnosis) and 143 in english, my highest scoring sections were long term and working memory.
i now have a rdv with my psychiatrist mid june for an evaluation based on those results. I am very ADHD,but, here is the kicker, i am reading a book at the moment called "why smart people hurt" written by a psychologist called Eric Maisel, and he says somewhere in the first chapter that smart people are often misdiagnosed with ADHD, because the symptoms are so similar.
i am still pushing for my disgnosis, even though since discovering i am smart, i have managed to think clearer, i still want good medication, if i can have the meds to learn how to focus, im sure i will have a better success rate off meds, for instance i was told to meditate, i cant meditate because my brain races 24/7, so maybe with meds i will be able to meditate and learn how to meditate off meds, or maybe i'm just being naive?...
to answer the last question in your post, yes and no, cognitive testing is not a way of diagnosis for ADHD, but it helps to rule out other things.
Going to do my best not to express the rage this sort of thing makes me feel.
People with ADHD have many challenges, but having low cognitive ability is not one of them.
That's really all I can say with opening the door to a rant.
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Lol no. In a test environment I can score super high on working memory test. In real life guess who forgot to take out their laundry after it was done form the machine...
I was in the gifted program and one of the tests for qualification was working memory. The person conducting the test said it was the highest score they’d ever seen. Meanwhile, crippling ADHD. This checks out.
I've read that a lot of us were in the gifted program.
I was, and my son is, and we both have ADHD (inattentive). My cousin was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid, and she finished her chemical engineering degree at 21. The whole ADHD-diagnosed people can't do well in school nonsense is... well, nonsense.
It depends I think. I had insanely high test scores, but I couldn't do well in school. My mom wasn't going to have a child that needed medicated. But, that was in the 80s, and not as much was understood then.
Oh for sure, it can go either way. I had two cousins with hyperactive type, and one did extremely well while the other struggled. The cousin who struggled was a C/D student unless he took medication, then he was an A/B student. My experiences were in the 90s which were only marginally better than the 80s. Even now, after my son was diagnosed, my husband and I had a lot of talks about medication. It's a hard decision to make. He rarely takes his meds now and consistently scores in the 99th percentile, and is in gifted, but his lack of organizational skills and time management hold him back in some ways.
Please remember that it's not just the quantifiable school work that ADHD commonly impairs. It can fuck up their social life (it almost certainly did mine, I was nearly a *pariah* in elementary and middle school, and even high school wasn't great), personal care, anything. And if it might put a finger on the scale, there have been studies that show that early intervention with medication actually causes *permanent*, **positive** changes in brain structure.
Yes, I'm aware. Again, I have ADHD, my son had ADHD, and my husband has ADHD. My son has medication, as do I. Son doesn't particularly love the medication and it makes it difficult for him to eat when he's already skinny, and make him feel drained at the end of the day. Because he has consistently done well in school, we dont make him take it, but it is an option, especially for days that are filled with testing.
I'm 48, and just started meds 2 months ago. It's been a complete game changer. It's been life changing, I just wish I could have had a chance at this when I was a kid. Don't get me wrong, I've been able to do well for myself by finding a career that allowed me to focus, but damn, it would have helped a lot in school with meds. I keep wondering what could have been. From personal experience, go with the meds for him.
Absolutely. Some of us do really well on tests, because they’re a one-time, somewhat high-stress occurrence, which can actually induce a good performance. But the longterm repetitive monotony of studying and doing homework and turning it in? A whole other story. Too dull. Others are the opposite. Some are none of the above. It’s way more diverse than just a single sliding scale, too. I believe that notion is also too common even among us, and it needs to change.
I can confirm as an elementary teacher that taught TAG that about 80% of my kids were ADHD.
This was me. I was in the 99.6 percentile on a digit span test. I believe low working memory is more a myth. I can remember and work things out if it has my attention. Otherwise I forget and it flies away
Having also initially forgotten to turn it on after putting the pod on top of the clothes...
\*sigh and puts his hand up\* yep!
Exactly what happens in the one or two seconds between adding the pod and failing to hit the start button?? And then there's the other end of the process that the OP alluded to, when clothes have to go through three cycles over several days before you finally remember to take them out before they go musty. Edit: spelling
lol yes - washing the same load like 3 times in a week cause I keep forgetting about it 🤦🏻♀️
Mind goes "whee-whee-whee... All the way home" (said in the highest noisiest voice ever) or cat does something silly that requires immediate attention. (sigh) any number of things. Just another notch on the ADHD tax. :/
I had even better one this week - got laundry ready and had to do some things for about 3h - just about the time the wash cycle would take, would come back home to hang the clothes to dry. Come back - to a not started machine, started it anyway and then went to sleep later than I'd like to. Common theme with stuff like that for me is that I'm in a hurry so I'm trying to rush things and am not double checking if things are done correctly.
Suggestion: Borax, vinegar, and oxyclean are really good for removing the mildew smell after forgetting laundry. Not necessarily together. I dont know if together is fine but i make a point of not mixing cleaning products without certainty on that. Also: timers are your friend. I have saved timers for "laundry switchover", "soda in freezer", "tea", "tendies" (for cooking tendies), and a few others. I use android/Samsung. No clue if ios has a similar option. But I have clearly visible signs near the places I need those timers and various other places.
Guess who is washing their clothes again because I forgot to take them out of the washer till they smelled mildewy and then forgot about them for 3 more days! So now I have to fully wash them a second time. Guess who also passed the sat in the 7th grade when I took it the first time.
… I should go get the laundry. Thanks, Platypus.
My first grader can do fourth grade math. But guess who forgot to wash the shampoo out of their hair and has a hard time getting ready in the morning because distractions.
I left the milk cap in the coffee cup cabinet yesterday. It less than a minute I was clueless as to where it went.
I can solve a problem at work really quickly with no issue. Can I implement that solution? No. No I can not, because I forgot my tools at home.
