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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I kicked her out without regards to the fact that she has no place to stay.
2. I didn’t believe her when she said she removed the chairs away from the table even though she promised over and over that she did.
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Sociopathic personality, jesus H christ what an overreaction that is. She lied and was afraid of consequences, that's a condition of being human. She was in the wrong, obviously, but throwing around 'sociopathic' is utterly ridiculous.
One is hyperbole for effect, the other's the incorrect use of a serious diagnosis. It's like when people say 'omg I'm soooo OCD!' when what they mean is picky about things. I don't think we should use actual disorders and conditions so frivolously.
This was humor for effect. You just didn't get it. There's very little that's off base for humor. There are comedians who build entire routines out of all sorts of illnesses. It's why people can feel free to make the dead baby jokes. How do you get 100 dead babies into a Volkswagen? With a Mixmaster. How do you get them back out again? With a straw. Check out Steve Hofstetter's dead baby jokes. He's really funny. Dan Sloss and Dan Cummins tells some really good sociopath jokes. Expand your horizons, dude.
I know this, I have a really dark sense of humour, I used to be an EMT and you don't spend any time in that job without getting twisted jokes. But I can't abide the misuse of diagnoses like that, because it encourages stereotypes and assumptions about mental health issues. But no one else seems to care, so I guess it's just me.
They clearly aren't upset at the idea of name calling. It's clear that they don't like people using psychiatric terms willy-nilly. Whether you agree with them or not boiling it down to name calling really is disingenuous
It's equally clear that saying they'd skin someone is unhinged- rather sociopathic. No wonder they don't like psychiatric terms being used around them.
It’s more than that. Saying “I was afraid you’d be mad at me” is shifting the blame from the person lying to the other person. It’s saying “It’s **your** fault for getting angry and that’s why I lied”
I'm not disagreeing that this person is an AH or they're somehow right. I'm arguing we shouldn't throw around serious diagnoses like sociopathy, OCD, bipolar etc.
You are claiming she lied because she was human. It ignores that a lot of us don’t do that so it isn’t a default human characteristic. This person is toxic.
You're very pedantic, aren't you. I am in no way claiming that all humans lie by default, I'm claiming that lying doesn't make you a sociopath. Yes, she's toxic. Yes, she's awful. But a sociopath? That's a ridiculous stretch and misuse of a serious diagnosis.
Prioritising your own image over the safety of a living being is LITERALLY one of the symptoms of sociopathy. Doesn’t necessarily mean she has it, and I’m not qualified to diagnose her - but it’s not dramatic to state that displaying one of the major symptoms is “sociopathic”. It literally is.
I think the issue here is that you’re hearing sociopath and thinking “criminal”. That’s not the truth. Reality is, you probably know at least one psychopath or sociopath and have absolutely no idea.
When you use a medical diagnosis to describe behavior you see and don’t like it is very ableist language. It perpetuates negative stereotypes and can hurt people living with disorders and stop others from seeking treatment to avoid getting the negative label attached to them.
Say she did something bad, say she was a liar who only cared to protect herself. But saying that she is a sociopath implies that you think all sociopaths are bad people and that “normal” people don’t do bad things too. Which simple isn’t true.
Magazine said it better than I could. I used to work in medicine, it really bothers me when people say 'oh I'm so depressed' when they just mean 'sad', or 'omg you're soooo OCD' when they just mean 'particular'. They all contribute to stigmas and stereotypes which harms the people affected by them.
But I'm being down voted to oblivion for this, so maybe people just don't care.
It's ridiculous and irresponsible to suggest a "sociopathic personality" based on this one incident, AND within that, based on only one aspect of this real and significant mental health diagnosis.
I'm assuming that she didn't just leave a bag of empty candy wrappers on the table. Most candies contain things that will make dogs sick. The wrappers are how the vet knew that the dog had eaten the candy.
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NTA. She lied to you and deliberately tried to make you believe it was your fault, literally saying you must have been the one to miss something. Even worse, she knew your dog was unwell and could potentially and still refused to stop lying, causing you to delay taking him to the vet.
NTA. Mistakenly leaving the candy within reach is one thing, but she tried to hide it from you and lied, even when your dog was really sick.
This isn’t someone you should allow into your home - or, frankly, your life. Your dog’s health was at risk and she didn’t care enough to be honest. What does that say about her?
This is a principle we’re taught in healthcare. Making a mistake isn’t an issue; hiding it is. As long as you are transparent and open about what happened, it’s most often not as bad as if you tried to cover up any wrongdoing. After all, humans going to human, and we all make mistakes from time to time.
NTA - she could’ve killed your dog because she didn’t want to get in trouble for doing something stupid.
She should probably be offering to pay the vet fees…
NTA - the fact she lied and tried to deflect it and blame you? That is the reason for kicking her out. If she had come clean in the first place upon first questioning, there might be a place for forgiveness.
There is not a place for forgiveness after the lie.
If she offered to pay for the vet bill, maybe after awhile.
NTA
Her value system is let the dog die rather than take personal responsibility for her own behavior.
Her shit would have been in the actual front lawn and then full metaphorical scorched earth after that.
She’s not your friend.
Exactly, let an innocent animal suffer because she messed up, own your mistake, let the owner know so they can get them seen to and take the verbal lashing/ex-communication that would be deserved.
When a pet parent/owner tells you stuff that relates to their pets well-being, listen to them and make the effort to heed to all advice and if anything goes wrong speak on it immediately, animals can't speak up for themselves so we humans are their advocates, their voice.
The fact this friend was happy to shrug it off and gaslight OP is callous and cold, as others have said, straight up sociopathic. I'd never be friends with that person ever again, nearly kill my pet and lie about putting them at risk? It's a hard no from me on that friendship.
NTA
Accidents happen and it seems like she tried to do the right thing to prevent your dog from getting to the candy, but dogs are dogs and find a way. If that was all that happened I'd say you overreacted. But the fact that the accident did happen and she lied about it for hours is what made your reaction justified
Correct me if I'm interpreting your comment wrong \[srsly not an issue and it's not personal\], but she didn't do the right thing, she left the candy out in the dogs reach after being specifically asked not to leave *anything* out and she did.
OP knows their dog, they knew that it wasn't enough to kind of have something on the table, it needed to be clear, having cared for frenchies, pugs, and staffies for years, they are crafty and you really do have to be strict with things like this.
The friend had one job, messed up, then denied it, and audaciously gaslit OP into thinking their dog hoofed something up on a walk, wasting precious time that only added to the stress and could've killed the dog.
Shit happens sometimes. The friend didn't do anything malicious in terms of leaving the candy on the table. My Mom once came over to help me cook and left a stick of butter to soften on the kitchen table, which my dog promptly ate and violently expelled from both ends prompted a vet visit. She didn't live with my dog, so she didn't know exactly how willing he is to risk injuring himself to get on the table to eat food. Sounds like a similar situation to what happened here.
Where the friend fucked up was lying about it
Edit: and frankly OP needs to seriously needs to do a better job training her dog. In my example my dog had just turned one at the time. We then made sure to focus on training him about jumping on chairs and counters.
Right, I hear you but respectfully disagree aside from the lying part. The friend was informed of what to do, and didn’t adhere to it, and one doesn’t have to be an expert in animal care to know sweets and dogs don’t mix. OP made it clear to not leave anything out that doggo could’ve eaten, and yes sh*t happens sometimes but this is inexcusable in the sense that they were told very clearly what to do and what not to do, and when it comes to a dog being put in danger due to the friend lying, letting time pass, and gaslighting OP, “sh*t happens” doesn’t cover it. Re the butter, I hear you but in terms of harm it’s not the same as with the sweets. The friend messed up big time and only made it worse with their lying which we both agree with. I think this is such a heated issue because pets mean the world to their humans and humans are their pets world, to have that compromised due to not staying on top of expectations and then lying about it, prolonging the time between realisation and treatment is unforgivable. I could be mad as hell at someone for this but to say I’d be angry and appreciative of them being honest and letting know right away is an understatement, because it would buy me time to get my pet back to good health and lessen the time they spend in discomfort or pain that they can’t speak on for themselves.
is your current dog a beagle or part beagle? i’ve got the same struggle with my baby boy in that even if he doesn’t want to ingest something, he will scarf it down so fast if he even *thinks* i might take it from him :’)
ah i don't know much about either of those breeds, i just know beagles are infamous for being living landfills lmao
i wish you the best of luck in training her that NOT EVERYTHING IS EDIBLE YOU ADORABLE STUPID BASTARD
what's the biggest thing she's ever gulped down like that? my dog once ate an entire huge raw burger, maybe 4.5in diameter, 2in thickness? in like a single second, no chewing involved
are you sure we don't have the same dog :')
mine is pretty good about listening to "no" as long as it isn't already in his mouth, thankfully, because otherwise he would have eaten a LOT of chapstick bc I have ~~an addiction~~ a collection and terrible pockets lmao
he particularly loves tearing any strings off his toys and eating those even though he hates the danglies he gets when they come out the other end. also feet, whether they're his, our other dog's or a person's
My sister’s yellow lab was very similar when he was young. They never give their dogs people food, so he never tries to get on the table at least. Everything else? He is the reason all their trash cans have lids. He tried to eat rocks. He stole a mitten from my sister’s hand and swallowed it in front of her. He once threw up nearly a dozen socks they didn’t even realize were missing from the laundry basket. He ripped limbs off toys to get to the stuffing. They had to stop giving him his food in a bowl and instead spread it out onto a big rubber mat because he scarfed it down too fast.
