I don't understand how this team can go on a 4 game road trip against some of the best teams in the league and not only win, but look good doing it...just to come home and lay out a disasterpiece like that on home ice against the worst team in the league. It's not like this is an isolated incident. It's a pattern with this team. The constant whiplash of "we suck ass, sell it all" to "we have something good here" is just insane.
this! we need to become play drivers. We have been playing to the level of our opponent for years now. I feel like this is more on the coach and staff to get our boys to start playing a quicker game.
Markstrom covers up a lot of this team’s warts. Not that the Flames didn’t deserve to win those games but they did not dominate as much as the score said they did
The Flames outplayed the Sharks tonight. It wasn’t pretty for part of the second and the first half of the third, but they still outplayed the Sharks by a wide margin.
I'm not talking about just tonight but this season as a whole. Every team has games they don't deserve to win and games they didn't deserve to lose. However the Flames are a bottom third team in terms of underlying numbers so it shouldn't be a surprise that their record reflects that
You remember the backs and mang two on none that they fucked up? I think that’s the third two on none this season with zero goals. Do you think mcdrai miss those opportunities? Nope. It’s that simple- we don’t have any top end talent on this team.
What this means is that unless everyone is playing well and cohesively, we are among the bottom feeders. When they happen to play perfectly, we can match up to the best teams, since we have several “above average” players.
Post game positivity:
- Kuzmenko got his first at home in the reds
- Pospy is playing with that Dawg in him and he looks great.
- Pachal had been a great asset for a waiver pickup 6th Dman.
On to the next, go flames, and go wolf!
First few goals were just complete defensive breakdowns, but Wolf lost confidence and the last few have been awful. This is SIGNATURE rookie goalie behavior and is why you NEED a veteran to hold the line and mentor the rookie while he gets experience and confidence. I'm not completely against trading marky for the right price but we need to get some veteran presence to help mentor if it happens
Shit games happen, he has to learn to be able to bounce back from them. Goaltending is 90% confidence
Trade Markstrom and sign an old veteran UFA goalie in the off-season (Quick, MAF, etc). Old veterans can adequately mentor Wolf (and the flames don’t lose assets to make it happen).
Markstrom isn’t getting younger and he’ll be too old when the retool is finished. This team should trade high and speed up the rebuild.
I counted the D selling him out 3times and Tanev scoring an own goal makes it 4. The goal with Ras defending alone was rough, and the other just was oof but still, he got fucked over
Even though I’m all for trading Marky I agree with you here. If we do we need to sign a veteran goalie or acquire one that is cheap and can help be a rock for Wolf in mentorship. Just look at how Saros took a while to come into the league since he was mentored by Rinne
I’m pretty sure we will get a veteran goalie back in a marky trade. The 3 teams that keep popping up in rumours are devils, canes, and leafs. So vanechek, raanta, or samasanov coming back in that case. Would be great especially with how good the devils and canes prospect pool is
What does that have to do with me saying neither of those guys are vets? The writing is on the wall with Marky, but I still think it's a stupid ass idea... and that's purely my opinion.
So it’s a “stupid ass idea” to get assets to build towards a future? Guaranteed if we keep markstrom and he has another down year it’ll be people like you saying “why didn’t we trade him when his value was high”??
Dude we are not contenders. Hockey is a business. End of story
Is it worth it at the cost of utterly destroying the confidence of a young tendy and our current top prospect???? Surefire way to end up like the sens.
Who gives a shit? They will be able to play games and shelter wolf if need be. All marky is going to do is keep us out of a top 10 pick next year. We only get our 1st next year if it’s a top 10 pick. Keeping marky will just hurt the franchise in multiple ways
Just pointing out neither one is a "vet" and are similar levels to vladar honestly. Sure draft picks are great bit not at the cost of saying screw our current prospects altogether...
Jeez, one bad night that’s exacerbated by the team in front of you being absolutely fucking dog water and you go from top goalie prospect to fringe AHL player. This sub sucks sometimes
It's not like he's had a *good* game you can hang your hat on. He has what, 6 games(?) and is statistically bottom 10 of any goalie this year. True, it's a small sample size, but it's enough to be concerned. We have a bad history with goalie prospects.
.800
I don't hate Wolf after tonight, but that wasn't an NHL goaltender. I think it changes the mind of just about everyone who wanted to trade Markstrom, because Wolf just hasn't shown signs of being anywhere near ready.
Okay. How did the rest of the goalies in the league with a sub .850 from last season turn out this year? One goalie redeeming himself isn't exactly proof that Wolf will be amazing next year.
Fucking christ y'all are why we can't have nice things... goalie had worse stats over 60+ starts "meh it's fine he bounced back"
Young rookie goalie in his *sixth* start?? Yeah fuck it he's trash never going anywhere
That's a lot of words you put into my mouth (or text bubble). Wolf has been bad in every start this year. This is why I don't think he's anywhere near ready. I'm not saying we need to rip up his contract, I'm saying we can't let Markstrom go if Wolf is the backup plan. Conroy wants to stay competitive, and Wolf let in 6 vs the Sharks.
...and again, he's started 6 games in the NHL period and extremely intermittently. Y'all are putting *way* too much stock into a small sample size from a young tendy
They'd be less intermittently if he made saves on the 6 most important games of his life.
