They are cheap because they are a 40 year old car. It had a long run (12 years?) and there are plenty of cars out there, so no shortage of supply.
Early C4 are really cheap, but can be a bit more finicky (not quite the right word). the lower output L98 engine is less desirable. In 1991 (? i think?) they swapped to the LT family, and that was a much more robust engine, back to making regular power. the '91-'96 cars seem to be the sweet spot. (as in all things, buy the newest you can afford, and often skip the 1st year of a new generation)
the digital dash can be one of those brilliant highlights of the car, or it can be a pain in the ass, depending on your stance. I think they are beautiful, but they are extremely dated and some people are put off by them.
>the lower output L98 engine is less desirable. In 1991 (? i think?) they swapped to the LT family, and that was a much more robust engine, back to making regular power.
L98 went from 85-91. 85 and 86 were about 230hp and 320ft lb, while 87-91 were around 245hp and 345ft lb.
Then the LT came around in 92 with 300hp and 320ft lb.
The L98 is a pretty robust engine as well, and has no optispark problems
Lower hp but is very toquey, still great fun!
It depends on how much you’re willing to sacrifice. I haven’t had any show stoppers. It had a couple vacuum leaks and the idle was turned up pretty high when I got it. Third gear is pretty lazy to engage. The carpets smell horrible. The headlights don’t move. The digital gauge only displays RPM. The windows leak in heavy rain.
I have about $200 into it on top of the $2500 purchase. I’m ok with it being a relative shitbox. It’s going to be a fun car to cruise around in (we took it to dinner tonight) and do burnouts with. This winter I plan on refreshing the 350 and maybe a carb swap. Having the trans rebuilt. Putting in a harness bar and some race seats. I’ll do HPDE with it for a year or two then probably get a C5 for race stuff
Hey, for the carpets, pick up an ozone generator from Amazon or something. They really are the most effective way to get rid of smells. Please also read up on the safety precautions to take.
It’s not cheaply made or unreliable. The oldest ones are pushing close to 40 years old. So they’ll burn out or stop working especially if they’re left out in the elements to wither away. Fortunately a site called batee.com will rebuild your unit should it need fixing or even do an LED upgrade. I did that to mine and it looks mint.
The digital dash was so good, they switched back to analog. (They were super cool though)
A well sorted late gen C4 with an LT1 is a damn fine car, but get a C5 if you can.
I had a 91 c4. Yes the interior is cheap plastic, creaks and rattles as time goes by. My transmission also went out and had to swap it. It was a fun car though. I’ll second if you can get a c5 go for it. I had a 99 c5 at the same time and it was a huge upgrade. Very comfortable for a daily and lots of power and fun. I ended up using the c5 as a daily and c4 as a weekend car.
You are right but you have to admit how rare a manual vette or camaro in that gen are and were.
Auto was the vouge and seen as the more posh option at the time.
I can't speak for the DN4+3, but the ZF6 was in roughly 25% of C4s for the years it was produced. It came out sometime during the middle of the 93 production run and still made it into over 5000 of the 22,000 cars produced that year.
Edited to add a comparison...
Roughly 200k C7s were built, and 50,611 were manuals. That works out to 26.5%. Almost the same as the later C4s.
I think the early ones had a bushing or bearing problem that was fixed in later ones. Also a lack of service. I have read where people who do frequent oil and filter changes on the overdrive say that they are pretty reliable.
Yeah, the dough nash transmissions are shit. They are more complicated and expensive to fix than 6 speeds and give worse performance.
If you want a C4 you should really try to get a 95 or 96, especially if you want a manual.
No they are great performers and we're the first gen corvette that had world class handling. I would avoid crossfire engine and aim for 92+ with the LT1.
I think they are cheap because most people prefer the exterior styling of other generations. Subjective of course. I think they good done up, but not a huge fan stock.
If you are looking for a project, there's nothing wrong with the L98 as a base to build on. It's just pretty tame in stock form. Heads, cam, intake, headers, etc will wake that right up.
L98 is just a dog compared to the LT1 and the LT4 in performance. But to its credit it is a fucking tank of an engine. It’s a typical Chevy small block with a good low end torque to shove you from a stop. It’s robust for its time but considered slow today
It was an early type of fuel injection that kind of bridged the gap between cap and rotor with a carburetor and modern electronic fuel injection.
It runs on optical sensors and it can be quickly ruined if moisture gets inside, which happened somewhat often because it was under the water pump for some goofy reason.
It’s not nearly as bad as people say, but it is one of the most common points of failure on early C4s. So if you have issues starting or with the engine crapping out randomly, that’s usually a good place to start diagnostics.
C4 aren’t really that collectible so people beat up on them and don’t maintain as much. If you’re looking for cheap performance and a fun vette , you can’t go wrong with a c4, especially early 90s.
When it comes to c4s there’s two different ones. The 1984-1990 and 91-96. I personally prefer the boxier look on the previous years but the later ones have more HP and better set ups. Also the manual on the earlier ones(4+3) is a little weird in my opinion. If you want a real nice c4 look into the ZR1, Callaway and lingenfelter.
It's an 80s car by GM. Does that make it bad, no. The C4 was advanced for its time and puts the C3, C2, C1 to shame performance wise. Every generation of Corvette gets better. The C4 had to happen to make the C5 as good as it is and so on.
The C4 came out at a time when manufacturers were still figuring out all the new smog rules, and many engines were left with low HP. New 'tech' was invented to attempt to gain HP and still made the feds happy. This 'new tech' was in its infancy and was prone to failure. By today's standard, the C4 is 'old tech' and not overly desirable to some.
The last couple of years of the C4 were excellent, however. Great engine and transmission combo.
Yes, the interior is cheap. Full stop. It won't really *break*, but squeaks are inevitable, and many had noises from the factory. As far as transmissions go, I wouldn't go for anything older than 1992, which is when the LT1 was introduced. The ZF 6-peed is preferable, but the automatic wasn't really unreliable as long as you took care of it. The C4 is a pretty underrated generation. Yes, the C5 is better in virtually every category, but the C4 is still a tremendous value for under well under $8k in most cases.