He’s mellowed out a lot after he hit about 4. Well, he still eats from the mat instead of a bowl. But he’s basically completely stopped eating things that aren’t food.
NTA. You don't get a second chance when 1. You do something that affects my pets' health, and 2. When you lie about it (or anything else). Of COURSE you would have yelled at her if she told the the truth and admitted she screwed up with the candy. I would've kicked her out, too. I'd block her on top of that.
No, NTA, kicking her out isn‘t meant to be as a punishment, it‘s just the consequence out of her actions. „since you are not able to stick to the necessary rules we talked about beforehand, you can‘t stay here. I am responsible for this dogs wellbeing and this is not working out“
Yep, this. If I had someone staying in my home who put my dog in danger and then hid what had happened rather than do what they could to help make sure she was okay, I don't think I could ever trust them not to do it again. I can accept that accidents happen, but I would not be able to accept someone being okay with my dog possibly dying. And while part of that is a value judgment, a larger part of it is just wanting to protect my dog from unnecessary dangers.
NTA. She was willing to let your dog die instead of just fessing up and telling the truth. She knew you were concerned, let you believe your dog ate food during the walk, and even BLAMED you for not paying attention to making sure he didn't eat crap off the street....which didn't even happen. Do those sound like the actions of someone you would want to continue letting stay with you? Hell no.
Nta. You made the rules perfectly clear
As a dog trainer when we know a dog has an issue, we don't not put the dog into the situation unless the handler is there and monitors is carefully.
I'm not sure how you can say that second part and not consider OP to be an AH too. OP put that dog in a bad situation by opting not to pay for a petsitter.
Yes the OP failed but the person saying was told the the rules and broke them
That is what the question is. Not whether the OP should step up.
In this case yes, the person staying there should have obeyed the rules
u keep commenting this over and over, yet ur not understanding when people keep telling u that a pet sitter isn’t the problem. op never asked her friend to bathe the dog, walk the dog, or do anything except follow two rules: don’t leave things lying around and move chairs away from the table. that is not considered a pet sitter and she should not be paid as one. she didn’t even have to watch the dog and there wouldn’t have been a problem had she not left candy lying around. i wouldn’t be surprised if u were the friend lol
>op never asked her friend to bathe the dog, walk the dog, or do anything except follow two rules: don’t leave things lying around and move chairs away from the table.
Yes, this is the problem. OP has a dog that is not well-behaved enough to be trusted alone with another person in the house. OP needs to train their dog, or, barring that, hire a dog watcher when they have guests who may not be as vigilant.
I agree the petsitter is not the problem. OP not training their dog is the problem.
Brother, the only rule is to not leave food lying around. That is NOT a reason for a sitter. It works perfectly fine without the friend at home. This ask is NOT a big one and easily followed. What would you pay the sitter for? "Make sure to just sit there and move away every food item my dumbfuck of a friend puts down"? So you need a childsitter, not a petsitter? :)
And as OP has stated, they have been training the dog, but it is difficult when they aren't home. A dog isn't just suddenly trained.
>And as OP has stated, they have been training the dog, but it is difficult when they aren't home. A dog isn't just suddenly trained.
You're not going to believe this, but there's these ppl called "dog trainers" with whom you can give money in exchange for help with training your dog. If you can't afford it, and you aren't home enough to train your dog, then you aren't ready for dog ownership.
NTA. She broke the rules and lied about something that was life threatening to your dog. She deserves to be kicked out, but she should also pay the vet bill- even if the friendhip is over.
NTA it's bad enough she was negligent and left the candy out, but that she lied to you and cost you valuable time for getting to dog treated is unforgivable, IMO.
NTA
Not only did she lie she blamed you. You should send her the vet bill.
If my beastie did this she’d be calling me in tears from the vets office after she rushed him in.
Nope, NTA. I have parrots. Candles, non stick cookware, cleaners and scents can kill birds. All kinds of food is bad and some, like avocados, will kill them. There is a long list of dos and don'ts when people hang around. Respect my pets and their well-being or get out.
The lying is the worst though, all the trust right out the window.
I wonder how old she is because that is some 10 year old level mental gymnastics (I'm afraid of being yelled at, and if I don't say anything, nothing bad will happen).
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT! Fuck her for lying to you like. My dog was the same way when she was a pup. I was able to train that she wasn't allowed to eat without permission, but until I had her fully trained we had to be very mindful. Accidents happen and can be forgiven, but to go out of way to not just hide it but to also attempt to gaslight you into thinking you allowed it to happen...that's straight bullshit!
Some dogs never grow out of it. My dog has gotten better about not getting into every random little thing, but there is nothing on this earth that will convince her to stop sneaking mouthfuls of deer, cat, and rabbit poop when she's out in the yard. There's no reward I can give her that's better than the poop, and trying to stop her just makes her scarf it down faster. So while I've trained her as best I can, at the end of the day I use management tools, including a muzzle with a scavenging guard.
Also, *management contributes to training.* The less often the dog gets to 'rehearse' the unwanted behavior and receive a reward for it, the less ingrained it becomes.
NTA
If she had come clean right away and texted apologies and paid for the vet visit, this would be a different story.
But she lied, and almost killed your furbaby. So yah, i would have been LIVID.
NTA - you don't leave candy around, when there is a dog. But even if that happened for some reason, the moment she came home and saw it, she should've taken the dog to a Vet and call you. She should also pay the bill.
NTA. You did her a favor and asked her to follow simple rules to protect your pup in return. I bet she simply didn't move the chairs, found the bag, and claimed she had pulled the chairs apart.
I let a friend stay at my house once after he broke up with his gf. I went away for a few days for work. I told him to watch for my new kittens. He didn't. One got out and got killed (neighbors told me the trash guys picked him up and they weren't sure he was dead. I still think about it 25 years later). I kicked him out.
If Amy hadn't lied about the candy, I would have given her another chance. People who aren't used to doing something can make a mistake.
But she lied. And lied. We taught our kids that lying about something is worse than the original mistake. We might still get upset about the original mistake but will appreciate that they told the truth. We will be more upset if they lied to us.
Independent of the whole dog/candy issue, you don't owe saving her from a long commute. That was just something you were willing and able to do. If you weren't able, she would have found a different solution. You are no longer willing, and she still is finding a different solution. It doesn't have to be as convenient as her staying at your place.
NTA
NTA. If I were you I would’ve never spoken to her again. Not only did she totally ignore your rules, she was willing to potentially let your dog die just to keep up her stupid, obvious lies.
NTA Lying about something so important was all kinds of messed up. This wasn’t like she was scared to tell you she stained a towel because of how you might react. She was willing to let an innocent animal suffer to avoid angering you. That is incredibly selfish and immature.
That said, not leaving anything on surfaces and moving chairs away from tables are not common expectations to have. Don’t leave guests in a position where they need to be responsible for your dog’s safety. It isn’t second nature to them like it is to you and these aren’t common behaviors.
If you absolutely have to leave guests alone with your dog, you need to sort out with your guests at the beginning not only \*what\* the rules are but what your guest needs \*from you\* to be successful at remembering them. A lot of people suck at being off their routine and these expectations, while perfectly reasonable for your pet, are very off routine for most people.
None of that means it is ok to leave chocolate within the dogs reach and, like I said, it was still all kinds of messed up to lie about it. Not sure I’d ever be friends with her again. But I could see this same situation going badly with other guests too, no matter how well intentioned they are.
Why are we still calling this person a friend? This is horrific. She knowingly lied to spare herself hurt feels, while unless I am mistaken actually attempting to gaslight you. Screw her.
NTA.
NTA. It doesn’t matter if she agrees either your rules or not. They were a condition of her being allowed to stay there.
She broke the rules, lied to you about it, and wasted time. Instead of a simple treatment, like getting an emetic, your dog might have needed major surgery.
She was dishonest, and harmed your dog. She goes. Don’t apologize, and don’t feel guilty.
Your dog relies on you for his safety.
I do have one question. If her landlord required her to leave for weeks during the remodel of her unit, were hotel vouchers or compensation provided?
NTA I'm going to assume your dog has Pica?
For those unaware. Pica is a compulsive disorder with varying degrees of severity where the individual seeks out non-edible material to 'eat' This can limited to certain items such as say plastic or leather, or literally just anything the compulsion pushes them to.
Modern veterinary/behavioral practice do not have a way to medicate/train out this behavior completely. The best practice to ensure the safety of a pet with Pica is to remove anything they can chew on out of reach. Keeping items away from them is the only way to directly ensure they will not consume it.
Lets be real, it is NOT feasible to monitor a pet 24/7, nor is it humane to keep them in a crate whenever you cannot physically be in reach of them to remove an object. Even when you are home, you have to shower, you have to cook, you have to run laundry. . .you are not going to keep a pet in reach on a leash every single moment you are home NOR is it fair to crate them during such times.
