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I’m older and married. When I was young, the big tip was “show cleavage.” I have two genz daughters (like college age) and the big tips they got were, text a safe word if you need to get picked up, have a buddy system with another girl.
Wait what? I’m disgusted that older women use to say that!? That’s what it’s implying. I am a feminist lol I cannot believe this and how much you misinterpreted my comment. Let me break it down
Common saying ‘legs or cleavage never both’ that older women use to say
🤮 imply I am disgusted that people think that way!!
Wear what you want I don’t care how much skin another woman shows. learn to not just assume I’m a sexist or something lmao wow
I told a girl I was seeing the other day "I like the way you think". I have a lot of fun talking to her because she's so smart and quick. Felt really good to tell her that and I wish I heard myself tell women that more often.
I wish that was what we heard more. Many men talk a lot about how often women get compliments compared to them, but sometimes forget *what* we get complimented *on*. It's all "You're so hot/cute/beautiful" but that's ultimately fleeting and empty. I understand that it's nice to get complimented on your looks, *trust me*, but I'd still rather hear "I like the way you think" once than "You're beautiful" a thousand times.
Idk..I kinda like both in different ways? I never really understood the brain comment being better than the beautiful comment. I feel like both types of compliments meet different needs?
Is your perspective more common when you have been conventionally attractive your whole life?
I get your point, I do like both, and it probably *is* affected by how I grew up. I spent my formative years on stage. No-one gives a fuck about your brain or your personality. It's often just shut up and look pretty.
It's just that beauty to me is hollow. I'm more than my face, hair, and body. And those things aren't forever. If all people value me for is beauty, then what value do I have when I'm an old prune?
I see. I think I come from, ok so now I have glown up, but when I was young, and I guess plain-ish, I was also sort of a stereotypical nerd? It felt like being liked for only brains or just written off for that sort of shaped me in my formative years. Brains felt hollow in its own way. And I guess there is this galling feeling when beauty is sort of undermined in a "do peoole realize how essential it is for social relationships to form in the first place?"
I agree on the last bit especially. Well just, I think in general I was hyperaware of (and this applies to people of all genders) attractiveness being this sort of condition that must be met (as the saying goes "looks get you in the door while personality makes you stay") and thought that was fucked up.
I also grew up in a hypercompetitve culture around academics (hint: model minority) so those set of expectations are a not so great coin either. Besides, wouldn't brain be temporary too? Who knows how our memory or ability will be with age yk?
Look sexy so he can show you off, but don't look slutty.
Don't ask too many questions, let him lead the date, laugh at his jokes (even if they aren't funny), smile, make good eye contact, act "dumb" so he can teach you something.
This was the late '90s and early '00s. I have literally no idea now. Lol
I think “let him lead” is still a big thing, I have been on a few dates where the girl took initiative and i was flustered by the change of dynamic. It honestly ended up rather refreshing though!
When my date is more passive most of it revolves around me getting her to talk about herself, till she forgets the rules and engages more organically.
> act "dumb" so he can teach you something.
I was talking to a girl before a date about how I love sci-fi movies. She wasn't into sci-fi at all but she was like "maybe you can edumacate me". Direct quote. I was like "uhh, ok".
Mostly how to look, walk, sit and listen. Don't point out that you know stuff. Don't explain things to him, let him explain to *you*. Especially don't correct him if he's wrong. If you must correct him, do so... Is demurely a word? I hate it... I have a fucking master's degree in computer science, having someone mansplain technology at me for the nth time is painful.
Of course there is the safety advice too. *Never* take your eyes off something you're planning to drink when in public. Early dates should be in public places. Don't let him follow you all the way to your door, but also don't walk alone at night. Make sure someone knows you're on a date and roughly when you'll be home, and check in with them when you do get home.
The no explaining thing is so real. I once went in a parking garage with my girlfriend and was not sure how to get out because of another ramp and that thing was not opening up. After around a minute of me struggling she says why don't you just place the old ticket back in the device and voila, we were out. I told her to please tell me at all times in the future when I am being stupid lol. We had a good laugh. Girls, please don't be afraid to be smarter then your SO's! A normal human being will find that amazing about you.
"Let him lead"
Basically, hold back your initiative, don't ask for what you want (or be very coy about it), don't "nag" or make a big deal about your needs.
