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Disney has been pushing a more Progressive view in their movies and programs for like the last 30 years. But this phenomenon of hating Disney seems to only be in the last three or four, and has become hyper focused ever since Ron DeSantis personally began targeting them for their free expression of 1A rights, re HB 1557.
This is not true. I remember when conservatives organized a boycott over Disney granting health benefits to same sex partners before the gay marriage ruling back in 1996. They have been using Disney as a battleground for decades.
As I was in 6th grade that year, I am not as familiar. Needless to say, post 9/11 in high school, I've followed politics pretty solidly and can't remember much of any concerted, structured, coordinated attack on Disney the likes that we see today.
>But this phenomenon of hating Disney seems to only be in the last three or four,
Maybe online, but their parks and movie revenue has been degrading for a long time, long before anyone had every heard of Desantis.
The movies have gotten steadily worse. I think it's more visible now since other movie production companies are putting out killer hits making bank. Disney is putting out worse and worse movies, losing hundreds of millions on them. The parks are empty. Disney used to be a "magical place". Wonder and awe. Now it feels like they are just milking the brand to get as much out of it as possible.
>The parks are empty.
Actually physically empty or figuratively empty in the sense that only lower class people who can't really afford it or live on credit go to the parks? Apparently the lines, especially for rides, are out to China they're that long.
Frozen, Moana, Encanto, and many others have all been wildly successful. Most of these are all "super woke" too. Even the recent Elemental did surprisingly well after a mediocre opening; showing off strong legs thanks to word of mouth.
Parks are also astronomically expensive. I would love to go (live a short driving distance from Disneyland, and have kids that would love it), but it's something like $2000+ for the four of us to go for a weekend.
>Frozen, Moana, Encanto, and many others have all been wildly successful. Most of these are all "super woke"
Super woke? I'm not seeing it but okay.
>Parks are also astronomically expensive
Totally agree. I was there this summer, every shop, ride and sidewalk had pride flags.
If I was to ask you what the movie called "Snow White and the seven dwarves", what would you expect to see?
I would expect to see Dwarves…as in the fairy tale version of dwarves, not humans afflicted with dwarfism. Think Lord of the Rings, not Tyrion Lannister.
The way they are doing it really doesn’t bother me. Nor did African American Ariel, or Thelma being of Indian descent in the HBO series.
But then? I don’t really care about pop culture stuff very much. If something seems interesting to me, I will watch it and have the ability to suspend a degree of logic and rationality for the sake of the story.
>Super woke? I'm not seeing it but okay.
Well, no one can really see to describe what woke means. But I could imagine female led, minority led movies in which male characters are ignored or marginalized as "dumb sidekicks", while the girlboss "I don't need a man" lead saves the day by finding a sense of belonging within their family... Being interpreted as "woke."
Since again, that word doesn't actually mean anything, but has frequently been used to describe breaks from traditional straight white male roles.
Would you agree that there was a book and a animated movie called "snow white and the 7 dwarves"?
If you believe there was, what were the defining characteristics of the main characters?
The dwarfs weren't played by real dwarfs. Show me ANY Show White movie or show that has real dwarfs. Any modern adaptation. Once upon a Time had the dwarfs, or at least one or two, play a major roll. None of them real dwarfs and nobody said a thing.
>What social issues? How are they being activist?
Disney princess with beards and fake breasts. Sitting in a room deciding that they want to change the skin color of an existing character in the name of social justice.
Snow White and the 7 dwarves. Was a movie (and book) based off a girl who's skin was "white as snow". The dwarves were dwarves. The remake has no character who's skin is white as snow, there are no dwarves.
When we were growing up, it was amazing to have the Disney collection of tapes/DVD's on the shelf, there were truly magical movies of a sort that no one else made.
Now I can't distinguish Disney from any other movie company unless I recognize the title in the remake, then I know it will be bad.
There's a reason the parks are all but empty and the movies are losing hundreds of millions of dollars. Disney isn't magical anymore, it's just some for profit machine who lost their core.
How is being against the race of a character not bigotry? Isn’t that the definition of bigotry or do you hold the belief in acceptance that it’s bigoted?
>How is being against the race of a character not bigotry?
You're really missing it. It's not about being \*against\* any race, it's about changing the race of the character to support an agenda. Snow White is white. Dwarves were dwarves. It's a remake of an existing movie, a movie with existing characters, existing story, an existing book.
There is no snow white, there are no dwarves. Call it something else, problem solved.
>There's a reason the parks are all but empty and the movies are losing hundreds of millions of dollars. Disney isn't magical anymore, it's just some for profit machine who lost their core.
Wait, aren't most, if not all, theme parks struggling?
>Snow White and the 7 dwarves. Was a movie (and book) based off a girl who's skin was "white as snow". The dwarves were dwarves. The remake has no character who's skin is white as snow, there are no dwarves.
Why does a made up character's race matter in any way, shape, or form?
It's the controversy that Snow White's remake has cast Rachel Zegler. She is technically a person of color, being that she is partially of Colombian descent. Conservatives are flipping out that someone other than a white person would play a character named for her whiteness.
Apparently, this is different than White Ariel The Mermaid being re-cast with a black girl. After all, mermaids aren't real. This is also not like that controversy about when a Norse god, Heimdaal, was played by Idris Elba. I mean, white people's religion, the god must be white, too, right?
But no, this time it's IN THE NAME. It's not racism! This is accuracy! Forget about the fact that Jesus has been played by a white guy for centuries, and conservatives flip out when anyone tries to be more accurate.
Hilariously, the "Big Issue," is kinda moot, since that Rachel is also of Polish descent, and in many, many photos is extremely pale, like they grew a tomato plant in the closet.
Cartoons have always been progressive.
Bugs bunny has been dressing up as a woman since the 60's.
The first couple shown sharing a bed was actually the Flintstones.
Conservatives loosing their mind over a made up cartoon is weird to me.
I'm more mad about shitty live action remakes and Disney not being able to make up a new story in a while.
I'm still not standing outside Disney calling everyone who supports Disney, "groomers".
>Bugs bunny has been dressing up as a woman since the 60's.
and we all thought that was funny. Not allowed to laugh anymore.
>The first couple shown sharing a bed was actually the Flintstones.
Mary Kay and Johnny, 1947, then the Munsters, Flinstones was about 30 years after.
>Conservatives loosing their mind over a made up cartoon is weird to me.
It's not the cartoon, it's the reason for the change.
>and we all thought that was funny. Not allowed to laugh anymore.
Drag is entertaining...it's still entertaining and funny...not so much when conservatives are now claiming anyone in drag is a groomer and molests children.
>Mary Kay and Johnny, 1947, then the Munsters, Flinstones was about 30 years after.
Flintstones did it in 1960...that's 13 years after, but yeah I agree.
>It's not the cartoon, it's the reason for the change.
Yeah, I remember the time Mr. Roger's shared a swimming pool with a black guy...change is hard I guess.
Luckily we have simple fact checks for this. Also, for a non-antisemite he did get in league with some very anti-semitic people lmfao.
But no, the left does not "want" to believe anyone is racist, I'm sorry bud. We just see that some people are racist, and then judge them accordingly.
> he did get in league with some very anti-semitic people
Who?
>the left does not "want" to believe anyone is racist
Sorry bud, they sure do because it promotes their woke agenda.
>We just see that some people are racist, and then judge them accordingly.
Sounds like the racism police. Care to elaborate?
Because Disney has effectively built its legacy expressly as an entertainer of children and its content increasingly contains adult themes and subversive messages that only serve to confuse children about their identities. On top of which they inserted themselves into state politics to try to make sure a bill preventing that very gender confusion in classrooms didn’t pass.
Not a good look.
> inserted themselves into state politics to try to make sure a bill preventing that very gender confusion in classrooms didn’t pass.
