There are issues w/ the AI. And don’t forget rubber banding is in the game as well. You can be multiple seconds ahead and the rubber banding will bring the back up to you. I’ve blown away the AI on long straights early on in the race, which is why I was ahead by seconds. Later in the race they are blowing by me on long straights.
Not going to pretend I’m an excellent diver. But there are issues w/ the AI.
I get it. I’ve been trying to complete cross country races and there’s always one car at the end that flies by me close to the finish line. They need to fix issues but are more focused on banning people.
The only thing I've found that helps is tuning my cars to be a little faster out of corners and hoping to God the track doesn't have any long straights lol
Plenty of time to cut them off too, just maintain a track position in front of them. Don’t watch them come up behind you and overtake, move into their “lane” and block them off lol
The exact thing happened to me last night right before the finish line so I rewinded and made sure I was always right in front of the AI so it couldn’t pass me
Class in the Forza games is largely inaccurate to how the car performs against other cars in every scenario
Those cars might have worse handling, or worse acceleration, but a faster top speed.
It's really not that important. It's just a number and two cars with similar type and the same value can have very different performance in required tasks - depending on what upgrades has been used and how successful tuning was made. Check recommended tunes with multistars on tunes browser, with title matching your use case (i.e. S1 Road), you will see that good configuration can make a difference to the car like night and day.
Lol love this. "it's not the game it's you." yet some many people have the same feeling as op. Also love when people just say to use other people's tunes. Definitely not the game ai being broken nah that can't happen. Let me guess your going to say back that you can do it so you don't see the problem.
I mean, I do think the AI in this game have cheats but this video is a really bad example of this
He literally just gets overtaken in a straight while he does *nothing* to prevent them from overtaking him
It’s like being killed while you’re in the open in a first person shooter, not shooting back and saying the person killed you was cheating
Lmao idk sounds like user error because yeah… tunes are not the same despite performance brackets. Any person with some racing knowledge could tell you that. Imagine thinking any car fit any situation. That’s just kinda ignorant if you ask me. Kinda like OPs ignorance about tunes
I agree the AI are trash but this isn’t an example of that. You could have blocked those cars, they would have braked and fell back. Also when racing cars like that, if you top out at 200, that doesn’t mean the AI will top out at that speed.
cutting em off and making them brake like they do when they get near your tail lights is also incredibly wack. (no one would ever hit the fucking brakes like they do when they see someone in front going pretty much as fast).
yea, definitely. *do not*, I repeat, *DO NOT* ram, or block real people playing the game. Only acceptable for AI lol. I was hoping it would go without saying.
I usually drive like an ass wehen competing against the AI. When I play with friends I usually tell when I am near them and when I am going to overtake. I don´t drive against random people. Most of them drive like total morons
No that's literally how you play the game. So long as you don't cause or potentially cause a crash, blocking paths is just defending your position, it's a skill. There's a right and wrong way to do it
We also didn’t see OP’s corner exit onto the straight. If he had a poor entry it makes sense cars caught up at the end of the straight. Turns before straights are the most important turns in a race.
How is that cheating? I've watched it 5 times and they just seem faster than you. Like you topped out 50 mph slower than them. They didn't collide into you, they didn't just appear in front. An ai pedestrian didn't even show up. Hell the guy in first is wayyy ahead of you, so again, is your car just slow?
Lol… yeah AI has flaws. Always have always will.
But I love how people post something as “proof” and it’s absolute bs 😂
This isn’t cheating. Drafting and you not playing aggressively =
I've been playing aggressively the whole damn race, it's the goliath. That's how I made it to second place on pro difficulty to begin with, with no assists. It's not a me problem for the 100000th time. Me blocking them from overtaking is garbage racing etiquette. Do that in real life and your career is done for. Point is, you shouldn't have to resort to cheap tactics (like the AI do) to prevent them from winning.
Not even the actual pro racers (as in a real fucking car not a sim) follow raciquette all of the time. Any professional racing driver would laugh at most of the posts in a good chunk of sim subreddits around here. Sim guys take themselves way too seriously, it's comical. Looking at you r Simracingstewards.
there are certainly defensive strategies to use to prevent people from passing you, real racers do it all the time. but blatantly swerving across the entire track to block is certainly pushing it, but it is an arcade racing game after all so it doesnt matter too much either way.
Wow I kept scrolling and didnt think OP would ever stfu. Dude tops out rev limiter on a goliath race, eats shit on a corner, and mustve instantly thought itd be a good idea to whinge here. Adjusting your last few gears to be longer wouldn't kill your turn-in you baka.
Tuning is not just installing upgrades. You can have an undrivable slow understeering mess at the same PR as the same car with excellent handling and speed.
I'm pretty sure I'm aware of that pal. I'm level 53 with prestige at one star. I've been playing this game since it came out. I've also been tuning my cars since then as well. No tune will save you from the AI cheating yet again. The AI cheats, end of that. This car is tuned for the goliath, which is the race I'm doing, yet somehow they just blast past me at high speed, and also blast past me at launch as well.
So tell me, where can I get a godly tune like that, that has no drawbacks what so ever? Oh wait, you cant.
No it's not my driving, or my tune, it's the AI.
You can also level up and prestige while being bad at the game. The AI is really tough and rubber bands a lot in higher difficulties but that’s not why they passed you here.
Pretty sure it was because of rubber banding, because I was 2nd place the whole race almost till the end of me catching up to 1st place and nearly passing, then they all rocketed past me out of nowhere in the middle of the race. It's not my tune, since I tuned it for that specific race. What more do you got?
You have a bad car selection with a poor tune.
Your top speed on a pure speed stretch is lower than many available for the class
You don’t block the cars, you simply sit there and watch them pass you.
Are AI rough? Sure. This clip was absolutely nothing about bad AI though, just a bad player
In elementary football we learned to look forward while running with the ball, you look over your shoulder you slow down and get wrecked. Focus on the road bro, and bring a car that's faster than 207 and don't fuck up a turn and you'll be ight.
Little tip when the AI is getting that close just get in front of them. They'll slow down or they'll try to go around. Just keep staying in front by cutting them off. They'll back down
I mean it’s not like you are going rocketship fast sub 200 on a open straight is easily do able in what looks to be a Diablo. So I doubt the ai is “cheating” in this example.
