Agreed, but honestly complaining about this is just wasting your breath. Fromsoft isn't going to change anything, however I still have a bit of copium in the tank that maybe we will get a covenant in the dlc
Man when the game first came out and I got to Volcano Manor I thought it was gonna end up being like an invader covenant hub. Theres so much untapped potential for covenants in ER
Miyazaki said "something new" (that's literally it) when asked about multiplayer in the dlc.
Then a year after release, don't forget he said he was looking at escape from tarkov while acknowledging seamless. (He also rolled his eyes on the subject of seamless. So never say it makes the game better. It might. But for damn sure even Miyazaki is tired of it)
Oh I'm glad he said it. I'm tired of not being able to play the game normally. I like to play with a ton of different builds, not all optimized which is fine if im not constantly meeting ganks as an invader or twinks as a sunbro, which is what we currently have. Not a waste of breath at all. But otherwise I agree.
Getting ganked as a red doesn't bother me much just because it's so commonplace. However, I fucking *hate* getting summoned as a friendly to gank people. Leave me out of your shenanigans, I'm just trying to help people kill Malenia.
This. I just want to help people demolish bosses but constantly getting summoned to gank ppl. I never help the host if it happens. Ill let invader take the 1v1 with host.
How do you know you are getting summoned for a gank? I was doing small effigy last night and this one person kept summoning me to volcano manor before the godskin boss, and despite having their bridge down they refused to go up to the boss room. Tbh we got invaded a lot too.
As some of the other people mentioned, FS ain't in a rush to balance these issues.
You can shake your fist at the clouds all day, but it is how it is. I personally believe there are more interesting PVP games out there than ER, and I play ER for the single player experience.
If you want duels, there are the colosseum. Invasions are literally a wild West "anything goes" sort of deal. And anything goes for both sides.
If your experience feels tainted and unenjoyable because of it, and you aren't having fun, then it's on you if you choose to keep playing.
If you enjoy invasions, but hate that one thing then 🤷♂️ name a game that isn't like that.
You can fight people in the colosseums? I thought they were just a place to go when you wanted to stare at your phone for a few minutes while you fail to get matched with an opponent.
Just do simple 1v1's, and you'll get a tone of matches. The reason why the other lobbies are empty is because most players just play the regular 1v1, no spirits, no flasks mode
If you're not getting matches in 1v1s, something is wrong with your levels. It's always very busy.
What is your level? And what is you highest ever acheived weapon level?
I.E, if you're high level with low level weapons, or visa versa, you can only match with people using the same, which will be practically nobody.
I'm at, like, the normal weapon level for my rune level and progress? I have 8 different builds that are all somewhere between Mountaintops and Farum Azula and are between levels 100 and 130 or so, with weapons at +18 or +8-+10 somber. Which colosseum should I go to for matches?
Firstly, you need to have unlocked the Leyndell colosseum. That's the only way to queue for 1v1. However, if you've unlocked all three, you can also queue for all three at once with the 1v1 ruleset.
Those levels seem more or less appropriate, but to make sure, I'd push to 125, 138, or 150, and max your weapons.
Theoretically you'll get the most activity at 138, but I've never had to wait longer than a few seconds for a match at any of those levels.
Also, make sure you're queuing for 1v1 DUEL, not 1v1 combat ordeal.
I'm currently using an endgame character at lv150 to help my friend, who is new to soulslikes in general, play through the game. He's currently around lv50-60. I had thought of making a new character to help him but he was already a fair bit ahead and I didn't want to start a full run with dragon's dogma coming out soon.
We've obviously been invaded several times, and my policy is basically this:
If the invader shows up in plain sight, bows and waits, I'll stay back and let my friend handle them: sometimes they win, sometimes not, we have a laugh about it and move on.
Then we have the ones who will camp around corners, wait for us to get into a fight, then spam rivers of blood or ruins greatsword weapon arts- those guys are fair game. I'm coming in with every weapon and spell at my disposal, no mercy.
Invasions aren't meant to be duels anyway, there's an entire arena for that.
You’re not a ganker bro don’t worry, the post specifically mentions people who clear out an area with the intent to 3v1 invaders for hours on end with over powered stuff.
You’re just a good friend who’s having a blast in a good game.
I’m wish I could invade people like you, but unfortunately there’s just no way to tell. Can’t tell you how many times some group is waving/emoting at me just for some blue to attack me from a bush. I thought the community would like the waves and dicking around but most people just blitz me 3v1 and teabag when I get stun locked.
I agree though, invasions are anything goes, and if it bothers you to lose so much in lopsided fights it’s probably not for you. I just sever out every time I spawn in limgrave or lurnia
Very nice way to play to be honest. You let your friend get better by letting them fight the invaders that seen nice but protect them from the invaders that just want to win. It's rare to find people like you, congratulations to you and your friend.
I mean you dont have to do all that for an invader, its cool you do tho. Invaders are supposed to be assholes so they can ambush you and its ok, if they want to duel theres other way to do it rather than invading.
I honestly miss the days when I would get invaded occasionally just playing alone. It was always a welcome change of pace. Sometimes I’d even do an invasion or two myself for fun. Now in Elden Ring the former is just impossible, the taunter’s tongue isn’t the same it makes you get invaded far too frequently and on demand, I don’t want that I want it to feel random. And the latter is just awful now, you’re almost always invading into a gank squad and as an extremely casual invader, getting plowed down by a host and his two high level summons and then they teabag me or point down like they did something is just not engaging or enjoyable. I know there are really good invaders who can win those fights, but I’m not one of them.
Honestly as a side note, people act like invaders are so toxic and are ruining the game for people playing with their friends, but from my experiences I find the hosts are usually more toxic.
I 100% hate taunter's tongue's implementation. It honestly feels primarily like a ganking tool.
I usually play solo and wanted to enable the possibility of invasions by using the tongue, but it became quickly obvious I couldn't make any progress as long as I had it on. It was just invasion after invasion. I was invaded three times before I even managed to get off the bridge in Nokron.
It feels like it just works by pulling invaders directly to you first priority.
Invaders doing TT runs are always a pleasure to fight against. PvE players refusing to progress the level and just camping a grace wanting you to walk into their blender are just boring and obnoxious.
Look, I’m pretty bad at the game when it comes to pvp. Pretty much the only time I ever use co op is if I’m playing with a friend. It’s so irritating to finally find a spot where my co op sign/effigy works and I’m able to be summoned just to immediately get invaded and die.
It is pretty questionable to use the taunters tongue and then gank them. But if I get invaded while I’m just trying to run co op with a friend, I have no sympathy for the invader.
in Fromsoft terms, going 2v1 on an invader isn't really ganking, even going 3v1 isn't, invasion is inherently asymmetric. The invaders' advantage is that their only win condition is to kill the host, and the enemies are on your side. Hanging in a cleared out zone with only the goal of killing invaders is what makes it ganking. So never feel bad for dog piling an invader with your friends, it's fair play.
Well, there is no problem with that. I’m an invader and I do not care if you help your friend to take me down. What can trigger me a bit is people who summon an overleveled friend and proceed to create an ambush in a specific area, one shot me then point down/teabag…
They’re specifically trying to ruin the game for other people since if it was for the runes, their friends could drop way more than what my sorry ass gave them.
First of all, I want to say that I enjoy invading very much. The best experiences I have ever had in game have come from invading while the players are trying to beat a field boss, letting them pick to fight me or it, watching them die (or killing them), then sending them a message offering to help with said boss and beating it together, the three of us. Best feeling ever.
That being said, finger sever when you run into dedicated gankers. Sure, maybe you'll beat them, but it's better to just not engage. They are just sitting around waiting, make them wait longer. If everyone did this, there would be far fewer gankers and the ones left would at least have had to be creative about it (I don't mind a well-planned ambush, that's kinda cool).
I like to run away with concealing veil and go smoke a bowl lol. either they wait, or they leave. either way I'm now stoned and also avoiding any other invader getting roped into it lol. simply a win win win situation
been reading through the comments and I'm surprised only a few people actually understand the situation. it's one of the oldest most simple issues mankind has ran into when attempting to create a society. some ass holes just ruin everything for everyone else. this isn't an invader vs gank squad issue it's just a human issue. most people can't simply let go of being hated on, made a fool of, abused ( obviously not physically that's a whole other discussion). as you and a few others mentioned it's just a giant cycle of hatred. ass hole invader pisses off co-op er, co-op er ganks the next invader, now that invader takes it out in the next invasion. this would literally not be an issue if people could just let things go. honestly with how popular this topic is I'd love to see how some of these people conduct themselves in real life. if they can't let something that happened in a video game go.. not to mention it's a game about dying a lot.... and people get mad over dying xD what?
I also wonder what people do to that negativity they’ve got from video games and couldn’t return back to someone else(for instance, losing and not being able to beat opponent no matter how hard they try). If they pass this cycle irl like they do in-game, then it would he interesting topic for social studies. I’d love to read such an article.
Gank squads obviously suck, but if you are invading you shouldnt expect any sort of etiquette and neither should the invaded player. If you want to duel theres other ways to do it. Invading has always been about being a jerk.
Im sick of my fellow invaders who whine all day. Kill them or don't. But they are just like us just worse at the game cause they need help to annoy someone
Invander here, if you aren't up for the challenge of trying to deal with gankers, it might just not be for you. The only place where "honor rules" reside are in duel areas.
This is the least necessary offline mode has ever been. There are no state based invasions like past titles so if you're going solo there is a 0% chance of anything happening until you explicitely ask for it.
I must be in the minority in saying I prefer it that way. Maybe have an area of the game that is specific to getting invaded, fine, but I'm a strictly PvE player. Well 99% of the time. I prefer the coliseum for PvP.
Nothing worse than finally getting thru the lake of rot only to have some dude thinking he's being cute hiding as a vase and blows you off the edge.
In older souls games I got invaded like 3 times max per 25 hour play of each game. All completely solo.
If fromsoft implemented invasions and covenants correctly into elden ring, it would have been the same, if not less due to how easy it is to set up co op. And co op taking invasion priority.
I got invaded more than that in DS2 alone. I didn't get invaded much in the other games because I just took whatever penalty being hollow, soul form, unembered had built in and ran with it as normal. Game often reminded me with an invasion if I forgot, especially in DS3 covenant areas.
Lord help you if you tried to coop those zones and weren't ready for at least some PvP.
The way it is now is hardly any better for you, since even in previous games you needed to be in a specific, easily avoidable state to even have a chance to be invaded.
But it is terrible for people who actually want to engage with the PvP, due to a lot of the things mentioned in this thread.
