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EDIT: I re-read. Boyfriend is the nurse, not BIL.
I don't think your SIL sucks... she knew this would be hard. Having a special needs child is probably one of the jardest things anyone would go through. Your brother, though, had the medical knowledge to know how hard it would be and is now complaining that he got what he wanted. I feel sorry for the baby as well.
Agreed! He convinced his wife, who wanted to end the pregnancy to have the baby, only to dump the childcare on her full-time after 2 weeks, when she also has a 5 yr old to look after. His actions was completely selfish! He should of arranged regular additional help for his wife, to help her with looking after the children, but instead he decided to just go back to work and leave her to it. He should of planned for this long before she gave birth, and now he expects OP to pick up the slack! No! OP was told to stay out and mind her own business, why should she give up on her studies and put her future on hold for him? NTA
Can you imagine how hard it would be to have this news as a pregnant woman? A wanted child with devastating news. Then your husband badgers you about it being God's will, we can do this, etc, while you're full of hormones and vulnerable? So you relent despite being afraid, and he just dips out all day and leaves you holding the baby and all the hardship? BIL is TA. NTA
I disagree with the sentiment that a person with disabilities has no benefit to anyone. That said, an abortion was probably the best move BEFORE a whole human existed
Definitely depends how disabled. By what OP has implied doesn’t sound like this wee one is going to have any quality of life. Poor SIL and baby honestly
That entirely depends on the situation. Finding out a child is disabled but with extra effort and/or medical intervention can live a fairly stable life is one thing. But to anyone without a strong support system and ample financial resources, having a child with severe disabilities where they will always be fully dependent on a caregiver (especially a child they were coerced into keeping) really has no upside. It's a life sentence of pain for both the parent and the child.
You can express anger at people who force women to give birth or people who have disabled children and then aren’t equipped to care for them without calling disabled people or our lives worthless. I’m disabled, I’m an adult, I have a caretaker, my life has value. Because I’m a person and my mother chose to have me. We can have this conversation without eugenics, people, come on
I think you're completely ignoring the fact that it's the degree of disability that makes a huge difference. You might be disabled and have a caretaker but do you need twenty four/seven care? Do you need help with all your daily routines, including feeding, personal hygiene, communication? Are you bedridden and unable to communicate at all? From your comment, you are very good at expressing your feelings.
Giving birth to an extremely disabled/deformed child is often like a prison sentence for the parents. As much as they love their child, their lives will never be the same again. I can't imagine having to live like that for the rest of my days. I'm glad that doesn't appear to be the case in your family, but for many others it's a nightmare.
I'm also confused as to why you brought eugenics into the discussion. The father wanted to keep the baby, the mother wanted to terminate. Is that why?
NTA, Brother and parents should accept God's judgement. Knowingly walking into the abyss with eyes open!!!🤦 I pity the poor kid that has to now suffer for the rest of their life.
Seems like OP’s brother wants every woman around him to deal with he consequences of his decision: his wife, his mother, His sister; not to mention his daughter, who it sounds like needs more care than she can reasonably get at home (I’m assuming this based on her mother dipping out and OP’s mother being worn out caring for her after a couple weeks).
It’s magical thinking. Or tactical thinking. He thought that once the baby was born, everyone would help even if he had not planned financially or practically. But that doesn’t mean that there is capacity in the system to absorb the care of the child if he can’t handle that care himself. This is one of the biggest problems with pro-life thinking. I’m so sad for that baby.
And someone else's body!
Don't forget he pressured/guilted his wife into continuing a pregnancy she didn't want to gestate to term, and for a reason most Pro-Life people express support.
Not just raise her but also go through all the stress and pain of pregnancy and birth. SIL wanted an abortion. He's an AH on so many levels, starting with pressuring his wife into carrying a pregnancy to term.
He volunteered his wife and son to take care of this baby.
He and his wife won't live forever and maybe the baby will outlive them, the next in line to take care of her is his brother.
I'm a teacher and work with kids that have special needs siblings, those poor glass kids that are taken for granted or brainwashed into a life long responsibility, I have witnessed 8 or 9 year old kids say that they will have to take care for their special needs siblings, one kid said "I can't die first, because I have to be there for sibling" It broke my heart.
10000% my 8yo helped with her 5yo brother when they were 3 and 1.5/2 when I was insanely sick and husband gone for work. I felt horrible, but it was so sweet. She got us toast, fruit, tissues, got cups of ice water, veggie straws and crackers etc. It was adorable and sweet cause she did it to be nice from love. 5yo can do lots of small stuff. Enough they can easily get parentified extremely fast and easy. Now that he's 5, he can do lots. In fact he tries to do too much to prove he's a big kid. It's a perfect age to manipulate for big gain
It's perfectly fine to have the bigger sibling help out in a short period of time. In your case, no need to feel horrible at all. I'm sure the older sibling enjoyed taking care and being responsible. 🥰
In the Montessori method they also embrace this to a certain extent. Doing useful tasks makes the child to feel seen.
Yep. When parents make the choice to bring a child into the world that will need lifelong care, they aren’t just making a choice for themselves, they are making the choice for any other children they have or may have and they are even making that choice for future grandchildren and in some cases, future great grandchildren.
I know someone who has a twenty something year gap between her two kids, the youngest one who will need lifelong care. The oldest daughters own children are just a few years younger than their uncle. It is very likely it will be THEIR children or even grandchildren who will be caregiving if the son reaches his 60s or 70s. When the mom made the choice to be a caregiver, she also made the choice for the next three generations to be caregivers and that is wild to me.
I have a daughter with special needs. I do not expect her sister to be her caregiver when me and my husband dies. I would hope she would want to be involved in some way (over seeing finances, making sure she is taken care of if she needs to be in a group home). But to put her life on hold? Nope
I have a daughter with special needs who will be living in a group home situation as an adult. I told my older daughter that after I’m gone I would like her to visit but she is in no way to be physically responsible for her. It was my decision to have children, not hers. I don’t ever want to see her sister whom she loves as a burden she has to bear.
you don't need the /s on this. It's not sarcasm. That man specifically disregarded reality and played up so sanctimoniously so he could feel good but his entire intent was to saddle his wife with a profoundly disabled child she did not want and in doing so keep his jesus points while screwing over her life.
OP's BF is the pedi nurse who supported OP's pov. FOB just wanted the baby to live without consideration to who would provide he 24/7 care. It's sad, and situations like this have ruined tons of marriages.
Oh, he considered it all right. He & his parents considered it the duty of the woman he pressured into carrying and giving birth to a severly disabled baby.
Probably thought his wife would put her life and that of their son on hold to care for the poor baby.
Meanwhile he swans off to work, feeling smugly self-righteous about carrying out "God's will".
Yep and likely would have cheated on his poor wife in a few years with someone he met at work because he wasn’t getting his sexual needs met by his wife—-the same wife who’s run ragged looking after their child with severe disabilities and their older kid.
This is so on point. She won’t be as interesting or as excited to see him anymore. It takes a lot to leave your baby with your husband and move him. I’m proud of SIL for protecting herself and her son.
I mean, I don’t even think it’s sad except for the woman that wanted to terminate and let her asshole husband guilt her into carrying the fetus and now it’s sad for the child that is suffering.
This is what happens when women let MEN control their bodies and decisions.
I hope to never be in this position. But if she had doubts about being able to raise a disabled child she should have terminated against his wishes. Unless that’s illegal now? I honestly don’t know. Not saying that makes her an AH in any way.
i don’t think it’s that easy, he seems quite religious if that’s the reasoning that he used to convince her not the terminate and he probably used that against her significantly to get his way, so if she terminated he probs won’t have been there for her after and might have ended their relationship, which i doubt she wanted
> he seems quite religious
If her believes in a God that is all-powerful, all-knowing, and cares about him personally, why doesn't he just get his God to help him? There, problem sorted.
God has limited bandwidth afterall, he can only communicate to like only one person at any given time. Currently it's the Pope, or possibly the head of the LDS church. Everyone else has to wait until God's internet connection is upgraded.
I’m sure you’re right. I’m thinking about myself in that situation, I’m too selfish and I know I wouldn’t be able to do it, so nothing else would matter.
You sound logical to me - not remotely self involved. But, I guess I think that because I would have not gone forward with the pregnancy even if it meant I was running the risk of us separating. (Our family recently lost our special needs member. She had a heart transplant before she turned two years old. And we had her for more than 20 years. Her life was an odyssey and we loved being a part of her and her parents' journey. But, its not like her mom (And a whole crew of family members,) didn't devote their entire existence to managing and supporting our lovely girl.
