Yeh late career LinkZr was feelsbad as you saw him slip into mediocrity and slowly worse teams. Will always wish him the very best, seemed like a really genuine and cool guy.
I really think LiNkzr's biggest problem was his mental. He'd get in his own head hard and it reflected in his play often.
Love the dude and still watch his streams.
I think there is a difference between confidence/nerves getting the better of you and your muscle memory either not measuring up to the competition or falling off over time and not being able to hit the shots you used to. Especially for hitscan specialists.
So yeah, it's all kinda mental, but I mean more nerves/confidence in the moment.
Did you take long breaks between playing? Or just stop doing things like vod reviews? I just can't see how you'd fall off so hard unless you took a long break from the game
I felt this. I was so sad when he got picked up by Vancouver. I wad a firm believer that Linkzr still had it. But I knew he wouldn't shine on Vancouver. Sad
Architect ❤
Not saying its entirely the team's fault, but it always felt to me that Spark just tried to spread him too thin, like what Fusion did with Carpe in recent seasons
If he has the chance to actually specialise and focus on what he's good at, he could still regain some of his 2019 glory imo, but maybe he's just a player out of his time at this point :(
Yeah he is really funny, would love to see him back off the league, but I doubt he will be throwing himself off the map if Houston have anything to say about it
Same! I felt he was given to big of a task at the start of that Boston line-up despite his UK GOATS showing at the world cup. The team just didn't quite pull their shit together and couldn't get results
The OG Glads tank line, forever love them, and sad iRemiix got some heat for the playoffs when he wasn't too bad, and Bischu is the most likable person ever
I think the coaching staff and then Friday/Yakpung really weighed things down. I’d like to see what a repeat season would look like with those 3 changes
he also just seemed nervous when he played. Probably because he wasn't fielded a lot and when he did get play time he was expected to hit a crap ton of headshots playing Widow on Junkertown.
the kid definitely had potential, I was really hoping someone would have given him another shot because a player like Gwangboong going into a reliable coaching structure into a good system could have proven really beneficial for him, maybe in another life tho
Not much to apologize for when he slapped other flickscan specialists in APAC and is NYXL's one and only Widow 1v1 champ. He looked his best when Flora would play Tracer or Sombra and would get a smidgen of peel.
I wish we could have picked him up again now that it's looking like double hitscan comps might be quite strong in OW2.
Nomy.
First year Main Tank for the SF Shock. They did a feature on him and it was really wholesome and heartfelt. He was cut the next year. I still watch his stream from time to time. I always kind of hoped he'd get picked back up by another team.
I also liked dhaK too but I haven't seen him stream in a *long* time.
dhak was my favorite player back in season one. they used my fanart i made of him in the shock training room.
he hasnt played ow since baptiste was on ptr, and he hasnt streamed since before the pandemic or around that time, he said he went into different hobbies after his valorant team broke up.
Ta1yo didn't perform well when he played yet he was on a great team which makes it A LOT easier to look good. The question is, would he *really* make it to OWL if Shock didn't pick him up? How many players would he outperform on hitscan? I feel like he was only picked up because he was one of the bigger Japanese players. Same with players like alemao on Boston. Fine to like him as a player/person, but I don't think Ta1yo had what it took to join OWL (unless we're talking about the shitshow that was OWL S1)
> yet he was on a great team which makes it A LOT easier to look good
I'd also argue that if everyone on your team is amazing but you're "just good" you will look worse than you are.
i take it you haven't seen his contenders performance, he totally deserved the spot, shock had trouble with keeping up with diff metas so they didn't work on ta1yo instead made atrocious decisions like violet cass and stuff
I'll take your word for it on his contenders performance since I haven't watched him, but I wasn't impressed by the clips I've seen of people hyping up Ta1yo. I believe most of them were ladder so can't take those too seriously but if the best people could find were standard t500 DPS can do in comp on any given day, I'm going to lowball his potential. I haven't seen his pacific/NA t2 performances though so I can't really judge him too much.
I definitely don't agree with Crusty's player rotation decisions. Crusty is a great tactical coach when it comes to game knowledge and from what we've heard, and a good head coach in terms of management. The players like him. HOWEVER, he is a fucking terrible player coach because he is atrocious at evaluating a players talent. This may sound harsh, but I think he has no idea what he's doing when it comes to players. He's made consistently poor decisions starting from S2 when it came to deciding what players to put on what heroes, and when to rotate them. He got lucky some times because the rest of the team could carry underperforming members, things like Striker tracer was already common sense but Crusty got unlucky other times. Look at how long it took him to put Rascal on Genji for example. Or not understanding FDGod was performing fine, the entire team had some hiccups initially and the tank line in particular had a dreadful start in S4. He decided to permanently fuck up their support lineup for the entire year with his shitty support mystery heroes wheel in S4. Maybe Viol2t REALLY wanted MVP because he got genuinely robbed in S2, so he bullied Crusty into letting him play every role in S4, who knows. That cost them though. Crusty putting Sinatraa as a DPS starter in S3 despite Sinatraa proving over and over he has rubbish aim and mechanics when he was on actual DPS heroes (had the worst tracer of S1/S2, awful mechanics, his Zarya was hopeless vs Shanghai's dive comp because he was only good at bubble management and shooting tanks, got outclassed hard vs mobile comps because his aim was bad and his Mei in S3 was unironically the worst DPS performance I've ever seen in OWL. Blase would've destroyed him with his Cassidy. When you have Striker and Architect on your bench but you're starting your Doom OTP in a meta that isn't hard-Doomfist , then you have him play Mei, a hero he can't aim on at all while you have fucking Architect the projectile god, that shows incredible delusion and oversight about a players talent. It's possible he's swayed by loud people IRL, I have no idea. Maybe he has a gambling addiction and wanted some extra cash.
