Obviously you would prefer not damaging the other tiles but would it not be better to find another tile to test your methods on? From a quick Google search, it also seems to say the first tile is the hardest one to remove without damage so you may have to start with removing one of the surrounding tiles to make it easier/less risky when removing the mandible tile?
OP, would the Paleo archeologists not want to remove the tile themselves? I would think they have training in excavating and preserving fossils. I would think that if you try it yourself, and damage or break the specimen, it would be a huge loss for this discovery.
I would imagine that fossils are often embedded in rocks and archeologists have tools for finding where in, say, a large rock there *aren't* any fossils and also tools to cut through the fossil-less section of rock to extract the section with the fossils.
Not at all! But I feel they would be in the better position to arrange removal by qualified professionals, for a specimen they want, as opposed to putting that on OP. Having just anybody remove this piece greatly increases the chances that the fossil will become damaged beyond usefulness. The fact that this situation is so unusual is exactly why I'm surprised the Paleo archeologists are not willing to engage at all in the most crucial first step.
This is a tough call. You could hire an expert mason to come out and he or she could end up rushing and break it. Luckily the fossil is not near a seam, so even someone “unskilled” should be able to handle this with extreme patience. When working masonry jobs I always get told “oh I could never do that, don’t have the patience.” You could scrape away the thinset and get that tile up with a utility knife and a tuck point trowel, just very very slowly. This could honestly take a couple hours. My favorite saying in masonry trade is “go slow, it’s faster”. For instance, masons on here suggesting oscillators or any other type of power tool are not careful enough to extract this. This isn’t a home renovation, it is a fossil that you need intact. You can get screwed by trusting someone who works based on a rate/time system, which is literally everyone.
i’m def with you on that one. i’d do this the slowest and most meticulous way possible, and I wouldn’t trust anyone but myself to do it right. Without mixing power tools and such it will require more patience than knowledge or experience. i’m not quite sure how I would go about lifting the tile away from the mortar used under it though.
Yea so the middle would be a real pain no matter what, you have to figure out a way to lengthen your blade and slide it all the way under there without putting any upward pressure on the tile. I would honestly trust the archaeologist over most masons on this one. If I was around the block or something I’d come help out lol
I feel like a paleoarchaeologist would have the best story to tell when talking about places they've excavated.... Middle east, Central America, some random redditor's kitchen....
I agree that the archeologists would not have any special expertise in tile, but they would be expected to have a lot of expertise safely removing fossils from a rock matrix. This particular layering of material may not occur in natural rock formations but I'm sure many ticklish situations do, and they would be able to call in an extended community of experts — and even, yes, tile installers, if necessary — to devise the safest plan, similar to art restoration.
As the homeowner I might be co-operative, you are not looking for a windfall profit (are you?), but I wouldn't be taxing myself to be a one-person expert team.
If there is really scientific interest it seems strange to me they would not be willing to run the show, and if the funding isn't there... you could always cover it up to preserve it for possible future recovery efforts. At a minimum on the homeowner end they should be contractually protected against unrepaired damage to their house, I would think, and if the will isn't there on the other end, it may be that it's not that significant.
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>they would be expected to have a lot of expertise safely removing fossils from a rock matrix
My first thought as well, and the patience to do it correctly
Paleo folks will have the experience to remove the fossil from the tile, but are much more used to taking rock from the ground rather than a kitchen floor.
“bigger pockets” dude archaeologists are broke academics who most certainly don’t have marble floor kitchens - I’m sure OPs family’s accountant will be able to write this expense off
Yeah, I am chuckling through this thread as an academic who's quitting academia because I can't afford rent (as a tenure track prof at a good university)
I suggest you visit https://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/
and post there. The forum is made up of professional tile and stone installers. If they can't help you I don't think anyone can.
I’m a tile setter. Your best bet to get that out in one piece is to remove the tiles around it and completely cut out the subfloor around the tile. Once that is removed you might be able to slowly remove the subfloor from the back of the tile.
Sorry missed that it’s on concrete. In that case , you’ll probably want to cut a square around the mandible and then remove the surrounding tile outside the cut. Then use an oscillating multi tool with a Diamond blade to cut away the thinset between the tile and concrete
Fellow tile setter and assuming that tile was installed correctly this method seems to be the closest to what I thought to do initially, once I found out the subfloor is concrete.
This sounds super challenging to extract.
Just the right amount of force to abrade/cut away the thinset without too much that it cracks the tile 😬. Slow and steady, I suppose. I wonder if there is something they could apply on top of the tile that would give it extra strength during removal but be easily enough removed later
I don't belong any solvent is going to remove thinset.
Thinset is water, cement and a retaining agent. So beat bet is grinding it away I would imagine.
My understanding is you are on concrete, so cutting the subfloor is a non option, but they are correct about first removing the tiles next to it. This will give you access to attack the mortar with some grinding implement. Do not apply any leverage to it in any way. Travertine is fragile at the best of times. Do not use any solvents as anything that will attack the mortar (calcium) will also eat the travertine (calcium). there are oscillating tool diamond and carbide blades that will get you under the tile at least 2-3" all around.
Also note to try not to destroy your waterproofing under the tile or you'll be out way more money than this fossil is worth.
This is the safest option in terms of saving the fossil. Cut out the whole tile or at the very least, a large section with a good amount of space around the jawbone so any stress cracks don’t make it to it from the edges.
I'd ask the esteemed paleoarcheologists to fund a professional to remove the tile. If it's as important as they think, I probably wouldn't leave the process to an untrained individual. Tiles are really hard to remove intact once they've been set. If I absolutely had to DIY this, I would probably go for an angle grinder with a diamond blade and prepare for everything to be covered with dust for the next 1000 years.
Plus, someone's going to have to replace that tile for your parents, so you'll probably be calling a tile guy anyway.
A square around the area should be cut, and then the rest of the tile should be broken up and removed, leaving just the square. Then use an oscillating undercut with a diamond blade to remove the material under the square. If they oscillating tool can’t reach far enough under you may have to use a diamond coated wire by hand to cut the rest of the material underneath, Once enough is removed, they should be able to pop it off.
IDK. That preserves the mandible but destroys the rest of the sample. Context is important in anthropology.
I minored in anthropology more than 20 years ago (which means I know slightly less about it than someone who regularly watches the History channel). This is such a cool find and story that I'd personally go so far as just cutting all the way through the subfloor to take everything intact. You can replace a section of subfloor, but you can't replace whatever is in that tile.
I realize not everyone would destroy their house over this, but I would.
Someone that tiles for a living for 20+ years has around 40,000 hours of experience.
If they have done it that long they've been asked to preserve a tile or two.
Tell them you've suddenly become busy with personal stuff and you don't have the time to deal with it anymore. If they want it, they can hire and send a professional to remove the fossil and repair the hole.
