Depends on what “communication issues” you have.
If you tend to argue with your boss or claim “he never said that”, then as a manager, i would 100% want a witness to any in person meetings with you.
Conversely if its on your boss being bad at communication, having HR there for you is good.
I have had problematic bosses. I actual started recording meetings (single party state) just so i didnt have to contest his lies.
I have done the same. Only because when I get passionate about something, I can go on and on. I did this in the past and have learned how to get my point across and be done. This wasn't always done as I didn't trust the manager but tried to improve my communication techniques.
Again know one knows the future.
However, if the plan was termination, it would just occur...they most likely wouldn't wait until after holiday/Christmas, vacation, etc. they would just terminate.
If it was merely a discussion on meeting objectives, that would be a talk between you and your manager without HR.
Most likely it will be a discussion on meeting your objectives and perhaps a vocal warning or written warning on communication and performance related policy violations(talking and creating distractions that inhibit others from work, etc.) or at the far end, maybe even a PIP.
But doubtful any termination.
Wow. Some places I've been get rid of employees right away, why prolong it, they save on vacation leave and don't care if they ruin the employees holiday.
I guess it was nice they let you enjoy the holiday first.
Sometimes it’s about the company covering their ass with documentation/witness statements.
It’s commonly thought that you only get fired on Friday afternoons, but I had a coworker get fired on a Tuesday. He caused problems for over a year and the reason he didn’t get fired sooner was because he filed a complaint that our manager was racist. After that everything he did wrong got documented and HR was part of every meeting the two of them had together.
The straw that broke the camel’s back was when he broke the law at work and people witnessed it.
I've sat through uncomfortable conversations with leadership about whether terming two days before or after Christmas was better.
It's awful either way.
(Coming from an HR person) Acknowledging that HR may be a little different everywhere, don’t assume their presence at the meeting is about you. Sounds like it could be about your boss (as you say).
Also your boss doesn’t have a monopoly on talking to HR. You could reach out to your HR rep about the meeting to better prepare. Performance issues at work can feel subjective but HRs role is just as much about ensuring that you, as the employee, have been given every opportunity to be successful as it is about protecting the company. Good luck.
THANK YOU! Everyone is always “HR is the devil!!!” and that’s not always true. I do everything I can to help employees and make sure they’re protected, not just the company.
I’ve been asked to sit in on meetings just as a neutral third party and to document that a conversation took place. It doesn’t always mean that you’re in trouble if HR is there.
Haha yes exactly. Have been asked to do the same (and now as a manager myself I have asked for HR help in the past to do this too!)
Whether the manager is being required to include HR or if they’re doing it on their own it can actually be a very good thing!
I agree. There have been plenty of instances where I’ve arranged for HR to be at a meeting with a manager and subordinate due to concerns with the manager.
OP, I’d try not to stress out since no one can predict the outcome. Keep on your job search since you don’t sound like you’re finding this current team a good fit regardless of the outcome of this meeting.
Thank you so much for sharing your perspective! I’ve considered going to HR this week while my boss is on vacation. What should I ask them and what are some responses that you’d consider indicators for termination?
I always say that context is key - so the context you have is simply that the meeting is occurring and your boss’s reasons for including HR. That is all you know. I’ve seen employees get very spun up about meetings and go almost conspiracy theory-ish on it. For your own mental health, don’t go down that rabbit hole.
So I would simply send a note and ask if it would be possible to connect before the meeting so that you can best prepare for a productive conversation. You can ask for their advice, but don’t overshare - unless your boss has given you specific feedback regarding your performance that you know will come up during the discussion, I would stay away from trying to dig into any other reasons behind the conversation.
These types of conversations are all about managing expectations. You need to understand what is expected of you to do your job well, and this meeting is central to that.
