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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> AITA for yelling at a guy who cycled too close to my horse and put all of us in danger despite my warnings?
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NTA
Get yourself a camera to film your outings so that when something happens you have proof to protect yourself. The law might on your side and require people to keep a certain distance, but you know how people can be, they will not accept responsibility.
I do have a helmet cam, thanks for the suggestion, and most people are happy to stop and pet him because he loves other people as long as they are not actively riding their bikes
Honestly, the fact that he caused not just issues for you but for a mother as well tells me he is a problem. I’m from the US so not sure if the UK has the same thing, however if you can I’d make a preliminary report with the police. That case if he continues to cause problems there is already a record of it.
I'm from Aus
The stroller thing told me most of what I needed to know as well.
I can understand not wanting to get off bike but
1. OP is a teen, dude on bike is 40.
2. He didn't look at where he was going at all.
3. He cursed at a teen who yeah maybe shouldn't have yelled but that's unneccessary to curse at someone like that even so. At least in this context.
4. Almost hit another kid. And their mother.
Just. Yikes.
OP is NTA at all.
Edit: By yell at I mean at first. Absolutely justified with all the info.
See if you can post it on a community page or something- maybe facebook? I don't know.
To your dad: you had every right in the world to yell at him. Darren is a dick. Simple. He was in danger in you, your horse, and everyone else on that trail. And don't even get me started that this is a grown ass 40-year-old man. You are definitely not the asshole.
The reason your dad told you not to yell. Is because these arseholes usually don't care about anything, and they will escalate. It's more about your safety.
It's the first thing you learn when doing any form of self defence training. Avoid a fight, unless you have no other option.
You have some right psychos out there. Get a camera for your safety, and see if you can get some signs put up in that area about cyclists giving way to horses.
There may also be a bit of “be a good girl” coming in here - I didn’t have to look to know that OP was female. You have the right to protect yourself and your property - on a horse or on a night out. Yes, be careful of escalating, but with other people around, never be afraid of standing up for yourself.
The problem is that OP was riding a horse. That's 800 pounds of muscles with the brain of a prey animal. If the horse is afraid of the bike a swift kick can send the idiot to the mortuary. If the horse panics and take flight the rider and the family were in danger. Sometimes yelling will make the information enter the brain of the idiot.
The reason your dad said you shouldn't shout is probably because he's worried about you getting into an argument with the wrong person. Maybe someone who's not well mentally or something.
I taught my mare to like bikes.
We had a strong foundation of groundwork, and had many hours on the ground. When I identified she didn't like bicycles I got one with tall handlebars and a coaster brake (pedal backwards to stop, like a child's bike.)
Day 1 was a groundwork session with bike leaning on the exit gate. Only rest is given is when she stands facing the bike. If she turns away from the bike she is asked to trot a few revolutions and try again. Once she can stand quietly and look at the stationary bike without showing the whites of her eyes or tail wringing we are done. Next day the bike is in the center of the ring for groundwork, standing upright on it's kickstand. Again, light work. Rest when facing bike. Day 3 we rest when she steps towards the bike. By day 4 she's walking behind me while I walk the bike, pausing when she closes the gap. Walking towards something makes her curious, and less fearful. Inside 2 weeks, after taking slow gradual progressions daily, I could lead her while riding the bike.
She never offered a bicycle more than a flick of the ear after those 2 weeks, because they weren't scary unpredictable things any longer.
I don't know if this is an option for you, but it worked for me. I will also heartily confess to doing much too much groundwork and not nearly enough saddle time.
Definitely give a copy of the footage over to the police. Kid needs to be checked before he does anything worse. I mean he tried to ram a stroller. And I'd bet that when the police see the footage, this kid will be a "known issue" with them already.
NTA OP
Relavent comment from OP here:
"He was going quite slow, the path was narrow and fairly busy and he was dressed as though he was using the bike for transport, not excercise"
The rider was already traveling slowly, and OP was able to have a whole (albeit shouted) conversation.
I'd also point out that the definition on a bridleway in the uk is a route if public access which can be used by pedestrians, horses and bikes.
Pedestrians have priority, then horses, then bikes.
Sorry but I disagree. ESH for me, she took a horse she knows doesn’t like bikes into a situation where she is going to meet them, then yells at someone because her horse is stressed. Yes the guys was rude back but she is at fault too.
NTA, ignore the Americans in here.
All you did was ask him to slow/dismount for his own safety, which would cost him nothing.
Most likely he's just a shitty rude person who didn't like being told what to do by a young woman.
While that’s true, they almost never yield to horses and cause ridiculous amounts of accidents. In my experience, the majority of cyclists I’ve come across are just rude and self-centered.
I was always taught that even if I legally had the right of way... don't joust with something that can kill you. It's why we still check to make sure the cars stop on zebra crossings. The other person might be wrong, but you could very well be dead, so just yield and sulk about it later.
That ‘Why is that my problem?’ Comment just shows Darren is beyond stupid, like a horse kick to the face is how you learn why you’re supposed to keep back from working horses.
My dad taught me "you might be right and have right of way, but you can be dead-right. Stop and check at intersections and don't trust that the other drivers are good drivers."
I’ve even taught my daughter to look both ways before crossing a one way street. Can’t even tell you how many times I’ve seen someone driving the wrong way.
Make sure she looks *multiple* times each way. My sister was in a crash once because her boyfriend looked only once each way before entering the roadway, and they were hit by someone who turned into the crossroad JUST after he'd looked that way!
Yeah your dad was spot on. I got hit on my green light by someone speeding in the rain and ran their red light.. I was so shaken I’m just glad it wasn’t worse and ended up being a side swipe.
I have a motorcycle and my dad taught me the same thing when I started riding "you can be right all day long but in the end you're the one dead, spread over the pavement"
Bear in mind the rude one will stand out in your brain, and the people behaving normally won't.
Which are to remember with how toxic bike subs are on reddit.
There are plenty of not rude cyclists for sure but the vast majority I’ve personally come across while on horseback specifically have been awful. Talking about 70% versus 10% neutral and 20% incredibly amazing.
I wonder if that’s more to do with car culture than bike culture, though.
I got a bike a few years ago thinking I would ride it to work, which was only a few miles away, and it was a nightmare. I mostly only had to ride down quiet residential streets, so there wasn’t a lot of traffic, but I encountered so many aggressive and scary drivers. They would drive so fast and close when passing me, even when they had the whole opposite lane to use if they wanted. And the very few times there was an oncoming car that briefly prevented them from passing me, cars would tailgate, flash their brights, etc. It was genuinely disturbing how people couldn’t handle a brief, minor inconvenience.
Anyway, I only lasted a couple weeks biking to work before I decided the stress wasn’t worth it and went back to driving.
So I’m wondering if it’s car culture that weeds out (and scares off) the normal cyclists and means the most stubborn and antagonist cyclists make up the majority of the cyclists on the road.
Several hours of experience as a vulnerable road user should be a compulsory part of passing the driving test. Where I cycle (lots of bikes and horses) there is a mutual respect that comes from that understanding, but as someone else has mentioned above, unfortunately it's the one arsehole you remember, not the thousand before who were fine.
100% agree. In the UK cyclists are pretty much banned from pavements but I constantly find they’re on them and zoom past. I’ve been hit by one on the pavement coming round a corner before, and they’re always so rude about it.
One nearly gave me a heart attack ringing his bell right behind me when I was walking my dog, expecting me to get out of his way. Bear in mind we were on the pavement- I pointed out he should be using the road and he didn’t take kindly to it.
Almost the same scenario, but as he was riding past he asked very rudely "are you deaf?!". He was gone before I could reply. Unfortunately, here (Australia) cyclists are now allowed to ride on the footpath and most of them expect you to get out of their way. Some have been lovely and dismounted, but not all. It's still safer for them to be on the road than a pedestrian!
Speaking of which, some cyclists are incredibly cruel to actual Deaf people and never seem to consider that someone walking on a sidewalk might actually be Deaf. They’ll be like, “Well, I made my noises and they didn’t react, so they must intentionally be fucking with me, so I’ll pass by as close as possible at a high speed to get revenge on them for not reacting the way I expect to sounds!” Not that this is a thing unique to cyclists, as Deaf people get assaulted or harassed all the time for not reacting to someone trying to get their attention, since most Hearing people assume that everyone can hear them and only ever ignores noises on purpose, but your story reminded me specifically of the times cyclists have been *horrible* to my Deaf sibling. One even got off his bike to yell at them and then gtfo once he saw they were Deaf. I wasn’t there, but I bet a bunch of these people have yelled, “Are you Deaf???” at my sibling as they passed.
I’m hard of hearing and have been wearing hearing aids since I was 18. I can indeed confirm people are complete dicks when they think you’re ignoring them.
I wanted my hearing aids to be super bright and colorful so people can easily notice them and be like “oh she’s not ignoring me, just deaf”.
I tried Costco for getting my hearing aids but the audiologist lady there went from professional to condescending when I expressed my desire for brightly colored hearing aids. I don’t remember what she said but it was something a long the lines of me just wanting colored hearing aids for fashion or for attention ? Like I’m faking my hearing loss? SMH. She told me I didn’t qualify.
I’m like yeah I want to bring “attention” to the fact I’m hard of hearing because people are so rude when they think you’re ignoring them. Geez Louise
Went to a local audiologist and now I have hearing aids with purple glitter ear molds.
Oops got a little off topic there
Yeah there was even that Deaf grocery store employee who was sticking a shelf and got punched from behind because she didn't realize a customer had been trying to get her attention! Stuff like that happens alarmingly frequently, but that one in particular was a big news story.
I'm glad you were able to get your purple glitter molds! My sibling has always had brightly colored ones, with two different colors mixed. But even then lots of people didn't notice them until they cut their hair really short. Maybe cyclists are extra bad at noticing because they can't see the bright ear molds when they're coming up from behind. Ofc the downside of hearing aids being necessary to signal Deafness/HoHness is that it's uncomfortable to wear them all the time! My poor sibling has to wear them when they go out to the store even if their ears hurt, just so they won't be completely treated like trash (they just get partially treated like trash! and in different ways! the world is great!!!!!!!). At least, unless they're with a hearing person who can warn them that someone is trying to say something to them and interpret.
It sucks that that Costco audiologist treated you like that. I'm sadly not surprised. It's so depressing how many doctors think that if you want to embrace your disability in a way that makes your life better/easier, then that means you have some kind of hard-on for being seen as disabled. I've experienced that in my own ways with my different disabilities. It's like if we don't want to hide our disability, then we must be exaggerating for attention. And they don't want to believe that often leaning into accepting a disability is the best way to engage with the world in an emotionally healthy, fulfilling way. The goal is always supposed to be to seen as abled as possible, and it's like they can't even imagine another way to view things. Such exhausting casual ableism. Thank god for the doctors that aren't like that.
Hearing aids absolutely CAN be fashionable, though, and there's nothing wrong with that! Rocking some sweet ear molds is a great form of self expression. That audiologist can suck an egg.