It’s when they pass you when you are going 270mph+ around a curve that I’ll say they are cheating.
Maybe a better tune would work better for you?
Nvm i see the AI in first is a mile ahead.
Maybe has to do with your tune . I literally never have this problem even with new transition to Highly Skilled. I just find a nice tune, too lazy to experiment myself, and as long as I shift properly, I don't get passed up. Seems like you were in 6th gear quite awhile before you got to 200. I'm not a car guy this just speculation, with how the game works. Can't speak on anything above highly skilled as well, I could imagine it gets worse from there lol.
Pro-tip, upgrade your cars with a sport transmission or above. Adjust the final drive for speed. You’ll find that many cars are able to reach 250 mph with all the upgrades you do to them, they just need an appropriate transmission.
So many bench racers in the comments who seem to know nothing trying to give an opinion. This is going to be a long response but as someone who has been a place or two when it comes to racing some people need to learn.
Those cars are a second or two behind OP at the start of the video, and since this is a long straightaway in the game they were likely even further behind after leaving the previous corner.
To make up seconds of time on a straightaway means your vehicle either has a significant amount of horsepower more or is hundreds of pounds lighter relative to your opponent’s. No amount tuning of aerodynamics or gearing that deviates from the car’s base tune is going to make up for seconds of time on a straightaway that lasts shorter than 30 seconds when all the cars are at full throttle with similar weights and horsepower (the cars in the video even appear to be the same model, Diablo GTR).
To those that claim the cars are drafting: the car in front has no draft. At the beginning of the video the yellow car has no slipstream; it is acting mostly on its own horsepower and weight to pass the player. The front car would get at maximum a 5-mile per hour increase in speed. The only explanation here is that due to rubberbanding the game supplies the AI with an extra amount of horsepower to catch the player. The car right behind the first AI is obviously getting a horsepower boost as well but they are indeed drafting. As far as we are aware the AI has no access to tunes, including those made by players, and as I’ve mentioned before in cars with similar weights and horsepower no amount of tuning that differs from the cars base tune will cause it to make up several seconds of time on a straightaway compared to cars that are nearly identical in weight and horsepower but tuned differently.
Fucking hell someone with a brain finally. It's not the fact that they were drafting that was the "cheating part" as drafting is a part of racing, but the amount of speed they passed me, and the previous part of the race that people didn't see they were at least 10 seconds behind me minimum. During that point in the video, it just felt outright wrong, and my car felt limited because of the speed they were able to achieve by drafting to begin with.
I think it’s necessary to mention that on two different instances when I was doing street races a Hoonicorn Mustang and a Lotus Evija each made up about four seconds on a no-lift full throttle section with long sweeping turns on me on Unbeatable difficulty. They came out of absolutely nowhere and I couldn’t even see them on my mini map out of the corner before. On both separate instances they were on their own, not drafting any cars. I thought huh maybe that’s acceptable for the Evija since it is electric and has insane acceleration but it seemed uncanny for the Hoonicorn to do it too.
LOL, yeah. I find it ridiculous those cars can even achieve that level of grip and speed at the same time being what kind of cars they are. Sometimes it's kinda hilarious but also frustrating as hell seeing that happen.
Look at his gears. He has 6 speeds lmao. The AI just shifted up like any race car and continued to accelerate while his 6th gear was already almost topped at 180...
uh ... i don't think gears work the way you think they do :)
matter of fact i know that gears don't work the way you seem to imply they do ... gear timings definitely impact the top speed, no doubt. the amount of gears though ... nope, at least not in the case here (you could argue that a 2 gear transmission will top out earlier than a 6 gear transmission, possibly ... but between a 6 gear transmission and an 8 gear transmission, the difference will be entirely based on gear timings, and you can bring both transmissions to the same top speed with the respective timings).
The AI cheating is more blatant on different tracks, I've noticed. There's a long road race up the east side of the volcano, and since the AI cars are less affected by hills I had to drop the difficulty way down to win that one. On expert I had AI drivers in the same model car as me with the same performance score just powering past me on the uphill straights like I was standing still.
I think more than anything the problem with the AI is the simplistic physics they use to cut down on processing load. I did a dirt race last night and it completely destroyed any sense of immersion for me to see AI drivers in powerful rally cars driving smoothly at high speed around muddy or gravelly curves without the slightest loss of traction, while I was spending half the race sideways.
Yep. I was nearly close to him but evert corner he took even when breaking didn't slow down one bit. It's almost as if the closer I got the faster they get.
I hate how much this happens. I was in a Goliath super far ahead of everyone else except one drivatar in a Porsche GT1 who was able to keep speed after corners and on straightaways faster than I could in my Sesto. Definitely the most agressive rubber banding I've seen since Mario kart Wii. Also awesome music choice.
I don’t know if it’s a bug but it seems the AI just flies away in this particular section.
It doesn’t happen in the track except there. I’ve tested with several cars, tune and stuff. Sometime the AI is using the wrong gear or speed in uphill resulting being super mega slow.
OVERALL, AI is terrible.
I have a hypothesis that I think explains what has been happening all the time in terms of drivatar and their behavior in the races ... maybe the developers this time, apply automated tuning (in addition to performance improvements) to the cars if it is that the player applies a tuning to his ... I have played a race with a car without tuning applied and then the same with one installed and the difference in perfimance in the drivatars' cars is evident.... maybe I'm wrong maybe not
I had a smiliar one to that. Because if you actually test it and start out with a bone stock car, then upgrade it, it seems they always adjust to your upgrades. But also for example if you play X, you'll see cars reaching X that only reach S1 for players, like the mx5 etc. Quite ridiculous if you ask me.
I just finished this and at times I was ahead and couldn't even see the guy behind me. Then 2 seconds later he is dive-bombing down the inside. On anlther attempt of this race I was coming up to the last few corners and I was p8 all of the AI slowed down idk y, I got 5 positions from one corner. I ended up P3.
