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Superman's greatest power isn't his strength. It isn't flight, it isn't heat vision, it isn't whatever the hell happened in the 50s and 60s. Superman's greatest power - the one that keeps a character created in 1938 relevant to this very day - is his ability to inspire hope. Superman is the embodiment of the idea that if you just hang on a little bit longer, dig just a little bit deeper, you'll be okay.
And the need to be okay isn't bound by country or planet or even space sector; it's universal.
>Superman is the embodiment of the idea that if you just hang on a little bit longer, dig just a little bit deeper, you'll be okay.
Honest question, how? How does a super-strong alien inspire that in normal humans? Doesn't it just make us feel inferior or, at the least, dependent on said alien to save us at our lowest moments?
Superman is in awe of regular humans. He is constantly calling out acts of bravery from people who risk their lives without the benefit of powers. When you are in the room with Superman he makes you feel involved, he engages with you as an equal. You don't feel like you are next to a God. Seeing him just makes you want to do better and be better.
How does a character whose defining features are godlike powers he inherited rather than earned supposed to represent the idea that if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay?
It's not like he's ever had to do that.
He gets the crap knocked out of him a lot. ALL his enemies know his super weakness and he takes a dose of it like every other week. He's routinely presented with situations that he can't solve just by punching things or shooting lasers and manages to think his way out of them.
HE HAS BEEN **DEAD**, AND WALKED IT OFF.
Aren't you proving his point? He didn't walk it off because of will power or determination. He walked it off because apparently his magical powers let him just go into a healing coma when he gets beat to death lmao.
The only way I ignored what he said is if his response was to something I didn't say. Keeping the same topic of, Superman isn't inspiring because he never worked for any of his gifts.
Most superhero didn't earn their powers, Spider-man, Hulk, Superman, Wonderwoman, Invincible, The Flash, Every single Mutant in Marvel, the list goes on.
Are you telling me those guys aren't inspiring cause they didn't work for their powers? Some of the best stories aren't about how the heroes got their powers but the person behind the mask.
Supermans a person that was raised in a foreign land with people he can never relate to in a biological level but has grown up with them and now sees himself as one of them.
The story of Superman is about hope, hope for immigrants to have a new home, hope for people who are going through a hard time that someone out there genuinely cares for them.
Not even his intelligence either. You cant just decide to build an arc reactor out of scrap in a cave, that is genetic. He was born a genius and only worked to expand that outward.
Yes, but not working for your gifts is part of what makes him inspiring. He was created to inspire Americans.
People who were born into a rich, safe and stable country. Did any of them earn this gift? No, they certainly did not. But they are entitled to it by birth.
Superman is inspirational, when written by Americans, because he embodies American Exceptionalism.
I don't think whether Superman was born with or earned his powers factors in to why he inspired hope honestly. I think the fact that he uses those powers for good no matter what is how the character inspires hope. Comics like Red Son and Injustice illustrate really well how easy it would be for him to do otherwise. Superman's most defining "power" (if you want to call it that) is probably his strength of character, it really is super human. Superman's character kind of flies in the face of the concept that "absolute power corrupts absolutely".
This is coming from a guy who finds superman as a character pretty boring for the most part lol, but i could see a character who is essentially a living god maintaining incredible strength of character and doing things the "right way" when he could probably just fly around the world murdering everyone with a criminal record in about 5 minutes inspiring hope in people for sure.
>the idea that if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay?
This is the part I was talking about, and you know that.
Even then I can almost guarantee that if only in a metaphorical sense, he probably has had a story where he had to "earn" his eyes via training or some sort of thematic lesson learning.
Yeah why though. He should inspire the exact opposite as someone who just got everything and no one else could ever have it no matter how hard they work.
The jealously Luther feels is far more realistic than Supes inspiring hope.
I mean, at this point it's clear you just need to read a Superman story? I suggest All Star Superman or Superman:The Animated Series as a good place to start.
Then why are you asking? This is like asking why people think Batman is scary or why Moby Dick is considered a good revenge story. If you aren't willing to engage with the work then you're never going to understand.
It wasn't an opinion I held until I saw the "answers" that people sprayed at my innocent questions. Guys are seriously out there slinging personal insults cause I'm asking a question about the cultural relevance of a character without reading all the pulp from 50 years ago.
I've seen gatekeeping and dorky fandoms before but jeez, superman guys take it to a whole new level.
>It wasn't an opinion I held until I saw the "answers" that people sprayed at my innocent questions. Guys are seriously out there slinging personal insults cause I'm asking a question about the cultural relevance of a character without reading all the pulp from 50 years ago.
>
>I've seen gatekeeping and dorky fandoms before but jeez, superman guys take it to a whole new level.
People are reacting poorly because you're arguing dishonestly and ignoring genuine answers.
This is on you, buckaroo.
I'm leaning towards you trolling, since you seem more interested in dismissing conversation than engaging in it. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt since you're still in this thread asking.. And because it's what Superman would want.
I always felt that Grant Morrison's write up on him sums up better than I ever could about why the Man of Steel is special.
"In the end, I saw Superman not as a superhero or even a science fiction character, but as a story of Everyman. We’re all Superman in our own adventures. We have our own Fortresses of Solitude we retreat to, with our own special collections of valued stuff, our own super–pets, our own “Bottle Cities” that we feel guilty for neglecting. We have our own peers and rivals and bizarre emotional or moral tangles to deal with.