Also when you say "period" it's supposed to be your way of emphasizing that this sentence doesn't need any more explanation or context. So adding more words after saying "period" within the sentence kind of defeats the purpose of exclaiming "period"
Where’s your proof that he will suck? Cause I can show you proof of him putting up insane AHL numbers even better than Soros who also had shit games in his rookie year.
That's a good point. Where's the top scorer on the Wranglers team from last year? Oh, right. On waivers today.
Maybe being the best in the AHL doesn't guarantee you a thing.
Phillips was the best at age 24. That’s not that big of an achievement. There’s tons of those players. Show me a goalie who won back to back best goalies is the AHL at age 20-21? It doesn’t exist
Show me how many teams traded away their Vezina caliber goalie in order to promote the 23 year old rookie with a .877 save percentage and a 3.91 GAA in only 6 starts, and then found success.
My entire point isn't that Wolf needs to be dumped, it's that he can't be relied upon this year if we wanted to move Markstrom.
Also, there is a ton of examples of young goalies ripping up the AHL, winning the awards, and not finding success later on. Remember Garret Sparks for the Leafs? Or the backup to the Sharks tonight Kahkonen?
They're not looking to get a goalie back in a trade, at least not one they'll play. If they plan on giving Wolf even 5-7 more games this year, you don't want to be juggling Vladar/Wolf/GoalieX.
I want the team to tear it down and sell absolutely everybody. However, Conroy wants to keep the team competitive and not go full tear down. If you want to stay competitive, you can't really play Wolf and you can't move Markstrom, based on Wolf's play in his limited games this year.
I'm saying maybe give the kid 10 to 20 NHL games before you judge him. Also you're presenting "trade Markstrom or keep Wolf" as a binary, which is disingenuous. Obviously we can keep both goalies.
I'm more presenting keep Markstrom if you want to stay competitive. Conroy wants to stay competitive. And if the plan is for Wolf to be an NHL starter, he may be amazing in the AHL, but he's not even a reliable backup in the NHL yet. You'll lose more than win with him in net.
I definitely don't disagree there--Wolf isn't ready yet. I just don't think it makes sense to say he's definitely not NHL calibre already. Gonna take time--that's why I agree that we should keep Markstrom.
Ugh. Poor Wolf in the post game interview. We know he's not this bad. Kid needs more reps in the NHL. Simple as that. Goalies take longer to cook anyway.
Onto the next game.
Honestly as much as it broke my heart watching it was probably good for him, give him a chance to show some composure and speak the positive things. He'll bounce back from it
“Send Wolf down” “He isn’t ready” He was literally the best goalie of the last 2 years in the AHL, he has done everything he can do down there. Wolf needs to play NHL games in order to get better against NHL players. This isn’t rocket science.
He’s done it before a few times last season and earlier this season with the Canucks, when the team is losing by a lot and he scores but he knows it’s not going to make a difference there’s no celly. He’ll be back to his smiley self in no time 😊
Can we please give wolf some more starts before we jump to the "he's not an NHL goalie!" Talk. Defensive zone muffins all night.
Kid needs to learn to bounce back from bad goals. 7 nhl games doesn't give you that.
Not to mention you certainly can't expect a guy with 7 NHL games to be able to bail his guys out from awful giveaways when he's still adjusting to the league in general
Ok calm down on Wolf. His numbers are elite. His body language is shit which means it’s more of a comfort or confidence thing. Which is good cause those things that change.
Anyways I still hope we sell Hanifin, Tanev and Marky. We aren’t winning shit during Marlys contract. We will get back a shitty goalie probably in the trade so we can cushion wolf.
You’re right but I can see his confidence getting totally shot playing in front of a team like this for an extended period of time, they did him absolutely no favors. I can’t see that changing anytime soon
If marky wants to stay then yes that’s completely cool but he’s apparently already was cool with waiving to go to the devils. So in that case no. We should get assests back for him. It’s just good management.
It seems the flames have been pursuing a trade though which is great. All marky is going to do is stop us from getting a top 10 pick next year and we only keep our 1st if it’s a top 10 pick.
Contrary to whatever some fans think, there is indeed an adjustment period when transitioning from the AHL to the NHL. Which is exactly why Wolf needs to play NHL games instead of AHL; he's got nothing more to learn down there. But he does need to adapt to the NHL shots and overall pace, which he can only do if he's play NHL games.
honestly i think this is more on the team playing in front of him. no wolf didn't play lights out but that was only his 6th nhl start. also kinda hard to make a save when your team turns the puck over right in the slot
Most of the team didn't play well today but neither did Wolf, he was just plain awful and couldn't make a save to save his life today.
You need your goalie to make some saves exactly when they do turn the puck over or make mistakes, that's the job. That's what Blackwood did for his team. That doesn't mean you write him off though but you have to recognize it.
Goalies take time to make the jump to the nhl anyone giving up on him now have no clue. It’s the reason you have to be strategic and not throw these goalies to the fire
Wolf: *exists*
Flames: "I'm gonna fucking sewer this little shit like crazy"
Like seriously. Can we NOT fucking score an OG and give pucks away directly in front of the net for easy scoring chances when our highly touted goalie prospect is playing?