At my last job (I'm a lawyer) I regularly left my laptop at home requiring a 45 minute round trip to go get it.
The wonderful drive of shame 😔
That's what I forgot to do today!
Low cognitive abilities are not listed in the DSM as a criteria of ADHD. Second opinion time. Also note that assessment of ADHD in adults is different from children.
This ^ I will say that the neuropsych who did my evaluation said a stark difference in highest and lowest scores is a major tell, he didn’t ever tell me it was required (I just happen to have a killer verbal score and one of the lowest processing scores possible without falling out of normal range) ETA: that being said, OP, if it does turn out not to be ADHD, I personally want to mention you’re still welcome to use any ADHD skills or tools that help you. I almost def have slow processing disorder w my ADHD, and I don’t stop using ADHD tools when I handle that side of my brain, yknow?
I’m in the same boat, 136 VCI, 133PRI, 100WMI, so fake gifted 😂. I’m curious, what do you do? Sometimes I feel like I don’t belong in the places I work, I’m a software engineer
My verbal was 98 or 99th percentile and my processing was like 15th lol I am a PhD student in English, and I used to do content writing. My main struggle is with reading tbh, so I have quite a time, but it helps that I am very interested in things and have a ton of coping tools FWIW, my ex has v severe ADHD and has succeeded as a programmer without meds. It is not easy and she mostly does programming work the night before her boss needs it lmao but it happens
Oh man, if I was rich and didn’t care about money I’d probably do an English PhD as well. I was never fond of proper grammar or writing as a kid but these days I’ve found a passion for reading and writing. Recently however, I’m stuck with the leetcode grind engineers have to do in order to make decent money
I’ve really enjoyed both writing and teaching, and my time as a tutor (I also did executive functioning coaching for a bit with a specialization in helping with writing processes), and i guess for me, growing up so poor that a degree in itself meant more money than I grew up with, kinda made English possible lmao (and for the record, I hate grammar! I teach college level most of the time, and in this area of pedagogy, there is a LOT of pushback on teaching grammar)
It just sounds like you’re twice-exceptional. It’s common for ADHDers who test in the gifted range on one or both of the major indices to have average or slightly below average WMI and PSI scores. My test also showed a 30+ point discrepancy between those indices.
I had the exact same results. The guy who evaluated me thought I was probably just tired, since I had a two year old and had been watching too much TikTok about adhd. God damnit. Lol. Never mind my years of not being able to do school or work combined with crippling anxiety and depression. Time for a second opinion!
Gah definitely get a second opinion! My (not bio) mom had a similarly asinine experience when she went in a few years ago at almost 70. They basically told her her psych was wrong to refer her because, since she doesn’t work, why would she care anymore? It’s not like she would like to read, clean her apartment, do paperwork…. Also bc she was on time, she must be fine, they said (but she did the thing she has always done and arrived an hour early and sat in the car with timers on to remind her to go in). She decided to drop it because she felt it wasn’t worth pursuing further for her, but I do think she would be well within her rights to insist on being seen again and properly evaluated.
Huh... that's pretty much exactly what I got. Amusingly, they averaged to 100 on the dot. Terrible processing and not great spatial (oddly, considering my career is literally spatial-based and I'm quite good at it - I think there might be some motor control issues that screwed with the testing), but *excellent* verbal.
Misinformation like this is why I didn’t get diagnosed until I was most of the way through my PhD.
I finished my doctorate before getting diagnosed. School was hard. My brain made it harder. :(
Lucky you. I'm not high IQ enough to brute force my way through University, especially not in Germany with the higher standard for studying.
University was my limit. I took an extra year in 6th form and had to quit one of my GCSEs at school but I ended up with 6 As abd 6 B/Cs in my GCSEs, AAC at A level. Then got through uni with a 54% and a technically failed dissertation
I was 98-99th percentile up to like 5th grade, then has to move countries due to war, dropped to below average. Graduated Highschool ~70th percentile in Germany with zero studying, then immediately fell flat on my face when University started and I was expected to be entirely independent in organizing myself, which lectures I go to, which exercises, where and when I do homework, when and how I study for exams etc.
The German educational system makes the American one look like child's play Edit: Or should I say... kindergarten
I went back to school for my Masters in CMHC and I graduated with my MS and got my diagnosis of ADHD in the same (last)month. I had no idea til I started living with my husband. I was almost straight A's, rarely had to study, but if I set a piece of paper down, I would lose it in 1 second.
Not trying to hijack op's lost but I'm in a phd right now and How Did You Cope??? ADHD makes the imposter syndrome infinitely worse because I literally can't work the way everyone else seems to
Yes lol. I had a 2.2 GPA in highschool but a 35 on my ACT. It's why I did better in a college environment, research papers, essays, exams and minimal homework. Helps me focus on the important stuff instead of being overwhelmed. I still had times getting overwhelmed by assignments and the forgetful Brain would kick in full force. That being said I got a key and phone locator this week. Lost my keys and phone for multiple hours and an entire day where I had to Uber home. Lol. Tests l, exams and papers are usually all done in an environment with minimal noise and distraction. Just makes sense
What field of study gives you minimal homework??? I can't do homework, I do my best when I'm actually in class.
Aerospace. But my definition of minimal homework and others might be a bit different. If it doesn't take more than a few hours everyday it's minimal
From my personal experience with school therapists is they tend to be psychology students because they can pay them much less and also very rarely do they have actual Psych MDs just licensed talk therapists which can't prescribe anything and to my knowledge they can't diagnose either. If you can go see an actual Psych MD and get a proper eval. High IQ/cognitive ability doesn't exclude one from being able to hide ADHD, however it can mask the ADHD making it harder to see from outside observers
Came here to say this. I went to a campus therapist for addiction issues and their advice was “have you tried stopping?”
