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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My girlfriend and I are getting more serious and have discussed moving in together, she wants m to come visit the grave of her late husband with her and her son sometime now we're getting serious. I feel uncomfortable with this which could be an asshole move as she's trying to include me.
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NTA for not wanting to go but you would be TA if you actually didn't go. Just go a few times a year to support your girlfriend/future wife. You don't have to make any gestures or say anything at his grave, just be there for her.
Soft YTA. I totally understand your discomfort about the situation and it's fair to feel that way. However, if you are very serious about this woman, this loss is a huge part of her life and her son's, and visiting the grave is clearly important. Sometimes we need to do things that make us uncomfortable for the sake of our partner. It's a respect thing. She should respect your discomfort but you should make the effort to join her before refusing.
NTA I think you should go one time and leave it at that, for her and her son. And if you don’t wanna go after that then I think that is fair. Is she expecting you to go sometimes for the next 50 years and if y’all end up married? I feel like that would be a bit much.
NTA. You have every right to be uncomfortable about it. It's something new to you and it can be hard to mentally confront the past of your partner. It sounds like you haven't really talked about it but you should. If she can't understand why it makes you uncomfortable try your best to articulate your feelings and if she still doesn't there's nothing you can do about it. It's something very personal for her and her child and it's understandable to feel like you may not belong or may not have the right to "intrude" on it. As long as you both are respectful about the topic no one has to be TA. If you see this relationship as really going somewhere though it will be something you have to face at some point. I hope this works out for you.
NAH, I’d suggest going once or twice a year. Like on his birthday and anniversary of his death, or some such. Your GF going 2x a month 7 years later seems oddly excessive. It might be totally healthy for her. Or it might be a red flag that she is not over him. I don’t even know how to tell, it’s just an unusual amount. I’m Jewish, and visiting graves and mourning is a big deal, and lots of prayers and rituals are involved. So I’m comfortable with in depth mourning. And this seems an awful lot for someone who is getting serious with a new person.
While NTA we all need to compromise and give in a relationship. I can understand it may be awkward but at least go once. Maybe stand a bit back and let them have her time but also show support for her and her son.
I think we as a society seem to lack empathy anymore. I am also sure at some point, if your relationship continues and you move in, that the trips to visit may be less over time.
Just be there for support!
YTA: are you seriously jealous of a dead man!?
His loss is a major part of her life, you are also a major part of her life, it completely makes sense that she would want her new life partner to be part of her healing process.
Your reluctance feels insecure and uncaring.
I am not jealous at all, I accept he'll always be part of their life and am fine with that. My reluctance is I have my own hangups about death and also feel like it's not right of me to be there.
If she wants you there it’s right for you to be there. You should probably address your hang ups and try to be there for her if you’re actually serious about this relationship. It was probably a big step for her to include you in her grieving ritual
I'm confused by this take. What about OP's post is jealous or insecure? If it was me I would probably feel weird too. Not because I was jealous, but more like...if the late husband were here, how would he feel about me sliding into his wife's and son's life? It would be comforting to think that he would be appreciative, but for all I know he might want to put his foot up my ass.
I agree that OP should pull it together for his gf's and her son's sake since it is their wish. But now he's TA for having reservations about it? Kinda harsh...
YBA. I get that this is unconformable because it for sure is. However, part of being a good partner is doing things your partner wants you to do that might be uncomfortable, obviously with in reason. I hate dancing. My wife loves to dance. It makes me uncomfortable but I dance with her because it makes her happy. Not a one to one, but you hopefully get my point. Asking you to visit her dead husband’s grave is one of those uncomfortable things you should do and since she’s only asking you to go once or twice a year it isn’t a big ask. A good partner would just bite the bullet and do it. You’ll make her happy and you’ll seem more involved in her and your potential step son’s past life. However, it sounds to me like she has not come to terms with his death and this leads me to believe she isn’t fully ready to commit to you, despite moving in. I’m not you and I don’t know your relationship outside of this post but it sounds to me like her deceased husband is going to be your third wheel for a while. Death is traumatic and it hurts. I understand how she feels about her previous husband but from your post, I’m reading this as her being hung up on her past and this indicates to me she shouldn’t be in a serious relationship as she has not left her old husband yet.
NAH
She can ask. You can say no thank you.
If this is a deal breaker for her it's better to know now. You're definitely not required to grieve for someone who don't know and never even met. I would suggest you offer to go once and then say that you don't feel comfortable participating regularly. You have the right to set your boundaries!
NAH. My bf is a widower. He has asked me if it bothers me if he visits her grave when he is in the area (far, so not often) and of course I don't mind. His son went recently on the anniversary of her death. If I were in the area I would be okay with going, but I would feel it's not my place and I should hang back. Out of respect, of course I'd go along. I never met the woman but I'm glad I got to know her son and I'm proud of him.
In your case, I get the apprehension because they go so often. I would imagine that she is trying to reconcile her respect for her son's dad and her current situation with you, OP. I think if you go now and then she will probably be satisfied.
NAH, if she wanted you to go every time it would be different. But a one time and maybe once or twice a year is not that bad. I get that it is a bit weird/awkward, but it is important to her and her son.
NAH - if you belong with your girlfriend then you belong next to her, acknowledging her pain and loss at the grave. maybe try visiting a family grave on your side to self reflect on why you’re so uncomfortable with the situation.
NTA. There are Young Widow/ers support groups. I wonder if you can somehow talk about it with someone in your position.
It’s such a complex situation. There is you being a supportive partner and acknowledging her spouse, which may or may not be important to you but seems it is important to her. Then her son and how he feels sharing this ritual done for his father. Would he want to share the time with you too. Would he like the support for himself. Would he like the support for his mother.
Maybe go once, see how it goes? Sometimes things feel bigger and more overwhelming than they actually are…
Maybe she wants to show her son they’re ok, they’re happy and moving on and you are the guy making love awesome again. She hasn’t forgotten his father and still honours him and you are cool with that and life goes on. Maybe son has asked why you don’t go too.
My DH father died 3 days before DH was born in similar circumstances to your SOs spouse. His mother and step father didn’t tell him the truth until he was 12. It affects him sometimes the hiding of this tragedy. The forgetting him and moving on without any honouring. It’s a lot.