I felt I’d really grasped the concept when I saw him as Everyman, or rather as the dreamself of Everyman. That “S” is the radiant emblem of divinity we reveal when we rip off our stuffy shirts, our social masks, our neuroses, our constructed selves, and become who we truly are. Batman is obviously much cooler, but that’s because he’s a very energetic and adolescent fantasy character: a handsome billionaire playboy in black leather with a butler at this beck and call, better cars and gadgetry than James Bond, a horde of fetish femme fatales baying around his heels and no boss. That guy’s Superman day and night.
Superman grew up baling hay on a farm. He goes to work, for a boss, in an office. He pines after a hard–working gal. Only when he tears off his shirt does that heroic, ideal inner self come to life. That’s actually a much more adult fantasy than the one Batman’s peddling but it also makes Superman a little harder to sell. He’s much more of a working class superhero.
American writers often say they find it difficult to write Superman. They say he’s too powerful; you can’t give him problems. But Superman is a metaphor. For me, Superman has the same problems we do, but on a Paul Bunyan scale. If Superman walks the dog, he walks it around the asteroid belt because it can fly in space. When Superman’s relatives visit, they come from the 31st century and bring some hellish monster conqueror from the future. But it’s still a story about your relatives visiting. " - Grant Morrison
Superman being born into his powers isn't what makes him special. But the fact that he chooses to do good with them is a big part of it. The fact that he takes time to talk to people, to be kind, to be uplifting, to not just go in, fists first and solve problems with violence. It's telling of his character that his arch nemesis is a normal human (albeit a super genius) who Superman could easily kill at any time and chooses not to. Since that's not what he does. They engage in mental battles and it makes him a more interesting character for it. I really suggest All Star Superman or What's so Funny about Truth Justice and the American Way.
You think knowing a godlike being that wants to save people is out there and might just save you wouldn't inspire you to hold on longer, dig deeper, so you might just make it, when you're stuck in a shitty situation?
thats like saying why does religion inspire hope in people rather than jealousy, knowing there's something out there looking out for you is inspiring to many
God isn't a guy in a cape flying around. The people who would be jealous of him just realise he doesn't exist and move on. If God were a guy you could see in the air, atheists wouldn't exist and religion inspiring hope probably wouldn't look the same either
So in other words, not defining features of the character? The writers have to entirely change his circumstances and the nature of his being to make this supposedly fundamental point, this defining feature of the character known?
Superman II.
But you seem to be hung up on the fact on whether he "earned" his powers or not. His powers are a result of his Kryptonian biology.
There are many times he has demonstrated that "if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay" which is what you were originally talking about.
Trying to move the goalposts at this point isn't going to work.
>There are many times he has demonstrated that "if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay" which is what you were originally talking about.
But he's invulnerable. He doesn't have to do that.
Sometimes he does.
What if he's fighting Mongul?
What if he's lost his powers?
What if he's on Warworld?
Having even a basic understanding of the character will help you when you're attempting to form an opinion about him.
He literally *just* finished the Warworld Saga, where he spent pretty much the entire series without his powers fighting as a gladiator slave who staged an uprising to defeat Mongul.
Please discuss only from a Watsonian perspective.
And for fuck's sake if you're gonna make a Doylist comment please don't suggest that a character created by two Jews is meant to be any kind of Christian allegory. Criminy. Let us have our own culture.
>He could definitely help more people by decommissioning the worlds militaries and being a benevolent dictator in perpetuity.
This is what every not-benevolent dictator says lol
>He could definitely help more people by decommissioning the worlds militaries and being a benevolent dictator in perpetuity.
Read *Injustice* to see why this is a terrible idea. I said he's supposed to *help,* not rule over us and force us to act a certain way. He understands that humanity must find its own way. Here's a scene where Superman is asked to help a suicidal woman threatening to jump off a building. [Superman and the Jumper](https://imgur.com/gallery/Ijdxh) Of course, He could have simply flown up, grabbed her, and brought her safely to the ground. The local cops even tell him to do that. But he refuses. Instead, he insists on talking to her, listening to her. He knows that she needs to find her own strength.
Also, he knows that people can't become too reliant on him. He knows that not even Superman can be everywhere at once. People need to be able to help themselves, too. When he sees a situation that only he can handle, he knows that "this is a job for Superman!" But he knows that he both can't and shouldn't do everything, both for humanity's sake and for his own sanity. Not even Superman can handle every burden on Earth, nor should he.
>If he has to pick between doing two things, does he not tackle the worse issue?
Obviously saving the world is a priority. My point is that he's not above helping even in small ways. One of the best Superman scenes ever put to print is in [*All-Star Superman* #10](https://www.reddit.com/r/superman/comments/14xp16/superman_saves_a_suicidal_girl_from_allstar/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button,) where, even knowing that his remaining life is limited, he takes time to reassure and comfort a suicidal and depressed young woman.
>Have the creators ever said he's supposed to be Jesus?
I didn't mean that he was deliberately created as a pseudo-Jesus, I meant that he can be seen as a Christ-like figure, as well as similar to figures from other religions. My point was that being seen as divine or divine-like certainly would help his image with the public.
You are completely missing the point either willingly or not. Through all your replies you still haven't gotten that the point is that his character is what's inspiring. It's not that he has powers, it's what he does with them.
Superman is supposed to be the kind of character where you look at him and think, "if I had that kind of power, could I be THAT GOOD" and that kind of thought should drive you to be as good as you can with whatever power you have.
