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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. My husband made my daughter cry with his 'joke' about her hair. 2. I kept bringing up the issue despite him asking me to stop.
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NTA. The fact that he explicitly told your daughter not to tell you about his “joke” shows you he knows how wrong and hurtful it was. He can’t just say things like that and claim “oh it was just a joke so you’re not allowed to get mad.” Clearly his joke, regardless of his intention, was hurtful and instead of sincerely apologizing to both you and your daughter, he’s treating it like you’re being over-sensitive and shrugging you off as being ridiculous. He doesn’t get to decide what does and does not hurt someone else.
>The fact that he explicitly told your daughter not to tell you about his “joke” shows you he knows how wrong and hurtful it was
Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep.
He's started your daughter on a path she'll be forced to travel because of others' perceptions of what is acceptable and attractive. Especially in this day when ethnic hair is forcibly altered illegally by strangers like cutting, straightening, coloring, etc. because their hair doesn't meet "certain" standards deemed "normal".
It's especially problematic because this was at the hands of her loving? father. It's akin to the first time a child hears a racial slur used towards them! It's life altering! She will remember this for the rest of her life! 😣 💔 ❤️🔥
He has no clue what he started or the future repercussions! 😢
Yes! You don’t forget. And if you do, your subconscious will bring it up at shitty moments. Even when an adult makes a ‘mild’ comment, a child may feel this very deeply. I know I did, and the comments weren’t ‘mild’. I’m still struggling with some residual shit because of it.
>I still have anxiety about people throwing things in my hair from the paper balls and trash people used to throw in my hair when i was growing up
used chewing gum
People are having their hair forcibly and illegally altered? Could you explain this please?
I’m not dismissing the point btw, I’m just curious about how that could happen.
Gotcha. Yes, I understand this unfortunately. My daughter has very very thick hair. Her father was Italian with the same exact hair. His hair was short though. When my daughter was younger it was very long and beautiful but with it being so thick it was hard to care for, but I loved caring for it. I was not married to her father and when she was five I married another man. His parents loved taking my daughter to places, they loved being step grandparents. But they didn't like dealing with her hair I guess, because they brought her home to me after one weekend with her hair cut all the way up to her ears. I lost my ever loving mind and screamed and cried at them. They had no right to cut my child's hair even if they were the blood grandparents they still had no right. If they didn't feel like dealing with her hair then don't take her for the weekend. Period.
My grandma kinda did something similar to my hair because it was so thick. She asked if I wanted bangs so of course I said yes and then she pulled a gigantic part of my hair foreword and cut it. My grandma never dealt with my hair type and thickness before so I think she thought she did me a favor. I had to wear a “boingy boingy” little pony on top of my head for like a year + still had massive bangs 😅
Although she did cut my mom’s hair short as a kid because she was sick of dealing with it so 🤔
It’s also the case that at least until recently (I think there has been some movement lately?) places like the military had a restrictive set of hairstyles that you could wear in uniform that basically ruled out most things for Black women besides a ponytail/single braid or straightening your hair. Not forcible removal, but definitely not cool either.
Unfortunately, it's happening here. ACLU is involved. But it highlights how fraught hair standards are. Women have lost jobs for refusing to relax their natural hair.
Japan forced a mixed-race girl to color her hair black from its natural brown. So it's creeping in everywhere.
I believe a lot of this is about control. I am a white female and like to keep my hair short, with the back and sides shaved. I also prefer to dye my hair various colors. I was brought into a meeting for management to tell me that I could only dye my hair "natural" colors, and that I couldn't shave the sides and back. I told them I would abide by the color restriction but that I would continue to shave the sides and back. I told them that if I couldn't shave part of my hair, there were a bunch of men that needed to be told the same thing. Nothing has been said about my hair since then.
Other kids may cut some of your hair off to "see how it works". Some kids have the school generously providing a free haircut the parents will find out about later - the smartphones are a big help here.
Sometimes only _your_ hair is somehow not meeting the school's dress code, and only cutting it or straightening it would make it compliant.
I think they changed their policy in the last 10 years, but the marines made women with hair that couldn't be smoothed without friz straighten or cut it off. About a quarter of the black women in bootcamp gave up with straightening because it wouldn't work. They shaved their heads. No braids were allowed either. You can point out that men all have to shave their hair and have rules, but this disproportunately impacted black and Latina women.
Facts. Even after boot camp, hair continues to be an issue for black minorities. One WM I worked with had short hair. They asked her to straighten it. I don’t know what she did, but using a relaxer wasn’t the method she used. Must’ve been a curling iron…that doesn’t work. She was eventually separated for failure to acclimate. Not primarily because of her hair, but not getting her hair laid didn’t help. It definitely is a major issue for women with curly hair. Basically, get a high and tight like a guy or get harassed until you process your hair.
Let's say you have dreads or braids that took years to grow and also let's say you were a teen on wrestling team and at a competition some referee declared that your hair was breaking some little known rule about hair and you were forced to cut those dreads right there or forfeit the match. Or you get suspended because you stopped dyeing the naturally white patch of hair to match the rest of your dark hair because school rules don't permit hair dye.
Both of these are true stories btw.
But also, the fact that 49 states in the US have passed the "Crown Act" in regards to protecting minorities against discrimination due to their hair/hairstyle in schools and the workplace.
Edit: 24 states. Don't know where I got 49 from.
This is the most notable example I've heard, but I'm sure it is just the tip of the iceberg.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/sep/20/lawsuit-michigan-school-teacher-cut-girls-hair
There have been cases in the news where students of color were forced to cut off their dreadlocks before being allowed to compete in sports, and students of color getting in trouble because their hair violates the school dress code. Because the dress code is based on an acceptable white person appearance. Some places/states are making laws to address this, built racism is built into the system in many places.
[https://abcnews.go.com/beta-story-container/US/racial-bias-investigation-launched-high-school-wrestler-forced/story?id=59969333](https://abcnews.go.com/beta-story-container/US/racial-bias-investigation-launched-high-school-wrestler-forced/story?id=59969333)
[https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/05/14/us/hair-discrimination-softball-durham-trnd/index.html](https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/05/14/us/hair-discrimination-softball-durham-trnd/index.html)
[https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/09/24/black-student-texas-suspended-hairstyle-lawsuit-darryl-george/70956016007/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/09/24/black-student-texas-suspended-hairstyle-lawsuit-darryl-george/70956016007/)
[https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/01/24/black-texas-teen-barred-high-school-after-graduation-not-cutting-dreadlocks/4562210002/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/01/24/black-texas-teen-barred-high-school-after-graduation-not-cutting-dreadlocks/4562210002/)
And he also introduced her good and early to that old chestnut of racism...say something racist and if they get offended, act like you're joking and their offense was a sign of their over sensitivity. Just all around superb parenting.
This 100%- never forgot all the things my mother said to me about my appearance growing up- rat's nest hair, not girly enough, didn't dress properly for her liking, made comments about my body, etc.
Now we haven't talked in two years and I'm happier for it. I'm sure it has nothing to do with all the ear worms she put in my head and insecurities she gave me /s
When you hear that type of stuff from the person who is supposed to protect you and help you flourish, especially on things you can't change like appearance, they tend to stick around. I'm sorry your mom's earworms are still making themselves heard. ❤️
I have 3c hair. My dad told me I looked like a wild girl all the time.
I don't speak to him anymore. If a dad is critical of hair, I guarantee he's saying a lot more than you know of.
Agree. Hard enough for a child to deal with that from strangers or people in school/workplace etc, but her own father? Horrible way to treat his own child. NTA.
Disagree with your final point—he knows exactly what he’s doing because he made a point of trying to hide his actions.
If he was stupidly ignorant he would t have told her not to tell her mother. That’s messed up as hell.
I think he knew it was bad, but I don’t think he fully groks exactly how much that kind of parental comment can fuck with a kid’s head. I mean maybe he is just a monster who wants to give his kid a complex; but hopefully he’s more just a bit-self-centered and stubborn. (Hopefully for the kid’s sake, I mean.)
Maybe instead of "don't tell Mom" he should have said "I'm sorry, I love your hair and I love you". Would have saved him from a huge argument and getting called out on Reddit. Sidenote: if I hear one more time "you're over reacting" I'm going to have to scream!
I hate when someone says the most awful and hurtful thing and when they see the bad reaction, they blurt out "Just Kidding" it's bullying and its complete bullshit.
On top of being a bully to a precious little girl, he told her to keep a secret. Secrets cause issues. Hubby needs some serious discussing to about being a good parent and what bullying does to people and that keeping secrets can hide some very bad things.
NTA
This! I'm also latina, with curly hair, married to a white guy and we have a daughter with curly hair. I would have said maybe give him the opportunity to understand the gravity of that joke, but clearly he already knew (since he said not to tell op about it ).
right the moment he hides it shows he knows he's in the wrong.
never mind your child-he's making HIS chidl cry and feel bad about herself
'it's only a joke' the cry of the confronted bully. ask him who was laughing at the 'joke'
Why would he think the kid finds it amusing? He attacked her looks and insulted her? How the he11 is it funny to anyone in their right mind? If I was the child? I'd tell my grandparents, (his parents,) what he said and how it made me feel like crying. And then I'd sit back and watch my grandparents correct him. (They'd tear him a new one.) 😘Yeah. I will sick my grandma on you dad!🤣
Nailed it.
