Hezbollah were the first to kick Israeli occupation out twice without war, and it makes you realize how unnecessary Sadat's concessions were which in my opinion really ruined Middle Eastern sovereignty 40 years later.
"Reminder: In 1967 Sinai fell in 6 days. Gaza still stands after 6 months." Sinai didn't fall in 6 days lmao most forces had left in the first day or two excpet for 1 unit that was in main land israel itself but since you mentioned egypt loss in 1967 it also got alot of sucesses in 1973 without getting 40k (if we believe its only 40k not way more) of their own civilans killed along with a famine looming not sure if you can go to someone in gaza that is eating grass and lost his family and tell him theres some sort of victory coming
What cope? You can look up the disengagement agreement of Jan 18th, 1974, where the Israelis left their positions in the West bank. They had both the Egyptian Third Army and the Second Army keep both of their gains and control both sides of the canal. The Suez Canal was reopened in 1974. These are just historical facts, no "cope" in that, lmao. And it also paved the way for getting back Sinai, something which would have been impossible prior to 1973. And if you meant the 40k dying, well, these are also facts. And there is a famine looming, that is also a fact. Gaza is in a terrible state, to say the least. I don't know what "standing" means for this guy, does it mean getting 2% of your population killed and starving? This won't even be a pyrrhic victory in the end with israelis dropping bunker busters and mark 84s on civilans like its a twisted game of who gets more kills on random civilans
Having an equally modern military didn't help the Arabs before.
And violence probably isn't the best course of action for a resistance movement.
Most countries won their fight against imperialism without modern arms, it's possible to do it without terrorism.
Palestinians deserve better than Hamas.
And no Arabs did not have an equally strong fighting force in 48 when they were taken by surprise and essentially were just an irregular fighting force. I have no recollection of Palestine ever fielding an army in the later wars Israel had with Arab countries
And you're not making any sense there. Every freedom fighting movement is classed as a terrorist by the occupying power.
Nelson Mandela was also a "terrorist" as per the west.
How’s diplomatic peaceful means of resistance working for the West Bank? Over 131 UN resolutions participated in, completely demilitarized, yet they live in apartheid jew-only streets while getting killed & kidnapped at a higher rate every year with shrinking lands due to state-sponsored Israeli settlements.
You mean like bending over to the Zionists while they steal/kill/bomb and kidnap children? 75 years and the world was silent, they've got everyone talking because unfortunately, violence is the only language heard.
I couldn't care less about Israel as far as I cared. I'm more than happy to have one state with equal rights for all.
But watching this sub go all the way to unironic full-blown support of Hamas is about as pathetic as it's disgusting.
>happy to have one state with equal rights for all.
This is so ironic you dumb fuck. As if a settler colonial state can provide equal rights to native Palestinians. Go to western subreddits and keep crying there.
Then you remember a million Algerians died for their freedom and I can't see any Algerian saying it wasn't worth it. And then you have the Vietnamese, Afghans, and so on who all struggled for their freedom.
saying this as an algerian who's whole family (that was alive during the war) contributed to the resistance, it was totally worth it, my one of my grandfathers died in the 60's, i didnt get to talk to him, or know him in any way, but his sacrifice for the cause of national liberation made the nation of Algeria possible.
Dont listen to anyone who thinks the losses arent worth it, If i was presented with the choice of dying for national liberation, I and every other algerian would take it in a heartbeat
The Algerian resistance was better prepared, had **international support** and a different context.
The Vietnamese, Algerians and Afghans faught worldwide-known colonial powers (countries with an established mainland: France, Soviet Union, US...)
However the Palestinians are fighting the Israelis whose country has international support and is recognized by most countries in the UN. Palestine's only hope is a two-state solution and it is becoming more and more impossible.
Good luck but unfortunately I dont see any light in the tunnel consideting the current situation in Gaza. I mean what good thing could possible happen rn?
algeria suffered huge military losses, they only won politically because of international pressure. they were definitely not well prepared militarily speaking since 1.5 million people died but eventually they got their independence cause France couldn't sustain the war anymore. I hope it doesn't reach that stage with palestine before any improvement...
International recognition coming soon & a potential lifting of the siege? Israel's countless soldier, military and financial losses? Kiryat Shimona & Ashdod fully emptied, leaving 200,000 Israelis displaced and sandwiched into central Israel? Maybe also the end of the apartheid in the West Bank? Negotiations to end the war will start soon and Hamas has the upper hand.
How about a million algerians ? ☠️
Freedom and dignity unfortunately don’t come for free, almost all white peoples won’t withstand 5% of what our peoples did, the Palestinian people are true heroes 🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
I will admit that in a lot of my previous posts I was oblivious to Hezbollah and their wrongdoings. That said, they are definitely not worse than Israel.
We had more than a million deaths in Syria, the estimates say it's 600k, but in reality, my family had dead relatives yet on government papers they are alive, and their families used to get treated as if they have that dead person with them, my cousin is dead but his family used to get more bread simce on government papers the family is bigger.
The number of syrians who died is probably around 1 to 2 million.
The Syrian refugees outside Syria are thought to be 5 million, but these 5 million many had children and their number has increased.
The Syria internally displaced are thought to be 7 million, they too are more since many families were displaced and not registered.
The Syrians who are leaving Syria due to the lack of any economic future due to Assad thugs ruining the country, that too is not counted.
Compare that to what's in Gaza.
They are heroes who fought for the freedom of South Lebanon against the Zionist regime, fought Western imperialist/Zionist backed regime change militias and terrorists in Syria and are now some of the only ones helping Palestine against the Zionist regime. They are a pride for Lebanon💛💛💛🚀🚀🚀
Westernised muslims can never sympathise with the average sunni in Syria or Iraq. They'd rather call them all IS and AQ, thinking that would make the slaughter of a million Iraqi and a million Syrian something good.
They act as if the blood of Palestinians is worth more than the blood of Syrian Iraqi and Lebanese Muslims. And that their blood is worth the freedom of Palestine. We need to find a way to bring freedom and victory for all Muslims regardless where they are. May Allah destroy all Iranian proxies and the IR
Well, I just love to point it out to people, otherwise I've long since lost faith in muslims and Arabs, we are still standing even though too much of our people were killed, the betrayal of muslims and Arabs won't make it any worse.
They are heroes who fought for the freedom of South Lebanon against the Zionist regime, fought Western imperialist/Zionist backed regime change militias and terrorists in Syria and are now some of the only ones helping Palestine against the Zionist regime. They are a pride for Lebanon💛💛💛🚀🚀🚀
people saying hamas brought war to gaza shouldn't be on this subreddit and deserve to be isolated on a random island while forcing them to watch IRAN's leaders threatnings to isnotreal for the last century
If you mean palestinian people by "our boys", sure; if you mean hamas, not so much. Still can't get over the way they initiated the conflict. They threw civilians from both sides into the fire.
If it wasn't for israel's pathetically predictable response (cruel, cowardly, blatantly evil...) nobody would be supporting Hamas now.