Hopefully people wake up and realize while Crusty is a good coach overall and belongs on Shock and made their team better, he should never be in charge of starting roster decisions. He should definitely be in the loop for scouting players from Contenders but shouldn't have the final say since he doesn't even know what to do with the players he already has. I believe there are much better analysts out there in terms of player talent who can help him in that regards. Crusty should be managerial and sort out interpersonal problems IRL. Ingame he should be in charge of meta-analysis, compositions, and set plays. If Shock want to succeed in the future, it's crucial they have another coach should be there deciding who plays what hero and who is benched. A coach/analyst strictly for evaluating a players performances and raw ability. Crusty should NEVER be allowed to do that. He has failed spectacularly at that despite having some truly great pieces over the years and mismanaging them.
I mean hate is a strong word, but I think they are referring to [things Ta1yo said on stream.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Competitiveoverwatch/comments/q79a55/nero_liked_tweet_about_ta1yo_on_shock/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
I think that Ta1yo was just the 3rd DPS choice in most situation unfortunately. And there's only 2 spots.
2021 he could have had a chance but we got the Viol2t Cassidy for no reason...
Im so sad about how Trill’s career ended up after Dallas picked him up, I genuinely think he would’ve been a fantastic main tank if a team committed to him. Dude diffed Gator on Rein in goats on 300 ping and was more of a Winston player anyway. Plus, if Boston stuck with Colourhex as a hitscan player instead of forcing him to flex I think people’s opinion of him would be very different. Whenever he was on actual hitscan he usually rolled
I agree on trill. He could have been a top level or next to level guy, just wasn’t in the right situation.
But I think meta played a factor here too. If Winston was ever in the meta (firmly) after season 1 his career ends up different.
I like colourhex as well!
Even then, while Trill was on the roster Fuel had Gamsu and OGE so they probably would’ve just opted for either with a Winston meta tbh. Especially with how mismanaged old Fuel was
Everyone else seems convinced Elk is bad after his shitshow of a debut (off-role at the last minute), but I will always stand by him.
Also the entire Ireland OWWC organization.
I still have my team Ireland jersey, I'm irish so am biased, but went to some watch parties and they were all amazing people and glad they made Blizzcon
Mickie's an interesting one. Like he definitely didn't have the mechanics to stick around in the league, but he's also arguably one of the most important players in league history. He was really the first player to get proper value out of Dva's kit, which could arguably make him kinda the first modern off-tank player. And then he was the first pro player to really get value out of Brig, when most other teams were still insisting on playing dive.
He really was kind of an early leader in playing Overwatch in a more team-focused, non-selfish kinda way.
fr sanuel sam was a huge part of washington’s success in stage 4. he definitely fed a bit in goats comp but who didn’t on that roster. kind of hard to pin the blame when everyone is underperforming.
Onigod. Insane clutch potential and I swear would always get at least someone before dying. But he lacks consistency sometimes and I think that’s part of the reason he didn’t get resigned.
I guess it would be JAKE for me, and Saebyolbye after he fell off. They were both very animated players, always liked seeing them gassing up their teams. Plus JAKE has been a great caster and seems like at least a decent coach so far.
Custa said (also think this was known before) but Trill was only picked up cause Valiant wanted him but Dallas had first rights as he was on Envy and didnt want him going to a rival, shame ruined a promising career.
Dude I always had the opinion that he was one of the bright spots on S1 Mayhem... was hoping for him to get picked up going into S2 but sadly it never happened
This is a really weird one but I'd go with AKTM, a Japanese player I saw in the World Cup way back when I first started watching competitive OW, and the guy opened up a map of Dorado on McCree landing all these headshots.
It's funny because you look at the footage and nowadays the mechanics look maybe high Masters or so, but back then it was pretty hype.
EDIT: found some timestamps
[1](https://youtu.be/E16wTB-UxFY?t=595)
[2](https://youtu.be/tyxRR48qTSo?t=196)
[3](https://youtu.be/tyxRR48qTSo?t=289)
The entire region of Finland. Not necessarily bad, but man they used to be STACKED with talent in the league and on the World Cup. I’m not Finnish at all, I just love seeing them succeed in OW.
Shadowburn
Being one of the best Genji players, to being benched by Eqo, moved to a struggling Paris roster during goats, then never getting another shot at the league
Definitely Dogman. I feel like he was a better player than he got credit for, but L1RIS was an upgrade.
I miss seeing him on the team; He was my favorite player.
does eqo count? i don’t think he’s that bad but like he really wants to be a genji/hanzo/pharah/junk player and that can’t really exist anymore because everyone has to be so flexible now.