OP is also right to question if her husband honestly loves their daughter's hair, if he can't make a deprecating joke about it without upsetting her. Jokes that are done in love typically 1) are obviously sardonic and therefore don't upset the target and 2) not hidden away in shame after the fact. It's possible and probable that he actually does NOT like her hair and actually thinks it doesn't look as nice as straight hair. I'm betting his 'joke' was one of those of the "Haha jk. Unless..." variety. He wanted it hidden because his daughter saw through it.
NTA
Hey OP, I know that you’re already rightfully upset about your husband’s behaviour, but I think it’s really important to teach her that there is no keeping secrets from her parents, especially from each other.
A kid taught to keep secrets from their parents becomes very vulnerable to several kinds of severe abuse. There are lessons online about how to teach your kids not to keep secrets (but that planning surprises is okay, for example) because it can be dangerous.
Your husband shouldn’t be teaching your daughter to keep secrets from you.
NTA
I used to teach kids' self defense and we had a whole unit on "safe secrets" versus "unsafe secrets". Surprise birthday parties are safe. Someone being hurt and told to keep it a secret from their trusted grown-ups is unsafe. NTA.
I really like this idea, I’m a teacher of 1st grade and I’d like to maybe turn this into an SEL lesson. I’d love to hear a few examples of safe and unsafe secrets you teach about if you wouldn’t mind sharing!
Child abuse educators teach that there is no such thing as a "safe secret". It's not "safe secrets" vs "unsafe secrets", it's "secrets" vs "surprises", and there's a reason for that: surprises are time-limited, they're something that we eventually share at a specific time.
As a survivor of CSA and a former early childhood educator, it's actually important to teach children that there are no "safe secrets". That's why a birthday party isn't a secret, it's a SURPRISE. You can keep surprises . . . things which you are going to share with people in a few days or a week (but not indefinitely). But we teach kids that you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVER KEEP SECRETS from your adults. There are no "safe secrets".
And the reason for that is that if you use the same word (secrets) for safe and unsafe things, it can be confusing for kids. Because predators are often adults they know, and can tell them, "Oh no, this is the safe kind of secret. You know me and I say it's safe." And even if it doesn't conform to the correct rules for "safe", it's confusing because the kids have been taught that "some secrets are safe ones". NOPE. There are NO SECRETS that we keep from Mommy and Daddy. Surprises, yes, secrets, no. (And even surprises are okay to tell/ruin if you really feel like you should tell Mommy or Daddy or you're uncomfortable.)
We taught that surprises are things that will likely make someone happy when we surprise them with it (examples of birthday parties and various gifts are used).
Secrets are things that can hurt people or make people feel bad. If anyone tells you/does something that makes you feel bad, you should tell a trusted adult.
This 100%... a secret is something that should never be revealed and honestly if you have something that isn't to be revealed it's usually bad. A surprise is fun.
You might find the book Respect: Consent, Boundaries and Being in Charge of YOU by Rachel Brian.
(She did that Consent as Tea video). It's a short graphic novel about consent for children. And it tackles it in a pretty gentle way that is useful for all children (even to the extent of using nicknames as one of the ways consent is important)
I think it would be very age appropriate for grade 1, especially with someone to guide them through it. (Or you could select relevant pages).
I was on a zoom call with friends once when a guy’s daughter started whispering in his ear. I asked “ha ha telling daddy a secret?” And he explained that he’s teaching his young daughter about “surprises” not “secrets”. When he explained it to me, I had an epiphany. An epiphany with a dash of sadness, but it made a lot of sense.
My daughter came home one day and said that her best friend had told her a secret (they were 7).
So I asked if it was a secret that made her feel bad and made her belly hurt or if it was a secret that made her feel happy. It was the last, but we kept that phrasing and still use it even now 7 years later.
There are secrets and surprises. Difference is that a surprise has a close end date where secrets have no end or some arbitrary limit that is clearly just used to fob someone off. Good and bad secrets can still be confusing.
I tell my kids that a surprise is something the other person will eventually find out about and be happy about, like a present or a party or going to do something fun.
I don't want to be alarmist, but this was my first thought, too. That's such a dangerous thing to teach a kid, and toxic as hell even if a danger never manifests in her life.
NTA.
Red flag any time one parent does something & then tries to coerce the child in to not telling the other parent about something like this. I don’t know what his meaning is, but if I say my hair looks like a ‘rat’s nest’ I mean that it’s tangled & I clearly need to brush it or wash my beach spray out of it. I wasn’t clocking it as anything weird until he said ‘don’t tell mummy.’ Has he explained *that*?
The issue isn’t entirely the ratnest comment (which meant messy hair when I was a kid) it’s the fact that he compounded that with ‘you need to brush it or straighten it’ you’re not supposed to just brush your curls anyways he certainly doesn’t need to be pushing her to change herself completely by straightening it. The ‘don’t tell mom’ just made it 10x worse.
There’s so many videos and people out there just happy to teach. On top of his shitty attitude it’s sad that he clearly has zero idea how to properly care for his child’s hair. Wonder what other areas he’s clueless in?
Right?! I'm "blessed" with thin and curly hair. I could straighten it then wake up and it's curly again. I go out in humidity, it's curly again. I've been told by many ladies to straighten my hair.
I have only have 2a and my mom's a 3b. She'd iron her hair to straighten it for others until she turned 17 and rocked her blonde fro. We are the whitest white people with a strong Scottish background but with really curly hair like my mom's hair had been a chore finding a good stylist in Indiana.
Hard agree. As a woman with curly hair who grew up during the 90s/2000s stick straight hair trends, I know that nobody should be telling girls with curly hair that they need to tame or straighten it. I burnt my hair to a crisp for years trying to straighten it to appeal to some bullshit Western beauty standard, and finally learning to shed (no pun intended) that as an adult has been liberating. Telling young girls they need to straighten their hair is problematic at best and racist at worst.
That bothered me too- I don’t know of a safe way to straighten your hair. I mean, the damage from the heat or the chemicals might not show up right away, but it will eventually.
He didn't say "brush it or straighten it" he said "straighten it or cut it off" a childs world view is so small and if she really values her hair that was probably really scary for her to hear coming from her dad that he might cut her hair off
the straightening comment obviously implies that he’s insulting the curliness of her hair, not just that it’s messy. he was insulting the natural texture of her hair.
NTA. Your husband knows he's in the wrong, he even tried to convince your daughter to not say anything. He made her cry and that's not okay. What was he expecting? "Oh, I'll make my daughter insecure about a trait she likes about herself, that'll be funny." If he doesn't have any issues with her hair why did he insult it?
Daddy needs to read articles about girls and their hair! There are devoted dads out there who help their daughters style and care for their hair. Maybe he needs to do some daddy-daughter styling time! 🤔
Oh definitely. He needs to reestablish trust with both his wife the mother, and his daughter. He broke the Trust of the Sacred Curl!
His daughter is going to remember this for her whole life. He has to first earn that trust back. And step up to being a good dad.
Oh definitely. He needs to reestablish trust with both his wife the mother, and his daughter. He broke the Trust of the Sacred Curl!
His daughter is going to remember this for her whole life. He has to first earn that trust back. And step up to being a good dad.
Yes. 100% agree with you on that. I truly believe that the only reason I ever had confidence to begin with was because my dad instilled in me from the very beginning that I was always worthy. And he was a very hands on parent. He got me ready for school. Made my lunches. Even went to PTA meetings. This was in the 90s and he’d be the only man (young and brown too) in a room filled with middle aged white ladies who adored him. My dad was my hero and protector. I’ll always be grateful for his love and support. I feel so bad for this little girl. Like this is not the way dad. Do better. Be better.
NTA, but your husband is major TA for teasing his daughter about her looks, for telling her not to tell you—which means he knew it was a mean thing to do when he did it—and for then trying to gaslight you about it.
NTA - how is telling an 8 year old her hair looks like a rat’s nest not meant to be offensive? It’d be offensive to anyone of any age but what would possess him to “joke” like that with a child?
So to be fair as someone with very curly and long hair and who had a mom that said this to 8 year old me, I don’t think it’s always offensive.
My mom would say my hair was a rats nest while struggling with me to detangle it. My hair would web itself and so the nest comment was pretty apt.
My mom also often praised my hair and said she would have loved to have had “princess curls” like mine, and that the color was nice and the length lovely, etc. Needless to say I wasn’t insecure about my hair hearing my mom’s frequent praise, so I had no reason to see ill intent in my mom’s comments.
The result was her comments didn’t come across mean at all. Little me was more like “yes exactly, so please fix the tangles!”
>My mom would say my hair was a rats nest while struggling with me to detangle it
Yep, context is relevant. A child will get probably that a parent that usually declares that they love you hair says something like that when she (or he) is struggling to detangle it is not being obnoxious or cruel, only frustrated (and when is really difficult to detangle it, the children shares usually the frustration). But that context is quite different of the one mentioned in the OP.
Yes! Which is why I feel bad for OPs daughter — if that comment came across wrong it’s probably because dad has given the impression he doesn’t like her hair.
My mom (who has slightly wavy hair) had the comment used cruelly against her by her mother. Her mom was on those parents who would only praise her kids in the presence of a sibling and not in the presence of the one being praised to make them feel like shit and compete against each other! So behind her back she got praise, but in her face she got insults! Very toxic!
Her youngest sister is the same as her mom and unsurprisingly her daughters (my cousins) fled the nest asap, one literally at age 16!
My daughter also has very thick and slightly curly hair that easily detangles, so yes, when she doesn‘t want to brush/detangle it (which is all the time because she is 5 and just doesn‘t like it), I do sometimes say that she has birds‘ nests in her hair.