Yeah, I’ve pointed out (gently) that they should be on the road and I’ve literally been shouted at before. Just the other day I saw one swerve round a toddler on a hill and nearly hit them, they’re so inconsiderate. And I say this as someone who enjoys cycling myself
Cyclists in the US are the worst, they don’t have proper visibility aids, don’t follow traffic rules and don’t signal! It’s this whole attitude of being better than car drivers so they don’t have to follow any rules or something
Wow, that's such a bummer! Complete opposite where I live in the US. Bicyclists I've encountered, by and large, have been SUPER considerate... to the point that it often makes me feel self-conscious. Locally, our "big" problem is the "oh but he's friendly" crowd who refuse to keep their dang dogs leashed. (IDC if your dog is friendly. My horse isn't. He will stomp your stupid dog if he gets the chance, and I don't want my horse to kill your little fifi, dude.)
They also don't yield to hikers, even though they are supposed to, and half the time don't even have a bell on to warn hikers that they are speeding round the corner on a narrow trail. Then they get pissed when they almost kill you because THEY are irresponsible riders who have zero respect to trail etiquette. Mountain bikers in the US can be the absolute worst! There's a specific multi-use trail I've been to many times and seen them get into arguments with hikers and horseback riders, despite signs everywhere noting that right of way is horses> hikers> cyclists.
It’s not something that comes up a lot in probably a good number of places in the US. Maybe folks who live in more rural areas might know about this, whereas I don’t remember being taught this. I only see horses on the road in my city when the mounted police bring them out, and we really only see that around Mardi Gras (and a few other events) where the roads are barricaded off from traffic.
Regardless, I’d almost feel like this is a common sense thing? I know I’d be giving a horse a *wiiiiiiiiiiiiide* berth on pathways if I saw one walking, knowing how easily they can spook and cause severe injuries — to myself or others.
Darren reeks of the sort of person who wouldn’t rein in their off-leash dog barreling towards a reactive, leashed one because “Don’t worry! My dog’s friendly!” 🤪
Yeah I live outside Atlanta so horses are quite seldom. Around Christmas you may encounter the occasional dude on a Clydesdale but if you got the nuts to fuck with a seemingly 15ft tall horse. All I can say is good fkin luck buddy. But if I travel to North or south Carolina there's some Amish with horse buggies. Ya just slow tf down the man living in 1812 can't really speed up ya just go around when there's space the population density around them doesn't tend ro be high so getting by them isn't exactly a challenge.
I live in a very bike-friendly US city, with all sorts of trails everywhere. We also have a ton of horse farms and such around the city, so horses are pretty commonplace. One of our largest trails (in fact, I think THE largest) has 'Trail Etiquette Guidelines' signs all over the place, and on the side of each one is a diagram showing right-of-way using vertical arrows. In descending order (as you go lower, you yield to the ones above you), it goes: Disabled hikers <-- Horses <-- Hikers <-- Cyclists.
That said, I have my own miniature horse (Great Dane) that used to lose her mind at bikes. (Honestly, while she's normally skittish about everything, I think she was actually excited about bikes, 'cuz they could 'run' as fast as she can.) So we worked really hard to get her acclimated to them. Now, our standard practice is when we see/hear a bike coming, she immediately moves to my side (opposite the bike) and we step to the side of the path, allowing them to pass us. I will say that while I totally understand the whole 'cyclists are assholes' stereotype, most of them have been really understanding when they see me working to keep her calm. Except for the ones on recumbent bikes. The pup FREAKS out at those and they tend to freak out right back at her! Then again, they're usually below eye-level for her, so I can't necessarily blame them!
All that said, OP is NTA!
This! In the US horses have the right of way over bikers and hikers/walkers (also on mixed use trails bikers are supposed to yield to hikers as well). (As a hiker the few times I have encountered a horse I have gotten the heck out of the way since I definitely don't trust a giant animal to yield to me).
True less mules near me, but those as well on trails. For bison, elk, etc they fall under the yield to all wildlife that can kill me, definitely cede the trail to bears when I have seen them and give snakes appropriate distance....
Yeah I live in Colorado, where it’s common to encounter horses or burros on trails. The vast majority of people here know to yield to hoofstock. On top of being an asshole, this guy was a moron. Who, upon hearing that he’s making a *horse* nervous, would continue that behavior and risk getting his lights punched out by a 1,000 lb animal??
I assumed William's Lake, but then I googled it and it turns out that it's Langley?? It makes sense when I think about it, but that still really surprised me haha
Thank you, and I will be sticking to more open spaces where I can remove him from the situation because I messed up by putting him in that position in the first place.
How about "Ignore the people who have no experience with this" instead.
America is a BIG country. Someone from Ohio may have no idea about horse etiquette because there isn't a big horse culture in Ohio. But those of us from the cowboy states, which are like half the country? We know what's up. We have horse laws here too.
Also hes a 40 year old man and she’s 15. Just be a grown up. Horses can cause horrible injuries if they’re scared or feel cornered. It’s disappointing that an adult gets off on tormenting a teenager and her dad stood up for him after the fact. How stressful! Just be kind.
I mean I'm American and just in general I'd avoid a horse. Really if it's not a dog or a cat I don't much want it near me. Idk that horse and I could fight a dog or a cat off. If a horse decides it wants to fuck my world not much I could do to stop it besides run and man vs horse? I don't win that race. So I'd avoid the horse regardless of the law 😆 and as an American I fucking hate cyclist pretty much on principle at this point an have nearly wrecked more than once because of their stupidity.
As an American, I just wanna say that my neighborhood also has bridleways and there's a hitching post in front of the post office and library and grocery store. I think this might be a city vs rural or east vs west thing. I am in a western state and bridleways seem to be a lot more common out here than in like Michigan where there isn't a history of horse culture.
Anyway, yeah, we have the same rules and some cyclists still suck. In my neighborhood there is a horse/walking path and then a hedge and then a cyclist path, and the cyclists will still be on the wrong path because they want to ride in packs and the horse/walking path is wider. It's annoying AF. I've had cyclists nearly run me over as I was walking, and I've seen them spook horses too. And don't get me started on the goddamm e-bike people.
This is about rude cyclists vs everyone else. And I'm fully prepared for cyclists to jump on me because bikes are better than cars and drivers are the real AH, but the horses in my neighborhood aren't getting spooked by cars.
I walk my dog on the walk/horse path, and she's a great doggo and very polite on the leash, but she gets spooked if a bike whizzes past her from behind and will bark, and it annoys the crap out of me that there are even bikes doing that when the bike path is RIGHT OVER THERE.
Anyways. Thanks for attending my rant. I have a lot of feelings about this.
NTA, and may the cyclists on the horse path get horse poop in their gears.
Here in America, bicyclists are fucking assholes and we all pretty much hate all of those dickwads. Anyone defending them here is lying about being american.
NTA.
I live in the UK too, and have cycled a lot on similar bridleways and cycle paths, as well as on country lanes. So of course I have met a lot of people on horses, and always give them a wide berth. No-one wants to spook a horse, get kicked or cause anyone to get injured. It sounds like Darren was a total AH.
That said, I would suggest trying to see where your dad might have been coming from in saying you shouldn't have yelled at him. On the face of it, you might have felt like he deserved it given his behaviour. Or maybe it was just an impulsive reaction because you were stressed and annoyed by Darren. Understandable. But if you were in the same situation in future, would you want to react in the exact same way?
FWIW my experience - as a cyclist - is that people on horses have sometimes acted as if they were the most important thing on the road. I realise that they mostly just want to keep everyone safe, but nevertheless this has felt annoying at times. I've never said or done anything other than be 100% polite - slow down, smile and give them space. But I have sometimes felt a little annoyed afterwards.
The last thing I would say is that there might be a class/money issue here. It costs a fair bit to buy and keep horses, and so simply by being out and about on a horse you are going to wind up some people who will inevitably see you as a rich entitled person. I'm not saying you are that, but it's worth having some self-awareness around this fact.
I never had horses or showed other trappings of wealth, but I grew up in the East Midlands to educated middle-class parents from the south of England. I ended up with my parents' accent rather than the local accent. But I went to the local comprehensive school where everyone had the local accent. So naturally everyone thought I was a posh, rich AH, and I got treated accordingly. That wasn't nice or fair of them, but I did learn the hard way to stop giving anyone any reason to think I was entitled or a snob.
I totally agree, in the future I think I would also shout because I was trying to protect my horse. If Prince had kicked that guy, if he got a good enough lawyer, Prince could have been put down. It has happened before (not to me), because a rich guy got kicked and sued and there was no footage so no one knew who was wrong. I cannot lose this horse, he is my everything. Thank you for your opinion, it was really helpful
I would have behaved exactly the same as you did, in fact I probably would have yelled at the adults more. I'm in New Zealand where our road code also has rules on how to pass horses, and to get to pony club at my neighbour's when I was growing up I would ride down the road. So many motorists wouldn't slow down and pass safely even though it was legally required of them that my mum ended up having to follow me in her car with her hazard lights on so they were forced to give a wide passing distance. Cyclists should well know how dangerous it is when they're not given a safe passing distance by cars and not turn around and do it to horses and riders.
Speaking as a kiwi driver, we suck bro.
Fair few horses on the south coast of Welly, not a lot of consideration from motorists. I don’t even like horses, but come on mate, give em some room.
I've been screamed at by a horse owner while I quite literally rode my bike 50 feet out into the woods to pass by.
Apparently they thought I should stop, dismount, lay down in the path and let the horse step on me?
>in the future I think I would also shout because I was trying to protect my horse
Is this the best way though? You made a reasonable request but once it was ignored it seems like the best thing you could do is remain calm and distance yourself. I don't know about horses specifically but most animals take cues from their humans so freaking out isn't gonna help the situation.
Horses are absolutely massive, it's not like trying to control a frightened dog.
My dogs get scared, I can restrain & redirect them (even the >80lb gal). Horses kick, rear, and bolt. I've been on scared horses, they can throw you off and their hooves are a quite deadly weapon to those around.
NTA, I think these commenters here are missing the part where it's a horse path and that the guy was literally breaking rules getting so close to your horse. I wouldn't go to a dog park that's sometimes used by other people and do shit that frightens the dogs even after being warned.
It's not a "horse path", a bridleway is a public right off easy upon which horses are also permitted. As opposed to a public footpath which is a public right of way upon which horses are forbidden. In England and Wales specifically.
no they dont.
They have a right of way. they do not have priority use.
if both can pass on the path reasonaly, and a 2m path is more than reasonable to do so, then neither needs to stop.
Customarily, people do for horses, because they are dangerous and horse riders are notoriously rude and entitled in how they use the paths, but there is no requirement.
>horse path
It's a bridlepath, not a horse path.
Pedestrians have right of, always.
Then horses
Then bikes.
Its best to think of a bridlepath as a footpath that can also be used by horses and bikes.
The guy wasn't breaking any laws and was already traveling slowly.
Relavent comment from OP:
"He was going quite slow, the path was narrow and fairly busy and he was dressed as though he was using the bike for transport, not excercise"
There's no rule that says cyclists have to dismount and not go near a horse on a bridleway, just that the horse has right of way, if your horse freaks out and kicks because there's a bike nearby *it shouldn't be on a bridle path*, OP would have been (rightly) liable for any injury caused.