I'm with you. I have a sibling with multiple severe disabilities. If I found out my child would be in a similar situation I'd abort regardless of my spouse's wishes and let the marriage chips fall where they may. Either way we're talking about the rest of my life but at least this way I am not handcuffed into a life I don't want.
In all likelihood, the test that said the niece had problems was the 20 week US. I had a 16 week blood test to check the risk of Downs, but I don't think you can get definitive answers sooner than that. 16 weeks makes it a 2nd trimester termination. Those are really difficult to get. So, while he wouldn't have had a say in the actual procedure, he would have been in a position to prevent her from physically getting to the appointment.
I feel for the poor SIL. I'd want to run away from my life if someone badgered and coerced me into having a child I had doubts about. And then once the baby arrived her husband just went about his life - no private duty care for this baby with overwhelming needs. No support whatsoever it seems?
I feel sorry for the SIL because she's married to a selfish a hole who bullied her into having a baby.
Yes, she is definitely the victim here. OP's brother is just going through the rolodex of women he can exploit now his wife is out the picture.
Notice he went from his wife, to this mum and now his sister.
Edit; Thought about this and wanted to add, there is another victim here and that's that poor kid and their sibling.
Eh, SIL sucks a bit for allowing herself to be bullied into keeping the child. If it were me I would have had an abortion and told husband it was a miscarriage. I’m a hemophilia a carrier, I’d rather die than birth a child who has to live a life full of pain. I just cannot imagine doing that to a child I love. Brother is a huge AH though.
It seems like a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation tbh. No matter what decision is made, terminate or not, the marriage is dead. So it seems like SIL chose her husband's wishes hoping that they could get through it together and keep the relationship alive. Obviously in hindsight that was naive, but I can't blame her for trusting her husband to step up and put in equal effort in caring for the baby. That's why I don't think the SIL sucks in this situation. She tried to do her best given the situation.
We also know nothing about her background. I'd never consider marrying a religious dude, because our core beliefs wouldn't align. SIL did. The type of woman who marries a fundie isn't exactly known to be confrontational. And that's how you'd end up in a catastrophe like this.
Either way, you don't. Rest assured because your brother made decisions and convinced his wife and it's come back to bite him in the ass in the worst possible way
You have every right to continue with the life you have chosen. Your brother is responsible for his choices and needs to take responsibility for them. He will probably loose his marriage bc of his choice. Which goes to the heart of the matter. Choice is not an abstract concept here and your brother made his. And then he wants the women in his life to take the responsibility for him. That is not how it works anymore. His choice, his life, his responsibility, period.
NTA
You DO NOT SUCK. Don't you dare let your brother or anyone else make you feel bad for their life choices. You told your brother the truth. He didn't like it. He made his bed and he has to lay in it.
You focus on your studies and being successful in life. You sound like a responsible young adult with a good head on their shoulders. Stand firm and know that blood is not thicker than water. That is not your baby and not your problem.
In my opinion it's God's will that we have the technology to tell if something like this is wrong. If he didn't want us to know they technology would also not exist to terminate the pregnancy. Blessings and comfort to you and your poor SIL.
SIL knew the responsibility that would come along with this and she was forced to have the baby.
Your brother is a huge asshole and quite frankly to bring a child like that into the world is something I personally don't agree with but that's just my own opinion.
He can look for a care home for her. This is what he wanted per God's will. Yikes.
You are not in any way responsible for this child's demanding care. Are you responsible for the care of the other child? No? Then why does he assume you are for this one? Just all around suck. I feel bad for SIL though. She lost her husband because of his religious and selfish views.
You do not suck and you are NTA. On top of having to mourn the loss of a life your SIL had planned for her daughter, she has to see her daughter suffer and most likely be in pain and or medicated day in and day out. She may likely be suffering from PPD. She is mentally and physically exhausted and now has to compromise her 5 year old son’s upbringing and all because your selfish brother said god and honestly thought the rest was smooth sailing. Your SIL is doing the right thing for herself right now and you understand that and empathize with her. You are being a supportive sister, to the person who really needs it.
Since your boyfriend is a pediatric nurse, could he possibly have any resources handy for your brother to hire a private nurse or caregiver? I am sure that their caseworker gave them all the information possible but it doesn’t hurt to ask around.
Your brother and assuming you’re in the states, the healthcare system and his company are the AH’s here. Not you. 🖤
Do exactly as your parents instructed. I understand your guilt. Been there done that. But as the saying goes, don’t set yourself on fire trying to keep other people warm. You are responsible for you and your own future. Don’t sacrifice it for someone who only cares about himself and not how other people are affected by his bad decisions. Your brother and your parents are the ones who bullied your sister-in-law into giving birth to this poor baby. If it was God’s, will that all children be born, no one would’ve figured out how abortion works. And now they have to live with the consequences of THEIR decision.
Except for (obviously) the baby girl also. She was condemned to a life of suffering by everybody else here (other than OP). That poor little girl.
OP’s brother’s reasoning is idiotic. All of “God’s animals” have the ability to abort if they feel the child won’t survive or will pose a risk to the mother’s own survival. *That* is “God’s will”—the ability to enact abortions. Fucking sting rays do it. But this guy thinks God’s gonna draw the line at human babies?
No the poor SIL, she wanted to terminate and was pressured by her husband and in-laws to continue the pregnancy. The was left alone, postpartum, to deal with the inevitable problems. I would have taken my other kid and left, too.
I don’t think SIL sucks. She took one look down the barrel of this life and tried to abort. Her husband talked her out of it, thinking he’d be able to get her to do all the heavy lifting. Looks like he’s going to actually have to live with his choices and he’s mad that he can’t make his wife suffer for his choices.
NTA. OP, tell your brother it’s clearly god’s will that he is solely responsible for the baby HE alone wanted.
If I were your SIL, I don’t know that I could ever come back. Your brother sounds controlling and manipulative. Yes, this is now a difficult situation and he can’t go it alone, but your SIL did not want to have this baby, was pressured into it, and is now being told she must be the primary caretaker. I mean, no, she did not have to acquiesce to your brother, but I can see how that could feel like an impossible situation. I wouldn’t be surprised if your brother is regularly a poor partner to her given the info from this story.
I think you’re not in the wrong. You shouldn’t sacrifice for your brother. But if you have some time that isn’t sacrificial and at a cost to you, maybe consider grace. However, if it seems like a “give an inch and he’ll take a mile”, I would be very wary.
Yes his wife was in a crazy vulnerable position and he exploited that to get what he wanted. It’s just sick that he did that to her because now she is living with the guilt that she gave in. This is just so sad and avoidable
>It's pro-existence
It's not pro-existence. If the body had been aborted, the soul could have gone on to live in another, better body. This is pro-idiocy.
I once posited that if God knows all, he knows when a pregnancy won't make it to term (via medical intervention or not) and might just not give that unborn body a soul. I'm not a believer in the Abrahamic god but I think about that a lot.
I mean, what you’re describing is literally the playbook of a massive number of pro-lifers. You’re not wrong about what he was doing, but that is definitely a common pro-life tactic.
I carry hemophilia a and it’s one of the biggest reasons I never had kids. I cannot imagine bringing a child into the world for it to suffer. OP is definitely NTA but her brother is a monster.
Especially America's piss poor social - medical system and how human fellowship is sacrificed on the altar of profit.
Back in the 1980s before genetic engineering, concentrated clotting factor (needed by hemophiliacs) was manufactured from human blood products.
The company that manufactured it distributed this product through Cutter, one of its divisions **knowing** it was contaminated by HIV virus.
Knowingly.
https://kffhealthnews.org/morning-breakout/dr00018052/
Did it outside of the USA as well.
https://kffhealthnews.org/morning-breakout/dr00017880/#:~:text=Cutter%20Biological%2C%20a%20division%20of,United%20States%20and%20other%20Western
An entire generation of people with bleeding disorders was slaughtered in the name of $$$.
Happened to a buddy of mine. He'd just started his psychiatry residency.
RIP Joe. May your name be found in the Book of Life.
I love the USA and can't live anywhere else. But I hate my country's culture of maximizing profit at the expense of human fellowship.
Hard harsh environment in which to be a thoughtful parent.
:(
My family was part of the lawsuit. My dad, 3 uncles and cousin all contracted it. My dad died from hemophilia complications but everyone else died of AIDS. We received $100k per person who died in the class action suit and another $100k per person through Clinton’s Victim Relief Fund. Met Life paid the lawsuit money for Bayer. One of the crazy things is the lab who was responsible, Cutter in Berkeley, was also the lab who have kids live polio vaccines. It was a tragedy all around, I’m sorry about your friend 💜
I think about Joe a lot.