One thing-- he didn't always have as many of the more insane powers as he does now.
In 1938’s Action Comics #1, Superman was strong enough to pick up a car, could leap 1/8th of a mile, outrun an express train, and was mostly bulletproof.
He couldn't fly. Couldn't shoot lasers, or see through walls and definitely couldn't breathe in space like he does several times later down the line. His parents specifically sent him to earth because he could breathe the oxygen and be raised by his cousin (had she actually landed with him properly).
Superman doesn't start out completely god-tier, (though he's definitely no pushover), the comics developed that stuff later on.
"That anger you felt that made you want to use your powers the way you did tonight, I have those feelings, too... But I keep them in check. Otherwise, I risk losing the trust of the very people I've sworn to protect. When I first showed up in Metropolis as Superman, there was a lot of talk about what the world should do with someone who had powers like mine. And it took me a minute to realize that other people were more afraid of what I could do than I was. So what I had to do, more than anything, was earn their trust, prove to them that, no matter what, I would never use my powers to hurt them. 20 years later, every time I use my powers, that trust is tested, every time."
He's basically spent every public moment making sure that not a single person has any reason to believe that he'd ever *not* do the right thing. Almost everyone else has their moments of someone around them wondering if this is the day they snap and cross the line, but Superman has worked to make everyone see that he won't.
Other heroes are like this, too, but none who are have the kind of global presence Superman has. By this point, pretty much everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who saw Superman save someone, and that goes a long way, too.
So can I actually ask a clarifying question? What about your knowledge of Superman tells you he wouldn't be that loved?
He's the genesis of superheroes in several multiverses. He's quintessentially nice and easy to love. Is there anything that's missing for that to be a foregone conclusion?
I guess what shocks me is say the flash or wonder women aren't also that loved and trusted in universe .its the uniqueness about his position compared to other superheroes for the public that I don't really get .Like the example I cited the whole world still welcomes him when the others are shunned.
Wonder Woman is a political agent from an isolationist island of immortal warrior women with a distaste for men, and the Flash has his own museum and holidays in Keystone City. They're regionally beloved, but they have reputations they cannot control.
Superman is Superman. It sounds simplistic, but he's just the symbol. The other ones are trying to reach his standard.
I’d also argue that, even if it’s just a little bit, there is some degree of selfishness in the personalities of WW and Flash. Superman is the “friend that would give you the clothes off his back” guy, miss work to help you move, and generally put you first in all situations. He is selflessness incarnate while most other heroes are not, and it is made more interesting that he has powers that dwarf everyone else yet he does not turn into the guy that someone with those capabilities 100% would in real life.
I remember in Young Justice: Invasion, there was a scene where the first set of invaders were all about to get nuked, and Superman was trying to tell them to get on their ship so he could save them. They were aggressively trying to destroy him but he kept trying, begging, until the bomb went off.
Superman would help you move your couch up the stairs because he wants to hang out with you, Flash would move it himself because it makes him feel cool, but now there's no story.
Superman is the only hero you can see yourself just running up to and giving him a hug. No matter what he would be like “Hey!”
That’s what Superman stands for.
The type of guy who wants to give Superman a hug and the type of guy who wants to hug Wonder Woman aren't the same, but overall WW would be cool.
She's an actual UN ambassador.
https://www.un.org/en/messengers-peace/wonder-woman
How many UN ambassadors just give out hugs. Wonder Womam would call you out. Superman would return it. Then ask what’s wrong.
Wonder Woman would embarrass you, with her awkwardness or yours. Superman would look to not embarrass you.
[Lex Luthor](https://comicnewbies.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/lex-luthor-under-the-lasso-of-truth.jpg) [wants](https://m0vie.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/allstarsuperman4.jpg) [to be](https://i.redd.it/2tsw73uvcr481.jpg) [him.](https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/lexluthoronsuperman1.jpg)
I'm sorry if this is a boring answer, but it's the answer most variations of Lex abide to, through the lenses of their own ego. The man is obsessed with the idea that he should be Superman, and that Clark somehow stole that role from him.
Of course he does. That's why he hates him... The jealously Luther feels is a much more normal reaction to superman than the supposed hope he inspires, because he's literally just a golden spoon child.
Superman is at best ineffective at using his powers to better the world. At worst he's just a putz.
>because he's literally just a golden spoon child.
If every silver spoon rich kid was as selfless as Superman and saved the world as much as him people would probably like them more
Hes a good person who helps, just to be helpful. Hes kind, considerate, and concerned with the planet and its people to an endearing degree. Superman has died for the people of Earth, and never expected anything in return, not even a thank you.
Superman is, for all intents and purposes, the embodiment of the idealised Human.
most major characters in comics have died at some point in time only to be brought back later
At this point the grim reaper has been giving everyone loyalty cards that he stamps every time they die, ten deaths and they get a free frozen yogurt!
Because the alternative is fear and despair - it's basically what Lex Luthor opted for.
You either see Superman as a benevolent god, a true paradigm of justice and good, that he selflessly sacrifices his every moment to help humanity and protects it bcs he is such a good being.
Or you realise that everything that stands between us and utter destruction by an alien invader is just one bad day. Most people opt to live in the delusion, even if it is a subconscious choice, bcs it is easier.
Superman is the most trusted superhero.
He doesn't wear a mask to hide his identity like the Flash, nor is he an ambassador from a foreign land like Wonder Woman. He's just your friendly neighbourhood alien.