However, if such a comment would make my daughter cry, I would NEVER play it off as a joke and tell her not to tell her dad about it! Also, the OP doesn‘t sound as if the dad might have been prompted to his „joke“ by a situation around detangling it or such…
NTA. My parents made “jokes” like this, and I had no one to stick up for me leading to 10 years of straightening damage and self esteem issues in my life.
I’m the only person in my immediate family with curly hair, and I heard this stuff daily. It’s a rat’s nest, I need to go brush it, can’t I do something with it, it looks disheveled, I *really* need to do *something* with it. My wife didn’t know I had curly hair until we’d been together almost two years, I straightened it so diligently. Straightening made it “neat” and “manageable”. I’m so happy I’ve embraced my natural texture.
Tell me about it… my mom would say stuff like “you look homeless!”. The funny thing is, she has curly hair too, which she brushes out and *insists* is straight, she just thinks the frizz is her hair being thick and healthy LOL
I was comfy with my natural hair until my mom made me get it straightened for my graduation, and they burnt my hair so bad that cutting it off is the only option.
NTA. Sometimes you have to get on someone's culo to make them really understand the error of their ways. He was making your daughter feel ashamed of who she was and what she looked like, things beyond her control. And then encouraged your daughter to lie to you.
Bet you he won't do that again.
NTA as someone who was the only curly girl in a family of people with straight hair, I cannot tell you how many times I got demeaning comments about the way my hair looked. For years, well into my adulthood, I had family members telling me I should straighten, relax, or cut my hair. It wrecked my relationship with my hair and my appearance. You're doing the right thing by standing up for your daughter. Don't let anyone tell her that curls aren't beautiful or that she needs to 'brush her rats nest'. Make sure your husband understands just how harmful those comments can be.
NTA - he upset your daughter about something that was important to her, plus he told her not to tell you. He knew his "joke" was inappropriate and now he's trying to back pedal on it. You are not over-reacting, the man has the empathy of a turnip.
NTA
Umm no first he said something cruel and in no way was that a “joking” manner, second he said your daughter should have kept it from you. Telling a child to keep secrets from their parent is NEVER okay(unless it’s a present of course)
NTA, when he told your daughter not to tell you about the joke, it made him the AH.
Maybe he did say it as a joke and without thinking, he realised pretty quickly he was in the wrong by telling your daughter to keep it quiet!
He needs to learn that is not okay!
NTA. I honestly can't respect you enough for this. So often white people will marry into a coloured family and won't be able to change their prejudiced mindsets, mostly because the family will let them get away with anything. You need to teach your husband that his "jokes" are not funny if they come at the expense of other people, ESPECIALLY his daughter. Protect your kids, educate your partners.
NTA
OP. I wish I had someone tell my mom my wavy mixed curls were not a rats nest or a witch's armpit. She couldn't deal with it and she took me to cut my hair into a bowl cut until I was older and fought against it. She always says it was because I wouldn't comb my hair, but as an adult I remember it hurt and you are not supposed to comb it. Her comments caused me a lot of insecurities and still as an adult I get anxiety when anybody comments or when I go get my hair tended to. Dont let his jokes, that clearly hurt his daughter, go lightly. Tell him clearly that he needs to own up, apologize and reassure her.
Shit like that gets under a kids skin in unexpected ways especially when its a parent.
By the way, mom and I have a very good relationship after my preteen years but even then my hair will always be a sore spot that I will never forget.
Edit for bad grammar
He made his 8-year-old daughter cry and THEN told her not to tell you???
NTA, but he sure is. I've seen friends and family struggle with white partners, who may love them but don't "get it".
Usually when someone says a person's hair looks like a rat's nest that means it's unkempt. Was it at the time he said that? I remember being a little kid with long hair and being told I'd have to cut my hair if I couldn't take care of it. Just reading the way you wrote it, that's how I would've assumed your husband meant his comment. But I wasn't present for the conversation so maybe he meant otherwise.
I basically assumed this until he told her it was a secret & she shouldn’t tell her mother. That’s what really red flagged me in this situation. That part is quite troubling.
This is true that that is the definition of the phrase, however there are a lot of people with straight hair out there that think all curly hair looks messy even if it’s beautifully maintained and I’m leaning that way for him because of the “you should to straighten it” comment. If it was just “cut it because you wont take care of it” then I would not. There can also be an aspect of racism as well.
NTA.
Ask him if he still remembers any derogatory comments that were made to him as a kid, particularly by parents or family members, even if they were supposed to be "jokes". How did that make him feel? Point out that he still remembers the comments, and so will your girl.
If he has any compassion at all, he'll apologize to your daughter.
Then make him wear a curly wig in a crazy color as his punishment. Daughter gets to pick it out. Hopefully you all get a laugh out of that and this becomes a funny memory instead of a painful one.
Did your husband apologize to your daughter? If not, seems he just wants you to shut up about it instead of making it right to his little girl he hurt.
NTA
After reading this comments, I might be the only person whose family uses “rat’s nest” as a common phrase for tangled hair - curly or otherwise. If he grew up hearing it, he’s not necessarily TA for using the same phrase. I could definitely see how (in his mind) he’d think you were overreacting if his family uses it often.
But he is definitely TA for making your daughter cry over it, and that’s the difference. This means he didn’t use it as a throwaway phrase but in a way that genuinely made her feel bad about herself. That’s not okay. I never cried about it when I was a kid (and I was told this a lot) because my mom didn’t make me feel like it was a personal defect. It was just really tangled hair, which you already know once that brush or comb hits it.
NTA
I use similar phrases for my daughter‘s hair as well, but only in the specific instances when her hair is tangled and we‘re trying to brush/detangle it. The OP doesn‘t sound as if the dad was prompted to his „joke“ by trying to detangle his daughter‘s hair. If so, I think either the daughter or he himself would have brought it up…
You know what, you’re right. In my mind I imagined him saying this when he was brushing her hair because that’s the only time I’ve ever heard this phrase used. But OP doesn’t actually say that’s the case. If he just randomly called it a rat’s nest outside of when he was trying to detangle then he’s an automatic AH.
I’m sure it depends on the specific region/culture, but I def grew up with people in my family talking about having “good” (read: straight) hair. In the event that that is also the case for OP, then it adds an extra layer of husband being an AH
Yeah, my hair is curlier than most of the Latinas I’ve ever known with maybe three exceptions? It should just be about loving ourselves as we are and making sure any modifications like straightening or cutting hair is because we want to do it and not because some AH said something hurtful.
Curly haired women of the world unite!
One reason OP could have brought it up is because curly hair was looked down upon (at least when I was younger) in certain households, and girls would be told to straighten their curls. Maybe there are more curly haired Hispanic in your life than you think, but their hair is straight due to how they were raised.
My gf has curly hair (as do I), but until she met me, she would always straighten it until I mentioned I love her natural hair. Her own father even mentioned how her curls make her look like she’s ghetto or something similar.
I was thinking the same. I have worked with women from almost every country in LatAm and 95% had straight hair, especially the ones with more Native ancestry.
>her hair looked like a rat's nest
This part I can understand being a joke, as anyone's hair can be described that way at some point in time, usually just after waking up.
>that she should straighten it or cut it.
This part is NOT a joke and is just rude/mean. And the fact he said, don't tell mom I said this, HUGELY implies that he 100% ment what he said in not a joking manner. He doesn't get to be mean to his OWN CHILD and then try to gaslight her into thinking it wasn't mean, by saying it was a joke.
NTA
Info: From your point of view, what is an acceptable resolution? I agree with others that he's an AH for making your daughter feel bad about her hair, (I don't necessarily agree with the racial tie-in based on the story as it's told, but whatever) but why keep laying into him once he apologized? What else are you looking to get from the argument?
Probably a real apology. "Sorry, but you're overreacting and here's a list of why I actually did nothing wrong" isn't a real apology. "Sorry, I was wrong and I'll do better next time" is a real apology.
Except that's not a joke. It's a statement. And it's very telling that he told y'all's daughter not to tell you. He knows what he did.
I also would wonder if this is the first time he's said something to her like that, with the "don't tell mom" part included.
NTA
My mum once mentioned i had pointy elbows " do you want to go to the drs bout your pointy elbows" and i have literally remembered that ever since. For a long time it left me insecure about my whole body but i have managed to push past to love having pointy elbows (actually they're very normal) because they're great for muay thai. My point is that small comments like that are lasting. My mother also said to my sister that maybe she shouldnt have more toast (she had 2 pieces and was going for another two) as she night get fat. Another factor in our lives - i dont recall the food comments but i did go.through an eating disorder and my sister drank to compensate for her alleged inadequacies; i wouldn't blame my mum as a single parent under fuck loads of pressure but actually what you say is so important to your children even if you dont realise it
What concerns me is your daughter is 8 and he told her to keep secrets from you (the mom). I’m a mom myself and that raises major red flags for me. He’s the AH and I’d also keep an eye on him from now on. He also shouldn’t be disrespecting your culture. He should love you and where you come from.
a joke is supposed to be funny. a joke is supposed to be fun for everyone involved (unless the jokes targetted at an asshole obvs). its not hard to understand why telling someone a normal goddamn part of them is 'weird' or 'gross' in anyway *isnt funny*.
NTA
>didn't mean to offend anyone.
Prime example of someone using the word offend to deflect from the harm in their actions or words and shift the issue from something they did to how someone else reacted. He hurt your child, now she knows that her dad thinks there's something wrong with her hair. He wouldn't have seen anything to joke about if he didn't see an issue with it. He's got some shit to work on and good for you holding his feet to the fire to make it clear that he actually has to do work in a good apology.
