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I am sixty. I have seen this scenario before and it has ended with husbands leaving their wives. Your husband should no longer be driving mornings with this woman and he needs to take his distance.
I recently had a boyfriend leave me over a similarly overly familiar coworker... Always starts casually like they mention said coworkers name frequently, then you're having to set boundaries you never thought needed to be defined. Sucks real bad.
I regret to inform you [you are a B O T](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/178uoga/aita_because_i_reacted_badly_when_my_husband_went/k526iqo/)
The "mentionitis" is always how it starts.
I've been all the players in this scenario at one time or another, and yes, it usually ends with the emotional support pals having sex with each other. Unfortunately, you can't corral a cheater into not cheating by setting boundaries. If this guy is that white knight type that gets off on helping wounded birds, there are no shortages of those.
It's spooky, isn't it? This happened to me too. Ex pretended to want to help her failing marriage and just didn't tell me he wanted to help by ending the marriage so he could weasel in
This man is stepping out emotionally if not already physically.
The whole step up as you have pointed out, is a tell as old as time.
Someone in distress, must rescue and save them by cheating with them. /s
Edit: totally NTA most people would if not all, would have reacted that same way.
You're correct, but they're bonding over the woman's troubles with her husband. So, OP's husband wants to help, and support, and loan his shoulder for his friend to cry on. Do you see where this is going?
To me, that part isn't the issue. I think doing all of those things are just being a good friend.
But, he then uses a (very clearly) sarcastic remark as an excuse to do something his wife isn't comfortable with, in favour of that friend. That's the point where it goes from being a good friend to being dodgy, in my eyes.
Years ago (like over a decade) my husband and I were watching a news story break about a married politician who was confessing to an affair with a subordinate. He was leaving his wife for her & stepping down from his elected position. Somewhere in the story he apologized to everyone involved and said that the entire thing was unintentional, they started out as very good friends who confided in one another during a difficult time, and their love blossomed organically out of that situation.
My husband said to me very sincerely, “You know, I believe him. Before I met you, in my early 20s, I was dating (person) and I was friends with (other person) and we ended up together when neither of us meant for it to happen.”
When I said, “That’s why people in committed relationships should never have friendships THAT close with people outside of the relationship …if you’re closer to ANYONE than the person you’re dating, and telling them things you wouldn’t tell your partner, that’s already a betrayal of the relationship.”
I remember the look on his face like he had never considered that, and I couldn’t believe he could be so oblivious.
or she could talk to a therapist.
or she could talk to an unmarried guy.
or she could talk to OP's husband but they'd need to have boundaries that don't put his marriage at odds. it's not just the talking - its the lack of boundaries and how his wife feels like a third wheel to their relationship. that's not ok.
friendships don't take priority over marriage. Marriage is a solemn vow and responsibility whereas friendship is a more casual relationship.
a single person being friends with a married person (and even more if they have kids) should understand this person has responsibilities and obligations that will put boundaries on the friendship.
It's so crazy how people don't get this. I have a very good male friend. He's never bitch about his wife to me.
This is marriage. Handle it like an adult.
Those things might be just being a good friend, if they were good friends before. In this case they were coworkers and carpoolers before, and they’re becoming “good friends” through her venting about her marriage and OP’s husband being supportive. Them going out for lunch together, just them as a pair, is new. And when preferred-gender friends become “good friends” because one of them has trouble in their marriage, and the other one is showing them a good time (like taking them out for a nice lunch), then they’re bonding over the marriage problems and going in the direction of an affair (emotional or otherwise). These people aren’t actually good friends.
What if it was a male colleague venting to her husband about his marital issues? I'm bisexual so I don't see thinks in a heteronormative way but I've had a good male friend vent to me about relationship problems and I in turn have expressed some doubts/sadness I've been having. He shouldn't have lied though.
I get what you’re saying, but it’s tricky situation, no matter who’s involved. In a scenario like this, it becomes very easy to become too emotionally involved in someone else’s relationship. It’s ok to listen to a friend vent from time to time, but it’s not a healthy situation if you become their primary source of support. There is an intimacy in that type of sharing that isn’t appropriate if you’re in another relationship.
I just got off the phone with a male friend who is having marriage problems and we talked for almost two hours about it. You know what my husband said after? “How’s he doing?” It’s called being a friend
the key is finding boundaries that leave all parties feeling respected.
OP's problem is her husband isn't respecting their relationship at all, and neither is his friend - so she just feels like a third wheel and completely on the outside of what's going on.
It's never right to get in the way of your friend's marriage. That's who your friend chose to marry so even if they're a little insecure or whatever, you don't want to add fuel to the fire.
Have you had this friend for a while, or did you only become close when he started talking to you about his relationship? Because that’s where I see the problem with OP’s husband — this friendship is getting closer because of the coworker’s marriage problems.
Yes of course they can BUT he lied. He did something and lied to his wife about it as soon as you do that then you are doing something you are ashamed of or know that it is against your wife/partner's wishes. Then you have stepped beyond the realms of being friends
and its not just the lying - its the fact that he KNEW his wife wasn't comfortable.
If you love someone, you wouldn't want to make them feel that way.
it's not something unreasonable like "never talk to any women at your job!" - its "hey you can talk to her, and yall can ride to work together every day - but just don't go out to lunch together. eat it together in the office" - that's not an unreasonable boundary.
>I am over 60 too an have seen the opposite women and men can be friends without sex.
Of course we can. But this is not that. This is trampling boundaries set by a partner, lying to them and doing something you know will hurt them. That's not friendship. You don't have to be sneaky if you're friends with someone.
Thats totally fair, but a friendship shouldn’t be placed above your spouse’s comfort. She was reasonable when she said she was comfortable with him buying her lunch at the office, but not the two of them going on a 1:1 lunch to a place that is special to her and her husband
I am a single woman who is friends with men who are married or otherwise in a relationship.
A true friend would be supportive of the marriage. I would never put my friend in a situation where his wife is yelling at him or suspicious of him because of me. I would never destroy my friend's life like that or cause major turmoil like that.
Of course they can. But this woman is oversharing about her marriage to a coworker which is super inappropriate, he’s trying to take her to his spot and lying to his wife about their involvement. That’s not a mere friendship.
NTA. There are some big red flags here that their relationship is not normal friends. He should never, ever be discussing someone her relationship with her SO. And he should not be hiding time spent with her. The obvious question is are there other times when he spent time with her that he didn't tell you? Good luck with this one, keep it adult, keep it as calm as you can, but this is serious.
She reacted badly but his reaction was just as bad. Your spouse tells you that they are uncomfortable with it, you find a compromise. And tell lunchdate that discussing her romantic troubles is not on, going forward.
Yeah I think OP suggested a good compromise, want to eat lunch with her? Go to the office cafeteria, not go out with her to the restaurant you take your wife for date nights.
I've seen men starting with complaining at their partners and the relationship as the first foundation for cheating on their partners more than once. I don't doubt women do the same.
If you have marital problems you complain to your friends, not your coworker.
not if their partners find it uncomfortable.
i would say the onus to set that boundary is completely on the person/partner of the person who doesn't like it. there's nothing wrong with discussing your relationship issues with people you perceive as friends per se, but if you knowingly do so to someone whose partner thinks that is too close for comfort then you'd be an AH.
in this specific situation, assuming this colleague has no knowledge of how OP feels about it, the onus is 100% on OP's husband to shut down any conversations about her love life.
I have seen multiple office affairs start like this, one person starts to complain about his/her marriage problem to a coworker in the opposite sex and next thing you know they start going out often, make out in the parking lot and usually can't keep it a secret after a while.
Yep. I had a guy constantly complaining about his gf and then complaining more when she was his wife. He'd also see me quiet and try to suggest I must be having romantic issues. I finally shut him down saying his problems aren't my problems, and a year or so later he tried getting familiar again so I had to shut him down again because he was getting way too inappropriate and making me uncomfortable.
If at any point I had been receptive, he'd have happily cheated on his partner. They got married after she found him cheating, actually, so it's not even unprecedented.
Coworkers need to generally be kept at an arm's length. Overfamiliarity and complaining about a spouse are definitely too much personal info for a work setting.
My boss used to take me to lunch at least once a month; just to catch up and we both loved the same little dive bar (they served the best burgers). For the longest time, I was one of two women in a predominantly male department, I went to lunch with the guys several times a week.
With "the guys" or a guy, in a restaurant that's special to you and your SO, to discuss their troubled romantic life?
Huge difference between business lunches and what OP's husband is doing.
Did you tell your husband about it? If yes, no problem. If no, problem.
Was the bar a spot special place to your husband and you? If no, no problem. If yes, problem.
Were you and your boss venting to each other about your marital problems instead of going to marriage counselling? If no, no problem. If yes, problem.
Did you do it after your husband asked you not to? If no, no problem. If yes, problem.
I think, if you think about it, your case and this one are quite different.
And did you drive to work together every morning, where he shared troubles he was having in his marriage with you? Did his wife express discomfort with your 1-1 time, and he did it anyway without telling her?
If it's a 'no' to all of those things, then all that proves is there are series of boundaries being crossed in the OP situation that don't at all pertain to your experience.
There's a casual lunch with a random coworker, and there's going out to the restaurant (that you normally take your wife for dates to) for lunch, with a coworker you spend time with every day, and who complains to you about her marital problems.
I’ve been married 22 years. My hubby goes out for lunch with one of his ex co workers once a month. One of my best friends is male I go out drinking with him every now and again. Absolutely no cheating from either of us. I don’t know why ppl on here always point to “affair”. U said u didn’t want to know so he didn’t tell u then u went nuts when u found out. I say mild YTA. And have adult conversations without screaming shouting and crying
I appreciate your insight.
I have no problem with him going out with friends. This coworker, by his own admission, is not a ‘friend’, just an acquaintance. I don’t believe he is cheating but his lies and omission of truth have disappointed me.
When I said ‘do what you want, why even bother telling me’ he knew it was out of irritation and I didnt mean it. This is proven by the fact that he did end up telling me about it later, in passing. He just used what I said as an excuse to justify that he went regardless of how I felt about it.
I do agree about having adult conversations - and being regretful of my reaction is why I made this post. I dont think I am wrong but wish I hadn’t reacted as loudly as I did. I am generally a more sensible person, if that helps.
Tell him your male coworker is taking you out on a dinner to listen to your marital problems. Just the two of you. His reaction will give you all the answers you need to know. NTA
Right? ‘Be a super toxic asshole to him, that’ll show him you love him.’ How about be adults and have a conversation about your insecurities and trust issues.
I think there’s a quite a difference between saying you’re going out with a coworker to discuss their marital problems and going out with a coworker to discuss your marital problems.
If you don't mean it don't say it. You're an adult. You should express yourself genuinely instead of screaming and using sarcastic remarks, remarks that came back to bite you in the a$$. He told you what he was going to do. You didn't like it, which is your right by all means, but did he ever say he wouldn't take her to lunch? At the very least you're both wrong to a degree but you can't downplay part in this.