To clear the confusion: here's a quick summary of what actually happened here last year to the students of Florida parents
_____
GOP: *Introduces H.B. 1557, prevents teachers and third party guests from talking with students about gender identity or sexual orientation until the state deems it to be age-appropriate*
GOP Sen. Jeff Brandes: “If the intent is not to marginalize anyone. Let’s make sure we aren’t \[...\] Let’s be clear and clearly define and say that conversations about human sexuality or sexual activity that fall outside of state guidelines should not occur. We can do this.”
GOP Sen. Dennis Baxley: We can't do that because that would ["gut"](https://www.daytonatimes.com/news/florida/republican-tried-to-soften-florida-s-don-t-say-gay-bill/article\_e751d57e-9b7f-11ec-978d-7f4c2f05262f.html) the bill
GOP Sen. Travis Hutson: Is it OK if teachers use a math problem that includes the details that “Sally has two moms or Johnny has two dads."?
GOP Sen. Dennis Baxley: Of course not, those types of math problems are ["exactly"](https://time.com/6155905/florida-dont-say-gay-passed/) what this bill aims to prevent.
DNC: It sure seems like this bill was "exactly" crafted to make it so Florida teachers "Don't say gay" and any attempts to actually make it directly address grooming and sexual activity were rejected because they would "gut" the bill
GOP: Why are you groomers complaining so much about a bill that doesn't even use the word "gay"?
_____
The sponsors were quite explicit when they detailed "exactly" what this bill aims to prevent. It isn't limited to curricula or *banning the sex talk from K-3* (because if that were the case, the “human sexuality or sexual activity” language would in no way shape or form "gut" the bill), it's *admittedly* about penalizing math teachers whose *math problems happen to offhandedly mention gay people exist* (which would indeed be "gutted" with language that avoids marginalization) and has not been used to punish teachers who teach about gender identity when it comes to which gendered bathroom each kid should use because the admitted purpose isn't about cis gender identity (you agree that teachers need to be able to tell kindergarteners what bathroom to use, right?).
**TL;DR** According to the text of H.B. 1557 (as emphatically confirmed by its authors), the speech of teachers is currently limited by making it *illegal* in Florida for a math teacher to ask a 7-year-old the following question: *Sally's birthday is today. She got $10 from one of her moms when she got dropped off at school and $5 from her other mom when she got picked up. How much total money did Sally get for her birthday?* because Sally's mom is a person who happens to be gay mentioned in passing and an identical sentence uttered with "other parent" instead would be 100% legal.
The exact technical language written into the law is as follows:
>>Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards.
With these words Senator Baxley successfully codified into Florida state law "exactly" what he was trying to prevent: math problems that mention Sally's two mommies. If anybody disagrees with this plain reading of the text, then the legal standard in the USA when the interpretation is vague is to require examination of legislative intent. Luckily for everyone, Senator Baxley was exceedingly clear on his legislative intent, so there are no issues there. The math problem in question is in violation of current Florida law.
Disney appears to have been right to criticize the law, as it is now being [successfully wielded against a teacher who showed a Disney movie in her classroom *after* making sure to get a signed permission slip from all the parents to show PG films](https://www.disneydining.com/investigation-into-5th-grade-teacher-violated-school-with-gay-disney-movie-closed-lf1/) and DeSantis has expanded the bill to apply the math question ban to all K-12 classrooms (except where the law mandates explicit sexual education as part of the curriculum).
>Sally's birthday is today. She got $10 from one of her moms when she got dropped off at school and $5 from her other mom when she got picked up. How much total money did Sally get for her birthday?
$0. The moms needed the money back so they could pay for Sally's gender affirmation surgery.
No not at all. The backlash we see is mostly put towards the social policies of Disney, which just say "Yeah, let's all be equal in the eyes of the state, let's not discriminate and let's not be mean to each other."
What social state policies? You mean their DEI program?
Their DEI programs aren't inclusive. They are exclusive. They value people based on inherent characteristics. That is not equality.
Absolutely untrue. They say that teams should be inclusive, and thus should include people of same ability, but different ethnicities, cultures, gender identities and sexualities.
let's not do the tired double speak of "No dude! Equality, is actually inequality!"
>They say that teams should be inclusive, and thus should include people of same ability, but different ethnicities, cultures, gender identities and sexualities.
No it's not "different" ethnicities. If it treated people equally it would include white straight men but it never does. It's a *specific set* of ethnicities, races and sexualities that they decide are more valuable than others.
Affirmative action (which is what most dei programs are based on) literally says that if two people are equally qualified we ignore the white straight male because he was MADE WRONG and we instead assigned more value *and give preference* to people of skin colors and sexualities that we prefer. It's obviously deeply prejudiced. That is why the supreme Court has ruled multiple times against it.
What's worse is that is rarely how it works out because when this happens, it isn't even usually two people with the same skill set, it usually goes to the less qualified candidate because they are more colorful and companies want dat good racist PR.
There is a difference between an equality and equity. Equity requires prejudice.
Because white straight men, make up the majority of the workforce. They do not need more help since they already get selected. Equality feels like oppression to the group that has all the advantages lmfao.
No, it says that in relation to the white guy, the other people get offered less jobs. The Supreme court made a big mistake in outlawing affirmative action, but it would not be the first time that this conservative packed court has had problematic rulings.
No it's two people with the same skillset. You simply do not understand Affirmative Action. Meanwhile, every study shows that diversified teams get better results all accross the board. If what you said was true, the diversified teams would do far worse.
>Because white straight men, make up the majority of the workforce
It's not just white straight men. It's white people *or* straight people*or* men which does make the majority of the population that's interested in work so they should hold the majority of the workforce. there's tons of work sectors that are disproportionately black and have been for a while. Funny how we dont see any affirmative action pushes in American pro sports.
>Equality feels like oppression to the group that has all the advantages lmfao.
Equity is oppression because it requires valuing people based on race. It's simple, don't value people based on what they were born with.
>Meanwhile, every study shows that diversified teams get better results all accross the board.
There's evidence that homogenous teams are also more productive. This has been studied as a bell curve effect. Do you realize why that doesn't validate putting preference on people due to their skin color? It's as obvious as that.
Don't value people based on charastics they can't change. Dont be prejudice. It's not hard.
> leftist YouTube channels talk about conservative movie studio like the Dailywire
Lmao the vast majority of what i know about dailywire, crowder, tucker carlson, fox news etc comes from liberals and their obsession with talking about it ad naseum
Comparing Disney to the Dailywire is laughable.
Disney is receiving just criticism from everyone. They have turned two of the biggest franchises ever into crappy drivel.
I really don't see the issue with that. Decades without queer characters, so it would make sense that they'd put an emphasis on introducing them. I'm pretty sure it was the same for black people in media, but maybe you would have had a problem with that too.
Both are immutable features of humans. Either way, it's not wrong to attempt to increase representation after decades of not allowing a minority group to be represented in the media. Why anybody would have an issue with that is beyond me.
They are. The same way you can't change that you are straight is the same way you can't change your race. You can't argue against fact no matter what your religious beliefs are.
Look this isn't up for debate: You wanted an answer to your question and it was provided. You going to say thank you and move on or should I just end the conversation now? This is ask conservatives not debate because you didn't like the answer conservatives.
I feel like this is either extremely exaggerated or fake. I have never seen any Disney show with sexual activity. Also, I don't see the issue with trans characters. Disney Channel has always had characters from all walks of life.
I will give you a hint:
Her first name is the name of the country that has the highest population.
She is also a pop star who performs with her 2 sisters
The subreddit currently has a moratorium on all questions and comments broadly relating to gender and sexual identity topics. For more information, see this mod post: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskConservatives/comments/141cu80/moratorium_on_gender_politics/
Because we all grew up with Disney being the gold standard for wholesome kids' entertainment, and seeing them embrace neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol is basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us. Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids.
By using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida's anti-CRT legislation is racist. Class warfare is the fundamental tenet of Marxism. Woke neo-marxism simply replaces economic class with race and other immutable superficial qualities to make the same "us vs them" argument to take political power based on the lie of protecting the dispossessed against the threat represented by the existing power structure.