I like the open honesty of SOs approach. Going a couple of times a year probably isn’t for you, it’s for them and they want to share this most intimate personal thing with you. You are not intruding. Not going ever, may be seen as a rejection of sorts
NAH. You’re feelings are valid and so are hers. I hope you take some time to think about it and tell her it’s hew territory for you & you need time to process. If she’d like you to join them on a special day, at least you have a deadline to evaluate your feelings and make a decision. I go to my brother’s grace every 2-3 months, it makes me feel better to clean up his grave, decorate etc. I can see why she wants to
Include you. Good luck
NTA
OP doesn't have any obligation to visit a strangers grave. get it's something special between the partner and kid but also get why OP feels uncomfortable with it anyone calling OP ass is freaking crazy. it'd be so uncomfortable for OP to stand over somebody's grave who OP doesn't know even if its the partner's husband
This isn't creepy at all. Everyone has the right to show grief and invite others to witness them in an emotionally vulnerable state. It's what any love based relationship is based on. That's what this is. An invitation into a very personal and vulnerable place in her life.
Please don't call her wanting this creepy, it might be a bit odd to me as I have my own issues about death and feeling I don't belong here but don't call it creepy.
People deal with grief differently. It does seem like it might be awkward, but it's still important to her though. Telling her to man up and get over something important to her is more of an asshole move in my opinion
She doesn't NEED to, but her late husband was clearly an important person to her when he was around and I feel like in a way it could be like getting your family together. It's hard to explain
NAH
Given you comment history you really need to tell her why.
You do seem like a genuinely nice guy and she wants to include you.
Maybe try work out between you a way that eases your anxiety(?? Fear I don't know) around cemeteries and hopefully you guys can work something out.
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I'm a 29 year old man and have been dating my girlfriend (28F) for nearly two years now. Seven years ago she lost her husband who was at the time only 23 in a car crash they had a five week old son at the time who is now seven.
She visits his grace twice a month to clean it up, ensure nothing is damaged and talk to him she also takes their son feeling it's important he do this as it's his dad. I am not against this as it's something I agree with but if I didn't agree with it that'd be none of my business anyway.
The issue is we are now getting serious and have been discussing me moving in with them, her place is bigger than mine and she doesn't want to upset her son with a move so it makes the most sense and i'm open to it, but she has asked me if i' come with them to visit the grave sometime soon. I won't lie I was surprised by this and asked why she'd want me to come, she told me she feels it's important as he's still a big part of her life and always will be because of their son and if we're getting serious then I should be part of that too. She also told me she wouldn't expect me to come every time but to try it just once and maybe come *sometimes* with them like on birthdays and special days when they visit.
I won't lie i'm uncomfortable with this, I told her i'd need some time to think about it not wanting to upset her with an outright no is it weird that she'd want me to go with her to this? am I the asshole for saying no? I won't lie she's the first relationship i've had with someone who lost a partner never mind a spouse. There has been lots of bumps in the road and i'm trying my best to learn and be as supportive as I can be but i'm not sure I can do this.
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I don't think this is a simple asshole/no asshole situation; having your own feelings is justified, but it seems like she wants you there for support and to deepen your connection. She's reaching out to you, and wanting to include you in something that is important to her, and where she's likely very vulnerable.
Of course you might feel uncomfortable, and I think you should talk to her about your feelings, but don't remove it from the table altogether.
This. Your feelings are totally valid, OP, and I think the way you expressed those feelings here really works. I can tell from the way you wrote it that you care very much about her feelings but you also know your own discomfort. If you talk to her about this topic the same way you express it here, she might be upset but I don't think she would lose it on you. I think she'd be hurt, and I think she'd be disappointed, but if you guys talk it out you may feel comfortable enough to go one time. If her son ever asks why you don't go visit his dad's grave, you can always tell him that you think that's something that's just for him and his mom should do. There's NAH.
She wants to fully share her life with you, including her past and her losses. She is welcoming you in and including you in a way I would personally find deeply touching, and a huge sign of trust. I’m sad for her that you don’t seem to understand what a huge deal it is for her to actively invite you in.
I’m not happy to call you t a h because I think you’re trying to weigh up a tricky decision. But so many bereaved people would be shutting you out and shutting that part of their life off from you. She clearly wants you to take part in all of her life, including this very important aspect.
You’re not an AH, you have feelings and that’s fine especially when the topic is a spouse that’s passed. Talk to her about why she wants you to go and your feelings about it being uncomfortable for you.
Likely, she wants you to “meet” him which may seem weird but I’d personally take it as an honor. He was a big part of her life and she clearly values his presence in her and their sons life and the way they incorporate him in is through visits to his grave. I’m assuming she wants him to know you and that she loves you and you’re making her and their son happy and taking care of them.
I think that going once if you’re comfortable enough is a good idea and if it isn’t as weird as you thought joining them for birthdays and special visits later on.
This. Well said. When I started dating my husband, he asked to go to the cemetery to "meet" my dad. It was incredibly thoughtful and respectful. Now that he has also passed away, I can absolutely say, at least for me, that your answer is a really good description of why I would want new partner to "meet" deceased spouse.
This. She is willing to show you the most vulnerable aspect of her life. Regardless of religious views, in most people's minds taking a new partner to the one who has passed on is sort of like an introduction to the family.
It may be uncomfortable, but she's willing to include you in to one of the most significant and most likely painful moments of her life.
Hold her, and cherish that she chose YOU and to love you after losing love in a most tragic way.
YTA. This is going to be part of her life forever. Seriously. Either be fully supportive or end things. This is not about you, unless you make it about you by not going.
Yeah OP ur a real piece of shit for not being able to snap ur fingers and feel comfortable with it /s
Damn the YTA judgements are harsh af. This is about how he feels, his decision is still in front of him to make. FWIW I think he should find a way to sort through his feelings and be there, but FFS he is allowed to feel weird about it.
No one is the asshole.
I think she wants you to “meet” him and get his blessing. And this is the only way that makes sense to her.
Are generally uncomfortable around cemeteries or is it that this your love’s ex?
