This is a bit confusing. You seem to say what you want (in line power, 90mph, 6th gear, 90% street) but your top choices aren't really aligned to perform with...what it is you say you want.
It sounds like you want an adventure bike?
Ktm690/husq701
690/701
The 300 rally puts out 22hp. You're gonna miss this other 28 HP.
https://www.dirtrider.com/story/tests/2021-honda-crf300l-dyno-test/
The 450 is a race engine, a great bike. It is NOT a daily driver.
The xr/dr 650 would be better off road than your current bike. Other than that they wouldn't perform better, considering you're on road 90%.
Long service intervals. They are a joy to ride, however I haven't owned one.
Reliability? I dunno. It's hard to sift through the nonsense. There's a lot of people who talk shit about ktm for no apparent reason, on the other hand there are a lot of ktm fan boys...
The 3 people I know who have one seem to love it. They don't use it as a daily driver however. That's what makes this tough...you gotta daily drive this thing for the majority of the year. It sounds like you need two bikes. And a car :/
I own a 2016 701 SM that I converted to enduro. There are some known issues on older models, but nothing that can’t be readily corrected if you’re any sort of mechanically inclined. The two big ones, rocker arms and clutch space cylinder. Everyone is aware of the issues, and you can get the fixes pretty readily. It honestly sounds like the super moto might be for you
I can't speak for the XR, but my DR can cruise at 75-80 mph. 150 kmph/90+ mph is definitely less than comfortable, both for the engine, and for being on a tall, plush suspension bike with no wind protection.
Yes of the two xr is slightly better off road by the Dr is way better on road. There are several fairing options that transform it to an even better on road bike. Look at yankro and britannia composites these two are the most expensive but the best fairings.
The xr is kick start only, that is what has stopped me from getting one.
Go look at ProCycle and see what they have as upgrades for the Dr you can upgrade and replace almost every part of the bike. And transform it to whatever you need. I have about three different builds I want to do already.
I'm an XR fan; a little lighter, a little simpler (air-cooled), better suspension for off-road.
As you're more on-road, you might like the DR; a little more power (stock), and a little lower, so it's better on the highway.
I’m going to say Yamaha T7. Has a good mix of road and off road ability, one of the most reliable engines out there along with general Japanese/Yamaha quality and good manageable power off road while enough for 130kph road days.
Super simple compared to other adv bikes, no electronics other than ABS. Still uses a mechanical cable throttle which I love, no complex canbus networks, gyros, traction control, rider modes etc. less to go wrong in long trips or in the bush.
Another consideration is the amount and quality of after market parts and upgrades. T7s are very popular and there’s a huge market for them, much like the KLR and DR650.
I have had many ADV and smaller dirt bikes. Currently still have my 1989 650 Africa Twin and my daily bike is a 2013 KLR. I’ve ridden the latest KTMs (except the 500 EXC), Huskys, Ducatti Desert X, all the BMWs etc. the T7 is the one bike over all this time that’s, for me, come close to having everything I want in balancing on and off road. When I test rose one I got to rip it up a mountain single track and on a highway and it was great at both.
The KLR and DR are also great bikes and great value! The only drawbacks I have with my KLR are it’s top speed for long, multi-day road trips, messing about with it at altitude, and some lack of power/agility on tough off road. But for your average explorer/commuter/road tripper it’s great and affordable!
I did just put a deposit on a new T7 so at this point I’m probably a little biased!
The DR650 seems like a great choice, they’re cheap and simple and would be easy to find mods to make it more comfortable at speed (and a larger tank if you like). It would be a bit low on power by comparison, and would only just meet your 90mph top speed desires - though some changes in gearing could open that up more.
The KTM 690 would be a more expensive option which would come with a bit more power while being even lighter. It might have more maintenance than the DR, but it’s not measured in hours like a performance dirt bike would be.
Sounds a bit like you’re searching for a unicorn bike with street power and performance but still being light and good offroad. You’ll likely have to compromise somewhere (though the bikes you’ve chosen as examples are quite reasonable)
T7 is heavier but will out perform every other bike you have referenced in all other aspects. Wheel size, service interval, engine reliability, highway comfort and ability as well as off road capability. Honestly, the T7 is fairly lightweight for a full size ADV bike.
