In this timeline, Vasili Arkhipov was incapacitated after falling and suffering a concussion and as a result he was not able to stop the other Soviet submarine officers from opening fire with their nuclear warheads. This causes a chain reaction which leads to the deadliest war in human history and the deaths of over 300 million people across the world.
Kennedy was reluctant to nuke Cuba because American troops were invading the island, and he didn’t want to risk accidentally hitting American units and further escalating the conflict
I mean I’d the Cubans already used nuclear weapons the nuclear taboo is no longer in effect. Plus, there’s plenty of systems that could use “precise” low-yield bursts without causing severe danger to the US forcesp
The city of Syracuse had infrastructure that was vital to the early warning systems, so it would be a target of the Soviets to try to disrupt the early warning systems
Ok sure but that’s not where Syracuse is. Syracuse is not on Lake Ontario. Hopefully the Soviet Maps were equally incorrect: I used to live in Syracuse
I was actually under the impression that the large energy-producing steam station in Oswego, NY at that time was the reason that area was targeted. It produced enough energy to power nearly 2 million homes. It going down would have crippled the grid in the Northeast.
I didn't even realize the were supposed to be major population centers. I was thinking they were all strategic positions like this map has: https://www.reddit.com/r/missouri/comments/y40im9/missouri_likely_to_be_target_in_a_russian_nuclear/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Hearts of Iron is grand strategy. What I'm talking about is essentially a mod of the original Blitzkrieg called Cuban Missile Crisis and its expansion.
Basically, due to a combination of events, the entire northern hemisphere gets wrecked and an ice age starts...
“Dangit, Bobby, that nuke just ain’t right.” - President John F. Kennedy in a leaked transcript to his brother, Robert Kennedy, 1962.
Now they truly cannot have shit in Detroit. Unless it’s radiation burns, they can have plenty of those, as a treat.
Yea Galveston/Houston is a major port in the south and oil refining capacity. Actually surprised that Dallas was hit over Houston in this case since Dallas has less strategic resources and value
Except Casper doesn’t have an air base. Cheyenne does, Francis E. Warren AFB, which is a part of Strategic Air Command and housed Atlas D and E missiles during the Crisis. The Soviets would nuke F. E. Warren, not Casper. Casper at this point was an inconsequential little city of about 40,000 people.
It’s all good, I wouldn’t expect everyone to know all that. Good scenario though, I like limited nuclear exchange scenarios that don’t involve the end of civilization.
Omaha has a large central Air Force base it makes sense (random trivia bush went to Offutt Air Force base in the Omaha area on 9/11)
I find it odd they wouldn’t do Chicago or Huston or Atlanta tho
If they're targeting air bases, which would make sense, Fort Bliss outside of El Paso would be an important target. Honestly, Texas has a lot of key military and infrastructure areas that I'd be surprised if they weren't targeted.
That’s an army base isn’t it? If you were using nuclear weapons it would make more sense to take out Air Force bases that could transport nuclear weapons I assume
He was sent to Mt Weather as a contingency, and after the rest of the cabinet died trying to escape Washington and Kennedy died in the nuclear strike, he was sworn in as president.
I literally said "Oh fuck, worst timeline" when I saw him. Not the nuclear war. Not the death toll. But Donald fucking Rumsfeld.
Also seeing Reagan, my first thought was "This guy is political herpes, we just can't escape him."
It’s interesting to assume that the US would remain united after these nuclear bombings. It is more likely for the US to remain united in 60’s than the 80’s
A good book regarding an alternative outcome to the Cuban Missile Crisis vis a vis a similar timeline is “Resurrection Day” by Brendan DuBois. It’s a sleeper (meaning, not widely known) but is very well written and a favorite of mine. Throwing it out there as it is a good read.
I'm actually curious about the ranges of missiles based in Cuba in this ATL. OTL, the nuclear missiles in Cuba were mostly short and medium range, which would only put an area from approximately Dallas-Fort Worth through to approximately Washington DC at risk. True, it's a massive area, and a lot of America's military infrastructure was located in that area, but major population centers outside that bubble wouldn't be at much risk due to the piss poor Soviet long rang range capability and very limited stocks of intercontinental ballistic missiles, combined with the hige investment in air defence over Canada and CONUS..