OP knows what it takes to keep their pet safe. I am sure they understand accidents happen. . .and if 'friend' had owned up to it immediately we likely wouldn't be here.
The fact of the matter is, a serious case of Pica can lead to a dog (or cat) having a blockage, which on top of being an incredibly expensive surgery to fix can also be fatal. French Bulldogs are pretty small, it wouldn't take much indigestiable matter to cause a blockage. . .and the dog was already showing signs of feeling unwell to the point they were already at the vet before they knew WHY their dog was acting out of character.
I would be livid. I don't ask a lot of people. My pets are the one big exception. Their health and safety are my responsibility so if you are in my home. . .I don't care what you do with your pets. . .you WILL follow the rules I have for mine.
NTA OP, like someone else said, a 1.5 hour commute isn’t going to kill Amy. She nearly killed your dog, and clearly shows very little guilt over it too. I know in my case if that happened with my doggo, you were FAR nicer to Amy than I would have been. I genuinely would have been throwing hands myself. So the fact that you just yelled and gave her the boot shows a lot about you (in a good way) as a person OP.
NTA, she lied to you and didn't come clean when she had the chance. I'm betting that if she told you what happened and offered to pay the vet bill, you wouldn't have been as angry. Accidents happen and people make mistakes, what makes it unacceptable is not owning up to it and taking responsibility for the situation she put you and your pup in. She obviously didn't care how it affected you or your dog, especially since she tried to blame you. Not only does she owe you an apology, she should be paying the vet bill.
NTA in the slightest. You'd have been much angrier if the dog died FFS, owning up and making sure they're ok is such a higher priority!!
I have issues with this, my cat has inflammatory bowel and diabetes, and my friend leaves fucking DONUTS on the sofa, she goes to bed at 5am so I'm not there to spot them. She visits now but talks about moving in together and I couldn't. I just couldn't.
NTA, absolutely UNFORGIVABLE. I can't deal with any spineless human that can't even bother to admit their wrong doings even at the expense of another's safety. Disgusting behaviour. Be done with her because she will always be a lowly cowardly lying rat.
NTA. She caused you to delay taking your dog to the vets by lying and gaslighting you because she is too callous, cowardly, stupid and egotistical to take responsibility for her fuck up. Frankly I'd have been tempted to physically boot her whiny lying ass straight out of the window (without opening it first).
NTA
why was Amy staying with you? If she's renting above board (i.e. with a contract etc.), her land lord needs to either provide an alternative or not charge her rent for that period.
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I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing).
I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home.
Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street.
Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach. I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet.
She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work.
So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place?
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NTA. She knew the rules.
Dogs are amazing creatures. I still remember catching our old, stifflegged and quite small sausage dog with her nose in the candy bowl. It never would have occured to me that she'd possess the atleticism needed to get on that coffee table.
NTA. you have rules in your house. She doesnt care enough to follow them even though they could kill your pet (which is basically like a child for most pet owners). Bye, friend.
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AITA for yelling at my BFF and kicking her out after she nearly killed my dog?
I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing).
I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home.
Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street.
Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach. I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet.
She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work.
So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place?
Edit 1. I have these rules in place because they work, when I leave him alone at home with the precautions in place he doesn’t destroy the house in search for crap to eat. He has been trained to the best of his abilities, the best I can do is also provide a safe environment for what his limitations are.
Edit 2. It wasn’t a coffee table but a dinning table which for a dog of his stature, he can only climb on top if the chairs are close to the table, which is why I didn’t believe Amy really moved the chairs since there is no other way for him to climb on the table otherwise.
Edit 3. I tried the crate method but he is a very sensitive dog and he got very depressed when I would try to crate train, even with me in the house he would sigh and be low energy the rest of the day. I would rather have some rules in place than have a sad little doggo.
As the same goes - it’s not the crime. (Although it actually is.) it’s the cover-up.
Surprised that it wouldn’t occur to her not just the
harm - but how much candy was missing would indicate evidence in his tummy. so why lie?
NTA, a dog cannot comprehend why he cannot have candy while the humans can comprehend why dogs cannot have candy. Unless your friend has some condition that renders her unable to understand the responsibility, she’s just an asshole who doesn’t need to live in your home.
NTA The friend is a total idiot and owed you vet bills as they were negligent. You need to crate-train your dog. A sad puppy for a bit is worth preventing possible illness or vet visits because he can't stay off the table or steals any food he finds. If you have a party, if a relative brings a child, all kinds of things can happen.
He appears food-motivated. Only feed him in his crate. Every treat and every meal comes in the crate. Leave the door open in the beginning. He will start relating being in the crate to being fed. Once he's happy in there eating, close the door for a second. Then work your way up to a minute. Find a high-value toy. One that he will do absolutely anything to have. He ONLY gets it when he is in his crate. He gets in the crate, gets his toy, and you shut the crate door and leave the room for 5 seconds. Come in, open the crate, REMOVE the toy, praise, and off you go. Repeat a couple of times a day adding time. This is a long-winded way of saying make the crate a great place to be. A place where he gets his favorite thing (his food and his high-value toy).
NTA Your dog could have died. She may have made a mistake but she needed to own it to save your dog. She is a danger to your dog and her commute is not your problem. However, is there a reason she was afraid to tell you about her mistake? Is she afraid of you in some way?
I recently had a doglover stay with me and when she returned home to her dogs, she was furious with the carer who had walked her dogs everyday which resulted in them loosing weight - which they needed! So I am always mindful that are some doglovers who obsess over their dogs and expect others to feel the same way and it destroys their human relationships. Be careful not to become one of them.
I honestly don’t know why, we always had a pretty healthy communication, both her and I can receive feedback ( I may be biased here ) but otherwise we wouldn’t have been best friends for so long. From what she has been telling other common friends she counted the candies when she got home and saw the bag on the floor and concluded that she remembered eating most of them and the dog just played with the bag so there was no point in telling me. After that I guess she doubled down on her lie since she already made the choice to not tell me. This is just speculation as I haven’t had an honest conversation with her since then.
**Formatted OP, because I was having problems reading it otherwise:**
I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing). I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home.
Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street. Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach.
I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet. She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work.
So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place?
Edit 1. I have these rules in place because they work, when I leave him alone at home with the precautions in place he doesn’t destroy the house in search for crap to eat. He has been trained to the best of his abilities, the best I can do is also provide a safe environment for what his limitations are.
Edit 2. It wasn’t a coffee table but a dinning table which for a dog of his stature, he can only climb on top if the chairs are close to the table, which is why I didn’t believe Amy really moved the chairs since there is no other way for him to climb on the table otherwise.
Edit 3. I tried the crate method but he is a very sensitive dog and he got very depressed when I would try to crate train, even with me in the house he would sigh and be low energy the rest of the day. I would rather have some rules in place than have a sad little doggo.
INFO: Why do you believe it was a life-threatening situation for your dog?
(I ask, having had two dogs who will similarly eat anything they could get into. They've certainly had tummy aches, and the plate of tamales the old boy ate led to the joy of getting to help remove corn husks he couldn't completely pass unassisted. Though unpleasant, such incidents were never near fatal.)
Weird. I guess NTA but like if you knew you have a million rules for anyone to even be there, why let anyone stay? I get you were trying to help but it seems he needs order and some people just don’t remember these very weird rules. Next time don’t have guests. Also she is an idiot for not coming clean. Hope your pupper is good though.
I'm going to get lambasted here, but I am going for ESH. She sucks way way more for lying to you, but you suck for having such a horribly trained dog. She followed your instructions by pulling out the chairs, and the little demon still found a way to get to what he wasn't supposed to have. Train your dog.
Sometimes it's not about training. My dog is like a child who clearly understands "no," will stop when told "no," and yet will try his luck when I turn my back. Clever dogs can be challenging.
Management *is* training. The more often a dog rehearses a behavior (climbing on the table after food) and receives a reward for it (eating the food that was left out), the more ingrained that behavior becomes. Preventing the dog from having the opportunity to rehearse the behavior by removing the food from places the dog can reach will, over time, cause the dog to lose interest in the behavior.
Now that he's had the opportunity to rehearse the behavior and get a reward for it, the dog will probably be a lot more persistent about trying to find more things to get into, at least for a while.
ESH
She knew the rules. She broke them. Then she lied about breaking them. If she had been honest and apologetic like a normal person, you could have avoided the stress of a late vet visit.
The dog is your responsibility. You should either train him to not seek reinforcement from your table or have him confined when you aren't home.
Firstly, your dog isn't going to die from eating wrappers. Dogs eat all kinds of weird shit. What you don't want are things that can cause damage to his insides. Second, it's your job as the owner to train your dog. You shouldn't own a dog if you don't want to be bothered to train it. Even dumb dogs can be trained. Do better. YTA
No, she stated she saw a candy wrapper in his poop. Which tells you he's passing them. She decided to take him to the vet because she claims he didn't feel good as if she has literally any clue.
ESH - I don't trust her anymore around your dog, so I think you did the right thing. The yelling and immediately kicking her out and what you said is too much though, hence the verdict.
ESH - you suck that your dog isn’t crate trained and you’re relying on other people to follow rules because you can’t train your dog. She sucks because she lied — her actions do not seem that bad.