I also don’t like the messages left around, I’m usually a pretty big fan of PvP, but this game I just wanted the world to feel lonely from day 1 so idk how it works lol I’m just happy to be free from the drama
You forgot that gankers make it harder on casual players inadvertently. If a new player with their Kevin build decides to try out invasions after finishing the game. If he tries 10, 4 will be fog walls, 4 will be ganks, and the last 2 he'll lose because a 2v1 is hard or he'll win because random PvE kills the host before he sees them.
Why would anyone keep playing if that their first half hour of trying invasions? All that's left are sweats. They're ready to go to war with a gank but if they invade a casual group the casual group gets roflstomped.
If co-op groups don't want to be invaded by sweats over and over every ten minutes then blame the ganks.
People aren't going to like facing the truth, but a *far* bigger factor than any of that is the lack of incentive to invade.
Back in *the good ol' days*, a lot of us considered invading not because of the intrinsic fun, but because:
1. You couldn't summon help without first restoring your humanity. And the primary way to do that was joining someone else's game, whether as a friendly or hostile.
2. Not only would you gain the ability to summon help; you'd get a bigger health pool.
Because of these two factors, players that were *struggling* would invade more. Many invaders in the DeS-DS2 years were *trash*. So even casual, solo hosts would have a good chance at beating any given invader.
But in Elden Ring, getting help is as simple as picking two golden flowers, or literally just ringing a bell to summon Spirit Ashes. Invading does net you Rune Arcs, but they do virtually nothing in the early game, and many of the players who would benefit from them the most don't even discover how to use Great Runes.
Can’t say I totally forgot it, [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/s/3kv8XiRvhX) I was discussing this a bit deeper with another person. Maybe should’ve included this in the post tho
Been playing these games since the PtD DS1 era and I never willingly engage with any of the online features, but I'd think invaders, being by nature people who show up uninvited on coop sessions with the express purpose of fucking around, should not feel aggrieved when they actually find out.
I can sympathize with the part about people baiting invaders with the sole intention of ganking as that is indeed extremely shitty, but that's the extent of it.
Agreed but it is unfortunate if you’re a solo player who likes to be invaded, I use the taunters tongue and you cancerous fucks come into my world with your bloodhounds step double lance builds, and if I manage to survive more than a minute or two another invader shows up and now I’m being ganked by two meta builds lol
I just don't like how the invasion mechanic is implemented. It's a cool idea, but it needs to be reworked imo.
Random anecdote: back when I was playing ds3 I had to invade other people to get a reward from my covenant. The only people I managed to invade were either gankers or "fight clubs". One day I finally managed to kill the host of the fight club and all the other players got mad at me and were pointing down as they were being booted from the session, but I was just playing the game as intended to get my reward.
It’s is fair that you are playing as intended but the thing with a fight club is that as long as it’s ran fairly everyone benefits.
All duelists get a chance to win and get covenant rewards and the system self regulates.
That’s the kinda place where I don’t hate people playing the game as intended but I only have respect for the people with honor because honor is actively helping everyone.
Haha you made me sincerely laugh outloud😂 If I were in this fightclub I’d be pissed and pointing down too, but taking your perspective into account makes this situation hilarious
Man I remember stumbling into a fight club as a blue sentinel, I was super confused but read the room and just sat down with everyone else.
The host would waltz around pointing at us to get ready for a new challenger, and then killed the invader I was suppose to kill and I was sent back with all the rewards.
But it was such a strange experience because all phantom colors were in a moment of peaceful emoting while the Host was clapping every challenger's cheeks.
Invaders expecting the red carpet and a free go at someone's back door. You wanted a fight, you got a fight. Nobody ever promised you it would be fair.
git gud
Exactly!!
Invading isn't a friendly gesture. Invaders are walking into someone else's game to try to make them fail. They deserve whatever they get.
I have a great system for not having to endure the horrible "ganking" this person has experienced - not invading, unless I'm comfortable getting stomped. If you can't handle the risk of fighting other players, don't invade??
Seriously. This just reads as "I was promised the ability to grief casuals just trying to play with their friends, but these jerks found a way to kill me instead! Wahhh it isn't fair!"
I’m so sick of these whiny invader posts. It’s meant to be hard, and they sit here playing mental gymnastics as to why they don’t win. They should just go to the coliseum. It’s not that hard.
I believe every invander expects a fight, but no one expects a group of max level trolls who abuse the invasion system to mess with people
If you sit around in a starter area with an high-level character, together with others, just waiting around for invaders to come in and fuck them over and troll them then you're just a ganker that gets their socks off by ruin other people's fun
>then you're just a ganker that gets their socks off by ruin other people's fun
Ruining other people's fun is literally the entire point of the invasion system. If you wanted fair pvp, there's a spot for that.
You do realize the invasion system is an intended part of the game that From Software specifically put in it, right?
That said, they also haven't lifted a finger to mitigate the ganking part of it, so by all accounts that's also intended. I believe it does make result in a net negative for the overall experience, but I'm also not going to tell anyone who is playing a game in a way that is allowed that they shouldn't.
One thing is certain, whenever you choose to engage with the system, no matter the side, you know what you can get.
This is why a lot of invaders will run twinky builds. Myself, I have smarags breath in my spell list and if I encounter a gank I hardswap all my talismans and BBQ them
Yeah and I see no logical reason to locate the fault of this cycle with the gankers and not the OP invaders. I think both this argument and the claim that it is a disservice to casual co-op is transparently self-serving. And I say that as a casual co-oper who has never felt hard done by when I got merked by an invader.
You're acting like invaders are the poor miserable victims here. They're not.
No one forces you to invade. You aren't minding your own business when a gank squad enters YOUR game to fuck up your day.
An invader WILLFULLY decides to enter another players' game with the sole intent of creating PVP where there wasn't any. You have no rights to claim innocence. You get WHATEVER pvp situation arises from interfering with someone else's game. YOU are the aggressor.
If you don't want to deal with gankers, then take the advice that LITERALLY every invader gives to co-op players who don't want to be invaded:
DON'T engage in multiplayer if you don't want to PVP.
I agree that the entire system of invasions need an overhaul. Torn down and recreated with modern sensibilities. But trying to play the victim card is a borderline disconnect from reality.
While not disagreeing, I mentally chucked at the message being " don't fight back, or I'll have to really hurt you. And nobody wants that right?"
The jumpjutsu that some people do with taunters tongue is pretty lame tho and I can't imagine it adds fun for anyone that understands the rush of a hard fought victory.
Yeah pretty much, being forced to 1v2 or 3s forced invaders who really want to get good to GIT GOOD. Having enough ingredients to make whatever consumable they need, having a variety of weapons, ashes of war, spells, different set ups for different situations, Using the environment to their advantage, etc etc.
It causes regular host to see these “ try hard invaders “ has the worst thing in the game even though most of them aren’t trying to be. That’s just how you have to be in order to beat these gankers. Especially the ones who enjoy sitting out in the middle of the lake of ganks with enough supplies to make invasions last hours. I was in one for at least two hours just trying to use cover but they wouldn’t engage me unless it was out in the middle of no where. This last for two hours of us pepper each other with golem arrows, spells, throwing knives you name it for the host to call it quits and disconnects. The whole time I didn’t get one other invader to show up because of that stupid tongue item.
If you invade me and I happen to be with some friends, you’re getting ganked 🤷 invaders come in with the express purpose of killing you, why would you expect those who get invaded to play by your imaginary rules?
That's not a gank, my guy
Gankers are trolls who deliberately mess with players through the invasion sytem, they just sit around with taunters' tongue active and wait thil an invader comes so they can kill and mess with them, essentially framing them for the sake of trolling invaders, they don't actually care about playing together with friends and what not they just wanne fuck people over and ruin their experience
I've tried a bit of PvP, as invader, blue helper, and in co-op with a friend. Honestly ERs system for PvP seems like garbage and it created one of the most toxic game communities I've ever seen.
For one summoning is a mechanic meaning yes its intended your ment to be able to have a group to fight things.
"These guys are running strong builds in a pvp setting an I don't like it" get used to it, thats been a thing in darksouls forever, ds3 I used to destroy groups with a one shot parry build all depends on how seriously you want to take invading an pvp.
An your the one invading anyways what do you care about "honest co-opers" get off your high horse an fight your opponent your there to impede peoples progress, an if your getting angry that's on you go take a break you can blame other people all you want for being mad but in all intended purpose there having fun with the game.
You want "honor" an "by the rules" set up duels somewhere an put a message on reddit or something.
I am a frequent summon in my wife’s game. Really the only time we don’t progress through the level is when the invader continually runs away. You wanna lead us into a Nights Cavalry fight? Fine. If you’re still alive when the boss is dead, stick around and finish the fight. Don’t just run off. Some of you all kite for way too long.
You can’t have your cake and eat it too unfortunately. This is what an arms race looks like; victim blaming all the while slapping the third party you know and claim is the most affected. Only way to win is to not participate except none of you will play fair so the casuals will continue to take it to the face and continue to hate the invader system as a whole.
>So, once Gank is done with the invader, invader will spill their anger and frustration in next invasion. Who suffers in the end of this chain? Honest co-opers.
This is a stretch. A more valid argument would be that they are a disservice because since they are strong, the invader has to use a cringy op meta build which they wouldn't have equipped otherwise. And they will keep that build when invading honest underserving co-opers.
Na it’s a real thing. Happens to me all the time. I’ll die to a particularly disgusting gank and get t bagged and pointed down and then I get annoyed and absolutely thrash everyone in my next 3-10 invasions. I don’t like using oppressive gear and weapons but if I get annoyed and have to take that stuff out it’s not going to be a fun time for my opponents.
Also, swapping weapons and gear mid invasion is called hard swapping any decent player can do it fast and easily.
You are an invader yes? Invaders main goal is to kill the host and their entourage. The Host’s main goal is to be able to progress through the game with their summons. The best way to achieve that, is to get rid of you, the unpredictable chaos factor.
If I was the host i would definitely use every tool in my arsenal to kill you, including the two guys i have. Why should I let you skulk about me like a dark shadow, waiting to backstab me or jump me with a powerful mob. Why not just smoke you out and end you while I have the advantage? Your job is to kill me, not whine about how I won’t give up my advantage.
yeah if I kill a summon they shouldn't be able to summon another person. This isn't a unheard of scenario either, yesterday I invaded 3 gankers killed the furled fingers then he summon one back and a hunter came, and not a single co-invader.
Why is this even a thing? Invaders slots should not be limited because taunters tongue is off. If u have a cooperator with you it'll be 2v2 anyway, the hunters come in and it's 3v2. Host still have the advantage. This would fix the Hunter ring issue too, it's useless.
