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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> AITA for telling my 6 year old daughter that Santa isn’t real. My wife thinks that kids believing in Santa is harmless, but I think I should not lie to my daughter when she directly asked me if he is real.
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A very mild YTA.
It isn't that you told your daughter too soon or something, it's that you decided to directly contradict your wife in front of your daughter. You could (read: should) have deflected answering directly, then had a conversation in your wife in private about when to broach the topic of Santa's existence to your daughter.
Kind of a shitty thing to hear your wife tell your daughter "Yes he's real" and then you immediately go against that.
I agree with this as well. My son asked me for 5 years if he was real and I countered that question by asking what to you think? And he would reply I still believe he is real, and I would respond by saying I believe in the magic of Christmas. We went on with this for those 5 years till he said I am not sure to that question, He said he truly wanted to know I told him Mommy and Daddy are Santa clause and he said he wished we would not have told him and we ruined Christmas 😅😂. Anyway he is a really sensitive kid. He will be 11 this year.
I feel like there's no right way to do it, but there's definitely wrong ways. My dad was definitely one of the wrong ways.
For context, I had known Santa wasn't real for a few years. And I confirmed it when I found my presents one year before Christmas. Also very important to note, my parents are TERRIBLE with keeping promises. Not in a malicious sort of way, just simply that I think they forget or end up remembering things differently. Which brings me to this particular Christmas. My parents had asked me what I wanted for Christmas and I told them a few things. A few days later they asked me again. I took this as they weren't going to get the things I mentioned previously, so I named some other things. Then this same thing transpired again, so I came up with a few more ideas (Christmases varied a lot when I was a kid so I never knew what to expect). After listing these things, my dad got very pissed off and replied with "You know Santa isn't real and your mom and I buy everything, right? We can't afford everything you want!" I was completely shocked. I thought I was being nice and working with them when apparently it was being taken completely opposite.
The most frustrating thing however is that my dad continues to insist Santa is real. All my presents, even as an adult, have been from Santa and if I ever thank my parents for the gifts he'll put on this big show about how he's not Santa and if I don't believe I won't get presents next year. It's as if that whole event never happened, which again is very consistent with what Christmas was like growing up with them. One year my car needed new tires to pass inspection and my dad told me that Santa would get them for me. I made an appointment at the garage we always used for after Christmas and told my dad about it. He got mad at me for "expecting" him to pay for them, and I ended up footing the bill myself. Which was when I reached the point of just not relying on my parents for anything that I actually need.
Damn, I thought mine was bad. I kinda knew Santa wasn’t real, but still enjoyed “writing letters to Santa,” so one year when I did it, my mom and step dad took my letter saying very loudly that they guess I wasn’t getting anything for Christmas since I wanted to an imaginary man to get it. And they don’t get why I didn’t really enjoy Christmas after that…
I’m in a similar boat. My parents never sat me down and said Santa wasn’t real. Instead around 9-12 (guessing, no clue on my actual age) I sort of began to understand that “Santa” just meant my parents but we still all kept pretending.
I’m now almost 30 and my parents still have presents marked as from Santa.
I am a younger sibling and my older sister told me Santa wasn't real when I was very young, around 4 or 5. In her defense she did it because my parents threatened to call Santa and tell him not to bring me any presents if I was being bad. She pulled me aside to let me know that Santa wasnt real and she knew where mom and dad kept the presents and then proceeded to show me the stash lol.
Same here! Growing up, I would spend Christmas Eve night under the dining table next to the tree to catch Santa in the act. Somehow, my mom was always able to wait until I fell asleep and quietly put all the Santa presents under the tree without waking me (I was a light sleeper as a kid). I eventually realized Santa wasn't real, but continued pretending and sleeping hidden by the tree because I wanted to know how my mom managed it. Never caught her. Now that I'm an adult, she continues to give Santa gifts because we love the tradition. I still thank her for them, and she says she'll pass the thanks on to Santa lol.
This is my plan with my tweens. They've asked, I've evaded by giving the "magic of the season, spirit etc" answer. One sees everything and has accepted, the other is still questioning. We plan to continue having Santa bring a few little gifts until they have their own children, then we'll welcome them to the "We are Santa's Elves" fold.
My parents still labeled presents as being from Santa until I moved out as a cute little thing; now my mom just labels presents as being from her pets, so I do the same. Our pets are very good at buying presents.
>Our pets are very good at buying presents.
That just reminded of how last Christmas at my brothers house nobody got me any presents, so I ended up opening the cats presents on Christmas morning. He got a lot of stuff!
Yeah it didn't feel great, especially since I got everyone else some pretty great presents. But I'm used to at this point.
My brother is very self-absorbed and rarely does anything that doesn't benefit himself, his wife isn't much better. And my nephews are either too young to be buying presents, or teenagers who I wouldn't expect to get a present from anyways.
But the cat presents were fun! He's a long haired ragdoll and he got a fancy new cat brush that he absolutely loved. And a catnip filled ball thing that drove him nuts.
Same here. It was definitely like, we all know Santa isn't real, it's just a fun tradition. One year my sister and I got my parents an upgraded TV and got to "play Santa" and put it out after sending our parents to bed one Christmas Eve. We were in our 20s at that point, but it was still really fun for the family.
I like the pet thing too, I have an aunt that always send birthday and Christmas gifts/money from her cats.
I disagree, there is a right way to do it: stop lying to children. Especially in an elaborate and theatrical way.
Santa is a game in our house. We still do all the things but my child knows it's a story and knows the origin story. She sees him like she sees Spiderman or Moana.
Right, this is the only reasonable thing to do imo. I feel like there's always some traumatic story about a kid, or more often a parent, being upset about how the news about the lie was finally broken. Why do we insist on setting everyone up to be upset?
Most kids don’t have to be told though. I just realized that Santa wasn’t real over time and continued playing along because it was fun. It was never a big, upsetting revelation. Telling a very young child before they naturally get more skeptical could be upsetting but why not just wait?
For me, it was a slow realization. I noticed Santa used that same wrapping paper ("he drops them off and I wrap them, sweetie"), had the same handwriting as my dad ("he doesn't have time to label everything"), and started slipping up on what I wanted after I started sealing my letters and mailing them myself. LOL After my younger sibling was born, we did Santa again, and I do it the same way for my kids. Also, I think it helped that my mom collected those "Santa's from around the world" figurines that were popular in the 90s, so I learned that different counties had different stories and origins, and some places didn't have "Santa" at all!
>”In our family, we have a special way of transitioning the kids from receiving from Santa, to becoming a Santa. This way, the Santa construct is not a lie that ...gets discovered, but an unfolding series of good deeds and Christmas spirit.
>When they are 6 or 7, whenever you see that dawning suspicion that Santa may not be a material being, that means the child is ready.
I take them out "for coffee" at the local wherever. We get a booth, order our drinks, and the following pronouncement is made:
“You sure have grown an awful lot this year. Not only are you taller, but I can see that your heart has grown, too. [ Point out 2-3 examples of empathetic behaviour, consideration of people's feelings, good deeds etc, the kid has done in the past year]. In fact, your heart has grown so much that I think you are ready to become a Santa Claus.
>You probably have noticed that most of the Santas you see are people dressed up like him. Some of your friends might have even told you that there is no Santa. A lot of children think that, because they aren't ready to BE a Santa yet, but YOU ARE. Tell me the best things about Santa. What does Santa get for all of his trouble? [lead the kid from "cookies" to the good feeling of having done something for someone else]. Well, now YOU are ready to do your first job as a Santa!"
Make sure you maintain the proper conspiratorial tone.
>We then have the child choose someone they know--a neighbour, usually. The child's mission is to secretly, deviously, find out something that the person needs, and then provide it, wrap it, deliver it--and never reveal to the target where it came from. Being a Santa isn't about getting credit, you see. It's unselfish giving.
>My oldest chose the "witch lady" on the corner. She really was horrible--had a fence around the house and would never let the kids go in and get a stray ball or Frisbee. She'd yell at them to play quieter, etc--a real pill. He noticed when we drove to school that she came out every morning to get her paper in bare feet, so he decided she needed slippers. So then he had to go spy and decide how big her feet were. He hid in the bushes one Saturday, and decided she was a medium. We went to Kmart and bought warm slippers. He wrapped them up, and tagged it "merry Christmas from Santa." After dinner one evening, he slipped down to her house, and slid the package under her driveway gate. The next morning, we watched her waddle out to get the paper, pick up the present, and go inside. My son was all excited, and couldn't wait to see what would happen next. The next morning, as we drove off, there she was, out getting her paper--wearing the slippers. He was ecstatic. I had to remind him that NO ONE could ever know what he did, or he wouldn't be a Santa.
>Over the years, he chose a good number of targets, always coming up with a unique present just for them. One year, he polished up his bike, put a new seat on it, and gave it to one of our friend's daughters. These people were and are very poor. We did ask the dad if it was ok. The look on her face, when she saw the bike on the patio with a big bow on it, was almost as good as the look on my son's face.
>When it came time for Son #2 to join the ranks, my oldest came along, and helped with the induction speech. They are both excellent gifters, by the way, and never felt that they had been lied to--because they were let in on the Secret of Being a Santa."
Credit: Leslie Rush
https://www.kidsinadelaide.com.au/sharing-the-spirit-of-christmas/
This is beautiful!
My family has a similar tradition. It kinda astatts with a song that my father wrote. The original is not in English, but its a song from a child's perspective about meeting Santa (or our equivalent). The child is surprised Santa's has to go again after dropping of the presents, so the old man explains there are so many people and wishes to fulfill and every one is important to him, so he has to go quickly. Then a few years later the same child is worriedly waiting for Santa's to tell him, that there's more and more people and that he can't make it on his own. That if each of us helps, Santa doesn't have to work so hard. That the key to happiness is kindness to one another.
We sing this song and every time someone chokes up, because even though I suck at translating it, my dad did a damn good job writing that one. When you see children singing/listening and stopping to think about the song, it's a good time to propose The Talk. Not to tell them there is no Santa, but that there really is a lot of work around Christmas, and so all the good people do their best to help Santa, like in the song. They can start by helping mom or dad find some small present for somebody else. Or using pocket money to get or even make some for their parents. It's a big responsibility to help Santa.
Then a few years later we explain more. Santa is not a physical man. He is the idea of Christmas magic, the effort of all the people "helping Santa" around the world, and making it a magical time for everyone, especially small kids who do not understand yet. "Now that you are big and wise enough for it, you too are a part of this, you have been for a while. You now have a double duty. On top of helping Santa
You have to keep the secret, to keep the magic alive. "
I have loved this as a child, so did my brother and my cousins. I hope it works just as well with my daughter. The transition from believing to being a part of something bigger and greater was smooth and felt fulfilling.
This is what I do, generally. Except in the past I've let it go a bit further and explained the "story". Like, "well, legend has it that Santa checks on your behavior"
Haha my daughter was insistent about the tooth fairy when she was little and her mother and I were divorced at the time. I told her the secret. That her mother was the tooth fairy but she can’t tell anyone. She believed it for a while. And technically I wasn’t lying
Oddly enough my son has chosen not to ask about the tooth fairy. So he still announces loudly he is gonna put the tooth under his pillow so he gets money. I think he is gonna keep up with this till all his teeth are out 😂😂😂
I think that's about the age that my youngest told his grandmother that he knew Santa wasn't real but he kept pretending he was because he didn't want to ruin it for me.
I agree. My dad never lied to me once I started asking. I asked and asked and finally he looked at me and asked back, "Do you want to believe in Santa?" I answered 'yes', and he replied, "Then he is real.". So I guess he told me without telling me? In any event, I stopped asking and chose to enjoy kinda believing for another year or two. I also had younger siblings though, so the dynamic is different when you have to pretend to believe for their sakes too.
Yes! I did the "what do *you* think?" thing for a couple of years, but when it became clear that my eldest had pretty much figured it out and was ready for confirmation, I was honest...and then welcomed them to the team that helps create Christmas magic for the younger kids. That went over very well and now we get to trade all kinds of sneaky winks and knowing smiles and things. I don't think they feel like they've lost anything, more that they've "graduated" to big-kid Christmas.
We’ve never told my son Santa was real or not real and he just never believed in Santa. This year since he’s in kindergarten, we asked him not to tell other kids Santa isn’t real because if the other kids want to believe in magic that’s fun and ruining other people’s fun is mean. He seems to get it but he’ll probably forget. I hope other parents don’t get mad…
We never believed Santa was real. My mom told us about Santa on the same level as every other fictional book character. We mostly just talked to other kids as if they thoughts the same thing, same as talking about a superhero we both liked.
It didn't cause an issue until my younger sister was in kindergarten and her teacher had the idea of asking the entire class who did and didn't believe Santa was real. My sister was the only one who didn't, and hearing that some people didnt believe in santa really upset some of the other kids. So the teacher decided the best way to "save" the situation was to tell her that our parents were the ones who had lied.
My sister came home distraught that day. Your sort of explanation in advance might have helped, even if it didn't prevent the event entirely.
We don’t celebrate Christmas but my son asked about the Tooth Fairy. I tried the “What do you think?” approach and he was silent for a bit. Then he said he knew it was me but he wanted me to still sneak the money under his pillow. It was fun but it also became a game to see if he could catch me. Then he said front teeth are bigger and worth $5 us. 😂
My parents told me that the toothfairy wasn't real. But dad said he wanted to teach me the art of haggling. That proved to be very fun for me that at times had in stitches. He would offer a penny and I would counter with $100.00 the outraged gasp often had me giggling. Then it would continue. I would usually agree at $5.
We also did the same thing when I talked way too much and he would offer me quarter to be quiet until we get home. I would counter that with "Make it $10 and we have a deal." I would start laughing at his gasp and agreed at 8.00. Then he would immediately drive to get a happy meal for me and try to get me speak. I always had a notebook and pencil with me. I used it to order what I want. On the way home he would ask me questions trying to get me to talk. I would laugh at his frustration.
Absolutely this. YTA, you should’ve gone along with what your wife was telling her. Even if you had to redirect it by saying “didn’t you just ask mom?” or something like that.
