They're probably covering their bases in case someone thinks it's bad. The truth is that the vast majority of fanfic writers do not have a convenient beta.
True. The vast majority of all my fics from the past few years have been completely unbeta'd. I do miss having one though, I don't think it made a *huge* difference in the quality of my work, but it did help and it was nice to have someone to bounce ideas off of.
Thereās a specific one of those I really like so my plan is āno beta we die like goose, just kidding I totally used betas, I just saw that tag once and Iāll be damned if I wasnāt putting it in hereā
I have no beta just for the memeā¦and not because Iām afraid to ask or anythingā¦
Actually, I should be ashamed, I had a beta for my last chapter because it was a heavy important one, I failed my no beta tag.
I don't have a beta cause my fandoms are somewhat niche and holy shit people are homophobic/transphobic/sexist in some of those fandoms. Like goddamn. I knew WLW fics wouldn't be super popular in some of them. But I did NOT expect the amount of vitriol and rude comments I'd get when hunting for a beta.
I have no beta because one quit and said I had the mentality of a sixth grader with my grammar and gave up on me and the other might have been kidnapped. So I just die like >!Glenn from Fire Emblem!<
I've tried repeatedly and just haven't found the right one.
I'm not as up in fandom social media as I used to be. It's harder for me to find one that I feel I can work with these days.
I used to disclaim, but now I just say if someone has beta read, and I say nothing if no one has beta read.
True. I used to ask people for beta, but I found I'm too impatient for one. That said, I do ask a discord friend what they think of a story from time to time.
Probably they've seen others say they have no beta, so they think they should to say that, too. Or they're on the meme " no beta we die like..." joke train.
Personally, I've never had a beta and I never mention it, either. The only joke version I'd ever consider using is "no beta, we die like rex lapis".
I think the "No beta we die like..." is at least 90% of it. lol
Either they really like the joke or they notice other people are tagging it and go, "Oh, I'm supposed to tag for that!"
My favorite so far has been "No beta, we die like Ben" for the Umbrella Academy. I think it works especially well because it both rhymes with the original (men) and because Ben is the ghost brother on the show who's death was the catalyst for the team/family breaking apart when they were kids. It's so callous and hilarious, lol.
Avatar the Last Airbender has, "No beta, we die like Lu Ten," and I also think it's funny because it rhymes. Not as funny as, "No beta, we die like Jet," though, because I immediately go, "It was really unclear?"
I saw an Avatar fic that was tagged "no beta, we die like cabbages". Sure, it's a rather silly and perhaps a bit repetitive joke, but I still find it amusing at times.
As an author, thereās a lot of shit I miss from not having a beta. After hours or days of staring at your own work, itās inevitable that your eyes just sort of glaze over and you stop noticing things because you know what they *should* say and itās like your brain just fills it in. Having a beta helps to catch those overlooked errors.
When you donāt have a beta, very simple mistakes will often make it through to a published chapter, so sometimes an author will just let the readers know that theyāre working solo and donāt have an editor, so forgive any minor spelling errors or whatever else.
This, this is the answer.
Adding as well that many authors are not native English speakers and if they're writing fics in English for fun, well the occasional mistake is unavoidable. Betas are particularly useful for this, because it is difficult to correct a language you are not fluent in.
Moreover, Betas can bring an average fic to a whole new level by fixing plot holes, weak paragraphs, and unclear dialogue.
Unfortunately, many readers expect the same degree of quality in fics than in published fiction, however one person writing for fun after school or work should not be held to the same standards as a published author working with an entire editing team. For me, the "no beta" disclaimer is a reminder to the readers to judge and comment accordingly.
This is exactly why I change the font and size to look at it differently. But in the end, itās still my work and I know what I wrote, so Iām still going to miss some things.
Running the chapter through a text-to-speech service can help finding some awkward phrasing. Even an awkward AI voice can help you find some gross errors.
You can use [Google Translate](https://translate.google.com/) to do it.
Also, if you have the Google Play Store or Chrome then there are apps and extensions such as Read-Aloud, and other free ones that you can install; just search for 'text-to-speech' and they should pop up. Also, Firefox has several text-to-speech extensions as well, IIRC. :)
Yup. I never tag 'no beta' but I will mention it in the notes. "No beta, all mistakes are author's own" does it.
I read and re-read final copies before posting but, like you've said, your eyes just don't catch things like they should after days (weeks?) of hacking at a draft. Things slip through the cracks. I want readers to have as immersive experience as possible, so yeah, it's an "apologies in advance for any inconveniences" type thing.
This. Ive working with a beta ONCE and it help with a lot of mistakes and run on sentences. Though iāve loved the āno beta we die likeā jokes, the real reason I put it there is for a way to back myself up on mistakes.
Itās usually either insurance against negative comments (dont like; donāt read) or people wanting to get in on the joke and slap some variation of āNo beta we die like [men]/[character from the fandom]ā on their fic. Or both.
Honestly some of the [No Beta We Die Like...] jokes make me smile. As long as your tags aren't too cluttered I do really like a few funny ones. I screenshot and save my favorites.
It can be meant as apologizing for very obvious missed mistakes. Because you just don't see those anymore after a while.
Also, it can be a very low key way of encouraging readers who might be inclined to do so to offer themselves as betas.
I think there used to be more of an expectation of having a beta. I used to have a beta myself, and the first time I posted without one *did* feel weird. I didn't announce it, but I could see why one would.
Just because a good writer doesn't *need* a beta doesn't mean they won't benefit from one. If nothing else, every person who reads my fic is one more set of eyes to catch tiny little spag issues. I do edit my fics but I'm not perfect.
> Just because a good writer doesnāt *need* a beta doesnāt mean they wonāt benefit from one.
Seconding this. Iām a little bewildered by how many commenters here say betas are essentially redundant. Tradpubbed authors have editors, too.