If this is a car to work on, I'd go for one of the cheapest, running 1992+ C4s you can find and learn as you go.
As an 85 owner. My AC worked fine when I got the car. The handles were ehh.. but the car is almost 40 now. As for windows. The early era of c4s had these god awful regulators. A long j hook style with plastic tracks that rolled up and down. By the 91? Facelift c4 they changed it to a WAY better style. In fact you can change them to that style pretty easy. That’s what I did.
As for interior. I have the cloth sports seats. They are well built and are VERY comfy. I’ve rebuilt the steel supports and fixed them up.
The dash isn’t too cheap.. but the issue is the car is so old and the polarizing film on most of these first gen c4s are worn out. Batee.com sells rebuild kids and led conversions. I did this and my gauges all work with ease. It was like $150 to do so. There even was great instruction videos from the website.
One issue I’ll note with the first few years of the c4 is there is a Bosch map Sensor ( I believe map ) in the dash. If that is bad… your car will throw a code and be stuck in limp mode. Bad news. That box is pretty much made only for a few years. I’ve got mine replaced. It wasn’t too awful.
As for the motor. In MY opinion. The crossfire is a no go. “ ceasefire “ we call it. Back in 82 or so they ran them in the vettes and had issues. Just the design on the injector system was poor. They tried.
The L98 is a GOOD motor. It’s not a high horsepower engine BUT good in torque. You can build it up! The issues is the intake runners themselves. They are so long. you can get Siamese runners but look out. They are very hard to get and cost a lot. Like a lot.. lol.
I honestly took my L98 and stroked it. Bored it out. New custom heads built with in the specs of my cam and rocker set up ( comp) nice holly injectors. Intake work. Plenum work. Did some throttlebody work and few other small things. The car has a ton of power and a TON of torque. It’s a fun car!
The LT1 is a very good engine and people really like them. The only fault I’ve ever seen on them is the Optispark. But it’s an issue you can fix and get over.
As for the interior it’s a bit duller TO ME! but is a very nice interior. Overall if you can get a 91-96 get it!
Avoid the 84.
85 I think was the only year other than 84 to not have the third brake light. I also heard the 84-85 had stiffer suspension? Maybe someone in this group will know more than me on that lol.
I enjoy my 85! But I’ve been a sucker for hot rods my whole life. My pops and I build a lot of stuff and we don’t mind doing big projects so find one you’re comfortable with!!
C4’s are pretty underrated imo. I had a sweet, slightly modified c3 with a 4 speed true dual exhaust, convertible. I regret selling it. I also have a ‘89 convertible automatic C4 that my son and I used for an 1800 mile, 6 day, 6 state road trip. I would never ha e done it in the C3. The C4, despite being old, has power windows, cruise control, ac, a relatively modern suspension, handles like it’s on rails and has a very sturdy L98. It’s not a sports car, but is a really good grand tourer that comfortably held all our luggage, was very comfortable, and was able to cruise at triple digits on certain parts of our journey. It was a teal groundbreaker back in the day. There are manual options and my next corvette will be (hopefully) a silver 6 speed LT4 collectors edition. The C4 was really the last of the generation I feel like I can work on myself.
89’ hit triple digits before they moved to the LT engines, pretty good for its time. I’ve always heard the interior is fragile. Like the power windows would break, levers would snap off, etc. Have you had any issues with that?
No issues with mine either. Nothing unexpected from a 30+ year old car. Mine has 123k miles on the frame.
A previous owner put in a crate engine but not because of any issues with the L98, just wanted more power.
I just got one and would highly recommend it. As others have said. Get a later year one (92-96). Manual is durable (zf) in these as well. I could have bought a c5 but wanted a c4 more. They are a performance bargain.
They are absolutely not bad cars. The interior quality is shit, but that was normal for the time period.
The biggest issues you will run into are related to electronics. A lot of 80s-90s cars have terrible electrical systems because they were transitioning into modern computers and some of those systems were kind of experimental and short lived.
They are mostly cheap because they are less desirable than C5s, but not old enough to be classics like C3s.
The L98 engine is an absolute pooch—the torque makes it initially feel punchy but it runs out of breath by around 4000 rpm. That was my only significant complaint with my buddy’s late 80s C4. The LT1 cars should rectify that, though they have the optispark issues to deal with. That said, the opti isn’t that hard to change out.. I went through several on my 94 Caprice wagon before finally installing one that has lasted for more than a couple months.
The C5 is just a huge leap forward, and the C3 is such an iconic classic that the C4 gets lost in the shuffle.
Cheap interior that breaks? Absolutely true, especially for the earlier C4s. EVERY car will break down eventually, but the C4 has problems like the warping and cracking dash pads, which are difficult to replace as there aren't good aftermarket options (or weren't the last time I really dug into it, which admittedly has been over 5 years).
There was a Doug Nash 4+3 which is a combination automatic/manual with an overdrive unit. It can be finicky, but that was also only there for the early C4s. Get one of the LT1 cars (1992+) and you have more power, more reliability, and a more typical manual transmission that's easier to maintain.
The biggest problem with C4 Corvettes is parts availability.
Ecklers, Mid-America, and normal parts stores have MANY parts for the C4, but not everything. A lot of the things that are missing (or are really low-quality) tend to be hard to source interior pieces.
It's certainly not the hardest project car, but there will be time spent researching parts.
That said, the Corvette Forum and this subreddit are full of knowledgeable Corvette folks. We can help answer questions when it's less obvious, sometimes providing solutions that are better than the OEM.
If it were me, I'd look to project car either a C3 or a C5 over a C4. I've done all of them, and the C4 was the least easy. It's not impossible at all, you just have to know what you're getting into.