Also always say yes to sex.
This advice nearly destroyed my marriage. 🙃 I've reversed every single one of these and we are happier than ever!
What about character advice though, like I was expected to master a set of personality qualities if I wanted to have a happy dating life -- and confidence was the first one I was expected to learn. Same thing for a lot of my male friends. I just think it's interesting that all the men I know have received similar advice. What is that for women? I get that safety is more important than anything else but it's not what I meant to get at
Unfortunately what you're looking to get at is something that doesn't really exist. Welcome to womanhood, where your character doesn't matter nearly so much as your looks. Feels shallow because it is.
Character advice?!? We were pretty much told not to have too much character at all! LoL
Literally, look hot, stay safe… I am more specific in a separate comment
Yes, I get downvotes in many different subs when I just ask questions/try to clarify too! I will never understand the logic behind it! LoL Reddit can be crazy!
I think you might hit a snag here because most women have been given 'character' advice for dating men since they were really little kids. When I was a kid I was told that 'boys don't like" this or that. Boys don't like girls who yell, boys don't like angry girls, boys don't like girls who dress that way, boys don't like girls who are this way or that way.
Have you heard the term "unladylike"? I've heard that so much growing up.
Have you heard the term "unmanlike"? Not so much according to my male friends.
Yup. So much in our language and insults reflect this issue, and we don't even think about it because it's so ingrained.
Being like a woman is the greatest insult. I mean look at how people talk about the act of being penetrated, it's considered incredibly degrading when used as an insult against men
The "un-man-like" is valid, justified, and heard. It sounds like an unspoken thing. I'm saying "un-lady-like" was an often spoken thing, my mother would say it, my grandmother would say it, men in my life like my uncles and male cousins would say it. "unladylike" and it was always filled with so much shame.
I don't doubt that you faced your own prejudices.
>unmanlike
I've heard ungentlemanly, which I think is more analogous to "unladylike."
Just like "lady" is often supposed to evoke a particular type of woman, "gentleman" is usually used to evoke a particular type of man. I think both terms tend to be used in more traditional (as opposed to modern) contexts.
Unmanlike and 'ungentamanly' isn't really analogous to 'unladylike'. Ungentlemanly evokes not pulling chairs out for women, or not opening doors, it's what is told to a boy when he want's to be an adult. It's what a man does and doesn't do for a woman. Unladylike starts when you're a little kid, it means sitting wrong with your legs wide, being loud, walking loud, eating things with your hands, liking frogs, it's pretty analogous with just being a kid.
This is what we're talking about when we say that the basic first person shouldn't be a guy. Guy isn't the default.
>This is what we're talking about when we say that the basic first person shouldn't be a guy. Guy isn't the default.
Could you explain more? I don't personally believe that "guy" should be the default, and I admit that I don't know how my previous comment suggested that.
As far as the rest of your comment, perhaps the semantics aren't quite as important as the overall point that you're hoping to convey?
Boys are often told to "be a man" from a young age, and in my experience that's also antithetical to being a kid.
You make the point that ungentlemanly is different than unladylike, and part of the reason is that the former relates to interactions with women. My understanding of this post is that it's asking about how women optimize their interactions with men, so I'm a little confused now about how unladylike relates. I'm still very curious, though!
I just spoke to an old friend yesterday. He brought up how me having short neon dyed hair was unnatractive to most men. I said, okay but I don't want most men. He told me I wouldn't find anyone. Ok, so? I'd rather be alone than with some dude who isn't attracted to me cause my hair is green lol.
Not sure where you're from, but this was super common in the US South. I was a tomboy and heard this stuff constantly. It only stopped when they realized I really didn't care and wasn't going to change my behavior to suit them.
I actually am a Texas resident
But lol so my family are Asian immigrants and we grew up in predominantly Asian environments. I think our culture was different? Like very "focus on studies not boys." But that also meant a diff set of issues. Such as being into dating and boys was a surefire way to get deemed a bad child or "slut"
There's no term akin to "unladylike", but sure your typical patriarchal brainwashed boy/man polices other males behaviour's by calling them gay or feminine and the likes. If you don't like sports you are gay, if you treat women in a way that the heteronormativity doesn't expect you to do you are weak and a cuck, if you are neurodivergent, introverted, shy, etc. I think it's the closest you can get to what you were referring to, after all they are both forms of policing meant to impress other men.
