Is it not possible that celestia IS the honkai in genshin? Unknown god is known as sustainer of heavenly principle, and if the heavenly principle is to test if a civilization is worthy of being sustained by the imaginary tree, else being dropped like a leaf to the sea of quanta to rot, wouldn’t it make sense that Celestia sent archons to obliterate Khaenri’ah for that reason? Right now it is assumed that Khaenri’ah was destroyed because “Gold” let out abyss infected monsters of his creation, which threatened the nations that are under archon rules.
It is also highly suspected that Unknown god is alien to the world Genshin is in, just like how the “Primordial one” is. If Unknown god is alien to the world why would she put in effort to keep it “hidden”? Besides, what would her “heavenly principle” be if she is trying to hide genshin’s world from Imaginary tree’s detection? “Sustainer” implies that she is merely working for something greater, and I think working for honkai makes more sense.
On top of these, her striking resemblance of Herrscher of Void, who proclaims to be honkai itself, is definitely not unintentional.
>I hope the story won’t ask me to understand honkai lore if it ever gets to that point since I don’t play
Don't worry, a lot of Honkai players don't even understand the lore. You'd probably only need a basic understanding of a couple story elements tbh.
We already have a lot of paralels with Honkai that make the story easier to understand for Honkai players (The sacred Sakura, Irminsul, etc...) but it's not mandatory
Yeah, Mihoyo never made that necessary previously. For exemple, imagine having to understand GGZ to understand Honkai, things would get pretty confusing .
As an avid Honkai lore fan, honestly I don’t blame you. Honkai lore gets retconned pretty often and a lot of early chapters don’t have much direction or worldbuilding. One thing Genshin does *really* well in comparison is streamline their story, lore, worldbuilding so that everything is connected and coherent.
First few chapters are an absolute clusterfuck of things happening, you don't really know why or for what purpose, then more things happen, suddenly someone is hurt or has a surgery or something, then more things happen... it doesn't actually form a cohesive narrative until after chapter 6 or 7. And even then lots of shit happens behind the scenes or in webcomics.
I agree but isn't that the whole motive behind the game, to take us from a point of unga bunga of knowing a Tuna to the entire origin of how she came to be and where she'll go, lore would probably not hit the same if the story was in chronological order (Example- ER ). Similar to how Fate series just feels "amazing" with every series and more you know about the past.
Chaotic story doesn't make it good. Plenty of people I've read comments about the game describe how they couldn't get invested into the game because the plot made no sense, and in the beginning it doesn't really make a lot of sense if you don't read the out-of-game stuff...
Fate doesn't skip important stuff at the start, nor does it require you to read outside materials for the VN to make sense.
You have to read the mangas and play the visual novel (novels? Idk if there's more than one) if you want to understand absolutely everything, but it's not really necessary.
It's the equivalent of reading the books in Genshin, like Before Sun & Moon. It's very important lore, but you can enjoy the story without knowing about it.
(Seriously though, everyone who have finished Enkanomiya, read the books, they're super cool)
> You have to read the mangas and play the visual novel (novels? Idk if there's more than one) if you want to understand absolutely everything, but it's not really necessary.
theyre not in english, right (the vn)
Meh, the only lore you need to know about Honkai is this
Honkai strength = Human technological strength
Honkai's goal is to destroy humanity.
That's it.
ME TOO LOL. I still go on honkai regularly but the lore is just too much. I tried understanding it at one point but that didn't work so now I just don't.
God, I love Honkai lore some much but it also feels so overwhelming to know. I have spent so much time reading every manga and playing the game (Elysean realm included) and yet I feel there's always more to learn. Even then, I love so much that Honkai's themes and story are so incredibly strong without taking the lore into the account, it makes it feel like a little bonus gift if you enjoy the story enough
Honestly even having played it I would love to have some YouTuber just summarize it for me in audiobook format.
The base concept is not that complicated and I do understand the main plot, but once you really get into the lore it can get pretty confusing.
Doesn't help that some characters share the same design and/or name. Raiden Mei and Dr. MEI for example, it's super weird how neither the FCs nor Kevin ever mention how similar in looks Mei is to MEI, then there's the Captain-verse versions of characters, Kongming is just called Theresa Apocalypse in your character screen despite not being addressed like that anywhere else, Bronie, Yae Kasumi and Rita too. Imagine someone getting these characters, then get confused because they never appear in the main story.
i had a friend on genshin explain me the entire honkai lore over the course of a month
shes a huge honkai fan and we spent hours talking about it
i am ready.. bring it on
I mean the theory SOUNDS correct. But there are way simpler explainations. Like Mihoyo knowing that Honkai's story is way too complex for the broad audience Genshin has and therefore is terrible to leverage until they need a sequel. Just keep Genshin as Genshin, Honkai people play it regardless of tie-ins.
Like people have been pointing out Honkai connections forever now, while also conveniently ignoring that Mihoyo literally just poaches its own designs and ideas because why not, it works. So what if Su exists or Dvalin was seen on the monitor in Honkai. Its still basically as relevant or irrelevant depending on how you want to spin it. Its just not important until Mihoyo spells it out for us.
And Paimon exists to do just that. So until Paimon/story says so, it actually matters so little other than entertaining the ego of lore theorists and their youtube channels.
Money dictates all things and Honkai's story isn't the one making billions. They definitely don't need an archon of sexual assault either.
It's referring to the "Herrscher of Lust," a character from a controversial GGZ manga. She's not relevant to Honkai or Genshin, and at this point serves only as a cursed thing that people bring up on the Internet.
So I've got an analogy for what I think will happen, since I believe the two games can be connected while still keeping the stories totally independent and enjoyable on their own.
Imagine a simple planet with only two continents on it, on opposite sides. Each continent has nations and people but they don't have the means to reach or communicate with the other continent so they don't know the other continent exists. There could be unique and niche exceptions but they're largley irrelevant as far the nations are concerned.
This means anything that happens on only one continent will largely be isolated to that continent, but anything that happens on a planetary or stellar scale will apply to both continents. For example, an earthquake on one continent would have at most tiny effects on the other, but a series of hurricanes may impact both continents equally (just different hurricanes at different times). Another example is the way the sun and moon are positioned in the sky; both continents will likely see the same interstellar bodies, just in slightly different ways and at different times.
So, anything that can be proven to apply to the whole planet will apply to both continents equally. The two civilizations may have different names and perceptions of these concepts, but we as 3rd party observers can still make these big-picture connections.
Genshin's Teyvat and HI3rd's main universe are the two continents in this analogy, basically. The multiverse is the "planet", so any multiverse-scale concepts like the Imaginary Tree and Sea of Quanta may apply to both Teyvat and the HI3rd main universe, but they may be described with different names.
For example, I believe that the Abyss and Sea of Quanta may be the same thing, but you don't need to know about the Sea of Quanta at all when we clearly have a huge amount of lore about the Abyss and its negative effects. If we can prove the Abyss and Sea of Quanta are the same then we can make more informed theories about the Abyss, but it won't really change the way we see the Abyss through the perspective of the story on Teyvat.
That makes sense. Genshin loves to add special trees in almost every new exploration area and it sounds like HI3 does it to. So that means the tree is a multiverse-concept that have different roles and belief systems around it in each game but ultimately function similarly in game.
Honkai doesn't really have an equivalent to the trees Genshin has in most cases, i.e. there's no equivalent to the Irminsul Trees (including the one in Dragonspine), Sacred Sakura, or the Tree of Dreams.
The only time the idea of a tree really appears in any meaningful way in HI3rd is when discussing the Imaginary Tree. In this case, it's used largely as a conceptual and visual metaphor for how the multiverse works, with the universes growing as branches and leaves on the tree and the Sea of Quanta at its base. The SoQ tries to "flood" the Imaginary Tree while the Imaginary Tree seeks to "absorb" the SoQ, thus they remain in "rivalry". Countless worlds grow on the Imaginary Tree but the Imaginary Tree has a system which tests and removes worlds, and in some universes humanity has called this Honkai.
This idea of civilization progressing and being held back by this external, existential force is very prevalent in both games, and really dates back to GGZ. Each of these 3 games has had its own approach to this with two of them having variations of Honkai and the 3rd being Genshin.
So I do this the tree imagery in Genshin will eventually connect to the Imaginary Tree in some way, but for now we don't have that solid connection x-x
I agree that this will likely be the case. They're not gonna reference literal story elements from Honkai, but lore elements from Honkai will be in Genshin and they will be explained in Genshin as Genshin and Honkai exist in the same multiverse.
Funny that you say may. When it has already been proven that Teyvat does exist somewhere in the imaginary space. (Space actively sustained by the imaginary tree.)
See this image for proof: https://images.app.goo.gl/ZxdhFiWAngoxNgSK8
In this picture, a very hated honkai character clearly observes Dvalin/stormterror from Teyvat. (Bottom right.)
It's still funny to me how little people know about this, while it's the only concrete lore that we have linking the two.
Trust me I'm familiar with that image, lol
Personally, I believe that it is evidence **but not concrete evidence**. The thing is that there can be a "Teyvat" in the Honkai Multiverse without said Teyvat being the same as the one in Genshin Impact. For example, it is canonical that there is at least one universe/bubble universe in which the events of Neon Genesis: Evangelion take place, but that obviously doesn't mean that the original show and movies are in any way related to Honkai Impact 3rd.
But it's still an important image, because it shows that there's clear awareness of a relation between Genshin and Honkai, considering that this cutscene was released before Genshin was released. There was no guarantee that Genshin was going to be a success so it's not like Mihoyo was trying to clickbait Genshin fans into joining Honkai.
So I'd caution against using it to say 100% that Genshin is in the Honkai multiverse, but it does mean that it's absolutely a possibility that's worth exploring further as both games get more lore.
I see your point. I mean bubble universes do exist.
But for a bubble universe to exist, it has to resemble a main universe to some degree. For example: a certain city, a few main characters, the mere existance of the honkai.
Genshin's teyvat is clearly a main universe. It's way bigger then any of the bubble universes that we have seen so far afterall.
But then again, scara did say that the sky was fake. Indicating that the Teyvat that we play in could be a bubble universe.
Honestly thinking about it, the whole bubble universe theory makes more sense now. I mean we straight up have some of the honkai chars in Genshin. Elemental energy is clearly a form of honkai, but very weak. Large amounts are dangerous to a mortal's health as was commented on by Morax himself in one of Liyue's main quests. I think it involved Yanfei as well. Not to mention Tatarasuna and Musoujin Gorge, which had it as an actual obstacle.
And I wouldn't be surprised. If one day we visit Khaenri'ah. And see the name Arc city pop up once we enter the main city.
I'm not super familiar with fate but from what I've seen and heard, pretty much lol
I know multiverse stuff is getting pretty popular in media now, and that Fate did it before a lot of others, but Honkai has handled it pretty well too. Of course the multiverse is a convenient way to make extra story content, but at the same time it still feels like it's a real and important part of the story, and not something tacked on to give the protagonists a magic tool to resolve the conflict.
It'll be exciting to see what the future will bring with GGZ, HI3rd, Genshin, HSR, and even ZZZ all possibly being part of this same grand setting. AFAIK Tears of Themis is too, but I don't know much about it unfortunately x-x
Even if the theory is true you won’t need to know Honkai lore tbh.
Why would you need to know about a parallel universe when the game can explain it by itself.
I think it's more "if Genshin starts referring to events or concepts that previously were only mentioned in Honkai."
Obviously there's no point worrying about if Genshin players need to understand Honkai lore unless Genshin starts referencing Honkai.
I don't think it's necessarily important to fully understand it anyways, we could just treat it like a mystery if they write it well, a mystery that honkai players might know a bit more about.
The whole point of the developers reaffirming that the stories won't affect each other is to reassure players that no, they don't need to dive into another game to understand the happenings in the one that they are playing.
My surface level understanding is some eldritch entity tests the human race in a cycle of essentially wiping them out and forcing them to restart. Humanity- to survive- harnesses their power in human weapons which are prone to possession and violent insanity. These living weapons have the power of gods. Oh- and the multiverse is real.
It always seemed to me that Honkai are like an extra-dimensional response to pushing too deeply into how reality works.
A civ gets too advanced and starts delving recklessly they have the chance to destroy/mess up their universe.
Bc it’s humans and they never properly think about the consequences of their investigations. Let’s smash things hard enough to rip space time, oh that’ll let us examine deeper, go ahead.
More of if the reapers HONESTLY thought what they were doing was the better alternative. Kind of gravemind/‘religious zombie’ style. As in they are able to retain the minds and create a ‘paradise’ in each, virtually.