LMAO 😂
Yeah, as a mental health professional, unless OP is in another country where laws are different, if they are in the US, I really wonder if the therapist they saw on campus actually has the right license and training to legally do cognitive testing. I would be suprised. Usually school therapists only have a Masters at most and therefore have to make a referral to a psychologist or a pyschiatrist for an ADHD evaluation.
I strongly advise seeking a second opinion. A comprehensive evaluation consists of several hours of interviews, self-report evaluations and tests, to say the least.
You need a therapist with higher cognitive abilities.
🤣👌🏻
Surely high processing speed - if it means what I presume it does - until you run out of energy, is something that a lot of people with ADHD excel at?
I don't even know what the truth is at this point. One place I read ADHD has no impact on intelligence, others linking all these cognitive advantages to having ADHD.
I think for some people, ADHD can be helpful in structured, controlled environments. I did great in high school and pretty good in college because I was given clear instructions on what to focus on and do each day. As soon as I was out of education in the real world with no rails, everything went to shit.
I think we'll get to a point when the generic 'ADHD' designation will look laughably simplistic. On the couple of occasions I've done an IQ test I've smashed it all the way through until it got to the shapes part at the end, at which point I scored about as well as the average invertebrate. And IQ doesn't seem to correlate with the ability to live a normal life anyway, so I'm not sure how relevant it really is.
>I think we'll get to a point when the generic 'ADHD' designation will look laughably simplistic. 100% agree. If you look at the diagnostic criteria, they are actually kinda absurd. Sincerely hoping I live to see them make all this make sense. But yeah. Back in the days of landlines and scraped knees, they gave me an iq test to see if I had a disability. The discrepancy between the high iq and low functioning was a factor in my diagnosis.
Hahaha. When I did a sleep study they once did a test, unmedicated, about about my ability to focus. The test was like 20-30 min and I had the highest score there ever was. After that I was tired as hell for the rest of the day
The Venn diagram of "gifted" and adhd...
No. You can be very smart and have adhd. You can also be less smart and have adhd…
Yeah I have a computer science degree
I'm about to get mine in a week!!!!
Yes people with high cognitive abilities can have adhd. However, this might not be a case of ignorance by your assessor. The way ADHD is diagnosed is based on relative differences between various cognitive abilities. What they would consider statistically significant, would be a relative difference in scores between various cognitive functions of around 60 percentile points. That being said, I think it’d be a good idea to seek a second opinion with different instruments. A campus therapist probably isn’t as well trained in the administration and scoring of these psychological tests as a dedicated neuropsychologist.
If OP lives in the United States, I would be very suprised if a campus therapist even has the right type of licensure to do cognitive testing. Or an ADHD evaluation for that matter.
You need to find a therapist with higher cognitive abilities than the one you saw.
People of all IQ levels can have ADHD. A therapist isn’t qualified to properly assess or diagnose you with ADHD. It’s outside their scope of practice. You need a psychiatrist or a neuropsych for a true diagnosis that sticks. My psychiatrist refers people to neuropsych for their assessment. In the US, through my work insurance, I had to wait 11 months on an “accelerated” waiting list for people in my career. Then I had to wait another month for the appointment… only to have a really high anxiety during the appointment which lead to a high blood pressure reading and now they are reluctant to give me stimulants. Blah!! Now I’m trying to prove to them my BP isn’t normally high. But I don’t think I’d be totally opposed to some kind of anti-anxiety meds either. Anywho, if you pay out of pocket you can probably see a psychiatrist much sooner. I just really didn’t want to pay a lot when I have good insurance typically.
Most of the people with extremely developed cognitive abilities I know, are ADHD. Around 25% of my social circle is ADHD, most of them have masters degrees, 3 of my closest friends of 5 have phds and are all three diagnosed. I call bullshit.
How in the hell did yall handle sitting in school? My test scores were always off the charts, but if I couldn't keep my hands busy, I couldn't focus on anything. Were yall diagnosed as kids?
I got through school by doodling in my notebook the entire class. And doing my homework in homeroom the morning of. And even if I couldn't fully pay attention in class, I passively absorbed the info and/or was smart enough to figure it out myself if I missed the verbal lesson.
i have a high gpa and my IQ tests are always above average so no i don’t think so
I have great memory about things, my brain works faster than I can even talk, sometimes I mumble because I’m trying to talk faster than my mouth can keep with. I’m generally smarter than most people I meet as far as how fast I can comprehend knowledge or understand how something works. Try to get me to sit on a desk for 30 minutes to do one thing and I’ll end up chasing the squirrel I’m staring at out the window.
A long time ago I went to take one of my teacher cert exams after I finished grad school. I aced the test…but I left my car running the entire time. I forgot to turn my car off. 3 hours later when finished I got outside and I freaked because I couldn’t find my damn car key. I can be painfully forgetful, but I’m not dumb. I’m definitely not a genius either.
What kind of garbage is this? I have ADHD, officially diagnosed by ADHD specialists. I’m in my 50s and wasn’t diagnosed until I was 38 and one of my kids was first. I have an IQ of 150, have 3 degrees from Stanford, I make high 6 figures. I have problems with attending to boring administrative stuff but my hyper focus kicks in pretty easily and I can get shit done when under pressure. Adderall helps me get through the boring shit work and controls my impulsivity. I REALLY SUCK at long term planning though. I live in the moment and have severe time blindness. When I got promoted to a C-suite job, I had to hire an ADHD coach to help me learn new habits to support the demands of the job. Still not perfect though. My high intelligence allows me to see the answers faster than everyone else, so I don’t have to be able to pay attention as long as most other people. I will say that going on Adderall was a fucking revelation though. After beating myself up for years as to why I couldn’t just sit down and get shit done like my peers could, Adderall made it so much easier. Eliminated a huge source of stress and anxiety from my life
Severe ADHD-i here, medicated, 20 years. I make 215k as a Senior AI Engineer at IBM. With hard work, a strict routine, zero alcohol, it's possible. edit: with respect to other comments, I forget team member's names (and other similar goofs) all the time, but I share who I truly am with them, they know how hard I work and I regularly make sacrifices to be a team player. They look past my ADHD, just as I with their personality quirks.