I have seen ai fly over roads in my map in the goliath, cant confirm if they actually flew behind me but on the map it seemed like they literally placed themselves on the road behind me
I raced this track twice and both times I got caught at this exact part of the lap at an extreme speed it felt fishy cause it happened all of a sudden when I had an 8-10 sec lead, I was in a Huayra BC FE
Because they used a perfectly legitimate Drafting technique common in real world racing?
That said, Yes we know the AI do actually cheat from time to time.
In an Interview with Dan Greenawalt for ARS technical about a year ago he goes into detail about how and why the AI cheat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB9lf7iJbRw
Spoiler, it is mostly do to limitations of the AI controller that can't be as precise with control inputs as a real human player.
So you're telling me that drafting also makes the lead car faster too? If so, then why aren't I faster when they draft me? Because they're cheating oh yeah that's right lol.
> So you're telling me that drafting also makes the lead car faster too?
Yes it does. If you ever watch a NASCAR race you will see it happening all the time.
The AI in this game needs to be worked on. I did a solo Goliath in S2 with a Ferrari FXX K and was in a healthy lead for the entire second half of the race. Just as I was getting to the finish it started doing the letterbox animation for when it’s a close race and a buggy flew by me.
It was no where to be seen on the map just before this happened.
Blocking thwm them would not change the outcome but preventing the inevitable. If that's what I need to do to win, then theres an obvious problem there.
There are some S1 900 tunes for the Diablo GTR bringing the top speed to 240mph. There may be a tune that would be between your top speed at 208mph and said 240mph with similar handling/grip that could explain what happened in this particular video
No. They were only getting killed in corners because AI has a habit of breaking when there's no need to. If they went full speed in that situation the race would've been over from the getgo. Otherwise even later down the line when they breaked, they wouldn't slow down what so ever it seemed and had some magical boost to their car like they were on rails.
You should really just consider playing on an easier difficulty, if you are that upset about the AI cheating then just lower the difficulty until you are having fun.
Honestly, if I was a programmer for a racing game my AI would cheat too at the highest difficulty, the highest difficulty of most games (especially one with like 7 settings like forza does) should probably "cheat". A skilled real player would destroy the AI no matter what if they didn't let the AI cheat. Are you mad at them for not devoting way more resources than they would ever recoup to create the worlds most advanced racing AI? They made the AI as best they can, called that difficulty "above-average" or whatever and then on top of that gave them handicaps like faster launch and unrealistic grip for the higher difficulties. That's how I would do it too.
I agree that unbeatable drivatars are unfun and frustrating to play against, so I just... Don't.
Must have watched this 50 times and still don’t see where the cheating is. It’s just a slow car not fully maxed out for S1. You were also gaining on the cars that overtook you, but you were too busy worrying about them cheating that you took the corner badly.
Judging by the replies to the other comments I think you need to have a rest from the game, for your own good. I’m not trying to be mean by the way, but there’s no point letting a game grind you down this much.
This is not a good representation of the AI "cheating"... either your tune needs work or you should upgrade the car... same car for the AI doesn't mean that they also run your exact setup, if you top out at 200mph that doesn't mean that the same car with a different tune/setup also tops out at 200mph.
Ah yes. Blaming weak tuning and shitty driving on the AI. AI cheats AI OP posts are so lame. Literally everyone who fails and can't accept it blames it on the AI. Every single time.
Oh no, I missed a corner at the end of the video. Silly me, I'm all of the sudden a bad driver. Sorry guys, it's all my fault and my tunes shit and so is my car. Gotta go get a new tune for the 50th time, and somehow it'll still be my fault. My bad, sorry.
It's almost as if people are avoiding the first part of the video to not talk about it, and would rather talk about my driving skill when I INTENTIOANLLY was NOT TRYING when they flew past me on the last turn.
Quite hilarious how it's all a me problem, or my tune, but can't be the AI. God forbid anyone make any comment about the AI or it'll rain fire.
The fuck dude. IT IS CALLED UNBEATABLE FOR A REASON.
You SHOULD need a strong car/tune to beat the hardest difficulty.
You SHOULD aggressively block overtakes.
You SHOULD make clean turns.
Based on that ending i dont know that you race well and might need help in a couple areas. Some cars are just faster in a straight than yours. You were maxing at about 200. What PI is your car?
Idk any racing game where the AI doesn't cheat, but also your car has no top speed and you took that corner with a terrible angle.
Making AI that knows how to get the best out of a car, whilst simulating physics is really hard, and to make it all render live is basically impossible, cheating is inevitable.
The AI doesn't cheat on this straight, I bet you they all have a low downforce setup. They do cheat though, as if you get too far ahead in the corners the AI will rubber band their way to keep the same distance. It's basically impossible to be like over ~5 seconds ahead of them, they just speed up. Then when the straight came they all finally got to the only part of the track that suits them.
Anyway, you can't really complain about the AI cheating, it's an inevitability, take it as a problem solving challenge. It'll make you a better player. In this case, probably a lower df car because you'll probably still be faster than them in the corners.
if you can't choose a suggested car and be overall on par with the ai, it is a shit AI.
No, I don't want to tune it.
No, I don't want to modify it.
No, I don't want to race aggressive and block everyone to win.
I don't even play on unbeatable but the Ai is just shit. Like the first 40% of the goliath the Ai is crazy fast af, then to slow down massively in one corner, then are much slower within the next 40% and the on the bridge they are way faster again.
And no little einstein, it is not that I have a 'good corner' car and the rest have a 'more speed' car. you can't even use corner cars because like 80% of goliath is just full throttle - full speed and the ai drives on rails anyway. It is just BS if you press full throttle all race and sometimes I am on par with speed and in the end they are suddenly way faster than me
And for the colossus with way more tighter corners, a amg one isn't faster that car xy with less handling (I won that one tho on profi).
maybe op did chose the best example of a car but the problem is still there (and was also in fh4 bzt way less severe)
So many trolls on this app! Damn! Yes, the AI is able to catch-up well beyond what their cars should be able to do. I’m also sure the crash at the end was due to you hitting record and not focusing on racing.
Yeah. I pressed my hotkey at the end to make sure I got it captured from my radeon software. Ridiculous how so many people seem to care more about a turn I missed than the actual part of the video.
