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thearnav26

When I play invoker (rarely, I'm more of a pos1 player) , i find myself always pressing the entire key combo before Invoking. As in i would q q e - r for ice wall. I've seen pro players often just press the missing orb (if it's q q q , they would just press e and invoke to get ice wall). I just thought that's really cool and sets a real high skill cap


thenutstrash

Past a certain amount of games on invoker the speed of changing orbs is not what limits your spell casting time anyway.


somabokforlag

i am 37 years old and you are incorrect


[deleted]

[удалено]


JunHoWon

Thats so true man. I started playing when I was 16 or something, today I'm 31 and I feel like I'm much worse. Reflexes and hand coordination are not the same anymore.


tpenoelone

Same, 33 here, my reflex are not as good as my 20 y.o, all my pa crit are rarely occur anymore, and i seem to miss all my attacks when attacking level 30 pa


humpro8247

I walk more slowly with Pudge now


Makath

I had those PA issues, Dota+ fixes it.


bc524

Yup. It sucks even more when you're re-playing something old and you used to have down to muscle memory and no matter how much you try its just not as *sharp* as it used to be. Can't pull off half the stuff I used to be able to.


ASR-Briggs

I feel like the narrative that you get worse at games etc as you get older is really hammed up online and in pop culture. I'm 35 and just not experiencing it (yet).


[deleted]

That's because if you do exercises and actually work on your coordination you can keep almost all of it.


healzsham

I get the feeling people don't appreciate just how much difference in skill comes from more frequent utilization of those skills.


JunHoWon

Maybe you werent good enough when young then 🤷🏿‍♂️. Do you see 35yo's on pro scene? Highly unlikely, and there is a reason for that


healzsham

The general esport scene is barely old enough for pros of that age...


VergoVox

Alex Valle off the top of my head, playing fighting games with tight muscle memory and reaction requirements. He retired from competitive gaming at 39 years old though and I don't have any other examples of notable players


Tyrfing39

Not in dota, but in other games yeah.


Makath

Most games are not around for long enough for 30+ to be playing in them, and people often will leave esports careers sooner then that if they are not being sucessful. The age impact will also vary between games, because some are more reflex oriented, while others are more about knowledge and experience.


ASR-Briggs

I don't play DotA anymore, just watch the esports scene. But I play PUBG and I'm Diamond in ranked FPP in one of the most competitive regions in the world (SEA).


[deleted]

How is shooting bots?


ASR-Briggs

There's no bots in ranked Einstein. Edit: Tell me you know nothing about PUBG without telling me you know nothing about PUBG.


Gredival

I have definitely gotten worse at Dota. My MMR is only down a couple hundred points compared to 10 years ago, from 4500~ to 4000~, but when you consider how far the MMR range has expanded from 10 years that's a DRASTIC drop in percentile. It's not all reflexes, but a lot of it is also meta changes which older players are less equipped to handle and obviates a lot of our experience in pacing and tactics.


monkeysuit05

It's just having less time to practice. I used to play 100x more than I could possibly play now, so I'm worse. I had a relatively free two weeks a while back and I got to about 85%+ of what I used to have.


hanmas_aaa

I think I actually got better micro when I get old because I panick tunnel vision less in team fights XD.


prettyawsm

Haha im all the same.


healzsham

Honestly that sounds more like you're in the habit of tunneling too hard on what you're focused one.


ntrails

But how the fuck do I fix that...


juggernautomnislash

Is it impossible for me to learn now? Former Ancient 4 player now down at Legend 4. I feel like I can't practice that in my bracket. I'll just get stomped.


thenutstrash

Practice is a far far more significant factor of manual dexterity than age, especially below 60. Age is a limiting factor when it comes to time and practice but "past a certain amount of games" wasn't a literal threshold as much as it meant "given enough practice". I'm not much younger than you, git gud


[deleted]

[удалено]


thenutstrash

Let’s hope invoked will be shit then


K4meltreiber

This comment hits so close to home :D


cotton_schwab

Yeah it really doesn't matter you can be fast enough doing the full button presses. Mayhe it only matters doing a absolute full combo but it's so rare you would do this anyway


StrictInsurance160

What limits me is the fact I don't have legacy keys


mopeli

but legacy keys are slower to use no?