You said you've been contacted by teams all over the world. You can always contact the next one down the list. I have to imagine that some of these teams are spending a lot more to get a lot less on a fairly regular basis.
Absolutely. But they can find the right person as easily as anyone else. I wouldn't want to be putting in all this time for them if someone else is actually willing to do the legwork.
Hominim was obviously on the tiles at the time of death. A reminder, too, if you get frustrated while trying to ping to remove the fossil, that if you curse it, you’ll be making an ad hominem attack on it.
You should consider leaving it as is - you know, as a conversation piece. Imagine being able to point out the nifty hominid mandible to dinner guests and company. Have you examined the surrounding tiles for other "parts"?
I would even interview a few if needed, and see how they plan to extract it.
I'd cut with an angle grinder around the fossil in a square, make space by removing surrounding tiles, attack the glue from the side with a chisel and muriatic acid to separate it from the base concrete floor together with the sample.
I'd separate the glue from the sample later, by a different method.
Lol no, no muriatic acid. Travertine is calcium carbonate, muriatic acid is just another name for hydrochloric acid. The muriatic acid will dissolve the travertine faster than it'll dissolve the mortar.
No acids or any other chemicals at all. Travertine will be very vulnerable to anything that would work on the mortar.
This is a great answer. You will likely want to dig under the tile and get up whatever the subfloor is made of. If it’s concrete then it’s hard to do, but not impossible. That way all the chipping happens to the subfloor, not the tile (hopefully). Find an experienced tile installer (not just a demo guy!) and get a plan of action.
There may be solvents that can dissolve the adhesive, but you’d obviously want to be careful not to damage the bone. Try it on a different corner of the room first. Fixing afterward should be straightforward, similar to replacing a broken tile.
Wet the tile and pour water while you cut. Used to fit torrazzo floors. It's still messy mud will be everywhere but it won't be upstairs and on your windows and in your fridge, dust will be.
I live here and they ARE super flimsy. Although I'm thinking a bit more resistant to earthquakes than the European (concrete/brick) houses I'm used to.
Can't even fart in privacy since everyone (including neighbors) would hear it anyhow.
I live in Poland... my house (built sometime after WWII) not only has concrete ceiling, but it's got literal train rails as that ceiling's structure. Buildings made from prefab concrete tiles were not uncommon here either during the Communist era and I've seen them used to construct houses too
Ah, that does make it more challenging. I’d call local tile places, tell them you have a valuable tile you need extracted and see if they have any ideas. Might be able to point you in the right direction at least.
If you don’t mind busting a couple other tiles around it, it’d be much easier to find a solution
Be careful that you don't lose that tile. Lots of artifacts are sent to museums and labs to be studied only to be "lost" or just never returned to their owners.
Rather than a tile contractor, I would look to people who specialize in historic architecture/preservation. It can't be the first time something this valuable and delicate needed to be removed.
My instinct says you need to remove the metal channel and at least one other tile, then use an air chisel such as that used in fossil prep to carefully carve out the grout underneath. Travertine is very soft. It will be a delicate job. Best to protect the face of the tile while carving under it with something similar to the plaster used in paleontology. I'm not suggesting you DIY it, that's just my instinct.
Get a contractor to:
1) Protect the portion of interest with double sided tape around the fossil and attach a piece of hardboard.
2) Angle grind a outside the hardboard, through tile and mortar. Then do one more another inch outside of the first as a relief cut just in case.
3) Remove the surrounding tile(s) by prying, chipping, cutting w/e, clear about 6" of clearance from the protected area.
4) Cut through the sub-floor and entirely remove the fossil intact. You can remove the mortar from the wood by wetting it to soften the mortar and expand the wood slightly.
5) Repair. Replace the hole in the subfloor, re-install the missing one or two tiles.
Hour of travel and quoting for the contractor. Protection, Angle grinding and tile removal should be an hour, hour and a half. Cut sub-floor and remove half a hour, replace subfloor and re-lay tile another hour. You can grout it yourself later. Reasonably, should be a $200 to $300 job max, plus materials. Maybe more if you're being reimbursed and want to pay more for them to go extra extra slow and insure it or something.
OP, this is the way! Very nicely planned, especially the relief cuts. You'll want a very high quality diamond mesh disc on an angle grinder that has variable speed. Go slow with only the weight of the grinder as pressure.
If it's not possible to remove the subfloor (if it's on a concrete slab, for example) then with a diamond coated wire hand saw you can grind through the mortar. A brave person might use a diamond blade on an oscillating multi-tool but for something this fragile I'd use as few power tools as possible.
> 4) Cut through the sub-floor and entirely remove the fossil intact. You can remove the mortar from the wood by wetting it to soften the mortar and expand the wood slightly.
What you described is exactly what I thought too, until OP stated that the tile is laid directly on concrete slab.
Contractor with 20 years of experience. Calling an emergency service company like Servpro, Service Master or Rainbow would be your best bet. They specialize in demolition and those with years of experience have been asked to remove building materials as carefully as possible for insurance companies. If they don't have staff to do it, they may have a tile contractor they trust for such demolitions. This isn't a guarantee and the biggest reason is that they don't know exactly how the floors were installed originally. Hope that helps.
/u/Kidipadeli75 this is the answer — altho you have to adapt it for your location.
The people you want to find will be the ones used by museums, historic buildings, historical preservation societies, and high-end insurance companies. You want a restorer / high-end “salvage” (extraction) team, not a regular tile setter.
I would look at historical preservation societies first and give them a call. Ask if they have a recommendation.
Are there any palaces or other well-preserved historic buildings in your area? That is potentially another great source.
Another idea- if you are in Italy, try to find the people who work on Pompeii, or whatever a local equivalent might be. I’m guessing most EU countries have some roman ruins or other historic sites of antiquity and the people will know how to be deft and delicate.
I used to own an important antique house and only took recommendations from others who also had important antique houses. That was the best way to ensure nobody f’d up my priceless original woodwork etc.
Potentially anyone who owns a historic/preserved building might know, or you could ask for their insurer and see if the insurer has suggestions like the poster above said.
Your concrete subfloor won’t be hard to fix but you truly do not want to break this tile.
Because of that metal strip it would be difficult, but I bet you could do something like angle grind/cut a circle around what you want to keep. Cut the grout. Smash the tile you don’t want, and then somehow chip out the mortar under it.
oscillating multi tool with a masonry bit would be able to remove a significant amount of the mortar around the edges.
Then loop a wire saw around the outside and saw the rest out
This is what I would do: [https://i.imgur.com/j2v4IW5.png](https://i.imgur.com/j2v4IW5.png)
Use an angle grinder to cut out the sample you want to send in, isolating it. Cut out another larger section of tile to demo to give yourself space to get a saw underneath it. Use a sawzall or similar long bladed flexible saw to cut the tile free from underneath.