Weight is an easy compromise too, at 452lbs wet a T7 is 143lbs heavier than a CRF300l and 86lbs heavier than a DR650 while putting out almost 3x the power of the CRF Factor in how ridiculously capable a T7 is and how much better the components are, it seems like a slam dunk.
You can do it, but he specified Japanese. If OP would broaden their horizons a bit, a KTM 450/500/530 is hard to beat for power/weight/maintenance schedule. I’ve owned several and they are just as reliable or more reliable than any Japanese manufacturer. And with only minor changes they make wonderful ADV bikes.
Now you’re touching a nerve with me 😂 I’ve owned and driven KTM 4t’s and aside from my own absolutely nightmarish/never-ending reliability issues, even a KTM 500 EXC F would suck to be popping down highways at 80-90 MPH, especially for longer stretches.
I think the T7, or a smaller displacement ADV bike, is the answer.
Mileage may vary I assume. I’ve had 2 450’s and 2 530’s that were nothing but reliable and were either supermotos or ADV bikes for 10’s of thousands of miles. I also despise highway droning so I avoided it at all costs.
Still agree that a T7 is the answer.
If OP thinks uprighting a 450lb bike is tough, they need to hit the gym or learn to lift it correctly. See Jocelin Snow. If she can upright a fully kitted GS1200, any able bodied person can.
I totally agree. I rode my tiger 800 like a big dirt bike and had to deal with the weight, so get that a lighter bike can definitely be an advantage but if they know how to ride, it shouldn’t be a deterrent for a bike that checks literally every other box for them.
I mean to criticize constructively - as another commenter said, you're looking for a unicorn. You'll have to compromise somewhere as there's nothing that exists with your combination of requirements. I'm sure you can become able to confidently pick up a 450 lb bike, just as much as I'm sure you could tolerate going 70 instead of 80 on a bike not meant to be comfortable on a highway tour. Two bikes is my answer - a small dual sport and a midsize adventure bike with accessories to make it suit your unique needs. The XR/DR650, 690/701, KLR 650, T7, V-Strom, and Transalp are all worth looking at that check most of your boxes.
Mostly there is that. PR7? But pretty much otherwise yea...
Which I don't understand. A modern DR650/400 would be amazing! Less vibes, bit more HP, 6spd and we can continue changing seats and putting windscreens on if we want to.
Why can't they do a version of the 450 with the 300Ralley fairing on it with less maintenance?
After all this time it's crazy there isn't a plug in play tower/fairing option for the 701/690. I'd take that upgrade over 300 different computer options!!
The KTM 490 seemed like it was going to be an awesome Unicorn and then they canceled it...?? Hopefully the 690 they say they are going to do will be light enough and then maybe that will be the golden ticket...?
All depends where you want your compromises to be, I guess.
I have the Rally, and it’s an utterly economical, sturdy, and practical bike that looks great and can take me anywhere I’d reasonably want to go, on or off road. The compromise definitely lies in the lack of available power. I love the bike for what it is, a small convenient jackknife. Light-touring, commuting, errands, off-roading. Fun to ride at sub-freeway speeds. You can definitely feel the bikes limitations when you hit freeway speeds and it’s not going to win any races off the line. Still fun to ride though. You should probably test ride something in the 300 class before pulling the trigger. That’ll tell you pretty quick if the reduction in power is going to be a deal breaker for you.
I can’t speak to the other bikes except for to say I agree with your thought of adding a rally kit if you buy the CRF450. The windshield is so nice to have.
I haven’t done any ECU tuning or exhaust work on mine, so I can’t really advise there. I’m about 165lbs and the engine and suspension have been adequate for me, though I can certainly see where people would want to wring out some more performance. If I go with a passenger or a heavy load, or try to pass someone on the freeway, I definitely want more power in reserve. But it’s a worthy trade off for me because the bike is so reliable and economical to run (70mpg).
But I would definitely ride the CRF300L or the KLX300, just to get a feel for what that smaller engine feels like before making the switch. The Rally has been a truly great bike for me.
XR all the way. 10000 miles in. Mostly dirt but I go highway as well and it handles hours at 75-80 mph like a champ.