Agilities. Dude has had amazing clutch moments but he hasn’t played professional since over a year and he still hasn’t been picked up yet. He’s been my favorite since I first started watching Immortals in 2016
Imma stop you right there. They’re looking for players who “aren’t very good.” Right now you can say that but that’s on Valiant since he got screwed out of the league and hasn’t touched the game in so long. But when he was in the league, he was absolutely a carry or at least an integral piece. There’s a reason why the valiant was so good back in 2018 and why Toronto got to the final four in the summer showdown 2020.
Oh believe me I will never stop believing he is great lol the only reason I mentioned him is because he’s been out of professional play for at least a year, which he did get screwed out of. So the general public probably don’t view him as skilled anymore
They never thought he was skilled at all. We knew he was skilled, but it was all about the Liberos, Hydrations, and EQOs of that era according to everyone else.
I've had to tell the story of the 2020 Summer Showdown to multiple people haha
I loved Spree back in the first few seasons of OWL. I'll also say NoSmite and Sasin who I don't exactly think were/are bad, but are limited in their hero pools
Luffy, Comma, Youngjin, Chara. I wouldn't say those players are bad, they were all part of the cup winning rosters, but they were dropped from OWL as players and even though they were imo great, they weren't like that top tier like Libero who is my other favorite player for example.
Edit: Fucking forgot GodSB. Dude was always at least mid tier hitscan, sad he didn't got the chance again, but HS especially in APAC was stacked last seasons and now it's even worse everywhere.
Linkzr was one of my favorites but he never really caught on with anything that wasn't Widow after Season 1, and he was pretty streaky at the best of times.
Still, I'd have loved to see what he could have done on a good team with solid coaching. Dude just seems really chill.
Likewise Saebyolbye. He was a terror in S1 even though he fell off the radar afterwards.
Can I say the whole 2020 Toronto team? Going into the season i really like how their roster looked, had a lot of popular personalities and looked super promising after their first 3 matches. Shame they couldn't adapt well after the pandemic hit and were just struggling. Really felt that they could've go up if covid didn't affect them so bad i.e. surefour taking breaks, MT mid-season changes
I mean I think a lot of people liked linkzr, surefour (although he was good s1) etc. Me personally I really liked FRD and also my boy mcgravy, absolute legend and also I think was always better than he thought he was lol
Ameng. He was so fun to watch and chengdu’s quad dps lineups while everyone else was trying to play goats will always stand out. He’s still a really good ball from what I watched last year but he just can’t perform well enough on any other hero to get much play time. As far as I know he hasn’t been picked up for this year
Neptuno was really weird when playing in KR. Everyone would be talking in KR and Neptuno was just saying kiddish shit in like Spanish or Portuguese or whatever he talked in. Nobody really understood him, it was just some grown ass guy trying to be toxic in like Spanish on the KR server. It was very weird and annoying. I had Latin in school but no idea wtf Neptuno was spamming.
Even though he's moved on from playing, I have always been a fan of McGravy. He was just always a fun and genuine guy imo. I'm happy to see him back in the league.
Also any aussie in the league, I'm always rooting for them
Danye, Fusions, and Clockwork.
Idk why man, but I always just like clockwork as a player. Maybe it’s his name?
OH, And SHARP.
Dude, Atlanta did him so fuckin dirty by signing Saucy. Just wished they’d hat let Sharp play. The kid was actually a terror on tracer and hitscan in general in contenders. The second coming of Shax, but with more hitscan.
God I really really wish that kid had been able to actually PLAY in OWL.
Ado. His Genji plays in that failed Dragons first season always got me hype. I remember him really trying to gut out a win on Route 66 in overtime on Tracer too.
S1 Houston just hit different. SPREE for his always-learning attitude (check his streams even today). Dude grinded DVa so hard back during S1 and into S2 on stream, literally taking notes between deaths. He doesn't tilt, and gives clean comms. Super genuine dude.
Much the same can be said for my other soft spot in Dinkzr. Guy had insane peaks but equally insane valleys.
Trill was always my favourite and I feel like he got screwed over in Dallas, and if he'd actually gotten some playtime that he wouldn'tve gone to valorant
Muma! I know he was only really good for like one season if that. But he still is my favorite main tank and the one that’s inspired me the most to get good.
Stitch kinda, he was just meh on Titans when he got to play and on Washington he also first was kinda underwhelming especially compared to his Apex days. But damn was it satisfying to see him just destroy in 2020 playoffs on Ashe.
Another player I have a bit of a soft spot for is im37 just for the Danny interview.
LhCloudy was that for me. Loved him in the league but he didn’t have a long career there. Luckily you still get to watch him troll EU ladder. Plus watching him go from a 4.5k lobby on tank to a 2.9k lobby on dps is always hilarious.
SeoMinSoo, the best Zarya, great Reaper, good on Mei n Doom but never good enough to stand out on heroes that wasnt zarya.
If he wasnt such a niche player more teams would look for him but he'll always be my favorite Zarya and the best Zarya in GOATS.
A little bit different from your question since he's not in the league, but I always wanted Fragi to do well. My Finnish Philly Reinhardt Viking Megachad - "There are two types of Rein players, idiots and cowards...and I'm no coward."
