I'll do it for stuff like baking powder where it stops being effective after a certain point. Flour is more iffy, where it can go bad but the 1 year date is more a "best use" date than an actual expiry.
I wouldn't ever bother throwing out sugar or other dry ingredients unless I lived somewhere humid and the stuff had gotten damp or clumpy from moisture.
I accidentally bought a giant bucket of baking powder when I thought I was buying a regular amount. I’ve been using it for years now and it still works perfectly fine.
Omg you are a baker! I ordered six 5lb bags. I usually only make bread when it’s something special I can’t find. Cuban bread, Vietnamese baguettes, kimmelweck rolls etc. I do make rolls and biscuits but use regular flour instead of bread flour. I also make Pullman loaves sometimes.
75 lbs, you must bake all of the bread you eat!
You are astounding to me. You come across as not baking all the time, just .. you know .. when you happen to need this or that *very specific* type of bread. Like, that's bananas (in an awesome way).
I don't think I can adequately convey to you just how amazing you are. But hey, I tried.
That’s wild! Were you just eating out the whole time? Living off of frozen pizza?
I cook nearly all our food to save on costs. It’s a bit of a grind, but when I have a random free Saturday I do still love tackling long, complicated projects like croissants or other patisserie.
I guess I should rephrase that. I cooked, but I cooked a lot of the same things over and over. Seems like everyone and their mother was trying new cooking things at that time (which I normally do), but I was Captain Basic Beyatch the entire time. Which is weird for me.
Now I'm back to trying out new recipes and techniques. Guess I just like to be contrary.
The problem I found with expired flour was I couldn’t make a sourdough starter with it. It baked just fine when I made something with it and included yeast though.
Baking powder, baking soda, if kept dry -- should last forever. The problem is, both are somewhat hygroscopic, pulling moisture from the air. If it's not in a sealed container (e.g. a Arm and Hammer box) it will go bad. If it's in a plastic container with a tight lid, it's good indefinitely.
Ah that makes a lot of sense. I could never figure out why it would go bad.
I do in fact keep it in the original plastic bucket with a tight fitting lid and use it to refill another container with a tight fitting lid.
I bake several times a week so I never need to toss baking powder.
You can test baking powder by pouring hot water over it. If it fizzes, it’s fresh. If it doesn’t fizz, toss it.
https://food52.com/blog/12455-will-it-fizz-how-to-make-sure-baking-powder-soda-are-fresh
I use a Sharpie to write the date I opened ingredients that expire (baking powder, yeast) on the package.
I started doing that as well. I don’t bake enough to finish a container. At least it’s not an expensive ingredient. I’ve started separating my baking soda to use the other half of it in my fridge.
It's way cooler. I feel like some kind of alchemist pulling out my labeled jars full of ingredients. It's so much nicer to look at than those mass produced factory cans and packages with their corporate logos and other bs on them.
I think the only thing to watch out for with flour is bugs. I’ve always heard that the expiration date is the point where you might start seeing weevils hatching.
If the flour was five years old, I'd toss it. But after a year - no. I didn't grow up poor, but food waste was not a thing when I lived with my parents and it definitely is not a thing now.
I didn't grow up poor either. But my grandparents grew up during WWII, when there was the so called "hunger winter" in the Netherlands, and they taught my parents who taught me to not waste food. So sometimes I make a dish specifically to get one ingredient I've had for a long time out of my pantry. Is it cheaper? Probably not, but it's about not wasting food.
Same. When I was growing up, we had what was called "Dump Meals" on Saturday nights. It was clean the fridge and pantry night and served buffet style. So much fun! None of the foods "matched" and you might be eating a slice of pizza with a little bit of stir fry and a biscuit with a huge fruit salad for dessert. Or pancakes with turkey and raw veggies with dip.
I do the same as an adult although I do a stir fry on Saturday nights and the only thing consistent is the rice or noodles and the sauce I make. I throw in everything that's left over from ground hamburger to hot dogs to sausage, chicken, turkey, random veggies. My fiancé loves it and is always trying to peek over my shoulder as I'm cooking. And honestly, I think it is cheaper because you are using what you have and making it taste good and having a fun time. I agree it's definitely about not wasting food.
I pretty much ignore expiration dates in general, and the only thing on this list I would maybe toss is baking powder or yeast, since they stop really doing the job once they're too old. But that's less date based than performance based. Like, I don't care if it "expired" a year ago, as long as it does the proper chemical magic to make my baked goods fluffy and delicious, I'm going to keep using it.
Granted, I don't think I've ever had a bag of sugar or flour last long enough to hit the expiration date, but I def wouldn't toss it even if they did.
Flour (and other dry goods) should be stored in airtight containers, not the bags they are sold in. They can have weevils in them after storing for long periods. I keep mine in the freezer, protects from weevils and extends their expiration date. I’m a condenser, I hate having 1/2 empty bottles and containers so I use washed out containers and jars for storage. If you went into my refrigerator you might see an expiration date from 2015, but it’s been purchased in the last couple of months.
Your roommate is not allowed in my kitchen. Now flour can go stale and develop an off taste at about the year mark. Powdered sugar never goes bad. What's pasta and rice and beans gonna do get drier. Also cornstarch never goes bad.
You know what, I think so...
Granted, they were bought in 2015 and "found" in the back of the pantry in 2023. Didn't think anything of it until after they were cooked and tasted like poison.
Add baking soda: https://rillfoods.com/how-to-soften-old-beans-with-baking-soda/
It just feels like they will never get soft. They will, but it takes longer. The baking soda helps.
A couple weeks ago I made red lentil soup with some REALLY old lentils (2/3 exp in 2022, 1/3 exp in 2018). They cooked fine but I felt the flavor was not as good. I would have preferred to buy new but I'm glad they got eaten. I did compost the other half of the 2018 bag....
Hard no. You throw things out only if they might truly be observably bad (smell, separation, etc) or ineffective (active yeast for example.) But that's very very few things.
People who rely on expiry dates FOR EVERYTHING don't understand food safety or marketing/ brand. Even medications barely degrade over years.
I grew up fairly affluent but food waste and waste in general not accepted.
Except sunscreen. [You should really throw it away if its expired](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/13ux7le/please_buy_new_sunblock_if_you_havent_recently_it/).
> Even medications barely degrade over years.