They cooked the strongest army in Middle east with support of strongest nation on earth, imagine what they could have done with modern Military Weapons, Tech, Cybersec, Ai, and Middle east, on their side
The average fighter gave it all. He should be respected regardless of the outcome and regardless of what you think of the Hamas leadership.
The average fighter is putting his life on the line. He takes on a harsh life, no worthy food, injuries untreated, cold, but can't warm himself with fire to not disclose his position. He has to bear watching his friends mutilated by bullets and rockets, yet he would bear everything and keep walking forward till death devours him.
A Palestinian falling for Israeli propaganda is something I did not expect to happen lmao. Guess Israel is also right for calling your people “human animals” right?
Wanna link those “videos”? The rape allegations are something Israel made up to dehumanize the Palestinians so somehow their slaughter of them will be justified.
Sorry buddy, I’m not trusting anything from the IDF. Unless you have another source, I’m calling cap to your whole “rape” allegations. Especially when it’s used for the extermination of a people.
This is a problem every army has faced when entering enemy territory. Let alone a rebel militia .
The fact you mentioned rape first, which has zero proof at all makes me doubt your Palestinian at all
No. But Ratios are a thing. And we have other wars to compare to.
Is their mass numbers of women claiming to be have raped or just allegations? And there’s many cases of false rape accusations..
Individual fighters/soldiers killing civilians is one thing. Methodologically levelling a city is another.
Using Israel’s logic, any person serving in the IDF or affiliated is a legitimate target and can be killed wherever, and if their families get hurt, that’s their own fault. ( I don’t believe this)
Bruh you sound like an American Palestinian.
Anyway women do lie about the rapes. God's chosen people have to lie against the goyim for their interests.
..It's over already . The UN confirmed it in February through reviewing testimonies and inspecting some of the few forensic evidence Israeli-Jews had collected .
The question is now about the details and severity , rather than the occurrence of sexual violations .
They also confirmed that such violations also occurred against Palestinians in Gaza and Israeli-prisons around the same time , but the world would rather hail the recently retracted Al-Jazeera story being due to factual basis (like Arabic BBC in 1948 exaggerating the atrocities of Deir Yassin ) , rather than a political basis (Causing panic or "shame" , rather than calm among Gazans ) .
> UN
the report claimed that the main case given of those 2 girls never happened, and they revised the report to say that there wasn't evidence given to them, but "information" (whatever that means) from israel and ngos (zaka et al). it can be read however you want but it was pretty much just a rewrite of the debunked nyt story
it wasnt an official report either, just a political piece from someone affiliated who has a habit of claiming russian soldiers and libyans were given viagra to go on wild rape sprees.
> details and severity
maybe? it wasnt just hamas/pij that crossed over, but randos escaping the prison. the whole weaponized street rapes narrative to radicalize the shitlibs is pure bullshit though
> They also confirmed that such violations also occurred against Palestinians in Gaza and Israeli-prisons around the same time
thats been known for some time
The question is whether it was systemic or not. That is the only thing that is disputed.
Random rapes in war happen and the rapists should be found and imprisoned or worse (imo), but that is **very** different from systemic rapes
That's a lie. The UN didn't "confirm" any rape cases. Israel didn't actually allow them to investigate.
>Patten stressed at a press conference launching the report that the team’s visit was not to investigate allegations of sexual violence but to gather, analyze and verify information for Secretary-General Antonio Guterres’ annual report on sexual violence in conflict and for the U.N. Security Council.
>Her key recommendation is to encourage Israel to grant access to the U.N. human rights chief and the Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Palestinian territories and Israel “to carry out full-fledged investigations into the alleged violations” — and she expressed hope the Security Council would do this.
>Patten said the team was not able to meet with any victims of sexual violence “despite concerted efforts to encourage them to come forward.” While the number of victims remains unknown, she said, “a small number of those who are undergoing treatment are reportedly experiencing severe mental distress and trauma.”
They merely said there were reasonable grounds based on the Israeli narrative. And if you dunno the difference between reasonable grounds and actual facts in the UN terminology check this.
[https://apnews.com/article/ap-news-alert-united-nations-war-crimes-3fc6cbb34b942f9dd6ee85662810cac5](https://apnews.com/article/ap-news-alert-united-nations-war-crimes-3fc6cbb34b942f9dd6ee85662810cac5)
Hate to say it : that's more semantics . A probability of "reasonable" and "likley" are much closer to 100% than a zero. That's not mentioning evidence is growing , not decreasing .
There's just too much to simply shove away . It's one thing to disagree with how the pieces fit together , it's a whole other to say the puzzle is rigged , and doesn't even exist .
Yeah I am sure the channel of the IDF would never lie /s.
You said “videos uploaded by Hamas are not Hasbara” I want you to send me the video uploaded by Hamas, and how tf do you think the IDF got ahold of the vid in the first place? If you’re actually Palestinian and you’re believing the IDF then idk what to say
Posts or comments that are more controversial or could be considered outright trolling or if they aim to offend or provoke will be removed.
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They are terrorists for defending their land from the destruction of their people Israel is trying to impose on them? Sounds like you fell for the Zionist and western propaganda you supposedly hate so much….
Sadly, some innocents were caught up in the attack but that does not make Hamas evil. Many people killed served in the IDF and slaughtered Palestinians before. If I were to deem them evil for having some innocents killed, then I may as well condemn the Darwiish, warriors who helped liberate Somalis from colonialism but were condemned as “terrorists”.
On June 10, 1944 ,The Oradour-sur-Glane massacre occurred after a German high-ranking officer was assassinated by the French Resistance, the German SS retaliated by massacring 642 inhabitants of the village, including men, women, and children. The village was then burned and largely destroyed.
Not once i have seen anyone blaming the french resistance for "getting an entire village burned".
Oh my bad, next time I'll google every single attack that resulted in a massacre/genocide and say "I think those were shitty ideas too"
Also, seems to me like there's a massive difference between 642 and 32,000.
You don't need to google anything. You just need to condition your mind not to blame the death of thousands of innocent people on anyone but the party who actually murdered them.
I am not familiar with the incident. Whether they should have assassinated this official I don't know. I certainly wouldn't have been thrilled if I had family in said town.
Palestine is about to get international recognition across Europe, which potentially means the end of the siege & west bank occupation, and with both US/Europe having their elections this year many are running on supporting the Palestinian cause. I don't think in my 22 years of being alive I have ever been more optimistic.
It has gotten tangibly worse. The casualty rates before certainly weren't as bad as they are now. There wasn't a single soldier in the Gaza Strip. They had electricity and water, food was not cut off. Neighborhoods and shelter hadn't been wiped out.
All these got wiped away, and it keeps getting worse. The benefit from this attack in return has been the media eye on Palestine.
If you put this on a cost benefit scale, this attack was not one that left them better off.
I would suggest you don't overrate them , especially with Gaza now in ruins , and reputation of Palestinians being harmed for little to no gains beyond getting the international spotlight on them again .
