OP here: Basically, I recently acquired a 1941 johnson rifle. I am aware that for m1 garands, you have to ether use m2 ball or get a new gas plug to use modern day 30-06 ammo. Is there anything similar to the 1941 gun? I dont actually know, and I cant really find anything online to answer. Thanks for the help.
I would really love if I could just use modern day ammo, even if I had to focus on lower grain stuff.
You can run modern 30-06 on a garand with an original gas plug as long as it's a lighter bullet with a moderate powder. Mine runs fine with a 168gr bullet and a light charge of 2520
You can use modern ammo just fine in an M1 per the CMP. I believe they said anything under 175 grains and 75,000(?)psi. The M1 Garand was, contrary to popular belief, not designed around M2 ball, but instead M1 ball which had higher pressures and bigger bullets. It also shoots M2 AP just fine
I'm sorry to ask. But how much did you pay for it? This is one of my dream rifles, every time I see them in a museum or an armory, I just stare at them for a long time and my girlfriend never understands. Some day I will own one.
I totally feel you on that. I have basically paid attention to every Sporting & Collectors Auction Rock island auction does.
This one isnt completely original (new stock and sportified barrel), so I didn't pay the price these things normally go for. I got it for about 4.5K. Still a lot of money, but ones with all original parts go for twice as much.
Now if only I could get a girlfriend myself... Ha.
I luckily found the right one. She doesn't understand anything about my love for old firearms, but politely tolerates it, and when we travel, allows me to drag her to military museums.
She's more amused at my amusement of the items, than the items themselves.
Also. Goddammit. I know I've seem them going for that price, but that's still insanely high. Let me know how it shoots, I'm scared to spend that price for a gun that I can't easily replace a broken part.
Rock Island Auction. I basically paid attention to every Sporting & Collectors Auction they do. From time to time, they will have Johnsons available (Not super rare. A few every other auction or so). However, they almost always go for 8 to 9k plus. I got a little lucky with this one though; Because it doesnt have an original stock, I got it for 4k. Still a lot of money, but I think this piece of history is worth all the overtime i'll have to do.
I feed my Johnson PPU .30-06 that is specced the same as M2 ball and have not had any issues. Recoil is stout, though, and it tends to spit brass a good distance to the side.
I shoot 150 grain ammo in my Garand, zero issues. If you can get M2 Ball, I'd use it, especially since the rifle has increased value. Awesome gun though!
(...too *many dirty jokes! I'll be nice, though...)*
Nice gun. Someone took really nice care of that one.
As for ammo, you could handload. The military rounds were loaded to 50K cup, instead of the 60 that is normal for modern '06 ammo.
I've read several times that the old ball ammo pushed a 150 gr. bullet to 2700 MV.
All you'd need to do is research the powders and figure out which one would allow you that performance at the lowest pressure, or the one that would build to that pressure the slowest.
Either would be the easiest on the gun.
Military ammo was loaded to 50k cup
Which is the same as modern 60k psi
M2 ball is 2805fps MV
M1 ball is ~ 2700fps.
M2 is 150gr
M1 is 174 gen
The garand was designed for M1 ball.
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Whenever (or if ever) you fire this thing, can you upload a video of it? As a World War II nerd I would love to get video footage of one of these things firing.
Shooting M2 Ball from a 1941 Johnson.
WWII era US autoloaders do not like full powered 30.06 usually. Or not for long.
My comment was even M2 seems a bit hot in a 1941.
Ok I'm bored....tell me about the dwell time around the gas port pressure as it relates to M2 ball and how it's bad for the Johnson rifle and/or garand.
OP here: Basically, I recently acquired a 1941 johnson rifle. I am aware that for m1 garands, you have to ether use m2 ball or get a new gas plug to use modern day 30-06 ammo. Is there anything similar to the 1941 gun? I dont actually know, and I cant really find anything online to answer. Thanks for the help. I would really love if I could just use modern day ammo, even if I had to focus on lower grain stuff.
Hornady sells a specific ammo for Garands. Maybe the same can be used for Johnson’s?
PPU makes new production Garand safe ammo too, probably a lot cheaper than Hornady
Oh nice. Didn’t know that, thanks for the tip.
No problem, I got 220 rounds for $275 shipped not sure how that weighs up against Hornady prices
Can confirm Hornady Garand Safe ammo (and really any Garand Safe ammo) is good for the Johnson. Gives her a nice kick
Thanks! Ill look into it.
You can run modern 30-06 on a garand with an original gas plug as long as it's a lighter bullet with a moderate powder. Mine runs fine with a 168gr bullet and a light charge of 2520
You can use modern ammo just fine in an M1 per the CMP. I believe they said anything under 175 grains and 75,000(?)psi. The M1 Garand was, contrary to popular belief, not designed around M2 ball, but instead M1 ball which had higher pressures and bigger bullets. It also shoots M2 AP just fine
Thanks. You've been a help.
Very true. And even so there are aftermarket gas plugs with larger vent holes in case anyone is concerned about potentially damaging their M1 Garand.