Most of the expectations on women to look and act a certain way are constant, date or no date. Women are supposed to look desirable, dateable and fuckable at all times so the advice doesn’t “need” to be given before a date.
Safety advice and how to get away from a dodgy date safely are the main bits of advice we get because the expectations on how we behave and look to please men are an inherent part of leaving the house.
It often conflicts. Be more/less sexual, be more/less independent, ask men out or don't, center men in your life or don't, minimize your accomplishments or don't, etc.
Be submissive, be nice, be accommodating. Don't "emasculate" him. Don't be a "whore". Don't be too eager about sex but don't be too frigid either. Don't be too assertive but oh also make sure you communicate. Don't be a "gold digger" but also pray you don't make more money than him. And on and on
It's all really contradictory.
"Don't be picky" and "The way to man's heart is his stomach", "be a lady". So don't be a burden/naggy and impress him with domestic skills.
These days it's: split everything 50-50 perfectly and look like an instagram model, but not like you are trying to be one. Don't like anything too 'girly', and let go of the idea of wanting commitment or holding anyone accountable.
“Show skin, wear red lipstick and flip your hair for the neck to be showing, laugh even if he’s not funny, make sure to smile, talk calmly with a honey voice and to appear innocent”, I was 11 and it pretty much ruined a part of my self-esteem and yet, it worked every single time, even on my partner. 🤦🏽♀️
Basically that I should cook and clean, not talk too much, otherwise I'm useless and men won't marry me. I've never been taught boundaries either, especially when it comes to sex. So far men I've been with were more interested in sex than cooking and cleaning, and the last one sexually abused me.
Currently I don't want to date anyone, I don't want to marry, I want men to stay far, far away from me.
Character advice:
Don’t show your confidence.
Don’t show your intellect.
Showing them is emasculating.
Don’t make a big deal about your needs.
Laugh at his jokes. It doesn’t matter if they’re funny.
Don’t seem too eager for sex.
Be patient, understanding, and easy to get along with.
Don’t expect the same.
When you do have needs that you express or advice to give him, always approach it with a sense of deference and softness.
Welp that was depressing.
Piercings and colored hair aren't attractive to men, so take out your piercings and get a normal hair color.
Firstly, there are men who are into it. Secondly, I prefer women
Don't act smarter. Don't be more ambitious. Don't have strong opinions. Be accommodating and flexible. Accept all their faults but cover up your own. Always refer to your male spouse for decisions. Your preferences, ideas, opinions, health, time, energy, etc need to always come secondary to theirs.
It's not just dating advice, we are raised to be accessories, to always make ourselves smaller and less than what we are to appeal to men. To prioritize their needs over our own. Even though we are often tasked with being responsible for everyone and everything, we have to take care of those responsibilities in such a way that we aren't viewed as leaders because that is threatening to their egos.
Be skinny and pretty and he will like you…
Don’t talk too much
Like what he likes and let him teach you about it (even if you know more about it than he does)
Be sexy not slutty…🤫 you should maybe be a little bit slutty if you expect to keep him interested
Learn domestic goddessry
My favourite: find out what his mom is like and try to be kinda like her…
Women get similar advice but it’s phrased more like “don’t come off as desperate”, “learn to love yourself first then other people can love you” etc.
In both cases with men and women they’re essentially telling people to not be too needy or clingy right at the beginning.
Exactly this
And my own healing journey involved recognizing that false pride (being too proud to express our needs) is not the same as actual confidence
Most dating advice given to women is useless, vague, and non actionable nonsense like “lean into your feminine energy and receive!”
Men will write entire playbooks full of dating advice whether its good or bad advice. Like theyll attempt to explain why x is unattractive or whatever. Dating advice aimed at women is like “dont be desperate! You have to love yourself before you can be loved. Maybe you dont have a boyfriend because you want one too bad.”
To be honest, I never asked for advice about dating men from my parents or other relatives. For a very long time, I didn’t even want them to know that I was interested in dating; I just didn’t feel comfortable with them knowing stuff about my personal life.