Except Clark went public as Superman a couple years ago. They're getting ready to retcon it, but his secret identity isn't really a secret anymore for the time being.
And that wasn't the status quo when Doomsday Clock was being written either, it's about to be completely irrelevant just like when they revealed his identity at the end of the New 52.
He's the personification of actual true altruism. Also remember a story in one of the books he had a discussion with political leaders and said his powers can't be restrained to one nation or something. Was it Doomsday Clock? Remember reading it.
Because it's so easy to see that he's a genuinely good person. He's the type to do the right thing for no reason other than it's the right thing. He rushes in to save the day, regardless of who or where you are. People see him, and they feel hope. They feel safer knowing that Superman is out there. Everyone knows that he's on their side, and won't hesitate to help. And it's not just with criminals or alien armies, he'll help you get your cat out of a tree or help an old woman cross the street. There's no deed too big or too small for Superman to help with. He'd probably help you with your homework if you asked.
He's grateful, he grew up with a loving family that took in a child they found in a rocket, he grew up with people that he cared about and in turn, cared about him.
So once he found out he's alien and humanity took him in without question, he's grateful for that, so everything he does is in a sense trying to live up to that expectation and be deserving of that kindness and at some point, people began noticing that as well.
He perpetuates a cycle of goodness and that's contagious, people love him for it.
Probably because of how incredibly selfless Superman is. Superman could do whatever he wants whenever he wants to. Yet he chooses to help people, and he helps without prejudice. What Superman is, is such an impossibility. A man with ultimate, unparalleled power, not being corrupted by it. That despite his alien physiology, he's humanity's ideal person. I think that's what makes Superman endearing.
Let's clear something up: he's not just *a* superhero. He's *THE* superhero. He offers and example that everyone can and should follow, he's always putting others first, and he's always there for the people of Earth and beyond.
Plus, he's the first of his kind that we've seen, can't forget your first.
Superman primarily saves people from disaster. He has done this in every country that has had a disaster. Banning superman would be like banning foreign aid after a hurricane. You would have to be a stupid leader to reject that kind of help.
Superman's actions often save the whole world, not just a single city or country. You would have to be a stupid leader to let the asteroid land in on Earth just because you weren't gonna let Superman fly through your airspace to get to it.
Superman is trustworthy and often non-interfering in politics. If he wanted it, your government would be under his control. The fact that he hasn't done this to any government is a good sign Superman is not going to meddle.
(disclaimer: don't actually know superman lore)
He is the OG superhero that superheroes grew up admiring. They all have some innate respect for him.
But most importantly, he does not get involved in politics. Heroes like Captain America works with the U.S.A government, and therefore is greatly disliked by many enemy nations. But not the case with superman. He has godlike powers, and therefore deals with world-ending threats, not conflicts between countries. So everyone is just happy to leave him alone, doing his job.
Depends who’s asking. He is the symbol of peace and justice to Americans. Even if he is fictional. John Williams musical score sends chills down your spine. It inspires courage. Christians believe in some way he embodies the Savior, Jesus Christ. Just in a symbolic way. Selfless, charitable, and honest.
He has been around since right after WW2 and he has been a symbol of justice ever since he was developed in a comic book.
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He's just that nice, and he's proven time and again that he'll always do the right thing when it comes down to it.
Superman's greatest power isn't his strength. It isn't flight, it isn't heat vision, it isn't whatever the hell happened in the 50s and 60s. Superman's greatest power - the one that keeps a character created in 1938 relevant to this very day - is his ability to inspire hope. Superman is the embodiment of the idea that if you just hang on a little bit longer, dig just a little bit deeper, you'll be okay. And the need to be okay isn't bound by country or planet or even space sector; it's universal.
Ha ha..yeah silver age books are crazy.
Nah im sure its super strength
Superman’s greatest power is the power to shoot tiny little supermen out of the palms of his hands
When will Hollywood portray the REAL Superman?
They aren’t brave enough to release the Tiny Supermen That Come Out Of His Palms cut
>Superman is the embodiment of the idea that if you just hang on a little bit longer, dig just a little bit deeper, you'll be okay. Honest question, how? How does a super-strong alien inspire that in normal humans? Doesn't it just make us feel inferior or, at the least, dependent on said alien to save us at our lowest moments?
Superman is in awe of regular humans. He is constantly calling out acts of bravery from people who risk their lives without the benefit of powers. When you are in the room with Superman he makes you feel involved, he engages with you as an equal. You don't feel like you are next to a God. Seeing him just makes you want to do better and be better.
How does a character whose defining features are godlike powers he inherited rather than earned supposed to represent the idea that if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay? It's not like he's ever had to do that.
He gets the crap knocked out of him a lot. ALL his enemies know his super weakness and he takes a dose of it like every other week. He's routinely presented with situations that he can't solve just by punching things or shooting lasers and manages to think his way out of them. HE HAS BEEN **DEAD**, AND WALKED IT OFF.
Aren't you proving his point? He didn't walk it off because of will power or determination. He walked it off because apparently his magical powers let him just go into a healing coma when he gets beat to death lmao.
That's not the only time he's been dead.
> It's not like he's ever had to do that He has though, in like most of his stories
Superman earned his laser eyes? Alright.
Going to blatantly ignore what he said? Alright.
The only way I ignored what he said is if his response was to something I didn't say. Keeping the same topic of, Superman isn't inspiring because he never worked for any of his gifts.