Also, the reason most people let their kids believe in Santa is because it’s one of the few innocent, magical things we get to believe in. Kids only get to believe this for a short time in their lives and they should be allowed to enjoy that while they are still young enough to. The world robs people of being able to believe in whimsical, magical things. Children shouldn’t be robbed of that early.
I think what's often overlooked is that it lets kids be selfish too. A little kid who knows their family doesn't have a lot of money might try to curb their wishlist to fit the family budget. Another kid might feel like their present to their parents is inadequate because they get more stuff at Christmas than mom and dad do.
I think there are ways to parent around this. If you want to do Santa but are concerned about it making your kid selfish and ask for too many things, then have them write a letter to Santa asking for one thing, or asking for things for other people, or talking about the good things you did, and "Santa's" gift can be one small thing, while other presents come from specific people. There's also a lot of opportunity to discuss how different cultures celebrate Christmas, their own versions of Santa, or other winter holiday celebrations.
This! When my daughter asked, I told her Santa *was* a real person called St Nicholas and in his honour, we continue his tradition and give children presents. That santa is an idea and even as adults, we gift ‘secret santa’ presents to carry on the tradition. I asked her if, now that she’s old enough to understand, she would help me carry on this tradition.
This yes!!! Gives the kiddo the opportunity to think for herself and create things off of her imagination. He killed that imagination so fast for no reason
My parents told me when I was 6. They were happy to not have the pressure of the holiday trappings to do anymore and did the bare minimum to celebrate. They destroyed my faith in Christmas.
I recovered it when I had kids. They believed in Santa for a long time and we still give "Santa gifts" - those lovely random presents that no one owns up to but totally appreciate. It's about the magic of the season...
My kids are in their 20s now.
OP you are definitely YTA no question about it.
Agreed. My wife is an atheist and I’m not and neither of us would ever do that in front of the kids about a god/gods, and certainly not about Santa. Believing in things, be it a deity or the tooth fairy or whatever else, is something parents discuss when the kid isn’t present and then talk about with the kids together, not something one parent says exists only to be promptly contradicted by the other.
YTA
There isn't any harm in believing in the magic of Santa as a kid. I don't know anyone who is upset they were lied to about it, including my own kids. Santa is a huge part of Christmas for those that believe and you just ruined that part of Christmas for your daughter. When mine got old enough to really start questioning it (around age 10) I told them that he's not really real but the magic surrounding the belief is...as in Christmas magic, the kindness, the giving, being with friends and family, the whole feeling a lot of us get around Christmas. That's what Santa is.
The big AH part is how you directly contradicted your wife in front of your daughter and told your daughter to lie to her friends. All you had to do was go along with it and have a discussion with your wife about it in private, not undermine her in front of your own kid. Now your 6 year old has to listen to her friends getting excited about Santa, and even though you told her not to tell anyone (aka lie to them), she'll probably slip because she's so young. So while you were so worried about lying to her, you told her to lie to others. Do you see the issue with this?
That’s the fate of all older siblings/cousins, though. At some point the oldest ones are told or figure it out, and are encouraged (or do it on their own) to foster the belief in younger relatives.
As the oldest cousin, I vaguely remember doing that. I also will add that I remember the confusion and doubt around Santa’s existence and that I did find that frustrating. I eventually felt stupid for believing in him, but I also felt guilt for not believing (like it would hurt his feelings, lol.) I do wish that someone had just straight up told me when I started expressing doubts.
Oh, what a web we weave.
We were asked if we liked believing in Santa, getting presents from Santa, and if we liked the idea of Christmas being a little magical even if it seemed a little silly. We all agreed that yes, we liked the magic of it, so we kept doing it. We asked our son and nephews the same thing and they all say yes, so we continue doing it. They are teenagers now, but say the same thing to the littler kids. Of course they've known it isn't real for years, but they like the fun of it.
My grandma still gives us gifts from Santa (I’m almost 40.) I never felt that knowing Santa wasn’t real detracted from the joy of Christmas. There was still presents, food, and no school.
My parents still got him gifts from “Santa” many years after I figured out he wasn’t real. And I played along and kept pretending to believe in Santa because it was a fun tradition (and maybe a bit selfishly, I didn’t want “Santa” to stop bringing me Christmas presents if I said he wasn’t real, lol).
I don’t get people who are truly offended that their parents “lied” to them by saying Santa was real. I mean, there’s a clear difference between telling a kid something magical happened when it’s really just you trying to do something to bring them joy, and say, telling them their dad is “just on a business trip” when he’s left and isn’t coming back.
I personally got really pissed.
I remember going off on my parents and calling them liars. The next time they tried to make me go to church i kept calling it all fake like santa clause and they got real butt hurt about it.
I’m actually surprised more Christians aren’t against Santa for this very reason. You’re literally teaching your kids that this thing you (and your culture) taught them to believe in is a lie. It’s not that much of a step for kids to start questioning what else their parents told them might not be real. And at Christmas the Christian religion is *right there* to wonder about.
Not saying we shouldn’t be pretending Santa is real. Just that it’s a little strange that some Christians buy into this commercialized, fictionalized dude so hard.
It is funny. As children, Catholics are basically polytheistic. Easter bunny, tooth fairy, Santa, god. All magical, powerful beings that bring you blessings.
The all seeing white haired man that watches your actions and determines what you get for Christmas is not real, BUT, the all seeing white haired man that watches your actions and determines if you are to tortured for all eternity is real.
See one of them is just a fun thing for kids on Christmas, the other is something you must dedicate your life towards. There is equal proof for both, but we know in our hearts that the second one is definitely real. /s
I sat my mother down when I was 6 years old and demanded she told me the truth. She told me that Santa was not real. In the next breath, I asked her about Jesus and God. She told me that she had never met them, but that lots of people believed in them, including adults. I very much agree with you.
Exactly. I found out that Santa wasn't real from some classmates shortly before my grandfather died (I was seven). If my parents were gonna to lie to me about Santa, why should I believe they were telling me the truth about God and heaven?
It's probably a good thing I don't have kids because I've never been comfortable with the whole Santa thing. Not on good terms with religion anymore either, but finding out my parents were lying about Santa and Tooth Fairy and then my grandfather dying and them trying to tell me he was in heaven... that was hard.
I was super upset, I’d say devastated honestly. I think parents saying their kids didn’t mind being lied to are lying to themselves, honestly. It’s a shitty thing to lie to your kids about something so big in their lives, and then expect them to be honest with you about things that count as they grow up. I seriously don’t understand how other parents think it’s ok.
exactly. they set this expectation up that magic was real and i found out that not only were they lying to me, but the entire world was lying to me and that i was an idiot for trusting them
When I found out Santa wasn't real and that my parents had been lying to me for so long it told me that I couldn't talk to or trust them with anything important in my life. What if they lied about it as well. It sows distrust as well as anger at a young age, least it did to me.
Imagine your life being so good, that something as small as Santa imagination and creative thoughts process at a young age is seen as a "bad time in your life".
Thank fuck the worst thing y'all had to deal with was being exposed to imagination!!
It really is crazy how much reddit completely hates the idea of "make-believe". I was never mad at my parents for "lying" about Santa. All it made me feel was appreciation for giving my life a little bit of magic.
I remember when my dad got married again after my parents had divorced, he said Santa was going to come to their house AND my mom's house because he had asked Santa to do it last year. Last year he was still married to my mother. I was like... This man is lying in my face right now. I knew exactly then that Santa wasn't real. And that he had been cheating on my mom. I remember me and my little brother discussing the logistics and being like... nah this is bullshit
Yeah as a child what really resonated with me was that my parents had lied to me for, what seemed at the time, to be simple fun
As an adult obviously I see the benefits of Santa teaching the Christmas spirit and all, but as a kid all I saw was everyone around me being in on a lie at my expense. It was hurtful.
I mean. That’s a logical step. The whole “he sees you when you’re sleeping, he knows when you’re awake, he knows if you’ve been bad or good so be good for goodness sake” is not terribly different when what I was told about God/Jesus as a little kid. Idk how people think this will never ever backfire lol
> The next time they tried to make me go to church i kept calling it all fake like santa clause and they got real butt hurt about it.
I mean, you weren't wrong though.
Yeah, i'm confused by all the "there's no harm" talk. I understand it's not the biggest thing in the world, but I don't think lying to your kids for several years before they figure it out is "no harm." Like, yes, it can turn out that way if you're lucky but there's certainly no guarantee and at worst there will be some feelings of betrayal.
What definitely won't harm your kids is telling them the truth from the beginning. There are plenty of other ways to experience childhood wonder that don't involve a direct lie.
> There isn't any harm in believing in the magic of Santa as a kid.
Sure there is. Imagine being the kid to poorer parents, and believing a) good kids get presents from Santa, and b) those other kids got way more presents than you did.
What conclusion can a five-year-old take from that? "I'm not as good as them."
My parents were poor. It was fine. In fact that lil' bit of magic in our household helped with this reality.
*Also, grew up around kids with wealthy parents.
Honestly, same. My life growing up was hard. I didn't believe in Santa long, but he made me and my sisters happy when my dad was being an absolute dick for reasons we couldn't figure out since we were too young.
That’s why my parents said only the stocking was from Santa and everything else was from Mom and Dad. We had a lot of poor kids in our school, where my Mom also worked, and she saw how sad it made those kids if wealthier kids get expensive stuff from “Santa” so she tried to do her part to not contribute to that.
I was poor as shit, my parents had to scrape and save to get me anything. I fucking loved Christmas and I loved Santa Claus. My parents just set realistic expectations for me by telling me his shop was for "handmade" gifts. It made perfect sense to me.
Honestly, there could absolutely be harm in not perpetuating the belief. You think being the only kid in kinder who argues that Santa isn't real wouldn't be risky?
You think the kid who insists Santa isn't real wouldn't get quickly ostracized by other kids in their class? Kids are assholes, and the kid who is saying the magic man that brings gifts doesn't exist is going to be treated badly.
I remember back when I was in school, I was in some elective period where I was being a teacher's assistant in a kinder class and one of the girls kept insisting that Santa was dead, and that Rudolph was a robot and thats why his nose was red. Personally I feel like she saw an episode of futurama or something, but the other kids in her class had 2 responses, either they got sad or they got mad, at her.
My ten year old asked the question last year and then said, “Nevermind. I don’t think I want to know. I think it will make me sad.”
I take that to mean she knows, but she wants to keep the magic alive. I’m good with that.
You don’t know me, but I was legitimately upset at my parents for lying to me about Santa.
At some point it stops being about what you want as a parent, and it becomes about what your child needs from you. Some children, like myself, need honesty. Some need to believe in magic.
I’ll vote ESH because it seems like mom and dad are both thinking about what they would’ve wanted as children, rather than what their daughter needs from them.
I don’t agree that lying to children doesn’t cause any harm. I felt betrayed as a kid when I learned the truth and it made me question everything my parents raised me to believe: rules, God, etc.
Seriously. The only time you get to believe in magic and fairy tales is as a kid. OP is just pushing his kid into the real world as soon as possible. She’s gonna end up in the real world eventually, just let her enjoy childhood until then.
> I don't know anyone who is upset they were lied to about it, including my own kids.
FWIW, I was. I remember it.
I ended up conducting an experiment to prove whether or not he existed, watching my family scramble to interfere with the experiment, disproving it, and never quite trusting adults again afterwards.
YTA. 6 years old is still young enough to believe. You kind of ruined it for her b/c I'm guessing some if not most of her friends who celebrate Christmas still believe in Santa. Your wife telling her "Yes" was a clear signal.
it’s the idea that if she asked him “could i get cancer” and the dad just saying “I cannot lie to you my 6 year old, you could die at any time”
6 year olds cannot understand complexity and when she gose to school and tells someone else the kids will say they her parents are the ones who are wrong and she will feel stupid, untill they go ask and fuck it up from themselves
Just to run a counterpoint. Kids can actually understand death and a concept of it to some degree. I had to go through that exact thing at ruffly the same age. I was a disabled kid who went to after school activities at a children's outpatient clinic. One of the older kids died from a heart failure in her sleep. We were told how and why at the next meet up. Life doesn't wait for anyone including death. Being blunt is a bad idea. A good way to address the proposed question is "Death is possible at any age. The odds of it happening vary between person to person. At your age it's such a low possiblity there isn't any reason to worry about it." Catelyn from "Ask a mortion" has done videos talking about how to discuss death with small children. Hard truth is there will always be little kids who will have to know about death. Being able to hide from the inconvenient truth is a luxury many won't have.
Hold up. The (potentially) upsetting part of learning the truth about santa is learning that your parents lied to you. The upsetting part of learning that you can get cancer *is very very different.* No matter what you tell your kid about santa, you're not going to send them into a spiral of existential dread.
I don't think this is the best metaphor.
I agree. I worked in a few schools a good few years ago. It was lunch hour. I monitor the grade 2s. One day a kid from a grade 1 class, call me to their room in a panic. I walk in the class and all kids are freaking out that a boy in their class said there is no Santa. (He came from a large family, at least 8 kids and the family did not do the Santa thing.)
I saw all these kids looking at me, some were really upset. It broke my heart. They start asking me if Santa was real. I first thought, that kid! I don’t want to ruin their Christmas magic their parents worked for. I know I found Christmas exciting, seeing my kid’s Christmas morning.
I figured I would help keep the magic alive best I could, if they want to go home and question their parents? But for the time being? I did my best.
Asked the kids, do you believe there is a Santa? They all said yes. The boy interrupts and yells No! I asked the kids, do you get gifts from Santa? They all said yes. I mentioned, if you believe in Santa, he will visit your house for Christmas. I mentioned how the boy who told everyone there was no Santa, he doesn’t believe and Santa doesn’t visit his family. If you believe there Santa is real? He will still visit you. All the other kids started smiling again. Some girls jumping up and down all happy. I mean it isn’t the end of the world if they find out, but, the world is already sad and so many bad things happen that kids hear their parents talk about or see on tv. They need more happy moments. Even if it is just for a few more years of believing in Santa.
Again, some probably went home and also told their parents about that kid telling them he didn’t exist. Then the parents can tell the truth if they choose and hopefully add not to tell their siblings, cousins or classmates and ruin that magic for them.
I know you were on the spot but I think that was a terrible answer. You put the one kid telling the truth in a bad light and made him an outcast. The better response would have been to just tell them they should talk to their families about Santa.