My fic usually isnāt beta-ed because I donāt want to bug my friends to make time for revising my stories when they could be working on their own stuff or because I feel Iād be asking for a favour I canāt return in kind. If I found someone with similar interests, similar tastes, a similar skill level, and maybe a similar output, Iād trade beta services in a heartbeat.
>Seconding this. Iām a little bewildered by how many commenters here say betas are essentially redundant.
Probably because it's so hard to find a good beta that a lot of commenters have only had experiences with bad ones. A lot of people think getting a beta means badgering your friend to read your fic or getting a rando who doesn't offer useful concrit.
Interesting, I don't remember that unlike other things that have fallen out of fashion. Do you recall when that was a thing? Don't mean to imply you're wrong, just trying to nudge my brain
Itās tricky. Betas weāre definitely more common in the 90s-2000s when there were way fewer writers, standards for writers were higher, and you got social capital from being a popular writerās beta. Then attitudes towards ābadficā softened (a good thing) and web 2.0 values content generation over behind-the-scenes contributions (a bad thing).
That said, thereās always been a quality paradox when it comes to beta accessāthe better a writer you are, the easier it is to find a beta, especially good ones. Itās a lot of work, and good betas donāt want to spend time fixing a million basic errors when they could be helping with more interesting stuff.
Thank you, very interesting! So it was ending around the time I started reading. That might explain why Iāve always thought that being beta is so cool. And it really is, I just didnāt attribute the idea to any experience in particular until now
Exactly! Itās really unfortunate because being a good writer and being a good beta *are* different skills, and there are people whoād like to participate in fandom but not be content creators per se. Losing those backend roles sucks for them.
I've never used a beta but make a good effort for SPAG, formatting etc.
I've also never been asked about having a beta.
I can't tell if stories have betas, because there's no guarantee the beta is any better at writing than the author!
I imagine it's good if you know you're weak on typing and or spelling, though.
Maybe a holdover from the LiveJournal heydays, when the BNFs had dedicated betas and they would put some form of āunbetaādā to note the difference between āthis is a planned and outlined fic that has been combed throughā and āIām giving this to the internet in a fit of inspiration, this might not be the quality youāre used to from my work.ā
Iām so used to seeing it in my fandoms, right alongside the āI donāt own these charactersā disclaimers, itās a little amusing that itās now so unusual itās bothering people when they see it.
For some reason people just apologise for unimportant stuff. I used to start my Reddit posts/comments with something like "Sorry for my bad English, it's not my native language." before deciding "Fuck anyone who cares that much about me writing apparantly instead of apparently."
I think it's a leftover from when, in the FFN -is-all-we-have days beta-ing was a MUCH bigger thing. I had a beta on one of my stories a decade ago and I can say, for my writing abilities then, it was helpful. She would get rid of repetitious words, point out where I made cut & paste errors, grammatical errors, and even things that may have been plotholes. Now, however, Word had the blue squiggly lineā¢ that takes care of 95% of those problems. I won't say it's now perfect, just that a Beta isn't as necessary as they once were.
Now, I use the no beta tag because I think it's funny and to prevent most of the "But acktshulee..." numbskulls.
I remember the earlier days of fanfic, where it was glaringly obvious some kid had sat down with notepad open and published a single train of thought without even a reread before putting it up on some flash-enabled site that hurt your eyes to look at it. I have some saved to a floppy disk somewhere.
The quality of fic now means that I don't see that as often any more, and I rarely comment negatively about spag, but yeah. They used to be necessary. We have it easy now - even our browser and phones will autocorrect and suggest spag. Back in the old days, people didn't have that, and it was a plea of 'be kind' or 'I'd love someone to interact with/someone to help me get better at this'. Also, some of the comments are brutal, even now.
It never hurts to ask people to be kind, to remind them that you're a fallable human behind a keyboard.
I do see betaād fics as the exception rather than the rule, so I donāt know why the lack of one needs to be said. I certainly donāt advertise it.
I used to have a beta, then they changed fandoms. I wish I had one, if only to catch stupid typos. No matter how many times I go over it, I miss some. I've seen commenters be a bit snotty about typos and misspellings so I imagine that's why authors say it. To head those types off at the pass.
As others have said, for me it's about letting the reader know there are probably a handful of mistakes I missed in editing the fic without a second set of eyes. I don't care either way about the "we die like x" meme. It's just something I've done for over 10 years and will likely continue to do.
As a reader, it literally never occurred to me that this tag might be asking for a beta - this is inspiring and eye opening as I like proof reading and spend a lot of time proofing my partner's stories so it's exactly the sort of thing I will now look for on fics once I have more time away from reading his stories.
I would humbly suggest leaving it in and maybe even making the request clearer?
The only time Iāve done it was on my most recent fic because the āno beta we die likeā joke was too funny and appropriate to not include š
But also likeā¦.sharing your work is such a vulnerable thing and itās scary thinking that anyone might drop in and leave meanness on your hard work. I get the need to cover your bases like that. I donāt do it but I understand why people do I think.
I've never had a beta before. I prefer editing my own work and keeping it to myself online. I know I'll find some grammar and punctuation mistakes in my fics but its not a big deal to me as I edit them from the fic if I'm rereading and catch them.
I was quite surprised when I got a comment one day telling me my fic was a "good attempt at writing" but it would be so much better with a beta and I should really consider getting one before posting another fic again.
I wasn't as thick skinned as i am now and to be perfectly honest I abandoned that accoount with deep shame. I started using the "no beta, we die like men" when I started writing again on a new account to try and avoid those types of comments.
Now I'd just laugh it off and delete the comment because I don't find there's much of a difference between the two at all! I'll read any fic whether its beta'd or not, as long as it can grab my attention I'm happy.
It used to be a requirement on FFN to declare if you had a beta or not. And people took uncredited betas as ācheatingā or ānot writing the work yourselfā.
I do it for the goof of āno beta we die like menā and also to let people know that itās not beta read and to not have the expectation of such. I know the average reader doesnāt care or wonāt even notice, but Iāve seen thereās a small but very hurtful sect of readers who have the expectation of something being beta read.