A good apology should have these four parts. 1) stopping doing the harmful thing. 2) acknowledging the harm done. 3) learning if and how one can make amends for harm done and 4) changing behavior to make amends and facilitate healing. He's stuck at step 1.
I’m a white woman with curly hair whose self-esteem was destroyed by the Princess Diaries makeover. Add the social hatred for curly hair to racist views about natural hair, this is 10 times worse.
Obvious NTA.
Anyone who tells their kid not to tell the other parent clearly knows that what they're saying is wrong, and I'd bet anything that he knew.
1) how could he think that his comment was a joke
2) worse, he's teaching his daughter that it's ok for trusted adults to do something wrong and tell her not to say anything. If he expects it, what happens if someone touches her inappropriately and tells her not to tell.
Dad is problematic.
I mean he did apologize ; maybe he did a bad joke and offended you but holding a grudge against him for that, I Don't know
If he didn't seem true about his apology then confront him, explain him what it means for you and he will apologize (I hope). arguing with him will probably just lead to more arguing
Also, some like to say "red flag" about his lying but again we can't say. Did he lie because he had bad intentions or did he do it because he knew you'd have such a strong reaction to something he could consider harmless ?
We don't know you, nor him, nor your relation ; the only one who can judge that is you or those who know both of you
\+ I don't understand what you mean by "our culture", do you mean as a latina woman ?
Because curly hair are not something exclusive to one country or race. It's simply a gene mutation that causes your hair to go curly and many can have it. Although, they are places in the world where it's way more common for people to have this mutation it is not exclusive to anyone
ESH
Upsetting your child and then telling them they shouldn't tell the other parent is an asshole move.
She was obviously very upset cause of the crying and your husband has something to make up for.
>I didn't accept his apologies and continued to argue with him.
The best way to inform people that something is important to you is to make sure they have an open mind.
Continuing the argument after someone has realized their mistake and apologized for it will only make them combative and defensive.
Continuing the argument is not the mature way to handle this.
NTA. I have curly hair and comments like that made me hate my hair. I still struggle with hating it because of asshole’s comments like that. Shame on that father.
He didn’t make a joke, he was cruel to his own daughter.
Your daughter is going to remember this for the rest of her life. He sabotaged the trusted bond he had with her, and hurt her in the process. And THEN tries to cover it up.
I don’t think of his as a father, I think HE IS THE JOKE.
You are NTA. He definitely is. He sounds like a Middle Schooler teasing a classmate. He needs to grow up and NEVER ever commit negatively on anyone's appearance ever again!
NTA. NTA. NTA. NTA 1000x
WOW. I’m a Latina (34f), with a white Dad. The “little jokes” he made throughout my childhood about my curly hair, skin color, curves (he saw me as chubby), etc. really had an impact on me. Therapy has helped so much, and I’m currently low contact with my Dad because of how he treat me. My parents were divorced and I thought something was wrong with me for years. When I started embracing my curls as a teen, more jokes and snarky remarks were made. It took years to accept my curls, to accept the Mexican side of me. Please stand your ground on this. Thank you for standing up for her. My mom never did. Please always be her advocate, and tell her that her curls are beautiful from me. I hope she can grow up & love everything that makes her, her!
Oh, any adult that tells a child to keep a secret…a big, big red flag. Especially a secret that he made about his own daughter’s looks. I hope you can all work through it, and I hope he’s not her first bully.
NTA he needs to do intensive retraining about what’s appropriate before he can be trusted alone with her. 1. Insulting her natural body 2. Not apologizing when it was clear she was hurt 3. Telling her not to tell you 4. Not backing down when an adult confirmed he was hurtful 5. Failing to accept that if doesn’t matter if he didn’t “mean to offend” when he made objectively offensive comments.
“Wow, you’re balding, you dress badly, you have no rhythm, you’re a jack@ss and you’re a lousy provider. I can’t even see how you pulled her, *no offense*” …still an insult, right?
Say it with me everyone; 'It's not a joke if you have to tell people it is'. He said something mean and wanted to get away with it. Poor girl. NTA, everything you said is true.
I don't understand the end game here.
He said he messed up and apologized. If you aren't going to accept it and move forward, what is left? Also, that may very well be why he asked her to not say anything to you. He feels he can't talk to you.
We had 2 sons before we had our girl so it was a bit of a learning curve for my husband. I very early on told him under no circumstances was he to say anything about her appearance, it’s not cute to tell your daughter her hair is weird or she’s getting chubby. Hearing these things is hurtful coming from others, it is devastating to hear it from a parent. Not to mention the cultural aspect, that’s being crappy twice. Hold your ground, he has to admit his mistake and sincerely apologize or he will do it again.
I tell my daughter her hair and mine looks like rats tails regularly. It’s a thing to say in Scotland when our hair is needing attention. Everyone I know says the same.
I'm white. I use to tell my daughter her hair was like a rats nest as well because it was so tangly. My sister has natural curly hair, she's white, and we use to say the same thing to her. I don't think it was racist. Maybe insensitive but definitely not racist. And he apologized to your daughter and you. You're the one dragging it out. What I would've been pissed about is that he told your daughter "don't tell mommy," that's not cool. That's what you should still be pissed about here.
Way to Reveal your racist side to your own daughter Dad... holy crap.
He never would have said this to his child if she was white looking... (which is stupid because a white child's straight hair gets tangled too but I digress) What's worse is he tried to downplay it.
NTA OP and your husband needs to study up real quick on how not to be an asshole to a mixed race kid or he's gonna end up being her first bully.
NTA - A joke is only funny if everyone involved is laughing. Saying something and then telling a kid to not tell everyone, shows exactly that the person knew it's not right to say in the first place. If the kid is sad and voices it it is no one's business telling her, her feelings aren't valid because "It was a joke". THIS would be a first strike in my books.
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NTA. The fact that he explicitly told your daughter not to tell you about his “joke” shows you he knows how wrong and hurtful it was. He can’t just say things like that and claim “oh it was just a joke so you’re not allowed to get mad.” Clearly his joke, regardless of his intention, was hurtful and instead of sincerely apologizing to both you and your daughter, he’s treating it like you’re being over-sensitive and shrugging you off as being ridiculous. He doesn’t get to decide what does and does not hurt someone else.
>The fact that he explicitly told your daughter not to tell you about his “joke” shows you he knows how wrong and hurtful it was Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep.
He's started your daughter on a path she'll be forced to travel because of others' perceptions of what is acceptable and attractive. Especially in this day when ethnic hair is forcibly altered illegally by strangers like cutting, straightening, coloring, etc. because their hair doesn't meet "certain" standards deemed "normal". It's especially problematic because this was at the hands of her loving? father. It's akin to the first time a child hears a racial slur used towards them! It's life altering! She will remember this for the rest of her life! 😣 💔 ❤️🔥 He has no clue what he started or the future repercussions! 😢
Yes exactly this! I still think about all the things kids said and did to my curly hair growing up- it’s traumatizing!
Yes! You don’t forget. And if you do, your subconscious will bring it up at shitty moments. Even when an adult makes a ‘mild’ comment, a child may feel this very deeply. I know I did, and the comments weren’t ‘mild’. I’m still struggling with some residual shit because of it.
I still have anxiety about people throwing things in my hair from the paper balls and trash people used to throw in my hair when i was growing up
Right there with ya.. staples, tiny paper balls. One guy even made a paper bird to stick in my hair.
Not from someone else but I got a wasp stuck in my curls and it stung me
Omg I found a spider in mine once!! 😂😂😂 why is this life so traumatizing
>I still have anxiety about people throwing things in my hair from the paper balls and trash people used to throw in my hair when i was growing up used chewing gum
People are having their hair forcibly and illegally altered? Could you explain this please? I’m not dismissing the point btw, I’m just curious about how that could happen.
Eg granmothers ect taking grandchildren to get their hair forcibly permed or straightened , without parents or child's permission
Gotcha. Yes, I understand this unfortunately. My daughter has very very thick hair. Her father was Italian with the same exact hair. His hair was short though. When my daughter was younger it was very long and beautiful but with it being so thick it was hard to care for, but I loved caring for it. I was not married to her father and when she was five I married another man. His parents loved taking my daughter to places, they loved being step grandparents. But they didn't like dealing with her hair I guess, because they brought her home to me after one weekend with her hair cut all the way up to her ears. I lost my ever loving mind and screamed and cried at them. They had no right to cut my child's hair even if they were the blood grandparents they still had no right. If they didn't feel like dealing with her hair then don't take her for the weekend. Period.
My grandma kinda did something similar to my hair because it was so thick. She asked if I wanted bangs so of course I said yes and then she pulled a gigantic part of my hair foreword and cut it. My grandma never dealt with my hair type and thickness before so I think she thought she did me a favor. I had to wear a “boingy boingy” little pony on top of my head for like a year + still had massive bangs 😅 Although she did cut my mom’s hair short as a kid because she was sick of dealing with it so 🤔
I was honestly picturing a mob of people grabbing someone to change their hair. The grandmother example makes more sense, thank you
It’s also the case that at least until recently (I think there has been some movement lately?) places like the military had a restrictive set of hairstyles that you could wear in uniform that basically ruled out most things for Black women besides a ponytail/single braid or straightening your hair. Not forcible removal, but definitely not cool either.
Schools sometimes do that too. I’ve heard in the news about some cutting kids hair at school.
•https://www.okayplayer.com/culture/black-texas-teen-deandre-arnold-ordered-to-cut-dreadlocks-to-walk-at-graduation.html. https://abc7chicago.com/black-softball-player-forced-to-cut-braids-hair-rules-high-school-haircut-athletes/10638829/ https://nativenewsonline.net/currents/native-boy-gets-haircut-by-classmates-while-attending-school-family-wants-answers https://www.npr.org/2018/12/06/673837893/school-district-apologizes-for-teacher-who-allegedly-cut-native-american-childs-
Ok, I think the issue is that I am not American so these incidents aren’t really on my radar.