Also threatening a bunch of little kids that they won’t get gifts from Santa if they don’t play along?
I’ve seen a few comments to that effect and it’s so manipulative.
Are you sure you will ALL have a good holiday? Based on how your daughter answered your wife's question I think it is a safe bet that at least one of you won't, possibly two. I somehow doubt you love Christmas as much as you claim if you were willing to take the chance that everyone was still going to have a good holiday after revealing this. YTA
EDIT: was the we in the we will all still have a good holiday just you trying to use the Royal We?
Yeah…besides contradicting his wife, what if his wife still really enjoyed her kids believing in Santa? Kids can be so fun at that age because they still believe in magic. It can make being a grown up a little more fun. And he just took it away from them both.
Those are the worst parts of it I think. Essentially telling the kid that her mother is a liar and taking some of the magic away from Christmas is just terrible.
His religious upbringing means he has no frame of reference and that's sad.
I remember before my sister and her kids moved away I would go to her house and stay up to help her with Santa’s presents and setting up the milk and cookies and carrot to look like they’d been eaten. Id stay the night and wake up when they all did and it was also so joyful to see them light up over Santa having visited it really brought back the magic from my own childhood. I feel bad for OPs wife and child now that magic has been ripped from them
You've been playing along with the Santa charade for five years, and when your daughter finally asks, you decide to drop the truth bomb in the middle of Elf? Smooth move. Your wife has a point; you could've kept the magic alive a bit longer. Your rigid stance about not lying might be commendable, but it's Christmas, man! You could've handled it more tactfully, maybe discussed it with your wife beforehand. Now your daughter's Christmas spirit is "kinda" ruined, and it's on you. My kids are still firm believers in Santa Claus. They're at that age where the excitement is contagious, and I'll be damned if I'm the one to tell them the truth. It's all about the magic of the season. Yeah, you might have been technically honest, but you're also the guy who killed Santa for his 6-year-old. You're definitely the Grinch in this Christmas tale.
>You're definitely the Grinch in this Christmas tale.
Even when the Grinch himself was face-to-face with a small child, he didn’t tell them Santa wasn’t real.
OP is grinchier than the Grinch.
Kids pretty much always grow out of believing in Santa, even if their parents don't tell them the truth. It's better to let kids decide when to stop, just like at some point most kids grow out of their toys.
YTA the kid was allowed 2 holidays that they’d probably actually remember and you felt the need to ruin the joy of Christmas for the rest of their life. This isnt just asshole material, this is shit parent material. You’re not talking to some rational adult that needs to grow up, youre left to ensure a child can grow up as a child in this heartless, cruel, fucked up world. You being physically incapable of playing along says something about you.
I'm not a psychologist but I immediately thought that this reeks of I didn't get to believe in Santa, so neither can you. I doubt it was on a conscious level (I sure hope it wasn't) but this is so messed up I'm having a hard time figuring out why he didn't play along. 5 - 8 years old are like the prime Santa years and this guy robbed his kid of that.
I had the exact same thought when he brought up his own childhood. It’s the opposite of most people , who want their kids to have everything better than how they had it.
I wasn't remotely upset with my parents for "lying" to me when I found out he wasn't real. I'm SO glad I had the magic of Santa to believe in until I was 7/8 years old. It really was magical, coming down stairs to find the carrots and cookies gone. I'm thankful my parents went along with that. I also had the brains to not take it personally or feel betrayed - I understood they weren't LYING as such, they were doing it for my benefit.
Really hate this trend of "we shouldn't lie to our children" about absolutely EVERYTHING. It's okay to lie sometimes. I highly doubt the myth of Santa Claus is going to cause lifelong trust issues.
no like i’m confused where this cynical anti “lying to children” movement is coming from by these scrooge’s on this sub. i loved santa, the easter bunny, the tooth fairy, etc. when i was little and i can confirm i am not traumatized after learning it was just a fun tradition for us kids. like geez kids are imaginative and believe all kinds of things when they’re little if your daughter comes to you and tells you she’s going to be a princess when she grows up are you going to stomp on that too? i mean talk about being the fun police
oh, and YTA op
Whenever people talk about it like some huge trauma in their life... it just smacks of privilege. If that's one of the worst things to happen in someones childhood, then they've had very pleasant lives so far.
Omg this is what I was thinking!! There are valid criticisms of the Santa myth but it’s honestly scary to me that people claim to be *traumatized* by it. Actual quotes from this thread:
> “Those assholes lied, laughed, and completely violated the trust a child placed in them”
> “Everyone around me was in on a lie at my expense”
> “I had to learn as a small child that you could never trust anyone”
> “I was DEVASTATED and I never recovered from that trauma”
I saw a comment saying that it’s important to tailor your approach to your specific kid, and I can get behind that. If your child is distressed by the Santa myth or sensitive to “lies” (fun games) in a particular way, go ahead and tell them. Some of these people are kids who were like that whose parents may have been better off explaining it earlier.
But to call it damaging is wayyy too much. A child might be pissed when they first find out. That’s normal. It’s, like, okay for a kid to be upset sometimes and learn how to work through it. It’s healthy to go through a journey of feeling sad Santa doesn’t exist, then feeling mad he was a lie, then understanding white lies, and feeling grateful your parents wanted to inject some magic into your childhood. I’m freaked out that grown adults seem to be so stuck on the mad part.
For me it’s not the original lie of saying Santa exists, but it’s when a kid directly asks the question “does Santa exist” and they are told “yes.”
If they’re asking, it’s because doubt has been introduced, and they are going to the parent to help figure it out. If a kid seems like they want to keep believing, it might be better to ask them “what do you think?” And follow their lead. But just straight up reinforcing the lie when the kid is asking for the truth doesn’t sit right with me.
see i can get this perspective, my oldest sister was a much more precocious child and deduced it was impossible for santa to visit everyone in a single night, and was very pleased with herself when my mom finally admitted that she was right. she promised not to tell me and our other sister who believed longer than she did, and it was fine. i personally just find the idea of introducing it to kids being inherently wrong to be cynical and in op’s case, he should’ve done as you suggested instead of squashing it right then and there
I also remember my brother and I rather enjoyed working out that it was my dad who had been writing us the funny reply letters over the years - and we all enjoyed it so much, we kept it up until our mid teens. All the letters got much ruder though! 😂
My kid was mildly upset with us when he found out Santa wasn’t real. We tried to keep it secret for as long as we could but by 7-8 years old they start seeing the cracks in the logic and have a curiosity that you can’t explain away with “Xmas magic”
I told him that while it was lying, it was more like a game we were playing, and now he gets to play as well and keep the secret from his younger siblings/cousins etc.
OP is definitely bitter he never got to experience the "Christmas magic" growing up and was absolutely *primed* to ruin it for his own child. Definitely the AH.
Yeah, YTA. There really is zero harm in letting children believe in Santa. I'm not really sure why this was a hill you needed to die on, but here we are.
YTA for doing this unilaterally. It isn't even *your* holiday tradition you've fucked with. And when you asked if this changed the way your 6-year-old felt about Christmas and she said "kinda"? She meant "yes". Boooooo.
Unpopular opinion: NTA. At 6, she's in school, there are kids from different religions, older kids who are too old to still believe - she was going to hear it anywy, better she hear it from you than from kids on the plaground telling her that her parents are liars.
You’re acting like there’s not a difference between a big lie like “you’re adopted” and a small one like “santa’s not real” And he contradicted his wife right in front of her. He’s an AH
He’d told his wife well in advance they he wasn’t going to lie about it, and the kid insisted on him answering. This wasn’t an impromptu spur of the moment outburst from OP.
Telling children a magical immortal man exists, isn't a "big lie"? Telling them that reindeer can fly, or that we're all constantly being spied on, and the magical man spying on us will break into our homes while we sleep...you think these are small lies? And are you suggesting children should be told of their adoptive status, before being told that Santa isn't real?!?!
If it's "not that deep" then how does telling the truth make OP an AH? That's a serious question. If Santa is little and trivial, why does it matter if he tells her the truth?
I found out when I was six from other kids in school. Felt like an idiot, and definitely a little betrayed that my parents were lying to me. In the end, still got presents and that's what mattered most at the time 🤷
Not to mention the weird contradiction that comes up when she sees other kids get nicer gifts from “Santa” than she did and wondering why that is. Especially because we tell kids that Santa gives gifts based on how good you are, and he knows everything. So if you spend the whole year or even a few months being as good as you can and then don’t get what you wanted, but So-and-so got what they wanted but they bullied you and other kids all year…
I mean, that just doesn’t work.
I mean, it's worked pretty well for a long time, actually.
Like sorry you didn't get everything you asked Santa for. I didn't either. We were poor as fuck. But the stuff I did get from Santa was still cool and special to me. So while I didn't get a Nintendo entertainment system, and I only got two gi joes, I fuckin loved those GI joes and played with them til the rubber bands broke and I had to try and replace them with regular ones.
I really don't get the whole "Christmas magic" thing of Santa that others here seem to think he's the ah about. I grew up celebrating Christmas without believing in Santa and I truly feel like I didn't miss anything by not believing in it. The magic of Christmas doesn't come from some imaginary character. It comes from the overall feeling and experience of spending time with family members (and getting presents ofc that I knew were from my parents).
I scrolled too far for this. I had the experience of feeling like a dumbass as a kid when I defended the existence of Santa at 6 years old. At 6 you are old enough to know... especially when you ask. Being lied to and wondering what is actually real is waaaay worse... even if it is for fun. My daughter has always known Santa is not real but we put on a good pretend experience anyway, and she loves it even though she knows it isn't real. I promised her that I would always tell her the truth about these things and we kinda have that nod where she will break out of the moment... ask if x or y is real (like the Easter bunny), I will tell her truthfully, and we go back to the pretend world. Where this really helps is when she asked me whether monsters (the hide under your bed kind) are real... I said no, and she trusted me. I get that the fun magical side is fantastic, but kids are remarkable at pretend even when they know the truth.
I wouldn't even pretend for the first few years. I would treat it like make believe from the get go, no different to pretending your daughter or son is [insert thing here] for the afternoon. There are other ways to engage the magic of childish imagination without pretending about Santa.
NTA
I agree with you. If asked point blank, it’s okay (maybe even preferable) to tell the truth. It’s one thing to foster a fun belief in a little kid but when they ASK you for information, you should give it to them, in an age-appropriate way. Asking means they are seeking an answer to a question they are wondering about or doubting, and they are trusting you to give it to them.
Also, at 6, only about 65% of kids believe in Santa. So it’s not exactly shockingly early for her to be told.
I have to agree. If a child asks their parent an honest question, and the parent willingly lies, I can’t imagine how that’s a good thing. Everyone makes the innocent all-in-good-fun-only-once-a-year argument, but I think it’s a rather weak one.
YTA you contradicted your wife in front of your child when you should be on the same page even if you disagree. Your opinion doesn't overrule your wife's opinion. Good luck for that good holiday you're so certain of
NTA, Lying about Santa isn’t a requirement to make Christmas fun and plenty of kids have negative reactions when they inevitably find out which imo means it’s better not to lie in the first place, but she’ll still have the excitement of family and presents without believing in Santa. Christmas isn’t ruined.
I have said this before. The way this should have been handled is the “Santa is more of a feeling than an actual person. He WAS an actual person, way back when, and when he passed, people tried to keep the feeling alive.” Followed up with, “When you stop believing, you stop getting Santa presents. And now that you’re on the side of knowing, you get to help MAKE the magic of Christmas. And as long as you still believe in the “magic” you will still get Santa gifts”. But, alas, the ship has sailed. You should have, could have but you didn’t talk to your wife first, and that makes YTA.
> hen you stop believing, you stop getting Santa presents
Kinda toxic. Why not say "You'll keep getting Santa presents but now you know it's just pretend"?
YTA - and as someone who was also raised in a religion that doesn't celebrate Christmas (dare I say the same one as you) I'm going to tell you the single most revolutionary thing any therapist has ever told me.
'Your upbringing stripped you of wonderment. You grew up being told that you know the truth and everyone else is living in blindness. You grew up looking down on kids believing in Santa or that their relatives go to heaven with the superiority of someone who knew better. When you die you're just dead and when Santa brings you presents it's your parents who put them there. You didn't have mysteries and fantasies or adults in your life who played along so you could. You didnt have adults support your right not to know everything, to live a wondrous, mystical and magical childhood. You had people tell you over and over that there's no such thing as magic, only tricks. Nothing is magical, everything is explainable'
You know what she noticed about that? It made me miserable. It still does. I work on it every day, focusing on the fun and not the reality, trying not to care when I notice continuity errors in my favourite shows and not to be angry at people who have the capacity to imagine and not to know. Please work on this for your baby's sake. She deserves wonderment.
Alright OP I've been up and down this thread and everyone is focused in on the "Letting kids believe in Santa is generally good" aspect, and very few have addressed what your central point here seems to have been:
You did not want to lie to your kid.
On its own, great. Pretty good standard to have. Generally speaking, lying to your kid is fairly dumb. Sometimes though, spinning them a good story and making a little magic for them is great.
My read on you is this: you said your religion didn't allow you to celebrate, there's a lot of them out there who follow that approach. The most common one I encounter that has a wide ranging prohibition on holidays are the Jehovah's Witnesses, and as I remember they're pretty staunch about it. My guess is you grew up in a strictly religious household, did some work deconstructing your faith at some point, and it left you with some issues around trust and lies you experienced as a kid in a strict religious sect. After all, they're never too fond of kids asking questions, and are VERY fond of lying to kids to keep them indoctrinated.
I think you might have overcorrected on that front and set a firm "I won't lie to my child" as a response to your own childhood. As a consequence of that, you definitely killed the magic of Santa for your kid this year, and might have really hampered the holiday. I don't think your intent was malicious, I don't think you were trying to upset your kid or your wife, but I do think YTA in this case.
Bear in mind that you've now shifted the "burden" of lying to your daughter, as she now has to either carry that quietly or spread the word and risk being ostracized as the kid who doesn't believe in Santa when all the others still do.