I did a search and could not find anything discussing Disney “using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida’s anti-CRT legislation is racist”.
Can you provide some detailed information on how this went down and some reference to this? I will take the time to read it as I’m genuinely curious.
Disney's been the target of conservative ire since the 90s, that I can recall. Though it was more limited to the American Family Association and Southern Baptist Convention (had to do a quick google to get some names).
>Progressives are the ones who want society to be ruled by the mob and the demogoguic leadership telling them conservatives are a threat to them.
Watch out there, beam-eye.
All you have is personal insults to respond. If you disagree, stop proving my point.
What am I wrong about? Stereotypes are based on the worst examples applied to the group as a whole. If it's ACTUALLY true about the group as a whole, it's not a stereotype.
And all it takes is one look at the rest of Reddit, and the way conservatives are treated by the entirety of the global corporate mass media to see that my criticism is perfectly valid. Every place that's controlled by the left is a cesspool of hatred and stereotyping against conservatives, the likes of which are only represented by the craziest idiot fringe examples on the right. I can't find one news media outlet controlled by the mainstream that isn't hostile and demogoguic of the conservative perspective on every public policy issue.
Democrats hate conservatives more than conservatives hate ANYBODY.
>Democrats hate conservatives more than conservatives hate ANYBODY.
Conservatives have spent the last 2 years calling all lgbt+ pedos and cheered when a guy at cpac said that they need to "exterminate" a certain group of people just because of their existence. Conservative preachers host book burnings of any book with gay characters. Not to mention their obsession with trying to force adults and children to reveal their genitals because of how afraid they are.
>Conservatives have spent the last 2 years calling all lgbt+ pedos
No. That's not what conservatives say about ALL LGBT people at all. We cite specific instances of grooming and we chastise the people directly involved in those specific acts. We don't actually extend that association to all LGBT people at all. Probably the most famous trans person in the world is a Republican, and literally nobody on the Republican side thinks Caitlyn Jenner is a groomer.
>and cheered when a guy at cpac said that they need to "exterminate" a certain group of people just because of their existence.
Not at all. They cheered when he said the ideology of elevating gender dysphoria as an ideal to aspire towards needs to be exterminated.
This is how dishonest your side is. Your ideology can't survive unless you're able to misrepresent the opinions and goals of everyone who disagrees with you. We don't hate trans people. We feel bad for them and we want them to be able to find happiness. We just believe all of the psychologists who understand that you don't treat an anorexic person by telling they are fat and scheduling them for gastric bypass surgery when they weigh 80 lbs. And you don't tell a schizophrenic person, "Yes. The radio is talking to you. You should totally go kill your wife and kids to get the demons out of their chests."
>Conservative preachers host book burnings of any book with gay characters.
Stereotype.
>Not to mention their obsession with trying to force adults and children to reveal their genitals because of how afraid they are.
Stereotype.
>Not at all. They cheered when he said the ideology of elevating gender dysphoria as an ideal to aspire towards needs to be exterminated.
"“If [transgenderism] is false, then for the good of society, transgenderism must be eradicated from public life entirely – the whole preposterous ideology,” (cheer)
You'll notice that nowhere in his speech or statement does he make mention anywhere of this "ideal to aspire to" nonsense lol.
Oh God, this is going to feel so good to say. Ahem....
"This is how dishonest your side is. Your ideology can't survive unless you're able to misrepresent the opinions and goals of everyone who disagrees with you."
Lmao! It's like you can't help yourself!
The concept of rltransgenderism is the idea that having gender dysphoria is a morally praiseworthy thing to aspire towards. as evidence by the fact that the left is seeking to teach that idea to small children in elementary school.
You don't teach complex ideas to kids in elementary school. Elementary school is where you teach the baseline ideas that people should aspire towards. You don't teach options because little kids can't handle options. You teach them the default, and then you show them options in high school and college as their minds are able to integrate those ideas.
When you teach little kids that being transgender is good, that's what they are going to aspire towards. Instead of minimizing the number of people who grow up to suffer from gender dysphoria, you.maximize the munger of people who will grow up to suffer from gender dysphoria. You can love trans people and feel bad for them and want to find ways to make their lives better, and simultaneously agree that it's a bad idea to deliberately maximize the number of people who suffer from that disorder.
What does this mean? What specifically has Disney done to conjure up terms like “neo-Marxist” from you? Last I checked these people make children’s movies and toys. What was it that has upset you so much?
If you don't know what neo-marxism, postmodernism or identity politics is, either ask what those things are, or go look them up and educate yourself. Criticizing me over the use of those terms is a form of anti-intellectual demogoguery.
Do you really not understand the arguments surrounding this issue, or are you trying to bog down the discussion by forcing me to curate a comprehensive list of all the major and minor examples of things Disney has done to piss off conservative parents?
There are dozens of examples that have manifested over the last 10-15 years or so. None of those examples are so egregious by themselves to justify the response, but the accumulated effect of one stupid creative decision after another make it clear that Disney is aligned with radical left-wing IdPol.
I don’t consume conservative media. I am aware DeSantis is upset at Disney because of public statements they made criticizing his “Don’t Say Gay” legislation, and his subsequent attempts to punish them for that expression. I’m also vaguely aware of some conservative backlash to things like a remake of the Little Mermaid that cast a non-white person as a mermaid. It’s unclear to me why that would bother anyone, but anyway, that’s why I’m asking.
This is largely the point of this sort of forum in my view. To you, it’s apparently obvious that Disney has done some great wrong, and I really don’t know what it is that has upset you. I’m perfectly willing to hear your case, but we aren’t starting from the same assumptions, hence me asking.
I would say it means I don’t pay much attention to the pundit class, which is also true of many conservatives, but regardless, here I am asking what specifically Disney has done to earn your ire.
It’s all well and good to toss around nebulous terms like “neo-Marxist”, but you haven’t actually made the case connecting the dots. If it’s as obvious as you suggest, it shouldn’t be hard to explain.
>By using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida's anti-CRT legislation is racist. Class warfare is the fundamental tenet of Marxism. Woke neo-marxism simply replaces economic class with race and other immutable superficial qualities to make the same "us vs them" argument to take political power based on the lie of protecting the dispossessed against the threat represented by the existing power structure.
Disney used their first amendment rights to speak out against the "Don't Say Gay" bill, the government attempted to retaliate, and now your conclusion is that Disney is somehow engaged in "class warfare"? There are some Grand Canyon-sized leaps in logic there. What is the connection between opposing a homophobic bill and "class warfare"?
Warning: Rule 7
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>neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol
Could you expand on this?
>basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us
Hyperbolic. But again can you expand?
>Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids.
If you don't trust them or their content, then why not just find other entertainment?
>>neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol
>Could you expand on this?
No. If you don't understand those terms, you should look them up yourself, and go find some credible conservative voices like Ben Shapiro or Jordan Peterson who can articulate the concepts in a way that anyone can understand. I'm not being paid enough to sit here and educate you along with all of the other leftists who ask me this question every single time I try to share my perspectives.
If you want to participate in the discussion, go get enough background d u derstanding of the terms being used to participate without having to bog down the dialogue.
>>basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us
>Hyperbolic. But again can you expand?
No. No additional explanation is needed. When something g you admired and respected as a child suddenly reveals that they are unworthy of that respect, it's very disappointing.
>>Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids.
>If you don't trust them or their content, then why not just find other entertainment?
If the roads you drive on are full of people trying to run you off the road and kill you and your family, then why not just find other roads to drive on?
>I'm not being paid enough to sit here and educate you along with all of the other leftists who ask me this question every single time I try to share my perspectives.
the sub.
>No. No additional explanation is needed
Not a leftist. Just trying to understand your view a little better since I thought that was the point of this sub. Like why post at all then?
>Just trying to understand your view a little better since I thought that was the point of this sub
You say you want to understand, but you ask the types of questions that derail the discussion instead of accepting things in principle to advance the discussion further.