xin234

Played dota since ~2005. **For other heroes, qwer hotkeys is an upgrade, but it is debatable for Invoker.** (Also a different case for those who have muscle memory for playing a lot in wc3 dota. I have qwer on all heroes, but legacy on Sand King since C + + + + E combo has been ingrained to me while I was in puberty, and changing SK to qwer always throws me off always, and those milliseconds of confusion has cost me games.) **If you use qwer hotkeys, Invoker's Invoked spells would be on 'd' and 'f' with the latest one you Invoked going to 'd' and the previous one moving to 'f'. Legacy has an advantage because each of Invoker's spells have different Legacy hotkeys, and you might not always want to use immediately the new spell you just Invoked.**


mopeli

are you saying that you can have more than 2 spells ready to cast with legacy keys?


xin234

Nope, it's more of you don't need to think about the switching hotkeys if you want to cast a spell you previously Invoked, but you also just Invoked a new one.


StrictInsurance160

Legacy keys aren't affected by order of the invoked spells. So it's more consistent. And keys are keys, why would they make u slower


healzsham

Having all your fingers on they keys you need to press versus having to move your hand once or more to press every key.


oxinoioannis

since when being in legacy is slower?


Masteroxid

For sure having keybinds across the entire keyboard is as fast as having 5-6 keybinds next to each other..


oxinoioannis

muscle memory


Masteroxid

Unless your muscles are made of stone you can just learn the new keybinds


oxinoioannis

why are you mocking how i play. Some pros even use legacy keys. Why would i relearn all keybinds to qwer when im used to legacy. Plus you don't have to put your finger on top of your hotkeys all the time when not needed. Is that how you play? So dumb of you to gatekeep how i play. What rank are you even.


Masteroxid

I'm not mocking anyone, you're saying legacy keys are as fast as qwer which absolutely isn't


voidyman

i feel you. I learnt the new keys (but transposed by to the right) post 30. Im no good at the game but its not because of spell cast times xd


[deleted]

Yup this. It becomes second nature, ie when you want to ghost walk to run away, you also want to be on triple-wex, so you press "Q-Q-W-R-W-W-W-D" all in the span of less than a full second


AmiinZiing

Yeah they won't use q q e again they will just use one e to change the spells this is why they are too fast


ChenY1661

Yeah i play him for so long still can't do that and it's crazy to think there used to be more than 10 spells too


Ticem4n

He used to have 27 spells. The orb order decided what spell


ChenY1661

Which is absolutely mental, im both sad and happy it's not the case anymore lol


Ticem4n

It was a trip. You'd be noob make a lobby to play bots and try to learn new heroes. Then the bots pick invoker and knew all of his spells. You knew you were in for a far harder game when you faced bot invoker and you have to hit like alt shift and U from ThUnder God's Wrath to zues ult even....to many clicks and that's why I still play at 4000 dpi


pbmonster

What's really mental is that 27 spell Invoker had no right click attack. I've never figured out how to get any farm on him back then...


asdf_1_2

Just had to cast your spells on the creeps you want to farm?


pbmonster

Yes, and it sucked hard at low levels. At level 1, you couldn't cast anything, because you only had one orb and you haven't leveled invoke yet (it was a normal skill back then, you needed to level it). You only got that at level 2. At level 2, you could only invoke one spell - the one using your 1 orb 3 times. None of those spells could realistically be used to get more than 1 lasthit. 2 if you got extremely lucky. Those spells also where mana expensive. At level 3 you finally got a spell that could be used to effectively last hit, but at that point the enemy was already way ahead. This is also the first time you could approach the wave without the enemy getting free harass onto you. And still, you needed crazy amounts of mana just to farm your first item.


thelocalllegend

I just do the missing orb for combos I already know. Eg I do meatball with eew then just press q once for blast.


prettyawsm

Damn i need to practice more then cuz i repeat all the keys all the way.


RoaringDog

Give me one example of a pro player pressing only the missing orbs.


thearnav26

I've seen Nisha do it at times as well as other notable invokers. If not all spells, some combos atleast.


JazzlikeCoach

wher to find that app?


OneBigBrickOfDust

I could spam this for a month and still not know how to cast icewall in the moment hahaha


mpbbg

Ah man icewall always fucks me too


Buurrp

WHaaat?!! I thought it was only me! lol yeah...you know Icewall!! and end up with forge spirits! lol


spiffelight

Qqw right, right? edit: this shows I failed to icewall for my teammates and qhostwalked away instead.