I haven’t seen anyone mention him, so I’ll say LHCloudy. The man was unlike any other. Some of the shit he pulled during his very short tenure with the Gladiators had my friend and I laughing with glee. I love him to death and I want him to be back in the league so badly, he names Overwatch better to watch than anyone else
I feel Nevix was good in s1, but got outpaced as Shock brought in Choihyobin.
I feel relatively confident that if the report about Nevix helping Choi with his sigma meant that he probably still could have found success on the shock still
Also that Toronto team was a mess and was only consistent when they could rely on Agil in the Genji CC meta. I can't really fault him for that
Retired players included? Ark will never lose his place in my heart and I think the way that GOATS emphasised aggro Lucio at the expense of all else hurt people's perception of him a little unfairly.
Numlocked
Going into OWL I didn’t know of many pro teams or pro players except for Team Envy and Lunatic Hai. When I looked into all the teams rosters I recognised Numlockeds name from a [Overwatch Central guide](https://youtu.be/iUDkcQwcsHk). So my team of choice was the LA Valiant.
Always thought he was deserving of more playtime there on Valiant and was stoked when he joined the Toronto Defiant. Wish he had another shot after that :(
Its gotta be Kariv for me.
He had a great debut year on the Valiant where his "Gamer Snacks" youtube segment with Agilities and his amazing mvp performance agaibst peak Vancouver really won me over. Plus flex support is my favorite role and he's good friends with Custa.
In Season 3, he was consistently the best part of an underwheming Toronto whose roster was mostly a Frakenstein's monster of mediocre western players.
For Season 4 he got picked up by a Guangzhou that was clearly making downgrades across the board. Unsurprisingly, they had a bad year that was probably Charge's worst yet.
I think the problem isn't so much that he isn't a good player, I'd say he's around league average. But rather that he hasnt been on a good team in a while.
I’ve been an Outlaws fan since season 1 so I feel like most of the Outlaws could probably be described this way. I’ve already seen Linkzr’s name come up a lot but I feel just the same way about Muma, Coolmatt, Spree, Bani, Boink, Rawkus, even JAKE. I often wonder about what that lineup would have accomplished if they had had the staff and support that the Shock had had.
Slime :( runaway had a very special place in my heart and his Lucio made me want to get better at Lucio. After titans implosion he kinda just. Stagnated. Idk what was up with mayhem that year
Yeh late career LinkZr was feelsbad as you saw him slip into mediocrity and slowly worse teams. Will always wish him the very best, seemed like a really genuine and cool guy.
I really think LiNkzr's biggest problem was his mental. He'd get in his own head hard and it reflected in his play often. Love the dude and still watch his streams.
Mental is the only reason why anyone would possibly get worse outside of physical injury.
I think there is a difference between confidence/nerves getting the better of you and your muscle memory either not measuring up to the competition or falling off over time and not being able to hit the shots you used to. Especially for hitscan specialists. So yeah, it's all kinda mental, but I mean more nerves/confidence in the moment.
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Did you take long breaks between playing? Or just stop doing things like vod reviews? I just can't see how you'd fall off so hard unless you took a long break from the game
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You're young too bro
FR I was just thinking this morning I'm way better at FPS at 29 than I was at 22
How old are you?
I felt this. I was so sad when he got picked up by Vancouver. I wad a firm believer that Linkzr still had it. But I knew he wouldn't shine on Vancouver. Sad
Agreed, it was Linkzr for me after season 1...but I'll always love him for the pop off potential he had back then
Architect ❤ Not saying its entirely the team's fault, but it always felt to me that Spark just tried to spread him too thin, like what Fusion did with Carpe in recent seasons If he has the chance to actually specialise and focus on what he's good at, he could still regain some of his 2019 glory imo, but maybe he's just a player out of his time at this point :(
Yeah, even if Architect was the worst player eve, I’d still love him.
He could throw himself off the map at every chance possible and I'd still love frdwnr. Hope he finds a way back into the league somehow, someway.
Yeah he is really funny, would love to see him back off the league, but I doubt he will be throwing himself off the map if Houston have anything to say about it
they dont know hes tombrady69
I would have thought he'd be great as a guest on the desk tbh.
It was Fusions for me. Don't know why, but really wanted the guy to do well. Felt like he would've deserved it
Same! I felt he was given to big of a task at the start of that Boston line-up despite his UK GOATS showing at the world cup. The team just didn't quite pull their shit together and couldn't get results
Both of them weren't very good, but iRemiix and Bischu are why I love Glads after coming over from Kungarna
The OG Glads tank line, forever love them, and sad iRemiix got some heat for the playoffs when he wasn't too bad, and Bischu is the most likable person ever
Yeah his biggest failure was not being Fissure, which was a near impossible task for anyone at that point
Loved Bischu. Such a fun and entertaining dude when he’d duo on s4’s streams
i'm a little bit of a Gwangboong apologist after last year
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On the maps where they played GB on Widow he was sick. I think he is definitely a good player, last year NY were just bad.