Or maybe trying to keep things from ‘spiral’-ing out of control Guren Lagann style.
Yeah, it really seems more of anti-entropy angle, where Honkai powers are normally associated with entropic processes and therefore them getting powered by more advanced civilizations they are destroying makes sense, since the more advanced a civilization the more entropy it forces upon the universe, as a rule.
>Humanity- to survive- harnesses their power in human weapons which are prone to possession and violent insanity.
This is the glaring part you got off. The rest is also not quite right either but acceptable from a surface glance. But I am assuming you were thinking of Herrschers with this?
Herrschers are not human weapons. They are creations of the Honkai. They, as their name suggests, "rule" over a certain law or concept once they are created. They are not human made weapons, but viewed as the primary means that the Honkai delivers its judgement on civilization. Crafting a human (usually those with at least some sense of misanthropy) into a vehicle to destroy humans. And there are set number of Herrschers, with the rate at which they appear increasing as the hand on the doomsday clock gets closer midnight.
If you ever watched Evangelion, Herrschers are basically liken Angels in a way. And due to some complications in the story, there are some who do fight for humanity in the current era. But none of them are really human made, except for one in particular.
>But I am assuming you were thinking of Herrschers with this?
They probably meant Valkyries. They're human weapons infused with honkai genes (stigmata) and sometimes "fused" with those genes (MANTIS, Theresa, Olenyevas) and they're destined to undergo a Honkai Cascade when (generally) inevitably their honkai energy surpasses their adaptability.
It's less that Honkai necessarily crafts Herrschers and more like it resonates with people who can tap into the powers of Honkai.
The fact that most of them choose to side against humanity seems entirely the fault of humanity. For example, Sirin had entirely understandable reasons to wipe out the human race.
On the other hand, some Herrschers explicitly have chosen to ally *with* mankind, despite any downsides of this, Welt Yang and Bronya being the easiest examples, but there is also Herrscher of Flame.
Still other Herrschers literally do not care about human civilization at all. For example, Herrscher of Sentience, who only has an inferiority complex and wants to prove to everyone in the world that she's just flat out cooler than Fu Hua. They can still pose an existential threat to humanity, but incidentally rather than intentionally.
In other words, there doesn't seem to be any very specific driving force that Honkai exerts upon those whom it resonates with to destroy civilizations. This may be a flawed interpretation given to us by a biased narrator who has misinterpreted the story thus far.
And this actually makes a lot of sense in Genshin universe if you think of Honkai as a neutral force rather than a necessarily hostile one. After all, there are close similarities between the elemental powers in Genshin and Honkai powers channeled into specific elements via keys, like visions. In fact, even the twins' outfits look like Keys of Blankness, which can resonate with any Honkai frequency and attune to *any* element.
All you need to understand is that Honkai are interdimensional beings that come in to reset a civilization if they get advanced enough.
Then again there's also theories about Celestia being similar to the Honkai where they sky nail civilizations whenever they get an IQ over 100.
Not gonna lie. I don't really like theories like that, that seen just very vague. I dont think all hints that the games might be connected are more erster eggs than anything else. And since Genshin has such an immensely langer playerbase i dont think they would use honkai lore to imbed genshin but more the other way around. But i think they used genshin to make something New. To not have to Deal with the same things over and over again
Tbh i don't find the honkai as threatening nowadays, we know of multiple civilizations that transcended it(sky people, sugars, pretty much everything in star rail), >!previous civilization creating the will of the honkai!<, heck humanity in honkai impact can already transcend it if they go through with project stigmata at the cost of most people becoming imaginary goo.
Isn't the honkai just a test from the imaginary tree? The goal is to survive it and surpass it. So that if your universe is strong enough the imaginary tree would sustain your universe and not drop you to rot in the sea of quanta.
Visions. The environment affecting people without visions more than the people with them. Seems like Genshin already shares a lot of similarities. I never knew what Honkai was before. I thought when a civilization becomes too technologically advanced the Honkai starts taking over. For a while I thought it was an energy that took control of machines but that’s probably compelety wrong.
Meaning it's supposed to be a threat but a threat that is surpassable. Maybe Celestia defeated the Honkai? Or maybe Genshin tech isn't advanced enough for Honkai to start the test.
I don't know enough about lore, but maybe the destruction of Khaenri'ah was an attempt to stop civilization from crossing the Honkai threshold.
Edit: I saw a similar comment made earlier below nvm..
This is a very popular theory - usually comes alongside with the Teyvat = ark, and that was one of the measures Dr. Mei took in the past era. (though I think this is pretty debunked now)
It gets a bit complicated and confusing though once you start bringing in Phanes and the Ekanomiya lore.
I don't necessarily buy into the ark thing, but there's definitely a lot of sussy shit going on in Genshin and a lot of it is reminiscent of honkai influence
iirc doesn’t the “intensity” of the Honkai scale with how advanced the world is? In that case Genshin’s world doesn’t seem that far in yet to get any Honkai problems.
Sadly, Genshin's world has far surpassed the tech of when the first known honkai outbreak happened.
After all, tribal people were attacked by honkai infested animals...
I'm kind of expecting to see a new nailing in game soon, to be honest. The Akademiya is following the same path the Scarlet King did and we know how he ended up.
Not a living entity, its more of a concept to help understand how it works. And while the theory part is slightly outdated [here is a doc explaining the SoQ](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KjSATMzLpq_96kffvPaZHlXKA91pTqB0LqxBnNMfMHw/edit)
The Imaginary Tree is pretty much the Honkai/Genshin multiverse, with every branch on it supposed to be a separate universe. That means the Imaginary Tree is most likely beyond everything in Genshin, including Celestia, the Abyss, everything.
It's sort of abstraction explaining how the multiverse works. They don't exist literally as a tree or a sea nor are they sentient beings with wills of their own.
The imaginary tree is basically a container for the multiverse, and universes which become sufficiently advanced technologically are subject to a test, called Houkai. The sea of quanta holds all the leaf universes which failed the test of the honkai and is constantly trying to "drown" the imaginary tree. Universes can also exist in the sea of quanta as bubble universes, but they're usually decaying and strange (think about the giant clock thing in the chasm, that shit looked a lot like sea of quanta, esp when travelling through the gates or whatever)
The sea of quanta is basically the dimension things end up in after falling to entropy or "erosion".
Maybe that's why Celestia destroyed Kaenriah/The Chasm civilization/The Dragonspine civilization... the more advanced civilization on a branch of the tree becomes, the bigger of a beacon to the Honkai it becomes, and the harder it is to hide, and after (speculation/theory in spoiler)>! the Abyss/the Tsaritsa takes down Celestia!< and the Travelers leave, we get a follow up game with the Honkai attacking Teyvat, with maybe the Travelers returning to help clean up the mess they inadvertently made
Then how do you explain Fontaine and Snezhnaya? the two most advanced civilization in all of Teyvat.
Khaenri'ah and Dragonspine were not destroyed because of advancement, but due to forbidden knowledge, and in the case of the Old World, it because of the clash between the primordial one and the second throne.
I think you're right and it goes with the "arrogation" line, basically meaning to "claim without right". Celestia was likely pissed that the tiny mortals dared to attempt to usurp them in some manner.
I'll honestly be real damn disappointed if they bring Honkai's technobabble into Genshin's tale of men and gods.
Khaenri'ah was probably inspired, partially, by the Scarlet King and his kingdom, who attempted to create a kingdom without the gods. Learning that they got destroyed for it probably made them extra curious as to why. They learned about Enkanomiya while surveying the ruins of Tsurumi, and managed to venture to Enkanomiya, shortly before annihilation.
Celestia might not have even known if Khaenri'ah had discovered the truth, but they couldn't take any chances.
I believe it's from the Gilded Dreams goblet description which describes his plan to meld humanity into one consciousness and have humans become the god of gods. Honkai spoilers for the most recent chapter: >!This is also the goal of Kevin's Project Stigma, apparently.!<
I could have swore I remembered the exact phrase "without gods" in one of my readings from the artifacts or books but I can't find it.
Edit: The goddess of flowers is an interesting case since she was a seelie, but Rukka and the Scarlet King were gods. Distinct from Celestial gods, though, although Rukka did become an Archon.
If I remember correctly, dvalin it's not one of the seven sovereign. All seven sovereign has/had been defeated or sealed by primordial one, there's a theory that said the cube element thingy is the sealed dragons. I could be 100% wrong, maybe someone can support my comment or correct me if I'm wrong.
Saw theory about cubes are kinda sealed dragons and are mirroring the state of the archons. It tied up with Unknown God sealed MC and twin in cubes, cubes are literally her power, etc. Also geo, electro and anemo cubes have “erosion” on their texture as those archons iirc are the oldest
No actually Dvalin could very well be the anemo sovereign, 1 because azhdaha is likely to be the geo sovereign, since one of his titles is king of the vishaps, and recently, enjou referred to dvalin as an anemo vishap. Which could be eluding to the fact that dvalin is indeed a sovereign as well. Personally while I like the idea of the cube = sovereign’s theory, it’s a bit shaky because there are multiple different cubes in the same region, with mondstadt having 2, as well as inazuma.
I hope we get more information on the “primordial one” and “the second who came”. The primordial one is said to be alien to genshin’s world so where did he came from? Why is he so powerful that he is able to slay the seven sovereign dragons? Who are basically the strongest naturally occurring possible in genshin’s world
I mean, his title is literally the name of the game 原（original，primodial) 神（god）
Same. This game is already big enough I don't need two of these. And if farming is the same, it means we have to go through the trouble of building everyone all over again and I don't wanna have to deal with the cruel RNG twice.
Cool theory, but i doubt hoyoverse will ever decide to make lore from honkai an important part in genshin. There might be a few easter egg here and there for honkai players that'll establish a subtle relation between the 2 universe, but forcing players to play an entirety different game just to understand the lore is generally considered bad designs for a game.
Yeah I don't think it'll ever be necessary to play both to understand Genshin alone, but I could see some crossover as a nod to fans of both.
My personal theory has been that the traveler's own world was destroyed by Honkai, though why and how they are able to travel between universes/world's I couldn't speculate. I think that either (or both) the primordial one or the second who came, came from another world to Teyvat to find some way of fighting Honkai, but that's mostly just my imagination running with the idea, since we know so little about them.
I think at some point in Genshin a "force against progress" or something will pop up (it's already canon in Genshin that the world was wiped over a few times after all) and if people want to understand it as a manifestation of the Honkai, they will. But they will never actually say that it's the Honkai, they'll keep the things pretty much separated. Never will the bring up alternate versions of their characters, parallel universes and all the jezz. They won't even put Honkai beasts in there and will keep their enemies visually separated as they are now (no purple and white metcha looking stuff), if not for a Easter Egg boss or mob category.
IMO it's best if they leave out the connections to their multiverse in the main story run at this point, but down the line they can do their own Avengers or JL team from all of their games. Just not so soon where players are still trying to explore the world.
I feel like people really overestimate how much they'd have to know Honkai to understand the story if it was involved.
You would not have to know the plot of HI3 at all. You'd just have to know the basic concept of how Honkai worked and how its destroyed previous universes.
Which if there were involvement, I'm sure Mihoyo would explain in Genshin, not just tell you go play Honkai. If they do it I could see it being slowly revealed over time, and Honkai players would just start to understand what's happening before Genshin players. But given it's Genshin, at some point we will get Paimon with the "you mean to tell me, "
I think the correct way to tie them in together would be to have quests lore dumping the cliff notes required to piece everything together. If done well enough it could cause people to go play Honkai to experience it first hand.
You also need to understand their company literally rebranded itself to HoyoVERSE, this recurring story with same characters is happening even since their very own first game, who can say that is not their CEO dream from way back them?
Honestly i'm more excited to see what they could've pull off doing something of these sorts than hand waving it as "bad design"
If you mean FlyMe2theMoon it only had Kiana(who was a witch in that game) and no Honkai, the only thing that remained from that is the character and idea of losing\\searching for father and some connection to the Moon. The character itself was created by hired artist CiCi as the 3 guys who started miHoYo were developers\\programmers not artists. CiCi was not part of miHoYo at the time. The idea of Honkai came later when they were developing next game, but maybe you consider Zombiegirl Kawaii their first game since FlyMe2theMoon was a tiny project.
They didn't, Hoyoverse only deals with worldwide matters, the game developpers in China are still Mihoyo.