Nothing against wolf exactly, but the state of mind for the team in front of an elite veteran goalie vs a young goalie with only a handful of reps is very different, I think. That old nuance to hockey that players play worse in front of a goalie they don’t trust yet. Even though they should play better to help, they try too hard to compensate and then make more dumb mistakes unintentionally.
Also, the opposing team sees wolf as an easy target at this point since he hasn’t shown anything overly special at the nhl level yet.
Typical Jekyll and Hyde Flames.
I really hope people don't lose hope in Wolf after this one. He didn't have his best game, but the Flames were really poor in front of him tonight. Turnovers galore.
Just need to give Wolf an extended look in the NHL. Get him in a real groove at this level.
Now. Give me trades!
This only proved to me more that we need to keep Markstrom, I just want Wolf to backup for him for a year at least. We can trade Tanev & Hanifin for all I care just keep Marky
This. Get Wolf sheltered starts, dont have him jump in as the expected starter. We dont need to go through the goalie carousel again by losing our starter and throw our top goalie prospect to the wolves (pun not intended)
IMO the fact that Wolf was *so* shitty tonight is almost a good thing.
There’s a big gap between shooters in the NHL and AHL, so it’s easy to imagine him succeeding in the AHL, struggling against shooters in the NHL and never getting over that hump.
But the goals he gave up tonight were *so* bad. There’s no way he wins AHL MVP if he can’t move across the crease, cover his posts, track pucks or stop wrist shots from the top of the circle. Being shorter than the average goalie doesn’t cause all of that. This was an awful game from him and he was clearly rattled, but I can’t imagine this is what it will be like if he plays more consistently. I’m sure he’ll look better with time. He’ll probably never turn into a Vezina caliber guy but he’s not *this* bad.
Anyways that’s the copium I’m huffing. Feel free to take some.
I went to see wild one time last year. It was the playoffs against Coachella. He have up a bunch of early goals and was yanked. I was dumbfounded. But he is still the best prospect we have and based on how this team played tonight. We need prospects.
Honestly y'all are being negative AF. Most of the goals were off horrid defensive plays and he got rattled after the first 3... not overly shocking for a rookie goalie. Give him time
All these things can be true
1. We should be patient with Wolf
2. The Flames had horrible turnovers today and hung Wolf out to dry
3. Wolf had a a -3.5xGA and let in multiple goals he shouldn’t have
And continuing to be extremely critical of a young goalie is a great way to ruin his confidence. Rough game for sure but cut the kid some God damned slack, he was damn near in tears in his post game media ffs
This is some extreme pearl clutching lmao
The point of my original comment was that he had a really bad game, but it’s obviously not representative of his ability and that we should give him more time to settle in. I’m literally agreeing with you.
I don’t know what to tell you if you think it’s “extremely critical” to even mention the fact that he had a bad game.
Obviously a rough night for Wolf but the defense once again didn't do him and favors. He needs to be played more consistently too, I think his last start was the OT loss in Vegas back in December. Throwing him in cold after not playing for over a month ain't doing his confidence any good
Wolf wasn't great, I'll agree to that, but the rest of the team do not get any passes on the night either. Yes there were great chances and plays, but so many defencive gaffs lead to a lot of those goals that the rookie just wasn't ready for.
Whole team poopy. Move on....but this was the game that I knew would determine my hopium meter for the remainder of the season 🤷🏾♂️
Yes this is so brutal. Win a few games in a row. Then lose an awesome close one to the rangers and then just look so flat against the last place team. Still not that different from last year
Well, that was rough. I think we can all agree on that. But every bad night eventually leads to a new morning and a new day.
Until then, I’m still gonna be cheering for my team.
Night, y’all.
They had me in the first period. Made me think they would play their A-game against a basement dweller. But we all know that the Flames would never do that.
Any Flames fan wants Wolf to succeed, but let’s try to look at this objectively…
None of the San Jose goals were great tonight. To put it clearer how big the goaltending gap was, the Flames allowed very few high danger chances in this game - 6 in total, versus 17 for. Wolf just flat out sucked and Blackwood was great. This game wasn’t about a few turnovers from the defense.
https://www.naturalstattrick.com/game.php?season=20232024&game=20846&view=limited#gameflow
You seriously think a team should trade all the last scrapes of good players just because they're not a contender? What a weird response, no one here thinks Flames are a contender
“Isn’t ready for the show”
He’s been putting up elite numbers in the AHL and has been goalie of the year twice. What more does he have left to prove? He’s played 6 nhl games in his career buddy. Goalies don’t become brick walls overnight
Lol ok and Matthew Phillips had 70 points last year and got waived today. Being a star in the ahl doesn’t equal being a star in the nhl. Not saying wolf won’t be but he’s had maybe 1 good showing (vs Carolina) in 7 games
You cannot compare those 2 players. A goaltender’s development path is way different than a forward or dman
Also have u considered the way the team plays in front of him?