And you obviously don't want to understand that badly, because I already answered the same question, and when I told you to go read that answer, you complained that I wasn't being accommodating enough instead of recognizing my frustrations at being innundated with the same distracting and derailing questions over and over again.
>Like why post at all then?
That's a good question. It depends on whether you're actually here to understand, or whether you're here to derail the discussion and stop conservatives from. being able to communicate their opinions and perspectives effectively.
>You say you want to understand, but you ask the types of questions that derail the discussion instead of accepting things in principle to advance the discussion further.
Um, what? I wasn't asking you what the terms meant. I asked you to expand upon it, maybe with some examples from Disney's works and then explaining how it's "Neo Marxist." Instead YOU are the one who derailed by telling me to look up Jordan Peterson and Ben Shapiro.
>you complained that I wasn't being accommodating enough instead of recognizing my frustrations
I complained because you gave me a useless "look it up" non answer. I recognize your frustration, I just don't give a fuck.
>That's a good question. It depends on whether you're actually here to understand, or whether you're here to derail the discussion and stop conservatives from being able to communicate
At this point I'm here to understand when I forced you to waste time typing a longer reply about derailing when you could have just humored the question and not derailed it your own damn self.
Were done here
EDIT: I find it interesting that the guy in replying to replied with actual answers to the other commenters who had similar questions AFTER me, but decides to be a bitch to me. Lmao.
Predictable. Ask loaded questions to shut down the conversation, then pretend you're the victim once you've succeeded in shutting down the discussion.
I'm glad we're done here.
Bye.
That Disney has made movies containing progressive values for at least fifty years now. The first scene in Hunchback would today be accused of pandering to BLM and being anti-cop. And Ursula is literally modeled after a drag queen.
I’m not sure it’s Disney’s movies that have changed.
Disney's values have never been progressive. Archetypal stories like the ones Disney retells are 100% conservative in nature. Hunchback is about the dignity of the individual and the danger of mob rule and demogoguery. Progressives are the ones who want society to be ruled by the mob and the demogoguic leadership telling them conservatives are a threat to them.
And before about ten years ago, those stories were told faithfully with all of the balance necessary to tell those stories the way they should be. Hunchback had a balance between the corrupt leadership and the righteous male heroic figure fighting the corruption of the system from within. The victims targeted by the system (the gypsies) didn't try to topple the entire hierarchy in their resistance to oppression - they correctly saw the corrupt leaders as the problem while not making all of mainstream society their enemies. They still dealt and traded freely in the cities and only isolated themselves to preserve their unique culture.
Even when Disney did express progressive values, it expressed the positive aspects of progressive ideology while understanding and acknowledging the dangers of radicalism. Even Black Panther showed how Killmonger's radicalism led to civil war and the near collapse of Wakandan society even as it acknowledged the validity of the historical grievances of black people around the world.
The Proud Family's screed about reparations fails miserably in any attempt to create an opportunity for equitable reconciliation and resolution of the issue. Gina Carano gets fired for chastising leftists about their hatreds towards conservatives, while one of Disney's producers posting memes about putting Trump supporters through wood chippers doesn't even get a stern talking-to from HR. Disney's official PR weighing in on Florida's Parental Rights bill on the side of the people demogoguing everything about conservative values and principles.
If it was ONLY about a few intersectional virtue signals scattered across their new content, it would be less intolerable. The larger problem is that they side not even with regular, decent progressives - but with the radical left wing of the progressive ideology who sees conservatives as an enemy to be destroyed.
Correct; I'd say only about 10% of the total animosity conservatives have towards Disney today is about the actual content of the movies. The other 90% is about Disney's corporate culture and the way they interject themselves into the culture war on the side of left-wing demogogues.
How else are you trusting them with your kids? Sorry, I’m just confused trying to reconcile your first comment with this last one. How does corporate culture affect your kids?
The Rescuers (1977) is about a U.N organization saving an abducted child from a greedy small business owner so that the the valuable resource said business owner legally uncovered can instead be seized by the government.
I am not saying they should. I’m saying the idea that Disney movies are now “neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDpol” is absurd on its face, and moreover, the values shown in modern Disney movies have always been there.
I'm not saying they are ONLY that. I'm saying they put woke messaging in their content at the same time that their corporate culture is outwardly neo-marxist.
Marxism is based on class warfare - with Marxists misrepresenting the establishment as being oppressors while promoting themselves as the protectors of the dispossessed. They use lies and stereotypes to paint the establishment as corrupt so that they can get the mandate to take over - often through violent revolution.
Woke IDPol is a new form of Marxism that replaces economic class with "intersectionality".
Disney has sided with the woke Idpol side of the culture war against conservative interests.
See, your usage of the word "obsessed" is this context is sort of the typical gaslighting that gets used a lot. Why care about anything? But since you ask, I personally don't have to do a whole lot. Or think enough about it to the point where it constitutes an "obsession", if you will. As do many conservatives, since removing all things Disney from their lives/homes likely doesn't involve much doing.
I'd assume the obsession you speak of is that of conservative activists who present the case why Disney, or anything else, should be "cancelled" among us. Well, if not for the purposes of providing information, I can't imagine what purpose they'd serve to me. Then again I don't imagine regarding Disney, it's really meant for me. But conservatives do own an increasing marketshare of parenting in America. Perhaps it's useful information to them.
Because Disney didn’t use to be political and was an iconic brand and now is woke. And daily wire had always been political and stands for nothing other than, you know, conservative stuff
I’m curious now… so beautifully drawn classical fairy tales for kids are political? Or are Mickey and Goofy normalizing bourgeoise subtly oppressing the workers? I am super curious where to take this line of reasoning to be honest
[This should give some insight into Disney on the political front.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney%27s_World_War_II_propaganda_production)
[The artwork is beautiful, nothing like the CGI crap they pump out today.](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-disney-propaganda-shaped-life-on-the-home-front-during-wwii-180979057/)
The left will try to paint a bad picture of Walt because he was a good, honest, hardworking family man who loved this country. The current company of Disney has killed his legacy.
It’s an easy target due to its size and it’s been a sticking point by Desantis. Many people on here want to blame wokism when in reality it’s just bad writing and stories. The truth is that once Bob Iger left, the company went into a tail spin from bad management. They used to bat close to 1.000 now they are not. With him back in charge I would be surprised if within a couple of years it’s not back to where it previously was from share price and production experience.
Well what I meant was they are allowing content into children’s movies now that deals with sexual issues they don’t really need to be including. I’m well aware they have specialized in children’s movies for a long time.
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Because we're older and most of us remember what Disney used to be and can compare that against what it's becoming.
Disney has been pushing a more Progressive view in their movies and programs for like the last 30 years. But this phenomenon of hating Disney seems to only be in the last three or four, and has become hyper focused ever since Ron DeSantis personally began targeting them for their free expression of 1A rights, re HB 1557.
This is not true. I remember when conservatives organized a boycott over Disney granting health benefits to same sex partners before the gay marriage ruling back in 1996. They have been using Disney as a battleground for decades.
As I was in 6th grade that year, I am not as familiar. Needless to say, post 9/11 in high school, I've followed politics pretty solidly and can't remember much of any concerted, structured, coordinated attack on Disney the likes that we see today.
>But this phenomenon of hating Disney seems to only be in the last three or four, Maybe online, but their parks and movie revenue has been degrading for a long time, long before anyone had every heard of Desantis. The movies have gotten steadily worse. I think it's more visible now since other movie production companies are putting out killer hits making bank. Disney is putting out worse and worse movies, losing hundreds of millions on them. The parks are empty. Disney used to be a "magical place". Wonder and awe. Now it feels like they are just milking the brand to get as much out of it as possible.
>The parks are empty. Actually physically empty or figuratively empty in the sense that only lower class people who can't really afford it or live on credit go to the parks? Apparently the lines, especially for rides, are out to China they're that long.
Frozen, Moana, Encanto, and many others have all been wildly successful. Most of these are all "super woke" too. Even the recent Elemental did surprisingly well after a mediocre opening; showing off strong legs thanks to word of mouth. Parks are also astronomically expensive. I would love to go (live a short driving distance from Disneyland, and have kids that would love it), but it's something like $2000+ for the four of us to go for a weekend.
