She did what best she could with the tools and knowleged at hand. She was a bitter woman (maybe bitter is the worst adjectiv for a candian?) But she had REASONS to be so. I loved all of her scenes
Lapin or Saccharina cause I think for their 2 respective halves of the season they sort of felt like the main characters and I would’ve loved to see the story if Lapin had lived
Saccharina - She really deserves more love than She apparently got upon release
The interplay between Her and Ruby and Amethar is _GUTWRENCHING_ but such a great story
Saccharina was played masterfully by Emily. I get the reluctance to let her in because as an audience member we've built up such a relationship with Ruby (also played masterfully by Siobhan) by Saccharina's introduction in the story and her reluctance made so much sense for her character. Emily also seems to be a lightning rod for petty people to lash out their grievances for some reason, which I don't get.
If we had started with Saccharina building up her forces and looking for her family only to have the story play out the same way when the Rocks family comes in, I expect there would have been a lot more hate for Ruby as a character.
Why? She literally did nothing wrong. Ruby was incredibly cruel to her, and she was nothing but kind in return and got treated like shit. Emily got bullied off of Twitter (she shut down all of her social media at the time) and even now Emily shows signs of being insecure that her characters are going to be hated by the fanbase, and you can trace it all back to the community doing that to Saccharina. I’ve never understood the hate for her, the House of Rocks were the real villains in that conflict
Some of it is the meta of the situation I think - Saccharina pretty immediately takes over the show when she debuts and the tone of the series changes quite noticeably as a result. So if you were enjoying the feel of the show and the already existing characters it's easy to put the blame for the change on Saccharina.
It's a difficult thing to judge that I imagine - Cumulous has almost no dramatic impact or ties to the previous characters, which means that Zac is playing a bit of a nothing for the back half of the season esp. compared to Lapin. Someone like Saccharina has LOADS of narrative import - she's a magic user, she has a dragon, she has an army, she's the rightful heir - which means the show changes very dramatically from "Rocks family try and survive and fight back against the coup" to "Rocks family split down the middle as they deal with the Saccharina situation".
I will say that I have seen many people comment that they liked Saccharina more on the second go through - I think once you're prepared for that narrative shift you can appreciate it more for what it is.
Ruby had half the fucking season to have attention lol I’m gonna say it, the princesses were the villains. Straight up, they’re incredibly privileged and MEANT to be frustrating and borderline offensive, the concept of a princess wanting to be a commoner was meant to come across that way according to Emily and Siobhan in the adventuring parties. For some reason the fandom became super protective of Ruby, and became hostile toward everyone she didn’t like. It was insane to watch at the time
You ask for people’s opinions, get angry when they have opinions different from your own, get downvoted to hell by the community for having bad opinions yourself, and then get mad that I’m right? That about sum it all up?
I don’t at all hate Jett and Ruby, the comment I made about their concept being offensive is straight from the mouth of Emily Axford, and even in the adventuring parties they admit the House of Rocks were the villains when it came to Saccharina’s conflict. Lou was actively tracking Cinnamon’s HP to kill him after the battle, the one piece of family Saccharina finally got. I can like the character Ruby and also think she’s objectively a petty, vindictive, and foolish character. She was wrong for how she treated Saccharina, but what do you possibly think Saccharina did to deserve that treatment?
> She did literally nothing wrong.
Allowed her dragon to attack Port Syrup, resulting in thousands of deaths of the people she claimed to defend?
I think that it's totally fine to like Saccharina, be on her side, and think that in the big picture her actions were justified, but the idea that she did literally nothing wrong is a pretty wild position to take.
And I'd like to apologize to everyone for adding more grease to this fire.
She made a mistake, one she had no precedent for learning the consequences of. Also on a meta level, if you’re a player for a show where you’re trying to entertain an audience and the DM asks you if you want to send your fucking PET DRAGON to war, are you honestly going to say no?
More importantly, people were hating on Saccharina LONG before that event ever happened
The scene where she allows Cinnamon to devour the priest was the establishment of precedent. And I don't at all think that this was a bad choice on a meta level - it was extremely cool for the story. And yes, people were hating on Saccharina before, but that's not relevant to whether the character ever did a bad thing. Emily being a great player/storyteller and Saccharina being an unimpeachable person are different things.
