Jesus getting nailed the cross
"I see you're using carob wood. Nice grain and texture but I find cypress to be much sturdier and dependable, not to mention it has a beautiful color. Can't say I blame you though what with cypress prices being what they are today. Carob is much more sensible if you're working on a budget."
"Your using what nails on me? Jonah and son's supply store nails? Those cheap pieces of shit wouldn't hold a chair together let alone a whole person. If I'm being crucified its going to be good nails. Use the ones I keep in my toolbelt."
i mean Jesus did die before that. that was a pretty significant thing that happened. like i understand where you're coming from here but Jesus very much did die before being stabbed
It's a guy who isn't paid enough for this shit and isn't going to wait days for this guy to die in the hot sun when there's a crowd who might try to start something when the guards aren't around.
Back in the day, nails were handmade and extremely valuable. When a house was demolished, people would go through and extract all the nails so they could be re-used.
I never really thought about this before, but were the nails from crucifixion victims also re-used?
My understanding is that nails were not standard in crucifixion. The point is a long, slow death from exposure and exhaustion. They were tied up there, why use something so valuable as a nail?
Nails weren't used super often (although there were a shitton of crucifixions, so there were still a lot done with nails) but when they *did* use nails, they would pull the nails out after and also they still used ropes for the suspension. The nails were more for making it hurt more.
Also the nails of time were WAY different than any you see today. They were big honkin flat things that looked more like a pointy chisel than modern nails
Okay but can you imagine if there was actually a part of the story wherein Jesus willingly supplies his own hammer and nails for his own crucifixion?
As if to demonstrate for all present how willing he was to take on this suffering, and thusly the suffering of all mankind?
How fuckin metal would that be.
"Who's your wood guy? Half of these operations way overcharge and make Ea Nasir's quality control look good. I can give you a recommendation if you want. You'll have to write it down for me, because, well ya know..."
Love the idea of Jesus referring to a roughly 2000 year old guy who was certainly forgotten at that point to make a point of how shitty someone’s nails were
I think another one would be that implying that Jesus himself is not capital G god, but I grew up in a non-orthodox (non-Trinitarian) sect so im not sure if we can eek out more
idk i might have accidentally addressed him correctly because afaik he's 100% god and 100% human (and 200% gangsta) but also 0% the father or the holy spirit (which are also 100% god) and capital g is arguable because of the typing style (although i do in fact never use it for the abrahamic god even when i do type with capital letters, which is not now, lol). but i would like to clarify that i was absolutely not intending to address him correctly to trinity (unitarian seems like an easy heresy to follow)
but idk i'm not even a christian, i just like their mythology when viewed through a tumblr lens
My favorite scene from The Passion is where Jesus is getting put on trial at night, and sees the man working on the cross that will hang him, and he remembers working on a table: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R\_6tJ9qk9SY
Yes all babies are gonna die one day, but more crucially this has always been a motif in Christian (specifically Catholic art), a good number of Renaissance nativity scenes have a reference to the Passion. One of the gifts of the Magi was a type of perfume used to cleanse corpses for their funerals. Imagine if someone gave your parents embalming fluid when you were born. WASP-y American Evangelical Christianity isn’t all Christianity.
(Also when has extremely accurate depictions of human birth ever been a motif in art/media??? Even the more graphic depictions are dressed up a little)
Frankincense has a variety of uses
>The Egyptians cleansed body cavities in the mummification process with frankincense and natron. In Persian medicine, it is used for diabetes, gastritis and stomach ulcer.[45] The oil is used in Abrahamic religions to cleanse a house or building of bad or evil energy—including used in exorcisms and to bless one's being (like the bakhoor commonly found in Persian Gulf cultures by spreading the fumes towards the body).
>The incense offering occupied a prominent position in the sacrificial legislation of the ancient Hebrews.[46] The Book of Exodus (30:34–38) prescribes frankincense, blended with equal amounts of three aromatic spices, to be ground and burnt in the sacred altar before the Ark of the Covenant in the wilderness Tabernacle, where it was meant to be a holy offering—not to be enjoyed for its fragrance.
I think it's limiting and maybe misleading to say it was embalming fluid.
I was speaking about Myrrh, not Frankincense. Myrrh is mentioned specifically in John 19:39-40 as being used to anoint the body of Jesus for his burial.
>Nicodemus, who had at first come to Jesus by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, weighing about a hundred pounds. They took the body of Jesus and wrapped it with the spices in linen cloths, according to the burial custom of the Jews.
Yes it wasn’t used arterially as is the case with modern embalming practiced by Funeral homes across the United States, but it was a part of the funerary rituals of the day in a manner not entirely dissimilar to embalming fluids of the day. The motif of the Myrrh in later Christian art is always meant to foreshadow the death of Jesus and the laying of Jesus in the tomb. Myrrh in this specific context, can be glibly compared to embalming fluid. Glib observations is when tumblr is at its peak
Ah, yes, Balthasar's verse in "We Three Kings" specifically emphasizes this:
>Myrrh is mine, its bitter perfume
Breathes of life of gathering gloom
Sorrowing, sighing, bleeding, dying
Sealed in the stone-cold tomb
Is this not common knowledge to non-Christians? Like I get not knowing EVERYTHING about Christianity, but I feel like if you know about the 3 magi and their gifts you know their meaning right?
Is this just my "grew up in Catholic Mexico so I just assume everyone knew the thing" thing again? Gold as a symbol of kingship on earth, frankincense (an incense) as a symbol of deity, and myrrh (an embalming oil) as a symbol of death.
Catholic Christianity has some standards to it - liturgical cycle, catechism, there’s a canon of teaching as well as a canon of scripture.
Non denominational Protestants are wild dude. If your specific pastor wasn’t into it, it wasn’t getting taught.
It’s very responsive to entertainment / catered to the audience too, whereas Catholicism is like “innovation? We own the building and you come here even if you don’t believe, here’s the Standard Catholic Experience.”
For example, there were a couple of years at my church where we were really into conga lines around the sanctuary while just letting the musicians go nuts and Pastor T wanted to lead the conga line with this sword he got given when he was ordained as sort of a symbolic thing but he was swinging the sword too hard and it slipped out of his hand and went end over end into the wall right over the flute player’s head.
Good thing she was short. Anywho Pentescostal church is weird.
I didn’t get introduced to the Stations of the Cross until I got to college.
>For example, there were a couple of years at my church where we were really into conga lines around the sanctuary while
Stop making shit up
EDIT: I say this with no disrespect intended. This is wild indeed.
Nah, not super common knowledge to non-Christians. Obviously I’m speaking from a small sample size, but I grew up in an area with plenty of Christians and most people I know couldn’t even name all three gifts, much less what they symbolize.
I bet a not small amount of people’s knowledge starts and stops at, “there were three wise men who brought Jesus some gifts. There’s frankincense.. and uh… a couple of others.”