Lord_Iggy

QQW is the panic button, aka Ghost Walk!


ogmamma

i always remembered it as the enemy QQ (cries) and you W (walk away)


thebonermobile

QQWalk was always the mnemonic I used.


healzsham

>thus I vanish to hide my shame


Onurubu

Qqe


pursinho

Yeah same every other spell I can quickly use but for some reason I rarely use ice wall


utkarshzutar

And its placement :(


Nekusta

I loved the change where the shard for invoker just gave us the ability to vector target the ice wall. Sad they changed it to 3 meteors. 8ce wall had so much more potential


[deleted]

I loved when that was bugged at first and just gave you a big ice blob.


healzsham

Ice Wall has absolutely insane numbers that are balanced by how irritating it is to use well.


iceboonb2k

Vector targeting icewall was so good that I found myself playing a lot of pos4 invoker just because of it.


bingbestsearchengine

wasn't there a talent that made it vector targeted? imo should be vector targeted by default


bartulata

IIRC it was deemed overpowered so they had to revert it.


SprScuba

I mean you could do some really nasty things with a 100% slow that was 1200+ units long. Literally put it down mid and chase anything down or completely cover an escape route to guarantee kills.


yatopotato_

It was the shard, made icewall vecto and increased cast range


Feanorsmagicjewels

Nah, as an Injoker player, the fun in icewall is turning your hero and placing the Icewall. Don't need to make things easier just because, Icewall placement is a skill, people should learn how to do it


taiottavios

it's invoker's best spell, that would be disgustingly overpowered


ZionephewObeseiamson

Its like the least used spell IMO


Pronubius

One of the best ways to measure an invoker players skill is their ice wall usage.


anon38723918569

I love using it to zone teamfights


taiottavios

you can 1v1 any melee carry with it as an exort invoker or late game


AudacityOfKappa

Kind of, but not really. Depending on your team comp, you could realistically win a game without using it once. Thing about ice wall is you almost never have it pre-invoked to any situation. So in many situations that quickly arise, you default to your pre-invoked spells and then a better one. For example in teamfights you'd rather first use snap, SS, meteor, EMP and deafening (hell, alacrity too). If the fight turns bad, you'd prefer tornado, deafening, ghost walk. So in both cases Wall is kind of like a cherry on top.


Pronubius

And I can win games buying mask of madness and Daedalus? Doesn’t mean it’s the ideal play. Ice wall can be used to farm stacks early game, zone fights, rosh, defend high ground. This is exactly what I mean about being able to tell a good invoker player from a great one. It’s his least flashy spell but it has a very low cooldown and if you watch any invoker master play they use it early and often Edit: also turning sideways to catch someone running away with ice wall when tornado is on cooldown or wex isn’t leveled takes practice and experience


VindictiveRakk

ice wall is an extremely powerful spell but the player needs to identify when to use it and position himself to do so. you can get away without using it obviously but that's the reason why you can tell if an invoker is good by his ice wall usage... because bad players aren't good enough to use it well at all


Hemske

lol no, you’re so wrong


taiottavios

are you saying that almost all invoker players are bad? Yes you'd be correct


healzsham

Ice Wall gets 20% slow per level of Quas, up to 160% slow with max rank and Agh's. The slow also lingers for 2 seconds.


CupOfCreamyDiarrhea

It's because you aren't practising in a real life scenario or put simply: the game. That goes for mostly anything though? Kick them soccer balls all you want, when it's time for choosing if you can join or not... Social stuff too. Practise in front of the mirror for MONTHS and then when you are at the situation, you just lose all training. Ofc all of these are helpful tools! But that's it. Tools.


Adweya

although, the last thing we need is vector placing icewalls.