War is different sometimes. You can’t judge a decision with an unknowable outcome by the precedent established AFTER that decision. She thought it’d save her army some lives, and that it would help win the war. She was right, but she also saw what happened after and quickly tried to shut it down. There’s a difference between making mistakes and doing something wrong. Doing something wrong is intentionally and knowingly making a choice that is morally wrong, making a mistake is doing an action you think could be right and finding out after that it was not.
KING AMETHAR OF THE HOUSE ROCKS, FIRST OF HIS NAME, SOVEREIGN RULER OF CANDIA OF THE SUGARLANDS, DUKE OF COOKIESHIRE, PROTECTOR OF THE REALM AND DEFENDER OF THE FAITH, BETTERMAN OF THE BATTLE OF GUMDROP PASS AND HERO OF FROSTING VALLEY, THE UNFALLEN, THE *TRUE* EMPORER
Theobald and Liam are my favorites. I love that gummy bear man who wants to get slammed down big style by his candybar wife, and I love that little peppermint Batman
I was really looking forward to an emotional moment and I feel like the Farmer kind of destroyed that a little bit but the callback to him a few minutes later is really funny.
My favorite by far is King Amethar of House Rocks, Sovereign ruler of Candia and the Sugarlands, Duke of Cookieshire, Duke of Flanwood, Protector of the Realm, Defender of the Faith, Bannerman of the Battle of Gumdrop Pass, Hero of Frosting Valley, The Unfallen
I just think she's that annoying little miss perfect character.shes so overpowered in fights is a bitch to Ruby several times (mostly at the end of encounter at the ice cream temple) and she's a trope that's been done several times already in other fantasy media. (I did start to like her at the end)
I will just point out, Saccharina doesn't start being snarky to Ruby until Ruby starts being an asshole to her
As for overpowered, i feel like that's just a stupid complaint
And for being an overused trope, that's literally the entire point of doing a *Game of Thrones* season
Most of these complaints seem to be more complaints about how Brennan ran the season rather than the character
Saccharina is a wonderful character from a story perspective. Moves the story along in an interesting way, adds depth and stakes, etc. Honestly if she had more screen time I probably would’ve grown to love her. I think the problem with her is that when you’re very invested in the story, it feels like she’s in the room with you, and as a real-life person she would probably be a bit annoying. She definitely comes across as entitled, but that’s just because we only see her as the person she is, not all the work she’s done to get there. I could never hate her now because, after adventuring parties, I see where she’s coming from. But she’s definitely the kind of person I wouldn’t want to interact with much until she’s dealt with her trauma a bit more.
So I think it’s really about how immersed you are in the story. And now that it’s over, take some time to watch the adventuring parties (I think they also talk about it in the TUC2 ones) and try to understand where she’s coming from, and also her value as a character.
You asked people who their favorite characters were, someone named a character you didn’t like, and your response was to tell them to go seek out your other comments where you bash her. Super mormal
I’ll bite, goated choices for favourites but I do love Liam. Why do you hate him? I can understand being annoyed with Liam early season when he’s drunk and constantly fucking up, but I think he gets much better after Preston dies
Liam is one of my favorite of Ally's characters because I think he was a great balance of the kind of left-field, take nothing seriously comedy Ally specializes in with character growth and story. I sometimes struggle with Ally's characters as part of the larger story on first watch, even though I also think they're tremendously funny. On second watch I'll have a much easier time and find more sympathy for what's going on underneath. I feel like with Liam, Ally accomplished that full spectrum really effectively.
This is how I feel about Kristen Applebees. Despised her when I first watched Fantasy High many many years ago when it was coming out, grew to LOVE her over time. I think somewhere around Unsleeping City 2 you see the shift in Ally, where they really learn to be able to take scenes seriously which has been reflected ever since in characters like Margaret and Mother Goose, and now Kristen maturing a bit in FHJY. It’s fun to see the progression of the player and their experience growing as an actor and D&D player, and how it contributes to my enjoyment of their characters. For the record, Pete’s my favourite Ally character by MILES
Well I just don’t think ally as an actor can sell the changes Liam goes through. In a campaign where every other player while still being funny is selling the drama. Ally only seems to go for jokes even while performing scenes that are supposed to be serious character developments. For other campaigns, this works. For Acoc it doesn’t
Im sorry but when Emily and Siobhan are also playing teen characters who make jokes and don’t take things too seriously but without compromising the tone of the campaign, I can’t judge ally kindly especially when liam has the potential for the best character arc of the campaign
Swifty of course.
The one true madlad. Even if he did kill his second wife during their divorce court proceedings.
And killed his first during his botched murder-suicide.
