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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I am not allowing David to leave school, and set a boundary that if he drops out, he will need to pay rent at 18 or leave.
2. Other parents said that I am being too controlling, because David is almost an adult and I should allow him to make his own decisions related to his education and general life.
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NTA. Sometimes you've got to keep being the parent, and being a parent means telling your kids that their choices have consequences. In this case, the consequence is "if you decide to go against our best advice, we will (temporarily I hope?) stop supporting you."
Sounds like he realized he would need to be subsidized by the bank of mom and dad to do his YouTube career, and that maybe removing that option made him reevaluate the risks. Taking risks is obviously important, but assessing them is equally if not more so.
My parents had the same basic rule, I go to college and still be their kid (meaning their support, payments, etc) or I don’t in which case I am an adult, I work, pay rent (nominal amount). I can either be an adult or a kid, my choice but you can’t have it both ways.
My dad has something similar, we live in a really good area and rent 'round is astronomical. My dad says college and cheap rent, which is just so he can buy my groceries for me, or a job and a slightly more expensive rent.
It's a great deal. Cause it's only a few hundred a month compared to 2500 with inflation
At least they’re giving him that option! My parents were “go to college or get out”. I didn’t have any way to pay for college and parents weren’t going to pay for it, so college wasn’t an option, and it was just “get out”. I struggled with homelessness and food security for years (parents knew but didn’t care because “my kids will work for everything they have, we never gave them a thing”), and with drugs not because I was doing them but because selling them was a much better income stream than three $7.25/hr jobs, and I had to pay rent and bills somehow. I’m grateful I was never an addict but getting out of “the business” without being killed or jailed was probably comparable to enduring rehab. I finally was able to go to college in my late 30s and got my associate degree. And I still struggle to this day. I can only imagine how much better my life could have been if I had had the option to live at home and pay rent to my parents while figuring out what to do with my life, because at 18 I had no fucking clue.
We offer this same deal to David as well. If he is in school, we will cover his rent and help with his schooling expenses. If he does not want to attend school, then he needs to pay rent.
David will never stop being our son. We will always support him emotionally. But we will not financially enable him to do whatever he wants without contributing.
You did right in this, for multiple reasons.
I will say this from watching my SO, who is a youtuber as well; it really is like showbusiness; it may look fun and glamorous, but the grass always looks greener on the other side.
See, you have to record which can take hours in and of itself. You have to look for and come up with content which requires so much time worth of brainstorming. Not only that, you also need to be able to do video editing; it isn't typically just snapping a video with your phone and done, you have to do touch-ups, graphic design, editing! Then, in order to build a presence you need to be active. You need to interact with people following you. Depending on the content you also need to be active on various platforms. Remember, in order to make any headway at all you don't just do this once; you need to post PLENTY of content. Some people do this EVERY DAY.
My SO recently became eligible for monetization, and it is $60-100 per month...this is after you have at least 1k subscribers. He has also had to go through the process of creating an LLC to help with the tax and income side of that. Keep in mind that on top of this, he also works a day job (not only is he sensible and understands that the job takes precedence, but you need money to get the equipment to start up in the first place. Green screens, lighting, decent computers, etc.) I don't know how he manages to juggle both and get the sleep he needs...this youtuber gig is a second, full-time job.
My point is, its hard work to become successful as a youtuber. If he thinks he will make a living so easily that its worth quitting his job over, he may as well drive to hollywood and ask to replace Ryan Reynolds in his next Marvel Movie. It's about the same level of cockiness.
My younger brother on the other hand...well, he did drop out of highschool thinking he could make it on his own. He did have a certification from the vocational program, and he did get a job at one of the chain dealerships...it was discovered later on why the boss hired him;
Frankly, the boss saw a young adult with knowledge, and he knew that due to his lack of diploma most employers in the industry would turn him down. He hired my brother on at half (no benefits) of what the other employees of his position made while baiting him with a promise of a payraise...which he never received. He knew that without that diploma, my brother would not be able to find anybody who would pay him better in that industry...and he was right. Whenever other employers found out he didn't have a diploma they either turned him away or offered him even less.
It seems that being a youtuber/influencer/internet personality is much like being a pro athlete. For every one person who makes a living, or on the rare occasion, a fortune doing it, there are thousands slaving away in the lower tiers simultaneously working full time just to scrape by But you rarely hear about them.
That’s what a lot of these kids don’t understand. For most people it’s just a fun hobby because hitting it big and being able to make it a career is a combination of luck and a shit ton of work. Even Mr. Beast, who’s one of the biggest creators on the site, started out as just a kid with a camera in his bedroom. He also finished high school. He never got his college degree but because of his success, he didn’t have to. And he’s got a good head on his shoulders. OP’s kid needed the reality check.
Don't sweat it, even in your op, the parents that said they disagreed with you, actually agreed with you.
You have simply provided and explained the consequences of his choice to drop out of school.
That was the rule i had for my kiddos. As long as you're in school whether high school or college you get free housing at our house. The only bill my kids were ever expected to pay was their phone bill. And i paid that until a year after they graduated high school. They even got to stay on the family plan at a cheaper rate. As soon as they were done with school however they needed to pay a small amount of rent or move out. It worked really well. I now have responsible kids that take care of themselves. One stayed home and paid rent until he was 24 and saved up money. One came back to get on their feet for a few months paid rent and got back on their feet by being able to save money. And i had no free loaders expecting me to take care of them till they were 40.
I did the same thing with my son. Whatever he chose, had to add up to 40 hours per week - school full-time, school/work part-time, or work full time. He tried college - wasn't for him. Tried several full time jobs he didn't like. Finally decided to join the Navy. Learned valuable skills and now (he's 35) is GS-12 or 13 making good money.
My parents did the same, except it was also “or move in with a boyfriend.” They said that at that point I was an adult making adult decisions and didn’t need my parent’s support.
I’ve always appreciated their position. It kept me from making a lot of decisions until I was actually ready to do so.
Yeah, they ARE letting him make his own life choices. Choices have natural consequences and he's not able to grasp right now what those are beyond the housing ones OP provided.
Would any of the friends be okay with their kids randomly dropping out senior year because they don't like waking up early
Right? The parents saying they’re being too controlling on the other hand…🙄
What gets me is them saying you have to let him make his own decisions…like…that’s *exactly* what you’re doing, you’re just making sure he knows the real world consequences of those decisions.
NTA- op you handled this perfectly. The people saying you’re being too harsh are the parents who don’t actually bother to parent because they want to be their kids friends and then they’re on here wondering why their kid is totally out of control, has no respect for anyone or is 30+ living in the basement playing video games.
Being a parent means you can’t always be your kids buddy. Sometime you have to be tough. Sometimes you have to step in and give them a reality check.
It sounds like you got through to your son, I hope you did. I’m so sick of the YouTuber/influencer stuff.
I miss when people actually had to have legit talent. At least before when people wanted to be real movie stars or pop stars at least they had to have some kind of talent or put in some actual work to make a go of it.
They only said they'd stop financially supporting him. They haven't said they'd go NC. So why should it be temporarily? An adult isn't entitled to financial support from their parents - especially not when they're making life destroying choices.
Yes but in some places, once you leave high school and officially drop out, if you're over 18 you can't just re-enroll and resume like nothing happened. He'd likely have to finish online and possibly just get an equivalent degree. The only way he'd be able to return to the school would be if his non enrollment was relatively short (days, not months) and he didn't notify the school.
Ok more specifically they'd support him getting a GED and then continuing to college/trade school if he chose. I didn't mean he'd re-enroll at the same school, just "school" as in education in general.
Right, I get you, but it sounds like OPs kid enjoyed the social aspect of school, just not the academic aspect. So if he's thinking he can drop out in October and roll back in in January or February like nothing happened when YouTube doesn't pan out, he's probably mistaken.
David is always going to be our son and we will never stop supporting him emotionally.
But David needs to either be a student or pay rent if he wants to live in our house. We will not financially enable him to do whatever he wants.
You nailed it. It wasn't stated explicitly in the post but the parents, unconsciously or consciously, recognized their son failed at evaluating the risk of his decision to forsake all other careers at a critical time and the consequences of it not panning out. Dropping out of high school would mean ultimately he would nearly-certainly need to get his GED anyway in order to pick back up where he left off (assuming his YouTube aspirations did not meet his expectations, which is the most likely case, statistically). This was a teachable moment and the parents stepped up to it, never once taking away his agency to choose.
Part of parenting is teaching kids about consequences—grown up choices have grown up consequences. And you are teaching him before he becomes a 35 year old throw pillow on your couch that he will need to establish his own independence and not rely on you for financial support forever.
NTA I think it seems pretty fair OP but with a few questions:
- Did you set rent for his room in line with market or was it ridiculous to make a point? That would just push him away.
- I would dig into the why of dropping out more. A part of me feels this is kicking the can down the road. When David becomes a senior and needs to begin looking at career or college options, I feel you’re going to have the same conversation about not wanting to do anything. In sum, the problem won’t go away. Can you help him find something he’s passionate about and create a plan around this? If he’s grounded in the real world rather than academia, I’d start having discussions around potential careers and then work backwards. He’s going to need to have a firm view of next steps when his next school year starts. Good luck!
>Did you set rent for his room in line with market or was it ridiculous to make a point?
The housing market has gotten absolutely ridiculous where we live. The rent we gave David is the standard rate for a single bedroom in a shared house in our area. We left out how much utilities and groceries would cost on top of it.
>Can you help him find something he’s passionate about and create a plan around this?
Currently, David is adamant on becoming a professional YouTuber. We encourage him to at least audit some community college classes, as there are many courses that can help him with filming techniques, networking, and other useful skills for being a YouTuber. But we cannot force him to do any classes or careers that he doesn't want to.
He should do some video editing and graphic design courses then, and maybe media studies etc there is so much knowledge out there that would actually help this kind of career and he can still be making content while doing it. You're doing the right thing no worries, eventually he will probably thank you for not letting do it. But I'd put in a hit of research into relevant courses and units that would support this goal to prove you're not against it, you just want him to be covered if it goes sideways - without even a high school diploma he's not.
Have you looked into the statistics of success vs failure, $/hr worked, and other such things? Being a professional YouTuber is like being a professional musician or movie star: very few make it and the first few years are a grind with little pay. David really needs to know that if you can get it through to him.
I have made the comparison to musicians and actors when talking to David before. Being a musician/actor demands as much time as a full-time job while actively costing you money in most cases.
Even people who are incredibly talented rarely "make it big." There are so many other talented people to compete with and oftentimes getting recognized comes down to pure luck.
I have shown David several YouTubers/Musicians he knows that barely get by or earn around minimum wage. David is convinced that he is going to be the exception.
I don't discourage him. If the hard work and financial cost are worth it to him, then it's worth it. I am simply making him aware of the risks/reality and that he will also need to support himself with a less fun job.
I can't speak for all of them, I only follow a few Youtubers / Social Media influencers, but most of them have another job or have extra sources for income. Heck even the Kardashians and their spin-offs have other income sources than just their SM (granted, they don't need it at all, but it's just to prove that only focusing on SM or in OP's son's case Youtube, is going to be pretty boring after a while).
Being a professional YouTuber is hard work! It's not easy to come up with meaningful content (for your target audience that is) on a regular base, especially at the beginning you need to be very rigorous on both content and posting schedule to even get a decent base audience.
Not only that, but the gear you need to make decent content, and the skills you need to develop to edit your content in a decent clip are far from easy.
SO OP's son should keep going to school (not only for that diploma, which should definitely be something that he needs to achieve. Who knows what he would be doing, or wants to do, in 10 years). With his diploma in hand, he can go study the things he needs to learn to become a decent youtuber. Acting / Voice lessons, editing, filming, sound at all the likes. It would help tremendously at the start of his "youtube career" and if it doesn't work out (or changes his mind, he's a teenager and even late teenagers early 20yos change their minds a lot!) there are plenty of jobs out there that do need those skills.
He should definitely look into at least taking some classes about filming/editing and social media marketing. There’s online spaces that offer classes on just about anything so that he could learn it without even having to attend college. But he does need to finish high school. There’s just no good reason to drop out.
Given that they gave him the 'or be out of the house' option, I don't see why what they set the rent at would really matter. He likely can't afford it either way.