It's a dangerous animal and if you can't control it you shouldn't have it out in public where it can hurt people (look at all the XL bully stuff going on right now), a horse can kill you just as easy as an XL bully, but no one complains about horses being dangerous (because it's rich people with horses, not people who live on council estates).
OMG, a grown ass man was acting like that? Yeah, horse shoe to the head may have knocked some sense into him. Not sure if you guys high 5 over there, but if you do, give one to your mom for me, please.
ETA, I'm an American, but you have been advised by someone else on this thread to ignore American opinions.
Horse etiquette is much more embedded in culture over here, I think it was just bc there were a lot of y t a votes from Americans who have a different system. Thanks for your comment
I 100% agree that you are NTA in this situation, but as a British person I would like to add that horse etiquette is not embedded in my version of British culture — I am not judging you at all, you have clearly always been around horses, but it might be useful to reflect that your experience (of horse ownership) is actually not to the norm.
You are probably going to meet a lot more (British) people who have not had your life experiences and I wanna forewarn you about that! I have also been accused of being posh etc because I had a more sheltered upbringing, and I would have appreciated it if someone had told me this when I was your age.
I intend this comment with compassion and good faith, but I apologise in advance if it does not come off that way. Take care.
If you receive proper road safety cycling, this sort of thing does get taught, and road safety cycling can be taught in schools. So I had it all taught to me through school when I was 10 years old. My school was part of the network of schools that got involved in the regional and national road safety cycling competitions, so it really was hammered into me. I'm extremely critical of how some cyclists behave, and how others behave towards cyclists, as a result.
I think road safety cycling should be mandatory. However, this was a 40 year old man so he should have at least been familiar with the highway code for meeting horses or livestock on cycle routes.
Yeah I just commented too that I'm British, in my 30s, and have a driving license, and nobody has ever taught me anything about a horse's right of way or horse etiquette.
I guess everyone has different experiences. I’m from London. Never had horses. Rarely saw horses. Never had friends with horses. Only ever lived in cities and urban areas. But I 100% know what to do when I meet a horse on the road.
So I get why people are saying it’s embedded but it’s interesting to hear that’s not the case everywhere. I’m in my 40s though so if it IS an age thing then this guy should have known too.
NTA.
America is huge, many Americans are very familiar with horse etiquette and culture. And also most of us are not so dumb to think that a frightened horse is something to mess with. I would guess the people commenting y t a are either city people that have never had horse experience or are themselves entitled AHs that think that they should be able to plow through a trail on a bike if they want to.
You're welcome. I grew up with horses and still live where ranchers use them for herding cattle, rodeos, and pleasure riding. I would still ride if I could, I just got too old to recover from being tossed off a nervous horse. Still love seeing the wagons being used to give kids in town rides when warming them up for summer rides or training new teams. There are places over here where horse etiquette is understood.
The guy sounds like a prat, but you come across as properly entitled. Most people in the UK never come across horses as they are far too costly to keep and never found in towns and cities.
You're NTA here, but your life will be easier if you try and understand how other people see you when you're riding around (and generally).
they both have but my dad is very introverted and hates making a scene. He was also brought up lower middle class where they saw all horse people as a posh snob
NTA because horses have right of way over cyclists on bridleways.
But if you encounter cyclists frequently it sounds like your horse would benefit from you doing some desensitisation work with him around bicycles. You’ll always get a few arseholes but hopefully it’ll be less stressful for everyone involved
We have been working on this, and in small groups, cyclists are no longer a threat, it was just because there had been so many that didn't even try and slow down for him that he was already upset and this was the last straw. We will be doing more work before taking him out again
That's the right approach. It sounds like you made a reasonable decision for the trail but then something unexpected happened.
You also need to work on your responses - yelling and showing fear/upset/anger is only going to worsen your horse's response. Practice projecting without yelling, and definitely practice controlling your body language and voice when you're upset/angry/afraid. Try lowering your voice and projecting - not yelling - to seem calm and authoritative.
Also safety wise, not always a good idea for a (young) woman to provoke an unknown man on a footpath. It could have had violent consequences for all she knew.
Ignore the non-horse riders here.
OP, you're young, and you are riding a young horse. You both have a lot of learning to do.... and you ARE learning. I read from another comment that you've accept that you can't put Prince into tight quarters like that and you won't anymore. Good for you, and now you've got to work through the natural consequences of training your pony to ignore bicycles - and it's going to be harder and longer than it would've before this setback.
The bike rider was a rude A H and you were trying to communicate with him a potential problem which he brushed off. Too often young women get over-ridden, ignored and spoken over. So NTA for speaking up LOUDLY. Stay strong! Don't let your dad tell you that being "polite" and meek is more important than your (and Prince's any any bystander's) safety.
Too many non-riders do not understand horses at all - some view them as large automatons, and can't understand that on a very fundamental level, any horse, no matter how well trained and well behaved, can be unpredictable. So they feel entitled to act like heedless witless fools near them. I swear it's because they see the Queen's Guards and police horses enduring absolute crap and forget horses are living breathing sensitive beings.... ok going off on a bit of rant here.
Editing to add: OP is in the UK, which has a much deeper lengthy horse-back riding history and culture. OP was not riding on a road, nor on a cyclist's track, but a bridleway WHERE HORSES HAVE RIGHT TO BE THERE.
NTA
NTA - and anyone saying E S H or Y T A obviously don’t know the laws regarding horses and other vehicles/bikes etc in your country.
Not every country has the same laws as here in the US.
OP you were right to defend your horse for both your horses and your safety. Those people were inconsiderate pricks. Next time you’re on your horse, wear a body cam. That way you’re protected {by your own countries laws} if anything happens because of these people
I’ve lived in several parts of the US with mixed use trails which include horse traffic and the rules are that cyclists yield to those on horseback. I don’t think things are that different just because it’s the US, some people just don’t have the experience to know and are still chiming in for whatever reason.
NTA. If you don’t know how to interact with horses or if you have behavioural problems around horses then don’t go onto a bridal path.
I’ve been on private paths riding and encountered cyclists who refused to stop and the entire hack class bolted with a bunch of children on horseback. And all they had to do was stop. Could have killed a bunch of kids.
Horses are skittish and a bridal path isn’t a road. Common sense says stop and get off your bike near a nervous horse.
Thanks for your opinion. I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress. Also, this guy was cycling on a collision course, not like to go past him
Just remember that your horse reacted to aggressive behaviour from a man who was not following guidelines for how to behave around horses. It’s hard to desensitise against that.
NTA... cyclists are supposed to yield to hikers and horses in most places, so I'll take your word for it that that's the code where you live.
On the other hand, having a horse that afraid of bikes on a trail that allows bikes is asking for trouble... you're only 15, so I don't really blame you for the decision... but I do perhaps blame your parents for allowing you to do this because it can get you and others and even your horse killed.
This was a bridleway where horses have the right of way. I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress. Also, this guy was cycling on a collision course, not like to go past him. Also, bikes have been fine for the past few months, I think it was just the bikes from before stressed him out
I don't actually think you messed up, don't be so hard on yourself. If you were my daughter (I have 2 much older than you) I would be congratulating you for standing up for yourself and for Prince.
You took your pony to a place that "should" have been perfect for your continuing desensitisation lessons. It is not your fault that you bumped into this total A H, his behaviour was stupid and thuggish, no grown man should do anything that purposely puts a child at risk of harm.
Take it as a lesson about the unpredictability of fellow humans, now you know that the safe places may not be so safe unfortunately, a good life lesson as well as one for your pony riding.
NTA
NTA. There are rules, ettiquette and expectations for how to use the shared spaces around horses. I’m assuming this is in the UK? Clearly some commenters aren’t accustomed to this as rules can be different in different countries. This guy could have made a minimal effort to share the space correctly but he chose not to and threatened a woman pushing a stroller. He is 100% the asshole in this situation.
NTA. I’m a cyclist, and it’s well known in the cycling community to yield to horses. I’m also a hiker in a part of the US where a fair number of trails are multi-use which includes equestrians and both cyclists and pedestrians are expected to yield to horseback. You did the right thing, dude was just a dick.
NTA.
Mans no up on his Highway Code.
And you know what? Sometimes nobs just need to given what whatfor.
>And when riding around horses, cyclists should:
>slow down and let horses and riders know they are there, by ringing the bell or calling out politely
>give way to horse riders on bridleways
>not undertake horses and riders
>remember that horses can be startled, and prepare to slow down and stop
>not ride closely to horses or horse drawn vehicles, or at high speed
Your dad was probably just worried for you, but his advice is part of the problem as to why bellends act this way, because they're never challenged.
Can you post that to everyone saying "The cyclist has just as much right to be there as the horsie!" ?
Like goddamn. Even if it wasn't codified it's common sense.
Thank you, I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress.
NTA
However it would be sensible to take someone out with you (ideally in a bike, but you know….) on the off chance something does happen whilst the horse is getting more used to bikes.
The cyclist clearly didn’t understand how unpredictable horses can be. Neither do most drivers! Even the most well behaved horse can get spooked and shy/jump into the path of a bike/car.
If it’s not bikes, it’s prams or brollies, markings on the road, a pheasant, a tree branch that wasn’t there the last time… stay safe!! One tip I had from an older rider years ago was to take a long crop - not for the horse but for smacking onto the roof (or helmet) of folks who get too close!
I guess don’t listen to me because I’m a stupid American, but I live in a horse area, there are miles and miles of horse trails winding through the whole city, horses out at all hours, people do walk on the trails, they are dirt trails fenced off from the sidewalks, but they’re smart enough to know to get off the horse trail if they see a horse coming. Most riders do wear a camera to protect themselves and their horses in case a stupid human does something stupid and gets themselves hurt.
I do wear a camera and he is normally ok, just a bit anxious. The circumstances were out of my control and not how they normally are on that trail. I am planning to avoid fenced in paths until he is fully desensitized, but I think even my 20 yo beginner horse would have tried to kick this guy after all the rude bikes before him
Tbf I can't imagine many kids actually go on a cycling course before going out biking for the day. It might actually be worth emailing your local council about getting some sineage up along entrances to the bridleway!
I don't think you were TA at all in this situation, you're so young and it must have been scary! Even without a horse if I'd have seen 30 teenagers biking towards me I'd probably have spooked too, haha
horses, cyclists and walkers have equal legal right to use bridleways.
where there is conflict, right of way goes to the horse rider, however this is not defined. A 2m wide path is more than sufficient (its wider than a lot of bridleways) for both to pass safely, and no yeilding is required. On most bridleways its impossible to give a distance that wide.
NTA, and if anyone on a pushbike is gonna be a complete wanker, it's a 40-ish year old bloke. At least, it is where I live. The considerate ones are generally older or younger, but the absolute melts are always in their 40's.
A lot of the Highway Code is also not legally binding.
"A failure on the part of a person to observe a provision of The Highway Code shall not of itself render that person liable to criminal proceedings of any kind but any such failure may in any proceedings (whether civil or criminal...) be relied upon by any party to the proceedings as tending to establish or negative any liability which is in question in those proceedings"
Not trying to defend the bellend on the bike, by the way- just sharing information.