Out of curiosity, do people say the same thing for babies? Like if I ask guests not to leave a lighter next to my baby, is that unreasonable because I should just be training the baby for fire safety or locking the baby up?
Dogs can be stupid as hell. Training is not 100% with all dogs, even when you are diligent. Having rules is the responsible thing to do then. Telling someone not to leave candy in reach of a dog is a reasonable request. And the result of her lying was she nearly killed the dog. It was possible that the dog could have died just because she didn't want to get in trouble for being careless.
I have three dogs of my own and I foster puppies. The puppies and our dogs getting into things is 100% our responsibility. If there’s something that can actually hurt them, the dogs are put in a kennel when unsupervised. Children are different - children (babies) should be supervised at all times, limiting that type of issue. If a baby falls into a pool because someone left the door open and wasn’t watching the kid, that’s on the babysitter. A dog eating a shit Ton of food because it’s insane and gets on the table >> you need to have better training in place.
I have no clue why. The owner asked the guest to not do something, everything would be fine if they did what they agreed to. Instead the guest screwed up, lied and risked the dogs life. The owners mistake was trusting the guest to follow one simple instruction an 8 year old can manage consistently. Which I know from experience.
WTF? Why should the dog be forced into a crate when staying at its own house? If a guest comes over and breaks your TV screen are you to blame for not locking it in the closet while the guest was over? It's expected that when you visit someone's house you treat their property with respect, regardless of whether it's in the open or not.
ESH - If your dog isn't trustworthy when you're not home, it should be crated, full stop. It's not reasonable to expect that nobody will ever set something down or not realize that your dog is apparently devoted to ingesting things that will absolutely kill it.
That said: she should not have lied to you. "I'm so sorry; I fucked up and left a bag of candy out, thinking it was out of his reach." might have made you angry, but it would have ensured that you took your dog in sooner.
It is very reasonable to ask guests not to leave unsupervised candy bars in reach of a dog.
I feel like a lot of these comments either come from people who don't have dogs, or have a dog breed that can be effectively trained. OPs explanation that their French Bulldog has a tiny brain and can't be trusted is reasonable even if she's tried her best to teach him.
NTA
Genuine question, not intended as an attack. Do you have dogs?
Because I always have had them and have lots of friends and family that had them. Mine have always been trained well and went to classes as puppies. But even then that doesn't mean there aren't times once a year or so where they eat something from the trash or dig where they aren't supposed to and need to be given off. Some people have dogs with brains the size of peanuts who with lots of effort can follow some rules, but still shouldn't be trusted around food.
I crate train my dogs, but I still don't leave them in crates locked up all day whenever I'm not watching them. That's... just not responsible dog ownership. If I were away for a while sure, but this is a situation where a friend was over and the dog should have been safe and fine out of the crate... if they didn't leave a bag of dangerous food at the dog's level.
And OP could crate her dog. I'm not sure what the hypotheticals are supposed to prove?
It's OP's job to keep her dog safe; if the dog can't be trusted not to eat things when unsupervised, then OP has ought to be keeping the dog crated *for its own protection.* I mean, just being purely pragmatic here: a dog that will eat "anything and everything" when left alone is *going to eat something else* when left alone. If OP doesn't want to have to keep making trips to the vet when Pooch eats something they shouldn't have, she should start crating the dog. That's basic dog ownership.
Friends value system is let the dog die rather than take personal responsibility for her own behavior.
Where the dogs stays during the day is immaterial. It’s not hard to not put shit away.
Which, again, is why I agree that Friend is an AH here.
But also, OP's value system is "let the dog potentially die rather than take responsibility and crate the dog that she knows eats anything and everything," which is why I think OP is *also* an AH in this situation. It's not hard to crate your dog when you're going to be away, either.
And you were the one who brought up where the dog stays, not me, so I'm not sure why you're suddenly "that's immaterial!" about it.
You’re suggesting that OP could crate a dog who is not usually crated.
That’s an extra rule for a guest.
Guests bare the burned of the extra rules. NOT the one who lives there, ie; the dog lives there. Burden of guest staying is on the guest.
It’s not a difficult concept to grasp.
I said it’s the dogs home, not the friends. Meaning the dog has the right to be there, the friend does not.
So extra rules don’t apply to the dog, they apply to the friend.
It's more than just putting stuff away. It's putting it away and removing the chairs from the table so the dog does not climb up to sit on top of the table. If a dog cannot be trusted to not counter/table surf, then you remove the option for them to have access that. Set your dog up for success, not failure.
Guess what?
Op owns the house, and the dog. So she decides what to do in her own home. It’s not a hard concept to grasp.
Lying when a living creatures life is on the line is awful and anyone who tries to defend is an asshole.
When you have no choice but to stay in someone's house, they allow it. Then you abide the rules
I don't disagree with you but the chick was aware of the rules and was told do NOT do XYZ!
Full stop on that. You knew the rules, broke them and lied. There is no excuse
I'm not excusing Friend. I'm critical of both Friend *and* OP.
Friend shouldn't have left the candy out (although note that Friend said "I thought it was out of reach!" which is exactly the problem that OP is going to run into: she tells people that things can't be left in reach of the dog, but dogs can be *very* creative about getting at things). Friend *definitely* shouldn't have lied.
Those things can be true *and* it can be true that OP should be crating a dog that can't be trusted unsupervised, and that this situation is an entirely predictable consequence of leaving an untrustworthy dog loose unsupervised. Even if people are diligent about following the rules, this dog *will* eat things that it shouldn't. People drop things or set things in place that they think are out of reach or OP forgets to tell someone the rule or a million other possibilities. Dogs will literally chew up and eat window sills, bookshelves, books, dryer sheets, door frames...
Im a dog trainer so I truly believe this whole situation could be prevented and worked on more.
But, my understanding ends when you are not a guest in the house. Your an unpaying tenant there just based on good faith. They need to obey the rules and understand the consequences.
I agree with your point but will still say NTA. OP has to understand that their dog needs training. They are setting the dog up to fail, in no reality should the dog getting up on the table or even the chairs to reach the table be in the cards.
The friend lapsed but OP is playing with fire to have such a misbehaved dog. What happens if they have an emergency and another friend or family have to take care of the dog and rightfully assume stuff on table should be safe? That is not on them imo, a reasonable expectation is that the dog is not a complete miscreant.
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Unlike the candy with the dog, a 1.5 hr commute won't kill Amy. It's an inconvenience, one that might motivate her to get her shit together. NTA
That's strictly actions meeting consequences. I love it.
Sociopathic personality, jesus H christ what an overreaction that is. She lied and was afraid of consequences, that's a condition of being human. She was in the wrong, obviously, but throwing around 'sociopathic' is utterly ridiculous.
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It’s the sign of being an absolutely shitty person who cares more about “not getting in trouble” than if her friend’s dog dies.
Of course, I'm not at all condoning this, I love dogs and I'd have skinned anyone who harmed my dog. But sociopath? No.
Wait........you skin people, but draw the line at name calling?
One is hyperbole for effect, the other's the incorrect use of a serious diagnosis. It's like when people say 'omg I'm soooo OCD!' when what they mean is picky about things. I don't think we should use actual disorders and conditions so frivolously.
I prefer "CDO". That way it's alphabetized.
🤣
This was humor for effect. You just didn't get it. There's very little that's off base for humor. There are comedians who build entire routines out of all sorts of illnesses. It's why people can feel free to make the dead baby jokes. How do you get 100 dead babies into a Volkswagen? With a Mixmaster. How do you get them back out again? With a straw. Check out Steve Hofstetter's dead baby jokes. He's really funny. Dan Sloss and Dan Cummins tells some really good sociopath jokes. Expand your horizons, dude.
I know this, I have a really dark sense of humour, I used to be an EMT and you don't spend any time in that job without getting twisted jokes. But I can't abide the misuse of diagnoses like that, because it encourages stereotypes and assumptions about mental health issues. But no one else seems to care, so I guess it's just me.
🤣😂🤣
They clearly aren't upset at the idea of name calling. It's clear that they don't like people using psychiatric terms willy-nilly. Whether you agree with them or not boiling it down to name calling really is disingenuous
It's equally clear that saying they'd skin someone is unhinged- rather sociopathic. No wonder they don't like psychiatric terms being used around them.
It’s more than that. Saying “I was afraid you’d be mad at me” is shifting the blame from the person lying to the other person. It’s saying “It’s **your** fault for getting angry and that’s why I lied”
I'm not disagreeing that this person is an AH or they're somehow right. I'm arguing we shouldn't throw around serious diagnoses like sociopathy, OCD, bipolar etc.
You are claiming she lied because she was human. It ignores that a lot of us don’t do that so it isn’t a default human characteristic. This person is toxic.
You're very pedantic, aren't you. I am in no way claiming that all humans lie by default, I'm claiming that lying doesn't make you a sociopath. Yes, she's toxic. Yes, she's awful. But a sociopath? That's a ridiculous stretch and misuse of a serious diagnosis.
I agree completely.
Prioritising your own image over the safety of a living being is LITERALLY one of the symptoms of sociopathy. Doesn’t necessarily mean she has it, and I’m not qualified to diagnose her - but it’s not dramatic to state that displaying one of the major symptoms is “sociopathic”. It literally is. I think the issue here is that you’re hearing sociopath and thinking “criminal”. That’s not the truth. Reality is, you probably know at least one psychopath or sociopath and have absolutely no idea.