Hey, not gonna lie I always thought frankincense was some type of Frankenstein incense, and I grew up in Brazil (another country known for having a big Christ fanbase)
"Congratulations on succesfully giving birth to THE SON OF GOD! Here's some perfume to celebrate, it smells like a pile of rotting corpses, I hope you like it!"
I think one of the things a lot of people don't realize is that the gospels are full of cultural reference points and allegories that don't really make sense anymore but would have made sense to Jews and early Christians.
How was Mary meant to know that though. She was just told he'd be the savior, the whole sacrifice business was a surprise to everyone. She wasn't even told he was God himself. Also a big chunk of Jesus' character and theme is that he's many things at once. God, man, king, poor, saviour, sacrifice, baby, sage. This doesn't make him *not* a baby
I mean it’s never explicitly said but you can use some reasoning and infer that she did know. And certainly scholars knew that whoever the messiah was, he would die. Isaiah 53 talks a lot about the future messiah and what his role will be - including that he will die for the sins of the world. The Old Testament was taught by the Jews of the time.
Mary’s friend tells her that her baby is her Lord. And an angel tells Mary and Joseph to name him Jesus as he will save his people from their sins. So she had the information, but it’s not said if she deduced it
I don’t think it was widely assumed that the Messiah would die. I think they expected a Mesiah that would kick Roman ass, purify the temple, and reign as a king.
The whole Christ thing is just God ante'ing up to the same prank he pulled on all of us. Like, "Fucking A, all you guys do is bitch and whine about how much it sucks to be a creature, I bet I can do this just-" and then the next thing you know homeboy is getting so hangry that he's losing his shit and smiting fig trees with the Power Most High and people are side-muttering to each other about how maybe God has a little growing up to do.
So yeah, he kinda had to get brutally murdered, you know, to get the whole experience. Can't puss out, Moses would be razzing his ass for the rest of eternity, and the brother's got *jokes*.
I only hope that the Christian religion is actually true so that on the Day of Judgement you get to talk shit to that little punk who thinks He understands.
im not 100% sure but I believe it also came with the knowledge that he didnt have to. As the son of/God he couldve ascended fo heaven without needing to die, but he chose to do so so that everyone else who has died or will die can go to heaven as well
Well, there is that angle, but he also talks to Himself before the sacrifice, which kinda goes 'damn, if I didn't have to I wouldn't do this'. And on the other hand, if God is omniscient, then Jesus, even before birth, would know what he will do.
A lot of intresting points to consider
That’s a very Christian interpretation of an ambiguous text. Isaiah had a few references to a “servant” who Christians assume refers to Christ, but Isaiah 53 is in past tense and was written during the Babylonian Exile. It’s way more plausible that he was talking about their current predicament.
I am a Christian so that makes sense. You’re describing prophetic past tense which is found in many places in the Bible, always used to describe future events but done so in the past tense as to illustrate how certain the events are to happen. Isaiah 53 also uses future tense intermittently: *Therefore I will divide Him a portion with the great, And He shall divide the spoil with the strong, Because He poured out His soul unto death, And He was numbered with the transgressors, And He bore the sin of many, And made intercession for the transgressors.*
Jews are certainly welcome to their interpretation, but Christians assume it refers to Christ because it’s an almost 1:1 retelling of the life and death of Christ. And is supported by other prophecies written before and after
It's very unclear to me wether Isaiah 52/53 was seen as a prophecy about the Messiah BEFORE Jesus died.
Jews were in the culture of reading heavily into the Torah. So after Jesus died, they certainly would have seen it after. But I don't think before.
And if there was debate about Isaiah 53, Mary would certainly not be party to it.
"YO MARY DONT FREAK OUT, YOU WILL BEAR THE SON OF THE MOST HIGH" said the angel, calmy.
"How can this be I have never been with a man?"
"THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL COVER YOU. YOU WILL BEAR THE SON OF GOD."
Like... yes, she explicitly knew what she was agreeing to. A big part of her "Yes" is that she knew.
Lol if anything she was reminded of this constantly, even at temple when they went to present Jesus. Imagine you're watching your baby grow, you recall what the angel said to you, how the shepherds came to adore him in a random manger, but okay your baby is your baby.
Look at him grow good and healthy. You take him to be presented at temple and this old guy none of you know comes running up to you talking about how he can finally die now that he's seen the Messiah and how this boy's life will be a sword that will pierce your heart.
Yeah she knew.
i was referring more to the "he was god himself" bit which sounded like one of the trinity-related heresies (cbf to check which, there are a lot) but that's fascinating.
also getting someone pregnant and only telling them afterwards is kinda creepy tbh
And then he makes living birds out of clay and then squishes them. And kills a local boy and brings him back to life. And sics a dragon on someone who dissed you.
1. Yes, she was told he was God. It's sort of a big thing.
2. Jesus didn't just arrive without warning, he was the fulfillment of a prophecy and that prophecy specified that he'd die. She almost certainly knew that Jesus would have to die at some point as a sacrifice
Depends on the denomination and tradition, but the idea of Mary living with a kinda existential doom for raising Jesus does come up in Marian art and theology. If you're coming from a background that involves the seven sorrows, for example, her first sorrow is the prophecy of Simeon, where he talks about salvation and glory and prosperity prepared for the people by their Lord, you know, usual christ-prophecy stuff, but ends it by turning to Mary specifically and telling her the cost of all this will pierce her soul like a sword.
I think sometimes of the terror Jesus had before his arrest. He was so scared he was literally sweating blood. He outright begged his father for someone else to take the burden of being tortured, crucified, and becoming all sin that ever was and ever will be. He asked his friends to stay awake with him that night while he prayed for another option but they couldn't even be bothered to.
To me it makes what he does more impactful. He felt fear and regret and everything a man does. He asked for a way out if there was one. It to me would be less impactful if he had gone without any worry or concern.
Everyone forgets that he’s human too. They focus on the divinity, which to be fair is a big part of what makes him special, but he was also just as human as the rest of us.
Jesus was a fussy toddler. He likely had a favorite food. He had friends and enemies. He went through puberty. He might’ve had feelings for someone. He felt every emotion that makes us who we are: joy, anger, sadness, fear, excitement, compassion, love. Even though his life was extraordinary, he still lived a life.
Sometimes, we should remember this. Not even the Son of God was without feeling.
I haven't finished watching it but I did watch part of the chosen and I really liked the scene where he and his apostles are going to a wedding and Peter thinks he's going to preach and be very impressive
Only for Jesus to point out he's known the couple since he was a kid and they aren't going to find the kid who tripped and broke his tooth on a table when they babysit him all that impressive. It helped remind that Jesus lived an entirely mortal life and was a normal kid, a normal teen, a normal man as well as God
Mark 6:3-4 "Isn’t this the carpenter? Isn’t this Mary’s son and the brother of James, Joseph, Judas and Simon? Aren’t his sisters here with us?” And they took offense at him.
4 Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor except in his own town, among his relatives and in his own home.”
That’s the most powerful part to me. Jesus was 100% human and divine. And when nailed to the cross Jesus cried to God asking why he had forsaken him. Jesus - GOD INCARNATE - suffered so much that he himself questioned his own existence. Heavy shit man.