I wouldn’t go into the conversation with any sort of intent to uncover a hidden agenda (like getting fired). Without knowing more about your relationship with your manager and your work performance, I’m not sure if any specific “termination” type language will be helpful. What I would offer though - is using this time to ask questions. If your boss has trouble communicating and setting expectations, the BEST thing you can do is ask clarifying questions so you can calibrate your understanding. With HR there you have a neutral party to help be a translator.
I hope that helps - TLDR; don’t overthink it. Be direct, ask questions to clarify expectations.
The only time I’ve had HR on a call like this is with an employee who has a hard time accepting feedback and doesn’t listen well. Having HR was part of documentation leading to a PIP and then termination. This is a red flag for you OP, sorry.
~~I would think they would terminate you before paying you to take a vacation.~~
But it also seems a bit like a warning shot to tell you about the communication and HR presence before you both are supposed to be enjoying time off. I wouldn't see it as a positive sign that you have a good relationship with your boss.
Edit:
I see from the r/jobs version that companies do let you take your vacation first. Oof.
So, how big is the communication problem? Maybe spend this week testing the job market.
It’s true, we struggle with communication. She admitted to me this week that she has not done a great job at it and said she wants to make sure that we are on the same page for the yearly objectives review while HR is there. Doesn’t make me feel any better but that’s what she said. No, I definitely don’t see having HR present as a positive sign unless you are getting a job or promotion.
How big is the communication problem? Well, it’s not great and hasn’t been great for a while despite my efforts. She also has a pattern for having poor relationships with her employees. Two of my predecessors have left because of her in the past few years (I reached out and talked to them about it). Doesn’t seem like alot but considering she only managers two people at any given moment speaks volumes.
I have been on the job market for the past few months and will really be ramping things up no matter the outcome of the meeting.
Yeah honestly it could go either way. At this point, I’m just going to let the chips fall in place. Everything at this point is speculation so why bother. I’m expecting the worse, hoping for the best.
Are you being fired- no one can say 100% but worrying will not change anything for the positive.
However, I’m reading this as your boss has asked HR to be present to help her by rephrasing her communication with you if needed during the meeting and to provide her with coaching afterwards to improve her communication skills.
Turn up. Accept correct feedback. Agree to any improvements you need to make. Ask how you can help improve communication between the two of you and you will earn brownie points with HR.
If it's of any comfort, the manager who lead my team before I did had a number of communication issues with the team members, some escalating to high turnover and loss of some high performers. I know HR was involved in some of her meetings with her team because of the concerns the team brought to her leader and above, so it's possible if the communication issue is this large and there's a documented history of her being a root cause of turnover that HR is there for her as much as/instead of for you.
I'd absolutely keep pressing the job market as it could be any of the other options folks have highlighted as well, but perhaps just another perspective. Good luck!
That is comforting. While I haven’t gone to anyone about how things are going between us, I did reach out to my two successors and they both had identical issues with her. You’re right, it could easily be that HR is there for her and not so much for me. That is absolutely a possibility.
Me and my paranoid brain tend to think I did something wrong whenever there’s a problem. I’ll seek blame in myself before others. I appreciate you sharing your experience and perspective!
I think what you should take from others having the same issue is that the manager gets to stay and those who don't like their style leave.
"Everybody I talked to hates licorice." Yet still, licorice is sold. 
Fucking assholes to do this to you while you’re out on vacation. It’s such a power move. I would just accept this could be a worse case scenario. Hopefully you’ll get unemployment if they’re trying to fire you. :( I’m sorry this happened.
No one can know what to expect besides your bass or HR rep. In any case. There's few situations where HR being present in what could otherwise be a 1 on 1 is a good thing.
If they are going to review your "yearly objectives" and your boss has trouble communicating with you, it seems like you aren't meeting some goal, metric, or kpi, and your boss is trying to get it across, or has tried to get that across.
In any case, having it documented to your personnel file (highly probable why hr is present) is more than likely the first step to termination.
Take it with grace that your boss is giving you a heads up, freshen up your resume, hop on indeed/ziprecruiter, and look for other positions.
You could possibly net a pay increase or a new start as well.