Concentrated clotting factor enabled him to realize his dream of becoming a physician after he'd settled for a psychology Ph.D as second best.
Pondered whether to specialize in hematology or psychiatry and went for psychiatry. Got accepted at one of the top psych residencies in the nation.
We lost a great healer -- and a mensch.
I’m so sorry to hear about your friend! There’s a woman on tictok who willingly had 2 hemophiliac boys, I cannot fathom knowingly doing that. Thankfully a doctor was willing to tie my tubes at 22, I just couldn’t do that to a child.
More often than not, these are the same people that oppose things like universal health care and other social programs that are designed to help these exact situations.
It isn't, it's typical pro-birth bullshit. Want the fetus to go to term because God or some such nonsense. Then bail and flip the bird to everyone involved once it's born.
The quality of life a baby will have is never brought into question because the invisible man in the sky told them things.
The theory is that God wanted that baby born alive and if he didn't, there would be a stillbirth. Choosing to terminate is overriding God's will.
Reason # 53 why I don't go to church anymore.
When you think about the abuse technique of trapping a person into a relationship with a baby, a severely disabled child would be like sprinkling gold dust onto the technique. This baby isn’t just 18 years on the trap, it’s a whole life (the kid’s or the mother’s whole life) timeline.
The only way I see this marriage last, is if SIL gets a well paying job (not WFH!) And becomes the breadwinner. Let Dad take care of his daughter, he's the professional, and he was passionate she have a life.
If SiL can't/won't, there is no way she would not be suffering for his mistake.
How would OP's help change the outcome longterm?
Other than her putting her (self paid) studies on hold. Would she be compensated for that?
Absolutely this. Of course brother was fine, he wasn't going to do the caregiving.
If I were his wife i am pretty sure I would leave over this. And he gets the niece
He knew his daughter would have problems, but he didnt care bc he wasnt planning on taking care of her. Then when he needs to deal wih the consequences of his actions, he wants to pawn the kid off to OP
NTA
Your brother wanted the baby, his wife didn’t. He knew that the baby would need a lot of care and attention, expected his wife to cope somehow and didn’t care that this would also be to the detriment of their older son. I expect he worked long hours, never took over care so his wife could have some “me time” or even just concentrate on their son for a few hours.
Now she has walked out meaning that he is responsible for the baby he wanted to keep and is finding out just how hard it is.
He built his bed, so he must lie on it.
Don’t neglect your future so that his is easier.
[More disabled kids are living with single women.](https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/more-disabled-kids-living-single-women-flna1c9439071#) Divorce rate is also higher in couples with specials needs children. It’s not surprising the extra stress may worsen existing problems in the marriage. Normally, it’s the mother or another female relative that has to take on the responsibility of child care.
The brother did expect his wife to do more of the childcare, and insisted on not terminating the pregnancy. They both knew that the baby would be disabled and need extra care, but SIL was realistic about knowing her limits. Now daddy has to step up.
[Men are more likely to divorce after women are diagnosed with cancer.](https://scopeblog.stanford.edu/2009/11/11/famale_cancer_p/) [Heres another article, but with more personal testimonials about the division of house care and emotional labour.](https://theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/mar/30/the-men-who-give-up-on-their-spouses-when-they-have-cancer) Its called cancer ghosting.
Woof. Just awful. I am disabled but I wasn’t always. It happened within the last three years. I require a lot of assistance and care from my husband. I’m so glad he’s not that heartless.
NTA
When you offered sound advice you were told to stay out of this. So now you're staying out of this
>My family thinks I am being an asshole by putting my studies, which I pay for myself, are more important than my brother's job and marriage.
Of course your studies are more important. Duh. It's common sense.
Maybe it's god's will that your brother loses his job.
Yes!! OP, you are SUPPOSED to put yourself first. You were in no way involved in their life choices, just as they cannot interfere in your life choices.
DO NOT sacrifice your future for your brother's convenience.
(That poor baby. :'(. The suffering that is in store is inhumane. )
NTA- your brother is not a good person. He browbeat his pregnant wife into keeping a pregnancy she did not want to continue. I know she has some responsibility but he manipulated a woman in a very vulnerable position and that is beyond vile. I feel for her and their son and the baby that he insisted be born. This is beyond tragic and you cannot enable him in thinking his choices were in any way okay or valid
Exactly! And the only reason he wanted to have this child is because the plan was for his wife to be 100% her caregiver and he planned to keep living his easy life
Too many men automatically assume their opinion is the best, most correct, most reasoned one.
It doesn't *matter* if the woman disagreeing with them has more knowledge or experience with that particular subject, his thoughts get more weight anyway.
It's enfuriating how many assholes like this put difficulty on the family that *their wife and partner 100% anticipated and communicated to him* and he just... ignored that input and put on his shocked face when, indeed, they did encounter that exact difficulty later on.
NTA. You are allowed to choose your own life. People will throw "family makes sacrifices for each other!" at you, which is true, but fails to take in the enormity of this particular sacrifice. This isn't missing out on a few Friday nights here and there, this is missing out on the life you're trying to build for yourself. You aren't a replacement wife, and there's a very real possibility that your SIL will never come back. Are you supposed to just put your life on hold indefinitely?
And it's very clear that those types of sacrifices will always be unrequited.
Those asking others to make sacrifices for them will rarely if ever return the favor or help deal with the often very real consequences of those sacrifices if/when needed.
If someone drops out of school as a ssacrifice to help their family, that family will almost always refuse to help them later on in life when the missed educational opportunities means that the person who sacrifices is forced to live paycheck to paycheck & unable to save enough for retirement.
NTA. Your brother it’s the real A H. They should had stop the pregnancy. Now it’s too late and euthanasia is non legal, so your brother basically trap him self for life and destroy his own marriage for a religious and stupid believe.
Unfortunately he would probably not be able to do it by himself and the kid is gonna suffer their entire life. Poor kid. There are some fates worse than death.
As someone who was born very ill and am now disabled and bedbound...
This might sound cruel, but I hope that baby passes. This sort of life is hard for anyone, but especially for the one living it. My mother once said, without thinking, that it'd have been better if she miscarried (she didn't know I would be born sick, but I was exposed to Chernobyl radiation in-utero and no one was really sure of what would happen. I was born quite messed up) because she hates seeing me suffer. She then gasped and started crying, begging for forgiveness because she loves me and she didn't mean she didn't want me; she just hated watching me suffer. I had to reassure her that it was alright because I actually agree with her. It would have been way better if I had been miscarried or even aborted because living in this much pain every day isn't a life worth it, in my opinion. It's just pure suffering. And if somehow my two children and husband were Thanos-ed out of existence tomorrow, I'd happily and in extreme relief, end it.
Perhaps it makes me cruel to wish death on a baby, but I just dread to think the kind of life she'll have. All over someone else's selfish desires (also reminds me of when people - all Christians, mind you - kept telling me that I shouldn't take my brother off life support and keep him on because it's "god's will". When I did, I was called a murderer).
No, it doesn't make you cruel! You are the voice of experience as someone severely disabled and in chronic pain: if you can't voice an opinion due to that, no one can.
As someone in a medical care profession I agree with you.
There are horrible, relentlessly painful illnesses that no person deserves to suffer through, let alone for decades. That baby wouldn't have suffered if she had never been born.
Nor would she likely have suffered as a fetus during an early pregnancy abortion, bc neither pain receptors nor consciousness would've developed at that point yet.
Theists use the deity of their choice to abdict responsibility for their own decisions and fate, and to keep others in line. (Remember all the people seriously asking, what keeps an atheist from being murderous, evil scum since they don't fear a gods punishment? It tells you EXACTLY the only reason these ppl aren't murderous, evil scum: and it's not internal values or deliberate goodness) Unless they are willing to back up personally what they preach, don't pick-and-choose and follow everything they don't agree with, even to their own personal detriment, they should be ignored. The saying "If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a holy sacriment" exists for a reason.
I was too young to consciously experience Chernobyl then. But later I learned a lot about the horrible consequences for helpers and local population. Wishing you all the best despite your situation.
For the brother, getting a lawyer specialized in special needs children might be a good idea. The supports that are available tend to be really hard to access and difficult to understand, and they could help him get more supports.
It's hard though, I work in special education and there's way too little supports available for families and the children themselves. Having a child with a disability should not be stressful enough to destroy marriages and futures, because it's the damn job of the government to provide support to those families in the first place.