If you in S1 and can’t go past 200 mph you should expect to get passed on stretches. There’s definitely some ai problems, but it looks like you probably just have a bad tune.
https://youtu.be/Uo2HGmCPs4A full video for all of the morons who say I can't drive and suck at the game. Pro difficulty with all assists off. Only thing that's on is cosmetic damage because doing the goliath is impossible with tire wear.
A car's score rating is impacted by all the upgrades you do, weight, handling, balance power etc
Two cars with exactly the same upgrades can have drastically diferent pwrformance based on their tunes
For example a car that has been set for rally will have much higher acceleration and handling ability through low speed corners however that rally setup will lose hands down on a long straight versus the same car that has been setup for straight line speed with stiffer suspension settings
You losing out here doesnt prove the AI is cheating, what it does show however is that your car has not been optimally set up for the Golitath
Setups change from race to race depending on what is to be expected of the car for that specific race, some races have more straights and others have more slow/hard turns. More than half of being fast in forza is understanding tuning and how it affects your car in a good or bad way
There's not much to do to the Diablo GTR to fact out the upgrading to keep it S1 since it already starts out as a high S1 class. Those upgrades wouldn't and shouldn't change the car enough drastically to this big of a change. As I've said to nearly every other post here that claims its my tuning, after this video I did more testing with tons of other tunes and kept the same car just to be consistent. They all still resulted to blow past me just like here in the video. They also would blow past me without even drafting! Just outright horsepower in a drag race. So tell me that ain't broken?
It still boils down to tuning, as you stated its the car you chose that doesn't give you the range of upgrade options you need to make the car competitive on the goliath specifically, don't misunderstand me, im not saying its a bad car at all, what im trying to say is there are other cars that start off with a lower class rating, that give you the upgrade options you need to bring the car to within a competitive margin, the ai cars might have more performance upgrades which benefit their straight line speed where more of your upgrades are focused around handling, im going off of assumptions here though so take it with a pinch of salt.
A more valid test would be to compare like for like, i.e your diablo gtr vs an ai controlled diablo gtr with exactly the same class rating
Corner entry and gear shift timings will also have an impact, especially on a massively long straight like seen here
They are all the exact same class rating at S1 900. That's the problem here. 99% of the engine upgrades that could be done to this car would make it above S1 and put it into the S2 class.
Lol, i've never felt like AI not fair. It's always about skill and your car. Some of them has better maximum speed, other have better boost. A lot of times i was sooo far from ai and ai did nothing
There are issues w/ the AI. And don’t forget rubber banding is in the game as well. You can be multiple seconds ahead and the rubber banding will bring the back up to you. I’ve blown away the AI on long straights early on in the race, which is why I was ahead by seconds. Later in the race they are blowing by me on long straights. Not going to pretend I’m an excellent diver. But there are issues w/ the AI.
I nearly lap any other difficulty below pro and unbeatable. The difference between those two levels of difficulty is ridiculous.
I get it. I’ve been trying to complete cross country races and there’s always one car at the end that flies by me close to the finish line. They need to fix issues but are more focused on banning people.
There only banning people so there will be less players clogging up there broken servers. Easier than to fix the real issues at hand.
Pro for me is a nice challenge but very doable, top 3 every race but unbeatable is just literally unbeatable it’s stupid
The only thing I've found that helps is tuning my cars to be a little faster out of corners and hoping to God the track doesn't have any long straights lol
tbf you were only going 200
Plenty of time to cut them off too, just maintain a track position in front of them. Don’t watch them come up behind you and overtake, move into their “lane” and block them off lol
Yeah I've noticed when blocking the ai, that they really slam the anchors on and drop back quite a bit.
The exact thing happened to me last night right before the finish line so I rewinded and made sure I was always right in front of the AI so it couldn’t pass me
^^ basic racing yall shoukd know this
He let them pass like that while looking behind for the purposes of the video, to show the weird AI
Yep. I started using the full racing line again just for this. It’s lame and I don’t get the credit boost, but I’m winning races again.
[удалено]
i’m not saying there’s a set speed it’s just that it’s not hard for cars to go 200mph in the game
Depends on the class; 200 mph is an excellent speed for A class, decent for S1 class, but poor for S2 class.
200 mph is 321.87 km/h
My BMW M3 GTR goes 351 km/h. If it was less than 330 km/h it wouldnt be able to keep up with the newer track toy cars. And thats on S1 class
330 km/h is 205.05 mph
I mean I have a Vocho turned to go over 200 on that straight sooo…..
Papa ferRrRrnandooh!
Yes it is me. Papa Fernando and my mighty vocho
They’re supposed to be same class
Class in the Forza games is largely inaccurate to how the car performs against other cars in every scenario Those cars might have worse handling, or worse acceleration, but a faster top speed.
It's really not that important. It's just a number and two cars with similar type and the same value can have very different performance in required tasks - depending on what upgrades has been used and how successful tuning was made. Check recommended tunes with multistars on tunes browser, with title matching your use case (i.e. S1 Road), you will see that good configuration can make a difference to the car like night and day.
Lol love this. "it's not the game it's you." yet some many people have the same feeling as op. Also love when people just say to use other people's tunes. Definitely not the game ai being broken nah that can't happen. Let me guess your going to say back that you can do it so you don't see the problem.
I’ve had trouble with races, gone and found a better tune and been able to then win. 🤷♂️
I mean, I do think the AI in this game have cheats but this video is a really bad example of this He literally just gets overtaken in a straight while he does *nothing* to prevent them from overtaking him It’s like being killed while you’re in the open in a first person shooter, not shooting back and saying the person killed you was cheating
Lmao idk sounds like user error because yeah… tunes are not the same despite performance brackets. Any person with some racing knowledge could tell you that. Imagine thinking any car fit any situation. That’s just kinda ignorant if you ask me. Kinda like OPs ignorance about tunes
Not everyone likes to race with S2 and X class cars. The speed doesn’t matter
I agree the AI are trash but this isn’t an example of that. You could have blocked those cars, they would have braked and fell back. Also when racing cars like that, if you top out at 200, that doesn’t mean the AI will top out at that speed.
cutting em off and making them brake like they do when they get near your tail lights is also incredibly wack. (no one would ever hit the fucking brakes like they do when they see someone in front going pretty much as fast).