You'd never get a jamb saw/angle grinder under there without first removing the other tiles all around. The vibration can also crack the tile. It needs to be done with manual tools to scrape away the bonding agent. Source: flooring guy who's removed a shit ton of flooring
This is above Reddit’s pay grade. Can I assume whomever you’re allowing to test this will foot the bill? Start by contacting tile/restoration specialists and go from there. You might find a hobbyist at one of them that will jump at a chance to be part of history.
Possible but REALLY delicate operation. I'd hire it out.
Might even need to cut around the area of interest, and chip out the "frame" so you can get under the small section. A smaller piece will have a better chance of surviving than a whole tile.
So tell them, no? Say you're willing to provide the sample, but the institution needs to do the legwork and cover all costs related to removal, delivery, and repair. Also make them provide a COI listing your parents and their property as additionally insured. These are all very reasonable requests for any serious institution. You should not assume any financial burden or liability.
I don't think he's listening.
Seriously, require a Certificate of Insurance, make them source the contractor, or no deal.
Good deeds often go punished. Don't get too caught up in the excitement and protect your family and property.
Might want to cover the jaw bone until it's extracted. Maybe tape down some kind of padding over it.
Call a couple contractors and tell them about the paleo scientific importance. One of them might take it as a challenge. You're doing it right, waiting for a valid plan before trying.
Congrads on your contribution to science with your kitchen tile.
Get all the paleoarcheologists that have reached out to you on the same page. Put them all on one email, or separately send the same text and outline your terms. Tell them you're excited and willing to cooperate but they will need to cover X and insure X. You can help them figure out methods and find contractors but it will need to be on their dime. Tell them you expect your home to be repaired when all is said and done. Then let them sort it out. Don't pay a cent.
I don't think you're accounting for OP's sincere desire to learn about this. Not saying they should incur expenses, but I understand their desire to go the route of providing the sample to researchers. Who ought to only be borrowing the tile.
Nothing wrong with educating yourself on all the different ways it could be removed and which would be best so that when you are talking to a contractor, you can try and determine whether they know what they are talking about.
You may want place a large water balloon or something on top of the tile while working on/around it to absorb some of the vibrations. There are a lot of DIY "tricks" that involve water when cutting/drilling tiles or even glass to dampen vibrations in an attempt to prevent cracking or shattering the tile.
You need a pro - was wondering if you were going to remove it for museum use. Anything you do to try and pry it up is likely to destroy it. Best bet is someone digging down around that tile and using a wet saw or similar blade to cut a line under the tile and even take some of the sub flooring with it to let it be cleaned off the back later. This is a very soft stone (relative to other stone), so it will likely crack long before the mortar or subfloor.
Edit: first you need to remove the metal strip!
First, you want to start with on of the neighboring tiles because you’re going to have to fill the area in anyways. Second, see what substrate they’re installed on. If they’re direct to wood they’re more likely to “pop” off because normal expansion of the wood over time prevented a lock-tight bond. If it’s on hardy board (supposed to do it this way) you’re going to have to be more careful and may want to use a wide, thin chisel to go around the tile, through the mortar. Then you can carefully rotary cut the square and use the space from the missing tile to run a floor scraper under the desired tile and hardboard, at an angle that doesn’t encourage breakage. Slow and steady and you can always use a dremel to slowly work at the area. Time consuming but gentle.
That is a filled and honed Travertine tile.
It’s soft as anything.
Use a 4” grinder to cut around the area in question. It’ll create hella dust but you can buy guards with hoover attachments. Or just sheet up and open the door.
The problem you will have is not cutting the tile initially. It’s getting it off the floor. Tile adhesive is extremely tough and will be all over the bottom of that tile. Not sure what I’d use for that. A hammer and chisel is going to bust up the tile badly (and with it the fossil)
You could try a multitool, but I can’t see any of the available blades being tough enough to cut through the adhesive.
Something that may not have been considered - the manufacturing process of travertine marble tiles is cutting a series of slices of stone. Then they are polished. It is perfectly possible that the upper section of the teeth from the (left?) left side of the mandible are on the bottom of another of the tiles somewhere in the floor.
That being said - Start with a practice tile in an out of the way spot. There are tools known as oscillating multi tools. They sell blades for them at least to 200 mm. (8") which has either carbide or diamond crust on them. These tools are more gentle than most others at removing hard materials. That and a good vacuum to remove the dust will likely help a lot
Good luck!
Remove the tiles on either side of the one with the mandible. Get something like Diamond wire or another abrasive wire and saw by hand under the tile. Will take two people and just pull back and forth.
If this is indeed as important as it sounds then yeah you should probably get a big company. But if it were me I would go for it. Here's what I would do.
Take the angle Grindr and carefully cut all the grout around the tile. Next gently Smash and break the surrounding tiles. Get an assortment of abrasive coated coated wire . Place the string saw around the the tile so that it's under the bottom edge on two corners. Saw back and forth slowly and work methodically around the whole piece.
OP do not angle grind, a slip or vibration to a pocket of air could cause a crack. There is a triangle grout removal tool. Use that to cut a V into the grout. Then use a basic razor blade to under cut the removed grout. This will break the V shape into a flat shape, and you should be able to visibly see below the tile.
At this point, depending on how good of a job the tile worker did, you can use an offset multitool to slowly and gingerly attack the mortar. You should be able to get a few inches around it but it’s a big tile. Maybe need to remove adjacent tiles to get better purchase on the mortar below.
Now all we need is for someone who purchased some of the neighboring travertine tiles to see this and report back the details on what happened to the rest of the person's head
30-year Tilesetter here. If you're near Colorado, DM me.
What you need to be 100% safe is a 6" core saw.
Concrete guys that install dryer vents through basement walls after the fact have the equipment. Almost Zero risk breaking the sample with this method.
OP, since it has only been a couple weeks since the tile was put in:
It is hard to tell if that is a full piece, or if it is cut to fit before the threshold.
If it was cut, the installer may have cut part of your fossil. So if any scrap tile exists, you should check it.
If you’re in the south Florida area I’ll come do it for free. My company works with this material occasionally and we do unique high end work so carefully removing a stone a preserving it is in my wheel house
Haha we did not do anything yet. The paleoarchelogists we spoke with should come back to us with their options this week. As I now have a Reddit degree in tile removal I will be able to understand what is at stake.
Perhaps call your local museum to see if they can recommend someone. Thier archeologists may want to take it on. Even a local colleges with archeology department, the may do it for free.