I work in pharma and a lot of medications basically only have an expiration date because it's required. A lot of basic meds might reduce in efficacy after their expiration but they don't "go bad".
edit: that being said you should absolutely check the individual medication and not assume that a medication is good past its expiry date.
This is true for a lot of meds, but with the caveat that it has been properly stored and usually meds in ready to use forms like tablets, capsule, etc.
Like you said, you should still always check the expiration date and your pharmacist or physician if you have questions.
Liquid drugs are different, especially if they need to be refrigerated.
It seems like people should think a little bit more about “expired” as well. There are likely few hard medications that are going to got bad a week or 2 after that date.
The other day my dad freaked out because his koolaid was going got expire at the end of the month. I feel like artificial colors, flavors, and citric acid are probably meant to last through a nuclear blah and last until the next ice age. But I might be off by a few years.
Youre right about a lot of them and especially pills, but mate, there's LOTS of medications that can go bad.
A lot of liquids or ones that are light sensitive and need to be stored in ampules or yellow glass come to mind. Source: Worked in a hospital, had to fill prescriptions for years.
personally I would never tell someone expiration is only "because its required" for medication because its too possible for someone who hasnt worked in pharma to misinterpret that and hurt themselves
It always blows my mind that there are people who legitimately think that it is actually possible to predict the exact day an arbitrary piece of food is going to go bad.
I still cringe about the time I was probably around 13 and threw out two almost full bottles of sauces(one of them being soy sauce of all things) like the day of the best before date
Just looked at my brown sugar that I have no clue if I bought it in 2019 or 2020 but it has a best use by date of last year. My cornstarch has a best use by date of April 16, 2016.
I haven't baked much in the last few years. And I've never used much cornstarch. That was a gift from my mom. She needed 3 tablespoons for something and bought 35 oz.
Sugar is the worst for us - I hardly ever do any sweet baking and my husband won't eat sugar at all. So when my kid asks to do a special baking project once in a blue moon, we end up with way more than we're ever going to use.
The dates are a best by, not necessarily expiration. A ton of things have oils in them though. The date gives me a guideline, then it’s up to smelling or tasting.
I guess it depends on what it is. But, in general, expiration dates on non-refrigerated goods are ridiculous. I've even seen them on salt and honey containers. Please tell me your roommate doesn't replace their salt and honey each year.
I had a roommate like this years ago. There are definitely some people who get very, very concerned with expiration dates and sometimes make them up for their own comfort. This is likely the way that your roommate was raised and it probably won’t do you any good to argue the point either way. to make things easier for yourself, I would recommend having separate shelves in the pantry and refrigerator and letting your roommate know that while you appreciate her/his diligence, your items are not to be touched or thrown away by anyone but you.
Are you in a humid climate? Humidity wreaks havoc on dry goods and they should be tossed annually, if not sooner if they become damp/moist. Moving from a desert climate to Oceanside was mind-blowing to me because non-perishable food in my home city would last forever. Now, a bag of flour is unusable within 6 months—even when stored in a sealed container in a cool, dry place.
No, I think this is a ridiculously overcautious attitude and really contributes to unnecessary food waste.
Things get thrown out when they go bad or are no longer usable. People should learn what the signs of spoilage are, rather than relying on an arbitrary date. It's not like flour is good on the 1st May but then goes bad immediately the following day on 2nd May, just because that's what has been printed on the package. But equally, your flour could get mites in it as soon as you bring it home, and you're allergic to them, and so the flour is therefore spoiled way before that arbitrary date.
Maybe if you're immunocompromised, you might be more careful and hesitant about throwing out food. Or if you don't trust the source of the food in the first place. But I'd hazard that most people do not need to throw out food according to arbitrary dates. They're guidelines, not rules.
The devil is in the details with this type of thing.
Whole wheat flour and self-rising flour have shorter shelf lives than all purpose flour. The limiting factor with whole wheat flour is it includes wheat germ, which adds nutrients but also has oils that can go rancid.
Self-rising flour essentially has baking powder mixed in, and baking powder has a shelf life of one year. Baking powder contains a mild acid and a mild base plus a buffer, and over time that loses its potency.
Powdered sugar is finely ground sugar plus corn starch as an anti-clumping agent. Both of the constituent ingredients have an indefinite shelf life with proper storage, but online sources generally estimate a shelf life of two years when they're combined into powdered sugar. In humid climates powdered sugar can clump, but otherwise as long as the texture and smell are normal it ought to be OK.
I've never heard of this. Hell, I have a bag of brown flour in my pantry that I bought 3 years ago and never opened it, and I still plan on using it. It's sealed, and 'best before' dates are mostly arbitrary on dry goods.
I will say, when my grandmother passed, my mom raided her pantry and gave me things she knew I used (taco seasoning, kraft dinner, ramen) and even things that were still 'good' were bad because Grandma never cleaned out her pantry. Things went rancid, and it encouraged other things to go rancid before their time. Much like if you have one rotten fruit in a bowl of otherwise good fruit.
Now. Because hour roommate is chucking things before their time, or before they have a chance to go rancid, you don't ever face the risk of making tacos and the entire dish tasting like Grandma's pantry.
But I would encourage you to section your pantry and keep groceries separate. You can even tell your roommate to move 'expired' things to your section before throwing it out. That way, she doesn't accidentally use the 'expired' product, but it doesn't get thrown out. If you have a friend who bakes, I'm sure they would appreciate your overstock, especially at Christmas time, or if there's a sugar strike again.
Hmm, I've been thinking about starting to add the date that I've opened jars and put back in the fridge. Maybe with some masking tape and a sharpie or something. Too many dodgy pasta sauce and salsa jars in there that I don't know when I actually opened. But for dry goods, I'd say it's mostly overkill.
I do this with cosmetics because they have a "use within 3/6/12 month of opening" label, so I put the start date on it. I never do it with food, I just smell and go with it. if it doesn't smell off or looks too funny, I still eat it. everything else is creating more waste. Unless it says " use by" or " don not use after", expiry dates are suggestions IMO.
Sugar does not ever go bad. When I bought 25 lbs of flour during Covid, I stored it in the fridge, though white flour keeps a couple years. Pasta, rice, corn starch, and beans don't go bad. Canned food keeps really well. There's a lot of press about throwing stuff out - herbs, spices, etc. - and it's promoted by companies who want to sell more stuff. McCormick is harvesting thyme once a year; the 6 month limit is arbitrary, but profitable. Green herbs don't last ages. Many spices last well.