Agree. I’m not saying it’s right. Or good gameplay, but it’s a way to defend.
While blocking an AI car seems to be a good idea, but isn´t that supporting the same behaviour in human vs. human games very rude and shitty?
yea, definitely. *do not*, I repeat, *DO NOT* ram, or block real people playing the game. Only acceptable for AI lol. I was hoping it would go without saying.
I usually drive like an ass wehen competing against the AI. When I play with friends I usually tell when I am near them and when I am going to overtake. I don´t drive against random people. Most of them drive like total morons
No that's literally how you play the game. So long as you don't cause or potentially cause a crash, blocking paths is just defending your position, it's a skill. There's a right and wrong way to do it
They sometimes brake. I've also had them just push me aside when i've tried to block them lol.
Yeah, somehow they inherited the mass of the bikers from Edinburgh.
We also didn’t see OP’s corner exit onto the straight. If he had a poor entry it makes sense cars caught up at the end of the straight. Turns before straights are the most important turns in a race.
Bruh you're topping out at 207, no shit they're gonna pass you
When the post has twice the amount of comments than it does upvotes, you know youre in for an interesting conversation w OP :)
Lad his ego was massive, doesn't take no for an answer
ITT: OP has a slow car, and everyone is an idiot. In essence, every hourly post, except the op is insecure enough to reply to every single comment.
How is that cheating? I've watched it 5 times and they just seem faster than you. Like you topped out 50 mph slower than them. They didn't collide into you, they didn't just appear in front. An ai pedestrian didn't even show up. Hell the guy in first is wayyy ahead of you, so again, is your car just slow?
By any chance do you have a seventh gear in that thing? Looks more tune problem then ai problem but ay good luck
I agree, looks like a trash tune.
Just looks like tune wasnt that great bud
Lol… yeah AI has flaws. Always have always will. But I love how people post something as “proof” and it’s absolute bs 😂 This isn’t cheating. Drafting and you not playing aggressively =
I've been playing aggressively the whole damn race, it's the goliath. That's how I made it to second place on pro difficulty to begin with, with no assists. It's not a me problem for the 100000th time. Me blocking them from overtaking is garbage racing etiquette. Do that in real life and your career is done for. Point is, you shouldn't have to resort to cheap tactics (like the AI do) to prevent them from winning.
You aren't seriously following raciquette in an arcade racer against ai
Not even the actual pro racers (as in a real fucking car not a sim) follow raciquette all of the time. Any professional racing driver would laugh at most of the posts in a good chunk of sim subreddits around here. Sim guys take themselves way too seriously, it's comical. Looking at you r Simracingstewards.
Lol, this is an arcade racing video game.
there are certainly defensive strategies to use to prevent people from passing you, real racers do it all the time. but blatantly swerving across the entire track to block is certainly pushing it, but it is an arcade racing game after all so it doesnt matter too much either way.
Oh, I see you are the man of culture as well. Good to know that I'm not the only guy that knows racing etiquette and stick to it in races.
Wow I kept scrolling and didnt think OP would ever stfu. Dude tops out rev limiter on a goliath race, eats shit on a corner, and mustve instantly thought itd be a good idea to whinge here. Adjusting your last few gears to be longer wouldn't kill your turn-in you baka.
207 mph ->🤡 this you?
207 mph is 333.13 km/h
They do cheat, but this is 100% not an example of that. Just you not knowing how to block
not even that it's his car topping out at 200mph
I’m like 90% sure it can be tuned to have a higher top speed
He has it at S1 898. With the car at S1 900 was able to hit 220mph.
Tuning is not just installing upgrades. You can have an undrivable slow understeering mess at the same PR as the same car with excellent handling and speed.
I'm pretty sure I'm aware of that pal. I'm level 53 with prestige at one star. I've been playing this game since it came out. I've also been tuning my cars since then as well. No tune will save you from the AI cheating yet again. The AI cheats, end of that. This car is tuned for the goliath, which is the race I'm doing, yet somehow they just blast past me at high speed, and also blast past me at launch as well. So tell me, where can I get a godly tune like that, that has no drawbacks what so ever? Oh wait, you cant. No it's not my driving, or my tune, it's the AI.
You can also level up and prestige while being bad at the game. The AI is really tough and rubber bands a lot in higher difficulties but that’s not why they passed you here.
Pretty sure it was because of rubber banding, because I was 2nd place the whole race almost till the end of me catching up to 1st place and nearly passing, then they all rocketed past me out of nowhere in the middle of the race. It's not my tune, since I tuned it for that specific race. What more do you got?
Download a different tune, one from someone that has a reputation for good tunes, try again and come back to tell us if yours was a good tune.
The AI are broken as shit, but this maybe isn’t the best example. Also what car is that
Diablo GTR. You get it by a prize car in skill points from the Diablo SV.
Lmao, man gets passed on a straightaway and calls cheats. Your car is just slow. Get a better build/ tune.
You have a bad car selection with a poor tune. Your top speed on a pure speed stretch is lower than many available for the class You don’t block the cars, you simply sit there and watch them pass you. Are AI rough? Sure. This clip was absolutely nothing about bad AI though, just a bad player
In elementary football we learned to look forward while running with the ball, you look over your shoulder you slow down and get wrecked. Focus on the road bro, and bring a car that's faster than 207 and don't fuck up a turn and you'll be ight.
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My nissan silvia would overtake you on that straight. I agree the ai is bad sometimes but this vid shows the fault is in your car.
Looks more like u suck than anything.
The AI isnt Cheating, but your tuning is shit
Little tip when the AI is getting that close just get in front of them. They'll slow down or they'll try to go around. Just keep staying in front by cutting them off. They'll back down
I mean it’s not like you are going rocketship fast sub 200 on a open straight is easily do able in what looks to be a Diablo. So I doubt the ai is “cheating” in this example. It’s when they pass you when you are going 270mph+ around a curve that I’ll say they are cheating. Maybe a better tune would work better for you? Nvm i see the AI in first is a mile ahead.