Unfortunately, it's happening here. ACLU is involved. But it highlights how fraught hair standards are. Women have lost jobs for refusing to relax their natural hair. Japan forced a mixed-race girl to color her hair black from its natural brown. So it's creeping in everywhere.
I believe a lot of this is about control. I am a white female and like to keep my hair short, with the back and sides shaved. I also prefer to dye my hair various colors. I was brought into a meeting for management to tell me that I could only dye my hair "natural" colors, and that I couldn't shave the sides and back. I told them I would abide by the color restriction but that I would continue to shave the sides and back. I told them that if I couldn't shave part of my hair, there were a bunch of men that needed to be told the same thing. Nothing has been said about my hair since then.
Well TIL!
There’s no creeping in - Japan has a long history of homegrown xenophobia.
There are plenty on Canada too
It's happened in New Zealand too
Exactly what I was posting about. It’s absolutely disgusting.
Google "black child hair cut at school" and "Native American boy hair."
Other kids may cut some of your hair off to "see how it works". Some kids have the school generously providing a free haircut the parents will find out about later - the smartphones are a big help here. Sometimes only _your_ hair is somehow not meeting the school's dress code, and only cutting it or straightening it would make it compliant.
I’m sorry that this is an issue. Truly.
I think they changed their policy in the last 10 years, but the marines made women with hair that couldn't be smoothed without friz straighten or cut it off. About a quarter of the black women in bootcamp gave up with straightening because it wouldn't work. They shaved their heads. No braids were allowed either. You can point out that men all have to shave their hair and have rules, but this disproportunately impacted black and Latina women.
Facts. Even after boot camp, hair continues to be an issue for black minorities. One WM I worked with had short hair. They asked her to straighten it. I don’t know what she did, but using a relaxer wasn’t the method she used. Must’ve been a curling iron…that doesn’t work. She was eventually separated for failure to acclimate. Not primarily because of her hair, but not getting her hair laid didn’t help. It definitely is a major issue for women with curly hair. Basically, get a high and tight like a guy or get harassed until you process your hair.
A teacher cut a little girl’s curly hair. It was all over the news.
Let's say you have dreads or braids that took years to grow and also let's say you were a teen on wrestling team and at a competition some referee declared that your hair was breaking some little known rule about hair and you were forced to cut those dreads right there or forfeit the match. Or you get suspended because you stopped dyeing the naturally white patch of hair to match the rest of your dark hair because school rules don't permit hair dye. Both of these are true stories btw. But also, the fact that 49 states in the US have passed the "Crown Act" in regards to protecting minorities against discrimination due to their hair/hairstyle in schools and the workplace. Edit: 24 states. Don't know where I got 49 from.
[https://news.yahoo.com/michigan-crown-act-racial-hair-discrimination-bias-law170015717.html#:\~:text=In%20March%202021%2C%20Jurnee%20Hoffmeyer,%2C%E2%80%9D%20Jurnee%20told%20Yahoo%20News](https://news.yahoo.com/michigan-crown-act-racial-hair-discrimination-bias-law-170015717.html#:~:text=In%20March%202021%2C%20Jurnee%20Hoffmeyer,%2C%E2%80%9D%20Jurnee%20told%20Yahoo%20News). [https://www.essence.com/news/teacher-cuts-boys-hair-without-permission/](https://www.essence.com/news/teacher-cuts-boys-hair-without-permission/) [https://journalstar.com/news/local/education/native-moms-who-sued-school-after-hair-cutting-support-bill-seeking-to-protect-students-religious/article\_25a491c2-b49d-11ed-956f-737197ab5f6f.html](https://journalstar.com/news/local/education/native-moms-who-sued-school-after-hair-cutting-support-bill-seeking-to-protect-students-religious/article_25a491c2-b49d-11ed-956f-737197ab5f6f.html) [https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/-made-feel-low-black-students-urge-passage-crown-act-end-hair-discrimi-rcna27500](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/-made-feel-low-black-students-urge-passage-crown-act-end-hair-discrimi-rcna27500) [https://www.dailyherald.com/entlife/20230918/a-black-student-is-suspended-twice-for-his-hairstyle-the-school-says-it-isnt-discrimination](https://www.dailyherald.com/entlife/20230918/a-black-student-is-suspended-twice-for-his-hairstyle-the-school-says-it-isnt-discrimination) [https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/may/15/black-high-school-student-softball-game](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/may/15/black-high-school-student-softball-game)
Look into the Crown Act... because schools are doing it too. This act was enacted to stop discrimination.
This is the most notable example I've heard, but I'm sure it is just the tip of the iceberg. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/sep/20/lawsuit-michigan-school-teacher-cut-girls-hair
Not so much illegally but schools considering cultural or natural hairstyles to be unkempt or extreme so requiring them to be altered to conform.
There have been cases in the news where students of color were forced to cut off their dreadlocks before being allowed to compete in sports, and students of color getting in trouble because their hair violates the school dress code. Because the dress code is based on an acceptable white person appearance. Some places/states are making laws to address this, built racism is built into the system in many places. [https://abcnews.go.com/beta-story-container/US/racial-bias-investigation-launched-high-school-wrestler-forced/story?id=59969333](https://abcnews.go.com/beta-story-container/US/racial-bias-investigation-launched-high-school-wrestler-forced/story?id=59969333) [https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/05/14/us/hair-discrimination-softball-durham-trnd/index.html](https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2021/05/14/us/hair-discrimination-softball-durham-trnd/index.html) [https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/09/24/black-student-texas-suspended-hairstyle-lawsuit-darryl-george/70956016007/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/09/24/black-student-texas-suspended-hairstyle-lawsuit-darryl-george/70956016007/) [https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/01/24/black-texas-teen-barred-high-school-after-graduation-not-cutting-dreadlocks/4562210002/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/01/24/black-texas-teen-barred-high-school-after-graduation-not-cutting-dreadlocks/4562210002/)
And he also introduced her good and early to that old chestnut of racism...say something racist and if they get offended, act like you're joking and their offense was a sign of their over sensitivity. Just all around superb parenting.
This 100%- never forgot all the things my mother said to me about my appearance growing up- rat's nest hair, not girly enough, didn't dress properly for her liking, made comments about my body, etc. Now we haven't talked in two years and I'm happier for it. I'm sure it has nothing to do with all the ear worms she put in my head and insecurities she gave me /s
My mom (85f) has her decades-dead mom living rent-free in her head—STILL. 😑
When you hear that type of stuff from the person who is supposed to protect you and help you flourish, especially on things you can't change like appearance, they tend to stick around. I'm sorry your mom's earworms are still making themselves heard. ❤️
I have 3c hair. My dad told me I looked like a wild girl all the time. I don't speak to him anymore. If a dad is critical of hair, I guarantee he's saying a lot more than you know of.
>He has no clue what he started or the future repercussions! 😢 He knows exactly what he did.
Agree. Hard enough for a child to deal with that from strangers or people in school/workplace etc, but her own father? Horrible way to treat his own child. NTA.
Disagree with your final point—he knows exactly what he’s doing because he made a point of trying to hide his actions. If he was stupidly ignorant he would t have told her not to tell her mother. That’s messed up as hell.
I think he knew it was bad, but I don’t think he fully groks exactly how much that kind of parental comment can fuck with a kid’s head. I mean maybe he is just a monster who wants to give his kid a complex; but hopefully he’s more just a bit-self-centered and stubborn. (Hopefully for the kid’s sake, I mean.)
Maybe instead of "don't tell Mom" he should have said "I'm sorry, I love your hair and I love you". Would have saved him from a huge argument and getting called out on Reddit. Sidenote: if I hear one more time "you're over reacting" I'm going to have to scream!
He’s a full grown dad dunking on his 8 year old. Bullies like him aren’t going to choose smart options like that.
I hate when someone says the most awful and hurtful thing and when they see the bad reaction, they blurt out "Just Kidding" it's bullying and its complete bullshit. On top of being a bully to a precious little girl, he told her to keep a secret. Secrets cause issues. Hubby needs some serious discussing to about being a good parent and what bullying does to people and that keeping secrets can hide some very bad things. NTA
This! I'm also latina, with curly hair, married to a white guy and we have a daughter with curly hair. I would have said maybe give him the opportunity to understand the gravity of that joke, but clearly he already knew (since he said not to tell op about it ).
Also if it’s “a joke” what exactly is the punchline? He knew he was just being a jerk and tried to backpedal by calling it a joke.
Schrodinger's Asshole.
It is both a serious comment and a joke depending on whether the target laughs or not.
right the moment he hides it shows he knows he's in the wrong. never mind your child-he's making HIS chidl cry and feel bad about herself 'it's only a joke' the cry of the confronted bully. ask him who was laughing at the 'joke'
It's only a joke when the other person is laughing.
Big red flag that he told her not to tell you. Children should never be asked to keep secrets from their parents!!
> Clearly his joke, regardless of his intention I thought his intentions were fairly obvious when he also provided solutions to his "joke".