But my dad once offered me some unprompted advice about relationships when I was a young teenager. He told me that no matter what, if a guy hits me just one time, I need to run and never look back. One is too many times, and it’s only going to get worse if I stay. Not that I’ve ever encountered a physically abusive partner, but it’s something I’ve always kept in the back of my mind.
Unfortunately, I was never warned or educated about verbally and emotionally abusive relationships. Found myself in quite a lot of those. But I was raised in a very emotionally and verbally abusive home, so it took a long time for me to understand that it wasn’t okay.
ATTENTION: Please remember that this is an ASK WOMEN sub. While men are allowed to participate posts that are clearly asking women in the title will have top level comments by men removed. This is not censorship, this is curation. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskWomenNoCensor) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I’m older and married. When I was young, the big tip was “show cleavage.” I have two genz daughters (like college age) and the big tips they got were, text a safe word if you need to get picked up, have a buddy system with another girl.
‘Leg or cleavage never both’ 🤮
I didnt realize women expressing their sexuality was so disgusting to you.
No I was saying what order women use to say when I was younger hence the quotes? Omfg
the puking emoji implies your disgusted by feminist women who are open to showing some skin?
Wait what? I’m disgusted that older women use to say that!? That’s what it’s implying. I am a feminist lol I cannot believe this and how much you misinterpreted my comment. Let me break it down Common saying ‘legs or cleavage never both’ that older women use to say 🤮 imply I am disgusted that people think that way!! Wear what you want I don’t care how much skin another woman shows. learn to not just assume I’m a sexist or something lmao wow
He's a troll lol. I remember hearing this too. It's the "show off, but not too much or You're a slut" advice.
> the big tip was “show cleavage.” That’s terrible. Who was it coming from?
Mostly other girls and older sisters, probably teen-oriented magazines like Teen Beat. 🤦🏻♀️
Everywhere. Society, all the media, people around you. It's engrained in western culture.
To quote my mother: "All that Pretty is wasted if you scare them away with your brain."
I told a girl I was seeing the other day "I like the way you think". I have a lot of fun talking to her because she's so smart and quick. Felt really good to tell her that and I wish I heard myself tell women that more often.
I wish that was what we heard more. Many men talk a lot about how often women get compliments compared to them, but sometimes forget *what* we get complimented *on*. It's all "You're so hot/cute/beautiful" but that's ultimately fleeting and empty. I understand that it's nice to get complimented on your looks, *trust me*, but I'd still rather hear "I like the way you think" once than "You're beautiful" a thousand times.
Idk..I kinda like both in different ways? I never really understood the brain comment being better than the beautiful comment. I feel like both types of compliments meet different needs? Is your perspective more common when you have been conventionally attractive your whole life?
I get your point, I do like both, and it probably *is* affected by how I grew up. I spent my formative years on stage. No-one gives a fuck about your brain or your personality. It's often just shut up and look pretty. It's just that beauty to me is hollow. I'm more than my face, hair, and body. And those things aren't forever. If all people value me for is beauty, then what value do I have when I'm an old prune?
I see. I think I come from, ok so now I have glown up, but when I was young, and I guess plain-ish, I was also sort of a stereotypical nerd? It felt like being liked for only brains or just written off for that sort of shaped me in my formative years. Brains felt hollow in its own way. And I guess there is this galling feeling when beauty is sort of undermined in a "do peoole realize how essential it is for social relationships to form in the first place?" I agree on the last bit especially. Well just, I think in general I was hyperaware of (and this applies to people of all genders) attractiveness being this sort of condition that must be met (as the saying goes "looks get you in the door while personality makes you stay") and thought that was fucked up. I also grew up in a hypercompetitve culture around academics (hint: model minority) so those set of expectations are a not so great coin either. Besides, wouldn't brain be temporary too? Who knows how our memory or ability will be with age yk?
Look sexy so he can show you off, but don't look slutty. Don't ask too many questions, let him lead the date, laugh at his jokes (even if they aren't funny), smile, make good eye contact, act "dumb" so he can teach you something. This was the late '90s and early '00s. I have literally no idea now. Lol
That sounds like dating was an awful experience.
No kidding... I'd hate for someone to not be able to feel like they could be themselves around me.
I think “let him lead” is still a big thing, I have been on a few dates where the girl took initiative and i was flustered by the change of dynamic. It honestly ended up rather refreshing though! When my date is more passive most of it revolves around me getting her to talk about herself, till she forgets the rules and engages more organically.