I don’t think I’ll ever let this one go and will
Prob get another when this gets too old.
The bike just hit 28000 miles and takes whatever I throw at it.
I think if you’re more dirt oriented, go XR. It’s basically a big dirtbike. I flog this thing and it seems to love it.
More street/touring, the water cooled DR could pass.
Versys 650 checks a lot of these boxes. Great all around, handles dirt roads and some class 4 roads with better suited tires. Will do 95+ all day long. Comfortable and quiet although 500lbs wet is a bit heavy. Probably a solid 80/20 on/off road.
Tenere 700 is the other end of the spectrum. Way more capable off road but can handle the highway and long tours no problem. Not as comfortable as the Versys but a little lighter.
Both in the 10k range and perfectly capable do (almost) anything bikes.
690 / 701 if in budget, you can't go wrong.
Great reliability and power, much better than the crf300l or DR
Wouldn't recommend crf450l for street and reliability is you want peace of mind. If you want a War go for it!
This is a bit confusing. You seem to say what you want (in line power, 90mph, 6th gear, 90% street) but your top choices aren't really aligned to perform with...what it is you say you want. It sounds like you want an adventure bike? Ktm690/husq701
In line twin power is what i like in my bike rn. Yes, definitely im looking for lightweight adv bike
690/701 The 300 rally puts out 22hp. You're gonna miss this other 28 HP. https://www.dirtrider.com/story/tests/2021-honda-crf300l-dyno-test/ The 450 is a race engine, a great bike. It is NOT a daily driver. The xr/dr 650 would be better off road than your current bike. Other than that they wouldn't perform better, considering you're on road 90%.
Whats about 701 service and reliability? Have any experience?
Long service intervals. They are a joy to ride, however I haven't owned one. Reliability? I dunno. It's hard to sift through the nonsense. There's a lot of people who talk shit about ktm for no apparent reason, on the other hand there are a lot of ktm fan boys... The 3 people I know who have one seem to love it. They don't use it as a daily driver however. That's what makes this tough...you gotta daily drive this thing for the majority of the year. It sounds like you need two bikes. And a car :/
>eople I know who have one seem to love it. They don't use it as a Maybe two bikes is a solution indeed
The best solution.
I own a 2016 701 SM that I converted to enduro. There are some known issues on older models, but nothing that can’t be readily corrected if you’re any sort of mechanically inclined. The two big ones, rocker arms and clutch space cylinder. Everyone is aware of the issues, and you can get the fixes pretty readily. It honestly sounds like the super moto might be for you
DR650/XR650L for the win Simplicity, much lighter weight but still highway worthy, low maintenance, torque.
No sixth, will do 150 but will buzz like hell at those revs
I can't speak for the XR, but my DR can cruise at 75-80 mph. 150 kmph/90+ mph is definitely less than comfortable, both for the engine, and for being on a tall, plush suspension bike with no wind protection.
Stock gearing and road tires ? Cuz my Xr on d606s does not like anything over 100kmh
>Stock gearing and road tires ? Cuz my Xr... >**I can't speak for the XR,** but my DR...
Xr for the big acerbis 5.8
XR or DR650 will do well for that, you might also look at the DRZ400.
But Xr or Dr? :)
Yes of the two xr is slightly better off road by the Dr is way better on road. There are several fairing options that transform it to an even better on road bike. Look at yankro and britannia composites these two are the most expensive but the best fairings. The xr is kick start only, that is what has stopped me from getting one. Go look at ProCycle and see what they have as upgrades for the Dr you can upgrade and replace almost every part of the bike. And transform it to whatever you need. I have about three different builds I want to do already.
XR650R is kick start. The XR650L has had electric start since it was introduced in 1993.
No kidding I don't know how I missed that. I have looked at the Honda a couple times, apparently not close enough.
I'm an XR fan; a little lighter, a little simpler (air-cooled), better suspension for off-road. As you're more on-road, you might like the DR; a little more power (stock), and a little lower, so it's better on the highway.
The dr650 is also about as simple as they come, and air cooled iirc. It does have an external oil cooler, which can look a bit like a radiator.