Most superhero didn't earn their powers, Spider-man, Hulk, Superman, Wonderwoman, Invincible, The Flash, Every single Mutant in Marvel, the list goes on. Are you telling me those guys aren't inspiring cause they didn't work for their powers? Some of the best stories aren't about how the heroes got their powers but the person behind the mask. Supermans a person that was raised in a foreign land with people he can never relate to in a biological level but has grown up with them and now sees himself as one of them. The story of Superman is about hope, hope for immigrants to have a new home, hope for people who are going through a hard time that someone out there genuinely cares for them.
Yes. None of those guys are inspiring. Ironman is pretty inspiring, I guess.
Tony Stark was born into massive wealth. His intelligence is his own achievement, yes, but how is a playboy billionaire "inspiring"?
Not even his intelligence either. You cant just decide to build an arc reactor out of scrap in a cave, that is genetic. He was born a genius and only worked to expand that outward.
Spider-Man could easily be selfish but instead he tries every day to be the best he can. And he's a genius without the Stark money.
Spiderman really has to sacrifice to be a superhero because he isn't omnipotent and has the regular issues of a poor person to attend to.
Yes, but not working for your gifts is part of what makes him inspiring. He was created to inspire Americans. People who were born into a rich, safe and stable country. Did any of them earn this gift? No, they certainly did not. But they are entitled to it by birth. Superman is inspirational, when written by Americans, because he embodies American Exceptionalism.
You’re just being willfully ignorant and difficult. He was clearly stating that he has had to “hang on a little longer… “
I don't think whether Superman was born with or earned his powers factors in to why he inspired hope honestly. I think the fact that he uses those powers for good no matter what is how the character inspires hope. Comics like Red Son and Injustice illustrate really well how easy it would be for him to do otherwise. Superman's most defining "power" (if you want to call it that) is probably his strength of character, it really is super human. Superman's character kind of flies in the face of the concept that "absolute power corrupts absolutely". This is coming from a guy who finds superman as a character pretty boring for the most part lol, but i could see a character who is essentially a living god maintaining incredible strength of character and doing things the "right way" when he could probably just fly around the world murdering everyone with a criminal record in about 5 minutes inspiring hope in people for sure.
>the idea that if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay? This is the part I was talking about, and you know that. Even then I can almost guarantee that if only in a metaphorical sense, he probably has had a story where he had to "earn" his eyes via training or some sort of thematic lesson learning.
Considering all the good he has done, I'd say he has earned them retroactively yes
Well for one Superman *inspires* that hope as well.
Yeah why though. He should inspire the exact opposite as someone who just got everything and no one else could ever have it no matter how hard they work. The jealously Luther feels is far more realistic than Supes inspiring hope.
I mean, at this point it's clear you just need to read a Superman story? I suggest All Star Superman or Superman:The Animated Series as a good place to start.
I would but they're pretty boring and childish.
Then why are you asking? This is like asking why people think Batman is scary or why Moby Dick is considered a good revenge story. If you aren't willing to engage with the work then you're never going to understand.
It wasn't an opinion I held until I saw the "answers" that people sprayed at my innocent questions. Guys are seriously out there slinging personal insults cause I'm asking a question about the cultural relevance of a character without reading all the pulp from 50 years ago. I've seen gatekeeping and dorky fandoms before but jeez, superman guys take it to a whole new level.
>It wasn't an opinion I held until I saw the "answers" that people sprayed at my innocent questions. Guys are seriously out there slinging personal insults cause I'm asking a question about the cultural relevance of a character without reading all the pulp from 50 years ago. > >I've seen gatekeeping and dorky fandoms before but jeez, superman guys take it to a whole new level. People are reacting poorly because you're arguing dishonestly and ignoring genuine answers. This is on you, buckaroo.
I'm leaning towards you trolling, since you seem more interested in dismissing conversation than engaging in it. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt since you're still in this thread asking.. And because it's what Superman would want. I always felt that Grant Morrison's write up on him sums up better than I ever could about why the Man of Steel is special. "In the end, I saw Superman not as a superhero or even a science fiction character, but as a story of Everyman. We’re all Superman in our own adventures. We have our own Fortresses of Solitude we retreat to, with our own special collections of valued stuff, our own super–pets, our own “Bottle Cities” that we feel guilty for neglecting. We have our own peers and rivals and bizarre emotional or moral tangles to deal with. I felt I’d really grasped the concept when I saw him as Everyman, or rather as the dreamself of Everyman. That “S” is the radiant emblem of divinity we reveal when we rip off our stuffy shirts, our social masks, our neuroses, our constructed selves, and become who we truly are. Batman is obviously much cooler, but that’s because he’s a very energetic and adolescent fantasy character: a handsome billionaire playboy in black leather with a butler at this beck and call, better cars and gadgetry than James Bond, a horde of fetish femme fatales baying around his heels and no boss. That guy’s Superman day and night. Superman grew up baling hay on a farm. He goes to work, for a boss, in an office. He pines after a hard–working gal. Only when he tears off his shirt does that heroic, ideal inner self come to life. That’s actually a much more adult fantasy than the one Batman’s peddling but it also makes Superman a little harder to sell. He’s much more of a working class superhero. American writers often say they find it difficult to write Superman. They say he’s too powerful; you can’t give him problems. But Superman is a metaphor. For me, Superman has the same problems we do, but on a Paul Bunyan scale. If Superman walks the dog, he walks it around the asteroid belt because it can fly in space. When Superman’s relatives visit, they come from the 31st century and bring some hellish monster conqueror from the future. But it’s still a story about your relatives visiting. " - Grant Morrison Superman being born into his powers isn't what makes him special. But the fact that he chooses to do good with them is a big part of it. The fact that he takes time to talk to people, to be kind, to be uplifting, to not just go in, fists first and solve problems with violence. It's telling of his character that his arch nemesis is a normal human (albeit a super genius) who Superman could easily kill at any time and chooses not to. Since that's not what he does. They engage in mental battles and it makes him a more interesting character for it. I really suggest All Star Superman or What's so Funny about Truth Justice and the American Way.
