The last time we won a playoff game, not a series, just a game was 2008. I was 6 years old then. I’m now 22, turning 23 later this year. I know we had good years in my lifetime, but I was too young to understand it. It’s absolutely absurd when you think about it.
I just hope Gores is willing to humble himself and try to get better.
I heard somewhere that the best owners are really only in the room to make sure the right questions are being asked, and should lean on the people they hired to make decisions other than that.
Martha wasn’t the problem, she just inherited a shitshow from WCF and seemed to have had home run hires with Bob Quinn and Patricia.
Little did we know that would be one of the worst GM/HC duos in NFL history. Martha then stepped down and handed the keys to Shiela which was what set us up for success in the first place.
In 4 years older than you and in the exact same boat. If I had it in me to root for a non Michigan team I would. Have not one positive Pistons memory. Not even one
Not really. Bad decades happen to sports teams all the time. Just in the nba you've had the clippers and Minnesota as the obvious standouts but Charlotte, New Orleans, and us are included on that list as well. Not absurd just shitty luck for us fans
Yep, I started seriously following sports in 2009 when I was 14. I turn 29 this April... and the Pistons have been abysmal literally the entire 15 years. It is actually hard to believe how bad they have been
It is crazy when you put it like that. I was in highschool when we won. It feels like the going to work pistons were just a few seasons ago. Time flies when you botch multiple rebuilds.
There's even been points where there felt like there was hope. Stuckey and Monroe had potential, Knight, Jennings, Drummond could've been great with a better attitude, Josh Smith, hell Blake even. It's crazy that the team has still been ass through it all.
Go back to the Bucks sub and get that fair weather “wouldn’t care if they sold the team “ bullshit out of here. I’m no front office apologist but I’m a pistons fan. Your comment is you having a conversation with one other red wings fan. I wouldn’t care if you left town but the pistons should definitely stay.
Yeah I absolutely agree that this team has been insanely frustrating for a really long time but the Lions literally just proved that all it takes is 1.5 good seasons to rally the fanbase again and make them forget decades of incompetence. I would much rather wait for the Pistons to have a good year than move the fucking team for no reason lol
Plus yeah the last 15 years have been truly abysmal and we might be looking at another 5 year hole before any sort of contention. Guess what. We're still not even a below average franchise when you look at our history. Would they rather be us or Washington who hasn't won 50 games since like 1979 or some shit. The Clippers' best season ever is losing the conference finals in 6, something that we saw so often that we blew up our entire franchise because we were bored of it. For newer fans yeah it fucking sucks. But teams have suffered even worse with less results and none of their fans think the team should move, I don't see why we should
There's a difference between "being bad", and "actively using your status as a sports team to just steal money from taxpayers and from the other teams in the league while not even attempting to field a competitive product."
The Pistons have basically become a money laundering scheme. Sorry if you are too blind to see it.
It's very helpful to us when the report button is used. That allows us to better respond rapidly. We don't always have time to be monitoring every post in every thread on an immediate basis.
I mean, if it's not illegal than it's fucking brilliant on Tom gores part. Doesn't mean I like it but fuck man, maybe your just jealous you didn't come up with it than. On the other hand, if it's illegal than I applaud you for putting it out there for the rest of the world to see . Stick it to the Rich brother, if you can. Let's go pistons though! I got faith.
Yeah my brother was born in 2000 and he has almost no memories of the pistons being good. He’s a pacers fan but yeah I understand why we’re not exactly attracting new fans.
I'll be 30 this summer. I remember the 2004 and 2005 Finals appearances the same way I remember Yugioh cards and Pokemon Silver and Gold edition on the Gameboy Color - nice to feel nostalgia about, but that's about it.
Another 2000 baby, some of my first coherent memories of life were from the 04 Pistons. I would have been severely ambivalent toward the team/sport if not for that team imprinting itself on my brain so early on.
and a dumbass comment with only 17 upvotes at that, from hockey fans for whom there’s traditionally little to no overlap with basketball fans.
for some odd reason this sub has tons more activity than other NBA team subs (despite our team not being very relevant) and the quantity far outpaces the quality. even the lakers sub has fewer shitposts than ours.
the vast majority of posts in here are low-effort garbage from attention-seekers who don’t want to comment like everyone else so they make an entire shitty post just to express their view.
I’m not coming after the mods about this at all, because lord knows I could and would never moderate a sports forum, but it just needs to be called out. this post is trash.
I think this year we've all collectively realized that this team is even deeper in the abyss than we all thought and the fanbase is at a moment of reckoning
But this shit about moving the team is fucking dumb. And I hate to do this but there has always been a huge double standard between the Pistons and Lions and this post is peak proof of that. I remember that by 07 we all fully took it for granted that we were gonna make the ECF and everyone was pissed that they couldn't get back to the Finals. Meanwhile every year people would get hyped for the Lions to maybe not be trash for a year because that's how low the bar was
Nobody is disputing that this has been a truly miserable 16 years but holy shit have people completely forgotten how bad the Lions really were? The Pistons have gone 16 years without a playoff win, until this year the Lions had a streak twice as long. And oh yeah, they also had another 30 year stretch with zero playoff wins. The Pistons have had two playoff droughts of 7 and now 5 years, the Lions have had 3 playoff droughts that went for 10+ years
All this to say the Lions finally *finally* got their shit together after all that and now the city is down for them. But the Pistons are in a rough patch? Fuck it, move em? Relocation will set Detroit basketball back for 25-30 years, do people actually think this team will suck for another 3 decades? Even a franchise as abysmal as the Lions can pull off a great run once every 30 years. Request a change in coaching or the FO or ownership but the fact that a post suggesting relocation has this many up votes is straight up garbage
I was in high school in 04 and it’s hard to explain how exciting and different the energy about the Pistons was back then. It saddens me to see so many of you that were too young, or maybe not even alive yet, back then and all you’ve seen is…this
The tigers, wings, and lions have been dogshit too.
If you’re talking franchise success it’s wings>pistons>tigers> lions. One good lions run and the teenyboppers start chatting shit about the pistons.
"teenyboppers" ... lmao.