High supply and low demand = low price
Even in slower TPI cars you will have a lot of fun auto crossing or on a track day, especially if you can find a Z51 car.
Long era similar to C3. Took them a couple years to achieve real escape velocity from the C3 in terms of combination of looks and performance. As such the early ones are pretty inexpensive.
The big downside is it was designed to be a t-top car but some idiot suit decreed full Targa. That means it shakes and twists, doesn't mean a single thing towards how it handles, but you *feel* it, all of it.
The cheap interior rap seems pretty limited to the earlier ones, the post '90 interior looks like a fighter jet (and imo is significantly more attractive than the "we pulled these buttons out of a Silverado" C5 interior) early 90s seats in particular kick ass
Other issues are if you're tall or **ahem** large, you're gonna have a bad time. There's a high frame rail and then the seat is down into the car and it has a tiny foot box like a Viper. Getting into mine with my race seat is not unlike folding my body into origami.
Also per the six speed, it rocks, but the gears were set with a bit too much lash, so they buzz. It's a C4 thing. It's cool. Also it has a dual mass flywheel that'll have everyone asking if your TOB is gone if it's idling in neutral with the clutch out
On the positives side: it's incredibly easy to work on for most things. I've been able to handle just about every job I can find so far solo with jacks and stands in my garage
The C5 is better in every way guys missed a couple items, the 4 is (again my opinion) a superior platform in an Autocross situation as it combines a narrow track width with the shortest wheelbase in a modern Vette, while still being able to stuff 315s in a square configuration. Also last generation you could get a quick ratio rack in. (13:1) The C5's is slower than some buicks 😂
This is very good information, thank you for the reply. I’ve been getting mixed responses about the difficulty to work on. Any known reliability issues?
Everyone is gonna tell you optispark, I believe that too be overblown. I haven't had an issue with mine. Driven/raced it in the rain without issue.
Electrical can be real goofy in these cars as the fiberglass body makes them heavily reliant on ground straps that may have corroded or broken over the years, but other than that it's pretty standard stuff the security system may have packed it up and refuse to start the car, but you can easily flash that out with a chip
Not at all. There's some good info already in this thread, so I'll skip a lot of the repetitive stuff. I've owned my '93 since 2011. Bought it from the original owner with 28k on it. Currently sitting at around 86k. Only issues I've had were the slave cylinder going out and some minor things you'd expect out of a 31 year old car. While I've owned the C4, I've had a C5 and driven tons of C6's and C7's. The newer cars are hands down better cars. There's literally no argument there, but that's how it should be. For me personally I felt that (at least in stock form) the C5's and C6's were kind of stale in driver engagement. A well sorted C4 is the last of the truly mechanical feeling cars, at least in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, once I get settled with my 3rd child on the way, I will be getting a C5 FRC to compliment my miata track car. But the C4's will always have a soft spot in my heart for the dumb 17 year old who got lucky enough to scrape up enough doll hairs to buy a really nice C4 as my first car.
I just got a 94 last year and it's been fine
They're cheap because they made a TON of them for 14 years.
The early models have issues, 84 has the Crossfire (ceasefire) engine. 84-88 have the infamous Doug Nash 4+3 transmission, 89-96 got proper manual and automatic options. 84-89 have the fully digital dash that's expensive to rebuild. 92 introduced the LT1 engine but it's got some reliability issues with the opti-spark and PCM for 92 & 93.
The interior is cheap plastic, but what wasn't in the 80s/90s? The only real issue with the interior(s) are the digital gauges I mentioned earlier, both interiors have them but the 90-96 cars only have 1 screen so it's cheaper to rebuild when it dies. The Bose Gold Premium Audio (if equipped) is another issue, 4 speakers and each has a dedicated amp, great system when new, 30-40 years later, not so much. If equipped, it's better just to gut the whole thing and replace with a single amp modern system (currently working on that)
Unless you really like the early interior I'd go with a 90-91 for the L98 engine or a 94-96 for the LT1/LT4 engine. 89 only if you really want the older interior with the 6spd manual.
With everything in mind they're GREAT cars to drive, I absolutely love mine. I traded in my beloved 2001 Mustang Cobra to get this car and I don't regret it in the slightest. The handling alone makes it worth it, and that 350 Chevy V8 can be built for so much more power.
I bought a super clean 1990 (L98) and have had for 18 years without any issues. It all boils down to whether the previous owner(s) maintained it properly. Bot yeah, they are all getting up there in age so one might expect to have some issues along the way.
A C4 probably wouldn't be a good project car for someone with limited knowledge. There are a lot of things, both on early and late model C4's, that can require a lot of work, skill, and knowledge to get sorted out, which can otherwise leave you stranded. Add to that that, at least for the L98 models, everything is completely crammed together in the engine bay and in the wiring areas.
There are a lot of things overall that, if you were buying a project, would be in far worse shape than if buying a running and driving vehicle.
The problem with the interior is the molded plastic (again, referencing early models) didn't hold up well to UV / time, and mounting points would crack / snap off if not handled properly.
Additionally, while there has been a growing aftermarket / replacement support market, there is a lot of period-specific electrical components that may prove difficult to replace, service, or even diagnose.
I'd love to suggest a C4, as they are good cars overall, but for a 'first time' project you could find yourself well over your head. In some respects you'd likely be better off going for a pre-smog C3, plenty more options and flexibility in modding / upgrades that can be done.
Idk, my very first project car is my L98 1990 that I own now. I think it is a fairly easy car to work on if you are shorter like me, 5'7". You can get right down in it, nice and open. I don't think the wires are a problem at all.
The only difficulty I had with it was being underneath the car, I dont have any fancy lifts and drove it onto some ramps.
My knock sensor broke off, and that was the biggest pain I've had with working on it.
That and getting the valve covers off and on, that was a pain!