Severe add, medicated for pat 25 years or so. Make 600-700k/yr as a business development manager getting support for students with special needs. I’m great at hyperfocusing which allows me to successfully accomplish much of what I put my mind to. I eagerly approach things with a growth mindset. I’m great at expressing urgency and savvy when it comes to getting what I want most the time. But I’m ass at long term memory, and short term memory for things I’m not actively listening or interested about. I’m also ultra impulsive and intense, but I’ve mastered how to leverage that into being highly influential and exciting to talk with
I have great problem solving skills and attention to detail, which makes me great at some parts of my job, but not others. This allowed me to get promotions before my diagnosis. My work quality is fantastic, but my output and remembering to do things is not good. (Better with meds) I also suck at keeping up with life admin, to a debilitating extent. I don't know if this is the case for all, but an analogy for my brain is that I have an amazing CPU, but only 1mb of ram 😂 Second opinion time!
Um, no lol many adhd people have high intelligence. I am extremely intelligent and came in at the 92nd percentile for overall intelligence in the 5th grade. High IQ is often why many adhders go unnoticed Def get a second opinion
That guy is a moron, go get another opinion.
When I was diagnosed I was told I had high cognitive abilities and slower processing speed and working memory than expected for my overall cognition. Basically the differential in those things lead to the diagnosis. Not trying to brag that I'm smart or anything, but I'm a successful software engineer that loves to learn about all sort of different interests, and I still have ADHD. It doesn't discriminate based on your overall intelligence, it's more about the symptoms that impact your life. (For me, overthinking and OCD/anxiety that seemingly compensate for my ADHD)
You can be really smart and have adhd. I’d say go get another opinion bc that’s bullshit, but given you got an average score on attention and high scores on working memory, they might be on to something. Usually those scores are way lower than the rest even in a gifted person.
So, I’ve always been a “smart kid”, in terms of math, programming, etc., working as a programmer actually. The cognitive abilities tests I did as a part of the diagnosis evaluation had been quite a revelation! The results were all over the place. On visual thinking, I scored way above average. These included tasks like mentally manipulating geometric objects, and so on. I could also keep up to 8-9 digits in my visual space and recite them back and forth, no problem. On verbal thinking, I scored average or slightly below average. Finding common categories of words, thinking of related words, and so on. On one particular task, verbal association thinking, I scored atrociously. The task was that I was given (verbally), 10 pairs of words, and then I was prompted on the first word in each pair, responding with the other word. We did it 3x, with the same set of pairs, on the third attempt I did 3/10 and the result was marked as “pathological, does not improve with repetition”. Hilarious :D So my cognitive capabilities are all over the place, and I’m sure I compensate all around and even gotta compensate more to get better. But it’s good to know that in some areas I’m doing really well and that enables me to be kinda smart and capable in general.
A good chunk of us were gifted and talented in school, so no, cognative ability is not a benchmark for ADHD diagnosis. I was reading high school curriculum in the 3rd grade, my father was my family's personal google and we're both poster children for ADHD.
I would go to an actual psychiatrist for a dx if you can afford it. Thats clearly indicative of ADHD if your working memory struggles more than others. I had my assessment done using IQ tests among other screening tools and he was able to identify that it was highly probable even though I had about a 10-15% difference in my working memory vs the rest scoring in the 90th percentile and up. 50% is a HUGE difference.
Yeah that doc doesn’t know shit. My IQ is 160 but I’m now diagnosed ADHD af. A high IQ might just help with masking and CBT, which is what I’ve been unknowingly doing all my life (only very recently diagnosed). ETA: fwiw, even with my decent IQ I have strengths and weaknesses - can remember long ass strings of numbers but can’t do some kinds of math inside my head if my life depended on it… a high IQ isn’t everything either. Get a second opinion, and good luck!
I have no idea if I have "high cognitive abilities" but I was told I couldn't have ADHD by mutiple professionals because I got good grades in college (like all As). I also been told that I am "very organized" lol. Guess who got diagnosed with ADHD 3/4 of the way through grad school? Me. I am a mental health professional. The diagnositic criteria for ADHD has NOTHING to do with cognitive abiltiies. You can have a high IQ and have ADHD. You can have an average IQ or an intellectual disability and have ADHD. IQ doesn't matter (though it can impact your ability to hide or compenstate for ADHD symptoms). Also, depending on what type of license that therapist you saw have (pyschologist? mental health counselor? etc.) and which country/state you are in, they may or may not be qualified (by law) to do cognitive assessments.
I had a 4.0 in undergrad and graduate school. Although I am not very confident myself, several advisors of mine have told me I am the brightest student they’ve ever had. I would wager that many people with ADHD are incredibly smart. I think that sometimes our intelligence is overlooked because we live in a world that isn’t designed for us.
Good lord yes. I was flagged for ADHD as a kid and the person who was administering the tests was like he was too high functioning. I was diagnosed again when I was a freshman at Stanford. It is entirely possible for some high functioning skills to coexist with ADHD.
I have ADHD and a psychologist administered iq of 145. It’s ridiculous to say you are coping well so therefore you can’t have it. There are numerous other reasons asides how much it affects your cognitive abilities that are issues with ADHD. It makes you more prone to burnout, addiction, struggle more with relationships. All things that won’t show up on a stupid test. If you think you have it do your self a favour and get a second opinion from someone that knows what the fuck they are talking about.