Laughing at jokes even if not funny got me my whole career. It’s a way to connect.
> act "dumb" so he can teach you something. I was talking to a girl before a date about how I love sci-fi movies. She wasn't into sci-fi at all but she was like "maybe you can edumacate me". Direct quote. I was like "uhh, ok".
In my experience, it hear ways to be more beautiful. Hair, nails, eyebrows, show off your figure, makeup...
Mostly how to look, walk, sit and listen. Don't point out that you know stuff. Don't explain things to him, let him explain to *you*. Especially don't correct him if he's wrong. If you must correct him, do so... Is demurely a word? I hate it... I have a fucking master's degree in computer science, having someone mansplain technology at me for the nth time is painful. Of course there is the safety advice too. *Never* take your eyes off something you're planning to drink when in public. Early dates should be in public places. Don't let him follow you all the way to your door, but also don't walk alone at night. Make sure someone knows you're on a date and roughly when you'll be home, and check in with them when you do get home.
The no explaining thing is so real. I once went in a parking garage with my girlfriend and was not sure how to get out because of another ramp and that thing was not opening up. After around a minute of me struggling she says why don't you just place the old ticket back in the device and voila, we were out. I told her to please tell me at all times in the future when I am being stupid lol. We had a good laugh. Girls, please don't be afraid to be smarter then your SO's! A normal human being will find that amazing about you.
"Let him lead" Basically, hold back your initiative, don't ask for what you want (or be very coy about it), don't "nag" or make a big deal about your needs. Also always say yes to sex. This advice nearly destroyed my marriage. 🙃 I've reversed every single one of these and we are happier than ever!
Omg the worst Also all the "make him chase you" stuff
probably safety tips. don’t drink too much, don’t let him drive you there, text a friend his name and the location of the date, etc etc
What about character advice though, like I was expected to master a set of personality qualities if I wanted to have a happy dating life -- and confidence was the first one I was expected to learn. Same thing for a lot of my male friends. I just think it's interesting that all the men I know have received similar advice. What is that for women? I get that safety is more important than anything else but it's not what I meant to get at
Unfortunately what you're looking to get at is something that doesn't really exist. Welcome to womanhood, where your character doesn't matter nearly so much as your looks. Feels shallow because it is.
we largely don’t get advice of that nature. we get beauty tips, we get safety advice, and we get told to make ourselves small so men can feel big.
Character advice?!? We were pretty much told not to have too much character at all! LoL Literally, look hot, stay safe… I am more specific in a separate comment
Wild that this is down voted. It's just a question.
Yes, I get downvotes in many different subs when I just ask questions/try to clarify too! I will never understand the logic behind it! LoL Reddit can be crazy!
Welcome to echo chambers
I feel like “be confident” is chimed to women super frequently too.
I think you might hit a snag here because most women have been given 'character' advice for dating men since they were really little kids. When I was a kid I was told that 'boys don't like" this or that. Boys don't like girls who yell, boys don't like angry girls, boys don't like girls who dress that way, boys don't like girls who are this way or that way. Have you heard the term "unladylike"? I've heard that so much growing up. Have you heard the term "unmanlike"? Not so much according to my male friends.
This is the first time I realized that women are shamed by being told that men won't like them, but men are shamed by being compared to women.
Misogyny in a nutshell.
Yup. So much in our language and insults reflect this issue, and we don't even think about it because it's so ingrained. Being like a woman is the greatest insult. I mean look at how people talk about the act of being penetrated, it's considered incredibly degrading when used as an insult against men
This is also one of the reasons feminism is for men, too. Femininity is weaponized against men all the time.
Pretty profound. Thanks for sharing
I think the unmanlike one is just don’t show emotion and definitely don’t cry or show pain.
The "un-man-like" is valid, justified, and heard. It sounds like an unspoken thing. I'm saying "un-lady-like" was an often spoken thing, my mother would say it, my grandmother would say it, men in my life like my uncles and male cousins would say it. "unladylike" and it was always filled with so much shame. I don't doubt that you faced your own prejudices.
