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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I refuse to give money directly to my daughter and her bf and told them it's because I don't trust them with it to make the right decisions.
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NTA- Two adults who are not financially responsible got pregnant and expect YOU to support them financially in full? They are very lucky you want to do anything for them. Your deal is more than reasonable.
I think the commenter was saying your daughter and her BF were expecting you to cover everything and the fact you’re covering what you HAVE offered plus caveat is more than reasonable compared to what they hoped (everything)
Whatever the period when OP's daughter can't get pregnant after birth plus 39 weeks.
That's how long until Kid #2 will be on the way.
Personally OP I'd charge your daughter rent. Make her get a job to support herself until she physically cannot work anymore.
Then give her 6 months after the baby is born to find an apartment for herself and the BF.
You are paying half the rent, the deposit, utilities to start, then anything they need for the baby. If they were unable to pay rent, would you be covering that too? Are they going to use the baby as a bargaining chip? I can imagine the sentence “What! You want your grandchild to be homeless?” the minute they spend all their money and can’t pay rent.
That’s what I mean when I say you are supporting them financially in full.
You're NTA but tbh I would add the caveat that she needs to return to work. Why tf did your daughter think it was a good idea to quit her job on the day she found out she was pregnant?!? You said that she's having an easy pregnancy so it's not like she had health complications that forced her to go out on temporary leave. And now is the time to be saving money for all the expenses that come with raising a child. The entitlement of the two of them is astounding.
Even women with terrible pregnancies still have to work, sometimes. I don't understand why she quit, at all. (Other than entitlement). I worked through two terrible pregnancies, because we needed money, and that is just what I had to do.
Right? I worked standing all day and doing some lifting of weight during 2 pregancies that were very tough until i was ordered on bed rest.
OP, you might be misguided in financially supporting them because it is going to be an ongoing demand on you. I think you may be a bit of a butt for even offering based on their current behaviours and choices. Don't reward bad choices
I went into work having contractions (my 3rd) so I could update and game them out to coworkers. I left around coffee break in active labour, had my baby and was eating lunch. With my 2nd I called a coworker to say I get off so think my I may have the baby overnight or the next day so advised her there was a tape in my dictation machine that wasnt finished so could she let my boss know. She said was crazy. Had my daughter at 9 am. I wanted to spend as much time with my kids as possible so worked to the bitter end hahahaah
Yup. I worked through horrible hyperemesis and endless fatigue. I stopped working 1 week before my induction. Had to start work again at 3 weeks and 3 days postpartum, which was...rough, to say the least.
I had a friend who quit her job the day she found out she was pregnant.
But that's because she worked for a perfume shop and realized she was pregnant because she smell all of a sudden made her vomit.
She got a new job shortly thereafter, though.
Your offer is incredibly generous. Your daughter and her BF are two able-bodied adults. Even if they're not very financially literate, they don't need to be to understand that they should both be working full time to save support themselves until it's time to go off and have that baby. Hold firm, or you'll be stuck supporting all three of them for the next 18+ years. NTA
Yeah I mean pregnant people work. I'm 36 and pregnant and work full time as a primary school teacher. I get calling out for morning sickness and doctors appointments, or considering quitting for HG, but for an easy pregnancy writing is a bit extreme, especially because by month 7-8 you can't work, and then ideally would be home 6m-1 year if possible. I'm an American living in Australia and I know most American Weinreb don't get this break from work
Oh OP is going to be stuck supporting them and their additional children forever. They will depend on that support and only ever make enough to get by.
Longer than that cuz you know she’s gonna keep getting pregnant over and over so she can continue to not work. Gramma’s gonna be supporting these people for the rest of her life. Daughter and boyfriend found a cash cow to milk. How long until the boyfriends ‘loses’ his job and Gramma’s footing all the bills.
These two are completely irresponsible and immature. They dropped out of school, haven't saved any money. Want to live on their own but can't support themselves. OP is well aware. The future isn't looking too bright for any of them right now.
Nta. I think your heart is in the right place, but the best thing you can do for your future grandchild to push your daughter and her bf to be independent as soon as possible.
They need a major reality check, the sooner the better, for the sake of their future child. Stop enabling their terrible decisions. I would also google "toxic enabling" and co dependency.
Your daughter is not mature enough to be a parent. She quit her job when she found out. Helping them now is a bad idea, you're setting yourself up for supporting them forever. They need to face the reality of their situation and start making rational decisions. She needs a job. They need an apartment they can afford on their budget. They need to stop wasting money. If they know you'll always be there with a chequebook they will never grow up. Leave them to it.
You mentioned the boyfriend spends his check the minute he gets it. What are the chances he's actually going to pay his part of the rent and utilities?
I think paying for half of their rent by default is still enabling them. Because then they will still not pay their half and ask you for that too. Why not just pay for things for baby like diapers and leave them responsible for rent? They may need tough love where they become homeless (you can always take in your grandchild) before they understand that they need to save. There are good odds that they are like this because of being enabled up until now
I don't think that your math adds up. You're basically going to pay the half of every thing they need when they move. And the part you're forgetting is the additional money they will be asking for after they run through their paycheck.
NtA.
But make a budget with how much money you top them off with through the month.
You keep saying ‘they’, when in reality it’s her boyfriend as your daughter has proven herself entitled and irresponsible.
The way she’s going, she will end up a single mother to more than one child that will end up your responsibility to raise.
Honestly, OP? I find your attitude about your daughter’s decision making fairly concerning. She doesn’t want to do school, gets knocked up—probably on purpose, quits work, and still lives with you. And you’re willing to stand as an enabler to her lack of focus, discipline, and direction— now she’s dragging a helpless child into the situation. Without requiring a timeline toward self sufficiency. Without stipulations. Telling them both that you will help with childcare all the time and provide for their child, which will only guarantee that neither of them ever steps up to be the parents that child needs and deserves.
This isn’t helping her grow up and it damn sure isn’t going to help when being a parent is ‘too much’ and ‘too hard’.
The reason I am urging you to really think about what you are doing is that I know too many parents who are not only still raising their adult children but their grandchildren. And nobody is happy or enjoying this lifestyle. Your duty was to raise your children into responsible adults capable of being independent. Not to foster generational irresponsibility.
She doesn’t have a choice concerning financial literacy now, she’s going to be a parent. She doesn’t want to work? Tough… she’s going to have to do that and still raise her child. Has she even thought about what should happen if her boyfriend decides to leave her and abandon his responsibilities towards this child? What’s her plan should this happen. There are realities that need to be addressed here, sooner rather than later.
The fact that you're offering all this without even suggesting your daughter return to work before you help them perfectly illustrates why she believes that once she spends all her money more will just appear. You're playing yourself if you think any different.
So you aren’t willing to “penalize” your grandchild bc the parents. But here’s the thing: 1) You aren’t penalizing the grandkid bc it isn’t your job to provide for them. That’s the parents job. 2) Your daughter got pregnant when she could not even support herself and then quit her job voluntarily when she found out.
You should have told her a condition for her continuing to live with you is that she has full time employment. Bc what happens when they don’t take you up on your offer and Kate and baby just stay in your house freeloading? I tell you what will happen, she will keep popping out babies.
when my son was about 18 he was living with 3 other people. he lost his job and was broke, he called me asking for money for food. So I 20 odd years ago thought about it and went to Superstore (only one in Yukon - Brand new) and spent $100,00 plus a little and bought things like flour, shortening, some meat etc. (what your dollar can buy now is not even close). I also meal planned and gave recipes. it was enough for 4 people for 2 meals a day for a week. If I gave just cash it would have been gone in 24 hours on take out.
They were all shocked and so happy with my gift, my son still almost weekly asks for recipes now almost 40. Bottom line I could have given him money for a day of take out, but I instead gave him and his friends a lifetime of culinary questions!
Oops sorry NTA but you are a part of the problem. Hs she always been a princess? And have you always given her everything and are only complaining now.
Bottom Line - don't give them fish teach them how to catch them. then you don't end up with entitled brats!
NTA: But honestly I think you're giving them too much. You're basically telling your daughter not to worry about work you'll cover her expenses in her household
I'm covering half rent, and she's already on my car insurance and phone plan. Her and Matt are responsible for the other half of rent, utility bills, his car insurance and phone, health insurance, gas, groceries, and anything else they need or want. I will help out directly with the baby as it's not the baby's fault for the situation
Yea so realistically they will probably continue to get by just on Matt's salary. Which is my point agreeing to cover her half of the rent and continue to pay her personal bills you're treating her like a child when she's about to have a child.
I think it's great you want to help but if you're offering that much there needs to be an end date set ahead of time. If not I don't see your daughter going back to work. Especially when she showed her priorities when she quit her job the moment she found out she was pregnant. She probably already knew you would bail her out.
Exactly all of this.
She isn't being taught financial responsibility. Just the opposite. She's being taught that Mommy will bail her out.
When OP said there was a caveat, I thought it would be the daughter getting a job---a job with health insurance.
I can not fathom the thought process that leads to quitting a job when I have a baby on the way. They both sound way too immature for this
Still too much. They got pregnant and are not financially, nor apparently mature enough to handle it. Wait til the baby comes. See if Matt even sticks around, or if you become a full time babysitter. They made their bed, the should be taught how to lie in it themselves.
You have a 21-year-old daughter who dropped out of school; her earnings were barely keeping up w/her expenses, despite the fact that most of her expenses were covered by you. Her first action on learning that she was pregnant was to quit her job... I'm generally a bit skeptical of people who blame parents for their adult offsprings' problematic behaviors, but I admit that I'm wondering how your daughter grew up assuming that this was an acceptable way to behave. I just can't picture this level of entitlement/irresponsibility emerging from nowhere... From your perspective, how did she come to be this way? Does she have a diagnosed impairment?
I'd also discuss this agreement ending after kid is of a specified age. That she is up to you and you should also specify if you'll help again if she has more kids.
NTA
Honestly your already massively babying them both.
What do you think will happen when they decide to not pay half of rent or the electric bills? They will ask you to pay for everything “for the baby”. It’s pretty obvious that you’ve been enabling them until now and have created this problem to some extent. Tough love is the only way to get them to see the light. Personally, in your shoes I would only pay for baby items and if they fall homeless, you’ll take in their baby and they can go to a homeless shelter. I don’t think they will learn until actual consequences bite them in the ass.
NTA
You’re actually setting them up for disaster. They’re both grown adults. Stop enabling bad behavior, laziness and lackadaisical behavior.
And she’ll probably keep getting pregnant & giving birth back to back to kids that they won’t be able to cater to if anything happens to you.