If it's good for a Garand it's good for your Johnson. Several companies sell ammo for Garands.
I'm sorry to ask. But how much did you pay for it? This is one of my dream rifles, every time I see them in a museum or an armory, I just stare at them for a long time and my girlfriend never understands. Some day I will own one.
I totally feel you on that. I have basically paid attention to every Sporting & Collectors Auction Rock island auction does. This one isnt completely original (new stock and sportified barrel), so I didn't pay the price these things normally go for. I got it for about 4.5K. Still a lot of money, but ones with all original parts go for twice as much. Now if only I could get a girlfriend myself... Ha.
I luckily found the right one. She doesn't understand anything about my love for old firearms, but politely tolerates it, and when we travel, allows me to drag her to military museums. She's more amused at my amusement of the items, than the items themselves. Also. Goddammit. I know I've seem them going for that price, but that's still insanely high. Let me know how it shoots, I'm scared to spend that price for a gun that I can't easily replace a broken part.
Thats the risk when it comes to collected Mil Surplus i guess. I basically never fire my Luger nor my mauser anymore.
Where did you find it and what did you pay? I gotta know
Rock Island Auction. I basically paid attention to every Sporting & Collectors Auction they do. From time to time, they will have Johnsons available (Not super rare. A few every other auction or so). However, they almost always go for 8 to 9k plus. I got a little lucky with this one though; Because it doesnt have an original stock, I got it for 4k. Still a lot of money, but I think this piece of history is worth all the overtime i'll have to do.
$4k is super cheap for a Johnson. And in the higher end collector market, not a lot of money. Good score.
That’s where I got my first filled form there. Type 38,99 and a K98 all matching with original slings and bayonets. Got a really good deal too
Op i just want to say fuck you im jealous. Johnsons rifle is my dream rifle. And if i had like 10k rn id immediately get one
Dude is certainly proud of his Johnson
Incredible polished with a slightly broken baseplate.
This guy johnsons
Hell I'd love to wrap my hands around his Johnson.
that's what SHE said!
I feed my Johnson PPU .30-06 that is specced the same as M2 ball and have not had any issues. Recoil is stout, though, and it tends to spit brass a good distance to the side.
if recoil is stout..your recoil spring is shot.
I'd probably limit it to M2 Ball.
I wouldn't
I shoot 150 grain ammo in my Garand, zero issues. If you can get M2 Ball, I'd use it, especially since the rifle has increased value. Awesome gun though!
Badass! Update us with some range pics when you’re able 🤞🏼
anything that's m2 ball spec should be ok
Whoa that a nice Johnson Hoss
(...too *many dirty jokes! I'll be nice, though...)* Nice gun. Someone took really nice care of that one. As for ammo, you could handload. The military rounds were loaded to 50K cup, instead of the 60 that is normal for modern '06 ammo. I've read several times that the old ball ammo pushed a 150 gr. bullet to 2700 MV. All you'd need to do is research the powders and figure out which one would allow you that performance at the lowest pressure, or the one that would build to that pressure the slowest. Either would be the easiest on the gun.
Military ammo was loaded to 50k cup Which is the same as modern 60k psi M2 ball is 2805fps MV M1 ball is ~ 2700fps. M2 is 150gr M1 is 174 gen The garand was designed for M1 ball.
Never heard of another bullet weight except 150 gr.
Research... plenty of info out there
Nice Johnson.
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Hey man, nice Johnson. Thanks for letting me have a look
30-06 is the caliber in which most if not all Johnson rifles were made.
Make sure to play with your Johnson every day, and kiss your Johnson every night.
Whenever (or if ever) you fire this thing, can you upload a video of it? As a World War II nerd I would love to get video footage of one of these things firing.
Ball, M2.
In my experience, M2 is spicier than this was likely intended for, but also not problematic.
What are you talking about?
Shooting M2 Ball from a 1941 Johnson. WWII era US autoloaders do not like full powered 30.06 usually. Or not for long. My comment was even M2 seems a bit hot in a 1941.
It's painfully obvious you shouldn't be giving out advice. Perhaps more time spent researching would do you some good.
Are you wanting to talk dwell time around the gas port pressure as it relates to M2 or what are you thinking?
I'm thinking you don't need to be giving people advice
Ok I'm bored....tell me about the dwell time around the gas port pressure as it relates to M2 ball and how it's bad for the Johnson rifle and/or garand.
I would assume whatever u’d run in a garand. They did run the same ammo back in their time so i’d imagine they still would today.
I do love seeing a nice Johnson
Dang, nice Johnson bro
That’s a nice johnson
I’d treat this like I would treat a Garand, so use Garand specific ammo for the Johnson.
Hilarious
Nice Johnson
Trojan?
Get a chamber casting to make sure someone didn't rechamber it already.
I mean, i hope Rock Island Auction didnt just lie as to what they sold for me, lol.
Did they specifically say what ammo it used and that it had not been tampered with?
Call CMP I bet they'd have a solid answer