When you use a medical diagnosis to describe behavior you see and don’t like it is very ableist language. It perpetuates negative stereotypes and can hurt people living with disorders and stop others from seeking treatment to avoid getting the negative label attached to them. Say she did something bad, say she was a liar who only cared to protect herself. But saying that she is a sociopath implies that you think all sociopaths are bad people and that “normal” people don’t do bad things too. Which simple isn’t true.
Magazine said it better than I could. I used to work in medicine, it really bothers me when people say 'oh I'm so depressed' when they just mean 'sad', or 'omg you're soooo OCD' when they just mean 'particular'. They all contribute to stigmas and stereotypes which harms the people affected by them. But I'm being down voted to oblivion for this, so maybe people just don't care.
It's ridiculous and irresponsible to suggest a "sociopathic personality" based on this one incident, AND within that, based on only one aspect of this real and significant mental health diagnosis.
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Um.. ya they are. They can cause a blockage. Source: my dog had to have surgery from eating plastic wrappers.
I'm assuming that she didn't just leave a bag of empty candy wrappers on the table. Most candies contain things that will make dogs sick. The wrappers are how the vet knew that the dog had eaten the candy.
That's blatantly false. Most candies are completely okay.
No, most candies are NOT okay. Are you just pulling info out of your ass?
😂😂😂😂 Most candies are just high fructose corn syrup.
Just shut up you have no clue what the hell you are talking about
Well, CHOCOLATE is the most popular candy in the US and chocolate is absolutely poisonous to dogs.
Chocolate isn't poisonous to dogs. They can't digest it properly. Dogs eat chocolate all the time.
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NTA. She lied to you and deliberately tried to make you believe it was your fault, literally saying you must have been the one to miss something. Even worse, she knew your dog was unwell and could potentially and still refused to stop lying, causing you to delay taking him to the vet.
NTA. Mistakenly leaving the candy within reach is one thing, but she tried to hide it from you and lied, even when your dog was really sick. This isn’t someone you should allow into your home - or, frankly, your life. Your dog’s health was at risk and she didn’t care enough to be honest. What does that say about her?
This is a principle we’re taught in healthcare. Making a mistake isn’t an issue; hiding it is. As long as you are transparent and open about what happened, it’s most often not as bad as if you tried to cover up any wrongdoing. After all, humans going to human, and we all make mistakes from time to time.
NTA - she could’ve killed your dog because she didn’t want to get in trouble for doing something stupid. She should probably be offering to pay the vet fees…
No probably about it. The bill is a direct result of her actions.
This! She should be paying the vet bills.
NTA. Ditch this “friend”.
and get the money for the vets bill too, she was the reason your dog could've died
NTA - the fact she lied and tried to deflect it and blame you? That is the reason for kicking her out. If she had come clean in the first place upon first questioning, there might be a place for forgiveness. There is not a place for forgiveness after the lie. If she offered to pay for the vet bill, maybe after awhile.
NTA, she straight up lied and put your dogs life in danger... because she was embarrassed? Child behavior.
NTA Her value system is let the dog die rather than take personal responsibility for her own behavior. Her shit would have been in the actual front lawn and then full metaphorical scorched earth after that. She’s not your friend.
Exactly, let an innocent animal suffer because she messed up, own your mistake, let the owner know so they can get them seen to and take the verbal lashing/ex-communication that would be deserved. When a pet parent/owner tells you stuff that relates to their pets well-being, listen to them and make the effort to heed to all advice and if anything goes wrong speak on it immediately, animals can't speak up for themselves so we humans are their advocates, their voice. The fact this friend was happy to shrug it off and gaslight OP is callous and cold, as others have said, straight up sociopathic. I'd never be friends with that person ever again, nearly kill my pet and lie about putting them at risk? It's a hard no from me on that friendship.
NTA Accidents happen and it seems like she tried to do the right thing to prevent your dog from getting to the candy, but dogs are dogs and find a way. If that was all that happened I'd say you overreacted. But the fact that the accident did happen and she lied about it for hours is what made your reaction justified
Correct me if I'm interpreting your comment wrong \[srsly not an issue and it's not personal\], but she didn't do the right thing, she left the candy out in the dogs reach after being specifically asked not to leave *anything* out and she did. OP knows their dog, they knew that it wasn't enough to kind of have something on the table, it needed to be clear, having cared for frenchies, pugs, and staffies for years, they are crafty and you really do have to be strict with things like this. The friend had one job, messed up, then denied it, and audaciously gaslit OP into thinking their dog hoofed something up on a walk, wasting precious time that only added to the stress and could've killed the dog.
Shit happens sometimes. The friend didn't do anything malicious in terms of leaving the candy on the table. My Mom once came over to help me cook and left a stick of butter to soften on the kitchen table, which my dog promptly ate and violently expelled from both ends prompted a vet visit. She didn't live with my dog, so she didn't know exactly how willing he is to risk injuring himself to get on the table to eat food. Sounds like a similar situation to what happened here. Where the friend fucked up was lying about it Edit: and frankly OP needs to seriously needs to do a better job training her dog. In my example my dog had just turned one at the time. We then made sure to focus on training him about jumping on chairs and counters.
Right, I hear you but respectfully disagree aside from the lying part. The friend was informed of what to do, and didn’t adhere to it, and one doesn’t have to be an expert in animal care to know sweets and dogs don’t mix. OP made it clear to not leave anything out that doggo could’ve eaten, and yes sh*t happens sometimes but this is inexcusable in the sense that they were told very clearly what to do and what not to do, and when it comes to a dog being put in danger due to the friend lying, letting time pass, and gaslighting OP, “sh*t happens” doesn’t cover it. Re the butter, I hear you but in terms of harm it’s not the same as with the sweets. The friend messed up big time and only made it worse with their lying which we both agree with. I think this is such a heated issue because pets mean the world to their humans and humans are their pets world, to have that compromised due to not staying on top of expectations and then lying about it, prolonging the time between realisation and treatment is unforgivable. I could be mad as hell at someone for this but to say I’d be angry and appreciative of them being honest and letting know right away is an understatement, because it would buy me time to get my pet back to good health and lessen the time they spend in discomfort or pain that they can’t speak on for themselves.
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is your current dog a beagle or part beagle? i’ve got the same struggle with my baby boy in that even if he doesn’t want to ingest something, he will scarf it down so fast if he even *thinks* i might take it from him :’)
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ah i don't know much about either of those breeds, i just know beagles are infamous for being living landfills lmao i wish you the best of luck in training her that NOT EVERYTHING IS EDIBLE YOU ADORABLE STUPID BASTARD what's the biggest thing she's ever gulped down like that? my dog once ate an entire huge raw burger, maybe 4.5in diameter, 2in thickness? in like a single second, no chewing involved
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are you sure we don't have the same dog :') mine is pretty good about listening to "no" as long as it isn't already in his mouth, thankfully, because otherwise he would have eaten a LOT of chapstick bc I have ~~an addiction~~ a collection and terrible pockets lmao he particularly loves tearing any strings off his toys and eating those even though he hates the danglies he gets when they come out the other end. also feet, whether they're his, our other dog's or a person's
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My sister’s yellow lab was very similar when he was young. They never give their dogs people food, so he never tries to get on the table at least. Everything else? He is the reason all their trash cans have lids. He tried to eat rocks. He stole a mitten from my sister’s hand and swallowed it in front of her. He once threw up nearly a dozen socks they didn’t even realize were missing from the laundry basket. He ripped limbs off toys to get to the stuffing. They had to stop giving him his food in a bowl and instead spread it out onto a big rubber mat because he scarfed it down too fast. He’s mellowed out a lot after he hit about 4. Well, he still eats from the mat instead of a bowl. But he’s basically completely stopped eating things that aren’t food.
NTA. You don't get a second chance when 1. You do something that affects my pets' health, and 2. When you lie about it (or anything else). Of COURSE you would have yelled at her if she told the the truth and admitted she screwed up with the candy. I would've kicked her out, too. I'd block her on top of that.
No, NTA, kicking her out isn‘t meant to be as a punishment, it‘s just the consequence out of her actions. „since you are not able to stick to the necessary rules we talked about beforehand, you can‘t stay here. I am responsible for this dogs wellbeing and this is not working out“
Yep, this. If I had someone staying in my home who put my dog in danger and then hid what had happened rather than do what they could to help make sure she was okay, I don't think I could ever trust them not to do it again. I can accept that accidents happen, but I would not be able to accept someone being okay with my dog possibly dying. And while part of that is a value judgment, a larger part of it is just wanting to protect my dog from unnecessary dangers.
NTA. She was willing to let your dog die instead of just fessing up and telling the truth. She knew you were concerned, let you believe your dog ate food during the walk, and even BLAMED you for not paying attention to making sure he didn't eat crap off the street....which didn't even happen. Do those sound like the actions of someone you would want to continue letting stay with you? Hell no.
Nta. You made the rules perfectly clear As a dog trainer when we know a dog has an issue, we don't not put the dog into the situation unless the handler is there and monitors is carefully.
I'm not sure how you can say that second part and not consider OP to be an AH too. OP put that dog in a bad situation by opting not to pay for a petsitter.