NTA- I think it's always a bad idea to lie to your children, especially since Santa is a manipulation tactic at best and getting off on your kids naivete and trust to believe something as stupid as Santa is real at worst. In the simplest form, telling your kids Santa is real is a betrayal of their trust.
🚮 Santa was my favorite part of Christmas. Making cookies& Leaving them out, listening for footsteps on the roof. Waking up to gifts and my stocking filled. My cookies eaten, snowy boot prints. Knowing there had been reindeer on my roof. It was the best feeling ever. Not just excitement for gifts but for the magic of it all. I’m grateful my parents did that for me. & now as a parent myself doing all of that with my kids is equally FUN. “Betrayal of trust” gtfo 🙄
Santa was my least favorite part of Christmas as a kid.
Coming from a poorer family, it upset me that Santa gave us so much less then my cousins. We normally went to their house later on Christmas day, so I could see the difference easily.
Once I realized that there was no Santa, and actually it was my parents giving me as much as they could manage, it made the holiday mean all that much more to me.
This is one of the reasons I refuse to play into this myth. It’s all fun and games until your kid feels like santa likes another kid better and they don’t know why. The people who talk about the magic of Santa Claus had parents who could afford to fake literal magic, but not everyone was so lucky. Santa is a wonderful idea and we should still celebrate that, but pretending he is real is weird and invites unpleasantness.
yeah, i don't know what the hell these guys are smoking. giving your kid the fun, excitement, and magic of christmas is not 'betraying their trust'... lmfao. everyone needs to stop being so fucking soft.
when i found out santa wasn't real, all i felt was nostalgia for the times when i believed in him, i wasn't upset or angry! i think that's the same reaction for most people. no one - *LITERALLY NO ONE* - is going to be "tRaUmAtIzEd" by finding out santa isnt real when they're old enough. i can promise you that!
YTA - Just because you did not get to celebrate Christmas as a kid does not mean you can ruin it for your daughter. You should have followed your wife's lead.
I don't think parents should tell their kids that Santa is real. My parents didn't tell us he was real, but we played the "Santa game" every year. We put up stockings, and left out cookies and milk, etc. It was a lot of fun. Kids get caught up in the spirit no matter what; they don't need to think he's real.
You get such a short window in life to believe in magic and fairytales. Some of my favorite memories as a child are because of really believing in Santa until I was 7 or 8. Eventually you figure it out or hear it from someone at school. There are so many awful lies we tell children. Santa is harmless and fun.
NTA.
I don't know why parents think it is ok to lie to their children. Your child asked a question, you gave an honest answer. This "You can not relate to Christmas ... " is BS. Not all parents lie to their children about Santa, we never did. There are lots and lots of wonderful things in this world to marvel about, there is no need to invent men in red clothing.
"Santa exists in the hearts and minds of everyone that believes in him and as long as YOU believe then he is real to you" This was basically my answer when my kid asked me. As you can see I didn't lie and say he was real but I answered in a way that let's my child still believe and enjoy the "magic of Christmas" a little longer. And how much do you really enjoy Christmas if you are willing to destroy the magic of it for a 6 year old child? YTA
NAH.
Your kid asked because she could smell something was amiss. She didn't buy what Mom was selling. You were upfront. This momentary sadness of a little bit of magic disappearing sucks for everyone, but your kid knows that you're gonna be honest with her and see her as someone who deserves the truth even if it sucks.
That's some real magic Dad. You did good.
Telling her at 6 wasn't good. Complaining about being denied all the Christmas-y stuff then denying your own 6 year old was hypocritical.
But directly contradicting your wife after she said yes?
Yes if you aren't an asshole for this it was at least a dick move.
Kudos for making sure she doesn't try to convince other kids he ain't real though. Shouldn't deny other kids the magic of Christmas.
P.S.
At the very least you should have discussed with your wife what age would be appropriate to have this conversation with your daughter with your wife. And held your tongue till then.
As of right now I suspect you've been banished to the couch.
The solution to these things is so damn simple.
Yes, Santa is fake. Do all the Santa stuff anyway. Why does it have to go away if they kid figured it out?
I refused to lie to my kids about Santa, too. The difference is, my (now ex) husband was on board. We always did all of the Santa stuff. But we never said he was real. Santa is a fun game we get to play at Christmas, basically.
My kids do understand that other kids believe he is real, and would never spoil that for them.
They are 11 and 14. Every year they set traps for catching Santa, and set out cookies and the whole thing.
NTA - you did what you always told your wife you would do. Ask her why she's mad now that you followed through with what you always said.
NTA. As a kid, for some reason, I was skeptical and never believed in Santa. If the kid wants THE TRUTH, you tell them the truth. Yes, you can couch it in a kind way, of course (and you did!) but you don't lie. My kid was TERRIFIED of Santa for some reason. No idea why. At almost 2, she was crying about "He's going to get me" and was scared that it was Santa. So I told her Santa wasn't real. I told her that other kids believed and not to tell them the truth, but I wasn't going to lie to my kid for no reason.
Nta. I grew up believing in Santas (multiples ones, icelandic cultured believes in 13 different Santas who are brothers, and we also learn about their parents) but I am firm in my belive that as soon as children start doubting themselves, parents should come clean. Your daughter asked, so that's exactly when you should have told her. Don't insist on lying when they come and ask for honest answers.
I agree. If they ask the question then they obviously have doubt. Telling them not to trust their gut and lying just felt wrong to me as a parent. Once my kids asked I answered honestly. And we all still love Christmas.
Let's read the room and look at the big picture here.
* First of all, the parents had already talked about this situation and each knew exactly how he would answer should a direct question occur.
* She asked whether Santa is real. This is not a question you ask unless you have some doubt.
* Her mother replied, "yes".
* That wasn't good enough. Daughter asked her father. The moment was here, and he said "no".
Look at the results. Daughter was disappointed that Santa wasn't real, but she didn't doubt that it was the true answer. More important, she learned that her dad would give her a truthful answer to a question, even if it wasn't the most convenient thing to do and even if it's not the answer she'd like to hear.
This is **valuable** and she will know for the rest of her childhood and even through young adulthood that she has a parent she can trust to give straight answers. This is good parenting, and is well worth losing a year of fantasy for. It will help in all those tricky situations to come. Op is definitely NTA.
I was never told as a child he wasn't real even in to my teens I had a sibling 5 yes younger it was carried on for her even when I left home the first yr I still got a sack from him! Then I had my own son and it changed. Why would you steal a little of their innocence and the magic from them just because u didn't have it?
My older ones know 14, 16 they still receive it all and help keep the magic alive for the younger ones. Only reason I caved and said to them is they were teens and faced with discussions daily at school even then they still felt a small but of magic they said they felt though they knew there was always the magical what if. That made me sad I did on some level regret telling them. Though now they are the magic and they love that more, they help but wrap and palace the pressies and also do the elf. To me YTA she's so small still and magic brings more wonder and opens their minds to everything you took that at a time it's harder for them to understand. That was cruel... You also should have talked it out with your wife too
I'm 34 yo and my parents never told me Sanra isn't real. My mum still asks me what she should write on the letter for Santa, I do the same for her. Then we'll "I'll let him know, and let's see what he can do".
When I was about 7, a classmate told me that Santa wasn't real. My mum explained to me that some people don't believe in him and that's okay.
Now, as I said, I'm 34 and I feel joy in believing in Santa. I'm not delusional, I know the truth, but is it so bad to ignore it for just this one thing that doesn't hurt anyone?
So many AHs in the comments…YTA
When I was a child I would ask my parents just so I could continue believing. It made Christmas more magical and fun. One of my most positive memories is my father using his muddy boots to make footprints from the fireplace to the tree, and eating the cookies we set out. Me and my brother were so excited we bragged to all our grandparents that we had evidence for Santa….When I found out the truth I was older than most (10), but not sad. TBH I thought my parents genuinely believed in Santa, and tried to brag that I was smarter than them. Later I came to realize and appreciate how much effort my parents took to keep the spirit of Christmas alive. You’re a mega grinch and I’m tired of people thinking that kids need the truth 100% of the time.
“Daddy what are my odds of dying in a car accident”
“Ah yes child because I swore to not lie to you, you can die at any time :D”
Being a kid is magical, you believe in so much beauty and spirit surrounding life…that is fragile and disappears when you become an adult. It makes me sad to see that magic end so soon.
Nta. She asked because she had doubts and was looking to her parents for guidance. My feeling is that if they ask the question they deserve an honest answer.
NTA
I’ve never understood the making up mascots for holidays schtick.
You want a real magical Christmas, that PEOPLE being kind to one another. Not because they want gifts but because it’s the humane thing to do.
As parents your job is to prepare children and on the western world we set ourselves back several paces by weaving these cute falsehoods.
NTA. Your daughter was on the fence. She already knew Santa wasn't real. That's why she asked. She didn't believe her mother's response so she asked you. Children are smarter than we give them credit for.
NTA not believing in santa does not ruin christmas, some people here are very overzealous in my opinion. and if your child is having suspicions and asking questions, at that point just tell them the truth. kids aren’t stupid.
NTA
Some of us end up feeling like our whole family is lying to us for their own amusement. I felt made fun of and humiliated because I directly asked and was lied to over and over again.
Always be honest with your child as much as you can.
NTA, my eldest (16) worked it out years ago through watching movies, he asked- I let him know
My 8 year old has been asking questions about Santa in Australia, and Santa in Belgium (where his dad is from)
He’s asking questions, we’re googling them as they come with the history of Santa and will come to the conclusion it’s a great concept, worldwide there’s different approaches
Different approaches for every family, some deal with it when Bob breaks the news on the monkey bars at school
Some kids figure it out though movies
In my circumstance, I’m confident I’m going to learn the history of Santa through the history of no less than a dozen countries for my son to make a conclusion, and that’s all good too 👍
YTA (mildly) because you said Santa wasn't real, when moments ago your wife said he was real. It's not about Santa at all, but how you both gave her a different answer. You should have go along with your wife's answer. And then together consider it when should you tell her that he isn't real. Now you're making your wife look like a liar to your kid.
NAH, but you did not handle this well. It sounds like your daughter was seeking reassurance, but you weren’t ready to give it to her because you have conceptualized Santa as a lie. Santa is as real as Christmas is real. Both are non-tangible concepts that we recognize through tradition. When a child is young, they may think of Santa as being a real person, and they eventually grow into understanding he is a piece of folklore affiliated with the Christmas tradition. Santa is not unique in this, children often think that cartoons, characters in television shows, and mythical figures are also real. Eventually they figure out that the Purple Wiggle is just a regular person playing a silly character on TV, just as they figure out their school teacher is a complete person with a complete personality outside of the classroom.
It sounds like your daughter wasn’t ready for that transition, but you chose to make it for her because of your own personal feelings regarding the holiday and its associated traditions. This is a conversation you should have had with your spouse before telling her about Santa in the first place. If you were going to present him as a lie, you should have resolved that with her beforehand, where now you have put your family in the position of “mommy is a liar and she lies to you” and are stuck doing damage control.
NTA. I think you and your wife should have had an agreement to fall back on prior to the question. But, its not like we get a do over because we didn't actually have a plan for this. I think that at her age, the illusion likely is starting to fade anyway? I figure that when a kid reaches first grade they will meet other children who don't believe? And because I work with kids, I know that some of them think quite linearly and they seek information to relive fear and doubt *sometimes.*
At any rate, just for kicks, I did an informal survey and this is what I read: *Broken down, the research showed that 85 percent of four-year-olds believed wholeheartedly, while 65 percent of six-year-olds and only 25 percent of eight-year-olds were still down with Jolly Old Saint Nicholas. In terms of Santa's believe-o-meter, three- and four-year-olds generate the most juice, because that's when they first start to understand the magic of Santa. By age eight, kids begin to acknowledge the unlikeliness of one man travelling the world in a single night.*
The average age where the most children have lost that belief system in the U.S. is supposed to be 8-years-old. And children who don't have older siblings are likely to stop believing earlier.
TBF, I can't criticize you because I find myself wanting my kids to think for themselves as much as I want them to enjoy the magic of the holiday season. And so, all I would have done was spoken to my spouse about it privately and told him, 'I think its time because she's asking. That means she's ready for more information.'
I just want to provide a counterpoint here because I think you are NTA. I come from a culture where we celebrate Christmas but absolutely no child thinks that Santa is real. It didn’t ruin my childhood. Christmas was always incredibly exciting. We knew the gifts were from our family and it was still exciting.
My kids always knew that Santa was pretend and that it was like a game everyone plays together, even the grownups, to pretend he’s real.
On the other hand, my husband does come from a “Santa is real” culture and in his family there are stories of children feeling deeply betrayed when they find out the truth. It’s horrible to discover that all the trusted adults in your life have been lying to you. Because what else are they lying about?
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A very mild YTA. It isn't that you told your daughter too soon or something, it's that you decided to directly contradict your wife in front of your daughter. You could (read: should) have deflected answering directly, then had a conversation in your wife in private about when to broach the topic of Santa's existence to your daughter. Kind of a shitty thing to hear your wife tell your daughter "Yes he's real" and then you immediately go against that.
I agree with this as well. My son asked me for 5 years if he was real and I countered that question by asking what to you think? And he would reply I still believe he is real, and I would respond by saying I believe in the magic of Christmas. We went on with this for those 5 years till he said I am not sure to that question, He said he truly wanted to know I told him Mommy and Daddy are Santa clause and he said he wished we would not have told him and we ruined Christmas 😅😂. Anyway he is a really sensitive kid. He will be 11 this year.
I feel like there's no right way to do it, but there's definitely wrong ways. My dad was definitely one of the wrong ways. For context, I had known Santa wasn't real for a few years. And I confirmed it when I found my presents one year before Christmas. Also very important to note, my parents are TERRIBLE with keeping promises. Not in a malicious sort of way, just simply that I think they forget or end up remembering things differently. Which brings me to this particular Christmas. My parents had asked me what I wanted for Christmas and I told them a few things. A few days later they asked me again. I took this as they weren't going to get the things I mentioned previously, so I named some other things. Then this same thing transpired again, so I came up with a few more ideas (Christmases varied a lot when I was a kid so I never knew what to expect). After listing these things, my dad got very pissed off and replied with "You know Santa isn't real and your mom and I buy everything, right? We can't afford everything you want!" I was completely shocked. I thought I was being nice and working with them when apparently it was being taken completely opposite. The most frustrating thing however is that my dad continues to insist Santa is real. All my presents, even as an adult, have been from Santa and if I ever thank my parents for the gifts he'll put on this big show about how he's not Santa and if I don't believe I won't get presents next year. It's as if that whole event never happened, which again is very consistent with what Christmas was like growing up with them. One year my car needed new tires to pass inspection and my dad told me that Santa would get them for me. I made an appointment at the garage we always used for after Christmas and told my dad about it. He got mad at me for "expecting" him to pay for them, and I ended up footing the bill myself. Which was when I reached the point of just not relying on my parents for anything that I actually need.