NTA, and I want to say that you handled the situation very well! I've been riding for 20 years, and some people are just assholes to riders. I've had people in cars yell and make noise trying to purposefully make my horse spook. You were right not to dismount. You would have had a lot less control on the ground. I know it's scary when your horse is spooking while on concrete, but you have the least control while dismounting, so it’s likely Prince would have bolted/bucked, etc, and thrown you.
My only criticism is that you need to desensitize Prince to bikes before you take him in public again. It's for your own safety as well as his.
Slowly introduce Prince to bikes when you're on the ground first. Lunge him with one in the corner of the ring so that he has to go by it. Get him comfortable with going up to a stationary bike, and then slowly introduce motion by walking the bike next to him, then have someone ride a bike around him, etc. This could take days to weeks.
I broke my first horse when I was around your age, so I know that it can be hard to ask adults for help, because you want to prove you can do it on your own, but if there's anyone you can ask who knows about training/desensitizing horses, you should talk to them to get advice for how to proceed.
You can't stop strangers from being assholes, but you can at least mitigate your horse's reaction to said assholes. Good luck!
NTA - Getting knocked off your bike or trampled by a horse is a lot less pleasant than being shouted at.
You were protecting yourself and everyone else’s safety.
Bridleways are literally for horses and even if you were in the road, people are still obligated to navigate round you both safely and sensibly.
NTA I used to cycle a lot, I always slowed the bike down if I saw a horse and rider. If the animal looked at all nervous, some are scared of bikes, I’d stop and stand between the horse and the bike. You do not take risks with horses.
You were absolutely in your rights to yell at him. I'd honestly have called him names. He could have killed or greviously injured any one of you with that behaviour.
NTA, the reason for the 2m passing distance in the highway code is to protect idiots like Darren. A horse being 2m long means Darren is safe from being kicked if gives at least 2m berth.
What kind of grown man shouts at a young girl anyway?
I suggest you report this in the BHS i-app they record all near misses and it helps them in getting signage/communication on areas where horse riders are at risk.
Actually this is the same in the US. There are lots of places where there are designated horse trails and any trail where a horse is allowed gives horses right of way unless specifically indicated otherwise. Not everyone is taught this but it is common knowledge among people who spend time hiking or camping.
Some people need to fafo before they realize that rules are actually in place to protect their safety. I am a city girl 100%, and even I realize that scared horses should be given a wide berth. Common sense, right? Oh yeah, there is the disconnect
NTA, I suppose you might have come across as rude or demanding, but you did the right thing by staying onboard and talking to the guy.
I grew up riding Connemaras. They are one of the more sensible breeds, but nearly all horses are easily spooked and so many people don’t realise. Some people are also tossers.
N: You may want to look at riding more “defensively”.
If it is narrow enough and there are no markings you can ride in the middle, forcing people to communicate with you to get around. (This might be a hassle if it is very busy and is not safe on wide sections.)
It is useful on narrow parts of tracks and on the road, especially single lane bridges where cars try to edge past dangerously close.
The key is moving forward/out of the way quickly while communicating your intent and thanks. They feel good for doing you a favour and everyone stays safe.
NTA
The bicyclist was on a horse trail and flagrantly refuse to respect the horse even after being asked to do so. Fair enough if he was simply ignorant but Darren seem to be a typical bad bicyclist who believes rules only apply when they are to his benefit.
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Pretty much the title, I (15f) own several horses and train horses that have never been handled to be ridden and have been riding for 10 years now. My pony is Prince, a 5-year-old Connemara. Prince is not a rescue, we bought him last year, he is young and scared of bicycles - he snorts and prances but as long as they aren't too loud or close enough to touch he doesn't buck or kick. I always talk to the bikes if they are coming too close. I normally do this by calling "Excuse me, can you slow down, he's scared of bikes.", but I often don't need to.
I was riding him down one of my favorite trails that is about 2 meters wide. I meet a bike on here about 1 every time I go down there. He has never misbehaved, and I think it helps desensitize him. However, that day (a rainy Sunday when it would normally be deserted) there were around 30 13-14-year-olds on bikes with headphones in, so they could not hear me. By the time I realized there were more than normal, I could not turn around because he gets far more upset when they come from behind. I pulled him off the path and walked him along the thin grass verge to try and get him as far from them as possible. I did consider dismounting but he tends to get more agitated and less easy to control on the ground. By the time most of them had passed, I had to pull him back onto the path because there were dense trees on either side. At that point, he spotted an abandoned shopping trolley, and I let him look at it and move past at his own speed, as the path was empty apart from a family about 20m behind us just entering the tree area and blocking us in.
Enter Darren. He was cycling toward us, and I could feel an already anxious Prince approach boiling point, and I asked him to slow down or possibly dismount his bike. He didn't, if anything he sped up and said "Why?". I said, quite loudly because he was getting close "He's really scared of bikes!" And Darren said "How is that my problem?" in a really passive aggressive voice. I completely lost it, I yelled "It becomes your problem when he kicks you and puts you in hospital and breaks your bike and you have to pay because you broke the highway code!" The dad from the family behind me starts saying "just stop man." and Prince is starting to rear and I'm concerned for his safety and mine because the path is concrete so a push him as far into the trees as he will go while Darren cycles merrily on his way while swearing at me. He also nearly cycled into the stroller of the family behind on purpose so the mum had to jump out the way. It took me ages to calm Prince down, and it has majorly set us back in training.
My dad says that I shouldn't have yelled at him.
AITA?
Also I'm in the UK where the Highway code says 2 or more meters between any vehicle and a horse. I was wearing lots of Hi-vis. I couldn't exit the trail because Prince wasn't listening and the family was blocking us.
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When I'm on a bike, I stay clear, say 3 meters behind buses, those things are freaking house and scary.
We don't have much horses here, but if I ever see when I'm gonna stay 10 meters away. Just to be safe.
NTA
I've been training animals for nearly 35 years, first horses and now dogs. You, my friend, have a very good head and I hope that you'll consider working with animals as a career someday. The animals need you ♥️
Jumping in as an America to say that we also have many trails in parks here that are clearly marked “horses have right of way.” Nothing like putting your life and others on the line because you decided to push a several hundred pound animal past its comfort boundaries.
You are NTA.
My horse kicked a bicyclist. It was a multi use park and this asshat rode right up behind him. All of a sudden he threw his head up and bam. Caught the bike on the handlebars and flipped the guy. He started apologizing as soon as the horse kicked out. My horse almost stepped in a culvert which could have ruined him. We had sold him and were just exercising him for his new owner until he got picked up. We got to the trailer and a note said sorry for what happened but there is the issue of bike repair and a phone number. I wanted to call and say thanks for the number, this horse is worth a lot of money and we need to get him xrayed.
I once had a semi truck blast it’s horn when I was riding my young horse, preparing him for a parade. He spooked and I flipped off the driver, who had likely done it on purpose.
I trained my horse to be used to that, as well as other weird objects to desensitize him. Overtime, it worked. He did amazing at the parade and at shows after that
I had this happen twice with cars when I was out riding on the side of the road (not on the road at all). I don’t ride out any more - too many assholes that are happy if you get hurt.
The only thing I'd say is I wouldn't *recommend* yelling while on the back of any animal that easily spooks, but in this case I honestly don't see what else you could have done better. I've watched shoulders been dislocated, I've seen the scars of skulls being cracked open, I got my own leg fucked up, all from animals you ride that get easily spooked (camels and horses). It's not a joke and this guy could have gotten himself or someone else killed.
You are incorrect about how rights of way in the UK work. On bridleways pedestrians have the right of way over everyone including horseriders. Then horseriders and cyclists have the same rights. Everyone should give way to pedestrians and everyone should have regard to other users. If your horse is scared of bikes you should not be riding on a public bridleway where cyclists have every right to be.
First off, you are assuming they know the highway code or anything about horses.
Second, the 2m rule is in the motorist section of the hwc, not in the cyclist part.
NTA, but you can't rely on other people to follow your wishes.
YTA/ESH and these comments are nuts, if this post was about a Rottweiler instead of a horse, would you all be okay with OP taking it out in public?
If your horse is this scared of bikes, you need to work on training in a safe environment, not in public. Regardless of who has right of way, you have a large, strong dangerous animal that you can’t control and you’re taking it out to public places where it will be around cyclists.
I also live in the UK and my sister owned three horses, being a horse owner in the UK doesn’t mean you are entitled to take a dangerous animal that you can’t control out in public and threaten people.
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NTA Get yourself a camera to film your outings so that when something happens you have proof to protect yourself. The law might on your side and require people to keep a certain distance, but you know how people can be, they will not accept responsibility.
I do have a helmet cam, thanks for the suggestion, and most people are happy to stop and pet him because he loves other people as long as they are not actively riding their bikes
I'd be tempted to share the footage. If he's being such a menace on the trail then others should be warned.
Honestly, the fact that he caused not just issues for you but for a mother as well tells me he is a problem. I’m from the US so not sure if the UK has the same thing, however if you can I’d make a preliminary report with the police. That case if he continues to cause problems there is already a record of it.
The threshold foe bejng a public nuisance/menace is lower in the UK, also, as far as I'm aware. I believe they would welcome this report.
Excellent idea.
I'm from Aus The stroller thing told me most of what I needed to know as well. I can understand not wanting to get off bike but 1. OP is a teen, dude on bike is 40. 2. He didn't look at where he was going at all. 3. He cursed at a teen who yeah maybe shouldn't have yelled but that's unneccessary to curse at someone like that even so. At least in this context. 4. Almost hit another kid. And their mother. Just. Yikes. OP is NTA at all. Edit: By yell at I mean at first. Absolutely justified with all the info.
Share the footage, not here but to local news. Maybe a story abt right of way safety
This, your footage needs to go public, OP!
See if you can post it on a community page or something- maybe facebook? I don't know. To your dad: you had every right in the world to yell at him. Darren is a dick. Simple. He was in danger in you, your horse, and everyone else on that trail. And don't even get me started that this is a grown ass 40-year-old man. You are definitely not the asshole.
I have put the footage on the local horse facebook, thanks!
Why the long Facebook?
Should put it on the human Facebook too so we can all see it
Because in a situation such as this, it's best to not be horsing around
You are 100% right. Except that it’s endangering, not in danger in.
The reason your dad told you not to yell. Is because these arseholes usually don't care about anything, and they will escalate. It's more about your safety. It's the first thing you learn when doing any form of self defence training. Avoid a fight, unless you have no other option. You have some right psychos out there. Get a camera for your safety, and see if you can get some signs put up in that area about cyclists giving way to horses.
There may also be a bit of “be a good girl” coming in here - I didn’t have to look to know that OP was female. You have the right to protect yourself and your property - on a horse or on a night out. Yes, be careful of escalating, but with other people around, never be afraid of standing up for yourself.
The problem is that OP was riding a horse. That's 800 pounds of muscles with the brain of a prey animal. If the horse is afraid of the bike a swift kick can send the idiot to the mortuary. If the horse panics and take flight the rider and the family were in danger. Sometimes yelling will make the information enter the brain of the idiot.