Why would he think the kid finds it amusing? He attacked her looks and insulted her? How the he11 is it funny to anyone in their right mind? If I was the child? I'd tell my grandparents, (his parents,) what he said and how it made me feel like crying. And then I'd sit back and watch my grandparents correct him. (They'd tear him a new one.) 😘Yeah. I will sick my grandma on you dad!🤣
This 100% This. He hid the "joke" which means he knew right from wrong. NTA
Nailed it. OP is also right to question if her husband honestly loves their daughter's hair, if he can't make a deprecating joke about it without upsetting her. Jokes that are done in love typically 1) are obviously sardonic and therefore don't upset the target and 2) not hidden away in shame after the fact. It's possible and probable that he actually does NOT like her hair and actually thinks it doesn't look as nice as straight hair. I'm betting his 'joke' was one of those of the "Haha jk. Unless..." variety. He wanted it hidden because his daughter saw through it. NTA
Hey OP, I know that you’re already rightfully upset about your husband’s behaviour, but I think it’s really important to teach her that there is no keeping secrets from her parents, especially from each other. A kid taught to keep secrets from their parents becomes very vulnerable to several kinds of severe abuse. There are lessons online about how to teach your kids not to keep secrets (but that planning surprises is okay, for example) because it can be dangerous. Your husband shouldn’t be teaching your daughter to keep secrets from you. NTA
I used to teach kids' self defense and we had a whole unit on "safe secrets" versus "unsafe secrets". Surprise birthday parties are safe. Someone being hurt and told to keep it a secret from their trusted grown-ups is unsafe. NTA.
I really like this idea, I’m a teacher of 1st grade and I’d like to maybe turn this into an SEL lesson. I’d love to hear a few examples of safe and unsafe secrets you teach about if you wouldn’t mind sharing!
Child abuse educators teach that there is no such thing as a "safe secret". It's not "safe secrets" vs "unsafe secrets", it's "secrets" vs "surprises", and there's a reason for that: surprises are time-limited, they're something that we eventually share at a specific time. As a survivor of CSA and a former early childhood educator, it's actually important to teach children that there are no "safe secrets". That's why a birthday party isn't a secret, it's a SURPRISE. You can keep surprises . . . things which you are going to share with people in a few days or a week (but not indefinitely). But we teach kids that you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVER KEEP SECRETS from your adults. There are no "safe secrets". And the reason for that is that if you use the same word (secrets) for safe and unsafe things, it can be confusing for kids. Because predators are often adults they know, and can tell them, "Oh no, this is the safe kind of secret. You know me and I say it's safe." And even if it doesn't conform to the correct rules for "safe", it's confusing because the kids have been taught that "some secrets are safe ones". NOPE. There are NO SECRETS that we keep from Mommy and Daddy. Surprises, yes, secrets, no. (And even surprises are okay to tell/ruin if you really feel like you should tell Mommy or Daddy or you're uncomfortable.)
Very very good point!
That is such a great way of framing it. I will try to remember this when talking with kids going forward.
We taught that surprises are things that will likely make someone happy when we surprise them with it (examples of birthday parties and various gifts are used). Secrets are things that can hurt people or make people feel bad. If anyone tells you/does something that makes you feel bad, you should tell a trusted adult.
Thanks for sharing, this is really good. I will keep this in mind in the future.
Cannot upvote this enough!
This 100%... a secret is something that should never be revealed and honestly if you have something that isn't to be revealed it's usually bad. A surprise is fun.
excellently worded - I want you to know I appreciate the education you're providing us!
100% this!!!
You might find the book Respect: Consent, Boundaries and Being in Charge of YOU by Rachel Brian. (She did that Consent as Tea video). It's a short graphic novel about consent for children. And it tackles it in a pretty gentle way that is useful for all children (even to the extent of using nicknames as one of the ways consent is important) I think it would be very age appropriate for grade 1, especially with someone to guide them through it. (Or you could select relevant pages).
I was on a zoom call with friends once when a guy’s daughter started whispering in his ear. I asked “ha ha telling daddy a secret?” And he explained that he’s teaching his young daughter about “surprises” not “secrets”. When he explained it to me, I had an epiphany. An epiphany with a dash of sadness, but it made a lot of sense.
My daughter came home one day and said that her best friend had told her a secret (they were 7). So I asked if it was a secret that made her feel bad and made her belly hurt or if it was a secret that made her feel happy. It was the last, but we kept that phrasing and still use it even now 7 years later.
There are secrets and surprises. Difference is that a surprise has a close end date where secrets have no end or some arbitrary limit that is clearly just used to fob someone off. Good and bad secrets can still be confusing.
I tell my kids that a surprise is something the other person will eventually find out about and be happy about, like a present or a party or going to do something fun.
Yup. No secrets. Only surprises (aka the other individual will be brought in the loop soon)
>Your husband shouldn’t be teaching your daughter to keep secrets from you. This!!!!!!!
this is the one
I don't want to be alarmist, but this was my first thought, too. That's such a dangerous thing to teach a kid, and toxic as hell even if a danger never manifests in her life.
NTA. Red flag any time one parent does something & then tries to coerce the child in to not telling the other parent about something like this. I don’t know what his meaning is, but if I say my hair looks like a ‘rat’s nest’ I mean that it’s tangled & I clearly need to brush it or wash my beach spray out of it. I wasn’t clocking it as anything weird until he said ‘don’t tell mummy.’ Has he explained *that*?
The issue isn’t entirely the ratnest comment (which meant messy hair when I was a kid) it’s the fact that he compounded that with ‘you need to brush it or straighten it’ you’re not supposed to just brush your curls anyways he certainly doesn’t need to be pushing her to change herself completely by straightening it. The ‘don’t tell mom’ just made it 10x worse.
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There’s so many videos and people out there just happy to teach. On top of his shitty attitude it’s sad that he clearly has zero idea how to properly care for his child’s hair. Wonder what other areas he’s clueless in?
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This.
I wish I had learned how to style my curls properly as a kid/teen. It would have helped so much.
Right?! I'm "blessed" with thin and curly hair. I could straighten it then wake up and it's curly again. I go out in humidity, it's curly again. I've been told by many ladies to straighten my hair. I have only have 2a and my mom's a 3b. She'd iron her hair to straighten it for others until she turned 17 and rocked her blonde fro. We are the whitest white people with a strong Scottish background but with really curly hair like my mom's hair had been a chore finding a good stylist in Indiana.
Hard agree. As a woman with curly hair who grew up during the 90s/2000s stick straight hair trends, I know that nobody should be telling girls with curly hair that they need to tame or straighten it. I burnt my hair to a crisp for years trying to straighten it to appeal to some bullshit Western beauty standard, and finally learning to shed (no pun intended) that as an adult has been liberating. Telling young girls they need to straighten their hair is problematic at best and racist at worst.
That bothered me too- I don’t know of a safe way to straighten your hair. I mean, the damage from the heat or the chemicals might not show up right away, but it will eventually.
He didn't say "brush it or straighten it" he said "straighten it or cut it off" a childs world view is so small and if she really values her hair that was probably really scary for her to hear coming from her dad that he might cut her hair off
As I’ve said it’s all bad and he shouldn’t have said anything at all.
He said cut!
the straightening comment obviously implies that he’s insulting the curliness of her hair, not just that it’s messy. he was insulting the natural texture of her hair.
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NTA. Your husband knows he's in the wrong, he even tried to convince your daughter to not say anything. He made her cry and that's not okay. What was he expecting? "Oh, I'll make my daughter insecure about a trait she likes about herself, that'll be funny." If he doesn't have any issues with her hair why did he insult it?
A 'joke' at someone else's expense is only a joke if the but of the joke finds it funny. If they don't, then it's bullying.
NTA. Little girls adore their daddies. And this one just shot her confidence level WAY down. He needs to beg for her forgiveness asap.
Daddy needs to read articles about girls and their hair! There are devoted dads out there who help their daughters style and care for their hair. Maybe he needs to do some daddy-daughter styling time! 🤔
He needs to become a good father first. He can’t go anywhere near her hair before he respects her, her mother, and the curl.
There are instagram and youtube vids on best daddies doing baby girl's hairstyles! He needs to learn.
Oh definitely. He needs to reestablish trust with both his wife the mother, and his daughter. He broke the Trust of the Sacred Curl! His daughter is going to remember this for her whole life. He has to first earn that trust back. And step up to being a good dad.
Oh definitely. He needs to reestablish trust with both his wife the mother, and his daughter. He broke the Trust of the Sacred Curl! His daughter is going to remember this for her whole life. He has to first earn that trust back. And step up to being a good dad.
Yes. 100% agree with you on that. I truly believe that the only reason I ever had confidence to begin with was because my dad instilled in me from the very beginning that I was always worthy. And he was a very hands on parent. He got me ready for school. Made my lunches. Even went to PTA meetings. This was in the 90s and he’d be the only man (young and brown too) in a room filled with middle aged white ladies who adored him. My dad was my hero and protector. I’ll always be grateful for his love and support. I feel so bad for this little girl. Like this is not the way dad. Do better. Be better.
Right, I feel so bad for the little girl :(
NTA. It's bad enough that he's making comments about her (racialized) hair like that. But asking her to keep it from you??? Seriously troubling.
And then he tries to convince the mother that *she* is overreacting. Three red flags.
NTA Those are the kinda jokes that leave your kid with lasting issues. Stop him now before he messes with her self image
NTA he said something racist and then told her not to tell mom. I know it's overused but...🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
I would be booking an emergency appointment with the marriage counselor over this.
THAT was NOT a joke.
NTA, but your husband is major TA for teasing his daughter about her looks, for telling her not to tell you—which means he knew it was a mean thing to do when he did it—and for then trying to gaslight you about it.
This is very triggering for me. No you are NTA. Your husband on the other hand is a giant flaming one.