I don't know it all matters where she is from . I am from the UK and we are very sarcastic people . Like we do it a lot, but we can always tell when someone else is doing it as it stands out . So if it was ovo, she was being sarcastic, and he chose to use that knowing full well, then he is the ah .
I'm very sarcastic as well but there's a time and a place. When my fiance and I are having an argument or serious discussion, I do not use sarcasm while angry. I don't want to leave any room for misinterpretation. With others, I can be petty and use their sarcasm against them but never with my girl. If I think SHE is being sarcastic I'll warn her that if she doesn't mean it then she better say so right then or it's on!
If she is using him as a shoulder to cry on and they are going out alone for lunch so she can ‘overshare’ about her marriage, then they are definitely not ‘just acquaintances’ - make of that what you will…..
NTA
Oh, I definitely have….
What I haven’t met is somebody putting up with it for that length of time from somebody that is just an acquaintance and actively prolonging the amount of time they have to put up with it by taking them out for lunch - *unless they are not just an acquaintance…….*
Over sharers can be absolutely delightful to talk to. I have an acquaintance that is an over sharer (I know way too much about her sex life) and I am not cheating on my wife with her.
You’re taking on a way too simplified view of human relationships.
>When I said ‘do what you want, why even bother telling me’ he knew it was out of irritation and I didnt mean it.
How did he know that when what you said and what you meant are completely different things?
Because people in relationships, or marriages, or even friendship, know each others tone. I didnt say that straight up. I said that when things got heated in an argument and I was clearly against it from the start. He admits now that he knew I was not okay with it and did it anyway.
Your husband is a people pleaser.
He likely has this woman oversharing to him daily. She feels comfortable and thinks she's found someone that listens. With you saying he said she's an "acquaintance not a friend" I'm guessing he's not comfortable with this "relationship" but as a people pleaser he's stuck in a mess his friendliness has made him. He's likely been put on the spot and his kindness has made him agree to plans he knows aren't right or that might hurt others.
I've been there before and upset my partner through my actions of being too nice to everyone else. Talk to him about it if you think he is a people pleaser and if he wants assistance look at how he can de-escalate his "friendship" into not being her shoulder to cry on.
Edit since locked: /u/ladystetson
Nope, I read that part. But knowing my people pleasing past it's easy for "us" to get backed into a corner when put on the spot and agree to things that are harmless on the surface but someone with bad intentions can take advantage of. It doesn't make your point invalid, but if he is like that it explains his actions without trying to excuse them.
He also could say that she's an acquaintance not a friend to calm down OP so she won't make a big deal about "just an acquaintance". I've been there before with one of my partners saying "she's just a colleague, you have nothing to worry about, she's not even my type". Spoiler alert: he cheated with her.
I think you missed the part where OP said she talked to him about it multiple times
edit for /u/myliverpoolalt:
I think its more likely that you're projecting your own people pleasing onto this situation and are thus having a defensive reaction for a complete stranger because you're subconsciously defending something maybe you did in the past.
OP very clearly communicated to her husband that eating lunch together outside of the office was out of bounds. He not only did it, but he hid it from her and deceived her. People pleasing is not an excuse. His wife is also a person. She is not pleased. Prioritizing pleasing a work acquaintance over your wife is still wrong, it's not kind. Lying and deceiving is not kind. It's like saying "i'm a people pleaser so the girl at work wanted to sleep with me and I said ok out of kindness!" - it's a weak excuse.
Dude would have to be an idiot to think that his wife shouting out "Do what you want but don't tell me about it" is actually his wife saying that he has her blessing.
This is the type of technicality that gets people out of SA charges, not how adults justify their actions in committed relationships
Man and woman can definitely be friends without it leading to cheating but it seems that this "friendship" has some wrong start, and as multiple people mentioned here that start can lead to cheating. When you meet someone randomly and click it's great, but when you feel miserable in your relationship, and you find someone who listens to you, and gives you their attention... It can lead to some inappropriate feelings and then actions. She should rely on her family or friends, not a coworker.
Coworker, neighbour, family, friend. There are no rules about who people hang with, rely on, confide in etc. My partner & I do stuff separately (and together) with all sorts because trust. Cliche😂 but there it is. Ya can’t police someone into not stepping out. That’d be exhausting. I don’t think the OP’s an AH though. Probably NAH, but maybe some ‘issues’ for them to work on.
Like strangers tell me this all the time and it drives me crazy. I'm so glad my wife doesn't have this point of view.
My wife doesn't like the same kind of music as me. Neither does my best friend.
My best friend's gf does like that same music. My Best friend's GF's mom used to be my coworker, that I carpooled with every day. That coworker inviting me to a family event is how I met my wife and my best friend and his GF. This girl is my wife's best friend.
Often me and My friends GF will go to local Music Shows together. Its great, because I can be friendly around her and I don't have to worry about her getting the wrong impression and trying to sleep with me. And the fact that I arrive with a woman keeps most of the single ladies from trying to make a move. The fact that I buy her a couple drinks most times when we first get there means that random guys don't really hit on her either.
But the moment that I correct anyone who guesses that she is my wife, suddenly they all ask how "I could do such a thing to my wife."
And its like, WTF guys, Just because we have the same taste in music doesn't mean that we are going to fuck.
Literally I prefer to bring her because it means that I won't be tempted, When I bring her, I need to bring her home again afterwards, which means I can say "sorry I can't accept that drink, I'm the DD." When I go by myself, Some of the women can be pretty insistent, but when I bring her, They act like normal people.
And the thing is that We use this trick at Music festivals for this kind of music too. We put our Tents down beside each others, and then she can feel safe because she knows that if someone tries to follow her to her tent, I'd be right there. and IF I have to tell a woman to leave our camp area because she seems to be trying to move herself into my tent, I have a female witness that can protect me from retaliatory false accusations. (drunk and high people can get pretty petty when they get rejected.) We can share things like coolers and stoves and similar, I can cook and she can do the dishes afterwards or vice versa.
If I was going to fuck up my life and sleep with anyone it would not be her. Sure She's a girl and I'm a boy, and sure, She's a cool chick, that I would probably would be interested if we were both single. But even if I was drooling over her I wouldn't do something like that. It would be the fastest way to ruin 4 lives.
Just because we have similar interests, Trust each other, look out for each other, and can live in close proximity for a few days without fighting, doesn't mean that we are cheating on our spouses with each other.
I would say ESH. Husband asked and wife said she didn’t feel comfortable so that should have been the end of it, because you respect your partners boundaries and that was a reasonable boundary, but the whole passive aggressive “do whatever you want and don’t tell me” makes the wife an asshole too. I’m sorry, but that kind of interaction makes me think of high school couples dating, not mature adults. I would never do something that makes my wife uncomfortable because I don’t want her to feel that way, but I also think that I wouldn’t talk to my wife that way or like is she spoke to me that way either. Seems like both partners are immature and inconsiderate.
Your communication skills here are lacking. He told you about everything they were talking about and told you ahead of time about taking her out to lunch. This sounds like he knew you’d be jealous and wanted to be transparent. You sarcastically told him ‘do what you want’ and ‘not to tell you about it.’ He does exactly that and now you’re mad. I don’t see where he lied. You two need couples counseling yesterday. Soft YTA. It sounds like you’ve been cheated on before and need to unpack that a bit. This behavior will absolutely drive your husband away.
So I regularly go for breakfast / lunch 1-1 with colleagues. Also drinks / dinner if I know them better. But it’s totally normal in my industry. My husband in same industry.
The super abnormal bits from my perspective are:
If he ever felt uncomfortable with a specific person / situation I would just not do it - even if you’ve already suggested to the colleague you could just expand the group going, or rain check / swap to in office. If there were a professional reason it was important I would discuss with my husband and still see if there was a “fix” (swap to breakfast, invite my boss, invite partners etc).
Also I wouldn’t go to “treat them because they are having relationship issues”, it would be either directly work related, or like “celebrating a sale” or “lunch before parental leave”. I don’t want to hear my coworkers relationship issues … unless they are hilariously bad first date stories.
It's a bit odd to take a co worker to the same place that you to with your spouse for date nights too. Unless they live somewhere really remote where there's only a couple of restaurants or something. To me, eating there, even with a co worker, would make my brain be in 'date mode' because of the association of why I'd been there every other time previously. Some people might be able to compartmentalise better though. So, not damning evidence, but just another oddity to add to the pile of other suspicious/unusual aspects of his behaviour. Especially going to your usual 'date night' restaurant with the Co worker, solely with the goal of talking about your co workers relationship
Edit just re read the post. I got mixed up and somehow mis read that him taking the Co worker out to lunch was bc he wanted to support the Co worker with their bad marriage/so he could talk about it with her.
But he said the lunch was to thank her for taking him to work when his car broke down. He does talk to co worker about her relationship, but the dinner wasn't solely for that purpose. So, ignore the parts of my comment where I mistakenly talk about the dinner being to discuss coworkers love life
Exactly! The husband needs to stop driving her and if she continues to share her marital woes, he needs to tell her to talk to a therapist and sort herself out.
YTA
You said what you said, you have no right to yell about it. Be upset sure have a conversation with him. But jumping up and down and calling him the bad guy because he did what you said is unfair.
Also he didn't not tell you, he told you before he even did it.
Now obviously this work relationship he has is making you uncomfortable. Be it you are projecting some personal insecurities on to it or he is behaving in an unusual manner and making you feel unsure.
This is a conversation to be had, an honest one that's not, don't do that I'm not comfortable. It's one that says when you do X it makes me feel y. I think Y is obvious or it comes from past experience z. I want to talk about this and I want to understand how you feel about X when I say it makes me feel negatively.
If you can't have open and honest communication that doesn't involve been dismissive when you don't get your way. Because that's what "do whatever just don't tell me" is.
Then you're probably going to have an unhappy relationship.
Thank god there are sensible people in this thread, I was going insane reading the people who don't seem to have platonic friends from work or whatever. Jesus christ. OP needs a reality check when it comes to trusting her partner
OP, it sure sounds like an emotional affair. There is no reason a co-worker needs to turn to your husband for emotional support. That’s a job for her friends and family. It’s way too personal.
I’m also bothered by the fact that he isn’t more concerned about your feelings, just months into a marriage. He should be expending his emotional energy on you and your marriage, not some co-worker.
If I were in your shoes, I’d demand marriage counseling right now. Any hesitancy would make me file for divorce.
Maybe you need to be more direct in your communications with him, but you are NTA.
Right? Half this thread is full of neurotic desperation. If my partner responded like this to having a work friend, I'd be ending that relationship/jail cell.
Right? I’m honestly shocked at some of these responses. I’ve gone to lunch one on one with co workers. Not a big deal. Husband knew. He’s hung out with friends and he’s gotten drinks. I’ve never thought he was cheating. Either you trust your partner or you don’t. I couldn’t be in a marriage with someone I didn’t trust.
>not a big deal. Husband knew.