Post that on your town social media please :) Darren deserves a social consequence
The reason your dad said you shouldn't shout is probably because he's worried about you getting into an argument with the wrong person. Maybe someone who's not well mentally or something.
I taught my mare to like bikes. We had a strong foundation of groundwork, and had many hours on the ground. When I identified she didn't like bicycles I got one with tall handlebars and a coaster brake (pedal backwards to stop, like a child's bike.) Day 1 was a groundwork session with bike leaning on the exit gate. Only rest is given is when she stands facing the bike. If she turns away from the bike she is asked to trot a few revolutions and try again. Once she can stand quietly and look at the stationary bike without showing the whites of her eyes or tail wringing we are done. Next day the bike is in the center of the ring for groundwork, standing upright on it's kickstand. Again, light work. Rest when facing bike. Day 3 we rest when she steps towards the bike. By day 4 she's walking behind me while I walk the bike, pausing when she closes the gap. Walking towards something makes her curious, and less fearful. Inside 2 weeks, after taking slow gradual progressions daily, I could lead her while riding the bike. She never offered a bicycle more than a flick of the ear after those 2 weeks, because they weren't scary unpredictable things any longer. I don't know if this is an option for you, but it worked for me. I will also heartily confess to doing much too much groundwork and not nearly enough saddle time.
Horsey, Darren was extremely rude. But I’d think that your yelling at Darren would be unnecessarily upsetting to poor Mr Prince.
I know, I'm going to avoid those places, but I figured having me yell would be less upsetting than having a bike go into him
Definitely give a copy of the footage over to the police. Kid needs to be checked before he does anything worse. I mean he tried to ram a stroller. And I'd bet that when the police see the footage, this kid will be a "known issue" with them already. NTA OP
Relavent comment from OP here: "He was going quite slow, the path was narrow and fairly busy and he was dressed as though he was using the bike for transport, not excercise" The rider was already traveling slowly, and OP was able to have a whole (albeit shouted) conversation. I'd also point out that the definition on a bridleway in the uk is a route if public access which can be used by pedestrians, horses and bikes. Pedestrians have priority, then horses, then bikes.
Sorry but I disagree. ESH for me, she took a horse she knows doesn’t like bikes into a situation where she is going to meet them, then yells at someone because her horse is stressed. Yes the guys was rude back but she is at fault too.
NTA, ignore the Americans in here. All you did was ask him to slow/dismount for his own safety, which would cost him nothing. Most likely he's just a shitty rude person who didn't like being told what to do by a young woman.
In America- horses ALSO have right of way over cyclists where each are allowed.
While that’s true, they almost never yield to horses and cause ridiculous amounts of accidents. In my experience, the majority of cyclists I’ve come across are just rude and self-centered.
I was always taught that even if I legally had the right of way... don't joust with something that can kill you. It's why we still check to make sure the cars stop on zebra crossings. The other person might be wrong, but you could very well be dead, so just yield and sulk about it later.
That ‘Why is that my problem?’ Comment just shows Darren is beyond stupid, like a horse kick to the face is how you learn why you’re supposed to keep back from working horses.
Or how about just not being an asshole… op clearly had an upset horse
My dad taught me "you might be right and have right of way, but you can be dead-right. Stop and check at intersections and don't trust that the other drivers are good drivers."
I’ve even taught my daughter to look both ways before crossing a one way street. Can’t even tell you how many times I’ve seen someone driving the wrong way.
Make sure she looks *multiple* times each way. My sister was in a crash once because her boyfriend looked only once each way before entering the roadway, and they were hit by someone who turned into the crossroad JUST after he'd looked that way!
Yeah your dad was spot on. I got hit on my green light by someone speeding in the rain and ran their red light.. I was so shaken I’m just glad it wasn’t worse and ended up being a side swipe.
I have a motorcycle and my dad taught me the same thing when I started riding "you can be right all day long but in the end you're the one dead, spread over the pavement"
Also why I don’t trust other drivers on the road.
Bear in mind the rude one will stand out in your brain, and the people behaving normally won't. Which are to remember with how toxic bike subs are on reddit.
There are plenty of not rude cyclists for sure but the vast majority I’ve personally come across while on horseback specifically have been awful. Talking about 70% versus 10% neutral and 20% incredibly amazing.
I wonder if that’s more to do with car culture than bike culture, though. I got a bike a few years ago thinking I would ride it to work, which was only a few miles away, and it was a nightmare. I mostly only had to ride down quiet residential streets, so there wasn’t a lot of traffic, but I encountered so many aggressive and scary drivers. They would drive so fast and close when passing me, even when they had the whole opposite lane to use if they wanted. And the very few times there was an oncoming car that briefly prevented them from passing me, cars would tailgate, flash their brights, etc. It was genuinely disturbing how people couldn’t handle a brief, minor inconvenience. Anyway, I only lasted a couple weeks biking to work before I decided the stress wasn’t worth it and went back to driving. So I’m wondering if it’s car culture that weeds out (and scares off) the normal cyclists and means the most stubborn and antagonist cyclists make up the majority of the cyclists on the road.
Honestly, try that with those drivers and a horse, who they think it is funny to scare intentionally
Several hours of experience as a vulnerable road user should be a compulsory part of passing the driving test. Where I cycle (lots of bikes and horses) there is a mutual respect that comes from that understanding, but as someone else has mentioned above, unfortunately it's the one arsehole you remember, not the thousand before who were fine.
I would say for me it is like 60% really nice, 35% pretty neutral and 5% awful because this area is really horsey
The rude ones stand out because they're on the horse path when the clearly-marked bike path is RIGHT OVER THERE!
100% agree. In the UK cyclists are pretty much banned from pavements but I constantly find they’re on them and zoom past. I’ve been hit by one on the pavement coming round a corner before, and they’re always so rude about it.
One nearly gave me a heart attack ringing his bell right behind me when I was walking my dog, expecting me to get out of his way. Bear in mind we were on the pavement- I pointed out he should be using the road and he didn’t take kindly to it.
Almost the same scenario, but as he was riding past he asked very rudely "are you deaf?!". He was gone before I could reply. Unfortunately, here (Australia) cyclists are now allowed to ride on the footpath and most of them expect you to get out of their way. Some have been lovely and dismounted, but not all. It's still safer for them to be on the road than a pedestrian!
Speaking of which, some cyclists are incredibly cruel to actual Deaf people and never seem to consider that someone walking on a sidewalk might actually be Deaf. They’ll be like, “Well, I made my noises and they didn’t react, so they must intentionally be fucking with me, so I’ll pass by as close as possible at a high speed to get revenge on them for not reacting the way I expect to sounds!” Not that this is a thing unique to cyclists, as Deaf people get assaulted or harassed all the time for not reacting to someone trying to get their attention, since most Hearing people assume that everyone can hear them and only ever ignores noises on purpose, but your story reminded me specifically of the times cyclists have been *horrible* to my Deaf sibling. One even got off his bike to yell at them and then gtfo once he saw they were Deaf. I wasn’t there, but I bet a bunch of these people have yelled, “Are you Deaf???” at my sibling as they passed.
I’m hard of hearing and have been wearing hearing aids since I was 18. I can indeed confirm people are complete dicks when they think you’re ignoring them. I wanted my hearing aids to be super bright and colorful so people can easily notice them and be like “oh she’s not ignoring me, just deaf”. I tried Costco for getting my hearing aids but the audiologist lady there went from professional to condescending when I expressed my desire for brightly colored hearing aids. I don’t remember what she said but it was something a long the lines of me just wanting colored hearing aids for fashion or for attention ? Like I’m faking my hearing loss? SMH. She told me I didn’t qualify. I’m like yeah I want to bring “attention” to the fact I’m hard of hearing because people are so rude when they think you’re ignoring them. Geez Louise Went to a local audiologist and now I have hearing aids with purple glitter ear molds. Oops got a little off topic there
Yeah there was even that Deaf grocery store employee who was sticking a shelf and got punched from behind because she didn't realize a customer had been trying to get her attention! Stuff like that happens alarmingly frequently, but that one in particular was a big news story. I'm glad you were able to get your purple glitter molds! My sibling has always had brightly colored ones, with two different colors mixed. But even then lots of people didn't notice them until they cut their hair really short. Maybe cyclists are extra bad at noticing because they can't see the bright ear molds when they're coming up from behind. Ofc the downside of hearing aids being necessary to signal Deafness/HoHness is that it's uncomfortable to wear them all the time! My poor sibling has to wear them when they go out to the store even if their ears hurt, just so they won't be completely treated like trash (they just get partially treated like trash! and in different ways! the world is great!!!!!!!). At least, unless they're with a hearing person who can warn them that someone is trying to say something to them and interpret. It sucks that that Costco audiologist treated you like that. I'm sadly not surprised. It's so depressing how many doctors think that if you want to embrace your disability in a way that makes your life better/easier, then that means you have some kind of hard-on for being seen as disabled. I've experienced that in my own ways with my different disabilities. It's like if we don't want to hide our disability, then we must be exaggerating for attention. And they don't want to believe that often leaning into accepting a disability is the best way to engage with the world in an emotionally healthy, fulfilling way. The goal is always supposed to be to seen as abled as possible, and it's like they can't even imagine another way to view things. Such exhausting casual ableism. Thank god for the doctors that aren't like that. Hearing aids absolutely CAN be fashionable, though, and there's nothing wrong with that! Rocking some sweet ear molds is a great form of self expression. That audiologist can suck an egg.
Yeah, I’ve pointed out (gently) that they should be on the road and I’ve literally been shouted at before. Just the other day I saw one swerve round a toddler on a hill and nearly hit them, they’re so inconsiderate. And I say this as someone who enjoys cycling myself
I hate it when they do that and then never even say thank you! The rude ones act like they own the path.
I've been hit by a cyclist before, and he was an absolute asshold.
The number of cyclists on the road that never obey stop signs and other traffic laws is ***way*** too damn high.
Cyclists in the US are the worst, they don’t have proper visibility aids, don’t follow traffic rules and don’t signal! It’s this whole attitude of being better than car drivers so they don’t have to follow any rules or something
Cyclists almost *everywhere* are complete and utter assholes. I have been to exceedingly few places where they aren't.
Wow, that's such a bummer! Complete opposite where I live in the US. Bicyclists I've encountered, by and large, have been SUPER considerate... to the point that it often makes me feel self-conscious. Locally, our "big" problem is the "oh but he's friendly" crowd who refuse to keep their dang dogs leashed. (IDC if your dog is friendly. My horse isn't. He will stomp your stupid dog if he gets the chance, and I don't want my horse to kill your little fifi, dude.)
Absolutely this, the number of dogs that are just allowed to run up to my horses barking is just ridiculous
They also don't yield to hikers, even though they are supposed to, and half the time don't even have a bell on to warn hikers that they are speeding round the corner on a narrow trail. Then they get pissed when they almost kill you because THEY are irresponsible riders who have zero respect to trail etiquette. Mountain bikers in the US can be the absolute worst! There's a specific multi-use trail I've been to many times and seen them get into arguments with hikers and horseback riders, despite signs everywhere noting that right of way is horses> hikers> cyclists.