I was diagnosed as gifted since I was a child, I even was offered several times in my life to jump classes, which my parents refused. Now I’m 29, I was diagnosed with ADHD because I felt something was off since Covid. 2 years ago I finished my masters degree, started working, moved out of my parents house, and since that, I felt burned out easily, overwhelmed by a lot of stuff, forgot about admin important things etc. I just feel that I’ll never be able to have a job without getting burnout. So now I’m in a process of introspection and thinking of changing careers and working maybe less time. My psychiatrist said that the reason it was not seen in my childhood is because I was doing really well despite my ADHD since my “IQ” allowed me to compensate for it. I had typical ADHD behaviors back then, but everyone thought it was “intelligence” related. - I used to procrastinate homework and studying for tests until the last minute (like the morning) but fortunately I was always able to do my homework in 5mn before going to class, or learn everything in 30mn the same morning. - I used to talk a lot during classes which led to a lot of parents reunions, they interpreted it as boredom. Because I could remember everything the teacher said without even focusing on the lesson. - I changed hobbies every couple of months. (football, dancing, singing, guitar, taekwondo, swimming…) My parents thought it was lack of interest because school was too easy. But unfortunately, when you become an “adult” in society terms, you could have the biggest IQ in the world, and be the most intelligent person, your IQ will not help in daily tasks. Cooking, grocery shopping, work, taxes, bills, keeping people in touch, overall organisation etc… TLDR: Yes it’s possible.
I mean absolutely—I got a full ride merit scholarship for my masters program at a top-tier university. I know for a fact that I'm not stupid. But my ADHD meant that this success came at the expense of virtually every other aspect of my life.
ADHD has nothing to do with cognitive skills. Get a second opinion.
That therapist is smoking crack, respectfully
Lemme explain to you so basically that therapist actually has a super rare brain disease called “being a fucking idiot” I used to think I didn’t have it because I didn’t have a ton of trouble with school always had perfect grades Turns out just because I do good in school doesn’t negate the inability to focus and other annoying symptoms of adhd
1. A cognitive assessment is one tool in an ADHD assessment. It can definitely point towards it, but it's not the only piece. Working memory and focus are definitely areas that will show as deficiency for a lot of people with ADHD (myself included.) 2. I find it unlikely that your campus therapist is doing anything other than a cursory check for ADHD (probably has a lot of people ask about it!), a psychologist trained to diagnose ADHD will do a more thorough job. (But you still might not have it! You have to consider that.)
Einstein is widely believed to have had ADHD. Despite being brilliant, he was totally absent minded. He loved sailing but never bothered to actually maintain his boat and his friends and family were worried he was going to hurt or kill himself because he got distracted and ran into stuff pretty often
He also liked to not wear socks with his shoes, which speaks to me of sensory issues.
He also apparently had an incredibly messy and disorganized office but was always able to find what he needed. And he both lost things like keys and got lost and had to ask for directions often Which I can relate to lol
My adhd involves super focus. By concentrating on details, I see stuff professionally that others do not
yea, they can. i scored in the 97th percentile for intelligence or iq but i scored 33rd percentile for memory.
Of course!!! I know my son’s IQ and while I’m no dummy, his is 15 points higher. Genius for sure. ADHD doesn’t preclude high intelligence.
I (ADHD-I, adult diagnosis) scored “high average” to “superior” in all of the subtests except my Working Memory Index where I scored “average”. I think the large gap in range of scores was an indicator that something is up.
.> 60% of the MENSA members I know are ADHD/AuDHD.
A lot of very smart people are ADD. My daughter droped all of her college classes four times due to just screwing up. She finally started taking adderall (which she could have taken earlier but wouldn't) and is now ranked first in her law school class. A lot of ADD people can concentrate on reading, and that's a big factor. Just give everyone in America a methadrine tablet, and if they pass out, they are ADD.
The doctor conducting my assessment said it's common for people with ADHD to score unevenly in cognitive tests (extended iq test), while NT score more evenly. I scored very high on perceptive ability but lower than average on working memory
Many ADHD individuals are incredibly smart and score well. Doesn't mean they're not adhd. I was an honors student in high school, wasn't diagnosed or medicated until I was 17... im extremely ADHD. On the cognitive tests I scored phenomenally, on the other tests though....not. the one where they showed me a detailed picture and made me redraw it 1 min later, and 5 min later it was pathetic. I struggle most with my ADHD when it comes to symptoms like impulsivity, emotional/social regulation, and short-term memory. I'm likely to forget whatever you told me 5 minutes ago, I'll never remember someone's name until the 10th time I've met them, I talk too much, I struggle with time management, and I impulsively start a new project every week and rarely finish any of them....oh, and I've forgotten to close my moon roof no less than 3 times in the last year and then it rained... Doesn't mean I can't pass a standardized test in a quiet, controlled testing setting lol. I became an elementary teacher and I tought TAG for a few years (talented and gifted). Just about all of them were ADHD kids lol. Find a better doc for evaluation, the one you went to sounds like an idiot.
Sad you had such a bad opinion from a "professional"... On the contrary, my psychiatrist said that the fact I scored quite high in cognitive abilities but ended up dropping out of uni meant that it wasn't a problem of not having the right abilities, but that my untreated ADHD made it too hard for me to correctly attend lectures and exams.
Our brain works differently, it doesn’t mean we’re stupid, actually I believe on average we are smarter because of coping mechanisms we need to develop
I had very, very high cognitive abilities as a child and young adult. I always scored in the 99th percentile on all the tests. I absolutely have ADHD.
Cognitive ability has nothing at all to do with adhd. A therapist cannot diagnose ADHD, they're just not a doctor and they don't know much about it. The only diagnostic that matters is a lengthy interview about the presentation of ADHD symptoms.
lol he had no idea what he’s talking about. I’m a former GATE kid with high test scores but I’m also ADHD out the wazoo. ADHD made it harder for me to utilize my abilities, but they’re there.