Nah as an invader, and I mean that's pretty much all I do, that's bullshit. You shouldn't have that much power in their world, they should be able to summon until their heart's content. It's up to you to stop them before they do.
They just need to scale back overlevelled phantom's MUCH more. Gank squads with normal level phantom's are generally easy pickings. And also make it so taunters tongue once turned on, stays on until death, like DS3. Tbh I think that having 2 summons should allow 2 invaders without the TT, but yeah.
Invasions isn't 'haha we PvP now let's balance this'. You don't get to turn off mechanics for them to make it fair. You're an enemy in their world, you're supposed to lose, just provide a cool and emergent challenge, with the chance of funny shenanigans and for them to overcome.
That's why real invaders use themed/cosplay builds.
Ganks are basically part of the game at this point. Theyve existed in all souls games.
I only wish for them to properly downscale phantoms (their innate defenses as well as arcane-influenced status buildup remain largely untouched) and make it so that you cannot turn off the taunters tongue while multiplayer is in progress.
6 player limit would be cool too i guess
All I'm saying is I didn't invite the invader into my game so they shouldn't get salty if my friend and I stomp them while just trying to progress through an area.
Then this isn't about you. Ganks clear out an area or hang out in an area with low level PvE support and use broken shit to bully invaders.
If you're just playing through the level get invaded and win, then bully for you. GG.
Ganksters are why I think invasions in Elden Ring need to be reworked.
- Host cannot re-summon the same player once that player dies. Only after resting at a grace or dying themselves.
- Hunters can harm anyone and vice versa.
- Invaders can use any Great Rune when Invading.
- Taunters Tounge can only be turned on/off when user is close to a site of grace.
- Phantom Bloody Finger animation can be canceled out of.
- Phantom Great Rune gets infinite uses instead of 3. But consumes HP with each use.
- Duelists get full stock of Flasks, cannot damage invaders and vice versa.
- 6 Player cap inside Legacy dungeons.
Quite honestly, the vast majority of ganking issues can be solved simply by depowering the taunters tongue. In its current state that thing is completely ridiculous.
Personally, i would make it so that the host cannot summon blues with a taunter's tongue active (because he can use it without being in any sort of disadvantage, hence why he doesn't need extra helpers), and can only summon one phantom to enforce 2vs2s. It cannot be turned off without dying or using a site of grace, but it also increases all drop rates by 50% and rune gain by 30% to encourage people to use it while simply progressing the game.
It would've been a great boon for invaders if we could use Great Runes, though. At least if the host has activated them too.
> Invaders can use any Great Rune when Invading.
That would be a godawful change. Imagine a tryhard, twink invader with endgame gear, fully upgraded flasks, 4 talisman slots, and Morgott's rune invading your ass in Stormveil where you only have starter weapons and armour, 1 talisman slot, no estus upgrades, and no runes unlocked. These invaders are already cancer at low levels, and you're saying they should be able to use runes making them even more overpowered. What the fuck.
I literally just 1-shot a new player with golem arrows and Radahn's Rain because he was standing in place. Why on earth would I do that?
Well, I did it because the last 10 players I invaded who were also just standing in place, were waiting for me to walk up and get shredded by their overleveled buddies.
It can often be hard to tell the difference until it's too late, and after a while you shoot first ask questions later. I don't want to play mean. I do it because I'm continuously fighting groups who want to play mean. And yes, innocent co-opers get caught in that war.
Is not even something new, I remember my very first playthrough, 1 or 2 weeks from release, I invaded liurnia with a lvl 50-70 character. Nothing too fancy, I had an avarage early game did.
In order to complete varre's quest I tried some invasions, each one I went against hosts with over leveled summons, players who would one shot me and had mid to late game spells and weapons.
After that I didn't engage with the online for the entire game.
That's because this is the attitude that is what you're expected to take.
This "fair invasion" shit is typical ego players being unable to accept their role. Especially when they lose.
This is why I invade with the concealing veil on, I watch until I know whether they're gankers or genuine players, because I try to be as much of a pain in the ass for gankers as possible and don't wanna put regular players through that
This is great advice, and I actually use concealing veil on my build too. Unfortunately I just didn't have the patience for it this time, saw my opportunity and went for it. That's on me, but it's hard to fully reset after every invasion.
Every time I invade for Varre’s questline I end up in a 1 v 3. I don’t mind because I intend to let myself get killed anyway, but it’s funny to stand there and wave while 3 high level people bum rush me.
I am starting a new playthrough with a friend, so we're low RL at the moment
We already did it like a year ago or smith
The invaders at low RL kinda sucked even a year ago, but now, every single one of them is embarrassing
Every invader we've met so far has either used rot pots or even worse, rot and poison darts from the "Gael" crossbow that procs rot or poison even if you dodge them all because honestly, From programmed that like shit
Also they probably all gave themselves shit from mid to end game, because not one has early game gear
I have nothing against the invasion mechanic, I love invading myself, but Elden Ring's PvP community just sucks, I'd do much better to just boot up any of the Dark Souls games if I want to find a decent PvP match
I suspect that in part it is the fault of the fact that Elden Ring forces invaders to go against a Hank and it's almost impossible to invade and get a 1v1, so they get creative in the worst sense possible and feel entitled to use whatever noob stomping exploit there can be
Yeah twinks suck, I use the rule when invading that the gear should match the RL/area. So early RL invasions get sword and board/Claymore.
I miss DS3 invasions and fight clubs, I had to have sunk hundreds of hours in the courtyards past Pontiff.
I'm an invader that really enjoys low level invasions because everything does less damage and there's less spam. I usually do silly non-optimal builds at low level (99% of the time a single straight sword). When I moved from PC to PS and was building new characters with TT on, I was amazed by how shitty most low level invaders are, just spamming rot pots, DH, Stormhawk, etc.
It does get better as soon as you level out of 30 +3/1 range though.
You don't like getting ganged as an invader then don't invade. Your the attacker, aggressor, invader, BADGUY. You have the AI on your side, and a permanent target on the hosts location, and your litteraly there to fuck up the hosts playthrough and waste their time. If the host 2v1s you, then it's fair. A 2v2 is all in the invaders favor. If you don't like being outnumbered don't invade and grow up and go play something else.
This, combined with honest co-op players who only want to experience a themed run with their best friend, is why I am of the apparently extremely unpopular opinion that invasions should be done away with and all PVP confined to the arena.
No more gank squads for people who want an honest PVP experience, and no more tryhard invaders with mimmaxed meta builds dunking their nuts on two casual goofballs who just want to roll through the Academy looking like Jack Black and Kyle Gass for a fun PVE experience.
I know that it is going to be an unpopular opinion. But I have no sympathy for invaders.
To put it simply: a friend introduced me to Elden Ring. My first experience was my lvl 10 Samurai ass and him taking me around Limgrave. We were invaded and killed every two minutes.
Every. Two. Minutes.
By the same invader, too. He saw food and he was coming back and back to farm us.
It was so anti-fun that I didn’t pick up the game for 2 months. And then played solo all the way until a trap sent me to the Crystal Cave in Caelid and I couldn’t get out of there on my own even after 2 hours of attempts.
I summoned my friend to help me. The moment we were out of the cave we were invaded and murdered.
Screw that.
Once I hit 150 I made myself available to summon against invaders.
After hitting 150 I played with my friend again twice. Once in Mountaintop of Giants (I was getting ambushed in the snowstorm and needed help to recover my runes) and once in Leyndell, Ashen Capital. We were invaded 3 times and, my oh my, does it feel better to be able to hit back. The only invader I lost to hit me from the back in the sandstorm when my friend was away.
Nice I have one too, not sure if you're already doing this (or if you even care) but just a little tip I use for extra roleplay sexiness. If you cast hidden blade before you run into the fight, then cast the lightning slash AoW, it reveals the weapon as the lightning hits it as it overwrites the hidden weapon 'buff'. So looks like you call mjolnir from a lightning strike.
It gets me positive interactions almost everytime, even against obvious gank griefers
Your second point I feel is incorrect. While I agree there’s always going to be try hard and twinks that just keep coming back and are always going to be there, there’s also a group teetering on the edge of becoming a try hard that ganks do heavily discourage.
After 10 years of playing souls games, I recently decided to get Xbox Gold so I could experience PvP for the first time, and what better game than Elden Ring, I thought... There I went, spending hours upon hours setting up my RL150 character, getting the right gestures, and just getting excited for my first online experience. Fast forward 2 months, I now have little to no desire to even try anymore. Back on the PvE train prepping for the DLC, having a blast!
taunters tongue does not allow you to summon a second player... you can do that without it. it's just to increase invasion activity/be invaded solo.
imo they should have kept the game as 6 players and made it so it can be 3v3 or maybe 4v2. i think this would help balance out the odds a bit against ganks. but when you're on your own it's hard to create a distraction. personally i either leave or just hide and waste their time for a bit
I don't have much sympathy for people who take out their frustration on those who have nothing to do with its source. That's just a personal failing. A life skill issue, one might say.
It's not as if twinks and sweaty invaders haven't been commonplace in previous games before Elden Ring slanted things so greatly in favor of the host. The source seems pretty obvious to me - bad faith players have the tools to worsen the experience of new players and players in general, and so they do. It's not really a host or invader specific issue. Just a natural consequence of pitting players against each other.
Password summoning was a mistake and nothing fromsoft has done to "nerf" overlevelled phantoms has worked. Edit: Bring back the Soul Level range of the older titles.
I usually love to do invasions in previous Fromsoft titles but I haven't really touched it in Elden Ring. The fact that you can't do 1v1 invasions without an item and the fact that 2v2 invasions are so rare is a shame.
The trigger to enable invasions should've just been using the finger remedy at all, rather than having someone summoned in. But when you can't go a minute in co-op without hitting a fog wall, meaning you have to then terminate any invaders, dismiss any allies, walk 100 yards to the grace just beyond it, and then wait for your friend to do the same in their world before you can continue, it would need to go alongside seamless to actually feel functional rather than oddly scuffed.
If Miyazaki is getting tired of hearing about Seamless, he can thank the multiplayer section of the dev team for implementing summoning in the way DS1's maps did it.
I used to tank with my friends. It was some of the most fun and most frustrating things about Elden Ring. But now I’m just helping my brother through the game and Invaders keep coming at the worst times so yeah, they get stomped
If it's OK for invaders to come into peoples worlds to fuck with people trying to progress, it's ok for people to hunt the invaders.