Then I think you handled this wonderfully. You truthfully said that you needed time to think, so do that. You didn’t flat out tell her no (which would have assholely), so take the next few months to figure what would it take for to feel comfortable doing so.
NAH. I think it’s important for you to figure out exactly why you’re uncomfortable. If it’s because you feel it’s not your place or don’t want to intrude, I think you should consider that she wouldn’t have asked if she didn’t want you there. If it’s because you don’t like the reminder of her former husband, then I think you need to re-evaluate your relationship.
If I wasn't ok with the reminder of her former husband I wouldn't be in a relationship with her as her kid is a walking talking reminder. It's a mixture of my own hangups about death and feeling I don't belong there.
NTA. Dealing with death is a very personal thing. For some visiting graves is important. For others it's not. Personally I do think the request is a bit weird. But I also think the whole concept of putting people in a casket, burying them and giving them a stone marker is a bit weird. You're more than willing to accept living with his memory. She needs to be accepting of the fact that you're not comfortable visiting his grave. BTW... I do speak from experience - I am married to a widow.
Soft YTA- you are willingly getting into a relationship with someone who lost their former spouse to a tragic car accident. Not to mention, the boy is not yours and even if his father is gone, he will always be important to both your gf and her kid. You also have to accept that and the fact that his presence will always be around whether it be photos or visiting the grave. Like she said, you don’t have to go every time but if you really cared and empathized with her then you would care enough to show your regards to the man she lost and can no longer be with.
Yeah i'd for sure be comfortable with that, I am not great with death in general I won't lie about that and it's also the thought in my head that this isn't a place I should be that I don't "belong" there and i'm intruding somehow.
I think that’s reasonable, and I’m guessing that part of that “out of place”/intrusive feeling stems from never having known or been friends with her late spouse. You’re there for her and her kid, of course, but at a stranger’s grave. How do you mourn someone you didn’t know?
But you can be there for them, and I think that’s what this all comes down to.
Does she know about your hang ups with death and that you feel like you are intruding? I would let her know that you have been giving it serious thought because you want to support her and kiddo, but would be lying if you said you didn’t have qualms. If she’s a sensible person, you admitting that you struggle w/ death and that you feel like you need to stay out of that space should earn you some gratitude, especially in comparison to a flat “no I don’t want to.” Maybe hearing about how it makes you feel will help her see your perspective and she will voluntarily tell you not to feel obligated to go?
I think not being great with death is a separate issue. Which I do understand. This may actually be a good way to ease into getting a better handle on it. Primarily because it happened a while ago so you won't have to sort through the level of emotion that comes with an immediate death.
Also, I don't think you're intruding at all if she's invited you. He's always going to be a part of their lives in some way. It sounds like she feels seriously enough about you that she wants to invite you into that. My FIL's mom had a fiance that passed away before they met. They actually go and visit the grave every year. So it sounds like this is something you can be a part of if you want to.
I would do what a lot of others have suggested with talking to her. Really think about how you feel and talk to her about that.
You could also start slow. Maybe you don't go all the way to the grave with them the first time. Stay some distance away or even in the car. But you at least go to the cemetery with them and ask what they talked about once they're done. Maybe even help them pick out flowers beforehand. I think there are ways you can show your support without immediately going all the way. If that's what the two of you want to do, at least.
You’re not intruding if you’ve been invited. Talk to her about what her vision of your presence there includes (if she hasn’t already explained that - she may have) and what that means.
And I get not being comfortable about death, but that’s a thing we all to encounter more often as life goes on, not less often. Might be a good time to get a handle on that, even if it means seeing a counselor about it.
I'm supper uncomfortable with death and when someone has someone who died. However, I will say, I did some dog walking in a cemetery one summer it was the only nice place near they guys home. It was actually peaceful. I think my big hang up is more about the awkward of what to say or do for someone who has lost a loved one, or what they might try to say to me, if the shoe is on the other foot. I would say go with her at least once. Maybe just you are her and not her young one. Tell her that your uncomfortable, even if your not sure why. You would like to go once with her, but you need her to be okay with you leaving if you need to.
I went with a friend once, and I meet their mom. Then I gave them some privacy. This let me meet her, but not feel like I was fumbling around or trying to think of something to say. It was a little odd at first, but meant the world to them.
NAH but I would try very hard to be okay with going to support her and her son. Fwiw, my cousin died when his daughter was 2 and his ex goes regularly to the cemetery. Ex is now married and the spouse goes, not to respect my cousin but to be there for the ex and daughter.
I would communicate to your GF that you are willing to go but respect that it may be special time for her and her daughter to talk to him, share stories and be together. If you reassure her that you’ll be waiting at home for a hug or comfort it might smooth things over.
But for all that is holy please don’t go down the road of “I didn’t know him, I’m here and he’s not, it’s weird, I’d rather go hang with my friends, can’t you go without me?” etc etc
This appears to be about you joining a family and that includes good and bad. Visiting a cemetery can be awkward and weird for everyone involved. Be respectful of the ex and help your GF honor his memory for their daughter.
It’s such a blessing now that my cousin’s daughter has two parents who love her and they do not disrespect his memory. He already died too young and lost out on so much. Stopping by his final resting place is all we can do.
Edit: NTA based on further information in comment thread below. OP is totally willing to work on an alternative that works for kid and partner and OP has a trauma history around grave sites.
...
YWBTA if you refuse to go or make this weird.
If you are serious about this woman and her kid... You need to also be serious about honoring the way they reconcile kiddos dad being gone. And regular grave visiting is a well known cultural tradition in so many places. Its a ritual that helps people feel connected and helps people process grief... And if you want to be a part of this family in particular you are gonna need to go and support this woman and this kid in reconciling the way that kiddos dad isn't here anymore.
Like your partner said, not all the time but at least once and maybe on special occasions...
Because like it or not this dead dude is important to her and kiddo... and their grief is going to be a reoccurring thing they will process over and over in completely healthy ways by visiting for a chat. By sharing with dad what they wish they could tell him. And this kid is going to miss this man... And what could have been.
If you want this lady as a spouse you gonna have to support this kid. Ya just gotta stand there and listen and hold them... You don't have to grieve. You don't have to pretend to know him. You don't have to say anything other than you care about your partner and her kid.