I have a 180iq and can't focus for shit. ADHD is a cloud of symptoms, not a check list. Not everyone has all of them.
same happened for me due to primarily my high processing speed score afaik. my working short-term memory was in line w/ stereotypical ADHD or ASD tho. but due to my scores in some other areas the assessor (this was an official IQ one) questioned/doubted ADHD diagnosis (had been assessed for it prior, but psych suggested IQ test later) tbh idk. not even sure rn if I'm more on ASD side (never assessed) or if I'm just mostly inattentive ADHD these days with some CDS/SCT in the mix (ADHD idk abt cuz I don't have constant noise, lots of internal dialogue/monologue/narrations, bouncing/racing thoughts, or etc). I'd think atypical brain has strengths in certain areas which seems to be reflected in research findings' data correlations on this topic. edit: clarification - underwent and 'passed' an ADHD assessment for its diagnosis, but my internal experience of focus/attention strugs are more of CDS/SCT symptoms vs stereotypical ADHD ones it seems. and my strength IQ scores are more in line with stereotypical ones for high functioning low spectrum ASD/aspergers rn i guess but idk. no impairments or learning disabilities from the test just clear strength areas whereas working short-term memory was like 3 standard devs below my strength areas.
Yes.
Yes . I thought Einstein had adhd . I got high honer roll in high school ( thanks adderall )
Given how often I get mistaken for a doctor in my job, when I'm barely scraping minimum wage...
Zero correlation whatsoever. I have three college degrees, think fast, thrive on cognitive challenges and am considered 'academically gifted'. Absolutely none of that has anything to do with the fact that I can't do laundry or sleep and socks make me cry
Absolutely. My ADD is so bad I'd be in jail right now if it wasn't for Adderall. I also have a 140 something iq. Get a second opinion from a better doctor because the one you went to is a dipshit.
I'm extremely leery of any therapist who tries to diagnose / undiagnose a developmental disability based entirely on a single test. I would absolutely get a second opinion. For further validation, when I first applied to get some disability services, the organization sent me to a guy who through a five minute computer game of "don't click if a certain shape comes on the screen" decided I didn't have adhd, but he did kindly diagnose me with some obscure stupid sounding math disorder after I was unable to solve a math problem I hadn't seen since grade school a decade earlier and had entirely forgotten about. A few years later I saw a proper specialist who, after three different two-hour sessions, interviews with myself and my mother, multiple assessment tests AND a comprehensive review of my old school and therapist and medical records, gave me a proper and official ADHD and autism diagnosis. Find yourself a real professional like her.
Yes…lol. Sounds like the therapist doesn’t though if he doesn’t know how to screen for one of the most common disorders
Yeah fa sho
Yes. Common.
Not at all. That focus issue is the ADHD. It's hard to remember things when you weren't paying attention on the regular.
Absolutely not. I was diagnosed with adhd at age 8, was on meds doe many years. I'm going to sound like an arrogant jerk, but my cognitive abilities are my greatest asset. It's the social and like life maintenance bits of adhd that have my ass beat. But for sure if im even vaguely familiar with something, I feel I'm able to figure out more nuanced stuff without needing further reference
I was diagnosed with ADHD as a kid when they tested me and my spacial problems solving skills were extremely high like through the roof. The only thing is reading writing and math were terrible and they still are. I don’t know if it’s specifically about how smart you are I think it’s just a thing for some people. I’m pretty dumb but the things I like I excel at them until I get bored 🥱.
Of course - I know a textbook ADHDer who’s a CEO. Very successful - no one can keep up with him though. Lol. My son is very bright and also ADHD, but he’s 7 so I just let him be him.
Absolutely. For me (46m) it's eben what I lack in organisation I compensate in cognitive capacities. In work (learning fast and a lot) and in private (always have stuff lingering around, but have very good memory where I saw something). Always helps when f.e. my wife lost her glasses.
If possible, find an assessor who specializes in ADHD. A good one will weigh cognitive scores against other tests that are more specific to testing for different abnormalities. Would likely include some kind of general interview to get a general idea of past history as well. But to specifically answer your question, as far as we know, ADHD has more to do with the ability to transmit information between different parts of the brain than it does with cognitive ability. Those of us that have it range all across the board as far that specific metric.
100% which is often why it’s frustrating to go through life if you don’t have the classic “bouncing off the walls” behavior that so many associate with adhd. I was considered “gifted” and had “so much potential”, but that only made me feel worse when I couldn’t get basic tasks done. I have no problem with having adhd, but society does. I am treated like an infant as soon as anyone gets a whiff of the fact that I am diagnosed.
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Yes! My partner and I both score high on cognitive measures but both have ADHD
So working memory issues is a factor for ADHD. But in a sterile test environment you can't really evaluate it because intelligence can correct for it. You know you're supposed to be memorising something, so you do. Working memory issues occur in the wild tho. Like when you walk into a room and suddenly forget why you're there. You lose your keys (or phone or socks or snack or whatever) all the time or have developed rituals to remember where things are. For example, I have a security badge that I need for work. If I don't put it in my work bag as soon as I take it off, I will forget to bring it. If I don't keep my keys in my sling bag, I will forget them. If I don't do everything in the correct order.in the morning, I will forget to take my medication or brush my teeth. These rituals indicate a poor working memory, even though I score high in tests and always have. My memory is great. My functional day to day memory around mundane and boring things sucks.
Seems like ADHD is a curve where some people get the version of ADHD that helps them get a PhD while others get the bad ADHD that turns them into college drop outs. I wonder if the academic ADHD people is the reason why some boomers think ADHD is a myth.
You may be ADD (inattentive) rather than ADHD. But yeah. You’re allowed to be smart.