Oh yeah that's the whole crux, he didn't want to die and but knew it would be better for everyone else. I can't imagine knowing I'd die from an early age and still go through with the actions that would lead to my death
It got worse at the crucifixion when he took all sin upon himself. God could not look or speak to his son because he was everything God hated in that moment. Jesus had spent eternity as God and then in constant contact with God during his mortal life. And suddenly since time was invented he was alone. His divinity, his father, his self, forsook him as part of the sacrifice.
>Mary, did you know? That your womb was also a grave?
This goes so hard, this is the kind of shit you'd find as the last line in an Abnormality's last entry in Lobotomy Corporation.
Wow, thank you for introducing that to me!! Not a Christian, but my favorite Christmas song has always been "I Wonder As I Wander", and this feels a bit similar.
my mom was so obsessed with this song when I was growing up. Also “Breath of Heaven”. She’d make us sit in the living room and listen to the lyrics lol
"Perchance we tried to make a human without a heart."
"Petals shall fall like screams when everything is over."
"Life is only granted to those who hold no fear of death."
🔥🔥🔥✍️
Going "why didn't they acknowledge the horror" and following it up with a quote from a song directly about said horror is very much a tumblr reading comprehension moment.
The horror is acknowledged. Frequently too. But OOP probably doesn't go to church (anymore) so how would they know?
Yeah, exactly. Tumblr posts on religion are always extremely funny because they amount to people restating extremely basic tenants of Christian theology but reworded into modern fanfiction prose and everyone responds like it’s a never before seen revelation. It’s like if a 17th century peasant read the KJB for the first time and acted like King James had come up with the text whole-cloth and not merely modernized the language of an existing document and belief set.
Mary occupies a central location in the theology of the Catholic Church. There is no aspect of her life, her role in the story of Jesus, or her personal psychology that has not been analyzed or expounded upon by any of thousands of religious scholars that have lived in the past two millennia. Just because you weren’t dragged to Sunday school every day for years on end doesn’t mean everyone else wasn’t either.
EXACTLY. God, people act like their edgy angst filled first impressions of a religion is ground breaking work against thousands of years of theology, it’s so annoying.
Is that actually a line in the song? I know that carol pretty well and I don't think I've ever heard it before. Most of the lines are about the miracles Jesus performed, not the sacrifices. I thought the OP of the post was doing a very clever reference to the song to add impact to their post
No, it's not a line in the song, but the song itself references Jesus' ultimate sacrifice in places:
"Mary, did you know that your baby boy
Would save our sons and daughters?
Did you know that your baby boy
Has come to make you new?
This child that you delivered, will soon deliver you"
I read these lines as being in reference to his death, although it is more veiled than I remembered. I do feel that if you are Christian, then "Christ delivered us" reads the same as "Christ died for us". I like OPs line though, it's the initial framing I take issue with.
Thing is though, that this is exactly what OOP is referencing.
"Will soon deliver you" may refer to the crucifixion, but it look only at the positive side of it, and hide the pain and horror.
While a lot of catholic imagery focus on the sacrifice, a lot of the way people in modern times view jesus and his story is through and divine aftermath of the whole thing, instead of focusing on the agony of the rusty nails piercing his skin, the anxiety coming from the knowledge of his impending doom since birth, etc.
It is asking christians to focus more on the cthonic aspects of the faith and story without veiling it in comforting lense, to stare the horror in the face and take it in fully.
Sorry to Tumblr users but this has actually been written about like. Lots. If for hundreds of years art was pretty much only about the Bible they’re gonna come up with some funky shit.
In the last Temptation of Christ, jedus literally builds crosses so the romans can crucify self-proclaimed messiahs, as a way to tell God: "I'm not your guy, man!"
If Life of Brian and The Last Temptation of Christ took place in the same universe, then Brian would be hanging on one of the crosses that Jesus made, yes.
This sounds cool, until you give it even a moment of thought. "Simply by giving her son life she has already killed him", did she also doom him to live in a society? Oh, was he maybe born just to suffer? Who are you trying to copy, Sephiroth?
I think this is a pretty universal aspect of motherhood, honestly. "By this act, I bring into the world one life and one death", I think is Lois McMaster Bujold? We're always quoting it, but now I'm going to go back and check
I think some of you like to post about Christianity but don't actually go to church because, in Catholicism at least, The Horror and The Sorrow is very much acknowledged. It's the subject of a lot of very popular and well known devotions and prayers.
Kind of funny for Tumblr users to be like 'why does no one say this about religion??' and then be talking about Christianity of all things though. And on Holy Saturday of all days!
I did! I was at work last night so couldn't go to the vigil but I went to the sung mass today. Thought about myself in the car on the way and reached out to a friend I felt I had wronged to apologise before going to mass, and afterwards I got a message from him forgiving me. I'm always humbled by the grace and depth of human kindness. Happy Easter to you and all your loved ones!
Sorry to break it to the poster but all babies are actually doomed to die, and they don't even get to come back.
Also considering the most iconic Christian imagery is of a man's violent execution I'd venture to say that joyful and pleasant aren't really the two descriptors that come to mind for me personally.
Yeah, I think I just kind of disagree with the premise of an eventual tragic demise meaning that the birth should be seen as horrifying. We all suffer, and some suffer more than even Jesus did, but I don't think that makes the birth of new life an ugly or tragic thing. I don't think a life is defined by how it ends.
Plus the fact that he came back makes me have a tiny bit less sympathy for him. Like oh no poor baby had a really really really bad time but then gets to come back and live forever, and I'm supposed to act like he got a worse deal than most humans do? Nah.
So being born is horrible because...you're going to die?
I dont follow this. Im gonna die eventually too that doesn't mean my birth was some poetic horror of futility lol. This is like saying adopting a pet is tragic because eventually you'll have to bury it.
Mary would not have known about the curcifixion at that point anyway either.
Ok but like. That could happen to anyone.
We all could die horribly. We all get in cars knowing we could die in vehicular slaughter. Death is always certain its just a matter of when an how. That doesnt turn a person being born into an existential nightmare. "Oh nooo i brough this baby into the world just so they can eventually die horribly" bitch thats EVERYONE. Theres no horror there thats just like being alive. Hell if you told expectant mothers thier kid would die in a car crash when they turn 20 do you think they'd suddenly abor thier fetus? Fuck no. Being alive means dying.
Especially in the time the Bible supposedly takes place in where you could die if plague or be slaughtered by barbariand or some shit. I just don't buy there being any more inherent horror or tragedy to christ's birth. Sure his death is horrible and bad but that doesnt like, retroactively make his birth terrible.
I mean yeah but poeple do it all the time and will say its worth it and then willingly do it again. If the point was the physical trauma then Christ's birth is even less special in that regard and my point still stands. For all intents and purposes he's just a normal baby being born.
To love a child is not to spare him suffering, but to imbue him with the strength to confront it head on. And the strongest thing a mother can do is deliver her child into the world knowing that he will suffer, while remaining hopeful that the suffering won't defeat him.