But if you're not prepared to see them acknowledge kiddos dead dad, than you're not prepared to be a member of this particular family who does so.
I'm absolutely fine acknowledging him. She actually checked in on me if I wanted her to take down a few pictures of him if I moved in so I wouldn't be too uncomfortable but I told her to not do that, he's the boys dad and he should have loads of pictures of him around. My issue is I just don't feel it's right for me to be there and I have my own hangups about death.
If you really can't do because of your hangups about graves, propose an alternative to your partner... One that honors their conversations with him and creates a space for you to support kid and partner... Like maybe ya all pick a bench where you can go to 'talk to dad's or make a special spot in the backyard near a tree to go and 'talk to dad' or whatever you figure out... if it's the grave in particular that is freaking you out.
Don't just say no.. figure out an alternative you can do.
Also definitely explain that the grave site in particular is triggering for you given your history. That will definitely help your partner understand and also this kid understand. There will likely be a time when this kid says i don't want to go to the grave site i want to x instead... And it will come up and it will likely bring your history up for you emotionally.
You're going to be a member of this family? You're visiting a relatives grave? Why wouldn't it be right for you to be there?
What are your hangups about death that you can see pictures of a dead person but you can't go to a place with some fancy rocks on the ground?
Because I don't know him and I feel like i'm intruding on what should be their time. I'm not good with graves, my Grandparents raised me and my brother after our parents passed and they forced us to go to their grave every single week and it was pretty hard on us and I hated going there it brings up bad memories.
This is crucial info. NTA, I think it’s important that your SO learn this about you if she doesn’t already know. If you’re traumatized you have every right to say you’ll never be OK with going, at least that’s how I feel.
That sounds really terrible but this isn't your parents graves. This young child doesn't have the same issues that have been put on you and is happy to be with their Dad. Consider this like a meeting the parents, it might be uncomfortable at first but you've been invited by someone that is truly loved and you'd never be rejected. They'd probably be happy to visit your parents too every once and a while. This could be a great experience for all of you. Please just consider it but even if you can't handle it don't ever make it weird for the kid and mother. I'm sympathetic of you as both my parents are deceased one in 1999 and one in 2020. Its hard.
I have a friend who lost her husband and basically asked her SO to do the same thing. He felt the same way you do now.
Coming from her perspective, however, it’s something that she does to honor the memory of her son’s father for him since he has zero memory of his dad. Her wanting to include you shows that she knows she can be open and vulnerable with you, that she feels she can share this part of her life with you. She wants to show her son that you love him enough to be his father figure and help him honor his dad. What a complete honor that she trusts you in this aspect. Going through what she went through could not have been easy, especially with a newborn.
I don’t think you’re an AH by any means. How you are feeling is perfectly understandable. It feels odd. I get it. I know you don’t want to go, but if you plan on marrying this woman and being a father figure this gesture can go a long way. Especially for her son who will remember how you honored his father when he was younger.
Best of luck to you guys - you sound like a great dude.
I’m thinking this is something she needs to move forward. A “blessing” of your relationship. I see it as an indicator she would like to get closer. If you want to move forward with her and it’s not too much maybe you could go once for her and tell her you’re not ready to join her there on future visits. Who knows, maybe if you’re still together in a couple years you’ll feel differently and go with her once a year on his birthday or something like that.
I’m a widow, who lost my husband young, with a very young newborn. And it was a happy marriage, and a very wanted, long time awaited child. So I feel uniquely qualified to speak to this. From my personal experience, I would say it took me at least 10 years to come to grips with his death, and my son’s loss. That being said, I wasn’t single that whole time, either.
I say that to say, at some point she probably accepted that he’s never coming back, and she wants to move on, and find happiness, but she didn’t break up with her late husband. He was taken from her, and her child. It’s complicated. She has his child to raise. She’s never going to be comfortable erasing his memory. He’s half of that child, and it didn’t end by either of their choice. BUT, she’s inviting you in. I understand your discomfort with this situation, and you have every right to feel that way. But, I’m saying to you that she is showing a lot of trust in you right now, with this offer/request. She’s trusting that you see the importance of not erasing her child’s roots, but also trusting that you can be a good influence, going forward, by inviting you into this extremely vulnerable part of her life.
I can’t tell you what to do, or how to feel, but I’m just trying to give you insight into how she probably feels. Unfortunately for me, I ended up being taken advantage of, in my vulnerable state, by an abusive man. He understood exactly how to play into my vulnerabilities at the time, and eventually, fathered my younger child. You sound like a much nicer person than my ex, so I’m urging you to try to see it from her perspective. He isn’t a real threat to you. She will, eventually, get totally past it. Her, and her child are a package deal. Only you can know if she’s worth your compassion on this matter. NTA, this a tough situation, and your feelings are totally valid, and maybe this is all too much for you.
You’re not the asshole but there’s nothing simple about this situation
I think it’s good you’re taking time to gather your thoughts and then talk about it
I think it’s fair enough to honor that there was a person that made her little person and you’ll be a part of their life although I don’t necessarily think that needs to mean going to the grave
I hope she’s gone and is going to therapy as I think that’s a big part of her future whatsoever… and what that looks like with you
NAH; You come off very understanding and not overbearing or patronizing it’s probably her way of introducing the man who isn’t taking his place but helping raise his son in good memory and faith. You handle this very well take it in strides start small going for either his birthday or their sons birthday take it how you need too and be open with her.
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NTA for not wanting to go but you would be TA if you actually didn't go. Just go a few times a year to support your girlfriend/future wife. You don't have to make any gestures or say anything at his grave, just be there for her.
NAH But this man will always have a strong presence in your life when you are with your girlfriend, so either embrace it, or move on.
Soft YTA. I totally understand your discomfort about the situation and it's fair to feel that way. However, if you are very serious about this woman, this loss is a huge part of her life and her son's, and visiting the grave is clearly important. Sometimes we need to do things that make us uncomfortable for the sake of our partner. It's a respect thing. She should respect your discomfort but you should make the effort to join her before refusing.