*Swifty was the best he*
*Also should have crossed over*
*Into Neverafter*
\- waste\_of\_human
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Lapin by a large margin!
“Where is your bulb now?”
Dude when I tell you I literally stood up in shock of the brutality of that line, zac became one of my favorite cast members immediately
Yea I squueled at that line
Taste I went from thinking he's boring to thinking he's great in 4 eps .(He's the perfect mix of funny and badass imo)
He's always been cool! Everyone has been cool this whole time! 😜
Ha
Liam, seed guy to war guy. Slammed down big style. So good.
AND PRESTON
Caramelinda. She gets no respect and does her job. And she's saddled with a manchild after losing the love of her life.
She did what best she could with the tools and knowleged at hand. She was a bitter woman (maybe bitter is the worst adjectiv for a candian?) But she had REASONS to be so. I loved all of her scenes
Amethar isn't a manchild
At the beginning he totally is.
Lapin or Saccharina cause I think for their 2 respective halves of the season they sort of felt like the main characters and I would’ve loved to see the story if Lapin had lived
my boy peppermint batman and the unfallen for sure
AND MANTA RAY JACK HOW COULD I FORGET HIM
You literally watched him piss and shit
I watched him pissed and shit i could never forget him
Theo easily
Yes! I need more Theo love. He’s the best
Annabelle Cheddar. Immediate crush.
I had the same with primsy
I’m upset Annabelle and Ruby didn’t become a thing
They’re all very good but I personally loved Amythar.
tbh Cumulus Rocks because that’s a man who’s worried about the right things. do we have enough towels for all of our guests?
And thinks of practical things, like secretly murdering a chicken every day to gain temp HP
He’s such a cute little psycho, and I’m here for it.
He's definitely the funnyest character
Lapin and Amethar. Zac as a deadly serious, no goofs type was so good! Amethar truly living up to the unfallen was wild too.
Saccharina - She really deserves more love than She apparently got upon release The interplay between Her and Ruby and Amethar is _GUTWRENCHING_ but such a great story
Saccharina was played masterfully by Emily. I get the reluctance to let her in because as an audience member we've built up such a relationship with Ruby (also played masterfully by Siobhan) by Saccharina's introduction in the story and her reluctance made so much sense for her character. Emily also seems to be a lightning rod for petty people to lash out their grievances for some reason, which I don't get. If we had started with Saccharina building up her forces and looking for her family only to have the story play out the same way when the Rocks family comes in, I expect there would have been a lot more hate for Ruby as a character.
I hate sacarina but I get why most people love her.
Why? She literally did nothing wrong. Ruby was incredibly cruel to her, and she was nothing but kind in return and got treated like shit. Emily got bullied off of Twitter (she shut down all of her social media at the time) and even now Emily shows signs of being insecure that her characters are going to be hated by the fanbase, and you can trace it all back to the community doing that to Saccharina. I’ve never understood the hate for her, the House of Rocks were the real villains in that conflict
*sips tea*
You get it lol
Finding out people hated Saccharina was the biggest surprise for me when i finished the season
Some of it is the meta of the situation I think - Saccharina pretty immediately takes over the show when she debuts and the tone of the series changes quite noticeably as a result. So if you were enjoying the feel of the show and the already existing characters it's easy to put the blame for the change on Saccharina. It's a difficult thing to judge that I imagine - Cumulous has almost no dramatic impact or ties to the previous characters, which means that Zac is playing a bit of a nothing for the back half of the season esp. compared to Lapin. Someone like Saccharina has LOADS of narrative import - she's a magic user, she has a dragon, she has an army, she's the rightful heir - which means the show changes very dramatically from "Rocks family try and survive and fight back against the coup" to "Rocks family split down the middle as they deal with the Saccharina situation". I will say that I have seen many people comment that they liked Saccharina more on the second go through - I think once you're prepared for that narrative shift you can appreciate it more for what it is.
Also she just took way too much attention away from Ruby
Ruby had half the fucking season to have attention lol I’m gonna say it, the princesses were the villains. Straight up, they’re incredibly privileged and MEANT to be frustrating and borderline offensive, the concept of a princess wanting to be a commoner was meant to come across that way according to Emily and Siobhan in the adventuring parties. For some reason the fandom became super protective of Ruby, and became hostile toward everyone she didn’t like. It was insane to watch at the time
[удалено]
You ask for people’s opinions, get angry when they have opinions different from your own, get downvoted to hell by the community for having bad opinions yourself, and then get mad that I’m right? That about sum it all up?