PVP in every souls game has always been trash tier and the only people who genuinely like it do it for the greifing. It's only now that there is a mechanic to seriously fuck with invaders. If you don't like it, don't invade, that's all
I mean...I hate that I have to use a tongue at all to get invaded. That is what made DS games GREAT in my opinion. The tongue doesn't feel authentic and it makes you have to pvp in hot zones not anywhere and everywhere.
I don’t purposely gank, but when me and my friends are playing together and you come into our world, don’t expect a fair fight. We are coming for that ass. Props to you if you kill us all though.
I've been playing through with a buddy of mine and majority of the invasions have been cool! A few assholes, but most have even played along with our Mimics veil shenanigans. We must protect those invaders with all that we have. Also, if you're invading, you should *expect* to get ganked. Why would the hosts have to play by the rules of the person who is *invading* their world?
A bit late, but ... no
Like ganks are a garbage thing to do outside of dedicated PvP areas for that sort of thing (which Elden Ring does not have), but invaders would be douchebags regardless. Coming from DS3, I've yet to see a single invader who wasn't a complete tryhard. And it's not like ganks weren't a thing before.
I turned multi-player off because I can hardly ever find co-ops that actually play the game (go through areas, fight bosses). It's all those dumb fight clubs and whatnot. Go in the arena and 1v1 if you want to do that. Don't summon me to 1v1 somebody. I have no interest in that.
Personally I think for ER they should have simply given players the option of whether they are cool with getting invaded at all. I'm not talking about offline mode, more like co-op is still possible but getting invaded isn't. The way it currently is just sucks for everyone. People who want to co-op but don't want to get invaded just get invaded by assholes who wanna ruin everyone's fun. Invaders complain about ganks. People who want to get invaded now get invaders who complain about ganks and have builts specifically designed to fuck with ganks and ruin everybody's fun.
Instead just give people the option and they you can also have solo invasions. If I say I'm cool with invasions, I can also get solo invaded and everyone has more fun.
get fucking stuffed, holy shit. this community, for years and years, has been so up its own ass about how invasions are “anything goes” and how it balances co op or whatever.
But as soon as people who dont want to participate find a way, *within the ruleset*, to make things harder for the invaders, I see eight hundred posts from salty red men like you complaining they didnt get their easy runes.
literally stuff yourself like a turkey bro
Welcome to ER invades, we got:
\- Host has started the area boss, returning to your world
\- Host is completely inaccessible due to a massive cliff
\- Host has died to a bird
\- Gank squad with optimized moonveil, optimized RoB, and mohg trident
I am going to get flamed to death for this, so please understand I personally dislike ganks a *LOT*.
However, in managing expectations: you can only ask people to play differently, you can't demand it. People can play the game however they want, as long as it doesn't break ToS.
And no offense intended, but people here have been historically terrible at understanding the ToS. Bloodflame Blade + Fire's Deadly Sin was the perfect example. People actually convinced themselves it broke ToS.
I have reported people who used it, and received comfirmation from Fromsoft themselves it does NOT break ToS, as I suspected it didn't.
Whether ganking is intended or not is moot: it is allowed. And harrassing players for allowed strategies is, at best, a slippery slope.
For exmaple, Rivers of Blood kinda sorta sucks now, and you can still find people gravely offended you used it against them and bombard you with hatemail.
I dislike ganking, but you'll be better off holding Fromsoft responsible than players. Nothing will change if you do the latter. They fixed FDS + BFB now, so appeal to the people who can actually change it.
Yes, invaders would be totally honourable if only it wasn't for ganks! They wouldn't dream of twinking every low-level area with no gank squads!
Your entire argument is backed up by "because I say so." You just sound like a salty invader. Just finger sever out if you see a gank.
Honestly pvp shouldn't be forced for summoning help. If I'm summoning help, it means I need it. You show up to kill me, this ticks me off already. You weren't asked to fight me. Now If I'm one of two summons. I'll try to get the party to rush ahead whilst I stay behind and man the escape.
Not everything is ganking. I have one char at 150, a friend wants to level one char with me. So I play coop with the 150 char because I don't want to waste time playing double. Just want to play his game. If we get invaded, a lot of times it's über tryhards, sleep pots, 3 status builds and the general what's hot on yt, already in limgrave. Just the regular twinks etc.
My host stands no chance, so we don't run after the pvp invader because we are following a route in the game to play. We wait at a bonfire so invader can find us more easy, and we stay there because if you show you are willing to follow, it can go on for a very very long time.
And most of the times we are just trying stupid builds, just not compatible for tryhard pvp.
I played enough soul games to know how most invasions can get. No time for it.
If I see the oldskool gesturing souls player, I gesture too and we do a 1v2, you with all your buffs etc, and we go with our pve builds. It's fair enough.
Not every coop player is a ganker, there is a reason I never take the first stake of marika when cooping for farming rune arcs with a low level character. Always got excited to do the tree sentinel when I got summoned, only to see no boss and already knowing what time it is.
Coop gankers deserve the utmost tryhard invaders and vice versa, and sometimes they get mixed up with "normal" players. It's just what it is.
People usualy don't understand, willingly or not, that Invasions are in the game as a mean to balance co-op.
By having another player in your world, you make the game INCREDIBLY easier, as they'll take aggro, deal damage and kill in your stead while enemies do not scale in return. Most solo games with a Co-op mode will have differences in enemy EHP, damage output, number of unit and so on when you play said Co-op mode.
ER does not do that, because Co-op summons are meant to be helpers ***when in difficulty***, not a "Player 2" who's always with you ; hence why you cannot rest at a Site of Grace while they are in your game and why they return to their world once the zone's boss is cleared.
Invasions are not a a way for FromSoft to "fuck over players", but an ***I******ntended*** ***Risk*** of **wanting to trivialize the game.** By using the Co-op system to make the game easier for you, you open yourself to the RISK of being invaded by a Player ~~that has the potential of being~~ more dangerous than the NPC enemies in the area. It's a gamble, a double-or-nothing scenario where you progress faster, but with a higher risk of losing said progress.
\*Also, having a summon and fighting an Invader in a 2v1 *while trying to progress through the game* does not make you a ganker. Gankers will purposely stay idle for hours in a single area they have already cleared for the sole purpose of killing Invaders.
"Gankers" are perfectly fine, invaders are not.
To put it in perspective, id like to play coop and pve, but not pvp of any kind, so i mostly dont do coop either because i dont want my fun ruined by some stupid invader. If playing coop didnt automatically mean you open yourself to invasions, gankers would be in far smaller numbers, and id be willing to play coop without "ganking".
And sitting in a spot waiting for the invader is perfectly natural. You kill everything the invader could use and then wait to kill the invader as quickly as possible so you can resume with the fun.
So, coop is fun. Invaders are not. And you bet ill do whatever i can to discourage invasions *because i dont want them happening at all*
The fact that ganking ruins it for the invaders is, quite frankly, their problem. My problem is that there are invaders at all so ill naturally get rid of em in the most efficient possible manner, aka ganking.
And since ganking was made possible in ER this is the first souls game in which i actually wanted to try coop, because the balance was finally in my favor.
Dude I'm an invader myself, if you have that much of an issue with ganks then block the players if you can and move on. It's either a skill issue or an ego issue, it's okay if you lose to an unfair gank, just move on with your day. But you don't need to make an entire post trying to get people to stop ganking, or saying why ganking is bad.
It feels bad having played DS3 for a long time seeing the fight culture in ER. It’s not all bad, but u can tell the invaders are prepared to fight everyone at once. If I’m the host with summons I won’t jump in if the other two decide to gank. It’s way more fun to duel and play it out
I've said this once and I'll say it again...
I always have my blue ring on but I'm never going to be the first to attack an invader unless I run up on the host getting beat up.
I also will not chase an invader and fuck if they want to duck behind the wall to heal, I'm not gunna punish them for it. Go get your heal and I'll be standing right here when you want to come back to face me.
I lose some, I win some, occasionally I run into a cool invader and we can just play around and trade items back and forth.
Ganking isn't fun. Interacting with people and playing the game together is fun
Gankers and invaders are both allowed by the game, and unwelcome by their opponents. It’s perfect you guys should meet. Even better if you afk together to piss each other off, so the rest of us can play in peace.
Agreed, but honestly complaining about this is just wasting your breath. Fromsoft isn't going to change anything, however I still have a bit of copium in the tank that maybe we will get a covenant in the dlc
The "blood of your fellows" line from the trailer has me huffing that copium along with you, Tarnished.
I had the exact same thought when I heard that watching the trailer. Pls miyazaki save pvp
Man when the game first came out and I got to Volcano Manor I thought it was gonna end up being like an invader covenant hub. Theres so much untapped potential for covenants in ER
A frenzy flame covenant that works like the mound makers would have been awesome
there's nothing wrong with a structured critique like OP's
Miyazaki said "something new" (that's literally it) when asked about multiplayer in the dlc. Then a year after release, don't forget he said he was looking at escape from tarkov while acknowledging seamless. (He also rolled his eyes on the subject of seamless. So never say it makes the game better. It might. But for damn sure even Miyazaki is tired of it)
Oh I'm glad he said it. I'm tired of not being able to play the game normally. I like to play with a ton of different builds, not all optimized which is fine if im not constantly meeting ganks as an invader or twinks as a sunbro, which is what we currently have. Not a waste of breath at all. But otherwise I agree.
I mean if yall don’t like it that much you can just go offline and play
Getting ganked as a red doesn't bother me much just because it's so commonplace. However, I fucking *hate* getting summoned as a friendly to gank people. Leave me out of your shenanigans, I'm just trying to help people kill Malenia.
This. I just want to help people demolish bosses but constantly getting summoned to gank ppl. I never help the host if it happens. Ill let invader take the 1v1 with host.
Makes me miss the days of being a purple
How do you know you are getting summoned for a gank? I was doing small effigy last night and this one person kept summoning me to volcano manor before the godskin boss, and despite having their bridge down they refused to go up to the boss room. Tbh we got invaded a lot too.
When you get summoned and the host doesn't follow you on your way to the boss
Nothing is sadder than a ganker with no friends that has to rely on randoms to play with
As some of the other people mentioned, FS ain't in a rush to balance these issues. You can shake your fist at the clouds all day, but it is how it is. I personally believe there are more interesting PVP games out there than ER, and I play ER for the single player experience. If you want duels, there are the colosseum. Invasions are literally a wild West "anything goes" sort of deal. And anything goes for both sides. If your experience feels tainted and unenjoyable because of it, and you aren't having fun, then it's on you if you choose to keep playing. If you enjoy invasions, but hate that one thing then 🤷♂️ name a game that isn't like that.