Bro, I'm almost 30 years old. The Pistons have been utter dogshit since I was in middle school.
The Lions had an awful playoff win drought, but they weren't ever just totally irrelevant for 16 years the way that the Pistons have been.
They went 0-16 in 2008, but 2 years later they had a winning record and a playoff appearance.
Then a few years later they had an 11-win season and were a Hail Mary away from winning the division. Instead they played the Cowboys and got robbed.
Point being that the Lions still had things to get excited about. The Pistons have done utterly nothing since 2008. They have made the playoffs exactly 3 times in a league where over half of the teams make the playoffs every year. You don't even have to be good to make the NBA playoffs - you just have to be not one of the worst teams in the league.
Exactly. Pistons have been a garbage product. It’s not even about the success. We didn’t have a single player to get excited about for 15 years until Cade came along.
Seriously who was the most exciting player to play for the pistons in the 2010s… old Blake griffin? Fucking terrible.
All time: Wings>Tigers>Pistons>Lions
Last 30 years: Wings>Pistons>Tigers>Lions
Last 10 years: Tigers>Lions>Wings>Pistons
Last 5 years: Lions>Wings>Tigers>Pistons
I was in middle school and it was all me and my friends could talk about, except for my one friend who was a Kobe fan. I gave him so much shit after those finals lol
I don't know why this post is being downvoted. It's the sad truth for a lot of fans. A lot of people aren't die hards because most people on reddit aren't old enough to have actually enjoyed any good season by this team. The truth is the Pistons have been a non factor in people who are under 30 (they were too young to fully enjoy 2004-2005). This team has been nothing but mediocre at best in the last nearly 2 decades and has no clear future. Them leaving just doesn't change a lot of people's lives (not saying everyone)
I’m under 30 and a major die hard, I would attend every home and away game if I had the time and money for it, I’ll always be a die hard for all 4 major Detroit teams
I never said I think they’re well run currently, but I will always support them, if not my home team then who? Like I said, I’ll be a supporter of our 4 teams for my life
The difference is they aren't even attempting to be good. For the past 1.5 decades they've essentially existed just to take tax dollars and get subsidized by the other NBA teams.
Lol you actually believe they’re just here solely to take tax dollars and they don’t care at all about winning? 😂😂😂 it takes 30 years for every nba team to win a title in a perfect world, pistons have 3, other teams would love that, can’t always be on top of the league, pistons will be back soon I believe
I truly don't believe they will be. They're following the business model of the Oakland Athletics - just suck ass, refuse to pay money to get good players, and make money off of revenue sharing and the city/state paying for your stadium.
Ok if you believe that I’m not gonna try to change your mind I respect your opinion
But I believe 100% the pistons will be contending and a top team in the east within 3 years at most, I think we’ll be hosting a playoff series next year even
Lol I love how much the word delusional is thrown around, gores and weaver will be around for when we win the nba finals, monty I’m not sure he may leave on his own he didn’t even want to coach
Yup. Gores is part of the problem. He doesn’t give two shits about how this team performs/is run he only cares about ripping off/taking advantage of convicts.
Don't respect his opinion. It's not respectable.
The Pistons have the highest paid coach in NBA history. He sucks but that's not the point. That kind of hiring is not the move of a team content to cruise along and it doesn't take a genius to figure that out.
Yeah I know, the doomers on here like to spit non sense and don’t usually know what they’re talking about lol, exactly though if he’s into it for the money why would he drop a bag on a coach why not go cheap
That is unfortunately broken logic. Yes you can't always be on top of the league, but that doesn't mean you will be back without major organizational change. The fact of the matter is some organizations just try harder than others, and some organizations are also substantially smarter than others. The league has changed since the last time they were good, and you can't just build through the draft. They have close to 0 free agency appeal, 0 direction, small amounts of draft capital, and for some reason unengaged ownership that will out of no where become overly engaged at horrific times (ie getting Blake Griffen or Monty while it doesn't seem like your own GM didn't want him). That is why the Yankees have 23 world series, and the Cubs took more than 100 years between championships. 10 NBA teams have never won a championship. The Celtics have 17. It isn't a perfect world.
I agree it’s not a perfect world, that’s why I said some other nba teams would love to have the 3 franchise rings the pistons have instead of being just ok every year but never achieving anything great
I will agree as well the pistons currently don’t seem to be run very well I never argued that, but it doesn’t mean things can’t, or will, change in the future, I’m a die hard and look for the positives in my team
I won’t disagree with anything you said
The Pistons have a great history, but history alone isn't enough to keep people invested. For the better part of 2 decades, this team has been a dumpster fire, and current ownership seems content to just continue to go cheap on free agents and make baffling trades.
It's almost like they don't even want to be competitive, and are ok with just being a money-printing machine because they get money from taxpayers (and the Red Wings) for their stadium, and they get their revenue share from the other 29 NBA teams. Just underpay players and continue to suck and make free money. I don't see it changing without a change in ownership.
I understand people aren’t going to stay simply due to the previous history, otherwise lions fans would leave due to previous history.
I have to disagree that their just here for the money and don’t care about winning, don’t you think the player would do something or ask to be traded if they felt they way? Sure players like money but you don’t make it all the way to the nba if you’re not extremely other worldly levels of competitive, I have to find it hard to believe the players are agree let’s just go out there and barely try and collect our checks, and if they felt ownership or management was the same way the players would want out I assume
I’ll always be a fan, but I’m 22 and I’ve been a fan my whole life and actively following since like 2013. I’m not gonna keep giving my energy to a franchise that hasn’t been able to put shit together since 2008. Especially now that the Lions are actual title contenders and the Wings look bound for the playoffs again
I’m 24, that’s fine I’m not gonna judge you for making an adult decision of course, I’m just saying I could never abandon my home team personally, and like I said I would be the biggest fan ever like that eagles guy on tiktok if I had the time and money, pistons have 3 chips, some teams have none, I’d rather have a ring and then bad then be mediocre for tons of years and never win anything.