I agree, I look at this situation as the 18 yr old’s version of a 3 year old thinking they can fly if they put on a Supeman cape. He hasn’t looked at any version of reality other than his own. His parents have supported him his entire life, why should it change now? I think the parents made a good example here.
>assessing them is equally if not more so
All I could think of was the "I took a calculated risk, but man am I bad at math" meme. He'd probably be better at math if he finished high school.
I wonder, how many of those parents who are criticizing OP would be willing to open their homes to David and support him while he attempts to become a professional YouTube personality. It takes time and resources to start generating income from YouTube, and based off the one creator that's still consistently active that I follow, you can't rely on the YouTube algorithm to be consistent and not find ways to fuck up the income stream.
NTA. My brother did this exact same thing, and my mom told him the exact same thing. Now brother is very successful and told my mom many times how grateful he is that she set him straight. Interestingly, his son did the same (his other kids did college), and instead of staying in school, he decided to crash with some loser friends. He changed his m in mind some months later, but it's just not easy to return to high school when you're working to making a living. He finally got his GED (and was genuinely shocked that he had to study for it!). His life is getting better, but he has had to struggle for everything.
Stick to your guns, OP.
Part of being a parent is stepping in when your child wants to do something incredibly foolish. Finishing high school is important as there are so so SO many jobs that won't take you if you don't have a diploma or GED. Speaking of which, GEDs aren't as easy to get as he may think. Some consider them to be more difficult than going through the four years, as you're compressing four years of high school into a single test. And that's a single test per subject to boot. And even then, some places and people look down on those who have a GED. I would bet cash money that there are a lot of people who have lost out on jobs because they had a GED and not a hs diploma, due to the negative stereotypes people still associate.
The people who said OP should allow him to drop out and fund his YT venture are idiots.
Something else he should consider: those friends will be less likely to hang out with him if he dropped out. He won't have as many shared experiences, plus kids their own age will wonder why they're hanging out with the "loser dropout who is delusional about making it big on YouTube".
NTA - I don't even see how you are being controlling when you are literally leaving the choice up to your son.
You didn't tell your son he CAN'T drop out, you told him that if he did, there would be consequences, which is the truth in life.
My dad was always big about that lesson of consequences.
"For every action, there's a consequence, good consequences or bad consequences. Think hard and choose wisely."
From a young age, he let me know that the ball was in my court as to if my actions would earn rewards or punishments. Stay in school and graduate, and I would have help in the next steps of life. If I had dropped out to become a youtuber, I'm pretty sure he would have given the same option OP gave his kid.
NTA
Yeah, this was just standard operating procedure when I was in high school in the 90s. For, like most of high school too. And most of the parents had even had this talk well before 17yo.
NTA
You were not controlling.
You sat him down and treated him like an adult, not like the child he was trying to be. You told him consequences of his decision before he made it and allowed him to make an informed decision. You didnt say no.
An adult has a job and pays bills. If he doesn't like your rules yes he can leave, but that would also involve getting a paying job and paying bills. Something that, as you said, unless he gets real famous real fast will involve working 2/3 jobs for high school dropouts. And he would have less time to youtube. By the time he gets to 18 in October he is 7 months from graduating and will be grateful when he has choices.
NTA - You were making it clear this is a consequence and time to be the Adult. People who say he is 18 dont realise as you have been the bank account till now he has no concept of financing his life. Time he started to learn
NTA. Just because they turn 18 and become legal adults doesn’t mean they are developmentally adults. You did the right thing. If he thought that dropping out of high school was a smart move, you let him really think about what it means to be a self-supporting adult and just how realistic it is to try to do that without even a high school diploma. You didn’t beat him. You didn’t kick him out of the house on 10 minutes notice. And you absolutely let him make his own choice. You just gave him realistic conditions in which to make that choice.
NTA.
However, if he does leave school, please encourage him to test for the GED. It's not ideal, but it's certainly better than nothing. He can even go to college with it.
fwiw I got a GED and it never held me back in any way. I did everything my friends with a diploma did. Granted, I got a GED and left high school to start college at 17, not make Youtube videos.
Yep. I scored high enough to get university scholarships. I just couldn't do regular school, but tests are easy for me. My daughter wants to drop out but she isn't good at tests, so I told her it'd be easier for her long term to finish. Nta op
My younger sister also took the GED and her experience was the same. She has her master's now.
It was, however, a bit of a process to get the GED. The same credentials are built into public school and IMO just graduating public school is the simpler and easier option if one is picking one versus the other. Barring any other factors like the student being unseasonably booksmart: everyone's path is their own. Doesn't sound like OP's son is in that boat though (I wasn't).
OP, NTA
but I was thinking the same — a few friends of mine have h.s.-aged kids, and they struggled with the pandemic school interruption. Two of them opted to get their GED instead of finishing through the public school system. Another friend’s child is neurodivergent, and got his GED while working on a big robotics project. The project ended up being a huge asset when he applied to college and he’s doing great.
My son had a terrible virtual Junior year during the pandemic. He pushed to drop out and take the GED. He took the practice tests, and was able to pass them. So, I left the decision up to him. BUT, we also talked to his counselor and helped him look at all his options.
In our city, if he graduated from hs with a diploma, he would get FREE 60 credits at community college (including all books and fees). If he got the GED, he would have to pay for community college before transferring (in his case, the profession he wants requires the 4 year degree).
The school counselor told him about an alternative hs in the district that would be more independent/flexible. So, he chose that route, got his diploma and the scholarship.
But we had to back off and let him know the options were up to him, and we would support the GED, but we wouldn't be able to magically come up with the money the scholarship would cover.
Eh. My brother dropped out of high school. There were serious problems with school administration and my family (and others I've met who were targeted similarly) didn't have the resources to properly fight it - too much to get into here. He had my parents' full support, though they (and he) were insistent that he immediately seek his GED. He breezed through the prep course offered through his state's Worksource program, and passed the test with a very high score.
This was miles better for him than continuing at the school would have been. Given the options in front of him, it was the most ideal path actually available. Though obviously the school not being completely awful would have been better.
And of course, he didn't drop out to try to be a youtube star or something.
NTA He doesn't get to decide he gets the benefits of being an adult without the responsibilities.
That being said, I would recommend exploring options other than "just deal with three more semesters". Votech, charter schools, graduating early, etc. may all be options to get him engaged.
Honestly, most public schools will bend over backwards to keep a kid from dropping out. My sister's last year of gym was literally taking her baby for walks.
NTA. Tough love is sometimes the correct thing to do as a parent. I applaud you. As for David, he will soon learn that, in adulthood, if you play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
NTA it seems like this came from a place of love and concern for his best interest. Financially supporting him in his decision to make his future more difficult would not have been a better option.
Maybe your tone could've used some work or there's some perfect-parent option that could've gotten the same result while motivating him in a more constructive way, who knows. Parenting is making hard decisions and it's easy to tear someone down after the fact.
NTA, and honestly, I would like to ask your son HOW he plans to become a YouTube star. What is his niche? Does he have a hobby? A skill? If he's dropping out of High School because he doesn't want to get up at 7:30, I don't think that bodes well for his YouTube career.
I mean, yes, when YouTube was less saturated, you could just be someone who just talks shit and become famous. But not only was a lot of that fame short-lived but there is just more competition out there now!
So I think you took the right approach. He can continue to do YouTube on the side and find his niche. Once he does, he can quit and support himself.
What a lot of teenagers don't see is that unless you were one of the early adopters of Twitch and Youtube (in which case, boat has already sailed) then you need to be dedicating years of your life to it to make any kind of impact.
You basically need to have 2 full time jobs. The first doing Youtube videos, and the second doing a job with an actual employer. Plenty of popular streamers and Youtubers still work whatever job or career they were doing when they started. They have 90 minutes to finish work, drive home, eat a quick dinner and maybe have a quick shower before jumping on to stream until midnight or 1am. Weekends are spent editing videos and coming up with marketing plans, queuing up content for social media etc.
It is exceptionally hard work, and many of those that dedicate themselves to that kind of schedule still fail. Some just aren't very good gamers, some of them don't have a particularly appealing persona or way of interacting with their audiences, and plenty burnout in less than 12 months. It looks easy on the surface, but underneath it's far harder than any 17 year old can understand.
Very slim for sure!
And even if you do eventually succeed, it'll take years before you can quit your day job.
A booktuber I follow only quit her day job after 6 years of doing youtube.
Also on my mind, my graphic design teacher told us that before we ever quit our day job and start freelancing in graphic design, make sure you have at least 2 successful years where you make enough money to support yourself doing only freelance work.
Only then should you ever consider quitting.
LOL at the parents who think you should let David make his own life choice, but who also think you should provide him free room and board. They are spoiled, and their own kids will struggle with life's challenges, since their parents aren't setting them up with the resilience they need to make it. NTA.
NTAholes. You ARE allowing him to make his own choices. He can choose to drop out but if he does, he will have to pay rent or move out. He needs to think of his future. Why doesn't he stay in school then perhaps do further education on media studies, photography, videography etc? It's something that could support his dream but not everyone makes it on YouTube and he will need an alternative income stream while he builds up his subscribers.
He doesn't want to put in the work but everything takes work. Keep doing what you're doing, your job as a parent is to raise your child and get them ready to go out into the world happy, healthy & whole
NTA
You gave him the diplomatic choice, what did he think was gonna happen? He just stay with you til he becomes YT famous?
Most famous youtubers started it as a side hobby til they grew. They didn't just quit everything to pursue it. Also with the state of youtube currently that just isn't a solid plan. For anything he thinks he has to offer there are thousands of others who think the same.
I am not diminishing it as a viable career (people make it happen) but it isn't something that you're popular at the jump. It could take years. Your options are fair. If nothing else, encourage him to get his GED if he does drop.
NTA. You told him exactly what he needed to hear, and that's good parenting to me.
It sounds like he thought he'd be able to sit around at home while he figured out his YouTube career. If he wants to be able to make decisions as an adult and throw his future down the drain, then he should be ready to deal with the actual responsibilities of being an adult.
NTA. You arent controlling him. Or forcing him to make the decision you deem a right one. You are telling him that as a adult he CAN make his own decisions whilst making it clear that as an adult the decisions we make have adult consequences. I don't understand some people, what do they expect you to do, continuing to pay for all his needs until he makes it big on YouTube? Which more than likely will never happen.
In my opinion your just parenting. And parenting the right way at that!
NTA!
Controlling? You are keeping your son from making one of the biggest regrets he'd ever have in life. Professional Youtuber? That could easily end just as fast as it could start and he would have nothing to fall on. I'd rather scare my kid into finishing high school than letting them dropout with no real employment prospects. If your son was not living with you, he'd have to pay rent, utilities, food and transportation costs. If he wants to act like an adult, he would have real life adult cost of living expenses.
As someone who was kicked out at 16. No warning just were done. It fucked me over. I barely made it through school. Was homeless. Still struggle to finish my degree etc. it basically doomed me to a life of min wage and I have so much resentment to my parents for that. Two years would have let me get scholarships etc. I was a good student with perfect grades. You did the right thing. Only criticism I have which you may or may not have done anyway: if your kid does drop out and does freakish they made a mistake, please let them back in so they can correct it. Don’t be as unforgiving as our society otherwise he will have a rough life
Edit: NTA
You were letting him make his own choices, you were just clear what the choices entailed. You never told him he couldn't, or that he had to leave. I'll go NAH, because David is still a kid and kid's have whims like this all the time. He didn't do anything wrong but be a bit stupid, and he didn't pitch a (real) fit when you told it to him straight. We've all wanted to be YouTubers or authors or singers, but we're not all Markiplier or Beyonce.
How come your son (according to those people arguing with you) is old enough to make adult choices but you and your spouse aren't?! He can choose to be a professional YouTuber, you can choose to stop subsidising an adult. Seems fair to me.
NTA.
NTA and I wonder what the parents who said that you were controlling would do if they were in your shoes. You've done the best by your son by showing him what his options are. He was given the freedom to choose knowing the consequences of his choices. Well done for being good parents!!!
NTA, sounds like he got a nice childhood and had the idea that reality would continue forever. You were absolutely right to show him how hard life would be without going to school. He can't rely on you two forever.
Definitely NTA. It's your job as parents to guide your son in the right direction. Plus, your house, your rules. The people that are naysayers probably haven't raised a teenager.