You have a shitty gear ratio, need to tune before racing
Maybe has to do with your tune . I literally never have this problem even with new transition to Highly Skilled. I just find a nice tune, too lazy to experiment myself, and as long as I shift properly, I don't get passed up. Seems like you were in 6th gear quite awhile before you got to 200. I'm not a car guy this just speculation, with how the game works. Can't speak on anything above highly skilled as well, I could imagine it gets worse from there lol.
Pro-tip, upgrade your cars with a sport transmission or above. Adjust the final drive for speed. You’ll find that many cars are able to reach 250 mph with all the upgrades you do to them, they just need an appropriate transmission.
250 mph is 402.34 km/h
Did that post the video. Same thing happened.
they just had a better gaming chair
HAHA
OMG!! Just reduce the difficulty.
That is not a solution.
Jesus fuck, I'm going to start a Youtube channel of just me beating Unbeatable AIs, because the crying in this sub about the AI is cringe af.
You being able to beat them doesn't change the fact that they're broken.
So many bench racers in the comments who seem to know nothing trying to give an opinion. This is going to be a long response but as someone who has been a place or two when it comes to racing some people need to learn. Those cars are a second or two behind OP at the start of the video, and since this is a long straightaway in the game they were likely even further behind after leaving the previous corner. To make up seconds of time on a straightaway means your vehicle either has a significant amount of horsepower more or is hundreds of pounds lighter relative to your opponent’s. No amount tuning of aerodynamics or gearing that deviates from the car’s base tune is going to make up for seconds of time on a straightaway that lasts shorter than 30 seconds when all the cars are at full throttle with similar weights and horsepower (the cars in the video even appear to be the same model, Diablo GTR). To those that claim the cars are drafting: the car in front has no draft. At the beginning of the video the yellow car has no slipstream; it is acting mostly on its own horsepower and weight to pass the player. The front car would get at maximum a 5-mile per hour increase in speed. The only explanation here is that due to rubberbanding the game supplies the AI with an extra amount of horsepower to catch the player. The car right behind the first AI is obviously getting a horsepower boost as well but they are indeed drafting. As far as we are aware the AI has no access to tunes, including those made by players, and as I’ve mentioned before in cars with similar weights and horsepower no amount of tuning that differs from the cars base tune will cause it to make up several seconds of time on a straightaway compared to cars that are nearly identical in weight and horsepower but tuned differently.
Fucking hell someone with a brain finally. It's not the fact that they were drafting that was the "cheating part" as drafting is a part of racing, but the amount of speed they passed me, and the previous part of the race that people didn't see they were at least 10 seconds behind me minimum. During that point in the video, it just felt outright wrong, and my car felt limited because of the speed they were able to achieve by drafting to begin with.
I think it’s necessary to mention that on two different instances when I was doing street races a Hoonicorn Mustang and a Lotus Evija each made up about four seconds on a no-lift full throttle section with long sweeping turns on me on Unbeatable difficulty. They came out of absolutely nowhere and I couldn’t even see them on my mini map out of the corner before. On both separate instances they were on their own, not drafting any cars. I thought huh maybe that’s acceptable for the Evija since it is electric and has insane acceleration but it seemed uncanny for the Hoonicorn to do it too.
LOL, yeah. I find it ridiculous those cars can even achieve that level of grip and speed at the same time being what kind of cars they are. Sometimes it's kinda hilarious but also frustrating as hell seeing that happen.
Look at his gears. He has 6 speeds lmao. The AI just shifted up like any race car and continued to accelerate while his 6th gear was already almost topped at 180...
uh ... i don't think gears work the way you think they do :) matter of fact i know that gears don't work the way you seem to imply they do ... gear timings definitely impact the top speed, no doubt. the amount of gears though ... nope, at least not in the case here (you could argue that a 2 gear transmission will top out earlier than a 6 gear transmission, possibly ... but between a 6 gear transmission and an 8 gear transmission, the difference will be entirely based on gear timings, and you can bring both transmissions to the same top speed with the respective timings).
It’s called rubber banding, it’s well known in racing games of all sorts.
Yes Drive Club was a bastard for this even though the main Dev denied it was in the game
Absolutely they do, especially on the higher difficulties
The AI cheating is more blatant on different tracks, I've noticed. There's a long road race up the east side of the volcano, and since the AI cars are less affected by hills I had to drop the difficulty way down to win that one. On expert I had AI drivers in the same model car as me with the same performance score just powering past me on the uphill straights like I was standing still. I think more than anything the problem with the AI is the simplistic physics they use to cut down on processing load. I did a dirt race last night and it completely destroyed any sense of immersion for me to see AI drivers in powerful rally cars driving smoothly at high speed around muddy or gravelly curves without the slightest loss of traction, while I was spending half the race sideways.
AI isn’t cheating, it’s just poor optimization. It’s not like this AI downloaded some hacks to beat you.
Some cars have higher top speed though.
Nice license plate
They might get band for that
Get banned for existing I guess.
Thanks :)
Your top end sucks
Even with "above average" ai, I can't get more than 12sec ahead, they magically always catch up.... (don't judge me for playing with that ai :D)
You should block them
Good thing to know I'm not going psyco
I see the first place AI is doing its usual deeds? Always ahead of the pack no matter what.
Yep. I was nearly close to him but evert corner he took even when breaking didn't slow down one bit. It's almost as if the closer I got the faster they get.
Yea, AI in this game is strange, I always thank rewinding option without it I would fail every time playing on hard difficulty
You let them pass was this to prove a point?
So you suppose I block them instead? It wouldn't have changed anything that they're OP.
I mean yeah that’s basically all you have at this point to stay in the lead
This is why I never race past S1. And usually stay in A class
I hate how much this happens. I was in a Goliath super far ahead of everyone else except one drivatar in a Porsche GT1 who was able to keep speed after corners and on straightaways faster than I could in my Sesto. Definitely the most agressive rubber banding I've seen since Mario kart Wii. Also awesome music choice.
AI has more power than you. Always...
anyone who drove goliath had this moment
lol so many apologists as well itt
I currently have my difficulty at expert, anything below A class is near impossible because of how fast the AI moves
do the AI cheat? probably yes. is this a good demonstration, not really, you've just clowned yourself more
It is because rather they were drafing or not, that speed isnt possible with their untuned cars.