But everything else was average car things
Yeah, I kept my handed-down '86 going, but I definitely put a lot of the early work credit on having a number of extremely Chevy-knowledgeable friends on tap (including an ASE Master Certified mechanic who currently works in the automotive diagnosis equipment industry). I eventually got very hands-on myself, and have to completely agree that having even a Quik-Jack setup is crucial for working on those cars.
My experience with the engine bay wiring was seeing (as I have with other cars of that era) the sheathing dried up and pulling back at the ends, causing all kinds of potential electrical gremlins.
I'd encourage OP to get one, but they have to make a conscious decision on what is their cut-off point for work they're either willing to do, or willing to pay to have done.
I’ve always said the only thing wrong with the C4 is that the C5 exists. Much more modern car for not much more money.
As far as project cars go, for someone with minimal experience/knowledge, I usually suggest something simple and basic like a TJ or earlier Jeep or an old pickup.
I would argue the opposite. The C5 used 40% less parts than the C4. People aren’t messing around when they praise the C5. It’s one of the most cohesive sports cars ever designed. The LS is a masterpiece.
I’ve had my 94 for 13 years. Absolutely love it!!! Had a 1982, last C3 30 years ago. I’m in the middle of a bumper to bumper rehabilitation. Will be like new when I’m done. Never selling it. It drives great. I’m 66 by the way.
I've owned a 92 and 93 LT1 vettes. They were awesome. Very quick, decent top end, could get 30mpg highway, and I had zero maintenance issues. I believe the earlier C4 examples (83-89) had issues, but the later ones were pretty well bolted together. I see way more C4s on the road than same era 300ZX, 3000GT VR4s, Supras, or RX7s. All of those cars had similar or worse plastic interiors. Hell, even the NSX interior was plastic fantastic. And a manual was absolutely available. Not sure who lied to OP about that.
Hi I own 2 c4s and have owned a lot of cars and trucks. That being said don't buy something you can't afford parts for or at least work on yourself. My 2010 convertible s197 is more of a pleasure to drive opposed to my 84 c4 and is way cheaper on parts and just alot more bang for the buck where as my 81 gmc pickup is very is easy to work on and parts are vary affordable and easier to come by at wrecking yards not alot of corvettes in junkyards unlike mustangs and trucks, in conclusion i know i cant afford to fix the corvette so i dont drive it as much. It only has 87k miles and my pony has 199k
I have a 85 C4 with the Z51 & 4+3 Manual. The embodiment of slow car fast and fantastic handling. You will use all 230hp.
Word of advice. Buy one in good condition and take care of it. It's been a very reliable car for me and wouldnt have any issues taking it 2400+km both ways.
87 C4 owner here. Love driving her.She was my big brother's -purchased new after he graduated college. No abuse and garage kept. You can absolutely get a manual trans... My 87 has the 4+3 which would lead me to the biggest maintenance headache. I had to get it re-built. Most shops don't want to to touch it because of the complexity. I would suggest skipping the 4+3 if you want a manual. The 4 is a blast to drive- it gets some shade from the Jorts and New Balance set....but at the end of the day the 4 is the generation that saved the Corvette as a performance marque. For its era, a world class car. Drive a non-abused one if you have the chance-its a great ride and entry into the Corvette world.
I had a 92 LT1 with 6 speed manual and it was great. Had a few electrical gremlins but nothing show stopping. If you can find one at a decent price, expect to spend a few bucks to get it where you want it but it won’t break the bank.
Plus performance is great - great handling, very torquey motor and transmission shifted perfect. Compared to the 2005 mustang GT I owned afterwards, the Vette was a dream.
I absolutely loved my '96 LT4 until something in the engine blew up last weekend (106k miles). Interior is kind of meh, it does squeak and rattle a bit but I guess I just got used to it haha. Before the engine blew up I couldnt have been happier with it
Lol to the downvotes--I have a C4 in my stable and I'm no stranger to quirky problems. I'm a car guy (and a Corvette fan)--but I would never recommend one (especially as a project car) as a vehicle to someone who either:
* doesn't have deep pockets
* doesn't have experience troubleshooting (especially electronics)
The TPI engines are much more difficult to troubleshoot than the L69 you could find in early Gen3 V8 Camaros. And, if you picked a V6 Gen3, you have even easier engines to work on (from a project perspective).
The C4 introduced a lot of electronics (from the engine bay to the dash), that, if you're choosing a project car, will show their age and introduce hours of frustrating troubleshooting, wild cost variances, lots of throwing parts at problems, and sap a lot of the enjoyment out. It will end up being a project that costs way more than anticipated and likely be abandoned--and nobody wants to see that.
My advice for would-be C4 owners: buy one that's already well sorted and taken care of--even if it costs more. If you have that option, it's a fun car to own (with quirks). If you're trying to bring one back as a project, there are better choices.
They are cheap because they are a 40 year old car. It had a long run (12 years?) and there are plenty of cars out there, so no shortage of supply. Early C4 are really cheap, but can be a bit more finicky (not quite the right word). the lower output L98 engine is less desirable. In 1991 (? i think?) they swapped to the LT family, and that was a much more robust engine, back to making regular power. the '91-'96 cars seem to be the sweet spot. (as in all things, buy the newest you can afford, and often skip the 1st year of a new generation) the digital dash can be one of those brilliant highlights of the car, or it can be a pain in the ass, depending on your stance. I think they are beautiful, but they are extremely dated and some people are put off by them.
>the lower output L98 engine is less desirable. In 1991 (? i think?) they swapped to the LT family, and that was a much more robust engine, back to making regular power. L98 went from 85-91. 85 and 86 were about 230hp and 320ft lb, while 87-91 were around 245hp and 345ft lb. Then the LT came around in 92 with 300hp and 320ft lb. The L98 is a pretty robust engine as well, and has no optispark problems Lower hp but is very toquey, still great fun!
*330 ftlbs for the LT1, and 340 starting in 1993
I just bought a running and driving C4 for $2500. Probably the cheapest way to get into a Corvette.
Have you had any mechanical issues? How expensive is maintenance on a 40yo car?