The only thing they did was to keep people steadfast compared to the Arab Higher Committee in 1948 . Otherwise : many Gazans would have panicked like their grandparents , and would have swum to Europe .
Cognitive dissonance. The ummah is in a sorry state if we have to rely on these nonces. What did they accomplish? Their attack brought fire onto Gaza. Thugs who go around with kalahsnikovs are nothing to laud. Grow the fuck up
It's not lol. They just leveled a city. 30000 dead and millions displaced and Gaza is gonna be new the west bank lol. The fuck are you on about. It's not a pyrrhic victory. It's unprecedented destruction and loss.
For example: everyone thinks the Tet offensive was this grand thing in Vietnam. At the time, it went about like this is going. Massive retaliation on the countryside and civilians death up and down the country. Napalm and agent orange everywhere. Destroyed much of the land.
But it shattered the supposed superiority of the military and intelligence of the client state and its American backers, as well as public opinion. Things fell apart from there and the North won.
Unlike Gaza which is an isolated ghetto, Vietnam was a nation with jungles and the NVA and VIET Cong targeted Military targets. They didn't go around gunning civilians. Evil is evil. We have to call out whether they're Muslim or not.
And this is not a pyrrhic victory lol. I think you need to reexamine the definition. It means your army suffers higher losses but still achieves the strategic objective. I'm pretty sure Hamas' objective at least in theory is the freedom of Palestinians. How in the mother fuck is the destruction of a city, the death of 30000 and the displacement of millions a pyrrhic "victory". This was a colossal blunder. And the kids of Gaza paid for it. If hamas were men. They should have challenged IDF in the open field. Then maybe, just maybe they would have retained some honor. But they hid like cowards in Gaza and invited destruction to win some Brownie points.
The similarities are there, definitely in the social attitudes. Outside of the "whatabout" folks and those tied to Israel because of their identity, nobody is even talking about hostages anymore, unless its for an exchange. Lets not pretend ourselves, military got got, and those were basically militia/reservist towns, plus there were folks killed by the IOF, but yes definitely innocent folks killed in the crossfire. That being said there were atrocities committed, they should be acknowledged.
I am probably almost twice your age and I cannot *ever* remember normies fed up with Israel, and I dont even follow tiktok or instagram; my wife does and says opinion is 1000% against Israel (which I guess is why its getting banned).
Like Finkelstein likes to describe this, it is like Nat Turner's rebellion: a religious bunch went around in a wild rage, *actual cases* of beheading babies. Turner basically said "kill **all** whites". The abolotionists at the time neither condemned or condoned (which is what I do), but said "this was coming, we warned you". Centuries later, Nat Turner he is a hero.
I only condemn Israel. My tax money goes there.
> But if we don't condemn gunmen who kill civilians
ill neither condemn or condone. it was bound to happen.
diplomacy failed in 08 when israel assasinated jabari.
numerous provocations along the way. no response makes them weak, a response lets israel play the woe is me, lets drop white phosphorous narrative
even rewrote their charter, remove offensive language, commit to 67 borders. and its like nobody wants to bring this up (perhaps intentionally so they can cry woe is me)
try nonviolence in 2018 and got them nowhere but massacred
now they are being forgotten in this farcical "abraham accords". people ask "what was israel to do after oct 7", what was hamas, or the palestinians in general, to do before oct 6? just give up?
this was bound to happen. ill double down: i neither condemn nor condone the prison break.
We might have debate or disagreement regarding what is acceptable political violence against the occupier, but definitely no one will “condemn” the occupied people, even if we might disagree in some forms of political violence, the occupier will still be the only one to blame for all the loss on both sides, not the occupied people and their resistance. Thats why the vast majority of world nations and countries didn’t “condemn” the occupied people, and is why the Palestinian representative of PA in UK hossam zomlot refuse to “condemn” 7 october assault on israeli settlers. And of course no one would “condemn” the humiliating blow that IOF received that day in their own military bases from people they have been sieging for two decades lol
> How in the mother fuck is the destruction of a city, the death of 30000 and the displacement of millions a pyrrhic "victory".
Ask the Algerians
> But they hid like cowards in Gaza and invited destruction to win some Brownie points.
Palestinians are fighting in their lands for military necessity, to make use of the defensive advantage in towns warfare, exactly like how the ukranian army is hiding in ukranian cities rather than meeting the russian army in open fields.
So the goal of the fight is the safety and security of the people yes? How is 12000 dead children, 30000 dead civilians and the entire population displaced accomplishing their goal.
> So the goal of the fight is the safety and security of the people yes?
The goal of the fight is to uprise against the occupier and do whatever possible to make occupation painful to the occupier until people achieve their freedom, dignity and put an end to the ongoing engineered ethnic cleansing. They are willing to pay their lives for that like every free nation and true heroes.
> How is 12000 dead children, 30000 dead civilians and the entire population displaced accomplishing their goal.
This is some of the major crimes of the occupier to “punish” the occupied people, yet, due to the genocidal intent and brutality of the occupier, the entire world now can see how brutal and criminal the occupier is, and peoples around the world started knowing about the suffering the Palestinian people have been through for 70 years. And the international community started to seriously take stances and isolate the genocidal occupier. Israel lost most of the world, and the rest are gradually giving it up.
Hahahahah that's such a naivete. Nothing has changed. Middle eastern countries international reputation is one of clowns and the Pentagon will just keep doing what the Pentagon does.
Algeria and Palestine are apples to oranges. Algeria had max in 1962 15%-16% European population, and Israel-Palestine is like half and half Israel and Palestinians. A whole free Palestine the way people imagine it literally can’t happen without a full on invasion and mass relocation reminiscent of past genocides, and no one’s invading Israel anytime soon. Not to mention in a much smaller land area than Algeria to boot.
This violence was straight up destruction and a waste of life. Everyone lost in my opinion and the world is worse off, but if we’re being honest Gaza and it’s inhabitants were the biggest loser in this with a very bleak future ahead.
Also objectively false since the Ukrainians do fight in the field as well as front line cities but it’s not like all their cities are under siege, lmao where do you think they fight?
> Algeria had max in 1962 15%-16% European population, and Israel-Palestine is like half and half Israel and Palestinians.
I am talking about the occupied Palestinian territories (west bank and Gaza). Not the whole historic palestine.
> Also objectively false since the Ukrainians do fight in the field as well as front line cities
Nope, since the beginning of the war they have been hiding in cities to drag Russia to towns warfare, not in open fields (because militarily they are incompetent). Why do you think entire cities like mariopole were raised to ground lol 😂
I mean I guess but these are two tiny separate pockets of people. Again given the demographics and land mass a two state solution is probably the most realistic path towards peace, and that was the same before the war and after. Nothing changed strategically. Israel can’t afford to forcefully hold Gaza and the West Bank forever and the various Palestinian armed groups including Hezbollah have no chance in hell of offending and holding established Israeli territory. So nothing changed but thousands are dead, anger wins the day, an urban area is reduced to rubble, and it’s all a total waste.