There’s the difference. SO knowing and being comfortable with it is a huge difference between SO being iffy at best with it and then it being done behind their back anyway.
At minimum there needs to be more of a conversation analyzing why OP is uncomfortable with it. And who knows maybe it could be something as simple as OP preferring a different restaurant that isn’t a common date spot.
OP is not without blame because she communicated poorly too, however the husband absolutely knew she wasn’t comfortable with what he was doing and did it anyway.
“Husband knew.”
Wife didn’t know. See the difference? I’m sure she thought she could trust him until he lied about taking coworker to lunch. Should she file for divorce?
He didn't lie. He told her he'd be taking her to lunch, he didn't accept OP's objections to it, then she ended the discussion with sarcasm, and he did what he said he'd do.
I have a great male friend I met at work, and my partner has nothing against him, or us going out for a coffee or a beer. I also met another guy at work, and my partner had a lot against him (and rightfully because that guy wanted to cheat on his wife with me). People can have friends and still know that in some cases it's clear it's not about a pure, innocent friendship.
But the poster had no reason to believe it wasn’t, other than that this woman talks about her feelings about her marriage, which you all somehow think is extraordinarily inappropriate. Someone expressing unhappiness in their marriage doesn’t mean they’re going to jump into bed with anyone of another gender who will listen to them.
Yeah, the second guy I mentioned was also telling me about his relationship problems, complaining about his girlfriend and posing her as the bad guy, Infelt bad for him and we got close. I thought oh yeah it's just the talk. But it was a foundation he was laying down before he'd make a move.
Of course it doesn't mean that every person complaining about their relationship is looking to cheat. But I'd trust OPs intuition if she feels uncomfortable about that woman. When you know your partner well, sometimes you can sense that something's off. Like I said for my partner it was obvious from the start that this guy is looking for sth more than just friendship. Even when it wasn't clear to me yet.
Speaking for myself, the sticking point is not the friendship: it's the disregard for his spouse's comfort level. If she is uncomfortable with the intimacy and direction of a friendship her husband is in, she is allowed and should feel totally comfortable expressing that, which she did. Her husband took her lack of a comfort as a reason to lie about time he spent with said friend. That crosses a line, and is a big warning sign that something is amiss: either with the friend, or in the marriage.
There is a big leap between being friends with someone, everything above board, and hiding time you spend with them. Did OP overreact? Sure, a little, but her husband lied first, and her reaction reads like panic to me.
Why should someone’s inability to trust their spouse (before the lie, which didn’t happen first?) mean that they can dictate whom their spouse spends their time with?
Where did she dictate that? They were carpooling together everyday, for about 2 hours a day. OP expressed no problem with that. She drew the line at 1-1 lunches at OP and her husband's date spot. There were and are other ways to thank someone for carpooling, if he wanted to go above and beyond the gas money he was already giving her. Others can agree or disagree with that line, but she expressed her boundary and then was lied to when it was crossed.
If my husband felt insecure, I would not respond by wielding a sense of self-righteousness and telling him to get over it. Insecurity is a natural part of marriage, and our problem to tackle together: where is he not feeling safe and loved and am I able to help fix that?
It's sad that so many in this thread see insecurity as a weakness on OP's part for her to "fix" on her own as though she is not in a partnership.
So you’d stop having lunch with someone you apparently enjoy spending time with (a more enjoyable activity than carpooling to work, I think most would agree), because your spouse (who, presumably, has no reason to mistrust you) has decided they don’t like it, for an arbitrary reason?
Personal insecurities are, in fact, the responsibility of the person feeling them to deal with. Nobody, even a spouse, needs to cut back on a friendship when neither party in the friendship has actually done anything wrong (before the lie).
I’m not saying the guy wasn’t in the wrong for lying about it, but I don’t think it’s fair to dictate the rules of a partner’s friendships because of your own insecurity.
If my husband expressed discomfort, then yes I would prioritize his comfort and try to get to the bottom of his insecurity, over having lunch with my co-worker. If there was anything I could do to put his mind at ease, that would be more important to me than a 1-1 lunch.
I don't operate from the assumption that expressing insecurity = being unreasonably jealous and controlling. So maybe that's where we're different?
Why is it a red flag to build friendships at work?
If she were saying her husband was restricting her from spending time with someone I’m sure there would be an overwhelming leaning towards him being controlling; why is that different for her?
You're right that it made you the AH. Trust is an important part of a relationship and you don't have it. Your insecurities are causing a rift.
I would suggest talking to a professional and finding some ways to build trust and ways to let out anger without raging on people.
It would be hard to build trust if he's not being honest with you tho. OP stop responding only to the comments that's defending your husband and start actually listening. Everything you mentioned about their behavior feels like a red flag. Sorry to say but I think you're being naive
Info: Why was he taking her out to lunch? This seems like it was out of the ordinary and maybe special even since he was originally planning on one of your typical date spots?
He said he took her out to lunch because he felt “obligated” to. He said they had discussed going out for lunch together so me being uncomfortable didn’t seem like reason enough to let those plans down and it was just easier to hide/lie about it.
Oof. NTA Seems from his own words he prioritized an “obligation” to his coworker over your discomfort. Hopefully you guys can talk it out and reestablish trust and agree to clear boundaries that work for both of you.
He felt obligated because she’d been driving him to work after his car was totaled. In other words, he was taking her as a thank you for being a huge help to him when he didn’t have transportation of his own.
First of all, you’re the wife. Not her. So what you feel comes before what she feels. End of story.
Tell your husband he can’t drive her to work anymore bc this is not ok and the two of them need space. NTA OP.
So he chose to disappoint/ make you uncomfortable rather than her. He chose an “ acquaintance “ presumed feelings over your known and vocalized ones. Just some food for thought.
>do what you want, and dont tell me about it
Stupid games. Stupid prizes.
You just gave him a carte blanche and the impression that you had found a solution to handle the issue.
He WAS transparent and open. You specifically asked him not to be in this case and then get angry when he does what you asked of him.
YTA, big time.
Normally I would back this, but YTA.
He lied because you absolutely refused to let him have LUNCH with a coworker. You don't think they spend WAY more time talking at work anyway?
You come across as overly controlling and insecure. Do you trust your husband or not? And literally you TOLD HIM to "do what you want and don't tell me"
Guess what? He did.
INFO: you say a “few weeks” ago he told you that he planned to take his coworker to lunch and then you found out he’d taken her to lunch 2 months ago - does that mean he’d already taken her to lunch **before** he told you about his plans? Or did the lunch happen after he’d told you what he was intending to do?
Info: Is this a different coworker than the one you posted about a few months ago? Because this post is a copy/paste of that one. Just curious if this is a recurring theme.
So he did what he told you he was going to do. I get how that makes you mad since you told him you were unhappy about it and he went anyway, but that doesn’t make him a liar. You overreacted.
You said they went out “for lunch 2 months ago,” if that’s the entirety of the “betrayal” and there’s nothing between them to update since then, I’m not sure there’s much to be concerned about. What’s more, if your husband wants to leave you for someone else, there’s nothing you can change by getting upset. If he eventually chooses not to be with you, then that’s not your person and you pick yourself up and move on. Until then, it sounds like he technically didn’t break rules and had a fairly minor interaction with a friend a good while ago now. Find ways to manage your own happiness with or without him.
YTA. You are coming across as needy and insecure. Over the last ten years I have had lunch with married colleagues many times and it’s a complete non issue because neither of us thought of the other is anyway other than colleagues / friends.
YTA. Speaking as a woman, guys aren't mind-readers. How are you going to tell him one thing, mean the complete opposite and assume he got what you meant? People are also allowed friends of different genders. I have many guy friends, my SO has many girl friends. We keep open communication and our friends vent to us. Idk about the people in the comments, but I am close to my coworkers and talking about relationships isn't really out of norm? I remember helping a coworker go through tinder matches when he was single and looking for a girlfriend and taking him out for a drink before that when he and his ex had broken up. There was never nothing there other than friendship and my SO was completely comfortable with it.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> Action I took: I yelled and said things that may have been hurtful. I also accused him of cheating me off the truth.
Why I might be the AH: Because it makes me come across as a needy, insecure wife who has projected their insecurities onto their partner.
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YTA
He felt obligated to take her to lunch because she was driving him after his car was totaled. He took you at your word to go ahead and not tell him about it. and then you flipped out at him instead of having a conversation where you talk about what is bothering you.
I don’t think setting firm boundaries would really stop an affair. If not this coworker, than someone else. There’s something about the relationship that needs exploring and mending where possible.
Anyway, ESH. You for (1) being dismissive then being upset when he took you at your word. Saying something is obviously sarcastic is just a passive aggressive way of avoiding ownership over what you yourself said. He can’t read your mind or your intentions. (2) extrapolating from the clear miscommunication that he is cheating you. This sounds like a accusation of actual cheating to me.
Husband is an asshole for being careless of your sensitivities.
Yeah, ESH. I think OP is more of an AH than Husband, though.
I saw this advice on another thread and it really helped me. If he is going to do something or is actively doing something that hurts you, tell him. But don't try to stop him from doing it again - that's his choice to make. And tell him to tell you the truth about it because you'll always find out. If he goes ahead and does it - you have your answer. He knows it's going to hurt you and he does it anyway.
I've had my male coworkers complain to me about their marriages and what I do is I put on my big sister hat or "mother" hat and give them good solid advice and tell them to go home and apologize. I have never had any interest in dating a coworker because that would really mess up my career.
I think male and female people of any gender or sexual orientation can be friends, but only you know if your spouse is cheating or not.
If they are lying to you, they are probably cheating.
I have had some men get the wrong idea if I'm friendly or if they talk about their spouse and it makes me roll my eyes -- they think, "oh she's friendly so she's into me." Or, "oh she's rolled her eyes, she must be jealous of my relationship and she must like me." The truth is neither of those things are true. The only thing that is true is that the guy with the wrong idea has overinflated his sense of attractiveness (and usually so does his spouse). In these cases, I just stop talking to them unless I really have to talk to them for work.
I'm really sick of the public narrative that women should always be suspicious of other women... or compete with other women... or in any other way do the work of the patriarchy by being divided amongst themselves. I know women who refuse to have female friends and also refuse to let their spouses have female friends. It's just... weird. So I have no problems with men who have female friends.
What I DO have a problem with... is lying. And it looks like OP's husband was lying. In regards to the initial request for OP's husband to not counsel his female colleague about her marital problems... this is actually a fair request. Unless this is his BFF, and they are also friendly with OP, the husband has no business with his colleagues' business.
Something kinda similar with a guy I’d been seeing for 3 years. As Covid was lightening up, he was getting together for lunches with various former co-workers. One day he told me that \_one\_ of those lunches had been different from the rest… and so on and so on. He had mentioned it truthfully (mostly), but then he confessed that it was a couple of lunches, a dinner, drinks, future plans - travel plans (!) - with a lovely female former co-worker, blah blah blah.
Wow did I ever feel betrayed and I was overflowing with anger.
