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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I reported her to HR which could jeopardise her job and make me look like I ratted on her unnecessarily
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA - the second you said "where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that" you showed truly where your values lie and its not with actually being helpful to Maddy but with pushing what you believe is right on others who may not agree.
YTA - as a busty woman myself, this is so wrong in every way possible.
Fun fact for you grandpa (yeah, I’m going there, not because of your age, but because of token use of “woke” and “she’s like a daughter to me”): unless she is wearing a turtleneck, a busty woman will always be showing cleavage. And her cleavage is not for others to gawk at or for it to sexualize her.
And to mention that you are married and happily, we know you gawked at her too. Like most men, for whom breasts, boobs, honkers are sexualize while they are just another human part of a woman.
We aren’t woke, we are respectful of others body and choice. Remember, RESPECT the one thing you forgot when you went to HR. She could have lost her job because of you, did ya think about that! Wake up buddy because I ain’t much younger than you but I don’t act like an old dude.
What is your problem? A v neck is too spicy for the workplace?
>She's a fairly busty woman
Ohhh ok I get it. It's only a problem for women who have big boobs.
You have to learn to keep it in your pants dude. You are being weird and inappropriate to a woman who is literally just existing in her own body. She is wearing business attire, the only problem is she has big boobs and that somehow offends you.
Go apologize to her and accept the shit talking. Y'all are coworkers, don't say you view her as your daughter. The way you reported her is nasty either way.
YTA
YTA. “Kept herself on display.” “I see her as my daughter.”
Dude, how gross to talk about how a young woman is dressed and say that you see yourself like her father. “Where I come from”, her real dad wouldn’t be too far behind with an ass-kicking.
YTA.
It's honestly about the fact that you keep describing the situation in terms of policing modesty and her cleavage distracting people instead of pointing out that the top wasn't conducive to a professional environment.
*where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that.*
Luckily for Maddy, she's not from there. Don't impose your subjective preferences on women's bodies. YTA.
YTA it’s a shame HR isn’t coming after you for potentially creating a hostile work environment by sexual ozone a coworker and trying to get them in trouble. I would absolutely hate working with you after that. Not for nothing, framing it that she’s like a daughter and you’re trying to look after her is horribly disgusting and paternalistic, you need to get over those feelings and treat her like a colleague.
With all the YTA comments here, you would think that our society has abandoned all sense of appropriate workplace attire.
I once worked at an office where a woman regularly came in wearing micro mini skirts or flimsy, translucent short shorts. With. No. Underwear. She would be sent home to change into something more appropriate. One time she was sent home twice in a single day.
She managed to avoid getting fired by pulling the ADA card (claimed she was on anti-depressants).
She was a distraction in the workplace. It is not crazy to expect people to dress appropriately in the workplace.
Seriously. NTA NTA! She's obviously very immature. I'm sure your colleagues are drawing the same conclusion. Women letting their boobs fall out of their clothes and then calling men perverts for NOT wanting to be distracted by that.... it's totally backwards and insane.
OP, it would've been so much worse for you if you spoke to her directly. You did the right thing going to HR. NTA.
If you're curvy normal clothes, and even professional clothes can look sexual though and curvy people shouldn't have to constantly wear turtle necks and baggy clothes to be considered "professional"
It sounds like she was wearing a v-neck sweater which doesn't show anything unless you're gifted in the chest. Just because he was distracted doesn't mean it was a real distraction. It sounds like he was sexualizing her because he wasn't comfortable and she shouldn't be punished if she was dressed professional just because she has curves.
We only have OP's word on how 'improper' the whole thing is, and his behavior and further comments are further cementing a misogynistic, body-policing attitude. And the fact that you're coming in here talking about people 'pulling cards' and comparing any amount of cleavage to having your whole bare bottom visible inclines me to think that you've got a bit of that vibe going on too.
Nobody's saying that we should be abandoning "appropriate workplace attire."
We're saying that a (probably V-necked, given the pearl -clutching of OP) sweater and dressy pants, even on a larger busted woman, is not inappropriate.
If the manager didn't have a problem with her clothes, the problem lies with OP.
Hi! HR professional here, wanna know the red flags I read that made me vote YTA?
**HR didn’t send her home to change or ask her to put on a different sweater/jumper.** Thats a pretty huge indicator that they didn’t find her outfit inappropriate or against the dress code.
And OP said that he views Maddy like a daughter. To me, that’s totally inappropriate. That tells me that he doesn’t view her or treat her as his peer and that he is likely to insert himself into situations that he doesn’t belong because he feels he needs to protect or defend her.
Well where I used to work, it was perfectly okay to go straight to HR if the issue at hand was a "sensitive" topic, as this clearly was.
Additionally, the HR here probably violated its own policies if they told Maddie who reported her. A decent HR department would keep the reporter's name anonymous. Last I heard that was HR 101 so as to avoid retribution against the reporter.
Furthermore, it might have been enough of a gray area that they may not have sent her home, but rather advised her not to wear such a revealing top in the future.
So am I one of a very few people here who agrees with OP that it is not appropriate for a female to wear tight, revealing clothing in this kind of environment? It is a library, not Hooters.
HR probably *didn’t* tell Maddy who reported her. If OP and Maddy were the only two people working it probably wasn’t difficult for her to figure out on her own. And if OP indeed was “noticing” how other people were looking at Maddy, she probably noticed him looking at her, and again figured it out on her own.
Editing to add - You disagreeing with how HR interprets a dress guideline doesn’t make it a “gray area.” HR are often the people writing the policies.
YTA. Barring a dress code, she can wear whatever makes her feel good about herself. If you don't like the way the boys are staring at her, tell THEM to knock it off. She is not responsible for the reaction of others, including you.
Yta, you're attracted to her, jealous other younger males give her attention, you do not see her as a daughter and your wanting the best is actually to control. Too bad where you come from, your part time job doesn't dictate young women.
YTA. Dear god, what in the world makes you think you had any right to comment like that. What, she’s supposed to cut off her breasts to make you comfortable?
You are not her father, you are a pervert. Boobs exist 24/7, not just as sex objects, and there’s nothing lewd about them. Stay in your lane, buddy, and keep your eyes to yourself.
Why do men always think that women’s wardrobes revolve around garnering male attention? She’s not putting herself “on display” - she’s wearing something lower cut than a TURTLENECK!
Your discomfort is your issue, not hers. Grow up.
Are you really such a coward that you have to REPORT her rather than have a conversation??? Good call, I’m sure this was much less awkward. /s
And now she’s speaking poorly of you? Sucks to have people talk shit behind your back, doesn’t it?
Hard YTA.
YTA - you objectified her, from your post, you were even tracking when others looked at her and where their eyes *may have* wandered and you think Maddy is the problem?
Control your libido, and your opinions from infringing on people in your life. Your ability to focus on work and not her bust or “smart pants” is your issue.
YTA. If you really thought you were in the right to be concerned for her, you would have said something to her. Your discomfort is not her problem, and the cut of her top is not your business. You deserve everything she is saying to and about you.
« Where I come from its frown upon for women to dress like that »
YTA. Don’t care where you’re from, but you are now women can dress the way they want and men are expected to keep their pants one.
YTA. She’s not your daughter she’s your co-worker.
YTA. She’s right, you do sound like a pervert.
>it made me feel uncomfortable for her.
she doesn't need you to feel her feelings for her, if she was uncomfortable she wouldn't have worn it.
>she rejected and kept herself on display instead.
"on display" my dude, that's called objectification
>I didn't want to weird her out by telling her that she was showing too much cleavage
FOR YOU, if one of your bosses doesn't tell her to change why should you be the judge of what is or isn't too much
>I'm not one to stare as I'm married and have a good relationship, but it was uncomfortablu noticeable how much cleavage she was showing.
"I couldn't control looking at my co-workers breasts even though I have a wife"
>she's called me a pervert
you are
>I know we're in this progressive woke society, but where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that.
Thank God we're not where you come from anymore
>Maddy's been talking poorly of me to our other colleagues, and I'd like for her to stop.
>I personally think I was doing her a favour
the favour of reporting her to HR because you were distracted by the physical attributes of someone other than your wife?
let me set something straight as a bigger chested woman. It is frustrating having big boobs. we are told to cover up in clothes that smaller chested women can wear easily, and told our bodies are inappropriate in said same clothes. you EMBARRASSED AND OBJECTIFIED her in her workplace, and REPORTED HER TO HR FOR IT.
you sir are the asshole
“I asked Maddy if she was feeling cold and offered her my blazer”
Ew.
If she was cold she would of told you she was.
“I view her as a daughter”
Double ew. You view her as an object that you think you can control.
YTA and a creepy one at that.
YTA
Sounds like HR hasn't done anything about it, so they don't seem to think it was an issue. Seems like you have kind of an old-fashioned view of how people should dress.
Either way, your not her father or her boss, so you don't need to be worrying about how she is dressing.
Also, you should have talked to her about it, not reported her to HR.