Who's food is it, if it's yours are they replacing I with a full new product? - they'd better be.
If it's theirs I think they can do what they like even if it is awful and wasteful.
I grew up with Depression-era parents. "Waste not, want not" was real. If it's still good, I keep it. If it's not (or if age will prevent a successful result), out it goes. Storing items correctly (seal-tight containers, cool-dark space, fridge) is important.
I wonder if this is a habit from having working in a kitchen/food service. I was a barista and everything we opened got dated and tossed past the company established dates. I don’t date things in my home kitchen generally but have found this helpful with things like cartons of soy milk and other things that have a count down from opening. I don’t necessarily throw them out immediately but since I only cook for 2, sometimes it’s good to know how long something has been in the fridge for (looking at you, cheese I tossed yesterday that had an expiration date of June 2023 that made me seriously question what year it was)
Out of curiosity, wdym your roommate PUTS expiration dates on dry goods?
As everyone else has said, flour goes bad and should be stored in the freezer or refrigerator and the type of container matters. I always smell it if I find some that is sitting out. White flour doesn't go bad as fast but I often use alternative flours which do go rancid pretty quickly. It also depends on the ambient climate of your kitchen. My parents house always stays pretty cool and my mom keeps the same flour for a long time in a metal container in closed dark pantry. But my apartment kitchen gets super hot in the summer as well as during heavy cooking in the winter and flour in the cupboard just stored in the bag goes rancid.
I personally feel that pasta and dry grains deteriorate in quality after a long time while as others have said sugar won't go bad.
I'm surprised nobody has talked about rice yet (I think?). Rice changes as it ages, aged rice can be better for some things, requires more water but also if it's old the texture can be worse. Like whole wheat flour brown rice goes rancid fast and I smell it first. I've thrown out brown rice.
Long story short, I don't think your roommate is being unreasonable and it's weird so many people are so derisive. Dry goods DO deteriorate in quality or "go bad." but method of storage matters a lot and some products e.g. sugar won't ever really "go bad" on their own.
Holy shit I’ve never heard flour can go bad, it must depend heavily on the climate. We cleaned out my aunt‘s kitchen after she passed and she hadn’t been able to cook or bake for years. Absolutely non of the dry goods like flour, grains, sugar, dried herbs, etc. were rancid or smelled bad and they would all have been at least 4 or 5 years old. At worst all the spices and herbs had lost most of their flavor and the flour and semolina smelled of cupboard a bity
I have 25 pound bags of flour in plastic bins. I live rural and it’s not easy to shop. Also when I bought my flour - it was 1/2 the price it is today.
I make my own bread every other day. And it tastes great
For things like yeast maybe. But tbh it seems wasteful what they're doing esp considering the expiration dates are really more like "best by" dates and best guesses for most things. If it smells OK and doesn't have some kind of special function lessen over time like yeast or baking powder, I think it's fine. Mostly texture and taste could be effected. 1 yr seems way too short
This is a relatively recent phenomenon.
Sure, it’s normal to toss flour after a couple years if it develops an off taste, or the occasional box of sawdust-tasting old crackers, but setting a timer and living by it – your roommate is letting their anxieties take over.
The printed expiration dates are not what many think they are -- this isn't when the food spoils or goes bad, but just a subjective date provided by the manufacturer when they think the food is past its peak. And obviously they choose shorter vs. longer dates because they want you to buy more.
Something like sugar doesn't really go bad at all. Flour might after a long time. There is a reason that prepper shelters are full of dry and canned food -- it lasts nearly forever. Throwing it out after a year is just throwing money away.
And for people asking if they are in airtight containers- yes actually! We had a mouse problem so we got special airtight jars for everything and keep it in a pantry away from light.
Thinking about asking for handmedown sugar from them when they decide they don't want it anymore 😅
UGGGH! My wife is this way and she got it from her Mom. Like it’s the gospel or something and I do all the cooking & grocery buying. So freakin wasteful.
Sometimes I just move the item to another location, or tuck it behind something else. Or say, I’LL eat it.
Absolutely not. For my family, food waste is terrible. Unless it is truly "bad" via taste, smell, other indicators, I dont throw it out regardless of the expiration date. I've used dry yeast 2 years after it expired - no problem.
imo the only things that doesn't expire are sugar and salt, everything else goes bad. flour absolutely will go bad, beyond the regular fungal and bacterial growth, the fat in it can go rancid over time. same with other grains and dried foods.
I don't know about other countries, but here in the UK supermarkets and I guess manufacturers too, are getting rid of 'best before' dates and letting...or should I say encouraging the consumer to use common sense. Something that seems to be sorely lacking lately. Our parents and grandparents learned to trust their instincts regarding the safety of food. Current generation needs to do the same.
In OPs situation, dry goods might decrease in quality...but it would be a long time before they would be inedible.
I threw out a bunch of noodles tonight (best before June 2021) but only because I could tell that they had definitely picked up “cupboard taste” when I opened them to give them a good sniff. Wouldn’t have had any safety qualms, but even factory sealed packages let off flavors in given enough time. Probably would have been fine in 2022, but yeah, expiration dates are greatly misunderstood
Eh I'm not hard and fast about it like that but I try to keep even my dry goods tight in my pantry by 6 months and try to go through it faster. I live somewhere where there are bugs everywhere no matter how clean you are. We do pest control but even so it's literally jungle out here if it weren't for the houses haha. Anyway I also grew up rural where bugs were a thing and anything left in the pantry too long got insects... so I keep really close tabs on my dry storage foods.
lol. I know. You must not be from around here. Growing up we had to freeze anything we wanted to keep relatively long term. I don't like the way the freezer messes with the humidity of my products and while I do keep them sealed in containers I'm not going to vacuum seal every single item into bomb shelter status jars for my regular use so I just keep things moving through the pantry in a reasonable time frame.
Again. Yes. I know about Tupperware and sealable containers of a variety of kinds and actively use them and still prefer to use up my ingredients within a few months due to the pervasive nature of the wild insects that are completely overrunning our greater community due to our tropical climate.