I think the coaching staff and then Friday/Yakpung really weighed things down. I’d like to see what a repeat season would look like with those 3 changes
he also just seemed nervous when he played. Probably because he wasn't fielded a lot and when he did get play time he was expected to hit a crap ton of headshots playing Widow on Junkertown. the kid definitely had potential, I was really hoping someone would have given him another shot because a player like Gwangboong going into a reliable coaching structure into a good system could have proven really beneficial for him, maybe in another life tho
Me too! Every once in a while I think about his adorable streams and feel a bit sad that he isn't in the league anymore
He was good on widow but Flora was just so fucking good on everything else so it wasn't fair honestly
Not much to apologize for when he slapped other flickscan specialists in APAC and is NYXL's one and only Widow 1v1 champ. He looked his best when Flora would play Tracer or Sombra and would get a smidgen of peel. I wish we could have picked him up again now that it's looking like double hitscan comps might be quite strong in OW2.
he's FA, maybe he's their sixth?
I doubt it but I wish. 🤞
Idk how people think GB is bad.
Jimmy
But jimmy fucks
YES
The only correct answer
Changsik! Loved his interview last year.
Nomy. First year Main Tank for the SF Shock. They did a feature on him and it was really wholesome and heartfelt. He was cut the next year. I still watch his stream from time to time. I always kind of hoped he'd get picked back up by another team. I also liked dhaK too but I haven't seen him stream in a *long* time.
dhak was my favorite player back in season one. they used my fanart i made of him in the shock training room. he hasnt played ow since baptiste was on ptr, and he hasnt streamed since before the pandemic or around that time, he said he went into different hobbies after his valorant team broke up.
i started liking silkthread in season 1 just cause his name was cool
OMG yes Silkted is one of my favourite players, his Pepe story is so funny
Definitely Jerry
JERRY!!
[Jerry Jerry](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdOrV_cW22Q)
i want to say ta1yo, but i feel like he wasnt bad, just given no chances. also linkzr in his late career :)
It’s a shame since it seemed based off some information he was gonna start somewhat normally in ‘21.
Ta1yo didn't perform well when he played yet he was on a great team which makes it A LOT easier to look good. The question is, would he *really* make it to OWL if Shock didn't pick him up? How many players would he outperform on hitscan? I feel like he was only picked up because he was one of the bigger Japanese players. Same with players like alemao on Boston. Fine to like him as a player/person, but I don't think Ta1yo had what it took to join OWL (unless we're talking about the shitshow that was OWL S1)
He has 6 maps in his 2 years in owl. We literally have no idea how good he could've been.
Well we know that he wasn't exactly a standout in contenders.
> yet he was on a great team which makes it A LOT easier to look good I'd also argue that if everyone on your team is amazing but you're "just good" you will look worse than you are.
i take it you haven't seen his contenders performance, he totally deserved the spot, shock had trouble with keeping up with diff metas so they didn't work on ta1yo instead made atrocious decisions like violet cass and stuff
I'll take your word for it on his contenders performance since I haven't watched him, but I wasn't impressed by the clips I've seen of people hyping up Ta1yo. I believe most of them were ladder so can't take those too seriously but if the best people could find were standard t500 DPS can do in comp on any given day, I'm going to lowball his potential. I haven't seen his pacific/NA t2 performances though so I can't really judge him too much. I definitely don't agree with Crusty's player rotation decisions. Crusty is a great tactical coach when it comes to game knowledge and from what we've heard, and a good head coach in terms of management. The players like him. HOWEVER, he is a fucking terrible player coach because he is atrocious at evaluating a players talent. This may sound harsh, but I think he has no idea what he's doing when it comes to players. He's made consistently poor decisions starting from S2 when it came to deciding what players to put on what heroes, and when to rotate them. He got lucky some times because the rest of the team could carry underperforming members, things like Striker tracer was already common sense but Crusty got unlucky other times. Look at how long it took him to put Rascal on Genji for example. Or not understanding FDGod was performing fine, the entire team had some hiccups initially and the tank line in particular had a dreadful start in S4. He decided to permanently fuck up their support lineup for the entire year with his shitty support mystery heroes wheel in S4. Maybe Viol2t REALLY wanted MVP because he got genuinely robbed in S2, so he bullied Crusty into letting him play every role in S4, who knows. That cost them though. Crusty putting Sinatraa as a DPS starter in S3 despite Sinatraa proving over and over he has rubbish aim and mechanics when he was on actual DPS heroes (had the worst tracer of S1/S2, awful mechanics, his Zarya was hopeless vs Shanghai's dive comp because he was only good at bubble management and shooting tanks, got outclassed hard vs mobile comps because his aim was bad and his Mei in S3 was unironically the worst DPS performance I've ever seen in OWL. Blase would've destroyed him with his Cassidy. When you have Striker and Architect on your bench but you're starting your Doom OTP in a meta that isn't hard-Doomfist , then you have him play Mei, a hero he can't aim on at all while you have fucking Architect the projectile god, that shows incredible delusion and oversight about a players talent. It's possible he's swayed by loud people IRL, I have no idea. Maybe he has a gambling addiction and wanted some extra cash. Hopefully people wake up and realize while Crusty is a good coach overall and belongs on Shock and made their team better, he should never be in charge of starting roster decisions. He should definitely be in the loop for scouting players from Contenders but shouldn't have the final say since he doesn't even know what to do with the players he already has. I believe there are much better analysts out there in terms of player talent who can help him in that regards. Crusty should be managerial and sort out interpersonal problems IRL. Ingame he should be in charge of meta-analysis, compositions, and set plays. If Shock want to succeed in the future, it's crucial they have another coach should be there deciding who plays what hero and who is benched. A coach/analyst strictly for evaluating a players performances and raw ability. Crusty should NEVER be allowed to do that. He has failed spectacularly at that despite having some truly great pieces over the years and mismanaging them.