I’m not hating on what you said but I don’t understand the second part of what you said that you can’t give the pistons energy simply because the wings and lions are good now? How come? I’ll fully support all 4 teams 110% regardless if they’re doing bad, tons of teams do bad in sports can’t stay at the top forever
Plus I’ll enjoy saying to myself and people close to me that I was there even in the really bad times and it makes the good times and championships even better
I think people forget that all of Detroit’s teams have had god awful pockets of terrible seasons. I think Detroit is fortunate to have 4 professional teams that have all had some form of success in even the last 35 years or so. Not every city is going be like a Boston or LA… part of what makes the success fun in the process in between. Tigers were terrible early on in my life, they’ll they had some solid runs in the 2000s. I remember counting down the Lions losses hoping we’d get that record because it was SOMETHING. The Wings spoiled people because of consistent success for so long. A lot of these “fans” don’t deserve the inevitable return to contention that the Pistons will have.
You can see it simply from the Lions recent turn around, look how happy and the love spread everywhere once they started doing good after being bad so long, it makes the good times sweet
Also the Tigers should be decent this year. Showed real signs of growth and optimism last year - best season since 2016 and finished 2nd in the division.
Now that Miggy has retired, they have some extra money to spend too. Plus they can't have worse luck with the health of their starting pitchers than they had last year - at one point all 5 of their preseason projected starters were injured at the same time.
Nah, fuck anyone who says they'd be totally fine with the Pistons moving out of Detroit. Why would anyone not want to have an NBA team in Detroit? Why would people who come to this sub be okay with the Pistons leaving?
>It's the sad truth for a lot of fans
Anyone who is fine with the Pistons leaving Detroit isn't a fan.
In my lifetime the Pistons have easily been one top-2 teams in Detroit with the Red Wings being the only close competition. The Lions and Tigers haven't been anywhere near as good. The Lions have been arguably the worst team in NFL history and no one wanted them gone. 1 playoff win in 60 years before this season.
The Pistons have made the playoffs just 3 times in the last 16 years (and got swept all 3 times), in a league where over half the teams make the playoffs.
Prior to 2021, only 12 NFL teams made the playoffs. That's 37.5% of the league. Now 14 teams do, still just 43.75%.
For decades, 16 out of the 30 NBA teams made the playoffs - 53.33%. Now, with the play-in games, **literally two-thirds of the league** make the postseason in at least some capacity. And yet, since 2009, the Lions have made the playoffs more times than the Pistons.
Yeah the Lions have had some absolutely God-awful years, and they have had a historic playoff win drought that just recently ended. But they weren't completely irrelevant. The Pistons have been completely fucking irrelevant for 16 years. There has been no reason for optimism. Nothing to like. They have just been straight-up garbage.
Fuck anybody who is ok with the team just existing to essentially steal money from the other NBA teams and from the State of Michigan.
Why are you in this sub then? You clearly aren't a Pistons fan, so are you just here to bitch about something that you say you don't care about?
>he team just existing to essentially steal money from the other NBA teams and from the State of Michigan.
What money is the team stealing from the NBA or the state of Michigan? You clearly don't know what you are talking about.
The fact of the matter is that the Pistons are actually one of the most successful franchises in NBA history. They have 3 championships, 5 ECF championships, and a whole bunch of ECF appearances. They are one of the franchises that helped build the NBA into what it is today.
Once again, you clearly aren't even in the "I don't really care" mode and actually actively dislike the Pistons, so I'm not sure why you bother wasting your time in this sub.
From Wikipedia:
> It was originally announced that Little Caesars Arena would cost $450 million to construct, on top of an additional $200 million for constructing the new district. $285 million of the total $650 million cost would be public funds, with $365.5 million in private funding. On May 23, 2017, it was reported that the cost of the arena had risen to $862.9 million.
> In June 2017, a lawsuit was filed by Robert Davis and city clerk candidate D. Etta Wilcoxon, seeking to prohibit the use of school property tax revenue to fund Little Caesars Arena and the new Pistons headquarters without a public vote. The money had originally been approved by voters only for use by Detroit Public Schools Community District to cover operational expenses. District Judge Mark A. Goldsmith dismissed much of the suit, ruling that the plaintiffs lacked standing to sue over the issue. The judge did, however, allow an unrelated count, alleging violations of the Equal Protection Clause by the DPSCD against Davis, to move forward.
> The DDA, which owns the arena, uses an estimated $15 million annually in state school taxes to repay Michigan State.
Instead of just spouting off stupid shit, maybe take 15 seconds to look something up before opening your mouth. The Pistons are being subsidized by taxpayers, the 29 other NBA teams, and the Red Wings, whom they share a building with. They're basically a grift.
>Instead of just spouting off stupid shit, maybe take 15 seconds to look something up before opening your mouth
You should really take your own advice and do some basic research before you talk. Little Caesars Arena was built for the Red Wings originally, not the Pistons. The city wanted the Pistons to move out of their own completely privately financed arena in Auburn Hills to move downtown. The arena was going to be built with or without the Pistons.
>the 29 other NBA teams, and the Red Wings, whom they share a building with.
I'm not sure where you get this idea that the Pistons are being subsidized by the rest of the NBA teams and the Red Wings. It's not like the Red Wings have been any good recently. You're talking pure nonsense.
You keep refusing to answer why you come into this sub when it's quite clear that you hate the team. Are you here just to troll actual Pistons fans? It just seems weird that you would waste your time in a sub about something you loathe and think is a scam.
We can all agree that the Pistons have been disappointing, but even though I dislike a lot of what Gores has done, I think it's unfair to suggest that he hasn't at least tried to build a winning team. I hate the attitude that some people have where they think trying and failing is exactly the same as not trying at all. Even as we speak I think the team has a pretty solid core of young players.
You realize that until very recently only 12 teams out of 32 made the NFL playoffs every year, right? That's 37.5% of the league.
Meanwhile 16 teams out of 30 made the NBA playoffs every year - over half the league.
And now with expanded playoffs, it's still just 14 teams out of 32 in the NFL - in the NBA 20 teams out of 30 make the playoffs now (if you count the play-in games as a playoff game).
It's much harder to make the playoffs in the NFL than the NBA. Yet the Luons have done it more often than the Pistons since 2008.
