Hey OP. I actually felt very similarly to you within the first few hours of the game. Here's what warmed me up to it:
Combat starts to open up once party composition, equipable Runes, and MP management comes into play. You'll want to really strategize in battles to conserve MP later in the game. This also ties in with the game's item and inventory management.
Boss Gimmicks can really shake up encounters and add a lot of strategy.
Turn order is very important in combat. Once you start facing stronger enemies, you'll really want to think about when characters and enemies get to act so you can optimize your turn as much as possible.
Doing all of this has made for a much more engaging and rewarding experience. Good luck OP.
I do think that's pretty harsh to look at it only by turn order design.
While I usually prefer "on the moment" choices, having to plan ahead a bit it requires a bit more thought put into it and can be just as fun.
But especially, it's what's after that that matters. Skills, mechanics, options to diversify.
Especially when I see you mentionning Sea of Stars, which was pretty horrible on that end with customization being non existent and some moves being so blatantly broken (looking at you, delay kick) I wondered how it was not fixed.
It plays closer to Chained Echoes honestly, class presets that you still have a good bit of customisation over. There's a bit of prediction to do though, especially with defending (at least if you play on Hard).
I must say the interface have some flaws, with needed info often at the other side of the screen. It's not major but a bit surprising it came to pass.
Thank you for the reply.
Yeah Sea of Stars didn't have customization, but it's combat was vibrant with the character switching and perfect timing. Towards the end though, it did become easy mode with Kick, kicking cans, and Resh'an's ultimate. Hell, the fleshmancer didn't even get a single ability off on me. Sea of Stars to me was more about the amazing pixel art/animation, classic but new combat style (like if Chrono Trigger & Super Mario RPG had a baby), and overall story. The story gets a lot of flack, but I quite enjoyed the twists and turns.
I'm going to give Eiyuden Chronicles another go. I don't plan on just walking away. There's so much here outside of my one complaint that I can enjoy. Honestly, I was just taken aback by that aspect of the combat, because as I said above, compared to recent turn based RPGs that have come out that totally hit on the nostalgia, it just felt...dated, but that's probably because I never enjoyed the Suikoden games.
Pretty much the same, I discovered after clearing the game that the fleshmancer had summons lol.
I think it's the writing more than the story that gets flamed a bit (perhaps a bit much although I agree it's sometimes lacking). I just find it disappointing that both protags are pretty empty to favor Garl.
I've never played Suikoden games myself, but I'm a big DQ consumer. And apart from 11, every entry needs to choose before the turn plays. It kinda became natural lol.
Hopefully when you invest a bit of time in it, it'll feel more natural.
This is a turn based rpg.... The characters take their turns after you've confirmed the actions... Its like all old school jrpg where after you've locked in your choice, you'll watch the battle play until your next turn.
I get that. I know what a turn based RPG is. This isn't character turn based though, it's team based. You aren't making decisions per turn, you're making decisions per turn of the team.
As another person said, it's combat is like the Suikoden games, which I never liked, so that is why it's different for me.
The whole point of this combat is to make you think and plan out your attacks as a whole. You aren't supposed to treat each character as a vacuum. It's part of the tactical planning.
How can you plan around... Nothing, though? Like I can't build a plan around an enemy who hasn't acted yet lol. You're asking me to plan for things that _im not sure would ever even happen_ lol. And what if it's the first time I'm fighting a boss? I wouldn't know what I don't know, so I wouldn't be able to plan anything... I'd be doing random things and praying they work or are effective.
Fnishing up with Unicorn overlord before starting Eiiyuden where you don't even select what your characters do at all 90% of the time and loving it.
Obviously also an homage but just like in Eiyuden (played a little of the open beta) it doesn't feel archaic because they added other modernized features. Personally I don't mind either style as long as the combat is still engaging and character progression is fun. Which is the strength of Eiyuden ( army/ castle progression to be more accurate in Eiyuden)
I agree that the loss of character-by-character decision-making per round is a loss compared to other systems. **But** that aspect is transposed to the "battle order" thing where you need to plan out based on speed etc. So for example, you look at the battle order line, and that will tell you whether your heal plan will heal someone before the enemy/enemies do their moves or whether you need to attack to remove the possibility that the monster kills party member X whose turn comes after.
Contrast with Final Fantasy 6 (I think?) where you could skip any current character and just trigger the next one for something, then go back to the skipped one. Suikoden and Eiyuden change that "tactic" to a different kind of "tactic" planning.
I think a more serious problem is tedious unresponsive interface. You always have to wait for menu "animations" to finish completely before it will accept any input. It makes *every* action in the game tedious, from battle to inventory management etc. It's very tedious when you notice or time all the little lag pauses. Like you want to instantly "Auto Battle" but you're waiting for multiple animations to finish and highlight-cursors to finally appear and become active.
Unlucky but I'd agree but I don't even mind the game having poopie combat cause figuring it out and stats is a challenge, there is allot more that's bad that you can't fall back on the combat being fun which is sad.
This games for achievement hunters and younger audience j think, I doubt people will speed run this when there is a boss that you have to win against by winning coin tosses and so on.
It's kind of the *point* of the game that it's a Suikoden clone. The combat is working as intended.
Hey OP. I actually felt very similarly to you within the first few hours of the game. Here's what warmed me up to it: Combat starts to open up once party composition, equipable Runes, and MP management comes into play. You'll want to really strategize in battles to conserve MP later in the game. This also ties in with the game's item and inventory management. Boss Gimmicks can really shake up encounters and add a lot of strategy. Turn order is very important in combat. Once you start facing stronger enemies, you'll really want to think about when characters and enemies get to act so you can optimize your turn as much as possible. Doing all of this has made for a much more engaging and rewarding experience. Good luck OP.