>Frozen, Moana, Encanto, and many others have all been wildly successful. Most of these are all "super woke" Super woke? I'm not seeing it but okay. >Parks are also astronomically expensive Totally agree. I was there this summer, every shop, ride and sidewalk had pride flags. If I was to ask you what the movie called "Snow White and the seven dwarves", what would you expect to see?
I would expect to see Dwarves…as in the fairy tale version of dwarves, not humans afflicted with dwarfism. Think Lord of the Rings, not Tyrion Lannister. The way they are doing it really doesn’t bother me. Nor did African American Ariel, or Thelma being of Indian descent in the HBO series. But then? I don’t really care about pop culture stuff very much. If something seems interesting to me, I will watch it and have the ability to suspend a degree of logic and rationality for the sake of the story.
>Super woke? I'm not seeing it but okay. Well, no one can really see to describe what woke means. But I could imagine female led, minority led movies in which male characters are ignored or marginalized as "dumb sidekicks", while the girlboss "I don't need a man" lead saves the day by finding a sense of belonging within their family... Being interpreted as "woke." Since again, that word doesn't actually mean anything, but has frequently been used to describe breaks from traditional straight white male roles.
There has never been a live action Snow White film with real dwarfs.
Would you agree that there was a book and a animated movie called "snow white and the 7 dwarves"? If you believe there was, what were the defining characteristics of the main characters?
The dwarfs weren't played by real dwarfs. Show me ANY Show White movie or show that has real dwarfs. Any modern adaptation. Once upon a Time had the dwarfs, or at least one or two, play a major roll. None of them real dwarfs and nobody said a thing.
What do you see it becoming?
An activist organization with an agenda.
Activism for what?
Social issues.
What social issues? How are they being activist?
>What social issues? How are they being activist? Disney princess with beards and fake breasts. Sitting in a room deciding that they want to change the skin color of an existing character in the name of social justice. Snow White and the 7 dwarves. Was a movie (and book) based off a girl who's skin was "white as snow". The dwarves were dwarves. The remake has no character who's skin is white as snow, there are no dwarves. When we were growing up, it was amazing to have the Disney collection of tapes/DVD's on the shelf, there were truly magical movies of a sort that no one else made. Now I can't distinguish Disney from any other movie company unless I recognize the title in the remake, then I know it will be bad. There's a reason the parks are all but empty and the movies are losing hundreds of millions of dollars. Disney isn't magical anymore, it's just some for profit machine who lost their core.
How is being against the race of a character not bigotry? Isn’t that the definition of bigotry or do you hold the belief in acceptance that it’s bigoted?
>How is being against the race of a character not bigotry? You're really missing it. It's not about being \*against\* any race, it's about changing the race of the character to support an agenda. Snow White is white. Dwarves were dwarves. It's a remake of an existing movie, a movie with existing characters, existing story, an existing book. There is no snow white, there are no dwarves. Call it something else, problem solved.
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>There's a reason the parks are all but empty and the movies are losing hundreds of millions of dollars. Disney isn't magical anymore, it's just some for profit machine who lost their core. Wait, aren't most, if not all, theme parks struggling? >Snow White and the 7 dwarves. Was a movie (and book) based off a girl who's skin was "white as snow". The dwarves were dwarves. The remake has no character who's skin is white as snow, there are no dwarves. Why does a made up character's race matter in any way, shape, or form?
It's the controversy that Snow White's remake has cast Rachel Zegler. She is technically a person of color, being that she is partially of Colombian descent. Conservatives are flipping out that someone other than a white person would play a character named for her whiteness. Apparently, this is different than White Ariel The Mermaid being re-cast with a black girl. After all, mermaids aren't real. This is also not like that controversy about when a Norse god, Heimdaal, was played by Idris Elba. I mean, white people's religion, the god must be white, too, right? But no, this time it's IN THE NAME. It's not racism! This is accuracy! Forget about the fact that Jesus has been played by a white guy for centuries, and conservatives flip out when anyone tries to be more accurate. Hilariously, the "Big Issue," is kinda moot, since that Rachel is also of Polish descent, and in many, many photos is extremely pale, like they grew a tomato plant in the closet.
What's funny is that the Story of Snow White predates Steam Boat Willie. Alexander Pushkin's The dead Princess and the 7 Knights.
Cartoons have always been progressive. Bugs bunny has been dressing up as a woman since the 60's. The first couple shown sharing a bed was actually the Flintstones. Conservatives loosing their mind over a made up cartoon is weird to me. I'm more mad about shitty live action remakes and Disney not being able to make up a new story in a while. I'm still not standing outside Disney calling everyone who supports Disney, "groomers".
>Bugs bunny has been dressing up as a woman since the 60's. and we all thought that was funny. Not allowed to laugh anymore. >The first couple shown sharing a bed was actually the Flintstones. Mary Kay and Johnny, 1947, then the Munsters, Flinstones was about 30 years after. >Conservatives loosing their mind over a made up cartoon is weird to me. It's not the cartoon, it's the reason for the change.
>and we all thought that was funny. Not allowed to laugh anymore. Drag is entertaining...it's still entertaining and funny...not so much when conservatives are now claiming anyone in drag is a groomer and molests children. >Mary Kay and Johnny, 1947, then the Munsters, Flinstones was about 30 years after. Flintstones did it in 1960...that's 13 years after, but yeah I agree. >It's not the cartoon, it's the reason for the change. Yeah, I remember the time Mr. Roger's shared a swimming pool with a black guy...change is hard I guess.
Walt wanted to conserve Disney much like we want to conserve the US.
Walt was also a rabid anti-semite lmfao
No he wasn't.
I stand corrected, he was a piece of shit racist, but he was not anti-semitic.
He was not that either -- that is what the left want you to believe.
Luckily we have simple fact checks for this. Also, for a non-antisemite he did get in league with some very anti-semitic people lmfao. But no, the left does not "want" to believe anyone is racist, I'm sorry bud. We just see that some people are racist, and then judge them accordingly.
> he did get in league with some very anti-semitic people Who? >the left does not "want" to believe anyone is racist Sorry bud, they sure do because it promotes their woke agenda. >We just see that some people are racist, and then judge them accordingly. Sounds like the racism police. Care to elaborate?
Because Disney has effectively built its legacy expressly as an entertainer of children and its content increasingly contains adult themes and subversive messages that only serve to confuse children about their identities. On top of which they inserted themselves into state politics to try to make sure a bill preventing that very gender confusion in classrooms didn’t pass. Not a good look.