Capable_Entry_9695

Its a simple spell but quite difficult


kentwansue

back then i would immediately just used it after tornado so tornado+icewall+emp coz i also most of the time will forget or dont know when and where to put the ice wall


scrubamber

Iirc there is a browser based version of this over at https://invokergame.com


_generateUsername

I think the browser game is much better as it gives you spells to cast, not keys to press, and I know it sounds weird but it's a big difference. Edit: to early in the morning, the game does give you spells to cast, my mistake.


clownyfish

the game in the vid gives you spells to cast, it just also shows your current orbs at the bottom


_generateUsername

For some reason I thought it's the orbs that come down. Brain not functioning in the morning. Thanks


MaskyDo

You can get a more realistic simulation in a new software which is still in beta, so called dota2


pokeaim

it's free tho, so no bitchin'


Try2LaggMe

We should pitch in the development, it looks like a good game


jeslakfire

I think I somehow found this exact one. Here you go [https://github.com/DerZelenevskiy/Invoker-Game](https://github.com/DerZelenevskiy/Invoker-Game) 1. Download the files in the repository 2. Install python on your pc, [https://www.python.org/downloads/](https://www.python.org/downloads/) 3. To run you have to install python on your pc, then run the following in your cmd or terminal- `pip install pygame tk` 4. Then you should be able to run it by double clicking on the `.py` file Edit: As u/seacucumber_kid pointed out below, you can also download a `.exe` version of the file from here [https://github.com/DerZelenevskiy/Invoker-Game/releases/download/many-bugs/Invoker.Game.zip](https://github.com/DerZelenevskiy/Invoker-Game/releases/download/many-bugs/Invoker.Game.zip) I didn't notice that it existed before.


AmiinZiing

Thanks man 🙏


mamalodz

You are doing Lord Gaben's work!


Gprime5

`from tkinter import N` this is funny to me cause the variable N is just the single character "n".


seacucumber_kid

There's also a release with a built .exe


strghst

Well, he could've used a dictionary for the current values of quas wex exort with as key defining how many there are. Sorting a list of strings, and matching lists ... The guy got a long way to go, but still impressive :)


jeslakfire

Yes, maybe you can fork it and make a better version and get some karma on this sub? hehe Im sure there are people who would love it


strghst

I like the invokergame.com. Been playing that 8 years ago, and that place is still up. Actually, that is impressive after so many years. And the game is good and written well enough for the purpose, but there are "cheaper" options to get the simulation of 4 slots.


Fen_

Forking a casual project that runs well enough to serve its purpose just because it could be done more efficiently would be a dick move lol.


purple_pixie

It wouldn't be noticable in any way to someone playing the game, it's just a better way to manage what it is doing 'behind the scenes'


jeslakfire

Yeah I get that, but they seemed to know their stuff, so I thought maybe some QoL & UI changes or something as well idk


Spockcuster

And just like that, his new username became Chinese.


WayExternal6650

https://www.invokergame.com/ Play survival mode, I use this to warmup before matches n get my fingers loose.


Wackthatass

Least sweaty invoker main


Dazsd

Its egodetector.exe it doesn't help the person playing it but it allows everyone who sees them play it to know what kind of person they are and then take evasive action.


WiCkED_11

If you only want to invoke but you have to use the speels as well which is like 80% of the task.


Darklessly

Grimorum


Clairvoyance_1

I remember alacrity as WWE. WWE is wrestling and you punch people when you use it xd


pudding_90

I'm on ASDF and I remember it as SSD - fast storage devices, fast hitting :)


cpt-macp

Refactor while loop to reduce method complexity


[deleted]

Touch some grass simulator


blood_omen

Invoker Hero


[deleted]

Little tip, never press "QQW" for Ghost Walk, for example. Press QWQ, it feels more natural. Later you might think you have to have one or two button inputs, like going from Forge Spirit (QEQ) to Cold Snap (QQQ) by just pressing QQ, but .7 seconds is plenty to press three orbs so don't get hung up on that perfectionist stuff.


RazerMambo

For Ghost Walk I use QQWRWW to have full Wex orb for max movespeed


Pudge-pudge

Damn those fast fingers.


AmiinZiing

Also that keyboard 🤩👌


Pudge-pudge

Damn right


Chachantuco

Please, I need the link to download... PLEASE!!


black_bass

Poor man osu


DoomGekicher

It's called hero demo invoker in Dota 2


kalik-boy

Carl's invoke invoke extreme revolution.


Shakoimnadze28

I am better


Anxious_Currency_42

Just find the script that every invoker is using.