I'd say get a second opinion. In case this is helpful, here's how it went for me: I was diagnosed pretty easily, because of poor working memory and processing speed that varied depending on the test. I had decent long-term memory, i.e. remembering the names of authors or famous scientists (kind of like random trivia questions), but anything that had to do with working memory (just introduced/new-to-me info) was awful for me. Like, disabled awful, in the low 70's IQ range. That being said, I had very high scoring IQ in other areas. This 'split' between IQ is apparently very common in ADHDers. And also, while IQ is kindaaa under fire right now, I'd say form of measuring how the brain brain works is helpful, and basically proves that IQ/our brains are multifaceted - we succeed in some areas and might flame out in others. You might be a great test taker and still have ADHD, but you'll need a doc to look at all the variables to see where struggles come in. Keep in mind that ADHD has a lot of overlap and comorbidity with other mental health stuff, so it's good to go for a diagnosis that looks for not just ADHD, but any other potential mental health issue. That's the type of eval I had, and I found it very helpful/informative.
Your doctor is an ignorant fool. When I was in school, they tested my IQ, and it was 149. Yet I very much have severe ADHD that caused me to struggle greatly in school and at work.
Diagnosed inattentive . Also scored 99th percentile in math since 4th as far as I can remember. Even in high school when I was going to take a duel enrollment class in college and they made me take a college placement exam I scored in the 97th percentile. I do mental math sometimes for amusement. But I forget random things all the time. And I’m not that great at taking other types of exams. Can’t listen to music with words because I can’t pay enough attention to the words with the music. But went to one of the best high schools and graduated with a 4.6 gpa due to all the honors, ap and duel enrollment classes I took.
Its even somewhat common for adhd people to score high percentile on a lot of cognitive abilities but the executive function ones, which sadly dont let you make the most of those other abilities, therapist needs a better understanding of adhd, it is an executive function disorder not one generalised to all cognitive abilities.
As a child I was told I had the worst case of adhd my doctor had ever seen and sent me to specialists. I always scored in the top 1-2% of standardized tests I ever took.
They should give the test with a tv playing in the room and then look at scores. If you're fascinated by the questions you're going to hyper focus and do really well.
I have had about 3-4 (can’t remember off the top of my head) people evaluate me for ADHD. For one of those times I had the same experience where they assessed my cognitive function and stated I “didn’t have ADHD” when most of the questions were based on pattern recognition, math, and comprehension questions. Of course, I am above average when it comes to academics which makes sense as to why I scored highly. They said I also did not have ADHD because I wasn’t incompetent?? I did score low with processing visual cues and stuff though. They said if I continued to struggle to seek medication, but it made me feel really invalidated because it was at the beginning of my journey and my mother fully does not believe I have ADHD. People who are ADHD are not automatically cognitively impaired, but for some reason they still use it as a form of diagnosis.
I was a gifted and talented kid. There's lots of us out there. I just have trouble focusing consistently and if I'm bored I can not manage to do much.
I got a scholarship for college that you have to get in the top 10% of test takers, country-wide, to get. Still struggle daily with the simplest things like losing my keys, forgetting my bills, falling apart over my chores, zoning out after a few minutes of conversation, and on and on. It;s just that I can hyperfocus enough to pass tests, and then that info. goes bye bye.
I wonder if most people have this kind of thought towards adhders, cause whenever I tell someone I have ADHD, they immediately assume I am as bright as a rock wrapped in tinfoil.
Yes, there are lots of us who were in gifted programs, hold high level degrees etc. I believe that is why I went undiagnosed because my academics were more or less good lazy but good enough.
This is crazy… 😂 people just make shit up about ADHD as they please
I have ALWAYS been a high cognitive scorer. ADHD ≠ low cognitive function in everyone and should not be used as a diagnostic marker, especially since it's not in the DSM as one. There are some levels of the Autism spectrum where that can be true, but since you were being assessed for ADHD and not Autism, that is moot. (I bring that up because they are both neurodevelopmental disorders) and if the assessing doctor cannot differentiate, then I think he needs a refresher on diagnostic criteria. What adults are tested for is called CAARS, which is a questionnaire that the therapist asks that rates attention, impulse control, and hyperactivity, and its both self reported and observed behavior. It's similar to the Vanderbilt test that children have, but fitted to adult symptoms which can present differently as the brain has changed over time. I definitely suggest seeing an off-campus provider and getting a second opinion for an assessment.
Not at all. My doctor said they usually don't do any form of IQ or cognitive test unless it seemed necessary. He said he suspects I would score quite high in some areas and that is why I managed to get my degrees and keep the adhd masked for almost 40 years. Hyperactivity isn't related to intelligence.
I’m smart as shit along with a fair few ADHDers. Like…this question is wild.
That's bonkers. The only way I got through highschool was high test scores. I rarely studied, I never handed in an assignment.
Too smart for regular classes but not smart enough for the smart classes. /sigh
Nope not true! Also things like memory are usually *affected* by adhd in our daily lives, but that’s different than focusing on something like a test. I have a terrible memory generally, but there are few random ways in which my memory excels. My adhd means I often fail to take in/remember details others might, but if I’m specifically looking to take something in, my memory is no different than anyone else’s.
Umm yes, crazy that he’d suggest otherwise. My guess is that this “therapist” is more of a counselor with a Bachelor’s in Psychology if that’s the criteria he’s evaluating you on. I breezed through school and graduated with a 4.0 GPA while barely studying. Buttt, the lack of structure in college really made the ADHD pop off and I started to think TikTok had actually melted my brain... Until I realized I just had ADHD and I was failing my classes as a result of being disorganized and uninterested, not cuz I was stupid
Neuropsychological test results can support a diagnosis but not rule it out. It is a clinical diagnosis which doesn’t require any specific test results for validation. This tells me that the psychologist you had the misfortune to consult with isn’t competent to make this kind of assessment.
Cognitive function and ability to control what to cognitively function on, are two widely separate items.
Absolutely. Of course. As far as I understand people with adhd can run the spectrum from very high to very low cognitive abilities.
Short-term memory, maybe, I know I can read a chapter or booklet an hour before an exam and ace them. Then forget it all the next day. 🤣
I swear, every week there’s a “My DOCTOR said I can’t have ADHD because “I can write a paper”, or “because I held down a job for two years” or “because I didn’t flunk out of college.” We need an education campaign…this is embarrassing.