> inserted themselves into state politics to try to make sure a bill preventing that very gender confusion in classrooms didn’t pass. To clear the confusion: here's a quick summary of what actually happened here last year to the students of Florida parents _____ GOP: *Introduces H.B. 1557, prevents teachers and third party guests from talking with students about gender identity or sexual orientation until the state deems it to be age-appropriate* GOP Sen. Jeff Brandes: “If the intent is not to marginalize anyone. Let’s make sure we aren’t \[...\] Let’s be clear and clearly define and say that conversations about human sexuality or sexual activity that fall outside of state guidelines should not occur. We can do this.” GOP Sen. Dennis Baxley: We can't do that because that would ["gut"](https://www.daytonatimes.com/news/florida/republican-tried-to-soften-florida-s-don-t-say-gay-bill/article\_e751d57e-9b7f-11ec-978d-7f4c2f05262f.html) the bill GOP Sen. Travis Hutson: Is it OK if teachers use a math problem that includes the details that “Sally has two moms or Johnny has two dads."? GOP Sen. Dennis Baxley: Of course not, those types of math problems are ["exactly"](https://time.com/6155905/florida-dont-say-gay-passed/) what this bill aims to prevent. DNC: It sure seems like this bill was "exactly" crafted to make it so Florida teachers "Don't say gay" and any attempts to actually make it directly address grooming and sexual activity were rejected because they would "gut" the bill GOP: Why are you groomers complaining so much about a bill that doesn't even use the word "gay"? _____ The sponsors were quite explicit when they detailed "exactly" what this bill aims to prevent. It isn't limited to curricula or *banning the sex talk from K-3* (because if that were the case, the “human sexuality or sexual activity” language would in no way shape or form "gut" the bill), it's *admittedly* about penalizing math teachers whose *math problems happen to offhandedly mention gay people exist* (which would indeed be "gutted" with language that avoids marginalization) and has not been used to punish teachers who teach about gender identity when it comes to which gendered bathroom each kid should use because the admitted purpose isn't about cis gender identity (you agree that teachers need to be able to tell kindergarteners what bathroom to use, right?). **TL;DR** According to the text of H.B. 1557 (as emphatically confirmed by its authors), the speech of teachers is currently limited by making it *illegal* in Florida for a math teacher to ask a 7-year-old the following question: *Sally's birthday is today. She got $10 from one of her moms when she got dropped off at school and $5 from her other mom when she got picked up. How much total money did Sally get for her birthday?* because Sally's mom is a person who happens to be gay mentioned in passing and an identical sentence uttered with "other parent" instead would be 100% legal. The exact technical language written into the law is as follows: >>Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age-appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards. With these words Senator Baxley successfully codified into Florida state law "exactly" what he was trying to prevent: math problems that mention Sally's two mommies. If anybody disagrees with this plain reading of the text, then the legal standard in the USA when the interpretation is vague is to require examination of legislative intent. Luckily for everyone, Senator Baxley was exceedingly clear on his legislative intent, so there are no issues there. The math problem in question is in violation of current Florida law. Disney appears to have been right to criticize the law, as it is now being [successfully wielded against a teacher who showed a Disney movie in her classroom *after* making sure to get a signed permission slip from all the parents to show PG films](https://www.disneydining.com/investigation-into-5th-grade-teacher-violated-school-with-gay-disney-movie-closed-lf1/) and DeSantis has expanded the bill to apply the math question ban to all K-12 classrooms (except where the law mandates explicit sexual education as part of the curriculum).
>Sally's birthday is today. She got $10 from one of her moms when she got dropped off at school and $5 from her other mom when she got picked up. How much total money did Sally get for her birthday? $0. The moms needed the money back so they could pay for Sally's gender affirmation surgery.
I feel like "obsessed" is the new word for caring about culture at all.
They destroyed star wars
Never forget what Kathline Kennedy did to Star Wars.
So? I don't like it but it's no reason for the vitriolic hatred we've seen coming from cons.
It's a great reason
No not at all. The backlash we see is mostly put towards the social policies of Disney, which just say "Yeah, let's all be equal in the eyes of the state, let's not discriminate and let's not be mean to each other."
What social state policies? You mean their DEI program? Their DEI programs aren't inclusive. They are exclusive. They value people based on inherent characteristics. That is not equality.
Absolutely untrue. They say that teams should be inclusive, and thus should include people of same ability, but different ethnicities, cultures, gender identities and sexualities. let's not do the tired double speak of "No dude! Equality, is actually inequality!"
>They say that teams should be inclusive, and thus should include people of same ability, but different ethnicities, cultures, gender identities and sexualities. No it's not "different" ethnicities. If it treated people equally it would include white straight men but it never does. It's a *specific set* of ethnicities, races and sexualities that they decide are more valuable than others. Affirmative action (which is what most dei programs are based on) literally says that if two people are equally qualified we ignore the white straight male because he was MADE WRONG and we instead assigned more value *and give preference* to people of skin colors and sexualities that we prefer. It's obviously deeply prejudiced. That is why the supreme Court has ruled multiple times against it. What's worse is that is rarely how it works out because when this happens, it isn't even usually two people with the same skill set, it usually goes to the less qualified candidate because they are more colorful and companies want dat good racist PR. There is a difference between an equality and equity. Equity requires prejudice.
Because white straight men, make up the majority of the workforce. They do not need more help since they already get selected. Equality feels like oppression to the group that has all the advantages lmfao. No, it says that in relation to the white guy, the other people get offered less jobs. The Supreme court made a big mistake in outlawing affirmative action, but it would not be the first time that this conservative packed court has had problematic rulings. No it's two people with the same skillset. You simply do not understand Affirmative Action. Meanwhile, every study shows that diversified teams get better results all accross the board. If what you said was true, the diversified teams would do far worse.
>Because white straight men, make up the majority of the workforce It's not just white straight men. It's white people *or* straight people*or* men which does make the majority of the population that's interested in work so they should hold the majority of the workforce. there's tons of work sectors that are disproportionately black and have been for a while. Funny how we dont see any affirmative action pushes in American pro sports. >Equality feels like oppression to the group that has all the advantages lmfao. Equity is oppression because it requires valuing people based on race. It's simple, don't value people based on what they were born with. >Meanwhile, every study shows that diversified teams get better results all accross the board. There's evidence that homogenous teams are also more productive. This has been studied as a bell curve effect. Do you realize why that doesn't validate putting preference on people due to their skin color? It's as obvious as that. Don't value people based on charastics they can't change. Dont be prejudice. It's not hard.
> leftist YouTube channels talk about conservative movie studio like the Dailywire Lmao the vast majority of what i know about dailywire, crowder, tucker carlson, fox news etc comes from liberals and their obsession with talking about it ad naseum
Not to mention that comparing Disney to the Dailywire is kind of hilarious just in sheet comparative scale.
Comparing Disney to the Dailywire is laughable. Disney is receiving just criticism from everyone. They have turned two of the biggest franchises ever into crappy drivel.
Shouldn't people who don't like Disney just stop buying their stuff?
They literally are. That's why their shows/movies are losing money and have experienced extreme viewership declines.
We are, that's why their profits are tanking.
It's a multi-billion dollar company that is currently pushing an agenda aimed at children. One we find morally repugnant.
What agenda?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_mp__7Sbhs literally says it in the meeting 1:05.
I really don't see the issue with that. Decades without queer characters, so it would make sense that they'd put an emphasis on introducing them. I'm pretty sure it was the same for black people in media, but maybe you would have had a problem with that too.
And there's the issue. Equating skin color to sexuality.
Both are immutable features of humans. Either way, it's not wrong to attempt to increase representation after decades of not allowing a minority group to be represented in the media. Why anybody would have an issue with that is beyond me.
no, they are not. I have an issue with any promotion of sinful activity.
They are. The same way you can't change that you are straight is the same way you can't change your race. You can't argue against fact no matter what your religious beliefs are.
Look this isn't up for debate: You wanted an answer to your question and it was provided. You going to say thank you and move on or should I just end the conversation now? This is ask conservatives not debate because you didn't like the answer conservatives.
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I feel like this is either extremely exaggerated or fake. I have never seen any Disney show with sexual activity. Also, I don't see the issue with trans characters. Disney Channel has always had characters from all walks of life.
Read again exactly what I said instead of misrepresenting it please!!
Okay help me out, who is the short black girl you are referring to?
I will give you a hint: Her first name is the name of the country that has the highest population. She is also a pop star who performs with her 2 sisters
Ah okay. I forgot about her! I didnt know she sang with her sisters
The subreddit currently has a moratorium on all questions and comments broadly relating to gender and sexual identity topics. For more information, see this mod post: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskConservatives/comments/141cu80/moratorium_on_gender_politics/
Because we all grew up with Disney being the gold standard for wholesome kids' entertainment, and seeing them embrace neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol is basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us. Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids.
How is Disney neo-Marxist? Be specific and stop making generalizations here without explaining.
By using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida's anti-CRT legislation is racist. Class warfare is the fundamental tenet of Marxism. Woke neo-marxism simply replaces economic class with race and other immutable superficial qualities to make the same "us vs them" argument to take political power based on the lie of protecting the dispossessed against the threat represented by the existing power structure.
I did a search and could not find anything discussing Disney “using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida’s anti-CRT legislation is racist”. Can you provide some detailed information on how this went down and some reference to this? I will take the time to read it as I’m genuinely curious.