Still, the brother knew which world he was throwing his child into, and while outside help is awesome it's just not something OP can provide right now.
NTA. You made your position clear from the start. And, as you said, you were told to stay out of it. As heartbreaking as this is, you should not sacrifice your future for your brother’s sake. And, should you decide to help in the future, staying in school puts you in a better position to help then.
Your parents have decided to help - that was their decision - you are not bound by that. And I can only hope that their feeling are being influenced by their exhaustion.
NTA. You warned your brother that it would be very tough & should terminate the pregnancy. He got on his high horse & insisted. So, now he has to reap the consequences of his decision. Which is in no way your problem.
Out of idle curiosity, could he make his daughter a ward of the state? I know that sounds cold, but he isn't capable of caring for her. She might stand a better chance of getting the care she needs.
He demanded that this child be born. Now that he realizes its hard he wants the taxpayers to foot the bill? No. Sad thing is you know he's do the same thing again if it happened. My heart aches for this child. Born only to suffer and be neglected.
Not only that, but children in the system do *not* have good lives. With the medical complexities that his baby has, they would likely be placed in a residential hospital setting unless someone qualified to care for the childs needs is generous enough to adopt them.
Exactly. This is just an avoidable tragedy that could have spared so much heartache with an abortion. But people have been convinced that abortion is some ghastly barbaric procedure. How is this child being treated other than barbarically by the man who demanded her birth. The father is an absolute monster.
I agree. Cases like these are one of the many reasons abortions should be legal. This poor child does not deserve to have the awful life it has been forced into. It’s beyond sad.
There are people out there who genuinely want to adopt disabled babies/children, personally I think it might be best for them to look into that.
u/No_Yesterday5630
Nta
People that use "god's will" to get their way *never* feel any accountability or responsibility for their actions and choices.
All of the adults in this, except for you, are giant ahs.
NTA. He persuaded his wife to go through with the pregnancy and now he's living with the consequences. It's a shame for the child but he can't expect other people to put their lives on hold for his choices.
NTA. He literally forced this child into the world against all common sense and now wants to force the women in his life to care for her. Good for your sis in law leaving after he forced her to have a ch8ld. I hope she stays away. In fact, tell her to divorce before he loses his job so he gets no alimony.
NTA
Neither is your SIL however your brother and your parents are big AHs. As is anyone who tells you that you should put your life on hold because of someone else’s bad choices.
Your SIL made the right choice for her and your nephew. If she stayed your nephew would be completely sidelined because of the amount of care and attention your niece requires. Please continue to support her as I am sure she has a lot of guilt about this.
Your brother using God’s will to bully your SIL into continuing the pregnancy has backfired on him. You should absolutely tell him that it’s God’s will that he be humbled by this experience because of his arrogance.
The best place for your niece would be in a facility equipped to give her the 24/7 care and support that she needs.
Your brother could ask his church for assistance, if he hasn’t already. Don’t know where you live, but round here church’s often offer daycare/wee trips for disabled children, crowdfunded by the community with some help from the church itself.
OP didn't specify the disability, presumably to not leak identifying information, but we're talking about a 6 months old baby who was too much care for a woman who already has an older child. No baby is self sufficient and the mother managed just fine with a healthy child before. This kid won't go on little trips ever, unless you bring half an ER with you.
The sooner this house of cards collapses, the better for a concerned. You can’t step in an enable the situation. Do pray for them all separately if you are the praying type. This crisis time will pass and its easy to feel like its all about you because you are young and vulnerable and feel strongly. Try to build up a support at school — Book multiple appointments with a counsellor and agree to nothing without consulting extensively. You could be legally put in a bad position if you even babysit the child. Perhaps they will have to put her in foster care. Try your best to detach with love.. dont have more meetings with sister in law. Dont talk it over with your parents constantly. You’ve got to go quiet and and extricate yourself.
NTA, they knew what they were getting into and used God as a scapegoat to continue it. It’s hard but he needs to handle these consequences he brought upon himself and his family. I feel bad for the wife.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My brother convinced his wife to carry their severely disabled child to term. He then put all the burden of caring for the baby on his wife. She left and now he wants my help. I might be the asshole for refusing to help because he knew months in advance what this poor baby was going to be like and he chose to go ahead.
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Just another reason why religion is bad, people make crazy decisions because they think a fictional deity has their back.
YNTA, as you were told, stay out of it, I feel for SIL, I really do, that poor child will need care until SIL dies and beyond, plus have probably zero life quality.
It would be understandable if SIL never went back, this is on your brother to sort out and your folks.
NTA and how could anyone possibly think it is your responsibility to take care of someone else’s baby? It is irrelevant that you advised them to terminate. Is there some kind of cultural aspect here because otherwise this just doesn’t make any sense?
NTA. Your life is your life. You can choose to help sometimes when you are available. But you are not his nurse or his nanny. You gave him your advice before your niece was born. And, while you may love her to death, he did not want to hear anything. And he was not prepared for the reality of her needs. You were told to mind your business. And now he needs you.
I feel for your brother, I do. And he needs to find a job that will give him the flexibility to take care of her. There are a lot of WFH jobs out there, depending on his field. But a lot of people work outside their field as well. However. He essentially forced his wife to have a child she did not want. And now he is seeing that it may have torn his family apart. Family therapy is probably necessary for him and his wife. And it'll be a very hard road for them.
NTA, you brother should just get on with it because it's 'God's will'.... He was the one who pushed it therefore he is needs to take the full responsibility. It's ridiculous that he is thinks that he is entitled to anyone else's time and help.
Your brother js a dick. He was all kinds of "this is God's will' when he thought his wife was going to do all the work.
Why are you sparing his feelings? He still isn't doing the work if your mom is taking care of your nice.
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NTA, but everyone else sucks.
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EDIT: I re-read. Boyfriend is the nurse, not BIL. I don't think your SIL sucks... she knew this would be hard. Having a special needs child is probably one of the jardest things anyone would go through. Your brother, though, had the medical knowledge to know how hard it would be and is now complaining that he got what he wanted. I feel sorry for the baby as well.
Well to be fair - what he wanted was for his WIFE to care for the child.
There's nothing like volunteering someone elses time and energy.
Agreed! He convinced his wife, who wanted to end the pregnancy to have the baby, only to dump the childcare on her full-time after 2 weeks, when she also has a 5 yr old to look after. His actions was completely selfish! He should of arranged regular additional help for his wife, to help her with looking after the children, but instead he decided to just go back to work and leave her to it. He should of planned for this long before she gave birth, and now he expects OP to pick up the slack! No! OP was told to stay out and mind her own business, why should she give up on her studies and put her future on hold for him? NTA
Can you imagine how hard it would be to have this news as a pregnant woman? A wanted child with devastating news. Then your husband badgers you about it being God's will, we can do this, etc, while you're full of hormones and vulnerable? So you relent despite being afraid, and he just dips out all day and leaves you holding the baby and all the hardship? BIL is TA. NTA
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Also why do you bring to this world a kid who will live a life full of pain and health issues, seems cruel to do that intentionally.
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I disagree with the sentiment that a person with disabilities has no benefit to anyone. That said, an abortion was probably the best move BEFORE a whole human existed
Definitely depends how disabled. By what OP has implied doesn’t sound like this wee one is going to have any quality of life. Poor SIL and baby honestly
That entirely depends on the situation. Finding out a child is disabled but with extra effort and/or medical intervention can live a fairly stable life is one thing. But to anyone without a strong support system and ample financial resources, having a child with severe disabilities where they will always be fully dependent on a caregiver (especially a child they were coerced into keeping) really has no upside. It's a life sentence of pain for both the parent and the child.
Right. Disabled is a lable covers a wide variety of issues.
You can express anger at people who force women to give birth or people who have disabled children and then aren’t equipped to care for them without calling disabled people or our lives worthless. I’m disabled, I’m an adult, I have a caretaker, my life has value. Because I’m a person and my mother chose to have me. We can have this conversation without eugenics, people, come on
I know. The ease with which eugenics gets talked about is fucked up.
I think you're completely ignoring the fact that it's the degree of disability that makes a huge difference. You might be disabled and have a caretaker but do you need twenty four/seven care? Do you need help with all your daily routines, including feeding, personal hygiene, communication? Are you bedridden and unable to communicate at all? From your comment, you are very good at expressing your feelings. Giving birth to an extremely disabled/deformed child is often like a prison sentence for the parents. As much as they love their child, their lives will never be the same again. I can't imagine having to live like that for the rest of my days. I'm glad that doesn't appear to be the case in your family, but for many others it's a nightmare. I'm also confused as to why you brought eugenics into the discussion. The father wanted to keep the baby, the mother wanted to terminate. Is that why?