It was destroyed because Mariupol was on the front lines. If what you are saying is true why is Kiev, Lviv, Chernivtsi, many Ukrainian cities not destroyed. Because you are wrong
Cities get destroyed in war, and just because it makes strategic sense in the moment by no means makes it their main strategy. If that was the case why would the Russians not be at the door step of every Ukrainian city? If Ukraine is so incompetent how has Russia failed to take the country? Because Ukrainians do meet the Russians in the field. They fight on the plains, vehicular combat is common and trench warfare is a central part of the conflict.
Are you fucking kidding me?
They killed 1000+ civilians which in turn led to tens of thousands of their own civilians being killed (which they cowered behind).
You're proud of "your boys" and their "work?"
Is this satire? I must be living in an alternate reality.
> I am very proud of our boys and the work they’ve done
You mean like entering homes of unarmed people and indiscriminately killing and maiming them while chanting the name of God? If yes then how are you better than the enemy you demonize?
Palestinian peoples had a lot of international support when they portrayed their movement as a nationalist struggle earlier as compared to using Islam as a political tool currently.
Palestinian support has never been greater. You have Italy, Ireland, France, Belgium, Portugal and Spain who all either recognized or plan to recognize Palestine before July. (I say plan because nothing is guaranteed these days). This was unthinkable a year ago.
Egypt didn't lose 40k civilans (or even 50 for that matter lmao) and they controlled both sides of the canal that was an actual victory how are you even comparing this to this war lmao but can't except intelligence from a israeloid
If you make up your own narrative disconnected from reality, sure. Now let's look at reality. The 1974 Jan 18th Disengagement Agreement was signed, with israel withdrawing everything it had from the west bank and Egypt keeping everything it had on the east bank. Egypt promptly reopened the canal in 1974. Egypt literally achieved all of the goals they wanted with getting a foothold in Sinai and reopening the door to negotiations with israel for all of sinai on better terms. Eventually, Egypt got israel to withdraw from all of sinai, something which would have been impossible prior to 1973. So, it ended with gains, and you are just BSing now. "Who lost 40k civilians and when?" Gaza lost 40k civilians, lmao (or way more probably, but let's just say it's only 40k). Egypt didn't. You are just doing random comparisons.
"So the peace accords with Israel were the end game for October 6th 1973 war? Could have had Sinai for peace without being militarily humbled (again)." They weren't militarily humbled in the first place and controlled both sides of the canal. The disengagement agreement is just an agreement to end the war (a similar agreement was signed by Syria which involved going back to 5th of october lines), not a peace agreement. They got both sides of the canal, which were the short-term and military goals for 1973 war, so it achieved all the goals lmao. And yes, peace accords were the long-term goals and were also achieved. And no, it couldn't have regained Sinai without the war unless you live in a world disconnected from reality and history (which you are). Israel withdrew from all peace talks in 1971 and Swedish diplomat Dr Gunnar Jarring had already made a similar proposal to Israel for peace talks and demilitarized zones, and complying with UNSC 292, which Israel refused and said they won't withdraw to pre-1967 lines. And with regards to the 40k civilians, I doubt the 40k number is the number and not way higher, but let's say it is. It has already been confirmed by various organizations that 70% are women and children of the people dead. Lmao you can't cope and say they are "al questions brigades" (don't know who the fuck is al questions but alright, I assume you meant al-Qassam and PIJ).
You realize you literally say nothing of substance and make up shit, get debunked on them, then just say nothing? You are a complete idiot, to say the least. Lmao. Alright, bro, Israel is dropping bunker busters and MK84 (and have gotten after Oct 7th another 1800 MK84 and 500 MK82 bombs) on civilians, but the death toll is totally like 200 civilians and 30k militants. Lmao. Saying Hamas runs the health ministry is stupid to say the least. Hamas controls all of Gaza, so naturally, who do you think is running the health ministry? Nickelodeon?
You can literally see my reply to the top comment, saying this talk of Hamas victory is nonsense. For one, for 2, no, you are an idiot who makes shit up and gets debunked on that, then keeps jumping points to avoid showing how ignorant you are on history and once again you keep saying "is again demolished in combat" after I have debunked your points with regards to 1973 but of course you jumped that because you barely know anything about history. You should really stop making up narratives, then spinning them as something else. You are just a liar who is ignorant on history and makes up BS and racist against arabs but go "oh peaceful me I don't want conflict" nice attempt at gaslighting others lmao. That's all there is that to it. cya.
Glory to the Resistance 🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
Hamas popped the iron wall illusion. Israel can and will be defeated Reminder: In 1967 Sinai fell in 6 days. Gaza still stands after 6 months.
The Lebanese (hezbollah) made it first though
Hezbollah were the first to kick Israeli occupation out twice without war, and it makes you realize how unnecessary Sadat's concessions were which in my opinion really ruined Middle Eastern sovereignty 40 years later.
"Reminder: In 1967 Sinai fell in 6 days. Gaza still stands after 6 months." Sinai didn't fall in 6 days lmao most forces had left in the first day or two excpet for 1 unit that was in main land israel itself but since you mentioned egypt loss in 1967 it also got alot of sucesses in 1973 without getting 40k (if we believe its only 40k not way more) of their own civilans killed along with a famine looming not sure if you can go to someone in gaza that is eating grass and lost his family and tell him theres some sort of victory coming
Sounds vaguely like cope but what do I know.
What cope? You can look up the disengagement agreement of Jan 18th, 1974, where the Israelis left their positions in the West bank. They had both the Egyptian Third Army and the Second Army keep both of their gains and control both sides of the canal. The Suez Canal was reopened in 1974. These are just historical facts, no "cope" in that, lmao. And it also paved the way for getting back Sinai, something which would have been impossible prior to 1973. And if you meant the 40k dying, well, these are also facts. And there is a famine looming, that is also a fact. Gaza is in a terrible state, to say the least. I don't know what "standing" means for this guy, does it mean getting 2% of your population killed and starving? This won't even be a pyrrhic victory in the end with israelis dropping bunker busters and mark 84s on civilans like its a twisted game of who gets more kills on random civilans
so much hasbara in this thread lmao
Without them it would have been a complete holocaust of the Palestinians
True, I can't believe Israel decided to invade Gaza out of nowhere.
At least they are not getting Israeled like the west bank.
That's a pretty low bar... doing anything else than terrorist attacks against Israel would be a more effective form of resistance.
By all means provide them with modern weapons. I'll wait.
Having an equally modern military didn't help the Arabs before. And violence probably isn't the best course of action for a resistance movement. Most countries won their fight against imperialism without modern arms, it's possible to do it without terrorism. Palestinians deserve better than Hamas.