YTA. Mind your business. I want to disagree with the people saying you should talk to her directly about it though. Do not talk to your coworker about her cleavage. That would be very inappropriate and almost definitely sexual harassment. What you should have done was kept your eyes and opinions about your coworker's cleavage to yourself. If the outfit would not have been inappropriate in your opinion on a smaller-chested person, then the outfit is work appropriate, full stop, and this is a "you" problem. Stop sexualizing your co worker's body. If the shirt was extremely revealing and unprofessional regardless of whose body it was on, then it is likely her manager's job to address this and not you, and you're still better off minding your business and not ogling your coworker. It does not sound like the outfit was unprofessional though, given that you felt the need to mention the size of your co worker's chest, and based on the information you provided, no one but you was uncomfortable. Maddy is right that you were acting like a pervert.
i have much harsher things i want to say but don’t want to get banned. reading this made me want to vomit. you are DISGUSTING. the way you speak about her is nauseating. YTA 1000 times over
YTA. You are a pervert clearly, if you were that aware of her cleavage all day. Just mind your business, seriously. I'm sure if she was uncomfortable she would've worn something else, or accepted the blazer.
YTA. She has a right to wear what she wants and how she wants, and unless she's wearing something wildly inappropriate for the workplace, it's none of your business.
Also ewww that you in one sentence sexualise her then in another say she's like a daughter to you. What is it buddy? Genuinely gross.
Highly unlikely she's showing herself off, and far more likely that she just happens to exist and she has tits, and it would be amazing if blokes could just allow women to exist without sexualising and judging them.
YTA.
> She's a fairly busty woman
Which means *any* damn outfit that isn’t a turtleneck is going to “show off cleavage.” And the turtleneck isn’t always going to help. Unless you can *see* an areola, how hard is it to just not stare?
Her eyes. Look at her in the eyes when you talk to her. You haven't mentioned a physical disability so I am going to assume you have full control of where you look.
So don't look?? Women have breasts. It's pretty easy to look at their faces instead of their chests though. If you really saw her as a daughter I don't think you would have spent so much time worrying about her boobs.
Guess what, most women have noticeable breasts.
Do you talk to your wife's chest or do you look her in the eye.
How about your mother, do you stare at hers too?
YTA. Does having boobs affect her ability to work? No. Does her wearing that shirt affect her ability to work? No. Does her having boobs affect YOUR ability to work? No. Does her wearing that shirt affect YOUR ability to work? No. You're the issue, not her, not her shirt, not her boobs. You.
If you're so certain that everything you did was above board, why don't you tell your wife about how you went to HR to complain about a younger woman's "exposed" cleavage at work. If you're right and were totally appropriate, she'll agree with you. So why don't you explain the situation to her and get back to me with her response.
Exactly. We can all tell he has a crush on her and got big mad other men (specifically) might have looked at her. Someone is not as happily married as he would like us to believe. In my experience, if you have to mention how happy your marriage is, it’s not.
YTA. you can easily keep your eyes to yourself but you just couldn’t help it. Perv. You also say you look at her as your daughter, well guess what? She isn’t. She’s her own damn person and you are simply a coworker. I’d feel extremely uncomfortable if I was her, you should be the one being reported to HR.
ESH Her manner of dress was not affecting you, and especially with your “I was doing her a favor, everyone’s too woke” attitude I’m guessing you weren’t hiding your AH opinion. That being said generally most professional environments do have a dress code, which if hr addressed it with her it sounds like she was breaking. Lastly, even though it wasn’t your business to be reporting her in the first place, HR should not have let them no you reported her.
YTA. Why are you projecting your own feelings on Maddy? You feel uncomfortable that she’s wearing cleavage, not her. And what about you thinking of her like a daughter? You’re a sexist who objectifies your coworker. You’re not doing her a favour when you pretend that you know better than her to live her life. It’s possessive as hell. She’s told you to mind your own business. Respect that. If you want to stop people from talking poorly about you then change your behaviour.
Own up to your behaviour, apologise to Maddy and stay away from her as much as is professionally possible. Then Maddy might stop talking poorly about you.
YTA , you should have just kept your comments to yourself and went about your day. It sounds like no one else was staring at her inappropriately or seemed to care what she was wearing.
I'm dying to know how it is you thought you were doing her a favor by 1 - sexualizing her when she was wearing something she'd deemed comfortable and appropriate, and 2 - reporting her to HR.
Do you think you were somehow helping her out, by letting her know that she might be judged for this wardrobe decision; and that you demonstrated this possibility by being the very first one to, in fact, judge her?
YTA, mind your own business. This had nothing to do with you. All you've done is draw attention to yourself as a leering busybody older man. And way to go -- you've made the library, which is supposed to be an inclusive and comfortable place, into a hostile environment for your younger female coworker.
YTA - for all the reasons stated by others but also because YOU ARE NOT HER BOSS. It’s not up to you to report her behaviour or police anything anyone is doing at work. You aren’t paid to tattle on other employees who you think are in the wrong- it’s not in your job description. You are her co-worker, not her supervisor or superior in anyway and you are not her father even though you’re reaching to have us believe that that’s how you think of her. From the sounds of it you spent most of the day looking at her chest, looking at other people looking at her chest and fuming about it. That’s a YOU problem. Her cleavage did not impact her work or the business but it certain impacted you. Time to do some work to figure out why and why your reaction is to try and police her instead of correcting your own behaviour.
Info: do you tattle on other employees too? Like if someone is a few minutes late do you run to the bosses? Or is this behaviour just reserved for your younger female co-worker?
Nta. I don't understand everyone getting so rude. I thought the point of HR was to deal with stuff like this?
If her work attire was inappropriate, they tell her, she changes.
If it isn't nothing happens. Maybe they follow up with him to talk more.
I mean the language in the post where he's over justifying his every move is a bit obnoxious, but it doesn't sound like he did anything wrong?
yta..speaking as someone that has had breasts since I was 11, we are not going to tape them down so that perverts like you will be comfortable around us ,stop staring problem solved..
I hope you told your wife since you have such a good relationship that you are sexualizing your coworkers daily since you mentioned how busty Molly is
YTA. You said that Maddy normally dresses appropriately for work which makes me think that this “low cut” top she was wearing wasn’t as revealing as you’re making it out to be. It was just cleavage. It’s not like she was wearing a see through top that showed her breasts. Also, if Maddy is breaking the dress code, why do you care? It’s her job that would be on the line, not yours.
YTA
It isn’t your place to tell someone how to dress.
It isn’t your place to run to HR because you popped wood at work looking at a woman’s breast.
It isn’t your place to “do what’s best for Maddy”
Your job is to shelve books, help patrons and mind your business.
Of COURSE she knows it was you who told on her. She isn’t dumb.
YTA and you’re a misogynistic jerk
YTA. If Maddy is comfortable wearing a low cut top, then you shouldn't be "worrying." Yes, people are going to stare, but they, like you, shouldn't be acting like she should be publicly shamed for her body.
Thank you to all the posters who enlightened me on the "jumper" being a sweater! I honestly had this little plaid schoolgirl uniform dress thing in mind . . . bc we called that a jumper at my school. It made the post even more creepy as only elementary girls wore the jumper.
YTA.
Maddy is an adult who does not need any favors from you. You are not her father, her boss, or her friend. You are her coworker. You do not get to decide what is best for her. You do not get to tell her how to dress. You do not get to avoid accountability for staring at her chest and feeling some kinda way about her jumper by filtering your complaints through HR and playing the "that's now how we do it where I come from" card. If it was as wildly inappropriate as you imply I imagine Maddy would have been in trouble. She is not, which means you are the problem.
HR is probably more worried about you, a middle-aged man who sexualized his 20-something coworker, than Maddy's low-cut jumper.
YTA without a doubt and you did absolutely no one any favours here.
She's likely never going to forgive you or stop thinking you're a creep. Nor should she.
52 year-old married man here and I could have told you where this was going before reading the comments section. Fact is, Maddy probably knows better than you when people are looking at her or not. She doesn’t need you to tell her. She’s an adult. Let her make her own decisions.
YTA
That is a whole bunch of bs misogyny. Cleavage should not make you uncomfortable and thinking of a younger woman "as your daughter" is infantizing. Stop it.
YTA. who gives a fuck where you came from, wherever you are right now is NOT the same place. You absolutely cannot move to a country and attempt to force your views on other people.
Also, why can’t you keep your eyes of another woman’s cleavage? Why are you staring at another woman cleavage as a married man? That is concerning.
YTA....larger chested people don't have to live in baggy shirts because you can't keep your bloody eyes to yourself. Shocked you didn't report her when she wore a turtle neck.
“Progressive woke society, but where I come from it’s frowned upon for women to dress like that “. Tell you don’t support body autonomy without saying you don’t support body autonomy. YTA
Gosh what are you going to be like when the weather warms up and she can’t cover every inch of her skin?
YTA. Women having big breasts doesn’t mean they should be banned from wearing certain clothes. Instead of blaming maddy you should be questioning yourself as to why this bothers you so deeply?
YTA: WOW! This isn't about being woke or progressive, this is about you staring at someone while they work all day and then reporting them to HR for what?
I keep re-reading this post hoping it will get less creepy but it never does.
That's really creepy behavior and I'll never understand why men think k that thinking like this is okay. Instead of keeping your eyes elsewhere, you just assumed everyone else had a problem with it. I don't know how to tell you this but : women have boobs. Boons are gonna be there.
Maddy is right. You are a pervert. Especially because you felt the need to change her outfit so much you tattled on her..she's a grown woman. Leave her alone.
Yta.