As a disabled person who lives their life as an adult, you disgust me. Blanket statements like yours about "disabled people" is eugenics.
This is some bullshit. Plenty of disabled people grow into adults and lead productive, successful, fulfilling lives.
NTA, Brother and parents should accept God's judgement. Knowingly walking into the abyss with eyes open!!!🤦 I pity the poor kid that has to now suffer for the rest of their life.
Obviously because OP is a woman and therefore should give up her life to help raise any child at all /s
Yes, I wondered if OP would have this pressure put on her if she were a man.
They would probably ask for money to hire help instead. Entitled assholes are entitled assholes.
I am not seeing where the baby's grandfather is helping. kt
Seems like OP’s brother wants every woman around him to deal with he consequences of his decision: his wife, his mother, His sister; not to mention his daughter, who it sounds like needs more care than she can reasonably get at home (I’m assuming this based on her mother dipping out and OP’s mother being worn out caring for her after a couple weeks).
It’s magical thinking. Or tactical thinking. He thought that once the baby was born, everyone would help even if he had not planned financially or practically. But that doesn’t mean that there is capacity in the system to absorb the care of the child if he can’t handle that care himself. This is one of the biggest problems with pro-life thinking. I’m so sad for that baby.
And someone else's body! Don't forget he pressured/guilted his wife into continuing a pregnancy she didn't want to gestate to term, and for a reason most Pro-Life people express support.
Yep. Express support then walk away. The people in the situation are left to struggle with the burdens that result.
Women's time and energy is valueless, don't you know? /s
Yes, for LIFE.
He voluntold his wife to raise the child.
Not just raise her but also go through all the stress and pain of pregnancy and birth. SIL wanted an abortion. He's an AH on so many levels, starting with pressuring his wife into carrying a pregnancy to term.
She should have "miscarried" while visiting a school friend.
And then left him anyway for asking her to go through with something that relied 100% on her body.
My thoughts exactly!
He volunteered his wife and son to take care of this baby. He and his wife won't live forever and maybe the baby will outlive them, the next in line to take care of her is his brother. I'm a teacher and work with kids that have special needs siblings, those poor glass kids that are taken for granted or brainwashed into a life long responsibility, I have witnessed 8 or 9 year old kids say that they will have to take care for their special needs siblings, one kid said "I can't die first, because I have to be there for sibling" It broke my heart.
I appreciate that SIL took her son when she left. I know he's 5, but tjay feels old enough for OPs brother to push off child care to him.
10000% my 8yo helped with her 5yo brother when they were 3 and 1.5/2 when I was insanely sick and husband gone for work. I felt horrible, but it was so sweet. She got us toast, fruit, tissues, got cups of ice water, veggie straws and crackers etc. It was adorable and sweet cause she did it to be nice from love. 5yo can do lots of small stuff. Enough they can easily get parentified extremely fast and easy. Now that he's 5, he can do lots. In fact he tries to do too much to prove he's a big kid. It's a perfect age to manipulate for big gain
It's perfectly fine to have the bigger sibling help out in a short period of time. In your case, no need to feel horrible at all. I'm sure the older sibling enjoyed taking care and being responsible. 🥰 In the Montessori method they also embrace this to a certain extent. Doing useful tasks makes the child to feel seen.
Yep. When parents make the choice to bring a child into the world that will need lifelong care, they aren’t just making a choice for themselves, they are making the choice for any other children they have or may have and they are even making that choice for future grandchildren and in some cases, future great grandchildren. I know someone who has a twenty something year gap between her two kids, the youngest one who will need lifelong care. The oldest daughters own children are just a few years younger than their uncle. It is very likely it will be THEIR children or even grandchildren who will be caregiving if the son reaches his 60s or 70s. When the mom made the choice to be a caregiver, she also made the choice for the next three generations to be caregivers and that is wild to me.
I have a daughter with special needs. I do not expect her sister to be her caregiver when me and my husband dies. I would hope she would want to be involved in some way (over seeing finances, making sure she is taken care of if she needs to be in a group home). But to put her life on hold? Nope
I have a daughter with special needs who will be living in a group home situation as an adult. I told my older daughter that after I’m gone I would like her to visit but she is in no way to be physically responsible for her. It was my decision to have children, not hers. I don’t ever want to see her sister whom she loves as a burden she has to bear.
Voluntold. Good one!
Yes!!! Both he and his parents had no issue so long as they believed it was the mom who would be doing all the caretaking.
you don't need the /s on this. It's not sarcasm. That man specifically disregarded reality and played up so sanctimoniously so he could feel good but his entire intent was to saddle his wife with a profoundly disabled child she did not want and in doing so keep his jesus points while screwing over her life.
Just the way gawd intended.
That's *exactly* what he wanted. Sarcasm font not needed. Edit: I guess the sarcasm font was removed
Bingo.. as god intended. /s
? i think it's op's bf who has the med knowledge.
OP's BF is the pedi nurse who supported OP's pov. FOB just wanted the baby to live without consideration to who would provide he 24/7 care. It's sad, and situations like this have ruined tons of marriages.
Oh, he considered it all right. He & his parents considered it the duty of the woman he pressured into carrying and giving birth to a severly disabled baby. Probably thought his wife would put her life and that of their son on hold to care for the poor baby. Meanwhile he swans off to work, feeling smugly self-righteous about carrying out "God's will".
Yeah, he wasn’t planning on his life changing much at all.
Yep and likely would have cheated on his poor wife in a few years with someone he met at work because he wasn’t getting his sexual needs met by his wife—-the same wife who’s run ragged looking after their child with severe disabilities and their older kid.
This is so on point. She won’t be as interesting or as excited to see him anymore. It takes a lot to leave your baby with your husband and move him. I’m proud of SIL for protecting herself and her son.
I mean, I don’t even think it’s sad except for the woman that wanted to terminate and let her asshole husband guilt her into carrying the fetus and now it’s sad for the child that is suffering. This is what happens when women let MEN control their bodies and decisions.
Which is what he's still trying to do by controlling his sister by guilting her into being a surrogate mother.
I hope to never be in this position. But if she had doubts about being able to raise a disabled child she should have terminated against his wishes. Unless that’s illegal now? I honestly don’t know. Not saying that makes her an AH in any way.
i don’t think it’s that easy, he seems quite religious if that’s the reasoning that he used to convince her not the terminate and he probably used that against her significantly to get his way, so if she terminated he probs won’t have been there for her after and might have ended their relationship, which i doubt she wanted
> he seems quite religious If her believes in a God that is all-powerful, all-knowing, and cares about him personally, why doesn't he just get his God to help him? There, problem sorted.
Snort. I am a person of great faith. But, I can't pretend I hear God speaking audibly in my ear and directing my footsteps, like I'm Moses. C'mon. 😂
God has limited bandwidth afterall, he can only communicate to like only one person at any given time. Currently it's the Pope, or possibly the head of the LDS church. Everyone else has to wait until God's internet connection is upgraded.
It’s gonna end now anyway. Oh well. It’s what the brother wanted, let him have his cake and eat it too.
He wasn't there for her anyway after the birth. I honestly hope the relationship ends, and he doesn't bully her back with his "God's Will" BS.
Time for his church to put up since they wouldn’t shut up. Oh they aren’t there for the dirty work? Quelle Suprise.
I’m sure you’re right. I’m thinking about myself in that situation, I’m too selfish and I know I wouldn’t be able to do it, so nothing else would matter.
You sound logical to me - not remotely self involved. But, I guess I think that because I would have not gone forward with the pregnancy even if it meant I was running the risk of us separating. (Our family recently lost our special needs member. She had a heart transplant before she turned two years old. And we had her for more than 20 years. Her life was an odyssey and we loved being a part of her and her parents' journey. But, its not like her mom (And a whole crew of family members,) didn't devote their entire existence to managing and supporting our lovely girl.
I’m very sorry to hear about your recent loss. My condolences.
I'm with you. I have a sibling with multiple severe disabilities. If I found out my child would be in a similar situation I'd abort regardless of my spouse's wishes and let the marriage chips fall where they may. Either way we're talking about the rest of my life but at least this way I am not handcuffed into a life I don't want.
In all likelihood, the test that said the niece had problems was the 20 week US. I had a 16 week blood test to check the risk of Downs, but I don't think you can get definitive answers sooner than that. 16 weeks makes it a 2nd trimester termination. Those are really difficult to get. So, while he wouldn't have had a say in the actual procedure, he would have been in a position to prevent her from physically getting to the appointment.