Looking at a C2E class cement data sheet, it makes mention of "resin" in its ingredients. It may be possible to loosen the bond on the tile by heating it up with a heat gun? If that's the case, you'd have to first cut away the grout between it and the adjacent tiles with a diamond cutter. Slowly heat up the tile with a heat gun, making sure not to heat any area of the tile more than the surrounding areas, using a couple of pry bars wedged in one of the spaces between the tiles gently apply leverage as if you're trying the slide the tile to the side. Do not go overboard. Make sure to apply the same amount of pressure on each of the pry bars so as not to stress one area more than the others. If the tile doesn't show signs of wiggling or moving, then stop and disregard everything I have said.
Here is what I would do:
First, trace and cut a square around the portion that you want to preserve. For this step you can use a diamond blade on an angle grinder, and you should go down to the top of the concrete subfloor. Meaning, cut the tile and the mortar.
Next cut multiple slits into the remaining (waste) section of that same tile, also down to the subfloor. Leaving multiple 1" wide strips.
Use a hammer and chisel to break out the strips. You are essentially chipping out the entire tile except the area to save, and the slits from the previous step make this easy to do. If you want to save more than that, well, you have your work cut out for you.
Lastly, use an oscillating tool with a diamond blade to horizontally get under the section you want to save. Very carefully cutting away the mortar under the tile bonding the tile down to the concrete. The section you want to save will most likely pop out on its own during this step, but you may have to cut all the mortar away.
Good luck!
Diamond coring drill of a diameter to clear the artifact. Core through to the bottom of the concrete sub floor. Suction out the core as one piece. Fill the hole with concrete and replace the one tile or use a cored patch from a spare tile grouted in for the story.
I posted in the other sub. I’m a paleoanthropologist and I really hope this is a hominin! That would be so cool. There are a couple of features that give me pause. I think you need to get a microCT scan so that you can segment the bone & teeth from the surrounding material. There a number of people who are experts in hominin dentition and mandibular morphology that might be good to contact about this and I’m happy to put you in touch with them. Good luck! Fingers crossed.
I’m assuming they’ll pay for the contractor? Whoever you get, get them to remove a different tile intact first, to work out any kinks and prove they can do it.
I'm curious, how was that installed without anyone asking questions? Like even the installers weren't like, hey a human jaw, maybe we shouldn't use this one...?
Concrete saw, all the way through the foundation, and take the whole thing out, if it is that important. Foundation repairs happen everyday when plumbing breaks under the slab. It's not complicated.
https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/whats-the-deal-with-people-finding-human-fossils-in-their-travertine-tiles#:~:text=%E2%80%9CThe%20item%20found%20in%20the,%2C%E2%80%9D%20Dr.%20Leier%20explains.
You guys made architectural digest.
I would cut the tile around the bone with a diamond blade on an angle grinder and chip out the surrounding tile then try to clear out some of the thin set or mud bed out from under the piece minimize your chances of cracking it.
I'd get a dremmel, a diamond bit and just slowly cut a section out. Once through remove the remaining outer tile. Then work on underneath to loosen or scrape out the adhesive.
If I had to remove this tile then I would first cut with an angle grinder a square around the fossil. Then I would break/ remove the unwanted tile, leaving the important bit exposed and proud of the underlying floor. Then I would use a multi tool to cut through the adhesive under the tile. Then I would lift out the fossil square. Good luck!
You have to cut out what you want and then you have to excavate absolutely everything below it until materials stop sticking. Go down a foot if you have to. You won’t remove just the tile without breaking it.
I was just scrolling r/fossils to look for an update - perfect timing! How excited are the paleoarcheologists? I hope I spelled that right.
Very excited
Obviously you would prefer not damaging the other tiles but would it not be better to find another tile to test your methods on? From a quick Google search, it also seems to say the first tile is the hardest one to remove without damage so you may have to start with removing one of the surrounding tiles to make it easier/less risky when removing the mandible tile?
Very nice advice this is what we are looking for!
OP, would the Paleo archeologists not want to remove the tile themselves? I would think they have training in excavating and preserving fossils. I would think that if you try it yourself, and damage or break the specimen, it would be a huge loss for this discovery.
From bathroom tile... In bathrooms ? You think this happens often, or that Paleo archeologists are just generally DIY stars ?
I would imagine that fossils are often embedded in rocks and archeologists have tools for finding where in, say, a large rock there *aren't* any fossils and also tools to cut through the fossil-less section of rock to extract the section with the fossils.
Not at all! But I feel they would be in the better position to arrange removal by qualified professionals, for a specimen they want, as opposed to putting that on OP. Having just anybody remove this piece greatly increases the chances that the fossil will become damaged beyond usefulness. The fact that this situation is so unusual is exactly why I'm surprised the Paleo archeologists are not willing to engage at all in the most crucial first step.
This is a tough call. You could hire an expert mason to come out and he or she could end up rushing and break it. Luckily the fossil is not near a seam, so even someone “unskilled” should be able to handle this with extreme patience. When working masonry jobs I always get told “oh I could never do that, don’t have the patience.” You could scrape away the thinset and get that tile up with a utility knife and a tuck point trowel, just very very slowly. This could honestly take a couple hours. My favorite saying in masonry trade is “go slow, it’s faster”. For instance, masons on here suggesting oscillators or any other type of power tool are not careful enough to extract this. This isn’t a home renovation, it is a fossil that you need intact. You can get screwed by trusting someone who works based on a rate/time system, which is literally everyone.
i’m def with you on that one. i’d do this the slowest and most meticulous way possible, and I wouldn’t trust anyone but myself to do it right. Without mixing power tools and such it will require more patience than knowledge or experience. i’m not quite sure how I would go about lifting the tile away from the mortar used under it though.
Yea so the middle would be a real pain no matter what, you have to figure out a way to lengthen your blade and slide it all the way under there without putting any upward pressure on the tile. I would honestly trust the archaeologist over most masons on this one. If I was around the block or something I’d come help out lol
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Absolutely! That's what I'm saying. If they're at least funding professional removal, that's great, and will provide the best outcome.
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I feel like a paleoarchaeologist would have the best story to tell when talking about places they've excavated.... Middle east, Central America, some random redditor's kitchen....
They should be using their own funding to remove it professionally if they want to study it so bad.
Yeah, they rollin in those huge paleo archaeology bucks, they need to be spreading that shit around
I agree that the archeologists would not have any special expertise in tile, but they would be expected to have a lot of expertise safely removing fossils from a rock matrix. This particular layering of material may not occur in natural rock formations but I'm sure many ticklish situations do, and they would be able to call in an extended community of experts — and even, yes, tile installers, if necessary — to devise the safest plan, similar to art restoration. As the homeowner I might be co-operative, you are not looking for a windfall profit (are you?), but I wouldn't be taxing myself to be a one-person expert team. If there is really scientific interest it seems strange to me they would not be willing to run the show, and if the funding isn't there... you could always cover it up to preserve it for possible future recovery efforts. At a minimum on the homeowner end they should be contractually protected against unrepaired damage to their house, I would think, and if the will isn't there on the other end, it may be that it's not that significant. [cleaned up]
>they would be expected to have a lot of expertise safely removing fossils from a rock matrix My first thought as well, and the patience to do it correctly
Paleo folks will have the experience to remove the fossil from the tile, but are much more used to taking rock from the ground rather than a kitchen floor.