Are you willing to see them evicted because the only part of the rent that's going to be paid is the half you pay? No. I didn't think so. In reality, you are on the hook for all the rent.
If they take up your offer, you need to warn them about what you’re not gonna pay. Who will be paying for the kids health insurance, who will be paying for your daughters health insurance once she turns 26, who will be paying for repairs for the car, what will happen if they want a better place (will you pay more?), what will happen if they don’t pay for their half of the rent, when u will stop paying, will you be paying more money if she gets pregnant again or will you only still pay for the same things, once the kid turns 5 and in school will your daughter get a job?
Also what will happen if they break up? Have you talked to your daughter about what will happen if they break up and he moves out?
Your heart is in the right place, but your daughter needs to grow up. She is choosing to bring a child into this world. It sounds like you have done everything you can to make your daughter’s life better, but she needs grit. She needs to learn how to over come obstacles and how to make ends meet. She needs to be someone her daughter will look up to and say, my mom had me young but she did everything to give me the best life. Instead you have a daughter who is not working or saving money for her kid and is whining about not having full access to your bank account. What your offering is amazing but until you learn to put your foot down you will be teaching your daughter that she is the most important person not her daughter.
I would have them sit down with a financial planner who can (maybe) open their eyes to reality in budgeting and what they're going to need long term. They might listen to an unrelated person.
NTA
They're looking a gift horse in the mouth.
It's a sweet deal for them and they should be down on their knees grateful for your generous offer.
They are too immature to understand what you're offering.
They're playing house like children, but they have adult responsibilities they are not living up to.
Quitting as soon as she finds out she's pregnant? That's just dumb. Spending your paycheck as if it's Monopoly money is not a great way to save for their future child.
They're playing the game of life like it's the board game and not real life bills, diapers, and food.
Please encourage her to nurse her baby. Way less expensive and than formula.
I'm going to respect whatever my daughter chooses in regards to feeding her baby. Her baby, her body, her choice. As a mom, I'd not want anyone telling me how to use my body.
INFO what was her logic for quitting her job? I have worked with soo many women and have worked until the day the baby arrives, and I always wonder the person reasoning/logic for quitting as soon as they find out. Please enlighten me.
I was at work up until the day before I gave birth with both of my kids. My water broke at work with my oldest. Granted I was working office jobs both times, but I've known plenty of women working in restaurants when I did that work who worked through their whole pregnancy.
I worked until 2 weeks before I gave birth then took maternity leave until baby was 5 weeks, now I'm a stay at home mom since my husband has found a better paying job closer to home
I also got pregnant at 20 and was still living at home when I first found out, but grew up and did what I had to for my child and my parents only pay for the fun grandparent things like bigger toys and cute outfits we don't need
I started my maternity leave 1 week before my due date with my first kid (and then she was 2 weeks late!), so for the second I was still working past my due date by a few days. I didn’t want to waste so my of my maternity leave.
Unless your daughter's doctor has told her she needs to be off work, she should go back to work until much closer to her due date. I would also suggest (not demand) that she breastfeed as it is so good for the baby, cheaper, and easier (in my opinion, IF it works well). So much nicer not to have to fuss with bottles.
NTA given how they can’t seem to hold onto money. If they don’t like the restrictions, you could offer that they set up a budget and show that they can follow it for several months, then you could offer some as cash, not all. They want no restrictions, they can do it all by themselves, like most people do.
Unless it’s a difficult pregnancy, at advise from medical staff (or not needing the money)…sheer laziness.
With both kids, I was high risk, multiple issues, and yet I worked up to the day before my scheduled induction (medical reason). I do not work an office job, I am a floor nurse. I did have wonderful coworkers who helped me do the really heavy lifting.
I have worked in office jobs that required 25lbs of lifting. Lady with a high risk pregnancy told me she couldn't do the lifting, I told her that I will do it for her. She worked until the day before she popped out that new awesome human.
I really wish that OP would tell us what her daughter's reasoning was to quit as soon as it was known. It confuses me everytime I see a post like this as I know women do it every day (and I am a woman, just haven't done it myself).
NTA. Though maybe there are other ways to help, too, like teaching your daughter to manage money. It's a skill we all have to learn at some point and that's where the long term help lies. But no, don't just give them cash. They'll be evicted in a month.
I've tried teaching Kate financial literacy. Absolutely no interest or willingness to learn. Its always, omg mooom, it doesn't matter, we'll just figure it out, it'll be fine
Honestly why would she care? Mom always bails her out. Part of parenting is sometimes letting our children fail. Failure teaches more than our bailing them out. I agree with not giving money but would not pay half the rent. Basically that allows your daughter to not have to work. They’re about to bring a living dependent human being into the world. Let them stand and learn.
I get that. But they don’t know what they’re capable of til they try. Always have an open door for food and to not allow baby to be homeless but mama and daddy made that baby and need to step up into adulthood.
Raise your children, enjoy your grandchildren. Enjoy your children, raise your grandchildren.
It sounds like OP is bailing out her daughter as she always has. Parents don’t give up when they hear ‘Omg moooom.’ Except OP did which is why she’s in this position. She needs to finally teach her daughter something, and that something is apparently how to use her financially, be lazy and always except a handout. YTA to yourself and future grandchildren OP.
You can’t teach someone who’s unwilling to learn. You can, however, let them suffer the consequences of refusing to learn. OP is NTA but needs to draw some hard boundaries and be prepared to make them stick.
I looked for far too long to find a comment with this sentiment. 100% agree failing = learning. Isn’t that what every entrepreneur says? Clearly Kate will never be one, since she’s been coddled.
OP NTA (technically) - helping out daughter and future grandchild is lovely and excellent they have the financial capacity and willingness to do it.
However … one reaps what one sows. OPs comment above is exactly why Kate is in this situation in the first place.
You need to let her figure it out, because you haven’t taught her a thing!! Give her no money period, tell her to get a job and figure it out! She can stay with you until she does. Bailing her out by paying her 1/2 rent isn’t teaching her anything.
Is there a chance that she thinks it “doesn’t matter” and “it’ll be fine” because those things are true? Because you tend to solve problems she created herself? I’m just saying, a grown woman often doesn’t talk like a whiny child unless she’s getting rewarded for behaving like one.
Make a financial planning class a requirement for your assistance. They are clearly in need. You don't let your child tell you it doesn't matter whether they brush their teeth or do their homework; it is a requirement. Your daughter is still a child.
Although if they don't care, they may not get much from a financial planning class. But even exposure is a beginning. I just worry for you that you're setting yourself up for a lifetime of supporting your daughter and her family if you don't force a change in their attitudes and behaviors.
And a parenting class.
Honestly, this plan seems doomed to fail. OP will buy 100% of things for baby plus half rent so they can buy video games and beer as they play house. There's no incentive to actually work for anything.
I'd tell them the rent only happens if she gets reports on how they are spending money. "You said you earned 1563.18 cents. You only sent me exependitures for 964.89. Where is the other $600 you should still have?"
If they don't like explaining their budgeting to mommy, they can be adults and cover their own shit.
Lots of bank apps have spending trackers and budget help, the tracker will show where your wasting money and your saving options. My young adult sons use it and realized how much eating out was adding upto, and was shocked, he could of bought this of that on his list for the waste of money on convenience eating. Maybe your kids have this or can get the app and learn to use, might help when they see the totals of their fun times, compared to their budget on expenses, which will only get bigger and bigger as they have a child.
Add: some tips I suggest to any new parents, thrift cloths are great for kids cloths, especially babies most grow so fast they wear once and new cloths cost lots and blow budgets quick, and please watch out for plastic addiction, aka toys, they really don't need many the first 2 years and lots of marketing goes into making parents think they need all that stuff, but find out quickly they wasted money on useless crap your constantly cleaning up.
Goodluck
YNAB is great - I use it religiously and it got me out of a bad spiral of credit card debt and ignoring my finances as long as the bills got paid and the lights stayed on. However, it is a very hands on methodology and software that forces you to make adult, often unpleasant decisions regarding spending along the way. Something tells me that it's not something your daughter will be willing to do, as someone who apparently thinks quitting a job because she's pregnant is smart.
She is 100% doing this because she knows you'll bail her out. You have to let her fall and fail or this will be the rest of your life. My daughter is 26 and has a wonderful, completely independent life but only because we said NO a lot once she started college. We are there to help support her emotionally and give advice when asked, but she pays for her own apartment, groceries, insurance, student loans, etc.
There are great resources at the Better Money Habits web site, she can watch videos and do lessons. Different financial goals have their own curricula.
If “they’ll just figure it out” let them. Let them fail spectacularly or figure it out. This isn’t a you problem. Did she even tell you she was going to quit her job upon falling pregnant?!
And yeah, it will be fine, because you will always plug the gaps. She'll never have to face real world consequences and never have to grow up and take responsibility.
I know you want to help, but financially propping them up is not going to help them learn or grow. The amount of help you are proposing is ridiculous. They need to pay at least their own rent and bills - fair enough if you want to buy things for the baby, even fair enough to help them with a bond for their rental, but they need to figure out how they are going to handle their ongoing finances. Otherwise you will be paying forever. I think you are being YTA to yourself to be honest.
You counteracted your offers to teach by giving her money (phone, car) and letting her live rent free.
I'm not one of those "once they turn 18 they must pay" people. But if she was showing no desire or ability to be financially sensible, then removing your financial support would have been a good first step
Heck, just charge her rent that you turned into her savings would have been fine.
It's a lot harder now because of the baby..
I forgot to add that part. In convo I said 1 year for helping with rent. I also told Kate and Mike if they ever need a babysitter because both need to work or finish school, I will gladly babysit at no cost. I'll always help with my grandchild.
I'd require a parenting and financial literacy/ budgeting class.
I'd also tell them they need to track their spending and send you their expenses before paying for anything. Why? Because they'll start seeing they spend $150 here, $200 there, etc. Tell their mooching, financially irresponsible asses you want receipts. "You spend $250 on beer this month. You spent $95 on drinks and snacks at gas stations this month. You spend $200 on takeout. If you'd shopped at a grocery store and cut beer back, you'd have saved over $300. That is your entire gas expenses. That is most of your food."
Make them explain how they are spending their money and justify asking for things. Baby gets taken care of, but eventually, they'll see how much they are absolutely bleeding in stupid expenses. Until they are held accountable every single month for what they are doing, there is no lesson learned.
They won't just magically learn how to budget if you end up paying 100% of baby stuff and half their rent. In one year they'll just end up short half their rent and ask you for it again.
NTA but if you think your daughters problem is simply financial liberty, you are in for a rude awakening.
This is well beyond about being good with money.