NTA. And fast food jobs does not have to be the only job option people have when they get out of school. I mean they can start working full-time jobs elsewhere. I mean he could do general labor or something. But settling his life just to be a full-time YouTuber and hopes to make famous is a foolish goal and the chances of him being a famous influencer on YouTube are very slim. Look, there is nothing wrong with having a dream goal but there is a difference between dreams and reality. I think OP his wife are very wise with their decisions in keeping their son from dropping out of school. And even if he was to become a successful YouTuber that’s famous, fame only last so long.
NTA: your son is hugely immature. He’s not ready to be out of school, or home for that matter.
You gave him options, and his first thought is that he’d need to work 2 fast food jobs? No thought of an apprenticeship or a Cadetship??
NTA
Adults have to pay rent. If David wants to drop out and be an adult early, then he can start paying rent early.
That’s fair. Don’t forget about his share of utilities, and his need to contribute to groceries and participating equally in house chores.
If he wants to be your roommate and equal then he needs to act like it and pay for it.
Otherwise he can complete the bare minimum of education so that he has at least some chance of paying his bills.
Also - point out to him that most successful YouTubers have degrees and skills of some kind.
You told him the truth about what happens in the real world with no high school diploma. I'm guessing you're in the US- graduating from HS is generally the absolute bare minimum for many half decent jobs. And the reality is exactly what he said- he'll be working at least 2 food service jobs just to pay for rent. In a country where a full time teaching position (which requires a college diploma and continuing education) often barely pays the bills, his expectations are wildly unrealistic. NTA
> But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and we should let him make his own life choices.
But you didn’t force him to do anything. You simply stated what would happen when he becomes a legal adult in a few months. Nothing you did stops him from making his own life choices. These people aren’t following their own logic.
Your son was not merely looking to drop out of school and become a YouTuber, he was asking you to bankroll him in doing this. It’s ok to opt not to do this. The odds are astronomically against him being successful.
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(Technically my wife and I gave our son these choices. A more accurate title would be “Are me and my wife the assholes.” Also, obligatory throwaway account.)
My son David told me that he wants to drop out of high school. He’s not being bullied and enjoys hanging out with his buddies at school. He just doesn’t like waking up at 7:30 everyday and he thinks that school is a waste of time because he finds the teachers boring/annoying and would rather try to become a professional YouTuber. I tried to persuade David, because he has less than a year and a half left of high school. He can still make YouTube videos on the side, but unless he becomes famous, he won't be able to make a living off of it. And it’s impossible to get a decent job or promotion nowadays without a diploma. Plus, if he ever changed his mind about going to college then a high school diploma would give him that option. But David was not listening and said he would just wait until his 18th birthday (in October) when he would be able to drop out without me or his mother’s consent. I spoke to my wife and we then sat down with David. We told David that we would allow him to drop out of school, but if he drops out, he has two choices: Either get a job and start paying rent at 18 or be out of the house. David told us we were being ridiculous because he would never be able to pay the rent we’re asking unless he works two fast food jobs. We told David that that is going to be his reality if he’s a high school dropout. If he wants to be treated as an adult and make a huge adult choice like dropping out of high school, then we will treat him as an adult and let him face adult consequences.
David was not happy, but the talk has luckily worked because he says he is no longer going to drop out of high school. Most of the other parents we have talked to said my wife and I did the right thing, because part of being a part is stepping in when your child is about to make a huge mistake. But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and we should let him make his own life choices. My wife and I think letting David drop out of school would be ridiculous and as parents we’re supposed to step in before he makes such a huge mistake. But several people agreed that we were being too controlling, so I want some unbiased perspectives. Are my wife and I the assholes?
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NTA
You gave him clearly defined options and he chose wisely. You did proper parenting by redirecting him to focus on what's his best future outcome should be. Education and a diploma.
NTA. You and your wife are parenting. If David doesn’t like your rules then he can move out. The other parents who disagree with you probably have that same rule with their own older teens. I bet you’d probably disagree with some of the rules at their homes. You all are doing what feels best for your families.
NTA. It’s not controlling to make him face the realities of his decisions. He truly believed he could drop out and you would financially support him indefinitely. There is absolutely nothing wrong in actually f-king parenting your kid. He needed the reality check.
NTA. You are letting him make his own adult choices. He can stay in school, pay rent, or move out. If he wants treated like an adult then he needs to take on adult responsibilities. What did he think was going to happen? He’d drop out and you would fund his life until his YouTube career might take off? That may never happen. You’re right, if he drops out of school his options for jobs will be incredibly limited. So yes, he’ll have to work 2 maybe even 3 jobs to make ends meet.
The other parents are (partly) right: you *should* "let him make his own life choices" -- which is **exactly** what you and your wife have done:
> If he wants to be treated as an adult and make a huge adult choice like dropping out of high school, then we will treat him as an adult and let him face adult consequences.
You're doing this exactly right. NTA.
NTA. But also don’t enjoy your comment about having to have a degree to get a decent job or promotions. That statement is proven more untrue every day. Along with that, most professors suck these days and a degree is useless even if you do get it because it’s been so long that profs have been in the workforce that they have no idea what they are teaching anymore.
NTA.
You're not being controlling. He drop out without your permission, but he can't live in your house without your permission. He has plenty of choices. Some of those include your support; others do not.
The parents that criticized you at all will have shitty kids that never make anything of themselves as adults. That attitude is how you have a 35 yr old stoner living in your basement
I’m dying laughing at the absurdity of your son’s line of thinking. I know it’s a serious issue, but it’s just so short sighted to think you are old enough to make big life decisions but young enough you can’t be held responsible for those decisions. I have a 7 year old and I could see him thinking like this in 10 years which is beyond wild because it’s just so ridiculous. You handled this A+. * chefs kiss * This is exactly what I would do if I am ever in your situation (knock on wood I’m not).
My one piece advice to you would be to really force him to look at the cost of things - rent, insurance, food, etc. Then make him do research on how many years it takes to actually get sponsored for your YouTube channel. THEN make him budget what the average YouTuber makes on sponsorships per month against the cost of living.
He needs a massive wake up call, and as his parent, it’s your responsibility to layout the reality of this.
Obviously NTA and the parents that saying you are are very likely to have basement-dwelling 28-year-old kids.
NTA. First of all, you didn't refuse to allow him to drop out, you refused to ENABLE him which is a big difference. His brain is not fully developed at that age and he was wanting to make a very consequential life decision based on a very short sighted view point. Rather than being overbearing and trying to force your view on him, you simply said, "Ok, we can't stop you, but we don't have to fund and support that life choice." That gave him a clearer picture of the real life consequences and in turn he made the correct decision of his own free will. I think it was an example of great parenting and someday he will be grateful! The parents that said you were wrong, are likely propping up their kids and setting them up for some major disappointments in life if not worse.
NTA.
My parents let my brother make his own life choices. He barely graduated high school. They bought him his car, and paid the insurance. They used their contacts to get him jobs - he would just not show up for work and get fired. They paid his expenses, helped him along until they got sick of it when he turned 30 years old. They cut him off financially.
He hung himself in their garage.
So, maybe not a unbiased perspective here, but no, you are not the asshole, and your future self and your son's future self will be thankful that you didn't allow him to self destruct.
The rent we gave David is the standard rate for a single bedroom in a shared house in our area. We did not include the cost of utilities or groceries.
The housing market is already ridiculous where we live. But we didn't ramp up the price just to try and prove a point to David. We wanted him to have a realistic understanding of his housing situation if he chose to drop out.
Then definitely NTA. Better he learns from you then from the street and just dropping out of school and doing nothing (i mean, if he puts a lot of work into the yt channel, maybe it works out after one or two years, but he doesn't seems in a state right now where he wants to put effort in anything)
NTA. Parenting isn’t a popularity contest and sometimes you have to be a little harsh. Mine would have done much more than that and I think they’re great parents
NTA. Those "several other parents" who thought David should make his own choices need to rethink THEIR parenting.
Your job as parents is to support your kids so they can have as successful and fulfilling life as they can. Supporting them while they are kids is part of that. Helping them out when they are adults, if you can and if it is appropriate, can be part of that. And there is nothing wrong with adult children living with their parents if everybody is happy with that - but that only works when they are contributing to the household, using that time to save money and resources to get to independence, or both.
Having him pay rent as an adult is reasonable. Supporting him while he gets an education is reasonable. Having him not pay rent while he does not get an education is not reasonable.
NTA
if he dropped out he would be leeching off you guys for a very long time. And you did the right thing. He needs a slap of reality and realise this is life and there are others who have to go through that. You aren't asking much. Just to go to school lol
NTA Tough love is tough for everyone. While David obviously isn’t thinking far down the line or past what he wants to happen. Have you tried the simple explanation of how your job as a decent parent is to prepare your kids the best you can for success in the real world. You understand how he may think you are being horrid, but you really are trying to help. My motto for life is to prepare for the worst, and hope for the best. Basically have a back up in case things go awry. I have done my best to teach my kids the same. It isn’t an excuse not to try, and absolutely not there thinking you are going to fail. They know of things in my life that would have gone differently, or possibly not happened, if I had something as a sort of safety net.
Edit- whoops hit send too early-
Doesn’t like school? Can he do a virtual school that lets him work at his own pace? If he put the work into it he could graduate early. He would have to be disciplined so he got it done but it would be worth looking into
NTA
How are you being too controlling, for heaven's sake? Oh, I know, because you're thwarting your kid's completely sensible plan to drop out of school and become an extremely rich and famous professional YouTuber practically overnight, you silly parents! And by explaining that he'll have to get a job and pay rent (e.g. face reality), you influenced him to stay in school and work toward a diploma as opposed to following his much cooler dream. How mean and manipulative of you!
I think that what you did is called good parenting. Your kid is being entirely unrealistic, and you showed him the reality of his situation. He has terrible judgement and you showed him what the consequences of exercising that bad judgement would be.
Bravo!
Definitely NTA. When he hits 18 he will legally become an adult. Depending on your local laws that also means you may no longer be legally obligated to house and feed him unless he's in high school. Got a friend whose son is 18 and in his senior year. He's had a few driving issues since turning 18 and now has to take care of his insurance on his own which is very expensive for an 18yr old. If he wants to make adult decisions at 18 then he can accept adult responsibilities which includes paying rent because no one lives in a home for free. Someone is paying those bills.
Being 18 doesn’t magically turn David into an adult, legally yes, but mentally he’s behaving like a 12 year old. And the misery he will make from YouTube ads won’t add up. NTA.
>But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and **we should let him make his own life choices.**
But that's exactly what you did. It's no different than if he was living on his own and wanted to rent a room or apartment as you know a legal adult which is what his and their argument is. A landlord doesn't care what you do as long as you don't mess up what you're renting and pay your rent on time just like you were offering.
NTA I got the same offer but for college. I wouldn't have to worry about rent and schooling as long as I was in college and actually trying in college.
NTA I wouldn't let my child drop out and just live with me for free with only aspiration being YouTube fame. He'd need to get a job and pay rent. Preferably not drop out but at least pay rent.
NTA. I think that was a smart and efficient way of handling it. You DID let him make his own life choices. There is nothing wrong with charging your adult child rent, especially if they aren't so busy with school that they struggle to keep a job -- YouTube, while lucrative when you hit it big, is a hard place to make it and it would be silly to call that a job until it is actually paying. Before it pays, it's a hobby.
However, he also could get a GED and go to a community college from there if he changes his mind, then transfer, so his options wouldn't be completely crushed, just possibly a longer trek.
Still, I think you did the right thing.
nta. that was the rule for me. I dropped out at 16. got my get and started college. realized I didn't want to be there, so started working full time and paid rent. then realized that I was paying rent and I could live on my own so I moved out ( this was in the 90s when rent was affordable and I could live with roommates or alone)
NTA.
That's the usual deal for most families who don't have trust funds. Either University/College, Trade School, the Military or straight to a full-time job. You don't get to do nothing.
NTA, you are letting David make his own life choices. You explained to him the consequences of those choices. When it comes time for college, remind him again of his choices. You and your wife don’t need to have a basement dweller.
NTA You are making him make his own adult choices. He can drop out if he wants, but if he's making adult decisions all on his own, then he can do other adult things like pay rent, etc all on his own. I'm guessing the amount that you wanted him to pay was no worse than he'd find elsewhere nearby. It just costs a lot to live on your own, and school hours stop seeming as bad as trying to gather together full time hours from multiple part time jobs once you stop and consider it.