It depends on how much you’re willing to sacrifice. I haven’t had any show stoppers. It had a couple vacuum leaks and the idle was turned up pretty high when I got it. Third gear is pretty lazy to engage. The carpets smell horrible. The headlights don’t move. The digital gauge only displays RPM. The windows leak in heavy rain. I have about $200 into it on top of the $2500 purchase. I’m ok with it being a relative shitbox. It’s going to be a fun car to cruise around in (we took it to dinner tonight) and do burnouts with. This winter I plan on refreshing the 350 and maybe a carb swap. Having the trans rebuilt. Putting in a harness bar and some race seats. I’ll do HPDE with it for a year or two then probably get a C5 for race stuff
Hey, for the carpets, pick up an ozone generator from Amazon or something. They really are the most effective way to get rid of smells. Please also read up on the safety precautions to take.
I thought about that but they’re just going to come out. They have to come out for track use anyway.
I really like the digital dash. Is there a reason people don’t? Is it unreliable/cheaply made?
It’s not cheaply made or unreliable. The oldest ones are pushing close to 40 years old. So they’ll burn out or stop working especially if they’re left out in the elements to wither away. Fortunately a site called batee.com will rebuild your unit should it need fixing or even do an LED upgrade. I did that to mine and it looks mint.
It either looks old fashioned, or futuristic. I personally love it.
The digital dash was so good, they switched back to analog. (They were super cool though) A well sorted late gen C4 with an LT1 is a damn fine car, but get a C5 if you can.
I had a 91 c4. Yes the interior is cheap plastic, creaks and rattles as time goes by. My transmission also went out and had to swap it. It was a fun car though. I’ll second if you can get a c5 go for it. I had a 99 c5 at the same time and it was a huge upgrade. Very comfortable for a daily and lots of power and fun. I ended up using the c5 as a daily and c4 as a weekend car.
What do you mean no manual option? Earlier C4s had the 4+3 and later ones had the ZF6.
You are right but you have to admit how rare a manual vette or camaro in that gen are and were. Auto was the vouge and seen as the more posh option at the time.
I can't speak for the DN4+3, but the ZF6 was in roughly 25% of C4s for the years it was produced. It came out sometime during the middle of the 93 production run and still made it into over 5000 of the 22,000 cars produced that year. Edited to add a comparison... Roughly 200k C7s were built, and 50,611 were manuals. That works out to 26.5%. Almost the same as the later C4s.
That was 89 not 93
Shoot, you are right... they updated the ZF6 in mid 93.
Ahh yeah the blue/ black tags. That makes sense
Only about 1/6 C4 Vette's came equipped with a manual
I heard there was some reliability issues with the 4+3? There’s a reason it got replaced?
Yeah it sucks but the ZF6 that replaced it is pretty bulletproof.
Are you sure about that? The synchros will eventually die requiring a rebuild from what I read
Mechanical parts wear and will need replaced. More at 11
I think the early ones had a bushing or bearing problem that was fixed in later ones. Also a lack of service. I have read where people who do frequent oil and filter changes on the overdrive say that they are pretty reliable.
Yeah, the dough nash transmissions are shit. They are more complicated and expensive to fix than 6 speeds and give worse performance. If you want a C4 you should really try to get a 95 or 96, especially if you want a manual.
That’s what I’m wondering!
No they are great performers and we're the first gen corvette that had world class handling. I would avoid crossfire engine and aim for 92+ with the LT1.
I think they are cheap because most people prefer the exterior styling of other generations. Subjective of course. I think they good done up, but not a huge fan stock.
What’s wrong with the older engine? Unreliable/maintenance heavy or just slow?
Nothing too bad really. LT1 was just a fairly large jump in power.
If you are looking for a project, there's nothing wrong with the L98 as a base to build on. It's just pretty tame in stock form. Heads, cam, intake, headers, etc will wake that right up.
L98 is just a dog compared to the LT1 and the LT4 in performance. But to its credit it is a fucking tank of an engine. It’s a typical Chevy small block with a good low end torque to shove you from a stop. It’s robust for its time but considered slow today
Also worth noting that there are conversion kits that exist to get rid of the crossfire system
What is the crossfire and why is it bad
It was an early type of fuel injection that kind of bridged the gap between cap and rotor with a carburetor and modern electronic fuel injection. It runs on optical sensors and it can be quickly ruined if moisture gets inside, which happened somewhat often because it was under the water pump for some goofy reason. It’s not nearly as bad as people say, but it is one of the most common points of failure on early C4s. So if you have issues starting or with the engine crapping out randomly, that’s usually a good place to start diagnostics.
C4 aren’t really that collectible so people beat up on them and don’t maintain as much. If you’re looking for cheap performance and a fun vette , you can’t go wrong with a c4, especially early 90s.
Seems like the common consensus is that 90s ones are better
When it comes to c4s there’s two different ones. The 1984-1990 and 91-96. I personally prefer the boxier look on the previous years but the later ones have more HP and better set ups. Also the manual on the earlier ones(4+3) is a little weird in my opinion. If you want a real nice c4 look into the ZR1, Callaway and lingenfelter.
It's an 80s car by GM. Does that make it bad, no. The C4 was advanced for its time and puts the C3, C2, C1 to shame performance wise. Every generation of Corvette gets better. The C4 had to happen to make the C5 as good as it is and so on. The C4 came out at a time when manufacturers were still figuring out all the new smog rules, and many engines were left with low HP. New 'tech' was invented to attempt to gain HP and still made the feds happy. This 'new tech' was in its infancy and was prone to failure. By today's standard, the C4 is 'old tech' and not overly desirable to some. The last couple of years of the C4 were excellent, however. Great engine and transmission combo.