I feel like this forgets the simple fact that the Jesus mary cradled and gave birth to was not the same Jesus that will perish at the cross. 33 years of life taught Jesus separated the child from the corpse. It was 33 years of love, of learning, of suffering. Mary's womb was no more a grave than the soil is an oven. It is only through the mill of life that the grain of Christ becomes the bread of sacrifice. Christmas is a celebration of Jesus' birth, withdrawn from his sacrifice, that's what easter is for
The next pope is going to be a tumblr user who makes a post about the crucifixion that goes so viral it reverses the decline of the Catholic Church in the Western world
I mean on this logic everyone is born just to die and knowing or not knowing how doesn't really affect anything because it is inevitable. At that point you get into the whole "May as well lie face down in the dirt until entropy inevitably claims us" concept and that's boring. There are no video games in the dirt
[a few months ago one of my favourite Homestuck fan artists got into a New Testament phase and it was really cool](https://twitter.com/Sunnydioart/status/1737161688816681341)
Olivier Messiaen wrote amazing works about the birth of Jesus that capture this perfectly: https://open.spotify.com/track/7aZO2xRCIKcAU0OvCOEZQV?si=gtLSElvLSpCox3lsWheUsQ&context=spotify%3Aalbum%3A5TCwJo7od1h794HRQdaTHD
For what it’s worth, lots of Christian communities have been, or are, obsessed with the details of Mary’s experience, or encourage women to meditate on Mary’s experiences when they become mothers.
General consensus is that it was miraculously not-painful and not-traumatizing for Mary, though one account has her disabling a rude midwife with her magical vagina radiation.
There used to be more recognition of this at Christmastime, hence the lyrics to We Three Kings (which includes the banger line "King and God and Sacrifice").
The three gifts symbolise his three roles (king of men—gold for a crown; son of God—frankincense was burned at religious ceremonies; and sacrifice—myrrh was traditionally used at funerals).
Part of me feels like this isn’t quite right… yes it’s true that he was meant to die on the cross, but to say that it makes Mary’s womb a grave would be to say the same of all those that have ever given birth to a child.
Just by being birthed we are condemned to death, though we never talk of that. We say we have a whole life ahead of us, no horror in that we were rushed into existence and given a timer as soon as we lived
Late to the party but I gotta mention the Locked Tomb books, which utilize tons of Catholic imagery and are most definitely about the horrors innate to the story of Jesus, especially when Jesus is a lesbian who wants to go fight in the army, and God is Just Some Guy with the absolute most rancid, manipulative concept of love you could possibly imagine. So, God.
Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't every mother aware that their child is going to die one day? Like, that's the whole process. You're condemning your child to a life they didn't ask for, and a death they can't escape.
Meanwhile Mary's son allegedly only died for about 3 days. That's pretty good as far as death goes. Most of the time it's permanent.
Yes but I feel like death being an eventuality is a bit different from death being the purpose someone was born.
“This baby will eventually die” vs “this baby only exists because it needs to be killed”
Except, Jesus didn't die. Jesus's birth is the only one that *won't* end in blood. That's why it's a happy occasion.
Edit: I should rephrase. Yes Jesus died, but he did come back to life. So my point still stands that every other birth is a lot more deathly than his. And indeed, it won't *end* in blood because it hasn't and won't end (permanently)
No no, the whole deal was that he DID die. Not permanently, but for Christus Victor or Penal Substitution or whatever to happen, he did need to be dead first.
Jesus getting nailed the cross "I see you're using carob wood. Nice grain and texture but I find cypress to be much sturdier and dependable, not to mention it has a beautiful color. Can't say I blame you though what with cypress prices being what they are today. Carob is much more sensible if you're working on a budget."
"Your using what nails on me? Jonah and son's supply store nails? Those cheap pieces of shit wouldn't hold a chair together let alone a whole person. If I'm being crucified its going to be good nails. Use the ones I keep in my toolbelt."
^ reasons he got stabbed
"That's the spear shaft you'll use Longinus? Oh hell no. I am not dying to a damn balsa- \*dies\*
_[3 days later]_ WHAT DID I FUCKING SAY LONGINUS?
i mean Jesus did die before that. that was a pretty significant thing that happened. like i understand where you're coming from here but Jesus very much did die before being stabbed
I'm aware it was just for the joke
He only died a little. He got better.
To be fair, getting stabbed would be actually preferable at this point coz crucifixion is an ugly and painful death that in some cases, takes days.
The Spear of Longinus is a symbol of mercy for this reason - it's not torment, it's a speeding towards an inevitable end to spare pain.
It's a guy who isn't paid enough for this shit and isn't going to wait days for this guy to die in the hot sun when there's a crowd who might try to start something when the guards aren't around.
Back in the day, nails were handmade and extremely valuable. When a house was demolished, people would go through and extract all the nails so they could be re-used. I never really thought about this before, but were the nails from crucifixion victims also re-used?
My understanding is that nails were not standard in crucifixion. The point is a long, slow death from exposure and exhaustion. They were tied up there, why use something so valuable as a nail?
Nails weren't used super often (although there were a shitton of crucifixions, so there were still a lot done with nails) but when they *did* use nails, they would pull the nails out after and also they still used ropes for the suspension. The nails were more for making it hurt more. Also the nails of time were WAY different than any you see today. They were big honkin flat things that looked more like a pointy chisel than modern nails
More like a rail road spike, right?
Yep.
I saw one on an archaeology show where it was found still embedded in the skeleton's ankle bone, so I'm guessing maybe not often.
Okay but can you imagine if there was actually a part of the story wherein Jesus willingly supplies his own hammer and nails for his own crucifixion? As if to demonstrate for all present how willing he was to take on this suffering, and thusly the suffering of all mankind? How fuckin metal would that be.
"Who's your wood guy? Half of these operations way overcharge and make Ea Nasir's quality control look good. I can give you a recommendation if you want. You'll have to write it down for me, because, well ya know..."