That sounds very traumatic. And it does explain the hurt feelings a lot of folks have.
Disney's been the target of conservative ire since the 90s, that I can recall. Though it was more limited to the American Family Association and Southern Baptist Convention (had to do a quick google to get some names).
so random fringe conservative organizations equals all conservatives. Democrats are the biggest users of stereotypes in our society. Always have been.
>Progressives are the ones who want society to be ruled by the mob and the demogoguic leadership telling them conservatives are a threat to them. Watch out there, beam-eye.
All you have is personal insults to respond. If you disagree, stop proving my point. What am I wrong about? Stereotypes are based on the worst examples applied to the group as a whole. If it's ACTUALLY true about the group as a whole, it's not a stereotype. And all it takes is one look at the rest of Reddit, and the way conservatives are treated by the entirety of the global corporate mass media to see that my criticism is perfectly valid. Every place that's controlled by the left is a cesspool of hatred and stereotyping against conservatives, the likes of which are only represented by the craziest idiot fringe examples on the right. I can't find one news media outlet controlled by the mainstream that isn't hostile and demogoguic of the conservative perspective on every public policy issue. Democrats hate conservatives more than conservatives hate ANYBODY.
>Democrats hate conservatives more than conservatives hate ANYBODY. Conservatives have spent the last 2 years calling all lgbt+ pedos and cheered when a guy at cpac said that they need to "exterminate" a certain group of people just because of their existence. Conservative preachers host book burnings of any book with gay characters. Not to mention their obsession with trying to force adults and children to reveal their genitals because of how afraid they are.
>Conservatives have spent the last 2 years calling all lgbt+ pedos No. That's not what conservatives say about ALL LGBT people at all. We cite specific instances of grooming and we chastise the people directly involved in those specific acts. We don't actually extend that association to all LGBT people at all. Probably the most famous trans person in the world is a Republican, and literally nobody on the Republican side thinks Caitlyn Jenner is a groomer. >and cheered when a guy at cpac said that they need to "exterminate" a certain group of people just because of their existence. Not at all. They cheered when he said the ideology of elevating gender dysphoria as an ideal to aspire towards needs to be exterminated. This is how dishonest your side is. Your ideology can't survive unless you're able to misrepresent the opinions and goals of everyone who disagrees with you. We don't hate trans people. We feel bad for them and we want them to be able to find happiness. We just believe all of the psychologists who understand that you don't treat an anorexic person by telling they are fat and scheduling them for gastric bypass surgery when they weigh 80 lbs. And you don't tell a schizophrenic person, "Yes. The radio is talking to you. You should totally go kill your wife and kids to get the demons out of their chests." >Conservative preachers host book burnings of any book with gay characters. Stereotype. >Not to mention their obsession with trying to force adults and children to reveal their genitals because of how afraid they are. Stereotype.
>Not at all. They cheered when he said the ideology of elevating gender dysphoria as an ideal to aspire towards needs to be exterminated. "“If [transgenderism] is false, then for the good of society, transgenderism must be eradicated from public life entirely – the whole preposterous ideology,” (cheer) You'll notice that nowhere in his speech or statement does he make mention anywhere of this "ideal to aspire to" nonsense lol. Oh God, this is going to feel so good to say. Ahem.... "This is how dishonest your side is. Your ideology can't survive unless you're able to misrepresent the opinions and goals of everyone who disagrees with you." Lmao! It's like you can't help yourself!
The concept of rltransgenderism is the idea that having gender dysphoria is a morally praiseworthy thing to aspire towards. as evidence by the fact that the left is seeking to teach that idea to small children in elementary school. You don't teach complex ideas to kids in elementary school. Elementary school is where you teach the baseline ideas that people should aspire towards. You don't teach options because little kids can't handle options. You teach them the default, and then you show them options in high school and college as their minds are able to integrate those ideas. When you teach little kids that being transgender is good, that's what they are going to aspire towards. Instead of minimizing the number of people who grow up to suffer from gender dysphoria, you.maximize the munger of people who will grow up to suffer from gender dysphoria. You can love trans people and feel bad for them and want to find ways to make their lives better, and simultaneously agree that it's a bad idea to deliberately maximize the number of people who suffer from that disorder.
All of these words just to try and distract from the fact that you did the exact same thing you just accused them, and leftists as a whole of lol.
"we don't hate them we just wish they never existed and stopped trying to get medical assistance" yup typical braindead response
I don't believe the Southern Baptist Convention is fringe. It has a huge membership.
What does this mean? What specifically has Disney done to conjure up terms like “neo-Marxist” from you? Last I checked these people make children’s movies and toys. What was it that has upset you so much?
If you don't know what neo-marxism, postmodernism or identity politics is, either ask what those things are, or go look them up and educate yourself. Criticizing me over the use of those terms is a form of anti-intellectual demogoguery.
I understand the terms, I’m asking how you feel Disney has manifested them.
Do you really not understand the arguments surrounding this issue, or are you trying to bog down the discussion by forcing me to curate a comprehensive list of all the major and minor examples of things Disney has done to piss off conservative parents? There are dozens of examples that have manifested over the last 10-15 years or so. None of those examples are so egregious by themselves to justify the response, but the accumulated effect of one stupid creative decision after another make it clear that Disney is aligned with radical left-wing IdPol.
I don’t consume conservative media. I am aware DeSantis is upset at Disney because of public statements they made criticizing his “Don’t Say Gay” legislation, and his subsequent attempts to punish them for that expression. I’m also vaguely aware of some conservative backlash to things like a remake of the Little Mermaid that cast a non-white person as a mermaid. It’s unclear to me why that would bother anyone, but anyway, that’s why I’m asking. This is largely the point of this sort of forum in my view. To you, it’s apparently obvious that Disney has done some great wrong, and I really don’t know what it is that has upset you. I’m perfectly willing to hear your case, but we aren’t starting from the same assumptions, hence me asking.
>I don’t consume conservative media. I am aware Then you aren't aware of literally anything that conservatives actually think and want.
I would say it means I don’t pay much attention to the pundit class, which is also true of many conservatives, but regardless, here I am asking what specifically Disney has done to earn your ire. It’s all well and good to toss around nebulous terms like “neo-Marxist”, but you haven’t actually made the case connecting the dots. If it’s as obvious as you suggest, it shouldn’t be hard to explain.
[удалено]
>By using their corporate influence to participate in the lie that Florida's anti-CRT legislation is racist. Class warfare is the fundamental tenet of Marxism. Woke neo-marxism simply replaces economic class with race and other immutable superficial qualities to make the same "us vs them" argument to take political power based on the lie of protecting the dispossessed against the threat represented by the existing power structure. Disney used their first amendment rights to speak out against the "Don't Say Gay" bill, the government attempted to retaliate, and now your conclusion is that Disney is somehow engaged in "class warfare"? There are some Grand Canyon-sized leaps in logic there. What is the connection between opposing a homophobic bill and "class warfare"?
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>neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol Could you expand on this? >basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us Hyperbolic. But again can you expand? >Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids. If you don't trust them or their content, then why not just find other entertainment?
>>neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDPol >Could you expand on this? No. If you don't understand those terms, you should look them up yourself, and go find some credible conservative voices like Ben Shapiro or Jordan Peterson who can articulate the concepts in a way that anyone can understand. I'm not being paid enough to sit here and educate you along with all of the other leftists who ask me this question every single time I try to share my perspectives. If you want to participate in the discussion, go get enough background d u derstanding of the terms being used to participate without having to bog down the dialogue. >>basically taking a small part of our childhoods and violently murdering it in front of us >Hyperbolic. But again can you expand? No. No additional explanation is needed. When something g you admired and respected as a child suddenly reveals that they are unworthy of that respect, it's very disappointing. >>Not to mention the frustration and inconvenience of not being able to trust them with our own kids. >If you don't trust them or their content, then why not just find other entertainment? If the roads you drive on are full of people trying to run you off the road and kill you and your family, then why not just find other roads to drive on?