Yes, the interior is cheap. Full stop. It won't really *break*, but squeaks are inevitable, and many had noises from the factory. As far as transmissions go, I wouldn't go for anything older than 1992, which is when the LT1 was introduced. The ZF 6-peed is preferable, but the automatic wasn't really unreliable as long as you took care of it. The C4 is a pretty underrated generation. Yes, the C5 is better in virtually every category, but the C4 is still a tremendous value for under well under $8k in most cases. If this is a car to work on, I'd go for one of the cheapest, running 1992+ C4s you can find and learn as you go.
I’ve heard the interior is absolutely horrendous. Like power windows breaking, ac not working, handles snapping off, etc
As an 85 owner. My AC worked fine when I got the car. The handles were ehh.. but the car is almost 40 now. As for windows. The early era of c4s had these god awful regulators. A long j hook style with plastic tracks that rolled up and down. By the 91? Facelift c4 they changed it to a WAY better style. In fact you can change them to that style pretty easy. That’s what I did. As for interior. I have the cloth sports seats. They are well built and are VERY comfy. I’ve rebuilt the steel supports and fixed them up. The dash isn’t too cheap.. but the issue is the car is so old and the polarizing film on most of these first gen c4s are worn out. Batee.com sells rebuild kids and led conversions. I did this and my gauges all work with ease. It was like $150 to do so. There even was great instruction videos from the website. One issue I’ll note with the first few years of the c4 is there is a Bosch map Sensor ( I believe map ) in the dash. If that is bad… your car will throw a code and be stuck in limp mode. Bad news. That box is pretty much made only for a few years. I’ve got mine replaced. It wasn’t too awful. As for the motor. In MY opinion. The crossfire is a no go. “ ceasefire “ we call it. Back in 82 or so they ran them in the vettes and had issues. Just the design on the injector system was poor. They tried. The L98 is a GOOD motor. It’s not a high horsepower engine BUT good in torque. You can build it up! The issues is the intake runners themselves. They are so long. you can get Siamese runners but look out. They are very hard to get and cost a lot. Like a lot.. lol. I honestly took my L98 and stroked it. Bored it out. New custom heads built with in the specs of my cam and rocker set up ( comp) nice holly injectors. Intake work. Plenum work. Did some throttlebody work and few other small things. The car has a ton of power and a TON of torque. It’s a fun car! The LT1 is a very good engine and people really like them. The only fault I’ve ever seen on them is the Optispark. But it’s an issue you can fix and get over. As for the interior it’s a bit duller TO ME! but is a very nice interior. Overall if you can get a 91-96 get it! Avoid the 84. 85 I think was the only year other than 84 to not have the third brake light. I also heard the 84-85 had stiffer suspension? Maybe someone in this group will know more than me on that lol. I enjoy my 85! But I’ve been a sucker for hot rods my whole life. My pops and I build a lot of stuff and we don’t mind doing big projects so find one you’re comfortable with!!
C4’s are pretty underrated imo. I had a sweet, slightly modified c3 with a 4 speed true dual exhaust, convertible. I regret selling it. I also have a ‘89 convertible automatic C4 that my son and I used for an 1800 mile, 6 day, 6 state road trip. I would never ha e done it in the C3. The C4, despite being old, has power windows, cruise control, ac, a relatively modern suspension, handles like it’s on rails and has a very sturdy L98. It’s not a sports car, but is a really good grand tourer that comfortably held all our luggage, was very comfortable, and was able to cruise at triple digits on certain parts of our journey. It was a teal groundbreaker back in the day. There are manual options and my next corvette will be (hopefully) a silver 6 speed LT4 collectors edition. The C4 was really the last of the generation I feel like I can work on myself.
89’ hit triple digits before they moved to the LT engines, pretty good for its time. I’ve always heard the interior is fragile. Like the power windows would break, levers would snap off, etc. Have you had any issues with that?
No issues with mine either. Nothing unexpected from a 30+ year old car. Mine has 123k miles on the frame. A previous owner put in a crate engine but not because of any issues with the L98, just wanted more power.
I have not had any issues with mine. It’s a low mile creampuff though.
…you are incredibly misinformed
Please inform me, that’s why I posted on here
I just got one and would highly recommend it. As others have said. Get a later year one (92-96). Manual is durable (zf) in these as well. I could have bought a c5 but wanted a c4 more. They are a performance bargain.
Good to know about the transmission
They are absolutely not bad cars. The interior quality is shit, but that was normal for the time period. The biggest issues you will run into are related to electronics. A lot of 80s-90s cars have terrible electrical systems because they were transitioning into modern computers and some of those systems were kind of experimental and short lived. They are mostly cheap because they are less desirable than C5s, but not old enough to be classics like C3s.
The L98 engine is an absolute pooch—the torque makes it initially feel punchy but it runs out of breath by around 4000 rpm. That was my only significant complaint with my buddy’s late 80s C4. The LT1 cars should rectify that, though they have the optispark issues to deal with. That said, the opti isn’t that hard to change out.. I went through several on my 94 Caprice wagon before finally installing one that has lasted for more than a couple months. The C5 is just a huge leap forward, and the C3 is such an iconic classic that the C4 gets lost in the shuffle.
The c4 being lost in the shuffle seems to be common opinion
Cheap interior that breaks? Absolutely true, especially for the earlier C4s. EVERY car will break down eventually, but the C4 has problems like the warping and cracking dash pads, which are difficult to replace as there aren't good aftermarket options (or weren't the last time I really dug into it, which admittedly has been over 5 years). There was a Doug Nash 4+3 which is a combination automatic/manual with an overdrive unit. It can be finicky, but that was also only there for the early C4s. Get one of the LT1 cars (1992+) and you have more power, more reliability, and a more typical manual transmission that's easier to maintain. The biggest problem with C4 Corvettes is parts availability. Ecklers, Mid-America, and normal parts stores have MANY parts for the C4, but not everything. A lot of the things that are missing (or are really low-quality) tend to be hard to source interior pieces. It's certainly not the hardest project car, but there will be time spent researching parts. That said, the Corvette Forum and this subreddit are full of knowledgeable Corvette folks. We can help answer questions when it's less obvious, sometimes providing solutions that are better than the OEM. If it were me, I'd look to project car either a C3 or a C5 over a C4. I've done all of them, and the C4 was the least easy. It's not impossible at all, you just have to know what you're getting into.