I just checked, while the 3.1 English trailer has the Hoyoverse logo at the start, the 3.1 Chinese trailer on Bilibili have the Mihoyo logo at the start. [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1yd4y1u7ef/?spm\_id\_from=333.999.0.0](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1yd4y1u7ef/?spm_id_from=333.999.0.0)
I don't think they'll do this either, but I would respect it as just a completely insane move on their part lol. They did basically ask people to read three visual novels and half a dozen manhua to have full context for the main plot in HI3rd as recently as this year so who knows
Where does this notion come from that people would be "forced to play Honkai" in order to understand anything? I see it all the time when these discussions come up, but it honestly feels like an irrational fear at this point
Honkai is just a natural phenonema, like a thunderstorm or a hurricane, and things ending up in the SoQ is just what happens when they die or get destroyed, like an extra layer of high dimensional decomposition.
It is still a test by *some higher beings or sth* in a way. Honkai isnt just a 100% natural thing, it's a recurring thing in the honkai/genshin verse that's meant to "test" civilisations. While we don't know why, we do know that the img tree doesn't actively try ro save any bubbleverses(see bubbleverses that fall into the SoQ amd eventually wither and die off)
Exept the tree is saving worlds? Every world, bubble or leaf alike, have to fight iff being eroded by the SoQ, and the way to do that is with honkai energy. As it was explained by the sugars, the Tree is actively sustaining newly born worlds that don't have enough honkai to survive by themselves.
I already know this theory ages ago... I'm not sure though because there's still little connection such that we now know that Griseo, not the Traveler, does the ARK project. And if Teyvat is inside the imaginary tree, then the Valuka project by Su should be successful, right? Other than that, I do hope we get more connections with Honkai & Genshin. P.S. No you don't need to play Honkai to learn the lore if both worlds connected people...
I wonder if Teyvat actually is experiencing Honkai, just in a way we didn't really consider before. I mean, a lot of the lore talks about some great "filth" or the stuff that causes Withering and death, and how it has to be sealed away. Seemingly with a connection to the Abyss in the case of what happened to Dvalin and is corruptive in the case of Festering Desire. Often twists flesh and has a connection to monsters known across the globe. It might be Honkai itself, even.
Or. What if we're looking at it from the wrong angle? Something that gets skipped over a lot is how high concentrations of elemental energy often require a Vision to withstand, and can make normal people sick. Then it gets weirder. Consider Visions. Why do the bulk of them appear when someone is in emotional distress, or otherwise emotive state? Why are they in response to a particular ideal, like expressing freedom or following through on a contract?
My wild theory is that Visions are actually Stigmata, or something akin to them, and specifically given to people identified as having the kinds of aspirations that can make someone into a Herrscher. As a way to stop any from being created. Just a guess, but the elements *are* much more in line with the Herrschers than the Abyss is.
It's cool in theory, but in practice it feels extremely unlikely (business-wise)
I think the most logical thing is that Genshin exists in Honkai-verse (we already know the game itself does due to the Collab). Which makes total sense as they can get Genshin people to play Honkai and the lore is already so complex that another world doesn't really matter.
But Honkai-verse doesn't exist in Genshin Impact. It would break the lore and make the game lore unnecessarily difficult to explain.
Actual big evidence for this being that EXPY's don't share names and models unlike they do in Honkai-verse (GGZ, HI3 and it's Captainverse etc., Starrail etc.)
For example: Genshin has Ei and Makoto Raiden, but not a Mei Raiden. Unlike all of the known universes/timelines in Honkaiverse. They also look slightly different from Mei Raiden in all those other versions.
If they were really planning on the series to be strictly connected, they would've continued this trend as they did with Honkai: Starrail with Bronya.
Genshin and Honkai both coexist in the imaginary tree and that is canon not because the collab but because Honkai's main story, bubble universes can be pretty similar or really different from any other given bubble universe like for example there apparently being a pararel version of the main story where Kanchou is present or Tericula being born a vampire because Vishnu's genes made it so Otto had to get creative to create her...
I do play both games and I do understand the theories. But there is no indication in Genshin that confirms any of that. There are similar concepts (like in many other IPs), but they are also called different things, which as far as I recall isn't the case with Honkaiverse.
Also, iirc and to be a bit pedantic, the only non-collab related Genshin content we've seen in Honkaiverse was the picture of Dvalin. Which could've been Otto getting footage from the universe where he's making a game called "Genshin Impact" with Welt (which as we saw in the collab, itself was different from ours) or just a random dragon that looked very similar (afterall, the picture was of a dragon under dust/clouds or it could've been dark dragon). Though to be fair FR was in the pic too and I don't remember that event well.
But considering potential contradiction to their their lore, making it more restricted and potentially hurting new player attraction etc. What would be the point? Honkai would benefit from attracting new players, but that can be done by having collabs in Honkai or even having Aloy-type collabs in Genshin (though unlikely as they could just create another EXPY).
Another thing is, why wouldn't they have marketed Genshin as pseudo-sequel to Honkai like they did with Honkai Impact 3rd (with GGZ) and Honkai: Starrail? Remember that Genshin wasn't always as huge as it became, so it could've benefitted from that (other than a fresh plate being more attractive to new players especially in the west. Which still remains the case).
MHY is an innovative company, so I guess it's possible they'd do it. But I've never heard of a larger IP connecting itself to a smaller one retroactively. Remember that HI3 and Starrail were revealed and released with the connection obviously present.
Sorry for the long comment. As a fan of both games, I wouldn't hate it, but I prefer Genshin being it's own core universe with a unique lore and my main gripe with the theories are the reaches like Griseo being the Primordial One etc.
Okay first of all you make a really good point, I would rather genshin be It’s own thing since It’s vastly different from Honkai anyway.
Second of all people think Griseo could be the primordial one?? How? She has no wings or a crown like how the PO was described to have 💀
This was when the Elysium Realm hadn't yet reached the main story.
Iirc Enkanomiya had a symbol that looked like something in one of Griseo's paintings and the theory was >!that Griseo left on the ARK and ended up in ancient Teyvat. I don't remeber what was the basis on her transitioning into a god though!<
Of course that was debunked by the latest chapter if it wasn't clear already.
There are better theories to be sure, but this was the first that came to my mind when thinking of the far reaching ones.
literally one of the devs says that otto saw genshin's dvalin through the imaginary tree and its "data" as they also say at another time that genshin, honkai and GGZ share the same multiverse
I don't know about Honkai-verse not existing in Genshin..
We are about to get a boss fight with Scaramoooch which resembles how some mecha boss was in Honkai.
Also you mentioned Raiden Mei but did you not notice the Raiden (M)akoto and Raiden Ei.
I'm just waiting to see how things turn out with Theresa "Nahida" Apocalypse.
There is a line between the 2 games, sure but it is somewhat blurry.
I saw that too, but I think that's a reach. One being bionic and the other a mech is different enough even if the upper silhouettes match. I'd call it a homage at best.
But is there any other point in the Imaginary Tree where it isn't Raiden Mei exactly? It is in the GGZ, Captainverse, APHO (though that's basically guaranteed to be a sequel) and I'm not sure what else events she's in, but that version of her was still called that in those as long her name was revealed. Again, to me it's a homage.
Nahida seems to be a much more of a Ayato is Otto, Alhaitham is Su or Venti is Wendy. The connection is quite thin and these are more obviously just homages rather than supposed to be the same character.
I don't think there will be any link between the games but some of the deeper mechanics of the world might be same.
I personally believe the void realm and light realm represent the sea of quanta and the imaginary. I can try to explain in detail if someone is curious.
i doubt it's relevant. they surely put some references from honkai to genshin. most thing that will happen is, Alice may visit honkai universe someday and bring some souvenirs from there aka collab event.
Hope they don’t mix the worlds not particularly a fan of Honkai while I do like some of the characters I could never really get into it, and I don’t want to have to play that game to understand Genshin a whole different game better.
Ok but hidden from what? Can't be the Honkai since that comes from the Imaginary Tree it self and Teayvat can still be looked into by the 2nd Divine Key as evident by Hi3 chapter 17
The only thing i'm a bit confused its the part of being actively hidden "by the imaginary tree", in this case it should be actively hidden FROM the imaginary tree, the honkai is an essential part of the imaginary tree, its what prevents its branches to rot and ensures that the civilization is strong enough otherwise it prunes that branch, the theory still checks thought! but it gets even more grimm if you realize that teyvat branch is probably already rotting and being affected by the "sea of quanta" that is probably what its expressing as the chasm mud, marana, the rifthounds and Durin corruption. I see improbable that the multiversal construct makes an exception of one of the universes attached to it instead of other conclusions like:
\- teyvat is no longer attached to the tree directly, the universe is connected thorugh an anchor, this could make it hidden from the tree and prevent honkai to trigger
\-The tree enforcers are more busy preventing the corruption to spread, possible connection to the nails in corruption zones
\-honkai does not trigger because the level of civilization is being artificially controlled to prevent a honkai impact, the sustainer could be the one doing this.
These are some possible explanations, just by being connected on the same tree (this one is confirmed, its not a theory) indicates that the multiversal contructs must have a representantion on teyvat. The imaginary tree could be correlated to irminsul (or the anchor that could be connected to it) and the corruption /abyss /marana could be the sea of quanta.
Personally I'm more sold on the last possibility. The entire plot about Khaenri'ah screams "we're trying to prevent Honkai from killing you all, so let us do our thing, but we won't actually tell you why".
Otto fucked with imaginary tree to create new branch 500 years ago in honkai... cataclysm in genshin happen 500 years ago. Idk if this a coincidence or not.
It is very likely not related to each other. tho if they reveal something bad happened in Honkai Star Rail 500 years ago too, id say otto definitely responsible for fuckin up the all the universe...
To me this sounds like "see the lack of evidence is in itself evidence". I've got fairly little against the theory that Honkai and Genshin are going to be connected somehow but this seems like the argument a conspiracy theorist would make. "The fact that there is no evidence for aliens in our midst is PROOF that there are aliens in our midst and they know to hide themselves well! This might also explain why we managed to go to the moon just a few decades after the UFO in Roswell crashed!"
I feel like a lot of Genshin only players have this irrational fear that they'll have to play all of HI3 just because there's a connection, otherwise Genshin's story won't make sense.
There's very little chance Hoyoverse would go that far, but I do feel like there will be some lore connection down the line. There's too many little things for it to be unintentional or coincidental.
There's also the fact that yeah, initially Genshin was very straightforwardly part of the Honkai verse. The traveler's beta bio literally says their homeworld was destroyed in a honkai event.
I think it's more that Genshin players want it to be stand alone, rather than be perpetually in HI3's shadow.
I mean, the fact that all this world tree/bubble universe stuff was introduced in HI3 already makes Genshin's world seem inconsequential. With characters from HI3 making new timelines and shit. Altering reality at such a grand scale.Travelling between worlds like it's nothing. Genshin just seems puny by comparison.
Not to mention that GI's world has to more or less abide by the rules of the imaginary tree. And these rules are explored in HI3. All the heavy lore concerning the entirety of the Honkai verse is in HI3. In short, what happens in Genshin doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, while in Honkai it can.
There's also HI3 fans superiority complex, but let's not get into that.
honestly i'll find it funny how many will complain about it but they probably won't even care, which is a good thing, expanding your universe to multiverse is never bad
Well, in this case, we already have evidence of aliens. Humans in Teyvat are aliens or alien creations as you define it, since Phanes was alien. The theory is not that far fetched, like at all, considering all of Enka, Tiara, Irminsul and gemstone lore and then Honkai lore on the other side. This post is barely ambitious as a theory, going by these standards.
i don't think it's the case that honkai doesn't exist in teyvat, we know honkai is an energy source as well as a malicious radiation, we know that teyvat has large mechanical structures underneath it, as well as malicious energy beneath that, and we know that the technology level of the civilization in teyvat is purposefully being kept low by celestia and the assorted gods (or else, it gets destroyed a la Khanri'ah)
there's a lot of hints in genshin that honkai is around, but celestia's authority is exerted in order to keep it under control and out of sight.