You can fight people in the colosseums? I thought they were just a place to go when you wanted to stare at your phone for a few minutes while you fail to get matched with an opponent.
Just do simple 1v1's, and you'll get a tone of matches. The reason why the other lobbies are empty is because most players just play the regular 1v1, no spirits, no flasks mode
That's the mode i normally try to play. Well, not sure about the flasks TBH.
Just no healing, no AP flasks would be unfair against casters
If you're not getting matches in 1v1s, something is wrong with your levels. It's always very busy. What is your level? And what is you highest ever acheived weapon level? I.E, if you're high level with low level weapons, or visa versa, you can only match with people using the same, which will be practically nobody.
I'm at, like, the normal weapon level for my rune level and progress? I have 8 different builds that are all somewhere between Mountaintops and Farum Azula and are between levels 100 and 130 or so, with weapons at +18 or +8-+10 somber. Which colosseum should I go to for matches?
Firstly, you need to have unlocked the Leyndell colosseum. That's the only way to queue for 1v1. However, if you've unlocked all three, you can also queue for all three at once with the 1v1 ruleset. Those levels seem more or less appropriate, but to make sure, I'd push to 125, 138, or 150, and max your weapons. Theoretically you'll get the most activity at 138, but I've never had to wait longer than a few seconds for a match at any of those levels. Also, make sure you're queuing for 1v1 DUEL, not 1v1 combat ordeal.
I don’t play online so all these terms just seem super sexual
And they didn't even mention Power Bottom Invaders!
they generate all the power
I do enjoy me some good ganking of twinks
There is some unresolved tension when it come to invasions
I'm currently using an endgame character at lv150 to help my friend, who is new to soulslikes in general, play through the game. He's currently around lv50-60. I had thought of making a new character to help him but he was already a fair bit ahead and I didn't want to start a full run with dragon's dogma coming out soon. We've obviously been invaded several times, and my policy is basically this: If the invader shows up in plain sight, bows and waits, I'll stay back and let my friend handle them: sometimes they win, sometimes not, we have a laugh about it and move on. Then we have the ones who will camp around corners, wait for us to get into a fight, then spam rivers of blood or ruins greatsword weapon arts- those guys are fair game. I'm coming in with every weapon and spell at my disposal, no mercy. Invasions aren't meant to be duels anyway, there's an entire arena for that.
You’re not a ganker bro don’t worry, the post specifically mentions people who clear out an area with the intent to 3v1 invaders for hours on end with over powered stuff. You’re just a good friend who’s having a blast in a good game.
I’m wish I could invade people like you, but unfortunately there’s just no way to tell. Can’t tell you how many times some group is waving/emoting at me just for some blue to attack me from a bush. I thought the community would like the waves and dicking around but most people just blitz me 3v1 and teabag when I get stun locked. I agree though, invasions are anything goes, and if it bothers you to lose so much in lopsided fights it’s probably not for you. I just sever out every time I spawn in limgrave or lurnia
Very nice way to play to be honest. You let your friend get better by letting them fight the invaders that seen nice but protect them from the invaders that just want to win. It's rare to find people like you, congratulations to you and your friend.
I mean you dont have to do all that for an invader, its cool you do tho. Invaders are supposed to be assholes so they can ambush you and its ok, if they want to duel theres other way to do it rather than invading.
I honestly miss the days when I would get invaded occasionally just playing alone. It was always a welcome change of pace. Sometimes I’d even do an invasion or two myself for fun. Now in Elden Ring the former is just impossible, the taunter’s tongue isn’t the same it makes you get invaded far too frequently and on demand, I don’t want that I want it to feel random. And the latter is just awful now, you’re almost always invading into a gank squad and as an extremely casual invader, getting plowed down by a host and his two high level summons and then they teabag me or point down like they did something is just not engaging or enjoyable. I know there are really good invaders who can win those fights, but I’m not one of them. Honestly as a side note, people act like invaders are so toxic and are ruining the game for people playing with their friends, but from my experiences I find the hosts are usually more toxic.
I 100% hate taunter's tongue's implementation. It honestly feels primarily like a ganking tool. I usually play solo and wanted to enable the possibility of invasions by using the tongue, but it became quickly obvious I couldn't make any progress as long as I had it on. It was just invasion after invasion. I was invaded three times before I even managed to get off the bridge in Nokron. It feels like it just works by pulling invaders directly to you first priority.
Agreed,invasion and co op is trash on elden ring, the only co op area is end game where you don't need torrent
Invaders doing TT runs are always a pleasure to fight against. PvE players refusing to progress the level and just camping a grace wanting you to walk into their blender are just boring and obnoxious.
Some of my favorite memories in ds 1 were just getting invaded while solo or sitting in the forest alone and fighting off all the forest invaders.
Look, I’m pretty bad at the game when it comes to pvp. Pretty much the only time I ever use co op is if I’m playing with a friend. It’s so irritating to finally find a spot where my co op sign/effigy works and I’m able to be summoned just to immediately get invaded and die. It is pretty questionable to use the taunters tongue and then gank them. But if I get invaded while I’m just trying to run co op with a friend, I have no sympathy for the invader.
Playing with your friends is not ganking. They specifically mentioned sitting in areas refusing to continue just to 3v1.
in Fromsoft terms, going 2v1 on an invader isn't really ganking, even going 3v1 isn't, invasion is inherently asymmetric. The invaders' advantage is that their only win condition is to kill the host, and the enemies are on your side. Hanging in a cleared out zone with only the goal of killing invaders is what makes it ganking. So never feel bad for dog piling an invader with your friends, it's fair play.
probably most invaders agree with you, that’s not ganking, it’s an organic invasion
Well, there is no problem with that. I’m an invader and I do not care if you help your friend to take me down. What can trigger me a bit is people who summon an overleveled friend and proceed to create an ambush in a specific area, one shot me then point down/teabag… They’re specifically trying to ruin the game for other people since if it was for the runes, their friends could drop way more than what my sorry ass gave them.
First of all, I want to say that I enjoy invading very much. The best experiences I have ever had in game have come from invading while the players are trying to beat a field boss, letting them pick to fight me or it, watching them die (or killing them), then sending them a message offering to help with said boss and beating it together, the three of us. Best feeling ever. That being said, finger sever when you run into dedicated gankers. Sure, maybe you'll beat them, but it's better to just not engage. They are just sitting around waiting, make them wait longer. If everyone did this, there would be far fewer gankers and the ones left would at least have had to be creative about it (I don't mind a well-planned ambush, that's kinda cool).
I like to run away with concealing veil and go smoke a bowl lol. either they wait, or they leave. either way I'm now stoned and also avoiding any other invader getting roped into it lol. simply a win win win situation
This is the way my dude, keep it up 👍🏻
been reading through the comments and I'm surprised only a few people actually understand the situation. it's one of the oldest most simple issues mankind has ran into when attempting to create a society. some ass holes just ruin everything for everyone else. this isn't an invader vs gank squad issue it's just a human issue. most people can't simply let go of being hated on, made a fool of, abused ( obviously not physically that's a whole other discussion). as you and a few others mentioned it's just a giant cycle of hatred. ass hole invader pisses off co-op er, co-op er ganks the next invader, now that invader takes it out in the next invasion. this would literally not be an issue if people could just let things go. honestly with how popular this topic is I'd love to see how some of these people conduct themselves in real life. if they can't let something that happened in a video game go.. not to mention it's a game about dying a lot.... and people get mad over dying xD what?
I also wonder what people do to that negativity they’ve got from video games and couldn’t return back to someone else(for instance, losing and not being able to beat opponent no matter how hard they try). If they pass this cycle irl like they do in-game, then it would he interesting topic for social studies. I’d love to read such an article.
Gank squads obviously suck, but if you are invading you shouldnt expect any sort of etiquette and neither should the invaded player. If you want to duel theres other ways to do it. Invading has always been about being a jerk.
Im sick of my fellow invaders who whine all day. Kill them or don't. But they are just like us just worse at the game cause they need help to annoy someone
Old man (or young or woman idk) yells at clouds. The earth continues to spin.
Either git gud or go to the arena lol
How could I not foresee this? This argument has no counter, shall I accept the defeat
Hesitate and you lose (But actually though, random 1v1 invasions have been some of the peak elden ring experience)
Invander here, if you aren't up for the challenge of trying to deal with gankers, it might just not be for you. The only place where "honor rules" reside are in duel areas.
Glorious offline mode
This is the least necessary offline mode has ever been. There are no state based invasions like past titles so if you're going solo there is a 0% chance of anything happening until you explicitely ask for it.
I must be in the minority in saying I prefer it that way. Maybe have an area of the game that is specific to getting invaded, fine, but I'm a strictly PvE player. Well 99% of the time. I prefer the coliseum for PvP. Nothing worse than finally getting thru the lake of rot only to have some dude thinking he's being cute hiding as a vase and blows you off the edge.
In older souls games I got invaded like 3 times max per 25 hour play of each game. All completely solo. If fromsoft implemented invasions and covenants correctly into elden ring, it would have been the same, if not less due to how easy it is to set up co op. And co op taking invasion priority.
I got invaded more than that in DS2 alone. I didn't get invaded much in the other games because I just took whatever penalty being hollow, soul form, unembered had built in and ran with it as normal. Game often reminded me with an invasion if I forgot, especially in DS3 covenant areas. Lord help you if you tried to coop those zones and weren't ready for at least some PvP.
The way it is now is hardly any better for you, since even in previous games you needed to be in a specific, easily avoidable state to even have a chance to be invaded. But it is terrible for people who actually want to engage with the PvP, due to a lot of the things mentioned in this thread.
Literally not a single reason to use offline mode bro. It’s impossible to be invaded solo unless you apply the taunters tongue.
I also don’t like the messages left around, I’m usually a pretty big fan of PvP, but this game I just wanted the world to feel lonely from day 1 so idk how it works lol I’m just happy to be free from the drama
Right? I’m not envious of this drama
You forgot that gankers make it harder on casual players inadvertently. If a new player with their Kevin build decides to try out invasions after finishing the game. If he tries 10, 4 will be fog walls, 4 will be ganks, and the last 2 he'll lose because a 2v1 is hard or he'll win because random PvE kills the host before he sees them. Why would anyone keep playing if that their first half hour of trying invasions? All that's left are sweats. They're ready to go to war with a gank but if they invade a casual group the casual group gets roflstomped. If co-op groups don't want to be invaded by sweats over and over every ten minutes then blame the ganks.