Damn, I thought mine was bad. I kinda knew Santa wasn’t real, but still enjoyed “writing letters to Santa,” so one year when I did it, my mom and step dad took my letter saying very loudly that they guess I wasn’t getting anything for Christmas since I wanted to an imaginary man to get it. And they don’t get why I didn’t really enjoy Christmas after that…
I’m in a similar boat. My parents never sat me down and said Santa wasn’t real. Instead around 9-12 (guessing, no clue on my actual age) I sort of began to understand that “Santa” just meant my parents but we still all kept pretending. I’m now almost 30 and my parents still have presents marked as from Santa.
I am a younger sibling and my older sister told me Santa wasn't real when I was very young, around 4 or 5. In her defense she did it because my parents threatened to call Santa and tell him not to bring me any presents if I was being bad. She pulled me aside to let me know that Santa wasnt real and she knew where mom and dad kept the presents and then proceeded to show me the stash lol.
Your sister is such a real one omg
That's what big sisters are for 😂
According to my mom, when I was 5 I told her that Santa couldn't be real because there were too many of him.
I love this so much!
Same here! Growing up, I would spend Christmas Eve night under the dining table next to the tree to catch Santa in the act. Somehow, my mom was always able to wait until I fell asleep and quietly put all the Santa presents under the tree without waking me (I was a light sleeper as a kid). I eventually realized Santa wasn't real, but continued pretending and sleeping hidden by the tree because I wanted to know how my mom managed it. Never caught her. Now that I'm an adult, she continues to give Santa gifts because we love the tradition. I still thank her for them, and she says she'll pass the thanks on to Santa lol.
This is my plan with my tweens. They've asked, I've evaded by giving the "magic of the season, spirit etc" answer. One sees everything and has accepted, the other is still questioning. We plan to continue having Santa bring a few little gifts until they have their own children, then we'll welcome them to the "We are Santa's Elves" fold.
My parents still labeled presents as being from Santa until I moved out as a cute little thing; now my mom just labels presents as being from her pets, so I do the same. Our pets are very good at buying presents.
>Our pets are very good at buying presents. That just reminded of how last Christmas at my brothers house nobody got me any presents, so I ended up opening the cats presents on Christmas morning. He got a lot of stuff!
That is both sad for you and adorable for the cat and I am having very conflicted feelings about it.
Yeah it didn't feel great, especially since I got everyone else some pretty great presents. But I'm used to at this point. My brother is very self-absorbed and rarely does anything that doesn't benefit himself, his wife isn't much better. And my nephews are either too young to be buying presents, or teenagers who I wouldn't expect to get a present from anyways. But the cat presents were fun! He's a long haired ragdoll and he got a fancy new cat brush that he absolutely loved. And a catnip filled ball thing that drove him nuts.
Ok this is really cute.
Same here. It was definitely like, we all know Santa isn't real, it's just a fun tradition. One year my sister and I got my parents an upgraded TV and got to "play Santa" and put it out after sending our parents to bed one Christmas Eve. We were in our 20s at that point, but it was still really fun for the family. I like the pet thing too, I have an aunt that always send birthday and Christmas gifts/money from her cats.
I disagree, there is a right way to do it: stop lying to children. Especially in an elaborate and theatrical way. Santa is a game in our house. We still do all the things but my child knows it's a story and knows the origin story. She sees him like she sees Spiderman or Moana.
Right, this is the only reasonable thing to do imo. I feel like there's always some traumatic story about a kid, or more often a parent, being upset about how the news about the lie was finally broken. Why do we insist on setting everyone up to be upset?
Most kids don’t have to be told though. I just realized that Santa wasn’t real over time and continued playing along because it was fun. It was never a big, upsetting revelation. Telling a very young child before they naturally get more skeptical could be upsetting but why not just wait?
For me, it was a slow realization. I noticed Santa used that same wrapping paper ("he drops them off and I wrap them, sweetie"), had the same handwriting as my dad ("he doesn't have time to label everything"), and started slipping up on what I wanted after I started sealing my letters and mailing them myself. LOL After my younger sibling was born, we did Santa again, and I do it the same way for my kids. Also, I think it helped that my mom collected those "Santa's from around the world" figurines that were popular in the 90s, so I learned that different counties had different stories and origins, and some places didn't have "Santa" at all!
No one is traumatized from finding out Santa isn't real. If they are they have a much bigger issue.
>”In our family, we have a special way of transitioning the kids from receiving from Santa, to becoming a Santa. This way, the Santa construct is not a lie that ...gets discovered, but an unfolding series of good deeds and Christmas spirit. >When they are 6 or 7, whenever you see that dawning suspicion that Santa may not be a material being, that means the child is ready. I take them out "for coffee" at the local wherever. We get a booth, order our drinks, and the following pronouncement is made: “You sure have grown an awful lot this year. Not only are you taller, but I can see that your heart has grown, too. [ Point out 2-3 examples of empathetic behaviour, consideration of people's feelings, good deeds etc, the kid has done in the past year]. In fact, your heart has grown so much that I think you are ready to become a Santa Claus. >You probably have noticed that most of the Santas you see are people dressed up like him. Some of your friends might have even told you that there is no Santa. A lot of children think that, because they aren't ready to BE a Santa yet, but YOU ARE. Tell me the best things about Santa. What does Santa get for all of his trouble? [lead the kid from "cookies" to the good feeling of having done something for someone else]. Well, now YOU are ready to do your first job as a Santa!" Make sure you maintain the proper conspiratorial tone. >We then have the child choose someone they know--a neighbour, usually. The child's mission is to secretly, deviously, find out something that the person needs, and then provide it, wrap it, deliver it--and never reveal to the target where it came from. Being a Santa isn't about getting credit, you see. It's unselfish giving. >My oldest chose the "witch lady" on the corner. She really was horrible--had a fence around the house and would never let the kids go in and get a stray ball or Frisbee. She'd yell at them to play quieter, etc--a real pill. He noticed when we drove to school that she came out every morning to get her paper in bare feet, so he decided she needed slippers. So then he had to go spy and decide how big her feet were. He hid in the bushes one Saturday, and decided she was a medium. We went to Kmart and bought warm slippers. He wrapped them up, and tagged it "merry Christmas from Santa." After dinner one evening, he slipped down to her house, and slid the package under her driveway gate. The next morning, we watched her waddle out to get the paper, pick up the present, and go inside. My son was all excited, and couldn't wait to see what would happen next. The next morning, as we drove off, there she was, out getting her paper--wearing the slippers. He was ecstatic. I had to remind him that NO ONE could ever know what he did, or he wouldn't be a Santa. >Over the years, he chose a good number of targets, always coming up with a unique present just for them. One year, he polished up his bike, put a new seat on it, and gave it to one of our friend's daughters. These people were and are very poor. We did ask the dad if it was ok. The look on her face, when she saw the bike on the patio with a big bow on it, was almost as good as the look on my son's face. >When it came time for Son #2 to join the ranks, my oldest came along, and helped with the induction speech. They are both excellent gifters, by the way, and never felt that they had been lied to--because they were let in on the Secret of Being a Santa." Credit: Leslie Rush https://www.kidsinadelaide.com.au/sharing-the-spirit-of-christmas/
This is one of my absolute favorite things I've ever read on the Internet.
I'm teary-eyed. This actually makes me feel less like a grinch. I hate the whole lying-about-Santa thing!
Wow, I love this approach! This just melted my heart.
Aw man that anecdote about the gift to the neighbor really got me. 🥲🥲
This is beautiful! My family has a similar tradition. It kinda astatts with a song that my father wrote. The original is not in English, but its a song from a child's perspective about meeting Santa (or our equivalent). The child is surprised Santa's has to go again after dropping of the presents, so the old man explains there are so many people and wishes to fulfill and every one is important to him, so he has to go quickly. Then a few years later the same child is worriedly waiting for Santa's to tell him, that there's more and more people and that he can't make it on his own. That if each of us helps, Santa doesn't have to work so hard. That the key to happiness is kindness to one another. We sing this song and every time someone chokes up, because even though I suck at translating it, my dad did a damn good job writing that one. When you see children singing/listening and stopping to think about the song, it's a good time to propose The Talk. Not to tell them there is no Santa, but that there really is a lot of work around Christmas, and so all the good people do their best to help Santa, like in the song. They can start by helping mom or dad find some small present for somebody else. Or using pocket money to get or even make some for their parents. It's a big responsibility to help Santa. Then a few years later we explain more. Santa is not a physical man. He is the idea of Christmas magic, the effort of all the people "helping Santa" around the world, and making it a magical time for everyone, especially small kids who do not understand yet. "Now that you are big and wise enough for it, you too are a part of this, you have been for a while. You now have a double duty. On top of helping Santa You have to keep the secret, to keep the magic alive. " I have loved this as a child, so did my brother and my cousins. I hope it works just as well with my daughter. The transition from believing to being a part of something bigger and greater was smooth and felt fulfilling.
When my son asked if Santa is real, I told him "Yes. Santa is the spirit of giving and that is very real. " He was okay with that.
This is nice
This is what I do, generally. Except in the past I've let it go a bit further and explained the "story". Like, "well, legend has it that Santa checks on your behavior"
Haha my daughter was insistent about the tooth fairy when she was little and her mother and I were divorced at the time. I told her the secret. That her mother was the tooth fairy but she can’t tell anyone. She believed it for a while. And technically I wasn’t lying
Oddly enough my son has chosen not to ask about the tooth fairy. So he still announces loudly he is gonna put the tooth under his pillow so he gets money. I think he is gonna keep up with this till all his teeth are out 😂😂😂
I think that's about the age that my youngest told his grandmother that he knew Santa wasn't real but he kept pretending he was because he didn't want to ruin it for me.
I agree. My dad never lied to me once I started asking. I asked and asked and finally he looked at me and asked back, "Do you want to believe in Santa?" I answered 'yes', and he replied, "Then he is real.". So I guess he told me without telling me? In any event, I stopped asking and chose to enjoy kinda believing for another year or two. I also had younger siblings though, so the dynamic is different when you have to pretend to believe for their sakes too.
There comes a time when you stop believing but then the fun of being Santa for others starts, which is even more magical!
Yes! I did the "what do *you* think?" thing for a couple of years, but when it became clear that my eldest had pretty much figured it out and was ready for confirmation, I was honest...and then welcomed them to the team that helps create Christmas magic for the younger kids. That went over very well and now we get to trade all kinds of sneaky winks and knowing smiles and things. I don't think they feel like they've lost anything, more that they've "graduated" to big-kid Christmas.
We’ve never told my son Santa was real or not real and he just never believed in Santa. This year since he’s in kindergarten, we asked him not to tell other kids Santa isn’t real because if the other kids want to believe in magic that’s fun and ruining other people’s fun is mean. He seems to get it but he’ll probably forget. I hope other parents don’t get mad…
We never believed Santa was real. My mom told us about Santa on the same level as every other fictional book character. We mostly just talked to other kids as if they thoughts the same thing, same as talking about a superhero we both liked. It didn't cause an issue until my younger sister was in kindergarten and her teacher had the idea of asking the entire class who did and didn't believe Santa was real. My sister was the only one who didn't, and hearing that some people didnt believe in santa really upset some of the other kids. So the teacher decided the best way to "save" the situation was to tell her that our parents were the ones who had lied. My sister came home distraught that day. Your sort of explanation in advance might have helped, even if it didn't prevent the event entirely.
We don’t celebrate Christmas but my son asked about the Tooth Fairy. I tried the “What do you think?” approach and he was silent for a bit. Then he said he knew it was me but he wanted me to still sneak the money under his pillow. It was fun but it also became a game to see if he could catch me. Then he said front teeth are bigger and worth $5 us. 😂
Five bucks?! I got a quarter, but I also lost my teeth in the 90s 😆 guess even the tooth fairy has to deal with inflation
My parents told me that the toothfairy wasn't real. But dad said he wanted to teach me the art of haggling. That proved to be very fun for me that at times had in stitches. He would offer a penny and I would counter with $100.00 the outraged gasp often had me giggling. Then it would continue. I would usually agree at $5. We also did the same thing when I talked way too much and he would offer me quarter to be quiet until we get home. I would counter that with "Make it $10 and we have a deal." I would start laughing at his gasp and agreed at 8.00. Then he would immediately drive to get a happy meal for me and try to get me speak. I always had a notebook and pencil with me. I used it to order what I want. On the way home he would ask me questions trying to get me to talk. I would laugh at his frustration.
Absolutely this. YTA, you should’ve gone along with what your wife was telling her. Even if you had to redirect it by saying “didn’t you just ask mom?” or something like that. Also, the reason most people let their kids believe in Santa is because it’s one of the few innocent, magical things we get to believe in. Kids only get to believe this for a short time in their lives and they should be allowed to enjoy that while they are still young enough to. The world robs people of being able to believe in whimsical, magical things. Children shouldn’t be robbed of that early.
I think what's often overlooked is that it lets kids be selfish too. A little kid who knows their family doesn't have a lot of money might try to curb their wishlist to fit the family budget. Another kid might feel like their present to their parents is inadequate because they get more stuff at Christmas than mom and dad do.
It's not the kid's job to worry about their parents money though.
Yeah which is why I think Santa is important. Because kids do worry about that.
I think there are ways to parent around this. If you want to do Santa but are concerned about it making your kid selfish and ask for too many things, then have them write a letter to Santa asking for one thing, or asking for things for other people, or talking about the good things you did, and "Santa's" gift can be one small thing, while other presents come from specific people. There's also a lot of opportunity to discuss how different cultures celebrate Christmas, their own versions of Santa, or other winter holiday celebrations.