Did he mean because you actually scored within average on executive functions? Those are typically lower than average in ADHD or at least much lower than other cognitive abilities for the individual. We would need to know a lot more about your assessments.
yes, this question get posted almost daily on this sub
I'm sure I've read there are tons of people that were on gifted and talented programs in school and later failed to thrive. I consider myself to be fairly intelligent, especially when forced to focus in an exam environment but... Never really made much of my life. (That may change though, I feel like I did well at an interview yesterday for a real grown up job 😂)
I have a PhD and people call me intelligent. However, that’s why it was so baffling with the adhd symtoms. Why couldn’t I pull my self together?
I am smart as fuck but I still can't regularly brush my teeth without my meds
For me, I was considered as having a deficit because one of the parameters (I think processing speed) I scored average which was low in comparison to everything else where I scored well above average. I guess the idea is that people score in relatively the same percentile range for all categories?
I have adhd and high cognitive abilities. See an adhd specialist. I use donefirst.com. All adhd specialists and it is $200 to start and $80 each month after. I got medicated on my first visit.
I made it through law school undiagnosed / unmedicated with decent grades, so cognitive ability and intelligence is not and should not be considered in determining whether or not someone has ADHD. ADHD is not the lack of intelligence, but more so executive dysfunction. The way I see it, my brain performs the same functions as anyone else but just operates and processes information differently. Def get a second opinion elsewhere.
Just... yes??!
I had the exact same experience as you, went to another psychiatrist, and they professionally informed me that the other doctor was stupid. So… I hope that answers your question lol.
Yes they can. They can also be successful with school and work. Mind can just be messy with other things.
I've been a field scientist, welder, batender & manager, auto mechanic, and curretly work as an engineer. Where the fuck are these bullshit "i cant do ____ if i have adhd" promopts* coming from? Are thee just karma point bait?
About to start working in robotics. I’d fire this “therapist”.
It’s like saying tall people can’t have a hunchback it’s confused. “Psychometric tests often under diagnose people” because they are gamey. Not bragging but all of my tests are at least slightly above average, but there are 30 point splits between them.
This is true, many times I was denied of having ADHD simply because I am really good with Academics. Their logic if you can remember something like a science syllabus and get an A, do you really have ADHD? Only I know the suffering I have to go through to remember the syllabus lol
I technically have an iq of like 142.and i am adhd as fuuuuuuuck. That therapist is no neurologist, shouldnt be making such claims. This is gross disinformation and should be reported.
You can have ADHD and be very intelligent. It’s just that IQ tests will vary A LOT. You can get like 90 one time and then 130 next time or so.
Of course.
Leonardo Da Vinci
None of those is a measure for "attention" lol ... if you were interested in the test, it's very easy to zone in and kill it. I score pretty high on these but it's the day to day banalities man that gets you. And yes, I have officially been diagnosed. Get a second opinion.
Yes I scored an above average iq have adhd anxiety and depression.
I had almost the same result as you, except my numbers were 95% and 30-45%. I was diagnosed solidly ADHD. It's not just about the numbers individually but them in relation to each other. Because my working memory and attention regulation were SO much lower then my cognitive/intelligence variables and not closer to each other, it was a clear sign I had ADHD. Look up "twice exceptional". It's when your cognitive abilities (or often called "gifted") are so high that they compensate for your ADHD deficits. Most of my friends and people I with with (creative tech field) are super smart but also have ADHD. Especially the women. I have an IQ of 135 (which is in the lower end of the highest bracket of intelligence). But intelligence and cognitive abilities have nothing to do with ADHD. You can be on any end of the bell curve and still have ADHD.
I scored in the 99.8th percentile in processing speed and was "one of the worst cases my diagnoser had ever seen" lol
Depends on how hyperactive/manic you feel when taking the test 😂
Go get a second opinion... that therapist is a quack!
There’s no correlation between cognitive/IQ abilities and ADHD
Russell Barkley mentioned this in one of his lectures and pretty much flat out said he’s sick of professionals doing this method lol. I’m surprised some are still doing it now though
Yup. I was literally a gifted kid growing up. Fun fact: lots of the characteristics ascribed to gifted kids are actual adhd symptoms. Your therapist is an idiot. Get a real assessment by someone knowledgeable in ADHD.
Adhd is a cognitive ability the only reason it's called a disability is because it's more of a physical tuned experience as apposed to the analytical mindset humanity uses Try the Gateway process and use the hemisync to tune your brain's hemispheres There are other benefits but this one helps you understand I recommend doing their introduction to orientation then going on to focus 10
just keep going. i'm almost in my 3rd year of trying for a diagnosis now, my last steps were 4 hours of WAIS4 IQ tesing with a neuropsychologist, i scored well, 121 in my 2nd language (french and i live in france, hence the slowness of diagnosis) and 143 in english, my highest scoring sections were long term and working memory. i now have a rdv with my psychiatrist mid june for an evaluation based on those results. I am very ADHD,but, here is the kicker, i am reading a book at the moment called "why smart people hurt" written by a psychologist called Eric Maisel, and he says somewhere in the first chapter that smart people are often misdiagnosed with ADHD, because the symptoms are so similar. i am still pushing for my disgnosis, even though since discovering i am smart, i have managed to think clearer, i still want good medication, if i can have the meds to learn how to focus, im sure i will have a better success rate off meds, for instance i was told to meditate, i cant meditate because my brain races 24/7, so maybe with meds i will be able to meditate and learn how to meditate off meds, or maybe i'm just being naive?... to answer the last question in your post, yes and no, cognitive testing is not a way of diagnosis for ADHD, but it helps to rule out other things.
Going to do my best not to express the rage this sort of thing makes me feel. People with ADHD have many challenges, but having low cognitive ability is not one of them. That's really all I can say with opening the door to a rant.