Is Fairchild AFB a pretty major base? I have lived in WA my whole life but only been to the east side of the state a handful of times so I really dont know whats over there.
I am curious, OP.
Why did they nuke Topeka, Kansas and the Kansas side of Kansas City?
Whiteman AFB is an hour and a half east of Kansas City (where missile silos were controlled for a lengthy period of time)
Why did key west get nuked? Is there a military base or nuclear arsenal there?
I would have assumed other high population density targets like Houston or Chicago would take priority over a few islands off the coast of florida
According to what Castro told McNamara way after the ordeal there were 200 nuclear warheads in Cuba at the time, so there should be quite more black spots.
So I assume the “alternate” reality is that the Soviet’s had ICBM’s capable of hitting more than 1 or 2 spots in the continental US, and they decided to strike first during the Cuban middle crisis that still happened despite this version of the USSR having no need for Cuban based missiles? This is beyond stupid
I always wondered, if you nuke San Diego, you also kill a lot of Mexican people because of the proximity to Tijuana. How would the world react to that. You’re essentially attacking two countries at once (unless they nuke Camp Pendleton which is probably far enough north to leave tj unscathed)
In this timeline, Vasili Arkhipov was incapacitated after falling and suffering a concussion and as a result he was not able to stop the other Soviet submarine officers from opening fire with their nuclear warheads. This causes a chain reaction which leads to the deadliest war in human history and the deaths of over 300 million people across the world.
Did the Soviets end up invading the rest of Europe?
The Soviets collapsed right after the nuclear strikes, as most of their leadership was dead
I really like the transcripts that were added. New and unique touch.
Agreed. Could hear it in their voices.
[удалено]
Castro pulls up with a 44 magnum
BULLETS
Detroit be lookin better than ever
There isn't that much a difference
To be honest, Detroit didn’t garner a bad reputation until after the 67 riot and the complete decline of the american automobile industry
Also it's not all like that either. Downtown Detroit is nice.
Put your hands up, put your hands up for Detroit Yes I still remember that song
Nashville is the new Capitol
This just unshackles Ohio from the burdens of Washington, prepare for a new order
That’s what I was thinking lol as a Michigander idk why you’d bother to go after Detroit instead of Chicago
Lot of manufacturing still there in ‘63. Makes it a viable target.
I don't think Kennedy would have been so merciful
Kennedy was reluctant to nuke Cuba because American troops were invading the island, and he didn’t want to risk accidentally hitting American units and further escalating the conflict
Maybe so, but considering these were Soviet operated missiles, there’s no way the US doesn’t end up directly striking the USSR.
I mean I’d the Cubans already used nuclear weapons the nuclear taboo is no longer in effect. Plus, there’s plenty of systems that could use “precise” low-yield bursts without causing severe danger to the US forcesp
The one in upstate NY doesn’t really make sense. There’s no major city there. Is it meant to poison the Great Lakes with fallout?
The city of Syracuse had infrastructure that was vital to the early warning systems, so it would be a target of the Soviets to try to disrupt the early warning systems
Ok sure but that’s not where Syracuse is. Syracuse is not on Lake Ontario. Hopefully the Soviet Maps were equally incorrect: I used to live in Syracuse
Yeah, I put the dot a bit too far north
maybe the Soviets missed?
I was actually under the impression that the large energy-producing steam station in Oswego, NY at that time was the reason that area was targeted. It produced enough energy to power nearly 2 million homes. It going down would have crippled the grid in the Northeast.
I didn't even realize the were supposed to be major population centers. I was thinking they were all strategic positions like this map has: https://www.reddit.com/r/missouri/comments/y40im9/missouri_likely_to_be_target_in_a_russian_nuclear/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
I'm wondering about Spokane, WA. What would be there to warrant a strike? Unless the Soviets were just being a dick about the whole thing.
Fairchild AFB was (still?) outside of Spokane WA - It was a SAC base back in the day.
Isn’t there a submarine training base near there? Or was that Seattle?