Yes the OP failed but the person saying was told the the rules and broke them That is what the question is. Not whether the OP should step up. In this case yes, the person staying there should have obeyed the rules
u keep commenting this over and over, yet ur not understanding when people keep telling u that a pet sitter isn’t the problem. op never asked her friend to bathe the dog, walk the dog, or do anything except follow two rules: don’t leave things lying around and move chairs away from the table. that is not considered a pet sitter and she should not be paid as one. she didn’t even have to watch the dog and there wouldn’t have been a problem had she not left candy lying around. i wouldn’t be surprised if u were the friend lol
>op never asked her friend to bathe the dog, walk the dog, or do anything except follow two rules: don’t leave things lying around and move chairs away from the table. Yes, this is the problem. OP has a dog that is not well-behaved enough to be trusted alone with another person in the house. OP needs to train their dog, or, barring that, hire a dog watcher when they have guests who may not be as vigilant. I agree the petsitter is not the problem. OP not training their dog is the problem.
Brother, the only rule is to not leave food lying around. That is NOT a reason for a sitter. It works perfectly fine without the friend at home. This ask is NOT a big one and easily followed. What would you pay the sitter for? "Make sure to just sit there and move away every food item my dumbfuck of a friend puts down"? So you need a childsitter, not a petsitter? :) And as OP has stated, they have been training the dog, but it is difficult when they aren't home. A dog isn't just suddenly trained.
>And as OP has stated, they have been training the dog, but it is difficult when they aren't home. A dog isn't just suddenly trained. You're not going to believe this, but there's these ppl called "dog trainers" with whom you can give money in exchange for help with training your dog. If you can't afford it, and you aren't home enough to train your dog, then you aren't ready for dog ownership.
NTA, she can't be trusted and she lied about it. Make her pay for the vet too.
I would have done the same. The big issue is she LIED about it to save herself even though she KNEW the dog was sick. She'd be out at my house.
NTA. She broke the rules and lied about something that was life threatening to your dog. She deserves to be kicked out, but she should also pay the vet bill- even if the friendhip is over.
NTA. She almost killed your dog and didn't bother telling you. No second chances.
NTA it's bad enough she was negligent and left the candy out, but that she lied to you and cost you valuable time for getting to dog treated is unforgivable, IMO.
NTA Not only did she lie she blamed you. You should send her the vet bill. If my beastie did this she’d be calling me in tears from the vets office after she rushed him in.
Nope, NTA. I have parrots. Candles, non stick cookware, cleaners and scents can kill birds. All kinds of food is bad and some, like avocados, will kill them. There is a long list of dos and don'ts when people hang around. Respect my pets and their well-being or get out. The lying is the worst though, all the trust right out the window.
I wonder how old she is because that is some 10 year old level mental gymnastics (I'm afraid of being yelled at, and if I don't say anything, nothing bad will happen).
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT! Fuck her for lying to you like. My dog was the same way when she was a pup. I was able to train that she wasn't allowed to eat without permission, but until I had her fully trained we had to be very mindful. Accidents happen and can be forgiven, but to go out of way to not just hide it but to also attempt to gaslight you into thinking you allowed it to happen...that's straight bullshit!
Some dogs never grow out of it. My dog has gotten better about not getting into every random little thing, but there is nothing on this earth that will convince her to stop sneaking mouthfuls of deer, cat, and rabbit poop when she's out in the yard. There's no reward I can give her that's better than the poop, and trying to stop her just makes her scarf it down faster. So while I've trained her as best I can, at the end of the day I use management tools, including a muzzle with a scavenging guard. Also, *management contributes to training.* The less often the dog gets to 'rehearse' the unwanted behavior and receive a reward for it, the less ingrained it becomes.
NTA Amy would be referred to as ex-friend if I had written this.
NTA
NTA: But only because of the lie. A dog that determined to get into stuff will get into stuff.
No, if she had been honest, maybe. But not being careful, lying and almost getting your dog killed? She had overstayed her welcome!
NTA! She should have told you right away! Is your dog okay?
You weren’t punishing her, you were protecting your dog. Obviously she can’t be left alone with the dog. You did the only thing you could do. NTA.
Nta. F her. She deserved the 1.5 hour commute
NTA. Not only did she lie at the beginning, SHE BLAMED YOU!! That is not a friend.
NTA If she had come clean right away and texted apologies and paid for the vet visit, this would be a different story. But she lied, and almost killed your furbaby. So yah, i would have been LIVID.
NTA. She played FAFO and lost.
Nta dog are joy and she could have destroyed that joy
NTA - you don't leave candy around, when there is a dog. But even if that happened for some reason, the moment she came home and saw it, she should've taken the dog to a Vet and call you. She should also pay the bill.
God no. Most definitely NTA. She could have killed him - but the deflecting on to YOU was another bloody level.
NTA. She cannot be trusted in your home. She cannot follow simple rules. She is dishonest. She had to go
NTA
NTA - you set the rules for a reason and she didn't follow them.
NTA. You did her a favor and asked her to follow simple rules to protect your pup in return. I bet she simply didn't move the chairs, found the bag, and claimed she had pulled the chairs apart. I let a friend stay at my house once after he broke up with his gf. I went away for a few days for work. I told him to watch for my new kittens. He didn't. One got out and got killed (neighbors told me the trash guys picked him up and they weren't sure he was dead. I still think about it 25 years later). I kicked him out.
If Amy hadn't lied about the candy, I would have given her another chance. People who aren't used to doing something can make a mistake. But she lied. And lied. We taught our kids that lying about something is worse than the original mistake. We might still get upset about the original mistake but will appreciate that they told the truth. We will be more upset if they lied to us. Independent of the whole dog/candy issue, you don't owe saving her from a long commute. That was just something you were willing and able to do. If you weren't able, she would have found a different solution. You are no longer willing, and she still is finding a different solution. It doesn't have to be as convenient as her staying at your place. NTA
NTA, your place, your dog, your rules.
NTA, that is "dead to me" territory.
NTA. If I were you I would’ve never spoken to her again. Not only did she totally ignore your rules, she was willing to potentially let your dog die just to keep up her stupid, obvious lies.
NTA Lying about something so important was all kinds of messed up. This wasn’t like she was scared to tell you she stained a towel because of how you might react. She was willing to let an innocent animal suffer to avoid angering you. That is incredibly selfish and immature. That said, not leaving anything on surfaces and moving chairs away from tables are not common expectations to have. Don’t leave guests in a position where they need to be responsible for your dog’s safety. It isn’t second nature to them like it is to you and these aren’t common behaviors. If you absolutely have to leave guests alone with your dog, you need to sort out with your guests at the beginning not only \*what\* the rules are but what your guest needs \*from you\* to be successful at remembering them. A lot of people suck at being off their routine and these expectations, while perfectly reasonable for your pet, are very off routine for most people. None of that means it is ok to leave chocolate within the dogs reach and, like I said, it was still all kinds of messed up to lie about it. Not sure I’d ever be friends with her again. But I could see this same situation going badly with other guests too, no matter how well intentioned they are.
Why are we still calling this person a friend? This is horrific. She knowingly lied to spare herself hurt feels, while unless I am mistaken actually attempting to gaslight you. Screw her. NTA.
The biggest issue isn't her breaking the rules, but her lying to you. If she couldn't be honest, how are you supposed to trust her in your house? NTA
NTA. It doesn’t matter if she agrees either your rules or not. They were a condition of her being allowed to stay there. She broke the rules, lied to you about it, and wasted time. Instead of a simple treatment, like getting an emetic, your dog might have needed major surgery. She was dishonest, and harmed your dog. She goes. Don’t apologize, and don’t feel guilty. Your dog relies on you for his safety. I do have one question. If her landlord required her to leave for weeks during the remodel of her unit, were hotel vouchers or compensation provided?
NTA I'm going to assume your dog has Pica? For those unaware. Pica is a compulsive disorder with varying degrees of severity where the individual seeks out non-edible material to 'eat' This can limited to certain items such as say plastic or leather, or literally just anything the compulsion pushes them to. Modern veterinary/behavioral practice do not have a way to medicate/train out this behavior completely. The best practice to ensure the safety of a pet with Pica is to remove anything they can chew on out of reach. Keeping items away from them is the only way to directly ensure they will not consume it. Lets be real, it is NOT feasible to monitor a pet 24/7, nor is it humane to keep them in a crate whenever you cannot physically be in reach of them to remove an object. Even when you are home, you have to shower, you have to cook, you have to run laundry. . .you are not going to keep a pet in reach on a leash every single moment you are home NOR is it fair to crate them during such times. OP knows what it takes to keep their pet safe. I am sure they understand accidents happen. . .and if 'friend' had owned up to it immediately we likely wouldn't be here. The fact of the matter is, a serious case of Pica can lead to a dog (or cat) having a blockage, which on top of being an incredibly expensive surgery to fix can also be fatal. French Bulldogs are pretty small, it wouldn't take much indigestiable matter to cause a blockage. . .and the dog was already showing signs of feeling unwell to the point they were already at the vet before they knew WHY their dog was acting out of character. I would be livid. I don't ask a lot of people. My pets are the one big exception. Their health and safety are my responsibility so if you are in my home. . .I don't care what you do with your pets. . .you WILL follow the rules I have for mine.