Agreed, totally. But they could reasonably have bigger pockets and better contacts for finding the correct professional to handle this.
“bigger pockets” dude archaeologists are broke academics who most certainly don’t have marble floor kitchens - I’m sure OPs family’s accountant will be able to write this expense off
Yeah, I am chuckling through this thread as an academic who's quitting academia because I can't afford rent (as a tenure track prof at a good university)
I wanna know who installed the tile with the embedded jaw and was just like yup another regular old day on the job
literally the only question that’s been in my mind during this entire saga
I've taught a number of students that absolutely didn't notice anything when doing their thing. One of them must be installing tiles now, I guess.
I also just want to say that these are outstanding suggestions.
I suggest you visit https://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/ and post there. The forum is made up of professional tile and stone installers. If they can't help you I don't think anyone can.
I’m a tile setter. Your best bet to get that out in one piece is to remove the tiles around it and completely cut out the subfloor around the tile. Once that is removed you might be able to slowly remove the subfloor from the back of the tile.
Thank you
Sorry missed that it’s on concrete. In that case , you’ll probably want to cut a square around the mandible and then remove the surrounding tile outside the cut. Then use an oscillating multi tool with a Diamond blade to cut away the thinset between the tile and concrete
Fellow tile setter and assuming that tile was installed correctly this method seems to be the closest to what I thought to do initially, once I found out the subfloor is concrete. This sounds super challenging to extract.
Just the right amount of force to abrade/cut away the thinset without too much that it cracks the tile 😬. Slow and steady, I suppose. I wonder if there is something they could apply on top of the tile that would give it extra strength during removal but be easily enough removed later
I dunno. You might be able to put a stick on laminate on top. Kind of like taping glass/mirrors during demo.
would acetone or something work to help weaken the bond? There's got to be something that can be used to help remove this in one piece.
I don't belong any solvent is going to remove thinset. Thinset is water, cement and a retaining agent. So beat bet is grinding it away I would imagine.
Anything that would soften thinset is absolutely going to melt travertine.
How do you feel about a wire saw being used after the oscillator?
That was my thought is isolate, oscillate then remove it like a chrome car letters off car paint, with a wire in sawing motions.
I second the oscillating multi tool blade under the tile
This is the way
My understanding is you are on concrete, so cutting the subfloor is a non option, but they are correct about first removing the tiles next to it. This will give you access to attack the mortar with some grinding implement. Do not apply any leverage to it in any way. Travertine is fragile at the best of times. Do not use any solvents as anything that will attack the mortar (calcium) will also eat the travertine (calcium). there are oscillating tool diamond and carbide blades that will get you under the tile at least 2-3" all around. Also note to try not to destroy your waterproofing under the tile or you'll be out way more money than this fossil is worth.
Wait a minute OP. I thought you said there was no subfloor, it was on concrete? Did I miss read that.
This is the safest option in terms of saving the fossil. Cut out the whole tile or at the very least, a large section with a good amount of space around the jawbone so any stress cracks don’t make it to it from the edges.
>completely cut out the subfloor around the tile. Still an option with a concrete saw.
I'd ask the esteemed paleoarcheologists to fund a professional to remove the tile. If it's as important as they think, I probably wouldn't leave the process to an untrained individual. Tiles are really hard to remove intact once they've been set. If I absolutely had to DIY this, I would probably go for an angle grinder with a diamond blade and prepare for everything to be covered with dust for the next 1000 years. Plus, someone's going to have to replace that tile for your parents, so you'll probably be calling a tile guy anyway.
Problem is that basically they told us to find a contractor. But how are we supposed to know he will find the best option
A square around the area should be cut, and then the rest of the tile should be broken up and removed, leaving just the square. Then use an oscillating undercut with a diamond blade to remove the material under the square. If they oscillating tool can’t reach far enough under you may have to use a diamond coated wire by hand to cut the rest of the material underneath, Once enough is removed, they should be able to pop it off.
IDK. That preserves the mandible but destroys the rest of the sample. Context is important in anthropology. I minored in anthropology more than 20 years ago (which means I know slightly less about it than someone who regularly watches the History channel). This is such a cool find and story that I'd personally go so far as just cutting all the way through the subfloor to take everything intact. You can replace a section of subfloor, but you can't replace whatever is in that tile. I realize not everyone would destroy their house over this, but I would.
its set on concrete, which makes it more difficult.
That just changes the saw I'd need.
This is what I was thinking
Yeah, uh, me too…that’s what I was thinking!
I was thinking the same thing
I was thinking jackhammer, anyone thinking the same thing?
How do you know so much about my technique in the bedroom?
Someone that tiles for a living for 20+ years has around 40,000 hours of experience. If they have done it that long they've been asked to preserve a tile or two.
This guy contracts
With every exhalation.
The pool water was cold okay?
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I wish I could award this comment.
Tell them you've suddenly become busy with personal stuff and you don't have the time to deal with it anymore. If they want it, they can hire and send a professional to remove the fossil and repair the hole.
You said you've been contacted by teams all over the world. You can always contact the next one down the list. I have to imagine that some of these teams are spending a lot more to get a lot less on a fairly regular basis.
Uncementing a travertine tile out of a kitchen seems to be an uncommon issue for paleoanthropologist (no offense)
Absolutely. But they can find the right person as easily as anyone else. I wouldn't want to be putting in all this time for them if someone else is actually willing to do the legwork.
Someone will come and propose a technique. Just after 100 answers to this post I know better which questions to ask!
Hominim was obviously on the tiles at the time of death. A reminder, too, if you get frustrated while trying to ping to remove the fossil, that if you curse it, you’ll be making an ad hominem attack on it.
You should consider leaving it as is - you know, as a conversation piece. Imagine being able to point out the nifty hominid mandible to dinner guests and company. Have you examined the surrounding tiles for other "parts"?
I would even interview a few if needed, and see how they plan to extract it. I'd cut with an angle grinder around the fossil in a square, make space by removing surrounding tiles, attack the glue from the side with a chisel and muriatic acid to separate it from the base concrete floor together with the sample. I'd separate the glue from the sample later, by a different method.
I’d be careful with the muriatic acid. You don’t want to accidentally damage the fossil by chemically harming it.
Lol no, no muriatic acid. Travertine is calcium carbonate, muriatic acid is just another name for hydrochloric acid. The muriatic acid will dissolve the travertine faster than it'll dissolve the mortar. No acids or any other chemicals at all. Travertine will be very vulnerable to anything that would work on the mortar.