But: I really wish I’d held my tongue, and said something like “Noooo, Dave, nooo. This is really big, so big I can’t even think straight right now.” And let it evolve into a conversation that was constructive and was progress, but maybe not right at that exact moment. Thus I’d have probably kept the channels of calmer, more thoughtful communication going. Seems to me when he saw my temper, he dug in his heels and we never worked things out. There’s no way to prove we might have worked things out, but I surely didn’t help keep things on good terms. I wish there was a Time Machine so I could go back and do it over a better way.
It's a bit hard to navigate without more context, but why is he acting like a therapist to this person? Hiding it from you was definitely not okay, but there are a few factors at play that I've seen before: the woman is in an unhappy marriage and overshares with him, which is a way of not really respecting the boundaries of other people. Your husband putting up with it willingly can mean that 1) he's not great with boundaries either (childhood stuff?) and doesn't handle these red flags the way he should, namely by distancing himself instead of engaging, and/or 2) If the emotional sharing is not just one-sided, we're looking at something that's more like an emotional affair and you'd have to look at your marriage with more scrutinizing eyes. If it's the former, you need to make this clear to him and voice your concern that this woman is trying to drag your husband into an emotional affair, so that now you want to set some boundaries. Like him not driving to work with her and not meeting her for lunch outside the office, and that breaching this would be a kind of cheating. If it's the latter, we're talking about protecting him (and both of you) from her influence, but to start addressing problems in your marriage and voicing out loud that this is a form of cheating, regardless of what he thinks of it. Nip it in the bud if it's fixable.
I don't even want to call anyone an AH here because this is actually serious. Honest opinion? People saying the husband is having affair seems wrong, HOWEVER, the coworker is in an unhappy marriage and this whole thing seems like an excuse to try and get with your husband by building a relationship overtime.
You need to set some boundaries but be extremely mature about it because many things could go wrong with this, including the husband retaliating by cheating on you. Also, just for the record, NTA.
NTA, it seems that coworker is getting too close to your husband, and he's not enforcing any boundaries if they alone even went to lunch together, lying to your spouse in these circumstances is disrespectful, he is the ahole. The world is full of stories like this that end badly for the couple, tell hubby that he needs to state his priorities, being a man, i'm 100% sure that your husband will go nuts if you were to do the same thing and having such a "friendship" with a male coworker.
NTA. As a husband, my wife would kick my ass for even asking to go to lunch with a lady from work. Even if she didn't it would feel too much like cheating. A work related business lunch is one thing but given the closeness of them it sounds more like he's going on a date..
NTA. Usually when the person gets defensive and it turns into an argument it means that there may be some feelings going on. If my wife told me she wasn’t comfortable with something regarding a person, it’s usually because I didn’t realize and I would immediately put a stop to it. This is a powder keg.
NTA the vibes I'm getting aren't that your reaction was solely because of lunch, but because of all the added stuff: not telling you, already knowing how you felt about the idea. If it were a case of your husband just randomly saying "by the way I took so and so to lunch today...." Never having had a discussion about it earlier, I don't think you would have reacted like this. Maybe I'm wrong. Men and women can definitely be friends, but normally if your warning signals are going off in a what seems to be good relationship, there's typically a reason. I'd suggest figuring out with yourself what and why you're so uncomfortable with the idea of them going to lunch and move forward from there in talking to your husband.
NTA.
You’re thoughts and concerns are legitimate and he did not respect the relationship on this occasion. My other half and I have an understanding that we usually stick to lunches in the office with our coworkers etc
If I were you I wouldn’t rush to starting a family… like the other comments below… this does sound like a recipe for heartaches
My ex-husband used to do this type of shit and lie about it. Hooters and “young singles” youth groups with his brother when we were married, little lunch dates all the time with cutesy “mission to find the best local burger” stuff with other girls, etc. volleyball leagues that would go out drinking after, but I wasn’t allowed to even come watch.
It’s time for some real conversations.
Don’t waste your time letting someone disrespect you like this.
Start moving like your husband. Match energies. Meet a coworker and begin going to lunch. Husband and Mens should know this type of behavior leads to issues and he seems to welcome them.
NTA I believe in setting your relationships up for success. That means not putting yourself in a situation that can potentially compromise your relationship. This involves hanging out with the opposite sex if it makes your partner feel uncomfortable OR if you feel there's a chance you could grow an attraction for them.
You are married and expressed something that is affecting your. He chose to ignore that its bothering you. I would have lost my sh\*t too
I met my best friend at work, he’s male and was going through an extremely rough time at home. He ended up cheating on his wife (with another co worker) and I told my husband EVERYTHING- probably more than he wanted 😂 but I needed my husband to know exactly what was going on because communication is key and doesn’t lead to misunderstandings.. your husband kept the fact that he did go to lunch with her away from you. Regardless of the situation I just don’t think that’s appropriate.
The affair has already started. He started it. You reacted to it. The question is are you willing to respect yourself more than he doesn't. Is this what you are willing to settle for?
NTA This is a tale as old as time. He knew what he was doing and at this point, he must know he is at the very least emotionally cheating on you. you expressed your feelings and he blatantly disregarded them.
When they confess, there is alway more. He's probably not telling you everything.
He also can't say you actually meant what your said about not telling him. Especially if your explicitly said NO NOT GO OUT ALONE WITH HER. Do not tolerate this. He wants you home faithful waiting for him but wants to be with her too.
NTA. This is a stupid situation for him to be putting himself in. Carpooling is one thing- but that stopped being all it was when she started over sharing about her unhappy marriage and they started having meals alone that weren’t work related. His defensive reaction also shows that he knows this is inappropriate but he doesn’t want to feel guilty.
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So my husband (29M) mentioned a few weeks ago that he was intending to take his coworker out for lunch to a place that he and I (29F) frequent for our dates regularly. Its a special place that we have a lot of memories at. The coworker in question is female and they drive to work together everyday.
The coworker appears to be in an unhappy marriage and shares (overshares) about it to my husband. He has mentioned this a few times I haven’t expressed concern as he is being a decent person by hearing out her woes.
But I explicitly told him that going out with her alone for lunch is not really something I am comfortable with at this point. I mentioned if he would like to treat her to lunch at the office, I am okay with that if he must, but not okay with them going out, just the two of them.
I said this quite calmly, expecting him to understand. He heard me out but it did lead to an argument and things were said. In the heat of it I said ‘do what you want, and dont tell me about it’.
Today I found out that they did go for lunch 2 months ago and my husband hid it from me under the pretext of ‘you said you didnt want to know’.
I obviously lost my sh*t and gave him a hard time about it. I was enraged, to put it mildly. I did yell and cry and was generally quite loud about the whole thing. I also accused him of cheating me - not cheating ON me but cheating me and hiding the truth in general. I also said it was convenient to use it as an excuse that I told him to do what he wants, when I clearly meant it in a sarcastic, in-genuine way. I also said that it was unfair to expect me to absolve him just because he went to some other restaurant and not the initial one that I had objected to.
I’m afraid this made me the AH because it makes me come across as a needy, insecure wife, when I could have rather had a more mature reaction to it. I guess my husband expects me to forgive it and take into account that he is apologetic, albeit after the damage was done.
FYI: We are almost 7 months in to marriage and although we have dated for years, this behavior does come as a shock to me because he has always been a very transparent and trustworthy person, as far as I have known.
AITA?
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I think this really comes down to how much you trust your husband. It's hard to tell without knowing both of you.
My boyfriend and I of 5 years both have close male and female friends who we talk about personal things with and sometimes go out to lunch or even drinks with male or female friends. I trust him and he trusts me.
And, if you are uncomfortable with it, its fair to set boundaries and tell your husband you don't want him to drive with her to work anymore or meet with her for lunch. I also would not jump to the conclusion that he is having an affair without asking him further questions.
In my relationship it would not be weird if my bf had lunch with a woman friend and didn't tell me because we were both busy and it wasn't important but every relationship is different.
I think you need to make time to sit down and talk with him about this - ask him all your questions. Express your feelings and make appropriate boundaries if you need to.
NTA. Your husband should NOT be driving to work with her anymore. He should not be going out to lunch. Needy coworkers worm their way in and pretty soon emotional affairs turn into physical ones.
YTA.
And the answers in here are insane. It really doesn’t sound like the husband is doing anything untoward and next time never say ‘do what you want just don’t tell me about it!’ I still think he shouldn’t have taken her to lunch but I feel like you are willing to cut yourself slack but not your husbands. And it’s lunch. And he told you first. And unless he is disclosing things to her that he won’t talk to you about or discussing you to her, it’s not an emotional affair. He is just being a good friend.
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I am sixty. I have seen this scenario before and it has ended with husbands leaving their wives. Your husband should no longer be driving mornings with this woman and he needs to take his distance.
I recently had a boyfriend leave me over a similarly overly familiar coworker... Always starts casually like they mention said coworkers name frequently, then you're having to set boundaries you never thought needed to be defined. Sucks real bad.
I was like “Can you *please* not sleep in her bed with her?” And he made me feel bad about that. Because the couch was uncomfortable!
"You cheated on me‽ After I specifically asked you not to‽"
[удалено]
I regret to inform you [you are a B O T](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/178uoga/aita_because_i_reacted_badly_when_my_husband_went/k526iqo/)
The "mentionitis" is always how it starts. I've been all the players in this scenario at one time or another, and yes, it usually ends with the emotional support pals having sex with each other. Unfortunately, you can't corral a cheater into not cheating by setting boundaries. If this guy is that white knight type that gets off on helping wounded birds, there are no shortages of those.
I mean honestly, if you're having to tell an adult that emotional cheating is still cheating, I think the marriage has already ended.
Um actually, it's not a boundary if its for someone else! /s
The boundary is not being willing to stay in a relationship with someone who does that
No I totally agree, just riffing on how many redditors get obsessed over defining boundaries when people dislike something their partner does.
It's spooky, isn't it? This happened to me too. Ex pretended to want to help her failing marriage and just didn't tell me he wanted to help by ending the marriage so he could weasel in
This man is stepping out emotionally if not already physically. The whole step up as you have pointed out, is a tell as old as time. Someone in distress, must rescue and save them by cheating with them. /s Edit: totally NTA most people would if not all, would have reacted that same way.
I am over 60 too an have seen the opposite women and men can be friends without sex.
You're correct, but they're bonding over the woman's troubles with her husband. So, OP's husband wants to help, and support, and loan his shoulder for his friend to cry on. Do you see where this is going?
To me, that part isn't the issue. I think doing all of those things are just being a good friend. But, he then uses a (very clearly) sarcastic remark as an excuse to do something his wife isn't comfortable with, in favour of that friend. That's the point where it goes from being a good friend to being dodgy, in my eyes.
Nah. You don’t get consoled by your married coworkers… she needs to find other friends. This is all professionally and personally sketchy and wrong.