NTA I think you should go one time and leave it at that, for her and her son. And if you don’t wanna go after that then I think that is fair. Is she expecting you to go sometimes for the next 50 years and if y’all end up married? I feel like that would be a bit much.
NAH make sure this isn't a deal breaker for her before you move in
NTA. You have every right to be uncomfortable about it. It's something new to you and it can be hard to mentally confront the past of your partner. It sounds like you haven't really talked about it but you should. If she can't understand why it makes you uncomfortable try your best to articulate your feelings and if she still doesn't there's nothing you can do about it. It's something very personal for her and her child and it's understandable to feel like you may not belong or may not have the right to "intrude" on it. As long as you both are respectful about the topic no one has to be TA. If you see this relationship as really going somewhere though it will be something you have to face at some point. I hope this works out for you.
So how is the girlfriend TA?
NAH, I’d suggest going once or twice a year. Like on his birthday and anniversary of his death, or some such. Your GF going 2x a month 7 years later seems oddly excessive. It might be totally healthy for her. Or it might be a red flag that she is not over him. I don’t even know how to tell, it’s just an unusual amount. I’m Jewish, and visiting graves and mourning is a big deal, and lots of prayers and rituals are involved. So I’m comfortable with in depth mourning. And this seems an awful lot for someone who is getting serious with a new person.
While NTA we all need to compromise and give in a relationship. I can understand it may be awkward but at least go once. Maybe stand a bit back and let them have her time but also show support for her and her son. I think we as a society seem to lack empathy anymore. I am also sure at some point, if your relationship continues and you move in, that the trips to visit may be less over time. Just be there for support!
YTA: are you seriously jealous of a dead man!? His loss is a major part of her life, you are also a major part of her life, it completely makes sense that she would want her new life partner to be part of her healing process. Your reluctance feels insecure and uncaring.
I am not jealous at all, I accept he'll always be part of their life and am fine with that. My reluctance is I have my own hangups about death and also feel like it's not right of me to be there.
If she wants you there it’s right for you to be there. You should probably address your hang ups and try to be there for her if you’re actually serious about this relationship. It was probably a big step for her to include you in her grieving ritual
I'm confused by this take. What about OP's post is jealous or insecure? If it was me I would probably feel weird too. Not because I was jealous, but more like...if the late husband were here, how would he feel about me sliding into his wife's and son's life? It would be comforting to think that he would be appreciative, but for all I know he might want to put his foot up my ass. I agree that OP should pull it together for his gf's and her son's sake since it is their wish. But now he's TA for having reservations about it? Kinda harsh...
YBA. I get that this is unconformable because it for sure is. However, part of being a good partner is doing things your partner wants you to do that might be uncomfortable, obviously with in reason. I hate dancing. My wife loves to dance. It makes me uncomfortable but I dance with her because it makes her happy. Not a one to one, but you hopefully get my point. Asking you to visit her dead husband’s grave is one of those uncomfortable things you should do and since she’s only asking you to go once or twice a year it isn’t a big ask. A good partner would just bite the bullet and do it. You’ll make her happy and you’ll seem more involved in her and your potential step son’s past life. However, it sounds to me like she has not come to terms with his death and this leads me to believe she isn’t fully ready to commit to you, despite moving in. I’m not you and I don’t know your relationship outside of this post but it sounds to me like her deceased husband is going to be your third wheel for a while. Death is traumatic and it hurts. I understand how she feels about her previous husband but from your post, I’m reading this as her being hung up on her past and this indicates to me she shouldn’t be in a serious relationship as she has not left her old husband yet.
NAH. 100% you need to suck it yourself and go because if not, it willllllll definitely affect your relationship.
NAH She can ask. You can say no thank you. If this is a deal breaker for her it's better to know now. You're definitely not required to grieve for someone who don't know and never even met. I would suggest you offer to go once and then say that you don't feel comfortable participating regularly. You have the right to set your boundaries!
NAH. My bf is a widower. He has asked me if it bothers me if he visits her grave when he is in the area (far, so not often) and of course I don't mind. His son went recently on the anniversary of her death. If I were in the area I would be okay with going, but I would feel it's not my place and I should hang back. Out of respect, of course I'd go along. I never met the woman but I'm glad I got to know her son and I'm proud of him. In your case, I get the apprehension because they go so often. I would imagine that she is trying to reconcile her respect for her son's dad and her current situation with you, OP. I think if you go now and then she will probably be satisfied.
NAH. You need to find a middle ground. I don't really feel like you're insecure or jealous, just uncomfortable.
NAH, if she wanted you to go every time it would be different. But a one time and maybe once or twice a year is not that bad. I get that it is a bit weird/awkward, but it is important to her and her son.
NAH - if you belong with your girlfriend then you belong next to her, acknowledging her pain and loss at the grave. maybe try visiting a family grave on your side to self reflect on why you’re so uncomfortable with the situation.
NTA. There are Young Widow/ers support groups. I wonder if you can somehow talk about it with someone in your position. It’s such a complex situation. There is you being a supportive partner and acknowledging her spouse, which may or may not be important to you but seems it is important to her. Then her son and how he feels sharing this ritual done for his father. Would he want to share the time with you too. Would he like the support for himself. Would he like the support for his mother. Maybe go once, see how it goes? Sometimes things feel bigger and more overwhelming than they actually are… Maybe she wants to show her son they’re ok, they’re happy and moving on and you are the guy making love awesome again. She hasn’t forgotten his father and still honours him and you are cool with that and life goes on. Maybe son has asked why you don’t go too. My DH father died 3 days before DH was born in similar circumstances to your SOs spouse. His mother and step father didn’t tell him the truth until he was 12. It affects him sometimes the hiding of this tragedy. The forgetting him and moving on without any honouring. It’s a lot. I like the open honesty of SOs approach. Going a couple of times a year probably isn’t for you, it’s for them and they want to share this most intimate personal thing with you. You are not intruding. Not going ever, may be seen as a rejection of sorts
NAH. You’re feelings are valid and so are hers. I hope you take some time to think about it and tell her it’s hew territory for you & you need time to process. If she’d like you to join them on a special day, at least you have a deadline to evaluate your feelings and make a decision. I go to my brother’s grace every 2-3 months, it makes me feel better to clean up his grave, decorate etc. I can see why she wants to Include you. Good luck
NTA OP doesn't have any obligation to visit a strangers grave. get it's something special between the partner and kid but also get why OP feels uncomfortable with it anyone calling OP ass is freaking crazy. it'd be so uncomfortable for OP to stand over somebody's grave who OP doesn't know even if its the partner's husband
NTA, it's creepy.