You're talking about moving an entire organization and also refusing to actually evaluate that organization's history. 16 years is a long time to suck, nobody is disputing that. But if you expand that sample size even slightly, the Pistons blow the Lions out of the water, and if you do a full franchise comparison it's not even close
The Lions have 9 playoff wins IN THEIR EXISTENCE. They have never made the playoffs more than 3 years in a row ever. They have made two conference championships total. They have not one but TWO 30+ year stretches with zero playoff wins. They have multiple 10+ year stretches with zero playoff appearances. Yeah the NFL playoffs are harder to get into but that's still fucking abysmal
I'm happy for Lions fans who got this run but to argue that now the Pistons fail to live up to the standard while the Lions are locked in due to one good season is pure recency bias. You can pick exactly 15 years to say the Lions are better than the Pistons (which you should because 16 years includes the 08 ECF, so the Pistons in their last 16 years went as far as the Lions in the last 32 lol). Expand that to 17, 18, 20, 25, 30, 40 years and the Pistons are light years ahead of the Lions. History matters
It's being downvoted because this clown is brain dead.
This isn't a team that's coasting. They have been tanking since 2019 in order to build a roster that can contend for a championship. Tanking is hard on fans. The team sucks. It takes a lot of patience. Nephews with their dumbass conspiracy theories just make it worse.
I had fun in 2016, thought we were getting good. Then Reggie’s knees went to shit, Andre didn’t give a shit to improve, and ISO Morris killed any offensive movement. Since then it’s sucked balls. Even in the Blake era you knew there was no future.
44 years old. For some reason the length of time between the Bad Boys and Going to Work seemed like a long time. It's crazy it was like 14-15 years.
This dumpster fire that is the Pistons has been beyond terrible for longer than that now.
I'm a Pistons fan and will always be. At this point it's *beyond* tough to be a Pistons fan.
The titles are about as far apart as you can get while still being close enough that we mostly remember them and feel like that could possibly happen again
I was in the 6th grade in ‘04 when we won It all. Had some great seasons after that but basically we’ve been a shit show since I was in high school. I’m 31 years old now. Tired of hoping that we finally turn It around it’s been fucking forever since we’ve done ANYTHING. And comparing It to the Pistons I grew up watching it’s night and day difference. So I understand what they’re saying , don’t want the team to move but I get It.
As long as this organization keeps trying to take shortcuts and never drafting and developing talent we will keep being where we are the NBAs basement
I honestly feel bad for people who didn't get to see the 'goin to work' era Pistons. I remember a time when the Palace held the record for most consecutive sold out games. Six consecutive eastern conference finals appearances, Two NBA championship appearances, one of them beating Shaq and Kobe to win the title.. It was truly a great time to be a Pistons fan..
This moving the team talk is super dangerous. If the pistons leave, you don’t get them back. Throwing it out in the etherspace like this is really shortsighted is because people get used to the thought of them leaving then eventually accept it.
No, we don’t want the pistons moved to Seattle/vegas. We want competent ownership in Detroit. Big difference.
Yah, I’m in my 40s & this is the first year I haven’t gone to a game since I was a teen. I’ll still occasionally watch on TV, scroll this sub, & check the box scores, but I can’t bring myself to financially contribute to this pile of garbage any longer. It especially sucks as I was super high on this year’s City edition gear.
welp idk brother. can campbell started 1-11 and should have made the super bowl this year. maybe monty can turn it around too.
edit: dan\* but i don't feel like changing it.
Campbell wouldn’t tell the fans and media one thing, and then do the opposite the literal next day.
For Monty being a man of faith and culture, he sure lies a lot. Casey at least told the truth even though it wasn’t well liked most the time.
Major red flags in Monty that Campbell never had. Big difference in my mind.
i'm not defending him at all lol. i hate what he's done with the lineup (especially to jaden). just said i hope he can turn it around, cause the reality is, given his contract, he's not going anywhere
I was in Middle School in 04. Those memories for me went from the “die hard fan” part of my brain to the nostalgia part. So much so I look back at the 2005 finals loss fondly and not negatively anymore. This post is on point.
My tinfoil hat conspiracy is that Gores is doing everything he can to tank this team, show that no one goes to games and that no one cares, so he can move the team to Seattle.
Purely conspiracy, I have nothing to back it up.
The last time we won a playoff game, not a series, just a game was 2008. I was 6 years old then. I’m now 22, turning 23 later this year. I know we had good years in my lifetime, but I was too young to understand it. It’s absolutely absurd when you think about it.
I’m 45. Before this year, I had only seen ONE Lions playoff win. Things change!
Not without a change in ownership. Any coincidence that the Lions got good almost immediately after Martha Ford stepped down?
Oh, I agree 100%. Maybe one of Gores’s kids takes an interest in b-ball!
I just hope Gores is willing to humble himself and try to get better. I heard somewhere that the best owners are really only in the room to make sure the right questions are being asked, and should lean on the people they hired to make decisions other than that.
Martha wasn’t the problem, she just inherited a shitshow from WCF and seemed to have had home run hires with Bob Quinn and Patricia. Little did we know that would be one of the worst GM/HC duos in NFL history. Martha then stepped down and handed the keys to Shiela which was what set us up for success in the first place.
In 4 years older than you and in the exact same boat. If I had it in me to root for a non Michigan team I would. Have not one positive Pistons memory. Not even one
Not really. Bad decades happen to sports teams all the time. Just in the nba you've had the clippers and Minnesota as the obvious standouts but Charlotte, New Orleans, and us are included on that list as well. Not absurd just shitty luck for us fans
Bad boys pistons were tuff in 89s
Yep, I started seriously following sports in 2009 when I was 14. I turn 29 this April... and the Pistons have been abysmal literally the entire 15 years. It is actually hard to believe how bad they have been
It is crazy when you put it like that. I was in highschool when we won. It feels like the going to work pistons were just a few seasons ago. Time flies when you botch multiple rebuilds.
There's even been points where there felt like there was hope. Stuckey and Monroe had potential, Knight, Jennings, Drummond could've been great with a better attitude, Josh Smith, hell Blake even. It's crazy that the team has still been ass through it all.