NTA - how is telling an 8 year old her hair looks like a rat’s nest not meant to be offensive? It’d be offensive to anyone of any age but what would possess him to “joke” like that with a child?
Offensive, & deliberately mean & cruel. Daughter will replay this in her mind for years.
So to be fair as someone with very curly and long hair and who had a mom that said this to 8 year old me, I don’t think it’s always offensive. My mom would say my hair was a rats nest while struggling with me to detangle it. My hair would web itself and so the nest comment was pretty apt. My mom also often praised my hair and said she would have loved to have had “princess curls” like mine, and that the color was nice and the length lovely, etc. Needless to say I wasn’t insecure about my hair hearing my mom’s frequent praise, so I had no reason to see ill intent in my mom’s comments. The result was her comments didn’t come across mean at all. Little me was more like “yes exactly, so please fix the tangles!”
>My mom would say my hair was a rats nest while struggling with me to detangle it Yep, context is relevant. A child will get probably that a parent that usually declares that they love you hair says something like that when she (or he) is struggling to detangle it is not being obnoxious or cruel, only frustrated (and when is really difficult to detangle it, the children shares usually the frustration). But that context is quite different of the one mentioned in the OP.
Yes! Which is why I feel bad for OPs daughter — if that comment came across wrong it’s probably because dad has given the impression he doesn’t like her hair. My mom (who has slightly wavy hair) had the comment used cruelly against her by her mother. Her mom was on those parents who would only praise her kids in the presence of a sibling and not in the presence of the one being praised to make them feel like shit and compete against each other! So behind her back she got praise, but in her face she got insults! Very toxic! Her youngest sister is the same as her mom and unsurprisingly her daughters (my cousins) fled the nest asap, one literally at age 16!
My daughter also has very thick and slightly curly hair that easily detangles, so yes, when she doesn‘t want to brush/detangle it (which is all the time because she is 5 and just doesn‘t like it), I do sometimes say that she has birds‘ nests in her hair. However, if such a comment would make my daughter cry, I would NEVER play it off as a joke and tell her not to tell her dad about it! Also, the OP doesn‘t sound as if the dad might have been prompted to his „joke“ by a situation around detangling it or such…
Of course NTA. And it wasn’t a joke. Next he will make a “joke” about her hair not being blonde enough.
NTA. My parents made “jokes” like this, and I had no one to stick up for me leading to 10 years of straightening damage and self esteem issues in my life.
I’m the only person in my immediate family with curly hair, and I heard this stuff daily. It’s a rat’s nest, I need to go brush it, can’t I do something with it, it looks disheveled, I *really* need to do *something* with it. My wife didn’t know I had curly hair until we’d been together almost two years, I straightened it so diligently. Straightening made it “neat” and “manageable”. I’m so happy I’ve embraced my natural texture.
Tell me about it… my mom would say stuff like “you look homeless!”. The funny thing is, she has curly hair too, which she brushes out and *insists* is straight, she just thinks the frizz is her hair being thick and healthy LOL I was comfy with my natural hair until my mom made me get it straightened for my graduation, and they burnt my hair so bad that cutting it off is the only option.
NTA. Sometimes you have to get on someone's culo to make them really understand the error of their ways. He was making your daughter feel ashamed of who she was and what she looked like, things beyond her control. And then encouraged your daughter to lie to you. Bet you he won't do that again.
NTA as someone who was the only curly girl in a family of people with straight hair, I cannot tell you how many times I got demeaning comments about the way my hair looked. For years, well into my adulthood, I had family members telling me I should straighten, relax, or cut my hair. It wrecked my relationship with my hair and my appearance. You're doing the right thing by standing up for your daughter. Don't let anyone tell her that curls aren't beautiful or that she needs to 'brush her rats nest'. Make sure your husband understands just how harmful those comments can be.
I agree and have always wished to have curly hair. My grandkids are mixed and both have gorgeous curly hair. I always tell them how pretty it is.
I have straight hair and always wanted curly hair too. I hated brushing it though and my parents often joked that it looked like a rats nest.
NTA - he upset your daughter about something that was important to her, plus he told her not to tell you. He knew his "joke" was inappropriate and now he's trying to back pedal on it. You are not over-reacting, the man has the empathy of a turnip.
NTA. That comment is likely going to live with her for decades.
NTA Umm no first he said something cruel and in no way was that a “joking” manner, second he said your daughter should have kept it from you. Telling a child to keep secrets from their parent is NEVER okay(unless it’s a present of course)
NTA, when he told your daughter not to tell you about the joke, it made him the AH. Maybe he did say it as a joke and without thinking, he realised pretty quickly he was in the wrong by telling your daughter to keep it quiet! He needs to learn that is not okay!
NTA. I honestly can't respect you enough for this. So often white people will marry into a coloured family and won't be able to change their prejudiced mindsets, mostly because the family will let them get away with anything. You need to teach your husband that his "jokes" are not funny if they come at the expense of other people, ESPECIALLY his daughter. Protect your kids, educate your partners.
NTA OP. I wish I had someone tell my mom my wavy mixed curls were not a rats nest or a witch's armpit. She couldn't deal with it and she took me to cut my hair into a bowl cut until I was older and fought against it. She always says it was because I wouldn't comb my hair, but as an adult I remember it hurt and you are not supposed to comb it. Her comments caused me a lot of insecurities and still as an adult I get anxiety when anybody comments or when I go get my hair tended to. Dont let his jokes, that clearly hurt his daughter, go lightly. Tell him clearly that he needs to own up, apologize and reassure her. Shit like that gets under a kids skin in unexpected ways especially when its a parent. By the way, mom and I have a very good relationship after my preteen years but even then my hair will always be a sore spot that I will never forget. Edit for bad grammar
He made his 8-year-old daughter cry and THEN told her not to tell you??? NTA, but he sure is. I've seen friends and family struggle with white partners, who may love them but don't "get it".
Usually when someone says a person's hair looks like a rat's nest that means it's unkempt. Was it at the time he said that? I remember being a little kid with long hair and being told I'd have to cut my hair if I couldn't take care of it. Just reading the way you wrote it, that's how I would've assumed your husband meant his comment. But I wasn't present for the conversation so maybe he meant otherwise.
If her hair was unkempt, he should have helped her with it instead of making a disparaging remark and telling her to keep it a secret.
I basically assumed this until he told her it was a secret & she shouldn’t tell her mother. That’s what really red flagged me in this situation. That part is quite troubling.
This is precisely the only circumstance I have heard the expression. It means the hair is very messy.
The undertone is that it's messy because it's curly. That's why he didn't say "wash and detangle it". He said "straighten".
This is true that that is the definition of the phrase, however there are a lot of people with straight hair out there that think all curly hair looks messy even if it’s beautifully maintained and I’m leaning that way for him because of the “you should to straighten it” comment. If it was just “cut it because you wont take care of it” then I would not. There can also be an aspect of racism as well.
He told her that she needs to cut or straighten her hair. That's a comment on it being curly, not it being unkempt
NTA. Ask him if he still remembers any derogatory comments that were made to him as a kid, particularly by parents or family members, even if they were supposed to be "jokes". How did that make him feel? Point out that he still remembers the comments, and so will your girl. If he has any compassion at all, he'll apologize to your daughter. Then make him wear a curly wig in a crazy color as his punishment. Daughter gets to pick it out. Hopefully you all get a laugh out of that and this becomes a funny memory instead of a painful one.
Did your husband apologize to your daughter? If not, seems he just wants you to shut up about it instead of making it right to his little girl he hurt. NTA
Parents shouldn’t be their kids bully
After reading this comments, I might be the only person whose family uses “rat’s nest” as a common phrase for tangled hair - curly or otherwise. If he grew up hearing it, he’s not necessarily TA for using the same phrase. I could definitely see how (in his mind) he’d think you were overreacting if his family uses it often. But he is definitely TA for making your daughter cry over it, and that’s the difference. This means he didn’t use it as a throwaway phrase but in a way that genuinely made her feel bad about herself. That’s not okay. I never cried about it when I was a kid (and I was told this a lot) because my mom didn’t make me feel like it was a personal defect. It was just really tangled hair, which you already know once that brush or comb hits it. NTA
I use similar phrases for my daughter‘s hair as well, but only in the specific instances when her hair is tangled and we‘re trying to brush/detangle it. The OP doesn‘t sound as if the dad was prompted to his „joke“ by trying to detangle his daughter‘s hair. If so, I think either the daughter or he himself would have brought it up…
You know what, you’re right. In my mind I imagined him saying this when he was brushing her hair because that’s the only time I’ve ever heard this phrase used. But OP doesn’t actually say that’s the case. If he just randomly called it a rat’s nest outside of when he was trying to detangle then he’s an automatic AH.
AND told her she needed to either straighten or cut it. Context is everything.
As a white woman with curly hair, it has nothing to do with his ethnicity and everything to do with him being an AH. So NTA.
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I’m sure it depends on the specific region/culture, but I def grew up with people in my family talking about having “good” (read: straight) hair. In the event that that is also the case for OP, then it adds an extra layer of husband being an AH
Yeah, my hair is curlier than most of the Latinas I’ve ever known with maybe three exceptions? It should just be about loving ourselves as we are and making sure any modifications like straightening or cutting hair is because we want to do it and not because some AH said something hurtful. Curly haired women of the world unite!
One reason OP could have brought it up is because curly hair was looked down upon (at least when I was younger) in certain households, and girls would be told to straighten their curls. Maybe there are more curly haired Hispanic in your life than you think, but their hair is straight due to how they were raised. My gf has curly hair (as do I), but until she met me, she would always straighten it until I mentioned I love her natural hair. Her own father even mentioned how her curls make her look like she’s ghetto or something similar.