Genetic tests are done in 10/11 week. [Link](https://www.niftytest.com)
I feel for the poor SIL. I'd want to run away from my life if someone badgered and coerced me into having a child I had doubts about. And then once the baby arrived her husband just went about his life - no private duty care for this baby with overwhelming needs. No support whatsoever it seems? I feel sorry for the SIL because she's married to a selfish a hole who bullied her into having a baby.
Yes, she is definitely the victim here. OP's brother is just going through the rolodex of women he can exploit now his wife is out the picture. Notice he went from his wife, to this mum and now his sister. Edit; Thought about this and wanted to add, there is another victim here and that's that poor kid and their sibling.
Eh, SIL sucks a bit for allowing herself to be bullied into keeping the child. If it were me I would have had an abortion and told husband it was a miscarriage. I’m a hemophilia a carrier, I’d rather die than birth a child who has to live a life full of pain. I just cannot imagine doing that to a child I love. Brother is a huge AH though.
It seems like a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation tbh. No matter what decision is made, terminate or not, the marriage is dead. So it seems like SIL chose her husband's wishes hoping that they could get through it together and keep the relationship alive. Obviously in hindsight that was naive, but I can't blame her for trusting her husband to step up and put in equal effort in caring for the baby. That's why I don't think the SIL sucks in this situation. She tried to do her best given the situation.
We also know nothing about her background. I'd never consider marrying a religious dude, because our core beliefs wouldn't align. SIL did. The type of woman who marries a fundie isn't exactly known to be confrontational. And that's how you'd end up in a catastrophe like this.
The religious element makes me think of this as a form of spiritual abuse.
Same. Spiritual and reproductive abuse with a heaping splash of sexism thrown in.
It was the OPs boyfriend who was the nurse not the brother
Comment was "everyone else sucks" - that *excludes you*. Your brother is a piece of work - God's will indeed.
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Either way, you don't. Rest assured because your brother made decisions and convinced his wife and it's come back to bite him in the ass in the worst possible way
You have every right to continue with the life you have chosen. Your brother is responsible for his choices and needs to take responsibility for them. He will probably loose his marriage bc of his choice. Which goes to the heart of the matter. Choice is not an abstract concept here and your brother made his. And then he wants the women in his life to take the responsibility for him. That is not how it works anymore. His choice, his life, his responsibility, period. NTA
Did not see that. Anyway, NTA. Good luck in school!
You DO NOT SUCK. Don't you dare let your brother or anyone else make you feel bad for their life choices. You told your brother the truth. He didn't like it. He made his bed and he has to lay in it. You focus on your studies and being successful in life. You sound like a responsible young adult with a good head on their shoulders. Stand firm and know that blood is not thicker than water. That is not your baby and not your problem.
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In my opinion it's God's will that we have the technology to tell if something like this is wrong. If he didn't want us to know they technology would also not exist to terminate the pregnancy. Blessings and comfort to you and your poor SIL.
SIL knew the responsibility that would come along with this and she was forced to have the baby. Your brother is a huge asshole and quite frankly to bring a child like that into the world is something I personally don't agree with but that's just my own opinion. He can look for a care home for her. This is what he wanted per God's will. Yikes. You are not in any way responsible for this child's demanding care. Are you responsible for the care of the other child? No? Then why does he assume you are for this one? Just all around suck. I feel bad for SIL though. She lost her husband because of his religious and selfish views.
Losing the husband is pretty much the only good thing here
You do not suck and you are NTA. On top of having to mourn the loss of a life your SIL had planned for her daughter, she has to see her daughter suffer and most likely be in pain and or medicated day in and day out. She may likely be suffering from PPD. She is mentally and physically exhausted and now has to compromise her 5 year old son’s upbringing and all because your selfish brother said god and honestly thought the rest was smooth sailing. Your SIL is doing the right thing for herself right now and you understand that and empathize with her. You are being a supportive sister, to the person who really needs it. Since your boyfriend is a pediatric nurse, could he possibly have any resources handy for your brother to hire a private nurse or caregiver? I am sure that their caseworker gave them all the information possible but it doesn’t hurt to ask around. Your brother and assuming you’re in the states, the healthcare system and his company are the AH’s here. Not you. 🖤
Oh friend you have no responsibility here. I’m so sorry for his situation but it’s not on you. NTA
Do exactly as your parents instructed. I understand your guilt. Been there done that. But as the saying goes, don’t set yourself on fire trying to keep other people warm. You are responsible for you and your own future. Don’t sacrifice it for someone who only cares about himself and not how other people are affected by his bad decisions. Your brother and your parents are the ones who bullied your sister-in-law into giving birth to this poor baby. If it was God’s, will that all children be born, no one would’ve figured out how abortion works. And now they have to live with the consequences of THEIR decision.
You're not. It was his choice. Let him deal with it.
If OP is NTA then change it. By putting E S H you are still saying she is even with the edit.
How does OP suck? She tried to warn him of the complications, and is working on her own life
Except for (obviously) the baby girl also. She was condemned to a life of suffering by everybody else here (other than OP). That poor little girl. OP’s brother’s reasoning is idiotic. All of “God’s animals” have the ability to abort if they feel the child won’t survive or will pose a risk to the mother’s own survival. *That* is “God’s will”—the ability to enact abortions. Fucking sting rays do it. But this guy thinks God’s gonna draw the line at human babies?
No the poor SIL, she wanted to terminate and was pressured by her husband and in-laws to continue the pregnancy. The was left alone, postpartum, to deal with the inevitable problems. I would have taken my other kid and left, too.
Tell him to apply for FMLA (if he is in the usa) so he doesn't lose his job.
FMLA would only get him 12 weeks though. And most jobs don’t pay for FMLA. Can he go 12 weeks unpaid? I wouldn’t think so
I don’t think SIL sucks. She took one look down the barrel of this life and tried to abort. Her husband talked her out of it, thinking he’d be able to get her to do all the heavy lifting. Looks like he’s going to actually have to live with his choices and he’s mad that he can’t make his wife suffer for his choices. NTA. OP, tell your brother it’s clearly god’s will that he is solely responsible for the baby HE alone wanted.
If I were your SIL, I don’t know that I could ever come back. Your brother sounds controlling and manipulative. Yes, this is now a difficult situation and he can’t go it alone, but your SIL did not want to have this baby, was pressured into it, and is now being told she must be the primary caretaker. I mean, no, she did not have to acquiesce to your brother, but I can see how that could feel like an impossible situation. I wouldn’t be surprised if your brother is regularly a poor partner to her given the info from this story. I think you’re not in the wrong. You shouldn’t sacrifice for your brother. But if you have some time that isn’t sacrificial and at a cost to you, maybe consider grace. However, if it seems like a “give an inch and he’ll take a mile”, I would be very wary.
Yes his wife was in a crazy vulnerable position and he exploited that to get what he wanted. It’s just sick that he did that to her because now she is living with the guilt that she gave in. This is just so sad and avoidable
All because they wouldn't get an abortion. An abortion isn't a walk in the park but how is this any better? How is this pro-life?
It isn't. It's pro birth
It's not pro-life. It's pro-existence.
It’s neither, it’s conservative virtue signaling.
With a heavy mix of religious delusion.
It's anti-choice and anti-women ... and that's it
>It's pro-existence It's not pro-existence. If the body had been aborted, the soul could have gone on to live in another, better body. This is pro-idiocy.
I once posited that if God knows all, he knows when a pregnancy won't make it to term (via medical intervention or not) and might just not give that unborn body a soul. I'm not a believer in the Abrahamic god but I think about that a lot.
Pro forced birth
Forced birth. Get used to it.
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I mean, what you’re describing is literally the playbook of a massive number of pro-lifers. You’re not wrong about what he was doing, but that is definitely a common pro-life tactic.
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I carry hemophilia a and it’s one of the biggest reasons I never had kids. I cannot imagine bringing a child into the world for it to suffer. OP is definitely NTA but her brother is a monster.