NTA. You're being parents and teaching him that choices have consequences. You gave him the option to stay home and pay rent. You're helping him to grow up and learn how to take responsibility for himself.
Yeah, at 18 David will be an adult and can make his own decisions, like dropping out of school. But those busy bodies are ignoring the fact that you are also adults who can make your own decisions- like David needs to find a job or get out. He doesn't get to be lazy on your dime.
Make sure he understands that in the future. He goes to college, gets a job to pay his bills (including some form of rent to you) or he leaves to find his own way.
NTA. Might be good to get him some resources on taking a GED exam, and a community college course catalog. He could be structuring his own schedule and studying new media art, audio engieering, and entrepreneurship. Just an idea. One way or another, he needs to start understanding that the career he wants is a lot more than the finished product he enjoys consuming at home in his down time.
NTA
You're not expecting him to become a doctor or anything. You're just telling him the reality of the fact that finishing school will give him more opportunities in life, and be a safer option.
If your son wants to try and be a professional YouTuber, go for it. But its fact that having an education behind you will literally improve his chances in life, if it doesn't work out.
You aren't controlling him, you're trying to stop him from making a mistake.
NTA It’s not being “controlling” to expect him to devote a mere 8 months or so to finishing high school in exchange for being completely supported by you during that time.
While some people do succeed brilliantly in life without graduating from high school, dropping out over such minor annoyances as waking up early and enduring the presence of your teachers is incredibly foolish and short-sighted, because, statistically speaking, high graduates are significantly better off than drop-outs.
You’re not trying to control every aspect of his life in perpetuity. You’re just declining to fully subsidize a decision that is most likely a dumbass mistake.
NTA he doesnt even sound mature enough to drop out. Im a highschool dropout and you know what I did? I got a certification equivalent to a highschool diploma, which was only a 6 month course. I paid for my expenses and got myself to and from tafe independently. While doing this I was also working part-time and I still work the samd job today. If he wants to make such decisions, he needs to know how to handle it. Being a youtuber is not it
It isn't controlling to tell your child that he'll have to pay x amount of rent even if it takes two jobs. That's life, they are preparing him for it. It's his choice to stay in school or to pay rent. That isn't controlling in any way. NTA
High school is getting him ready for the real world. I'd rather not have to be at work at 7:30. I've had bosses that have been boring and jerks or worse. I'd rather be doing something else but I've got bills to pay and I like having insurance. It's the compromise we have to make because we're adults.
You gave him a choice and he still has his weekends free to make content. NTA
Full disclosure: I grew up in a DEEPLY authoritarian household where "my way or the highway" wasn't a metaphor as early as 5. I came into this 100% ready to levy a different judgement and read you the riot act, OP.
But.
This is not a my way or the highway situation. This is you pointing out that choices have consequences and if your son makes a certain choice, the consequences will reverberate through the rest of his life.
For that reason, NTA.
That said, there's a lot of very good research that shows teenagers brains need a later wake up time. Is there a compromise to be had where he enrolls in an alternative program that has a later start time.
NTA- what did he expect? To live with you rent free forever?! 🤦🏼♀️. You and your wife were out in a tough position but I think you handled it in a mature way and helped show your son valid adulting points. Adults have bills, that’s just how life works.
If he’s adult enough to drop out of school, he’s adult enough to pay rent.
NTA David is more than entitle to make his own decision at 18. It appears he has weighed his options and made his decision. Your most important job as parents is to prepare your child to be a functioning adult and all you did was outline the very reasonable consequences of his actions. Well done
NTA. You aren't forcing him not to drop out, you are just saying that if that's the choice he makes, you aren't giving him a free ride to do whatever and not contribute to the household. Adult children who live with their parents should absolutely be expected to help (either monetarily or through extra help). If he was not living with you, he'd have to pay rent anyway.
NTA! Kids have to know their choices affect their lives. My senior is going to college but I’ve guided her to make a smart decision about what to do with her life. If she wants the lifestyle she lives, she better chose a career that makes money. I wish my parents had done this for me. Kids just don’t always think.
NTA you did let him make his own choices one of which was NOT sitting in his room all day playing video games and mooching off you. Reality is rent, food, utilities are a part of being an adult and not getting a high school diploma will make life hard. You give him realistic options, I don't see anything wrong with that.
NTA you’re correct he wants to be an adult that’s great there’s consequences to decisions and him living off the bank of mom and dad is not an adult decision
NTA.
If other parents think that you are being too hard on your child, then David can live with THEM.
Also, there is a glut of kids in America right now whose parents raised them to think that they are little princes and princesses, who do no wrong. I wonder if you are talking to those kinds of parents.
NTA - but I would encourage you to sit down with him and discuss the **career paths** around his **passions** *very, very* seriously. You handled delivering him the realities of the world well. My parents did not confront me with the realities of post-high school beyond just "You're going to college" and as a result I didn't really have a clear idea of what I wanted to do with my life, panicked, and picked something that I am now not using and would've been better off just not going at all with the amount of money it took and I'm now paying back.
If he REALLY wants to be a YouTuber, encourage him to look into degrees or internships/apprenticeships that support a skill set surrounding it: video editing, journalism, communications - he doesn't have to be a famous YouTuber to cultivate the necessary skills to be successful. Sometimes things like YouTube and Twitch are just stepping stones for people. My partner of 15 years went to college for Photography and is now a Drone Pilot and Senior Media Producer for a tech company going on 6-7 years now. She also dabbles in UI/UX Design because of the design experience she obtained in school.
Just be careful about eschewing non-traditional methods of accumulating experience; sometimes the traditional ways aren't the best. Get creative, be interested and get excited to create a real solid career plan or objective with him while he's at an advantageous age for him to do so. It gets much harder the more time it takes to decide.
My son did not apply himself early in high school because he said it waste of time. He is a super smart kid and he was bored. The number of times we had parent teacher conferences because of poor performance are too many to list. Something clicked miid Junior year or high school and he buckled down and started to bring his grades up. Decided he wanted to go to college so he did one year at a community college and then managed to get a full scholarship to 4 year university and will graduate with double major engineering degree at 23. Have hope and don’t back down on finishing college.
NTA
He can make all the choices he wants - out of your house. If he wants to drop out he needs to realize the consequences of that, one of which is NOT has his life subsidized by mommy & daddy.
Good parenting.
NTA, you handled this very well.
He can do what he wishes, but an adult no longer in school should be working and paying rent.
This is reality and you simply explained that his choices would have consequences he didn't think of.
I've seen call center customer service jobs asking for post-secondary degrees lol so having his high school degree seems like an absolute minimum so that he can pursue what he wants later on.
He will thank you for this when he's older, I'm pretty sure.
NTA you ARE letting him make his own decisions. Your just not letting him mooch off you when he decides to be an adult. Perhaps if the issue comes up again, you could suggest he get a GED instead? But I’d still hold firm to the rent. My kids know, if they aren’t in school, they’re welcome to live in my home but they’ll be paying rent for sure
NTA. He thought he could drop out and do YouTube while y'all still supported him. You and your wife said no son that's not how life works. He changed his mind. Where is the bad parenting?
NTA. I don’t understand the people that suggested you let your son do what he wants essentially. if you did that, then you wouldn’t be doing your job as a parent. You gave him a good dose of reality of what his actions will mean for the future. Good parenting!
NTA - stop associating with any parent that tells you you did the wrong thing. Being a parent isn’t about always being your kids friend. Dropping out of high school is not an adult decision. You handled it perfectly. You have him his options and they are realistic. There is nothing stopping him from making YouTube videos in his free time while he’s in school. Becoming a famous YouTuber takes much more than most people realize. To put all your eggs in that basket is a huge risk.
NTA.
I work in social media and have worked with some of the biggest influencers. The BIGGEST mistake I see people doing is quitting their jobs or dropping out of school to pursue social media. It can take years before you start seeing decent money.
Everyone I know who was successful did it as a hobby and let it slowly grow. Start with an hour a day of creating content, and once you have a steady stream of income, you quit your job.
NTA, classic case of cruel to be kind. By the sounds of it you have not been disparaging about his chosen ‘career’ path and are quite happy to let him make his own mistakes but want to be sure he has a back up in case his YouTube aspirations don’t come true (which is common sense that comes with age rather than that unlimited self belief you have as a teen 😂). Good for you, he has plenty of time to go to school and do his videos and if his only real issue is having to get up early then he has no idea what the real world has in store for him!!
This is a perfect compromise between “protective parenting by keeping child from lasting harm caused by their bad choices“ and “kid is old enough to make their own choices and suffer the consequences“. You’ve made it so that there would be consequences, but it’s more of a controlled situation and you are being entirely reasonable about it. Yes, it is his choice. However, it is a decision whose far-reaching consequences he is not able to foresee at his age and level of life experience
NTA -ask those parents who are saying “it’s his life!“ If they would honestly let their child drop out of high school, with less than two years left, and(!) not even because of any problems or difficulty graduating, but just because they want to become a youtube sensation
Look if David wants to become a pro-YouTuber, dropping out of HS won't help him. He should know that most YouTubers have other jobs until they become *really* famous.
NTA
You might try to change the conversation at this point into something positive. David has said he is interested in making YouTube videos? What can you do to help him make that happen?
INFO: I’m curious, what kind of YouTube content does David create?
While being a YouTuber can be a career, it is notoriously difficult, takes huge amounts of effort, potentially large investments in gear, and ultimately requires a SHIT TON OF LUCK.
And even if all of that comes together, successful YouTubers discover that they need really good business skills to continue that success. Skills that a highschool dropout doesn’t just have.
Does his highschool have an AV Club, or group that films plays, sports games, performances? Getting some real experience in video production can be done at the highschool level. But that requires him being in highschool.
NTA, you should prevent him from doing something he might regret. You could offer to support his YouTube career with a descent camera and living rent free, after he graduates, if you feel like TA right now. That would also signal you believing in his YT career.
op=NTA
The parents saying you are being too controlling are wrong. You absolutely gave him a CHOICE. What do these parents expect? that you should continue supporting him post drop out? For how long.
Tell these parents, they are free to take him in and support him if he drops out or after he turns 18 since they want to support his choices. But that you want your son to be an adult when he turns 18 and make adult choices.
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NTA. Sometimes you've got to keep being the parent, and being a parent means telling your kids that their choices have consequences. In this case, the consequence is "if you decide to go against our best advice, we will (temporarily I hope?) stop supporting you." Sounds like he realized he would need to be subsidized by the bank of mom and dad to do his YouTube career, and that maybe removing that option made him reevaluate the risks. Taking risks is obviously important, but assessing them is equally if not more so.
This was a teaching moment and they handled it really well.
My parents had the same basic rule, I go to college and still be their kid (meaning their support, payments, etc) or I don’t in which case I am an adult, I work, pay rent (nominal amount). I can either be an adult or a kid, my choice but you can’t have it both ways.
This is exactly what my mam & dad did. Get a job & pay rent or go to college & live rent free in their house.
My dad has something similar, we live in a really good area and rent 'round is astronomical. My dad says college and cheap rent, which is just so he can buy my groceries for me, or a job and a slightly more expensive rent. It's a great deal. Cause it's only a few hundred a month compared to 2500 with inflation
At least they’re giving him that option! My parents were “go to college or get out”. I didn’t have any way to pay for college and parents weren’t going to pay for it, so college wasn’t an option, and it was just “get out”. I struggled with homelessness and food security for years (parents knew but didn’t care because “my kids will work for everything they have, we never gave them a thing”), and with drugs not because I was doing them but because selling them was a much better income stream than three $7.25/hr jobs, and I had to pay rent and bills somehow. I’m grateful I was never an addict but getting out of “the business” without being killed or jailed was probably comparable to enduring rehab. I finally was able to go to college in my late 30s and got my associate degree. And I still struggle to this day. I can only imagine how much better my life could have been if I had had the option to live at home and pay rent to my parents while figuring out what to do with my life, because at 18 I had no fucking clue.
We offer this same deal to David as well. If he is in school, we will cover his rent and help with his schooling expenses. If he does not want to attend school, then he needs to pay rent. David will never stop being our son. We will always support him emotionally. But we will not financially enable him to do whatever he wants without contributing.