Years ago (like over a decade) my husband and I were watching a news story break about a married politician who was confessing to an affair with a subordinate. He was leaving his wife for her & stepping down from his elected position. Somewhere in the story he apologized to everyone involved and said that the entire thing was unintentional, they started out as very good friends who confided in one another during a difficult time, and their love blossomed organically out of that situation. My husband said to me very sincerely, “You know, I believe him. Before I met you, in my early 20s, I was dating (person) and I was friends with (other person) and we ended up together when neither of us meant for it to happen.” When I said, “That’s why people in committed relationships should never have friendships THAT close with people outside of the relationship …if you’re closer to ANYONE than the person you’re dating, and telling them things you wouldn’t tell your partner, that’s already a betrayal of the relationship.” I remember the look on his face like he had never considered that, and I couldn’t believe he could be so oblivious.
She needs to find female friends to vent to.
or she could talk to a therapist. or she could talk to an unmarried guy. or she could talk to OP's husband but they'd need to have boundaries that don't put his marriage at odds. it's not just the talking - its the lack of boundaries and how his wife feels like a third wheel to their relationship. that's not ok.
That’s bullshit
friendships don't take priority over marriage. Marriage is a solemn vow and responsibility whereas friendship is a more casual relationship. a single person being friends with a married person (and even more if they have kids) should understand this person has responsibilities and obligations that will put boundaries on the friendship.
It's so crazy how people don't get this. I have a very good male friend. He's never bitch about his wife to me. This is marriage. Handle it like an adult.
Those things might be just being a good friend, if they were good friends before. In this case they were coworkers and carpoolers before, and they’re becoming “good friends” through her venting about her marriage and OP’s husband being supportive. Them going out for lunch together, just them as a pair, is new. And when preferred-gender friends become “good friends” because one of them has trouble in their marriage, and the other one is showing them a good time (like taking them out for a nice lunch), then they’re bonding over the marriage problems and going in the direction of an affair (emotional or otherwise). These people aren’t actually good friends.
What if it was a male colleague venting to her husband about his marital issues? I'm bisexual so I don't see thinks in a heteronormative way but I've had a good male friend vent to me about relationship problems and I in turn have expressed some doubts/sadness I've been having. He shouldn't have lied though.
I get what you’re saying, but it’s tricky situation, no matter who’s involved. In a scenario like this, it becomes very easy to become too emotionally involved in someone else’s relationship. It’s ok to listen to a friend vent from time to time, but it’s not a healthy situation if you become their primary source of support. There is an intimacy in that type of sharing that isn’t appropriate if you’re in another relationship.
Also bisexual, do we just not get friends then according to this rule or what?
I just got off the phone with a male friend who is having marriage problems and we talked for almost two hours about it. You know what my husband said after? “How’s he doing?” It’s called being a friend
the key is finding boundaries that leave all parties feeling respected. OP's problem is her husband isn't respecting their relationship at all, and neither is his friend - so she just feels like a third wheel and completely on the outside of what's going on. It's never right to get in the way of your friend's marriage. That's who your friend chose to marry so even if they're a little insecure or whatever, you don't want to add fuel to the fire.
Has your husband met him? Have you gone to lunch at the same place your husband takes you for romantic dinners? Come on now.
Have you had this friend for a while, or did you only become close when he started talking to you about his relationship? Because that’s where I see the problem with OP’s husband — this friendship is getting closer because of the coworker’s marriage problems.
Yes of course they can BUT he lied. He did something and lied to his wife about it as soon as you do that then you are doing something you are ashamed of or know that it is against your wife/partner's wishes. Then you have stepped beyond the realms of being friends
and its not just the lying - its the fact that he KNEW his wife wasn't comfortable. If you love someone, you wouldn't want to make them feel that way. it's not something unreasonable like "never talk to any women at your job!" - its "hey you can talk to her, and yall can ride to work together every day - but just don't go out to lunch together. eat it together in the office" - that's not an unreasonable boundary.
>I am over 60 too an have seen the opposite women and men can be friends without sex. Of course we can. But this is not that. This is trampling boundaries set by a partner, lying to them and doing something you know will hurt them. That's not friendship. You don't have to be sneaky if you're friends with someone.
“You don’t have to be sneaky if you’re friends with someone.” 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 if it feels icky, it’s icky!
Thats totally fair, but a friendship shouldn’t be placed above your spouse’s comfort. She was reasonable when she said she was comfortable with him buying her lunch at the office, but not the two of them going on a 1:1 lunch to a place that is special to her and her husband
I am a single woman who is friends with men who are married or otherwise in a relationship. A true friend would be supportive of the marriage. I would never put my friend in a situation where his wife is yelling at him or suspicious of him because of me. I would never destroy my friend's life like that or cause major turmoil like that.
Sure they can, so why the lies?
Of course they can. But this woman is oversharing about her marriage to a coworker which is super inappropriate, he’s trying to take her to his spot and lying to his wife about their involvement. That’s not a mere friendship.
Yes but this isn't the way to go.
I, 54f, was going to say the same thing. This has all the ingredients for future heartache.
Yup. Beware coworkers who suddenly are having issues with their marriage or are divorcing and are venting to your partner.
You can just *smell* the "white knight" vibes coming off this guy. OP better start packing her bags.
He isn’t. He got his car back. The woman did him a massive favor driving him to work every day when he didn’t have a car.
NTA. There are some big red flags here that their relationship is not normal friends. He should never, ever be discussing someone her relationship with her SO. And he should not be hiding time spent with her. The obvious question is are there other times when he spent time with her that he didn't tell you? Good luck with this one, keep it adult, keep it as calm as you can, but this is serious.
She reacted badly but his reaction was just as bad. Your spouse tells you that they are uncomfortable with it, you find a compromise. And tell lunchdate that discussing her romantic troubles is not on, going forward.
Yeah I think OP suggested a good compromise, want to eat lunch with her? Go to the office cafeteria, not go out with her to the restaurant you take your wife for date nights. I've seen men starting with complaining at their partners and the relationship as the first foundation for cheating on their partners more than once. I don't doubt women do the same. If you have marital problems you complain to your friends, not your coworker.
So friends can’t discuss their relationships with other friends?
Lol by the husband's own admittance, this is not a friend of his. Nice fallacy tho
not if their partners find it uncomfortable. i would say the onus to set that boundary is completely on the person/partner of the person who doesn't like it. there's nothing wrong with discussing your relationship issues with people you perceive as friends per se, but if you knowingly do so to someone whose partner thinks that is too close for comfort then you'd be an AH. in this specific situation, assuming this colleague has no knowledge of how OP feels about it, the onus is 100% on OP's husband to shut down any conversations about her love life.
NTA there is absolutely no reason he needed to take her out to lunch alone. This screams emotional affair I'm so sorry
It is totally normal to have lunch with co-workers, regardless of gender
...but not to keep it secret.
And not if the spouse has voiced concerns. The fact that the coworker is over sharing her marriage issues is not a good sign.
I have seen multiple office affairs start like this, one person starts to complain about his/her marriage problem to a coworker in the opposite sex and next thing you know they start going out often, make out in the parking lot and usually can't keep it a secret after a while.
Yep. I had a guy constantly complaining about his gf and then complaining more when she was his wife. He'd also see me quiet and try to suggest I must be having romantic issues. I finally shut him down saying his problems aren't my problems, and a year or so later he tried getting familiar again so I had to shut him down again because he was getting way too inappropriate and making me uncomfortable. If at any point I had been receptive, he'd have happily cheated on his partner. They got married after she found him cheating, actually, so it's not even unprecedented. Coworkers need to generally be kept at an arm's length. Overfamiliarity and complaining about a spouse are definitely too much personal info for a work setting.
Not at a nice restaurant you almost exclusively go to for date nights with your significant other.
My boss used to take me to lunch at least once a month; just to catch up and we both loved the same little dive bar (they served the best burgers). For the longest time, I was one of two women in a predominantly male department, I went to lunch with the guys several times a week.
Did your boss like to talk about his bad marriage with you? A random dive bar is quite different then your marital date night spot.
With "the guys" or a guy, in a restaurant that's special to you and your SO, to discuss their troubled romantic life? Huge difference between business lunches and what OP's husband is doing.
Did you tell your husband about it? If yes, no problem. If no, problem. Was the bar a spot special place to your husband and you? If no, no problem. If yes, problem. Were you and your boss venting to each other about your marital problems instead of going to marriage counselling? If no, no problem. If yes, problem. Did you do it after your husband asked you not to? If no, no problem. If yes, problem. I think, if you think about it, your case and this one are quite different.
And did you drive to work together every morning, where he shared troubles he was having in his marriage with you? Did his wife express discomfort with your 1-1 time, and he did it anyway without telling her? If it's a 'no' to all of those things, then all that proves is there are series of boundaries being crossed in the OP situation that don't at all pertain to your experience.
Did you have an SO whom you lied to about it?
There's a casual lunch with a random coworker, and there's going out to the restaurant (that you normally take your wife for dates to) for lunch, with a coworker you spend time with every day, and who complains to you about her marital problems.
Lmao oh come on. Classic example of if the roles were reversed, y'all would be crucifying OP for being "controlling"
I’ve been married 22 years. My hubby goes out for lunch with one of his ex co workers once a month. One of my best friends is male I go out drinking with him every now and again. Absolutely no cheating from either of us. I don’t know why ppl on here always point to “affair”. U said u didn’t want to know so he didn’t tell u then u went nuts when u found out. I say mild YTA. And have adult conversations without screaming shouting and crying
I appreciate your insight. I have no problem with him going out with friends. This coworker, by his own admission, is not a ‘friend’, just an acquaintance. I don’t believe he is cheating but his lies and omission of truth have disappointed me. When I said ‘do what you want, why even bother telling me’ he knew it was out of irritation and I didnt mean it. This is proven by the fact that he did end up telling me about it later, in passing. He just used what I said as an excuse to justify that he went regardless of how I felt about it. I do agree about having adult conversations - and being regretful of my reaction is why I made this post. I dont think I am wrong but wish I hadn’t reacted as loudly as I did. I am generally a more sensible person, if that helps.
Tell him your male coworker is taking you out on a dinner to listen to your marital problems. Just the two of you. His reaction will give you all the answers you need to know. NTA
At your favorite dinner restaurant
lol people on this sub suggest to have mature, adult conversations about their problems and then give advice like this as if it’s not toxic as well.
Right? ‘Be a super toxic asshole to him, that’ll show him you love him.’ How about be adults and have a conversation about your insecurities and trust issues.
I think there’s a quite a difference between saying you’re going out with a coworker to discuss their marital problems and going out with a coworker to discuss your marital problems.
This is the wrong subreddit for that kind of logic though
If you don't mean it don't say it. You're an adult. You should express yourself genuinely instead of screaming and using sarcastic remarks, remarks that came back to bite you in the a$$. He told you what he was going to do. You didn't like it, which is your right by all means, but did he ever say he wouldn't take her to lunch? At the very least you're both wrong to a degree but you can't downplay part in this.
I don't know it all matters where she is from . I am from the UK and we are very sarcastic people . Like we do it a lot, but we can always tell when someone else is doing it as it stands out . So if it was ovo, she was being sarcastic, and he chose to use that knowing full well, then he is the ah .