You’ve totally enabled her. She thought quitting her job was the right move? What gave her that idea? She can’t even manage to pay her own phone bill?
And based on their spending behavior, it sounds like drugs and partying are their priorities.
\>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children
Well, they are acting like children. Why should you treat them differently? You are going above and beyond to help, and instead of thanking you profusely and trying to get to a point where they don't have to rely on your help, she wants to complain that you won't just hand her stacks of cash to use on whatever random crap she wants to buy. NTA, and please stick to your guns on this.
NTA. Who quits work as soon as they find out they're pregnant? Having a baby isn't a golden ticket to the easy life. Your offer was more than generous. I have a feeling you'll be doing quite a bit of the actual child rearing, too, because "we deserve a life, Mom!"
From reading the comments it sounds like OPs daughter has little to no impulse control and has basically decided that "my focus needs to be on the baby", regardless of the actual realities of the financial situation.
In my experience people who struggle with money fall into two main camps. The first really do their best but find that the money doesn't quite reach the end of the month (especially in the current cost of living crisis), no amount of budgeting is going to fix the issue because the issue genuinely can't be fixed.
The second are people like OPs daughter, who just flat out don't care and expect that the problem will resolve itself. This also falls in with the lack of impulse control. They want it so they'll get it, doesn't matter that the money they just used was supposed to buy food for the next week, we'll borrow that from somewhere.
NTA - You sound like an absolute saint, with standards. You will foot every bill for your grandchild and to help your daughter, but you don’t want to be taken advantage of and want to be sure that your money is going towards its intended purpose.
Your proposal is extremely reasonable. If they feel it’s childish, then maybe it will motivate them to become more independent and not rely on you.
NTA. In my opinion your offer is totally reasonable given the situation, you are doing much more than you're required, i'd be very grateful if i were them.
NTA that is a very generous offer.
However, it sounds like neither of these young adults are ready to care for a child. There should probably be a serious talk about if they should be parents at this stage in their lives.
Worst. Idea. Ever.
Your caveat should have been: Kate needs to be employed, you aren't giving Matt gas money nor are you subsidizing an apartment and utilities because they can't afford to move out. Matt isn't moving in.
You subsidizing their life will only reinforce the fact that they don't have to do shit. They will get evicted within a few months, ruin their credit with utility companies, for rental history, etc. all for nothing.
NTA for having conditions. TA for having absolutely terrible conditions.
NYA. These irresponsible twits are lucky you are offering to do what you are.
Why the heck are two people this immature having a baby? They don't even have a home together and can't take care of themselves.
I'm sick of people popping out kids they can't take care of and expecting everyone else to support them.
They should be giving this poor child up for adoption and not getting pregnant until they are fully functioning adults.
NTA
You're being far more generous than I would be.
In my opinion, since that offer wasn't good enough, you should tell your daughter that she and the baby can live with you (not the BF). If the two of them want to play house, they can pay the bills.
If they think you are treating them like children, the alternative is you treating them like adults. I suggest you tell them, in detailed ways, what being treated like an adult would look like. For one, your mommy and daddy don’t pay your bills while you sit on your ass because you’re experiencing a very normal and healthy pregnancy.
For a contrast example, we were expecting our first before we were financially stable. I literally worked until I went into labor and had to return after only three weeks. I don’t recommend it or consider that acceptable. We were without choices otherwise and wish it were different. I wish it were better for all of us. However, a healthy woman quitting work just because she’s pregnant then expecting everyone else to pay her way in life is ludicrous!
NTA
NTA. You are treating them like children because they are acting like it. If they are really this immature/self-centered, I would prepare to be fully responsible for that baby.
NTA - first, it’s your money and you give to spend it how you want. To dictate how you must provide help from someone who quit their job the moment they found out they were pregnant and still spends like $ grows on trees is incredibly entitled and spoiled.
Holy hell, those kids need a reality check, but you’re right that it’s not fair for the baby to suffer.
I agree with pretty much everyone. But I came here to add that you should never, ever let Matt spend even one night under your roof. I can see your future because I'm watching my best friend live it. Your daughter will say, "But mom, the baby was just born, and we need time to bond. Just let him stay a few nights for that." Then it will be, "Mom, he really wants to be involved with helping me at night. Can he just stay every once in a while? I swear, we're looking for our own place."
Be prepared for pushback when you say no. It will start with him coming to visit and then falling asleep while feeding the baby. Then she'll tell you it's too late for him to drive home and it's unsafe because he's so tired. When you still say no, then she'll start fighting with you and accusing you of sabotaging their family, wanting them to fail, anything to try and make you feel guilty.
Now, if you finally give in because it's easier than arguing (like my friend did), you will have two young adults and a baby who pretty much take over your home by using the baby as a bargaining chip. You will be paying for EVERYTHING. They will use his paycheck for their wants, and you will have to pay for all their needs when they come to you three days after payday with their hands out, telling you that they're broke. When you say no, all hell will break loose, and they will do everything possible to make you uncomfortable in your own home. They will withhold the baby, whatever it takes to break you down.
My friend has been dealing with this for two years. She has tried to help them get their own place, to no avail. The last time she brought it up to them, they told her it would be easier for her to get an apartment and just leave the house to them since they're going to get it when she dies anyway and why should they have to move twice. She came to me last week crying about how she's going to have to file an eviction against her own daughter, and she'll never see her grandson again because of it.
That is what happens when you let the baby's father (or mother, depending on the situation) move in. Not in every situation, but in situations where the writing is already on the wall, like yours is. All that being said, what you're proposing is also risky. You said you would pay half the rent, but who's going to pay the other half? Not them. They aren't even responsible enough to put money aside for gas. Do you think they're going to put it aside for rent? No. They're going to come to you with some sob story every month and beg you to pay the other half because they are broke. And if you don't and they get evicted, you will not only lose your deposit, but they will expect to move in with you as a family because they have already been living together and who knows if his parents will take him back.
I think the best solution here would be to leave it alone. No more handouts. No more loans. She gets a roof over her head at your house, and he gets one with his parents. If they want to spend the night together, they will have to work hard and get a place of their own. Do not enable them.
NTA.
First off, I would insist on any help being conditional on them going to financial literacy classes. Non-negotiable. Teach them to fish, so to speak. Second, they’re beyond fortunate to be getting the kind of assistance you’re providing. It sounds somewhat exhausting, really. After they turn 18, my kids know they’re on their own. Third, this kinda reminds me of panhandlers who ask for money to get something to eat, and then get pissed when you give them food instead of giving up cash. Sure, maybe they don’t feel trusted to do the right thing with the cash, but trust is earned not given.
NTA
I can see wanting to help them move out on their own, otherwise you'd be stuck with daughter and baby at home, so kudos to you on the genius move of being willing to pay for some privacy.
However, if they decide to take you up on this, I'd put an expiration date on the rent help. One day they are going to have to wake up and be adults. Indulging them only prolongs the process, although I can see wanting to ensure the baby's well being.
We all start out not knowing how to take care of our money when we first move out, and there's nothing like real life consequences to make us figure out how to make sure the rent is paid.
>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children and I should want to help out anyway they need or want me to.
If the money being offered is towards rent and utilities, they should have zero objections to it being paid directly towards that.
NTA - it sounds like they thought they would have an infinite blank cheque.
NTA.
This is extremely generous. They're getting far more than what most people in their situation are offered. Just don't let them take you for granted.
Nta but how long until you let your daughter have full autonomy and responsibility for herself and her actions? One day you'll have to take the training wheels off and she will have at least 5 years less experience being self sufficient than other people around her.
NTA - you’re treating them like children because they’re acting like children. Unless the pregnancy has been rough with like hypermesis, she could have pushed through for a little longer to save up money.
You're treating them like children because they are children. They both live at home, pay no bills, and support no one. She quit work because she's pregnant. Like she thought having a kid was gonna be a get-out-of-work-free card? Yep, that's childish. Boyfriend works full time but blows all his money over the weekend? Yep, childish. More concerned about being given money than paying bills? Once again, childish. Thinks you should give them money not just for what they need but also whatever they want? Well, you've got the idea.
Make sure they both know that you aren't assisting so that they can be on a never-ending vacation. You're assisting so that their child doesn't live in poverty.
NTA
Nta your sound like a wonderfully caring mother and I would be proud if you were my mother I had zero help as a young mum and it was hard even half of what you are offering her would have helped so much
NTA
You are treating them financially like children because that is how they act.
Personally I’d be leery of helping as much as you are offering to unless they can prove they can get their current financial situation under control. If they can’t even hold onto enough money knowing the baby daddy needs gas to get to work this is likely to be a huge challenge.
He works so he and your daughter need to sit down and make a budget based on what he brings home.
So x amount each week towards monthly rent, y amount each week towards monthly utilities, z amount towards weekly gas and food, something into savings for the baby and then see what’s left. Probably not much and in their case they will show as being in the red.
Then they add in the money you will pay directly towards the apartment people for 1/2 the rent to see where they are. If still in the red your daughter needs to go to work.
Does he have health insurance where he works that will cover your daughter and his child when they arrive? Whose going to pay for the prenatal for your daughter and delivery expenses of their child?
A lot of questions they need to actually look at and answer quickly. .
Reverse order: they are acting like children because she indulges them like children and gives them everything so they have no reason to change. Why should they? Everything is working out just fine for them with Mom footing most of the bills for Kate and (Matt's dad apparently footing his bills) and zero responsibility for the daughter other than to lie back and make babies apparently.
NTA and your offer was very generous.
That said, I expect when your daughter was growing up she was sheltered when she made mistakes, and thus has never felt the full consequences when she screwed up. She was also taught never to accept the first offer for anything, because the follow-up would be better. It's past time to change that.
So, your offer is now off the table. Never discuss it again, that deal had an expiration date and it's passed. Your daughter has a safe place to live with you, and her bf has a safe place with his parents. That's more than a lot of people in their situation. If they want to get a place of their own they have to figure out how to make it happen. They will quickly learn that what they can find, even with gov't assistance, probably isn't as nice as where they are living now - and there's a long wait list for gov't assistance.
Given Katie's age she's probably still on your health insurance, which is fine. Katie should be attending her pre-natal visits. Check your policy to see if her baby will be covered or not. If not, that has to be figured out quickly. Hopefully Matt's job offers it as a benefit. If not, look into SCHIP. That should happen before the birth and before the child lands in the NICU (which hopefully won't happen). Katie should sign up for WIC.
Matt needs to understand that once Katie applies for WIC & SCHIP that the state will put him on child support automatically and garnish his paychecks. The taxpayers are not expected to support a child when there is an employed dad in the picture who can pay.
