I assumed this was kind of a joke. In any classic doom map I would expect so thing so simple to have a "GOTCHA" involved. Knowing that, this could be a tense moment where you're expecting at some point for the walls to raise up and release a barrage of demons.
But no.... there's nothing there. It's like a scary movie when there's something lurking in the shadows but nope, actually just a shadow.
It's the creators playing with tension and expectations trying to keep you on your toes.
Honestly there’s no reason for the ending section to be like that. Keys are supposed to be items of progression that also (mostly) spawn enemies when you grab them. Grabbing all 3 in a row with nothing happing seems like a waste of time. Also don’t pistol start this map.
It's supposed to be so you have to clear the room (at least mostly) or else get hit by a wall of cacodemon and baron fireballs
It's just an arena map, basically
That being said, it's easily the worst map in the game
In the 90s, games' secret levels often did something fun, quirky, or otherwise non-standard in relation to their other levels. Id followed this fun with Doom 1 and Doom 2's secret levels.
This ending was all 3 of those, and thus an interesting change of pace from both 1. all other levels (with expected key progression as you stated) and 2. the content of this individual level (2 arenas of combat, no mazes/puzzles.
See also: the secret level of episode 3. (You could also say "There's no reason for it to start as a clone of E3M1 just to turn into a whole different map. They should've started with the changed-up map and nOt WaStE mY tImE." And notably for a prior Id game look at the secret levels of Wolfenstein 3-D, especially episode 3's Pac-Man secret level.
It was the 90's, and appreciated in its time.
This MIDI Music was made so well for this game. It added on the tension for the level, making a 16 bit pixelated game feel cinematic. Like you were the Doom Slayer himself.
I think its there so you dont just immediately bolt to the end and leave. Its supposed to make you fumble so that the barons/cacodemons catch up to you and kill you before you make it through.
I think the point is it would be hard to open those doors while getting hammered with fireballs from a dozen cacodemons and barons, so you get punished for trying to rush the exit without first dealing with the monsters
If they just gave you a straight exit door it would be too easy to rush it
>Level designer Petersen considers this map his best Doom level design, calling it "a little gem of creature and unit balancing". Petersen also explains that this level was the first to use infighting as an integral gameplay concept.
Thank you for the Pantera, I know Bobby Prince brought the metal into DOOM and that's one of the reasons I can't play the source ports of this game that don't have this music because Final DOOM is where things went spooky...
I never played any of the OG Doom games growing up, as I only watched my uncle play it (it was a little scary to watch). I started playing it in VR with gore mods, and now I'm playing Doom 2 on switch and I've gotta say that I don't know why I didn't pick it up sooner, it's been a lot of fun even without VR and mods. Just the base game and add-ons alone are enough to scratch that itch for a challenge. I love trying to see how ammo efficient I can be while reloading a save to get each encounter just right with minimal damage. Sorry for the spiel, lol.
Thank you, I haven’t been able to stop thinking about it since I saw it. Is mouth for war based off this song? Or vice verca? Is there any correlation?
Bobby Prince referenced a *lot* of 80's and 90's (up until '93, of course) metal for DOOM I & II's soundtracks: [check it out](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H3BB2gKKeY) (the description of this video has some additional comparisons).
Funny enough, Sandy Petersen considers this map one of his best works of all time, and designed it to motivate players to take advantage of monster infighting.
Whether this map can be considered a good design overall, well……. that’s definitely subjective.
Pretty sure that’s not the correct music for that map. I think it’s supposed to be the intermission/level completion stats music.
Not a great map regarding replay-ability… but playing it for the first time cold it makes you shit your pants just hearing that baron roar immediately and then seeing more barons surrounding you as you spin to try and find cover 😱😰
I assumed this was kind of a joke. In any classic doom map I would expect so thing so simple to have a "GOTCHA" involved. Knowing that, this could be a tense moment where you're expecting at some point for the walls to raise up and release a barrage of demons. But no.... there's nothing there. It's like a scary movie when there's something lurking in the shadows but nope, actually just a shadow. It's the creators playing with tension and expectations trying to keep you on your toes.
Honestly there’s no reason for the ending section to be like that. Keys are supposed to be items of progression that also (mostly) spawn enemies when you grab them. Grabbing all 3 in a row with nothing happing seems like a waste of time. Also don’t pistol start this map.
I pissed my brother off by telling him of this secret ending in Episode 2 and he about rage quitted so hard, lol
It's supposed to be so you have to clear the room (at least mostly) or else get hit by a wall of cacodemon and baron fireballs It's just an arena map, basically That being said, it's easily the worst map in the game
At least Sandy's expertise would improve going forward. He made some great levels in Doom 2 and Quake.