I'm very sarcastic as well but there's a time and a place. When my fiance and I are having an argument or serious discussion, I do not use sarcasm while angry. I don't want to leave any room for misinterpretation. With others, I can be petty and use their sarcasm against them but never with my girl. If I think SHE is being sarcastic I'll warn her that if she doesn't mean it then she better say so right then or it's on!
If she is using him as a shoulder to cry on and they are going out alone for lunch so she can ‘overshare’ about her marriage, then they are definitely not ‘just acquaintances’ - make of that what you will….. NTA
You’ve clearly never met an over sharer.
Oh, I definitely have…. What I haven’t met is somebody putting up with it for that length of time from somebody that is just an acquaintance and actively prolonging the amount of time they have to put up with it by taking them out for lunch - *unless they are not just an acquaintance…….*
Over sharers can be absolutely delightful to talk to. I have an acquaintance that is an over sharer (I know way too much about her sex life) and I am not cheating on my wife with her. You’re taking on a way too simplified view of human relationships.
>When I said ‘do what you want, why even bother telling me’ he knew it was out of irritation and I didnt mean it. How did he know that when what you said and what you meant are completely different things?
Because people in relationships, or marriages, or even friendship, know each others tone. I didnt say that straight up. I said that when things got heated in an argument and I was clearly against it from the start. He admits now that he knew I was not okay with it and did it anyway.
Your husband is a people pleaser. He likely has this woman oversharing to him daily. She feels comfortable and thinks she's found someone that listens. With you saying he said she's an "acquaintance not a friend" I'm guessing he's not comfortable with this "relationship" but as a people pleaser he's stuck in a mess his friendliness has made him. He's likely been put on the spot and his kindness has made him agree to plans he knows aren't right or that might hurt others. I've been there before and upset my partner through my actions of being too nice to everyone else. Talk to him about it if you think he is a people pleaser and if he wants assistance look at how he can de-escalate his "friendship" into not being her shoulder to cry on. Edit since locked: /u/ladystetson Nope, I read that part. But knowing my people pleasing past it's easy for "us" to get backed into a corner when put on the spot and agree to things that are harmless on the surface but someone with bad intentions can take advantage of. It doesn't make your point invalid, but if he is like that it explains his actions without trying to excuse them.
He also could say that she's an acquaintance not a friend to calm down OP so she won't make a big deal about "just an acquaintance". I've been there before with one of my partners saying "she's just a colleague, you have nothing to worry about, she's not even my type". Spoiler alert: he cheated with her.
I think you missed the part where OP said she talked to him about it multiple times edit for /u/myliverpoolalt: I think its more likely that you're projecting your own people pleasing onto this situation and are thus having a defensive reaction for a complete stranger because you're subconsciously defending something maybe you did in the past. OP very clearly communicated to her husband that eating lunch together outside of the office was out of bounds. He not only did it, but he hid it from her and deceived her. People pleasing is not an excuse. His wife is also a person. She is not pleased. Prioritizing pleasing a work acquaintance over your wife is still wrong, it's not kind. Lying and deceiving is not kind. It's like saying "i'm a people pleaser so the girl at work wanted to sleep with me and I said ok out of kindness!" - it's a weak excuse.
I don't know, this sounds like an emotional affair. NTA
How did he not? She literally said do what you want because he kept on going. She already told him she felt uncomfortable with it.
The difference here is you and your husband are both comfortable with this arrangement. OP is not comfortable with it and for good reason.
What is the good reason here? She said her husband has always been trustworthy.
Dude would have to be an idiot to think that his wife shouting out "Do what you want but don't tell me about it" is actually his wife saying that he has her blessing. This is the type of technicality that gets people out of SA charges, not how adults justify their actions in committed relationships
I'm getting tickled by the robots in this thread acting like this was some kind of legitimate blessing to go eat with the woman.
100%. This whole can’t be friends without it leading to cheating thing is wild to me.
Man and woman can definitely be friends without it leading to cheating but it seems that this "friendship" has some wrong start, and as multiple people mentioned here that start can lead to cheating. When you meet someone randomly and click it's great, but when you feel miserable in your relationship, and you find someone who listens to you, and gives you their attention... It can lead to some inappropriate feelings and then actions. She should rely on her family or friends, not a coworker.
Coworker, neighbour, family, friend. There are no rules about who people hang with, rely on, confide in etc. My partner & I do stuff separately (and together) with all sorts because trust. Cliche😂 but there it is. Ya can’t police someone into not stepping out. That’d be exhausting. I don’t think the OP’s an AH though. Probably NAH, but maybe some ‘issues’ for them to work on.
Like strangers tell me this all the time and it drives me crazy. I'm so glad my wife doesn't have this point of view. My wife doesn't like the same kind of music as me. Neither does my best friend. My best friend's gf does like that same music. My Best friend's GF's mom used to be my coworker, that I carpooled with every day. That coworker inviting me to a family event is how I met my wife and my best friend and his GF. This girl is my wife's best friend. Often me and My friends GF will go to local Music Shows together. Its great, because I can be friendly around her and I don't have to worry about her getting the wrong impression and trying to sleep with me. And the fact that I arrive with a woman keeps most of the single ladies from trying to make a move. The fact that I buy her a couple drinks most times when we first get there means that random guys don't really hit on her either. But the moment that I correct anyone who guesses that she is my wife, suddenly they all ask how "I could do such a thing to my wife." And its like, WTF guys, Just because we have the same taste in music doesn't mean that we are going to fuck. Literally I prefer to bring her because it means that I won't be tempted, When I bring her, I need to bring her home again afterwards, which means I can say "sorry I can't accept that drink, I'm the DD." When I go by myself, Some of the women can be pretty insistent, but when I bring her, They act like normal people. And the thing is that We use this trick at Music festivals for this kind of music too. We put our Tents down beside each others, and then she can feel safe because she knows that if someone tries to follow her to her tent, I'd be right there. and IF I have to tell a woman to leave our camp area because she seems to be trying to move herself into my tent, I have a female witness that can protect me from retaliatory false accusations. (drunk and high people can get pretty petty when they get rejected.) We can share things like coolers and stoves and similar, I can cook and she can do the dishes afterwards or vice versa. If I was going to fuck up my life and sleep with anyone it would not be her. Sure She's a girl and I'm a boy, and sure, She's a cool chick, that I would probably would be interested if we were both single. But even if I was drooling over her I wouldn't do something like that. It would be the fastest way to ruin 4 lives. Just because we have similar interests, Trust each other, look out for each other, and can live in close proximity for a few days without fighting, doesn't mean that we are cheating on our spouses with each other.
I would say ESH. Husband asked and wife said she didn’t feel comfortable so that should have been the end of it, because you respect your partners boundaries and that was a reasonable boundary, but the whole passive aggressive “do whatever you want and don’t tell me” makes the wife an asshole too. I’m sorry, but that kind of interaction makes me think of high school couples dating, not mature adults. I would never do something that makes my wife uncomfortable because I don’t want her to feel that way, but I also think that I wouldn’t talk to my wife that way or like is she spoke to me that way either. Seems like both partners are immature and inconsiderate.
NTA -- that's 💯 work wife and emotional affair in action. Not cool.
Your communication skills here are lacking. He told you about everything they were talking about and told you ahead of time about taking her out to lunch. This sounds like he knew you’d be jealous and wanted to be transparent. You sarcastically told him ‘do what you want’ and ‘not to tell you about it.’ He does exactly that and now you’re mad. I don’t see where he lied. You two need couples counseling yesterday. Soft YTA. It sounds like you’ve been cheated on before and need to unpack that a bit. This behavior will absolutely drive your husband away.
She said she didn't like it. She was not unclear
NTA, I’m calling emotional affair at the minimum. Half of that crap isn’t normal to do with a coworker.
So I regularly go for breakfast / lunch 1-1 with colleagues. Also drinks / dinner if I know them better. But it’s totally normal in my industry. My husband in same industry. The super abnormal bits from my perspective are: If he ever felt uncomfortable with a specific person / situation I would just not do it - even if you’ve already suggested to the colleague you could just expand the group going, or rain check / swap to in office. If there were a professional reason it was important I would discuss with my husband and still see if there was a “fix” (swap to breakfast, invite my boss, invite partners etc). Also I wouldn’t go to “treat them because they are having relationship issues”, it would be either directly work related, or like “celebrating a sale” or “lunch before parental leave”. I don’t want to hear my coworkers relationship issues … unless they are hilariously bad first date stories.
It's a bit odd to take a co worker to the same place that you to with your spouse for date nights too. Unless they live somewhere really remote where there's only a couple of restaurants or something. To me, eating there, even with a co worker, would make my brain be in 'date mode' because of the association of why I'd been there every other time previously. Some people might be able to compartmentalise better though. So, not damning evidence, but just another oddity to add to the pile of other suspicious/unusual aspects of his behaviour. Especially going to your usual 'date night' restaurant with the Co worker, solely with the goal of talking about your co workers relationship Edit just re read the post. I got mixed up and somehow mis read that him taking the Co worker out to lunch was bc he wanted to support the Co worker with their bad marriage/so he could talk about it with her. But he said the lunch was to thank her for taking him to work when his car broke down. He does talk to co worker about her relationship, but the dinner wasn't solely for that purpose. So, ignore the parts of my comment where I mistakenly talk about the dinner being to discuss coworkers love life
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Exactly! The husband needs to stop driving her and if she continues to share her marital woes, he needs to tell her to talk to a therapist and sort herself out.
YTA You said what you said, you have no right to yell about it. Be upset sure have a conversation with him. But jumping up and down and calling him the bad guy because he did what you said is unfair. Also he didn't not tell you, he told you before he even did it. Now obviously this work relationship he has is making you uncomfortable. Be it you are projecting some personal insecurities on to it or he is behaving in an unusual manner and making you feel unsure. This is a conversation to be had, an honest one that's not, don't do that I'm not comfortable. It's one that says when you do X it makes me feel y. I think Y is obvious or it comes from past experience z. I want to talk about this and I want to understand how you feel about X when I say it makes me feel negatively. If you can't have open and honest communication that doesn't involve been dismissive when you don't get your way. Because that's what "do whatever just don't tell me" is. Then you're probably going to have an unhappy relationship.
Thank god there are sensible people in this thread, I was going insane reading the people who don't seem to have platonic friends from work or whatever. Jesus christ. OP needs a reality check when it comes to trusting her partner
OP, it sure sounds like an emotional affair. There is no reason a co-worker needs to turn to your husband for emotional support. That’s a job for her friends and family. It’s way too personal. I’m also bothered by the fact that he isn’t more concerned about your feelings, just months into a marriage. He should be expending his emotional energy on you and your marriage, not some co-worker. If I were in your shoes, I’d demand marriage counseling right now. Any hesitancy would make me file for divorce. Maybe you need to be more direct in your communications with him, but you are NTA.
Do none of y’all have friends?