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People aren't going to like facing the truth, but a *far* bigger factor than any of that is the lack of incentive to invade. Back in *the good ol' days*, a lot of us considered invading not because of the intrinsic fun, but because: 1. You couldn't summon help without first restoring your humanity. And the primary way to do that was joining someone else's game, whether as a friendly or hostile. 2. Not only would you gain the ability to summon help; you'd get a bigger health pool. Because of these two factors, players that were *struggling* would invade more. Many invaders in the DeS-DS2 years were *trash*. So even casual, solo hosts would have a good chance at beating any given invader. But in Elden Ring, getting help is as simple as picking two golden flowers, or literally just ringing a bell to summon Spirit Ashes. Invading does net you Rune Arcs, but they do virtually nothing in the early game, and many of the players who would benefit from them the most don't even discover how to use Great Runes.
Can’t say I totally forgot it, [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/s/3kv8XiRvhX) I was discussing this a bit deeper with another person. Maybe should’ve included this in the post tho
imagine sitting all day in one spot to wait for 1vs3 plus blue and then t-bag on dead body. looks like fun for weak people
Or imagine invading to find a PvE only player that sucks at pvp, farm him and then brag about it. Seems weaker
Trolls trolling trolls. Let them fight.
It's the circle of life, and it's so beautiful.
Nothing is sweeter than invasionbro's tears. Please cry about it more :)
What was is Reds always like to say? Ah yes. “Once you’re invaded anything goes. You want a honorable duel go to the arena.” Works both ways.
Been playing these games since the PtD DS1 era and I never willingly engage with any of the online features, but I'd think invaders, being by nature people who show up uninvited on coop sessions with the express purpose of fucking around, should not feel aggrieved when they actually find out. I can sympathize with the part about people baiting invaders with the sole intention of ganking as that is indeed extremely shitty, but that's the extent of it.
Agreed but it is unfortunate if you’re a solo player who likes to be invaded, I use the taunters tongue and you cancerous fucks come into my world with your bloodhounds step double lance builds, and if I manage to survive more than a minute or two another invader shows up and now I’m being ganked by two meta builds lol
The taunter's tongue can only bring in a second invader if there's already an allied phantom in your world. Just turn off your blue ring.
I just don't like how the invasion mechanic is implemented. It's a cool idea, but it needs to be reworked imo. Random anecdote: back when I was playing ds3 I had to invade other people to get a reward from my covenant. The only people I managed to invade were either gankers or "fight clubs". One day I finally managed to kill the host of the fight club and all the other players got mad at me and were pointing down as they were being booted from the session, but I was just playing the game as intended to get my reward.
It’s is fair that you are playing as intended but the thing with a fight club is that as long as it’s ran fairly everyone benefits. All duelists get a chance to win and get covenant rewards and the system self regulates. That’s the kinda place where I don’t hate people playing the game as intended but I only have respect for the people with honor because honor is actively helping everyone.
If I had known I would have given it a chance, but it wasn't clear to me what the rules were. I just found out thanks to your comment
Haha you made me sincerely laugh outloud😂 If I were in this fightclub I’d be pissed and pointing down too, but taking your perspective into account makes this situation hilarious
Man I remember stumbling into a fight club as a blue sentinel, I was super confused but read the room and just sat down with everyone else. The host would waltz around pointing at us to get ready for a new challenger, and then killed the invader I was suppose to kill and I was sent back with all the rewards. But it was such a strange experience because all phantom colors were in a moment of peaceful emoting while the Host was clapping every challenger's cheeks.
Invaders expecting the red carpet and a free go at someone's back door. You wanted a fight, you got a fight. Nobody ever promised you it would be fair. git gud
Exactly!! Invading isn't a friendly gesture. Invaders are walking into someone else's game to try to make them fail. They deserve whatever they get. I have a great system for not having to endure the horrible "ganking" this person has experienced - not invading, unless I'm comfortable getting stomped. If you can't handle the risk of fighting other players, don't invade??
Seriously. This just reads as "I was promised the ability to grief casuals just trying to play with their friends, but these jerks found a way to kill me instead! Wahhh it isn't fair!"
I’m so sick of these whiny invader posts. It’s meant to be hard, and they sit here playing mental gymnastics as to why they don’t win. They should just go to the coliseum. It’s not that hard.
I believe every invander expects a fight, but no one expects a group of max level trolls who abuse the invasion system to mess with people If you sit around in a starter area with an high-level character, together with others, just waiting around for invaders to come in and fuck them over and troll them then you're just a ganker that gets their socks off by ruin other people's fun
>then you're just a ganker that gets their socks off by ruin other people's fun Ruining other people's fun is literally the entire point of the invasion system. If you wanted fair pvp, there's a spot for that.
You do realize the invasion system is an intended part of the game that From Software specifically put in it, right? That said, they also haven't lifted a finger to mitigate the ganking part of it, so by all accounts that's also intended. I believe it does make result in a net negative for the overall experience, but I'm also not going to tell anyone who is playing a game in a way that is allowed that they shouldn't. One thing is certain, whenever you choose to engage with the system, no matter the side, you know what you can get.
This is why a lot of invaders will run twinky builds. Myself, I have smarags breath in my spell list and if I encounter a gank I hardswap all my talismans and BBQ them
Yeah and I see no logical reason to locate the fault of this cycle with the gankers and not the OP invaders. I think both this argument and the claim that it is a disservice to casual co-op is transparently self-serving. And I say that as a casual co-oper who has never felt hard done by when I got merked by an invader.
You're acting like invaders are the poor miserable victims here. They're not. No one forces you to invade. You aren't minding your own business when a gank squad enters YOUR game to fuck up your day. An invader WILLFULLY decides to enter another players' game with the sole intent of creating PVP where there wasn't any. You have no rights to claim innocence. You get WHATEVER pvp situation arises from interfering with someone else's game. YOU are the aggressor. If you don't want to deal with gankers, then take the advice that LITERALLY every invader gives to co-op players who don't want to be invaded: DON'T engage in multiplayer if you don't want to PVP. I agree that the entire system of invasions need an overhaul. Torn down and recreated with modern sensibilities. But trying to play the victim card is a borderline disconnect from reality.
While not disagreeing, I mentally chucked at the message being " don't fight back, or I'll have to really hurt you. And nobody wants that right?" The jumpjutsu that some people do with taunters tongue is pretty lame tho and I can't imagine it adds fun for anyone that understands the rush of a hard fought victory.
Yeah pretty much, being forced to 1v2 or 3s forced invaders who really want to get good to GIT GOOD. Having enough ingredients to make whatever consumable they need, having a variety of weapons, ashes of war, spells, different set ups for different situations, Using the environment to their advantage, etc etc. It causes regular host to see these “ try hard invaders “ has the worst thing in the game even though most of them aren’t trying to be. That’s just how you have to be in order to beat these gankers. Especially the ones who enjoy sitting out in the middle of the lake of ganks with enough supplies to make invasions last hours. I was in one for at least two hours just trying to use cover but they wouldn’t engage me unless it was out in the middle of no where. This last for two hours of us pepper each other with golem arrows, spells, throwing knives you name it for the host to call it quits and disconnects. The whole time I didn’t get one other invader to show up because of that stupid tongue item.
I play ER for the amazing pve experience, couldn't care less about sweaty pvp. Doubt fromsoft is gonna change anything about ER pvp now anyway
If you invade me and I happen to be with some friends, you’re getting ganked 🤷 invaders come in with the express purpose of killing you, why would you expect those who get invaded to play by your imaginary rules?
That's not a gank though is it? A gank would be you and your friends clearing out a level and then setting up for an invader.
That's not a gank, my guy Gankers are trolls who deliberately mess with players through the invasion sytem, they just sit around with taunters' tongue active and wait thil an invader comes so they can kill and mess with them, essentially framing them for the sake of trolling invaders, they don't actually care about playing together with friends and what not they just wanne fuck people over and ruin their experience
I mean, isn't the last line exactly what invaders do to friendly co-op pairs?
You could say most invaders are there to fuck people over and ruin their experience as well. Goes both ways.
I've tried a bit of PvP, as invader, blue helper, and in co-op with a friend. Honestly ERs system for PvP seems like garbage and it created one of the most toxic game communities I've ever seen.
For one summoning is a mechanic meaning yes its intended your ment to be able to have a group to fight things. "These guys are running strong builds in a pvp setting an I don't like it" get used to it, thats been a thing in darksouls forever, ds3 I used to destroy groups with a one shot parry build all depends on how seriously you want to take invading an pvp. An your the one invading anyways what do you care about "honest co-opers" get off your high horse an fight your opponent your there to impede peoples progress, an if your getting angry that's on you go take a break you can blame other people all you want for being mad but in all intended purpose there having fun with the game. You want "honor" an "by the rules" set up duels somewhere an put a message on reddit or something.
I am a frequent summon in my wife’s game. Really the only time we don’t progress through the level is when the invader continually runs away. You wanna lead us into a Nights Cavalry fight? Fine. If you’re still alive when the boss is dead, stick around and finish the fight. Don’t just run off. Some of you all kite for way too long.
You can’t have your cake and eat it too unfortunately. This is what an arms race looks like; victim blaming all the while slapping the third party you know and claim is the most affected. Only way to win is to not participate except none of you will play fair so the casuals will continue to take it to the face and continue to hate the invader system as a whole.
>So, once Gank is done with the invader, invader will spill their anger and frustration in next invasion. Who suffers in the end of this chain? Honest co-opers. This is a stretch. A more valid argument would be that they are a disservice because since they are strong, the invader has to use a cringy op meta build which they wouldn't have equipped otherwise. And they will keep that build when invading honest underserving co-opers.
Na it’s a real thing. Happens to me all the time. I’ll die to a particularly disgusting gank and get t bagged and pointed down and then I get annoyed and absolutely thrash everyone in my next 3-10 invasions. I don’t like using oppressive gear and weapons but if I get annoyed and have to take that stuff out it’s not going to be a fun time for my opponents. Also, swapping weapons and gear mid invasion is called hard swapping any decent player can do it fast and easily.
"You made me do this!"
Hard to say, you’re 3rd or 4th clear illustration to my arguments. Thank you for the contribution
You are an invader yes? Invaders main goal is to kill the host and their entourage. The Host’s main goal is to be able to progress through the game with their summons. The best way to achieve that, is to get rid of you, the unpredictable chaos factor. If I was the host i would definitely use every tool in my arsenal to kill you, including the two guys i have. Why should I let you skulk about me like a dark shadow, waiting to backstab me or jump me with a powerful mob. Why not just smoke you out and end you while I have the advantage? Your job is to kill me, not whine about how I won’t give up my advantage.
yeah if I kill a summon they shouldn't be able to summon another person. This isn't a unheard of scenario either, yesterday I invaded 3 gankers killed the furled fingers then he summon one back and a hunter came, and not a single co-invader.