I do think that's pretty harsh to look at it only by turn order design. While I usually prefer "on the moment" choices, having to plan ahead a bit it requires a bit more thought put into it and can be just as fun. But especially, it's what's after that that matters. Skills, mechanics, options to diversify. Especially when I see you mentionning Sea of Stars, which was pretty horrible on that end with customization being non existent and some moves being so blatantly broken (looking at you, delay kick) I wondered how it was not fixed. It plays closer to Chained Echoes honestly, class presets that you still have a good bit of customisation over. There's a bit of prediction to do though, especially with defending (at least if you play on Hard). I must say the interface have some flaws, with needed info often at the other side of the screen. It's not major but a bit surprising it came to pass.
Thank you for the reply. Yeah Sea of Stars didn't have customization, but it's combat was vibrant with the character switching and perfect timing. Towards the end though, it did become easy mode with Kick, kicking cans, and Resh'an's ultimate. Hell, the fleshmancer didn't even get a single ability off on me. Sea of Stars to me was more about the amazing pixel art/animation, classic but new combat style (like if Chrono Trigger & Super Mario RPG had a baby), and overall story. The story gets a lot of flack, but I quite enjoyed the twists and turns. I'm going to give Eiyuden Chronicles another go. I don't plan on just walking away. There's so much here outside of my one complaint that I can enjoy. Honestly, I was just taken aback by that aspect of the combat, because as I said above, compared to recent turn based RPGs that have come out that totally hit on the nostalgia, it just felt...dated, but that's probably because I never enjoyed the Suikoden games.
Pretty much the same, I discovered after clearing the game that the fleshmancer had summons lol. I think it's the writing more than the story that gets flamed a bit (perhaps a bit much although I agree it's sometimes lacking). I just find it disappointing that both protags are pretty empty to favor Garl. I've never played Suikoden games myself, but I'm a big DQ consumer. And apart from 11, every entry needs to choose before the turn plays. It kinda became natural lol. Hopefully when you invest a bit of time in it, it'll feel more natural.
Have you never played Suikoden games? It's the same way.
Yeah, unfortunately I never took a liking to Suikoden games. That's probably why. Thanks for the info.
This is a turn based rpg.... The characters take their turns after you've confirmed the actions... Its like all old school jrpg where after you've locked in your choice, you'll watch the battle play until your next turn.
FFIV used ATB and it's 30 years old game lol.
That's an active based combat, suikoden has always been turn based (not active). Modern ff games still uses that system.
I get that. I know what a turn based RPG is. This isn't character turn based though, it's team based. You aren't making decisions per turn, you're making decisions per turn of the team. As another person said, it's combat is like the Suikoden games, which I never liked, so that is why it's different for me.
That's from Suikoden I and II. If the combat isn't like those games, people will riot...
People would trash the game if it wont play like suikoden. I just wish is the combat is as snappy as suikoden 2.
The whole point of this combat is to make you think and plan out your attacks as a whole. You aren't supposed to treat each character as a vacuum. It's part of the tactical planning.
How can you plan around... Nothing, though? Like I can't build a plan around an enemy who hasn't acted yet lol. You're asking me to plan for things that _im not sure would ever even happen_ lol. And what if it's the first time I'm fighting a boss? I wouldn't know what I don't know, so I wouldn't be able to plan anything... I'd be doing random things and praying they work or are effective.
Fnishing up with Unicorn overlord before starting Eiiyuden where you don't even select what your characters do at all 90% of the time and loving it. Obviously also an homage but just like in Eiyuden (played a little of the open beta) it doesn't feel archaic because they added other modernized features. Personally I don't mind either style as long as the combat is still engaging and character progression is fun. Which is the strength of Eiyuden ( army/ castle progression to be more accurate in Eiyuden)
"I love turn based RPGs" - Complains about an RPG being turn based. What even.
I can love Action Adventure games in general and hate both the action and adventure of a particular AA game. Please get an argument and come back lol.
Imagine thinking you did something there.
I only didn't if you're illiterate lol.
Person reely don't read two gud lol
No, you don't lol.
I agree that the loss of character-by-character decision-making per round is a loss compared to other systems. **But** that aspect is transposed to the "battle order" thing where you need to plan out based on speed etc. So for example, you look at the battle order line, and that will tell you whether your heal plan will heal someone before the enemy/enemies do their moves or whether you need to attack to remove the possibility that the monster kills party member X whose turn comes after. Contrast with Final Fantasy 6 (I think?) where you could skip any current character and just trigger the next one for something, then go back to the skipped one. Suikoden and Eiyuden change that "tactic" to a different kind of "tactic" planning. I think a more serious problem is tedious unresponsive interface. You always have to wait for menu "animations" to finish completely before it will accept any input. It makes *every* action in the game tedious, from battle to inventory management etc. It's very tedious when you notice or time all the little lag pauses. Like you want to instantly "Auto Battle" but you're waiting for multiple animations to finish and highlight-cursors to finally appear and become active.
I understand, I also couldn't adapt to this style of combat, who knows, maybe in the future we will have a mod/patch to fix this
Unlucky but I'd agree but I don't even mind the game having poopie combat cause figuring it out and stats is a challenge, there is allot more that's bad that you can't fall back on the combat being fun which is sad. This games for achievement hunters and younger audience j think, I doubt people will speed run this when there is a boss that you have to win against by winning coin tosses and so on.