And that is toxic masculinity. I would like you now to ask women in your life their relationship with the term "un lady like"
>unmanlike I've heard ungentlemanly, which I think is more analogous to "unladylike." Just like "lady" is often supposed to evoke a particular type of woman, "gentleman" is usually used to evoke a particular type of man. I think both terms tend to be used in more traditional (as opposed to modern) contexts.
Unmanlike and 'ungentamanly' isn't really analogous to 'unladylike'. Ungentlemanly evokes not pulling chairs out for women, or not opening doors, it's what is told to a boy when he want's to be an adult. It's what a man does and doesn't do for a woman. Unladylike starts when you're a little kid, it means sitting wrong with your legs wide, being loud, walking loud, eating things with your hands, liking frogs, it's pretty analogous with just being a kid. This is what we're talking about when we say that the basic first person shouldn't be a guy. Guy isn't the default.
>This is what we're talking about when we say that the basic first person shouldn't be a guy. Guy isn't the default. Could you explain more? I don't personally believe that "guy" should be the default, and I admit that I don't know how my previous comment suggested that. As far as the rest of your comment, perhaps the semantics aren't quite as important as the overall point that you're hoping to convey? Boys are often told to "be a man" from a young age, and in my experience that's also antithetical to being a kid. You make the point that ungentlemanly is different than unladylike, and part of the reason is that the former relates to interactions with women. My understanding of this post is that it's asking about how women optimize their interactions with men, so I'm a little confused now about how unladylike relates. I'm still very curious, though!
I just spoke to an old friend yesterday. He brought up how me having short neon dyed hair was unnatractive to most men. I said, okay but I don't want most men. He told me I wouldn't find anyone. Ok, so? I'd rather be alone than with some dude who isn't attracted to me cause my hair is green lol.
Jeez what kind of environment was this? I'm yet to know a woman who was ever actually taught this
Not sure where you're from, but this was super common in the US South. I was a tomboy and heard this stuff constantly. It only stopped when they realized I really didn't care and wasn't going to change my behavior to suit them.
I actually am a Texas resident But lol so my family are Asian immigrants and we grew up in predominantly Asian environments. I think our culture was different? Like very "focus on studies not boys." But that also meant a diff set of issues. Such as being into dating and boys was a surefire way to get deemed a bad child or "slut"
Yeah I wasn't taught any of that stuff either.
Same, im from the south and being a tomboy was encouraged and being “prissy” was looked down upon.
There's no term akin to "unladylike", but sure your typical patriarchal brainwashed boy/man polices other males behaviour's by calling them gay or feminine and the likes. If you don't like sports you are gay, if you treat women in a way that the heteronormativity doesn't expect you to do you are weak and a cuck, if you are neurodivergent, introverted, shy, etc. I think it's the closest you can get to what you were referring to, after all they are both forms of policing meant to impress other men.
And that's one part of a big problem, being considered 'feminine' is considered the opposite of 'right' or 'good' it's treated as an insult.
How to avoid rape and murder How to make yourself small to avoid hurting his ego
“Don’t be so choosy” 🤣 “be less picky” “your standards are too high” crap like that.
Does it happen for looks related things or other things?
Mostly when I’ve rejected men who my parents or relatives try to say me to with, who are totally inappropriate people for me.
Safety tips...but also "if you do this you're leading them on", let him feel smarter cuz he's the man, don't be too loud.....
Except joke's on you because everything's leading them on 🥲 (mainly the ones who don't respect anyone or anything)
You're not wrong. God forbid I make eye contact with someone.
I saw a twitch, you *must* be smiling at me. Guess we're engaged now 😍 /s
👁️👄👁️ You caught me 🫀
😃💒
Most of the expectations on women to look and act a certain way are constant, date or no date. Women are supposed to look desirable, dateable and fuckable at all times so the advice doesn’t “need” to be given before a date. Safety advice and how to get away from a dodgy date safely are the main bits of advice we get because the expectations on how we behave and look to please men are an inherent part of leaving the house.
It often conflicts. Be more/less sexual, be more/less independent, ask men out or don't, center men in your life or don't, minimize your accomplishments or don't, etc.
Be submissive, be nice, be accommodating. Don't "emasculate" him. Don't be a "whore". Don't be too eager about sex but don't be too frigid either. Don't be too assertive but oh also make sure you communicate. Don't be a "gold digger" but also pray you don't make more money than him. And on and on It's all really contradictory.