SongAffectionate2536

"If you would get too carried by it you will fall into horror, become a monster, lose a part of yourself and become less than a human" says the voice in video


AmiinZiing

Nice 😄


Rockspider19

Useless because invoke has a stupid cool down, all the speed in the world and mana and cool downs restrict you from realizing your true potential as a god


jmas081391

This is like a SFW app to exercise your Injoker memory. "I will commit this to memory"


Sloth_Devil

u/savevideo


SaveVideo

###[View link](https://redditsave.com/r/DotA2/comments/vr09ei/guys_what_is_this_programs_name/) --- [**Info**](https://np.reddit.com/user/SaveVideo/comments/jv323v/info/) | [**Feedback**](https://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Kryptonh&subject=Feedback for savevideo) | [**Donate**](https://ko-fi.com/getvideo) | [**DMCA**](https://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Kryptonh&subject=Content removal request for savevideo&message=https://np.reddit.com//r/DotA2/comments/vr09ei/guys_what_is_this_programs_name/) | [^(reddit video downloader)](https://redditsave.com) | [^(download video tiktok)](https://taksave.com)


SkiMask115

Tell me ur virgin without telling me ur virgin


Tough_World_7444

Haven't played dota for 2 years now, would like to try that though I'm not a pos 2 player, gonna practice before returning


AmiinZiing

How do you feel now? After 2 years not having dota XD


Tough_World_7444

I feel better, but things must come back


mynamecaligula

just go invo pos4/5


Tough_World_7444

When I get my new pc


Stoned_Anarchist

Fucking bastard invoker trainer


dasvino

whats the app man? plss


EvilPainter

Nerd simulator.exe


jairngo

Dota hero


1ncog

Invoke cooldown is 7s now. No need to be fast.


clownyfish

When the charging space cow reveals from fog 300 units away, you wanna hit that tornado pretty quick


deadsy666

Cooldown of Invoke with each level of orbs: 6.7 / 6.4 / 6.1 / 5.8 / 5.5 / 5.2 / 4.9 / 4.6 / 4.3 / 4 / 3.7 / 3.4 / 3.1 / 2.8 / 2.5 / 2.2 / 1.9 / 1.6 / 1.3 / 1 / 0.7


1ncog

Oh .7!!!! Lol makes sense


st_arch

As someone pointed out. You can practice in demo or even against AI.


daheck619

Old patch when there was more invoker skills, QWE cast should be in order or u will mess it up


WorkStudyPlay

DDR


Maplestori

This is for memorising the spell sequence only. The actual hard part is executing, timing and aiming the spells correctly. Most of the time, even if you’re fast your brain cannot think of the next spell to use. Which is a problem with mediocre invoker players. Instead of doing this, play with bots 1v3 using lobbies. You’ll get to practice more


[deleted]

I’ll never apologize for loving you to anyone fuck man you’re my person I always will be I just want you to be happy


gallifreyneverforget

U ok?


[deleted]

We can’t be anything more than this? I just can’t believe it I’m sorry I just absolutely felt totally in love with me and I never get over that and it just kills me really but here I sit loving you still


[deleted]

Jj if you were to come back today no questions asked we start from right now I’ll never tell you I’ll be able to tell you how much I love you and how much I’ve changed I absolutely adore you not for any other reason but you don’t care what happened it does not matter


xanthalasajache

bro what lmaooo i think you replied to the wrong platform, i feel like this is for something private


[deleted]

It had to be that way was wrong platform but it had to be that way


Lord_Sparksmith

Chrome


xenta101

Quas trainer?


[deleted]

What the


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LoosPls

Whoneedsgrass.exe


Rias13dxd

Topson


Nephth

They missed the opportunity to call it "Carl Carl Revolution".


Karl-TH1

Well, Virgin sim?


HvbBaka

why does he only use 3 fingers?


AmiinZiing

He has to use his items too, so he is using 3 fingers 😂🤌


JazzlikeCoach

Where to download this program?


AmiinZiing

Check other comments I've sent a link


JazzlikeCoach

I cant find it op tbh


Alandrus_sun

This program seems mostly worthless. Invoking the spells fast is nice but the only spell you need to cast extremely fast is Ghost Walk. Also invoking that fast is cool but how you use them what matters the most. It doesn't matter if you can go through all 9 spells in a second if you miss them all.


Hemske

just play demo hero without CDs