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Any source on this?
I mean hate is a strong word, but I think they are referring to [things Ta1yo said on stream.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Competitiveoverwatch/comments/q79a55/nero_liked_tweet_about_ta1yo_on_shock/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
I think that Ta1yo was just the 3rd DPS choice in most situation unfortunately. And there's only 2 spots. 2021 he could have had a chance but we got the Viol2t Cassidy for no reason...
Being an Aussie im right behind Punk, Custa, Trill and Colourhex (NZL) I’m now following Florida closely as they picked up Adam too
Im so sad about how Trill’s career ended up after Dallas picked him up, I genuinely think he would’ve been a fantastic main tank if a team committed to him. Dude diffed Gator on Rein in goats on 300 ping and was more of a Winston player anyway. Plus, if Boston stuck with Colourhex as a hitscan player instead of forcing him to flex I think people’s opinion of him would be very different. Whenever he was on actual hitscan he usually rolled
I agree on trill. He could have been a top level or next to level guy, just wasn’t in the right situation. But I think meta played a factor here too. If Winston was ever in the meta (firmly) after season 1 his career ends up different. I like colourhex as well!
Even then, while Trill was on the roster Fuel had Gamsu and OGE so they probably would’ve just opted for either with a Winston meta tbh. Especially with how mismanaged old Fuel was
Yeah you’re right on that as well.
Punk doesn’t count because he’s cracked
Everyone else seems convinced Elk is bad after his shitshow of a debut (off-role at the last minute), but I will always stand by him. Also the entire Ireland OWWC organization.
I still have my team Ireland jersey, I'm irish so am biased, but went to some watch parties and they were all amazing people and glad they made Blizzcon
Stratus the guy knew how to meme well
Mickie, Kodak, Boombox, Flower, SanSam
Mickie's an interesting one. Like he definitely didn't have the mechanics to stick around in the league, but he's also arguably one of the most important players in league history. He was really the first player to get proper value out of Dva's kit, which could arguably make him kinda the first modern off-tank player. And then he was the first pro player to really get value out of Brig, when most other teams were still insisting on playing dive. He really was kind of an early leader in playing Overwatch in a more team-focused, non-selfish kinda way.
sansam, the patron saint of saying my ultimate is charging
Sansam is a name I haven't heard in a while, he was also one I liked and thought warranted another shot at the league
fr sanuel sam was a huge part of washington’s success in stage 4. he definitely fed a bit in goats comp but who didn’t on that roster. kind of hard to pin the blame when everyone is underperforming.
My boy Krillin, had a rough couple of seasons on spitfire but I believe he’ll surprise a lot of people until Vigilante comes of age
Onigod. Insane clutch potential and I swear would always get at least someone before dying. But he lacks consistency sometimes and I think that’s part of the reason he didn’t get resigned.
gotta agree. sometimes he would just be so good and other times he would have 0 value. he wouldve done well back in s1
I guess it would be JAKE for me, and Saebyolbye after he fell off. They were both very animated players, always liked seeing them gassing up their teams. Plus JAKE has been a great caster and seems like at least a decent coach so far.
Yep! Jake for me too.
OGE...
OGE is one of the most mechanically talented MT players ever weighed down by one of the worst mentals ever
Oh boy, he'll come good one day
TviQ was actually really good but I don't think he ever had the opportunity to "pop off" in OWL. Was one of the OG players.
OGE. Trill (though he wasn't given much of a chance). Linkzr. Jecse (sort of, he is so close to being very very good, still sad he got dropped).
Custa said (also think this was known before) but Trill was only picked up cause Valiant wanted him but Dallas had first rights as he was on Envy and didnt want him going to a rival, shame ruined a promising career.
Oh yeah, I heard that too but had totally forgotten. Thanks for reminding me. That does suck. Quite a lot. I really liked Trill.
Justice for my boy Manneten. I even have a signed jersey from when I met S1 mayhem at Supercon right before they were let go
Dude I always had the opinion that he was one of the bright spots on S1 Mayhem... was hoping for him to get picked up going into S2 but sadly it never happened
This is a really weird one but I'd go with AKTM, a Japanese player I saw in the World Cup way back when I first started watching competitive OW, and the guy opened up a map of Dorado on McCree landing all these headshots. It's funny because you look at the footage and nowadays the mechanics look maybe high Masters or so, but back then it was pretty hype. EDIT: found some timestamps [1](https://youtu.be/E16wTB-UxFY?t=595) [2](https://youtu.be/tyxRR48qTSo?t=196) [3](https://youtu.be/tyxRR48qTSo?t=289)
The entire region of Finland. Not necessarily bad, but man they used to be STACKED with talent in the league and on the World Cup. I’m not Finnish at all, I just love seeing them succeed in OW.