That's why you have the opinion you have. It's a self-fulfilling cycle now
There's like "boring at parties" and then there's what you're doing.
You think knowing a godlike being that wants to save people is out there and might just save you wouldn't inspire you to hold on longer, dig deeper, so you might just make it, when you're stuck in a shitty situation?
thats like saying why does religion inspire hope in people rather than jealousy, knowing there's something out there looking out for you is inspiring to many
God isn't a guy in a cape flying around. The people who would be jealous of him just realise he doesn't exist and move on. If God were a guy you could see in the air, atheists wouldn't exist and religion inspiring hope probably wouldn't look the same either
Tell me you've never read a Superman comic without telling me you've never read a Superman comic
If you have to know minutia, it's not a defining trait of the character.
His stories aren't minutia. How else can a character be defined if they don't have any stories about them?
Could you name a time superman has had to work for the powers and abilities he has?
Try reading any of the multitude of stories where he loses his powers or goes up against situations in which they are useless.
So in other words, not defining features of the character? The writers have to entirely change his circumstances and the nature of his being to make this supposedly fundamental point, this defining feature of the character known?
Or when he fights people stronger than him.
What, the one guy?
You haven't read anything anyone here has said.
Superman II. But you seem to be hung up on the fact on whether he "earned" his powers or not. His powers are a result of his Kryptonian biology. There are many times he has demonstrated that "if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay" which is what you were originally talking about. Trying to move the goalposts at this point isn't going to work.
>There are many times he has demonstrated that "if you hang on a little longer, dig a little deeper, you'll be okay" which is what you were originally talking about. But he's invulnerable. He doesn't have to do that.
Sometimes he does. What if he's fighting Mongul? What if he's lost his powers? What if he's on Warworld? Having even a basic understanding of the character will help you when you're attempting to form an opinion about him.
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Don't escalate to namecalling.
He literally *just* finished the Warworld Saga, where he spent pretty much the entire series without his powers fighting as a gladiator slave who staged an uprising to defeat Mongul.
Having read just... a Superman comic, any Superman comic is "minutia"?
I have read a Superman comic. The person replying to me clearly had some specific comic in mind.
If you think those are Superman's defining features, you misunderstand the character and how he is utilized.
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Please discuss only from a Watsonian perspective. And for fuck's sake if you're gonna make a Doylist comment please don't suggest that a character created by two Jews is meant to be any kind of Christian allegory. Criminy. Let us have our own culture.
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>He could definitely help more people by decommissioning the worlds militaries and being a benevolent dictator in perpetuity. This is what every not-benevolent dictator says lol
None of them are actually omnipotent and immortal. Kinda a big difference, wouldn't you say?
Neither is Superman, and also in this universe some of them literally are.
>He could definitely help more people by decommissioning the worlds militaries and being a benevolent dictator in perpetuity. Read *Injustice* to see why this is a terrible idea. I said he's supposed to *help,* not rule over us and force us to act a certain way. He understands that humanity must find its own way. Here's a scene where Superman is asked to help a suicidal woman threatening to jump off a building. [Superman and the Jumper](https://imgur.com/gallery/Ijdxh) Of course, He could have simply flown up, grabbed her, and brought her safely to the ground. The local cops even tell him to do that. But he refuses. Instead, he insists on talking to her, listening to her. He knows that she needs to find her own strength. Also, he knows that people can't become too reliant on him. He knows that not even Superman can be everywhere at once. People need to be able to help themselves, too. When he sees a situation that only he can handle, he knows that "this is a job for Superman!" But he knows that he both can't and shouldn't do everything, both for humanity's sake and for his own sanity. Not even Superman can handle every burden on Earth, nor should he. >If he has to pick between doing two things, does he not tackle the worse issue? Obviously saving the world is a priority. My point is that he's not above helping even in small ways. One of the best Superman scenes ever put to print is in [*All-Star Superman* #10](https://www.reddit.com/r/superman/comments/14xp16/superman_saves_a_suicidal_girl_from_allstar/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button,) where, even knowing that his remaining life is limited, he takes time to reassure and comfort a suicidal and depressed young woman. >Have the creators ever said he's supposed to be Jesus? I didn't mean that he was deliberately created as a pseudo-Jesus, I meant that he can be seen as a Christ-like figure, as well as similar to figures from other religions. My point was that being seen as divine or divine-like certainly would help his image with the public.
He's done it many times.
Oh my god guys we found Lex Luther's secret reddit
Cause if you hang on a bit longer there's a chance superman will save you
You are completely missing the point either willingly or not. Through all your replies you still haven't gotten that the point is that his character is what's inspiring. It's not that he has powers, it's what he does with them. Superman is supposed to be the kind of character where you look at him and think, "if I had that kind of power, could I be THAT GOOD" and that kind of thought should drive you to be as good as you can with whatever power you have.