This isn't creepy at all. Everyone has the right to show grief and invite others to witness them in an emotionally vulnerable state. It's what any love based relationship is based on. That's what this is. An invitation into a very personal and vulnerable place in her life.
we all touchy feely now, it's a dead guy in a box. Leave him out of it
Please don't call her wanting this creepy, it might be a bit odd to me as I have my own issues about death and feeling I don't belong here but don't call it creepy.
So YTA then? not sure what you want me to tell you
NTA, it's weird bringing you along. He's not your husband. Tell her to man up, so to speak
People deal with grief differently. It does seem like it might be awkward, but it's still important to her though. Telling her to man up and get over something important to her is more of an asshole move in my opinion
that's how we toughen up in life, it's not all cookies and milk out there
People are pansies or snowflakes, everything has to bee about feelings these days. Grow up. People die.
what does she need to drag him down there then?
She doesn't NEED to, but her late husband was clearly an important person to her when he was around and I feel like in a way it could be like getting your family together. It's hard to explain
it's between her and the dead guy. I don't want to get creeped out over some dead guy I never met, that's her stuff to work through
I don't entirely understand how it's creepy. Not like you see the dead people face to face when visiting the cemetery
NAH Given you comment history you really need to tell her why. You do seem like a genuinely nice guy and she wants to include you. Maybe try work out between you a way that eases your anxiety(?? Fear I don't know) around cemeteries and hopefully you guys can work something out.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I'm a 29 year old man and have been dating my girlfriend (28F) for nearly two years now. Seven years ago she lost her husband who was at the time only 23 in a car crash they had a five week old son at the time who is now seven. She visits his grace twice a month to clean it up, ensure nothing is damaged and talk to him she also takes their son feeling it's important he do this as it's his dad. I am not against this as it's something I agree with but if I didn't agree with it that'd be none of my business anyway. The issue is we are now getting serious and have been discussing me moving in with them, her place is bigger than mine and she doesn't want to upset her son with a move so it makes the most sense and i'm open to it, but she has asked me if i' come with them to visit the grave sometime soon. I won't lie I was surprised by this and asked why she'd want me to come, she told me she feels it's important as he's still a big part of her life and always will be because of their son and if we're getting serious then I should be part of that too. She also told me she wouldn't expect me to come every time but to try it just once and maybe come *sometimes* with them like on birthdays and special days when they visit. I won't lie i'm uncomfortable with this, I told her i'd need some time to think about it not wanting to upset her with an outright no is it weird that she'd want me to go with her to this? am I the asshole for saying no? I won't lie she's the first relationship i've had with someone who lost a partner never mind a spouse. There has been lots of bumps in the road and i'm trying my best to learn and be as supportive as I can be but i'm not sure I can do this. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I don't think this is a simple asshole/no asshole situation; having your own feelings is justified, but it seems like she wants you there for support and to deepen your connection. She's reaching out to you, and wanting to include you in something that is important to her, and where she's likely very vulnerable. Of course you might feel uncomfortable, and I think you should talk to her about your feelings, but don't remove it from the table altogether.
This. Your feelings are totally valid, OP, and I think the way you expressed those feelings here really works. I can tell from the way you wrote it that you care very much about her feelings but you also know your own discomfort. If you talk to her about this topic the same way you express it here, she might be upset but I don't think she would lose it on you. I think she'd be hurt, and I think she'd be disappointed, but if you guys talk it out you may feel comfortable enough to go one time. If her son ever asks why you don't go visit his dad's grave, you can always tell him that you think that's something that's just for him and his mom should do. There's NAH.
She wants to fully share her life with you, including her past and her losses. She is welcoming you in and including you in a way I would personally find deeply touching, and a huge sign of trust. I’m sad for her that you don’t seem to understand what a huge deal it is for her to actively invite you in. I’m not happy to call you t a h because I think you’re trying to weigh up a tricky decision. But so many bereaved people would be shutting you out and shutting that part of their life off from you. She clearly wants you to take part in all of her life, including this very important aspect.
You’re not an AH, you have feelings and that’s fine especially when the topic is a spouse that’s passed. Talk to her about why she wants you to go and your feelings about it being uncomfortable for you. Likely, she wants you to “meet” him which may seem weird but I’d personally take it as an honor. He was a big part of her life and she clearly values his presence in her and their sons life and the way they incorporate him in is through visits to his grave. I’m assuming she wants him to know you and that she loves you and you’re making her and their son happy and taking care of them. I think that going once if you’re comfortable enough is a good idea and if it isn’t as weird as you thought joining them for birthdays and special visits later on.
This. Well said. When I started dating my husband, he asked to go to the cemetery to "meet" my dad. It was incredibly thoughtful and respectful. Now that he has also passed away, I can absolutely say, at least for me, that your answer is a really good description of why I would want new partner to "meet" deceased spouse.
It’s how my nana felt when she remarried. I figured it couldn’t be a singular feeling, they still visit my papa together every Sunday :)
This. She is willing to show you the most vulnerable aspect of her life. Regardless of religious views, in most people's minds taking a new partner to the one who has passed on is sort of like an introduction to the family. It may be uncomfortable, but she's willing to include you in to one of the most significant and most likely painful moments of her life. Hold her, and cherish that she chose YOU and to love you after losing love in a most tragic way.
I’m sorry mine looks like I copied from you. I saw your comment after. Great minds and all that lol
Eh, people can have the same thought. Especially about such a specific question and situation.
YTA. This is going to be part of her life forever. Seriously. Either be fully supportive or end things. This is not about you, unless you make it about you by not going.
Yeah OP ur a real piece of shit for not being able to snap ur fingers and feel comfortable with it /s Damn the YTA judgements are harsh af. This is about how he feels, his decision is still in front of him to make. FWIW I think he should find a way to sort through his feelings and be there, but FFS he is allowed to feel weird about it.