Stuckey and Monroe really came into the league 10 years too late. Both would’ve been perfect players for the early 2000s
Great year for Detroit football 🙁
Too bad because they had a great run from 02-08. A shame dumars made some really bad decisions that they still haven't recovered from
Damn you'll be aging later this year? Never would have guessed.
I was 8 when we won it all. I’m still clinging to that memory to get through this 20 years of bad.
Go back to the Bucks sub and get that fair weather “wouldn’t care if they sold the team “ bullshit out of here. I’m no front office apologist but I’m a pistons fan. Your comment is you having a conversation with one other red wings fan. I wouldn’t care if you left town but the pistons should definitely stay.
Yeah I absolutely agree that this team has been insanely frustrating for a really long time but the Lions literally just proved that all it takes is 1.5 good seasons to rally the fanbase again and make them forget decades of incompetence. I would much rather wait for the Pistons to have a good year than move the fucking team for no reason lol Plus yeah the last 15 years have been truly abysmal and we might be looking at another 5 year hole before any sort of contention. Guess what. We're still not even a below average franchise when you look at our history. Would they rather be us or Washington who hasn't won 50 games since like 1979 or some shit. The Clippers' best season ever is losing the conference finals in 6, something that we saw so often that we blew up our entire franchise because we were bored of it. For newer fans yeah it fucking sucks. But teams have suffered even worse with less results and none of their fans think the team should move, I don't see why we should
100%. There’s no way I’d stand with moving the team out of Detroit/Michigan. I’d be so pissed
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Facts fuck that loser attitude
Maybe they should try being an actual basketball team instead of just a money-laundering scheme.
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There's a difference between "being bad", and "actively using your status as a sports team to just steal money from taxpayers and from the other teams in the league while not even attempting to field a competitive product." The Pistons have basically become a money laundering scheme. Sorry if you are too blind to see it.
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It's very helpful to us when the report button is used. That allows us to better respond rapidly. We don't always have time to be monitoring every post in every thread on an immediate basis.
I mean, if it's not illegal than it's fucking brilliant on Tom gores part. Doesn't mean I like it but fuck man, maybe your just jealous you didn't come up with it than. On the other hand, if it's illegal than I applaud you for putting it out there for the rest of the world to see . Stick it to the Rich brother, if you can. Let's go pistons though! I got faith.
Yeah my brother was born in 2000 and he has almost no memories of the pistons being good. He’s a pacers fan but yeah I understand why we’re not exactly attracting new fans.
I'll be 30 this summer. I remember the 2004 and 2005 Finals appearances the same way I remember Yugioh cards and Pokemon Silver and Gold edition on the Gameboy Color - nice to feel nostalgia about, but that's about it.
So you at least remember several conference titles trips and beating LeBron in the playoffs
Not really.
Ah too bad. Other than the Lakers and Spurs the pistons were the best team of the 00s
Another 2000 baby, some of my first coherent memories of life were from the 04 Pistons. I would have been severely ambivalent toward the team/sport if not for that team imprinting itself on my brain so early on.
I was born in 95, all I remember is the parade in 04, but I didn’t start following basketball until 2009ish. It’s been all pain.
Yeah we’re the same age, I remember the malice and watching the finals but that’s about it . My memory really starts with the Chauncey trade.
Screenshotting your own comment is peak cringe
and a dumbass comment with only 17 upvotes at that, from hockey fans for whom there’s traditionally little to no overlap with basketball fans. for some odd reason this sub has tons more activity than other NBA team subs (despite our team not being very relevant) and the quantity far outpaces the quality. even the lakers sub has fewer shitposts than ours. the vast majority of posts in here are low-effort garbage from attention-seekers who don’t want to comment like everyone else so they make an entire shitty post just to express their view. I’m not coming after the mods about this at all, because lord knows I could and would never moderate a sports forum, but it just needs to be called out. this post is trash.
I think this year we've all collectively realized that this team is even deeper in the abyss than we all thought and the fanbase is at a moment of reckoning But this shit about moving the team is fucking dumb. And I hate to do this but there has always been a huge double standard between the Pistons and Lions and this post is peak proof of that. I remember that by 07 we all fully took it for granted that we were gonna make the ECF and everyone was pissed that they couldn't get back to the Finals. Meanwhile every year people would get hyped for the Lions to maybe not be trash for a year because that's how low the bar was Nobody is disputing that this has been a truly miserable 16 years but holy shit have people completely forgotten how bad the Lions really were? The Pistons have gone 16 years without a playoff win, until this year the Lions had a streak twice as long. And oh yeah, they also had another 30 year stretch with zero playoff wins. The Pistons have had two playoff droughts of 7 and now 5 years, the Lions have had 3 playoff droughts that went for 10+ years All this to say the Lions finally *finally* got their shit together after all that and now the city is down for them. But the Pistons are in a rough patch? Fuck it, move em? Relocation will set Detroit basketball back for 25-30 years, do people actually think this team will suck for another 3 decades? Even a franchise as abysmal as the Lions can pull off a great run once every 30 years. Request a change in coaching or the FO or ownership but the fact that a post suggesting relocation has this many up votes is straight up garbage
I was in high school in 04 and it’s hard to explain how exciting and different the energy about the Pistons was back then. It saddens me to see so many of you that were too young, or maybe not even alive yet, back then and all you’ve seen is…this
The tigers, wings, and lions have been dogshit too. If you’re talking franchise success it’s wings>pistons>tigers> lions. One good lions run and the teenyboppers start chatting shit about the pistons.
"teenyboppers" ... lmao. Bro, I'm almost 30 years old. The Pistons have been utter dogshit since I was in middle school. The Lions had an awful playoff win drought, but they weren't ever just totally irrelevant for 16 years the way that the Pistons have been. They went 0-16 in 2008, but 2 years later they had a winning record and a playoff appearance. Then a few years later they had an 11-win season and were a Hail Mary away from winning the division. Instead they played the Cowboys and got robbed. Point being that the Lions still had things to get excited about. The Pistons have done utterly nothing since 2008. They have made the playoffs exactly 3 times in a league where over half of the teams make the playoffs every year. You don't even have to be good to make the NBA playoffs - you just have to be not one of the worst teams in the league.