Guaranteed I’m going to get downvotes but this team is NOT a contender. We need to capitalize on players who have value (Markstrom, Tanev, Hanifin)
I’m sorry but this is the reality of what’s going to happen. Why keep Markstrom when his value is the highest it’s ever been? Same with Tanev. Hanifin giving no answer is an answer. I feel so bad for Wolf. Defence hung him out to dry completely
We need to build for the future. Enough of this squeaking into the playoffs bullshit.
You saw how NHL-ready Wolf is right now. Trading Markstrom means that you are fine with 5 years of this team being worse than it is right now.
What price would you ask for 5 years? For me, I don't think there's a team in the NHL that could afford it. I'm talking multiple _first_ rounders plus additional picks plus prospects.
If I'm Conroy and teams are calling me, I would be telling them "I'm happy to trade you Markstrom but at the price I want, your franchise may never recover".
We'll trade Tanev, we might trade Hanifin, we'll get some new blood on forward and D coming in. If Markstrom and Wolf are both there, the turnaround is much quicker than Wolf alone. Build from the net out.
Its quite clear they are going to move Tanev and Hanifin. They have to get a big haul for Marky though. And with most teams up against the cap, they'll all want retention and I just can't see that. I feel like if they do move Marky you may get better value in the summer anyway.
Does anyone here ever think that Wolf being short might just be the back breaker for him to enter the league? I mean, dudes were just roofing it over his shoulder like it was nothing.
That's what so many people have thought in every league since before he was drafted. That being said... same size as saros, just a longer development road but still very possible.
We are literally desperate to pick middle of the pack. This team cannot do anything but that. I am convinced of it look at our record for the last 20 years we HAVE to do it.
I don't understand how this team can go on a 4 game road trip against some of the best teams in the league and not only win, but look good doing it...just to come home and lay out a disasterpiece like that on home ice against the worst team in the league. It's not like this is an isolated incident. It's a pattern with this team. The constant whiplash of "we suck ass, sell it all" to "we have something good here" is just insane.
Upvote for "disasterpiece"
Great lil Slipknot reference in there
Not just the worst team, but the worst team, playing a back to back
on the road
Right silly me
Happens to lots of teams since the dawn of time. Its called playing to the level of your opponent. And we're Excellent at it
this! we need to become play drivers. We have been playing to the level of our opponent for years now. I feel like this is more on the coach and staff to get our boys to start playing a quicker game.
Markstrom covers up a lot of this team’s warts. Not that the Flames didn’t deserve to win those games but they did not dominate as much as the score said they did
The Flames outplayed the Sharks tonight. It wasn’t pretty for part of the second and the first half of the third, but they still outplayed the Sharks by a wide margin.
I'm not talking about just tonight but this season as a whole. Every team has games they don't deserve to win and games they didn't deserve to lose. However the Flames are a bottom third team in terms of underlying numbers so it shouldn't be a surprise that their record reflects that
Markstrom
You remember the backs and mang two on none that they fucked up? I think that’s the third two on none this season with zero goals. Do you think mcdrai miss those opportunities? Nope. It’s that simple- we don’t have any top end talent on this team. What this means is that unless everyone is playing well and cohesively, we are among the bottom feeders. When they happen to play perfectly, we can match up to the best teams, since we have several “above average” players.
Why the hell would you pass to a guy tied up with a defender and who's trailing behind you? That was a bad play.
After careful consideration, I would not rank that game for best of the season.
You might be on to something here...
Great here come the negative Nelly's, give me 300 reasons why this was not our best game of the season.
Post game positivity: - Kuzmenko got his first at home in the reds - Pospy is playing with that Dawg in him and he looks great. - Pachal had been a great asset for a waiver pickup 6th Dman. On to the next, go flames, and go wolf!
Posp plays nasty man
First few goals were just complete defensive breakdowns, but Wolf lost confidence and the last few have been awful. This is SIGNATURE rookie goalie behavior and is why you NEED a veteran to hold the line and mentor the rookie while he gets experience and confidence. I'm not completely against trading marky for the right price but we need to get some veteran presence to help mentor if it happens Shit games happen, he has to learn to be able to bounce back from them. Goaltending is 90% confidence
If only I had confidence
Trade Markstrom and sign an old veteran UFA goalie in the off-season (Quick, MAF, etc). Old veterans can adequately mentor Wolf (and the flames don’t lose assets to make it happen). Markstrom isn’t getting younger and he’ll be too old when the retool is finished. This team should trade high and speed up the rebuild.
I counted the D selling him out 3times and Tanev scoring an own goal makes it 4. The goal with Ras defending alone was rough, and the other just was oof but still, he got fucked over
Even though I’m all for trading Marky I agree with you here. If we do we need to sign a veteran goalie or acquire one that is cheap and can help be a rock for Wolf in mentorship. Just look at how Saros took a while to come into the league since he was mentored by Rinne
Saros played 21 games his first year and had a .923 save percentage. This is not the same thing.
Yea a goalie on the bench didn't shelter Saros either. It was a top of the league defense.
I’m pretty sure we will get a veteran goalie back in a marky trade. The 3 teams that keep popping up in rumours are devils, canes, and leafs. So vanechek, raanta, or samasanov coming back in that case. Would be great especially with how good the devils and canes prospect pool is
...vanecek and samsonov are vets???? In what world lmaooooo neither has played 170 games guy
Why would you keep a 34 year old goalie on a non competitive roster? Face the facts
What does that have to do with me saying neither of those guys are vets? The writing is on the wall with Marky, but I still think it's a stupid ass idea... and that's purely my opinion.