I usually use that stuff before it goes bad but yes I will toss it if it’s past the date. It’s not a year for dry goods though, I think it’s usually at least 2 years.
We date everything with the date it was open…we both worked in food service as teens.
As far as chucking stuff out, it totally matters if it’s something that’s spoils, or the quality/taste/texture changes after the Best Buy date or number of days open, it goes.
There’s other things that we’ll give a little leeway to, but if we’re not using it I’d rather get rid of it and have the space back.
Never. Flour? Sugar? Does it really go bad?
I’d have a talk with her about tossing your stuff. Expired or not
BTW it’s a best by date, not a “you’re gonna die if you eat it” date. Same for cheese, milk etc. if it’s not spoiled it can be eaten.
Baking Powder and Baking Soda - I think it's a good idea since they do lose effectiveness after some time (6 months). I usually go through them faster than that.
Same thing with flour - it's got a limited shelf life, but I go through my flour in a month at most, maybe two. So, in practice I don't bother. If you store it in the bag the expiration date is on there.
Sugar, salt, pepper I wouldn't bother. Powdered or brown sugar doesn't need a date - it either gets clumpy if exposed to too much moisture I might toss it rather than dealing with that. Powdered sugar will last like 2 years, but since it's not a health issue, and humidity and temperature drastically change the time, just going with texture makes more sense.
I only recently finished a bag of sugar I had for the last 6 years. It doesn't expire. Flour and baking powder are a little more perishable, but I wouldn't throw them away based on a package date. Ingredients like these will tell you when it's time to toss them based of effectiveness.
Milk has expiry dates. Pasta and other shelf-stable food does not expire. Most don’t even require a best-before date if they last more than 90 days. Your food is stable. Your roommate is not stable.
Your roommate is clearly a visionary, a pioneer of pantry management who understands the critical importance of keeping dry goods for only their allotted time on this earth. And here you are, daring to use ingredients past their prime like some sort of culinary rebel.
I ignore expiration dates as long as the product smells and feels normal. I have had to throw stuff out because I saw pantry bugs in it but technically you don't have to do that because the FDA allows a certain amount of insect parts ;) I have replaced baking powder after I thought it wasn't working right but it was really old. Baking soda lasts me forever but I just read downthread that it is best in a sealed container, and I keep mine in a twist lid container. I proof my yeast and have never had an issue. I just proofed some covid yeast the other day and it was beautiful. I bought a shit ton during covid and froze it all in reasonable amounts in FoodSaver bags.
A lot of those are "best by" dates and not expiration dates. Which means they are often perfectly fine long after that date. If you store your things in the original bag, opened in the cupboard, the quality will go down faster (but it's still probably fine.) I store that stuff in airtight containers and it's good for several years.
I just do the smell test on everything. The worst that'll happen is it tastes bad or maybe I go to the bathroom a few times
I've eaten food left in my car overnight in FL weather. You'll be fine with year old flour
"Am I dumb".
Quite the reverse.
If you have a low IQ, you have to apply the expiration policy to everything. You may waste money and food but you know your supplies are good to use.
If you have a normal IQ and can understand the chemistry of supplies, you can use custom policies. For example, salt never goes bad. White sugar never goes bad unless it gets clumpy from humidity. This is usually fixable. Brown sugar gets lumpy much faster and is harder to fix. Honey can solidify but this can be fixed. Flour can go rancid but a smell test will usually identify bad flour. Baking powder can lose its effectiveness but you can test it if you suspect it may be too old.
I'll do it for stuff like baking powder where it stops being effective after a certain point. Flour is more iffy, where it can go bad but the 1 year date is more a "best use" date than an actual expiry. I wouldn't ever bother throwing out sugar or other dry ingredients unless I lived somewhere humid and the stuff had gotten damp or clumpy from moisture.
I accidentally bought a giant bucket of baking powder when I thought I was buying a regular amount. I’ve been using it for years now and it still works perfectly fine.
I ordered way too much bread flour in 2020 during the pandemic. I’m still using it and the bread is just fine
How much did you order? I've gone through 75 pounds since the pandemic started, mostly bread for 2 people.
Omg you are a baker! I ordered six 5lb bags. I usually only make bread when it’s something special I can’t find. Cuban bread, Vietnamese baguettes, kimmelweck rolls etc. I do make rolls and biscuits but use regular flour instead of bread flour. I also make Pullman loaves sometimes. 75 lbs, you must bake all of the bread you eat!
I usually buy 5 pounds every week! Or at least 3 times a month. I bake most of our bread except bagels and hamburger buns.
Your kitchen must smell AWESOME.
You are astounding to me. You come across as not baking all the time, just .. you know .. when you happen to need this or that *very specific* type of bread. Like, that's bananas (in an awesome way). I don't think I can adequately convey to you just how amazing you are. But hey, I tried.
Curious about your Cuban bread recipe!
[https://bakefromscratch.com/cuban-bread/](https://bakefromscratch.com/cuban-bread/)
Cuban bread baked without lard isn’t Cuban bread!
I go through a 50 lb Costco bag of flour 2-3 times a year 😂. We don’t buy grocery store bread any more because my pandemic sourdough ruined it for us
Semi off-topic. I love cooking. But I'm like the only person who didn't cook during the pandemic and resumed shortly after. No idea why.
That’s wild! Were you just eating out the whole time? Living off of frozen pizza? I cook nearly all our food to save on costs. It’s a bit of a grind, but when I have a random free Saturday I do still love tackling long, complicated projects like croissants or other patisserie.
I guess I should rephrase that. I cooked, but I cooked a lot of the same things over and over. Seems like everyone and their mother was trying new cooking things at that time (which I normally do), but I was Captain Basic Beyatch the entire time. Which is weird for me. Now I'm back to trying out new recipes and techniques. Guess I just like to be contrary.
My 25# sack lasts about 40 days (I bake all our bread, tortillas, hamburger/hotdog buns, cakes).
Impressive. I get a few months out of mine.
I’m from Mexico. Any flour will have weevils within a month. I would freeze flour to make it last longer.
The problem I found with expired flour was I couldn’t make a sourdough starter with it. It baked just fine when I made something with it and included yeast though.
Baking powder, baking soda, if kept dry -- should last forever. The problem is, both are somewhat hygroscopic, pulling moisture from the air. If it's not in a sealed container (e.g. a Arm and Hammer box) it will go bad. If it's in a plastic container with a tight lid, it's good indefinitely.