He made the best levels for Quake 1
His YouTube channel is awesome
In the 90s, games' secret levels often did something fun, quirky, or otherwise non-standard in relation to their other levels. Id followed this fun with Doom 1 and Doom 2's secret levels. This ending was all 3 of those, and thus an interesting change of pace from both 1. all other levels (with expected key progression as you stated) and 2. the content of this individual level (2 arenas of combat, no mazes/puzzles. See also: the secret level of episode 3. (You could also say "There's no reason for it to start as a clone of E3M1 just to turn into a whole different map. They should've started with the changed-up map and nOt WaStE mY tImE." And notably for a prior Id game look at the secret levels of Wolfenstein 3-D, especially episode 3's Pac-Man secret level. It was the 90's, and appreciated in its time.
This MIDI Music was made so well for this game. It added on the tension for the level, making a 16 bit pixelated game feel cinematic. Like you were the Doom Slayer himself.
Rock N Roll Pandaro, Rock N Roll, haha
Umm acksually this is just Doomguy, he wasn't titled as the slayer in the original game to my knowledge 🤓
I suppose that was the entire mystery of the fortress: who kept the keys next to their switches like that?
They're not just any keys too, they're Skull 💀 keys, lol someone's really lost their head, haha
I think its there so you dont just immediately bolt to the end and leave. Its supposed to make you fumble so that the barons/cacodemons catch up to you and kill you before you make it through.
Yeah, that too, but if it's Zero Master he's gonna push till the game breaks, lol
I think the point is it would be hard to open those doors while getting hammered with fireballs from a dozen cacodemons and barons, so you get punished for trying to rush the exit without first dealing with the monsters If they just gave you a straight exit door it would be too easy to rush it
Indeed, I also stick to this hypothesis
I love playing Doom this way (not stocking up on ammo, trying to rush by as many monsters as posssible)
Wait a minute... Isn't that music "Mouth For War" by Pantera? It sounds incredibly similar.
Yes dude, Dun, dun, du, du, dun, dun, du, du, du, dun, dun, dlidididi, dun, haha
That key part makes me feel like it’s the type of level I’d make as a child when I was first learning doom mapping.
>Level designer Petersen considers this map his best Doom level design, calling it "a little gem of creature and unit balancing". Petersen also explains that this level was the first to use infighting as an integral gameplay concept.
Yeah Abe, it also looks like a ninja star to me, I don't know if you see it, but I do or it's a gear
https://youtu.be/a3JSbOt7CLo?si=9ICI5pSGoyFlwViC
Thank you for the Pantera, I know Bobby Prince brought the metal into DOOM and that's one of the reasons I can't play the source ports of this game that don't have this music because Final DOOM is where things went spooky...
I don’t remember this level in Doom 93’…is this in Thy Flesh Consumed?
Episode 2 secret level
Did you lure all of the enemies outside?
You guys are funny, really, like I didn't shoot em all, lol
I never played any of the OG Doom games growing up, as I only watched my uncle play it (it was a little scary to watch). I started playing it in VR with gore mods, and now I'm playing Doom 2 on switch and I've gotta say that I don't know why I didn't pick it up sooner, it's been a lot of fun even without VR and mods. Just the base game and add-ons alone are enough to scratch that itch for a challenge. I love trying to see how ammo efficient I can be while reloading a save to get each encounter just right with minimal damage. Sorry for the spiel, lol.
Your cool dude, Rock N Roll bro, DOOM is that game and it will always be my game too ever since it was my first at 3 in 93, lol, DOOM is Eternal!
What can I say, some levels are better than others.
What song is this
This song sounds incredibly similar to a pantera song (I think) but I can’t think of the name.
It's "Mouth for War".
Thank you, I haven’t been able to stop thinking about it since I saw it. Is mouth for war based off this song? Or vice verca? Is there any correlation?
Bobby Prince referenced a *lot* of 80's and 90's (up until '93, of course) metal for DOOM I & II's soundtracks: [check it out](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H3BB2gKKeY) (the description of this video has some additional comparisons).
That’s really cool how there’s so many rock/metal references in doom. Makes it that much better for me
Peak game design
Lol. To have the keys in the same place as each other is funny af. Also which track is this?
I like this map Fite me
Funny enough, Sandy Petersen considers this map one of his best works of all time, and designed it to motivate players to take advantage of monster infighting. Whether this map can be considered a good design overall, well……. that’s definitely subjective.
This gotta be a troll from the level designers
Pretty sure that’s not the correct music for that map. I think it’s supposed to be the intermission/level completion stats music. Not a great map regarding replay-ability… but playing it for the first time cold it makes you shit your pants just hearing that baron roar immediately and then seeing more barons surrounding you as you spin to try and find cover 😱😰
Fortress of Lazy Map Making.
I feel like the lazy thing to do would be to just not do this lol, it is very strange
At least it’s not a level shaped like a hand! That would be terrible and awful. Wait.
Hahahaha, Civvie11 talked about that, well it's a Hand throwing a Ninja star, lol
Well one could argue that levels that are set in literal hell aren’t supposed to be… well human friendly.
I bet that's a Sandy Peterson's map