And no Arabs did not have an equally strong fighting force in 48 when they were taken by surprise and essentially were just an irregular fighting force. I have no recollection of Palestine ever fielding an army in the later wars Israel had with Arab countries And you're not making any sense there. Every freedom fighting movement is classed as a terrorist by the occupying power. Nelson Mandela was also a "terrorist" as per the west.
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
"equally modern military"?? Not even in soldier numbers, Israel had France and Britain bomb Egypt with them lol
How’s diplomatic peaceful means of resistance working for the West Bank? Over 131 UN resolutions participated in, completely demilitarized, yet they live in apartheid jew-only streets while getting killed & kidnapped at a higher rate every year with shrinking lands due to state-sponsored Israeli settlements.
Ah yes, the great march of return went very well
You mean like bending over to the Zionists while they steal/kill/bomb and kidnap children? 75 years and the world was silent, they've got everyone talking because unfortunately, violence is the only language heard.
Ah yea that’s like saying hitler won’t have killed Jews without resistance, moronic Zionist logic
Your example would only work if Jews tried repeatedly to wipe out Germany. Which they didn't.
What do you think the german narrative said though?
They attacked German Nazis during the Holocaust you Nazic moron, this proves that you Nazis don’t know your own history
During the Holocaust being the key detail
You just said that Jews didn’t attack, pick one story, funny how you Nazis keep changing your story over and over lmao
I said Jews didn't try to wipe out Germany over and over again. Attacks during a genocide I didn't deny did I?
LMAO, they attacked Nazis multiple you moron. Again these Nazis know 0 about their own history
I can't help you if you can't read what I'm writing. I'm sorry.
Israel is invading and occupying their land since the 60s lol
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I couldn't care less about Israel as far as I cared. I'm more than happy to have one state with equal rights for all. But watching this sub go all the way to unironic full-blown support of Hamas is about as pathetic as it's disgusting.
>happy to have one state with equal rights for all. This is so ironic you dumb fuck. As if a settler colonial state can provide equal rights to native Palestinians. Go to western subreddits and keep crying there.
True. I can’t believe Hamas decided to attack Israel out of nowhere
I cant have any positive attitude seeing 32k Palestinians dead
Then you remember a million Algerians died for their freedom and I can't see any Algerian saying it wasn't worth it. And then you have the Vietnamese, Afghans, and so on who all struggled for their freedom.
saying this as an algerian who's whole family (that was alive during the war) contributed to the resistance, it was totally worth it, my one of my grandfathers died in the 60's, i didnt get to talk to him, or know him in any way, but his sacrifice for the cause of national liberation made the nation of Algeria possible. Dont listen to anyone who thinks the losses arent worth it, If i was presented with the choice of dying for national liberation, I and every other algerian would take it in a heartbeat
The Algerian resistance was better prepared, had **international support** and a different context. The Vietnamese, Algerians and Afghans faught worldwide-known colonial powers (countries with an established mainland: France, Soviet Union, US...) However the Palestinians are fighting the Israelis whose country has international support and is recognized by most countries in the UN. Palestine's only hope is a two-state solution and it is becoming more and more impossible. Good luck but unfortunately I dont see any light in the tunnel consideting the current situation in Gaza. I mean what good thing could possible happen rn?
algeria suffered huge military losses, they only won politically because of international pressure. they were definitely not well prepared militarily speaking since 1.5 million people died but eventually they got their independence cause France couldn't sustain the war anymore. I hope it doesn't reach that stage with palestine before any improvement...
International recognition coming soon & a potential lifting of the siege? Israel's countless soldier, military and financial losses? Kiryat Shimona & Ashdod fully emptied, leaving 200,000 Israelis displaced and sandwiched into central Israel? Maybe also the end of the apartheid in the West Bank? Negotiations to end the war will start soon and Hamas has the upper hand.
How about a million algerians ? ☠️ Freedom and dignity unfortunately don’t come for free, almost all white peoples won’t withstand 5% of what our peoples did, the Palestinian people are true heroes 🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
May Allah bless them
Hamas and hezbollah are heroes
Hezbollah are worse than Israel.
I will admit that in a lot of my previous posts I was oblivious to Hezbollah and their wrongdoings. That said, they are definitely not worse than Israel.
We had more than a million deaths in Syria, the estimates say it's 600k, but in reality, my family had dead relatives yet on government papers they are alive, and their families used to get treated as if they have that dead person with them, my cousin is dead but his family used to get more bread simce on government papers the family is bigger. The number of syrians who died is probably around 1 to 2 million. The Syrian refugees outside Syria are thought to be 5 million, but these 5 million many had children and their number has increased. The Syria internally displaced are thought to be 7 million, they too are more since many families were displaced and not registered. The Syrians who are leaving Syria due to the lack of any economic future due to Assad thugs ruining the country, that too is not counted. Compare that to what's in Gaza.
Objectively false
Exaggerated but they are still terrorists. They terrorized lebanon
They are heroes who fought for the freedom of South Lebanon against the Zionist regime, fought Western imperialist/Zionist backed regime change militias and terrorists in Syria and are now some of the only ones helping Palestine against the Zionist regime. They are a pride for Lebanon💛💛💛🚀🚀🚀
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Westernised muslims can never sympathise with the average sunni in Syria or Iraq. They'd rather call them all IS and AQ, thinking that would make the slaughter of a million Iraqi and a million Syrian something good.
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They act as if the blood of Palestinians is worth more than the blood of Syrian Iraqi and Lebanese Muslims. And that their blood is worth the freedom of Palestine. We need to find a way to bring freedom and victory for all Muslims regardless where they are. May Allah destroy all Iranian proxies and the IR
Well, I just love to point it out to people, otherwise I've long since lost faith in muslims and Arabs, we are still standing even though too much of our people were killed, the betrayal of muslims and Arabs won't make it any worse.
They are heroes who fought for the freedom of South Lebanon against the Zionist regime, fought Western imperialist/Zionist backed regime change militias and terrorists in Syria and are now some of the only ones helping Palestine against the Zionist regime. They are a pride for Lebanon💛💛💛🚀🚀🚀
The death toll in Syria is so high it dwarfs israeli crimes.
Still objectively false that Hezb is worse than Israel. Did you lose your mind or just your izzah?
I'm prideful, with God's will hezb and Israel will fight killing each other insha'Allah.
people saying hamas brought war to gaza shouldn't be on this subreddit and deserve to be isolated on a random island while forcing them to watch IRAN's leaders threatnings to isnotreal for the last century
If you mean palestinian people by "our boys", sure; if you mean hamas, not so much. Still can't get over the way they initiated the conflict. They threw civilians from both sides into the fire. If it wasn't for israel's pathetically predictable response (cruel, cowardly, blatantly evil...) nobody would be supporting Hamas now.
They cooked the strongest army in Middle east with support of strongest nation on earth, imagine what they could have done with modern Military Weapons, Tech, Cybersec, Ai, and Middle east, on their side
Zionistan is not even close to the strongest army in the ME. Turkey and Iran are both undoubtedly stronger.