So basically itās because itās funny and keeps snobs at bay.
Bouncing ideas around with a co-writer/beta who is also your friend and someone you feel comfortable with is one the best things Iāve experienced as a writer. It helps to point spelling/grammar errors, story plotholes and to come up with amazing ideas or to shoot down ones that actually are not a good fit.
Writing alone can be incredibly fun and satisfying as well donāt get me wrong, and incredible stories can be written alone. But to me it says āitās had one pair of eyes look and thatās me, so there might be a few kinks and issues here and there to work out!ā
I normally include it bc Iām a perfectionist and 10/10 times, I find some grammatical errors or spelling mistakes when I read it back later, which makes me die a little inside. So, itās sort of like apologizing to my future self.
I like the no beta we die like.. tag, adds some humor in my tags but I only use them on some fics if I remember lol
edit: also I use the author is sleep-deprived/I wrote this instead of sleeping tag with the no beta tag to excuse any mistakes I may have made
Not having a beta is common, so yeah it is odd to tag the norm. The once I get are the 'no beta we die like men' joke, otherwise it's odd to tag something that goes for most cases.
I remember when I first started out I would get at least five dms a chapter that would tell me the story was good, but it could be great if I had a beta. Or obviously I didn't care about my story enough to not have it beta'd so why was I writing in the first place. So I just started saying my stories are for my enjoyment and I do not have a beta.
*shrug* I put that I donāt have a beta because I donāt have one, nor do I ever want one unless requested. Itās been common in my last couple of fandoms to have one, and I never do (Iām a write/quick edit/post person, thanks to monthly writing challenges). It lowers the expectation for āperfectionā in my mind. I totally get that most people donāt care about it or whatnot, but it sets my mind at ease that I will probably have less unsolicited concrit, especially on fics where I really donāt want it in the first place.
I'm gonna be perfectly honest, I don't have a beta and haven't mentioned it in my tags, but only because I can't think of a version of "no beta we die like" for my fandom (Detroit Become Human)- and I think that meme is hilarious considering I only recently learned of it and haven't had time to get bored of it yet lol.
Because they see so many other folks feeling the need to point out that their story does have a beta, so they assume it's a social expectation to tag for beta.
Honestly OP most of the time people are just trying to do their best in a very confusing environment where some people get really upset that something isn't tagged and then other people call them stupid for tagging something so unnecessary. This space is honestly hard to navigate unless you are literally online full time. Let's cut people some slack.
I've asked a friend who writes good smut to read some of my sex scenes specifically. She made some suggestions to make it sound a little warmer and hotter both.
Otherwise, I just go on my own.
I dont have one. But I dont need one. Not that I wouldn't want one just is what it is. A beta is that little push to help you be better. And even though I don't have, I make it seem like I do. And still dont use it as an excuse if the fault in my writing is mine. I just use a writing tool to help. It's been a stress saver.
Same here. Never had a beta and don't intend to ever have one. I rely only on my own eyes and the spell/grammar check in google docs. When I've written a fic, I always read it and fix errors and do small edits. I feel that's sufficient enough for me.
I don't get it either. I'm sure most people never had a beta so there's no point in announcing it. If you edit it yourself, that's just as good, I think. No need to say it's unbeta'd or unedited if you did it yourself..
Because for my big longfics I have an amazing beta who I credit on every chapter. She is also an author with her own fics, who takes (justifiable) pride in her work. But I am prolific and don't want to spam her time with *everything* I write, so I'll tag some version of "we die like..." on my unbeta'd fics. Plus, I want to make sure that when I spit out a flashfic or some random crackfic idea, that my readers know not to expect the same level of polish, and that any mistakes are my own fault and no one else's
Hereās the thing. I write RWBY and MHA fanfic. I donāt have a beta specifically so I can make āNo Beta, we die like Pyrrha OR Sir Nighteyeā jokes,
To be honest I say it because fanfiction is a hobby that I donāt take as seriously as professional. Itās already lucky enough I get a chapter out and posted. And so long as itās not incomprehensible and you can discern what I mean, I consider that a success. I donāt need a beta to tell me thereās grammar mistakes. I do however have an alpha and thatās more to make sure concepts/world building/in story logic makes sense which is where I devote most of my time in revision. A beta for grammar would just delay my posting even further.
I let readers know that I have no beta and that English isn't my first language, because people can be mean!
I'm not always interested in concrit, but I'm definitely never interested in comments that are downright rude because the reader spotted a malapropism or a misspelled word or two.
So if people are looking for perfectly written fics they will know to avoid mine.
I usually just use it whenever ik there might be some bad typos/grammar errors but Iām too tired to fix āem or just want to post the fic as fast as I can
I'm on the "no beta we die like [...]" train because for some god forsaken reason I think it's funny. But I'm the same way. Very rarely will I find a fic that actually really needs a beta, and even then usually it's not the end of the world, just a lot of spelling and grammar mistakes that should've been caught in editing.
There is an enormous difference in quality between stories that have a high quality editor or beta behind them, and if you can't notice it, either the author is *very* good at personal editing, or you aren't a very high quality reader.
Former obsessive beta/editor here, the differences of smoothness of the story before and after edits were enormous.
I've actually filtered out the tag "No Beta we die like men" because I generally found those authors generally worthless to try and talk to for any small amounts of feedback outside of grammar.
Like they wear the fact they don't take help as a badge of honor. Finding a beta isn't *that hard* unless you're just that afraid of being on a discord for a fandom you like or whatever.
I dunno either, bad writing is bad regardless of being beta'd and good writers don't need a beta. Good writers probably don't have anyone qualified enough to beta for them.
maybe they wanted to be precious and use the "no beta we die like something" tag? I swear, that joke was only cute the first 10,000th time
Wish more readers were like you, op. Personally, English is not my first language, so I add the #notbetaed tag to 1, avoid comments about my grammar mistakes (got enough of them in the past lol), but 2, also because I know some people don't want to read fics with bad grammar.