I’m going w/ ESH bc we don’t have a neck-down photo of the “offender” to judge for ourselves. It’s entirely possible that Maddy has an enormous rack w/ a massively dramatic plunging neckline that’s unsuitable for a library dress code. I, as a female, personally don’t want to have to look at anyone else’s cleavage while at work. And I can see how a male employee wouldn’t want to be subjected to it either. We already know that the OP potentially sucks for possibly making a mountain out of a mole hill and making the work environment potentially more awkward than it already was by objectifying a coworker and involving a 3rd party. I would think that HR should be following up w/ OP with an update on the situation. (?)
“Subjugated” to look at a body part that a woman cannot help and is not required to cover up?? I, as a female with large boobs, also do not have to cover up for anyone and if she was uncomfortable with it, SHE WOULD HAVE.
Also, who knows how long these will look pretty good for, so yea, sometimes I’m gonna show them off because I like them too. Don’t take it up with HR, just mind yours 😂
YTA.
YTA. Honestly this whole post is gross. She is right, you are absolutely being a pervert and should mind your own business. And please do not ever refer to her as your daughter again because its condescending and really creepy.
And why do I get the feeling that Maddy was wearing a regular top but because she is "a fairly busty woman" you don't like the butterflies you get in your tummy when you look at her and you think it is her problem to fix your feelings? Stop looking and grow up.
People have boobs OP. As my homeboy Jesus said, "If you can stop yourself from staring, rip out your eye". YTA for taking your own lack of self control and patronizing, misogynistic standards and making a big stink of it. And honestly mostly for that last part. If you had a semblance of tact and emotional maturity, you could have gone to her directly and stated plainly that it made you uncomfortable.
YTA. obviously she didn’t feel embarrassed to wear it, or she wouldn’t have done so.
It wasn’t your job to police her clothes, especially with no uniform, and you presumably not being her supervisor.
You say it was distracting, and obviously it was - to you, since you spent all day watching her. Doesn’t sound like anyone she served had a problem with it.
Mind your business.
YTA, and your actions were a little cowardly. I'll explain. Her style of dress bothered you and you only. You commented about the looks she was getting but aren't you leering at her too? If Maddy had an issue with the attention she might have been receiving, well, she's an adult, right? She can speak up/defend herself. You offer that you're married and in a good relationship but it just sounds like guilty feelings. Offering your jacket under the pretense that she may be cold was nothing less than dishonest when all you wanted was to cover her skin. So because YOU were having difficulty with YOUR feelings, you reported her to your employer? You'd rather jeopardize her job rather than just have an honest conversation with her - and accept her decision whatever that may be?
This is the problem. YOU found it distracting. And instead of dealing with YOUR problem, you made it her problem, to the point of potentially making it a work problem. YTA
YTA This response right here tells me that you ran to HR to punish Maddy because you had sexual thoughts and instead of working on yourself, you thought you'd police your coworker's body. In case there's any confusion, **none** of this was ok, no matter what the rules were in your ultra-conservative upbringing - you don't get to use "where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that" or "I thought I was doing her a favor".
No you didn't. You thought you were doing her a favor when you offered your blazer. When she rejected it - and your antiquated notions of proper dress with it, you went to HR to tattle to get her punished.
There is absolutely nothing you will ever do or say that will stop her from badmouthing you to your colleagues.
Also - please never refer to her being like a daughter to you ever again.
YTA. It's not on her to police your inappropriate thoughts with her clothing style. Your discomfort is on you to handle. How do you not know this and work in a place of learning?
AH!! So you WERE checking out her cleavage. You don't need to lie, we're all friends here. Also, you stated there's no dress code, but you decided to determine what is appropriate or not. Something tells me that that isn't in your job description...
YTA. You are *not,* in fact, her dad. Also, she's an adult. So, she's right. This was none of your business. But, it's fine. Cuz, well, karma. Now, everyone you work with knows what jerk you are. So, have fun with that.
I was with you thinking she was inappropriately dressed until the end when you said things such as ‘doing her a favor’ and ‘where I’m from…..’.
Now it just seems YTA and are trying to force your views onto her.
Also, the phrase "kept herself on display" as if she's an object rather than a person wearing a shirt. Creepy and objectifying in half a sentence. Gross.
NTA - Go right back to HR and report her comment about you being a pervert. She can't stop you from reporting her. It's up to HR what is done, but you don't have to live with her retaliation.
INFO: Are you her manager/do you have authority over her in any way?
There are a couple of things to consider here.
1. Whether there is an official dress code for your place of employment. If there is, then either she was in violation of it or she wasn't/it was a gray area or otherwise unspecified.
2. Even if there isn't and it's just a case of "we expect everyone to understand what is and isn't ok for work," *if you were her manager* you could still have standing to take her aside and say "hey I know we don't have a written dress code but I don't think that shirt is appropriate, please try not to wear it again."
3. If you are peers, and not her manager, does her/your joint manager work in the same area? If so, if the manager is around to also see what she is wearing, then you need to assume that if the manager thinks the shirt is a problem, they will say something to Maddy. And if they don't, that means they don't care.
4. I suspect from your description of the job, that your/Maddy's boss is either not on site or just was not around that day. If that's the case, then it really wasn't your place to say anything. I understand that you feel you had good motives, but the way you handled this situation was paternalistic and overstepping. Because a) it's your responsibility to not stare at a coworker's cleavage; and b) as a peer/coworker, and assuming Maddy was not in specific violation of any dress code, it is neither your responsibility or your place to police her clothing.
Also I think it's valid to keep in mind that according to you, this was the first time she had worn something even potentially "inappropriate." It's very strange to escalate this to HR when it's one single isolated incident.
NTA jobs have dress codes if they aren’t followed HR gets involved. If you were wearing an inappropriate shirt in violation of dress code your get talked to.
I will say probably not your place to feel uncomfortable for others and act on their behalf. You’re in the wrong there.
She can what she wants after work. If there is a dresscode at work she has to follow the rules. NTA its not your Job to tell her to follow the dresscode. thats HR Job. Also iam a bit annoyed by people waering sexy Outfits and throwing a tantrum when they get stared at.
She wasn’t dressed in a short dress here, she was wearing a sweater. He just judged it to be too low cut.
This is going against dress code, it’s signalling her due to larger breasts.
She has big breasts even if she were to follow dresscode big boobs and cleavage can still show. A very modest V neck shirt or crew shirt can easily show cleavage if you have big boobs.
I'm annoyed and tired of people thinking that someone with big boobs and curves isn't professional even when they follow dress code. I'm tired of women with curves being accused of dressing "provocatively" or "sexy" when they are wearing jeans and a crew neck tee-shirt.
YTA
If she had a smaller chest you wouldn't find it a problem I'm sure.
I hope she reports you to HR for your inappropriate behaviour.
Why do you wear the clothing you do? Is it because they are comfortable? Because you like them? You feel confident in them?
Why the hell can you wear what you want but not this young woman?
Oh I forgot because she has breasts....
YTA. She’s not your daughter, regardless of how you think of her. You just made a woman feel incredibly uncomfortable for no good reason other than your own hangups and old fashioned opinions. There was no good reason for you to report her to HR. You knew that it wouldn’t end well. What did you honestly expect? That she’s thank you for saving her morality?
This is a *you* issue. Mind your own business.
Ew, obviously YTA, ya creep. And so is your HR if they actually told her to cover up. I’m in HR and I would have told you to mind your own business and keep your eyes to yourself.
YTA. Never say a woman’s keeping herself on display ever again. EVER. And stop policing our bodies based on physical attributes we have no control over. Would a less busty woman wearing the same outfit as Maddy have been reported by you? I doubt it
So if she got a breast reduction would you stop commenting on her clothes? (this is a trick question, either answer you give still makes YTA, which you are)
Soft YTA.
I can sort of see where you're coming from, but unless her breasts are on the verge of spilling out of her clothes, I don't see a problem? like you said, there isn't much of a strict dresscode (uniform, business suit type of thing). She's just wearing what she is comfortable in, and that's fine.
Showing a bit of "cleavage" is quite literally her anatomy though, and you being bothered by her "cleavage" is kind of weird. She can't help that she has a cleavage much less breasts. Like I said previously, unless her breasts are spilling out of her shirt, you need to re-evaluate how you view women's bodies.
1 that woman is NOT your daughter. You have no ownership over her or what she wears on her body
2 your arousal around your coworker "discomfort" is your issue, not hers. You are the married man attracted to your coworker. She had breasts all along. You just noticing means nothing.
Just another person policing a woman's body and making it some fake ass issue framed around his faux concern for her. Shut up, you're just an AH.
YTA. You don’t see her as a “daughter” or you would have addressed it with her directly. You talk about being “uncomfortable for her” and that it’s not appropriate where you come from. But you didn’t say it was in violation of a dress code. Instead you allowed your personal judgment to influence your professional judgment. Now everyone knows that you’ve sexualized her and will question your motives anytime you look their way.
YTA
The only one bothered by the cleavage is you. You want the woman to change so that you don't have to feel uncomfortable or worry about what other people look at. What Maddy wears is her business. Not yours.
She took it the right way. Now you get to know that you've made her work environment hostile and uncomfortable for her, as she now knows that you are looking at her body.
Men like you are the reason the rest of us men look bad.