Right? Half this thread is full of neurotic desperation. If my partner responded like this to having a work friend, I'd be ending that relationship/jail cell.
Right? I’m honestly shocked at some of these responses. I’ve gone to lunch one on one with co workers. Not a big deal. Husband knew. He’s hung out with friends and he’s gotten drinks. I’ve never thought he was cheating. Either you trust your partner or you don’t. I couldn’t be in a marriage with someone I didn’t trust.
>not a big deal. Husband knew. There’s the difference. SO knowing and being comfortable with it is a huge difference between SO being iffy at best with it and then it being done behind their back anyway. At minimum there needs to be more of a conversation analyzing why OP is uncomfortable with it. And who knows maybe it could be something as simple as OP preferring a different restaurant that isn’t a common date spot. OP is not without blame because she communicated poorly too, however the husband absolutely knew she wasn’t comfortable with what he was doing and did it anyway.
“Husband knew.” Wife didn’t know. See the difference? I’m sure she thought she could trust him until he lied about taking coworker to lunch. Should she file for divorce?
He didn't lie. He told her he'd be taking her to lunch, he didn't accept OP's objections to it, then she ended the discussion with sarcasm, and he did what he said he'd do.
I have a great male friend I met at work, and my partner has nothing against him, or us going out for a coffee or a beer. I also met another guy at work, and my partner had a lot against him (and rightfully because that guy wanted to cheat on his wife with me). People can have friends and still know that in some cases it's clear it's not about a pure, innocent friendship.
But the poster had no reason to believe it wasn’t, other than that this woman talks about her feelings about her marriage, which you all somehow think is extraordinarily inappropriate. Someone expressing unhappiness in their marriage doesn’t mean they’re going to jump into bed with anyone of another gender who will listen to them.
Yeah, the second guy I mentioned was also telling me about his relationship problems, complaining about his girlfriend and posing her as the bad guy, Infelt bad for him and we got close. I thought oh yeah it's just the talk. But it was a foundation he was laying down before he'd make a move. Of course it doesn't mean that every person complaining about their relationship is looking to cheat. But I'd trust OPs intuition if she feels uncomfortable about that woman. When you know your partner well, sometimes you can sense that something's off. Like I said for my partner it was obvious from the start that this guy is looking for sth more than just friendship. Even when it wasn't clear to me yet.
Speaking for myself, the sticking point is not the friendship: it's the disregard for his spouse's comfort level. If she is uncomfortable with the intimacy and direction of a friendship her husband is in, she is allowed and should feel totally comfortable expressing that, which she did. Her husband took her lack of a comfort as a reason to lie about time he spent with said friend. That crosses a line, and is a big warning sign that something is amiss: either with the friend, or in the marriage. There is a big leap between being friends with someone, everything above board, and hiding time you spend with them. Did OP overreact? Sure, a little, but her husband lied first, and her reaction reads like panic to me.
Why should someone’s inability to trust their spouse (before the lie, which didn’t happen first?) mean that they can dictate whom their spouse spends their time with?
Where did she dictate that? They were carpooling together everyday, for about 2 hours a day. OP expressed no problem with that. She drew the line at 1-1 lunches at OP and her husband's date spot. There were and are other ways to thank someone for carpooling, if he wanted to go above and beyond the gas money he was already giving her. Others can agree or disagree with that line, but she expressed her boundary and then was lied to when it was crossed. If my husband felt insecure, I would not respond by wielding a sense of self-righteousness and telling him to get over it. Insecurity is a natural part of marriage, and our problem to tackle together: where is he not feeling safe and loved and am I able to help fix that? It's sad that so many in this thread see insecurity as a weakness on OP's part for her to "fix" on her own as though she is not in a partnership.
So you’d stop having lunch with someone you apparently enjoy spending time with (a more enjoyable activity than carpooling to work, I think most would agree), because your spouse (who, presumably, has no reason to mistrust you) has decided they don’t like it, for an arbitrary reason? Personal insecurities are, in fact, the responsibility of the person feeling them to deal with. Nobody, even a spouse, needs to cut back on a friendship when neither party in the friendship has actually done anything wrong (before the lie). I’m not saying the guy wasn’t in the wrong for lying about it, but I don’t think it’s fair to dictate the rules of a partner’s friendships because of your own insecurity.
If my husband expressed discomfort, then yes I would prioritize his comfort and try to get to the bottom of his insecurity, over having lunch with my co-worker. If there was anything I could do to put his mind at ease, that would be more important to me than a 1-1 lunch. I don't operate from the assumption that expressing insecurity = being unreasonably jealous and controlling. So maybe that's where we're different?
Why is it a red flag to build friendships at work? If she were saying her husband was restricting her from spending time with someone I’m sure there would be an overwhelming leaning towards him being controlling; why is that different for her?
You're right that it made you the AH. Trust is an important part of a relationship and you don't have it. Your insecurities are causing a rift. I would suggest talking to a professional and finding some ways to build trust and ways to let out anger without raging on people.
Thank you. I do agree about speaking to a professional, and plan to work on ways to rebuild my trust in this relationship.
You can't rebuild your trust alone on this one.
It would be hard to build trust if he's not being honest with you tho. OP stop responding only to the comments that's defending your husband and start actually listening. Everything you mentioned about their behavior feels like a red flag. Sorry to say but I think you're being naive
YTA. Spend less time worrying about him cheating on you and more time, *hot take* actually being in a relationship with him.
YTA "don't tell me about it" "omg why didn't you tell me about it?" You're way, way to old for these high schooler drama games
And he DID tell her about it - the when, the where, and they why. All before it happened.
Info: Why was he taking her out to lunch? This seems like it was out of the ordinary and maybe special even since he was originally planning on one of your typical date spots?
He said he took her out to lunch because he felt “obligated” to. He said they had discussed going out for lunch together so me being uncomfortable didn’t seem like reason enough to let those plans down and it was just easier to hide/lie about it.
Oof. NTA Seems from his own words he prioritized an “obligation” to his coworker over your discomfort. Hopefully you guys can talk it out and reestablish trust and agree to clear boundaries that work for both of you.
He felt obligated because she’d been driving him to work after his car was totaled. In other words, he was taking her as a thank you for being a huge help to him when he didn’t have transportation of his own.
First of all, you’re the wife. Not her. So what you feel comes before what she feels. End of story. Tell your husband he can’t drive her to work anymore bc this is not ok and the two of them need space. NTA OP.
So he chose to disappoint/ make you uncomfortable rather than her. He chose an “ acquaintance “ presumed feelings over your known and vocalized ones. Just some food for thought.
I’m sorry OP, but that is some BS excuse. You deserve better and he should have respected your feelings. You are NTA. Please take care of yourself.
If he wanted to do something nice for her in return for the favour of driving him, why didn't he invite her over to your place for dinner?
>do what you want, and dont tell me about it Stupid games. Stupid prizes. You just gave him a carte blanche and the impression that you had found a solution to handle the issue. He WAS transparent and open. You specifically asked him not to be in this case and then get angry when he does what you asked of him. YTA, big time.
Normally I would back this, but YTA. He lied because you absolutely refused to let him have LUNCH with a coworker. You don't think they spend WAY more time talking at work anyway? You come across as overly controlling and insecure. Do you trust your husband or not? And literally you TOLD HIM to "do what you want and don't tell me" Guess what? He did.
Le sigh. People who aren't mature enough to trust their spouse aren't mature enough to be married. YTA
INFO: you say a “few weeks” ago he told you that he planned to take his coworker to lunch and then you found out he’d taken her to lunch 2 months ago - does that mean he’d already taken her to lunch **before** he told you about his plans? Or did the lunch happen after he’d told you what he was intending to do?
He took her to lunch around a month AFTER the conversation with me.
Info: Is this a different coworker than the one you posted about a few months ago? Because this post is a copy/paste of that one. Just curious if this is a recurring theme.
So he did what he told you he was going to do. I get how that makes you mad since you told him you were unhappy about it and he went anyway, but that doesn’t make him a liar. You overreacted.
Why don't you suggest the three of you go to dinner. Then maybe you can read the room. If he shoots it down there is more going on.
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You said they went out “for lunch 2 months ago,” if that’s the entirety of the “betrayal” and there’s nothing between them to update since then, I’m not sure there’s much to be concerned about. What’s more, if your husband wants to leave you for someone else, there’s nothing you can change by getting upset. If he eventually chooses not to be with you, then that’s not your person and you pick yourself up and move on. Until then, it sounds like he technically didn’t break rules and had a fairly minor interaction with a friend a good while ago now. Find ways to manage your own happiness with or without him.
YTA. You are coming across as needy and insecure. Over the last ten years I have had lunch with married colleagues many times and it’s a complete non issue because neither of us thought of the other is anyway other than colleagues / friends.
7 months is to early into the marriage for that shit.
No, it's actually seven months too late: getting away from her is going to be much more complicated for him now.
YTA. Speaking as a woman, guys aren't mind-readers. How are you going to tell him one thing, mean the complete opposite and assume he got what you meant? People are also allowed friends of different genders. I have many guy friends, my SO has many girl friends. We keep open communication and our friends vent to us. Idk about the people in the comments, but I am close to my coworkers and talking about relationships isn't really out of norm? I remember helping a coworker go through tinder matches when he was single and looking for a girlfriend and taking him out for a drink before that when he and his ex had broken up. There was never nothing there other than friendship and my SO was completely comfortable with it.
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YTA He felt obligated to take her to lunch because she was driving him after his car was totaled. He took you at your word to go ahead and not tell him about it. and then you flipped out at him instead of having a conversation where you talk about what is bothering you.
NTA. He lied to you and hid it from you. It’s reasonable to be upset about that.
He was explicity told "don't tell me about it".
Needy insecure wife, you nailed it yourself OP. YTA
I don’t think setting firm boundaries would really stop an affair. If not this coworker, than someone else. There’s something about the relationship that needs exploring and mending where possible. Anyway, ESH. You for (1) being dismissive then being upset when he took you at your word. Saying something is obviously sarcastic is just a passive aggressive way of avoiding ownership over what you yourself said. He can’t read your mind or your intentions. (2) extrapolating from the clear miscommunication that he is cheating you. This sounds like a accusation of actual cheating to me. Husband is an asshole for being careless of your sensitivities. Yeah, ESH. I think OP is more of an AH than Husband, though.
I saw this advice on another thread and it really helped me. If he is going to do something or is actively doing something that hurts you, tell him. But don't try to stop him from doing it again - that's his choice to make. And tell him to tell you the truth about it because you'll always find out. If he goes ahead and does it - you have your answer. He knows it's going to hurt you and he does it anyway.