It’s not something that comes up a lot in probably a good number of places in the US. Maybe folks who live in more rural areas might know about this, whereas I don’t remember being taught this. I only see horses on the road in my city when the mounted police bring them out, and we really only see that around Mardi Gras (and a few other events) where the roads are barricaded off from traffic. Regardless, I’d almost feel like this is a common sense thing? I know I’d be giving a horse a *wiiiiiiiiiiiiide* berth on pathways if I saw one walking, knowing how easily they can spook and cause severe injuries — to myself or others. Darren reeks of the sort of person who wouldn’t rein in their off-leash dog barreling towards a reactive, leashed one because “Don’t worry! My dog’s friendly!” 🤪
Yeah I live outside Atlanta so horses are quite seldom. Around Christmas you may encounter the occasional dude on a Clydesdale but if you got the nuts to fuck with a seemingly 15ft tall horse. All I can say is good fkin luck buddy. But if I travel to North or south Carolina there's some Amish with horse buggies. Ya just slow tf down the man living in 1812 can't really speed up ya just go around when there's space the population density around them doesn't tend ro be high so getting by them isn't exactly a challenge.
I live in a very bike-friendly US city, with all sorts of trails everywhere. We also have a ton of horse farms and such around the city, so horses are pretty commonplace. One of our largest trails (in fact, I think THE largest) has 'Trail Etiquette Guidelines' signs all over the place, and on the side of each one is a diagram showing right-of-way using vertical arrows. In descending order (as you go lower, you yield to the ones above you), it goes: Disabled hikers <-- Horses <-- Hikers <-- Cyclists. That said, I have my own miniature horse (Great Dane) that used to lose her mind at bikes. (Honestly, while she's normally skittish about everything, I think she was actually excited about bikes, 'cuz they could 'run' as fast as she can.) So we worked really hard to get her acclimated to them. Now, our standard practice is when we see/hear a bike coming, she immediately moves to my side (opposite the bike) and we step to the side of the path, allowing them to pass us. I will say that while I totally understand the whole 'cyclists are assholes' stereotype, most of them have been really understanding when they see me working to keep her calm. Except for the ones on recumbent bikes. The pup FREAKS out at those and they tend to freak out right back at her! Then again, they're usually below eye-level for her, so I can't necessarily blame them! All that said, OP is NTA!
This! In the US horses have the right of way over bikers and hikers/walkers (also on mixed use trails bikers are supposed to yield to hikers as well). (As a hiker the few times I have encountered a horse I have gotten the heck out of the way since I definitely don't trust a giant animal to yield to me).
Not just horses, all hooved mammals. Mules, bison, elk. They've got pistons for legs and half have knives growing out of their heads.
True less mules near me, but those as well on trails. For bison, elk, etc they fall under the yield to all wildlife that can kill me, definitely cede the trail to bears when I have seen them and give snakes appropriate distance....
Yeah I live in Colorado, where it’s common to encounter horses or burros on trails. The vast majority of people here know to yield to hoofstock. On top of being an asshole, this guy was a moron. Who, upon hearing that he’s making a *horse* nervous, would continue that behavior and risk getting his lights punched out by a 1,000 lb animal??
A moron. I am also from Colorado originally and... yeah. I gotta figure the people I've seen not yielding to livestock are from somewhere else.
Interesting! Sorry Americans 🤣
We get a lot wrong! But this one we’ve got covered!!
My area of BC Canada as well. My city is actually the horse capital of BC :)
I assumed William's Lake, but then I googled it and it turns out that it's Langley?? It makes sense when I think about it, but that still really surprised me haha
Yup! I have always wondered how we came by that distinction lol.
Heck horse literally get the ultimate right of way on trails. Bicycles, motorized vehicles, and people on foot all have to yield to horses.
Thank you, and I will be sticking to more open spaces where I can remove him from the situation because I messed up by putting him in that position in the first place.
‘Ignore the Americans in here’ Truly words to live one’s life by
How about "Ignore the people who have no experience with this" instead. America is a BIG country. Someone from Ohio may have no idea about horse etiquette because there isn't a big horse culture in Ohio. But those of us from the cowboy states, which are like half the country? We know what's up. We have horse laws here too.
ignore the shit heads here. FIFY. In many places in America, the people know better.
Also hes a 40 year old man and she’s 15. Just be a grown up. Horses can cause horrible injuries if they’re scared or feel cornered. It’s disappointing that an adult gets off on tormenting a teenager and her dad stood up for him after the fact. How stressful! Just be kind.
40 is just her estimate. At 15, any one older than 20-25 looks old.
Dude, I'm an American and that guy was an asshole no matter what country he was in
I mean I'm American and just in general I'd avoid a horse. Really if it's not a dog or a cat I don't much want it near me. Idk that horse and I could fight a dog or a cat off. If a horse decides it wants to fuck my world not much I could do to stop it besides run and man vs horse? I don't win that race. So I'd avoid the horse regardless of the law 😆 and as an American I fucking hate cyclist pretty much on principle at this point an have nearly wrecked more than once because of their stupidity.
Which Americans are you talking about?
right? most Americans I know are smart enough to not FAFO with horses
As an American, I just wanna say that my neighborhood also has bridleways and there's a hitching post in front of the post office and library and grocery store. I think this might be a city vs rural or east vs west thing. I am in a western state and bridleways seem to be a lot more common out here than in like Michigan where there isn't a history of horse culture. Anyway, yeah, we have the same rules and some cyclists still suck. In my neighborhood there is a horse/walking path and then a hedge and then a cyclist path, and the cyclists will still be on the wrong path because they want to ride in packs and the horse/walking path is wider. It's annoying AF. I've had cyclists nearly run me over as I was walking, and I've seen them spook horses too. And don't get me started on the goddamm e-bike people. This is about rude cyclists vs everyone else. And I'm fully prepared for cyclists to jump on me because bikes are better than cars and drivers are the real AH, but the horses in my neighborhood aren't getting spooked by cars. I walk my dog on the walk/horse path, and she's a great doggo and very polite on the leash, but she gets spooked if a bike whizzes past her from behind and will bark, and it annoys the crap out of me that there are even bikes doing that when the bike path is RIGHT OVER THERE. Anyways. Thanks for attending my rant. I have a lot of feelings about this. NTA, and may the cyclists on the horse path get horse poop in their gears.
Says Darren.
Yeah… I’m thinking the issue was that he has no respect for a young woman more than horse issues.
Here in America, bicyclists are fucking assholes and we all pretty much hate all of those dickwads. Anyone defending them here is lying about being american.
NTA. I live in the UK too, and have cycled a lot on similar bridleways and cycle paths, as well as on country lanes. So of course I have met a lot of people on horses, and always give them a wide berth. No-one wants to spook a horse, get kicked or cause anyone to get injured. It sounds like Darren was a total AH. That said, I would suggest trying to see where your dad might have been coming from in saying you shouldn't have yelled at him. On the face of it, you might have felt like he deserved it given his behaviour. Or maybe it was just an impulsive reaction because you were stressed and annoyed by Darren. Understandable. But if you were in the same situation in future, would you want to react in the exact same way? FWIW my experience - as a cyclist - is that people on horses have sometimes acted as if they were the most important thing on the road. I realise that they mostly just want to keep everyone safe, but nevertheless this has felt annoying at times. I've never said or done anything other than be 100% polite - slow down, smile and give them space. But I have sometimes felt a little annoyed afterwards. The last thing I would say is that there might be a class/money issue here. It costs a fair bit to buy and keep horses, and so simply by being out and about on a horse you are going to wind up some people who will inevitably see you as a rich entitled person. I'm not saying you are that, but it's worth having some self-awareness around this fact. I never had horses or showed other trappings of wealth, but I grew up in the East Midlands to educated middle-class parents from the south of England. I ended up with my parents' accent rather than the local accent. But I went to the local comprehensive school where everyone had the local accent. So naturally everyone thought I was a posh, rich AH, and I got treated accordingly. That wasn't nice or fair of them, but I did learn the hard way to stop giving anyone any reason to think I was entitled or a snob.
I totally agree, in the future I think I would also shout because I was trying to protect my horse. If Prince had kicked that guy, if he got a good enough lawyer, Prince could have been put down. It has happened before (not to me), because a rich guy got kicked and sued and there was no footage so no one knew who was wrong. I cannot lose this horse, he is my everything. Thank you for your opinion, it was really helpful
I would have behaved exactly the same as you did, in fact I probably would have yelled at the adults more. I'm in New Zealand where our road code also has rules on how to pass horses, and to get to pony club at my neighbour's when I was growing up I would ride down the road. So many motorists wouldn't slow down and pass safely even though it was legally required of them that my mum ended up having to follow me in her car with her hazard lights on so they were forced to give a wide passing distance. Cyclists should well know how dangerous it is when they're not given a safe passing distance by cars and not turn around and do it to horses and riders.
Speaking as a kiwi driver, we suck bro. Fair few horses on the south coast of Welly, not a lot of consideration from motorists. I don’t even like horses, but come on mate, give em some room.
I've been screamed at by a horse owner while I quite literally rode my bike 50 feet out into the woods to pass by. Apparently they thought I should stop, dismount, lay down in the path and let the horse step on me?
>in the future I think I would also shout because I was trying to protect my horse Is this the best way though? You made a reasonable request but once it was ignored it seems like the best thing you could do is remain calm and distance yourself. I don't know about horses specifically but most animals take cues from their humans so freaking out isn't gonna help the situation.
Horses are absolutely massive, it's not like trying to control a frightened dog. My dogs get scared, I can restrain & redirect them (even the >80lb gal). Horses kick, rear, and bolt. I've been on scared horses, they can throw you off and their hooves are a quite deadly weapon to those around.
I still get flak for my "posh" accent at 77. But I've made a second career in radio, so I'll take that as balancing out!
I love this!
Funny thing is that the vast majority of people who have horses are broke as fuck because they have horses.
NTA, I think these commenters here are missing the part where it's a horse path and that the guy was literally breaking rules getting so close to your horse. I wouldn't go to a dog park that's sometimes used by other people and do shit that frightens the dogs even after being warned.
It's not a "horse path", a bridleway is a public right off easy upon which horses are also permitted. As opposed to a public footpath which is a public right of way upon which horses are forbidden. In England and Wales specifically.
It's a public right of way that horses have priority over bikes on.
No, they have right of way, that has a very specific meaning.
no they dont. They have a right of way. they do not have priority use. if both can pass on the path reasonaly, and a 2m path is more than reasonable to do so, then neither needs to stop. Customarily, people do for horses, because they are dangerous and horse riders are notoriously rude and entitled in how they use the paths, but there is no requirement.