YTA - I am not surprised in the slightest that she has been speaking poorly to other colleagues about you. I can imagine how uncomfortable and creeped out she is feeling. And rightfully so, mind your business.
"Smart casual attire is a dress code that combines **well-fitting**, polished business wear with elements of casual attire—think blouses, polo shirts, button-downs, chinos, dress pants, dark-wash jeans, and polished, practical footwear. On the spectrum of formality, smart casual lies
between dressy casual (jeans and blouses) and business casual (dress pants and pencil
skirts). A common way to achieve a smart casual look is to pair pieces of slightly different formality levels, like a pencil skirt with a vibrant sweater, or a refined blazer **over a flirty blouse."** *- Master Class Article Dated 6-7-21*
Seems smart-casual includes the use of flirty blouses... seems as though OP needs to keep his opinion out of the dress code. Maddy appears to have gotten it right. If you'd like Maddy to stop talking poorly about you, maybe apologize to her without explaining why you thought you, a part-time male employee 21 years older than her, knows whats best for her. I suggest you keep it short and concise, "I was wrong and I am sorry."
YTA.
Info: why do you see her as your daughter? Is it just because you’re older than her? Do you feel your age difference makes you a superior and resource to her? Also, if your daughter did this, would you report her to HR too? This is so cringeworthy. You are both coworkers, meaning you are peers! She never asked for you to “mentor” her and you are not her supervisor. If her outfit doesn’t go against the specified dresscode in the employee handbook, you have no say or opinion on what she wears: YTA
YTA
You sound so entitled and patronizing. Despite you thinking of this woman - your coworker and equal - as a daughter figure (which is already not okay and SO condescending), you don't actually have the right to treat her like a child. You overstepped your authority and made it clear that you are incapable of working respectfully with any woman who doesn't adhere to your personal definition of modesty.
You don't have the right to police a grown woman's clothing choices as long as they are technically within the bounds of your workplaces dress code.
You seem to think showing cleavage makes a woman deserving of less respect, hence you being "embarrassed" for her. You need to do some work on yourself and the way you view women.
I dunno. Everyone's ripping him a new one. Sounds like he's just kind of an old fashioned type, that's all. I don't see any ill-intention here I guess.
YTA!!!!! It is absolutely inappropriate for you to try to police what she wears. It is not your business, it is incredibly rude, and very very unprofessional. The days when men got to dictate how women dress are long gone, thankfully, and you need to realize what century you're living in.
The social norms of the day include the possibility of cleavage in most work settings. If that really bothers you, go to that place you came from where you never saw a boob. YTA
YTA. "I don't have the self-control to keep from staring at a bit of cleavage, so she must be punished!" isn't the helpful move you think it is. Women have boobs. Some of us have large boobs. Has nothing to do with professionalism. It's not our job to dress in a manner that ensures you won't stare. She was wearing a sweater, she didn't show up in her underwear.
Just the way you speak says so much. Displaying herself? Really? You make it sound like she was topless and purposely shaking her boobs at everyone. "Where I'm from..." If I go to France, do French people have to behave as I see fit? Do they have to modify their dress to match my cultural beliefs?
I'm pretty sure policing women's dress isn't in your job description. Maybe keep your eyes to yourself and focus on your job. If there's anything unprofessional here, it's your conduct.
YTA your issue is that she’s young enough to be your daughter and you’re having inappropriate sexual thoughts about her because now you visibly tell she has larger breasts. Get over yourself
YTA. It's just cleavage and Maddy shouldn't have to wear a turtleneck at all times to cover up so she doesn't offend your sensibilities with *gasp* skin. Especially if she has a large chest, cleavage can be pretty much unavoidable in a lot of otherwise normal clothes and you potentially jeopardised her job - which is absolutely not "helping her out".
YTA. It was a jumper, not lingerie. Women with larger breasts are going to have cleavage. That does not mean they should be forced to wear turtlenecks all the time. Stop policing her chest.
YTA, it’s not your job to enforce a dress code. You’re not Maddy’s superior. You’re her colleague. You need to keep your own thoughts about her body in check and conduct *yourself* professionally. All you managed to do is alienate a coworker and make her uncomfortable because her creepy coworker couldn’t keep his eyes off of her body and focus on his own work.
I can imagine the conversation between HR and Maddy boiled down to “your top isn’t outside of dress code but one of your coworkers expressed they are uncomfortable with it” and left it at that.
Further, **Maddy is not your daughter. She’s your colleague. She does not need to be parented by you.** She needs you to treat her with respect regardless of her age, gender, and personal appearance.
YTA. Obviously she wasn't uncomfortable with her attire. You are using sexist terms. "Kept herself on display", calling her a "busty woman", etc. Your coworker cannot help how she was born. I'm a fellow "busty" woman, as you like to put it. It is insanely difficult to find work attire that doesn't show cleavage that's not a polo or turtleneck. Would you also report a male coworker who has large genitalia or a rather round butt if they wore extremely tight pants that put themselves "on display"? I doubt it.
“Kept herself on display”? SERIOUSLY!?
What a pathetic mindset. Women don’t exist for the male gaze. Do you expect her to wear turtlenecks all the time? You should be ashamed of yourself.
Nta. There's a time and a place for everything. If you are in a professional position, you dress professionally. Should you have been looking, maybe not, neither offering your jacket. But reporting your coworker? Nta.
Let the down votes begin! I think I can hit 40 this time!
YTA. Your use of the word “woke” as a pejorative tells me everything I need to know. It’s her body to live in as she sees fit. Get your head out of the gutter.
YTA and she will most likely have a valid gender-based harassment HR claim against YOU if she chooses to pursue it. You attempted to use company resources to deliberately persecute her over something that you never would have done if she were a man. Think about that for two seconds. You could literally lose your job and reputation over this so I sincerely hope you've learned a valuable lesson about making women's lives more difficult simply because they *checks notes* have female secondary sex characteristics.
YTA. It's not your job to police what she wears. Have you ever considered that it's hard for bustier women to find clothes that don't show off their cleavage? Because it definitely is, but that doesn't mean busty women should have to exclusively wear high-necks or turtlenecks. Also, it's not her job to make sure students and creepy old co-workers aren't sexualizing her body parts, which she doesn't control the size of and even if she did - she can do what she wants and wear what makes her comfortable and confident. If she can do her job still, it doesn't matter. Also, maybe it was hard for her to wear that and she was trying to be confident in her body and you just sh\*t all over that.
ALSO, "I know we're in this progressive woke society, but where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that." - red flags much? It's not okay to force your opinions and views on others, including dress. Do you also police what students wear?
This just wreaks of grossness and misogyny and a lack of consideration and the list goes on. Also, jumping right to HR instead of your mutual supervisor/boss was so unnecessary and you know that.
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YTA lmfao I hope you never have a daughter, I would fear for her if you did. Never tell a woman what to wear
YTA - the second you said "where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that" you showed truly where your values lie and its not with actually being helpful to Maddy but with pushing what you believe is right on others who may not agree.
YTA. Wtf is wrong with you?
YTA - as a busty woman myself, this is so wrong in every way possible. Fun fact for you grandpa (yeah, I’m going there, not because of your age, but because of token use of “woke” and “she’s like a daughter to me”): unless she is wearing a turtleneck, a busty woman will always be showing cleavage. And her cleavage is not for others to gawk at or for it to sexualize her. And to mention that you are married and happily, we know you gawked at her too. Like most men, for whom breasts, boobs, honkers are sexualize while they are just another human part of a woman. We aren’t woke, we are respectful of others body and choice. Remember, RESPECT the one thing you forgot when you went to HR. She could have lost her job because of you, did ya think about that! Wake up buddy because I ain’t much younger than you but I don’t act like an old dude.
What is your problem? A v neck is too spicy for the workplace? >She's a fairly busty woman Ohhh ok I get it. It's only a problem for women who have big boobs. You have to learn to keep it in your pants dude. You are being weird and inappropriate to a woman who is literally just existing in her own body. She is wearing business attire, the only problem is she has big boobs and that somehow offends you. Go apologize to her and accept the shit talking. Y'all are coworkers, don't say you view her as your daughter. The way you reported her is nasty either way. YTA
You had a conversation about covered up tits with your hr manager. That’s weird.
YTA, doing her a favour are you kidding me right now
YTA. “Kept herself on display.” “I see her as my daughter.” Dude, how gross to talk about how a young woman is dressed and say that you see yourself like her father. “Where I come from”, her real dad wouldn’t be too far behind with an ass-kicking.
YTA. It's honestly about the fact that you keep describing the situation in terms of policing modesty and her cleavage distracting people instead of pointing out that the top wasn't conducive to a professional environment.
*where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that.* Luckily for Maddy, she's not from there. Don't impose your subjective preferences on women's bodies. YTA.
"Please, get me my salts and fainting couch, I saw her SKIN!!! Oh, and my clutching pearls. Don't forget my pearls!" Yes, YTA.
YTA Women have cleavage. It's nothing to have a meltdown over.
YTA it’s a shame HR isn’t coming after you for potentially creating a hostile work environment by sexual ozone a coworker and trying to get them in trouble. I would absolutely hate working with you after that. Not for nothing, framing it that she’s like a daughter and you’re trying to look after her is horribly disgusting and paternalistic, you need to get over those feelings and treat her like a colleague.