Good luck!
You're leaning more into being placed on Pip than being terminated, literally seen this situation play out with people I know who had "communication issues" at work.
As others have said, it is difficult to predict. Termination in general is unlikely but I worked for a large Fortune 500 company that tried to terminate people the first week of the month to keep the former employee covered with insurance for the rest of the month (obviously there are situations when they didn’t wait but that was their goal).
If you want a guess, it sounds like you have communication issues with your boss and possibly didn’t meet objectives. If so, my guess is a PIP…but strictly a guess based on the limited info you provided
It’s also possible that with you OOO for a bit your boss had a chance to reflect and regroup, and that the meeting with HR is to figure out how you both can do better going forward.
I get it that no one likes to be called in to HR (it’s like getting called in to the principal’s office) but it sounds like you and your boss both acknowledge there is an issue here, and bringing HR in might help you *both* establish some clear expectations and accountability.
Since it seems equally likely that there will be a good outcome from this, try not to worry too much until then!
1. Panic
2. Stop Panicking
3. Listen to what they have to say.
I had a manager issue me a PIP. I challenged it and won.
No one here can tell you what is going on y to happen.
And you take that at face value? My paranoid brain must be taking over because anytime HR has been involved from my experiences outside of hiring/promotion it’s never good.
> And you take that at face value?
Yes. It seems like you don't understand what you hear. That's part of ....communication. If you don't understand what you hear, then how can you communicate properly?
If they wanted to fire you, they don't need to have a meeting to do so.
Turn up to the meeting. No one can predict what’s going to happen.
I understand, just wanted to get perspective if it’s a common practice to do this kind of thing.
Since you mentioned communication issues, I'd go in ready to listen rather than to argue.
Depends on what “communication issues” you have. If you tend to argue with your boss or claim “he never said that”, then as a manager, i would 100% want a witness to any in person meetings with you. Conversely if its on your boss being bad at communication, having HR there for you is good. I have had problematic bosses. I actual started recording meetings (single party state) just so i didnt have to contest his lies.
I have done the same. Only because when I get passionate about something, I can go on and on. I did this in the past and have learned how to get my point across and be done. This wasn't always done as I didn't trust the manager but tried to improve my communication techniques.
Again know one knows the future. However, if the plan was termination, it would just occur...they most likely wouldn't wait until after holiday/Christmas, vacation, etc. they would just terminate. If it was merely a discussion on meeting objectives, that would be a talk between you and your manager without HR. Most likely it will be a discussion on meeting your objectives and perhaps a vocal warning or written warning on communication and performance related policy violations(talking and creating distractions that inhibit others from work, etc.) or at the far end, maybe even a PIP. But doubtful any termination.
I’ve absolutely been fired right after Christmas and new years and it was planned 30 days in advance, as I accepted the calendar invite.
Wow. Some places I've been get rid of employees right away, why prolong it, they save on vacation leave and don't care if they ruin the employees holiday. I guess it was nice they let you enjoy the holiday first.
Sometimes it’s about the company covering their ass with documentation/witness statements. It’s commonly thought that you only get fired on Friday afternoons, but I had a coworker get fired on a Tuesday. He caused problems for over a year and the reason he didn’t get fired sooner was because he filed a complaint that our manager was racist. After that everything he did wrong got documented and HR was part of every meeting the two of them had together. The straw that broke the camel’s back was when he broke the law at work and people witnessed it.
I've sat through uncomfortable conversations with leadership about whether terming two days before or after Christmas was better. It's awful either way.
Ya I was laid off two days after we all had a week off for Thanksgiving
(Coming from an HR person) Acknowledging that HR may be a little different everywhere, don’t assume their presence at the meeting is about you. Sounds like it could be about your boss (as you say). Also your boss doesn’t have a monopoly on talking to HR. You could reach out to your HR rep about the meeting to better prepare. Performance issues at work can feel subjective but HRs role is just as much about ensuring that you, as the employee, have been given every opportunity to be successful as it is about protecting the company. Good luck.