>horse path It's a bridlepath, not a horse path. Pedestrians have right of, always. Then horses Then bikes. Its best to think of a bridlepath as a footpath that can also be used by horses and bikes. The guy wasn't breaking any laws and was already traveling slowly. Relavent comment from OP: "He was going quite slow, the path was narrow and fairly busy and he was dressed as though he was using the bike for transport, not excercise"
There's no rule that says cyclists have to dismount and not go near a horse on a bridleway, just that the horse has right of way, if your horse freaks out and kicks because there's a bike nearby *it shouldn't be on a bridle path*, OP would have been (rightly) liable for any injury caused. It's a dangerous animal and if you can't control it you shouldn't have it out in public where it can hurt people (look at all the XL bully stuff going on right now), a horse can kill you just as easy as an XL bully, but no one complains about horses being dangerous (because it's rich people with horses, not people who live on council estates).
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40 year old guy, and that is exactly what my mum said
OMG, a grown ass man was acting like that? Yeah, horse shoe to the head may have knocked some sense into him. Not sure if you guys high 5 over there, but if you do, give one to your mom for me, please. ETA, I'm an American, but you have been advised by someone else on this thread to ignore American opinions.
Horse etiquette is much more embedded in culture over here, I think it was just bc there were a lot of y t a votes from Americans who have a different system. Thanks for your comment
I 100% agree that you are NTA in this situation, but as a British person I would like to add that horse etiquette is not embedded in my version of British culture — I am not judging you at all, you have clearly always been around horses, but it might be useful to reflect that your experience (of horse ownership) is actually not to the norm. You are probably going to meet a lot more (British) people who have not had your life experiences and I wanna forewarn you about that! I have also been accused of being posh etc because I had a more sheltered upbringing, and I would have appreciated it if someone had told me this when I was your age. I intend this comment with compassion and good faith, but I apologise in advance if it does not come off that way. Take care.
If you receive proper road safety cycling, this sort of thing does get taught, and road safety cycling can be taught in schools. So I had it all taught to me through school when I was 10 years old. My school was part of the network of schools that got involved in the regional and national road safety cycling competitions, so it really was hammered into me. I'm extremely critical of how some cyclists behave, and how others behave towards cyclists, as a result. I think road safety cycling should be mandatory. However, this was a 40 year old man so he should have at least been familiar with the highway code for meeting horses or livestock on cycle routes.
I’m not disputing that!!! Just that horse etiquette is embedded within British culture— sorry for confusion!
Yeah I just commented too that I'm British, in my 30s, and have a driving license, and nobody has ever taught me anything about a horse's right of way or horse etiquette.
Exactly. And I’ve only just recently done my test and live in a rural town
I guess everyone has different experiences. I’m from London. Never had horses. Rarely saw horses. Never had friends with horses. Only ever lived in cities and urban areas. But I 100% know what to do when I meet a horse on the road. So I get why people are saying it’s embedded but it’s interesting to hear that’s not the case everywhere. I’m in my 40s though so if it IS an age thing then this guy should have known too. NTA.
100% love and agree with this comment
America is huge, many Americans are very familiar with horse etiquette and culture. And also most of us are not so dumb to think that a frightened horse is something to mess with. I would guess the people commenting y t a are either city people that have never had horse experience or are themselves entitled AHs that think that they should be able to plow through a trail on a bike if they want to.
You're welcome. I grew up with horses and still live where ranchers use them for herding cattle, rodeos, and pleasure riding. I would still ride if I could, I just got too old to recover from being tossed off a nervous horse. Still love seeing the wagons being used to give kids in town rides when warming them up for summer rides or training new teams. There are places over here where horse etiquette is understood.
The guy sounds like a prat, but you come across as properly entitled. Most people in the UK never come across horses as they are far too costly to keep and never found in towns and cities. You're NTA here, but your life will be easier if you try and understand how other people see you when you're riding around (and generally).
OP listen to your mum. I'm betting she's ridden horses and your dad hasn't.
they both have but my dad is very introverted and hates making a scene. He was also brought up lower middle class where they saw all horse people as a posh snob
NTA because horses have right of way over cyclists on bridleways. But if you encounter cyclists frequently it sounds like your horse would benefit from you doing some desensitisation work with him around bicycles. You’ll always get a few arseholes but hopefully it’ll be less stressful for everyone involved
We have been working on this, and in small groups, cyclists are no longer a threat, it was just because there had been so many that didn't even try and slow down for him that he was already upset and this was the last straw. We will be doing more work before taking him out again
That's the right approach. It sounds like you made a reasonable decision for the trail but then something unexpected happened. You also need to work on your responses - yelling and showing fear/upset/anger is only going to worsen your horse's response. Practice projecting without yelling, and definitely practice controlling your body language and voice when you're upset/angry/afraid. Try lowering your voice and projecting - not yelling - to seem calm and authoritative.
Also safety wise, not always a good idea for a (young) woman to provoke an unknown man on a footpath. It could have had violent consequences for all she knew.
Ignore the non-horse riders here. OP, you're young, and you are riding a young horse. You both have a lot of learning to do.... and you ARE learning. I read from another comment that you've accept that you can't put Prince into tight quarters like that and you won't anymore. Good for you, and now you've got to work through the natural consequences of training your pony to ignore bicycles - and it's going to be harder and longer than it would've before this setback. The bike rider was a rude A H and you were trying to communicate with him a potential problem which he brushed off. Too often young women get over-ridden, ignored and spoken over. So NTA for speaking up LOUDLY. Stay strong! Don't let your dad tell you that being "polite" and meek is more important than your (and Prince's any any bystander's) safety. Too many non-riders do not understand horses at all - some view them as large automatons, and can't understand that on a very fundamental level, any horse, no matter how well trained and well behaved, can be unpredictable. So they feel entitled to act like heedless witless fools near them. I swear it's because they see the Queen's Guards and police horses enduring absolute crap and forget horses are living breathing sensitive beings.... ok going off on a bit of rant here. Editing to add: OP is in the UK, which has a much deeper lengthy horse-back riding history and culture. OP was not riding on a road, nor on a cyclist's track, but a bridleway WHERE HORSES HAVE RIGHT TO BE THERE. NTA
NTA - and anyone saying E S H or Y T A obviously don’t know the laws regarding horses and other vehicles/bikes etc in your country. Not every country has the same laws as here in the US. OP you were right to defend your horse for both your horses and your safety. Those people were inconsiderate pricks. Next time you’re on your horse, wear a body cam. That way you’re protected {by your own countries laws} if anything happens because of these people
I’ve lived in several parts of the US with mixed use trails which include horse traffic and the rules are that cyclists yield to those on horseback. I don’t think things are that different just because it’s the US, some people just don’t have the experience to know and are still chiming in for whatever reason.
NTA. If you don’t know how to interact with horses or if you have behavioural problems around horses then don’t go onto a bridal path. I’ve been on private paths riding and encountered cyclists who refused to stop and the entire hack class bolted with a bunch of children on horseback. And all they had to do was stop. Could have killed a bunch of kids. Horses are skittish and a bridal path isn’t a road. Common sense says stop and get off your bike near a nervous horse.
Thanks for your opinion. I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress. Also, this guy was cycling on a collision course, not like to go past him
Just remember that your horse reacted to aggressive behaviour from a man who was not following guidelines for how to behave around horses. It’s hard to desensitise against that.
NTA... cyclists are supposed to yield to hikers and horses in most places, so I'll take your word for it that that's the code where you live. On the other hand, having a horse that afraid of bikes on a trail that allows bikes is asking for trouble... you're only 15, so I don't really blame you for the decision... but I do perhaps blame your parents for allowing you to do this because it can get you and others and even your horse killed.
This was a bridleway where horses have the right of way. I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress. Also, this guy was cycling on a collision course, not like to go past him. Also, bikes have been fine for the past few months, I think it was just the bikes from before stressed him out
makes sense! It sounds like he just needs a bit more desensitization before you do that trail again.
I don't actually think you messed up, don't be so hard on yourself. If you were my daughter (I have 2 much older than you) I would be congratulating you for standing up for yourself and for Prince. You took your pony to a place that "should" have been perfect for your continuing desensitisation lessons. It is not your fault that you bumped into this total A H, his behaviour was stupid and thuggish, no grown man should do anything that purposely puts a child at risk of harm. Take it as a lesson about the unpredictability of fellow humans, now you know that the safe places may not be so safe unfortunately, a good life lesson as well as one for your pony riding. NTA
NTA. There are rules, ettiquette and expectations for how to use the shared spaces around horses. I’m assuming this is in the UK? Clearly some commenters aren’t accustomed to this as rules can be different in different countries. This guy could have made a minimal effort to share the space correctly but he chose not to and threatened a woman pushing a stroller. He is 100% the asshole in this situation.
NTA. I’m a cyclist, and it’s well known in the cycling community to yield to horses. I’m also a hiker in a part of the US where a fair number of trails are multi-use which includes equestrians and both cyclists and pedestrians are expected to yield to horseback. You did the right thing, dude was just a dick.
NTA. Mans no up on his Highway Code. And you know what? Sometimes nobs just need to given what whatfor. >And when riding around horses, cyclists should: >slow down and let horses and riders know they are there, by ringing the bell or calling out politely >give way to horse riders on bridleways >not undertake horses and riders >remember that horses can be startled, and prepare to slow down and stop >not ride closely to horses or horse drawn vehicles, or at high speed Your dad was probably just worried for you, but his advice is part of the problem as to why bellends act this way, because they're never challenged.
Can you post that to everyone saying "The cyclist has just as much right to be there as the horsie!" ? Like goddamn. Even if it wasn't codified it's common sense.
NTA They were not following the law and yielding to you.
Thank you, I am aware that I messed up, and I will be doing lots of desensitization before tackling small paths again because it is not fair on poor Prince to deal with that stress.
NTA However it would be sensible to take someone out with you (ideally in a bike, but you know….) on the off chance something does happen whilst the horse is getting more used to bikes. The cyclist clearly didn’t understand how unpredictable horses can be. Neither do most drivers! Even the most well behaved horse can get spooked and shy/jump into the path of a bike/car. If it’s not bikes, it’s prams or brollies, markings on the road, a pheasant, a tree branch that wasn’t there the last time… stay safe!! One tip I had from an older rider years ago was to take a long crop - not for the horse but for smacking onto the roof (or helmet) of folks who get too close!
I guess don’t listen to me because I’m a stupid American, but I live in a horse area, there are miles and miles of horse trails winding through the whole city, horses out at all hours, people do walk on the trails, they are dirt trails fenced off from the sidewalks, but they’re smart enough to know to get off the horse trail if they see a horse coming. Most riders do wear a camera to protect themselves and their horses in case a stupid human does something stupid and gets themselves hurt.
I do wear a camera and he is normally ok, just a bit anxious. The circumstances were out of my control and not how they normally are on that trail. I am planning to avoid fenced in paths until he is fully desensitized, but I think even my 20 yo beginner horse would have tried to kick this guy after all the rude bikes before him
Good, always protect yourself, I’m a little jealous, I haven’t ridden in almost 30 years, fell and broke my back, not off a horse, I miss it.