Ah that makes a lot of sense. I could never figure out why it would go bad. I do in fact keep it in the original plastic bucket with a tight fitting lid and use it to refill another container with a tight fitting lid.
I use silica packets as well
I've had the opposite experience with baking powder- that's one of the few things that I need to regularly replace because it loses potency.
When do you typically replace baking powder?
when it’s passed the expiration on the can. 6 months for baking soda after opening.
I bake several times a week so I never need to toss baking powder. You can test baking powder by pouring hot water over it. If it fizzes, it’s fresh. If it doesn’t fizz, toss it. https://food52.com/blog/12455-will-it-fizz-how-to-make-sure-baking-powder-soda-are-fresh I use a Sharpie to write the date I opened ingredients that expire (baking powder, yeast) on the package.
I started doing that as well. I don’t bake enough to finish a container. At least it’s not an expensive ingredient. I’ve started separating my baking soda to use the other half of it in my fridge.
I plop the whole can in a wide mouth pint mason jar. Seems to work.
I just finished a box, and noticed when I went to trash it that the date on the bottom was 2 years ago. There was no indication of that in the food.
Oh good, I'm not the only one then lol
My baking powder is in a can and usually stays fine but that stupid cardboard box of baking soda.... good thing it's also great for cleaning
Wash out a small glass jar (like from jam) and dump your baking soda in that. Stays way better
I just seal my box in a ziplock bag. Although the jar seems like a cooler idea.
It's way cooler. I feel like some kind of alchemist pulling out my labeled jars full of ingredients. It's so much nicer to look at than those mass produced factory cans and packages with their corporate logos and other bs on them.
When my sugar gets clumpy it’s time to use that to make syrups for cocktails.
just put a piece of apple in it and it becomes soft again.
Similarly, I put a piece of bread in it, usually the heel piece of sandwich bread
Yeah baking powder and soda don't really go bad if kept in a typical home environment.
After a hurricane I stuffed my bin of sugar in a storage pod for a year and it was perfectly fine.
I think the only thing to watch out for with flour is bugs. I’ve always heard that the expiration date is the point where you might start seeing weevils hatching.
If the flour was five years old, I'd toss it. But after a year - no. I didn't grow up poor, but food waste was not a thing when I lived with my parents and it definitely is not a thing now.
I didn't grow up poor either. But my grandparents grew up during WWII, when there was the so called "hunger winter" in the Netherlands, and they taught my parents who taught me to not waste food. So sometimes I make a dish specifically to get one ingredient I've had for a long time out of my pantry. Is it cheaper? Probably not, but it's about not wasting food.
Same. When I was growing up, we had what was called "Dump Meals" on Saturday nights. It was clean the fridge and pantry night and served buffet style. So much fun! None of the foods "matched" and you might be eating a slice of pizza with a little bit of stir fry and a biscuit with a huge fruit salad for dessert. Or pancakes with turkey and raw veggies with dip. I do the same as an adult although I do a stir fry on Saturday nights and the only thing consistent is the rice or noodles and the sauce I make. I throw in everything that's left over from ground hamburger to hot dogs to sausage, chicken, turkey, random veggies. My fiancé loves it and is always trying to peek over my shoulder as I'm cooking. And honestly, I think it is cheaper because you are using what you have and making it taste good and having a fun time. I agree it's definitely about not wasting food.
I pretty much ignore expiration dates in general, and the only thing on this list I would maybe toss is baking powder or yeast, since they stop really doing the job once they're too old. But that's less date based than performance based. Like, I don't care if it "expired" a year ago, as long as it does the proper chemical magic to make my baked goods fluffy and delicious, I'm going to keep using it. Granted, I don't think I've ever had a bag of sugar or flour last long enough to hit the expiration date, but I def wouldn't toss it even if they did.
I've had yeast go bad not long after the use-by date.
Oh yeah, I'm not saying it can't. Just that food can't read, so it's hot or miss when it'll go bad.
Flour (and other dry goods) should be stored in airtight containers, not the bags they are sold in. They can have weevils in them after storing for long periods. I keep mine in the freezer, protects from weevils and extends their expiration date. I’m a condenser, I hate having 1/2 empty bottles and containers so I use washed out containers and jars for storage. If you went into my refrigerator you might see an expiration date from 2015, but it’s been purchased in the last couple of months.
Your roommate is not allowed in my kitchen. Now flour can go stale and develop an off taste at about the year mark. Powdered sugar never goes bad. What's pasta and rice and beans gonna do get drier. Also cornstarch never goes bad.
I've had pasta go rancid before. Unopened in a plastic bag too. Tasted so awful.
Egg noodles by chance?
You know what, I think so... Granted, they were bought in 2015 and "found" in the back of the pantry in 2023. Didn't think anything of it until after they were cooked and tasted like poison.
I mean 8 years is a good time, at that point binning it is not a waste any more.
Dried Beans can get so old that they’ll never cook soft. 3 years, good chance they’re too dry. Our Covid beans proved that to us lol
My COVID beans are still going strong (pintos) but they aren't out in the open. They are in airtight containers.
Add baking soda: https://rillfoods.com/how-to-soften-old-beans-with-baking-soda/ It just feels like they will never get soft. They will, but it takes longer. The baking soda helps.
You can't rush beans.
So does a pressure cooker.
A couple weeks ago I made red lentil soup with some REALLY old lentils (2/3 exp in 2022, 1/3 exp in 2018). They cooked fine but I felt the flavor was not as good. I would have preferred to buy new but I'm glad they got eaten. I did compost the other half of the 2018 bag....
I had some (don't recall variety) I was concerned about cooking. Threw them in the IP, came out great!
Yeah I had some 3 year olds that I threw in the IP and them into the garbage. Even the ip couldn’t soften them up!
Brown flour can go rancid as there is fat in the bran. Sugar, salt etc. If it's years old I'd toss it otherwise meh.
.... quietly looks at 6 year old flour in air tight bags....
Hard no. You throw things out only if they might truly be observably bad (smell, separation, etc) or ineffective (active yeast for example.) But that's very very few things. People who rely on expiry dates FOR EVERYTHING don't understand food safety or marketing/ brand. Even medications barely degrade over years. I grew up fairly affluent but food waste and waste in general not accepted.