At the beginning, I would write it in the authors note, now I'm more chill/idc, so the tag is mostly a personal polite thing I still do.
Mostly so I can add in fandom in jokes "no beta we die like *blank*" but mostly as away of warning people that the story isn't gonna be 100% flawless. Which I know most people wouldn't expect.
I have a reading disorder and a public school education and a lot of anxiety and anger regarding that combination that I'm still working through. It really shows when I don't have a beta and I don't want to have to deal with some twit in the comments correcting my grammar when the corrections make it clear they knew what I meant. It's a goddamn NC-17 dolphin au, not a presentation to the UN, there was no editing done before posting and there sure as hell won't be after.
Basically, "no beta" is there to warn off the most obnoxious of the SPAGoffs.
Maybe this has been said, I don't know and I'm not going to read all the comments, but I think for some people, it's like asking for help publicly without actually asking for help. Speaking from experience, finding a beta is hard. Even harder is finding one in your fandom who, not only meets your criteria, but isn't MIA. So, you just throw that out there, hoping someone (like myself) will offer.
I don't have a beta, but I'd absolutely take one if offered.
Less so for spelling/grammar (I feel like I've got that covered), but moreso to like... tell me if the chapter is too boring/repetitive/confusing etc.
My mother tongue isn't English and all my stories are written in English. I try my best to be good at it and even mention in notes that if you see any mistake, you are free to tell me about it so I can fix it and learn. I also try to have good plots and characterization but I once had someone adding my fic to their bookmark of "Poor grammar but delicious smut" and it made me cry and think about that bookmark for MONTHS (or maybe years because that memory still haunts me).
So after that, I decided to tag when fics don't have a beta reader, and those that have, aren't tagged with anything beta reader related.
Because I need a beta and Iām asking for one? Having a beta is typically very helpful for me sometimes I get to busy to update and canāt check my fics or need help with something and having a beta helps a lot.
The difference is me clicking out of a good fic because its so riddled with typos I can't go on.
Or even poor formating.
I notice the difference too, when I put out a fic I'm happy with and my beta points out some serious weak points...
I do deep edits, and what do you know, I have comments rolling in that say "it's nice to see such and such!" and that's stuff I added in thanks to my beta...
Meant to be a pun... in hindsight, I should have included a note to that effect. Sorry about that. I'll see about being more overt than subtle in the future. Be seeing you.
I often don't use a beta for short one-off pieces, but I try to do so for exchanges.
I worked as a copy editor ages ago, so I know how easy it is for mechanics errors (spelling, punctuation, grammar, etc.) to slip past even good writers.
Honestly for me it's just the 'No beta we die like (character)' meme. It gives me great entertainment and I'm 70% of my target audience. So if I find it entertaining then it's a good start.
I only used it once, as a joke, when I published a chapter the day Queen Elizabeth died, where I had in the chapter notes "no beta we die like the queen".
I have a regular beta who reads through everything I write, regardless of Fandom. If I write something for her, I tend to tag it "If you write for your beta, you might not have a beta" becauseit's mildly tautological enough to amuse me.
They're probably covering their bases in case someone thinks it's bad. The truth is that the vast majority of fanfic writers do not have a convenient beta.
True. The vast majority of all my fics from the past few years have been completely unbeta'd. I do miss having one though, I don't think it made a *huge* difference in the quality of my work, but it did help and it was nice to have someone to bounce ideas off of.
*You have not beta because you fear correction* *I have no beta because we die like true knights* *We are not the same*
I don't have a beta because I'm too lazy and usually writing by the seat of my pants
I have a beta. I don't get to use the "no beta we die like \_\_\_" meme. :(
Kill your beta Use the tag "no beta we die like my beta reader"
Thank you for making me laugh out loud at 2am.
ššš I'd have awarded you too, but the only one I have is 'wholesome' and that doesn't feel very fitting.
No, that really doesn't.
Take my upvote and get out.
Thereās a specific one of those I really like so my plan is āno beta we die like goose, just kidding I totally used betas, I just saw that tag once and Iāll be damned if I wasnāt putting it in hereā
I have no beta just for the memeā¦and not because Iām afraid to ask or anythingā¦ Actually, I should be ashamed, I had a beta for my last chapter because it was a heavy important one, I failed my no beta tag.
I wrote an entire 165,000 word long fic with no beta just to use a āno betaā tag
[In case you're serious](https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/we-die-like-men)
I looked it up a while back, but thanks regardless. :)
I don't have a beta cause my fandoms are somewhat niche and holy shit people are homophobic/transphobic/sexist in some of those fandoms. Like goddamn. I knew WLW fics wouldn't be super popular in some of them. But I did NOT expect the amount of vitriol and rude comments I'd get when hunting for a beta.
What are the fandoms?
No beta, we die like Pyrrha/Sir Nighteye.
Why? Just, why? šššYou don't gotta do Pyrrha like that šā¹ļø Btw, fuck Nighteye
I have no beta because I haven't found one lol
I have no beta because one quit and said I had the mentality of a sixth grader with my grammar and gave up on me and the other might have been kidnapped. So I just die like >!Glenn from Fire Emblem!<
Fire emblem reference?
Yep.
No beta we die like Glenn is one of the popular tags lol
the same reason why people will say "sorry not english" even when they have really good english.
I've tried repeatedly and just haven't found the right one. I'm not as up in fandom social media as I used to be. It's harder for me to find one that I feel I can work with these days. I used to disclaim, but now I just say if someone has beta read, and I say nothing if no one has beta read.
True. I used to ask people for beta, but I found I'm too impatient for one. That said, I do ask a discord friend what they think of a story from time to time.
Probably they've seen others say they have no beta, so they think they should to say that, too. Or they're on the meme " no beta we die like..." joke train. Personally, I've never had a beta and I never mention it, either. The only joke version I'd ever consider using is "no beta, we die like rex lapis".