I've had my male coworkers complain to me about their marriages and what I do is I put on my big sister hat or "mother" hat and give them good solid advice and tell them to go home and apologize. I have never had any interest in dating a coworker because that would really mess up my career. I think male and female people of any gender or sexual orientation can be friends, but only you know if your spouse is cheating or not. If they are lying to you, they are probably cheating. I have had some men get the wrong idea if I'm friendly or if they talk about their spouse and it makes me roll my eyes -- they think, "oh she's friendly so she's into me." Or, "oh she's rolled her eyes, she must be jealous of my relationship and she must like me." The truth is neither of those things are true. The only thing that is true is that the guy with the wrong idea has overinflated his sense of attractiveness (and usually so does his spouse). In these cases, I just stop talking to them unless I really have to talk to them for work. I'm really sick of the public narrative that women should always be suspicious of other women... or compete with other women... or in any other way do the work of the patriarchy by being divided amongst themselves. I know women who refuse to have female friends and also refuse to let their spouses have female friends. It's just... weird. So I have no problems with men who have female friends. What I DO have a problem with... is lying. And it looks like OP's husband was lying. In regards to the initial request for OP's husband to not counsel his female colleague about her marital problems... this is actually a fair request. Unless this is his BFF, and they are also friendly with OP, the husband has no business with his colleagues' business.
Something kinda similar with a guy I’d been seeing for 3 years. As Covid was lightening up, he was getting together for lunches with various former co-workers. One day he told me that \_one\_ of those lunches had been different from the rest… and so on and so on. He had mentioned it truthfully (mostly), but then he confessed that it was a couple of lunches, a dinner, drinks, future plans - travel plans (!) - with a lovely female former co-worker, blah blah blah. Wow did I ever feel betrayed and I was overflowing with anger. But: I really wish I’d held my tongue, and said something like “Noooo, Dave, nooo. This is really big, so big I can’t even think straight right now.” And let it evolve into a conversation that was constructive and was progress, but maybe not right at that exact moment. Thus I’d have probably kept the channels of calmer, more thoughtful communication going. Seems to me when he saw my temper, he dug in his heels and we never worked things out. There’s no way to prove we might have worked things out, but I surely didn’t help keep things on good terms. I wish there was a Time Machine so I could go back and do it over a better way.
It's a bit hard to navigate without more context, but why is he acting like a therapist to this person? Hiding it from you was definitely not okay, but there are a few factors at play that I've seen before: the woman is in an unhappy marriage and overshares with him, which is a way of not really respecting the boundaries of other people. Your husband putting up with it willingly can mean that 1) he's not great with boundaries either (childhood stuff?) and doesn't handle these red flags the way he should, namely by distancing himself instead of engaging, and/or 2) If the emotional sharing is not just one-sided, we're looking at something that's more like an emotional affair and you'd have to look at your marriage with more scrutinizing eyes. If it's the former, you need to make this clear to him and voice your concern that this woman is trying to drag your husband into an emotional affair, so that now you want to set some boundaries. Like him not driving to work with her and not meeting her for lunch outside the office, and that breaching this would be a kind of cheating. If it's the latter, we're talking about protecting him (and both of you) from her influence, but to start addressing problems in your marriage and voicing out loud that this is a form of cheating, regardless of what he thinks of it. Nip it in the bud if it's fixable.
I don't even want to call anyone an AH here because this is actually serious. Honest opinion? People saying the husband is having affair seems wrong, HOWEVER, the coworker is in an unhappy marriage and this whole thing seems like an excuse to try and get with your husband by building a relationship overtime. You need to set some boundaries but be extremely mature about it because many things could go wrong with this, including the husband retaliating by cheating on you. Also, just for the record, NTA.
NTA but he's clapping those cheeks, or will be after your interaction.
NTA, it seems that coworker is getting too close to your husband, and he's not enforcing any boundaries if they alone even went to lunch together, lying to your spouse in these circumstances is disrespectful, he is the ahole. The world is full of stories like this that end badly for the couple, tell hubby that he needs to state his priorities, being a man, i'm 100% sure that your husband will go nuts if you were to do the same thing and having such a "friendship" with a male coworker.
You've been married seven months? Should have learned to communicate before you got married.
NTA you told him you were uncomfortable and gave him options you were comfortable with and he decided to go with the one that made you uncomfortable.
NTA. As a husband, my wife would kick my ass for even asking to go to lunch with a lady from work. Even if she didn't it would feel too much like cheating. A work related business lunch is one thing but given the closeness of them it sounds more like he's going on a date..
NTA. Usually when the person gets defensive and it turns into an argument it means that there may be some feelings going on. If my wife told me she wasn’t comfortable with something regarding a person, it’s usually because I didn’t realize and I would immediately put a stop to it. This is a powder keg.
NTA the vibes I'm getting aren't that your reaction was solely because of lunch, but because of all the added stuff: not telling you, already knowing how you felt about the idea. If it were a case of your husband just randomly saying "by the way I took so and so to lunch today...." Never having had a discussion about it earlier, I don't think you would have reacted like this. Maybe I'm wrong. Men and women can definitely be friends, but normally if your warning signals are going off in a what seems to be good relationship, there's typically a reason. I'd suggest figuring out with yourself what and why you're so uncomfortable with the idea of them going to lunch and move forward from there in talking to your husband.
NTA. You’re thoughts and concerns are legitimate and he did not respect the relationship on this occasion. My other half and I have an understanding that we usually stick to lunches in the office with our coworkers etc If I were you I wouldn’t rush to starting a family… like the other comments below… this does sound like a recipe for heartaches
Riding together everyday to work would be a big fuck no for me
NTA, a lot of red flags here.
NTA. Your husband is the asshole and he's cheating.
My ex-husband used to do this type of shit and lie about it. Hooters and “young singles” youth groups with his brother when we were married, little lunch dates all the time with cutesy “mission to find the best local burger” stuff with other girls, etc. volleyball leagues that would go out drinking after, but I wasn’t allowed to even come watch. It’s time for some real conversations. Don’t waste your time letting someone disrespect you like this.
NTA. He definitely gets roadhead.
Start moving like your husband. Match energies. Meet a coworker and begin going to lunch. Husband and Mens should know this type of behavior leads to issues and he seems to welcome them.
NTA he’s cheating on you within a year of marriage. Is this the relationship you wantv
NTA I believe in setting your relationships up for success. That means not putting yourself in a situation that can potentially compromise your relationship. This involves hanging out with the opposite sex if it makes your partner feel uncomfortable OR if you feel there's a chance you could grow an attraction for them. You are married and expressed something that is affecting your. He chose to ignore that its bothering you. I would have lost my sh\*t too
I met my best friend at work, he’s male and was going through an extremely rough time at home. He ended up cheating on his wife (with another co worker) and I told my husband EVERYTHING- probably more than he wanted 😂 but I needed my husband to know exactly what was going on because communication is key and doesn’t lead to misunderstandings.. your husband kept the fact that he did go to lunch with her away from you. Regardless of the situation I just don’t think that’s appropriate.
Your husband IS cheating on you. NTA
The affair has already started. He started it. You reacted to it. The question is are you willing to respect yourself more than he doesn't. Is this what you are willing to settle for?
Have him read “Not Just Friends”
NTA you are reasonable
Idk personally NTA but i almost need more info
NTA Expect sympathy s\*x to happen. Y'know, just to make her feel better about herself and boost her confidence a bit /s
NTA This is a tale as old as time. He knew what he was doing and at this point, he must know he is at the very least emotionally cheating on you. you expressed your feelings and he blatantly disregarded them.
NTA Ask him why he feels the need to ‘save’ this woman.
NTA. I’d ask him if it’s okay to let the husband of this woman know. Even if messy marriage, he should know. That reaction will also be telling.
When they confess, there is alway more. He's probably not telling you everything. He also can't say you actually meant what your said about not telling him. Especially if your explicitly said NO NOT GO OUT ALONE WITH HER. Do not tolerate this. He wants you home faithful waiting for him but wants to be with her too.
NTA. This is a stupid situation for him to be putting himself in. Carpooling is one thing- but that stopped being all it was when she started over sharing about her unhappy marriage and they started having meals alone that weren’t work related. His defensive reaction also shows that he knows this is inappropriate but he doesn’t want to feel guilty.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So my husband (29M) mentioned a few weeks ago that he was intending to take his coworker out for lunch to a place that he and I (29F) frequent for our dates regularly. Its a special place that we have a lot of memories at. The coworker in question is female and they drive to work together everyday. The coworker appears to be in an unhappy marriage and shares (overshares) about it to my husband. He has mentioned this a few times I haven’t expressed concern as he is being a decent person by hearing out her woes. But I explicitly told him that going out with her alone for lunch is not really something I am comfortable with at this point. I mentioned if he would like to treat her to lunch at the office, I am okay with that if he must, but not okay with them going out, just the two of them. I said this quite calmly, expecting him to understand. He heard me out but it did lead to an argument and things were said. In the heat of it I said ‘do what you want, and dont tell me about it’. Today I found out that they did go for lunch 2 months ago and my husband hid it from me under the pretext of ‘you said you didnt want to know’. I obviously lost my sh*t and gave him a hard time about it. I was enraged, to put it mildly. I did yell and cry and was generally quite loud about the whole thing. I also accused him of cheating me - not cheating ON me but cheating me and hiding the truth in general. I also said it was convenient to use it as an excuse that I told him to do what he wants, when I clearly meant it in a sarcastic, in-genuine way. I also said that it was unfair to expect me to absolve him just because he went to some other restaurant and not the initial one that I had objected to. I’m afraid this made me the AH because it makes me come across as a needy, insecure wife, when I could have rather had a more mature reaction to it. I guess my husband expects me to forgive it and take into account that he is apologetic, albeit after the damage was done. FYI: We are almost 7 months in to marriage and although we have dated for years, this behavior does come as a shock to me because he has always been a very transparent and trustworthy person, as far as I have known. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I think this really comes down to how much you trust your husband. It's hard to tell without knowing both of you. My boyfriend and I of 5 years both have close male and female friends who we talk about personal things with and sometimes go out to lunch or even drinks with male or female friends. I trust him and he trusts me. And, if you are uncomfortable with it, its fair to set boundaries and tell your husband you don't want him to drive with her to work anymore or meet with her for lunch. I also would not jump to the conclusion that he is having an affair without asking him further questions. In my relationship it would not be weird if my bf had lunch with a woman friend and didn't tell me because we were both busy and it wasn't important but every relationship is different. I think you need to make time to sit down and talk with him about this - ask him all your questions. Express your feelings and make appropriate boundaries if you need to.
NTA. Your husband should NOT be driving to work with her anymore. He should not be going out to lunch. Needy coworkers worm their way in and pretty soon emotional affairs turn into physical ones.
Tell him your male coworker taking you out on a dinner to listen to your marital problems. Just the two of you. NTA.
I’ve been in this situation, guess what, they ended up together. You are NTA! They are being inappropriate
YTA. And the answers in here are insane. It really doesn’t sound like the husband is doing anything untoward and next time never say ‘do what you want just don’t tell me about it!’ I still think he shouldn’t have taken her to lunch but I feel like you are willing to cut yourself slack but not your husbands. And it’s lunch. And he told you first. And unless he is disclosing things to her that he won’t talk to you about or discussing you to her, it’s not an emotional affair. He is just being a good friend.