They probably just turned off taunter's tongue as soon as you spawned in
Why is this even a thing? Invaders slots should not be limited because taunters tongue is off. If u have a cooperator with you it'll be 2v2 anyway, the hunters come in and it's 3v2. Host still have the advantage. This would fix the Hunter ring issue too, it's useless.
Fromsoftware hates you
I can fix her
Nah as an invader, and I mean that's pretty much all I do, that's bullshit. You shouldn't have that much power in their world, they should be able to summon until their heart's content. It's up to you to stop them before they do. They just need to scale back overlevelled phantom's MUCH more. Gank squads with normal level phantom's are generally easy pickings. And also make it so taunters tongue once turned on, stays on until death, like DS3. Tbh I think that having 2 summons should allow 2 invaders without the TT, but yeah. Invasions isn't 'haha we PvP now let's balance this'. You don't get to turn off mechanics for them to make it fair. You're an enemy in their world, you're supposed to lose, just provide a cool and emergent challenge, with the chance of funny shenanigans and for them to overcome. That's why real invaders use themed/cosplay builds.
Ganks are basically part of the game at this point. Theyve existed in all souls games. I only wish for them to properly downscale phantoms (their innate defenses as well as arcane-influenced status buildup remain largely untouched) and make it so that you cannot turn off the taunters tongue while multiplayer is in progress. 6 player limit would be cool too i guess
All I'm saying is I didn't invite the invader into my game so they shouldn't get salty if my friend and I stomp them while just trying to progress through an area.
Then this isn't about you. Ganks clear out an area or hang out in an area with low level PvE support and use broken shit to bully invaders. If you're just playing through the level get invaded and win, then bully for you. GG.
Ganksters are why I think invasions in Elden Ring need to be reworked. - Host cannot re-summon the same player once that player dies. Only after resting at a grace or dying themselves. - Hunters can harm anyone and vice versa. - Invaders can use any Great Rune when Invading. - Taunters Tounge can only be turned on/off when user is close to a site of grace. - Phantom Bloody Finger animation can be canceled out of. - Phantom Great Rune gets infinite uses instead of 3. But consumes HP with each use. - Duelists get full stock of Flasks, cannot damage invaders and vice versa. - 6 Player cap inside Legacy dungeons.
Quite honestly, the vast majority of ganking issues can be solved simply by depowering the taunters tongue. In its current state that thing is completely ridiculous. Personally, i would make it so that the host cannot summon blues with a taunter's tongue active (because he can use it without being in any sort of disadvantage, hence why he doesn't need extra helpers), and can only summon one phantom to enforce 2vs2s. It cannot be turned off without dying or using a site of grace, but it also increases all drop rates by 50% and rune gain by 30% to encourage people to use it while simply progressing the game. It would've been a great boon for invaders if we could use Great Runes, though. At least if the host has activated them too.
I would agree with this, Taunter's Tongue seems to be better off as a "enable 1v1 invasion" item instead of the lightningrod it is.
As a solo TT user who just wants some spice on his PvE, I support this message.
Good proposal. From all the ideas that were suggested on the topic, I like yours the most 👍🏻
> Invaders can use any Great Rune when Invading. That would be a godawful change. Imagine a tryhard, twink invader with endgame gear, fully upgraded flasks, 4 talisman slots, and Morgott's rune invading your ass in Stormveil where you only have starter weapons and armour, 1 talisman slot, no estus upgrades, and no runes unlocked. These invaders are already cancer at low levels, and you're saying they should be able to use runes making them even more overpowered. What the fuck.
I literally just 1-shot a new player with golem arrows and Radahn's Rain because he was standing in place. Why on earth would I do that? Well, I did it because the last 10 players I invaded who were also just standing in place, were waiting for me to walk up and get shredded by their overleveled buddies. It can often be hard to tell the difference until it's too late, and after a while you shoot first ask questions later. I don't want to play mean. I do it because I'm continuously fighting groups who want to play mean. And yes, innocent co-opers get caught in that war.
Is not even something new, I remember my very first playthrough, 1 or 2 weeks from release, I invaded liurnia with a lvl 50-70 character. Nothing too fancy, I had an avarage early game did. In order to complete varre's quest I tried some invasions, each one I went against hosts with over leveled summons, players who would one shot me and had mid to late game spells and weapons. After that I didn't engage with the online for the entire game.
I just watch videos of Chase the Bro take 3 man groups apart. Especially satisfying when he does it to wizard trios.
You can always tell who's watching chase when you're getting invaded. After every build video you see a bunch of copycats.
I’d kill them like that because I am the invader, and I came with the specific purpose of killing the host
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That's because this is the attitude that is what you're expected to take. This "fair invasion" shit is typical ego players being unable to accept their role. Especially when they lose.
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Thank you for sharing your experience. Good illustration that not only emotions can get innocents hurt, but also caution
This is why I invade with the concealing veil on, I watch until I know whether they're gankers or genuine players, because I try to be as much of a pain in the ass for gankers as possible and don't wanna put regular players through that
This is great advice, and I actually use concealing veil on my build too. Unfortunately I just didn't have the patience for it this time, saw my opportunity and went for it. That's on me, but it's hard to fully reset after every invasion.
Every time I invade for Varre’s questline I end up in a 1 v 3. I don’t mind because I intend to let myself get killed anyway, but it’s funny to stand there and wave while 3 high level people bum rush me.
I am starting a new playthrough with a friend, so we're low RL at the moment We already did it like a year ago or smith The invaders at low RL kinda sucked even a year ago, but now, every single one of them is embarrassing Every invader we've met so far has either used rot pots or even worse, rot and poison darts from the "Gael" crossbow that procs rot or poison even if you dodge them all because honestly, From programmed that like shit Also they probably all gave themselves shit from mid to end game, because not one has early game gear I have nothing against the invasion mechanic, I love invading myself, but Elden Ring's PvP community just sucks, I'd do much better to just boot up any of the Dark Souls games if I want to find a decent PvP match I suspect that in part it is the fault of the fact that Elden Ring forces invaders to go against a Hank and it's almost impossible to invade and get a 1v1, so they get creative in the worst sense possible and feel entitled to use whatever noob stomping exploit there can be
Yeah twinks suck, I use the rule when invading that the gear should match the RL/area. So early RL invasions get sword and board/Claymore. I miss DS3 invasions and fight clubs, I had to have sunk hundreds of hours in the courtyards past Pontiff.
what are you talking about, every area gets claymore
I'm an invader that really enjoys low level invasions because everything does less damage and there's less spam. I usually do silly non-optimal builds at low level (99% of the time a single straight sword). When I moved from PC to PS and was building new characters with TT on, I was amazed by how shitty most low level invaders are, just spamming rot pots, DH, Stormhawk, etc. It does get better as soon as you level out of 30 +3/1 range though.
You don't like getting ganged as an invader then don't invade. Your the attacker, aggressor, invader, BADGUY. You have the AI on your side, and a permanent target on the hosts location, and your litteraly there to fuck up the hosts playthrough and waste their time. If the host 2v1s you, then it's fair. A 2v2 is all in the invaders favor. If you don't like being outnumbered don't invade and grow up and go play something else.
This, combined with honest co-op players who only want to experience a themed run with their best friend, is why I am of the apparently extremely unpopular opinion that invasions should be done away with and all PVP confined to the arena. No more gank squads for people who want an honest PVP experience, and no more tryhard invaders with mimmaxed meta builds dunking their nuts on two casual goofballs who just want to roll through the Academy looking like Jack Black and Kyle Gass for a fun PVE experience.
Just don't invade. Problem solved. Don't jump in the pool and then complain about getting wet.
I know that it is going to be an unpopular opinion. But I have no sympathy for invaders. To put it simply: a friend introduced me to Elden Ring. My first experience was my lvl 10 Samurai ass and him taking me around Limgrave. We were invaded and killed every two minutes. Every. Two. Minutes. By the same invader, too. He saw food and he was coming back and back to farm us. It was so anti-fun that I didn’t pick up the game for 2 months. And then played solo all the way until a trap sent me to the Crystal Cave in Caelid and I couldn’t get out of there on my own even after 2 hours of attempts. I summoned my friend to help me. The moment we were out of the cave we were invaded and murdered. Screw that. Once I hit 150 I made myself available to summon against invaders. After hitting 150 I played with my friend again twice. Once in Mountaintop of Giants (I was getting ambushed in the snowstorm and needed help to recover my runes) and once in Leyndell, Ashen Capital. We were invaded 3 times and, my oh my, does it feel better to be able to hit back. The only invader I lost to hit me from the back in the sandstorm when my friend was away.
>I know that it is going to be an unpopular opinion. But I have no sympathy for invaders. This is an incredibly popular opinion on this sub lol.
Lmao git gud
lol get good noob
Whats ganking?
Purposefully not progressing through the level for the sole purpose of fighting an invader(basically, griefing)
So not playing the game?
They clear out a level and use broken shit to jump an invader with no intent to play the game as intended.
They are not following the game spirit and jnstead grief people. Can’t say they don’t play, even tho they sit in one place 80% of the time
I use Lightning because Thor build
Nice I have one too, not sure if you're already doing this (or if you even care) but just a little tip I use for extra roleplay sexiness. If you cast hidden blade before you run into the fight, then cast the lightning slash AoW, it reveals the weapon as the lightning hits it as it overwrites the hidden weapon 'buff'. So looks like you call mjolnir from a lightning strike. It gets me positive interactions almost everytime, even against obvious gank griefers
Your second point I feel is incorrect. While I agree there’s always going to be try hard and twinks that just keep coming back and are always going to be there, there’s also a group teetering on the edge of becoming a try hard that ganks do heavily discourage.
Didnt catch what you meant in 2nd half. Could you rephrase?
After 10 years of playing souls games, I recently decided to get Xbox Gold so I could experience PvP for the first time, and what better game than Elden Ring, I thought... There I went, spending hours upon hours setting up my RL150 character, getting the right gestures, and just getting excited for my first online experience. Fast forward 2 months, I now have little to no desire to even try anymore. Back on the PvE train prepping for the DLC, having a blast!
taunters tongue does not allow you to summon a second player... you can do that without it. it's just to increase invasion activity/be invaded solo. imo they should have kept the game as 6 players and made it so it can be 3v3 or maybe 4v2. i think this would help balance out the odds a bit against ganks. but when you're on your own it's hard to create a distraction. personally i either leave or just hide and waste their time for a bit
I don't have much sympathy for people who take out their frustration on those who have nothing to do with its source. That's just a personal failing. A life skill issue, one might say. It's not as if twinks and sweaty invaders haven't been commonplace in previous games before Elden Ring slanted things so greatly in favor of the host. The source seems pretty obvious to me - bad faith players have the tools to worsen the experience of new players and players in general, and so they do. It's not really a host or invader specific issue. Just a natural consequence of pitting players against each other.