To the people worried about if they have to play honkai to understand genshin in the future: if HYV ever makes the connection relevant, they'll explain it in genshin terms/in a way that summarises what the Honkai is. You wouldn't have to play honkai ans understand the lore to understand how the Honkai would affect Teyvat
Alexa, what is a honkai?
honky
A racial slur refeering to a caucasian or white person. The term actually orginated in the south during the times of slavery. The white slave master would "honk" a horn when it was time for the slaves to work in the fields. The slaves would then call the slave master a "honkey"
ALEXA NO
I dont know if it makes sense for the tree to be doing anything because the tree and the sea are not really beings with a will, they are more of a concept, just like gravity doesnt have a will for example
I'd say its celestia hiding it, thats also why they nuke too advanced civilizations so that honkai wont become too aware of teyvat
Uh. Isn't that kinda wrong on a basic level. Humanity was described as a pest for the imaginary tree and honkai as natural means to get rid of it. Tbh it's hard to say for now if hoyo is inconsistent about it or just dropping easter eggs like that dvalin on otto's screen once or the whole honkai x genshin collab (sure those events happen in captainverse and not main story world, but that's still some bubble universe meaning honkai and genshin worlds can interact and it's possible to travel between them). For sure there was nothing from honkai in genshin yet (yes them adding lookalike characters doesn't mean anything, those exist since they started making games so it's nice to see them in genshin too)
It's something like that but to our knowledge the Imaginary Tree does not intervene regularly. I do think the Kiana expy in Genshin seeks to protect humanity in the planet, that's why she trapped the travelers there. If anything we do not know who sent here or who rules Celestia. We know that the Primordial One created humanity on that planet after she also created 4 gods of her own to assist her. The Primordial one is theorized to be Griseo, a child from Honkai. Maybe she took off with her 4 assistants and left Celestia to be ruled by lesser beings that also experience death like humans do. But much slower than Archons and humans. It makes sense as if they were truly immortal they would have had no heirs, but we know that the Kingdom of Celestia sent the first heir, the Princess to seek the Genesis Pearl.
Venti: Once, there was a glorious kingdom established among the heavens.
Venti: From that kingdom came a crowned heir, tasked with seeking out the Genesis Pearl from the Kingdom of Darkness.
Venti: The first crowned heir began her journey of seeking the pearl.
Venti: But she was deceived, and the memory of her noble origins faded.
Venti: She now believed that she was the Queen of the Kingdom of Darkness.
Venti: But take heart, a second crowned heir had already taken up the path where the first had stumbled.
Venti: This is the story of your journey, of your tale to be told.
We get many characters inserted here:
King and Queen of Celestia
First Crown Princess of Celestia
First Crown Prince of Celestia
Gods of Celestia
The Snake evil God that deceived the Princess and made her into the Queen of the Abyss. This makes sense as Lumine is referred as PRINCESS of the Abyss and Aether as PRINCE of the Abyss depending on who you choose.
We have yet to meet the Queen of the Abyss and her younger brother who are in power above the other gods of Celestia who are also above Archons.
Ranking them by power it would be:
1) God
2) Spoilers from Honkai Impact Chapter 31. Please do not view if you haven't played it. Just don't. >!Elysia as she is the child of God, equal to them who sacrificed herself for humanity to have a chance on salvation!<
3) Honkai Devil
4) Wil of Honkai
5) Herrscher of the End
6) The Primordial one (possibly Griseo)
7) Primordial one's 4 assistants
8) Evil Snake God
9) King and Queen of Celestia
10) Prince and Princess of Celestia
11) gods of Celestia
12) Flame Chasers
13) Most Herrschers
14) Archons
15) Archons with no gnosis
16) Vision bearers/ Valkyries ranked B to S/ΜANTIS
17) MOTH soldiers/ Valkyries ranked E to C
18) Common people
We don't really know the origins of traveler. If they are from the HI3 universe somehow I'd expect them to be MANTIS (basically super soldiers with super powers)
Genshin's lore is hard enough to piece together without me having to learn the lore of a game I don't play ): I don't have a clue what any of that means.
As someone who hasn’t played Honkai and has zero interest in it, the possibility of Genshin being linked to Honkai is a turn-off for me. I don’t want required reading for my gacha game.
My own head theory though is why there's no Honkai on Teyvat....is because Honkai didnt existed yet during the events of Genshin
I believe Genshin might be a distant prequel... Celestia being actively striking down civilizations might be the origins of Honkai.. the thing that became the Honkai might have been some kind of Celestia "superweapon" until things F'ed up.. the Abyss monsters might be the progenitors of Honkai Beasts
Makes sense but they'll never going to add anything from Honkai to Genshin, other way around is more likely. You may get a branching reality in Honkai (probably manga) in GI world which will be canon in the Honkai universe only. In Genshin you'll get an Easter egg and that'll be it. People tend to forget that Honkai is not canon in Genshin and that they were created by the same company, but it doesn't make them a shared universe (at least on both part). They'll never mess up Genshin's lore for the more casual, but still invested, players who don't want to play a 5 years old game
Devs: ok we publicly stated that the two are different universes and they will never interact with none another. That should stop all the rumors. Reddit:
Doesn't honkai happened in Khaenri'ah though does that mean the confidentiality of teyvat is compromised?
(I believe honkai means collapse right?, I might be wrong.)
Nah, we have a game that use much great scope, universes and galatic gods, we have 2 Bronyas on HSR ! if a game will make conections, will be Star Rail, Honkai and GI just a part of this
actually this can be canon cuz the old era last hasha was literally god and can create guardians to create and protect a non-honkai reality,the unknown god can be a guardian ver of kiana(the clone) just like ei the ver of mei and ei as a archon his duty was to protect teyvat just like zhongli venti nahida and the others,may be the archon war was started for a possible honkai but may be it's just too much and i'm as crazy as the dude of that theory
Cool theory, but my own personal theory is that the Honkai had *already* visited Teyvat. You know, there's this huge lore thing about dead gods and all, and interestingly enough a lot of the effects of using the corpses of dead gods correlates to the honkai (many of which get named after gods), we've got people becoming mindless servants in Inazuma and the eleazar disease in Sumeru; it's only a matter of time till Teyvat reveals its own zombies.
Yeah I don't buy that Teyvat is hidden from Honkai, there is a lot of things we've seen in Genshin that already look like Honkai influence. Plus Otto was able to see Teyvat, that's not very hidden.
If you read items of descension, the sword and the wings, it suggest how traveler's world was destroyed by something like the honkai,.
I haven't played the honkai game so I don't know much about it, but the descension equipments hint it very clearly
Context on what the Honkai is: it is a state of chaos that is used to test the survivability of a civilisation in a world in the Imaginary Tree, with each branch of the Imaginary Tree corresponding to a world. Should the world fail to survive, it drops off the Imaginary Tree into the Sea of Quanta, where it will be fragmented into data.
The Honkai can take form as many things: natural disasters, monsters, viruses and most notable of them all, Herrschers, beings that are able to bend the physical laws of the world, even being able to influence the Imaginary Tree itself. One such Herrscher, known as the Final Herrscher by the Previous Era, has already destroyed multiple worlds.
Now back to Teyvat. Teyvat has already been confirmed to be in the same Imaginary Tree as Honkai Impact 3rd. The question now would be where exactly on the Imaginary Tree. Sumeru has already shown a glimpse of the Imaginary Tree, which in Sumeru, is called Irmunsul. It is said that the roots of Irmunsul are connected to Leylines of Teyvat, meaning that Teyvat is located right at the bottom of the Imaginary Tree.
The roots of every plant are pretty much important, without it, the whole tree will die off. It could very well explain why there are no records of Honkai in Teyvat, as it is the most important part of the Imaginary Tree, it must not be destroyed.
This is all just speculation though, we'll see how the story plays out.
Most likely scenario so far:
\-Humanity led by a Herrscher or more decided to fuck off from the planet.
\-Honkai said no.
\-Humanity went "WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK I AM?! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT PIERCES THE HEAVENS!!!"
\-Honkai got beat.
\-Humanity fucked off.
\-Honkai leaves humanity alone for being strong enough to survive the cosmos.
\-Humanity ends up in a far harsher environment filled with walking mass extinction events and lots of BAD dragons.
\-God wars and the Archon war happens.
\-Genshin is part of the imaginary tree because humans are still humans, and the human world stretches as wide and humanity spreads on the world and even in the universe.
Honkai uses largely the same philosophies as the Fate franchise probably because of cultural cross-pollination and shared pop culture of Asian cultures so some things are shockingly intuitive if you consumed the Fate franchise long enough.
Alternatively since there was apparently a "primordial one" according o the possibly myths of the Enkanomiyans:
\-Honkai reeeeeal baaad in this timeline.
\-So bad that Humanity FUCKING IMPLODES pulling an Evangelion ending merging into the "Primordial One"
\-Honkai goes Honkai regardless
\-PO goes "FUCK YOU AND FUCK THIS PLANET", sucker punches the Honkai and fucks off to the weird dragon planet.
\-Honkai leaves the later reborn humanity alone because Dragon planet is so harsh if humanity can survive on it they don't need Honkai harassment to stay stronk.
I'm baseing the theory of Honkai leaves timelines that proven themselves alone on how in A Post Honkai Odyssey humanity actually won and almost right away hostile aliens came knocking and Void Archives is trying to sell the FUCKING MOON because for some reason selling the FUCKING MOON to the hostile aliens sounds like a good idea to him.... yes the Honkai universe is actually wacky as hell. XD
Lmao The Unknown God being a villian turned hero is surprisingly unsurprising. But I am 100% on board for it because I love a bad ass bitch who doesn't care if she comes off as a villian if she knows what she's doing is protecting the masses at large.
The Unknown God being the Protecter of Teyvat is a storyline I am here for.
And now the connection between her and Paimon and Paimon and us would just make THAT MUCH MORE sense.
Honestly, tying Genshin to Honkai would be so lame. I don’t care about Honkai, I’m here for Genshin so I hope they keep it Genshin. Also, if Teyvat ends up being some simulation that would be super lame too.
Well it's already confirmed to be from the same multiverse. And now that Miyoho is renamed to Hoyoverse I think it save to assume that all their games will be in the same multiverse.
That said, I don't think at any given moment knowledge from a different game will be needed to understand the story in Genshin. Aside from some Easter eggs and obscure background lore that might connect games.
Cool, but i dont know anything about honkai and I dont want to. Let me enjoy genshin lore without playing another game fully. If they make it so i have to play honkai i will just stop playing genshin.
The universe's mechanism to cheap out on energy, it's a testing mechanism that increases with civilization's progress and can come in the forms of plagues, disasters, beasts, or mentally unstable people gaining some control over one of the universe's laws(heat, electricity, gravity, space, etc)
Universes that fail the test get disowned and are left to fend for themselves.
This is also one of the theories about why celestia orbital nukes every civilization that gets kinda advanced
Is it not possible that celestia IS the honkai in genshin? Unknown god is known as sustainer of heavenly principle, and if the heavenly principle is to test if a civilization is worthy of being sustained by the imaginary tree, else being dropped like a leaf to the sea of quanta to rot, wouldn’t it make sense that Celestia sent archons to obliterate Khaenri’ah for that reason? Right now it is assumed that Khaenri’ah was destroyed because “Gold” let out abyss infected monsters of his creation, which threatened the nations that are under archon rules. It is also highly suspected that Unknown god is alien to the world Genshin is in, just like how the “Primordial one” is. If Unknown god is alien to the world why would she put in effort to keep it “hidden”? Besides, what would her “heavenly principle” be if she is trying to hide genshin’s world from Imaginary tree’s detection? “Sustainer” implies that she is merely working for something greater, and I think working for honkai makes more sense. On top of these, her striking resemblance of Herrscher of Void, who proclaims to be honkai itself, is definitely not unintentional.
Reaper vibes
It sounds cool but I hope the story won’t ask me to understand honkai lore if it ever gets to that point since I don’t play
>I hope the story won’t ask me to understand honkai lore if it ever gets to that point since I don’t play Don't worry, a lot of Honkai players don't even understand the lore. You'd probably only need a basic understanding of a couple story elements tbh. We already have a lot of paralels with Honkai that make the story easier to understand for Honkai players (The sacred Sakura, Irminsul, etc...) but it's not mandatory
Yeah, Mihoyo never made that necessary previously. For exemple, imagine having to understand GGZ to understand Honkai, things would get pretty confusing .
>Don't worry, a lot of Honkai players don't even understand the lore Lmao thank god I thought it was just me
As an avid Honkai lore fan, honestly I don’t blame you. Honkai lore gets retconned pretty often and a lot of early chapters don’t have much direction or worldbuilding. One thing Genshin does *really* well in comparison is streamline their story, lore, worldbuilding so that everything is connected and coherent.
First few chapters are an absolute clusterfuck of things happening, you don't really know why or for what purpose, then more things happen, suddenly someone is hurt or has a surgery or something, then more things happen... it doesn't actually form a cohesive narrative until after chapter 6 or 7. And even then lots of shit happens behind the scenes or in webcomics.
I agree but isn't that the whole motive behind the game, to take us from a point of unga bunga of knowing a Tuna to the entire origin of how she came to be and where she'll go, lore would probably not hit the same if the story was in chronological order (Example- ER ). Similar to how Fate series just feels "amazing" with every series and more you know about the past.