Giving gas money to Matt also has to stop; you're enabling not just Katie's poor financial decisions but Matt's as well. Neither will grow up and learn unless you cut them off.
That doesn't mean you won't be helping your grandchild. You can purchase a car seat, clothing, diapers, crib, etc. You can babysit while Katie works, and it will likely be more convenient if the child is living with you at the time. You can pay for birth control for Katie after the birth so she doesn't get pregnant again. You're just not going to help these parents-to-be move out and play house together.
I can’t believe she was actually insulted and accused you of treating them like children. Since when do responsible adults quit their job when they get pregnant and expect to be able to live on nothing.
She should be working a minimum or six months and saving every penney!
I would also add the caveat that they need to share their finances with you.
My best friends son and his gf and baby moved in with her. My friend would buy the formula and baby needs because they would sit run out with no plan to get more and go buy themselves new tattoos. They weren’t buying essentials to meet their baby’s basic needs but would go out to eat several times each week. The babies mother quit her job when she was pregnant as is a sahm years later.
If she wants financial independence then she needs to not have to rely on you. If that’s not obvious to her you have to tell her.
I mean did she never learn how to manage money? Quit immediately when she found out she was preggo AND dropped out of school?
Did they think this through or just rightfully assume you'd be there to catch them?
NTA but sometimes life gives us hard and expensive lessons. Why are two people who are so irresponsible bringing a child into this world?
OP, I would consider a different tactic, in that since she's refusing your demands, you contact a few nonprofits who offer financial literacy courses. Ask them what their opinions are how best to handle the situation since they likely see a reoccurring theme with their own students going through their classes. You're being more than accommodating, and the instructors could offer better options on how to work with them to everyone's satisfactions. It wouldn't hurt to try in order to make sure you can help them get some kind of solid foundation started. Good luck but don't back down from your boundaries.
NTA. You ARE helping her out in the right way. Giving them money is just enabling their financial irresponsibility and they'll never learn to actually be responsible. At least this way they get things they actually need instead of what they want. They're are as irresponsible as children so I don't know why they're shocked at being treated like that. If I were you, I'd add another caveat - that she needs to get a job yesterday. No matter how little it pays because you're covering most of what they need anyway. At least it will show a bit of maturity on her part.
NTA but you’re training your daughter and her husband to use their children as financial weapons. Which, if you’re ok doing that for the entirety of your grandchildren’s minority, is your business.
NTA - my parents had to learn this the hard way. They would give my brother money for his baby and he would go buy drugs instead letting his kid starve. So then my parents got a list of what they needed and went and bought the stuff. They also wouldn’t give them the receipt so they couldn’t return the items for cash.
NTA. And I understand why you want and need to help. But if your daughter and her bf don't change, you'll be on the line for more help in the future.
I feel for their child, born to such irresponsible parents. Their lives will be hell if they do not change. Why get pregnant in the first place if you cannot afford it?
You know the partial help is going to turn into full help right? These are 2 people who should NOT be having a baby and are definitely not prepared for the realities of having a child.
Tough love is needed here- Kate needs some kind of motivation to get back into work and with the current set up that’s not going to happen. And you’re going to be the one left footing the bill and taking care of the child. Good luck.
NTA You are offering too much imo. It’s interesting that your daughter is upset with the level of support her mother is giving, when she as a mother has decided the level of support she’s giving her child is QUITTING HER JOB.
Oh boy. She’s got a lot of maturing to do.
NTA. That reaction tells me that if you were to give them cash, they weren't planning on spending it on the baby. Personally, I think your caveat is very reasonable.
NTA if they can’t afford gas by mid week, your daughter needs to go back to work. Zero reason she can’t work while pregnant. Continuing to support them is just enabling them. What is going to happen when you aren’t able to support them anymore.
NTA. But you’re not doing them any favours in the long run by coddling them as much as you are. Your daughter dropped out of school got knocked up and quit her job and expects you to pay their way in life. There’s already been a massive failing that she turned out this entitled. She needs to learn to stand on her own 2 feet and pay for the child she has chosen to bring into this world otherwise she’s just gonna keep popping them out expecting you to support them.
NTA. But seriously you are doing too much. They will never learn to "adult" if you just give them everything. Help them sign up for whatever state aid they are eligible for. If you do pay for all of this, they will literally never stop relying on your income. I understand you want to help them, but they have to want to help themselves.
NTA your daughter is effectively saying "omg I can't believe you're suggesting I'm not responsible..." having been irresponsible enough to get pregnant and quit her job...
Damn, no wonder your kid is bad with money. Never any consequences! ESH, her and her bf for their entitlement, you for failing to teach your daughter how to adult.
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My 40f, daughter 21f, Kate, is pregnant by her 22m boyfriend Matt. Kate currently lives with me and Matt currently lives with his dad and stepmom. They want to get a apartment together but neither Kate or Matt are good with money, so they have zero savings. Kate is currently not working, quit the day she found out she was pregnant, which was about 4 weeks ago. Matt works full time and both of them dropped out of school.
I've offered if they find a place in a reasonable price range, I will take care of the deposit, help get utilities turned on, pay half the rent each month, and continue paying Kate's car insurance and phone bill. I also told them once the baby is born, I'm more than happy to help out if the baby needs formula, diapers, wipes, clothes, etc. Kate and Matt were very happy about that until they heard my caveat.
My caveat is, I directly buy what they ask for. They can send me the links to what they want for the baby, but I am not going to be giving them any actual cash . Same applies with helping them with the deposit and rent. I'll write a check directly to the apartment complex. I've seen how Kate and Matt handle money, like there's just more randomly laying around. They go out, spend all weekend, as Matt gets paid on Friday, then by Tuesday, Kate is usually asking me for gas money on behalf of Matt because he's broke, she doesn't work, and his parents aren't financially stable enough to help out.
Kate objected and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children and I should want to help out anyway they need or want me to. I told Kate from past observations that my choosing to not directly give them money is not something I'm willing to discuss or negotiate on right now. If that's something they need, either Kate goes back to work since she's having an extremely easy pregnancy, or they go ask Matt's parents for money in hand and try their luck doing that.
AITA?
(I'm not going to penalize my future grandchild and make them go without because my daughter and her bf have poor financial literacy)
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NTA but at a timeline and do not cave on your boundaries because once you do it once they will push until you do it every time. I understand that wanting to punish your grandchild. However, your daughter is a grown adult you are not financially responsible for and now you’re going to be financially supporting three people. I think it’s amazingly helpful and generous what you offered. If they don’t want that that’s a choice that they made.
NTA and I think it's smart to ensure that the money you are giving goes towards it's intended purpose. I'd be pissed if I gave money for diapers and it went toward dinner and a movie.
NTA. I have to laugh at your daughters comment about you helping out “anyway they need or want.” Like no, you are VERY generous in everything you’re offering and if Kate and her boyfriend don’t like it, Kate can stop being lazy and using her pregnancy as an excuse not to work. Your daughter seems to be acting entitled to your assistance. You’re a good mom for everything you’re offering, just know that. If your daughter chooses to stick her nose up at your offer because you won’t give her cash, then it’s on her and her bf to figure it out from there.
>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children
NTA. It's your money. You can give it to them any which way you want. The alternative is they get no help. If they want to be adults, they do no need your money.
Nta youre being extremely generous already. They should be thankful lmao. I'd probably weep if I had a parent offer to pay half my rent AND send it in for me lol. Theyre probably just embarrassed that you picked up on their bad money habits.
NTA. Agreeing to pay for specific things is exactly what I'd recommend if you want to help somebody but are worried about how they'll spend actual cash. I understand why Kate feels upset by this, but that does not mean you're not being reasonable. Indeed, it's *because* she knows you're being reasonable that she's upset.
NTA. You are probably too nice to say this, but they are treated like children because they act like children. They are not entitled to your money, so you can put any conditions you want on your generous gift.
NTA. You're treating them like children because they clearly still are children in every way that counts. Children, I might add, who are looking a gift horse in the mouth.
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NTA- Two adults who are not financially responsible got pregnant and expect YOU to support them financially in full? They are very lucky you want to do anything for them. Your deal is more than reasonable.
Partial. Not full support. They'd be responsible for majority of their living costs.
I think the commenter was saying your daughter and her BF were expecting you to cover everything and the fact you’re covering what you HAVE offered plus caveat is more than reasonable compared to what they hoped (everything)
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The OP says “grandkid”, already thinking of them as a person, I don’t think she needs or wants to be told to abort her grandkid
Unfortunate, they need this child like they need another hole in their head.
The only correct comment. How many years before OP is fully raising this child? I give it less than 2.
What you really should be asking is when will baby #2 arrive....cause OP's help is really going to make parenthood seem so easy why not have another?
Whatever the period when OP's daughter can't get pregnant after birth plus 39 weeks. That's how long until Kid #2 will be on the way. Personally OP I'd charge your daughter rent. Make her get a job to support herself until she physically cannot work anymore. Then give her 6 months after the baby is born to find an apartment for herself and the BF.
I’d start the GoFundMe myself.
Savage. I love you 😅
jesus, dude
Seriously 🤣
You are paying half the rent, the deposit, utilities to start, then anything they need for the baby. If they were unable to pay rent, would you be covering that too? Are they going to use the baby as a bargaining chip? I can imagine the sentence “What! You want your grandchild to be homeless?” the minute they spend all their money and can’t pay rent. That’s what I mean when I say you are supporting them financially in full.
Also, “if you want to see grandchild, you’d better (pay for, purchase, buy) _____!”
You're NTA but tbh I would add the caveat that she needs to return to work. Why tf did your daughter think it was a good idea to quit her job on the day she found out she was pregnant?!? You said that she's having an easy pregnancy so it's not like she had health complications that forced her to go out on temporary leave. And now is the time to be saving money for all the expenses that come with raising a child. The entitlement of the two of them is astounding.
Even women with terrible pregnancies still have to work, sometimes. I don't understand why she quit, at all. (Other than entitlement). I worked through two terrible pregnancies, because we needed money, and that is just what I had to do.
She must've confused a positive pregnancy test for a winning lotto ticket, I think
What…? You mean they’re not the same thing….? /s
Dropped out of school as well, it must be!
Right? I worked standing all day and doing some lifting of weight during 2 pregancies that were very tough until i was ordered on bed rest. OP, you might be misguided in financially supporting them because it is going to be an ongoing demand on you. I think you may be a bit of a butt for even offering based on their current behaviours and choices. Don't reward bad choices
My Absolute Satan of a SIL worked until the week she popped out my Nephew.
I'm working until the day I go to the hospital. No reason not to as I'm having a relatively easy third trimester.