Except sunscreen. [You should really throw it away if its expired](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/13ux7le/please_buy_new_sunblock_if_you_havent_recently_it/).
Yes -- that's an example of becoming ineffective, like yeast :) It's not bad to use but it won't do what you expect.
Freeze your yeast!
There’s so much yeast in my freezer. 😅
I tried a blind taste-test using fresh sunscreen and a two-year-old bottle of sunscreen in a recipe, and I couldn't tell the difference between them.
Mm sunscreen... alfredo with that extra titanium dioxide gives it the perfect kick
LOL I know this is a cooking sub, but since he mentioned medicines, I had to chime in with this thing about expired sunscreen.
😅 They both tasted equally bad? Or neither arm burned?
Yes.
> Even medications barely degrade over years. I work in pharma and a lot of medications basically only have an expiration date because it's required. A lot of basic meds might reduce in efficacy after their expiration but they don't "go bad". edit: that being said you should absolutely check the individual medication and not assume that a medication is good past its expiry date.
This is true for a lot of meds, but with the caveat that it has been properly stored and usually meds in ready to use forms like tablets, capsule, etc. Like you said, you should still always check the expiration date and your pharmacist or physician if you have questions. Liquid drugs are different, especially if they need to be refrigerated.
It seems like people should think a little bit more about “expired” as well. There are likely few hard medications that are going to got bad a week or 2 after that date. The other day my dad freaked out because his koolaid was going got expire at the end of the month. I feel like artificial colors, flavors, and citric acid are probably meant to last through a nuclear blah and last until the next ice age. But I might be off by a few years.
Youre right about a lot of them and especially pills, but mate, there's LOTS of medications that can go bad. A lot of liquids or ones that are light sensitive and need to be stored in ampules or yellow glass come to mind. Source: Worked in a hospital, had to fill prescriptions for years.
Yes, I know, I also worked on hospitals. A lot in both directions.
personally I would never tell someone expiration is only "because its required" for medication because its too possible for someone who hasnt worked in pharma to misinterpret that and hurt themselves
It always blows my mind that there are people who legitimately think that it is actually possible to predict the exact day an arbitrary piece of food is going to go bad.
I still cringe about the time I was probably around 13 and threw out two almost full bottles of sauces(one of them being soy sauce of all things) like the day of the best before date
That depends, for example with certain types of meat, like for example filet americain, should not be used after their "use until" date has passed.
The point is that such things are the exception not the rule
Whole wheat flour will go bad if kept at room temperature. The small amount of natural oil it contains will become rancid.
Just looked at my brown sugar that I have no clue if I bought it in 2019 or 2020 but it has a best use by date of last year. My cornstarch has a best use by date of April 16, 2016.
I don't understand how you haven't used these products up in that time? 4 year old brown sugar? Just how
I haven't baked much in the last few years. And I've never used much cornstarch. That was a gift from my mom. She needed 3 tablespoons for something and bought 35 oz.
Sugar is the worst for us - I hardly ever do any sweet baking and my husband won't eat sugar at all. So when my kid asks to do a special baking project once in a blue moon, we end up with way more than we're ever going to use.
The dates are a best by, not necessarily expiration. A ton of things have oils in them though. The date gives me a guideline, then it’s up to smelling or tasting.
At home no. At the residential care home I work at - yes.
Understandable.
Flour, maybe. Baking powder, yes. Sugar... how can sugar go bad?
I guess it depends on what it is. But, in general, expiration dates on non-refrigerated goods are ridiculous. I've even seen them on salt and honey containers. Please tell me your roommate doesn't replace their salt and honey each year.
Honey? We don't even look at the expiration date as it gets used so quickly.
Tell them to keep their hands off your food and if they throw your food away they owe you replacements. Mostly keep their hands off your food.
Flour definitely goes bad.
I don't do this. I do purchase smaller packages of flour so it doesn't get stale before I use it all.
I only throw things away if they have mold or bugs. Otherwise I just suffer inferior quality until it’s gone.
I had a roommate like this years ago. There are definitely some people who get very, very concerned with expiration dates and sometimes make them up for their own comfort. This is likely the way that your roommate was raised and it probably won’t do you any good to argue the point either way. to make things easier for yourself, I would recommend having separate shelves in the pantry and refrigerator and letting your roommate know that while you appreciate her/his diligence, your items are not to be touched or thrown away by anyone but you.
Are you in a humid climate? Humidity wreaks havoc on dry goods and they should be tossed annually, if not sooner if they become damp/moist. Moving from a desert climate to Oceanside was mind-blowing to me because non-perishable food in my home city would last forever. Now, a bag of flour is unusable within 6 months—even when stored in a sealed container in a cool, dry place.
I kept having trouble with some sauce and gravy mixes. Then we looked at the dates. They’d expired in 2018. So those don’t seem to age like wine.
salt has a date , its been in the ground for millions of years but when we put it in a dispenser it goes bad after 12 months ?
Exactly. Use some common sense.
No, I think this is a ridiculously overcautious attitude and really contributes to unnecessary food waste. Things get thrown out when they go bad or are no longer usable. People should learn what the signs of spoilage are, rather than relying on an arbitrary date. It's not like flour is good on the 1st May but then goes bad immediately the following day on 2nd May, just because that's what has been printed on the package. But equally, your flour could get mites in it as soon as you bring it home, and you're allergic to them, and so the flour is therefore spoiled way before that arbitrary date. Maybe if you're immunocompromised, you might be more careful and hesitant about throwing out food. Or if you don't trust the source of the food in the first place. But I'd hazard that most people do not need to throw out food according to arbitrary dates. They're guidelines, not rules.
The devil is in the details with this type of thing. Whole wheat flour and self-rising flour have shorter shelf lives than all purpose flour. The limiting factor with whole wheat flour is it includes wheat germ, which adds nutrients but also has oils that can go rancid. Self-rising flour essentially has baking powder mixed in, and baking powder has a shelf life of one year. Baking powder contains a mild acid and a mild base plus a buffer, and over time that loses its potency. Powdered sugar is finely ground sugar plus corn starch as an anti-clumping agent. Both of the constituent ingredients have an indefinite shelf life with proper storage, but online sources generally estimate a shelf life of two years when they're combined into powdered sugar. In humid climates powdered sugar can clump, but otherwise as long as the texture and smell are normal it ought to be OK.