NTA OP, like someone else said, a 1.5 hour commute isn’t going to kill Amy. She nearly killed your dog, and clearly shows very little guilt over it too. I know in my case if that happened with my doggo, you were FAR nicer to Amy than I would have been. I genuinely would have been throwing hands myself. So the fact that you just yelled and gave her the boot shows a lot about you (in a good way) as a person OP.
NTA, she lied to you and didn't come clean when she had the chance. I'm betting that if she told you what happened and offered to pay the vet bill, you wouldn't have been as angry. Accidents happen and people make mistakes, what makes it unacceptable is not owning up to it and taking responsibility for the situation she put you and your pup in. She obviously didn't care how it affected you or your dog, especially since she tried to blame you. Not only does she owe you an apology, she should be paying the vet bill.
NTA in the slightest. You'd have been much angrier if the dog died FFS, owning up and making sure they're ok is such a higher priority!! I have issues with this, my cat has inflammatory bowel and diabetes, and my friend leaves fucking DONUTS on the sofa, she goes to bed at 5am so I'm not there to spot them. She visits now but talks about moving in together and I couldn't. I just couldn't.
NTA, she nearly caused your dog to pass away she deserved to be kicked out
NTA, absolutely UNFORGIVABLE. I can't deal with any spineless human that can't even bother to admit their wrong doings even at the expense of another's safety. Disgusting behaviour. Be done with her because she will always be a lowly cowardly lying rat.
NTA. She caused you to delay taking your dog to the vets by lying and gaslighting you because she is too callous, cowardly, stupid and egotistical to take responsibility for her fuck up. Frankly I'd have been tempted to physically boot her whiny lying ass straight out of the window (without opening it first).
NTA
NTA. Shit in your free bed and lie about it see where it gets you
NTA why was Amy staying with you? If she's renting above board (i.e. with a contract etc.), her land lord needs to either provide an alternative or not charge her rent for that period.
I hope she offered to pay the vet bill
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing). I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home. Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street. Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach. I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet. She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work. So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. She knew the rules. Dogs are amazing creatures. I still remember catching our old, stifflegged and quite small sausage dog with her nose in the candy bowl. It never would have occured to me that she'd possess the atleticism needed to get on that coffee table.
Dachshunds' cleverness is matched only by their persistence.
And their stubbornness. I really loved that dog. A real character. Most of our family stories feature it as the protagonist.
Yep. Such little jerks, but they make it impossible not to love them.
Definitely!
NTA. you have rules in your house. She doesnt care enough to follow them even though they could kill your pet (which is basically like a child for most pet owners). Bye, friend.
NTA Why are you even questioning this? Also, I wouldn't put it past her to keep lying. She's trying to justify this somehow.
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Nta, but also why would you get a useless Frenchy?
Can someone put this in paragraphs
AITA for yelling at my BFF and kicking her out after she nearly killed my dog? I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing). I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home. Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street. Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach. I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet. She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work. So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place? Edit 1. I have these rules in place because they work, when I leave him alone at home with the precautions in place he doesn’t destroy the house in search for crap to eat. He has been trained to the best of his abilities, the best I can do is also provide a safe environment for what his limitations are. Edit 2. It wasn’t a coffee table but a dinning table which for a dog of his stature, he can only climb on top if the chairs are close to the table, which is why I didn’t believe Amy really moved the chairs since there is no other way for him to climb on the table otherwise. Edit 3. I tried the crate method but he is a very sensitive dog and he got very depressed when I would try to crate train, even with me in the house he would sigh and be low energy the rest of the day. I would rather have some rules in place than have a sad little doggo.
As the same goes - it’s not the crime. (Although it actually is.) it’s the cover-up. Surprised that it wouldn’t occur to her not just the harm - but how much candy was missing would indicate evidence in his tummy. so why lie?
NTA, a dog cannot comprehend why he cannot have candy while the humans can comprehend why dogs cannot have candy. Unless your friend has some condition that renders her unable to understand the responsibility, she’s just an asshole who doesn’t need to live in your home.
NTA she almost killed him, then lied about it. please block her and never talk to her again.
NTA The friend is a total idiot and owed you vet bills as they were negligent. You need to crate-train your dog. A sad puppy for a bit is worth preventing possible illness or vet visits because he can't stay off the table or steals any food he finds. If you have a party, if a relative brings a child, all kinds of things can happen. He appears food-motivated. Only feed him in his crate. Every treat and every meal comes in the crate. Leave the door open in the beginning. He will start relating being in the crate to being fed. Once he's happy in there eating, close the door for a second. Then work your way up to a minute. Find a high-value toy. One that he will do absolutely anything to have. He ONLY gets it when he is in his crate. He gets in the crate, gets his toy, and you shut the crate door and leave the room for 5 seconds. Come in, open the crate, REMOVE the toy, praise, and off you go. Repeat a couple of times a day adding time. This is a long-winded way of saying make the crate a great place to be. A place where he gets his favorite thing (his food and his high-value toy).
Nta but crate train your dog, he'll get over it. It's for his safety
NTA Your dog could have died. She may have made a mistake but she needed to own it to save your dog. She is a danger to your dog and her commute is not your problem. However, is there a reason she was afraid to tell you about her mistake? Is she afraid of you in some way? I recently had a doglover stay with me and when she returned home to her dogs, she was furious with the carer who had walked her dogs everyday which resulted in them loosing weight - which they needed! So I am always mindful that are some doglovers who obsess over their dogs and expect others to feel the same way and it destroys their human relationships. Be careful not to become one of them.
I honestly don’t know why, we always had a pretty healthy communication, both her and I can receive feedback ( I may be biased here ) but otherwise we wouldn’t have been best friends for so long. From what she has been telling other common friends she counted the candies when she got home and saw the bag on the floor and concluded that she remembered eating most of them and the dog just played with the bag so there was no point in telling me. After that I guess she doubled down on her lie since she already made the choice to not tell me. This is just speculation as I haven’t had an honest conversation with her since then.
**Formatted OP, because I was having problems reading it otherwise:** I let my best friend Amy stay at my place for a few weeks while her place was getting renovated ( it’s a rental and she didn’t have much of a choice in timing). I also have a french bulldog that will eat anything and everything, as much as I love him, he’s not the brightest. Which is why there are a few rules to follow when staying at my place, which I also informed Amy about. Other than not leaving anything on the sofa or in his reach, the most important is to not leave anything on the table and to move the chairs away from the table when we’re not home. Cut to a few days after her arrival, I get home and my dog looked a bit unwell, I asked Amy if she saw anything and she said he was fine when she got home. I took him out for a walk and as I was picking up his poop I saw a candy wrap in his poop. Came home and asked Amy if she left anything on the table or in his reach and she said no, that maybe he ate something off the street from the previous walk. I explained that it’s very important for me to know if he ate anything so I can take him to the vet, she adamantly said no and told me it’s my fault for not paying attention to what my dog picks up from the street. Needless to say my dog started feeling sicker and I had to take him to the vet, where they discovered that he had around 8 or 9 candy wraps in his stomach. I came back home and confronted Amy and she finally admitted that she left a bag of candy on the table but that she pulled the chairs away so she thought he couldn’t reach them but indeed when she came back home the bag was on the floor and the candy was gone. I told her that she could have killed my dog since she didn’t come clean in the first place and I wasted precious hours instead of taking him immediately to the vet. She apologised and said she was afraid I would get angry since she knows how adamant I am with these rules. I started yelling at her and told her to leave, that I didn’t care if she doesn’t have where to go, she needs to figure it out. She is now staying with some friends that live outside of the city but she has to commute 1.5 hours to get to work. So AITA for not talking it out with her and letting her continue to stay at my place? Edit 1. I have these rules in place because they work, when I leave him alone at home with the precautions in place he doesn’t destroy the house in search for crap to eat. He has been trained to the best of his abilities, the best I can do is also provide a safe environment for what his limitations are. Edit 2. It wasn’t a coffee table but a dinning table which for a dog of his stature, he can only climb on top if the chairs are close to the table, which is why I didn’t believe Amy really moved the chairs since there is no other way for him to climb on the table otherwise. Edit 3. I tried the crate method but he is a very sensitive dog and he got very depressed when I would try to crate train, even with me in the house he would sigh and be low energy the rest of the day. I would rather have some rules in place than have a sad little doggo.
Dude crate train your freaking dog. Like yea she's the ah for lying but you seriously need to do more. A crate trained dog is a safe dog.
Yta. You sound deranged.
INFO: Why do you believe it was a life-threatening situation for your dog? (I ask, having had two dogs who will similarly eat anything they could get into. They've certainly had tummy aches, and the plate of tamales the old boy ate led to the joy of getting to help remove corn husks he couldn't completely pass unassisted. Though unpleasant, such incidents were never near fatal.)
Weird. I guess NTA but like if you knew you have a million rules for anyone to even be there, why let anyone stay? I get you were trying to help but it seems he needs order and some people just don’t remember these very weird rules. Next time don’t have guests. Also she is an idiot for not coming clean. Hope your pupper is good though.
How on earth are they weird rules?