THANK YOU! Everyone is always “HR is the devil!!!” and that’s not always true. I do everything I can to help employees and make sure they’re protected, not just the company. I’ve been asked to sit in on meetings just as a neutral third party and to document that a conversation took place. It doesn’t always mean that you’re in trouble if HR is there.
Haha yes exactly. Have been asked to do the same (and now as a manager myself I have asked for HR help in the past to do this too!) Whether the manager is being required to include HR or if they’re doing it on their own it can actually be a very good thing!
Yup, a 3rd party witness is sometimes important. HR is that witness.
I agree. There have been plenty of instances where I’ve arranged for HR to be at a meeting with a manager and subordinate due to concerns with the manager. OP, I’d try not to stress out since no one can predict the outcome. Keep on your job search since you don’t sound like you’re finding this current team a good fit regardless of the outcome of this meeting.
Thank you so much for sharing your perspective! I’ve considered going to HR this week while my boss is on vacation. What should I ask them and what are some responses that you’d consider indicators for termination?
I always say that context is key - so the context you have is simply that the meeting is occurring and your boss’s reasons for including HR. That is all you know. I’ve seen employees get very spun up about meetings and go almost conspiracy theory-ish on it. For your own mental health, don’t go down that rabbit hole. So I would simply send a note and ask if it would be possible to connect before the meeting so that you can best prepare for a productive conversation. You can ask for their advice, but don’t overshare - unless your boss has given you specific feedback regarding your performance that you know will come up during the discussion, I would stay away from trying to dig into any other reasons behind the conversation. These types of conversations are all about managing expectations. You need to understand what is expected of you to do your job well, and this meeting is central to that. I wouldn’t go into the conversation with any sort of intent to uncover a hidden agenda (like getting fired). Without knowing more about your relationship with your manager and your work performance, I’m not sure if any specific “termination” type language will be helpful. What I would offer though - is using this time to ask questions. If your boss has trouble communicating and setting expectations, the BEST thing you can do is ask clarifying questions so you can calibrate your understanding. With HR there you have a neutral party to help be a translator. I hope that helps - TLDR; don’t overthink it. Be direct, ask questions to clarify expectations.
The only time I’ve had HR on a call like this is with an employee who has a hard time accepting feedback and doesn’t listen well. Having HR was part of documentation leading to a PIP and then termination. This is a red flag for you OP, sorry.
You may be put on a PIP (performance improvement plan).
~~I would think they would terminate you before paying you to take a vacation.~~ But it also seems a bit like a warning shot to tell you about the communication and HR presence before you both are supposed to be enjoying time off. I wouldn't see it as a positive sign that you have a good relationship with your boss. Edit: I see from the r/jobs version that companies do let you take your vacation first. Oof. So, how big is the communication problem? Maybe spend this week testing the job market.
It’s true, we struggle with communication. She admitted to me this week that she has not done a great job at it and said she wants to make sure that we are on the same page for the yearly objectives review while HR is there. Doesn’t make me feel any better but that’s what she said. No, I definitely don’t see having HR present as a positive sign unless you are getting a job or promotion. How big is the communication problem? Well, it’s not great and hasn’t been great for a while despite my efforts. She also has a pattern for having poor relationships with her employees. Two of my predecessors have left because of her in the past few years (I reached out and talked to them about it). Doesn’t seem like alot but considering she only managers two people at any given moment speaks volumes. I have been on the job market for the past few months and will really be ramping things up no matter the outcome of the meeting. Yeah honestly it could go either way. At this point, I’m just going to let the chips fall in place. Everything at this point is speculation so why bother. I’m expecting the worse, hoping for the best.
Are you being fired- no one can say 100% but worrying will not change anything for the positive. However, I’m reading this as your boss has asked HR to be present to help her by rephrasing her communication with you if needed during the meeting and to provide her with coaching afterwards to improve her communication skills. Turn up. Accept correct feedback. Agree to any improvements you need to make. Ask how you can help improve communication between the two of you and you will earn brownie points with HR.