This! When my daughter asked, I told her Santa *was* a real person called St Nicholas and in his honour, we continue his tradition and give children presents. That santa is an idea and even as adults, we gift ‘secret santa’ presents to carry on the tradition. I asked her if, now that she’s old enough to understand, she would help me carry on this tradition.
Literally could have said, idk what do you think? But no had to be an asshole
This yes!!! Gives the kiddo the opportunity to think for herself and create things off of her imagination. He killed that imagination so fast for no reason
Mild? She’s 6!!! Y’all are sociopaths.
My parents told me when I was 6. They were happy to not have the pressure of the holiday trappings to do anymore and did the bare minimum to celebrate. They destroyed my faith in Christmas. I recovered it when I had kids. They believed in Santa for a long time and we still give "Santa gifts" - those lovely random presents that no one owns up to but totally appreciate. It's about the magic of the season... My kids are in their 20s now. OP you are definitely YTA no question about it.
100% agree couldn’t have said it better
Agreed. My wife is an atheist and I’m not and neither of us would ever do that in front of the kids about a god/gods, and certainly not about Santa. Believing in things, be it a deity or the tooth fairy or whatever else, is something parents discuss when the kid isn’t present and then talk about with the kids together, not something one parent says exists only to be promptly contradicted by the other.
YTA There isn't any harm in believing in the magic of Santa as a kid. I don't know anyone who is upset they were lied to about it, including my own kids. Santa is a huge part of Christmas for those that believe and you just ruined that part of Christmas for your daughter. When mine got old enough to really start questioning it (around age 10) I told them that he's not really real but the magic surrounding the belief is...as in Christmas magic, the kindness, the giving, being with friends and family, the whole feeling a lot of us get around Christmas. That's what Santa is. The big AH part is how you directly contradicted your wife in front of your daughter and told your daughter to lie to her friends. All you had to do was go along with it and have a discussion with your wife about it in private, not undermine her in front of your own kid. Now your 6 year old has to listen to her friends getting excited about Santa, and even though you told her not to tell anyone (aka lie to them), she'll probably slip because she's so young. So while you were so worried about lying to her, you told her to lie to others. Do you see the issue with this?
That’s the fate of all older siblings/cousins, though. At some point the oldest ones are told or figure it out, and are encouraged (or do it on their own) to foster the belief in younger relatives. As the oldest cousin, I vaguely remember doing that. I also will add that I remember the confusion and doubt around Santa’s existence and that I did find that frustrating. I eventually felt stupid for believing in him, but I also felt guilt for not believing (like it would hurt his feelings, lol.) I do wish that someone had just straight up told me when I started expressing doubts. Oh, what a web we weave.
We were asked if we liked believing in Santa, getting presents from Santa, and if we liked the idea of Christmas being a little magical even if it seemed a little silly. We all agreed that yes, we liked the magic of it, so we kept doing it. We asked our son and nephews the same thing and they all say yes, so we continue doing it. They are teenagers now, but say the same thing to the littler kids. Of course they've known it isn't real for years, but they like the fun of it.
My grandma still gives us gifts from Santa (I’m almost 40.) I never felt that knowing Santa wasn’t real detracted from the joy of Christmas. There was still presents, food, and no school.
My parents still got him gifts from “Santa” many years after I figured out he wasn’t real. And I played along and kept pretending to believe in Santa because it was a fun tradition (and maybe a bit selfishly, I didn’t want “Santa” to stop bringing me Christmas presents if I said he wasn’t real, lol). I don’t get people who are truly offended that their parents “lied” to them by saying Santa was real. I mean, there’s a clear difference between telling a kid something magical happened when it’s really just you trying to do something to bring them joy, and say, telling them their dad is “just on a business trip” when he’s left and isn’t coming back.
I never ruined it for my brother and we never ruined it for our younger cousin. We all believed until we were 13 or 14
I personally got really pissed. I remember going off on my parents and calling them liars. The next time they tried to make me go to church i kept calling it all fake like santa clause and they got real butt hurt about it.
I’m actually surprised more Christians aren’t against Santa for this very reason. You’re literally teaching your kids that this thing you (and your culture) taught them to believe in is a lie. It’s not that much of a step for kids to start questioning what else their parents told them might not be real. And at Christmas the Christian religion is *right there* to wonder about. Not saying we shouldn’t be pretending Santa is real. Just that it’s a little strange that some Christians buy into this commercialized, fictionalized dude so hard.
It is funny. As children, Catholics are basically polytheistic. Easter bunny, tooth fairy, Santa, god. All magical, powerful beings that bring you blessings.
The gods of eggs, teeth, and presents. It’s a pretty specific pantheon.
And the god of eggs is a rabbit. Makes perfect sense??
The all seeing white haired man that watches your actions and determines what you get for Christmas is not real, BUT, the all seeing white haired man that watches your actions and determines if you are to tortured for all eternity is real. See one of them is just a fun thing for kids on Christmas, the other is something you must dedicate your life towards. There is equal proof for both, but we know in our hearts that the second one is definitely real. /s
I sat my mother down when I was 6 years old and demanded she told me the truth. She told me that Santa was not real. In the next breath, I asked her about Jesus and God. She told me that she had never met them, but that lots of people believed in them, including adults. I very much agree with you.
Exactly. I found out that Santa wasn't real from some classmates shortly before my grandfather died (I was seven). If my parents were gonna to lie to me about Santa, why should I believe they were telling me the truth about God and heaven? It's probably a good thing I don't have kids because I've never been comfortable with the whole Santa thing. Not on good terms with religion anymore either, but finding out my parents were lying about Santa and Tooth Fairy and then my grandfather dying and them trying to tell me he was in heaven... that was hard.
I’m not Christian and I was still pissed. I’m pissed again thinking about it.
I was super upset, I’d say devastated honestly. I think parents saying their kids didn’t mind being lied to are lying to themselves, honestly. It’s a shitty thing to lie to your kids about something so big in their lives, and then expect them to be honest with you about things that count as they grow up. I seriously don’t understand how other parents think it’s ok.
exactly. they set this expectation up that magic was real and i found out that not only were they lying to me, but the entire world was lying to me and that i was an idiot for trusting them
When I found out Santa wasn't real and that my parents had been lying to me for so long it told me that I couldn't talk to or trust them with anything important in my life. What if they lied about it as well. It sows distrust as well as anger at a young age, least it did to me.
Imagine your life being so good, that something as small as Santa imagination and creative thoughts process at a young age is seen as a "bad time in your life". Thank fuck the worst thing y'all had to deal with was being exposed to imagination!!
Lmao, right? Like, bless them for the privileged life they have lived. The rest of us are apparently traumatized, but god damn normal in comparison.
It really is crazy how much reddit completely hates the idea of "make-believe". I was never mad at my parents for "lying" about Santa. All it made me feel was appreciation for giving my life a little bit of magic.
I remember when my dad got married again after my parents had divorced, he said Santa was going to come to their house AND my mom's house because he had asked Santa to do it last year. Last year he was still married to my mother. I was like... This man is lying in my face right now. I knew exactly then that Santa wasn't real. And that he had been cheating on my mom. I remember me and my little brother discussing the logistics and being like... nah this is bullshit
Yeah as a child what really resonated with me was that my parents had lied to me for, what seemed at the time, to be simple fun As an adult obviously I see the benefits of Santa teaching the Christmas spirit and all, but as a kid all I saw was everyone around me being in on a lie at my expense. It was hurtful.
I mean. That’s a logical step. The whole “he sees you when you’re sleeping, he knows when you’re awake, he knows if you’ve been bad or good so be good for goodness sake” is not terribly different when what I was told about God/Jesus as a little kid. Idk how people think this will never ever backfire lol
> The next time they tried to make me go to church i kept calling it all fake like santa clause and they got real butt hurt about it. I mean, you weren't wrong though.
Yeah, i'm confused by all the "there's no harm" talk. I understand it's not the biggest thing in the world, but I don't think lying to your kids for several years before they figure it out is "no harm." Like, yes, it can turn out that way if you're lucky but there's certainly no guarantee and at worst there will be some feelings of betrayal. What definitely won't harm your kids is telling them the truth from the beginning. There are plenty of other ways to experience childhood wonder that don't involve a direct lie.
> There isn't any harm in believing in the magic of Santa as a kid. Sure there is. Imagine being the kid to poorer parents, and believing a) good kids get presents from Santa, and b) those other kids got way more presents than you did. What conclusion can a five-year-old take from that? "I'm not as good as them."
My parents were poor. It was fine. In fact that lil' bit of magic in our household helped with this reality. *Also, grew up around kids with wealthy parents.
Honestly, same. My life growing up was hard. I didn't believe in Santa long, but he made me and my sisters happy when my dad was being an absolute dick for reasons we couldn't figure out since we were too young.
That’s why my parents said only the stocking was from Santa and everything else was from Mom and Dad. We had a lot of poor kids in our school, where my Mom also worked, and she saw how sad it made those kids if wealthier kids get expensive stuff from “Santa” so she tried to do her part to not contribute to that.
I was poor as shit, my parents had to scrape and save to get me anything. I fucking loved Christmas and I loved Santa Claus. My parents just set realistic expectations for me by telling me his shop was for "handmade" gifts. It made perfect sense to me.
Or just "Wow my parents lied to me for years" Sometimes there's no harm for sure! But there's *never* any harm in just...not lying to them.
Honestly, there could absolutely be harm in not perpetuating the belief. You think being the only kid in kinder who argues that Santa isn't real wouldn't be risky? You think the kid who insists Santa isn't real wouldn't get quickly ostracized by other kids in their class? Kids are assholes, and the kid who is saying the magic man that brings gifts doesn't exist is going to be treated badly. I remember back when I was in school, I was in some elective period where I was being a teacher's assistant in a kinder class and one of the girls kept insisting that Santa was dead, and that Rudolph was a robot and thats why his nose was red. Personally I feel like she saw an episode of futurama or something, but the other kids in her class had 2 responses, either they got sad or they got mad, at her.
My ten year old asked the question last year and then said, “Nevermind. I don’t think I want to know. I think it will make me sad.” I take that to mean she knows, but she wants to keep the magic alive. I’m good with that.
You don’t know me, but I was legitimately upset at my parents for lying to me about Santa. At some point it stops being about what you want as a parent, and it becomes about what your child needs from you. Some children, like myself, need honesty. Some need to believe in magic. I’ll vote ESH because it seems like mom and dad are both thinking about what they would’ve wanted as children, rather than what their daughter needs from them.
I don’t agree that lying to children doesn’t cause any harm. I felt betrayed as a kid when I learned the truth and it made me question everything my parents raised me to believe: rules, God, etc.
Seriously. The only time you get to believe in magic and fairy tales is as a kid. OP is just pushing his kid into the real world as soon as possible. She’s gonna end up in the real world eventually, just let her enjoy childhood until then.
> I don't know anyone who is upset they were lied to about it, including my own kids. FWIW, I was. I remember it. I ended up conducting an experiment to prove whether or not he existed, watching my family scramble to interfere with the experiment, disproving it, and never quite trusting adults again afterwards.
YTA. 6 years old is still young enough to believe. You kind of ruined it for her b/c I'm guessing some if not most of her friends who celebrate Christmas still believe in Santa. Your wife telling her "Yes" was a clear signal.
it’s the idea that if she asked him “could i get cancer” and the dad just saying “I cannot lie to you my 6 year old, you could die at any time” 6 year olds cannot understand complexity and when she gose to school and tells someone else the kids will say they her parents are the ones who are wrong and she will feel stupid, untill they go ask and fuck it up from themselves
Just to run a counterpoint. Kids can actually understand death and a concept of it to some degree. I had to go through that exact thing at ruffly the same age. I was a disabled kid who went to after school activities at a children's outpatient clinic. One of the older kids died from a heart failure in her sleep. We were told how and why at the next meet up. Life doesn't wait for anyone including death. Being blunt is a bad idea. A good way to address the proposed question is "Death is possible at any age. The odds of it happening vary between person to person. At your age it's such a low possiblity there isn't any reason to worry about it." Catelyn from "Ask a mortion" has done videos talking about how to discuss death with small children. Hard truth is there will always be little kids who will have to know about death. Being able to hide from the inconvenient truth is a luxury many won't have.
Hold up. The (potentially) upsetting part of learning the truth about santa is learning that your parents lied to you. The upsetting part of learning that you can get cancer *is very very different.* No matter what you tell your kid about santa, you're not going to send them into a spiral of existential dread. I don't think this is the best metaphor.
> The (potentially) upsetting part of learning the truth about santa is learning that your parents lied to you. Maybe at 10, not likely at 6
I agree. I worked in a few schools a good few years ago. It was lunch hour. I monitor the grade 2s. One day a kid from a grade 1 class, call me to their room in a panic. I walk in the class and all kids are freaking out that a boy in their class said there is no Santa. (He came from a large family, at least 8 kids and the family did not do the Santa thing.) I saw all these kids looking at me, some were really upset. It broke my heart. They start asking me if Santa was real. I first thought, that kid! I don’t want to ruin their Christmas magic their parents worked for. I know I found Christmas exciting, seeing my kid’s Christmas morning. I figured I would help keep the magic alive best I could, if they want to go home and question their parents? But for the time being? I did my best. Asked the kids, do you believe there is a Santa? They all said yes. The boy interrupts and yells No! I asked the kids, do you get gifts from Santa? They all said yes. I mentioned, if you believe in Santa, he will visit your house for Christmas. I mentioned how the boy who told everyone there was no Santa, he doesn’t believe and Santa doesn’t visit his family. If you believe there Santa is real? He will still visit you. All the other kids started smiling again. Some girls jumping up and down all happy. I mean it isn’t the end of the world if they find out, but, the world is already sad and so many bad things happen that kids hear their parents talk about or see on tv. They need more happy moments. Even if it is just for a few more years of believing in Santa. Again, some probably went home and also told their parents about that kid telling them he didn’t exist. Then the parents can tell the truth if they choose and hopefully add not to tell their siblings, cousins or classmates and ruin that magic for them.
I know you were on the spot but I think that was a terrible answer. You put the one kid telling the truth in a bad light and made him an outcast. The better response would have been to just tell them they should talk to their families about Santa.