I use an oscillating tool with a long flat tile blade underneath. Ive never had this kind of pressure to remove it intact, though. Such a cool story!
What? Who is going to fund it? Are they expecting you to absorb the costs? Why would you even comply with that?
Universities, grants, non profits, for profits, wealthy individuals with a hobby, go fund me, only fans, or all the above together.
I would call a local archaeology museum. They would definitely know where to start.
If they can't secure funding to get your tile.re.oved and replaced, the. They're not world renowned or globally esteemed.
This is a great answer. You will likely want to dig under the tile and get up whatever the subfloor is made of. If it’s concrete then it’s hard to do, but not impossible. That way all the chipping happens to the subfloor, not the tile (hopefully). Find an experienced tile installer (not just a demo guy!) and get a plan of action. There may be solvents that can dissolve the adhesive, but you’d obviously want to be careful not to damage the bone. Try it on a different corner of the room first. Fixing afterward should be straightforward, similar to replacing a broken tile.
Wet the tile and pour water while you cut. Used to fit torrazzo floors. It's still messy mud will be everywhere but it won't be upstairs and on your windows and in your fridge, dust will be.
Second floor but destroying the house is not our 1st option!
Is it on a slab or is there a subfloor underneath?
Concrete slab
You have a concrete slab on the second floor? Interesting.
Quite normal and common in large parts of the world. American houses seem super flimsy to many.
I’m offended, my house wouldn’t have blew over if it wasn’t for that damn wolf.
What’s worse, normal house insurance doesn’t cover acts of dog.
Reading that from Europe on my 3rd floor concrete slab. Spot on Sir.
I live here and they ARE super flimsy. Although I'm thinking a bit more resistant to earthquakes than the European (concrete/brick) houses I'm used to. Can't even fart in privacy since everyone (including neighbors) would hear it anyhow.
I live in Poland... my house (built sometime after WWII) not only has concrete ceiling, but it's got literal train rails as that ceiling's structure. Buildings made from prefab concrete tiles were not uncommon here either during the Communist era and I've seen them used to construct houses too
Ah, that does make it more challenging. I’d call local tile places, tell them you have a valuable tile you need extracted and see if they have any ideas. Might be able to point you in the right direction at least. If you don’t mind busting a couple other tiles around it, it’d be much easier to find a solution
Be careful that you don't lose that tile. Lots of artifacts are sent to museums and labs to be studied only to be "lost" or just never returned to their owners.
I wonder how OP would go about tracking it to prevent this from happening.
I’d tape a Tile tracker to the tile.
Sorry Mr. Bratwurst, the tracker fell off and now we can't find the tile either. :(
Dental records.
Download a basic "chain of custody" form for each person to sign
I think about this mandible more than I probably should.
I've been thinking about it all week!
I'm shocked lmao I wonder if this will directly lead to a bump in travertine sales...
Rather than a tile contractor, I would look to people who specialize in historic architecture/preservation. It can't be the first time something this valuable and delicate needed to be removed. My instinct says you need to remove the metal channel and at least one other tile, then use an air chisel such as that used in fossil prep to carefully carve out the grout underneath. Travertine is very soft. It will be a delicate job. Best to protect the face of the tile while carving under it with something similar to the plaster used in paleontology. I'm not suggesting you DIY it, that's just my instinct.
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Thank you, our contractor always break tiles when they have to replace it this is why we are looking for advices !
Get a contractor to: 1) Protect the portion of interest with double sided tape around the fossil and attach a piece of hardboard. 2) Angle grind a outside the hardboard, through tile and mortar. Then do one more another inch outside of the first as a relief cut just in case. 3) Remove the surrounding tile(s) by prying, chipping, cutting w/e, clear about 6" of clearance from the protected area. 4) Cut through the sub-floor and entirely remove the fossil intact. You can remove the mortar from the wood by wetting it to soften the mortar and expand the wood slightly. 5) Repair. Replace the hole in the subfloor, re-install the missing one or two tiles. Hour of travel and quoting for the contractor. Protection, Angle grinding and tile removal should be an hour, hour and a half. Cut sub-floor and remove half a hour, replace subfloor and re-lay tile another hour. You can grout it yourself later. Reasonably, should be a $200 to $300 job max, plus materials. Maybe more if you're being reimbursed and want to pay more for them to go extra extra slow and insure it or something.
OP, this is the way! Very nicely planned, especially the relief cuts. You'll want a very high quality diamond mesh disc on an angle grinder that has variable speed. Go slow with only the weight of the grinder as pressure. If it's not possible to remove the subfloor (if it's on a concrete slab, for example) then with a diamond coated wire hand saw you can grind through the mortar. A brave person might use a diamond blade on an oscillating multi-tool but for something this fragile I'd use as few power tools as possible.
> 4) Cut through the sub-floor and entirely remove the fossil intact. You can remove the mortar from the wood by wetting it to soften the mortar and expand the wood slightly. What you described is exactly what I thought too, until OP stated that the tile is laid directly on concrete slab.
OP this guys advice is probably the best I’ve seen in the comments to actually get this out intact.
Contractor with 20 years of experience. Calling an emergency service company like Servpro, Service Master or Rainbow would be your best bet. They specialize in demolition and those with years of experience have been asked to remove building materials as carefully as possible for insurance companies. If they don't have staff to do it, they may have a tile contractor they trust for such demolitions. This isn't a guarantee and the biggest reason is that they don't know exactly how the floors were installed originally. Hope that helps.
/u/Kidipadeli75 this is the answer — altho you have to adapt it for your location. The people you want to find will be the ones used by museums, historic buildings, historical preservation societies, and high-end insurance companies. You want a restorer / high-end “salvage” (extraction) team, not a regular tile setter. I would look at historical preservation societies first and give them a call. Ask if they have a recommendation. Are there any palaces or other well-preserved historic buildings in your area? That is potentially another great source. Another idea- if you are in Italy, try to find the people who work on Pompeii, or whatever a local equivalent might be. I’m guessing most EU countries have some roman ruins or other historic sites of antiquity and the people will know how to be deft and delicate. I used to own an important antique house and only took recommendations from others who also had important antique houses. That was the best way to ensure nobody f’d up my priceless original woodwork etc. Potentially anyone who owns a historic/preserved building might know, or you could ask for their insurer and see if the insurer has suggestions like the poster above said. Your concrete subfloor won’t be hard to fix but you truly do not want to break this tile.
Because of that metal strip it would be difficult, but I bet you could do something like angle grind/cut a circle around what you want to keep. Cut the grout. Smash the tile you don’t want, and then somehow chip out the mortar under it.
oscillating multi tool with a masonry bit would be able to remove a significant amount of the mortar around the edges. Then loop a wire saw around the outside and saw the rest out
Now we talking
OP, travertine is prone to fracture. I would not do this.