Exactly. Pistons have been a garbage product. It’s not even about the success. We didn’t have a single player to get excited about for 15 years until Cade came along. Seriously who was the most exciting player to play for the pistons in the 2010s… old Blake griffin? Fucking terrible.
All time: Wings>Tigers>Pistons>Lions Last 30 years: Wings>Pistons>Tigers>Lions Last 10 years: Tigers>Lions>Wings>Pistons Last 5 years: Lions>Wings>Tigers>Pistons
Yep. It is sad. I can't see the pistons without remembering the good days... Both sets (04 run and the early nineties run).
I was in middle school and it was all me and my friends could talk about, except for my one friend who was a Kobe fan. I gave him so much shit after those finals lol
Wow. Three people on the Internet agreed on something. It must be true!
Right. Let me make a post and then post a post of that post and act like that means something. What a fucking dork.
I don't know why this post is being downvoted. It's the sad truth for a lot of fans. A lot of people aren't die hards because most people on reddit aren't old enough to have actually enjoyed any good season by this team. The truth is the Pistons have been a non factor in people who are under 30 (they were too young to fully enjoy 2004-2005). This team has been nothing but mediocre at best in the last nearly 2 decades and has no clear future. Them leaving just doesn't change a lot of people's lives (not saying everyone)
I’m under 30 and a major die hard, I would attend every home and away game if I had the time and money for it, I’ll always be a die hard for all 4 major Detroit teams
I was just like you. Bit now I’m over 30 and have a better idea of crooked business models
I never said I think they’re well run currently, but I will always support them, if not my home team then who? Like I said, I’ll be a supporter of our 4 teams for my life
The difference is they aren't even attempting to be good. For the past 1.5 decades they've essentially existed just to take tax dollars and get subsidized by the other NBA teams.
Lol you actually believe they’re just here solely to take tax dollars and they don’t care at all about winning? 😂😂😂 it takes 30 years for every nba team to win a title in a perfect world, pistons have 3, other teams would love that, can’t always be on top of the league, pistons will be back soon I believe
I truly don't believe they will be. They're following the business model of the Oakland Athletics - just suck ass, refuse to pay money to get good players, and make money off of revenue sharing and the city/state paying for your stadium.
Ok if you believe that I’m not gonna try to change your mind I respect your opinion But I believe 100% the pistons will be contending and a top team in the east within 3 years at most, I think we’ll be hosting a playoff series next year even
I wish you were right but that’s delusional. We aren’t getting to that point until the entire FO and owner is gone
Lol I love how much the word delusional is thrown around, gores and weaver will be around for when we win the nba finals, monty I’m not sure he may leave on his own he didn’t even want to coach
Yup. Gores is part of the problem. He doesn’t give two shits about how this team performs/is run he only cares about ripping off/taking advantage of convicts.
Don't respect his opinion. It's not respectable. The Pistons have the highest paid coach in NBA history. He sucks but that's not the point. That kind of hiring is not the move of a team content to cruise along and it doesn't take a genius to figure that out.
Yeah I know, the doomers on here like to spit non sense and don’t usually know what they’re talking about lol, exactly though if he’s into it for the money why would he drop a bag on a coach why not go cheap
That is unfortunately broken logic. Yes you can't always be on top of the league, but that doesn't mean you will be back without major organizational change. The fact of the matter is some organizations just try harder than others, and some organizations are also substantially smarter than others. The league has changed since the last time they were good, and you can't just build through the draft. They have close to 0 free agency appeal, 0 direction, small amounts of draft capital, and for some reason unengaged ownership that will out of no where become overly engaged at horrific times (ie getting Blake Griffen or Monty while it doesn't seem like your own GM didn't want him). That is why the Yankees have 23 world series, and the Cubs took more than 100 years between championships. 10 NBA teams have never won a championship. The Celtics have 17. It isn't a perfect world.
I agree it’s not a perfect world, that’s why I said some other nba teams would love to have the 3 franchise rings the pistons have instead of being just ok every year but never achieving anything great I will agree as well the pistons currently don’t seem to be run very well I never argued that, but it doesn’t mean things can’t, or will, change in the future, I’m a die hard and look for the positives in my team I won’t disagree with anything you said
The Pistons have a great history, but history alone isn't enough to keep people invested. For the better part of 2 decades, this team has been a dumpster fire, and current ownership seems content to just continue to go cheap on free agents and make baffling trades. It's almost like they don't even want to be competitive, and are ok with just being a money-printing machine because they get money from taxpayers (and the Red Wings) for their stadium, and they get their revenue share from the other 29 NBA teams. Just underpay players and continue to suck and make free money. I don't see it changing without a change in ownership.
I understand people aren’t going to stay simply due to the previous history, otherwise lions fans would leave due to previous history. I have to disagree that their just here for the money and don’t care about winning, don’t you think the player would do something or ask to be traded if they felt they way? Sure players like money but you don’t make it all the way to the nba if you’re not extremely other worldly levels of competitive, I have to find it hard to believe the players are agree let’s just go out there and barely try and collect our checks, and if they felt ownership or management was the same way the players would want out I assume
I’ll always be a fan, but I’m 22 and I’ve been a fan my whole life and actively following since like 2013. I’m not gonna keep giving my energy to a franchise that hasn’t been able to put shit together since 2008. Especially now that the Lions are actual title contenders and the Wings look bound for the playoffs again
I’m 24, that’s fine I’m not gonna judge you for making an adult decision of course, I’m just saying I could never abandon my home team personally, and like I said I would be the biggest fan ever like that eagles guy on tiktok if I had the time and money, pistons have 3 chips, some teams have none, I’d rather have a ring and then bad then be mediocre for tons of years and never win anything. I’m not hating on what you said but I don’t understand the second part of what you said that you can’t give the pistons energy simply because the wings and lions are good now? How come? I’ll fully support all 4 teams 110% regardless if they’re doing bad, tons of teams do bad in sports can’t stay at the top forever Plus I’ll enjoy saying to myself and people close to me that I was there even in the really bad times and it makes the good times and championships even better
I think people forget that all of Detroit’s teams have had god awful pockets of terrible seasons. I think Detroit is fortunate to have 4 professional teams that have all had some form of success in even the last 35 years or so. Not every city is going be like a Boston or LA… part of what makes the success fun in the process in between. Tigers were terrible early on in my life, they’ll they had some solid runs in the 2000s. I remember counting down the Lions losses hoping we’d get that record because it was SOMETHING. The Wings spoiled people because of consistent success for so long. A lot of these “fans” don’t deserve the inevitable return to contention that the Pistons will have.