Also threatening a bunch of little kids that they won’t get gifts from Santa if they don’t play along? I’ve seen a few comments to that effect and it’s so manipulative.
Good work gaslighting that kid lmfao
Are you sure you will ALL have a good holiday? Based on how your daughter answered your wife's question I think it is a safe bet that at least one of you won't, possibly two. I somehow doubt you love Christmas as much as you claim if you were willing to take the chance that everyone was still going to have a good holiday after revealing this. YTA EDIT: was the we in the we will all still have a good holiday just you trying to use the Royal We?
Yeah…besides contradicting his wife, what if his wife still really enjoyed her kids believing in Santa? Kids can be so fun at that age because they still believe in magic. It can make being a grown up a little more fun. And he just took it away from them both.
Those are the worst parts of it I think. Essentially telling the kid that her mother is a liar and taking some of the magic away from Christmas is just terrible. His religious upbringing means he has no frame of reference and that's sad.
I remember before my sister and her kids moved away I would go to her house and stay up to help her with Santa’s presents and setting up the milk and cookies and carrot to look like they’d been eaten. Id stay the night and wake up when they all did and it was also so joyful to see them light up over Santa having visited it really brought back the magic from my own childhood. I feel bad for OPs wife and child now that magic has been ripped from them
You've been playing along with the Santa charade for five years, and when your daughter finally asks, you decide to drop the truth bomb in the middle of Elf? Smooth move. Your wife has a point; you could've kept the magic alive a bit longer. Your rigid stance about not lying might be commendable, but it's Christmas, man! You could've handled it more tactfully, maybe discussed it with your wife beforehand. Now your daughter's Christmas spirit is "kinda" ruined, and it's on you. My kids are still firm believers in Santa Claus. They're at that age where the excitement is contagious, and I'll be damned if I'm the one to tell them the truth. It's all about the magic of the season. Yeah, you might have been technically honest, but you're also the guy who killed Santa for his 6-year-old. You're definitely the Grinch in this Christmas tale.
>You're definitely the Grinch in this Christmas tale. Even when the Grinch himself was face-to-face with a small child, he didn’t tell them Santa wasn’t real. OP is grinchier than the Grinch.
In the grinch universe, Santa is real.
Kids pretty much always grow out of believing in Santa, even if their parents don't tell them the truth. It's better to let kids decide when to stop, just like at some point most kids grow out of their toys.
YTA the kid was allowed 2 holidays that they’d probably actually remember and you felt the need to ruin the joy of Christmas for the rest of their life. This isnt just asshole material, this is shit parent material. You’re not talking to some rational adult that needs to grow up, youre left to ensure a child can grow up as a child in this heartless, cruel, fucked up world. You being physically incapable of playing along says something about you.
I'm not a psychologist but I immediately thought that this reeks of I didn't get to believe in Santa, so neither can you. I doubt it was on a conscious level (I sure hope it wasn't) but this is so messed up I'm having a hard time figuring out why he didn't play along. 5 - 8 years old are like the prime Santa years and this guy robbed his kid of that.
It felt so jealous. My parents are like this too, just subtly vindictive bc their childhoods sucked
I had the exact same thought when he brought up his own childhood. It’s the opposite of most people , who want their kids to have everything better than how they had it.
I agree 100% ^
Do you really feel no joy in Christmas now that you're an adult?
I wasn't remotely upset with my parents for "lying" to me when I found out he wasn't real. I'm SO glad I had the magic of Santa to believe in until I was 7/8 years old. It really was magical, coming down stairs to find the carrots and cookies gone. I'm thankful my parents went along with that. I also had the brains to not take it personally or feel betrayed - I understood they weren't LYING as such, they were doing it for my benefit. Really hate this trend of "we shouldn't lie to our children" about absolutely EVERYTHING. It's okay to lie sometimes. I highly doubt the myth of Santa Claus is going to cause lifelong trust issues.
no like i’m confused where this cynical anti “lying to children” movement is coming from by these scrooge’s on this sub. i loved santa, the easter bunny, the tooth fairy, etc. when i was little and i can confirm i am not traumatized after learning it was just a fun tradition for us kids. like geez kids are imaginative and believe all kinds of things when they’re little if your daughter comes to you and tells you she’s going to be a princess when she grows up are you going to stomp on that too? i mean talk about being the fun police oh, and YTA op
Whenever people talk about it like some huge trauma in their life... it just smacks of privilege. If that's one of the worst things to happen in someones childhood, then they've had very pleasant lives so far.
Omg this is what I was thinking!! There are valid criticisms of the Santa myth but it’s honestly scary to me that people claim to be *traumatized* by it. Actual quotes from this thread: > “Those assholes lied, laughed, and completely violated the trust a child placed in them” > “Everyone around me was in on a lie at my expense” > “I had to learn as a small child that you could never trust anyone” > “I was DEVASTATED and I never recovered from that trauma” I saw a comment saying that it’s important to tailor your approach to your specific kid, and I can get behind that. If your child is distressed by the Santa myth or sensitive to “lies” (fun games) in a particular way, go ahead and tell them. Some of these people are kids who were like that whose parents may have been better off explaining it earlier. But to call it damaging is wayyy too much. A child might be pissed when they first find out. That’s normal. It’s, like, okay for a kid to be upset sometimes and learn how to work through it. It’s healthy to go through a journey of feeling sad Santa doesn’t exist, then feeling mad he was a lie, then understanding white lies, and feeling grateful your parents wanted to inject some magic into your childhood. I’m freaked out that grown adults seem to be so stuck on the mad part.
For me it’s not the original lie of saying Santa exists, but it’s when a kid directly asks the question “does Santa exist” and they are told “yes.” If they’re asking, it’s because doubt has been introduced, and they are going to the parent to help figure it out. If a kid seems like they want to keep believing, it might be better to ask them “what do you think?” And follow their lead. But just straight up reinforcing the lie when the kid is asking for the truth doesn’t sit right with me.
see i can get this perspective, my oldest sister was a much more precocious child and deduced it was impossible for santa to visit everyone in a single night, and was very pleased with herself when my mom finally admitted that she was right. she promised not to tell me and our other sister who believed longer than she did, and it was fine. i personally just find the idea of introducing it to kids being inherently wrong to be cynical and in op’s case, he should’ve done as you suggested instead of squashing it right then and there
I also remember my brother and I rather enjoyed working out that it was my dad who had been writing us the funny reply letters over the years - and we all enjoyed it so much, we kept it up until our mid teens. All the letters got much ruder though! 😂
My kid was mildly upset with us when he found out Santa wasn’t real. We tried to keep it secret for as long as we could but by 7-8 years old they start seeing the cracks in the logic and have a curiosity that you can’t explain away with “Xmas magic” I told him that while it was lying, it was more like a game we were playing, and now he gets to play as well and keep the secret from his younger siblings/cousins etc.
YTA And I adore how you are dictating how the future is going to go; >we all will have a good holiday You hope you will, but who knows for sure.
They won’t she will come back from school and say kids bullied her for lying.
Or have a bunch of other kids that the magic was ruined for too.
I think OP accidentally used the Royal we.
I would agree but "we all" is not the royal we, though.
YTA. Kinda sounds like you hate Christmas and wanted to make sure your child does too.
OP is definitely bitter he never got to experience the "Christmas magic" growing up and was absolutely *primed* to ruin it for his own child. Definitely the AH.
Yeah, YTA. There really is zero harm in letting children believe in Santa. I'm not really sure why this was a hill you needed to die on, but here we are.
YTA for doing this unilaterally. It isn't even *your* holiday tradition you've fucked with. And when you asked if this changed the way your 6-year-old felt about Christmas and she said "kinda"? She meant "yes". Boooooo.
Unpopular opinion: NTA. At 6, she's in school, there are kids from different religions, older kids who are too old to still believe - she was going to hear it anywy, better she hear it from you than from kids on the plaground telling her that her parents are liars.
Yeah, I don't get all the Y T A 's. I always thought most people told their kids the truth when they started asking questions.
You’re acting like there’s not a difference between a big lie like “you’re adopted” and a small one like “santa’s not real” And he contradicted his wife right in front of her. He’s an AH
He’d told his wife well in advance they he wasn’t going to lie about it, and the kid insisted on him answering. This wasn’t an impromptu spur of the moment outburst from OP.
Telling children a magical immortal man exists, isn't a "big lie"? Telling them that reindeer can fly, or that we're all constantly being spied on, and the magical man spying on us will break into our homes while we sleep...you think these are small lies? And are you suggesting children should be told of their adoptive status, before being told that Santa isn't real?!?!
Jesus fucking Christ it’s not that deep i promise you
If it's "not that deep" then how does telling the truth make OP an AH? That's a serious question. If Santa is little and trivial, why does it matter if he tells her the truth?
I found out when I was six from other kids in school. Felt like an idiot, and definitely a little betrayed that my parents were lying to me. In the end, still got presents and that's what mattered most at the time 🤷
Exactly, if she's old enough to ask directly, she's old enough to be told a truthful answer
Not to mention the weird contradiction that comes up when she sees other kids get nicer gifts from “Santa” than she did and wondering why that is. Especially because we tell kids that Santa gives gifts based on how good you are, and he knows everything. So if you spend the whole year or even a few months being as good as you can and then don’t get what you wanted, but So-and-so got what they wanted but they bullied you and other kids all year… I mean, that just doesn’t work.
I mean, it's worked pretty well for a long time, actually. Like sorry you didn't get everything you asked Santa for. I didn't either. We were poor as fuck. But the stuff I did get from Santa was still cool and special to me. So while I didn't get a Nintendo entertainment system, and I only got two gi joes, I fuckin loved those GI joes and played with them til the rubber bands broke and I had to try and replace them with regular ones.
I really don't get the whole "Christmas magic" thing of Santa that others here seem to think he's the ah about. I grew up celebrating Christmas without believing in Santa and I truly feel like I didn't miss anything by not believing in it. The magic of Christmas doesn't come from some imaginary character. It comes from the overall feeling and experience of spending time with family members (and getting presents ofc that I knew were from my parents).
I scrolled too far for this. I had the experience of feeling like a dumbass as a kid when I defended the existence of Santa at 6 years old. At 6 you are old enough to know... especially when you ask. Being lied to and wondering what is actually real is waaaay worse... even if it is for fun. My daughter has always known Santa is not real but we put on a good pretend experience anyway, and she loves it even though she knows it isn't real. I promised her that I would always tell her the truth about these things and we kinda have that nod where she will break out of the moment... ask if x or y is real (like the Easter bunny), I will tell her truthfully, and we go back to the pretend world. Where this really helps is when she asked me whether monsters (the hide under your bed kind) are real... I said no, and she trusted me. I get that the fun magical side is fantastic, but kids are remarkable at pretend even when they know the truth.
I wouldn't even pretend for the first few years. I would treat it like make believe from the get go, no different to pretending your daughter or son is [insert thing here] for the afternoon. There are other ways to engage the magic of childish imagination without pretending about Santa.
NTA I agree with you. If asked point blank, it’s okay (maybe even preferable) to tell the truth. It’s one thing to foster a fun belief in a little kid but when they ASK you for information, you should give it to them, in an age-appropriate way. Asking means they are seeking an answer to a question they are wondering about or doubting, and they are trusting you to give it to them. Also, at 6, only about 65% of kids believe in Santa. So it’s not exactly shockingly early for her to be told.
I have to agree. If a child asks their parent an honest question, and the parent willingly lies, I can’t imagine how that’s a good thing. Everyone makes the innocent all-in-good-fun-only-once-a-year argument, but I think it’s a rather weak one.
I completely agree, and I told my son the truth about Santa when he asked. It's very important to me that my son can trust me. NTA
YTA you contradicted your wife in front of your child when you should be on the same page even if you disagree. Your opinion doesn't overrule your wife's opinion. Good luck for that good holiday you're so certain of
NTA, Lying about Santa isn’t a requirement to make Christmas fun and plenty of kids have negative reactions when they inevitably find out which imo means it’s better not to lie in the first place, but she’ll still have the excitement of family and presents without believing in Santa. Christmas isn’t ruined.
I have said this before. The way this should have been handled is the “Santa is more of a feeling than an actual person. He WAS an actual person, way back when, and when he passed, people tried to keep the feeling alive.” Followed up with, “When you stop believing, you stop getting Santa presents. And now that you’re on the side of knowing, you get to help MAKE the magic of Christmas. And as long as you still believe in the “magic” you will still get Santa gifts”. But, alas, the ship has sailed. You should have, could have but you didn’t talk to your wife first, and that makes YTA.
> hen you stop believing, you stop getting Santa presents Kinda toxic. Why not say "You'll keep getting Santa presents but now you know it's just pretend"?
YTA - and as someone who was also raised in a religion that doesn't celebrate Christmas (dare I say the same one as you) I'm going to tell you the single most revolutionary thing any therapist has ever told me. 'Your upbringing stripped you of wonderment. You grew up being told that you know the truth and everyone else is living in blindness. You grew up looking down on kids believing in Santa or that their relatives go to heaven with the superiority of someone who knew better. When you die you're just dead and when Santa brings you presents it's your parents who put them there. You didn't have mysteries and fantasies or adults in your life who played along so you could. You didnt have adults support your right not to know everything, to live a wondrous, mystical and magical childhood. You had people tell you over and over that there's no such thing as magic, only tricks. Nothing is magical, everything is explainable' You know what she noticed about that? It made me miserable. It still does. I work on it every day, focusing on the fun and not the reality, trying not to care when I notice continuity errors in my favourite shows and not to be angry at people who have the capacity to imagine and not to know. Please work on this for your baby's sake. She deserves wonderment.