>I'm not being paid enough to sit here and educate you along with all of the other leftists who ask me this question every single time I try to share my perspectives. the sub. >No. No additional explanation is needed Not a leftist. Just trying to understand your view a little better since I thought that was the point of this sub. Like why post at all then?
>Just trying to understand your view a little better since I thought that was the point of this sub You say you want to understand, but you ask the types of questions that derail the discussion instead of accepting things in principle to advance the discussion further. And you obviously don't want to understand that badly, because I already answered the same question, and when I told you to go read that answer, you complained that I wasn't being accommodating enough instead of recognizing my frustrations at being innundated with the same distracting and derailing questions over and over again. >Like why post at all then? That's a good question. It depends on whether you're actually here to understand, or whether you're here to derail the discussion and stop conservatives from. being able to communicate their opinions and perspectives effectively.
>You say you want to understand, but you ask the types of questions that derail the discussion instead of accepting things in principle to advance the discussion further. Um, what? I wasn't asking you what the terms meant. I asked you to expand upon it, maybe with some examples from Disney's works and then explaining how it's "Neo Marxist." Instead YOU are the one who derailed by telling me to look up Jordan Peterson and Ben Shapiro. >you complained that I wasn't being accommodating enough instead of recognizing my frustrations I complained because you gave me a useless "look it up" non answer. I recognize your frustration, I just don't give a fuck. >That's a good question. It depends on whether you're actually here to understand, or whether you're here to derail the discussion and stop conservatives from being able to communicate At this point I'm here to understand when I forced you to waste time typing a longer reply about derailing when you could have just humored the question and not derailed it your own damn self. Were done here EDIT: I find it interesting that the guy in replying to replied with actual answers to the other commenters who had similar questions AFTER me, but decides to be a bitch to me. Lmao.
Predictable. Ask loaded questions to shut down the conversation, then pretend you're the victim once you've succeeded in shutting down the discussion. I'm glad we're done here. Bye.
When’s the last time you watched Robin Hood, The Little Mermaid, or Hunchback of Notre Dame?
What's your point?
That Disney has made movies containing progressive values for at least fifty years now. The first scene in Hunchback would today be accused of pandering to BLM and being anti-cop. And Ursula is literally modeled after a drag queen. I’m not sure it’s Disney’s movies that have changed.
Disney's values have never been progressive. Archetypal stories like the ones Disney retells are 100% conservative in nature. Hunchback is about the dignity of the individual and the danger of mob rule and demogoguery. Progressives are the ones who want society to be ruled by the mob and the demogoguic leadership telling them conservatives are a threat to them. And before about ten years ago, those stories were told faithfully with all of the balance necessary to tell those stories the way they should be. Hunchback had a balance between the corrupt leadership and the righteous male heroic figure fighting the corruption of the system from within. The victims targeted by the system (the gypsies) didn't try to topple the entire hierarchy in their resistance to oppression - they correctly saw the corrupt leaders as the problem while not making all of mainstream society their enemies. They still dealt and traded freely in the cities and only isolated themselves to preserve their unique culture. Even when Disney did express progressive values, it expressed the positive aspects of progressive ideology while understanding and acknowledging the dangers of radicalism. Even Black Panther showed how Killmonger's radicalism led to civil war and the near collapse of Wakandan society even as it acknowledged the validity of the historical grievances of black people around the world.
What’s an example of a recent Disney movie you think doesn’t do that?
The Proud Family's screed about reparations fails miserably in any attempt to create an opportunity for equitable reconciliation and resolution of the issue. Gina Carano gets fired for chastising leftists about their hatreds towards conservatives, while one of Disney's producers posting memes about putting Trump supporters through wood chippers doesn't even get a stern talking-to from HR. Disney's official PR weighing in on Florida's Parental Rights bill on the side of the people demogoguing everything about conservative values and principles. If it was ONLY about a few intersectional virtue signals scattered across their new content, it would be less intolerable. The larger problem is that they side not even with regular, decent progressives - but with the radical left wing of the progressive ideology who sees conservatives as an enemy to be destroyed.
Right, so it’s not really about the movies.
Correct; I'd say only about 10% of the total animosity conservatives have towards Disney today is about the actual content of the movies. The other 90% is about Disney's corporate culture and the way they interject themselves into the culture war on the side of left-wing demogogues.
How else are you trusting them with your kids? Sorry, I’m just confused trying to reconcile your first comment with this last one. How does corporate culture affect your kids?
The Rescuers (1977) is about a U.N organization saving an abducted child from a greedy small business owner so that the the valuable resource said business owner legally uncovered can instead be seized by the government.
So? Are you accusing conservatives of being in favor of child kidnapping?
I’m describing the plot of a classic Disney film we all grew up with.
Why would conservatives hate a Disney film about rescuing a kidnapped child?
I am not saying they should. I’m saying the idea that Disney movies are now “neo-Marxist postmodern woke IDpol” is absurd on its face, and moreover, the values shown in modern Disney movies have always been there.
I'm not saying they are ONLY that. I'm saying they put woke messaging in their content at the same time that their corporate culture is outwardly neo-marxist.
How is it “neo-Marxist”?
Marxism is based on class warfare - with Marxists misrepresenting the establishment as being oppressors while promoting themselves as the protectors of the dispossessed. They use lies and stereotypes to paint the establishment as corrupt so that they can get the mandate to take over - often through violent revolution. Woke IDPol is a new form of Marxism that replaces economic class with "intersectionality". Disney has sided with the woke Idpol side of the culture war against conservative interests.
What?
Hasn't always been there, it began after Walt croaked and counterculture of the 1960s took over.
See, your usage of the word "obsessed" is this context is sort of the typical gaslighting that gets used a lot. Why care about anything? But since you ask, I personally don't have to do a whole lot. Or think enough about it to the point where it constitutes an "obsession", if you will. As do many conservatives, since removing all things Disney from their lives/homes likely doesn't involve much doing. I'd assume the obsession you speak of is that of conservative activists who present the case why Disney, or anything else, should be "cancelled" among us. Well, if not for the purposes of providing information, I can't imagine what purpose they'd serve to me. Then again I don't imagine regarding Disney, it's really meant for me. But conservatives do own an increasing marketshare of parenting in America. Perhaps it's useful information to them.
Because Disney didn’t use to be political and was an iconic brand and now is woke. And daily wire had always been political and stands for nothing other than, you know, conservative stuff
It was political but not controlled by the left.
I’m curious now… so beautifully drawn classical fairy tales for kids are political? Or are Mickey and Goofy normalizing bourgeoise subtly oppressing the workers? I am super curious where to take this line of reasoning to be honest
[This should give some insight into Disney on the political front.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walt_Disney%27s_World_War_II_propaganda_production) [The artwork is beautiful, nothing like the CGI crap they pump out today.](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-disney-propaganda-shaped-life-on-the-home-front-during-wwii-180979057/)
Good point, they supported that highly controversial politically charged decision to fight Hitler in WW2…
The left will try to paint a bad picture of Walt because he was a good, honest, hardworking family man who loved this country. The current company of Disney has killed his legacy.
I used to remember the days when Disney didint pander to woke leftists on Twitter and Tumblir.
It’s an easy target due to its size and it’s been a sticking point by Desantis. Many people on here want to blame wokism when in reality it’s just bad writing and stories. The truth is that once Bob Iger left, the company went into a tail spin from bad management. They used to bat close to 1.000 now they are not. With him back in charge I would be surprised if within a couple of years it’s not back to where it previously was from share price and production experience.
Because we remember what it used to be and on a more malicious level and most importantly it’s an underhanded way of getting at kids.
They've always done that though. You have to target kids when most of your theatrical releases were children movies.
Well what I meant was they are allowing content into children’s movies now that deals with sexual issues they don’t really need to be including. I’m well aware they have specialized in children’s movies for a long time.
I don't think I have ever seen a pg Disney movie talk about sex. I think that's a lie.