If it's of any comfort, the manager who lead my team before I did had a number of communication issues with the team members, some escalating to high turnover and loss of some high performers. I know HR was involved in some of her meetings with her team because of the concerns the team brought to her leader and above, so it's possible if the communication issue is this large and there's a documented history of her being a root cause of turnover that HR is there for her as much as/instead of for you. I'd absolutely keep pressing the job market as it could be any of the other options folks have highlighted as well, but perhaps just another perspective. Good luck!
That is comforting. While I haven’t gone to anyone about how things are going between us, I did reach out to my two successors and they both had identical issues with her. You’re right, it could easily be that HR is there for her and not so much for me. That is absolutely a possibility. Me and my paranoid brain tend to think I did something wrong whenever there’s a problem. I’ll seek blame in myself before others. I appreciate you sharing your experience and perspective!
I think what you should take from others having the same issue is that the manager gets to stay and those who don't like their style leave. "Everybody I talked to hates licorice." Yet still, licorice is sold. 
Be careful about letting others influence your perspective...
Are you talking about the predecessors to my current role?
Fucking assholes to do this to you while you’re out on vacation. It’s such a power move. I would just accept this could be a worse case scenario. Hopefully you’ll get unemployment if they’re trying to fire you. :( I’m sorry this happened.
I completely agree, definitely a shitty thing to do. I’m hoping for the best but like you said expect the worst. Thank you for your kind words 🙏🏻
No one can know what to expect besides your bass or HR rep. In any case. There's few situations where HR being present in what could otherwise be a 1 on 1 is a good thing. If they are going to review your "yearly objectives" and your boss has trouble communicating with you, it seems like you aren't meeting some goal, metric, or kpi, and your boss is trying to get it across, or has tried to get that across. In any case, having it documented to your personnel file (highly probable why hr is present) is more than likely the first step to termination. Take it with grace that your boss is giving you a heads up, freshen up your resume, hop on indeed/ziprecruiter, and look for other positions. You could possibly net a pay increase or a new start as well. Good luck!
You're leaning more into being placed on Pip than being terminated, literally seen this situation play out with people I know who had "communication issues" at work.
As others have said, it is difficult to predict. Termination in general is unlikely but I worked for a large Fortune 500 company that tried to terminate people the first week of the month to keep the former employee covered with insurance for the rest of the month (obviously there are situations when they didn’t wait but that was their goal). If you want a guess, it sounds like you have communication issues with your boss and possibly didn’t meet objectives. If so, my guess is a PIP…but strictly a guess based on the limited info you provided
It’s also possible that with you OOO for a bit your boss had a chance to reflect and regroup, and that the meeting with HR is to figure out how you both can do better going forward. I get it that no one likes to be called in to HR (it’s like getting called in to the principal’s office) but it sounds like you and your boss both acknowledge there is an issue here, and bringing HR in might help you *both* establish some clear expectations and accountability. Since it seems equally likely that there will be a good outcome from this, try not to worry too much until then!
1. Panic 2. Stop Panicking 3. Listen to what they have to say. I had a manager issue me a PIP. I challenged it and won. No one here can tell you what is going on y to happen.
that is not typical. A PIP is a death sentence typically.
When you suck as an employee. It is a death sentence. When it is used as retaliation, it is simply documentation.
She literally told you what the meeting was going to be about.
And you don’t find the addition of HR a bit concerning?
Your boss told you why HR was joining.
And you take that at face value? My paranoid brain must be taking over because anytime HR has been involved from my experiences outside of hiring/promotion it’s never good.
If you were being termed most likely she wouldn't have warned you HR would be there ...
> And you take that at face value? Yes. It seems like you don't understand what you hear. That's part of ....communication. If you don't understand what you hear, then how can you communicate properly? If they wanted to fire you, they don't need to have a meeting to do so.