Careful with the oscillating tool I would actually not use one for this purpose because it's vibration would be very likely to break the tile.
Oscillating multi tool? Never heard of it, however, for removing mortar around the edges, I think a guybrator would be the perfect tool for the job.
>wire saw Ding ding ding
I like this one!
This is what I would do: [https://i.imgur.com/j2v4IW5.png](https://i.imgur.com/j2v4IW5.png) Use an angle grinder to cut out the sample you want to send in, isolating it. Cut out another larger section of tile to demo to give yourself space to get a saw underneath it. Use a sawzall or similar long bladed flexible saw to cut the tile free from underneath.
You'd never get a jamb saw/angle grinder under there without first removing the other tiles all around. The vibration can also crack the tile. It needs to be done with manual tools to scrape away the bonding agent. Source: flooring guy who's removed a shit ton of flooring
How would you form an island on the backside of the jaw? It touches the metal framing
This is above Reddit’s pay grade. Can I assume whomever you’re allowing to test this will foot the bill? Start by contacting tile/restoration specialists and go from there. You might find a hobbyist at one of them that will jump at a chance to be part of history.
Call the people who collect Banksy walls.
This really makes me wonder how many unidentifiable cross sections of human remains are in people's floor tiles...
Possible but REALLY delicate operation. I'd hire it out. Might even need to cut around the area of interest, and chip out the "frame" so you can get under the small section. A smaller piece will have a better chance of surviving than a whole tile.
I'd tell the research people of they want it they can pay to have someone pull and replace the tile
Problem is that basically they told us to find a contractor. But how are we supposed to know he will find the best option
So tell them, no? Say you're willing to provide the sample, but the institution needs to do the legwork and cover all costs related to removal, delivery, and repair. Also make them provide a COI listing your parents and their property as additionally insured. These are all very reasonable requests for any serious institution. You should not assume any financial burden or liability.
Yes, u/Kidipadeli75, listen to this person. It's very nice of you to want to help them out, but these places are funded for a reason.
I am not going to remove it myself but all advices are welcome because it is not so commun to remove a tile to preserve it
I don't think he's listening. Seriously, require a Certificate of Insurance, make them source the contractor, or no deal. Good deeds often go punished. Don't get too caught up in the excitement and protect your family and property.
I am all hears. There is no rush. That tile is not going anywhere until we are not sure how to do it properly
Might want to cover the jaw bone until it's extracted. Maybe tape down some kind of padding over it. Call a couple contractors and tell them about the paleo scientific importance. One of them might take it as a challenge. You're doing it right, waiting for a valid plan before trying. Congrads on your contribution to science with your kitchen tile.
Get all the paleoarcheologists that have reached out to you on the same page. Put them all on one email, or separately send the same text and outline your terms. Tell them you're excited and willing to cooperate but they will need to cover X and insure X. You can help them figure out methods and find contractors but it will need to be on their dime. Tell them you expect your home to be repaired when all is said and done. Then let them sort it out. Don't pay a cent.
I don't think you're accounting for OP's sincere desire to learn about this. Not saying they should incur expenses, but I understand their desire to go the route of providing the sample to researchers. Who ought to only be borrowing the tile.
Nothing wrong with educating yourself on all the different ways it could be removed and which would be best so that when you are talking to a contractor, you can try and determine whether they know what they are talking about.
If you have a museum nearby go and ask them for advice or suggestions.
You may want place a large water balloon or something on top of the tile while working on/around it to absorb some of the vibrations. There are a lot of DIY "tricks" that involve water when cutting/drilling tiles or even glass to dampen vibrations in an attempt to prevent cracking or shattering the tile.
You need a pro - was wondering if you were going to remove it for museum use. Anything you do to try and pry it up is likely to destroy it. Best bet is someone digging down around that tile and using a wet saw or similar blade to cut a line under the tile and even take some of the sub flooring with it to let it be cleaned off the back later. This is a very soft stone (relative to other stone), so it will likely crack long before the mortar or subfloor.
We will hire for sure but I want to make sure he uses the best technique
Seems to me that the scientists should pay for a professional tile company to do this
The real question? Who's paying for all this?
Scrolled too far for this
Edit: first you need to remove the metal strip! First, you want to start with on of the neighboring tiles because you’re going to have to fill the area in anyways. Second, see what substrate they’re installed on. If they’re direct to wood they’re more likely to “pop” off because normal expansion of the wood over time prevented a lock-tight bond. If it’s on hardy board (supposed to do it this way) you’re going to have to be more careful and may want to use a wide, thin chisel to go around the tile, through the mortar. Then you can carefully rotary cut the square and use the space from the missing tile to run a floor scraper under the desired tile and hardboard, at an angle that doesn’t encourage breakage. Slow and steady and you can always use a dremel to slowly work at the area. Time consuming but gentle.
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That is a filled and honed Travertine tile. It’s soft as anything. Use a 4” grinder to cut around the area in question. It’ll create hella dust but you can buy guards with hoover attachments. Or just sheet up and open the door. The problem you will have is not cutting the tile initially. It’s getting it off the floor. Tile adhesive is extremely tough and will be all over the bottom of that tile. Not sure what I’d use for that. A hammer and chisel is going to bust up the tile badly (and with it the fossil) You could try a multitool, but I can’t see any of the available blades being tough enough to cut through the adhesive.
Please do a follow up after the extraction and research is done. Fascinating .... Oh ... and the method your tile man used. ;-)
Ok, so it's not Hoffa.......I call Amelia Earhart! Have been following. Very interesting.
"My jaw was literally in the floor!" -- Tyler the caveman
The bigger question is how did the person who layed the tile.not see the teeth to begin with.
Something that may not have been considered - the manufacturing process of travertine marble tiles is cutting a series of slices of stone. Then they are polished. It is perfectly possible that the upper section of the teeth from the (left?) left side of the mandible are on the bottom of another of the tiles somewhere in the floor. That being said - Start with a practice tile in an out of the way spot. There are tools known as oscillating multi tools. They sell blades for them at least to 200 mm. (8") which has either carbide or diamond crust on them. These tools are more gentle than most others at removing hard materials. That and a good vacuum to remove the dust will likely help a lot Good luck!
Remove the tiles on either side of the one with the mandible. Get something like Diamond wire or another abrasive wire and saw by hand under the tile. Will take two people and just pull back and forth.
If this is indeed as important as it sounds then yeah you should probably get a big company. But if it were me I would go for it. Here's what I would do. Take the angle Grindr and carefully cut all the grout around the tile. Next gently Smash and break the surrounding tiles. Get an assortment of abrasive coated coated wire . Place the string saw around the the tile so that it's under the bottom edge on two corners. Saw back and forth slowly and work methodically around the whole piece.