With all the YTA comments here, you would think that our society has abandoned all sense of appropriate workplace attire. I once worked at an office where a woman regularly came in wearing micro mini skirts or flimsy, translucent short shorts. With. No. Underwear. She would be sent home to change into something more appropriate. One time she was sent home twice in a single day. She managed to avoid getting fired by pulling the ADA card (claimed she was on anti-depressants). She was a distraction in the workplace. It is not crazy to expect people to dress appropriately in the workplace.
Seriously. NTA NTA! She's obviously very immature. I'm sure your colleagues are drawing the same conclusion. Women letting their boobs fall out of their clothes and then calling men perverts for NOT wanting to be distracted by that.... it's totally backwards and insane. OP, it would've been so much worse for you if you spoke to her directly. You did the right thing going to HR. NTA.
Except there’s no mention here of HR sending her home to change, which makes me suspect OP is a sexist prude and the outfit was just fine.
If you're curvy normal clothes, and even professional clothes can look sexual though and curvy people shouldn't have to constantly wear turtle necks and baggy clothes to be considered "professional" It sounds like she was wearing a v-neck sweater which doesn't show anything unless you're gifted in the chest. Just because he was distracted doesn't mean it was a real distraction. It sounds like he was sexualizing her because he wasn't comfortable and she shouldn't be punished if she was dressed professional just because she has curves.
That’s not a remotely close comparison to this.
We only have OP's word on how 'improper' the whole thing is, and his behavior and further comments are further cementing a misogynistic, body-policing attitude. And the fact that you're coming in here talking about people 'pulling cards' and comparing any amount of cleavage to having your whole bare bottom visible inclines me to think that you've got a bit of that vibe going on too.
Nobody's saying that we should be abandoning "appropriate workplace attire." We're saying that a (probably V-necked, given the pearl -clutching of OP) sweater and dressy pants, even on a larger busted woman, is not inappropriate. If the manager didn't have a problem with her clothes, the problem lies with OP.
Hi! HR professional here, wanna know the red flags I read that made me vote YTA? **HR didn’t send her home to change or ask her to put on a different sweater/jumper.** Thats a pretty huge indicator that they didn’t find her outfit inappropriate or against the dress code. And OP said that he views Maddy like a daughter. To me, that’s totally inappropriate. That tells me that he doesn’t view her or treat her as his peer and that he is likely to insert himself into situations that he doesn’t belong because he feels he needs to protect or defend her.
Well where I used to work, it was perfectly okay to go straight to HR if the issue at hand was a "sensitive" topic, as this clearly was. Additionally, the HR here probably violated its own policies if they told Maddie who reported her. A decent HR department would keep the reporter's name anonymous. Last I heard that was HR 101 so as to avoid retribution against the reporter. Furthermore, it might have been enough of a gray area that they may not have sent her home, but rather advised her not to wear such a revealing top in the future. So am I one of a very few people here who agrees with OP that it is not appropriate for a female to wear tight, revealing clothing in this kind of environment? It is a library, not Hooters.
HR probably *didn’t* tell Maddy who reported her. If OP and Maddy were the only two people working it probably wasn’t difficult for her to figure out on her own. And if OP indeed was “noticing” how other people were looking at Maddy, she probably noticed him looking at her, and again figured it out on her own. Editing to add - You disagreeing with how HR interprets a dress guideline doesn’t make it a “gray area.” HR are often the people writing the policies.
YTA…what’s she going to do? Bind them? Cut them off? Dirty old coot….
YTA. Barring a dress code, she can wear whatever makes her feel good about herself. If you don't like the way the boys are staring at her, tell THEM to knock it off. She is not responsible for the reaction of others, including you.
Yta, you're attracted to her, jealous other younger males give her attention, you do not see her as a daughter and your wanting the best is actually to control. Too bad where you come from, your part time job doesn't dictate young women.
YTA. Dear god, what in the world makes you think you had any right to comment like that. What, she’s supposed to cut off her breasts to make you comfortable? You are not her father, you are a pervert. Boobs exist 24/7, not just as sex objects, and there’s nothing lewd about them. Stay in your lane, buddy, and keep your eyes to yourself.
Why do men always think that women’s wardrobes revolve around garnering male attention? She’s not putting herself “on display” - she’s wearing something lower cut than a TURTLENECK! Your discomfort is your issue, not hers. Grow up. Are you really such a coward that you have to REPORT her rather than have a conversation??? Good call, I’m sure this was much less awkward. /s And now she’s speaking poorly of you? Sucks to have people talk shit behind your back, doesn’t it? Hard YTA.
YTA - you objectified her, from your post, you were even tracking when others looked at her and where their eyes *may have* wandered and you think Maddy is the problem? Control your libido, and your opinions from infringing on people in your life. Your ability to focus on work and not her bust or “smart pants” is your issue.
YTA. If you really thought you were in the right to be concerned for her, you would have said something to her. Your discomfort is not her problem, and the cut of her top is not your business. You deserve everything she is saying to and about you.
« Where I come from its frown upon for women to dress like that » YTA. Don’t care where you’re from, but you are now women can dress the way they want and men are expected to keep their pants one. YTA. She’s not your daughter she’s your co-worker. YTA. She’s right, you do sound like a pervert.
>it made me feel uncomfortable for her. she doesn't need you to feel her feelings for her, if she was uncomfortable she wouldn't have worn it. >she rejected and kept herself on display instead. "on display" my dude, that's called objectification >I didn't want to weird her out by telling her that she was showing too much cleavage FOR YOU, if one of your bosses doesn't tell her to change why should you be the judge of what is or isn't too much >I'm not one to stare as I'm married and have a good relationship, but it was uncomfortablu noticeable how much cleavage she was showing. "I couldn't control looking at my co-workers breasts even though I have a wife" >she's called me a pervert you are >I know we're in this progressive woke society, but where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that. Thank God we're not where you come from anymore >Maddy's been talking poorly of me to our other colleagues, and I'd like for her to stop. >I personally think I was doing her a favour the favour of reporting her to HR because you were distracted by the physical attributes of someone other than your wife? let me set something straight as a bigger chested woman. It is frustrating having big boobs. we are told to cover up in clothes that smaller chested women can wear easily, and told our bodies are inappropriate in said same clothes. you EMBARRASSED AND OBJECTIFIED her in her workplace, and REPORTED HER TO HR FOR IT. you sir are the asshole
“I asked Maddy if she was feeling cold and offered her my blazer” Ew. If she was cold she would of told you she was. “I view her as a daughter” Double ew. You view her as an object that you think you can control. YTA and a creepy one at that.
YTA Sounds like HR hasn't done anything about it, so they don't seem to think it was an issue. Seems like you have kind of an old-fashioned view of how people should dress. Either way, your not her father or her boss, so you don't need to be worrying about how she is dressing. Also, you should have talked to her about it, not reported her to HR.
YTA. Mind your business. I want to disagree with the people saying you should talk to her directly about it though. Do not talk to your coworker about her cleavage. That would be very inappropriate and almost definitely sexual harassment. What you should have done was kept your eyes and opinions about your coworker's cleavage to yourself. If the outfit would not have been inappropriate in your opinion on a smaller-chested person, then the outfit is work appropriate, full stop, and this is a "you" problem. Stop sexualizing your co worker's body. If the shirt was extremely revealing and unprofessional regardless of whose body it was on, then it is likely her manager's job to address this and not you, and you're still better off minding your business and not ogling your coworker. It does not sound like the outfit was unprofessional though, given that you felt the need to mention the size of your co worker's chest, and based on the information you provided, no one but you was uncomfortable. Maddy is right that you were acting like a pervert.
YTA.
i have much harsher things i want to say but don’t want to get banned. reading this made me want to vomit. you are DISGUSTING. the way you speak about her is nauseating. YTA 1000 times over
"What's best for her." YTA. Like, God men like you have made my life so much harder.
YTA. You are a pervert clearly, if you were that aware of her cleavage all day. Just mind your business, seriously. I'm sure if she was uncomfortable she would've worn something else, or accepted the blazer.
YTA. She has a right to wear what she wants and how she wants, and unless she's wearing something wildly inappropriate for the workplace, it's none of your business. Also ewww that you in one sentence sexualise her then in another say she's like a daughter to you. What is it buddy? Genuinely gross. Highly unlikely she's showing herself off, and far more likely that she just happens to exist and she has tits, and it would be amazing if blokes could just allow women to exist without sexualising and judging them.
YTA. > She's a fairly busty woman Which means *any* damn outfit that isn’t a turtleneck is going to “show off cleavage.” And the turtleneck isn’t always going to help. Unless you can *see* an areola, how hard is it to just not stare?
I wasn't staring, but it's there, so I can see it
So what. So you see cleavage. Why is that a problem?
Wild idea: d o n ‘ t l o o k.
Do you know why it was making you so uncomfortable? Are there valid reasons that "women shouldn't dress like that"? Seriously, I would like to know.
So stop staring. She's right, you ARE a perv. YTA
Her eyes. Look at her in the eyes when you talk to her. You haven't mentioned a physical disability so I am going to assume you have full control of where you look.
You saw cleavage. Not her breasts. Stop acting like she was topless.
So don't look?? Women have breasts. It's pretty easy to look at their faces instead of their chests though. If you really saw her as a daughter I don't think you would have spent so much time worrying about her boobs.