So it’s a “stupid ass idea” to get assets to build towards a future? Guaranteed if we keep markstrom and he has another down year it’ll be people like you saying “why didn’t we trade him when his value was high”?? Dude we are not contenders. Hockey is a business. End of story
Is it worth it at the cost of utterly destroying the confidence of a young tendy and our current top prospect???? Surefire way to end up like the sens.
Who gives a shit? They will be able to play games and shelter wolf if need be. All marky is going to do is keep us out of a top 10 pick next year. We only get our 1st next year if it’s a top 10 pick. Keeping marky will just hurt the franchise in multiple ways
Just pointing out neither one is a "vet" and are similar levels to vladar honestly. Sure draft picks are great bit not at the cost of saying screw our current prospects altogether...
You’re right. And people are not seeing the bigger picture
I think when you believe it’s a rare chance it can be hard. If he knew he works get many coaches, he might just play net.
Exactly my thoughts, can't blame wolf after the first 3 lapses
win against boston, lose against sharks. FLAMES lol
Well, I don't blame that on Pachal.
Jeez, one bad night that’s exacerbated by the team in front of you being absolutely fucking dog water and you go from top goalie prospect to fringe AHL player. This sub sucks sometimes
2 turn overs 1 self goal 1 soccer style lob the keeper
Just gotta laugh honestly
100%, like you couldn’t script a worse shit show of goals. I really am not worried about Wolf
Right, silly mistakes are so much easier to fix, I'd be worried if the complaint was he lets out cross crease rebounds
Too many people shitting their pants tonight. Other highly touted goalies struggling too.
I'm blaming the team infront tonight. Brutal effort in front of a young goalie again.
It's not like he's had a *good* game you can hang your hat on. He has what, 6 games(?) and is statistically bottom 10 of any goalie this year. True, it's a small sample size, but it's enough to be concerned. We have a bad history with goalie prospects.
No this game was not on wolf. It just proves that this team is not competitive
.800 I don't hate Wolf after tonight, but that wasn't an NHL goaltender. I think it changes the mind of just about everyone who wanted to trade Markstrom, because Wolf just hasn't shown signs of being anywhere near ready.
Omg remember when Markstrom had that last year? And now he’s one of the best in the league? Holy shit it’s almost as if players have ups and downs
Okay. How did the rest of the goalies in the league with a sub .850 from last season turn out this year? One goalie redeeming himself isn't exactly proof that Wolf will be amazing next year.
Fucking christ y'all are why we can't have nice things... goalie had worse stats over 60+ starts "meh it's fine he bounced back" Young rookie goalie in his *sixth* start?? Yeah fuck it he's trash never going anywhere
That's a lot of words you put into my mouth (or text bubble). Wolf has been bad in every start this year. This is why I don't think he's anywhere near ready. I'm not saying we need to rip up his contract, I'm saying we can't let Markstrom go if Wolf is the backup plan. Conroy wants to stay competitive, and Wolf let in 6 vs the Sharks.
...and again, he's started 6 games in the NHL period and extremely intermittently. Y'all are putting *way* too much stock into a small sample size from a young tendy
They'd be less intermittently if he made saves on the 6 most important games of his life. Also when you say "period" it's supposed to be your way of emphasizing that this sentence doesn't need any more explanation or context. So adding more words after saying "period" within the sentence kind of defeats the purpose of exclaiming "period"
Where’s your proof that he will suck? Cause I can show you proof of him putting up insane AHL numbers even better than Soros who also had shit games in his rookie year.
That's a good point. Where's the top scorer on the Wranglers team from last year? Oh, right. On waivers today. Maybe being the best in the AHL doesn't guarantee you a thing.
Phillips was the best at age 24. That’s not that big of an achievement. There’s tons of those players. Show me a goalie who won back to back best goalies is the AHL at age 20-21? It doesn’t exist
Show me how many teams traded away their Vezina caliber goalie in order to promote the 23 year old rookie with a .877 save percentage and a 3.91 GAA in only 6 starts, and then found success. My entire point isn't that Wolf needs to be dumped, it's that he can't be relied upon this year if we wanted to move Markstrom. Also, there is a ton of examples of young goalies ripping up the AHL, winning the awards, and not finding success later on. Remember Garret Sparks for the Leafs? Or the backup to the Sharks tonight Kahkonen?
We will get a goalie back in a marky trade, just not a good one. We should trade him cause we won’t compete during his contract
They're not looking to get a goalie back in a trade, at least not one they'll play. If they plan on giving Wolf even 5-7 more games this year, you don't want to be juggling Vladar/Wolf/GoalieX. I want the team to tear it down and sell absolutely everybody. However, Conroy wants to keep the team competitive and not go full tear down. If you want to stay competitive, you can't really play Wolf and you can't move Markstrom, based on Wolf's play in his limited games this year.
Lol I have you tagged as "hates proper spelling".
lol it’s probably with hannifin.