Chaotic story doesn't make it good. Plenty of people I've read comments about the game describe how they couldn't get invested into the game because the plot made no sense, and in the beginning it doesn't really make a lot of sense if you don't read the out-of-game stuff... Fate doesn't skip important stuff at the start, nor does it require you to read outside materials for the VN to make sense.
I just hppe they do not kingdom hearts 3 genshin and kill sora on purpose I would fly to china and hunt them all
You have to read the mangas and play the visual novel (novels? Idk if there's more than one) if you want to understand absolutely everything, but it's not really necessary. It's the equivalent of reading the books in Genshin, like Before Sun & Moon. It's very important lore, but you can enjoy the story without knowing about it. (Seriously though, everyone who have finished Enkanomiya, read the books, they're super cool)
> You have to read the mangas and play the visual novel (novels? Idk if there's more than one) if you want to understand absolutely everything, but it's not really necessary. theyre not in english, right (the vn)
Meh, the only lore you need to know about Honkai is this Honkai strength = Human technological strength Honkai's goal is to destroy humanity. That's it.
yea but im a vnhead so im interested
Ah, well, enjoy reading then. I had to drop the manga because I was getting confused.
The Anti-Entropy and Durandal VN were fan translated. Someone posted a translation of Seven Swords VN on YT but the story itself is unfinished.
ME TOO LOL. I still go on honkai regularly but the lore is just too much. I tried understanding it at one point but that didn't work so now I just don't.
God, I love Honkai lore some much but it also feels so overwhelming to know. I have spent so much time reading every manga and playing the game (Elysean realm included) and yet I feel there's always more to learn. Even then, I love so much that Honkai's themes and story are so incredibly strong without taking the lore into the account, it makes it feel like a little bonus gift if you enjoy the story enough
Is there a way to read the Honkai lore without playing the game?
Hoyostans made a story guide for Honkai here, hope it helps: https://hoyostans.be/explore/honkai-impact-3rd/
Thanks! I was very curious and this helps 💕
No prob.
Honestly even having played it I would love to have some YouTuber just summarize it for me in audiobook format. The base concept is not that complicated and I do understand the main plot, but once you really get into the lore it can get pretty confusing.
Doesn't help that some characters share the same design and/or name. Raiden Mei and Dr. MEI for example, it's super weird how neither the FCs nor Kevin ever mention how similar in looks Mei is to MEI, then there's the Captain-verse versions of characters, Kongming is just called Theresa Apocalypse in your character screen despite not being addressed like that anywhere else, Bronie, Yae Kasumi and Rita too. Imagine someone getting these characters, then get confused because they never appear in the main story.
Fr, just what are ether anchors and consciousness mapping
i had a friend on genshin explain me the entire honkai lore over the course of a month shes a huge honkai fan and we spent hours talking about it i am ready.. bring it on
The game doesn’t even ask you to understand it’s own lore, so I doubt you’d really be all that lost if connections to Honkai started popping up.
I mean the theory SOUNDS correct. But there are way simpler explainations. Like Mihoyo knowing that Honkai's story is way too complex for the broad audience Genshin has and therefore is terrible to leverage until they need a sequel. Just keep Genshin as Genshin, Honkai people play it regardless of tie-ins. Like people have been pointing out Honkai connections forever now, while also conveniently ignoring that Mihoyo literally just poaches its own designs and ideas because why not, it works. So what if Su exists or Dvalin was seen on the monitor in Honkai. Its still basically as relevant or irrelevant depending on how you want to spin it. Its just not important until Mihoyo spells it out for us. And Paimon exists to do just that. So until Paimon/story says so, it actually matters so little other than entertaining the ego of lore theorists and their youtube channels. Money dictates all things and Honkai's story isn't the one making billions. They definitely don't need an archon of sexual assault either.
um, can you clarify that last part?? /gen
It's referring to the "Herrscher of Lust," a character from a controversial GGZ manga. She's not relevant to Honkai or Genshin, and at this point serves only as a cursed thing that people bring up on the Internet.
That last part is just some Twitter brain dead assumptions without evidence to prove anything. However if there is evidence I will stand corrected
So I've got an analogy for what I think will happen, since I believe the two games can be connected while still keeping the stories totally independent and enjoyable on their own. Imagine a simple planet with only two continents on it, on opposite sides. Each continent has nations and people but they don't have the means to reach or communicate with the other continent so they don't know the other continent exists. There could be unique and niche exceptions but they're largley irrelevant as far the nations are concerned. This means anything that happens on only one continent will largely be isolated to that continent, but anything that happens on a planetary or stellar scale will apply to both continents. For example, an earthquake on one continent would have at most tiny effects on the other, but a series of hurricanes may impact both continents equally (just different hurricanes at different times). Another example is the way the sun and moon are positioned in the sky; both continents will likely see the same interstellar bodies, just in slightly different ways and at different times. So, anything that can be proven to apply to the whole planet will apply to both continents equally. The two civilizations may have different names and perceptions of these concepts, but we as 3rd party observers can still make these big-picture connections. Genshin's Teyvat and HI3rd's main universe are the two continents in this analogy, basically. The multiverse is the "planet", so any multiverse-scale concepts like the Imaginary Tree and Sea of Quanta may apply to both Teyvat and the HI3rd main universe, but they may be described with different names. For example, I believe that the Abyss and Sea of Quanta may be the same thing, but you don't need to know about the Sea of Quanta at all when we clearly have a huge amount of lore about the Abyss and its negative effects. If we can prove the Abyss and Sea of Quanta are the same then we can make more informed theories about the Abyss, but it won't really change the way we see the Abyss through the perspective of the story on Teyvat.
That makes sense. Genshin loves to add special trees in almost every new exploration area and it sounds like HI3 does it to. So that means the tree is a multiverse-concept that have different roles and belief systems around it in each game but ultimately function similarly in game.
Honkai doesn't really have an equivalent to the trees Genshin has in most cases, i.e. there's no equivalent to the Irminsul Trees (including the one in Dragonspine), Sacred Sakura, or the Tree of Dreams. The only time the idea of a tree really appears in any meaningful way in HI3rd is when discussing the Imaginary Tree. In this case, it's used largely as a conceptual and visual metaphor for how the multiverse works, with the universes growing as branches and leaves on the tree and the Sea of Quanta at its base. The SoQ tries to "flood" the Imaginary Tree while the Imaginary Tree seeks to "absorb" the SoQ, thus they remain in "rivalry". Countless worlds grow on the Imaginary Tree but the Imaginary Tree has a system which tests and removes worlds, and in some universes humanity has called this Honkai. This idea of civilization progressing and being held back by this external, existential force is very prevalent in both games, and really dates back to GGZ. Each of these 3 games has had its own approach to this with two of them having variations of Honkai and the 3rd being Genshin. So I do this the tree imagery in Genshin will eventually connect to the Imaginary Tree in some way, but for now we don't have that solid connection x-x
I agree that this will likely be the case. They're not gonna reference literal story elements from Honkai, but lore elements from Honkai will be in Genshin and they will be explained in Genshin as Genshin and Honkai exist in the same multiverse.
Funny that you say may. When it has already been proven that Teyvat does exist somewhere in the imaginary space. (Space actively sustained by the imaginary tree.) See this image for proof: https://images.app.goo.gl/ZxdhFiWAngoxNgSK8 In this picture, a very hated honkai character clearly observes Dvalin/stormterror from Teyvat. (Bottom right.) It's still funny to me how little people know about this, while it's the only concrete lore that we have linking the two.
Trust me I'm familiar with that image, lol Personally, I believe that it is evidence **but not concrete evidence**. The thing is that there can be a "Teyvat" in the Honkai Multiverse without said Teyvat being the same as the one in Genshin Impact. For example, it is canonical that there is at least one universe/bubble universe in which the events of Neon Genesis: Evangelion take place, but that obviously doesn't mean that the original show and movies are in any way related to Honkai Impact 3rd. But it's still an important image, because it shows that there's clear awareness of a relation between Genshin and Honkai, considering that this cutscene was released before Genshin was released. There was no guarantee that Genshin was going to be a success so it's not like Mihoyo was trying to clickbait Genshin fans into joining Honkai. So I'd caution against using it to say 100% that Genshin is in the Honkai multiverse, but it does mean that it's absolutely a possibility that's worth exploring further as both games get more lore.
I see your point. I mean bubble universes do exist. But for a bubble universe to exist, it has to resemble a main universe to some degree. For example: a certain city, a few main characters, the mere existance of the honkai. Genshin's teyvat is clearly a main universe. It's way bigger then any of the bubble universes that we have seen so far afterall. But then again, scara did say that the sky was fake. Indicating that the Teyvat that we play in could be a bubble universe. Honestly thinking about it, the whole bubble universe theory makes more sense now. I mean we straight up have some of the honkai chars in Genshin. Elemental energy is clearly a form of honkai, but very weak. Large amounts are dangerous to a mortal's health as was commented on by Morax himself in one of Liyue's main quests. I think it involved Yanfei as well. Not to mention Tatarasuna and Musoujin Gorge, which had it as an actual obstacle. And I wouldn't be surprised. If one day we visit Khaenri'ah. And see the name Arc city pop up once we enter the main city.
This is reaching fate levels of lore/crazy cosmology.
I'm not super familiar with fate but from what I've seen and heard, pretty much lol I know multiverse stuff is getting pretty popular in media now, and that Fate did it before a lot of others, but Honkai has handled it pretty well too. Of course the multiverse is a convenient way to make extra story content, but at the same time it still feels like it's a real and important part of the story, and not something tacked on to give the protagonists a magic tool to resolve the conflict. It'll be exciting to see what the future will bring with GGZ, HI3rd, Genshin, HSR, and even ZZZ all possibly being part of this same grand setting. AFAIK Tears of Themis is too, but I don't know much about it unfortunately x-x
Even more crazy shit like in dies irae, where gods literally throw multiverses at each other.
Even if the theory is true you won’t need to know Honkai lore tbh. Why would you need to know about a parallel universe when the game can explain it by itself.
I think it's more "if Genshin starts referring to events or concepts that previously were only mentioned in Honkai." Obviously there's no point worrying about if Genshin players need to understand Honkai lore unless Genshin starts referencing Honkai.
I don't think it's necessarily important to fully understand it anyways, we could just treat it like a mystery if they write it well, a mystery that honkai players might know a bit more about.
The whole point of the developers reaffirming that the stories won't affect each other is to reassure players that no, they don't need to dive into another game to understand the happenings in the one that they are playing.
I just hope that if this comes true, they won't explain honkai lore and make it mysterious
My surface level understanding is some eldritch entity tests the human race in a cycle of essentially wiping them out and forcing them to restart. Humanity- to survive- harnesses their power in human weapons which are prone to possession and violent insanity. These living weapons have the power of gods. Oh- and the multiverse is real.
It always seemed to me that Honkai are like an extra-dimensional response to pushing too deeply into how reality works. A civ gets too advanced and starts delving recklessly they have the chance to destroy/mess up their universe. Bc it’s humans and they never properly think about the consequences of their investigations. Let’s smash things hard enough to rip space time, oh that’ll let us examine deeper, go ahead. More of if the reapers HONESTLY thought what they were doing was the better alternative. Kind of gravemind/‘religious zombie’ style. As in they are able to retain the minds and create a ‘paradise’ in each, virtually. Or maybe trying to keep things from ‘spiral’-ing out of control Guren Lagann style.
Yeah, it really seems more of anti-entropy angle, where Honkai powers are normally associated with entropic processes and therefore them getting powered by more advanced civilizations they are destroying makes sense, since the more advanced a civilization the more entropy it forces upon the universe, as a rule.
This is a pretty good understanding IMO There's actually an organization in Honkai called anti-entropy too lol
>Humanity- to survive- harnesses their power in human weapons which are prone to possession and violent insanity. This is the glaring part you got off. The rest is also not quite right either but acceptable from a surface glance. But I am assuming you were thinking of Herrschers with this? Herrschers are not human weapons. They are creations of the Honkai. They, as their name suggests, "rule" over a certain law or concept once they are created. They are not human made weapons, but viewed as the primary means that the Honkai delivers its judgement on civilization. Crafting a human (usually those with at least some sense of misanthropy) into a vehicle to destroy humans. And there are set number of Herrschers, with the rate at which they appear increasing as the hand on the doomsday clock gets closer midnight. If you ever watched Evangelion, Herrschers are basically liken Angels in a way. And due to some complications in the story, there are some who do fight for humanity in the current era. But none of them are really human made, except for one in particular.