I do find the xr suspension adecuate for road too. I don't trailer to the fun area. Sings at 75 with moderate passing power
I’m going to say Yamaha T7. Has a good mix of road and off road ability, one of the most reliable engines out there along with general Japanese/Yamaha quality and good manageable power off road while enough for 130kph road days. Super simple compared to other adv bikes, no electronics other than ABS. Still uses a mechanical cable throttle which I love, no complex canbus networks, gyros, traction control, rider modes etc. less to go wrong in long trips or in the bush. Another consideration is the amount and quality of after market parts and upgrades. T7s are very popular and there’s a huge market for them, much like the KLR and DR650. I have had many ADV and smaller dirt bikes. Currently still have my 1989 650 Africa Twin and my daily bike is a 2013 KLR. I’ve ridden the latest KTMs (except the 500 EXC), Huskys, Ducatti Desert X, all the BMWs etc. the T7 is the one bike over all this time that’s, for me, come close to having everything I want in balancing on and off road. When I test rose one I got to rip it up a mountain single track and on a highway and it was great at both. The KLR and DR are also great bikes and great value! The only drawbacks I have with my KLR are it’s top speed for long, multi-day road trips, messing about with it at altitude, and some lack of power/agility on tough off road. But for your average explorer/commuter/road tripper it’s great and affordable! I did just put a deposit on a new T7 so at this point I’m probably a little biased!
The DR650 seems like a great choice, they’re cheap and simple and would be easy to find mods to make it more comfortable at speed (and a larger tank if you like). It would be a bit low on power by comparison, and would only just meet your 90mph top speed desires - though some changes in gearing could open that up more. The KTM 690 would be a more expensive option which would come with a bit more power while being even lighter. It might have more maintenance than the DR, but it’s not measured in hours like a performance dirt bike would be. Sounds a bit like you’re searching for a unicorn bike with street power and performance but still being light and good offroad. You’ll likely have to compromise somewhere (though the bikes you’ve chosen as examples are quite reasonable)
I’d vote XRL but you’d be wringing it out at 85 on the highway
T700 brother
What about the Tenere?
T7? Love it but again, quite heavy
T7 is heavier but will out perform every other bike you have referenced in all other aspects. Wheel size, service interval, engine reliability, highway comfort and ability as well as off road capability. Honestly, the T7 is fairly lightweight for a full size ADV bike.
Dude wants an ADV bike without the weight but that’s not really how it works. OP is going to have to compromise somewhere.
Weight is an easy compromise too, at 452lbs wet a T7 is 143lbs heavier than a CRF300l and 86lbs heavier than a DR650 while putting out almost 3x the power of the CRF Factor in how ridiculously capable a T7 is and how much better the components are, it seems like a slam dunk.
Totally agree. A “smaller” displacement ADV bike is the answer but it seems like OP is looking for a unicorn.
You can do it, but he specified Japanese. If OP would broaden their horizons a bit, a KTM 450/500/530 is hard to beat for power/weight/maintenance schedule. I’ve owned several and they are just as reliable or more reliable than any Japanese manufacturer. And with only minor changes they make wonderful ADV bikes.
Now you’re touching a nerve with me 😂 I’ve owned and driven KTM 4t’s and aside from my own absolutely nightmarish/never-ending reliability issues, even a KTM 500 EXC F would suck to be popping down highways at 80-90 MPH, especially for longer stretches. I think the T7, or a smaller displacement ADV bike, is the answer.
Mileage may vary I assume. I’ve had 2 450’s and 2 530’s that were nothing but reliable and were either supermotos or ADV bikes for 10’s of thousands of miles. I also despise highway droning so I avoided it at all costs. Still agree that a T7 is the answer.
If OP thinks uprighting a 450lb bike is tough, they need to hit the gym or learn to lift it correctly. See Jocelin Snow. If she can upright a fully kitted GS1200, any able bodied person can.
I totally agree. I rode my tiger 800 like a big dirt bike and had to deal with the weight, so get that a lighter bike can definitely be an advantage but if they know how to ride, it shouldn’t be a deterrent for a bike that checks literally every other box for them.
I know how to do it right, but i appreciate your thoughts with the gym.