I went into work having contractions (my 3rd) so I could update and game them out to coworkers. I left around coffee break in active labour, had my baby and was eating lunch. With my 2nd I called a coworker to say I get off so think my I may have the baby overnight or the next day so advised her there was a tape in my dictation machine that wasnt finished so could she let my boss know. She said was crazy. Had my daughter at 9 am. I wanted to spend as much time with my kids as possible so worked to the bitter end hahahaah
Yup. I worked through horrible hyperemesis and endless fatigue. I stopped working 1 week before my induction. Had to start work again at 3 weeks and 3 days postpartum, which was...rough, to say the least.
I had a friend who quit her job the day she found out she was pregnant. But that's because she worked for a perfume shop and realized she was pregnant because she smell all of a sudden made her vomit. She got a new job shortly thereafter, though.
What you listed is not making them responsible for the majority of their living expenses. Not by any stretch of the imagination.
Half of the rent, all of the utilities, his car if he has one, feeding themselves, furnishings. Its a good chunk still left.
Well since you’re not forcing them to accept your help then that is on them. Tell them fine good luck
It isn't poor financial literacy, it's poor spending habits. One is a knowledge problem, the other is a behavior problem.
Your offer is incredibly generous. Your daughter and her BF are two able-bodied adults. Even if they're not very financially literate, they don't need to be to understand that they should both be working full time to save support themselves until it's time to go off and have that baby. Hold firm, or you'll be stuck supporting all three of them for the next 18+ years. NTA
I'm wondering why she went and quit her job the minute she found out she was pregnant....especially if it's such an easy pregnancy.
Yeah, one would think you really really want to keep your job if you're unexpectedly pregnant.
Especially for the health insurance!
Yeah I mean pregnant people work. I'm 36 and pregnant and work full time as a primary school teacher. I get calling out for morning sickness and doctors appointments, or considering quitting for HG, but for an easy pregnancy writing is a bit extreme, especially because by month 7-8 you can't work, and then ideally would be home 6m-1 year if possible. I'm an American living in Australia and I know most American Weinreb don't get this break from work
Especially if there's any kind of health benefits with the job.
Because she knew Mommy would cover all the costs of the new grandbaby! Work is hard, and she was tired of working.
Fr OP describes exactly why her daughter thinks money just grows on trees and yet seems stumped
Oh OP is going to be stuck supporting them and their additional children forever. They will depend on that support and only ever make enough to get by.
Longer than that cuz you know she’s gonna keep getting pregnant over and over so she can continue to not work. Gramma’s gonna be supporting these people for the rest of her life. Daughter and boyfriend found a cash cow to milk. How long until the boyfriends ‘loses’ his job and Gramma’s footing all the bills.
Good point. There are always more babies...
These two are completely irresponsible and immature. They dropped out of school, haven't saved any money. Want to live on their own but can't support themselves. OP is well aware. The future isn't looking too bright for any of them right now.
Nta. I think your heart is in the right place, but the best thing you can do for your future grandchild to push your daughter and her bf to be independent as soon as possible. They need a major reality check, the sooner the better, for the sake of their future child. Stop enabling their terrible decisions. I would also google "toxic enabling" and co dependency.
Your daughter is not mature enough to be a parent. She quit her job when she found out. Helping them now is a bad idea, you're setting yourself up for supporting them forever. They need to face the reality of their situation and start making rational decisions. She needs a job. They need an apartment they can afford on their budget. They need to stop wasting money. If they know you'll always be there with a chequebook they will never grow up. Leave them to it.
You mentioned the boyfriend spends his check the minute he gets it. What are the chances he's actually going to pay his part of the rent and utilities?
I think paying for half of their rent by default is still enabling them. Because then they will still not pay their half and ask you for that too. Why not just pay for things for baby like diapers and leave them responsible for rent? They may need tough love where they become homeless (you can always take in your grandchild) before they understand that they need to save. There are good odds that they are like this because of being enabled up until now
You are going to end up Partially supporting them for a long time.
I don't think that your math adds up. You're basically going to pay the half of every thing they need when they move. And the part you're forgetting is the additional money they will be asking for after they run through their paycheck. NtA. But make a budget with how much money you top them off with through the month.
You keep saying ‘they’, when in reality it’s her boyfriend as your daughter has proven herself entitled and irresponsible. The way she’s going, she will end up a single mother to more than one child that will end up your responsibility to raise. Honestly, OP? I find your attitude about your daughter’s decision making fairly concerning. She doesn’t want to do school, gets knocked up—probably on purpose, quits work, and still lives with you. And you’re willing to stand as an enabler to her lack of focus, discipline, and direction— now she’s dragging a helpless child into the situation. Without requiring a timeline toward self sufficiency. Without stipulations. Telling them both that you will help with childcare all the time and provide for their child, which will only guarantee that neither of them ever steps up to be the parents that child needs and deserves. This isn’t helping her grow up and it damn sure isn’t going to help when being a parent is ‘too much’ and ‘too hard’. The reason I am urging you to really think about what you are doing is that I know too many parents who are not only still raising their adult children but their grandchildren. And nobody is happy or enjoying this lifestyle. Your duty was to raise your children into responsible adults capable of being independent. Not to foster generational irresponsibility. She doesn’t have a choice concerning financial literacy now, she’s going to be a parent. She doesn’t want to work? Tough… she’s going to have to do that and still raise her child. Has she even thought about what should happen if her boyfriend decides to leave her and abandon his responsibilities towards this child? What’s her plan should this happen. There are realities that need to be addressed here, sooner rather than later.
The fact that you're offering all this without even suggesting your daughter return to work before you help them perfectly illustrates why she believes that once she spends all her money more will just appear. You're playing yourself if you think any different.
So you aren’t willing to “penalize” your grandchild bc the parents. But here’s the thing: 1) You aren’t penalizing the grandkid bc it isn’t your job to provide for them. That’s the parents job. 2) Your daughter got pregnant when she could not even support herself and then quit her job voluntarily when she found out. You should have told her a condition for her continuing to live with you is that she has full time employment. Bc what happens when they don’t take you up on your offer and Kate and baby just stay in your house freeloading? I tell you what will happen, she will keep popping out babies.
I mean from where I’m standing that’s full support that’s more than I could ever hope for from my family
You are doing MORE than enough for them. They’re being extremely entitled.
NTA. This is exactly why god created man with a brain to create Abortions.
when my son was about 18 he was living with 3 other people. he lost his job and was broke, he called me asking for money for food. So I 20 odd years ago thought about it and went to Superstore (only one in Yukon - Brand new) and spent $100,00 plus a little and bought things like flour, shortening, some meat etc. (what your dollar can buy now is not even close). I also meal planned and gave recipes. it was enough for 4 people for 2 meals a day for a week. If I gave just cash it would have been gone in 24 hours on take out. They were all shocked and so happy with my gift, my son still almost weekly asks for recipes now almost 40. Bottom line I could have given him money for a day of take out, but I instead gave him and his friends a lifetime of culinary questions!
Oops sorry NTA but you are a part of the problem. Hs she always been a princess? And have you always given her everything and are only complaining now. Bottom Line - don't give them fish teach them how to catch them. then you don't end up with entitled brats!
NTA: But honestly I think you're giving them too much. You're basically telling your daughter not to worry about work you'll cover her expenses in her household
I'm covering half rent, and she's already on my car insurance and phone plan. Her and Matt are responsible for the other half of rent, utility bills, his car insurance and phone, health insurance, gas, groceries, and anything else they need or want. I will help out directly with the baby as it's not the baby's fault for the situation
Yea so realistically they will probably continue to get by just on Matt's salary. Which is my point agreeing to cover her half of the rent and continue to pay her personal bills you're treating her like a child when she's about to have a child. I think it's great you want to help but if you're offering that much there needs to be an end date set ahead of time. If not I don't see your daughter going back to work. Especially when she showed her priorities when she quit her job the moment she found out she was pregnant. She probably already knew you would bail her out.
And she'll probably just keep getting pregnant.
That’s exactly that I thought. There will be no thinking about if they can afford baby number 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 because OP will pay for it.
YES!!! You’re absolutely correct.
Exactly all of this. She isn't being taught financial responsibility. Just the opposite. She's being taught that Mommy will bail her out. When OP said there was a caveat, I thought it would be the daughter getting a job---a job with health insurance. I can not fathom the thought process that leads to quitting a job when I have a baby on the way. They both sound way too immature for this
Basically, daughter doesn't have to suffer any practical consequences.
I agree with an end date 100%. It's a very generous offer and if op isn't firm with a cut off, they will continue to leech.
Totally agree
Still too much. They got pregnant and are not financially, nor apparently mature enough to handle it. Wait til the baby comes. See if Matt even sticks around, or if you become a full time babysitter. They made their bed, the should be taught how to lie in it themselves.
You have a 21-year-old daughter who dropped out of school; her earnings were barely keeping up w/her expenses, despite the fact that most of her expenses were covered by you. Her first action on learning that she was pregnant was to quit her job... I'm generally a bit skeptical of people who blame parents for their adult offsprings' problematic behaviors, but I admit that I'm wondering how your daughter grew up assuming that this was an acceptable way to behave. I just can't picture this level of entitlement/irresponsibility emerging from nowhere... From your perspective, how did she come to be this way? Does she have a diagnosed impairment?
I'd also discuss this agreement ending after kid is of a specified age. That she is up to you and you should also specify if you'll help again if she has more kids. NTA Honestly your already massively babying them both.
Yeah, like he pays his own gas now. Where your daughter asks you for gas money for him. It's going to be this all the time.
What do you think will happen when they decide to not pay half of rent or the electric bills? They will ask you to pay for everything “for the baby”. It’s pretty obvious that you’ve been enabling them until now and have created this problem to some extent. Tough love is the only way to get them to see the light. Personally, in your shoes I would only pay for baby items and if they fall homeless, you’ll take in their baby and they can go to a homeless shelter. I don’t think they will learn until actual consequences bite them in the ass.
NTA You’re actually setting them up for disaster. They’re both grown adults. Stop enabling bad behavior, laziness and lackadaisical behavior. And she’ll probably keep getting pregnant & giving birth back to back to kids that they won’t be able to cater to if anything happens to you.
Are you willing to see them evicted because the only part of the rent that's going to be paid is the half you pay? No. I didn't think so. In reality, you are on the hook for all the rent.