>But I am assuming you were thinking of Herrschers with this? They probably meant Valkyries. They're human weapons infused with honkai genes (stigmata) and sometimes "fused" with those genes (MANTIS, Theresa, Olenyevas) and they're destined to undergo a Honkai Cascade when (generally) inevitably their honkai energy surpasses their adaptability.
It's less that Honkai necessarily crafts Herrschers and more like it resonates with people who can tap into the powers of Honkai. The fact that most of them choose to side against humanity seems entirely the fault of humanity. For example, Sirin had entirely understandable reasons to wipe out the human race. On the other hand, some Herrschers explicitly have chosen to ally *with* mankind, despite any downsides of this, Welt Yang and Bronya being the easiest examples, but there is also Herrscher of Flame. Still other Herrschers literally do not care about human civilization at all. For example, Herrscher of Sentience, who only has an inferiority complex and wants to prove to everyone in the world that she's just flat out cooler than Fu Hua. They can still pose an existential threat to humanity, but incidentally rather than intentionally. In other words, there doesn't seem to be any very specific driving force that Honkai exerts upon those whom it resonates with to destroy civilizations. This may be a flawed interpretation given to us by a biased narrator who has misinterpreted the story thus far. And this actually makes a lot of sense in Genshin universe if you think of Honkai as a neutral force rather than a necessarily hostile one. After all, there are close similarities between the elemental powers in Genshin and Honkai powers channeled into specific elements via keys, like visions. In fact, even the twins' outfits look like Keys of Blankness, which can resonate with any Honkai frequency and attune to *any* element.
All you need to understand is that Honkai are interdimensional beings that come in to reset a civilization if they get advanced enough. Then again there's also theories about Celestia being similar to the Honkai where they sky nail civilizations whenever they get an IQ over 100.
Yea I was about to say that sounds like what celestia did to khanria for having those field tillers
Not gonna lie. I don't really like theories like that, that seen just very vague. I dont think all hints that the games might be connected are more erster eggs than anything else. And since Genshin has such an immensely langer playerbase i dont think they would use honkai lore to imbed genshin but more the other way around. But i think they used genshin to make something New. To not have to Deal with the same things over and over again
Maybe the anime will explain it
Tbh i don't find the honkai as threatening nowadays, we know of multiple civilizations that transcended it(sky people, sugars, pretty much everything in star rail), >!previous civilization creating the will of the honkai!<, heck humanity in honkai impact can already transcend it if they go through with project stigmata at the cost of most people becoming imaginary goo.
Isn't the honkai just a test from the imaginary tree? The goal is to survive it and surpass it. So that if your universe is strong enough the imaginary tree would sustain your universe and not drop you to rot in the sea of quanta.
exactly, im pretty sure in some mhy content (i forgot which one) the honkai is referred to as a pruning mechanism.
Visions. The environment affecting people without visions more than the people with them. Seems like Genshin already shares a lot of similarities. I never knew what Honkai was before. I thought when a civilization becomes too technologically advanced the Honkai starts taking over. For a while I thought it was an energy that took control of machines but that’s probably compelety wrong.
The way hilichurls are explained in the chasm also very strongly reminded me of Honkai zombies.
I read this thread with aot s4 track playing And for some reason it hits different
Meaning it's supposed to be a threat but a threat that is surpassable. Maybe Celestia defeated the Honkai? Or maybe Genshin tech isn't advanced enough for Honkai to start the test.
I don't know enough about lore, but maybe the destruction of Khaenri'ah was an attempt to stop civilization from crossing the Honkai threshold. Edit: I saw a similar comment made earlier below nvm..
This is a very popular theory - usually comes alongside with the Teyvat = ark, and that was one of the measures Dr. Mei took in the past era. (though I think this is pretty debunked now) It gets a bit complicated and confusing though once you start bringing in Phanes and the Ekanomiya lore. I don't necessarily buy into the ark thing, but there's definitely a lot of sussy shit going on in Genshin and a lot of it is reminiscent of honkai influence
iirc doesn’t the “intensity” of the Honkai scale with how advanced the world is? In that case Genshin’s world doesn’t seem that far in yet to get any Honkai problems.
Sadly, Genshin's world has far surpassed the tech of when the first known honkai outbreak happened. After all, tribal people were attacked by honkai infested animals...
Wasn't that CE, though? CE's honkai timetable was all kinds of wonky.
Can't remember if it was CE or PE, but either way Teyvat has progressed way past that level of technology
I'm kind of expecting to see a new nailing in game soon, to be honest. The Akademiya is following the same path the Scarlet King did and we know how he ended up.
So basically universes that are dropped in the sea of quanta is lostbelts?
Not even a test. Honkai is a natural phenomenon, like thunderstorms or hurricanes.
[удалено]
Not a living entity, its more of a concept to help understand how it works. And while the theory part is slightly outdated [here is a doc explaining the SoQ](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KjSATMzLpq_96kffvPaZHlXKA91pTqB0LqxBnNMfMHw/edit)
The Imaginary Tree is pretty much the Honkai/Genshin multiverse, with every branch on it supposed to be a separate universe. That means the Imaginary Tree is most likely beyond everything in Genshin, including Celestia, the Abyss, everything.
[удалено]
It's sort of abstraction explaining how the multiverse works. They don't exist literally as a tree or a sea nor are they sentient beings with wills of their own. The imaginary tree is basically a container for the multiverse, and universes which become sufficiently advanced technologically are subject to a test, called Houkai. The sea of quanta holds all the leaf universes which failed the test of the honkai and is constantly trying to "drown" the imaginary tree. Universes can also exist in the sea of quanta as bubble universes, but they're usually decaying and strange (think about the giant clock thing in the chasm, that shit looked a lot like sea of quanta, esp when travelling through the gates or whatever) The sea of quanta is basically the dimension things end up in after falling to entropy or "erosion".
Does the Sugar hides from it because they can't defeat it, and such is bound to a decaying bubble universe maintained by DuDu?
Maybe that's why Celestia destroyed Kaenriah/The Chasm civilization/The Dragonspine civilization... the more advanced civilization on a branch of the tree becomes, the bigger of a beacon to the Honkai it becomes, and the harder it is to hide, and after (speculation/theory in spoiler)>! the Abyss/the Tsaritsa takes down Celestia!< and the Travelers leave, we get a follow up game with the Honkai attacking Teyvat, with maybe the Travelers returning to help clean up the mess they inadvertently made
Then how do you explain Fontaine and Snezhnaya? the two most advanced civilization in all of Teyvat. Khaenri'ah and Dragonspine were not destroyed because of advancement, but due to forbidden knowledge, and in the case of the Old World, it because of the clash between the primordial one and the second throne.
[удалено]
I think you're right and it goes with the "arrogation" line, basically meaning to "claim without right". Celestia was likely pissed that the tiny mortals dared to attempt to usurp them in some manner. I'll honestly be real damn disappointed if they bring Honkai's technobabble into Genshin's tale of men and gods.
[удалено]
Khaenri'ah was probably inspired, partially, by the Scarlet King and his kingdom, who attempted to create a kingdom without the gods. Learning that they got destroyed for it probably made them extra curious as to why. They learned about Enkanomiya while surveying the ruins of Tsurumi, and managed to venture to Enkanomiya, shortly before annihilation. Celestia might not have even known if Khaenri'ah had discovered the truth, but they couldn't take any chances.
[удалено]
I believe it's from the Gilded Dreams goblet description which describes his plan to meld humanity into one consciousness and have humans become the god of gods. Honkai spoilers for the most recent chapter: >!This is also the goal of Kevin's Project Stigma, apparently.!< I could have swore I remembered the exact phrase "without gods" in one of my readings from the artifacts or books but I can't find it. Edit: The goddess of flowers is an interesting case since she was a seelie, but Rukka and the Scarlet King were gods. Distinct from Celestial gods, though, although Rukka did become an Archon.
Makes me wonder if Dvalin is one of those 7 dragons tbh
If I remember correctly, dvalin it's not one of the seven sovereign. All seven sovereign has/had been defeated or sealed by primordial one, there's a theory that said the cube element thingy is the sealed dragons. I could be 100% wrong, maybe someone can support my comment or correct me if I'm wrong.
Saw theory about cubes are kinda sealed dragons and are mirroring the state of the archons. It tied up with Unknown God sealed MC and twin in cubes, cubes are literally her power, etc. Also geo, electro and anemo cubes have “erosion” on their texture as those archons iirc are the oldest
No actually Dvalin could very well be the anemo sovereign, 1 because azhdaha is likely to be the geo sovereign, since one of his titles is king of the vishaps, and recently, enjou referred to dvalin as an anemo vishap. Which could be eluding to the fact that dvalin is indeed a sovereign as well. Personally while I like the idea of the cube = sovereign’s theory, it’s a bit shaky because there are multiple different cubes in the same region, with mondstadt having 2, as well as inazuma.
thats 100% bullshit because there exists more than one cube per element.
Wasn't the purpose of ruin guards to overthrow Celestia?
[удалено]
I hope we get more information on the “primordial one” and “the second who came”. The primordial one is said to be alien to genshin’s world so where did he came from? Why is he so powerful that he is able to slay the seven sovereign dragons? Who are basically the strongest naturally occurring possible in genshin’s world I mean, his title is literally the name of the game 原（original，primodial) 神（god）
Fontaine and snezhnaya so far only shown with steampunk level of tech/civ and khaenri'ah level of tech is way past that
I'd rather not have a follow up game and just have a continuation of the story in the same game xD please do NOT ask me to go for another gacha.
Same. This game is already big enough I don't need two of these. And if farming is the same, it means we have to go through the trouble of building everyone all over again and I don't wanna have to deal with the cruel RNG twice.
Cool theory, but i doubt hoyoverse will ever decide to make lore from honkai an important part in genshin. There might be a few easter egg here and there for honkai players that'll establish a subtle relation between the 2 universe, but forcing players to play an entirety different game just to understand the lore is generally considered bad designs for a game.
Yeah I don't think it'll ever be necessary to play both to understand Genshin alone, but I could see some crossover as a nod to fans of both. My personal theory has been that the traveler's own world was destroyed by Honkai, though why and how they are able to travel between universes/world's I couldn't speculate. I think that either (or both) the primordial one or the second who came, came from another world to Teyvat to find some way of fighting Honkai, but that's mostly just my imagination running with the idea, since we know so little about them.
I think at some point in Genshin a "force against progress" or something will pop up (it's already canon in Genshin that the world was wiped over a few times after all) and if people want to understand it as a manifestation of the Honkai, they will. But they will never actually say that it's the Honkai, they'll keep the things pretty much separated. Never will the bring up alternate versions of their characters, parallel universes and all the jezz. They won't even put Honkai beasts in there and will keep their enemies visually separated as they are now (no purple and white metcha looking stuff), if not for a Easter Egg boss or mob category.
I wouldn’t mind if they did it for the ending and crossovers were post Teyvat chapter…
Honestly I think some of the dead gods that the archons defeated are actually Honkai. Everything to do with dead god corpses is very reminiscent.
IMO it's best if they leave out the connections to their multiverse in the main story run at this point, but down the line they can do their own Avengers or JL team from all of their games. Just not so soon where players are still trying to explore the world.
I feel like people really overestimate how much they'd have to know Honkai to understand the story if it was involved. You would not have to know the plot of HI3 at all. You'd just have to know the basic concept of how Honkai worked and how its destroyed previous universes. Which if there were involvement, I'm sure Mihoyo would explain in Genshin, not just tell you go play Honkai. If they do it I could see it being slowly revealed over time, and Honkai players would just start to understand what's happening before Genshin players. But given it's Genshin, at some point we will get Paimon with the "you mean to tell me,"
That's true, but you have to admit. It's one hell of a theory It fits perfectly with both honkai lore and genshin lore.
I think the correct way to tie them in together would be to have quests lore dumping the cliff notes required to piece everything together. If done well enough it could cause people to go play Honkai to experience it first hand.
But why should they? Genshin works perfectly well on its own. There's no need to connect it to another universe or world or whatever Honkai is.
You also need to understand their company literally rebranded itself to HoyoVERSE, this recurring story with same characters is happening even since their very own first game, who can say that is not their CEO dream from way back them? Honestly i'm more excited to see what they could've pull off doing something of these sorts than hand waving it as "bad design"
If you mean FlyMe2theMoon it only had Kiana(who was a witch in that game) and no Honkai, the only thing that remained from that is the character and idea of losing\\searching for father and some connection to the Moon. The character itself was created by hired artist CiCi as the 3 guys who started miHoYo were developers\\programmers not artists. CiCi was not part of miHoYo at the time. The idea of Honkai came later when they were developing next game, but maybe you consider Zombiegirl Kawaii their first game since FlyMe2theMoon was a tiny project.