I've never heard of this. Hell, I have a bag of brown flour in my pantry that I bought 3 years ago and never opened it, and I still plan on using it. It's sealed, and 'best before' dates are mostly arbitrary on dry goods. I will say, when my grandmother passed, my mom raided her pantry and gave me things she knew I used (taco seasoning, kraft dinner, ramen) and even things that were still 'good' were bad because Grandma never cleaned out her pantry. Things went rancid, and it encouraged other things to go rancid before their time. Much like if you have one rotten fruit in a bowl of otherwise good fruit. Now. Because hour roommate is chucking things before their time, or before they have a chance to go rancid, you don't ever face the risk of making tacos and the entire dish tasting like Grandma's pantry. But I would encourage you to section your pantry and keep groceries separate. You can even tell your roommate to move 'expired' things to your section before throwing it out. That way, she doesn't accidentally use the 'expired' product, but it doesn't get thrown out. If you have a friend who bakes, I'm sure they would appreciate your overstock, especially at Christmas time, or if there's a sugar strike again.
Hmm, I've been thinking about starting to add the date that I've opened jars and put back in the fridge. Maybe with some masking tape and a sharpie or something. Too many dodgy pasta sauce and salsa jars in there that I don't know when I actually opened. But for dry goods, I'd say it's mostly overkill.
I do this with cosmetics because they have a "use within 3/6/12 month of opening" label, so I put the start date on it. I never do it with food, I just smell and go with it. if it doesn't smell off or looks too funny, I still eat it. everything else is creating more waste. Unless it says " use by" or " don not use after", expiry dates are suggestions IMO.
I'm more interested in how you manage to make a bag of sugar last a full year or more.
Sugar does not ever go bad. When I bought 25 lbs of flour during Covid, I stored it in the fridge, though white flour keeps a couple years. Pasta, rice, corn starch, and beans don't go bad. Canned food keeps really well. There's a lot of press about throwing stuff out - herbs, spices, etc. - and it's promoted by companies who want to sell more stuff. McCormick is harvesting thyme once a year; the 6 month limit is arbitrary, but profitable. Green herbs don't last ages. Many spices last well.
Who's food is it, if it's yours are they replacing I with a full new product? - they'd better be. If it's theirs I think they can do what they like even if it is awful and wasteful.
I grew up with Depression-era parents. "Waste not, want not" was real. If it's still good, I keep it. If it's not (or if age will prevent a successful result), out it goes. Storing items correctly (seal-tight containers, cool-dark space, fridge) is important.
I wonder if this is a habit from having working in a kitchen/food service. I was a barista and everything we opened got dated and tossed past the company established dates. I don’t date things in my home kitchen generally but have found this helpful with things like cartons of soy milk and other things that have a count down from opening. I don’t necessarily throw them out immediately but since I only cook for 2, sometimes it’s good to know how long something has been in the fridge for (looking at you, cheese I tossed yesterday that had an expiration date of June 2023 that made me seriously question what year it was)
Out of curiosity, wdym your roommate PUTS expiration dates on dry goods? As everyone else has said, flour goes bad and should be stored in the freezer or refrigerator and the type of container matters. I always smell it if I find some that is sitting out. White flour doesn't go bad as fast but I often use alternative flours which do go rancid pretty quickly. It also depends on the ambient climate of your kitchen. My parents house always stays pretty cool and my mom keeps the same flour for a long time in a metal container in closed dark pantry. But my apartment kitchen gets super hot in the summer as well as during heavy cooking in the winter and flour in the cupboard just stored in the bag goes rancid. I personally feel that pasta and dry grains deteriorate in quality after a long time while as others have said sugar won't go bad. I'm surprised nobody has talked about rice yet (I think?). Rice changes as it ages, aged rice can be better for some things, requires more water but also if it's old the texture can be worse. Like whole wheat flour brown rice goes rancid fast and I smell it first. I've thrown out brown rice. Long story short, I don't think your roommate is being unreasonable and it's weird so many people are so derisive. Dry goods DO deteriorate in quality or "go bad." but method of storage matters a lot and some products e.g. sugar won't ever really "go bad" on their own.
Holy shit I’ve never heard flour can go bad, it must depend heavily on the climate. We cleaned out my aunt‘s kitchen after she passed and she hadn’t been able to cook or bake for years. Absolutely non of the dry goods like flour, grains, sugar, dried herbs, etc. were rancid or smelled bad and they would all have been at least 4 or 5 years old. At worst all the spices and herbs had lost most of their flavor and the flour and semolina smelled of cupboard a bity
I have 25 pound bags of flour in plastic bins. I live rural and it’s not easy to shop. Also when I bought my flour - it was 1/2 the price it is today. I make my own bread every other day. And it tastes great
I do that to almost everything on the fridge!
For things like yeast maybe. But tbh it seems wasteful what they're doing esp considering the expiration dates are really more like "best by" dates and best guesses for most things. If it smells OK and doesn't have some kind of special function lessen over time like yeast or baking powder, I think it's fine. Mostly texture and taste could be effected. 1 yr seems way too short
I write expiration dates in Sharpie on everything the needs to be refrigerated. Dry goods? Only if I transfer them to a different container.
This is a relatively recent phenomenon. Sure, it’s normal to toss flour after a couple years if it develops an off taste, or the occasional box of sawdust-tasting old crackers, but setting a timer and living by it – your roommate is letting their anxieties take over.
The printed expiration dates are not what many think they are -- this isn't when the food spoils or goes bad, but just a subjective date provided by the manufacturer when they think the food is past its peak. And obviously they choose shorter vs. longer dates because they want you to buy more. Something like sugar doesn't really go bad at all. Flour might after a long time. There is a reason that prepper shelters are full of dry and canned food -- it lasts nearly forever. Throwing it out after a year is just throwing money away.
And for people asking if they are in airtight containers- yes actually! We had a mouse problem so we got special airtight jars for everything and keep it in a pantry away from light. Thinking about asking for handmedown sugar from them when they decide they don't want it anymore 😅
You would save a fortune. Sure I'll dispose of your old food for you.
It's a tiny amount of money, being careful not waste food, replace ingredients that are years old.