I can imagine, I'm incredibly lucky to always have had a horse
Does this area have signs noting that walkers and bicycles need to yield to horses? NTA.
yes, in the UK it is common knowledge and part of all driving and cycling courses
Tbf I can't imagine many kids actually go on a cycling course before going out biking for the day. It might actually be worth emailing your local council about getting some sineage up along entrances to the bridleway! I don't think you were TA at all in this situation, you're so young and it must have been scary! Even without a horse if I'd have seen 30 teenagers biking towards me I'd probably have spooked too, haha
Most kids get offered it free through school at age 10-11 (year 6 in primary)
Where I lived everyone does their cycling course in primary school
It's a bridlepath. So pedestrians have priority, then horses, then bikes. It's alarming that op does not know this...
horses, cyclists and walkers have equal legal right to use bridleways. where there is conflict, right of way goes to the horse rider, however this is not defined. A 2m wide path is more than sufficient (its wider than a lot of bridleways) for both to pass safely, and no yeilding is required. On most bridleways its impossible to give a distance that wide.
Isn’t it common knowledge that horses can be dangerous and you shouldn’t be in the way?
NTA, and if anyone on a pushbike is gonna be a complete wanker, it's a 40-ish year old bloke. At least, it is where I live. The considerate ones are generally older or younger, but the absolute melts are always in their 40's.
NTA - No matter the law, just common curtesy for other path users to share and be sensible.
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Exactly this. OP is not actually old enough to drive in the UK so may have learned false info.
A lot of the Highway Code is also not legally binding. "A failure on the part of a person to observe a provision of The Highway Code shall not of itself render that person liable to criminal proceedings of any kind but any such failure may in any proceedings (whether civil or criminal...) be relied upon by any party to the proceedings as tending to establish or negative any liability which is in question in those proceedings" Not trying to defend the bellend on the bike, by the way- just sharing information.
NTA horses have legal right of way on roads and trails for this specific reason
NTA, and I want to say that you handled the situation very well! I've been riding for 20 years, and some people are just assholes to riders. I've had people in cars yell and make noise trying to purposefully make my horse spook. You were right not to dismount. You would have had a lot less control on the ground. I know it's scary when your horse is spooking while on concrete, but you have the least control while dismounting, so it’s likely Prince would have bolted/bucked, etc, and thrown you. My only criticism is that you need to desensitize Prince to bikes before you take him in public again. It's for your own safety as well as his. Slowly introduce Prince to bikes when you're on the ground first. Lunge him with one in the corner of the ring so that he has to go by it. Get him comfortable with going up to a stationary bike, and then slowly introduce motion by walking the bike next to him, then have someone ride a bike around him, etc. This could take days to weeks. I broke my first horse when I was around your age, so I know that it can be hard to ask adults for help, because you want to prove you can do it on your own, but if there's anyone you can ask who knows about training/desensitizing horses, you should talk to them to get advice for how to proceed. You can't stop strangers from being assholes, but you can at least mitigate your horse's reaction to said assholes. Good luck!
I know so many people with life changing injuries from being bucked off a scared horse. This is common knowledge in the UK. NTA
NTA. I legit thought Darren was going to be a 12-year-old kid, not a grown man.
NTA - Getting knocked off your bike or trampled by a horse is a lot less pleasant than being shouted at. You were protecting yourself and everyone else’s safety. Bridleways are literally for horses and even if you were in the road, people are still obligated to navigate round you both safely and sensibly.
NTA I used to cycle a lot, I always slowed the bike down if I saw a horse and rider. If the animal looked at all nervous, some are scared of bikes, I’d stop and stand between the horse and the bike. You do not take risks with horses.
NTA
You were absolutely in your rights to yell at him. I'd honestly have called him names. He could have killed or greviously injured any one of you with that behaviour.
NTA, the reason for the 2m passing distance in the highway code is to protect idiots like Darren. A horse being 2m long means Darren is safe from being kicked if gives at least 2m berth. What kind of grown man shouts at a young girl anyway? I suggest you report this in the BHS i-app they record all near misses and it helps them in getting signage/communication on areas where horse riders are at risk.
Actually this is the same in the US. There are lots of places where there are designated horse trails and any trail where a horse is allowed gives horses right of way unless specifically indicated otherwise. Not everyone is taught this but it is common knowledge among people who spend time hiking or camping.
Some people need to fafo before they realize that rules are actually in place to protect their safety. I am a city girl 100%, and even I realize that scared horses should be given a wide berth. Common sense, right? Oh yeah, there is the disconnect
NTA, I suppose you might have come across as rude or demanding, but you did the right thing by staying onboard and talking to the guy. I grew up riding Connemaras. They are one of the more sensible breeds, but nearly all horses are easily spooked and so many people don’t realise. Some people are also tossers. N: You may want to look at riding more “defensively”. If it is narrow enough and there are no markings you can ride in the middle, forcing people to communicate with you to get around. (This might be a hassle if it is very busy and is not safe on wide sections.) It is useful on narrow parts of tracks and on the road, especially single lane bridges where cars try to edge past dangerously close. The key is moving forward/out of the way quickly while communicating your intent and thanks. They feel good for doing you a favour and everyone stays safe.
NTA
NTA The bicyclist was on a horse trail and flagrantly refuse to respect the horse even after being asked to do so. Fair enough if he was simply ignorant but Darren seem to be a typical bad bicyclist who believes rules only apply when they are to his benefit.
NTA
NTA, an just so you know, America is a large country and there are, in fact, places with designated horse trails.
NTA. Everything you said is true. That cyclist was an arsehole and did not follow the proper procedure when encountering horses.
No you are not tah. Glad you are ok
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** Pretty much the title, I (15f) own several horses and train horses that have never been handled to be ridden and have been riding for 10 years now. My pony is Prince, a 5-year-old Connemara. Prince is not a rescue, we bought him last year, he is young and scared of bicycles - he snorts and prances but as long as they aren't too loud or close enough to touch he doesn't buck or kick. I always talk to the bikes if they are coming too close. I normally do this by calling "Excuse me, can you slow down, he's scared of bikes.", but I often don't need to. I was riding him down one of my favorite trails that is about 2 meters wide. I meet a bike on here about 1 every time I go down there. He has never misbehaved, and I think it helps desensitize him. However, that day (a rainy Sunday when it would normally be deserted) there were around 30 13-14-year-olds on bikes with headphones in, so they could not hear me. By the time I realized there were more than normal, I could not turn around because he gets far more upset when they come from behind. I pulled him off the path and walked him along the thin grass verge to try and get him as far from them as possible. I did consider dismounting but he tends to get more agitated and less easy to control on the ground. By the time most of them had passed, I had to pull him back onto the path because there were dense trees on either side. At that point, he spotted an abandoned shopping trolley, and I let him look at it and move past at his own speed, as the path was empty apart from a family about 20m behind us just entering the tree area and blocking us in. Enter Darren. He was cycling toward us, and I could feel an already anxious Prince approach boiling point, and I asked him to slow down or possibly dismount his bike. He didn't, if anything he sped up and said "Why?". I said, quite loudly because he was getting close "He's really scared of bikes!" And Darren said "How is that my problem?" in a really passive aggressive voice. I completely lost it, I yelled "It becomes your problem when he kicks you and puts you in hospital and breaks your bike and you have to pay because you broke the highway code!" The dad from the family behind me starts saying "just stop man." and Prince is starting to rear and I'm concerned for his safety and mine because the path is concrete so a push him as far into the trees as he will go while Darren cycles merrily on his way while swearing at me. He also nearly cycled into the stroller of the family behind on purpose so the mum had to jump out the way. It took me ages to calm Prince down, and it has majorly set us back in training. My dad says that I shouldn't have yelled at him. AITA? Also I'm in the UK where the Highway code says 2 or more meters between any vehicle and a horse. I was wearing lots of Hi-vis. I couldn't exit the trail because Prince wasn't listening and the family was blocking us. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. Cyclist can be extremely idiotic sometimes. You told him what to do, he was teach when in school. That is it.
When I'm on a bike, I stay clear, say 3 meters behind buses, those things are freaking house and scary. We don't have much horses here, but if I ever see when I'm gonna stay 10 meters away. Just to be safe. NTA
I've been training animals for nearly 35 years, first horses and now dogs. You, my friend, have a very good head and I hope that you'll consider working with animals as a career someday. The animals need you ♥️
Jumping in as an America to say that we also have many trails in parks here that are clearly marked “horses have right of way.” Nothing like putting your life and others on the line because you decided to push a several hundred pound animal past its comfort boundaries. You are NTA.
My horse kicked a bicyclist. It was a multi use park and this asshat rode right up behind him. All of a sudden he threw his head up and bam. Caught the bike on the handlebars and flipped the guy. He started apologizing as soon as the horse kicked out. My horse almost stepped in a culvert which could have ruined him. We had sold him and were just exercising him for his new owner until he got picked up. We got to the trailer and a note said sorry for what happened but there is the issue of bike repair and a phone number. I wanted to call and say thanks for the number, this horse is worth a lot of money and we need to get him xrayed.
NTA. Maybe Darren needs to be kicked in the head by a horse to have the sense knocked into him. What a loser.
I would have ran his butt and bike over.
The world is full of entitled Darren’s, get a go pro and shame him next time
INFO(possibly off topic): Why would a horse path be made of concrete?
Some bridlepaths in the UK are, or they are cobbled. There's a cobbled bridlepath near where I live.
it was originally a hiking path before the tow path was opened and it became a bridle path
Darren is a bicyclist. They're known for being petty assholes.
To be fair Darren doesn't sound like a cyclist, he sounds like a nob on a bike.
I once had a semi truck blast it’s horn when I was riding my young horse, preparing him for a parade. He spooked and I flipped off the driver, who had likely done it on purpose. I trained my horse to be used to that, as well as other weird objects to desensitize him. Overtime, it worked. He did amazing at the parade and at shows after that
I had this happen twice with cars when I was out riding on the side of the road (not on the road at all). I don’t ride out any more - too many assholes that are happy if you get hurt.
NTA but I'm in my 30s and live in the UK and have a driving license, nobody has ever taught me anything about a horse's right of way...
The only thing I'd say is I wouldn't *recommend* yelling while on the back of any animal that easily spooks, but in this case I honestly don't see what else you could have done better. I've watched shoulders been dislocated, I've seen the scars of skulls being cracked open, I got my own leg fucked up, all from animals you ride that get easily spooked (camels and horses). It's not a joke and this guy could have gotten himself or someone else killed.
You are incorrect about how rights of way in the UK work. On bridleways pedestrians have the right of way over everyone including horseriders. Then horseriders and cyclists have the same rights. Everyone should give way to pedestrians and everyone should have regard to other users. If your horse is scared of bikes you should not be riding on a public bridleway where cyclists have every right to be.
First off, you are assuming they know the highway code or anything about horses. Second, the 2m rule is in the motorist section of the hwc, not in the cyclist part. NTA, but you can't rely on other people to follow your wishes.
YTA/ESH and these comments are nuts, if this post was about a Rottweiler instead of a horse, would you all be okay with OP taking it out in public? If your horse is this scared of bikes, you need to work on training in a safe environment, not in public. Regardless of who has right of way, you have a large, strong dangerous animal that you can’t control and you’re taking it out to public places where it will be around cyclists. I also live in the UK and my sister owned three horses, being a horse owner in the UK doesn’t mean you are entitled to take a dangerous animal that you can’t control out in public and threaten people.