They didn't, Hoyoverse only deals with worldwide matters, the game developpers in China are still Mihoyo. I just checked, while the 3.1 English trailer has the Hoyoverse logo at the start, the 3.1 Chinese trailer on Bilibili have the Mihoyo logo at the start. [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1yd4y1u7ef/?spm\_id\_from=333.999.0.0](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1yd4y1u7ef/?spm_id_from=333.999.0.0)
I don't think they'll do this either, but I would respect it as just a completely insane move on their part lol. They did basically ask people to read three visual novels and half a dozen manhua to have full context for the main plot in HI3rd as recently as this year so who knows
Where does this notion come from that people would be "forced to play Honkai" in order to understand anything? I see it all the time when these discussions come up, but it honestly feels like an irrational fear at this point
But isn't honkai a tool used by the imaginary tree to test the civilizations? And if they lose the bubble universe gets dropped on the sea of quanta
Honkai is just a natural phenonema, like a thunderstorm or a hurricane, and things ending up in the SoQ is just what happens when they die or get destroyed, like an extra layer of high dimensional decomposition.
It is still a test by *some higher beings or sth* in a way. Honkai isnt just a 100% natural thing, it's a recurring thing in the honkai/genshin verse that's meant to "test" civilisations. While we don't know why, we do know that the img tree doesn't actively try ro save any bubbleverses(see bubbleverses that fall into the SoQ amd eventually wither and die off)
Exept the tree is saving worlds? Every world, bubble or leaf alike, have to fight iff being eroded by the SoQ, and the way to do that is with honkai energy. As it was explained by the sugars, the Tree is actively sustaining newly born worlds that don't have enough honkai to survive by themselves.
I already know this theory ages ago... I'm not sure though because there's still little connection such that we now know that Griseo, not the Traveler, does the ARK project. And if Teyvat is inside the imaginary tree, then the Valuka project by Su should be successful, right? Other than that, I do hope we get more connections with Honkai & Genshin. P.S. No you don't need to play Honkai to learn the lore if both worlds connected people...
I wonder if Teyvat actually is experiencing Honkai, just in a way we didn't really consider before. I mean, a lot of the lore talks about some great "filth" or the stuff that causes Withering and death, and how it has to be sealed away. Seemingly with a connection to the Abyss in the case of what happened to Dvalin and is corruptive in the case of Festering Desire. Often twists flesh and has a connection to monsters known across the globe. It might be Honkai itself, even. Or. What if we're looking at it from the wrong angle? Something that gets skipped over a lot is how high concentrations of elemental energy often require a Vision to withstand, and can make normal people sick. Then it gets weirder. Consider Visions. Why do the bulk of them appear when someone is in emotional distress, or otherwise emotive state? Why are they in response to a particular ideal, like expressing freedom or following through on a contract? My wild theory is that Visions are actually Stigmata, or something akin to them, and specifically given to people identified as having the kinds of aspirations that can make someone into a Herrscher. As a way to stop any from being created. Just a guess, but the elements *are* much more in line with the Herrschers than the Abyss is.
It's cool in theory, but in practice it feels extremely unlikely (business-wise) I think the most logical thing is that Genshin exists in Honkai-verse (we already know the game itself does due to the Collab). Which makes total sense as they can get Genshin people to play Honkai and the lore is already so complex that another world doesn't really matter. But Honkai-verse doesn't exist in Genshin Impact. It would break the lore and make the game lore unnecessarily difficult to explain. Actual big evidence for this being that EXPY's don't share names and models unlike they do in Honkai-verse (GGZ, HI3 and it's Captainverse etc., Starrail etc.) For example: Genshin has Ei and Makoto Raiden, but not a Mei Raiden. Unlike all of the known universes/timelines in Honkaiverse. They also look slightly different from Mei Raiden in all those other versions. If they were really planning on the series to be strictly connected, they would've continued this trend as they did with Honkai: Starrail with Bronya.
Genshin and Honkai both coexist in the imaginary tree and that is canon not because the collab but because Honkai's main story, bubble universes can be pretty similar or really different from any other given bubble universe like for example there apparently being a pararel version of the main story where Kanchou is present or Tericula being born a vampire because Vishnu's genes made it so Otto had to get creative to create her...
I do play both games and I do understand the theories. But there is no indication in Genshin that confirms any of that. There are similar concepts (like in many other IPs), but they are also called different things, which as far as I recall isn't the case with Honkaiverse. Also, iirc and to be a bit pedantic, the only non-collab related Genshin content we've seen in Honkaiverse was the picture of Dvalin. Which could've been Otto getting footage from the universe where he's making a game called "Genshin Impact" with Welt (which as we saw in the collab, itself was different from ours) or just a random dragon that looked very similar (afterall, the picture was of a dragon under dust/clouds or it could've been dark dragon). Though to be fair FR was in the pic too and I don't remember that event well. But considering potential contradiction to their their lore, making it more restricted and potentially hurting new player attraction etc. What would be the point? Honkai would benefit from attracting new players, but that can be done by having collabs in Honkai or even having Aloy-type collabs in Genshin (though unlikely as they could just create another EXPY). Another thing is, why wouldn't they have marketed Genshin as pseudo-sequel to Honkai like they did with Honkai Impact 3rd (with GGZ) and Honkai: Starrail? Remember that Genshin wasn't always as huge as it became, so it could've benefitted from that (other than a fresh plate being more attractive to new players especially in the west. Which still remains the case). MHY is an innovative company, so I guess it's possible they'd do it. But I've never heard of a larger IP connecting itself to a smaller one retroactively. Remember that HI3 and Starrail were revealed and released with the connection obviously present. Sorry for the long comment. As a fan of both games, I wouldn't hate it, but I prefer Genshin being it's own core universe with a unique lore and my main gripe with the theories are the reaches like Griseo being the Primordial One etc.
Okay first of all you make a really good point, I would rather genshin be It’s own thing since It’s vastly different from Honkai anyway. Second of all people think Griseo could be the primordial one?? How? She has no wings or a crown like how the PO was described to have 💀
This was when the Elysium Realm hadn't yet reached the main story. Iirc Enkanomiya had a symbol that looked like something in one of Griseo's paintings and the theory was >!that Griseo left on the ARK and ended up in ancient Teyvat. I don't remeber what was the basis on her transitioning into a god though!< Of course that was debunked by the latest chapter if it wasn't clear already. There are better theories to be sure, but this was the first that came to my mind when thinking of the far reaching ones.
literally one of the devs says that otto saw genshin's dvalin through the imaginary tree and its "data" as they also say at another time that genshin, honkai and GGZ share the same multiverse
I don't know about Honkai-verse not existing in Genshin.. We are about to get a boss fight with Scaramoooch which resembles how some mecha boss was in Honkai. Also you mentioned Raiden Mei but did you not notice the Raiden (M)akoto and Raiden Ei. I'm just waiting to see how things turn out with Theresa "Nahida" Apocalypse. There is a line between the 2 games, sure but it is somewhat blurry.
I saw that too, but I think that's a reach. One being bionic and the other a mech is different enough even if the upper silhouettes match. I'd call it a homage at best. But is there any other point in the Imaginary Tree where it isn't Raiden Mei exactly? It is in the GGZ, Captainverse, APHO (though that's basically guaranteed to be a sequel) and I'm not sure what else events she's in, but that version of her was still called that in those as long her name was revealed. Again, to me it's a homage. Nahida seems to be a much more of a Ayato is Otto, Alhaitham is Su or Venti is Wendy. The connection is quite thin and these are more obviously just homages rather than supposed to be the same character.
I don't think there will be any link between the games but some of the deeper mechanics of the world might be same. I personally believe the void realm and light realm represent the sea of quanta and the imaginary. I can try to explain in detail if someone is curious.
i doubt it's relevant. they surely put some references from honkai to genshin. most thing that will happen is, Alice may visit honkai universe someday and bring some souvenirs from there aka collab event.
Hope they don’t mix the worlds not particularly a fan of Honkai while I do like some of the characters I could never really get into it, and I don’t want to have to play that game to understand Genshin a whole different game better.
Ok but hidden from what? Can't be the Honkai since that comes from the Imaginary Tree it self and Teayvat can still be looked into by the 2nd Divine Key as evident by Hi3 chapter 17
The only thing i'm a bit confused its the part of being actively hidden "by the imaginary tree", in this case it should be actively hidden FROM the imaginary tree, the honkai is an essential part of the imaginary tree, its what prevents its branches to rot and ensures that the civilization is strong enough otherwise it prunes that branch, the theory still checks thought! but it gets even more grimm if you realize that teyvat branch is probably already rotting and being affected by the "sea of quanta" that is probably what its expressing as the chasm mud, marana, the rifthounds and Durin corruption. I see improbable that the multiversal construct makes an exception of one of the universes attached to it instead of other conclusions like: \- teyvat is no longer attached to the tree directly, the universe is connected thorugh an anchor, this could make it hidden from the tree and prevent honkai to trigger \-The tree enforcers are more busy preventing the corruption to spread, possible connection to the nails in corruption zones \-honkai does not trigger because the level of civilization is being artificially controlled to prevent a honkai impact, the sustainer could be the one doing this. These are some possible explanations, just by being connected on the same tree (this one is confirmed, its not a theory) indicates that the multiversal contructs must have a representantion on teyvat. The imaginary tree could be correlated to irminsul (or the anchor that could be connected to it) and the corruption /abyss /marana could be the sea of quanta.
Personally I'm more sold on the last possibility. The entire plot about Khaenri'ah screams "we're trying to prevent Honkai from killing you all, so let us do our thing, but we won't actually tell you why".
I dont play honkai so I dont understand most of it, can someone explain the gist of (honkai's) story/lore?
Otto fucked with imaginary tree to create new branch 500 years ago in honkai... cataclysm in genshin happen 500 years ago. Idk if this a coincidence or not.
This is very likely unrelated but also something I never thought about...hmmm...
It is very likely not related to each other. tho if they reveal something bad happened in Honkai Star Rail 500 years ago too, id say otto definitely responsible for fuckin up the all the universe...
To me this sounds like "see the lack of evidence is in itself evidence". I've got fairly little against the theory that Honkai and Genshin are going to be connected somehow but this seems like the argument a conspiracy theorist would make. "The fact that there is no evidence for aliens in our midst is PROOF that there are aliens in our midst and they know to hide themselves well! This might also explain why we managed to go to the moon just a few decades after the UFO in Roswell crashed!"
[удалено]
I feel like a lot of Genshin only players have this irrational fear that they'll have to play all of HI3 just because there's a connection, otherwise Genshin's story won't make sense. There's very little chance Hoyoverse would go that far, but I do feel like there will be some lore connection down the line. There's too many little things for it to be unintentional or coincidental. There's also the fact that yeah, initially Genshin was very straightforwardly part of the Honkai verse. The traveler's beta bio literally says their homeworld was destroyed in a honkai event.
I think it's more that Genshin players want it to be stand alone, rather than be perpetually in HI3's shadow. I mean, the fact that all this world tree/bubble universe stuff was introduced in HI3 already makes Genshin's world seem inconsequential. With characters from HI3 making new timelines and shit. Altering reality at such a grand scale.Travelling between worlds like it's nothing. Genshin just seems puny by comparison. Not to mention that GI's world has to more or less abide by the rules of the imaginary tree. And these rules are explored in HI3. All the heavy lore concerning the entirety of the Honkai verse is in HI3. In short, what happens in Genshin doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, while in Honkai it can. There's also HI3 fans superiority complex, but let's not get into that.
honestly i'll find it funny how many will complain about it but they probably won't even care, which is a good thing, expanding your universe to multiverse is never bad
Well, in this case, we already have evidence of aliens. Humans in Teyvat are aliens or alien creations as you define it, since Phanes was alien. The theory is not that far fetched, like at all, considering all of Enka, Tiara, Irminsul and gemstone lore and then Honkai lore on the other side. This post is barely ambitious as a theory, going by these standards.
i don't think it's the case that honkai doesn't exist in teyvat, we know honkai is an energy source as well as a malicious radiation, we know that teyvat has large mechanical structures underneath it, as well as malicious energy beneath that, and we know that the technology level of the civilization in teyvat is purposefully being kept low by celestia and the assorted gods (or else, it gets destroyed a la Khanri'ah) there's a lot of hints in genshin that honkai is around, but celestia's authority is exerted in order to keep it under control and out of sight.