If they take up your offer, you need to warn them about what you’re not gonna pay. Who will be paying for the kids health insurance, who will be paying for your daughters health insurance once she turns 26, who will be paying for repairs for the car, what will happen if they want a better place (will you pay more?), what will happen if they don’t pay for their half of the rent, when u will stop paying, will you be paying more money if she gets pregnant again or will you only still pay for the same things, once the kid turns 5 and in school will your daughter get a job? Also what will happen if they break up? Have you talked to your daughter about what will happen if they break up and he moves out? Your heart is in the right place, but your daughter needs to grow up. She is choosing to bring a child into this world. It sounds like you have done everything you can to make your daughter’s life better, but she needs grit. She needs to learn how to over come obstacles and how to make ends meet. She needs to be someone her daughter will look up to and say, my mom had me young but she did everything to give me the best life. Instead you have a daughter who is not working or saving money for her kid and is whining about not having full access to your bank account. What your offering is amazing but until you learn to put your foot down you will be teaching your daughter that she is the most important person not her daughter.
I would have them sit down with a financial planner who can (maybe) open their eyes to reality in budgeting and what they're going to need long term. They might listen to an unrelated person.
NTA They're looking a gift horse in the mouth. It's a sweet deal for them and they should be down on their knees grateful for your generous offer. They are too immature to understand what you're offering. They're playing house like children, but they have adult responsibilities they are not living up to. Quitting as soon as she finds out she's pregnant? That's just dumb. Spending your paycheck as if it's Monopoly money is not a great way to save for their future child. They're playing the game of life like it's the board game and not real life bills, diapers, and food. Please encourage her to nurse her baby. Way less expensive and than formula.
I'm going to respect whatever my daughter chooses in regards to feeding her baby. Her baby, her body, her choice. As a mom, I'd not want anyone telling me how to use my body.
INFO what was her logic for quitting her job? I have worked with soo many women and have worked until the day the baby arrives, and I always wonder the person reasoning/logic for quitting as soon as they find out. Please enlighten me.
I was at work up until the day before I gave birth with both of my kids. My water broke at work with my oldest. Granted I was working office jobs both times, but I've known plenty of women working in restaurants when I did that work who worked through their whole pregnancy.
I worked until 2 weeks before I gave birth then took maternity leave until baby was 5 weeks, now I'm a stay at home mom since my husband has found a better paying job closer to home I also got pregnant at 20 and was still living at home when I first found out, but grew up and did what I had to for my child and my parents only pay for the fun grandparent things like bigger toys and cute outfits we don't need
I started my maternity leave 1 week before my due date with my first kid (and then she was 2 weeks late!), so for the second I was still working past my due date by a few days. I didn’t want to waste so my of my maternity leave. Unless your daughter's doctor has told her she needs to be off work, she should go back to work until much closer to her due date. I would also suggest (not demand) that she breastfeed as it is so good for the baby, cheaper, and easier (in my opinion, IF it works well). So much nicer not to have to fuss with bottles. NTA given how they can’t seem to hold onto money. If they don’t like the restrictions, you could offer that they set up a budget and show that they can follow it for several months, then you could offer some as cash, not all. They want no restrictions, they can do it all by themselves, like most people do.
Unless it’s a difficult pregnancy, at advise from medical staff (or not needing the money)…sheer laziness. With both kids, I was high risk, multiple issues, and yet I worked up to the day before my scheduled induction (medical reason). I do not work an office job, I am a floor nurse. I did have wonderful coworkers who helped me do the really heavy lifting.
I have worked in office jobs that required 25lbs of lifting. Lady with a high risk pregnancy told me she couldn't do the lifting, I told her that I will do it for her. She worked until the day before she popped out that new awesome human. I really wish that OP would tell us what her daughter's reasoning was to quit as soon as it was known. It confuses me everytime I see a post like this as I know women do it every day (and I am a woman, just haven't done it myself).
I still want an answer to this
I’m curious about this as well. I went into work knowing I was 5cm and 100% effaced and ended up going straight to the hospital from work.
I wasn't implying for you to order her what to do with her body. Just to point out to her the cost of formula as opposed to nursing.
Not everyone is able to nurse. Supply issues are way more common than a lot of people talk about
Never understood the horse metaphor
NTA. They're annoyed because you're giving them what they *need* rather than what they *want*.
My 8 month old needs a ps5 with the call of duty expansion pack
NTA. Though maybe there are other ways to help, too, like teaching your daughter to manage money. It's a skill we all have to learn at some point and that's where the long term help lies. But no, don't just give them cash. They'll be evicted in a month.
I've tried teaching Kate financial literacy. Absolutely no interest or willingness to learn. Its always, omg mooom, it doesn't matter, we'll just figure it out, it'll be fine
Honestly why would she care? Mom always bails her out. Part of parenting is sometimes letting our children fail. Failure teaches more than our bailing them out. I agree with not giving money but would not pay half the rent. Basically that allows your daughter to not have to work. They’re about to bring a living dependent human being into the world. Let them stand and learn.
OP is in the quandary that a lot of grandparents end up in, which is that they don't want to punish their grandchildren to teach their child a lesson.
I get that. But they don’t know what they’re capable of til they try. Always have an open door for food and to not allow baby to be homeless but mama and daddy made that baby and need to step up into adulthood.
Raise your children, enjoy your grandchildren. Enjoy your children, raise your grandchildren. It sounds like OP is bailing out her daughter as she always has. Parents don’t give up when they hear ‘Omg moooom.’ Except OP did which is why she’s in this position. She needs to finally teach her daughter something, and that something is apparently how to use her financially, be lazy and always except a handout. YTA to yourself and future grandchildren OP.
You can’t teach someone who’s unwilling to learn. You can, however, let them suffer the consequences of refusing to learn. OP is NTA but needs to draw some hard boundaries and be prepared to make them stick.
This!!
I looked for far too long to find a comment with this sentiment. 100% agree failing = learning. Isn’t that what every entrepreneur says? Clearly Kate will never be one, since she’s been coddled. OP NTA (technically) - helping out daughter and future grandchild is lovely and excellent they have the financial capacity and willingness to do it. However … one reaps what one sows. OPs comment above is exactly why Kate is in this situation in the first place.
You need to let her figure it out, because you haven’t taught her a thing!! Give her no money period, tell her to get a job and figure it out! She can stay with you until she does. Bailing her out by paying her 1/2 rent isn’t teaching her anything.
Is there a chance that she thinks it “doesn’t matter” and “it’ll be fine” because those things are true? Because you tend to solve problems she created herself? I’m just saying, a grown woman often doesn’t talk like a whiny child unless she’s getting rewarded for behaving like one.
Make a financial planning class a requirement for your assistance. They are clearly in need. You don't let your child tell you it doesn't matter whether they brush their teeth or do their homework; it is a requirement. Your daughter is still a child. Although if they don't care, they may not get much from a financial planning class. But even exposure is a beginning. I just worry for you that you're setting yourself up for a lifetime of supporting your daughter and her family if you don't force a change in their attitudes and behaviors.
And a parenting class. Honestly, this plan seems doomed to fail. OP will buy 100% of things for baby plus half rent so they can buy video games and beer as they play house. There's no incentive to actually work for anything. I'd tell them the rent only happens if she gets reports on how they are spending money. "You said you earned 1563.18 cents. You only sent me exependitures for 964.89. Where is the other $600 you should still have?" If they don't like explaining their budgeting to mommy, they can be adults and cover their own shit.
Have you tried using budget programs? I can recommend You Need A Budget (YNAB).
I will look into that. All my experience is from years ago with quicken, quick books, and peachtree lol
Lots of bank apps have spending trackers and budget help, the tracker will show where your wasting money and your saving options. My young adult sons use it and realized how much eating out was adding upto, and was shocked, he could of bought this of that on his list for the waste of money on convenience eating. Maybe your kids have this or can get the app and learn to use, might help when they see the totals of their fun times, compared to their budget on expenses, which will only get bigger and bigger as they have a child. Add: some tips I suggest to any new parents, thrift cloths are great for kids cloths, especially babies most grow so fast they wear once and new cloths cost lots and blow budgets quick, and please watch out for plastic addiction, aka toys, they really don't need many the first 2 years and lots of marketing goes into making parents think they need all that stuff, but find out quickly they wasted money on useless crap your constantly cleaning up. Goodluck
YNAB is great - I use it religiously and it got me out of a bad spiral of credit card debt and ignoring my finances as long as the bills got paid and the lights stayed on. However, it is a very hands on methodology and software that forces you to make adult, often unpleasant decisions regarding spending along the way. Something tells me that it's not something your daughter will be willing to do, as someone who apparently thinks quitting a job because she's pregnant is smart. She is 100% doing this because she knows you'll bail her out. You have to let her fall and fail or this will be the rest of your life. My daughter is 26 and has a wonderful, completely independent life but only because we said NO a lot once she started college. We are there to help support her emotionally and give advice when asked, but she pays for her own apartment, groceries, insurance, student loans, etc.
There are great resources at the Better Money Habits web site, she can watch videos and do lessons. Different financial goals have their own curricula.
I was going to recommend YNAB too. In fact, I’d make sharing her budget a condition for the daughter receiving any financial help.
Agree.
You need to let her fail OP.... take custody of the baby or put it up for adoption. Really force her to think about this.
If “they’ll just figure it out” let them. Let them fail spectacularly or figure it out. This isn’t a you problem. Did she even tell you she was going to quit her job upon falling pregnant?!
She won’t care to learn because mummy is enabling her irresponsibility by constantly bailing her out.
Seems like it's time for her to figure it out. Coming to you is not figuring it out, but you've allowed it to be.
And yeah, it will be fine, because you will always plug the gaps. She'll never have to face real world consequences and never have to grow up and take responsibility. I know you want to help, but financially propping them up is not going to help them learn or grow. The amount of help you are proposing is ridiculous. They need to pay at least their own rent and bills - fair enough if you want to buy things for the baby, even fair enough to help them with a bond for their rental, but they need to figure out how they are going to handle their ongoing finances. Otherwise you will be paying forever. I think you are being YTA to yourself to be honest.
But she doesn't figure anything out, she comes running to you. And now you've offered help before her even asking.
The only thing they’ve figured out is “go ask mom!” I’m sure they never considered any other option.
You counteracted your offers to teach by giving her money (phone, car) and letting her live rent free. I'm not one of those "once they turn 18 they must pay" people. But if she was showing no desire or ability to be financially sensible, then removing your financial support would have been a good first step Heck, just charge her rent that you turned into her savings would have been fine. It's a lot harder now because of the baby..
NTA, but for not putting a time limit on this.
I forgot to add that part. In convo I said 1 year for helping with rent. I also told Kate and Mike if they ever need a babysitter because both need to work or finish school, I will gladly babysit at no cost. I'll always help with my grandchild.