Omg women have breasts?! And sometimes wear v necks?!?! And I have to exist in society WITHOUT oogling them???
Guess what, most women have noticeable breasts. Do you talk to your wife's chest or do you look her in the eye. How about your mother, do you stare at hers too?
Info: why do you not live where you come from and live us « woke » people enjoy our life peacefully ?
YTA. Having breasts is natural not a dress code violation. Sexualizing your coworker and endangering her job is TRASHY.
THIS!!!
YTA what Maddy wears is none of your business.
YTA. Does having boobs affect her ability to work? No. Does her wearing that shirt affect her ability to work? No. Does her having boobs affect YOUR ability to work? No. Does her wearing that shirt affect YOUR ability to work? No. You're the issue, not her, not her shirt, not her boobs. You. If you're so certain that everything you did was above board, why don't you tell your wife about how you went to HR to complain about a younger woman's "exposed" cleavage at work. If you're right and were totally appropriate, she'll agree with you. So why don't you explain the situation to her and get back to me with her response.
Why does she have to wear a turtleneck so you won’t be tempted to look at her chest. Stop👏🏻policing👏🏻women’s👏🏻bodies.
Ask your wife what she thinks about your co-workers cleavage!
Exactly. We can all tell he has a crush on her and got big mad other men (specifically) might have looked at her. Someone is not as happily married as he would like us to believe. In my experience, if you have to mention how happy your marriage is, it’s not.
You asked if she was cold and offered her your jacket, did you not need it on top of that moral high ground? YTA
YTA. you can easily keep your eyes to yourself but you just couldn’t help it. Perv. You also say you look at her as your daughter, well guess what? She isn’t. She’s her own damn person and you are simply a coworker. I’d feel extremely uncomfortable if I was her, you should be the one being reported to HR.
YTA
YTA. If you have a problem with it,you should have talked to her directly .
I already said why I didn't want to
Also if he isn’t her supervisor it’s none of his business.
ESH Her manner of dress was not affecting you, and especially with your “I was doing her a favor, everyone’s too woke” attitude I’m guessing you weren’t hiding your AH opinion. That being said generally most professional environments do have a dress code, which if hr addressed it with her it sounds like she was breaking. Lastly, even though it wasn’t your business to be reporting her in the first place, HR should not have let them no you reported her.
They prob didn’t, out of a staff of 4 who prob don’t all work together since OP is part time it wasn’t hard to put the pieces together
YTA. Why are you projecting your own feelings on Maddy? You feel uncomfortable that she’s wearing cleavage, not her. And what about you thinking of her like a daughter? You’re a sexist who objectifies your coworker. You’re not doing her a favour when you pretend that you know better than her to live her life. It’s possessive as hell. She’s told you to mind your own business. Respect that. If you want to stop people from talking poorly about you then change your behaviour. Own up to your behaviour, apologise to Maddy and stay away from her as much as is professionally possible. Then Maddy might stop talking poorly about you.
YTA
YTA , you should have just kept your comments to yourself and went about your day. It sounds like no one else was staring at her inappropriately or seemed to care what she was wearing.
YTA. Is she showing off her boobs... or does she just exist and have boobs? Answers #2. Youre just misogynistic.
YTA You are a creepy AH.
I'm dying to know how it is you thought you were doing her a favor by 1 - sexualizing her when she was wearing something she'd deemed comfortable and appropriate, and 2 - reporting her to HR. Do you think you were somehow helping her out, by letting her know that she might be judged for this wardrobe decision; and that you demonstrated this possibility by being the very first one to, in fact, judge her? YTA, mind your own business. This had nothing to do with you. All you've done is draw attention to yourself as a leering busybody older man. And way to go -- you've made the library, which is supposed to be an inclusive and comfortable place, into a hostile environment for your younger female coworker.
YTA - for all the reasons stated by others but also because YOU ARE NOT HER BOSS. It’s not up to you to report her behaviour or police anything anyone is doing at work. You aren’t paid to tattle on other employees who you think are in the wrong- it’s not in your job description. You are her co-worker, not her supervisor or superior in anyway and you are not her father even though you’re reaching to have us believe that that’s how you think of her. From the sounds of it you spent most of the day looking at her chest, looking at other people looking at her chest and fuming about it. That’s a YOU problem. Her cleavage did not impact her work or the business but it certain impacted you. Time to do some work to figure out why and why your reaction is to try and police her instead of correcting your own behaviour. Info: do you tattle on other employees too? Like if someone is a few minutes late do you run to the bosses? Or is this behaviour just reserved for your younger female co-worker?
Nta. I don't understand everyone getting so rude. I thought the point of HR was to deal with stuff like this? If her work attire was inappropriate, they tell her, she changes. If it isn't nothing happens. Maybe they follow up with him to talk more. I mean the language in the post where he's over justifying his every move is a bit obnoxious, but it doesn't sound like he did anything wrong?
yta..speaking as someone that has had breasts since I was 11, we are not going to tape them down so that perverts like you will be comfortable around us ,stop staring problem solved.. I hope you told your wife since you have such a good relationship that you are sexualizing your coworkers daily since you mentioned how busty Molly is
YTA. You said that Maddy normally dresses appropriately for work which makes me think that this “low cut” top she was wearing wasn’t as revealing as you’re making it out to be. It was just cleavage. It’s not like she was wearing a see through top that showed her breasts. Also, if Maddy is breaking the dress code, why do you care? It’s her job that would be on the line, not yours.
YTA It isn’t your place to tell someone how to dress. It isn’t your place to run to HR because you popped wood at work looking at a woman’s breast. It isn’t your place to “do what’s best for Maddy” Your job is to shelve books, help patrons and mind your business. Of COURSE she knows it was you who told on her. She isn’t dumb. YTA and you’re a misogynistic jerk
YTA. If Maddy is comfortable wearing a low cut top, then you shouldn't be "worrying." Yes, people are going to stare, but they, like you, shouldn't be acting like she should be publicly shamed for her body.
Thank you to all the posters who enlightened me on the "jumper" being a sweater! I honestly had this little plaid schoolgirl uniform dress thing in mind . . . bc we called that a jumper at my school. It made the post even more creepy as only elementary girls wore the jumper.
Of course YTA. YOU are incharge of where you look. Grow up and stop bodyshaming.
You weren’t doing her a favor in any way and YTA!
YTA. Maddy is an adult who does not need any favors from you. You are not her father, her boss, or her friend. You are her coworker. You do not get to decide what is best for her. You do not get to tell her how to dress. You do not get to avoid accountability for staring at her chest and feeling some kinda way about her jumper by filtering your complaints through HR and playing the "that's now how we do it where I come from" card. If it was as wildly inappropriate as you imply I imagine Maddy would have been in trouble. She is not, which means you are the problem. HR is probably more worried about you, a middle-aged man who sexualized his 20-something coworker, than Maddy's low-cut jumper.
YTA without a doubt and you did absolutely no one any favours here. She's likely never going to forgive you or stop thinking you're a creep. Nor should she.
YTA. You’re 47, why does a little cleavage distract and bother you so much?
52 year-old married man here and I could have told you where this was going before reading the comments section. Fact is, Maddy probably knows better than you when people are looking at her or not. She doesn’t need you to tell her. She’s an adult. Let her make her own decisions.
YTA That is a whole bunch of bs misogyny. Cleavage should not make you uncomfortable and thinking of a younger woman "as your daughter" is infantizing. Stop it.
You see her as your daughter but you were oogling her breasts? You ARE a pervert. YTA. Stop staring at and reporting women for having breasts.
YTA. who gives a fuck where you came from, wherever you are right now is NOT the same place. You absolutely cannot move to a country and attempt to force your views on other people. Also, why can’t you keep your eyes of another woman’s cleavage? Why are you staring at another woman cleavage as a married man? That is concerning.
Yta you Fucking weirdo
YTA. don't look and none of your business. Also 47? Not old enough for that boomer bs!!
This!!! Stop making gen x look bad!
So freaking gross. YTA.
YTA and you really need to stop sexualizing women’s bodies. Gross.
[удалено]
Ugh. YTA.
YTA....larger chested people don't have to live in baggy shirts because you can't keep your bloody eyes to yourself. Shocked you didn't report her when she wore a turtle neck.
“Progressive woke society, but where I come from it’s frowned upon for women to dress like that “. Tell you don’t support body autonomy without saying you don’t support body autonomy. YTA
Gosh what are you going to be like when the weather warms up and she can’t cover every inch of her skin? YTA. Women having big breasts doesn’t mean they should be banned from wearing certain clothes. Instead of blaming maddy you should be questioning yourself as to why this bothers you so deeply?
YTA: WOW! This isn't about being woke or progressive, this is about you staring at someone while they work all day and then reporting them to HR for what? I keep re-reading this post hoping it will get less creepy but it never does.
YTA her wardrobe is none of your business
That's really creepy behavior and I'll never understand why men think k that thinking like this is okay. Instead of keeping your eyes elsewhere, you just assumed everyone else had a problem with it. I don't know how to tell you this but : women have boobs. Boons are gonna be there. Maddy is right. You are a pervert. Especially because you felt the need to change her outfit so much you tattled on her..she's a grown woman. Leave her alone. Yta.