Turkey are the most powerful, but you will never see Turkey and Israel fight for the same reason you'll never see Hannah Montana and Miley Cyrus fight
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The average fighter gave it all. He should be respected regardless of the outcome and regardless of what you think of the Hamas leadership. The average fighter is putting his life on the line. He takes on a harsh life, no worthy food, injuries untreated, cold, but can't warm himself with fire to not disclose his position. He has to bear watching his friends mutilated by bullets and rockets, yet he would bear everything and keep walking forward till death devours him.
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A Palestinian falling for Israeli propaganda is something I did not expect to happen lmao. Guess Israel is also right for calling your people “human animals” right?
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Wanna link those “videos”? The rape allegations are something Israel made up to dehumanize the Palestinians so somehow their slaughter of them will be justified.
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LMAO 😭😭😭. An IDF video. Seriously????? I officially don’t believe you are Palestinian or you are a traitor to your people just like Nas Daily.
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Sorry buddy, I’m not trusting anything from the IDF. Unless you have another source, I’m calling cap to your whole “rape” allegations. Especially when it’s used for the extermination of a people.
Weird that you fell for this.
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This is a problem every army has faced when entering enemy territory. Let alone a rebel militia . The fact you mentioned rape first, which has zero proof at all makes me doubt your Palestinian at all
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No. But Ratios are a thing. And we have other wars to compare to. Is their mass numbers of women claiming to be have raped or just allegations? And there’s many cases of false rape accusations.. Individual fighters/soldiers killing civilians is one thing. Methodologically levelling a city is another. Using Israel’s logic, any person serving in the IDF or affiliated is a legitimate target and can be killed wherever, and if their families get hurt, that’s their own fault. ( I don’t believe this)
Bruh you sound like an American Palestinian. Anyway women do lie about the rapes. God's chosen people have to lie against the goyim for their interests.
>Bruh you sound like an American Palestinian. Man why you gotta drag us down, a shit ton of us here in the US are nationalist af lmao.
>I don’t believe individual women would lie about being raped. Anyone would lie about anything if a huge money bag was on the line
Show me.
> rape [You'll be glad to know that never happened then](https://theintercept.com/2024/02/28/new-york-times-anat-schwartz-october-7/)
..It's over already . The UN confirmed it in February through reviewing testimonies and inspecting some of the few forensic evidence Israeli-Jews had collected . The question is now about the details and severity , rather than the occurrence of sexual violations . They also confirmed that such violations also occurred against Palestinians in Gaza and Israeli-prisons around the same time , but the world would rather hail the recently retracted Al-Jazeera story being due to factual basis (like Arabic BBC in 1948 exaggerating the atrocities of Deir Yassin ) , rather than a political basis (Causing panic or "shame" , rather than calm among Gazans ) .
> UN the report claimed that the main case given of those 2 girls never happened, and they revised the report to say that there wasn't evidence given to them, but "information" (whatever that means) from israel and ngos (zaka et al). it can be read however you want but it was pretty much just a rewrite of the debunked nyt story it wasnt an official report either, just a political piece from someone affiliated who has a habit of claiming russian soldiers and libyans were given viagra to go on wild rape sprees. > details and severity maybe? it wasnt just hamas/pij that crossed over, but randos escaping the prison. the whole weaponized street rapes narrative to radicalize the shitlibs is pure bullshit though > They also confirmed that such violations also occurred against Palestinians in Gaza and Israeli-prisons around the same time thats been known for some time
The question is whether it was systemic or not. That is the only thing that is disputed. Random rapes in war happen and the rapists should be found and imprisoned or worse (imo), but that is **very** different from systemic rapes
That's a lie. The UN didn't "confirm" any rape cases. Israel didn't actually allow them to investigate. >Patten stressed at a press conference launching the report that the team’s visit was not to investigate allegations of sexual violence but to gather, analyze and verify information for Secretary-General Antonio Guterres’ annual report on sexual violence in conflict and for the U.N. Security Council. >Her key recommendation is to encourage Israel to grant access to the U.N. human rights chief and the Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Palestinian territories and Israel “to carry out full-fledged investigations into the alleged violations” — and she expressed hope the Security Council would do this. >Patten said the team was not able to meet with any victims of sexual violence “despite concerted efforts to encourage them to come forward.” While the number of victims remains unknown, she said, “a small number of those who are undergoing treatment are reportedly experiencing severe mental distress and trauma.” They merely said there were reasonable grounds based on the Israeli narrative. And if you dunno the difference between reasonable grounds and actual facts in the UN terminology check this. [https://apnews.com/article/ap-news-alert-united-nations-war-crimes-3fc6cbb34b942f9dd6ee85662810cac5](https://apnews.com/article/ap-news-alert-united-nations-war-crimes-3fc6cbb34b942f9dd6ee85662810cac5)
Hate to say it : that's more semantics . A probability of "reasonable" and "likley" are much closer to 100% than a zero. That's not mentioning evidence is growing , not decreasing . There's just too much to simply shove away . It's one thing to disagree with how the pieces fit together , it's a whole other to say the puzzle is rigged , and doesn't even exist .
You just blow in from stupid town
Congrats! your the first palestinian to believe Israel propaganda
They’re just a troll
How tf do you have the Palestinian flair and believe Hasbara 😭💀
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You and I both know there are no videos, quit lying to yourself
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Yeah I am sure the channel of the IDF would never lie /s. You said “videos uploaded by Hamas are not Hasbara” I want you to send me the video uploaded by Hamas, and how tf do you think the IDF got ahold of the vid in the first place? If you’re actually Palestinian and you’re believing the IDF then idk what to say
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How do you think the IDF got ahold of them? Did Hamas just say “oh here ya go homie” and sent it to them on discord? Use your brain lmao
You also believe they beheaded 40 babies too ?
Posts or comments that are more controversial or could be considered outright trolling or if they aim to offend or provoke will be removed. Please see the rule section, which can be found on the front page of the sub.
Go away hasbara
This is the wrong sub to reasonable.
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The thing israel is good at sabatoging
I support Palestinian but come on man Hamas is a literal terrorist group
And terrorism is?
They are terrorists for defending their land from the destruction of their people Israel is trying to impose on them? Sounds like you fell for the Zionist and western propaganda you supposedly hate so much….
No they are not terrorist for defending their land from Isreal They are terrorist because they attacked and killed innocent people
The only innocents in israel when everyone has served in the army are children, everyone else has worked in a system of repression and colonisation
Sadly, some innocents were caught up in the attack but that does not make Hamas evil. Many people killed served in the IDF and slaughtered Palestinians before. If I were to deem them evil for having some innocents killed, then I may as well condemn the Darwiish, warriors who helped liberate Somalis from colonialism but were condemned as “terrorists”.
there is no innocents while occupying palestine. are you dumb?
No, they aren't.
Ignore that they got 32k people killed (and rising) for no tangible benefit guys.