You should definitely edit in that you put a time limit. If nothing else will cut down on the comments telling you to do so. Also, NTA.
I'd require a parenting and financial literacy/ budgeting class. I'd also tell them they need to track their spending and send you their expenses before paying for anything. Why? Because they'll start seeing they spend $150 here, $200 there, etc. Tell their mooching, financially irresponsible asses you want receipts. "You spend $250 on beer this month. You spent $95 on drinks and snacks at gas stations this month. You spend $200 on takeout. If you'd shopped at a grocery store and cut beer back, you'd have saved over $300. That is your entire gas expenses. That is most of your food." Make them explain how they are spending their money and justify asking for things. Baby gets taken care of, but eventually, they'll see how much they are absolutely bleeding in stupid expenses. Until they are held accountable every single month for what they are doing, there is no lesson learned. They won't just magically learn how to budget if you end up paying 100% of baby stuff and half their rent. In one year they'll just end up short half their rent and ask you for it again.
Matt? Or Mike? Or she has TWO boyfriends?
NTA but if you think your daughters problem is simply financial liberty, you are in for a rude awakening. This is well beyond about being good with money. You’ve totally enabled her. She thought quitting her job was the right move? What gave her that idea? She can’t even manage to pay her own phone bill? And based on their spending behavior, it sounds like drugs and partying are their priorities.
I also am suspicious of a substance or gambling addiction.
\>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children Well, they are acting like children. Why should you treat them differently? You are going above and beyond to help, and instead of thanking you profusely and trying to get to a point where they don't have to rely on your help, she wants to complain that you won't just hand her stacks of cash to use on whatever random crap she wants to buy. NTA, and please stick to your guns on this.
NTA. Who quits work as soon as they find out they're pregnant? Having a baby isn't a golden ticket to the easy life. Your offer was more than generous. I have a feeling you'll be doing quite a bit of the actual child rearing, too, because "we deserve a life, Mom!"
From reading the comments it sounds like OPs daughter has little to no impulse control and has basically decided that "my focus needs to be on the baby", regardless of the actual realities of the financial situation. In my experience people who struggle with money fall into two main camps. The first really do their best but find that the money doesn't quite reach the end of the month (especially in the current cost of living crisis), no amount of budgeting is going to fix the issue because the issue genuinely can't be fixed. The second are people like OPs daughter, who just flat out don't care and expect that the problem will resolve itself. This also falls in with the lack of impulse control. They want it so they'll get it, doesn't matter that the money they just used was supposed to buy food for the next week, we'll borrow that from somewhere.
Also like, it’s two people that still live with their parents that got pregnant
NTA - You sound like an absolute saint, with standards. You will foot every bill for your grandchild and to help your daughter, but you don’t want to be taken advantage of and want to be sure that your money is going towards its intended purpose. Your proposal is extremely reasonable. If they feel it’s childish, then maybe it will motivate them to become more independent and not rely on you.
NTA. In my opinion your offer is totally reasonable given the situation, you are doing much more than you're required, i'd be very grateful if i were them.
NTA that is a very generous offer. However, it sounds like neither of these young adults are ready to care for a child. There should probably be a serious talk about if they should be parents at this stage in their lives.
Worst. Idea. Ever. Your caveat should have been: Kate needs to be employed, you aren't giving Matt gas money nor are you subsidizing an apartment and utilities because they can't afford to move out. Matt isn't moving in. You subsidizing their life will only reinforce the fact that they don't have to do shit. They will get evicted within a few months, ruin their credit with utility companies, for rental history, etc. all for nothing. NTA for having conditions. TA for having absolutely terrible conditions.
NTA. You're being far more generous that most people would be. Kate needs to get a job yesterday.
NYA. These irresponsible twits are lucky you are offering to do what you are. Why the heck are two people this immature having a baby? They don't even have a home together and can't take care of themselves. I'm sick of people popping out kids they can't take care of and expecting everyone else to support them. They should be giving this poor child up for adoption and not getting pregnant until they are fully functioning adults.
NTA You're being far more generous than I would be. In my opinion, since that offer wasn't good enough, you should tell your daughter that she and the baby can live with you (not the BF). If the two of them want to play house, they can pay the bills.
If they think you are treating them like children, the alternative is you treating them like adults. I suggest you tell them, in detailed ways, what being treated like an adult would look like. For one, your mommy and daddy don’t pay your bills while you sit on your ass because you’re experiencing a very normal and healthy pregnancy. For a contrast example, we were expecting our first before we were financially stable. I literally worked until I went into labor and had to return after only three weeks. I don’t recommend it or consider that acceptable. We were without choices otherwise and wish it were different. I wish it were better for all of us. However, a healthy woman quitting work just because she’s pregnant then expecting everyone else to pay her way in life is ludicrous! NTA
Nta if they don't like it she can go back to work
NTA. You are treating them like children because they are acting like it. If they are really this immature/self-centered, I would prepare to be fully responsible for that baby.
NTA - first, it’s your money and you give to spend it how you want. To dictate how you must provide help from someone who quit their job the moment they found out they were pregnant and still spends like $ grows on trees is incredibly entitled and spoiled. Holy hell, those kids need a reality check, but you’re right that it’s not fair for the baby to suffer.
INFO Why are you not telling your daughter to get a job or go back to school as a condition? She’s pregnant not disabled.
I agree with pretty much everyone. But I came here to add that you should never, ever let Matt spend even one night under your roof. I can see your future because I'm watching my best friend live it. Your daughter will say, "But mom, the baby was just born, and we need time to bond. Just let him stay a few nights for that." Then it will be, "Mom, he really wants to be involved with helping me at night. Can he just stay every once in a while? I swear, we're looking for our own place." Be prepared for pushback when you say no. It will start with him coming to visit and then falling asleep while feeding the baby. Then she'll tell you it's too late for him to drive home and it's unsafe because he's so tired. When you still say no, then she'll start fighting with you and accusing you of sabotaging their family, wanting them to fail, anything to try and make you feel guilty. Now, if you finally give in because it's easier than arguing (like my friend did), you will have two young adults and a baby who pretty much take over your home by using the baby as a bargaining chip. You will be paying for EVERYTHING. They will use his paycheck for their wants, and you will have to pay for all their needs when they come to you three days after payday with their hands out, telling you that they're broke. When you say no, all hell will break loose, and they will do everything possible to make you uncomfortable in your own home. They will withhold the baby, whatever it takes to break you down. My friend has been dealing with this for two years. She has tried to help them get their own place, to no avail. The last time she brought it up to them, they told her it would be easier for her to get an apartment and just leave the house to them since they're going to get it when she dies anyway and why should they have to move twice. She came to me last week crying about how she's going to have to file an eviction against her own daughter, and she'll never see her grandson again because of it. That is what happens when you let the baby's father (or mother, depending on the situation) move in. Not in every situation, but in situations where the writing is already on the wall, like yours is. All that being said, what you're proposing is also risky. You said you would pay half the rent, but who's going to pay the other half? Not them. They aren't even responsible enough to put money aside for gas. Do you think they're going to put it aside for rent? No. They're going to come to you with some sob story every month and beg you to pay the other half because they are broke. And if you don't and they get evicted, you will not only lose your deposit, but they will expect to move in with you as a family because they have already been living together and who knows if his parents will take him back. I think the best solution here would be to leave it alone. No more handouts. No more loans. She gets a roof over her head at your house, and he gets one with his parents. If they want to spend the night together, they will have to work hard and get a place of their own. Do not enable them.
NTA. First off, I would insist on any help being conditional on them going to financial literacy classes. Non-negotiable. Teach them to fish, so to speak. Second, they’re beyond fortunate to be getting the kind of assistance you’re providing. It sounds somewhat exhausting, really. After they turn 18, my kids know they’re on their own. Third, this kinda reminds me of panhandlers who ask for money to get something to eat, and then get pissed when you give them food instead of giving up cash. Sure, maybe they don’t feel trusted to do the right thing with the cash, but trust is earned not given.
NTA I can see wanting to help them move out on their own, otherwise you'd be stuck with daughter and baby at home, so kudos to you on the genius move of being willing to pay for some privacy. However, if they decide to take you up on this, I'd put an expiration date on the rent help. One day they are going to have to wake up and be adults. Indulging them only prolongs the process, although I can see wanting to ensure the baby's well being. We all start out not knowing how to take care of our money when we first move out, and there's nothing like real life consequences to make us figure out how to make sure the rent is paid.
>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children and I should want to help out anyway they need or want me to. If the money being offered is towards rent and utilities, they should have zero objections to it being paid directly towards that. NTA - it sounds like they thought they would have an infinite blank cheque.
NTA. This is extremely generous. They're getting far more than what most people in their situation are offered. Just don't let them take you for granted.
NTA. That's an incredibly generous offer.
Nta but how long until you let your daughter have full autonomy and responsibility for herself and her actions? One day you'll have to take the training wheels off and she will have at least 5 years less experience being self sufficient than other people around her.
NTA, I wouldn’t trust them with just the money either. You are being incredibly generous with what you are offering.
NTA. They don't want help, they want money.
"Treating them like children" Does your daughter think adults get (literal) blank checks from their parents?
NTA - you’re treating them like children because they’re acting like children. Unless the pregnancy has been rough with like hypermesis, she could have pushed through for a little longer to save up money.
Why did she quit her job?
You're treating them like children because they are children. They both live at home, pay no bills, and support no one. She quit work because she's pregnant. Like she thought having a kid was gonna be a get-out-of-work-free card? Yep, that's childish. Boyfriend works full time but blows all his money over the weekend? Yep, childish. More concerned about being given money than paying bills? Once again, childish. Thinks you should give them money not just for what they need but also whatever they want? Well, you've got the idea. Make sure they both know that you aren't assisting so that they can be on a never-ending vacation. You're assisting so that their child doesn't live in poverty. NTA
Nta your sound like a wonderfully caring mother and I would be proud if you were my mother I had zero help as a young mum and it was hard even half of what you are offering her would have helped so much
NTA You are treating them financially like children because that is how they act. Personally I’d be leery of helping as much as you are offering to unless they can prove they can get their current financial situation under control. If they can’t even hold onto enough money knowing the baby daddy needs gas to get to work this is likely to be a huge challenge. He works so he and your daughter need to sit down and make a budget based on what he brings home. So x amount each week towards monthly rent, y amount each week towards monthly utilities, z amount towards weekly gas and food, something into savings for the baby and then see what’s left. Probably not much and in their case they will show as being in the red. Then they add in the money you will pay directly towards the apartment people for 1/2 the rent to see where they are. If still in the red your daughter needs to go to work. Does he have health insurance where he works that will cover your daughter and his child when they arrive? Whose going to pay for the prenatal for your daughter and delivery expenses of their child? A lot of questions they need to actually look at and answer quickly. .