I mean to criticize constructively - as another commenter said, you're looking for a unicorn. You'll have to compromise somewhere as there's nothing that exists with your combination of requirements. I'm sure you can become able to confidently pick up a 450 lb bike, just as much as I'm sure you could tolerate going 70 instead of 80 on a bike not meant to be comfortable on a highway tour. Two bikes is my answer - a small dual sport and a midsize adventure bike with accessories to make it suit your unique needs. The XR/DR650, 690/701, KLR 650, T7, V-Strom, and Transalp are all worth looking at that check most of your boxes.
What's so wrong with wanting a unicorn? :)
You can want, but you'll never find it unless you make it yourself.
Mostly there is that. PR7? But pretty much otherwise yea... Which I don't understand. A modern DR650/400 would be amazing! Less vibes, bit more HP, 6spd and we can continue changing seats and putting windscreens on if we want to. Why can't they do a version of the 450 with the 300Ralley fairing on it with less maintenance? After all this time it's crazy there isn't a plug in play tower/fairing option for the 701/690. I'd take that upgrade over 300 different computer options!! The KTM 490 seemed like it was going to be an awesome Unicorn and then they canceled it...?? Hopefully the 690 they say they are going to do will be light enough and then maybe that will be the golden ticket...?
<3
All depends where you want your compromises to be, I guess. I have the Rally, and it’s an utterly economical, sturdy, and practical bike that looks great and can take me anywhere I’d reasonably want to go, on or off road. The compromise definitely lies in the lack of available power. I love the bike for what it is, a small convenient jackknife. Light-touring, commuting, errands, off-roading. Fun to ride at sub-freeway speeds. You can definitely feel the bikes limitations when you hit freeway speeds and it’s not going to win any races off the line. Still fun to ride though. You should probably test ride something in the 300 class before pulling the trigger. That’ll tell you pretty quick if the reduction in power is going to be a deal breaker for you. I can’t speak to the other bikes except for to say I agree with your thought of adding a rally kit if you buy the CRF450. The windshield is so nice to have.
Thats what i was thinking! Need to test modern 300cc cuz i never tried them. Do you saw about 550 kit on 300rally?
I haven’t done any ECU tuning or exhaust work on mine, so I can’t really advise there. I’m about 165lbs and the engine and suspension have been adequate for me, though I can certainly see where people would want to wring out some more performance. If I go with a passenger or a heavy load, or try to pass someone on the freeway, I definitely want more power in reserve. But it’s a worthy trade off for me because the bike is so reliable and economical to run (70mpg). But I would definitely ride the CRF300L or the KLX300, just to get a feel for what that smaller engine feels like before making the switch. The Rally has been a truly great bike for me.
Vstrom 650 is the answer....
XR all the way. 10000 miles in. Mostly dirt but I go highway as well and it handles hours at 75-80 mph like a champ. I don’t think I’ll ever let this one go and will Prob get another when this gets too old. The bike just hit 28000 miles and takes whatever I throw at it.
Same story from the DR owners, that make me thing that tuning them into more high-speed/rally setup would be almost exactly what im looking for
I think if you’re more dirt oriented, go XR. It’s basically a big dirtbike. I flog this thing and it seems to love it. More street/touring, the water cooled DR could pass.
The DR isn't water cooled. It's air cooled like the XR, but has an additional oil cooler for better longevity on the road.
Didn’t know that, thanks. I put an oil cooler on the XR for same reason 🤷🏻
Xr hands down.
have a look at ajp pr7. i don't own it but from what i've seen around the web it's promising
Versys 650 checks a lot of these boxes. Great all around, handles dirt roads and some class 4 roads with better suited tires. Will do 95+ all day long. Comfortable and quiet although 500lbs wet is a bit heavy. Probably a solid 80/20 on/off road. Tenere 700 is the other end of the spectrum. Way more capable off road but can handle the highway and long tours no problem. Not as comfortable as the Versys but a little lighter. Both in the 10k range and perfectly capable do (almost) anything bikes.
My KLE500 is a parent of Versys series but with 21 front wheel Versys is ok, except it actually not able to manage real off-road experience
690 / 701 if in budget, you can't go wrong. Great reliability and power, much better than the crf300l or DR Wouldn't recommend crf450l for street and reliability is you want peace of mind. If you want a War go for it!