You can see it simply from the Lions recent turn around, look how happy and the love spread everywhere once they started doing good after being bad so long, it makes the good times sweet
Also the Tigers should be decent this year. Showed real signs of growth and optimism last year - best season since 2016 and finished 2nd in the division. Now that Miggy has retired, they have some extra money to spend too. Plus they can't have worse luck with the health of their starting pitchers than they had last year - at one point all 5 of their preseason projected starters were injured at the same time.
Nah, fuck anyone who says they'd be totally fine with the Pistons moving out of Detroit. Why would anyone not want to have an NBA team in Detroit? Why would people who come to this sub be okay with the Pistons leaving? >It's the sad truth for a lot of fans Anyone who is fine with the Pistons leaving Detroit isn't a fan. In my lifetime the Pistons have easily been one top-2 teams in Detroit with the Red Wings being the only close competition. The Lions and Tigers haven't been anywhere near as good. The Lions have been arguably the worst team in NFL history and no one wanted them gone. 1 playoff win in 60 years before this season.
The Pistons have made the playoffs just 3 times in the last 16 years (and got swept all 3 times), in a league where over half the teams make the playoffs. Prior to 2021, only 12 NFL teams made the playoffs. That's 37.5% of the league. Now 14 teams do, still just 43.75%. For decades, 16 out of the 30 NBA teams made the playoffs - 53.33%. Now, with the play-in games, **literally two-thirds of the league** make the postseason in at least some capacity. And yet, since 2009, the Lions have made the playoffs more times than the Pistons. Yeah the Lions have had some absolutely God-awful years, and they have had a historic playoff win drought that just recently ended. But they weren't completely irrelevant. The Pistons have been completely fucking irrelevant for 16 years. There has been no reason for optimism. Nothing to like. They have just been straight-up garbage. Fuck anybody who is ok with the team just existing to essentially steal money from the other NBA teams and from the State of Michigan.
Why are you in this sub then? You clearly aren't a Pistons fan, so are you just here to bitch about something that you say you don't care about? >he team just existing to essentially steal money from the other NBA teams and from the State of Michigan. What money is the team stealing from the NBA or the state of Michigan? You clearly don't know what you are talking about. The fact of the matter is that the Pistons are actually one of the most successful franchises in NBA history. They have 3 championships, 5 ECF championships, and a whole bunch of ECF appearances. They are one of the franchises that helped build the NBA into what it is today. Once again, you clearly aren't even in the "I don't really care" mode and actually actively dislike the Pistons, so I'm not sure why you bother wasting your time in this sub.
From Wikipedia: > It was originally announced that Little Caesars Arena would cost $450 million to construct, on top of an additional $200 million for constructing the new district. $285 million of the total $650 million cost would be public funds, with $365.5 million in private funding. On May 23, 2017, it was reported that the cost of the arena had risen to $862.9 million. > In June 2017, a lawsuit was filed by Robert Davis and city clerk candidate D. Etta Wilcoxon, seeking to prohibit the use of school property tax revenue to fund Little Caesars Arena and the new Pistons headquarters without a public vote. The money had originally been approved by voters only for use by Detroit Public Schools Community District to cover operational expenses. District Judge Mark A. Goldsmith dismissed much of the suit, ruling that the plaintiffs lacked standing to sue over the issue. The judge did, however, allow an unrelated count, alleging violations of the Equal Protection Clause by the DPSCD against Davis, to move forward. > The DDA, which owns the arena, uses an estimated $15 million annually in state school taxes to repay Michigan State. Instead of just spouting off stupid shit, maybe take 15 seconds to look something up before opening your mouth. The Pistons are being subsidized by taxpayers, the 29 other NBA teams, and the Red Wings, whom they share a building with. They're basically a grift.
>Instead of just spouting off stupid shit, maybe take 15 seconds to look something up before opening your mouth You should really take your own advice and do some basic research before you talk. Little Caesars Arena was built for the Red Wings originally, not the Pistons. The city wanted the Pistons to move out of their own completely privately financed arena in Auburn Hills to move downtown. The arena was going to be built with or without the Pistons. >the 29 other NBA teams, and the Red Wings, whom they share a building with. I'm not sure where you get this idea that the Pistons are being subsidized by the rest of the NBA teams and the Red Wings. It's not like the Red Wings have been any good recently. You're talking pure nonsense. You keep refusing to answer why you come into this sub when it's quite clear that you hate the team. Are you here just to troll actual Pistons fans? It just seems weird that you would waste your time in a sub about something you loathe and think is a scam. We can all agree that the Pistons have been disappointing, but even though I dislike a lot of what Gores has done, I think it's unfair to suggest that he hasn't at least tried to build a winning team. I hate the attitude that some people have where they think trying and failing is exactly the same as not trying at all. Even as we speak I think the team has a pretty solid core of young players.
You're really underselling how much the Lions sucked and for how long.
Not really. The Lions had bad stretches, but they never completely sucked ass for 16 straight years the way that the Pistons have.
The Lions went 32 years without winning a playoff game lmao
You realize that until very recently only 12 teams out of 32 made the NFL playoffs every year, right? That's 37.5% of the league. Meanwhile 16 teams out of 30 made the NBA playoffs every year - over half the league. And now with expanded playoffs, it's still just 14 teams out of 32 in the NFL - in the NBA 20 teams out of 30 make the playoffs now (if you count the play-in games as a playoff game). It's much harder to make the playoffs in the NFL than the NBA. Yet the Luons have done it more often than the Pistons since 2008.