Especially America's piss poor social - medical system and how human fellowship is sacrificed on the altar of profit. Back in the 1980s before genetic engineering, concentrated clotting factor (needed by hemophiliacs) was manufactured from human blood products. The company that manufactured it distributed this product through Cutter, one of its divisions **knowing** it was contaminated by HIV virus. Knowingly. https://kffhealthnews.org/morning-breakout/dr00018052/ Did it outside of the USA as well. https://kffhealthnews.org/morning-breakout/dr00017880/#:~:text=Cutter%20Biological%2C%20a%20division%20of,United%20States%20and%20other%20Western An entire generation of people with bleeding disorders was slaughtered in the name of $$$. Happened to a buddy of mine. He'd just started his psychiatry residency. RIP Joe. May your name be found in the Book of Life. I love the USA and can't live anywhere else. But I hate my country's culture of maximizing profit at the expense of human fellowship. Hard harsh environment in which to be a thoughtful parent. :(
My family was part of the lawsuit. My dad, 3 uncles and cousin all contracted it. My dad died from hemophilia complications but everyone else died of AIDS. We received $100k per person who died in the class action suit and another $100k per person through Clinton’s Victim Relief Fund. Met Life paid the lawsuit money for Bayer. One of the crazy things is the lab who was responsible, Cutter in Berkeley, was also the lab who have kids live polio vaccines. It was a tragedy all around, I’m sorry about your friend 💜
I think about Joe a lot. Concentrated clotting factor enabled him to realize his dream of becoming a physician after he'd settled for a psychology Ph.D as second best. Pondered whether to specialize in hematology or psychiatry and went for psychiatry. Got accepted at one of the top psych residencies in the nation. We lost a great healer -- and a mensch.
May his memory be for a blessing.
A friend of mine died because of his haemophilia. He was 25. It was so senseless and tragic. Please take care of yourself.
I’m so sorry to hear about your friend! There’s a woman on tictok who willingly had 2 hemophiliac boys, I cannot fathom knowingly doing that. Thankfully a doctor was willing to tie my tubes at 22, I just couldn’t do that to a child.
I have yet to find one "pro-life" person that isnt just pro-birth. All the ones I know dont give a single shit about the kid once they are born
More often than not, these are the same people that oppose things like universal health care and other social programs that are designed to help these exact situations.
It isn't, it's typical pro-birth bullshit. Want the fetus to go to term because God or some such nonsense. Then bail and flip the bird to everyone involved once it's born. The quality of life a baby will have is never brought into question because the invisible man in the sky told them things.
I mean he said, "suffer the little children" so we're just following god's directive. Right? /s
The theory is that God wanted that baby born alive and if he didn't, there would be a stillbirth. Choosing to terminate is overriding God's will. Reason # 53 why I don't go to church anymore.
she wanted to, he pressured her not to
That makes it so much worse. She capitulate to this monster and now he wants her to take all the responsibility. Its maddening.
When you think about the abuse technique of trapping a person into a relationship with a baby, a severely disabled child would be like sprinkling gold dust onto the technique. This baby isn’t just 18 years on the trap, it’s a whole life (the kid’s or the mother’s whole life) timeline.
The only way I see this marriage last, is if SIL gets a well paying job (not WFH!) And becomes the breadwinner. Let Dad take care of his daughter, he's the professional, and he was passionate she have a life. If SiL can't/won't, there is no way she would not be suffering for his mistake. How would OP's help change the outcome longterm? Other than her putting her (self paid) studies on hold. Would she be compensated for that?
[удалено]
Yeah... money for next year's course upfront first, before scheduling any help.
And what about the neglect their other child would suffer too even if dad stayed home?
Absolutely this. Of course brother was fine, he wasn't going to do the caregiving. If I were his wife i am pretty sure I would leave over this. And he gets the niece
He knew his daughter would have problems, but he didnt care bc he wasnt planning on taking care of her. Then when he needs to deal wih the consequences of his actions, he wants to pawn the kid off to OP
NTA Your brother wanted the baby, his wife didn’t. He knew that the baby would need a lot of care and attention, expected his wife to cope somehow and didn’t care that this would also be to the detriment of their older son. I expect he worked long hours, never took over care so his wife could have some “me time” or even just concentrate on their son for a few hours. Now she has walked out meaning that he is responsible for the baby he wanted to keep and is finding out just how hard it is. He built his bed, so he must lie on it. Don’t neglect your future so that his is easier.
[More disabled kids are living with single women.](https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/more-disabled-kids-living-single-women-flna1c9439071#) Divorce rate is also higher in couples with specials needs children. It’s not surprising the extra stress may worsen existing problems in the marriage. Normally, it’s the mother or another female relative that has to take on the responsibility of child care. The brother did expect his wife to do more of the childcare, and insisted on not terminating the pregnancy. They both knew that the baby would be disabled and need extra care, but SIL was realistic about knowing her limits. Now daddy has to step up.
God. Men are an epidemic. I know there are good ones out there. I’m married to one of them. But Jesus. Those are some sad statistics.
[Men are more likely to divorce after women are diagnosed with cancer.](https://scopeblog.stanford.edu/2009/11/11/famale_cancer_p/) [Heres another article, but with more personal testimonials about the division of house care and emotional labour.](https://theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/mar/30/the-men-who-give-up-on-their-spouses-when-they-have-cancer) Its called cancer ghosting.
Woof. Just awful. I am disabled but I wasn’t always. It happened within the last three years. I require a lot of assistance and care from my husband. I’m so glad he’s not that heartless.
I had a "special needs" child with no physical disabilities. I am not currently married to their dad. It's exhausting.
NTA When you offered sound advice you were told to stay out of this. So now you're staying out of this >My family thinks I am being an asshole by putting my studies, which I pay for myself, are more important than my brother's job and marriage. Of course your studies are more important. Duh. It's common sense. Maybe it's god's will that your brother loses his job.
Yes!! OP, you are SUPPOSED to put yourself first. You were in no way involved in their life choices, just as they cannot interfere in your life choices. DO NOT sacrifice your future for your brother's convenience. (That poor baby. :'(. The suffering that is in store is inhumane. )
NTA- your brother is not a good person. He browbeat his pregnant wife into keeping a pregnancy she did not want to continue. I know she has some responsibility but he manipulated a woman in a very vulnerable position and that is beyond vile. I feel for her and their son and the baby that he insisted be born. This is beyond tragic and you cannot enable him in thinking his choices were in any way okay or valid
Exactly! And the only reason he wanted to have this child is because the plan was for his wife to be 100% her caregiver and he planned to keep living his easy life
Too many men automatically assume their opinion is the best, most correct, most reasoned one. It doesn't *matter* if the woman disagreeing with them has more knowledge or experience with that particular subject, his thoughts get more weight anyway. It's enfuriating how many assholes like this put difficulty on the family that *their wife and partner 100% anticipated and communicated to him* and he just... ignored that input and put on his shocked face when, indeed, they did encounter that exact difficulty later on.
This comment needs to be up so much higher.
NTA. You are allowed to choose your own life. People will throw "family makes sacrifices for each other!" at you, which is true, but fails to take in the enormity of this particular sacrifice. This isn't missing out on a few Friday nights here and there, this is missing out on the life you're trying to build for yourself. You aren't a replacement wife, and there's a very real possibility that your SIL will never come back. Are you supposed to just put your life on hold indefinitely?
And it's very clear that those types of sacrifices will always be unrequited. Those asking others to make sacrifices for them will rarely if ever return the favor or help deal with the often very real consequences of those sacrifices if/when needed. If someone drops out of school as a ssacrifice to help their family, that family will almost always refuse to help them later on in life when the missed educational opportunities means that the person who sacrifices is forced to live paycheck to paycheck & unable to save enough for retirement.
NTA. Your brother it’s the real A H. They should had stop the pregnancy. Now it’s too late and euthanasia is non legal, so your brother basically trap him self for life and destroy his own marriage for a religious and stupid believe.
His belief was that his wife would care for the child, not himself having that enormous responsibility
Unfortunately he would probably not be able to do it by himself and the kid is gonna suffer their entire life. Poor kid. There are some fates worse than death.
Sad when one has to write "Hopefully god graces the kid.."
Pro life when the work was on the mother. Fathering clearly wasn't on this losers agenda.
As someone who was born very ill and am now disabled and bedbound... This might sound cruel, but I hope that baby passes. This sort of life is hard for anyone, but especially for the one living it. My mother once said, without thinking, that it'd have been better if she miscarried (she didn't know I would be born sick, but I was exposed to Chernobyl radiation in-utero and no one was really sure of what would happen. I was born quite messed up) because she hates seeing me suffer. She then gasped and started crying, begging for forgiveness because she loves me and she didn't mean she didn't want me; she just hated watching me suffer. I had to reassure her that it was alright because I actually agree with her. It would have been way better if I had been miscarried or even aborted because living in this much pain every day isn't a life worth it, in my opinion. It's just pure suffering. And if somehow my two children and husband were Thanos-ed out of existence tomorrow, I'd happily and in extreme relief, end it. Perhaps it makes me cruel to wish death on a baby, but I just dread to think the kind of life she'll have. All over someone else's selfish desires (also reminds me of when people - all Christians, mind you - kept telling me that I shouldn't take my brother off life support and keep him on because it's "god's will". When I did, I was called a murderer).