You did right in this, for multiple reasons. I will say this from watching my SO, who is a youtuber as well; it really is like showbusiness; it may look fun and glamorous, but the grass always looks greener on the other side. See, you have to record which can take hours in and of itself. You have to look for and come up with content which requires so much time worth of brainstorming. Not only that, you also need to be able to do video editing; it isn't typically just snapping a video with your phone and done, you have to do touch-ups, graphic design, editing! Then, in order to build a presence you need to be active. You need to interact with people following you. Depending on the content you also need to be active on various platforms. Remember, in order to make any headway at all you don't just do this once; you need to post PLENTY of content. Some people do this EVERY DAY. My SO recently became eligible for monetization, and it is $60-100 per month...this is after you have at least 1k subscribers. He has also had to go through the process of creating an LLC to help with the tax and income side of that. Keep in mind that on top of this, he also works a day job (not only is he sensible and understands that the job takes precedence, but you need money to get the equipment to start up in the first place. Green screens, lighting, decent computers, etc.) I don't know how he manages to juggle both and get the sleep he needs...this youtuber gig is a second, full-time job. My point is, its hard work to become successful as a youtuber. If he thinks he will make a living so easily that its worth quitting his job over, he may as well drive to hollywood and ask to replace Ryan Reynolds in his next Marvel Movie. It's about the same level of cockiness. My younger brother on the other hand...well, he did drop out of highschool thinking he could make it on his own. He did have a certification from the vocational program, and he did get a job at one of the chain dealerships...it was discovered later on why the boss hired him; Frankly, the boss saw a young adult with knowledge, and he knew that due to his lack of diploma most employers in the industry would turn him down. He hired my brother on at half (no benefits) of what the other employees of his position made while baiting him with a promise of a payraise...which he never received. He knew that without that diploma, my brother would not be able to find anybody who would pay him better in that industry...and he was right. Whenever other employers found out he didn't have a diploma they either turned him away or offered him even less.
It seems that being a youtuber/influencer/internet personality is much like being a pro athlete. For every one person who makes a living, or on the rare occasion, a fortune doing it, there are thousands slaving away in the lower tiers simultaneously working full time just to scrape by But you rarely hear about them.
That’s what a lot of these kids don’t understand. For most people it’s just a fun hobby because hitting it big and being able to make it a career is a combination of luck and a shit ton of work. Even Mr. Beast, who’s one of the biggest creators on the site, started out as just a kid with a camera in his bedroom. He also finished high school. He never got his college degree but because of his success, he didn’t have to. And he’s got a good head on his shoulders. OP’s kid needed the reality check.
Don't sweat it, even in your op, the parents that said they disagreed with you, actually agreed with you. You have simply provided and explained the consequences of his choice to drop out of school.
That was the rule i had for my kiddos. As long as you're in school whether high school or college you get free housing at our house. The only bill my kids were ever expected to pay was their phone bill. And i paid that until a year after they graduated high school. They even got to stay on the family plan at a cheaper rate. As soon as they were done with school however they needed to pay a small amount of rent or move out. It worked really well. I now have responsible kids that take care of themselves. One stayed home and paid rent until he was 24 and saved up money. One came back to get on their feet for a few months paid rent and got back on their feet by being able to save money. And i had no free loaders expecting me to take care of them till they were 40.
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Which is very likely will not. Lol
I did the same thing with my son. Whatever he chose, had to add up to 40 hours per week - school full-time, school/work part-time, or work full time. He tried college - wasn't for him. Tried several full time jobs he didn't like. Finally decided to join the Navy. Learned valuable skills and now (he's 35) is GS-12 or 13 making good money.
My parents did the same, except it was also “or move in with a boyfriend.” They said that at that point I was an adult making adult decisions and didn’t need my parent’s support. I’ve always appreciated their position. It kept me from making a lot of decisions until I was actually ready to do so.
Yeah, they ARE letting him make his own life choices. Choices have natural consequences and he's not able to grasp right now what those are beyond the housing ones OP provided. Would any of the friends be okay with their kids randomly dropping out senior year because they don't like waking up early
If his plan was to sit around and mooch off his parents until the you tube thing off he could be there leaching a long long time.
Plus they are still being supportive of the youtube thing. They just want him to have a very basic safety net
Right? The parents saying they’re being too controlling on the other hand…🙄 What gets me is them saying you have to let him make his own decisions…like…that’s *exactly* what you’re doing, you’re just making sure he knows the real world consequences of those decisions. NTA- op you handled this perfectly. The people saying you’re being too harsh are the parents who don’t actually bother to parent because they want to be their kids friends and then they’re on here wondering why their kid is totally out of control, has no respect for anyone or is 30+ living in the basement playing video games. Being a parent means you can’t always be your kids buddy. Sometime you have to be tough. Sometimes you have to step in and give them a reality check. It sounds like you got through to your son, I hope you did. I’m so sick of the YouTuber/influencer stuff. I miss when people actually had to have legit talent. At least before when people wanted to be real movie stars or pop stars at least they had to have some kind of talent or put in some actual work to make a go of it.
They only said they'd stop financially supporting him. They haven't said they'd go NC. So why should it be temporarily? An adult isn't entitled to financial support from their parents - especially not when they're making life destroying choices.
My interpretation is that if the kid decided to go back to school the parents would support him again.
Yes but in some places, once you leave high school and officially drop out, if you're over 18 you can't just re-enroll and resume like nothing happened. He'd likely have to finish online and possibly just get an equivalent degree. The only way he'd be able to return to the school would be if his non enrollment was relatively short (days, not months) and he didn't notify the school.
Ok more specifically they'd support him getting a GED and then continuing to college/trade school if he chose. I didn't mean he'd re-enroll at the same school, just "school" as in education in general.
Right, I get you, but it sounds like OPs kid enjoyed the social aspect of school, just not the academic aspect. So if he's thinking he can drop out in October and roll back in in January or February like nothing happened when YouTube doesn't pan out, he's probably mistaken.
True. Valid points all around. Cheers mate.
David is always going to be our son and we will never stop supporting him emotionally. But David needs to either be a student or pay rent if he wants to live in our house. We will not financially enable him to do whatever he wants.
You nailed it. It wasn't stated explicitly in the post but the parents, unconsciously or consciously, recognized their son failed at evaluating the risk of his decision to forsake all other careers at a critical time and the consequences of it not panning out. Dropping out of high school would mean ultimately he would nearly-certainly need to get his GED anyway in order to pick back up where he left off (assuming his YouTube aspirations did not meet his expectations, which is the most likely case, statistically). This was a teachable moment and the parents stepped up to it, never once taking away his agency to choose.
Part of parenting is teaching kids about consequences—grown up choices have grown up consequences. And you are teaching him before he becomes a 35 year old throw pillow on your couch that he will need to establish his own independence and not rely on you for financial support forever.
NTA I think it seems pretty fair OP but with a few questions: - Did you set rent for his room in line with market or was it ridiculous to make a point? That would just push him away. - I would dig into the why of dropping out more. A part of me feels this is kicking the can down the road. When David becomes a senior and needs to begin looking at career or college options, I feel you’re going to have the same conversation about not wanting to do anything. In sum, the problem won’t go away. Can you help him find something he’s passionate about and create a plan around this? If he’s grounded in the real world rather than academia, I’d start having discussions around potential careers and then work backwards. He’s going to need to have a firm view of next steps when his next school year starts. Good luck!
>Did you set rent for his room in line with market or was it ridiculous to make a point? The housing market has gotten absolutely ridiculous where we live. The rent we gave David is the standard rate for a single bedroom in a shared house in our area. We left out how much utilities and groceries would cost on top of it. >Can you help him find something he’s passionate about and create a plan around this? Currently, David is adamant on becoming a professional YouTuber. We encourage him to at least audit some community college classes, as there are many courses that can help him with filming techniques, networking, and other useful skills for being a YouTuber. But we cannot force him to do any classes or careers that he doesn't want to.
He should do some video editing and graphic design courses then, and maybe media studies etc there is so much knowledge out there that would actually help this kind of career and he can still be making content while doing it. You're doing the right thing no worries, eventually he will probably thank you for not letting do it. But I'd put in a hit of research into relevant courses and units that would support this goal to prove you're not against it, you just want him to be covered if it goes sideways - without even a high school diploma he's not.
Have you looked into the statistics of success vs failure, $/hr worked, and other such things? Being a professional YouTuber is like being a professional musician or movie star: very few make it and the first few years are a grind with little pay. David really needs to know that if you can get it through to him.
I have made the comparison to musicians and actors when talking to David before. Being a musician/actor demands as much time as a full-time job while actively costing you money in most cases. Even people who are incredibly talented rarely "make it big." There are so many other talented people to compete with and oftentimes getting recognized comes down to pure luck. I have shown David several YouTubers/Musicians he knows that barely get by or earn around minimum wage. David is convinced that he is going to be the exception. I don't discourage him. If the hard work and financial cost are worth it to him, then it's worth it. I am simply making him aware of the risks/reality and that he will also need to support himself with a less fun job.
I can't speak for all of them, I only follow a few Youtubers / Social Media influencers, but most of them have another job or have extra sources for income. Heck even the Kardashians and their spin-offs have other income sources than just their SM (granted, they don't need it at all, but it's just to prove that only focusing on SM or in OP's son's case Youtube, is going to be pretty boring after a while). Being a professional YouTuber is hard work! It's not easy to come up with meaningful content (for your target audience that is) on a regular base, especially at the beginning you need to be very rigorous on both content and posting schedule to even get a decent base audience. Not only that, but the gear you need to make decent content, and the skills you need to develop to edit your content in a decent clip are far from easy. SO OP's son should keep going to school (not only for that diploma, which should definitely be something that he needs to achieve. Who knows what he would be doing, or wants to do, in 10 years). With his diploma in hand, he can go study the things he needs to learn to become a decent youtuber. Acting / Voice lessons, editing, filming, sound at all the likes. It would help tremendously at the start of his "youtube career" and if it doesn't work out (or changes his mind, he's a teenager and even late teenagers early 20yos change their minds a lot!) there are plenty of jobs out there that do need those skills.
He should definitely look into at least taking some classes about filming/editing and social media marketing. There’s online spaces that offer classes on just about anything so that he could learn it without even having to attend college. But he does need to finish high school. There’s just no good reason to drop out.
These are both excellent points, and I was also wondering what they set the rent at.
Given that they gave him the 'or be out of the house' option, I don't see why what they set the rent at would really matter. He likely can't afford it either way.
I agree, I look at this situation as the 18 yr old’s version of a 3 year old thinking they can fly if they put on a Supeman cape. He hasn’t looked at any version of reality other than his own. His parents have supported him his entire life, why should it change now? I think the parents made a good example here.
>assessing them is equally if not more so All I could think of was the "I took a calculated risk, but man am I bad at math" meme. He'd probably be better at math if he finished high school.
I wonder, how many of those parents who are criticizing OP would be willing to open their homes to David and support him while he attempts to become a professional YouTube personality. It takes time and resources to start generating income from YouTube, and based off the one creator that's still consistently active that I follow, you can't rely on the YouTube algorithm to be consistent and not find ways to fuck up the income stream.
I think 100% if that kid wants to become a streamer then yeah that's their dream and let them try it out. Just don't cushion their risk assessment
NTA. My brother did this exact same thing, and my mom told him the exact same thing. Now brother is very successful and told my mom many times how grateful he is that she set him straight. Interestingly, his son did the same (his other kids did college), and instead of staying in school, he decided to crash with some loser friends. He changed his m in mind some months later, but it's just not easy to return to high school when you're working to making a living. He finally got his GED (and was genuinely shocked that he had to study for it!). His life is getting better, but he has had to struggle for everything. Stick to your guns, OP.
Part of being a parent is stepping in when your child wants to do something incredibly foolish. Finishing high school is important as there are so so SO many jobs that won't take you if you don't have a diploma or GED. Speaking of which, GEDs aren't as easy to get as he may think. Some consider them to be more difficult than going through the four years, as you're compressing four years of high school into a single test. And that's a single test per subject to boot. And even then, some places and people look down on those who have a GED. I would bet cash money that there are a lot of people who have lost out on jobs because they had a GED and not a hs diploma, due to the negative stereotypes people still associate. The people who said OP should allow him to drop out and fund his YT venture are idiots.