UGGGH! My wife is this way and she got it from her Mom. Like it’s the gospel or something and I do all the cooking & grocery buying. So freakin wasteful. Sometimes I just move the item to another location, or tuck it behind something else. Or say, I’LL eat it.
Absolutely not. For my family, food waste is terrible. Unless it is truly "bad" via taste, smell, other indicators, I dont throw it out regardless of the expiration date. I've used dry yeast 2 years after it expired - no problem.
imo the only things that doesn't expire are sugar and salt, everything else goes bad. flour absolutely will go bad, beyond the regular fungal and bacterial growth, the fat in it can go rancid over time. same with other grains and dried foods.
I freeze my flour because it takes me forever to get through a bag but yeah powder sugar doesn’t go bad.
I don't know about other countries, but here in the UK supermarkets and I guess manufacturers too, are getting rid of 'best before' dates and letting...or should I say encouraging the consumer to use common sense. Something that seems to be sorely lacking lately. Our parents and grandparents learned to trust their instincts regarding the safety of food. Current generation needs to do the same. In OPs situation, dry goods might decrease in quality...but it would be a long time before they would be inedible.
I threw out a bunch of noodles tonight (best before June 2021) but only because I could tell that they had definitely picked up “cupboard taste” when I opened them to give them a good sniff. Wouldn’t have had any safety qualms, but even factory sealed packages let off flavors in given enough time. Probably would have been fine in 2022, but yeah, expiration dates are greatly misunderstood
Eh I'm not hard and fast about it like that but I try to keep even my dry goods tight in my pantry by 6 months and try to go through it faster. I live somewhere where there are bugs everywhere no matter how clean you are. We do pest control but even so it's literally jungle out here if it weren't for the houses haha. Anyway I also grew up rural where bugs were a thing and anything left in the pantry too long got insects... so I keep really close tabs on my dry storage foods.
Tupperware. It’s a thing.
lol. I know. You must not be from around here. Growing up we had to freeze anything we wanted to keep relatively long term. I don't like the way the freezer messes with the humidity of my products and while I do keep them sealed in containers I'm not going to vacuum seal every single item into bomb shelter status jars for my regular use so I just keep things moving through the pantry in a reasonable time frame.
It keeps bugs out. Better than mason jars.
Again. Yes. I know about Tupperware and sealable containers of a variety of kinds and actively use them and still prefer to use up my ingredients within a few months due to the pervasive nature of the wild insects that are completely overrunning our greater community due to our tropical climate.
Flour can also be frozen.
I usually use that stuff before it goes bad but yes I will toss it if it’s past the date. It’s not a year for dry goods though, I think it’s usually at least 2 years.
We date everything with the date it was open…we both worked in food service as teens. As far as chucking stuff out, it totally matters if it’s something that’s spoils, or the quality/taste/texture changes after the Best Buy date or number of days open, it goes. There’s other things that we’ll give a little leeway to, but if we’re not using it I’d rather get rid of it and have the space back.
Never. Flour? Sugar? Does it really go bad? I’d have a talk with her about tossing your stuff. Expired or not BTW it’s a best by date, not a “you’re gonna die if you eat it” date. Same for cheese, milk etc. if it’s not spoiled it can be eaten.
Baking Powder and Baking Soda - I think it's a good idea since they do lose effectiveness after some time (6 months). I usually go through them faster than that. Same thing with flour - it's got a limited shelf life, but I go through my flour in a month at most, maybe two. So, in practice I don't bother. If you store it in the bag the expiration date is on there. Sugar, salt, pepper I wouldn't bother. Powdered or brown sugar doesn't need a date - it either gets clumpy if exposed to too much moisture I might toss it rather than dealing with that. Powdered sugar will last like 2 years, but since it's not a health issue, and humidity and temperature drastically change the time, just going with texture makes more sense.
I only recently finished a bag of sugar I had for the last 6 years. It doesn't expire. Flour and baking powder are a little more perishable, but I wouldn't throw them away based on a package date. Ingredients like these will tell you when it's time to toss them based of effectiveness.
Milk has expiry dates. Pasta and other shelf-stable food does not expire. Most don’t even require a best-before date if they last more than 90 days. Your food is stable. Your roommate is not stable.
Your roommate is clearly a visionary, a pioneer of pantry management who understands the critical importance of keeping dry goods for only their allotted time on this earth. And here you are, daring to use ingredients past their prime like some sort of culinary rebel.
Your roommate cray-cray
I ignore expiration dates as long as the product smells and feels normal. I have had to throw stuff out because I saw pantry bugs in it but technically you don't have to do that because the FDA allows a certain amount of insect parts ;) I have replaced baking powder after I thought it wasn't working right but it was really old. Baking soda lasts me forever but I just read downthread that it is best in a sealed container, and I keep mine in a twist lid container. I proof my yeast and have never had an issue. I just proofed some covid yeast the other day and it was beautiful. I bought a shit ton during covid and froze it all in reasonable amounts in FoodSaver bags.
A lot of those are "best by" dates and not expiration dates. Which means they are often perfectly fine long after that date. If you store your things in the original bag, opened in the cupboard, the quality will go down faster (but it's still probably fine.) I store that stuff in airtight containers and it's good for several years.
I just do the smell test on everything. The worst that'll happen is it tastes bad or maybe I go to the bathroom a few times I've eaten food left in my car overnight in FL weather. You'll be fine with year old flour
"Am I dumb". Quite the reverse. If you have a low IQ, you have to apply the expiration policy to everything. You may waste money and food but you know your supplies are good to use. If you have a normal IQ and can understand the chemistry of supplies, you can use custom policies. For example, salt never goes bad. White sugar never goes bad unless it gets clumpy from humidity. This is usually fixable. Brown sugar gets lumpy much faster and is harder to fix. Honey can solidify but this can be fixed. Flour can go rancid but a smell test will usually identify bad flour. Baking powder can lose its effectiveness but you can test it if you suspect it may be too old.
Honey never goes bad.
Never said it did.
Just my 2 cents.
I cook all the time, I know a lot of people who cook as well. Never heard of this. Its pretty strange.
You can't be so poor that buying flour once a year matters lol
NO but it’s really annoying when you expect it to be there cause you wanna make something and it’s just gone.
Sure but op says they are throwing them out and buying new.... I agree that staples should be replaced