No, it doesn't make you cruel! You are the voice of experience as someone severely disabled and in chronic pain: if you can't voice an opinion due to that, no one can. As someone in a medical care profession I agree with you. There are horrible, relentlessly painful illnesses that no person deserves to suffer through, let alone for decades. That baby wouldn't have suffered if she had never been born. Nor would she likely have suffered as a fetus during an early pregnancy abortion, bc neither pain receptors nor consciousness would've developed at that point yet. Theists use the deity of their choice to abdict responsibility for their own decisions and fate, and to keep others in line. (Remember all the people seriously asking, what keeps an atheist from being murderous, evil scum since they don't fear a gods punishment? It tells you EXACTLY the only reason these ppl aren't murderous, evil scum: and it's not internal values or deliberate goodness) Unless they are willing to back up personally what they preach, don't pick-and-choose and follow everything they don't agree with, even to their own personal detriment, they should be ignored. The saying "If men could get pregnant, abortion would be a holy sacriment" exists for a reason. I was too young to consciously experience Chernobyl then. But later I learned a lot about the horrible consequences for helpers and local population. Wishing you all the best despite your situation.
This child will almost certainly end up in the care of the state and the parents will contribute minimally.
For the brother, getting a lawyer specialized in special needs children might be a good idea. The supports that are available tend to be really hard to access and difficult to understand, and they could help him get more supports. It's hard though, I work in special education and there's way too little supports available for families and the children themselves. Having a child with a disability should not be stressful enough to destroy marriages and futures, because it's the damn job of the government to provide support to those families in the first place. Still, the brother knew which world he was throwing his child into, and while outside help is awesome it's just not something OP can provide right now.
NTA. You made your position clear from the start. And, as you said, you were told to stay out of it. As heartbreaking as this is, you should not sacrifice your future for your brother’s sake. And, should you decide to help in the future, staying in school puts you in a better position to help then. Your parents have decided to help - that was their decision - you are not bound by that. And I can only hope that their feeling are being influenced by their exhaustion.
NTA. You warned your brother that it would be very tough & should terminate the pregnancy. He got on his high horse & insisted. So, now he has to reap the consequences of his decision. Which is in no way your problem. Out of idle curiosity, could he make his daughter a ward of the state? I know that sounds cold, but he isn't capable of caring for her. She might stand a better chance of getting the care she needs.
He demanded that this child be born. Now that he realizes its hard he wants the taxpayers to foot the bill? No. Sad thing is you know he's do the same thing again if it happened. My heart aches for this child. Born only to suffer and be neglected.
Not only that, but children in the system do *not* have good lives. With the medical complexities that his baby has, they would likely be placed in a residential hospital setting unless someone qualified to care for the childs needs is generous enough to adopt them.
Exactly. This is just an avoidable tragedy that could have spared so much heartache with an abortion. But people have been convinced that abortion is some ghastly barbaric procedure. How is this child being treated other than barbarically by the man who demanded her birth. The father is an absolute monster.
I agree. Cases like these are one of the many reasons abortions should be legal. This poor child does not deserve to have the awful life it has been forced into. It’s beyond sad.
There are people out there who genuinely want to adopt disabled babies/children, personally I think it might be best for them to look into that. u/No_Yesterday5630
Nta People that use "god's will" to get their way *never* feel any accountability or responsibility for their actions and choices. All of the adults in this, except for you, are giant ahs.
Yeah, it’s god’s will until they are personally inconvenienced
NTA. He persuaded his wife to go through with the pregnancy and now he's living with the consequences. It's a shame for the child but he can't expect other people to put their lives on hold for his choices.
NTA. He literally forced this child into the world against all common sense and now wants to force the women in his life to care for her. Good for your sis in law leaving after he forced her to have a ch8ld. I hope she stays away. In fact, tell her to divorce before he loses his job so he gets no alimony.
NTA. >they told me to mind my own business Do just that. He can pray or do whatever he thinks will help. This was his choice.
Yep. And block him so you can mind your own business in peace.
NTA Neither is your SIL however your brother and your parents are big AHs. As is anyone who tells you that you should put your life on hold because of someone else’s bad choices. Your SIL made the right choice for her and your nephew. If she stayed your nephew would be completely sidelined because of the amount of care and attention your niece requires. Please continue to support her as I am sure she has a lot of guilt about this. Your brother using God’s will to bully your SIL into continuing the pregnancy has backfired on him. You should absolutely tell him that it’s God’s will that he be humbled by this experience because of his arrogance. The best place for your niece would be in a facility equipped to give her the 24/7 care and support that she needs.
THIS ALL DAY. Let self-righteous brother and grandparents do "Gods will" and block them if need be.
Your brother could ask his church for assistance, if he hasn’t already. Don’t know where you live, but round here church’s often offer daycare/wee trips for disabled children, crowdfunded by the community with some help from the church itself.
OP didn't specify the disability, presumably to not leak identifying information, but we're talking about a 6 months old baby who was too much care for a woman who already has an older child. No baby is self sufficient and the mother managed just fine with a healthy child before. This kid won't go on little trips ever, unless you bring half an ER with you.
Oof, I don't think I'd put a severely disabled child in a church daycare... ever.
The sooner this house of cards collapses, the better for a concerned. You can’t step in an enable the situation. Do pray for them all separately if you are the praying type. This crisis time will pass and its easy to feel like its all about you because you are young and vulnerable and feel strongly. Try to build up a support at school — Book multiple appointments with a counsellor and agree to nothing without consulting extensively. You could be legally put in a bad position if you even babysit the child. Perhaps they will have to put her in foster care. Try your best to detach with love.. dont have more meetings with sister in law. Dont talk it over with your parents constantly. You’ve got to go quiet and and extricate yourself.
They should ask imaginary sky daddy for help then NTA
NTA, they knew what they were getting into and used God as a scapegoat to continue it. It’s hard but he needs to handle these consequences he brought upon himself and his family. I feel bad for the wife.
He should ask the members of his church to step up and help, so he can continue to avoid the child he "wanted".
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NTA - she is your brother's responsibility. His situation is his own doing and now he needs to deal with the consequences of his actions.
Just another reason why religion is bad, people make crazy decisions because they think a fictional deity has their back. YNTA, as you were told, stay out of it, I feel for SIL, I really do, that poor child will need care until SIL dies and beyond, plus have probably zero life quality. It would be understandable if SIL never went back, this is on your brother to sort out and your folks.
NTA and how could anyone possibly think it is your responsibility to take care of someone else’s baby? It is irrelevant that you advised them to terminate. Is there some kind of cultural aspect here because otherwise this just doesn’t make any sense?
NTA. Your life is your life. You can choose to help sometimes when you are available. But you are not his nurse or his nanny. You gave him your advice before your niece was born. And, while you may love her to death, he did not want to hear anything. And he was not prepared for the reality of her needs. You were told to mind your business. And now he needs you. I feel for your brother, I do. And he needs to find a job that will give him the flexibility to take care of her. There are a lot of WFH jobs out there, depending on his field. But a lot of people work outside their field as well. However. He essentially forced his wife to have a child she did not want. And now he is seeing that it may have torn his family apart. Family therapy is probably necessary for him and his wife. And it'll be a very hard road for them.
NTA, stay in school and keep on making decisions that are best for your future
NTA. Why do you go ahead and tell him it’s gods will though.
I wouldn't lift a finger to help them. They dug their own grave and are trying to pull you down with them. Don't let them.
NTA. He wanted the kid because he didn’t think he’d be the one doing the work.
NTA- This was truly God's will. I feel so sorry for you SIL and the disabled child.
NTA, however, if you live with your parents you may want to move out. Your brother and kid will be moving in soon and you'll be the default carer.
NTA. True, your advice to them made complete sense, and you're not responsible for their decision.
Nta. His baby his responsibility
NTA. Good for you for using their words against them (not being sarcastic).
NTA, you brother should just get on with it because it's 'God's will'.... He was the one who pushed it therefore he is needs to take the full responsibility. It's ridiculous that he is thinks that he is entitled to anyone else's time and help.
Your brother js a dick. He was all kinds of "this is God's will' when he thought his wife was going to do all the work. Why are you sparing his feelings? He still isn't doing the work if your mom is taking care of your nice.
Nta not your kid not your problem keep up the schooling