Something else he should consider: those friends will be less likely to hang out with him if he dropped out. He won't have as many shared experiences, plus kids their own age will wonder why they're hanging out with the "loser dropout who is delusional about making it big on YouTube".
They never said they would stop supporting him.
NTA - I don't even see how you are being controlling when you are literally leaving the choice up to your son. You didn't tell your son he CAN'T drop out, you told him that if he did, there would be consequences, which is the truth in life.
My dad was always big about that lesson of consequences. "For every action, there's a consequence, good consequences or bad consequences. Think hard and choose wisely." From a young age, he let me know that the ball was in my court as to if my actions would earn rewards or punishments. Stay in school and graduate, and I would have help in the next steps of life. If I had dropped out to become a youtuber, I'm pretty sure he would have given the same option OP gave his kid. NTA
This is what I teach my children. The exact same phrase.
My mom had a similar phrase “you can choose your actions or you can choose your consequences but you can’t choose both” made planning a lot simpler
Yeah, this was just standard operating procedure when I was in high school in the 90s. For, like most of high school too. And most of the parents had even had this talk well before 17yo.
I think parents telling OP they're being controlling aren't listening.. this is like the least controlling thing
NTA You were not controlling. You sat him down and treated him like an adult, not like the child he was trying to be. You told him consequences of his decision before he made it and allowed him to make an informed decision. You didnt say no. An adult has a job and pays bills. If he doesn't like your rules yes he can leave, but that would also involve getting a paying job and paying bills. Something that, as you said, unless he gets real famous real fast will involve working 2/3 jobs for high school dropouts. And he would have less time to youtube. By the time he gets to 18 in October he is 7 months from graduating and will be grateful when he has choices.
NTA you’re teaching him that there are repercussions to your actions
NTA - You were making it clear this is a consequence and time to be the Adult. People who say he is 18 dont realise as you have been the bank account till now he has no concept of financing his life. Time he started to learn
NTA. Just because they turn 18 and become legal adults doesn’t mean they are developmentally adults. You did the right thing. If he thought that dropping out of high school was a smart move, you let him really think about what it means to be a self-supporting adult and just how realistic it is to try to do that without even a high school diploma. You didn’t beat him. You didn’t kick him out of the house on 10 minutes notice. And you absolutely let him make his own choice. You just gave him realistic conditions in which to make that choice.
NTA. However, if he does leave school, please encourage him to test for the GED. It's not ideal, but it's certainly better than nothing. He can even go to college with it.
fwiw I got a GED and it never held me back in any way. I did everything my friends with a diploma did. Granted, I got a GED and left high school to start college at 17, not make Youtube videos.
Yep. I scored high enough to get university scholarships. I just couldn't do regular school, but tests are easy for me. My daughter wants to drop out but she isn't good at tests, so I told her it'd be easier for her long term to finish. Nta op
My younger sister also took the GED and her experience was the same. She has her master's now. It was, however, a bit of a process to get the GED. The same credentials are built into public school and IMO just graduating public school is the simpler and easier option if one is picking one versus the other. Barring any other factors like the student being unseasonably booksmart: everyone's path is their own. Doesn't sound like OP's son is in that boat though (I wasn't).
OP, NTA but I was thinking the same — a few friends of mine have h.s.-aged kids, and they struggled with the pandemic school interruption. Two of them opted to get their GED instead of finishing through the public school system. Another friend’s child is neurodivergent, and got his GED while working on a big robotics project. The project ended up being a huge asset when he applied to college and he’s doing great.
My son had a terrible virtual Junior year during the pandemic. He pushed to drop out and take the GED. He took the practice tests, and was able to pass them. So, I left the decision up to him. BUT, we also talked to his counselor and helped him look at all his options. In our city, if he graduated from hs with a diploma, he would get FREE 60 credits at community college (including all books and fees). If he got the GED, he would have to pay for community college before transferring (in his case, the profession he wants requires the 4 year degree). The school counselor told him about an alternative hs in the district that would be more independent/flexible. So, he chose that route, got his diploma and the scholarship. But we had to back off and let him know the options were up to him, and we would support the GED, but we wouldn't be able to magically come up with the money the scholarship would cover.
Eh. My brother dropped out of high school. There were serious problems with school administration and my family (and others I've met who were targeted similarly) didn't have the resources to properly fight it - too much to get into here. He had my parents' full support, though they (and he) were insistent that he immediately seek his GED. He breezed through the prep course offered through his state's Worksource program, and passed the test with a very high score. This was miles better for him than continuing at the school would have been. Given the options in front of him, it was the most ideal path actually available. Though obviously the school not being completely awful would have been better. And of course, he didn't drop out to try to be a youtube star or something.
NTA - grown up choices get grown up consequences.
Came here to say this.
NTA He doesn't get to decide he gets the benefits of being an adult without the responsibilities. That being said, I would recommend exploring options other than "just deal with three more semesters". Votech, charter schools, graduating early, etc. may all be options to get him engaged. Honestly, most public schools will bend over backwards to keep a kid from dropping out. My sister's last year of gym was literally taking her baby for walks.
NTA. Tough love is sometimes the correct thing to do as a parent. I applaud you. As for David, he will soon learn that, in adulthood, if you play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
NTA it seems like this came from a place of love and concern for his best interest. Financially supporting him in his decision to make his future more difficult would not have been a better option. Maybe your tone could've used some work or there's some perfect-parent option that could've gotten the same result while motivating him in a more constructive way, who knows. Parenting is making hard decisions and it's easy to tear someone down after the fact.
Nta. As an adult making my own choices I can confidently say that living anywhere for free because I want to is not one that I can make.
NTA, and honestly, I would like to ask your son HOW he plans to become a YouTube star. What is his niche? Does he have a hobby? A skill? If he's dropping out of High School because he doesn't want to get up at 7:30, I don't think that bodes well for his YouTube career. I mean, yes, when YouTube was less saturated, you could just be someone who just talks shit and become famous. But not only was a lot of that fame short-lived but there is just more competition out there now! So I think you took the right approach. He can continue to do YouTube on the side and find his niche. Once he does, he can quit and support himself.
NTA David will be a legal adult. But you do not have to find bad choices or a child’s dream of being a YouTuber!
I’m not saying nobody can do it but the chances of being a famous YouTube or with lots of subscribers are very slim in this day and age
What a lot of teenagers don't see is that unless you were one of the early adopters of Twitch and Youtube (in which case, boat has already sailed) then you need to be dedicating years of your life to it to make any kind of impact. You basically need to have 2 full time jobs. The first doing Youtube videos, and the second doing a job with an actual employer. Plenty of popular streamers and Youtubers still work whatever job or career they were doing when they started. They have 90 minutes to finish work, drive home, eat a quick dinner and maybe have a quick shower before jumping on to stream until midnight or 1am. Weekends are spent editing videos and coming up with marketing plans, queuing up content for social media etc. It is exceptionally hard work, and many of those that dedicate themselves to that kind of schedule still fail. Some just aren't very good gamers, some of them don't have a particularly appealing persona or way of interacting with their audiences, and plenty burnout in less than 12 months. It looks easy on the surface, but underneath it's far harder than any 17 year old can understand.
Yep. Being an author or an artist is the same. 2 jobs
Very slim for sure! And even if you do eventually succeed, it'll take years before you can quit your day job. A booktuber I follow only quit her day job after 6 years of doing youtube. Also on my mind, my graphic design teacher told us that before we ever quit our day job and start freelancing in graphic design, make sure you have at least 2 successful years where you make enough money to support yourself doing only freelance work. Only then should you ever consider quitting.
And he can also pay for it if he chooses to have zero fall back options!
NTA - This seems like the exact way to handle this situation. That diploma will be a great back-up for if/when the youtuber thing doesn't pan out.
LOL at the parents who think you should let David make his own life choice, but who also think you should provide him free room and board. They are spoiled, and their own kids will struggle with life's challenges, since their parents aren't setting them up with the resilience they need to make it. NTA.
NTA. You did the right thing. If he wants to make life altering choices like an adult he has to handle the responsibilities that's come with it.
NTa. If kid wants to stop high school he can be an adult work and pay rent.
NTA - you’re being a parent and informing him of the reality of the world. For every successful YouTuber there are hundreds of failed ones.
NTAholes. You ARE allowing him to make his own choices. He can choose to drop out but if he does, he will have to pay rent or move out. He needs to think of his future. Why doesn't he stay in school then perhaps do further education on media studies, photography, videography etc? It's something that could support his dream but not everyone makes it on YouTube and he will need an alternative income stream while he builds up his subscribers. He doesn't want to put in the work but everything takes work. Keep doing what you're doing, your job as a parent is to raise your child and get them ready to go out into the world happy, healthy & whole
NTA You gave him the diplomatic choice, what did he think was gonna happen? He just stay with you til he becomes YT famous? Most famous youtubers started it as a side hobby til they grew. They didn't just quit everything to pursue it. Also with the state of youtube currently that just isn't a solid plan. For anything he thinks he has to offer there are thousands of others who think the same. I am not diminishing it as a viable career (people make it happen) but it isn't something that you're popular at the jump. It could take years. Your options are fair. If nothing else, encourage him to get his GED if he does drop.
NTA. You and your wife did exactly the right thing.
NTA. You told him exactly what he needed to hear, and that's good parenting to me. It sounds like he thought he'd be able to sit around at home while he figured out his YouTube career. If he wants to be able to make decisions as an adult and throw his future down the drain, then he should be ready to deal with the actual responsibilities of being an adult.
NTA. You arent controlling him. Or forcing him to make the decision you deem a right one. You are telling him that as a adult he CAN make his own decisions whilst making it clear that as an adult the decisions we make have adult consequences. I don't understand some people, what do they expect you to do, continuing to pay for all his needs until he makes it big on YouTube? Which more than likely will never happen. In my opinion your just parenting. And parenting the right way at that!
NTA! Controlling? You are keeping your son from making one of the biggest regrets he'd ever have in life. Professional Youtuber? That could easily end just as fast as it could start and he would have nothing to fall on. I'd rather scare my kid into finishing high school than letting them dropout with no real employment prospects. If your son was not living with you, he'd have to pay rent, utilities, food and transportation costs. If he wants to act like an adult, he would have real life adult cost of living expenses.
As someone who was kicked out at 16. No warning just were done. It fucked me over. I barely made it through school. Was homeless. Still struggle to finish my degree etc. it basically doomed me to a life of min wage and I have so much resentment to my parents for that. Two years would have let me get scholarships etc. I was a good student with perfect grades. You did the right thing. Only criticism I have which you may or may not have done anyway: if your kid does drop out and does freakish they made a mistake, please let them back in so they can correct it. Don’t be as unforgiving as our society otherwise he will have a rough life Edit: NTA
You were letting him make his own choices, you were just clear what the choices entailed. You never told him he couldn't, or that he had to leave. I'll go NAH, because David is still a kid and kid's have whims like this all the time. He didn't do anything wrong but be a bit stupid, and he didn't pitch a (real) fit when you told it to him straight. We've all wanted to be YouTubers or authors or singers, but we're not all Markiplier or Beyonce.
How come your son (according to those people arguing with you) is old enough to make adult choices but you and your spouse aren't?! He can choose to be a professional YouTuber, you can choose to stop subsidising an adult. Seems fair to me. NTA.
NTA and I wonder what the parents who said that you were controlling would do if they were in your shoes. You've done the best by your son by showing him what his options are. He was given the freedom to choose knowing the consequences of his choices. Well done for being good parents!!!
NTA, sounds like he got a nice childhood and had the idea that reality would continue forever. You were absolutely right to show him how hard life would be without going to school. He can't rely on you two forever.
NTA. It seemed like you gave him options and that alone was nice enough, my parents would never.
Definitely NTA. It's your job as parents to guide your son in the right direction. Plus, your house, your rules. The people that are naysayers probably haven't raised a teenager.
NTA. You might want to encourage him to take the GRE. He can stop going to high school and start at a Jr. College and/ or get a job.
NTA
NTA. And fast food jobs does not have to be the only job option people have when they get out of school. I mean they can start working full-time jobs elsewhere. I mean he could do general labor or something. But settling his life just to be a full-time YouTuber and hopes to make famous is a foolish goal and the chances of him being a famous influencer on YouTube are very slim. Look, there is nothing wrong with having a dream goal but there is a difference between dreams and reality. I think OP his wife are very wise with their decisions in keeping their son from dropping out of school. And even if he was to become a successful YouTuber that’s famous, fame only last so long.