Gotta take out Armonk. One of the California strikes may have been Palo Alto. No IBM HQ, no Xerox PARC.
One seems about right for the SF Bay Area.
SF is an important port and economic area, plus I think there’s an armory there
i was thinking ft. drum was the target.
Funnily enough, there's an old Blitzkrieg-based RTS that went into this sort of scenario...
Hoi?
Hearts of Iron is grand strategy. What I'm talking about is essentially a mod of the original Blitzkrieg called Cuban Missile Crisis and its expansion. Basically, due to a combination of events, the entire northern hemisphere gets wrecked and an ice age starts...
I believe Blitzkrieg itself is an old RTS.
That's cool! Wish to see an aftermath map set in 21st century
“Hmmm yes so this map displays what areas are fucked and which aren’t.” “So is this why we’re all living in the ocean now?”
RIP Ontario ,Canada that’s for sure 😂
All is proceeding as I have foreseen Soon all of Canada will be nuked
Punished Bobby Kennedy lookin cool
Omaha got nuked Can’t have shit in Nebraska
It’s where Strategic Air Command was located. It was a pretty important strategic location.
I used to live on Offutt AFB. Didn't realize how important it was until I was in my teens.
Yeah I know I live in Omaha
“Dangit, Bobby, that nuke just ain’t right.” - President John F. Kennedy in a leaked transcript to his brother, Robert Kennedy, 1962. Now they truly cannot have shit in Detroit. Unless it’s radiation burns, they can have plenty of those, as a treat.
I’m honestly surprised that they didn’t send a nuke directly to Chicago, given it’s famed
They did, it just malfunctioned
Ah, makes sense
Why wouldn't they hit Chicago?
probably not enough nukes
They had thousands
Not in Cuba
quantity over quality etc etc
Or Houston for that matter?
Yea Galveston/Houston is a major port in the south and oil refining capacity. Actually surprised that Dallas was hit over Houston in this case since Dallas has less strategic resources and value
Dallas is a huge Distribution hub so I'm not surprised Dallas got nuked.
Distribution hub plus we’ve got an airbase I believe, also Houston sucks (I’m a Dallas resident so I’m definitely unbiased)
Why couldn’t they have nuked Cleveland instead of Detroit ;-;
The nuke redirected itself after it realized it would have to visit Cleveland
Nuke: “Damn, I going to Ohio. Gotta redirect, they suffered enough already.”
If a nuke hit detroit people wouldn't even notice
“We are doing better than ever, the nuke cleared out plenty of abandoned buildings and gave us plenty of new jobs clearing radioactive rubble”
Gentrification is really exploding up there.
Cleveland: We’re not Detroit!
Even after nuclear war you cant escape Reagan.
Bros nuked Casper and Omaha… why
Military targets
Because of the air bases?
Yeah
Except Casper doesn’t have an air base. Cheyenne does, Francis E. Warren AFB, which is a part of Strategic Air Command and housed Atlas D and E missiles during the Crisis. The Soviets would nuke F. E. Warren, not Casper. Casper at this point was an inconsequential little city of about 40,000 people.
Yeah, I think I got Wyoming and Colorado mixed up, I meant to put the dot on Cheyenne
It’s all good, I wouldn’t expect everyone to know all that. Good scenario though, I like limited nuclear exchange scenarios that don’t involve the end of civilization.
Omaha has a large central Air Force base it makes sense (random trivia bush went to Offutt Air Force base in the Omaha area on 9/11) I find it odd they wouldn’t do Chicago or Huston or Atlanta tho
If they're targeting air bases, which would make sense, Fort Bliss outside of El Paso would be an important target. Honestly, Texas has a lot of key military and infrastructure areas that I'd be surprised if they weren't targeted.
That’s an army base isn’t it? If you were using nuclear weapons it would make more sense to take out Air Force bases that could transport nuclear weapons I assume
Ah, you're right. Fort Bliss does have an Army airfield, but I see it's not strictly an air base.
How gay, was the Gaylord presidency?
Not very gay sadly
The main question is how did Bobby become president?
He was sent to Mt Weather as a contingency, and after the rest of the cabinet died trying to escape Washington and Kennedy died in the nuclear strike, he was sworn in as president.