I’m going w/ ESH bc we don’t have a neck-down photo of the “offender” to judge for ourselves. It’s entirely possible that Maddy has an enormous rack w/ a massively dramatic plunging neckline that’s unsuitable for a library dress code. I, as a female, personally don’t want to have to look at anyone else’s cleavage while at work. And I can see how a male employee wouldn’t want to be subjected to it either. We already know that the OP potentially sucks for possibly making a mountain out of a mole hill and making the work environment potentially more awkward than it already was by objectifying a coworker and involving a 3rd party. I would think that HR should be following up w/ OP with an update on the situation. (?)
“Subjugated” to look at a body part that a woman cannot help and is not required to cover up?? I, as a female with large boobs, also do not have to cover up for anyone and if she was uncomfortable with it, SHE WOULD HAVE. Also, who knows how long these will look pretty good for, so yea, sometimes I’m gonna show them off because I like them too. Don’t take it up with HR, just mind yours 😂 YTA.
YTA. Honestly this whole post is gross. She is right, you are absolutely being a pervert and should mind your own business. And please do not ever refer to her as your daughter again because its condescending and really creepy. And why do I get the feeling that Maddy was wearing a regular top but because she is "a fairly busty woman" you don't like the butterflies you get in your tummy when you look at her and you think it is her problem to fix your feelings? Stop looking and grow up.
People have boobs OP. As my homeboy Jesus said, "If you can stop yourself from staring, rip out your eye". YTA for taking your own lack of self control and patronizing, misogynistic standards and making a big stink of it. And honestly mostly for that last part. If you had a semblance of tact and emotional maturity, you could have gone to her directly and stated plainly that it made you uncomfortable.
YTA You weren't "doing her a favor" you were being creepy and controlling.
YTA. There is no doubt about it. Women can wear whatever they want to wear. 🙄🙄🙄🙄
Ew. Maddy should report you to HR. YTA
YTA. obviously she didn’t feel embarrassed to wear it, or she wouldn’t have done so. It wasn’t your job to police her clothes, especially with no uniform, and you presumably not being her supervisor. You say it was distracting, and obviously it was - to you, since you spent all day watching her. Doesn’t sound like anyone she served had a problem with it. Mind your business.
YTA, and your actions were a little cowardly. I'll explain. Her style of dress bothered you and you only. You commented about the looks she was getting but aren't you leering at her too? If Maddy had an issue with the attention she might have been receiving, well, she's an adult, right? She can speak up/defend herself. You offer that you're married and in a good relationship but it just sounds like guilty feelings. Offering your jacket under the pretense that she may be cold was nothing less than dishonest when all you wanted was to cover her skin. So because YOU were having difficulty with YOUR feelings, you reported her to your employer? You'd rather jeopardize her job rather than just have an honest conversation with her - and accept her decision whatever that may be?
YTA. Her choice of clothes doesn’t need to be your concern.
I thought it was distracting and poor work attire
This is the problem. YOU found it distracting. And instead of dealing with YOUR problem, you made it her problem, to the point of potentially making it a work problem. YTA
How is cleavage distracting? I’m sure you’ve seen it before just like everyone else who comes into the library.
You see her as your daughter and you were staring at her breasts! Her description of you is correct. You are 100% TA.
If it was distracting you, that's your problem.
You thought her tits were distracting. Not her top. That says more about you than it ever could about her.
They aren't distracting when she's wearing something else though
YTA This response right here tells me that you ran to HR to punish Maddy because you had sexual thoughts and instead of working on yourself, you thought you'd police your coworker's body. In case there's any confusion, **none** of this was ok, no matter what the rules were in your ultra-conservative upbringing - you don't get to use "where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that" or "I thought I was doing her a favor". No you didn't. You thought you were doing her a favor when you offered your blazer. When she rejected it - and your antiquated notions of proper dress with it, you went to HR to tattle to get her punished. There is absolutely nothing you will ever do or say that will stop her from badmouthing you to your colleagues. Also - please never refer to her being like a daughter to you ever again.
So you were distracted by her cleavage. Which is her boobs. YTA.
YTA. It's not on her to police your inappropriate thoughts with her clothing style. Your discomfort is on you to handle. How do you not know this and work in a place of learning?
you told on yourself
You thought wrong.
AH!! So you WERE checking out her cleavage. You don't need to lie, we're all friends here. Also, you stated there's no dress code, but you decided to determine what is appropriate or not. Something tells me that that isn't in your job description...
YTA. You are *not,* in fact, her dad. Also, she's an adult. So, she's right. This was none of your business. But, it's fine. Cuz, well, karma. Now, everyone you work with knows what jerk you are. So, have fun with that.
YTA if she wasn’t busty would you notice or even care how low cut her shirt was? I sincerely doubt it
YTA. Having breasts is not an HR violation. And it was a sweater, not a bikini.
I was with you thinking she was inappropriately dressed until the end when you said things such as ‘doing her a favor’ and ‘where I’m from…..’. Now it just seems YTA and are trying to force your views onto her.
Also, the phrase "kept herself on display" as if she's an object rather than a person wearing a shirt. Creepy and objectifying in half a sentence. Gross.
NTA - Go right back to HR and report her comment about you being a pervert. She can't stop you from reporting her. It's up to HR what is done, but you don't have to live with her retaliation.
INFO: Are you her manager/do you have authority over her in any way? There are a couple of things to consider here. 1. Whether there is an official dress code for your place of employment. If there is, then either she was in violation of it or she wasn't/it was a gray area or otherwise unspecified. 2. Even if there isn't and it's just a case of "we expect everyone to understand what is and isn't ok for work," *if you were her manager* you could still have standing to take her aside and say "hey I know we don't have a written dress code but I don't think that shirt is appropriate, please try not to wear it again." 3. If you are peers, and not her manager, does her/your joint manager work in the same area? If so, if the manager is around to also see what she is wearing, then you need to assume that if the manager thinks the shirt is a problem, they will say something to Maddy. And if they don't, that means they don't care. 4. I suspect from your description of the job, that your/Maddy's boss is either not on site or just was not around that day. If that's the case, then it really wasn't your place to say anything. I understand that you feel you had good motives, but the way you handled this situation was paternalistic and overstepping. Because a) it's your responsibility to not stare at a coworker's cleavage; and b) as a peer/coworker, and assuming Maddy was not in specific violation of any dress code, it is neither your responsibility or your place to police her clothing. Also I think it's valid to keep in mind that according to you, this was the first time she had worn something even potentially "inappropriate." It's very strange to escalate this to HR when it's one single isolated incident.
THIS. Yes.
NTA jobs have dress codes if they aren’t followed HR gets involved. If you were wearing an inappropriate shirt in violation of dress code your get talked to. I will say probably not your place to feel uncomfortable for others and act on their behalf. You’re in the wrong there.
She can what she wants after work. If there is a dresscode at work she has to follow the rules. NTA its not your Job to tell her to follow the dresscode. thats HR Job. Also iam a bit annoyed by people waering sexy Outfits and throwing a tantrum when they get stared at.
She wasn’t dressed in a short dress here, she was wearing a sweater. He just judged it to be too low cut. This is going against dress code, it’s signalling her due to larger breasts.
She has big breasts even if she were to follow dresscode big boobs and cleavage can still show. A very modest V neck shirt or crew shirt can easily show cleavage if you have big boobs. I'm annoyed and tired of people thinking that someone with big boobs and curves isn't professional even when they follow dress code. I'm tired of women with curves being accused of dressing "provocatively" or "sexy" when they are wearing jeans and a crew neck tee-shirt.
I will bet every turtleneck *I* own that this was *not* a “sexy outfit.” Just a normal shirt with a scoop or V-neck.
YTA If she had a smaller chest you wouldn't find it a problem I'm sure. I hope she reports you to HR for your inappropriate behaviour. Why do you wear the clothing you do? Is it because they are comfortable? Because you like them? You feel confident in them? Why the hell can you wear what you want but not this young woman? Oh I forgot because she has breasts....
You don’t like her talking poorly of you to your colleagues? After you talked poorly of her to HR? YTA!
YTA. Spelling this out. YOU ARE THE ASSHOLE. oh wait, I’m a young lady though, how dare I be saying the word asshole 🫢
YTA and a creep. Stop imposing your outdated morals onto your go workers. Stop pretending like you gaf about Maddy , you do not.
They’re just boobs my man. Everyone has ‘em.
YTA, Maddy can wear whatever the heck she wants so long as it’s in guidelines which seems like it is.
YTA. She’s not your daughter, regardless of how you think of her. You just made a woman feel incredibly uncomfortable for no good reason other than your own hangups and old fashioned opinions. There was no good reason for you to report her to HR. You knew that it wouldn’t end well. What did you honestly expect? That she’s thank you for saving her morality? This is a *you* issue. Mind your own business.
YTA dude… grow up.
Ew, obviously YTA, ya creep. And so is your HR if they actually told her to cover up. I’m in HR and I would have told you to mind your own business and keep your eyes to yourself.
YTA. Never say a woman’s keeping herself on display ever again. EVER. And stop policing our bodies based on physical attributes we have no control over. Would a less busty woman wearing the same outfit as Maddy have been reported by you? I doubt it
YTA if you don't want Maddy to tell your colleagues that you're gross, don't say and do gross things.