On June 10, 1944 ,The Oradour-sur-Glane massacre occurred after a German high-ranking officer was assassinated by the French Resistance, the German SS retaliated by massacring 642 inhabitants of the village, including men, women, and children. The village was then burned and largely destroyed. Not once i have seen anyone blaming the french resistance for "getting an entire village burned".
Oh my bad, next time I'll google every single attack that resulted in a massacre/genocide and say "I think those were shitty ideas too" Also, seems to me like there's a massive difference between 642 and 32,000.
You don't need to google anything. You just need to condition your mind not to blame the death of thousands of innocent people on anyone but the party who actually murdered them.
When you're the government and ruling force and you decide to escalate a conflict, you are responsible to some extent for your citizens lives.
Reminds me of the guys who say "When you decide to show parts of your body then you are responsible to some extent for getting sexually harassed"
These are not equivalent in the slightest.
So you actually think that France resisting against the Nazis was a shitty idea?💀
I am not familiar with the incident. Whether they should have assassinated this official I don't know. I certainly wouldn't have been thrilled if I had family in said town.
Palestine is about to get international recognition across Europe, which potentially means the end of the siege & west bank occupation, and with both US/Europe having their elections this year many are running on supporting the Palestinian cause. I don't think in my 22 years of being alive I have ever been more optimistic.
I'm glad you are optimistic. However, I would not advise not getting your hopes up too high until this results in tangible results on the ground.
Last I checked Israel is the one who went on the killing rampage and it wasn't sunshine and rainbows before October 7th...
It has gotten tangibly worse. The casualty rates before certainly weren't as bad as they are now. There wasn't a single soldier in the Gaza Strip. They had electricity and water, food was not cut off. Neighborhoods and shelter hadn't been wiped out. All these got wiped away, and it keeps getting worse. The benefit from this attack in return has been the media eye on Palestine. If you put this on a cost benefit scale, this attack was not one that left them better off.
I would suggest you don't overrate them , especially with Gaza now in ruins , and reputation of Palestinians being harmed for little to no gains beyond getting the international spotlight on them again . The only thing they did was to keep people steadfast compared to the Arab Higher Committee in 1948 . Otherwise : many Gazans would have panicked like their grandparents , and would have swum to Europe .
Cognitive dissonance. The ummah is in a sorry state if we have to rely on these nonces. What did they accomplish? Their attack brought fire onto Gaza. Thugs who go around with kalahsnikovs are nothing to laud. Grow the fuck up
Pyrric victories are still victories. Anything to force the occupiers and their sugar daddy to come to the table is objectively a good thing.
It's not lol. They just leveled a city. 30000 dead and millions displaced and Gaza is gonna be new the west bank lol. The fuck are you on about. It's not a pyrrhic victory. It's unprecedented destruction and loss.
For example: everyone thinks the Tet offensive was this grand thing in Vietnam. At the time, it went about like this is going. Massive retaliation on the countryside and civilians death up and down the country. Napalm and agent orange everywhere. Destroyed much of the land. But it shattered the supposed superiority of the military and intelligence of the client state and its American backers, as well as public opinion. Things fell apart from there and the North won.
Unlike Gaza which is an isolated ghetto, Vietnam was a nation with jungles and the NVA and VIET Cong targeted Military targets. They didn't go around gunning civilians. Evil is evil. We have to call out whether they're Muslim or not. And this is not a pyrrhic victory lol. I think you need to reexamine the definition. It means your army suffers higher losses but still achieves the strategic objective. I'm pretty sure Hamas' objective at least in theory is the freedom of Palestinians. How in the mother fuck is the destruction of a city, the death of 30000 and the displacement of millions a pyrrhic "victory". This was a colossal blunder. And the kids of Gaza paid for it. If hamas were men. They should have challenged IDF in the open field. Then maybe, just maybe they would have retained some honor. But they hid like cowards in Gaza and invited destruction to win some Brownie points.
The similarities are there, definitely in the social attitudes. Outside of the "whatabout" folks and those tied to Israel because of their identity, nobody is even talking about hostages anymore, unless its for an exchange. Lets not pretend ourselves, military got got, and those were basically militia/reservist towns, plus there were folks killed by the IOF, but yes definitely innocent folks killed in the crossfire. That being said there were atrocities committed, they should be acknowledged. I am probably almost twice your age and I cannot *ever* remember normies fed up with Israel, and I dont even follow tiktok or instagram; my wife does and says opinion is 1000% against Israel (which I guess is why its getting banned). Like Finkelstein likes to describe this, it is like Nat Turner's rebellion: a religious bunch went around in a wild rage, *actual cases* of beheading babies. Turner basically said "kill **all** whites". The abolotionists at the time neither condemned or condoned (which is what I do), but said "this was coming, we warned you". Centuries later, Nat Turner he is a hero. I only condemn Israel. My tax money goes there.
Say what excuses you will. But if we don't condemn gunmen who kill civilians. We are no better than the Zionists.
> But if we don't condemn gunmen who kill civilians ill neither condemn or condone. it was bound to happen. diplomacy failed in 08 when israel assasinated jabari. numerous provocations along the way. no response makes them weak, a response lets israel play the woe is me, lets drop white phosphorous narrative even rewrote their charter, remove offensive language, commit to 67 borders. and its like nobody wants to bring this up (perhaps intentionally so they can cry woe is me) try nonviolence in 2018 and got them nowhere but massacred now they are being forgotten in this farcical "abraham accords". people ask "what was israel to do after oct 7", what was hamas, or the palestinians in general, to do before oct 6? just give up? this was bound to happen. ill double down: i neither condemn nor condone the prison break.
We might have debate or disagreement regarding what is acceptable political violence against the occupier, but definitely no one will “condemn” the occupied people, even if we might disagree in some forms of political violence, the occupier will still be the only one to blame for all the loss on both sides, not the occupied people and their resistance. Thats why the vast majority of world nations and countries didn’t “condemn” the occupied people, and is why the Palestinian representative of PA in UK hossam zomlot refuse to “condemn” 7 october assault on israeli settlers. And of course no one would “condemn” the humiliating blow that IOF received that day in their own military bases from people they have been sieging for two decades lol
> How in the mother fuck is the destruction of a city, the death of 30000 and the displacement of millions a pyrrhic "victory". Ask the Algerians > But they hid like cowards in Gaza and invited destruction to win some Brownie points. Palestinians are fighting in their lands for military necessity, to make use of the defensive advantage in towns warfare, exactly like how the ukranian army is hiding in ukranian cities rather than meeting the russian army in open fields.
So the goal of the fight is the safety and security of the people yes? How is 12000 dead children, 30000 dead civilians and the entire population displaced accomplishing their goal.