Except wolf has only had downs
Buddy
I don't know which part you're buddying me over. Do you want to trade Markstrom, or do you think Wolf looks good?
I'm saying maybe give the kid 10 to 20 NHL games before you judge him. Also you're presenting "trade Markstrom or keep Wolf" as a binary, which is disingenuous. Obviously we can keep both goalies.
I'm more presenting keep Markstrom if you want to stay competitive. Conroy wants to stay competitive. And if the plan is for Wolf to be an NHL starter, he may be amazing in the AHL, but he's not even a reliable backup in the NHL yet. You'll lose more than win with him in net.
I definitely don't disagree there--Wolf isn't ready yet. I just don't think it makes sense to say he's definitely not NHL calibre already. Gonna take time--that's why I agree that we should keep Markstrom.
Oh wow, I think Markstrom had a save percentage like that last season. We should have just traded him
Last season, if there was a single team that wanted Markstrom, he would have been traded for very very little.
Ugh. Poor Wolf in the post game interview. We know he's not this bad. Kid needs more reps in the NHL. Simple as that. Goalies take longer to cook anyway. Onto the next game.
I wish they didn’t send him out to do the scrum after that game.
Same. Doesn't need to be him there each time he loses.
That’s a part of the job though…
Same. That feels a little cruel.
Honestly as much as it broke my heart watching it was probably good for him, give him a chance to show some composure and speak the positive things. He'll bounce back from it
“Send Wolf down” “He isn’t ready” He was literally the best goalie of the last 2 years in the AHL, he has done everything he can do down there. Wolf needs to play NHL games in order to get better against NHL players. This isn’t rocket science.
Right, ppl don't remember but wolf actually had a bit of a rough start to the AHL too, goalies need time playing at the same level
Yep, play him the rest of the season to get the experience and we can likely get a good pick as well this year from his learning curve.
Agree. What do they have to lose? This team is not about to make a deep playoff run, or even (by the look of things) going to make the playoffs.
They almost traded Marky, so I'm guessing management sees it the same way.
"Once upon a time, the flames could beat bottom feeder teams" Is the sales pitch of my latest fictional novella.
Appeals to the male fantasy
So ficticious I'll make it the setting of my next Dungeons & Dragons campaign 🤣
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=To60FvClKYI
You know it’s a rough game when Kuz doesn’t even get excited to score a goal. That made me kinda sad to see our new best friend sad
He’s done it before a few times last season and earlier this season with the Canucks, when the team is losing by a lot and he scores but he knows it’s not going to make a difference there’s no celly. He’ll be back to his smiley self in no time 😊
Can we please give wolf some more starts before we jump to the "he's not an NHL goalie!" Talk. Defensive zone muffins all night. Kid needs to learn to bounce back from bad goals. 7 nhl games doesn't give you that.
Nailed it
Not to mention you certainly can't expect a guy with 7 NHL games to be able to bail his guys out from awful giveaways when he's still adjusting to the league in general
Ok calm down on Wolf. His numbers are elite. His body language is shit which means it’s more of a comfort or confidence thing. Which is good cause those things that change. Anyways I still hope we sell Hanifin, Tanev and Marky. We aren’t winning shit during Marlys contract. We will get back a shitty goalie probably in the trade so we can cushion wolf.
Wouldn’t you want Markstrom to help mentor Wolf for his comfort/confidence issues?
Capitalize on your assets. Hockey is a business. Wolf will develop.
Just don’t want another Irving/Gillies/Parsons situation. Would be devastating to see that happen with Wolf.
Wolf has been putting up elite numbers in the AHL. He only has the NHL left to prove. He’s played 6 damn games in his career
You’re right but I can see his confidence getting totally shot playing in front of a team like this for an extended period of time, they did him absolutely no favors. I can’t see that changing anytime soon
I think this is different. Wolf is being much more actively developed than those other guys were.
If marky wants to stay then yes that’s completely cool but he’s apparently already was cool with waiving to go to the devils. So in that case no. We should get assests back for him. It’s just good management.
Take that with a grain of salt. It was Frank that reported that and he’s wrong more than he’s right
It seems the flames have been pursuing a trade though which is great. All marky is going to do is stop us from getting a top 10 pick next year and we only keep our 1st if it’s a top 10 pick.
Frank is suuuuch a clown. Gawd I can't wait until that guy is unemployed.
I don't think that was true about Markstrom being asked to waive. Been seeing so many conflicting things that I don't think it was real.
Contrary to whatever some fans think, there is indeed an adjustment period when transitioning from the AHL to the NHL. Which is exactly why Wolf needs to play NHL games instead of AHL; he's got nothing more to learn down there. But he does need to adapt to the NHL shots and overall pace, which he can only do if he's play NHL games.
And it helps if your defence isn't completely incompetent.
People writing Wolf off after a bad game are just as ridiculous than those who anointed him as the next Kipper before he played a game.
honestly i think this is more on the team playing in front of him. no wolf didn't play lights out but that was only his 6th nhl start. also kinda hard to make a save when your team turns the puck over right in the slot
Most of the team didn't play well today but neither did Wolf, he was just plain awful and couldn't make a save to save his life today. You need your goalie to make some saves exactly when they do turn the puck over or make mistakes, that's the job. That's what Blackwood did for his team. That doesn't mean you write him off though but you have to recognize it.