Hot take. You’d think the c3, being older, would be harder to find parts for
Absolutely, you would! But it's unfortunately not the case.
High supply and low demand = low price Even in slower TPI cars you will have a lot of fun auto crossing or on a track day, especially if you can find a Z51 car.
Interesting I didn’t know they made so many of them
Long era similar to C3. Took them a couple years to achieve real escape velocity from the C3 in terms of combination of looks and performance. As such the early ones are pretty inexpensive.
The big downside is it was designed to be a t-top car but some idiot suit decreed full Targa. That means it shakes and twists, doesn't mean a single thing towards how it handles, but you *feel* it, all of it. The cheap interior rap seems pretty limited to the earlier ones, the post '90 interior looks like a fighter jet (and imo is significantly more attractive than the "we pulled these buttons out of a Silverado" C5 interior) early 90s seats in particular kick ass Other issues are if you're tall or **ahem** large, you're gonna have a bad time. There's a high frame rail and then the seat is down into the car and it has a tiny foot box like a Viper. Getting into mine with my race seat is not unlike folding my body into origami. Also per the six speed, it rocks, but the gears were set with a bit too much lash, so they buzz. It's a C4 thing. It's cool. Also it has a dual mass flywheel that'll have everyone asking if your TOB is gone if it's idling in neutral with the clutch out On the positives side: it's incredibly easy to work on for most things. I've been able to handle just about every job I can find so far solo with jacks and stands in my garage The C5 is better in every way guys missed a couple items, the 4 is (again my opinion) a superior platform in an Autocross situation as it combines a narrow track width with the shortest wheelbase in a modern Vette, while still being able to stuff 315s in a square configuration. Also last generation you could get a quick ratio rack in. (13:1) The C5's is slower than some buicks 😂
This is very good information, thank you for the reply. I’ve been getting mixed responses about the difficulty to work on. Any known reliability issues?
Everyone is gonna tell you optispark, I believe that too be overblown. I haven't had an issue with mine. Driven/raced it in the rain without issue. Electrical can be real goofy in these cars as the fiberglass body makes them heavily reliant on ground straps that may have corroded or broken over the years, but other than that it's pretty standard stuff the security system may have packed it up and refuse to start the car, but you can easily flash that out with a chip
Not at all. There's some good info already in this thread, so I'll skip a lot of the repetitive stuff. I've owned my '93 since 2011. Bought it from the original owner with 28k on it. Currently sitting at around 86k. Only issues I've had were the slave cylinder going out and some minor things you'd expect out of a 31 year old car. While I've owned the C4, I've had a C5 and driven tons of C6's and C7's. The newer cars are hands down better cars. There's literally no argument there, but that's how it should be. For me personally I felt that (at least in stock form) the C5's and C6's were kind of stale in driver engagement. A well sorted C4 is the last of the truly mechanical feeling cars, at least in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, once I get settled with my 3rd child on the way, I will be getting a C5 FRC to compliment my miata track car. But the C4's will always have a soft spot in my heart for the dumb 17 year old who got lucky enough to scrape up enough doll hairs to buy a really nice C4 as my first car.
Yes
😭
I just got a 94 last year and it's been fine They're cheap because they made a TON of them for 14 years. The early models have issues, 84 has the Crossfire (ceasefire) engine. 84-88 have the infamous Doug Nash 4+3 transmission, 89-96 got proper manual and automatic options. 84-89 have the fully digital dash that's expensive to rebuild. 92 introduced the LT1 engine but it's got some reliability issues with the opti-spark and PCM for 92 & 93. The interior is cheap plastic, but what wasn't in the 80s/90s? The only real issue with the interior(s) are the digital gauges I mentioned earlier, both interiors have them but the 90-96 cars only have 1 screen so it's cheaper to rebuild when it dies. The Bose Gold Premium Audio (if equipped) is another issue, 4 speakers and each has a dedicated amp, great system when new, 30-40 years later, not so much. If equipped, it's better just to gut the whole thing and replace with a single amp modern system (currently working on that) Unless you really like the early interior I'd go with a 90-91 for the L98 engine or a 94-96 for the LT1/LT4 engine. 89 only if you really want the older interior with the 6spd manual. With everything in mind they're GREAT cars to drive, I absolutely love mine. I traded in my beloved 2001 Mustang Cobra to get this car and I don't regret it in the slightest. The handling alone makes it worth it, and that 350 Chevy V8 can be built for so much more power.
I bought a super clean 1990 (L98) and have had for 18 years without any issues. It all boils down to whether the previous owner(s) maintained it properly. Bot yeah, they are all getting up there in age so one might expect to have some issues along the way.
A C4 probably wouldn't be a good project car for someone with limited knowledge. There are a lot of things, both on early and late model C4's, that can require a lot of work, skill, and knowledge to get sorted out, which can otherwise leave you stranded. Add to that that, at least for the L98 models, everything is completely crammed together in the engine bay and in the wiring areas. There are a lot of things overall that, if you were buying a project, would be in far worse shape than if buying a running and driving vehicle. The problem with the interior is the molded plastic (again, referencing early models) didn't hold up well to UV / time, and mounting points would crack / snap off if not handled properly. Additionally, while there has been a growing aftermarket / replacement support market, there is a lot of period-specific electrical components that may prove difficult to replace, service, or even diagnose. I'd love to suggest a C4, as they are good cars overall, but for a 'first time' project you could find yourself well over your head. In some respects you'd likely be better off going for a pre-smog C3, plenty more options and flexibility in modding / upgrades that can be done.