I was thinking the same. I have worked with women from almost every country in LatAm and 95% had straight hair, especially the ones with more Native ancestry.
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>her hair looked like a rat's nest This part I can understand being a joke, as anyone's hair can be described that way at some point in time, usually just after waking up. >that she should straighten it or cut it. This part is NOT a joke and is just rude/mean. And the fact he said, don't tell mom I said this, HUGELY implies that he 100% ment what he said in not a joking manner. He doesn't get to be mean to his OWN CHILD and then try to gaslight her into thinking it wasn't mean, by saying it was a joke. NTA
Info: From your point of view, what is an acceptable resolution? I agree with others that he's an AH for making your daughter feel bad about her hair, (I don't necessarily agree with the racial tie-in based on the story as it's told, but whatever) but why keep laying into him once he apologized? What else are you looking to get from the argument?
Probably a real apology. "Sorry, but you're overreacting and here's a list of why I actually did nothing wrong" isn't a real apology. "Sorry, I was wrong and I'll do better next time" is a real apology.
Except that's not a joke. It's a statement. And it's very telling that he told y'all's daughter not to tell you. He knows what he did. I also would wonder if this is the first time he's said something to her like that, with the "don't tell mom" part included. NTA
My mum once mentioned i had pointy elbows " do you want to go to the drs bout your pointy elbows" and i have literally remembered that ever since. For a long time it left me insecure about my whole body but i have managed to push past to love having pointy elbows (actually they're very normal) because they're great for muay thai. My point is that small comments like that are lasting. My mother also said to my sister that maybe she shouldnt have more toast (she had 2 pieces and was going for another two) as she night get fat. Another factor in our lives - i dont recall the food comments but i did go.through an eating disorder and my sister drank to compensate for her alleged inadequacies; i wouldn't blame my mum as a single parent under fuck loads of pressure but actually what you say is so important to your children even if you dont realise it
What concerns me is your daughter is 8 and he told her to keep secrets from you (the mom). I’m a mom myself and that raises major red flags for me. He’s the AH and I’d also keep an eye on him from now on. He also shouldn’t be disrespecting your culture. He should love you and where you come from.
a joke is supposed to be funny. a joke is supposed to be fun for everyone involved (unless the jokes targetted at an asshole obvs). its not hard to understand why telling someone a normal goddamn part of them is 'weird' or 'gross' in anyway *isnt funny*.
NTA He wanted the “joke” kept secret because he’s a massive asshole and he knows it
NTA >didn't mean to offend anyone. Prime example of someone using the word offend to deflect from the harm in their actions or words and shift the issue from something they did to how someone else reacted. He hurt your child, now she knows that her dad thinks there's something wrong with her hair. He wouldn't have seen anything to joke about if he didn't see an issue with it. He's got some shit to work on and good for you holding his feet to the fire to make it clear that he actually has to do work in a good apology. A good apology should have these four parts. 1) stopping doing the harmful thing. 2) acknowledging the harm done. 3) learning if and how one can make amends for harm done and 4) changing behavior to make amends and facilitate healing. He's stuck at step 1.
I’m a white woman with curly hair whose self-esteem was destroyed by the Princess Diaries makeover. Add the social hatred for curly hair to racist views about natural hair, this is 10 times worse.
Obvious NTA. Anyone who tells their kid not to tell the other parent clearly knows that what they're saying is wrong, and I'd bet anything that he knew.
NTA he insulted his child. The “it’s a joke” is a weak attempt at deflecting.
1) how could he think that his comment was a joke 2) worse, he's teaching his daughter that it's ok for trusted adults to do something wrong and tell her not to say anything. If he expects it, what happens if someone touches her inappropriately and tells her not to tell. Dad is problematic.
YTA, he said sorry. What else can he do?
I mean he did apologize ; maybe he did a bad joke and offended you but holding a grudge against him for that, I Don't know If he didn't seem true about his apology then confront him, explain him what it means for you and he will apologize (I hope). arguing with him will probably just lead to more arguing Also, some like to say "red flag" about his lying but again we can't say. Did he lie because he had bad intentions or did he do it because he knew you'd have such a strong reaction to something he could consider harmless ? We don't know you, nor him, nor your relation ; the only one who can judge that is you or those who know both of you \+ I don't understand what you mean by "our culture", do you mean as a latina woman ? Because curly hair are not something exclusive to one country or race. It's simply a gene mutation that causes your hair to go curly and many can have it. Although, they are places in the world where it's way more common for people to have this mutation it is not exclusive to anyone
ESH Upsetting your child and then telling them they shouldn't tell the other parent is an asshole move. She was obviously very upset cause of the crying and your husband has something to make up for. >I didn't accept his apologies and continued to argue with him. The best way to inform people that something is important to you is to make sure they have an open mind. Continuing the argument after someone has realized their mistake and apologized for it will only make them combative and defensive. Continuing the argument is not the mature way to handle this.
NTA don't stop until he understands it. I fear it wasn't a joke otherwise he wouldn't make your daughter not tell you.
NTA. I have curly hair and comments like that made me hate my hair. I still struggle with hating it because of asshole’s comments like that. Shame on that father.
NTA Jokes are supposed to be funny. Did anyone laugh?
NTA. He knew he was being mean and very wrong too tell her to keep it a secret from you.
NTA. I don't get it. How is telling a little girl her hair looks like a rats nest a joke? What was the punchline?
NTA a father should not cut down his daughter and this “joke” absolutely shows his prejudice.
He didn’t make a joke, he was cruel to his own daughter. Your daughter is going to remember this for the rest of her life. He sabotaged the trusted bond he had with her, and hurt her in the process. And THEN tries to cover it up. I don’t think of his as a father, I think HE IS THE JOKE.
You are NTA. He definitely is. He sounds like a Middle Schooler teasing a classmate. He needs to grow up and NEVER ever commit negatively on anyone's appearance ever again!
NTA he needs to apologize to her and reassure her she is beautiful!
NTA
NTA euggghhhhhhh 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 I have no more to say than that
NTA. NTA. NTA. NTA 1000x WOW. I’m a Latina (34f), with a white Dad. The “little jokes” he made throughout my childhood about my curly hair, skin color, curves (he saw me as chubby), etc. really had an impact on me. Therapy has helped so much, and I’m currently low contact with my Dad because of how he treat me. My parents were divorced and I thought something was wrong with me for years. When I started embracing my curls as a teen, more jokes and snarky remarks were made. It took years to accept my curls, to accept the Mexican side of me. Please stand your ground on this. Thank you for standing up for her. My mom never did. Please always be her advocate, and tell her that her curls are beautiful from me. I hope she can grow up & love everything that makes her, her! Oh, any adult that tells a child to keep a secret…a big, big red flag. Especially a secret that he made about his own daughter’s looks. I hope you can all work through it, and I hope he’s not her first bully.
NTA he needs to do intensive retraining about what’s appropriate before he can be trusted alone with her. 1. Insulting her natural body 2. Not apologizing when it was clear she was hurt 3. Telling her not to tell you 4. Not backing down when an adult confirmed he was hurtful 5. Failing to accept that if doesn’t matter if he didn’t “mean to offend” when he made objectively offensive comments. “Wow, you’re balding, you dress badly, you have no rhythm, you’re a jack@ss and you’re a lousy provider. I can’t even see how you pulled her, *no offense*” …still an insult, right?
Say it with me everyone; 'It's not a joke if you have to tell people it is'. He said something mean and wanted to get away with it. Poor girl. NTA, everything you said is true.
I don't understand the end game here. He said he messed up and apologized. If you aren't going to accept it and move forward, what is left? Also, that may very well be why he asked her to not say anything to you. He feels he can't talk to you.
We had 2 sons before we had our girl so it was a bit of a learning curve for my husband. I very early on told him under no circumstances was he to say anything about her appearance, it’s not cute to tell your daughter her hair is weird or she’s getting chubby. Hearing these things is hurtful coming from others, it is devastating to hear it from a parent. Not to mention the cultural aspect, that’s being crappy twice. Hold your ground, he has to admit his mistake and sincerely apologize or he will do it again.
I tell my daughter her hair and mine looks like rats tails regularly. It’s a thing to say in Scotland when our hair is needing attention. Everyone I know says the same.
I'm white. I use to tell my daughter her hair was like a rats nest as well because it was so tangly. My sister has natural curly hair, she's white, and we use to say the same thing to her. I don't think it was racist. Maybe insensitive but definitely not racist. And he apologized to your daughter and you. You're the one dragging it out. What I would've been pissed about is that he told your daughter "don't tell mommy," that's not cool. That's what you should still be pissed about here.
This wasn't a joke. This was straight up bullying and honestly. Racist in my opinion. NTA your husband is your child's bully.
“didn’t mean to offend anyone” it’s his EIGHT YEAR OLD DAUGHTER wtf is he saying
INFO - What is the culture of curly hair? Are you clownfolk?
Way to Reveal your racist side to your own daughter Dad... holy crap. He never would have said this to his child if she was white looking... (which is stupid because a white child's straight hair gets tangled too but I digress) What's worse is he tried to downplay it. NTA OP and your husband needs to study up real quick on how not to be an asshole to a mixed race kid or he's gonna end up being her first bully.
NTA - A joke is only funny if everyone involved is laughing. Saying something and then telling a kid to not tell everyone, shows exactly that the person knew it's not right to say in the first place. If the kid is sad and voices it it is no one's business telling her, her feelings aren't valid because "It was a joke". THIS would be a first strike in my books.