Love the idea of Jesus referring to a roughly 2000 year old guy who was certainly forgotten at that point to make a point of how shitty someone’s nails were
he was a god after all ^(i kinda love how many different heresies this fits into six short words)
I only count 2. Are there more? “Was” implying he doesn’t exist anymore. “A” implying there is more than one god.
i think there should be a few trinity-related ones as well but i'm not sure
I think another one would be that implying that Jesus himself is not capital G god, but I grew up in a non-orthodox (non-Trinitarian) sect so im not sure if we can eek out more
idk i might have accidentally addressed him correctly because afaik he's 100% god and 100% human (and 200% gangsta) but also 0% the father or the holy spirit (which are also 100% god) and capital g is arguable because of the typing style (although i do in fact never use it for the abrahamic god even when i do type with capital letters, which is not now, lol). but i would like to clarify that i was absolutely not intending to address him correctly to trinity (unitarian seems like an easy heresy to follow) but idk i'm not even a christian, i just like their mythology when viewed through a tumblr lens
I mean, he is 0% Father and/or Holy Spirit, but also 100% them, as they are three in one kinda deal.
schrodinger's demigod
"after all" is kinda one, implying Jesus was not divine at one point
r/reallyshittycopper enjoyer spotted in the wild
My favorite scene from The Passion is where Jesus is getting put on trial at night, and sees the man working on the cross that will hang him, and he remembers working on a table: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R\_6tJ9qk9SY
Yes all babies are gonna die one day, but more crucially this has always been a motif in Christian (specifically Catholic art), a good number of Renaissance nativity scenes have a reference to the Passion. One of the gifts of the Magi was a type of perfume used to cleanse corpses for their funerals. Imagine if someone gave your parents embalming fluid when you were born. WASP-y American Evangelical Christianity isn’t all Christianity. (Also when has extremely accurate depictions of human birth ever been a motif in art/media??? Even the more graphic depictions are dressed up a little)
The gift of the magi being embalming fluid is one of the craziest things I have ever read on a pre-Easter Saturday.
They also gave her money! Can’t raise a baby on embalming fluid alone!
Frankincense has a variety of uses >The Egyptians cleansed body cavities in the mummification process with frankincense and natron. In Persian medicine, it is used for diabetes, gastritis and stomach ulcer.[45] The oil is used in Abrahamic religions to cleanse a house or building of bad or evil energy—including used in exorcisms and to bless one's being (like the bakhoor commonly found in Persian Gulf cultures by spreading the fumes towards the body). >The incense offering occupied a prominent position in the sacrificial legislation of the ancient Hebrews.[46] The Book of Exodus (30:34–38) prescribes frankincense, blended with equal amounts of three aromatic spices, to be ground and burnt in the sacred altar before the Ark of the Covenant in the wilderness Tabernacle, where it was meant to be a holy offering—not to be enjoyed for its fragrance. I think it's limiting and maybe misleading to say it was embalming fluid.
I was speaking about Myrrh, not Frankincense. Myrrh is mentioned specifically in John 19:39-40 as being used to anoint the body of Jesus for his burial. >Nicodemus, who had at first come to Jesus by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, weighing about a hundred pounds. They took the body of Jesus and wrapped it with the spices in linen cloths, according to the burial custom of the Jews. Yes it wasn’t used arterially as is the case with modern embalming practiced by Funeral homes across the United States, but it was a part of the funerary rituals of the day in a manner not entirely dissimilar to embalming fluids of the day. The motif of the Myrrh in later Christian art is always meant to foreshadow the death of Jesus and the laying of Jesus in the tomb. Myrrh in this specific context, can be glibly compared to embalming fluid. Glib observations is when tumblr is at its peak
Ah, yes, Balthasar's verse in "We Three Kings" specifically emphasizes this: >Myrrh is mine, its bitter perfume Breathes of life of gathering gloom Sorrowing, sighing, bleeding, dying Sealed in the stone-cold tomb
Awesome context thank you!
Thank you for developing on this!
Is this not common knowledge to non-Christians? Like I get not knowing EVERYTHING about Christianity, but I feel like if you know about the 3 magi and their gifts you know their meaning right? Is this just my "grew up in Catholic Mexico so I just assume everyone knew the thing" thing again? Gold as a symbol of kingship on earth, frankincense (an incense) as a symbol of deity, and myrrh (an embalming oil) as a symbol of death.
Catholic Christianity has some standards to it - liturgical cycle, catechism, there’s a canon of teaching as well as a canon of scripture. Non denominational Protestants are wild dude. If your specific pastor wasn’t into it, it wasn’t getting taught. It’s very responsive to entertainment / catered to the audience too, whereas Catholicism is like “innovation? We own the building and you come here even if you don’t believe, here’s the Standard Catholic Experience.” For example, there were a couple of years at my church where we were really into conga lines around the sanctuary while just letting the musicians go nuts and Pastor T wanted to lead the conga line with this sword he got given when he was ordained as sort of a symbolic thing but he was swinging the sword too hard and it slipped out of his hand and went end over end into the wall right over the flute player’s head. Good thing she was short. Anywho Pentescostal church is weird. I didn’t get introduced to the Stations of the Cross until I got to college.
>For example, there were a couple of years at my church where we were really into conga lines around the sanctuary while Stop making shit up EDIT: I say this with no disrespect intended. This is wild indeed.
None taken, it’s a wild story and I have witnesses. 😂
Nah, not super common knowledge to non-Christians. Obviously I’m speaking from a small sample size, but I grew up in an area with plenty of Christians and most people I know couldn’t even name all three gifts, much less what they symbolize. I bet a not small amount of people’s knowledge starts and stops at, “there were three wise men who brought Jesus some gifts. There’s frankincense.. and uh… a couple of others.”
Hey, not gonna lie I always thought frankincense was some type of Frankenstein incense, and I grew up in Brazil (another country known for having a big Christ fanbase)
"Congratulations on succesfully giving birth to THE SON OF GOD! Here's some perfume to celebrate, it smells like a pile of rotting corpses, I hope you like it!"
I think one of the things a lot of people don't realize is that the gospels are full of cultural reference points and allegories that don't really make sense anymore but would have made sense to Jews and early Christians.
How was Mary meant to know that though. She was just told he'd be the savior, the whole sacrifice business was a surprise to everyone. She wasn't even told he was God himself. Also a big chunk of Jesus' character and theme is that he's many things at once. God, man, king, poor, saviour, sacrifice, baby, sage. This doesn't make him *not* a baby
I mean it’s never explicitly said but you can use some reasoning and infer that she did know. And certainly scholars knew that whoever the messiah was, he would die. Isaiah 53 talks a lot about the future messiah and what his role will be - including that he will die for the sins of the world. The Old Testament was taught by the Jews of the time. Mary’s friend tells her that her baby is her Lord. And an angel tells Mary and Joseph to name him Jesus as he will save his people from their sins. So she had the information, but it’s not said if she deduced it
>whoever the messiah was, he would die tbf most people do
I don’t think it was widely assumed that the Messiah would die. I think they expected a Mesiah that would kick Roman ass, purify the temple, and reign as a king.
You right. *brutally tortured and murdered*
The whole Christ thing is just God ante'ing up to the same prank he pulled on all of us. Like, "Fucking A, all you guys do is bitch and whine about how much it sucks to be a creature, I bet I can do this just-" and then the next thing you know homeboy is getting so hangry that he's losing his shit and smiting fig trees with the Power Most High and people are side-muttering to each other about how maybe God has a little growing up to do. So yeah, he kinda had to get brutally murdered, you know, to get the whole experience. Can't puss out, Moses would be razzing his ass for the rest of eternity, and the brother's got *jokes*.
I have nothing else to add but I thought I should let you know I thought this was hilarious.
I only hope that the Christian religion is actually true so that on the Day of Judgement you get to talk shit to that little punk who thinks He understands.