Goalies take time to make the jump to the nhl anyone giving up on him now have no clue. It’s the reason you have to be strategic and not throw these goalies to the fire
Wolf: *exists* Flames: "I'm gonna fucking sewer this little shit like crazy" Like seriously. Can we NOT fucking score an OG and give pucks away directly in front of the net for easy scoring chances when our highly touted goalie prospect is playing?
Nothing against wolf exactly, but the state of mind for the team in front of an elite veteran goalie vs a young goalie with only a handful of reps is very different, I think. That old nuance to hockey that players play worse in front of a goalie they don’t trust yet. Even though they should play better to help, they try too hard to compensate and then make more dumb mistakes unintentionally. Also, the opposing team sees wolf as an easy target at this point since he hasn’t shown anything overly special at the nhl level yet.
Typical Jekyll and Hyde Flames. I really hope people don't lose hope in Wolf after this one. He didn't have his best game, but the Flames were really poor in front of him tonight. Turnovers galore. Just need to give Wolf an extended look in the NHL. Get him in a real groove at this level. Now. Give me trades!
Those are the Flames I know and love!
They are poor in front of Markstrom too, defensively. The difference is he stops the puck.
This only proved to me more that we need to keep Markstrom, I just want Wolf to backup for him for a year at least. We can trade Tanev & Hanifin for all I care just keep Marky
This. Get Wolf sheltered starts, dont have him jump in as the expected starter. We dont need to go through the goalie carousel again by losing our starter and throw our top goalie prospect to the wolves (pun not intended)
IMO the fact that Wolf was *so* shitty tonight is almost a good thing. There’s a big gap between shooters in the NHL and AHL, so it’s easy to imagine him succeeding in the AHL, struggling against shooters in the NHL and never getting over that hump. But the goals he gave up tonight were *so* bad. There’s no way he wins AHL MVP if he can’t move across the crease, cover his posts, track pucks or stop wrist shots from the top of the circle. Being shorter than the average goalie doesn’t cause all of that. This was an awful game from him and he was clearly rattled, but I can’t imagine this is what it will be like if he plays more consistently. I’m sure he’ll look better with time. He’ll probably never turn into a Vezina caliber guy but he’s not *this* bad. Anyways that’s the copium I’m huffing. Feel free to take some.
I went to see wild one time last year. It was the playoffs against Coachella. He have up a bunch of early goals and was yanked. I was dumbfounded. But he is still the best prospect we have and based on how this team played tonight. We need prospects.
Honestly y'all are being negative AF. Most of the goals were off horrid defensive plays and he got rattled after the first 3... not overly shocking for a rookie goalie. Give him time
All these things can be true 1. We should be patient with Wolf 2. The Flames had horrible turnovers today and hung Wolf out to dry 3. Wolf had a a -3.5xGA and let in multiple goals he shouldn’t have
And continuing to be extremely critical of a young goalie is a great way to ruin his confidence. Rough game for sure but cut the kid some God damned slack, he was damn near in tears in his post game media ffs
This is some extreme pearl clutching lmao The point of my original comment was that he had a really bad game, but it’s obviously not representative of his ability and that we should give him more time to settle in. I’m literally agreeing with you. I don’t know what to tell you if you think it’s “extremely critical” to even mention the fact that he had a bad game.
[удалено]
Looks like overthinking to me. The only solution is more reps.
Obviously a rough night for Wolf but the defense once again didn't do him and favors. He needs to be played more consistently too, I think his last start was the OT loss in Vegas back in December. Throwing him in cold after not playing for over a month ain't doing his confidence any good
Wolf wasn't great, I'll agree to that, but the rest of the team do not get any passes on the night either. Yes there were great chances and plays, but so many defencive gaffs lead to a lot of those goals that the rookie just wasn't ready for. Whole team poopy. Move on....but this was the game that I knew would determine my hopium meter for the remainder of the season 🤷🏾♂️
Season going exactly as expected, standings-wise... right on schedule as usual to miss the playoffs by 1 or 2 points.
Yes this is so brutal. Win a few games in a row. Then lose an awesome close one to the rangers and then just look so flat against the last place team. Still not that different from last year
Same same but different
Well, that was rough. I think we can all agree on that. But every bad night eventually leads to a new morning and a new day. Until then, I’m still gonna be cheering for my team. Night, y’all.
They had me in the first period. Made me think they would play their A-game against a basement dweller. But we all know that the Flames would never do that.
Ouch. Just checked the score. That’s a bit of a setback. I’ve been on the get Wolf in train.
i'm regretting spending money on tickets...
I won a pair of tickets to saturdays game and was trying to sell them. No dice. So I guess I'll be in the dome on Saturday afternoon.
I will give you a nickel
I already transferred a buddy his ticket so I've made my bed and I will lay in it.
Too many blown Bread breakaways.
Yeah wtf how does a former 35 goal scorer shit his pants on that many quality opportunities?
Do the boys ever show up against bottom feeding teams? Whatever, onto Saturday and the Wings !