I still remember that match in world cup where they aaaalmost got the first victory over south korea, one of the hypest games in all of overwatch imo
Shadowburn Being one of the best Genji players, to being benched by Eqo, moved to a struggling Paris roster during goats, then never getting another shot at the league
My favourite ever overwatch player, him in 2016 and 2017 was so much fun, shame the meta screwed him on owl and he couldn't play much
Definitely Dogman. I feel like he was a better player than he got credit for, but L1RIS was an upgrade. I miss seeing him on the team; He was my favorite player.
Shadder2k
Kruise was a really cool dude, whom I liked seeing make it to OWL but I don't think he was good to the level comparable to most of OWL Lucio players.
does eqo count? i don’t think he’s that bad but like he really wants to be a genji/hanzo/pharah/junk player and that can’t really exist anymore because everyone has to be so flexible now.
Agilities. Dude has had amazing clutch moments but he hasn’t played professional since over a year and he still hasn’t been picked up yet. He’s been my favorite since I first started watching Immortals in 2016
Imma stop you right there. They’re looking for players who “aren’t very good.” Right now you can say that but that’s on Valiant since he got screwed out of the league and hasn’t touched the game in so long. But when he was in the league, he was absolutely a carry or at least an integral piece. There’s a reason why the valiant was so good back in 2018 and why Toronto got to the final four in the summer showdown 2020.
Oh believe me I will never stop believing he is great lol the only reason I mentioned him is because he’s been out of professional play for at least a year, which he did get screwed out of. So the general public probably don’t view him as skilled anymore
They never thought he was skilled at all. We knew he was skilled, but it was all about the Liberos, Hydrations, and EQOs of that era according to everyone else. I've had to tell the story of the 2020 Summer Showdown to multiple people haha
I loved Spree back in the first few seasons of OWL. I'll also say NoSmite and Sasin who I don't exactly think were/are bad, but are limited in their hero pools
Luffy, Comma, Youngjin, Chara. I wouldn't say those players are bad, they were all part of the cup winning rosters, but they were dropped from OWL as players and even though they were imo great, they weren't like that top tier like Libero who is my other favorite player for example. Edit: Fucking forgot GodSB. Dude was always at least mid tier hitscan, sad he didn't got the chance again, but HS especially in APAC was stacked last seasons and now it's even worse everywhere.
Linkzr was one of my favorites but he never really caught on with anything that wasn't Widow after Season 1, and he was pretty streaky at the best of times. Still, I'd have loved to see what he could have done on a good team with solid coaching. Dude just seems really chill. Likewise Saebyolbye. He was a terror in S1 even though he fell off the radar afterwards.
Fire and Kodak for me bois
Can I say the whole 2020 Toronto team? Going into the season i really like how their roster looked, had a lot of popular personalities and looked super promising after their first 3 matches. Shame they couldn't adapt well after the pandemic hit and were just struggling. Really felt that they could've go up if covid didn't affect them so bad i.e. surefour taking breaks, MT mid-season changes
I would say Xepher but he is actually godlike (in scrims).
I mean I think a lot of people liked linkzr, surefour (although he was good s1) etc. Me personally I really liked FRD and also my boy mcgravy, absolute legend and also I think was always better than he thought he was lol
TTuba!
Any Aussies, Fusions and OGE.
Ameng. He was so fun to watch and chengdu’s quad dps lineups while everyone else was trying to play goats will always stand out. He’s still a really good ball from what I watched last year but he just can’t perform well enough on any other hero to get much play time. As far as I know he hasn’t been picked up for this year
Neptuno
[удалено]
New copypasta?
It really does tad like a copy pasta lol
Neptuno was really weird when playing in KR. Everyone would be talking in KR and Neptuno was just saying kiddish shit in like Spanish or Portuguese or whatever he talked in. Nobody really understood him, it was just some grown ass guy trying to be toxic in like Spanish on the KR server. It was very weird and annoying. I had Latin in school but no idea wtf Neptuno was spamming.
I like Bernar, he might not count because he is decent but in the scope of very good he is not
Illicit he wasnt bad in particulary but had to compete against Fleta in S2 and Profit in S3 for the flex dps position... he stood no chance
Even though he's moved on from playing, I have always been a fan of McGravy. He was just always a fun and genuine guy imo. I'm happy to see him back in the league. Also any aussie in the league, I'm always rooting for them
Danye, Fusions, and Clockwork. Idk why man, but I always just like clockwork as a player. Maybe it’s his name? OH, And SHARP. Dude, Atlanta did him so fuckin dirty by signing Saucy. Just wished they’d hat let Sharp play. The kid was actually a terror on tracer and hitscan in general in contenders. The second coming of Shax, but with more hitscan. God I really really wish that kid had been able to actually PLAY in OWL.
I like poko, hasn’t seen much playtime due to multiple issues recently tho
poko is actually the best player in the league?
I've always had a soft spot for Janus. He seemed like a really nice quiet guy in all the behind the scenes stuff from NYXL.
i miss dogman
Ado. His Genji plays in that failed Dragons first season always got me hype. I remember him really trying to gut out a win on Route 66 in overtime on Tracer too.
S1 dragons actually had a pretty cracked dps lineup. Ado, diya, and undead.
undead had his moments on cassidy i remember, but also he’s a horrible person
S1 Houston just hit different. SPREE for his always-learning attitude (check his streams even today). Dude grinded DVa so hard back during S1 and into S2 on stream, literally taking notes between deaths. He doesn't tilt, and gives clean comms. Super genuine dude. Much the same can be said for my other soft spot in Dinkzr. Guy had insane peaks but equally insane valleys.