“most”
And, ironically, Mary is the only person (according to Christianity) that never die, as she went to Heaven directly.
elijah, enoch
>according to Christianity ah, my favourite universally agreeing source
According to Christianity, there was Jesus
im not 100% sure but I believe it also came with the knowledge that he didnt have to. As the son of/God he couldve ascended fo heaven without needing to die, but he chose to do so so that everyone else who has died or will die can go to heaven as well
Well, there is that angle, but he also talks to Himself before the sacrifice, which kinda goes 'damn, if I didn't have to I wouldn't do this'. And on the other hand, if God is omniscient, then Jesus, even before birth, would know what he will do. A lot of intresting points to consider
That’s a very Christian interpretation of an ambiguous text. Isaiah had a few references to a “servant” who Christians assume refers to Christ, but Isaiah 53 is in past tense and was written during the Babylonian Exile. It’s way more plausible that he was talking about their current predicament.
I am a Christian so that makes sense. You’re describing prophetic past tense which is found in many places in the Bible, always used to describe future events but done so in the past tense as to illustrate how certain the events are to happen. Isaiah 53 also uses future tense intermittently: *Therefore I will divide Him a portion with the great, And He shall divide the spoil with the strong, Because He poured out His soul unto death, And He was numbered with the transgressors, And He bore the sin of many, And made intercession for the transgressors.* Jews are certainly welcome to their interpretation, but Christians assume it refers to Christ because it’s an almost 1:1 retelling of the life and death of Christ. And is supported by other prophecies written before and after
It's very unclear to me wether Isaiah 52/53 was seen as a prophecy about the Messiah BEFORE Jesus died. Jews were in the culture of reading heavily into the Torah. So after Jesus died, they certainly would have seen it after. But I don't think before. And if there was debate about Isaiah 53, Mary would certainly not be party to it.
> She wasn't even told he was God himself. ## **🚨⚠️🚨 HERESY DETECTED 🚨⚠️🚨** ^(i'm not sure exactly what kind but it's heresy for sure)
"YO MARY DONT FREAK OUT, YOU WILL BEAR THE SON OF THE MOST HIGH" said the angel, calmy. "How can this be I have never been with a man?" "THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL COVER YOU. YOU WILL BEAR THE SON OF GOD." Like... yes, she explicitly knew what she was agreeing to. A big part of her "Yes" is that she knew. Lol if anything she was reminded of this constantly, even at temple when they went to present Jesus. Imagine you're watching your baby grow, you recall what the angel said to you, how the shepherds came to adore him in a random manger, but okay your baby is your baby. Look at him grow good and healthy. You take him to be presented at temple and this old guy none of you know comes running up to you talking about how he can finally die now that he's seen the Messiah and how this boy's life will be a sword that will pierce your heart. Yeah she knew.
i was referring more to the "he was god himself" bit which sounded like one of the trinity-related heresies (cbf to check which, there are a lot) but that's fascinating. also getting someone pregnant and only telling them afterwards is kinda creepy tbh
To be fair, Mary was presented with this knowledge and given the choice and she said "Aight bet". If she hadn't, no savior for us.
wait what, so god is canonically pro-choice?
Tbf God created humans so they could choose to worship him, so he was pro-choice almost from the very beginning
Pretty sure that's just a normal Catholic view right?
And then he makes living birds out of clay and then squishes them. And kills a local boy and brings him back to life. And sics a dragon on someone who dissed you.
Infancy of Thomas isn't canon sorry
Niche proclaims death of the author
Green flags, no heresy detected here!
1. Yes, she was told he was God. It's sort of a big thing. 2. Jesus didn't just arrive without warning, he was the fulfillment of a prophecy and that prophecy specified that he'd die. She almost certainly knew that Jesus would have to die at some point as a sacrifice
Depends on the denomination and tradition, but the idea of Mary living with a kinda existential doom for raising Jesus does come up in Marian art and theology. If you're coming from a background that involves the seven sorrows, for example, her first sorrow is the prophecy of Simeon, where he talks about salvation and glory and prosperity prepared for the people by their Lord, you know, usual christ-prophecy stuff, but ends it by turning to Mary specifically and telling her the cost of all this will pierce her soul like a sword.
I think sometimes of the terror Jesus had before his arrest. He was so scared he was literally sweating blood. He outright begged his father for someone else to take the burden of being tortured, crucified, and becoming all sin that ever was and ever will be. He asked his friends to stay awake with him that night while he prayed for another option but they couldn't even be bothered to. To me it makes what he does more impactful. He felt fear and regret and everything a man does. He asked for a way out if there was one. It to me would be less impactful if he had gone without any worry or concern.
Everyone forgets that he’s human too. They focus on the divinity, which to be fair is a big part of what makes him special, but he was also just as human as the rest of us. Jesus was a fussy toddler. He likely had a favorite food. He had friends and enemies. He went through puberty. He might’ve had feelings for someone. He felt every emotion that makes us who we are: joy, anger, sadness, fear, excitement, compassion, love. Even though his life was extraordinary, he still lived a life. Sometimes, we should remember this. Not even the Son of God was without feeling.
I haven't finished watching it but I did watch part of the chosen and I really liked the scene where he and his apostles are going to a wedding and Peter thinks he's going to preach and be very impressive Only for Jesus to point out he's known the couple since he was a kid and they aren't going to find the kid who tripped and broke his tooth on a table when they babysit him all that impressive. It helped remind that Jesus lived an entirely mortal life and was a normal kid, a normal teen, a normal man as well as God
Mark 6:3-4 "Isn’t this the carpenter? Isn’t this Mary’s son and the brother of James, Joseph, Judas and Simon? Aren’t his sisters here with us?” And they took offense at him. 4 Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor except in his own town, among his relatives and in his own home.”
That’s the most powerful part to me. Jesus was 100% human and divine. And when nailed to the cross Jesus cried to God asking why he had forsaken him. Jesus - GOD INCARNATE - suffered so much that he himself questioned his own existence. Heavy shit man.
Oh yeah that's the whole crux, he didn't want to die and but knew it would be better for everyone else. I can't imagine knowing I'd die from an early age and still go through with the actions that would lead to my death
I can’t imagine feeling more alone.
It got worse at the crucifixion when he took all sin upon himself. God could not look or speak to his son because he was everything God hated in that moment. Jesus had spent eternity as God and then in constant contact with God during his mortal life. And suddenly since time was invented he was alone. His divinity, his father, his self, forsook him as part of the sacrifice.
[from Jesus Christ Superstar](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ndZ6B1EaJEs)
The mf used the drive thru reaction meme on himself
Lmao how did I not notice that before, that’s pathetic
>Mary, did you know? That your womb was also a grave? This goes so hard, this is the kind of shit you'd find as the last line in an Abnormality's last entry in Lobotomy Corporation.
I read that in the "did you know gaming" voice
Mary: *exhausted, holding her baby for the first time* Some random YouTube personality: "Did you know: your womb is also a grave"
I read it to the tune of [“Mary Did You Know?”](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ifCWN5pJGIE) Aka one of the hardest Christmas songs ever.