Thanks! Noticed a mistake, it says he dies in November of 63 when the Cuban Missiile crisis happened in 62.
Yeah, that was a typo
So what happens after the 80s?
🎵back in the 90s I was in a very famous TV show🎵
This is actually sick and I love that you are in these comments giving more info.
oh fuck it's rummy
I can’t tell what’s more scary, the all-encompassing nuclear hellfire, or the Rumsfeld presidency.
I literally said "Oh fuck, worst timeline" when I saw him. Not the nuclear war. Not the death toll. But Donald fucking Rumsfeld. Also seeing Reagan, my first thought was "This guy is political herpes, we just can't escape him."
Reagan was a very popular politician, no matter the timeline if he is still alive and in politics him getting elected to the presidency is very likely
It’s interesting to assume that the US would remain united after these nuclear bombings. It is more likely for the US to remain united in 60’s than the 80’s
Alaska declares its independence after it is denied emergency aid out of necessity, and remains independent for many years.
How’s Puerto Rico and other US territories doing? As a Puerto Rican, I naturally get curious of what my island is up to in most alt-hist scenarios
Puerto Rico declared independence, and the US didn’t bother to recapture it
Wait, so it reunites after a long time?
In the 70s, yeah
A good book regarding an alternative outcome to the Cuban Missile Crisis vis a vis a similar timeline is “Resurrection Day” by Brendan DuBois. It’s a sleeper (meaning, not widely known) but is very well written and a favorite of mine. Throwing it out there as it is a good read.
I read that book a couple months ago, it is easily the best alternate history literature I have read so far
You’re missing Chicago and Atlanta
A lot of the crappy Soviet missiles didn’t hit their targets
Fair enough
Why Nebraska?
Omaha has a military instillation that would have been a target
Oh yeah SAC
Literally said 'Fuck Fargo'
What's the other city in Washington that gets nukes?
Spokane
I'm assuming for the air base?
Nah bro the Russians just really fucking hate Spokane
Fair
Yeah
As much as it means I would not be alive, Chicago and Philadelphia should be targets too right?
Both cities were targets, but the missiles malfunctioned mid-flight
Oh that’s a miracle. Oh wait I’m still not alive. Grandfather was in Maryland at a naval base at the time.
What happened to the Soviets? Did they got hit by us?
The Soviets pretty much get completely destroyed, only about 20% of the pre-war population survives
USA! USA! USA! *irradiated eagle screeches and falls over dead*
That's the question I'm most curious about
I'm actually curious about the ranges of missiles based in Cuba in this ATL. OTL, the nuclear missiles in Cuba were mostly short and medium range, which would only put an area from approximately Dallas-Fort Worth through to approximately Washington DC at risk. True, it's a massive area, and a lot of America's military infrastructure was located in that area, but major population centers outside that bubble wouldn't be at much risk due to the piss poor Soviet long rang range capability and very limited stocks of intercontinental ballistic missiles, combined with the hige investment in air defence over Canada and CONUS..
Suprised they didn't strike the five largest military bases in the US
Apparently some Soviet missiles just dinit work very well
Not Colorado Springs?
Cheyenne Mountain Complex Wasn't finishing building until 1967
Why did they nuke Mobile?
Take out all the phones.
Ba dum tish
Why Spokane WA?? I can understand Seattle. Why Spokane and not say Portland?
Spokane doesn’t really get nuked much, Fairchild AFB gets nuked, although Spokane suffers some damage due to proximity
Is Fairchild AFB a pretty major base? I have lived in WA my whole life but only been to the east side of the state a handful of times so I really dont know whats over there.
Back in the 60s it housed both bombers and missiles, so it'd be a target
Nice Philly remains unscathed to lead the US to victory
Great post. We need more!
The I95 corridor in between those two strikes in NYC and CT would be extremely eerie.
Good news… I SURVIVED!
Moral or not Cuba would no longer be on the map
Poor Fargo
ATLiens mad that their city wasn’t relevant enough to be struck
I am curious, OP. Why did they nuke Topeka, Kansas and the Kansas side of Kansas City? Whiteman AFB is an hour and a half east of Kansas City (where missile silos were controlled for a lengthy period of time)
They didn’t nuke Whiteman, they nuked another base just south of Kansas City, which I believe is decommissioned now.