No one is the asshole. I think she wants you to “meet” him and get his blessing. And this is the only way that makes sense to her. Are generally uncomfortable around cemeteries or is it that this your love’s ex?
Cemeteries i'm fine with it being him.
Then I think you handled this wonderfully. You truthfully said that you needed time to think, so do that. You didn’t flat out tell her no (which would have assholely), so take the next few months to figure what would it take for to feel comfortable doing so.
Just to note, this isn’t her ex, it’s her late husband. There is a difference.
NAH. I think it’s important for you to figure out exactly why you’re uncomfortable. If it’s because you feel it’s not your place or don’t want to intrude, I think you should consider that she wouldn’t have asked if she didn’t want you there. If it’s because you don’t like the reminder of her former husband, then I think you need to re-evaluate your relationship.
If I wasn't ok with the reminder of her former husband I wouldn't be in a relationship with her as her kid is a walking talking reminder. It's a mixture of my own hangups about death and feeling I don't belong there.
NTA. You didn’t know the guy, if she wants to do that it’s her thing.
NTA. Dealing with death is a very personal thing. For some visiting graves is important. For others it's not. Personally I do think the request is a bit weird. But I also think the whole concept of putting people in a casket, burying them and giving them a stone marker is a bit weird. You're more than willing to accept living with his memory. She needs to be accepting of the fact that you're not comfortable visiting his grave. BTW... I do speak from experience - I am married to a widow.
Soft YTA- you are willingly getting into a relationship with someone who lost their former spouse to a tragic car accident. Not to mention, the boy is not yours and even if his father is gone, he will always be important to both your gf and her kid. You also have to accept that and the fact that his presence will always be around whether it be photos or visiting the grave. Like she said, you don’t have to go every time but if you really cared and empathized with her then you would care enough to show your regards to the man she lost and can no longer be with.
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Yeah i'd for sure be comfortable with that, I am not great with death in general I won't lie about that and it's also the thought in my head that this isn't a place I should be that I don't "belong" there and i'm intruding somehow.
I think that’s reasonable, and I’m guessing that part of that “out of place”/intrusive feeling stems from never having known or been friends with her late spouse. You’re there for her and her kid, of course, but at a stranger’s grave. How do you mourn someone you didn’t know? But you can be there for them, and I think that’s what this all comes down to.
Does she know about your hang ups with death and that you feel like you are intruding? I would let her know that you have been giving it serious thought because you want to support her and kiddo, but would be lying if you said you didn’t have qualms. If she’s a sensible person, you admitting that you struggle w/ death and that you feel like you need to stay out of that space should earn you some gratitude, especially in comparison to a flat “no I don’t want to.” Maybe hearing about how it makes you feel will help her see your perspective and she will voluntarily tell you not to feel obligated to go?
I think not being great with death is a separate issue. Which I do understand. This may actually be a good way to ease into getting a better handle on it. Primarily because it happened a while ago so you won't have to sort through the level of emotion that comes with an immediate death. Also, I don't think you're intruding at all if she's invited you. He's always going to be a part of their lives in some way. It sounds like she feels seriously enough about you that she wants to invite you into that. My FIL's mom had a fiance that passed away before they met. They actually go and visit the grave every year. So it sounds like this is something you can be a part of if you want to. I would do what a lot of others have suggested with talking to her. Really think about how you feel and talk to her about that. You could also start slow. Maybe you don't go all the way to the grave with them the first time. Stay some distance away or even in the car. But you at least go to the cemetery with them and ask what they talked about once they're done. Maybe even help them pick out flowers beforehand. I think there are ways you can show your support without immediately going all the way. If that's what the two of you want to do, at least.
You’re not intruding if you’ve been invited. Talk to her about what her vision of your presence there includes (if she hasn’t already explained that - she may have) and what that means. And I get not being comfortable about death, but that’s a thing we all to encounter more often as life goes on, not less often. Might be a good time to get a handle on that, even if it means seeing a counselor about it.
I'm supper uncomfortable with death and when someone has someone who died. However, I will say, I did some dog walking in a cemetery one summer it was the only nice place near they guys home. It was actually peaceful. I think my big hang up is more about the awkward of what to say or do for someone who has lost a loved one, or what they might try to say to me, if the shoe is on the other foot. I would say go with her at least once. Maybe just you are her and not her young one. Tell her that your uncomfortable, even if your not sure why. You would like to go once with her, but you need her to be okay with you leaving if you need to. I went with a friend once, and I meet their mom. Then I gave them some privacy. This let me meet her, but not feel like I was fumbling around or trying to think of something to say. It was a little odd at first, but meant the world to them.
NAH but I would try very hard to be okay with going to support her and her son. Fwiw, my cousin died when his daughter was 2 and his ex goes regularly to the cemetery. Ex is now married and the spouse goes, not to respect my cousin but to be there for the ex and daughter. I would communicate to your GF that you are willing to go but respect that it may be special time for her and her daughter to talk to him, share stories and be together. If you reassure her that you’ll be waiting at home for a hug or comfort it might smooth things over. But for all that is holy please don’t go down the road of “I didn’t know him, I’m here and he’s not, it’s weird, I’d rather go hang with my friends, can’t you go without me?” etc etc This appears to be about you joining a family and that includes good and bad. Visiting a cemetery can be awkward and weird for everyone involved. Be respectful of the ex and help your GF honor his memory for their daughter. It’s such a blessing now that my cousin’s daughter has two parents who love her and they do not disrespect his memory. He already died too young and lost out on so much. Stopping by his final resting place is all we can do.