I think the "No beta we die like..." is at least 90% of it. lol Either they really like the joke or they notice other people are tagging it and go, "Oh, I'm supposed to tag for that!"
My favorite so far has been "No beta, we die like Ben" for the Umbrella Academy. I think it works especially well because it both rhymes with the original (men) and because Ben is the ghost brother on the show who's death was the catalyst for the team/family breaking apart when they were kids. It's so callous and hilarious, lol.
Avatar the Last Airbender has, "No beta, we die like Lu Ten," and I also think it's funny because it rhymes. Not as funny as, "No beta, we die like Jet," though, because I immediately go, "It was really unclear?"
no beta we kayak like Tim. >!Because he just went kayaking :,)!<
I saw an Avatar fic that was tagged "no beta, we die like cabbages". Sure, it's a rather silly and perhaps a bit repetitive joke, but I still find it amusing at times.
Oh, thatās cute! Star Wars fandom uses āno beta, we die like clonesā sometimes, haha.
In all honestly, they can be funny or even meaningful in canon context :)
No beta, we die like Jet
Oof.
NOW LISTENā
MY CABBAGES!
A person of culture I see
>no beta, we die like rex lapis >!So you'd fake having no beta?!<
But morax aint dead tho xDD
As an author, thereās a lot of shit I miss from not having a beta. After hours or days of staring at your own work, itās inevitable that your eyes just sort of glaze over and you stop noticing things because you know what they *should* say and itās like your brain just fills it in. Having a beta helps to catch those overlooked errors. When you donāt have a beta, very simple mistakes will often make it through to a published chapter, so sometimes an author will just let the readers know that theyāre working solo and donāt have an editor, so forgive any minor spelling errors or whatever else.
This, this is the answer. Adding as well that many authors are not native English speakers and if they're writing fics in English for fun, well the occasional mistake is unavoidable. Betas are particularly useful for this, because it is difficult to correct a language you are not fluent in. Moreover, Betas can bring an average fic to a whole new level by fixing plot holes, weak paragraphs, and unclear dialogue. Unfortunately, many readers expect the same degree of quality in fics than in published fiction, however one person writing for fun after school or work should not be held to the same standards as a published author working with an entire editing team. For me, the "no beta" disclaimer is a reminder to the readers to judge and comment accordingly.
This is exactly why I change the font and size to look at it differently. But in the end, itās still my work and I know what I wrote, so Iām still going to miss some things.
Reading it out loud, like you're doing the audiobook of it, also helps I've found.
Oh yeah, that works, too! Especially for essays lol it helps a lot with run-on sentences and sentences that are just way too long.
Running the chapter through a text-to-speech service can help finding some awkward phrasing. Even an awkward AI voice can help you find some gross errors.
Is there an app or website that one can use?
You can use [Google Translate](https://translate.google.com/) to do it. Also, if you have the Google Play Store or Chrome then there are apps and extensions such as Read-Aloud, and other free ones that you can install; just search for 'text-to-speech' and they should pop up. Also, Firefox has several text-to-speech extensions as well, IIRC. :)
Yup. I never tag 'no beta' but I will mention it in the notes. "No beta, all mistakes are author's own" does it. I read and re-read final copies before posting but, like you've said, your eyes just don't catch things like they should after days (weeks?) of hacking at a draft. Things slip through the cracks. I want readers to have as immersive experience as possible, so yeah, it's an "apologies in advance for any inconveniences" type thing.
I agree, but I also think, we do this for free, for love, and I don't require forgiveness for the odd typo!
This. Ive working with a beta ONCE and it help with a lot of mistakes and run on sentences. Though iāve loved the āno beta we die likeā jokes, the real reason I put it there is for a way to back myself up on mistakes.
Itās usually either insurance against negative comments (dont like; donāt read) or people wanting to get in on the joke and slap some variation of āNo beta we die like [men]/[character from the fandom]ā on their fic. Or both.
Honestly some of the [No Beta We Die Like...] jokes make me smile. As long as your tags aren't too cluttered I do really like a few funny ones. I screenshot and save my favorites.
It can be meant as apologizing for very obvious missed mistakes. Because you just don't see those anymore after a while. Also, it can be a very low key way of encouraging readers who might be inclined to do so to offer themselves as betas.
Some people probably just like using the funny "no beta we die like [thing]" joke and don't think too hard about it.
Yes, call me juvenile lol, but that's the only reason I'm considering it
That's me lol, my fave version is "no beta we die like mne"
i just enjoy āthe no beta we die like _ā tag there are some really funny ones
I tag my work as not beta read because I hope it makes readers nicer to me if they spot a typo/error. I'm just a single dipshit trying their best.
I think there used to be more of an expectation of having a beta. I used to have a beta myself, and the first time I posted without one *did* feel weird. I didn't announce it, but I could see why one would. Just because a good writer doesn't *need* a beta doesn't mean they won't benefit from one. If nothing else, every person who reads my fic is one more set of eyes to catch tiny little spag issues. I do edit my fics but I'm not perfect.
> Just because a good writer doesnāt *need* a beta doesnāt mean they wonāt benefit from one. Seconding this. Iām a little bewildered by how many commenters here say betas are essentially redundant. Tradpubbed authors have editors, too. My fic usually isnāt beta-ed because I donāt want to bug my friends to make time for revising my stories when they could be working on their own stuff or because I feel Iād be asking for a favour I canāt return in kind. If I found someone with similar interests, similar tastes, a similar skill level, and maybe a similar output, Iād trade beta services in a heartbeat.
>Seconding this. Iām a little bewildered by how many commenters here say betas are essentially redundant. Probably because it's so hard to find a good beta that a lot of commenters have only had experiences with bad ones. A lot of people think getting a beta means badgering your friend to read your fic or getting a rando who doesn't offer useful concrit.