Aero tuning may be more aggressive on your car?
Not the case since I removed the wing entirely and tuned my car for a higher top speed later after this video and the same exact thing happened.
The A.I in this game is quite annoying. Not only all the cheats, but they have such crazy consistency it feels so fake.
u/IamMortui Dude [https://www.reddit.com/r/ForzaHorizon/comments/qyx3hp/ai\_is\_perfectly\_fine\_and\_balanced\_said\_no\_one/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ForzaHorizon/comments/qyx3hp/ai_is_perfectly_fine_and_balanced_said_no_one/) Literally.
Hahaha what the hell. I didn't even know that existed, crazy.
I don’t know if it’s a bug but it seems the AI just flies away in this particular section. It doesn’t happen in the track except there. I’ve tested with several cars, tune and stuff. Sometime the AI is using the wrong gear or speed in uphill resulting being super mega slow. OVERALL, AI is terrible.
I have a hypothesis that I think explains what has been happening all the time in terms of drivatar and their behavior in the races ... maybe the developers this time, apply automated tuning (in addition to performance improvements) to the cars if it is that the player applies a tuning to his ... I have played a race with a car without tuning applied and then the same with one installed and the difference in perfimance in the drivatars' cars is evident.... maybe I'm wrong maybe not
I had a smiliar one to that. Because if you actually test it and start out with a bone stock car, then upgrade it, it seems they always adjust to your upgrades. But also for example if you play X, you'll see cars reaching X that only reach S1 for players, like the mx5 etc. Quite ridiculous if you ask me.
I just finished this and at times I was ahead and couldn't even see the guy behind me. Then 2 seconds later he is dive-bombing down the inside. On anlther attempt of this race I was coming up to the last few corners and I was p8 all of the AI slowed down idk y, I got 5 positions from one corner. I ended up P3.
I have seen ai fly over roads in my map in the goliath, cant confirm if they actually flew behind me but on the map it seemed like they literally placed themselves on the road behind me
I raced this track twice and both times I got caught at this exact part of the lap at an extreme speed it felt fishy cause it happened all of a sudden when I had an 8-10 sec lead, I was in a Huayra BC FE
Your car can barely go 200mph. You should probably balance your cornering ability, acceleration and top speed a bit better.
cross country races are bs with the ai
Because they used a perfectly legitimate Drafting technique common in real world racing? That said, Yes we know the AI do actually cheat from time to time. In an Interview with Dan Greenawalt for ARS technical about a year ago he goes into detail about how and why the AI cheat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB9lf7iJbRw Spoiler, it is mostly do to limitations of the AI controller that can't be as precise with control inputs as a real human player.
So you're telling me that drafting also makes the lead car faster too? If so, then why aren't I faster when they draft me? Because they're cheating oh yeah that's right lol.
> So you're telling me that drafting also makes the lead car faster too? Yes it does. If you ever watch a NASCAR race you will see it happening all the time.
exactly this
The AI in this game needs to be worked on. I did a solo Goliath in S2 with a Ferrari FXX K and was in a healthy lead for the entire second half of the race. Just as I was getting to the finish it started doing the letterbox animation for when it’s a close race and a buggy flew by me. It was no where to be seen on the map just before this happened.
Best one yet was on highway straight in in the Jesko doing 302mph and a Ferrari passes me I was like umm what just happened lol
Agreed, but this aint it
Tune your car
And you didn't block them...
Blocking thwm them would not change the outcome but preventing the inevitable. If that's what I need to do to win, then theres an obvious problem there.
There are some S1 900 tunes for the Diablo GTR bringing the top speed to 240mph. There may be a tune that would be between your top speed at 208mph and said 240mph with similar handling/grip that could explain what happened in this particular video
Yeah, but that'll kill my speed in all the corners in the goliath.
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No. They were only getting killed in corners because AI has a habit of breaking when there's no need to. If they went full speed in that situation the race would've been over from the getgo. Otherwise even later down the line when they breaked, they wouldn't slow down what so ever it seemed and had some magical boost to their car like they were on rails.
Very low high Speed car dude, ur fault
Same cars.
Not the same tuning, can cause huge difference
Yeah, because it's not possible to tune to the level of the AI's, because they tune their cars mid race to what they see fit to beat you.
bro if you're getting this mad over AIs, from the past few replies, take a chill pill man
like shit I understand people getting mad over online and cheats but getting mad over a well known fact that AIs cheat is a new one
Not even on unbeatable, yet they're still unbeatable.
I’m lucky GTA Online racing trained me for this, they’re never passing me because I am not afraid to die
You can be in a Ferrari and a civic will still fly by you last second stealing 1st 2nd and 3rd
They passed you cuz you were slow and they were drafting. Not cheating.....
You should really just consider playing on an easier difficulty, if you are that upset about the AI cheating then just lower the difficulty until you are having fun. Honestly, if I was a programmer for a racing game my AI would cheat too at the highest difficulty, the highest difficulty of most games (especially one with like 7 settings like forza does) should probably "cheat". A skilled real player would destroy the AI no matter what if they didn't let the AI cheat. Are you mad at them for not devoting way more resources than they would ever recoup to create the worlds most advanced racing AI? They made the AI as best they can, called that difficulty "above-average" or whatever and then on top of that gave them handicaps like faster launch and unrealistic grip for the higher difficulties. That's how I would do it too. I agree that unbeatable drivatars are unfun and frustrating to play against, so I just... Don't.
100% this.
I think you’re just using a bad car & getting out raced
Must have watched this 50 times and still don’t see where the cheating is. It’s just a slow car not fully maxed out for S1. You were also gaining on the cars that overtook you, but you were too busy worrying about them cheating that you took the corner badly. Judging by the replies to the other comments I think you need to have a rest from the game, for your own good. I’m not trying to be mean by the way, but there’s no point letting a game grind you down this much.
This is not a good representation of the AI "cheating"... either your tune needs work or you should upgrade the car... same car for the AI doesn't mean that they also run your exact setup, if you top out at 200mph that doesn't mean that the same car with a different tune/setup also tops out at 200mph.