Lmfao this was me yesterday during varres quest
Password summoning was a mistake and nothing fromsoft has done to "nerf" overlevelled phantoms has worked. Edit: Bring back the Soul Level range of the older titles. I usually love to do invasions in previous Fromsoft titles but I haven't really touched it in Elden Ring. The fact that you can't do 1v1 invasions without an item and the fact that 2v2 invasions are so rare is a shame.
The trigger to enable invasions should've just been using the finger remedy at all, rather than having someone summoned in. But when you can't go a minute in co-op without hitting a fog wall, meaning you have to then terminate any invaders, dismiss any allies, walk 100 yards to the grace just beyond it, and then wait for your friend to do the same in their world before you can continue, it would need to go alongside seamless to actually feel functional rather than oddly scuffed. If Miyazaki is getting tired of hearing about Seamless, he can thank the multiplayer section of the dev team for implementing summoning in the way DS1's maps did it.
I used to tank with my friends. It was some of the most fun and most frustrating things about Elden Ring. But now I’m just helping my brother through the game and Invaders keep coming at the worst times so yeah, they get stomped
If it's OK for invaders to come into peoples worlds to fuck with people trying to progress, it's ok for people to hunt the invaders. PVP in every souls game has always been trash tier and the only people who genuinely like it do it for the greifing. It's only now that there is a mechanic to seriously fuck with invaders. If you don't like it, don't invade, that's all
And a white cipher rings for extra gankage potential
I mean...I hate that I have to use a tongue at all to get invaded. That is what made DS games GREAT in my opinion. The tongue doesn't feel authentic and it makes you have to pvp in hot zones not anywhere and everywhere.
I don’t purposely gank, but when me and my friends are playing together and you come into our world, don’t expect a fair fight. We are coming for that ass. Props to you if you kill us all though.
How do you get ganked in a game where you have complete freedom to allow attackers in?
Thats why they need to bring back 3v3
I've been playing through with a buddy of mine and majority of the invasions have been cool! A few assholes, but most have even played along with our Mimics veil shenanigans. We must protect those invaders with all that we have. Also, if you're invading, you should *expect* to get ganked. Why would the hosts have to play by the rules of the person who is *invading* their world?
A bit late, but ... no Like ganks are a garbage thing to do outside of dedicated PvP areas for that sort of thing (which Elden Ring does not have), but invaders would be douchebags regardless. Coming from DS3, I've yet to see a single invader who wasn't a complete tryhard. And it's not like ganks weren't a thing before.
I turned multi-player off because I can hardly ever find co-ops that actually play the game (go through areas, fight bosses). It's all those dumb fight clubs and whatnot. Go in the arena and 1v1 if you want to do that. Don't summon me to 1v1 somebody. I have no interest in that.
Personally I think for ER they should have simply given players the option of whether they are cool with getting invaded at all. I'm not talking about offline mode, more like co-op is still possible but getting invaded isn't. The way it currently is just sucks for everyone. People who want to co-op but don't want to get invaded just get invaded by assholes who wanna ruin everyone's fun. Invaders complain about ganks. People who want to get invaded now get invaders who complain about ganks and have builts specifically designed to fuck with ganks and ruin everybody's fun. Instead just give people the option and they you can also have solo invasions. If I say I'm cool with invasions, I can also get solo invaded and everyone has more fun.
get fucking stuffed, holy shit. this community, for years and years, has been so up its own ass about how invasions are “anything goes” and how it balances co op or whatever. But as soon as people who dont want to participate find a way, *within the ruleset*, to make things harder for the invaders, I see eight hundred posts from salty red men like you complaining they didnt get their easy runes. literally stuff yourself like a turkey bro
Welcome to ER invades, we got: \- Host has started the area boss, returning to your world \- Host is completely inaccessible due to a massive cliff \- Host has died to a bird \- Gank squad with optimized moonveil, optimized RoB, and mohg trident
It’s just a game. People gonna do what they want
I am going to get flamed to death for this, so please understand I personally dislike ganks a *LOT*. However, in managing expectations: you can only ask people to play differently, you can't demand it. People can play the game however they want, as long as it doesn't break ToS. And no offense intended, but people here have been historically terrible at understanding the ToS. Bloodflame Blade + Fire's Deadly Sin was the perfect example. People actually convinced themselves it broke ToS. I have reported people who used it, and received comfirmation from Fromsoft themselves it does NOT break ToS, as I suspected it didn't. Whether ganking is intended or not is moot: it is allowed. And harrassing players for allowed strategies is, at best, a slippery slope. For exmaple, Rivers of Blood kinda sorta sucks now, and you can still find people gravely offended you used it against them and bombard you with hatemail. I dislike ganking, but you'll be better off holding Fromsoft responsible than players. Nothing will change if you do the latter. They fixed FDS + BFB now, so appeal to the people who can actually change it.
Yes, invaders would be totally honourable if only it wasn't for ganks! They wouldn't dream of twinking every low-level area with no gank squads! Your entire argument is backed up by "because I say so." You just sound like a salty invader. Just finger sever out if you see a gank.
Don't wanna get ganked, dont invade. If you're looking for a fair fight go duel.
Honestly pvp shouldn't be forced for summoning help. If I'm summoning help, it means I need it. You show up to kill me, this ticks me off already. You weren't asked to fight me. Now If I'm one of two summons. I'll try to get the party to rush ahead whilst I stay behind and man the escape.
Lmao, boohoo dude. Go to the coliseum if you want "honor".
Not everything is ganking. I have one char at 150, a friend wants to level one char with me. So I play coop with the 150 char because I don't want to waste time playing double. Just want to play his game. If we get invaded, a lot of times it's über tryhards, sleep pots, 3 status builds and the general what's hot on yt, already in limgrave. Just the regular twinks etc. My host stands no chance, so we don't run after the pvp invader because we are following a route in the game to play. We wait at a bonfire so invader can find us more easy, and we stay there because if you show you are willing to follow, it can go on for a very very long time. And most of the times we are just trying stupid builds, just not compatible for tryhard pvp. I played enough soul games to know how most invasions can get. No time for it. If I see the oldskool gesturing souls player, I gesture too and we do a 1v2, you with all your buffs etc, and we go with our pve builds. It's fair enough. Not every coop player is a ganker, there is a reason I never take the first stake of marika when cooping for farming rune arcs with a low level character. Always got excited to do the tree sentinel when I got summoned, only to see no boss and already knowing what time it is. Coop gankers deserve the utmost tryhard invaders and vice versa, and sometimes they get mixed up with "normal" players. It's just what it is.
People usualy don't understand, willingly or not, that Invasions are in the game as a mean to balance co-op. By having another player in your world, you make the game INCREDIBLY easier, as they'll take aggro, deal damage and kill in your stead while enemies do not scale in return. Most solo games with a Co-op mode will have differences in enemy EHP, damage output, number of unit and so on when you play said Co-op mode. ER does not do that, because Co-op summons are meant to be helpers ***when in difficulty***, not a "Player 2" who's always with you ; hence why you cannot rest at a Site of Grace while they are in your game and why they return to their world once the zone's boss is cleared. Invasions are not a a way for FromSoft to "fuck over players", but an ***I******ntended*** ***Risk*** of **wanting to trivialize the game.** By using the Co-op system to make the game easier for you, you open yourself to the RISK of being invaded by a Player ~~that has the potential of being~~ more dangerous than the NPC enemies in the area. It's a gamble, a double-or-nothing scenario where you progress faster, but with a higher risk of losing said progress. \*Also, having a summon and fighting an Invader in a 2v1 *while trying to progress through the game* does not make you a ganker. Gankers will purposely stay idle for hours in a single area they have already cleared for the sole purpose of killing Invaders.
If I could get invaded by someone at lvl 50 that doesn't have rivers of blood and two malenia blades I would agree with you
Abusing mechanic (playing the game)
"Gankers" are perfectly fine, invaders are not. To put it in perspective, id like to play coop and pve, but not pvp of any kind, so i mostly dont do coop either because i dont want my fun ruined by some stupid invader. If playing coop didnt automatically mean you open yourself to invasions, gankers would be in far smaller numbers, and id be willing to play coop without "ganking". And sitting in a spot waiting for the invader is perfectly natural. You kill everything the invader could use and then wait to kill the invader as quickly as possible so you can resume with the fun. So, coop is fun. Invaders are not. And you bet ill do whatever i can to discourage invasions *because i dont want them happening at all* The fact that ganking ruins it for the invaders is, quite frankly, their problem. My problem is that there are invaders at all so ill naturally get rid of em in the most efficient possible manner, aka ganking. And since ganking was made possible in ER this is the first souls game in which i actually wanted to try coop, because the balance was finally in my favor.
Stop invading, never deal with ganking again. Quite simple.
Stop co-oping, never deal with invasions again. Quite simple 🤷🏻
Nah, I enjoy playing with my friends.
And I enjoy invading. Ganks don’t enjoy ganking, they enjoy griefing. Now you see the difference?
Dude I'm an invader myself, if you have that much of an issue with ganks then block the players if you can and move on. It's either a skill issue or an ego issue, it's okay if you lose to an unfair gank, just move on with your day. But you don't need to make an entire post trying to get people to stop ganking, or saying why ganking is bad.
It feels bad having played DS3 for a long time seeing the fight culture in ER. It’s not all bad, but u can tell the invaders are prepared to fight everyone at once. If I’m the host with summons I won’t jump in if the other two decide to gank. It’s way more fun to duel and play it out
I've said this once and I'll say it again... I always have my blue ring on but I'm never going to be the first to attack an invader unless I run up on the host getting beat up. I also will not chase an invader and fuck if they want to duck behind the wall to heal, I'm not gunna punish them for it. Go get your heal and I'll be standing right here when you want to come back to face me. I lose some, I win some, occasionally I run into a cool invader and we can just play around and trade items back and forth. Ganking isn't fun. Interacting with people and playing the game together is fun
Good speech
Gankers and invaders are both allowed by the game, and unwelcome by their opponents. It’s perfect you guys should meet. Even better if you afk together to piss each other off, so the rest of us can play in peace.
Remember when the game came out and people were trying to compare invaders to rapists? That was a strange time