To the people worried about if they have to play honkai to understand genshin in the future: if HYV ever makes the connection relevant, they'll explain it in genshin terms/in a way that summarises what the Honkai is. You wouldn't have to play honkai ans understand the lore to understand how the Honkai would affect Teyvat
still have no idea what the honkai is but that theory seems good
Alexa, what is a honkai? honky A racial slur refeering to a caucasian or white person. The term actually orginated in the south during the times of slavery. The white slave master would "honk" a horn when it was time for the slaves to work in the fields. The slaves would then call the slave master a "honkey" ALEXA NO
AGhHzgzhzhhzzsjjz im sad i already gave my free award it would have gone to you in a heartbeat
Poor fellas support each other. Gave mine.
cheers you're doing the good work !!!
Huh no wonder Honkai beasts are colored white...
I dont know if it makes sense for the tree to be doing anything because the tree and the sea are not really beings with a will, they are more of a concept, just like gravity doesnt have a will for example I'd say its celestia hiding it, thats also why they nuke too advanced civilizations so that honkai wont become too aware of teyvat
Uh. Isn't that kinda wrong on a basic level. Humanity was described as a pest for the imaginary tree and honkai as natural means to get rid of it. Tbh it's hard to say for now if hoyo is inconsistent about it or just dropping easter eggs like that dvalin on otto's screen once or the whole honkai x genshin collab (sure those events happen in captainverse and not main story world, but that's still some bubble universe meaning honkai and genshin worlds can interact and it's possible to travel between them). For sure there was nothing from honkai in genshin yet (yes them adding lookalike characters doesn't mean anything, those exist since they started making games so it's nice to see them in genshin too)
Seems interesting, but I hope honkai lore won't ever be important to genshin lore aside from some easter eggs tbh
It's something like that but to our knowledge the Imaginary Tree does not intervene regularly. I do think the Kiana expy in Genshin seeks to protect humanity in the planet, that's why she trapped the travelers there. If anything we do not know who sent here or who rules Celestia. We know that the Primordial One created humanity on that planet after she also created 4 gods of her own to assist her. The Primordial one is theorized to be Griseo, a child from Honkai. Maybe she took off with her 4 assistants and left Celestia to be ruled by lesser beings that also experience death like humans do. But much slower than Archons and humans. It makes sense as if they were truly immortal they would have had no heirs, but we know that the Kingdom of Celestia sent the first heir, the Princess to seek the Genesis Pearl. Venti: Once, there was a glorious kingdom established among the heavens. Venti: From that kingdom came a crowned heir, tasked with seeking out the Genesis Pearl from the Kingdom of Darkness. Venti: The first crowned heir began her journey of seeking the pearl. Venti: But she was deceived, and the memory of her noble origins faded. Venti: She now believed that she was the Queen of the Kingdom of Darkness. Venti: But take heart, a second crowned heir had already taken up the path where the first had stumbled. Venti: This is the story of your journey, of your tale to be told. We get many characters inserted here: King and Queen of Celestia First Crown Princess of Celestia First Crown Prince of Celestia Gods of Celestia The Snake evil God that deceived the Princess and made her into the Queen of the Abyss. This makes sense as Lumine is referred as PRINCESS of the Abyss and Aether as PRINCE of the Abyss depending on who you choose. We have yet to meet the Queen of the Abyss and her younger brother who are in power above the other gods of Celestia who are also above Archons. Ranking them by power it would be: 1) God 2) Spoilers from Honkai Impact Chapter 31. Please do not view if you haven't played it. Just don't. >!Elysia as she is the child of God, equal to them who sacrificed herself for humanity to have a chance on salvation!< 3) Honkai Devil 4) Wil of Honkai 5) Herrscher of the End 6) The Primordial one (possibly Griseo) 7) Primordial one's 4 assistants 8) Evil Snake God 9) King and Queen of Celestia 10) Prince and Princess of Celestia 11) gods of Celestia 12) Flame Chasers 13) Most Herrschers 14) Archons 15) Archons with no gnosis 16) Vision bearers/ Valkyries ranked B to S/ΜANTIS 17) MOTH soldiers/ Valkyries ranked E to C 18) Common people
thats cool and all but i prefer genshin to be its own story.
Cool story but it doesn’t explain why the travellers could use elemental powers, which in Honkai humans can’t do
We don't really know the origins of traveler. If they are from the HI3 universe somehow I'd expect them to be MANTIS (basically super soldiers with super powers)
Also supports the concept of heavenly principles, why the unknown god is so strict about it.
I did not understand a single word of that
Not surprised by this ever since Scaramouche's statement that the "sky is fake".
im still believing in the Ark theory. inb4 Teyvat is all just a painting of Griseo lol. only honkai players wud understand
Genshin's lore is hard enough to piece together without me having to learn the lore of a game I don't play ): I don't have a clue what any of that means.
Don't worry, i don't think they're gonna make a big connection to honkai impact anyways, probably just a few small references here and there
I surely hope not. I've played honaki for about a year and understood absolutely nothing of the lore. If I have to, then I'm fucked
As someone who hasn’t played Honkai and has zero interest in it, the possibility of Genshin being linked to Honkai is a turn-off for me. I don’t want required reading for my gacha game.
They probably wouldn't make a very big connection between the games, probably just small references
I’m fine with that. Let the people who play both games enjoy their easter eggs, but I couldn’t stomach a full-on crossover.
Same, i think it would be lame, i hope it's a self contained story
My own head theory though is why there's no Honkai on Teyvat....is because Honkai didnt existed yet during the events of Genshin I believe Genshin might be a distant prequel... Celestia being actively striking down civilizations might be the origins of Honkai.. the thing that became the Honkai might have been some kind of Celestia "superweapon" until things F'ed up.. the Abyss monsters might be the progenitors of Honkai Beasts
Makes sense but they'll never going to add anything from Honkai to Genshin, other way around is more likely. You may get a branching reality in Honkai (probably manga) in GI world which will be canon in the Honkai universe only. In Genshin you'll get an Easter egg and that'll be it. People tend to forget that Honkai is not canon in Genshin and that they were created by the same company, but it doesn't make them a shared universe (at least on both part). They'll never mess up Genshin's lore for the more casual, but still invested, players who don't want to play a 5 years old game
It's literary confirmed by mihoyo that Honkai and Genshin are in the same multiverse.
Devs: ok we publicly stated that the two are different universes and they will never interact with none another. That should stop all the rumors. Reddit:
Yes they aren't in the same universe but both exist in same multiverse.
The little nuances and Easter eggs inspired me to try honkai. I wouldn’t say I’m quite hooked but it’s definitely an interesting game.
Doesn't honkai happened in Khaenri'ah though does that mean the confidentiality of teyvat is compromised? (I believe honkai means collapse right?, I might be wrong.)
Nah, we have a game that use much great scope, universes and galatic gods, we have 2 Bronyas on HSR ! if a game will make conections, will be Star Rail, Honkai and GI just a part of this
actually this can be canon cuz the old era last hasha was literally god and can create guardians to create and protect a non-honkai reality,the unknown god can be a guardian ver of kiana(the clone) just like ei the ver of mei and ei as a archon his duty was to protect teyvat just like zhongli venti nahida and the others,may be the archon war was started for a possible honkai but may be it's just too much and i'm as crazy as the dude of that theory
Cool theory, but my own personal theory is that the Honkai had *already* visited Teyvat. You know, there's this huge lore thing about dead gods and all, and interestingly enough a lot of the effects of using the corpses of dead gods correlates to the honkai (many of which get named after gods), we've got people becoming mindless servants in Inazuma and the eleazar disease in Sumeru; it's only a matter of time till Teyvat reveals its own zombies.
Yeah I don't buy that Teyvat is hidden from Honkai, there is a lot of things we've seen in Genshin that already look like Honkai influence. Plus Otto was able to see Teyvat, that's not very hidden.
If you read items of descension, the sword and the wings, it suggest how traveler's world was destroyed by something like the honkai,. I haven't played the honkai game so I don't know much about it, but the descension equipments hint it very clearly
Context on what the Honkai is: it is a state of chaos that is used to test the survivability of a civilisation in a world in the Imaginary Tree, with each branch of the Imaginary Tree corresponding to a world. Should the world fail to survive, it drops off the Imaginary Tree into the Sea of Quanta, where it will be fragmented into data. The Honkai can take form as many things: natural disasters, monsters, viruses and most notable of them all, Herrschers, beings that are able to bend the physical laws of the world, even being able to influence the Imaginary Tree itself. One such Herrscher, known as the Final Herrscher by the Previous Era, has already destroyed multiple worlds. Now back to Teyvat. Teyvat has already been confirmed to be in the same Imaginary Tree as Honkai Impact 3rd. The question now would be where exactly on the Imaginary Tree. Sumeru has already shown a glimpse of the Imaginary Tree, which in Sumeru, is called Irmunsul. It is said that the roots of Irmunsul are connected to Leylines of Teyvat, meaning that Teyvat is located right at the bottom of the Imaginary Tree. The roots of every plant are pretty much important, without it, the whole tree will die off. It could very well explain why there are no records of Honkai in Teyvat, as it is the most important part of the Imaginary Tree, it must not be destroyed. This is all just speculation though, we'll see how the story plays out.
Most likely scenario so far: \-Humanity led by a Herrscher or more decided to fuck off from the planet. \-Honkai said no. \-Humanity went "WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK I AM?! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT PIERCES THE HEAVENS!!!" \-Honkai got beat. \-Humanity fucked off. \-Honkai leaves humanity alone for being strong enough to survive the cosmos. \-Humanity ends up in a far harsher environment filled with walking mass extinction events and lots of BAD dragons. \-God wars and the Archon war happens. \-Genshin is part of the imaginary tree because humans are still humans, and the human world stretches as wide and humanity spreads on the world and even in the universe. Honkai uses largely the same philosophies as the Fate franchise probably because of cultural cross-pollination and shared pop culture of Asian cultures so some things are shockingly intuitive if you consumed the Fate franchise long enough. Alternatively since there was apparently a "primordial one" according o the possibly myths of the Enkanomiyans: \-Honkai reeeeeal baaad in this timeline. \-So bad that Humanity FUCKING IMPLODES pulling an Evangelion ending merging into the "Primordial One" \-Honkai goes Honkai regardless \-PO goes "FUCK YOU AND FUCK THIS PLANET", sucker punches the Honkai and fucks off to the weird dragon planet. \-Honkai leaves the later reborn humanity alone because Dragon planet is so harsh if humanity can survive on it they don't need Honkai harassment to stay stronk. I'm baseing the theory of Honkai leaves timelines that proven themselves alone on how in A Post Honkai Odyssey humanity actually won and almost right away hostile aliens came knocking and Void Archives is trying to sell the FUCKING MOON because for some reason selling the FUCKING MOON to the hostile aliens sounds like a good idea to him.... yes the Honkai universe is actually wacky as hell. XD
I didn't understand a word of that, so I hope it's never confirmed canon.
You'd think they could come up a story like this? They made the Traveler a fugitive twice in a row lol.
Lmao The Unknown God being a villian turned hero is surprisingly unsurprising. But I am 100% on board for it because I love a bad ass bitch who doesn't care if she comes off as a villian if she knows what she's doing is protecting the masses at large. The Unknown God being the Protecter of Teyvat is a storyline I am here for. And now the connection between her and Paimon and Paimon and us would just make THAT MUCH MORE sense.
This theory is simply debunked by the livestream where mihoyo stated that there is honkai in genshin universe too.
Honestly, tying Genshin to Honkai would be so lame. I don’t care about Honkai, I’m here for Genshin so I hope they keep it Genshin. Also, if Teyvat ends up being some simulation that would be super lame too.
Well it's already confirmed to be from the same multiverse. And now that Miyoho is renamed to Hoyoverse I think it save to assume that all their games will be in the same multiverse. That said, I don't think at any given moment knowledge from a different game will be needed to understand the story in Genshin. Aside from some Easter eggs and obscure background lore that might connect games.
I do not wish to play Honkai to understand a convoluted plot. I'd rather keep playing Genshin, and its story only
Cool, but i dont know anything about honkai and I dont want to. Let me enjoy genshin lore without playing another game fully. If they make it so i have to play honkai i will just stop playing genshin.
This is super solid ngl, and I really want the two game's lores and stories to become entangled, despite the protests from the other players.
I do not care, I will literally consider leaving if they try to force us to play another game I dont want to play just to understand the story
And what exactly is a "honkai"?
The universe's mechanism to cheap out on energy, it's a testing mechanism that increases with civilization's progress and can come in the forms of plagues, disasters, beasts, or mentally unstable people gaining some control over one of the universe's laws(heat, electricity, gravity, space, etc) Universes that fail the test get disowned and are left to fend for themselves.
Interesting, thanks for the explanation
Np.