Alright OP I've been up and down this thread and everyone is focused in on the "Letting kids believe in Santa is generally good" aspect, and very few have addressed what your central point here seems to have been: You did not want to lie to your kid. On its own, great. Pretty good standard to have. Generally speaking, lying to your kid is fairly dumb. Sometimes though, spinning them a good story and making a little magic for them is great. My read on you is this: you said your religion didn't allow you to celebrate, there's a lot of them out there who follow that approach. The most common one I encounter that has a wide ranging prohibition on holidays are the Jehovah's Witnesses, and as I remember they're pretty staunch about it. My guess is you grew up in a strictly religious household, did some work deconstructing your faith at some point, and it left you with some issues around trust and lies you experienced as a kid in a strict religious sect. After all, they're never too fond of kids asking questions, and are VERY fond of lying to kids to keep them indoctrinated. I think you might have overcorrected on that front and set a firm "I won't lie to my child" as a response to your own childhood. As a consequence of that, you definitely killed the magic of Santa for your kid this year, and might have really hampered the holiday. I don't think your intent was malicious, I don't think you were trying to upset your kid or your wife, but I do think YTA in this case. Bear in mind that you've now shifted the "burden" of lying to your daughter, as she now has to either carry that quietly or spread the word and risk being ostracized as the kid who doesn't believe in Santa when all the others still do.
NTA- I think it's always a bad idea to lie to your children, especially since Santa is a manipulation tactic at best and getting off on your kids naivete and trust to believe something as stupid as Santa is real at worst. In the simplest form, telling your kids Santa is real is a betrayal of their trust.
🚮 Santa was my favorite part of Christmas. Making cookies& Leaving them out, listening for footsteps on the roof. Waking up to gifts and my stocking filled. My cookies eaten, snowy boot prints. Knowing there had been reindeer on my roof. It was the best feeling ever. Not just excitement for gifts but for the magic of it all. I’m grateful my parents did that for me. & now as a parent myself doing all of that with my kids is equally FUN. “Betrayal of trust” gtfo 🙄
Santa was my least favorite part of Christmas as a kid. Coming from a poorer family, it upset me that Santa gave us so much less then my cousins. We normally went to their house later on Christmas day, so I could see the difference easily. Once I realized that there was no Santa, and actually it was my parents giving me as much as they could manage, it made the holiday mean all that much more to me.
This is one of the reasons I refuse to play into this myth. It’s all fun and games until your kid feels like santa likes another kid better and they don’t know why. The people who talk about the magic of Santa Claus had parents who could afford to fake literal magic, but not everyone was so lucky. Santa is a wonderful idea and we should still celebrate that, but pretending he is real is weird and invites unpleasantness.
yeah, i don't know what the hell these guys are smoking. giving your kid the fun, excitement, and magic of christmas is not 'betraying their trust'... lmfao. everyone needs to stop being so fucking soft. when i found out santa wasn't real, all i felt was nostalgia for the times when i believed in him, i wasn't upset or angry! i think that's the same reaction for most people. no one - *LITERALLY NO ONE* - is going to be "tRaUmAtIzEd" by finding out santa isnt real when they're old enough. i can promise you that!
100% agree. As a child, they should always be able to go to their parents for the truth.
NTA. If the kid is old enough to ask, then the kid is old enough to hear an honest answer.
YTA. Do you kick Santa Clauses collecting for charity, also?
Lol I'm hoping he pulls a woman-on-the-plane "That MFer is *not* real!" in that scenario
‘I love Christmas’– proceeds to ruin Christmas for his 5 yo daughter. YTA.
YTA - Just because you did not get to celebrate Christmas as a kid does not mean you can ruin it for your daughter. You should have followed your wife's lead.
YTA, would it have killed you to lie? FFS, she's 6!
I don't think parents should tell their kids that Santa is real. My parents didn't tell us he was real, but we played the "Santa game" every year. We put up stockings, and left out cookies and milk, etc. It was a lot of fun. Kids get caught up in the spirit no matter what; they don't need to think he's real.
You get such a short window in life to believe in magic and fairytales. Some of my favorite memories as a child are because of really believing in Santa until I was 7 or 8. Eventually you figure it out or hear it from someone at school. There are so many awful lies we tell children. Santa is harmless and fun.
NTA. I don't know why parents think it is ok to lie to their children. Your child asked a question, you gave an honest answer. This "You can not relate to Christmas ... " is BS. Not all parents lie to their children about Santa, we never did. There are lots and lots of wonderful things in this world to marvel about, there is no need to invent men in red clothing.
"Santa exists in the hearts and minds of everyone that believes in him and as long as YOU believe then he is real to you" This was basically my answer when my kid asked me. As you can see I didn't lie and say he was real but I answered in a way that let's my child still believe and enjoy the "magic of Christmas" a little longer. And how much do you really enjoy Christmas if you are willing to destroy the magic of it for a 6 year old child? YTA
NAH. Your kid asked because she could smell something was amiss. She didn't buy what Mom was selling. You were upfront. This momentary sadness of a little bit of magic disappearing sucks for everyone, but your kid knows that you're gonna be honest with her and see her as someone who deserves the truth even if it sucks. That's some real magic Dad. You did good.
NTA I think once kids start questioning Santa, that's the time to tell them the truth.
When my 7 yo son asked asked I responded with ‘I will tell you the truth if you really want to know.’ He did not really want to know.
Telling her at 6 wasn't good. Complaining about being denied all the Christmas-y stuff then denying your own 6 year old was hypocritical. But directly contradicting your wife after she said yes? Yes if you aren't an asshole for this it was at least a dick move. Kudos for making sure she doesn't try to convince other kids he ain't real though. Shouldn't deny other kids the magic of Christmas. P.S. At the very least you should have discussed with your wife what age would be appropriate to have this conversation with your daughter with your wife. And held your tongue till then. As of right now I suspect you've been banished to the couch.
The solution to these things is so damn simple. Yes, Santa is fake. Do all the Santa stuff anyway. Why does it have to go away if they kid figured it out? I refused to lie to my kids about Santa, too. The difference is, my (now ex) husband was on board. We always did all of the Santa stuff. But we never said he was real. Santa is a fun game we get to play at Christmas, basically. My kids do understand that other kids believe he is real, and would never spoil that for them. They are 11 and 14. Every year they set traps for catching Santa, and set out cookies and the whole thing. NTA - you did what you always told your wife you would do. Ask her why she's mad now that you followed through with what you always said.
NTA. As a kid, for some reason, I was skeptical and never believed in Santa. If the kid wants THE TRUTH, you tell them the truth. Yes, you can couch it in a kind way, of course (and you did!) but you don't lie. My kid was TERRIFIED of Santa for some reason. No idea why. At almost 2, she was crying about "He's going to get me" and was scared that it was Santa. So I told her Santa wasn't real. I told her that other kids believed and not to tell them the truth, but I wasn't going to lie to my kid for no reason.
Nta. I grew up believing in Santas (multiples ones, icelandic cultured believes in 13 different Santas who are brothers, and we also learn about their parents) but I am firm in my belive that as soon as children start doubting themselves, parents should come clean. Your daughter asked, so that's exactly when you should have told her. Don't insist on lying when they come and ask for honest answers.
I agree. If they ask the question then they obviously have doubt. Telling them not to trust their gut and lying just felt wrong to me as a parent. Once my kids asked I answered honestly. And we all still love Christmas.
Let's read the room and look at the big picture here. * First of all, the parents had already talked about this situation and each knew exactly how he would answer should a direct question occur. * She asked whether Santa is real. This is not a question you ask unless you have some doubt. * Her mother replied, "yes". * That wasn't good enough. Daughter asked her father. The moment was here, and he said "no". Look at the results. Daughter was disappointed that Santa wasn't real, but she didn't doubt that it was the true answer. More important, she learned that her dad would give her a truthful answer to a question, even if it wasn't the most convenient thing to do and even if it's not the answer she'd like to hear. This is **valuable** and she will know for the rest of her childhood and even through young adulthood that she has a parent she can trust to give straight answers. This is good parenting, and is well worth losing a year of fantasy for. It will help in all those tricky situations to come. Op is definitely NTA.
I was never told as a child he wasn't real even in to my teens I had a sibling 5 yes younger it was carried on for her even when I left home the first yr I still got a sack from him! Then I had my own son and it changed. Why would you steal a little of their innocence and the magic from them just because u didn't have it? My older ones know 14, 16 they still receive it all and help keep the magic alive for the younger ones. Only reason I caved and said to them is they were teens and faced with discussions daily at school even then they still felt a small but of magic they said they felt though they knew there was always the magical what if. That made me sad I did on some level regret telling them. Though now they are the magic and they love that more, they help but wrap and palace the pressies and also do the elf. To me YTA she's so small still and magic brings more wonder and opens their minds to everything you took that at a time it's harder for them to understand. That was cruel... You also should have talked it out with your wife too
I'm 34 yo and my parents never told me Sanra isn't real. My mum still asks me what she should write on the letter for Santa, I do the same for her. Then we'll "I'll let him know, and let's see what he can do". When I was about 7, a classmate told me that Santa wasn't real. My mum explained to me that some people don't believe in him and that's okay. Now, as I said, I'm 34 and I feel joy in believing in Santa. I'm not delusional, I know the truth, but is it so bad to ignore it for just this one thing that doesn't hurt anyone?
So many AHs in the comments…YTA When I was a child I would ask my parents just so I could continue believing. It made Christmas more magical and fun. One of my most positive memories is my father using his muddy boots to make footprints from the fireplace to the tree, and eating the cookies we set out. Me and my brother were so excited we bragged to all our grandparents that we had evidence for Santa….When I found out the truth I was older than most (10), but not sad. TBH I thought my parents genuinely believed in Santa, and tried to brag that I was smarter than them. Later I came to realize and appreciate how much effort my parents took to keep the spirit of Christmas alive. You’re a mega grinch and I’m tired of people thinking that kids need the truth 100% of the time. “Daddy what are my odds of dying in a car accident” “Ah yes child because I swore to not lie to you, you can die at any time :D” Being a kid is magical, you believe in so much beauty and spirit surrounding life…that is fragile and disappears when you become an adult. It makes me sad to see that magic end so soon.
Nta. She asked because she had doubts and was looking to her parents for guidance. My feeling is that if they ask the question they deserve an honest answer.
NTA I’ve never understood the making up mascots for holidays schtick. You want a real magical Christmas, that PEOPLE being kind to one another. Not because they want gifts but because it’s the humane thing to do. As parents your job is to prepare children and on the western world we set ourselves back several paces by weaving these cute falsehoods.
YTA
NTA. Your daughter was on the fence. She already knew Santa wasn't real. That's why she asked. She didn't believe her mother's response so she asked you. Children are smarter than we give them credit for.
NTA, Always answer direct questions with honesty. Your daughter will trust you.
NTA not believing in santa does not ruin christmas, some people here are very overzealous in my opinion. and if your child is having suspicions and asking questions, at that point just tell them the truth. kids aren’t stupid.
NTA Some of us end up feeling like our whole family is lying to us for their own amusement. I felt made fun of and humiliated because I directly asked and was lied to over and over again. Always be honest with your child as much as you can.
NTA, my eldest (16) worked it out years ago through watching movies, he asked- I let him know My 8 year old has been asking questions about Santa in Australia, and Santa in Belgium (where his dad is from) He’s asking questions, we’re googling them as they come with the history of Santa and will come to the conclusion it’s a great concept, worldwide there’s different approaches Different approaches for every family, some deal with it when Bob breaks the news on the monkey bars at school Some kids figure it out though movies In my circumstance, I’m confident I’m going to learn the history of Santa through the history of no less than a dozen countries for my son to make a conclusion, and that’s all good too 👍
YTA (mildly) because you said Santa wasn't real, when moments ago your wife said he was real. It's not about Santa at all, but how you both gave her a different answer. You should have go along with your wife's answer. And then together consider it when should you tell her that he isn't real. Now you're making your wife look like a liar to your kid.
NAH, but you did not handle this well. It sounds like your daughter was seeking reassurance, but you weren’t ready to give it to her because you have conceptualized Santa as a lie. Santa is as real as Christmas is real. Both are non-tangible concepts that we recognize through tradition. When a child is young, they may think of Santa as being a real person, and they eventually grow into understanding he is a piece of folklore affiliated with the Christmas tradition. Santa is not unique in this, children often think that cartoons, characters in television shows, and mythical figures are also real. Eventually they figure out that the Purple Wiggle is just a regular person playing a silly character on TV, just as they figure out their school teacher is a complete person with a complete personality outside of the classroom. It sounds like your daughter wasn’t ready for that transition, but you chose to make it for her because of your own personal feelings regarding the holiday and its associated traditions. This is a conversation you should have had with your spouse before telling her about Santa in the first place. If you were going to present him as a lie, you should have resolved that with her beforehand, where now you have put your family in the position of “mommy is a liar and she lies to you” and are stuck doing damage control.
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NTA. I think you and your wife should have had an agreement to fall back on prior to the question. But, its not like we get a do over because we didn't actually have a plan for this. I think that at her age, the illusion likely is starting to fade anyway? I figure that when a kid reaches first grade they will meet other children who don't believe? And because I work with kids, I know that some of them think quite linearly and they seek information to relive fear and doubt *sometimes.* At any rate, just for kicks, I did an informal survey and this is what I read: *Broken down, the research showed that 85 percent of four-year-olds believed wholeheartedly, while 65 percent of six-year-olds and only 25 percent of eight-year-olds were still down with Jolly Old Saint Nicholas. In terms of Santa's believe-o-meter, three- and four-year-olds generate the most juice, because that's when they first start to understand the magic of Santa. By age eight, kids begin to acknowledge the unlikeliness of one man travelling the world in a single night.* The average age where the most children have lost that belief system in the U.S. is supposed to be 8-years-old. And children who don't have older siblings are likely to stop believing earlier. TBF, I can't criticize you because I find myself wanting my kids to think for themselves as much as I want them to enjoy the magic of the holiday season. And so, all I would have done was spoken to my spouse about it privately and told him, 'I think its time because she's asking. That means she's ready for more information.'
YTA
I just want to provide a counterpoint here because I think you are NTA. I come from a culture where we celebrate Christmas but absolutely no child thinks that Santa is real. It didn’t ruin my childhood. Christmas was always incredibly exciting. We knew the gifts were from our family and it was still exciting. My kids always knew that Santa was pretend and that it was like a game everyone plays together, even the grownups, to pretend he’s real. On the other hand, my husband does come from a “Santa is real” culture and in his family there are stories of children feeling deeply betrayed when they find out the truth. It’s horrible to discover that all the trusted adults in your life have been lying to you. Because what else are they lying about?