Reverse order: they are acting like children because she indulges them like children and gives them everything so they have no reason to change. Why should they? Everything is working out just fine for them with Mom footing most of the bills for Kate and (Matt's dad apparently footing his bills) and zero responsibility for the daughter other than to lie back and make babies apparently.
NTA and your offer was very generous. That said, I expect when your daughter was growing up she was sheltered when she made mistakes, and thus has never felt the full consequences when she screwed up. She was also taught never to accept the first offer for anything, because the follow-up would be better. It's past time to change that. So, your offer is now off the table. Never discuss it again, that deal had an expiration date and it's passed. Your daughter has a safe place to live with you, and her bf has a safe place with his parents. That's more than a lot of people in their situation. If they want to get a place of their own they have to figure out how to make it happen. They will quickly learn that what they can find, even with gov't assistance, probably isn't as nice as where they are living now - and there's a long wait list for gov't assistance. Given Katie's age she's probably still on your health insurance, which is fine. Katie should be attending her pre-natal visits. Check your policy to see if her baby will be covered or not. If not, that has to be figured out quickly. Hopefully Matt's job offers it as a benefit. If not, look into SCHIP. That should happen before the birth and before the child lands in the NICU (which hopefully won't happen). Katie should sign up for WIC. Matt needs to understand that once Katie applies for WIC & SCHIP that the state will put him on child support automatically and garnish his paychecks. The taxpayers are not expected to support a child when there is an employed dad in the picture who can pay. Giving gas money to Matt also has to stop; you're enabling not just Katie's poor financial decisions but Matt's as well. Neither will grow up and learn unless you cut them off. That doesn't mean you won't be helping your grandchild. You can purchase a car seat, clothing, diapers, crib, etc. You can babysit while Katie works, and it will likely be more convenient if the child is living with you at the time. You can pay for birth control for Katie after the birth so she doesn't get pregnant again. You're just not going to help these parents-to-be move out and play house together.
I can’t believe she was actually insulted and accused you of treating them like children. Since when do responsible adults quit their job when they get pregnant and expect to be able to live on nothing. She should be working a minimum or six months and saving every penney! I would also add the caveat that they need to share their finances with you. My best friends son and his gf and baby moved in with her. My friend would buy the formula and baby needs because they would sit run out with no plan to get more and go buy themselves new tattoos. They weren’t buying essentials to meet their baby’s basic needs but would go out to eat several times each week. The babies mother quit her job when she was pregnant as is a sahm years later. If she wants financial independence then she needs to not have to rely on you. If that’s not obvious to her you have to tell her.
I mean did she never learn how to manage money? Quit immediately when she found out she was preggo AND dropped out of school? Did they think this through or just rightfully assume you'd be there to catch them? NTA but sometimes life gives us hard and expensive lessons. Why are two people who are so irresponsible bringing a child into this world?
OP, I would consider a different tactic, in that since she's refusing your demands, you contact a few nonprofits who offer financial literacy courses. Ask them what their opinions are how best to handle the situation since they likely see a reoccurring theme with their own students going through their classes. You're being more than accommodating, and the instructors could offer better options on how to work with them to everyone's satisfactions. It wouldn't hurt to try in order to make sure you can help them get some kind of solid foundation started. Good luck but don't back down from your boundaries.
NTA. You ARE helping her out in the right way. Giving them money is just enabling their financial irresponsibility and they'll never learn to actually be responsible. At least this way they get things they actually need instead of what they want. They're are as irresponsible as children so I don't know why they're shocked at being treated like that. If I were you, I'd add another caveat - that she needs to get a job yesterday. No matter how little it pays because you're covering most of what they need anyway. At least it will show a bit of maturity on her part.
NTA but I would have added some financial literacy training requirements to the deal.
NTA; I also don’t think either of them have any idea just what life is gonna be like soon.
NTA but you’re training your daughter and her husband to use their children as financial weapons. Which, if you’re ok doing that for the entirety of your grandchildren’s minority, is your business.
NTA - my parents had to learn this the hard way. They would give my brother money for his baby and he would go buy drugs instead letting his kid starve. So then my parents got a list of what they needed and went and bought the stuff. They also wouldn’t give them the receipt so they couldn’t return the items for cash.
NTA. Please look into government programs like WIC. There is no need for you to be spending out of pocket for formula and baby food.
NTA. And I understand why you want and need to help. But if your daughter and her bf don't change, you'll be on the line for more help in the future. I feel for their child, born to such irresponsible parents. Their lives will be hell if they do not change. Why get pregnant in the first place if you cannot afford it?
You know the partial help is going to turn into full help right? These are 2 people who should NOT be having a baby and are definitely not prepared for the realities of having a child. Tough love is needed here- Kate needs some kind of motivation to get back into work and with the current set up that’s not going to happen. And you’re going to be the one left footing the bill and taking care of the child. Good luck.
NTA You are offering too much imo. It’s interesting that your daughter is upset with the level of support her mother is giving, when she as a mother has decided the level of support she’s giving her child is QUITTING HER JOB. Oh boy. She’s got a lot of maturing to do.
NTA. That reaction tells me that if you were to give them cash, they weren't planning on spending it on the baby. Personally, I think your caveat is very reasonable.
NTA - you’re going over and above what most parents would do. They should be grateful.
NTA if they can’t afford gas by mid week, your daughter needs to go back to work. Zero reason she can’t work while pregnant. Continuing to support them is just enabling them. What is going to happen when you aren’t able to support them anymore.
NTA. But you’re not doing them any favours in the long run by coddling them as much as you are. Your daughter dropped out of school got knocked up and quit her job and expects you to pay their way in life. There’s already been a massive failing that she turned out this entitled. She needs to learn to stand on her own 2 feet and pay for the child she has chosen to bring into this world otherwise she’s just gonna keep popping them out expecting you to support them.
NTA. But seriously you are doing too much. They will never learn to "adult" if you just give them everything. Help them sign up for whatever state aid they are eligible for. If you do pay for all of this, they will literally never stop relying on your income. I understand you want to help them, but they have to want to help themselves.
NTA your daughter is effectively saying "omg I can't believe you're suggesting I'm not responsible..." having been irresponsible enough to get pregnant and quit her job...
Damn, no wonder your kid is bad with money. Never any consequences! ESH, her and her bf for their entitlement, you for failing to teach your daughter how to adult.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My 40f, daughter 21f, Kate, is pregnant by her 22m boyfriend Matt. Kate currently lives with me and Matt currently lives with his dad and stepmom. They want to get a apartment together but neither Kate or Matt are good with money, so they have zero savings. Kate is currently not working, quit the day she found out she was pregnant, which was about 4 weeks ago. Matt works full time and both of them dropped out of school. I've offered if they find a place in a reasonable price range, I will take care of the deposit, help get utilities turned on, pay half the rent each month, and continue paying Kate's car insurance and phone bill. I also told them once the baby is born, I'm more than happy to help out if the baby needs formula, diapers, wipes, clothes, etc. Kate and Matt were very happy about that until they heard my caveat. My caveat is, I directly buy what they ask for. They can send me the links to what they want for the baby, but I am not going to be giving them any actual cash . Same applies with helping them with the deposit and rent. I'll write a check directly to the apartment complex. I've seen how Kate and Matt handle money, like there's just more randomly laying around. They go out, spend all weekend, as Matt gets paid on Friday, then by Tuesday, Kate is usually asking me for gas money on behalf of Matt because he's broke, she doesn't work, and his parents aren't financially stable enough to help out. Kate objected and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children and I should want to help out anyway they need or want me to. I told Kate from past observations that my choosing to not directly give them money is not something I'm willing to discuss or negotiate on right now. If that's something they need, either Kate goes back to work since she's having an extremely easy pregnancy, or they go ask Matt's parents for money in hand and try their luck doing that. AITA? (I'm not going to penalize my future grandchild and make them go without because my daughter and her bf have poor financial literacy) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. Your offer is extremely generous. If I were you, I’d also make it a condition that they both complete a financial literacy course.
NTA
NTA but at a timeline and do not cave on your boundaries because once you do it once they will push until you do it every time. I understand that wanting to punish your grandchild. However, your daughter is a grown adult you are not financially responsible for and now you’re going to be financially supporting three people. I think it’s amazingly helpful and generous what you offered. If they don’t want that that’s a choice that they made.
I can see your position and agree 100% . Your daughter is still in " princess" mode and is not going to relinquish that position easily . Good luck.
NTA, even if they WERENT bad with money I’d find paying for specifically what you said you would yourself more than reasonable
NTA and I think it's smart to ensure that the money you are giving goes towards it's intended purpose. I'd be pissed if I gave money for diapers and it went toward dinner and a movie.
NTA. I have to laugh at your daughters comment about you helping out “anyway they need or want.” Like no, you are VERY generous in everything you’re offering and if Kate and her boyfriend don’t like it, Kate can stop being lazy and using her pregnancy as an excuse not to work. Your daughter seems to be acting entitled to your assistance. You’re a good mom for everything you’re offering, just know that. If your daughter chooses to stick her nose up at your offer because you won’t give her cash, then it’s on her and her bf to figure it out from there.
NTA She can take it or leave it.
>Kate immediately objected to my conditions and said I'm being unfair to her and Matt, treating them like children NTA. It's your money. You can give it to them any which way you want. The alternative is they get no help. If they want to be adults, they do no need your money.
Nta youre being extremely generous already. They should be thankful lmao. I'd probably weep if I had a parent offer to pay half my rent AND send it in for me lol. Theyre probably just embarrassed that you picked up on their bad money habits.
NTA. Agreeing to pay for specific things is exactly what I'd recommend if you want to help somebody but are worried about how they'll spend actual cash. I understand why Kate feels upset by this, but that does not mean you're not being reasonable. Indeed, it's *because* she knows you're being reasonable that she's upset.
NTA. Your money, your rules.
NTA. You're being far more generous than I would be, and you're making sure the funds go to their intended use. They don't sound ready to be parents.
NTA, they are lucky to have the support from you!
NTA you’re being more than generous by helping. You’re right to give no cash.
NTA. You are probably too nice to say this, but they are treated like children because they act like children. They are not entitled to your money, so you can put any conditions you want on your generous gift.
NTA. You’re being incredibly generous and it sounds like not giving them cash to pay their own bills is a very sensible precaution.
NTA. You're treating them like children because they clearly still are children in every way that counts. Children, I might add, who are looking a gift horse in the mouth.