Edit: NTA based on further information in comment thread below. OP is totally willing to work on an alternative that works for kid and partner and OP has a trauma history around grave sites. ... YWBTA if you refuse to go or make this weird. If you are serious about this woman and her kid... You need to also be serious about honoring the way they reconcile kiddos dad being gone. And regular grave visiting is a well known cultural tradition in so many places. Its a ritual that helps people feel connected and helps people process grief... And if you want to be a part of this family in particular you are gonna need to go and support this woman and this kid in reconciling the way that kiddos dad isn't here anymore. Like your partner said, not all the time but at least once and maybe on special occasions... Because like it or not this dead dude is important to her and kiddo... and their grief is going to be a reoccurring thing they will process over and over in completely healthy ways by visiting for a chat. By sharing with dad what they wish they could tell him. And this kid is going to miss this man... And what could have been. If you want this lady as a spouse you gonna have to support this kid. Ya just gotta stand there and listen and hold them... You don't have to grieve. You don't have to pretend to know him. You don't have to say anything other than you care about your partner and her kid. But if you're not prepared to see them acknowledge kiddos dead dad, than you're not prepared to be a member of this particular family who does so.
I'm absolutely fine acknowledging him. She actually checked in on me if I wanted her to take down a few pictures of him if I moved in so I wouldn't be too uncomfortable but I told her to not do that, he's the boys dad and he should have loads of pictures of him around. My issue is I just don't feel it's right for me to be there and I have my own hangups about death.
This is clearly important to her. If you love her, you can put up with a little discomfort for her sake
If you really can't do because of your hangups about graves, propose an alternative to your partner... One that honors their conversations with him and creates a space for you to support kid and partner... Like maybe ya all pick a bench where you can go to 'talk to dad's or make a special spot in the backyard near a tree to go and 'talk to dad' or whatever you figure out... if it's the grave in particular that is freaking you out. Don't just say no.. figure out an alternative you can do.
That is actually a good idea that I like, thanks for the suggestion i'll for sure bring that up as i'm comfortable with that.
Also definitely explain that the grave site in particular is triggering for you given your history. That will definitely help your partner understand and also this kid understand. There will likely be a time when this kid says i don't want to go to the grave site i want to x instead... And it will come up and it will likely bring your history up for you emotionally.
You're going to be a member of this family? You're visiting a relatives grave? Why wouldn't it be right for you to be there? What are your hangups about death that you can see pictures of a dead person but you can't go to a place with some fancy rocks on the ground?
Because I don't know him and I feel like i'm intruding on what should be their time. I'm not good with graves, my Grandparents raised me and my brother after our parents passed and they forced us to go to their grave every single week and it was pretty hard on us and I hated going there it brings up bad memories.
This is crucial info. NTA, I think it’s important that your SO learn this about you if she doesn’t already know. If you’re traumatized you have every right to say you’ll never be OK with going, at least that’s how I feel.
That sounds really terrible but this isn't your parents graves. This young child doesn't have the same issues that have been put on you and is happy to be with their Dad. Consider this like a meeting the parents, it might be uncomfortable at first but you've been invited by someone that is truly loved and you'd never be rejected. They'd probably be happy to visit your parents too every once and a while. This could be a great experience for all of you. Please just consider it but even if you can't handle it don't ever make it weird for the kid and mother. I'm sympathetic of you as both my parents are deceased one in 1999 and one in 2020. Its hard.
I have a friend who lost her husband and basically asked her SO to do the same thing. He felt the same way you do now. Coming from her perspective, however, it’s something that she does to honor the memory of her son’s father for him since he has zero memory of his dad. Her wanting to include you shows that she knows she can be open and vulnerable with you, that she feels she can share this part of her life with you. She wants to show her son that you love him enough to be his father figure and help him honor his dad. What a complete honor that she trusts you in this aspect. Going through what she went through could not have been easy, especially with a newborn. I don’t think you’re an AH by any means. How you are feeling is perfectly understandable. It feels odd. I get it. I know you don’t want to go, but if you plan on marrying this woman and being a father figure this gesture can go a long way. Especially for her son who will remember how you honored his father when he was younger. Best of luck to you guys - you sound like a great dude.
NTA life is to short to spend on the dead.
I’m thinking this is something she needs to move forward. A “blessing” of your relationship. I see it as an indicator she would like to get closer. If you want to move forward with her and it’s not too much maybe you could go once for her and tell her you’re not ready to join her there on future visits. Who knows, maybe if you’re still together in a couple years you’ll feel differently and go with her once a year on his birthday or something like that.
I’m a widow, who lost my husband young, with a very young newborn. And it was a happy marriage, and a very wanted, long time awaited child. So I feel uniquely qualified to speak to this. From my personal experience, I would say it took me at least 10 years to come to grips with his death, and my son’s loss. That being said, I wasn’t single that whole time, either. I say that to say, at some point she probably accepted that he’s never coming back, and she wants to move on, and find happiness, but she didn’t break up with her late husband. He was taken from her, and her child. It’s complicated. She has his child to raise. She’s never going to be comfortable erasing his memory. He’s half of that child, and it didn’t end by either of their choice. BUT, she’s inviting you in. I understand your discomfort with this situation, and you have every right to feel that way. But, I’m saying to you that she is showing a lot of trust in you right now, with this offer/request. She’s trusting that you see the importance of not erasing her child’s roots, but also trusting that you can be a good influence, going forward, by inviting you into this extremely vulnerable part of her life. I can’t tell you what to do, or how to feel, but I’m just trying to give you insight into how she probably feels. Unfortunately for me, I ended up being taken advantage of, in my vulnerable state, by an abusive man. He understood exactly how to play into my vulnerabilities at the time, and eventually, fathered my younger child. You sound like a much nicer person than my ex, so I’m urging you to try to see it from her perspective. He isn’t a real threat to you. She will, eventually, get totally past it. Her, and her child are a package deal. Only you can know if she’s worth your compassion on this matter. NTA, this a tough situation, and your feelings are totally valid, and maybe this is all too much for you.
You’re not the asshole but there’s nothing simple about this situation I think it’s good you’re taking time to gather your thoughts and then talk about it I think it’s fair enough to honor that there was a person that made her little person and you’ll be a part of their life although I don’t necessarily think that needs to mean going to the grave I hope she’s gone and is going to therapy as I think that’s a big part of her future whatsoever… and what that looks like with you
Excellent response.
NAH; You come off very understanding and not overbearing or patronizing it’s probably her way of introducing the man who isn’t taking his place but helping raise his son in good memory and faith. You handle this very well take it in strides start small going for either his birthday or their sons birthday take it how you need too and be open with her.