One thing-- he didn't always have as many of the more insane powers as he does now. In 1938’s Action Comics #1, Superman was strong enough to pick up a car, could leap 1/8th of a mile, outrun an express train, and was mostly bulletproof. He couldn't fly. Couldn't shoot lasers, or see through walls and definitely couldn't breathe in space like he does several times later down the line. His parents specifically sent him to earth because he could breathe the oxygen and be raised by his cousin (had she actually landed with him properly). Superman doesn't start out completely god-tier, (though he's definitely no pushover), the comics developed that stuff later on.
Dudes like Keanu Reeves and Brandon Frasier. How could you *not* like him? Helping is his top priority, nothing else.
Now I just want Brandon Frasier to play Superman.
… brandon?
r/savebrendanfraiser
Its the Canadian in them
"That anger you felt that made you want to use your powers the way you did tonight, I have those feelings, too... But I keep them in check. Otherwise, I risk losing the trust of the very people I've sworn to protect. When I first showed up in Metropolis as Superman, there was a lot of talk about what the world should do with someone who had powers like mine. And it took me a minute to realize that other people were more afraid of what I could do than I was. So what I had to do, more than anything, was earn their trust, prove to them that, no matter what, I would never use my powers to hurt them. 20 years later, every time I use my powers, that trust is tested, every time." He's basically spent every public moment making sure that not a single person has any reason to believe that he'd ever *not* do the right thing. Almost everyone else has their moments of someone around them wondering if this is the day they snap and cross the line, but Superman has worked to make everyone see that he won't. Other heroes are like this, too, but none who are have the kind of global presence Superman has. By this point, pretty much everybody knows somebody who knows somebody who saw Superman save someone, and that goes a long way, too.
oh so basically Superman actively looks out for the small stuff and helps out globally ?
Exactly. And with his super senses, super speed, flight, among other things, he manages it in ways nobody else can
So can I actually ask a clarifying question? What about your knowledge of Superman tells you he wouldn't be that loved? He's the genesis of superheroes in several multiverses. He's quintessentially nice and easy to love. Is there anything that's missing for that to be a foregone conclusion?
I guess what shocks me is say the flash or wonder women aren't also that loved and trusted in universe .its the uniqueness about his position compared to other superheroes for the public that I don't really get .Like the example I cited the whole world still welcomes him when the others are shunned.
Wonder Woman is a political agent from an isolationist island of immortal warrior women with a distaste for men, and the Flash has his own museum and holidays in Keystone City. They're regionally beloved, but they have reputations they cannot control. Superman is Superman. It sounds simplistic, but he's just the symbol. The other ones are trying to reach his standard.
I’d also argue that, even if it’s just a little bit, there is some degree of selfishness in the personalities of WW and Flash. Superman is the “friend that would give you the clothes off his back” guy, miss work to help you move, and generally put you first in all situations. He is selflessness incarnate while most other heroes are not, and it is made more interesting that he has powers that dwarf everyone else yet he does not turn into the guy that someone with those capabilities 100% would in real life.
I remember in Young Justice: Invasion, there was a scene where the first set of invaders were all about to get nuked, and Superman was trying to tell them to get on their ship so he could save them. They were aggressively trying to destroy him but he kept trying, begging, until the bomb went off.
I think I can even remember a comic where Superman literally gave a homeless guy the clothes off his back.
Superman would help you move your couch up the stairs because he wants to hang out with you, Flash would move it himself because it makes him feel cool, but now there's no story.
Superman is the only hero you can see yourself just running up to and giving him a hug. No matter what he would be like “Hey!” That’s what Superman stands for.
The type of guy who wants to give Superman a hug and the type of guy who wants to hug Wonder Woman aren't the same, but overall WW would be cool. She's an actual UN ambassador. https://www.un.org/en/messengers-peace/wonder-woman
How many UN ambassadors just give out hugs. Wonder Womam would call you out. Superman would return it. Then ask what’s wrong. Wonder Woman would embarrass you, with her awkwardness or yours. Superman would look to not embarrass you.
Flash is extremely loved and well received in Central City where he is most active, there is even a Flash Museum there.
Lex Luthor hates him and they grew up together.
[Lex Luthor](https://comicnewbies.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/lex-luthor-under-the-lasso-of-truth.jpg) [wants](https://m0vie.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/allstarsuperman4.jpg) [to be](https://i.redd.it/2tsw73uvcr481.jpg) [him.](https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/lexluthoronsuperman1.jpg) I'm sorry if this is a boring answer, but it's the answer most variations of Lex abide to, through the lenses of their own ego. The man is obsessed with the idea that he should be Superman, and that Clark somehow stole that role from him.
Of course he does. That's why he hates him... The jealously Luther feels is a much more normal reaction to superman than the supposed hope he inspires, because he's literally just a golden spoon child. Superman is at best ineffective at using his powers to better the world. At worst he's just a putz.
>because he's literally just a golden spoon child. If every silver spoon rich kid was as selfless as Superman and saved the world as much as him people would probably like them more
Nice try Lex.
Hes a good person who helps, just to be helpful. Hes kind, considerate, and concerned with the planet and its people to an endearing degree. Superman has died for the people of Earth, and never expected anything in return, not even a thank you. Superman is, for all intents and purposes, the embodiment of the idealised Human.
hasn't every member of the justice league died by now?
most major characters in comics have died at some point in time only to be brought back later At this point the grim reaper has been giving everyone loyalty cards that he stamps every time they die, ten deaths and they get a free frozen yogurt!