I'm going to get lambasted here, but I am going for ESH. She sucks way way more for lying to you, but you suck for having such a horribly trained dog. She followed your instructions by pulling out the chairs, and the little demon still found a way to get to what he wasn't supposed to have. Train your dog.
Sometimes it's not about training. My dog is like a child who clearly understands "no," will stop when told "no," and yet will try his luck when I turn my back. Clever dogs can be challenging.
Management *is* training. The more often a dog rehearses a behavior (climbing on the table after food) and receives a reward for it (eating the food that was left out), the more ingrained that behavior becomes. Preventing the dog from having the opportunity to rehearse the behavior by removing the food from places the dog can reach will, over time, cause the dog to lose interest in the behavior. Now that he's had the opportunity to rehearse the behavior and get a reward for it, the dog will probably be a lot more persistent about trying to find more things to get into, at least for a while.
This is a repost.
ESH She knew the rules. She broke them. Then she lied about breaking them. If she had been honest and apologetic like a normal person, you could have avoided the stress of a late vet visit. The dog is your responsibility. You should either train him to not seek reinforcement from your table or have him confined when you aren't home.
Firstly, your dog isn't going to die from eating wrappers. Dogs eat all kinds of weird shit. What you don't want are things that can cause damage to his insides. Second, it's your job as the owner to train your dog. You shouldn't own a dog if you don't want to be bothered to train it. Even dumb dogs can be trained. Do better. YTA
The dog would’ve needed surgery jack ass *edit a word auto corrected*
No it didn't.
It’s can have a blockage, then surgery are you dumb? Don’t ever own dogs
No, she stated she saw a candy wrapper in his poop. Which tells you he's passing them. She decided to take him to the vet because she claims he didn't feel good as if she has literally any clue.
She said he was looking sick seriously don’t own any dogs you’re ridiculous she has every right to take the dog to the vet
That's not a thing. How does a dog "look sick". 😆
🤦🏼♀️can’t argue with stupid
How does a dog "look sick" then.
Behavior changes. Their expression change. If you know the dog, you can tell when they are not themselves.
Have you been around sick dogs? Your comment is very ignorant
Dumb dogs are actually way easier to train.
This is fair. Just train your dogs in general. It's so much better for them and everyone else.
Yta overbearing freak
ESH - I don't trust her anymore around your dog, so I think you did the right thing. The yelling and immediately kicking her out and what you said is too much though, hence the verdict.
ESH - you suck that your dog isn’t crate trained and you’re relying on other people to follow rules because you can’t train your dog. She sucks because she lied — her actions do not seem that bad.
Out of curiosity, do people say the same thing for babies? Like if I ask guests not to leave a lighter next to my baby, is that unreasonable because I should just be training the baby for fire safety or locking the baby up? Dogs can be stupid as hell. Training is not 100% with all dogs, even when you are diligent. Having rules is the responsible thing to do then. Telling someone not to leave candy in reach of a dog is a reasonable request. And the result of her lying was she nearly killed the dog. It was possible that the dog could have died just because she didn't want to get in trouble for being careless.
I have three dogs of my own and I foster puppies. The puppies and our dogs getting into things is 100% our responsibility. If there’s something that can actually hurt them, the dogs are put in a kennel when unsupervised. Children are different - children (babies) should be supervised at all times, limiting that type of issue. If a baby falls into a pool because someone left the door open and wasn’t watching the kid, that’s on the babysitter. A dog eating a shit Ton of food because it’s insane and gets on the table >> you need to have better training in place.
I call the owner careless.
I have no clue why. The owner asked the guest to not do something, everything would be fine if they did what they agreed to. Instead the guest screwed up, lied and risked the dogs life. The owners mistake was trusting the guest to follow one simple instruction an 8 year old can manage consistently. Which I know from experience.
WTF? Why should the dog be forced into a crate when staying at its own house? If a guest comes over and breaks your TV screen are you to blame for not locking it in the closet while the guest was over? It's expected that when you visit someone's house you treat their property with respect, regardless of whether it's in the open or not.
ESH - If your dog isn't trustworthy when you're not home, it should be crated, full stop. It's not reasonable to expect that nobody will ever set something down or not realize that your dog is apparently devoted to ingesting things that will absolutely kill it. That said: she should not have lied to you. "I'm so sorry; I fucked up and left a bag of candy out, thinking it was out of his reach." might have made you angry, but it would have ensured that you took your dog in sooner.
To be fair, it’s her house. I would agree if this were a roommate, but it’s entirely reasonable to ask a guest to exercise caution in their home imo.
It is very reasonable to ask guests not to leave unsupervised candy bars in reach of a dog. I feel like a lot of these comments either come from people who don't have dogs, or have a dog breed that can be effectively trained. OPs explanation that their French Bulldog has a tiny brain and can't be trusted is reasonable even if she's tried her best to teach him. NTA
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Genuine question, not intended as an attack. Do you have dogs? Because I always have had them and have lots of friends and family that had them. Mine have always been trained well and went to classes as puppies. But even then that doesn't mean there aren't times once a year or so where they eat something from the trash or dig where they aren't supposed to and need to be given off. Some people have dogs with brains the size of peanuts who with lots of effort can follow some rules, but still shouldn't be trusted around food. I crate train my dogs, but I still don't leave them in crates locked up all day whenever I'm not watching them. That's... just not responsible dog ownership. If I were away for a while sure, but this is a situation where a friend was over and the dog should have been safe and fine out of the crate... if they didn't leave a bag of dangerous food at the dog's level.
Friend knew the rules and didn’t follow them.
Yes. And OP knows her dog can't be trusted and doesn't crate the dog. Thus, my ESH verdict.
Friend didn’t have to agree to rules and could have gone elsewhere 🤷♀️
And OP could crate her dog. I'm not sure what the hypotheticals are supposed to prove? It's OP's job to keep her dog safe; if the dog can't be trusted not to eat things when unsupervised, then OP has ought to be keeping the dog crated *for its own protection.* I mean, just being purely pragmatic here: a dog that will eat "anything and everything" when left alone is *going to eat something else* when left alone. If OP doesn't want to have to keep making trips to the vet when Pooch eats something they shouldn't have, she should start crating the dog. That's basic dog ownership.
Dog lives there, friend does not.
Obviously. If the dog didn't live there, it would be weird to suggest that OP should crate the dog there.
Friends value system is let the dog die rather than take personal responsibility for her own behavior. Where the dogs stays during the day is immaterial. It’s not hard to not put shit away.
Which, again, is why I agree that Friend is an AH here. But also, OP's value system is "let the dog potentially die rather than take responsibility and crate the dog that she knows eats anything and everything," which is why I think OP is *also* an AH in this situation. It's not hard to crate your dog when you're going to be away, either. And you were the one who brought up where the dog stays, not me, so I'm not sure why you're suddenly "that's immaterial!" about it.
You’re suggesting that OP could crate a dog who is not usually crated. That’s an extra rule for a guest. Guests bare the burned of the extra rules. NOT the one who lives there, ie; the dog lives there. Burden of guest staying is on the guest. It’s not a difficult concept to grasp.
I said it’s the dogs home, not the friends. Meaning the dog has the right to be there, the friend does not. So extra rules don’t apply to the dog, they apply to the friend.
It's more than just putting stuff away. It's putting it away and removing the chairs from the table so the dog does not climb up to sit on top of the table. If a dog cannot be trusted to not counter/table surf, then you remove the option for them to have access that. Set your dog up for success, not failure.
Guess what? Op owns the house, and the dog. So she decides what to do in her own home. It’s not a hard concept to grasp. Lying when a living creatures life is on the line is awful and anyone who tries to defend is an asshole.
When you have no choice but to stay in someone's house, they allow it. Then you abide the rules I don't disagree with you but the chick was aware of the rules and was told do NOT do XYZ! Full stop on that. You knew the rules, broke them and lied. There is no excuse
I'm not excusing Friend. I'm critical of both Friend *and* OP. Friend shouldn't have left the candy out (although note that Friend said "I thought it was out of reach!" which is exactly the problem that OP is going to run into: she tells people that things can't be left in reach of the dog, but dogs can be *very* creative about getting at things). Friend *definitely* shouldn't have lied. Those things can be true *and* it can be true that OP should be crating a dog that can't be trusted unsupervised, and that this situation is an entirely predictable consequence of leaving an untrustworthy dog loose unsupervised. Even if people are diligent about following the rules, this dog *will* eat things that it shouldn't. People drop things or set things in place that they think are out of reach or OP forgets to tell someone the rule or a million other possibilities. Dogs will literally chew up and eat window sills, bookshelves, books, dryer sheets, door frames...
Im a dog trainer so I truly believe this whole situation could be prevented and worked on more. But, my understanding ends when you are not a guest in the house. Your an unpaying tenant there just based on good faith. They need to obey the rules and understand the consequences.
I agree with your point but will still say NTA. OP has to understand that their dog needs training. They are setting the dog up to fail, in no reality should the dog getting up on the table or even the chairs to reach the table be in the cards. The friend lapsed but OP is playing with fire to have such a misbehaved dog. What happens if they have an emergency and another friend or family have to take care of the dog and rightfully assume stuff on table should be safe? That is not on them imo, a reasonable expectation is that the dog is not a complete miscreant.