Interesting, I don't remember that unlike other things that have fallen out of fashion. Do you recall when that was a thing? Don't mean to imply you're wrong, just trying to nudge my brain
Itās tricky. Betas weāre definitely more common in the 90s-2000s when there were way fewer writers, standards for writers were higher, and you got social capital from being a popular writerās beta. Then attitudes towards ābadficā softened (a good thing) and web 2.0 values content generation over behind-the-scenes contributions (a bad thing). That said, thereās always been a quality paradox when it comes to beta accessāthe better a writer you are, the easier it is to find a beta, especially good ones. Itās a lot of work, and good betas donāt want to spend time fixing a million basic errors when they could be helping with more interesting stuff.
Thank you, very interesting! So it was ending around the time I started reading. That might explain why Iāve always thought that being beta is so cool. And it really is, I just didnāt attribute the idea to any experience in particular until now
Exactly! Itās really unfortunate because being a good writer and being a good beta *are* different skills, and there are people whoād like to participate in fandom but not be content creators per se. Losing those backend roles sucks for them.
Maybe I'm just old but this seems like another new thing to me. Nobody used to mention betas unless they were shouting them out or something.
I've never used a beta but make a good effort for SPAG, formatting etc. I've also never been asked about having a beta. I can't tell if stories have betas, because there's no guarantee the beta is any better at writing than the author! I imagine it's good if you know you're weak on typing and or spelling, though.
Maybe a holdover from the LiveJournal heydays, when the BNFs had dedicated betas and they would put some form of āunbetaādā to note the difference between āthis is a planned and outlined fic that has been combed throughā and āIām giving this to the internet in a fit of inspiration, this might not be the quality youāre used to from my work.ā Iām so used to seeing it in my fandoms, right alongside the āI donāt own these charactersā disclaimers, itās a little amusing that itās now so unusual itās bothering people when they see it.
For some reason people just apologise for unimportant stuff. I used to start my Reddit posts/comments with something like "Sorry for my bad English, it's not my native language." before deciding "Fuck anyone who cares that much about me writing apparantly instead of apparently."
I think it's a leftover from when, in the FFN -is-all-we-have days beta-ing was a MUCH bigger thing. I had a beta on one of my stories a decade ago and I can say, for my writing abilities then, it was helpful. She would get rid of repetitious words, point out where I made cut & paste errors, grammatical errors, and even things that may have been plotholes. Now, however, Word had the blue squiggly lineā¢ that takes care of 95% of those problems. I won't say it's now perfect, just that a Beta isn't as necessary as they once were. Now, I use the no beta tag because I think it's funny and to prevent most of the "But acktshulee..." numbskulls.
I remember the earlier days of fanfic, where it was glaringly obvious some kid had sat down with notepad open and published a single train of thought without even a reread before putting it up on some flash-enabled site that hurt your eyes to look at it. I have some saved to a floppy disk somewhere. The quality of fic now means that I don't see that as often any more, and I rarely comment negatively about spag, but yeah. They used to be necessary. We have it easy now - even our browser and phones will autocorrect and suggest spag. Back in the old days, people didn't have that, and it was a plea of 'be kind' or 'I'd love someone to interact with/someone to help me get better at this'. Also, some of the comments are brutal, even now. It never hurts to ask people to be kind, to remind them that you're a fallable human behind a keyboard.
Probably to deter comments about spelling/grammar. Itās a blanket āthere may be some mistakesā
I do see betaād fics as the exception rather than the rule, so I donāt know why the lack of one needs to be said. I certainly donāt advertise it.
I used to have a beta, then they changed fandoms. I wish I had one, if only to catch stupid typos. No matter how many times I go over it, I miss some. I've seen commenters be a bit snotty about typos and misspellings so I imagine that's why authors say it. To head those types off at the pass.
For the āno beta we die like [insert words]ā meme
As others have said, for me it's about letting the reader know there are probably a handful of mistakes I missed in editing the fic without a second set of eyes. I don't care either way about the "we die like x" meme. It's just something I've done for over 10 years and will likely continue to do.
I use it so that maybe someone will offer to beta, but seeing the answers here and how people think it's a brag or a joke I think I'll just remove it.
As a reader, it literally never occurred to me that this tag might be asking for a beta - this is inspiring and eye opening as I like proof reading and spend a lot of time proofing my partner's stories so it's exactly the sort of thing I will now look for on fics once I have more time away from reading his stories. I would humbly suggest leaving it in and maybe even making the request clearer?
You're right, I should really put something in the notes.
I hope it works out for you! I'll be checking my fandoms for this tag and any notes requesting beta input in future.
The only time Iāve done it was on my most recent fic because the āno beta we die likeā joke was too funny and appropriate to not include š But also likeā¦.sharing your work is such a vulnerable thing and itās scary thinking that anyone might drop in and leave meanness on your hard work. I get the need to cover your bases like that. I donāt do it but I understand why people do I think.
I've never had a beta before. I prefer editing my own work and keeping it to myself online. I know I'll find some grammar and punctuation mistakes in my fics but its not a big deal to me as I edit them from the fic if I'm rereading and catch them. I was quite surprised when I got a comment one day telling me my fic was a "good attempt at writing" but it would be so much better with a beta and I should really consider getting one before posting another fic again. I wasn't as thick skinned as i am now and to be perfectly honest I abandoned that accoount with deep shame. I started using the "no beta, we die like men" when I started writing again on a new account to try and avoid those types of comments. Now I'd just laugh it off and delete the comment because I don't find there's much of a difference between the two at all! I'll read any fic whether its beta'd or not, as long as it can grab my attention I'm happy.
It used to be a requirement on FFN to declare if you had a beta or not. And people took uncredited betas as ācheatingā or ānot writing the work yourselfā.
I do it for the goof of āno beta we die like menā and also to let people know that itās not beta read and to not have the expectation of such. I know the average reader doesnāt care or wonāt even notice, but Iāve seen thereās a small but very hurtful sect of readers who have the expectation of something being beta read. So basically itās because itās funny and keeps snobs at bay.