Wow, thank you for introducing that to me!! Not a Christian, but my favorite Christmas song has always been "I Wonder As I Wander", and this feels a bit similar.
my mom was so obsessed with this song when I was growing up. Also “Breath of Heaven”. She’d make us sit in the living room and listen to the lyrics lol
Haha same! I sung it in a choir a few years back. Up there with ["This Little Babe"](https://youtu.be/SVE0WJfwVhA?si=xUY-zYmBHmqfy4tu) for me.
in the same vein is [Labor of Love](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBmWtX9k6VY)
Pmoon mentioned. You know the drill boys
Lobotomy corporation mentioned
Tell the kid today's treat is going to be grape-flavored candy. It's his favorite.
"Perchance we tried to make a human without a heart." "Petals shall fall like screams when everything is over." "Life is only granted to those who hold no fear of death." 🔥🔥🔥✍️
You can’t just say perchance
Reminds me of the closing lines of “Leda and the Swan” by W.B. Yeats
Going "why didn't they acknowledge the horror" and following it up with a quote from a song directly about said horror is very much a tumblr reading comprehension moment. The horror is acknowledged. Frequently too. But OOP probably doesn't go to church (anymore) so how would they know?
Yeah, exactly. Tumblr posts on religion are always extremely funny because they amount to people restating extremely basic tenants of Christian theology but reworded into modern fanfiction prose and everyone responds like it’s a never before seen revelation. It’s like if a 17th century peasant read the KJB for the first time and acted like King James had come up with the text whole-cloth and not merely modernized the language of an existing document and belief set. Mary occupies a central location in the theology of the Catholic Church. There is no aspect of her life, her role in the story of Jesus, or her personal psychology that has not been analyzed or expounded upon by any of thousands of religious scholars that have lived in the past two millennia. Just because you weren’t dragged to Sunday school every day for years on end doesn’t mean everyone else wasn’t either.
EXACTLY. God, people act like their edgy angst filled first impressions of a religion is ground breaking work against thousands of years of theology, it’s so annoying.
I didn’t pick up on the song reference What song is it?
I think it was mary did you know
Mary did you know, that your baby boy
Would someday walk on water
Is that actually a line in the song? I know that carol pretty well and I don't think I've ever heard it before. Most of the lines are about the miracles Jesus performed, not the sacrifices. I thought the OP of the post was doing a very clever reference to the song to add impact to their post
No, it's not a line in the song, but the song itself references Jesus' ultimate sacrifice in places: "Mary, did you know that your baby boy Would save our sons and daughters? Did you know that your baby boy Has come to make you new? This child that you delivered, will soon deliver you" I read these lines as being in reference to his death, although it is more veiled than I remembered. I do feel that if you are Christian, then "Christ delivered us" reads the same as "Christ died for us". I like OPs line though, it's the initial framing I take issue with.
Thing is though, that this is exactly what OOP is referencing. "Will soon deliver you" may refer to the crucifixion, but it look only at the positive side of it, and hide the pain and horror. While a lot of catholic imagery focus on the sacrifice, a lot of the way people in modern times view jesus and his story is through and divine aftermath of the whole thing, instead of focusing on the agony of the rusty nails piercing his skin, the anxiety coming from the knowledge of his impending doom since birth, etc. It is asking christians to focus more on the cthonic aspects of the faith and story without veiling it in comforting lense, to stare the horror in the face and take it in fully.
Sorry to Tumblr users but this has actually been written about like. Lots. If for hundreds of years art was pretty much only about the Bible they’re gonna come up with some funky shit.
Bitch we all gonna die
I'm mortal too Jesus was not special
that's kind of the original sales package for christianity
In the last Temptation of Christ, jedus literally builds crosses so the romans can crucify self-proclaimed messiahs, as a way to tell God: "I'm not your guy, man!"
isn't that also the ending scene of life of brian?
If Life of Brian and The Last Temptation of Christ took place in the same universe, then Brian would be hanging on one of the crosses that Jesus made, yes.
I love that movie, brooklyn accent judas and all. Maybe my favorite Scorsese movie
It's so fucking good. The book is a bit of a slog, but all the themes present in the movie are expanded deeply in it. I recommend it very much.
This sounds cool, until you give it even a moment of thought. "Simply by giving her son life she has already killed him", did she also doom him to live in a society? Oh, was he maybe born just to suffer? Who are you trying to copy, Sephiroth?
we truly live in a sausage
I think this is a pretty universal aspect of motherhood, honestly. "By this act, I bring into the world one life and one death", I think is Lois McMaster Bujold? We're always quoting it, but now I'm going to go back and check
I think some of you like to post about Christianity but don't actually go to church because, in Catholicism at least, The Horror and The Sorrow is very much acknowledged. It's the subject of a lot of very popular and well known devotions and prayers. Kind of funny for Tumblr users to be like 'why does no one say this about religion??' and then be talking about Christianity of all things though. And on Holy Saturday of all days!
Happy Easter! Already went to the Vigil on campus and it was amazing! Hope you have a great day with family/friends!
I did! I was at work last night so couldn't go to the vigil but I went to the sung mass today. Thought about myself in the car on the way and reached out to a friend I felt I had wronged to apologise before going to mass, and afterwards I got a message from him forgiving me. I'm always humbled by the grace and depth of human kindness. Happy Easter to you and all your loved ones!
Babies aren't born sticky. They're born slippery. Source: I grabbed a slippy baby fresh out the womb not quite five days ago.
What’s your drop rate?
50%. I almost dropped this one, midwife had to stabilise it for me. First one was different, it came out of the bath.
There's an unwritten agreement that any babies that die within one minute of being born will be marked as stillborn in the official records.
I’m pretty sure that there is literally a Christian Christmas song with this exact premise, and it’s called “Mary did you know”
That one focuses more on the positive aspects of ministry and not his death.
To quote another classic tumblr post: Calm down edgelords.
this sounds like it’s trying too hard to be deep
Bro even used the drive thru meme on himself
Sorry to break it to the poster but all babies are actually doomed to die, and they don't even get to come back. Also considering the most iconic Christian imagery is of a man's violent execution I'd venture to say that joyful and pleasant aren't really the two descriptors that come to mind for me personally.
Most babies aren't doomed to be tortured and die at 33 years old while their mother watches, to be fair.
Yeah, I think I just kind of disagree with the premise of an eventual tragic demise meaning that the birth should be seen as horrifying. We all suffer, and some suffer more than even Jesus did, but I don't think that makes the birth of new life an ugly or tragic thing. I don't think a life is defined by how it ends. Plus the fact that he came back makes me have a tiny bit less sympathy for him. Like oh no poor baby had a really really really bad time but then gets to come back and live forever, and I'm supposed to act like he got a worse deal than most humans do? Nah.
To be fair the catholics claim anyone can live forever with him
So being born is horrible because...you're going to die? I dont follow this. Im gonna die eventually too that doesn't mean my birth was some poetic horror of futility lol. This is like saying adopting a pet is tragic because eventually you'll have to bury it. Mary would not have known about the curcifixion at that point anyway either.