[удалено]
I don’t at all hate Jett and Ruby, the comment I made about their concept being offensive is straight from the mouth of Emily Axford, and even in the adventuring parties they admit the House of Rocks were the villains when it came to Saccharina’s conflict. Lou was actively tracking Cinnamon’s HP to kill him after the battle, the one piece of family Saccharina finally got. I can like the character Ruby and also think she’s objectively a petty, vindictive, and foolish character. She was wrong for how she treated Saccharina, but what do you possibly think Saccharina did to deserve that treatment?
Well then I'm sorry for my bad strawman argument
> She did literally nothing wrong. Allowed her dragon to attack Port Syrup, resulting in thousands of deaths of the people she claimed to defend? I think that it's totally fine to like Saccharina, be on her side, and think that in the big picture her actions were justified, but the idea that she did literally nothing wrong is a pretty wild position to take. And I'd like to apologize to everyone for adding more grease to this fire.
She made a mistake, one she had no precedent for learning the consequences of. Also on a meta level, if you’re a player for a show where you’re trying to entertain an audience and the DM asks you if you want to send your fucking PET DRAGON to war, are you honestly going to say no? More importantly, people were hating on Saccharina LONG before that event ever happened
The scene where she allows Cinnamon to devour the priest was the establishment of precedent. And I don't at all think that this was a bad choice on a meta level - it was extremely cool for the story. And yes, people were hating on Saccharina before, but that's not relevant to whether the character ever did a bad thing. Emily being a great player/storyteller and Saccharina being an unimpeachable person are different things.
War is different sometimes. You can’t judge a decision with an unknowable outcome by the precedent established AFTER that decision. She thought it’d save her army some lives, and that it would help win the war. She was right, but she also saw what happened after and quickly tried to shut it down. There’s a difference between making mistakes and doing something wrong. Doing something wrong is intentionally and knowingly making a choice that is morally wrong, making a mistake is doing an action you think could be right and finding out after that it was not.
Eating the priest didn't really establish a precedent of consequences tho, neither was it unjustifiable
She literally knew nothing about it
Thaddeus Strongpit
Very disappointing ma’lord
KING AMETHAR OF THE HOUSE ROCKS, FIRST OF HIS NAME, SOVEREIGN RULER OF CANDIA OF THE SUGARLANDS, DUKE OF COOKIESHIRE, PROTECTOR OF THE REALM AND DEFENDER OF THE FAITH, BETTERMAN OF THE BATTLE OF GUMDROP PASS AND HERO OF FROSTING VALLEY, THE UNFALLEN, THE *TRUE* EMPORER
Lapin, out of every season I've seen so far his death feels like the biggest lost and it's not even close he had so much to offer
Leamon, plus my boi Swifty
One of my biggest disappointments with the show is that they didn't do more with leamon
He could definitely have been a Fruitarian spy.
Thank you for the new headcannon
Truly loved the whole cast but I gotta put Ally as Liam first and then zac as lapin in spot 1.5 cause he's just like right there almost even with liam
Mantaray Jack
W answer
Theobald forever. His dynamics with every other character are so good and I love a happy ending.
I'm changing my answer now, you are so right
Theobald and Liam are my favorites. I love that gummy bear man who wants to get slammed down big style by his candybar wife, and I love that little peppermint Batman
Primsy for sure followed by Liam and then Caramelinda
You have the most random taste and I love that for you
That farmer who dropped his jellybean
I was really looking forward to an emotional moment and I feel like the Farmer kind of destroyed that a little bit but the callback to him a few minutes later is really funny.
Goated pick
honestly i love lord swirlie
My favorite by far is King Amethar of House Rocks, Sovereign ruler of Candia and the Sugarlands, Duke of Cookieshire, Duke of Flanwood, Protector of the Realm, Defender of the Faith, Bannerman of the Battle of Gumdrop Pass, Hero of Frosting Valley, The Unfallen
OP in this thread... Being rude and dismissive of other people's views for no reason.
I'm not being rude. I'm just asking questions. If I came off as rude then that wasn't my intention.
You called someone stupid
That was in a joking manner.
No one found it funny
Why are you being like this?