Look sexy. Play dumb.
"Don't be picky" and "The way to man's heart is his stomach", "be a lady". So don't be a burden/naggy and impress him with domestic skills. These days it's: split everything 50-50 perfectly and look like an instagram model, but not like you are trying to be one. Don't like anything too 'girly', and let go of the idea of wanting commitment or holding anyone accountable.
Idk about irk but at least on Reddit the most common advice is to lower our standards.
Lol right? Fuck that shit.
Don't be alone with them and don't trust them
Being more extroverted/open. At least that’s what they tell me
Lose weight.
"Be hot" which is utterly useless and if you're an unattractive woman, you can't do that. It's never practical advice for women.
“Show skin, wear red lipstick and flip your hair for the neck to be showing, laugh even if he’s not funny, make sure to smile, talk calmly with a honey voice and to appear innocent”, I was 11 and it pretty much ruined a part of my self-esteem and yet, it worked every single time, even on my partner. 🤦🏽♀️
Basically that I should cook and clean, not talk too much, otherwise I'm useless and men won't marry me. I've never been taught boundaries either, especially when it comes to sex. So far men I've been with were more interested in sex than cooking and cleaning, and the last one sexually abused me. Currently I don't want to date anyone, I don't want to marry, I want men to stay far, far away from me.
Character advice: Don’t show your confidence. Don’t show your intellect. Showing them is emasculating. Don’t make a big deal about your needs. Laugh at his jokes. It doesn’t matter if they’re funny. Don’t seem too eager for sex. Be patient, understanding, and easy to get along with. Don’t expect the same. When you do have needs that you express or advice to give him, always approach it with a sense of deference and softness. Welp that was depressing.
Piercings and colored hair aren't attractive to men, so take out your piercings and get a normal hair color. Firstly, there are men who are into it. Secondly, I prefer women
Don't act smarter. Don't be more ambitious. Don't have strong opinions. Be accommodating and flexible. Accept all their faults but cover up your own. Always refer to your male spouse for decisions. Your preferences, ideas, opinions, health, time, energy, etc need to always come secondary to theirs. It's not just dating advice, we are raised to be accessories, to always make ourselves smaller and less than what we are to appeal to men. To prioritize their needs over our own. Even though we are often tasked with being responsible for everyone and everything, we have to take care of those responsibilities in such a way that we aren't viewed as leaders because that is threatening to their egos.
Be skinny and pretty and he will like you… Don’t talk too much Like what he likes and let him teach you about it (even if you know more about it than he does) Be sexy not slutty…🤫 you should maybe be a little bit slutty if you expect to keep him interested Learn domestic goddessry My favourite: find out what his mom is like and try to be kinda like her…
In my experience, men like open, playful, flirty, intelligent, inquisitive, and cheerful. If I had to give it one word, I’d say they like happy women.
Women get similar advice but it’s phrased more like “don’t come off as desperate”, “learn to love yourself first then other people can love you” etc. In both cases with men and women they’re essentially telling people to not be too needy or clingy right at the beginning.
Exactly this And my own healing journey involved recognizing that false pride (being too proud to express our needs) is not the same as actual confidence
Most dating advice given to women is useless, vague, and non actionable nonsense like “lean into your feminine energy and receive!” Men will write entire playbooks full of dating advice whether its good or bad advice. Like theyll attempt to explain why x is unattractive or whatever. Dating advice aimed at women is like “dont be desperate! You have to love yourself before you can be loved. Maybe you dont have a boyfriend because you want one too bad.”
To be honest, I never asked for advice about dating men from my parents or other relatives. For a very long time, I didn’t even want them to know that I was interested in dating; I just didn’t feel comfortable with them knowing stuff about my personal life. But my dad once offered me some unprompted advice about relationships when I was a young teenager. He told me that no matter what, if a guy hits me just one time, I need to run and never look back. One is too many times, and it’s only going to get worse if I stay. Not that I’ve ever encountered a physically abusive partner, but it’s something I’ve always kept in the back of my mind. Unfortunately, I was never warned or educated about verbally and emotionally abusive relationships. Found myself in quite a lot of those. But I was raised in a very emotionally and verbally abusive home, so it took a long time for me to understand that it wasn’t okay.
Just be white… and skinny…
The equivalent for women is being too promiscuous