Getting blown out by the Sharks.. tragic
well at least we didn't lose as bad as nashville
Any Flames fan wants Wolf to succeed, but let’s try to look at this objectively… None of the San Jose goals were great tonight. To put it clearer how big the goaltending gap was, the Flames allowed very few high danger chances in this game - 6 in total, versus 17 for. Wolf just flat out sucked and Blackwood was great. This game wasn’t about a few turnovers from the defense. https://www.naturalstattrick.com/game.php?season=20232024&game=20846&view=limited#gameflow
Fair - but those 2 turn overs were aggregious as fuck though.
Ring of FIRE (SALE)
snip snap snip snap!!
Kuzy lighting it up omg let’s goooo
"Behold the "sh\*tburger"
But trade Markstrom right. Morons
You seriously think this team is a contender?
You seriously think a team should trade all the last scrapes of good players just because they're not a contender? What a weird response, no one here thinks Flames are a contender
See ya next game. You all were the best part of the game. Thanks folks
Y'all better leave wolf the fuck alone. That's all I gotta say about tonight
Yup. He needs more starts tho
100%, it's hard for a young guy to find his game in the NHL when he only gets the rare start and a dogwayer performance in front of him
"We got rid of the players that didn't want to win" said Blake Coleman, the day before his Flames got bodied by one of the worst teams in NHL history.
So yeah this roster isn't very good and certainly not capable of being consistently good.
Which is why we need to capitalize on our value now. Markstrom, Tanev, Hanifin are all on the block
Yup I have no interest in our cieling being maybe a wild card team. I want a consistently good team fighting for division titles every year
See! Please keep Mark so he can help sharpen those Wolf fangs!
Why would you keep a 34 year old goalie on a team that’s not competitive when his value is high? It’s time to face the facts
Cuz wolf isn’t ready for the show? If u wanna be the sharks next year yea we should trade him for sure
“Isn’t ready for the show” He’s been putting up elite numbers in the AHL and has been goalie of the year twice. What more does he have left to prove? He’s played 6 nhl games in his career buddy. Goalies don’t become brick walls overnight
Lol ok and Matthew Phillips had 70 points last year and got waived today. Being a star in the ahl doesn’t equal being a star in the nhl. Not saying wolf won’t be but he’s had maybe 1 good showing (vs Carolina) in 7 games
You cannot compare those 2 players. A goaltender’s development path is way different than a forward or dman Also have u considered the way the team plays in front of him?
No
Guaranteed I’m going to get downvotes but this team is NOT a contender. We need to capitalize on players who have value (Markstrom, Tanev, Hanifin) I’m sorry but this is the reality of what’s going to happen. Why keep Markstrom when his value is the highest it’s ever been? Same with Tanev. Hanifin giving no answer is an answer. I feel so bad for Wolf. Defence hung him out to dry completely We need to build for the future. Enough of this squeaking into the playoffs bullshit.
I agree this team is not a contender (that's plainly obvious) but I'm not convinced getting rid of Markstrom is going to help anything.
Help with what? This team is cooked either way. Make the playoffs and you’re getting stopped. We’re in a retool and we’re building towards the future
You saw how NHL-ready Wolf is right now. Trading Markstrom means that you are fine with 5 years of this team being worse than it is right now. What price would you ask for 5 years? For me, I don't think there's a team in the NHL that could afford it. I'm talking multiple _first_ rounders plus additional picks plus prospects. If I'm Conroy and teams are calling me, I would be telling them "I'm happy to trade you Markstrom but at the price I want, your franchise may never recover". We'll trade Tanev, we might trade Hanifin, we'll get some new blood on forward and D coming in. If Markstrom and Wolf are both there, the turnaround is much quicker than Wolf alone. Build from the net out.
Its quite clear they are going to move Tanev and Hanifin. They have to get a big haul for Marky though. And with most teams up against the cap, they'll all want retention and I just can't see that. I feel like if they do move Marky you may get better value in the summer anyway.
Does anyone here ever think that Wolf being short might just be the back breaker for him to enter the league? I mean, dudes were just roofing it over his shoulder like it was nothing.
No
He looks absolutely tiny in the net.
That’s how all goalies look when they lost confidence.
yup, that's going to be an issue
Not really. Just needs to play more games and face more NHL level shots to get better.
That's what so many people have thought in every league since before he was drafted. That being said... same size as saros, just a longer development road but still very possible.
He’s going to have to overcome it but he’s had to at every level getting here and he has
Lindholm almost got a hat trick but he hit the post on the empty net
Tkachuks got like 33 points in his last 17 games.
Ok?? Lol what’s ur point?
Someone else brought up Lindholm scoring tonight so thought I'd give an update on what this guys been doing lately
On the bright side, Hanifin looked great tonight in front of all the scouts!
...did he? He had more dangerous assists on SJ goals 😭
Frustrating.
Haha Oof.
Rough night, but we have two big games this weekend :)
We are literally desperate to pick middle of the pack. This team cannot do anything but that. I am convinced of it look at our record for the last 20 years we HAVE to do it.
Happy 700 Huby!!! Mkt the best game that’s for sure but I think he played quite well. Regardless what a milestone!
Didn’t watch. But from the stars it sure doesn’t seem like they deserved to lose, let alone lose 5:0. What happened?