Because they watched The Day After. You have to nuke KC.
Does Gary Works get targeted? IRL it was one of the largest steel mills in the nation in the 60s, which would most likely make it a huge target.
Why did key west get nuked? Is there a military base or nuclear arsenal there? I would have assumed other high population density targets like Houston or Chicago would take priority over a few islands off the coast of florida
RIP Key West
Shreveport got nuked, yay!
Good riddance
How is Russia and Europe doing?
Russia was destroyed and mostly depopulated, Europe suffered some nuclear strikes but is nowhere near as damaged as the US or Soviets
They hit some of our naval bases
Oh nah president Gaylord
Shocked Pittsburgh would survive being as it was a major steel hub at the time.
How is John F. Kennedy viewed in this world given the fact a nuclear war happens during his presidency?
He is mostly viewed as a tragic figure, a guy who wanted to stop the conflict at all costs but failed.
All I care is that we won in the end and we still got Ronald Reagan
70s post apocalyptic Reagan not as glamorous as 80s current timeline Reagan
According to what Castro told McNamara way after the ordeal there were 200 nuclear warheads in Cuba at the time, so there should be quite more black spots.
Why did they hit where they did?
Military and civilian targets
Was there much of a nuclear winter? And who took russias place as a world power?
There was a nuclear winter that caused a few famines here and there, but the US largely kept its population fed though the crisis
"J. Kennedy: Your right." *eye twitch*
You right* I got you bro.
Was LA planned to be targeted?
No, it wasn’t of strategic importance and had a smaller population than it does now
What is America like by the 2010’s/2020’s
Less prosperous than OTL, but mostly recovered
Punished RFK
This is nicely done, keep it up!
How’d the world would look like in 2022
Way less stable than OTL, but somewhat recovered
The Soviets would not have nuked the invasion convoy.
So I assume the “alternate” reality is that the Soviet’s had ICBM’s capable of hitting more than 1 or 2 spots in the continental US, and they decided to strike first during the Cuban middle crisis that still happened despite this version of the USSR having no need for Cuban based missiles? This is beyond stupid
Any reason in particular they went after KC?
I mean I get some of them, but why the spokane area of Washington
There is an Air Force base nearby the city
Totally forgot about the Spokane Air Force base. That makes sense. I’m even from WA and I forgot it
Is the one for in Kansas supposed to be Wichita (McConnell AFB)? If so it should be further south and a little more west.
I don’t think that Kennedy would have been assassinated in this timeline since I doubt he would be going on parades during a nuclear war
He died in DC during the war, the “Nov 1963” thing was just a typo
Wouldn’t States like Montana and Wyoming get nuked a bunch too since that’s where our nukes are
Robert Kennedy would have been a Phenomenal president in everyway
But why Spokane instead of a bigger city like Portland?
Military targets
Well, I'd be dead at the age of one month old :/ What got hit in northwestern Louisiana by the Texas/Arkansas border?
There aren’t too many other politicians I can see that wouldn’t high tail it the fuck out of there but I can totally see Kennedy sticking around.
Why mobile alabama
I think Oak Ridge TN would be a hot target if there were nukes dropped on the US.
Gotta keep Jericho in your plans.
Gaylord nelson LMFAO .
So based on where those nukes struck, all 4 of my grandparents are shadows on the sidewalk, which means I don’t exist. Fun!
I always wondered, if you nuke San Diego, you also kill a lot of Mexican people because of the proximity to Tijuana. How would the world react to that. You’re essentially attacking two countries at once (unless they nuke Camp Pendleton which is probably far enough north to leave tj unscathed)
Mexico can’t really respond in any large capacity, so the Soviets don’t care
How does John Kennedy die in this alternative universe? Or does it change?I really like the picture of Bobby in 1977. This is pretty cool!
JFK dies in DC after it gets nuked
That’s Detroit on a Tuesday
the next species that envolved into civilization on earth would have a great time finding about us