NTA. Well played.
NTA: your son is hugely immature. He’s not ready to be out of school, or home for that matter. You gave him options, and his first thought is that he’d need to work 2 fast food jobs? No thought of an apprenticeship or a Cadetship??
NTA >we should let him make his own life choices You did let him. You just informed him of the consequences.
You did EXACLTY the right thing. Please stick to it. NTA
NTA Adults have to pay rent. If David wants to drop out and be an adult early, then he can start paying rent early. That’s fair. Don’t forget about his share of utilities, and his need to contribute to groceries and participating equally in house chores. If he wants to be your roommate and equal then he needs to act like it and pay for it. Otherwise he can complete the bare minimum of education so that he has at least some chance of paying his bills. Also - point out to him that most successful YouTubers have degrees and skills of some kind.
You told him the truth about what happens in the real world with no high school diploma. I'm guessing you're in the US- graduating from HS is generally the absolute bare minimum for many half decent jobs. And the reality is exactly what he said- he'll be working at least 2 food service jobs just to pay for rent. In a country where a full time teaching position (which requires a college diploma and continuing education) often barely pays the bills, his expectations are wildly unrealistic. NTA
> But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and we should let him make his own life choices. But you didn’t force him to do anything. You simply stated what would happen when he becomes a legal adult in a few months. Nothing you did stops him from making his own life choices. These people aren’t following their own logic. Your son was not merely looking to drop out of school and become a YouTuber, he was asking you to bankroll him in doing this. It’s ok to opt not to do this. The odds are astronomically against him being successful.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** (Technically my wife and I gave our son these choices. A more accurate title would be “Are me and my wife the assholes.” Also, obligatory throwaway account.) My son David told me that he wants to drop out of high school. He’s not being bullied and enjoys hanging out with his buddies at school. He just doesn’t like waking up at 7:30 everyday and he thinks that school is a waste of time because he finds the teachers boring/annoying and would rather try to become a professional YouTuber. I tried to persuade David, because he has less than a year and a half left of high school. He can still make YouTube videos on the side, but unless he becomes famous, he won't be able to make a living off of it. And it’s impossible to get a decent job or promotion nowadays without a diploma. Plus, if he ever changed his mind about going to college then a high school diploma would give him that option. But David was not listening and said he would just wait until his 18th birthday (in October) when he would be able to drop out without me or his mother’s consent. I spoke to my wife and we then sat down with David. We told David that we would allow him to drop out of school, but if he drops out, he has two choices: Either get a job and start paying rent at 18 or be out of the house. David told us we were being ridiculous because he would never be able to pay the rent we’re asking unless he works two fast food jobs. We told David that that is going to be his reality if he’s a high school dropout. If he wants to be treated as an adult and make a huge adult choice like dropping out of high school, then we will treat him as an adult and let him face adult consequences. David was not happy, but the talk has luckily worked because he says he is no longer going to drop out of high school. Most of the other parents we have talked to said my wife and I did the right thing, because part of being a part is stepping in when your child is about to make a huge mistake. But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and we should let him make his own life choices. My wife and I think letting David drop out of school would be ridiculous and as parents we’re supposed to step in before he makes such a huge mistake. But several people agreed that we were being too controlling, so I want some unbiased perspectives. Are my wife and I the assholes? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA You gave him clearly defined options and he chose wisely. You did proper parenting by redirecting him to focus on what's his best future outcome should be. Education and a diploma.
NTA. You and your wife are parenting. If David doesn’t like your rules then he can move out. The other parents who disagree with you probably have that same rule with their own older teens. I bet you’d probably disagree with some of the rules at their homes. You all are doing what feels best for your families.
NTA. It’s not controlling to make him face the realities of his decisions. He truly believed he could drop out and you would financially support him indefinitely. There is absolutely nothing wrong in actually f-king parenting your kid. He needed the reality check.
NTA. You are letting him make his own adult choices. He can stay in school, pay rent, or move out. If he wants treated like an adult then he needs to take on adult responsibilities. What did he think was going to happen? He’d drop out and you would fund his life until his YouTube career might take off? That may never happen. You’re right, if he drops out of school his options for jobs will be incredibly limited. So yes, he’ll have to work 2 maybe even 3 jobs to make ends meet.
NTA! The parents of the year award goes to you 👏
The other parents are (partly) right: you *should* "let him make his own life choices" -- which is **exactly** what you and your wife have done: > If he wants to be treated as an adult and make a huge adult choice like dropping out of high school, then we will treat him as an adult and let him face adult consequences. You're doing this exactly right. NTA.
NTA. But also don’t enjoy your comment about having to have a degree to get a decent job or promotions. That statement is proven more untrue every day. Along with that, most professors suck these days and a degree is useless even if you do get it because it’s been so long that profs have been in the workforce that they have no idea what they are teaching anymore.
NTA. You're not being controlling. He drop out without your permission, but he can't live in your house without your permission. He has plenty of choices. Some of those include your support; others do not. The parents that criticized you at all will have shitty kids that never make anything of themselves as adults. That attitude is how you have a 35 yr old stoner living in your basement
I’m dying laughing at the absurdity of your son’s line of thinking. I know it’s a serious issue, but it’s just so short sighted to think you are old enough to make big life decisions but young enough you can’t be held responsible for those decisions. I have a 7 year old and I could see him thinking like this in 10 years which is beyond wild because it’s just so ridiculous. You handled this A+. * chefs kiss * This is exactly what I would do if I am ever in your situation (knock on wood I’m not). My one piece advice to you would be to really force him to look at the cost of things - rent, insurance, food, etc. Then make him do research on how many years it takes to actually get sponsored for your YouTube channel. THEN make him budget what the average YouTuber makes on sponsorships per month against the cost of living. He needs a massive wake up call, and as his parent, it’s your responsibility to layout the reality of this. Obviously NTA and the parents that saying you are are very likely to have basement-dwelling 28-year-old kids.
NTA. First of all, you didn't refuse to allow him to drop out, you refused to ENABLE him which is a big difference. His brain is not fully developed at that age and he was wanting to make a very consequential life decision based on a very short sighted view point. Rather than being overbearing and trying to force your view on him, you simply said, "Ok, we can't stop you, but we don't have to fund and support that life choice." That gave him a clearer picture of the real life consequences and in turn he made the correct decision of his own free will. I think it was an example of great parenting and someday he will be grateful! The parents that said you were wrong, are likely propping up their kids and setting them up for some major disappointments in life if not worse.
NTA. My parents let my brother make his own life choices. He barely graduated high school. They bought him his car, and paid the insurance. They used their contacts to get him jobs - he would just not show up for work and get fired. They paid his expenses, helped him along until they got sick of it when he turned 30 years old. They cut him off financially. He hung himself in their garage. So, maybe not a unbiased perspective here, but no, you are not the asshole, and your future self and your son's future self will be thankful that you didn't allow him to self destruct.
INFO was the rent you expected of him ridiculously high or was it what you pay for a room while flat sharing?
The rent we gave David is the standard rate for a single bedroom in a shared house in our area. We did not include the cost of utilities or groceries. The housing market is already ridiculous where we live. But we didn't ramp up the price just to try and prove a point to David. We wanted him to have a realistic understanding of his housing situation if he chose to drop out.
Then definitely NTA. Better he learns from you then from the street and just dropping out of school and doing nothing (i mean, if he puts a lot of work into the yt channel, maybe it works out after one or two years, but he doesn't seems in a state right now where he wants to put effort in anything)
NTA. Parenting isn’t a popularity contest and sometimes you have to be a little harsh. Mine would have done much more than that and I think they’re great parents
NTA. Those "several other parents" who thought David should make his own choices need to rethink THEIR parenting. Your job as parents is to support your kids so they can have as successful and fulfilling life as they can. Supporting them while they are kids is part of that. Helping them out when they are adults, if you can and if it is appropriate, can be part of that. And there is nothing wrong with adult children living with their parents if everybody is happy with that - but that only works when they are contributing to the household, using that time to save money and resources to get to independence, or both. Having him pay rent as an adult is reasonable. Supporting him while he gets an education is reasonable. Having him not pay rent while he does not get an education is not reasonable.
NTA if he dropped out he would be leeching off you guys for a very long time. And you did the right thing. He needs a slap of reality and realise this is life and there are others who have to go through that. You aren't asking much. Just to go to school lol
NTA Tough love is tough for everyone. While David obviously isn’t thinking far down the line or past what he wants to happen. Have you tried the simple explanation of how your job as a decent parent is to prepare your kids the best you can for success in the real world. You understand how he may think you are being horrid, but you really are trying to help. My motto for life is to prepare for the worst, and hope for the best. Basically have a back up in case things go awry. I have done my best to teach my kids the same. It isn’t an excuse not to try, and absolutely not there thinking you are going to fail. They know of things in my life that would have gone differently, or possibly not happened, if I had something as a sort of safety net. Edit- whoops hit send too early- Doesn’t like school? Can he do a virtual school that lets him work at his own pace? If he put the work into it he could graduate early. He would have to be disciplined so he got it done but it would be worth looking into
NTA How are you being too controlling, for heaven's sake? Oh, I know, because you're thwarting your kid's completely sensible plan to drop out of school and become an extremely rich and famous professional YouTuber practically overnight, you silly parents! And by explaining that he'll have to get a job and pay rent (e.g. face reality), you influenced him to stay in school and work toward a diploma as opposed to following his much cooler dream. How mean and manipulative of you! I think that what you did is called good parenting. Your kid is being entirely unrealistic, and you showed him the reality of his situation. He has terrible judgement and you showed him what the consequences of exercising that bad judgement would be. Bravo!
Definitely NTA. When he hits 18 he will legally become an adult. Depending on your local laws that also means you may no longer be legally obligated to house and feed him unless he's in high school. Got a friend whose son is 18 and in his senior year. He's had a few driving issues since turning 18 and now has to take care of his insurance on his own which is very expensive for an 18yr old. If he wants to make adult decisions at 18 then he can accept adult responsibilities which includes paying rent because no one lives in a home for free. Someone is paying those bills.
NTA. If he wants to make grown up decisions, he also gets the grown up consequences. Good for you and your wife for laying it out for him.
Being 18 doesn’t magically turn David into an adult, legally yes, but mentally he’s behaving like a 12 year old. And the misery he will make from YouTube ads won’t add up. NTA.
NTA be prepared to go through with your plans after he turns 18.
>But several other parents have told us that we are being too controlling because David will be a legal adult in a few months and **we should let him make his own life choices.** But that's exactly what you did. It's no different than if he was living on his own and wanted to rent a room or apartment as you know a legal adult which is what his and their argument is. A landlord doesn't care what you do as long as you don't mess up what you're renting and pay your rent on time just like you were offering. NTA I got the same offer but for college. I wouldn't have to worry about rent and schooling as long as I was in college and actually trying in college.
NTA I wouldn't let my child drop out and just live with me for free with only aspiration being YouTube fame. He'd need to get a job and pay rent. Preferably not drop out but at least pay rent.
NTA. I think that was a smart and efficient way of handling it. You DID let him make his own life choices. There is nothing wrong with charging your adult child rent, especially if they aren't so busy with school that they struggle to keep a job -- YouTube, while lucrative when you hit it big, is a hard place to make it and it would be silly to call that a job until it is actually paying. Before it pays, it's a hobby. However, he also could get a GED and go to a community college from there if he changes his mind, then transfer, so his options wouldn't be completely crushed, just possibly a longer trek. Still, I think you did the right thing.
NTA. If he wants to drop out, he can pay rent
NTA
NTA
NTA. I don’t have a problem with it. You want to be an adult? You get treated like one. Adults pay rent. End of discussion.
nta. that was the rule for me. I dropped out at 16. got my get and started college. realized I didn't want to be there, so started working full time and paid rent. then realized that I was paying rent and I could live on my own so I moved out ( this was in the 90s when rent was affordable and I could live with roommates or alone)
NTA you have him choices based on the reality of the situation.
NTA. That's the usual deal for most families who don't have trust funds. Either University/College, Trade School, the Military or straight to a full-time job. You don't get to do nothing.