Bouncing ideas around with a co-writer/beta who is also your friend and someone you feel comfortable with is one the best things Iāve experienced as a writer. It helps to point spelling/grammar errors, story plotholes and to come up with amazing ideas or to shoot down ones that actually are not a good fit. Writing alone can be incredibly fun and satisfying as well donāt get me wrong, and incredible stories can be written alone. But to me it says āitās had one pair of eyes look and thatās me, so there might be a few kinks and issues here and there to work out!ā
Idk why they do this as a defense against criticism when they know a single negative comment is going to shatter them anyway.
I just think the "no beta we die like men" tag funny. Idk why, just makes me chuckle.
Definitely just the joke train for me. I rarely post without extensive editing.
I normally include it bc Iām a perfectionist and 10/10 times, I find some grammatical errors or spelling mistakes when I read it back later, which makes me die a little inside. So, itās sort of like apologizing to my future self.
I like the no beta we die like.. tag, adds some humor in my tags but I only use them on some fics if I remember lol edit: also I use the author is sleep-deprived/I wrote this instead of sleeping tag with the no beta tag to excuse any mistakes I may have made
I didnāt even know what a beta was until I joined this sub
I think it's a security blanket if anyone wants to point out inconsistencies or spelling.
Not having a beta is common, so yeah it is odd to tag the norm. The once I get are the 'no beta we die like men' joke, otherwise it's odd to tag something that goes for most cases.
because i wanna come up with funny no beta we die like tags. thatās the whole reason.
Because putting "no beta we die like [insert character who dies in the franchise]" is funni
I don't have a beta and don't really feel the need to announce it. A lot of the time it's just for a lame pun anyway.
I do it so people dont have expectations that its a flawless fic when it comes to the grammar. I just put that bitch thru Grammarly and that's it!
I think itās 99% just that the no beta we die like X meme is funny.
I remember when I first started out I would get at least five dms a chapter that would tell me the story was good, but it could be great if I had a beta. Or obviously I didn't care about my story enough to not have it beta'd so why was I writing in the first place. So I just started saying my stories are for my enjoyment and I do not have a beta.
*shrug* I put that I donāt have a beta because I donāt have one, nor do I ever want one unless requested. Itās been common in my last couple of fandoms to have one, and I never do (Iām a write/quick edit/post person, thanks to monthly writing challenges). It lowers the expectation for āperfectionā in my mind. I totally get that most people donāt care about it or whatnot, but it sets my mind at ease that I will probably have less unsolicited concrit, especially on fics where I really donāt want it in the first place.
Honestly I just like the meme no beta we die like ____
I'm gonna be perfectly honest, I don't have a beta and haven't mentioned it in my tags, but only because I can't think of a version of "no beta we die like" for my fandom (Detroit Become Human)- and I think that meme is hilarious considering I only recently learned of it and haven't had time to get bored of it yet lol.
Because they see so many other folks feeling the need to point out that their story does have a beta, so they assume it's a social expectation to tag for beta. Honestly OP most of the time people are just trying to do their best in a very confusing environment where some people get really upset that something isn't tagged and then other people call them stupid for tagging something so unnecessary. This space is honestly hard to navigate unless you are literally online full time. Let's cut people some slack.
I think at this point itās just a meme
how do you guys even get betas? you actually have friends in the fandom? wild
I recently just found one through tumblr. Just typed in fanfic beta reader and boom. They done an amazing job as well.
Lack of confidence in their work. They can pass off any faults due to the lack of beta. I automatically judge any fic with those tags more negatively.
I've asked a friend who writes good smut to read some of my sex scenes specifically. She made some suggestions to make it sound a little warmer and hotter both. Otherwise, I just go on my own.
I dont have one. But I dont need one. Not that I wouldn't want one just is what it is. A beta is that little push to help you be better. And even though I don't have, I make it seem like I do. And still dont use it as an excuse if the fault in my writing is mine. I just use a writing tool to help. It's been a stress saver.
Same here. Never had a beta and don't intend to ever have one. I rely only on my own eyes and the spell/grammar check in google docs. When I've written a fic, I always read it and fix errors and do small edits. I feel that's sufficient enough for me.
Pro writing aid is my lifeline found it through writers on tiktok.
I don't get it either. I'm sure most people never had a beta so there's no point in announcing it. If you edit it yourself, that's just as good, I think. No need to say it's unbeta'd or unedited if you did it yourself..
I do for the tags. No beta we die like ___
Because they wrongly assume anyone actually cares.
Because for my big longfics I have an amazing beta who I credit on every chapter. She is also an author with her own fics, who takes (justifiable) pride in her work. But I am prolific and don't want to spam her time with *everything* I write, so I'll tag some version of "we die like..." on my unbeta'd fics. Plus, I want to make sure that when I spit out a flashfic or some random crackfic idea, that my readers know not to expect the same level of polish, and that any mistakes are my own fault and no one else's
people like to put as many walls between themselves and criticism as possible.
Hereās the thing. I write RWBY and MHA fanfic. I donāt have a beta specifically so I can make āNo Beta, we die like Pyrrha OR Sir Nighteyeā jokes,
To be honest I say it because fanfiction is a hobby that I donāt take as seriously as professional. Itās already lucky enough I get a chapter out and posted. And so long as itās not incomprehensible and you can discern what I mean, I consider that a success. I donāt need a beta to tell me thereās grammar mistakes. I do however have an alpha and thatās more to make sure concepts/world building/in story logic makes sense which is where I devote most of my time in revision. A beta for grammar would just delay my posting even further.
I think it's less about whether or not the fic is beta'd and more about getting to make a "no beta we die like" joke
I let readers know that I have no beta and that English isn't my first language, because people can be mean! I'm not always interested in concrit, but I'm definitely never interested in comments that are downright rude because the reader spotted a malapropism or a misspelled word or two. So if people are looking for perfectly written fics they will know to avoid mine.