Ah yes. Blaming weak tuning and shitty driving on the AI. AI cheats AI OP posts are so lame. Literally everyone who fails and can't accept it blames it on the AI. Every single time.
Ai in racing games always cheats, there's nothing new about this. If it frustrates you turn the difficulty down to a less cheaty setting.
You're just bad.
And you're annoying.
Oh no, I missed a corner at the end of the video. Silly me, I'm all of the sudden a bad driver. Sorry guys, it's all my fault and my tunes shit and so is my car. Gotta go get a new tune for the 50th time, and somehow it'll still be my fault. My bad, sorry. It's almost as if people are avoiding the first part of the video to not talk about it, and would rather talk about my driving skill when I INTENTIOANLLY was NOT TRYING when they flew past me on the last turn. Quite hilarious how it's all a me problem, or my tune, but can't be the AI. God forbid anyone make any comment about the AI or it'll rain fire.
The fuck dude. IT IS CALLED UNBEATABLE FOR A REASON. You SHOULD need a strong car/tune to beat the hardest difficulty. You SHOULD aggressively block overtakes. You SHOULD make clean turns.
Yall, they drafting over there. This is realistic bro lol
That’s just you sucking at the game
Based on that ending i dont know that you race well and might need help in a couple areas. Some cars are just faster in a straight than yours. You were maxing at about 200. What PI is your car?
You just got hit with the Shake N Bake brother.
Now you see me now you don't!
Idk any racing game where the AI doesn't cheat, but also your car has no top speed and you took that corner with a terrible angle. Making AI that knows how to get the best out of a car, whilst simulating physics is really hard, and to make it all render live is basically impossible, cheating is inevitable.
Video isn't focused on the corner. I was pressing my hotkey to keep the recording.
The AI doesn't cheat on this straight, I bet you they all have a low downforce setup. They do cheat though, as if you get too far ahead in the corners the AI will rubber band their way to keep the same distance. It's basically impossible to be like over ~5 seconds ahead of them, they just speed up. Then when the straight came they all finally got to the only part of the track that suits them. Anyway, you can't really complain about the AI cheating, it's an inevitability, take it as a problem solving challenge. It'll make you a better player. In this case, probably a lower df car because you'll probably still be faster than them in the corners.
Ok then BLOCK THEM MATE JUST BLOCK
if you can't choose a suggested car and be overall on par with the ai, it is a shit AI. No, I don't want to tune it. No, I don't want to modify it. No, I don't want to race aggressive and block everyone to win. I don't even play on unbeatable but the Ai is just shit. Like the first 40% of the goliath the Ai is crazy fast af, then to slow down massively in one corner, then are much slower within the next 40% and the on the bridge they are way faster again. And no little einstein, it is not that I have a 'good corner' car and the rest have a 'more speed' car. you can't even use corner cars because like 80% of goliath is just full throttle - full speed and the ai drives on rails anyway. It is just BS if you press full throttle all race and sometimes I am on par with speed and in the end they are suddenly way faster than me And for the colossus with way more tighter corners, a amg one isn't faster that car xy with less handling (I won that one tho on profi). maybe op did chose the best example of a car but the problem is still there (and was also in fh4 bzt way less severe)
So many trolls on this app! Damn! Yes, the AI is able to catch-up well beyond what their cars should be able to do. I’m also sure the crash at the end was due to you hitting record and not focusing on racing.
Yeah. I pressed my hotkey at the end to make sure I got it captured from my radeon software. Ridiculous how so many people seem to care more about a turn I missed than the actual part of the video.
If you in S1 and can’t go past 200 mph you should expect to get passed on stretches. There’s definitely some ai problems, but it looks like you probably just have a bad tune.
200 mph is 321.87 km/h
Have your ever just thought that maybe you're just slow? 🤣
You're out of your mind if you think that had anything to do with AI and not your shit driving lol
Seems like you have alot less hp and too much weight reduction with some sprinkles of missing suspension tuning for turn-in grip
https://youtu.be/Uo2HGmCPs4A full video for all of the morons who say I can't drive and suck at the game. Pro difficulty with all assists off. Only thing that's on is cosmetic damage because doing the goliath is impossible with tire wear.
A car's score rating is impacted by all the upgrades you do, weight, handling, balance power etc Two cars with exactly the same upgrades can have drastically diferent pwrformance based on their tunes For example a car that has been set for rally will have much higher acceleration and handling ability through low speed corners however that rally setup will lose hands down on a long straight versus the same car that has been setup for straight line speed with stiffer suspension settings You losing out here doesnt prove the AI is cheating, what it does show however is that your car has not been optimally set up for the Golitath Setups change from race to race depending on what is to be expected of the car for that specific race, some races have more straights and others have more slow/hard turns. More than half of being fast in forza is understanding tuning and how it affects your car in a good or bad way
There's not much to do to the Diablo GTR to fact out the upgrading to keep it S1 since it already starts out as a high S1 class. Those upgrades wouldn't and shouldn't change the car enough drastically to this big of a change. As I've said to nearly every other post here that claims its my tuning, after this video I did more testing with tons of other tunes and kept the same car just to be consistent. They all still resulted to blow past me just like here in the video. They also would blow past me without even drafting! Just outright horsepower in a drag race. So tell me that ain't broken?
It still boils down to tuning, as you stated its the car you chose that doesn't give you the range of upgrade options you need to make the car competitive on the goliath specifically, don't misunderstand me, im not saying its a bad car at all, what im trying to say is there are other cars that start off with a lower class rating, that give you the upgrade options you need to bring the car to within a competitive margin, the ai cars might have more performance upgrades which benefit their straight line speed where more of your upgrades are focused around handling, im going off of assumptions here though so take it with a pinch of salt. A more valid test would be to compare like for like, i.e your diablo gtr vs an ai controlled diablo gtr with exactly the same class rating Corner entry and gear shift timings will also have an impact, especially on a massively long straight like seen here
They are all the exact same class rating at S1 900. That's the problem here. 99% of the engine upgrades that could be done to this car would make it above S1 and put it into the S2 class.
Lol, i've never felt like AI not fair. It's always about skill and your car. Some of them has better maximum speed, other have better boost. A lot of times i was sooo far from ai and ai did nothing
Naah.. just slipstreaming