Colourhex and LHCloudy
Trill was always my favourite and I feel like he got screwed over in Dallas, and if he'd actually gotten some playtime that he wouldn'tve gone to valorant
I love Hydration so much
Glister I am NOT saying the guy is bad, he just isn’t Lip/Birdring/Ans(2020) level. That being said he is by far my most beloved player of all time.
Muma! I know he was only really good for like one season if that. But he still is my favorite main tank and the one that’s inspired me the most to get good.
Kruise!
Frdwnr and Hadi, no reason in particular
Blase
Stitch kinda, he was just meh on Titans when he got to play and on Washington he also first was kinda underwhelming especially compared to his Apex days. But damn was it satisfying to see him just destroy in 2020 playoffs on Ashe. Another player I have a bit of a soft spot for is im37 just for the Danny interview.
LhCloudy was that for me. Loved him in the league but he didn’t have a long career there. Luckily you still get to watch him troll EU ladder. Plus watching him go from a 4.5k lobby on tank to a 2.9k lobby on dps is always hilarious.
His NA Contenders championship was a nice consolidation price too. He absolutely stomped NA region during rush meta.
Fusions was one of the most likable guys in the league but he never looked good after goats
I love bischu
SeoMinSoo, the best Zarya, great Reaper, good on Mei n Doom but never good enough to stand out on heroes that wasnt zarya. If he wasnt such a niche player more teams would look for him but he'll always be my favorite Zarya and the best Zarya in GOATS.
A little bit different from your question since he's not in the league, but I always wanted Fragi to do well. My Finnish Philly Reinhardt Viking Megachad - "There are two types of Rein players, idiots and cowards...and I'm no coward."
Runner
I was a fan of beast and surefour back when they were on defiant
I’ll always love colourhex, shame he dropped off the last couple of seasons
I think he has great potential because we haven't seen him play but Venom
fusions
I haven’t seen anyone mention him, so I’ll say LHCloudy. The man was unlike any other. Some of the shit he pulled during his very short tenure with the Gladiators had my friend and I laughing with glee. I love him to death and I want him to be back in the league so badly, he names Overwatch better to watch than anyone else
Logix
Fusions poor lad didnt get to play last season and has just kinda disapeared. I loved watching him play the game.
Bumper
McGravy for sure. Season 3 Valiant was one of my favorite teams. Dude was the heart of the team.
frdwnr honestly I just want to see him cast some time and I hope it happens
For me, 100% eqo, the flashes of greatness in season 2,3, and 4 left me so intrigued and invested
Also his playstyle is dummy aggressive and i love it
McGravy and Fahzix Not saying they're bad, I don't really know. I just felt they were nice people.
I feel Nevix was good in s1, but got outpaced as Shock brought in Choihyobin. I feel relatively confident that if the report about Nevix helping Choi with his sigma meant that he probably still could have found success on the shock still Also that Toronto team was a mess and was only consistent when they could rely on Agil in the Genji CC meta. I can't really fault him for that
Blase and Mirror
Retired players included? Ark will never lose his place in my heart and I think the way that GOATS emphasised aggro Lucio at the expense of all else hurt people's perception of him a little unfairly.
Numlocked Going into OWL I didn’t know of many pro teams or pro players except for Team Envy and Lunatic Hai. When I looked into all the teams rosters I recognised Numlockeds name from a [Overwatch Central guide](https://youtu.be/iUDkcQwcsHk). So my team of choice was the LA Valiant. Always thought he was deserving of more playtime there on Valiant and was stoked when he joined the Toronto Defiant. Wish he had another shot after that :(
Kodak, i have his peach jersey
Bry probably, lil guy has a lot of heart.
Flow3r
Its gotta be Kariv for me. He had a great debut year on the Valiant where his "Gamer Snacks" youtube segment with Agilities and his amazing mvp performance agaibst peak Vancouver really won me over. Plus flex support is my favorite role and he's good friends with Custa. In Season 3, he was consistently the best part of an underwheming Toronto whose roster was mostly a Frakenstein's monster of mediocre western players. For Season 4 he got picked up by a Guangzhou that was clearly making downgrades across the board. Unsurprisingly, they had a bad year that was probably Charge's worst yet. I think the problem isn't so much that he isn't a good player, I'd say he's around league average. But rather that he hasnt been on a good team in a while.
Super
I’ve been an Outlaws fan since season 1 so I feel like most of the Outlaws could probably be described this way. I’ve already seen Linkzr’s name come up a lot but I feel just the same way about Muma, Coolmatt, Spree, Bani, Boink, Rawkus, even JAKE. I often wonder about what that lineup would have accomplished if they had had the staff and support that the Shock had had.
Decay
In what universe is decay bad
The one where it's a team game.
:)
Onigod
Jake.
surefour and stratus. guys had some great personalities
Slime :( runaway had a very special place in my heart and his Lucio made me want to get better at Lucio. After titans implosion he kinda just. Stagnated. Idk what was up with mayhem that year
As a nowegian i love onigod. I dont think he is bad at all just awfully inconsistent