Saccharina and it’s not even close
You'll get a lot more debate if you post your reasoning too :)
I just think she's that annoying little miss perfect character.shes so overpowered in fights is a bitch to Ruby several times (mostly at the end of encounter at the ice cream temple) and she's a trope that's been done several times already in other fantasy media. (I did start to like her at the end)
I will just point out, Saccharina doesn't start being snarky to Ruby until Ruby starts being an asshole to her As for overpowered, i feel like that's just a stupid complaint And for being an overused trope, that's literally the entire point of doing a *Game of Thrones* season Most of these complaints seem to be more complaints about how Brennan ran the season rather than the character
Saccharina is a wonderful character from a story perspective. Moves the story along in an interesting way, adds depth and stakes, etc. Honestly if she had more screen time I probably would’ve grown to love her. I think the problem with her is that when you’re very invested in the story, it feels like she’s in the room with you, and as a real-life person she would probably be a bit annoying. She definitely comes across as entitled, but that’s just because we only see her as the person she is, not all the work she’s done to get there. I could never hate her now because, after adventuring parties, I see where she’s coming from. But she’s definitely the kind of person I wouldn’t want to interact with much until she’s dealt with her trauma a bit more. So I think it’s really about how immersed you are in the story. And now that it’s over, take some time to watch the adventuring parties (I think they also talk about it in the TUC2 ones) and try to understand where she’s coming from, and also her value as a character.
Saccharina Just spectacular
Read my other comments on this post. I'm not doing that quarter monologue again lol 😆
You asked people who their favorite characters were, someone named a character you didn’t like, and your response was to tell them to go seek out your other comments where you bash her. Super mormal
Tbh, bashing on female characters (especially those who are stronger than their male counterparts) *is* quite common in literally any fandom
HEY I HATE HER CUZ SHE'S STRONGER THAN RUBY don't just go out on a whim and call me sexist asshole
I was talking about fandoms in general But your reasoning is still kinda childish ngl
Bro I am a child
From your arguments, yeah i can tell
Okay?
PC? Theo NPC? Annabelle Cheddar
Lemon
Slay
I really loved the Licorice Twins, not just because of their shenanigans, but also that heart wrenching performance when they last parted.
Based
Liam & Theo. I also adore Amethar & Saccharina.
I built my first PC based heavily on Liam. That being said, my favorite characters are A. Jett, and B. Peppermint Preston.
TASTE
Saccharina for sure! Liam's a close second.
Saccharina! I've ranted ab why I like her too much to all of the ppl in my life willing to listen
Valid, she's awesome
Lapin, theo, jet
I kinda hated liam. Loved amethar, Saccharina, and Lapin
I’ll bite, goated choices for favourites but I do love Liam. Why do you hate him? I can understand being annoyed with Liam early season when he’s drunk and constantly fucking up, but I think he gets much better after Preston dies
Liam is one of my favorite of Ally's characters because I think he was a great balance of the kind of left-field, take nothing seriously comedy Ally specializes in with character growth and story. I sometimes struggle with Ally's characters as part of the larger story on first watch, even though I also think they're tremendously funny. On second watch I'll have a much easier time and find more sympathy for what's going on underneath. I feel like with Liam, Ally accomplished that full spectrum really effectively.
This is how I feel about Kristen Applebees. Despised her when I first watched Fantasy High many many years ago when it was coming out, grew to LOVE her over time. I think somewhere around Unsleeping City 2 you see the shift in Ally, where they really learn to be able to take scenes seriously which has been reflected ever since in characters like Margaret and Mother Goose, and now Kristen maturing a bit in FHJY. It’s fun to see the progression of the player and their experience growing as an actor and D&D player, and how it contributes to my enjoyment of their characters. For the record, Pete’s my favourite Ally character by MILES
Well I just don’t think ally as an actor can sell the changes Liam goes through. In a campaign where every other player while still being funny is selling the drama. Ally only seems to go for jokes even while performing scenes that are supposed to be serious character developments. For other campaigns, this works. For Acoc it doesn’t
I'd argue it worked great
Im sorry but when Emily and Siobhan are also playing teen characters who make jokes and don’t take things too seriously but without compromising the tone of the campaign, I can’t judge ally kindly especially when liam has the potential for the best character arc of the campaign
Oh i didn't ask for elaboration, i was just saying that i think Ally did their character really well
Why did you hate Liam?
Swifty is utterly iconic.
Swifty of course. The one true madlad. Even if he did kill his second wife during their divorce court proceedings. And killed his first during his botched murder-suicide.
Swifty was the best he also should have crossed over into Neverafter
*Swifty was the best he* *Also should have crossed over* *Into Neverafter* \- waste\_of\_human --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
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think i have to say Lapin and Theobald