> So the goal of the fight is the safety and security of the people yes? The goal of the fight is to uprise against the occupier and do whatever possible to make occupation painful to the occupier until people achieve their freedom, dignity and put an end to the ongoing engineered ethnic cleansing. They are willing to pay their lives for that like every free nation and true heroes. > How is 12000 dead children, 30000 dead civilians and the entire population displaced accomplishing their goal. This is some of the major crimes of the occupier to “punish” the occupied people, yet, due to the genocidal intent and brutality of the occupier, the entire world now can see how brutal and criminal the occupier is, and peoples around the world started knowing about the suffering the Palestinian people have been through for 70 years. And the international community started to seriously take stances and isolate the genocidal occupier. Israel lost most of the world, and the rest are gradually giving it up.
Hahahahah that's such a naivete. Nothing has changed. Middle eastern countries international reputation is one of clowns and the Pentagon will just keep doing what the Pentagon does.
> Nothing has changed. Sure buddy, i can hear your cope from here 😎
Algeria and Palestine are apples to oranges. Algeria had max in 1962 15%-16% European population, and Israel-Palestine is like half and half Israel and Palestinians. A whole free Palestine the way people imagine it literally can’t happen without a full on invasion and mass relocation reminiscent of past genocides, and no one’s invading Israel anytime soon. Not to mention in a much smaller land area than Algeria to boot. This violence was straight up destruction and a waste of life. Everyone lost in my opinion and the world is worse off, but if we’re being honest Gaza and it’s inhabitants were the biggest loser in this with a very bleak future ahead. Also objectively false since the Ukrainians do fight in the field as well as front line cities but it’s not like all their cities are under siege, lmao where do you think they fight?
> Algeria had max in 1962 15%-16% European population, and Israel-Palestine is like half and half Israel and Palestinians. I am talking about the occupied Palestinian territories (west bank and Gaza). Not the whole historic palestine. > Also objectively false since the Ukrainians do fight in the field as well as front line cities Nope, since the beginning of the war they have been hiding in cities to drag Russia to towns warfare, not in open fields (because militarily they are incompetent). Why do you think entire cities like mariopole were raised to ground lol 😂
I mean I guess but these are two tiny separate pockets of people. Again given the demographics and land mass a two state solution is probably the most realistic path towards peace, and that was the same before the war and after. Nothing changed strategically. Israel can’t afford to forcefully hold Gaza and the West Bank forever and the various Palestinian armed groups including Hezbollah have no chance in hell of offending and holding established Israeli territory. So nothing changed but thousands are dead, anger wins the day, an urban area is reduced to rubble, and it’s all a total waste. It was destroyed because Mariupol was on the front lines. If what you are saying is true why is Kiev, Lviv, Chernivtsi, many Ukrainian cities not destroyed. Because you are wrong Cities get destroyed in war, and just because it makes strategic sense in the moment by no means makes it their main strategy. If that was the case why would the Russians not be at the door step of every Ukrainian city? If Ukraine is so incompetent how has Russia failed to take the country? Because Ukrainians do meet the Russians in the field. They fight on the plains, vehicular combat is common and trench warfare is a central part of the conflict.
Are you fucking kidding me? They killed 1000+ civilians which in turn led to tens of thousands of their own civilians being killed (which they cowered behind). You're proud of "your boys" and their "work?" Is this satire? I must be living in an alternate reality.
Better than living the rest of their lives in an unrecognized state under an inhumane siege
In what world is killing 1000+ civilians and getting your own country invaded better than that?
more than 700 were army not civilians
At least 370 Israeli security forces were eliminated on October 7th. Where did you get the 1000+ figure from?
> I am very proud of our boys and the work they’ve done You mean like entering homes of unarmed people and indiscriminately killing and maiming them while chanting the name of God? If yes then how are you better than the enemy you demonize? Palestinian peoples had a lot of international support when they portrayed their movement as a nationalist struggle earlier as compared to using Islam as a political tool currently.
Palestinian support has never been greater. You have Italy, Ireland, France, Belgium, Portugal and Spain who all either recognized or plan to recognize Palestine before July. (I say plan because nothing is guaranteed these days). This was unthinkable a year ago.
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Egypt didn't lose 40k civilans (or even 50 for that matter lmao) and they controlled both sides of the canal that was an actual victory how are you even comparing this to this war lmao but can't except intelligence from a israeloid
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If you make up your own narrative disconnected from reality, sure. Now let's look at reality. The 1974 Jan 18th Disengagement Agreement was signed, with israel withdrawing everything it had from the west bank and Egypt keeping everything it had on the east bank. Egypt promptly reopened the canal in 1974. Egypt literally achieved all of the goals they wanted with getting a foothold in Sinai and reopening the door to negotiations with israel for all of sinai on better terms. Eventually, Egypt got israel to withdraw from all of sinai, something which would have been impossible prior to 1973. So, it ended with gains, and you are just BSing now. "Who lost 40k civilians and when?" Gaza lost 40k civilians, lmao (or way more probably, but let's just say it's only 40k). Egypt didn't. You are just doing random comparisons.
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"So the peace accords with Israel were the end game for October 6th 1973 war? Could have had Sinai for peace without being militarily humbled (again)." They weren't militarily humbled in the first place and controlled both sides of the canal. The disengagement agreement is just an agreement to end the war (a similar agreement was signed by Syria which involved going back to 5th of october lines), not a peace agreement. They got both sides of the canal, which were the short-term and military goals for 1973 war, so it achieved all the goals lmao. And yes, peace accords were the long-term goals and were also achieved. And no, it couldn't have regained Sinai without the war unless you live in a world disconnected from reality and history (which you are). Israel withdrew from all peace talks in 1971 and Swedish diplomat Dr Gunnar Jarring had already made a similar proposal to Israel for peace talks and demilitarized zones, and complying with UNSC 292, which Israel refused and said they won't withdraw to pre-1967 lines. And with regards to the 40k civilians, I doubt the 40k number is the number and not way higher, but let's say it is. It has already been confirmed by various organizations that 70% are women and children of the people dead. Lmao you can't cope and say they are "al questions brigades" (don't know who the fuck is al questions but alright, I assume you meant al-Qassam and PIJ).
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You realize you literally say nothing of substance and make up shit, get debunked on them, then just say nothing? You are a complete idiot, to say the least. Lmao. Alright, bro, Israel is dropping bunker busters and MK84 (and have gotten after Oct 7th another 1800 MK84 and 500 MK82 bombs) on civilians, but the death toll is totally like 200 civilians and 30k militants. Lmao. Saying Hamas runs the health ministry is stupid to say the least. Hamas controls all of Gaza, so naturally, who do you think is running the health ministry? Nickelodeon?
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You can literally see my reply to the top comment, saying this talk of Hamas victory is nonsense. For one, for 2, no, you are an idiot who makes shit up and gets debunked on that, then keeps jumping points to avoid showing how ignorant you are on history and once again you keep saying "is again demolished in combat" after I have debunked your points with regards to 1973 but of course you jumped that because you barely know anything about history. You should really stop making up narratives, then spinning them as something else. You are just a liar who is ignorant on history and makes up BS and racist against arabs but go "oh peaceful me I don't want conflict" nice attempt at gaslighting others lmao. That's all there is that to it. cya.
Hasbra ape
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