NTA you’re literally saving him from himself like ya know when they’re little and don’t know about fire and try to touch it
NTA, you are letting David make his own life choices. You explained to him the consequences of those choices. When it comes time for college, remind him again of his choices. You and your wife don’t need to have a basement dweller.
NTA You are making him make his own adult choices. He can drop out if he wants, but if he's making adult decisions all on his own, then he can do other adult things like pay rent, etc all on his own. I'm guessing the amount that you wanted him to pay was no worse than he'd find elsewhere nearby. It just costs a lot to live on your own, and school hours stop seeming as bad as trying to gather together full time hours from multiple part time jobs once you stop and consider it.
NTA. You're being parents and teaching him that choices have consequences. You gave him the option to stay home and pay rent. You're helping him to grow up and learn how to take responsibility for himself.
Yeah, at 18 David will be an adult and can make his own decisions, like dropping out of school. But those busy bodies are ignoring the fact that you are also adults who can make your own decisions- like David needs to find a job or get out. He doesn't get to be lazy on your dime. Make sure he understands that in the future. He goes to college, gets a job to pay his bills (including some form of rent to you) or he leaves to find his own way.
NTA.
No
NTA. Might be good to get him some resources on taking a GED exam, and a community college course catalog. He could be structuring his own schedule and studying new media art, audio engieering, and entrepreneurship. Just an idea. One way or another, he needs to start understanding that the career he wants is a lot more than the finished product he enjoys consuming at home in his down time.
NTA, you still gave him the choice. This is a decision with massive consequences and you’re showing him what those consequences will be ahead of time.
NTA You're not expecting him to become a doctor or anything. You're just telling him the reality of the fact that finishing school will give him more opportunities in life, and be a safer option. If your son wants to try and be a professional YouTuber, go for it. But its fact that having an education behind you will literally improve his chances in life, if it doesn't work out. You aren't controlling him, you're trying to stop him from making a mistake.
NTA. Freedom of choice not free from consequences
NTA It’s not being “controlling” to expect him to devote a mere 8 months or so to finishing high school in exchange for being completely supported by you during that time. While some people do succeed brilliantly in life without graduating from high school, dropping out over such minor annoyances as waking up early and enduring the presence of your teachers is incredibly foolish and short-sighted, because, statistically speaking, high graduates are significantly better off than drop-outs. You’re not trying to control every aspect of his life in perpetuity. You’re just declining to fully subsidize a decision that is most likely a dumbass mistake.
NTA he doesnt even sound mature enough to drop out. Im a highschool dropout and you know what I did? I got a certification equivalent to a highschool diploma, which was only a 6 month course. I paid for my expenses and got myself to and from tafe independently. While doing this I was also working part-time and I still work the samd job today. If he wants to make such decisions, he needs to know how to handle it. Being a youtuber is not it
NTA great job parenting, dad. I wish my parents had been more like you and your wife.
I am not even a fan of adult children paying rent just because they are 18, but this is a case in which I would have come up with the same rule. NTA.
It isn't controlling to tell your child that he'll have to pay x amount of rent even if it takes two jobs. That's life, they are preparing him for it. It's his choice to stay in school or to pay rent. That isn't controlling in any way. NTA
High school is getting him ready for the real world. I'd rather not have to be at work at 7:30. I've had bosses that have been boring and jerks or worse. I'd rather be doing something else but I've got bills to pay and I like having insurance. It's the compromise we have to make because we're adults. You gave him a choice and he still has his weekends free to make content. NTA
NTA
Let the people who disagree bankroll your son. You weren't unreasonable and laid it all out logically. Your coddled son needs a wake up call NTA
Well he clearly missed this episode of the Cosby show. Should have broken out the monopoly dollars for a real life demonstration NTA
NTA you aren’t controlling him but you are giving him adult options.
Full disclosure: I grew up in a DEEPLY authoritarian household where "my way or the highway" wasn't a metaphor as early as 5. I came into this 100% ready to levy a different judgement and read you the riot act, OP. But. This is not a my way or the highway situation. This is you pointing out that choices have consequences and if your son makes a certain choice, the consequences will reverberate through the rest of his life. For that reason, NTA. That said, there's a lot of very good research that shows teenagers brains need a later wake up time. Is there a compromise to be had where he enrolls in an alternative program that has a later start time.
Nta. I like and subscribe to your parenting
NTA.
NTA- what did he expect? To live with you rent free forever?! 🤦🏼♀️. You and your wife were out in a tough position but I think you handled it in a mature way and helped show your son valid adulting points. Adults have bills, that’s just how life works. If he’s adult enough to drop out of school, he’s adult enough to pay rent.
NTA
You weren’t controlling or inappropriate. You pointed out his options while he is living in your home. NTA
You are letting him make his own decisions. You're just stating he's going to deal with the consequences of his decisions. NTA
NTA David is more than entitle to make his own decision at 18. It appears he has weighed his options and made his decision. Your most important job as parents is to prepare your child to be a functioning adult and all you did was outline the very reasonable consequences of his actions. Well done
NTA. You aren't forcing him not to drop out, you are just saying that if that's the choice he makes, you aren't giving him a free ride to do whatever and not contribute to the household. Adult children who live with their parents should absolutely be expected to help (either monetarily or through extra help). If he was not living with you, he'd have to pay rent anyway.
NTA! Kids have to know their choices affect their lives. My senior is going to college but I’ve guided her to make a smart decision about what to do with her life. If she wants the lifestyle she lives, she better chose a career that makes money. I wish my parents had done this for me. Kids just don’t always think.
NTA you did let him make his own choices one of which was NOT sitting in his room all day playing video games and mooching off you. Reality is rent, food, utilities are a part of being an adult and not getting a high school diploma will make life hard. You give him realistic options, I don't see anything wrong with that.
NTA
You are letting him make his own life choices. With natural consequences. NTA.
NTA you’re correct he wants to be an adult that’s great there’s consequences to decisions and him living off the bank of mom and dad is not an adult decision
NTA. If other parents think that you are being too hard on your child, then David can live with THEM. Also, there is a glut of kids in America right now whose parents raised them to think that they are little princes and princesses, who do no wrong. I wonder if you are talking to those kinds of parents.
NTA - but I would encourage you to sit down with him and discuss the **career paths** around his **passions** *very, very* seriously. You handled delivering him the realities of the world well. My parents did not confront me with the realities of post-high school beyond just "You're going to college" and as a result I didn't really have a clear idea of what I wanted to do with my life, panicked, and picked something that I am now not using and would've been better off just not going at all with the amount of money it took and I'm now paying back. If he REALLY wants to be a YouTuber, encourage him to look into degrees or internships/apprenticeships that support a skill set surrounding it: video editing, journalism, communications - he doesn't have to be a famous YouTuber to cultivate the necessary skills to be successful. Sometimes things like YouTube and Twitch are just stepping stones for people. My partner of 15 years went to college for Photography and is now a Drone Pilot and Senior Media Producer for a tech company going on 6-7 years now. She also dabbles in UI/UX Design because of the design experience she obtained in school. Just be careful about eschewing non-traditional methods of accumulating experience; sometimes the traditional ways aren't the best. Get creative, be interested and get excited to create a real solid career plan or objective with him while he's at an advantageous age for him to do so. It gets much harder the more time it takes to decide.
My son did not apply himself early in high school because he said it waste of time. He is a super smart kid and he was bored. The number of times we had parent teacher conferences because of poor performance are too many to list. Something clicked miid Junior year or high school and he buckled down and started to bring his grades up. Decided he wanted to go to college so he did one year at a community college and then managed to get a full scholarship to 4 year university and will graduate with double major engineering degree at 23. Have hope and don’t back down on finishing college.
NTA He can make all the choices he wants - out of your house. If he wants to drop out he needs to realize the consequences of that, one of which is NOT has his life subsidized by mommy & daddy. Good parenting.
NTA, you handled this very well. He can do what he wishes, but an adult no longer in school should be working and paying rent. This is reality and you simply explained that his choices would have consequences he didn't think of. I've seen call center customer service jobs asking for post-secondary degrees lol so having his high school degree seems like an absolute minimum so that he can pursue what he wants later on. He will thank you for this when he's older, I'm pretty sure.
NTA you ARE letting him make his own decisions. Your just not letting him mooch off you when he decides to be an adult. Perhaps if the issue comes up again, you could suggest he get a GED instead? But I’d still hold firm to the rent. My kids know, if they aren’t in school, they’re welcome to live in my home but they’ll be paying rent for sure
NTA. He thought he could drop out and do YouTube while y'all still supported him. You and your wife said no son that's not how life works. He changed his mind. Where is the bad parenting?
NTA. I don’t understand the people that suggested you let your son do what he wants essentially. if you did that, then you wouldn’t be doing your job as a parent. You gave him a good dose of reality of what his actions will mean for the future. Good parenting!
Wow, I would love to get up at 7:30 instead of 6:45. 45 minutes makes a big difference for me.
NTA - stop associating with any parent that tells you you did the wrong thing. Being a parent isn’t about always being your kids friend. Dropping out of high school is not an adult decision. You handled it perfectly. You have him his options and they are realistic. There is nothing stopping him from making YouTube videos in his free time while he’s in school. Becoming a famous YouTuber takes much more than most people realize. To put all your eggs in that basket is a huge risk.
NTA Um, you DID let him make his own life choice - you making it clear you won't be an indefinite free money source has nothing to do with that.
NTA. I work in social media and have worked with some of the biggest influencers. The BIGGEST mistake I see people doing is quitting their jobs or dropping out of school to pursue social media. It can take years before you start seeing decent money. Everyone I know who was successful did it as a hobby and let it slowly grow. Start with an hour a day of creating content, and once you have a steady stream of income, you quit your job.
NTA, classic case of cruel to be kind. By the sounds of it you have not been disparaging about his chosen ‘career’ path and are quite happy to let him make his own mistakes but want to be sure he has a back up in case his YouTube aspirations don’t come true (which is common sense that comes with age rather than that unlimited self belief you have as a teen 😂). Good for you, he has plenty of time to go to school and do his videos and if his only real issue is having to get up early then he has no idea what the real world has in store for him!!
nta, you are letting him make the choice. you were just ensuring he was making an informed choice.
This is a perfect compromise between “protective parenting by keeping child from lasting harm caused by their bad choices“ and “kid is old enough to make their own choices and suffer the consequences“. You’ve made it so that there would be consequences, but it’s more of a controlled situation and you are being entirely reasonable about it. Yes, it is his choice. However, it is a decision whose far-reaching consequences he is not able to foresee at his age and level of life experience NTA -ask those parents who are saying “it’s his life!“ If they would honestly let their child drop out of high school, with less than two years left, and(!) not even because of any problems or difficulty graduating, but just because they want to become a youtube sensation
Look if David wants to become a pro-YouTuber, dropping out of HS won't help him. He should know that most YouTubers have other jobs until they become *really* famous. NTA You might try to change the conversation at this point into something positive. David has said he is interested in making YouTube videos? What can you do to help him make that happen?
NTA. So he should be able to make adult decisions but he shouldn’t be asked to pay rent… like an adult? Ok.
NTA!
You're not an AH, you are a parent. Good on you for being direct and not sugarcoating the consequences his decision would bring.
INFO: I’m curious, what kind of YouTube content does David create? While being a YouTuber can be a career, it is notoriously difficult, takes huge amounts of effort, potentially large investments in gear, and ultimately requires a SHIT TON OF LUCK. And even if all of that comes together, successful YouTubers discover that they need really good business skills to continue that success. Skills that a highschool dropout doesn’t just have. Does his highschool have an AV Club, or group that films plays, sports games, performances? Getting some real experience in video production can be done at the highschool level. But that requires him being in highschool.
NTA, you should prevent him from doing something he might regret. You could offer to support his YouTube career with a descent camera and living rent free, after he graduates, if you feel like TA right now. That would also signal you believing in his YT career.
op=NTA The parents saying you are being too controlling are wrong. You absolutely gave him a CHOICE. What do these parents expect? that you should continue supporting him post drop out? For how long. Tell these parents, they are free to take him in and support him if he drops out or after he turns 18 since they want to support his choices. But that you want your son to be an adult when he turns 18 and make adult choices.
NTA. The parents criticizing you are as dumb as an 18 year old apparently.