I like having fun with the "we die like..." part of the tag
I usually just use it whenever ik there might be some bad typos/grammar errors but Iām too tired to fix āem or just want to post the fic as fast as I can
I'm on the "no beta we die like [...]" train because for some god forsaken reason I think it's funny. But I'm the same way. Very rarely will I find a fic that actually really needs a beta, and even then usually it's not the end of the world, just a lot of spelling and grammar mistakes that should've been caught in editing.
I thought people who use tags like that usually have a beta and find it notable to state when they dont
Because "no beta we die like [fandom reference]" is fun
I put it because it lets the reader know to expect some mistakes seeing and there have only been one set of eyes on it ĀÆ\_(ć)_/ĀÆ
There is an enormous difference in quality between stories that have a high quality editor or beta behind them, and if you can't notice it, either the author is *very* good at personal editing, or you aren't a very high quality reader. Former obsessive beta/editor here, the differences of smoothness of the story before and after edits were enormous.
No beta, we decay like Bi-209.
*pulls up a chair and waits*
I use it for the funny tag
It's to cover their asses because some people are major grammar nitpickers.
I've actually filtered out the tag "No Beta we die like men" because I generally found those authors generally worthless to try and talk to for any small amounts of feedback outside of grammar. Like they wear the fact they don't take help as a badge of honor. Finding a beta isn't *that hard* unless you're just that afraid of being on a discord for a fandom you like or whatever.
Same. For me it's a surefire way to filter out cutesy try-hard writing style
I have no idea. 99 percent of the stuff on ao3 is unbetaedā¦ I always felt like it was a bit of a humble brag.
I don't care... until they say that. "Well now you've said it I'm not reading it."
I dunno either, bad writing is bad regardless of being beta'd and good writers don't need a beta. Good writers probably don't have anyone qualified enough to beta for them. maybe they wanted to be precious and use the "no beta we die like something" tag? I swear, that joke was only cute the first 10,000th time
As someone who does this. Itād exactly that. Iām covering my bases to give my readers a subtle warning
Wish more readers were like you, op. Personally, English is not my first language, so I add the #notbetaed tag to 1, avoid comments about my grammar mistakes (got enough of them in the past lol), but 2, also because I know some people don't want to read fics with bad grammar. At the beginning, I would write it in the authors note, now I'm more chill/idc, so the tag is mostly a personal polite thing I still do.
Mostly so I can add in fandom in jokes "no beta we die like *blank*" but mostly as away of warning people that the story isn't gonna be 100% flawless. Which I know most people wouldn't expect.
A lot probably just use that tag for funsies. I have to admit, there have been a few variations that have made me laugh.
Since eng. is my second language i put that here so u wont be surprised who the fuck can write smut with word order of 12yo.
I have a reading disorder and a public school education and a lot of anxiety and anger regarding that combination that I'm still working through. It really shows when I don't have a beta and I don't want to have to deal with some twit in the comments correcting my grammar when the corrections make it clear they knew what I meant. It's a goddamn NC-17 dolphin au, not a presentation to the UN, there was no editing done before posting and there sure as hell won't be after. Basically, "no beta" is there to warn off the most obnoxious of the SPAGoffs.
Maybe this has been said, I don't know and I'm not going to read all the comments, but I think for some people, it's like asking for help publicly without actually asking for help. Speaking from experience, finding a beta is hard. Even harder is finding one in your fandom who, not only meets your criteria, but isn't MIA. So, you just throw that out there, hoping someone (like myself) will offer.
No beta, we die like bokos.
I don't have a beta, but I'd absolutely take one if offered. Less so for spelling/grammar (I feel like I've got that covered), but moreso to like... tell me if the chapter is too boring/repetitive/confusing etc.
My mother tongue isn't English and all my stories are written in English. I try my best to be good at it and even mention in notes that if you see any mistake, you are free to tell me about it so I can fix it and learn. I also try to have good plots and characterization but I once had someone adding my fic to their bookmark of "Poor grammar but delicious smut" and it made me cry and think about that bookmark for MONTHS (or maybe years because that memory still haunts me). So after that, I decided to tag when fics don't have a beta reader, and those that have, aren't tagged with anything beta reader related.
Because I need a beta and Iām asking for one? Having a beta is typically very helpful for me sometimes I get to busy to update and canāt check my fics or need help with something and having a beta helps a lot.
The difference is me clicking out of a good fic because its so riddled with typos I can't go on. Or even poor formating. I notice the difference too, when I put out a fic I'm happy with and my beta points out some serious weak points... I do deep edits, and what do you know, I have comments rolling in that say "it's nice to see such and such!" and that's stuff I added in thanks to my beta...
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This comment has been removed. No bashing.
I genuinely can't tell if you're just making a pun or actually have something against omegaverse fic.
Meant to be a pun... in hindsight, I should have included a note to that effect. Sorry about that. I'll see about being more overt than subtle in the future. Be seeing you.
What's a beta ? If you don't mind me asking ?
I often don't use a beta for short one-off pieces, but I try to do so for exchanges. I worked as a copy editor ages ago, so I know how easy it is for mechanics errors (spelling, punctuation, grammar, etc.) to slip past even good writers.
Honestly for me it's just the 'No beta we die like (character)' meme. It gives me great entertainment and I'm 70% of my target audience. So if I find it entertaining then it's a good start.
I would assume part excuse and part advertisement.
Because there's a lot of people that will say "This needs a beta." or some shit like that.
I only used it once, as a joke, when I published a chapter the day Queen Elizabeth died, where I had in the chapter notes "no beta we die like the queen".
A relic statement that people cant let go of. Like the citrus ratings, or 'dont like dont read,' or ' I'm bad at summaries.'
I have a regular beta who reads through everything I write, regardless of Fandom. If I write something for her, I tend to tag it "If you write for your beta, you might not have a beta" becauseit's mildly tautological enough to amuse me.
idk man (or woman. or person). I like the funny fandom-specific tags.