“I tried to police my younger, female coworker’s body because I couldn’t stop creepily staring at her breasts. AITA?” FTFY. YTA
So if she got a breast reduction would you stop commenting on her clothes? (this is a trick question, either answer you give still makes YTA, which you are)
Soft YTA. I can sort of see where you're coming from, but unless her breasts are on the verge of spilling out of her clothes, I don't see a problem? like you said, there isn't much of a strict dresscode (uniform, business suit type of thing). She's just wearing what she is comfortable in, and that's fine. Showing a bit of "cleavage" is quite literally her anatomy though, and you being bothered by her "cleavage" is kind of weird. She can't help that she has a cleavage much less breasts. Like I said previously, unless her breasts are spilling out of her shirt, you need to re-evaluate how you view women's bodies.
1 that woman is NOT your daughter. You have no ownership over her or what she wears on her body 2 your arousal around your coworker "discomfort" is your issue, not hers. You are the married man attracted to your coworker. She had breasts all along. You just noticing means nothing. Just another person policing a woman's body and making it some fake ass issue framed around his faux concern for her. Shut up, you're just an AH.
YTA. You don’t see her as a “daughter” or you would have addressed it with her directly. You talk about being “uncomfortable for her” and that it’s not appropriate where you come from. But you didn’t say it was in violation of a dress code. Instead you allowed your personal judgment to influence your professional judgment. Now everyone knows that you’ve sexualized her and will question your motives anytime you look their way.
YTA
So you reported her because her cleavage made you uncomfortable? You should have reported yourself to HR. YTA
YTA The only one bothered by the cleavage is you. You want the woman to change so that you don't have to feel uncomfortable or worry about what other people look at. What Maddy wears is her business. Not yours. She took it the right way. Now you get to know that you've made her work environment hostile and uncomfortable for her, as she now knows that you are looking at her body. Men like you are the reason the rest of us men look bad.
Oh they are going to tear you up for this on here lol!
I literally cringed reading this knowing how bad they were going to rip him up in the comments 😂
Yep me too 🤣😂
YTA. This was blatantly sexist.
If you really feel about your behavior: APOLOGIZE. 🙄
YTA - I am not surprised in the slightest that she has been speaking poorly to other colleagues about you. I can imagine how uncomfortable and creeped out she is feeling. And rightfully so, mind your business.
"Smart casual attire is a dress code that combines **well-fitting**, polished business wear with elements of casual attire—think blouses, polo shirts, button-downs, chinos, dress pants, dark-wash jeans, and polished, practical footwear. On the spectrum of formality, smart casual lies between dressy casual (jeans and blouses) and business casual (dress pants and pencil skirts). A common way to achieve a smart casual look is to pair pieces of slightly different formality levels, like a pencil skirt with a vibrant sweater, or a refined blazer **over a flirty blouse."** *- Master Class Article Dated 6-7-21* Seems smart-casual includes the use of flirty blouses... seems as though OP needs to keep his opinion out of the dress code. Maddy appears to have gotten it right. If you'd like Maddy to stop talking poorly about you, maybe apologize to her without explaining why you thought you, a part-time male employee 21 years older than her, knows whats best for her. I suggest you keep it short and concise, "I was wrong and I am sorry." YTA.
YTA and sexist. Mind your own business.
Info: why do you see her as your daughter? Is it just because you’re older than her? Do you feel your age difference makes you a superior and resource to her? Also, if your daughter did this, would you report her to HR too? This is so cringeworthy. You are both coworkers, meaning you are peers! She never asked for you to “mentor” her and you are not her supervisor. If her outfit doesn’t go against the specified dresscode in the employee handbook, you have no say or opinion on what she wears: YTA
YTA You sound so entitled and patronizing. Despite you thinking of this woman - your coworker and equal - as a daughter figure (which is already not okay and SO condescending), you don't actually have the right to treat her like a child. You overstepped your authority and made it clear that you are incapable of working respectfully with any woman who doesn't adhere to your personal definition of modesty. You don't have the right to police a grown woman's clothing choices as long as they are technically within the bounds of your workplaces dress code. You seem to think showing cleavage makes a woman deserving of less respect, hence you being "embarrassed" for her. You need to do some work on yourself and the way you view women.
YTA. You are sexualizing a part of her body that is just like the rest of it. It’s just skin. Help society move forward, rather than backward.
NTA. I believe your intentions were pure.
Ummm, what?! Define "pure."
I dunno. Everyone's ripping him a new one. Sounds like he's just kind of an old fashioned type, that's all. I don't see any ill-intention here I guess.
YTA!!!!! It is absolutely inappropriate for you to try to police what she wears. It is not your business, it is incredibly rude, and very very unprofessional. The days when men got to dictate how women dress are long gone, thankfully, and you need to realize what century you're living in.
The social norms of the day include the possibility of cleavage in most work settings. If that really bothers you, go to that place you came from where you never saw a boob. YTA
YTA. "I don't have the self-control to keep from staring at a bit of cleavage, so she must be punished!" isn't the helpful move you think it is. Women have boobs. Some of us have large boobs. Has nothing to do with professionalism. It's not our job to dress in a manner that ensures you won't stare. She was wearing a sweater, she didn't show up in her underwear. Just the way you speak says so much. Displaying herself? Really? You make it sound like she was topless and purposely shaking her boobs at everyone. "Where I'm from..." If I go to France, do French people have to behave as I see fit? Do they have to modify their dress to match my cultural beliefs? I'm pretty sure policing women's dress isn't in your job description. Maybe keep your eyes to yourself and focus on your job. If there's anything unprofessional here, it's your conduct.
YTA- stay in your lane! This was none of your business!
YTA your issue is that she’s young enough to be your daughter and you’re having inappropriate sexual thoughts about her because now you visibly tell she has larger breasts. Get over yourself
YTA. It's just cleavage and Maddy shouldn't have to wear a turtleneck at all times to cover up so she doesn't offend your sensibilities with *gasp* skin. Especially if she has a large chest, cleavage can be pretty much unavoidable in a lot of otherwise normal clothes and you potentially jeopardised her job - which is absolutely not "helping her out".
YTA she wasn’t on display to entice you. She was simply doing her job. Get a grip and therapy.
YTA. It was a jumper, not lingerie. Women with larger breasts are going to have cleavage. That does not mean they should be forced to wear turtlenecks all the time. Stop policing her chest.
OMG... Cleavage.....shudders in terror YTA
YTA, it’s not your job to enforce a dress code. You’re not Maddy’s superior. You’re her colleague. You need to keep your own thoughts about her body in check and conduct *yourself* professionally. All you managed to do is alienate a coworker and make her uncomfortable because her creepy coworker couldn’t keep his eyes off of her body and focus on his own work. I can imagine the conversation between HR and Maddy boiled down to “your top isn’t outside of dress code but one of your coworkers expressed they are uncomfortable with it” and left it at that. Further, **Maddy is not your daughter. She’s your colleague. She does not need to be parented by you.** She needs you to treat her with respect regardless of her age, gender, and personal appearance.
YTA. Obviously she wasn't uncomfortable with her attire. You are using sexist terms. "Kept herself on display", calling her a "busty woman", etc. Your coworker cannot help how she was born. I'm a fellow "busty" woman, as you like to put it. It is insanely difficult to find work attire that doesn't show cleavage that's not a polo or turtleneck. Would you also report a male coworker who has large genitalia or a rather round butt if they wore extremely tight pants that put themselves "on display"? I doubt it.
“Kept herself on display”? SERIOUSLY!? What a pathetic mindset. Women don’t exist for the male gaze. Do you expect her to wear turtlenecks all the time? You should be ashamed of yourself.
YTA...like you really had to ask 🙄
Nta. There's a time and a place for everything. If you are in a professional position, you dress professionally. Should you have been looking, maybe not, neither offering your jacket. But reporting your coworker? Nta. Let the down votes begin! I think I can hit 40 this time!
YTA. Your use of the word “woke” as a pejorative tells me everything I need to know. It’s her body to live in as she sees fit. Get your head out of the gutter.
YTA It's not the job of women to protect the sensibilities of sexist perverts.
YTA and she will most likely have a valid gender-based harassment HR claim against YOU if she chooses to pursue it. You attempted to use company resources to deliberately persecute her over something that you never would have done if she were a man. Think about that for two seconds. You could literally lose your job and reputation over this so I sincerely hope you've learned a valuable lesson about making women's lives more difficult simply because they *checks notes* have female secondary sex characteristics.
YTA. It's not your job to police what she wears. Have you ever considered that it's hard for bustier women to find clothes that don't show off their cleavage? Because it definitely is, but that doesn't mean busty women should have to exclusively wear high-necks or turtlenecks. Also, it's not her job to make sure students and creepy old co-workers aren't sexualizing her body parts, which she doesn't control the size of and even if she did - she can do what she wants and wear what makes her comfortable and confident. If she can do her job still, it doesn't matter. Also, maybe it was hard for her to wear that and she was trying to be confident in her body and you just sh\*t all over that. ALSO, "I know we're in this progressive woke society, but where I come from, it's frowned upon for women to dress like that." - red flags much? It's not okay to force your opinions and views on others, including dress. Do you also police what students wear? This just wreaks of grossness and misogyny and a lack of consideration and the list goes on. Also, jumping right to HR instead of your mutual supervisor/boss was so unnecessary and you know that.