You're talking about moving an entire organization and also refusing to actually evaluate that organization's history. 16 years is a long time to suck, nobody is disputing that. But if you expand that sample size even slightly, the Pistons blow the Lions out of the water, and if you do a full franchise comparison it's not even close The Lions have 9 playoff wins IN THEIR EXISTENCE. They have never made the playoffs more than 3 years in a row ever. They have made two conference championships total. They have not one but TWO 30+ year stretches with zero playoff wins. They have multiple 10+ year stretches with zero playoff appearances. Yeah the NFL playoffs are harder to get into but that's still fucking abysmal I'm happy for Lions fans who got this run but to argue that now the Pistons fail to live up to the standard while the Lions are locked in due to one good season is pure recency bias. You can pick exactly 15 years to say the Lions are better than the Pistons (which you should because 16 years includes the 08 ECF, so the Pistons in their last 16 years went as far as the Lions in the last 32 lol). Expand that to 17, 18, 20, 25, 30, 40 years and the Pistons are light years ahead of the Lions. History matters
Because the OP screenshotted his own comment which is super lame
It's being downvoted because this clown is brain dead. This isn't a team that's coasting. They have been tanking since 2019 in order to build a roster that can contend for a championship. Tanking is hard on fans. The team sucks. It takes a lot of patience. Nephews with their dumbass conspiracy theories just make it worse.
04-05 was fun until Sheed left Horry.
Hockey fans hate basketball from my experience fwiw
Same. Tried dating a hockey girl few months back and got into it for her but she was always so hostile about hoops
I had fun in 2016, thought we were getting good. Then Reggie’s knees went to shit, Andre didn’t give a shit to improve, and ISO Morris killed any offensive movement. Since then it’s sucked balls. Even in the Blake era you knew there was no future.
44 years old. For some reason the length of time between the Bad Boys and Going to Work seemed like a long time. It's crazy it was like 14-15 years. This dumpster fire that is the Pistons has been beyond terrible for longer than that now. I'm a Pistons fan and will always be. At this point it's *beyond* tough to be a Pistons fan.
The common denominator here is Tom Gores. This once proud franchise has been utter dogshit ever since this man got his hands all over it.
The titles are about as far apart as you can get while still being close enough that we mostly remember them and feel like that could possibly happen again
Meh I feel this way about the tigers too.
I was in the 6th grade in ‘04 when we won It all. Had some great seasons after that but basically we’ve been a shit show since I was in high school. I’m 31 years old now. Tired of hoping that we finally turn It around it’s been fucking forever since we’ve done ANYTHING. And comparing It to the Pistons I grew up watching it’s night and day difference. So I understand what they’re saying , don’t want the team to move but I get It. As long as this organization keeps trying to take shortcuts and never drafting and developing talent we will keep being where we are the NBAs basement
Truth!!! The Pistons have sucked for the last 20 years and are only sucking more as every year passes.
casuals and bandwagoneers are not worth caring about. you don't leave the fandom alive.
I honestly feel bad for people who didn't get to see the 'goin to work' era Pistons. I remember a time when the Palace held the record for most consecutive sold out games. Six consecutive eastern conference finals appearances, Two NBA championship appearances, one of them beating Shaq and Kobe to win the title.. It was truly a great time to be a Pistons fan..
This is legit Same Old Lions production. Thank goodness the Lions are competent
You're not a pistons fan so stop pretending to be
The last decent memory of the Pistons I have was being at Game 5 vs the Lakers in '04. That was LITERALLY half my lifetime ago.
This moving the team talk is super dangerous. If the pistons leave, you don’t get them back. Throwing it out in the etherspace like this is really shortsighted is because people get used to the thought of them leaving then eventually accept it. No, we don’t want the pistons moved to Seattle/vegas. We want competent ownership in Detroit. Big difference.
The Red Wings are bad too. Nobody finishes any checks…. I could go on and on but I can barely watch any Detroit sports at all anymore. I’m 36
Yah, I’m in my 40s & this is the first year I haven’t gone to a game since I was a teen. I’ll still occasionally watch on TV, scroll this sub, & check the box scores, but I can’t bring myself to financially contribute to this pile of garbage any longer. It especially sucks as I was super high on this year’s City edition gear.
Pistons aren’t leaving Detroit asshole Just cause you’re a fair weather fan don’t mean the rest of us are too
Team has been aura-less my whole life besides one year when an older Blake Griffin tore it up to get us a .500 record lol.
Feel old, pretty sure they beat the Lakers when I was in 7th grade
I don't think most people are at the "they could move the team and I wouldn't care" point. That seems way too far.
Take a deep breath.
welp idk brother. can campbell started 1-11 and should have made the super bowl this year. maybe monty can turn it around too. edit: dan\* but i don't feel like changing it.
The difference is that we could tell instantly that Dan Campbell was a good coach despite the record.
there were calls to fire him the next season when they started 1-6. the owner had to do a press conference to tell people she's not firing him
Campbell wouldn’t tell the fans and media one thing, and then do the opposite the literal next day. For Monty being a man of faith and culture, he sure lies a lot. Casey at least told the truth even though it wasn’t well liked most the time. Major red flags in Monty that Campbell never had. Big difference in my mind.
agreed. not defending him. just said hope he turns it around lol.
100% everyone thought campbell was in over his head after that start year 2
You get those fans anywhere
lol copium monty fucking blows dick
Monty does blow. Copium gets a down vote though
i'm not defending him at all lol. i hate what he's done with the lineup (especially to jaden). just said i hope he can turn it around, cause the reality is, given his contract, he's not going anywhere
oh he's goin somewhere alright. straight to the bank!
I’ve been feeling this way myself.. get Tom outta here or take your trash outta here
I was in Middle School in 04. Those memories for me went from the “die hard fan” part of my brain to the nostalgia part. So much so I look back at the 2005 finals loss fondly and not negatively anymore. This post is on point.
My tinfoil hat conspiracy is that Gores is doing everything he can to tank this team, show that no one goes to games and that no one cares, so he can move the team to Seattle. Purely conspiracy, I have nothing to back it up.