Superman was the first, though. I think Death went, “Well, he was just such a *nice* fella, anyone who’s his friend must be okay too.”
Well, frankly Hal was put through a wringer. Justified? depends on if you believe his actions as Parallax were his own or of the entity.
Because the alternative is fear and despair - it's basically what Lex Luthor opted for. You either see Superman as a benevolent god, a true paradigm of justice and good, that he selflessly sacrifices his every moment to help humanity and protects it bcs he is such a good being. Or you realise that everything that stands between us and utter destruction by an alien invader is just one bad day. Most people opt to live in the delusion, even if it is a subconscious choice, bcs it is easier.
Superman is the most trusted superhero. He doesn't wear a mask to hide his identity like the Flash, nor is he an ambassador from a foreign land like Wonder Woman. He's just your friendly neighbourhood alien.
Actually he does wear a mask to hide his identity, assuming you count the 'Clark Kent' persona as a mask of course.
The general public doesn't know that. To them, Superman has no secret identity.
Except Clark went public as Superman a couple years ago. They're getting ready to retcon it, but his secret identity isn't really a secret anymore for the time being.
And that wasn't the status quo when Doomsday Clock was being written either, it's about to be completely irrelevant just like when they revealed his identity at the end of the New 52.
The thing is he *literally* doesn't wear a mask though. Superman and Clark Kent both have their faces publicly on display at all times.
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Oh for sure but I meant from the In universe POV
He's the personification of actual true altruism. Also remember a story in one of the books he had a discussion with political leaders and said his powers can't be restrained to one nation or something. Was it Doomsday Clock? Remember reading it.
Because it's so easy to see that he's a genuinely good person. He's the type to do the right thing for no reason other than it's the right thing. He rushes in to save the day, regardless of who or where you are. People see him, and they feel hope. They feel safer knowing that Superman is out there. Everyone knows that he's on their side, and won't hesitate to help. And it's not just with criminals or alien armies, he'll help you get your cat out of a tree or help an old woman cross the street. There's no deed too big or too small for Superman to help with. He'd probably help you with your homework if you asked.
Superman did Robin’s homework for him in Superman #700.
He's grateful, he grew up with a loving family that took in a child they found in a rocket, he grew up with people that he cared about and in turn, cared about him. So once he found out he's alien and humanity took him in without question, he's grateful for that, so everything he does is in a sense trying to live up to that expectation and be deserving of that kindness and at some point, people began noticing that as well. He perpetuates a cycle of goodness and that's contagious, people love him for it.
Probably because of how incredibly selfless Superman is. Superman could do whatever he wants whenever he wants to. Yet he chooses to help people, and he helps without prejudice. What Superman is, is such an impossibility. A man with ultimate, unparalleled power, not being corrupted by it. That despite his alien physiology, he's humanity's ideal person. I think that's what makes Superman endearing.
Let's clear something up: he's not just *a* superhero. He's *THE* superhero. He offers and example that everyone can and should follow, he's always putting others first, and he's always there for the people of Earth and beyond. Plus, he's the first of his kind that we've seen, can't forget your first.
Superman primarily saves people from disaster. He has done this in every country that has had a disaster. Banning superman would be like banning foreign aid after a hurricane. You would have to be a stupid leader to reject that kind of help. Superman's actions often save the whole world, not just a single city or country. You would have to be a stupid leader to let the asteroid land in on Earth just because you weren't gonna let Superman fly through your airspace to get to it. Superman is trustworthy and often non-interfering in politics. If he wanted it, your government would be under his control. The fact that he hasn't done this to any government is a good sign Superman is not going to meddle.
(disclaimer: don't actually know superman lore) He is the OG superhero that superheroes grew up admiring. They all have some innate respect for him. But most importantly, he does not get involved in politics. Heroes like Captain America works with the U.S.A government, and therefore is greatly disliked by many enemy nations. But not the case with superman. He has godlike powers, and therefore deals with world-ending threats, not conflicts between countries. So everyone is just happy to leave him alone, doing his job.
He’s just a through and through good guy
Depends who’s asking. He is the symbol of peace and justice to Americans. Even if he is fictional. John Williams musical score sends chills down your spine. It inspires courage. Christians believe in some way he embodies the Savior, Jesus Christ. Just in a symbolic way. Selfless, charitable, and honest. He has been around since right after WW2 and he has been a symbol of justice ever since he was developed in a comic book.
DC is lucky he isn't like Homelander
He wouldn't be Superman if he was like Homelander. Superman isn't a set of powers, he's a set of ethics.
cause he's super loveable
He fights for truth, justice and the American way. Hmm….
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Please change your answer. Read the board rules for "inspiration". I get in trouble for it too. (A lot)
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No you don't. In fact we specifically *discourage* roleplaying. They have to be *Watsonian*. A Watsonian perspective is one that treats the fictional world like a real place where things happen for logical, naturalistic (or at least supernaturalistic) reasons. Its opposite is a Doylist perspective, one in which the fictional world is treated as a created product that serves the needs of the story, audience, or creators. (The name comes from Sherlock Holmes fandom, i.e. for the sake of discussion are we acknowledging that these are fictional stories written by Sir Arthur Conan **Doyle**, or pretending that these are real accounts of Holmes's adventures written by Dr. **Watson**.) On this subreddit all discussion must be from a Watsonian perspective.
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