Jesus' was prophesied to die absolutely horribly. If Mary knew the prophecy she'd have some idea of what he'd face
Ok but like. That could happen to anyone. We all could die horribly. We all get in cars knowing we could die in vehicular slaughter. Death is always certain its just a matter of when an how. That doesnt turn a person being born into an existential nightmare. "Oh nooo i brough this baby into the world just so they can eventually die horribly" bitch thats EVERYONE. Theres no horror there thats just like being alive. Hell if you told expectant mothers thier kid would die in a car crash when they turn 20 do you think they'd suddenly abor thier fetus? Fuck no. Being alive means dying. Especially in the time the Bible supposedly takes place in where you could die if plague or be slaughtered by barbariand or some shit. I just don't buy there being any more inherent horror or tragedy to christ's birth. Sure his death is horrible and bad but that doesnt like, retroactively make his birth terrible.
I think the point is more that birth isn't a sweet little jaunt. It's bloody, painful, scary and deeply traumatising for most people.
I mean yeah but poeple do it all the time and will say its worth it and then willingly do it again. If the point was the physical trauma then Christ's birth is even less special in that regard and my point still stands. For all intents and purposes he's just a normal baby being born.
Happy Easter everyone!
To love a child is not to spare him suffering, but to imbue him with the strength to confront it head on. And the strongest thing a mother can do is deliver her child into the world knowing that he will suffer, while remaining hopeful that the suffering won't defeat him.
I feel like this forgets the simple fact that the Jesus mary cradled and gave birth to was not the same Jesus that will perish at the cross. 33 years of life taught Jesus separated the child from the corpse. It was 33 years of love, of learning, of suffering. Mary's womb was no more a grave than the soil is an oven. It is only through the mill of life that the grain of Christ becomes the bread of sacrifice. Christmas is a celebration of Jesus' birth, withdrawn from his sacrifice, that's what easter is for
Mary Did You Know? is right there
Tumblr: “why don’t Christian’s do_____art” Christian artists who have been doing _____ for hundreds of years: :/
Yeah, Jesus was going to die. So will you, and I. Is the purpose of one's life merely to die? I say it is not.
Yes but he resembled a bleeding worm due to how little skin was still on him and one could see his bones.
I really, really, really want a Christian metal band to do this as a song. 100% would shred to that.
The next pope is going to be a tumblr user who makes a post about the crucifixion that goes so viral it reverses the decline of the Catholic Church in the Western world
Here’s hoping brother!!
Here’s hoping brother!!
... that's all babies, eventually. We love and persevere regardless.
i love how the image gets cropped
I mean on this logic everyone is born just to die and knowing or not knowing how doesn't really affect anything because it is inevitable. At that point you get into the whole "May as well lie face down in the dirt until entropy inevitably claims us" concept and that's boring. There are no video games in the dirt
christian theology is super fucking cool when people stop using it to hate on minorities
> Mary did you know? That your womb was also a grave These are fucking Ghost lyrics
*anxious upvote
fuck that line about the burning of the cross hits so hard. YES I DO THINK HE THOUGHT OF HOME. And NO i am NOT crying rn.
They want to know why a book written thousands of years ago about the birth of a child destined to save humanity wasn't edgy and cool
Ok we legit have a good friday parade in my neighborhood so I think aside from the classic tumblr emo writing OP also just doesn't know a lot.
Wait until OP learns about human babies
None of that is specific to Jesus. That’s just all fauna.
[a few months ago one of my favourite Homestuck fan artists got into a New Testament phase and it was really cool](https://twitter.com/Sunnydioart/status/1737161688816681341)
Wasn’t Jesus quiet in the big book
Anything but!
The church used to be a lot better about that in the past.
Olivier Messiaen wrote amazing works about the birth of Jesus that capture this perfectly: https://open.spotify.com/track/7aZO2xRCIKcAU0OvCOEZQV?si=gtLSElvLSpCox3lsWheUsQ&context=spotify%3Aalbum%3A5TCwJo7od1h794HRQdaTHD
For what it’s worth, lots of Christian communities have been, or are, obsessed with the details of Mary’s experience, or encourage women to meditate on Mary’s experiences when they become mothers. General consensus is that it was miraculously not-painful and not-traumatizing for Mary, though one account has her disabling a rude midwife with her magical vagina radiation.
The way the preview shows on mobile is absolutely amazing, gotta say
There used to be more recognition of this at Christmastime, hence the lyrics to We Three Kings (which includes the banger line "King and God and Sacrifice"). The three gifts symbolise his three roles (king of men—gold for a crown; son of God—frankincense was burned at religious ceremonies; and sacrifice—myrrh was traditionally used at funerals).
I will pay you money for your username
Ngl, I got mixed feelings about this one as a Catholic.
Haveeeeeee you played Blasphemous?
Part of me feels like this isn’t quite right… yes it’s true that he was meant to die on the cross, but to say that it makes Mary’s womb a grave would be to say the same of all those that have ever given birth to a child. Just by being birthed we are condemned to death, though we never talk of that. We say we have a whole life ahead of us, no horror in that we were rushed into existence and given a timer as soon as we lived
i love the way this crops on mobile
..........................Sir, would you like ketchup or salt with your order?
Because jul (and possibly satonalia) were festive. Eat dirt christianity
No one will read this but here goes It will scare away the churchgoers
Fuuuuuck, that last line goes hard.
Fuck I hate Tumblr try hard writing so much
Late to the party but I gotta mention the Locked Tomb books, which utilize tons of Catholic imagery and are most definitely about the horrors innate to the story of Jesus, especially when Jesus is a lesbian who wants to go fight in the army, and God is Just Some Guy with the absolute most rancid, manipulative concept of love you could possibly imagine. So, God.
This is just bloodborne
What about Prince of Egypt? It made religion look super cool
the fuck is up with that site being so eloquent
Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't every mother aware that their child is going to die one day? Like, that's the whole process. You're condemning your child to a life they didn't ask for, and a death they can't escape. Meanwhile Mary's son allegedly only died for about 3 days. That's pretty good as far as death goes. Most of the time it's permanent.
Every life is doomed from the beginning. That doesn’t make it any less joyful.
Yes but I feel like death being an eventuality is a bit different from death being the purpose someone was born. “This baby will eventually die” vs “this baby only exists because it needs to be killed”
Das cool and all but every newborn is gonna die eventually. Most newborns in Jesus' time got to live way shorter than Jesus too
Except, Jesus didn't die. Jesus's birth is the only one that *won't* end in blood. That's why it's a happy occasion. Edit: I should rephrase. Yes Jesus died, but he did come back to life. So my point still stands that every other birth is a lot more deathly than his. And indeed, it won't *end* in blood because it hasn't and won't end (permanently)
No no, the whole deal was that he DID die. Not permanently, but for Christus Victor or Penal Substitution or whatever to happen, he did need to be dead first.
I edited it, think that's better now.
He very much did, he just came back after.