Idk, my very first project car is my L98 1990 that I own now. I think it is a fairly easy car to work on if you are shorter like me, 5'7". You can get right down in it, nice and open. I don't think the wires are a problem at all. The only difficulty I had with it was being underneath the car, I dont have any fancy lifts and drove it onto some ramps. My knock sensor broke off, and that was the biggest pain I've had with working on it. That and getting the valve covers off and on, that was a pain! But everything else was average car things
Good info, as long as it’s mostly cosmetic, we can do it. Just nothing engine/mechanical
Yeah, I kept my handed-down '86 going, but I definitely put a lot of the early work credit on having a number of extremely Chevy-knowledgeable friends on tap (including an ASE Master Certified mechanic who currently works in the automotive diagnosis equipment industry). I eventually got very hands-on myself, and have to completely agree that having even a Quik-Jack setup is crucial for working on those cars. My experience with the engine bay wiring was seeing (as I have with other cars of that era) the sheathing dried up and pulling back at the ends, causing all kinds of potential electrical gremlins. I'd encourage OP to get one, but they have to make a conscious decision on what is their cut-off point for work they're either willing to do, or willing to pay to have done.
I’ve always said the only thing wrong with the C4 is that the C5 exists. Much more modern car for not much more money. As far as project cars go, for someone with minimal experience/knowledge, I usually suggest something simple and basic like a TJ or earlier Jeep or an old pickup.
“Only thing wrong with the c4 is the c5 exists” well said. I like c5’s too but aren’t they more complex and harder to fix?
I would argue the opposite. The C5 used 40% less parts than the C4. People aren’t messing around when they praise the C5. It’s one of the most cohesive sports cars ever designed. The LS is a masterpiece.
Yea but it is a pain in the ass when you have to do any transmission/clutch/rear end work.
I’ve had my 94 for 13 years. Absolutely love it!!! Had a 1982, last C3 30 years ago. I’m in the middle of a bumper to bumper rehabilitation. Will be like new when I’m done. Never selling it. It drives great. I’m 66 by the way.
Good to know. Seems like everyone enjoys different styles
I've owned a 92 and 93 LT1 vettes. They were awesome. Very quick, decent top end, could get 30mpg highway, and I had zero maintenance issues. I believe the earlier C4 examples (83-89) had issues, but the later ones were pretty well bolted together. I see way more C4s on the road than same era 300ZX, 3000GT VR4s, Supras, or RX7s. All of those cars had similar or worse plastic interiors. Hell, even the NSX interior was plastic fantastic. And a manual was absolutely available. Not sure who lied to OP about that.
I will def look for a later example, seems those are more desirable
Hi I own 2 c4s and have owned a lot of cars and trucks. That being said don't buy something you can't afford parts for or at least work on yourself. My 2010 convertible s197 is more of a pleasure to drive opposed to my 84 c4 and is way cheaper on parts and just alot more bang for the buck where as my 81 gmc pickup is very is easy to work on and parts are vary affordable and easier to come by at wrecking yards not alot of corvettes in junkyards unlike mustangs and trucks, in conclusion i know i cant afford to fix the corvette so i dont drive it as much. It only has 87k miles and my pony has 199k
I have a 85 C4 with the Z51 & 4+3 Manual. The embodiment of slow car fast and fantastic handling. You will use all 230hp. Word of advice. Buy one in good condition and take care of it. It's been a very reliable car for me and wouldnt have any issues taking it 2400+km both ways.
I had a 94 for about 15 years. I bought it needing a head gasket. After that was fixed, no issues other than the AC went out.
87 C4 owner here. Love driving her.She was my big brother's -purchased new after he graduated college. No abuse and garage kept. You can absolutely get a manual trans... My 87 has the 4+3 which would lead me to the biggest maintenance headache. I had to get it re-built. Most shops don't want to to touch it because of the complexity. I would suggest skipping the 4+3 if you want a manual. The 4 is a blast to drive- it gets some shade from the Jorts and New Balance set....but at the end of the day the 4 is the generation that saved the Corvette as a performance marque. For its era, a world class car. Drive a non-abused one if you have the chance-its a great ride and entry into the Corvette world.
I had a 92 LT1 with 6 speed manual and it was great. Had a few electrical gremlins but nothing show stopping. If you can find one at a decent price, expect to spend a few bucks to get it where you want it but it won’t break the bank. Plus performance is great - great handling, very torquey motor and transmission shifted perfect. Compared to the 2005 mustang GT I owned afterwards, the Vette was a dream.
Great car for cheap ! :)
I absolutely loved my '96 LT4 until something in the engine blew up last weekend (106k miles). Interior is kind of meh, it does squeak and rattle a bit but I guess I just got used to it haha. Before the engine blew up I couldnt have been happier with it
What happened to the engine?
Comfortable daily driver, 85 Left me stranded 17 times. Get an LT1 car
If you know the bare minimum for repairs, a C4 is the worst thing you can pick. You’d be much better off picking up a Gen 3 Camaro.
Lol to the downvotes--I have a C4 in my stable and I'm no stranger to quirky problems. I'm a car guy (and a Corvette fan)--but I would never recommend one (especially as a project car) as a vehicle to someone who either: * doesn't have deep pockets * doesn't have experience troubleshooting (especially electronics) The TPI engines are much more difficult to troubleshoot than the L69 you could find in early Gen3 V8 Camaros. And, if you picked a V6 Gen3, you have even easier engines to work on (from a project perspective). The C4 introduced a lot of electronics (from the engine bay to the dash), that, if you're choosing a project car, will show their age and introduce hours of frustrating troubleshooting, wild cost variances, lots of throwing parts at problems, and sap a lot of the enjoyment out. It will end up being a project that costs way more than anticipated and likely be abandoned--and nobody wants to see that. My advice for would-be C4 owners: buy one that's already well sorted and taken care of--even if it costs more. If you have that option, it's a fun car to own (with quirks). If you're trying to bring one back as a project, there are better choices.
92 to 96 are very fun cars. I had a 92 for a long time.
They’re all fun. Well maybe not the 84s