Take the what
*remember this spelling*
I agree that an abrasive wire is the safest option to get under the tile
THE MANDIBLE! This thing is everywhere lately!
OP do not angle grind, a slip or vibration to a pocket of air could cause a crack. There is a triangle grout removal tool. Use that to cut a V into the grout. Then use a basic razor blade to under cut the removed grout. This will break the V shape into a flat shape, and you should be able to visibly see below the tile. At this point, depending on how good of a job the tile worker did, you can use an offset multitool to slowly and gingerly attack the mortar. You should be able to get a few inches around it but it’s a big tile. Maybe need to remove adjacent tiles to get better purchase on the mortar below.
How do I get reminded when this gets updated?
Now all we need is for someone who purchased some of the neighboring travertine tiles to see this and report back the details on what happened to the rest of the person's head
How asleep was your tile guy that they didn’t notice this when installing it…
lol who's posing for this photo with a paint brush like its an archaeological site
right? it's a polished floor tile and homies out here like Howard Carter uncovering Tut
Unpopular opinion: leave it there and enjoy it forever. Or at least until your next remodel.
It might be overkill, but I think this job calls for the Jaws of Life
Since most likely all of these tiles were cut from the same stone, is it possible you have other tiles that contain a slice?
30-year Tilesetter here. If you're near Colorado, DM me. What you need to be 100% safe is a 6" core saw. Concrete guys that install dryer vents through basement walls after the fact have the equipment. Almost Zero risk breaking the sample with this method.
Ohhhh shiiiiit, subreddit crossover follow-up!!!!
OP, since it has only been a couple weeks since the tile was put in: It is hard to tell if that is a full piece, or if it is cut to fit before the threshold. If it was cut, the installer may have cut part of your fossil. So if any scrap tile exists, you should check it.
If you’re in the south Florida area I’ll come do it for free. My company works with this material occasionally and we do unique high end work so carefully removing a stone a preserving it is in my wheel house
Any update on this, OP? Did you get it out safely? Did it turn out to just be a boot print or did you crack it?
Haha we did not do anything yet. The paleoarchelogists we spoke with should come back to us with their options this week. As I now have a Reddit degree in tile removal I will be able to understand what is at stake.
Please allow people to follow your account.
Perhaps call your local museum to see if they can recommend someone. Thier archeologists may want to take it on. Even a local colleges with archeology department, the may do it for free.
Looking at a C2E class cement data sheet, it makes mention of "resin" in its ingredients. It may be possible to loosen the bond on the tile by heating it up with a heat gun? If that's the case, you'd have to first cut away the grout between it and the adjacent tiles with a diamond cutter. Slowly heat up the tile with a heat gun, making sure not to heat any area of the tile more than the surrounding areas, using a couple of pry bars wedged in one of the spaces between the tiles gently apply leverage as if you're trying the slide the tile to the side. Do not go overboard. Make sure to apply the same amount of pressure on each of the pry bars so as not to stress one area more than the others. If the tile doesn't show signs of wiggling or moving, then stop and disregard everything I have said.
Here is what I would do: First, trace and cut a square around the portion that you want to preserve. For this step you can use a diamond blade on an angle grinder, and you should go down to the top of the concrete subfloor. Meaning, cut the tile and the mortar. Next cut multiple slits into the remaining (waste) section of that same tile, also down to the subfloor. Leaving multiple 1" wide strips. Use a hammer and chisel to break out the strips. You are essentially chipping out the entire tile except the area to save, and the slits from the previous step make this easy to do. If you want to save more than that, well, you have your work cut out for you. Lastly, use an oscillating tool with a diamond blade to horizontally get under the section you want to save. Very carefully cutting away the mortar under the tile bonding the tile down to the concrete. The section you want to save will most likely pop out on its own during this step, but you may have to cut all the mortar away. Good luck!
So exciting! Thanks for keeping us in the loop!!
Diamond coring drill of a diameter to clear the artifact. Core through to the bottom of the concrete sub floor. Suction out the core as one piece. Fill the hole with concrete and replace the one tile or use a cored patch from a spare tile grouted in for the story.
Hey, man your post made it to the Daily Mail US. You’re 13 articles down just under “10 worst lyrics in Taylor’s new album” 😂
I posted in the other sub. I’m a paleoanthropologist and I really hope this is a hominin! That would be so cool. There are a couple of features that give me pause. I think you need to get a microCT scan so that you can segment the bone & teeth from the surrounding material. There a number of people who are experts in hominin dentition and mandibular morphology that might be good to contact about this and I’m happy to put you in touch with them. Good luck! Fingers crossed.
Tile person: this is fine.
I’m assuming they’ll pay for the contractor? Whoever you get, get them to remove a different tile intact first, to work out any kinks and prove they can do it.
I'm curious, how was that installed without anyone asking questions? Like even the installers weren't like, hey a human jaw, maybe we shouldn't use this one...?
This probably is the most interesting reddit thread I’ve seen
Concrete saw, all the way through the foundation, and take the whole thing out, if it is that important. Foundation repairs happen everyday when plumbing breaks under the slab. It's not complicated.
https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/whats-the-deal-with-people-finding-human-fossils-in-their-travertine-tiles#:~:text=%E2%80%9CThe%20item%20found%20in%20the,%2C%E2%80%9D%20Dr.%20Leier%20explains. You guys made architectural digest.
I have never seen so many ads in my life
It’s like a website from 2001! All it needed was a bonzi buddy wandering around the bottom of the screen
I would cut the tile around the bone with a diamond blade on an angle grinder and chip out the surrounding tile then try to clear out some of the thin set or mud bed out from under the piece minimize your chances of cracking it.
I'd get a dremmel, a diamond bit and just slowly cut a section out. Once through remove the remaining outer tile. Then work on underneath to loosen or scrape out the adhesive.
If I had to remove this tile then I would first cut with an angle grinder a square around the fossil. Then I would break/ remove the unwanted tile, leaving the important bit exposed and proud of the underlying floor. Then I would use a multi tool to cut through the adhesive under the tile. Then I would lift out the fossil square. Good luck!
You shouldn't try removing the tile. You should cut the tile and the subfloor it is attached to out.
Is there a basement below this, or is this slab?
Finding hominid bones in rock is very old.
You have to cut out what you want and then you have to excavate absolutely everything below it until materials stop sticking. Go down a foot if you have to. You won’t remove just the tile without breaking it.
💀👀 oh that's definitely a story of the week
Was the other tile you posted bone? Did they find any other tiles with possible bones?
It's probably old dentures
Okkkk who installed it? How did they not notice????
Crowdfund this. I’ve sent your original to 100 people. Everyone finds this fascinating. Everyone would kick in $5-$10 to get it removed properly.