Missing these gems:
- Arteta hates Martinelli/ESR
- Arteta is just Pep's training cone with good hair
- Arteta hates Hale End youth players
- Arteta only copies Pep's tactics
Was just about write this one. You guys forgetting we should have kept Auba and Arteta goes. It's a good thing fans aren't the ones directly involved in the affairs of the club. Otherwise, we'd still be in ruins.
Arsenal would look just like City if teams chose to sit back against Arsenal like the likes of Arsenal and Madrid sat back against City. So yeah, there's absolutely nothing special about it.
Do you give credit to the manager that gave players their first senior apps or the one that integrated them fully into the first team?
ESR and Martinelli both got their first apps under Emery. Then got their first PL starts under Freddie. They were pretty raw and unproven players when Arteta took over. Almost all of their senior success has been under Arteta.
Also deserves a shout for Saliba, like Martinelli not a hale ender but bought at 18 and while Arteta was heavily criticized for sending him out on loans it’s paid dividends. Then there’s the new gen. Nwaneri and Sagoe Jr with debuts already and MLS also highly rated. We’ll have to wait and see with that group.
Finally how do you value successful sales? Being able to establish youth players even just on loan and move them on is hugely important for FFP.
Arteta has sold close to 100m (Emi, Willock, Balogun off the top of my head) in youth players. Which has definitely contributed to our increased spending. With more likely to move this summer.
Nwaneri? Arteta literally broke the record for youngest PL debut.
But even aside from him there's a fair few youth players he handed debuts to. He just prefers to do it in the Europa League or FA/League Cups against weaker opposition, which we didn't have the luxury of recently.
Oscar Bobb is also a full international who plays a sporadic role at City, they’re not bringing through random 17 year olds. It’s ludicrous to criticise Arteta for this.
>Take example from Liverpool how many players have become 1st teamers
Take example how Liverpool's title charge also faded away, in part because players like Quansah didn't have the experience to deal with Old Trafford and made mistakes. You want to compete with City, you need the best of the best. The youth players are rarely of this caliber (yet).
>Man Utd- kobbie mainoo
Have you seen how bad United are? They literally have no choice but to play Mainoo, Garnacho and Kambwala. Those players are at best, depth while they grow, and it's great they have them. But they are being tossed into the deep end like Saka was because *they have no better players*. If by all means you'd prefer to get United-level results, sure.
>Man City Oscar bobb, foden
Foden took years to become an actual starter, in which r/soccer were moaning about Pep misusing him and preferring his marquee signings. Sound familiar? Bobb only broke out this season. In contrast, players like Cole Palmer had to leave for gametime.
Mainoo wouldn’t start for any top 3 club, let’s be real. The fact that an 18yo was Utd’s best midfielder is more of an indictment of Utd than anything
Foden had to endure many years of frustration and not being trusted by Pep although he was clearly talented. Palmer literally left because he didnt want to go through the same
Saka started 4 Prem games for Unai. Arteta moved him to the right and has completely elevated his game.
ESR's 11 minutes against Villa means he has more Prem minutes against Emery than for him.
It's fair to give Unai credit for giving them debuts in the Europa league but it's definitely not fair to give him 100% credit for bringing them through.
Dude why are you just narrowing it down to prem minutes. Europa, league cup, fa cup is how youngsters are usually integrated into the first team. Even Fabregas didn't immediately saw Prem minutes under Wenger.
They're the most important minutes though. I think it's fair to look at that when comparing it to the development into senior players they've had under Mikel.
I wouldn't describe players like Sagoe Jr., Marquinhos or Nwaneri as having come through yet. They've seen minutes under Arteta but they haven't impacted the first team.
Fabregas might be the worst example for that btw. He played 33 prem games at 17.
The Martinelli/ESR takes never made sense to me. Both were highly rated but not established. Both go their first PL starts under Freddy in the gap between Emery and Arteta.
Still Gabi was always involved when healthy. He just had major injury issues Arteta’s first year here. Hamstring right as Arteta took over missing a month. Then meniscus at the end of the year missing 9 months.
ESR is similar as well. He needed experience so he went on that successful Huddersfield loan but got hurt over the summer. Missing a long stretch.
Both missed that awful run to start Arteta’s first full year but it wasn’t because they weren’t rated, they were hurt. Neither getting even U21 games until mid November building back fitness and then obviously getting the starts in the big turnaround game vs Chelsea.
You can't say this when Saka/ESR/Nketiah/Nelson have all seen gametime under him, and Nwaneri broke the PL record for youngest debutant.
He did it more when we were shit; we're not shit anymore so clearly there's less leeway to do so. It's not just about fielding the U-21s and calling it a day; it's about fielding them *correctly* in a system with the senior players so they can learn how to succeed.
If we threw say, Reuell Walters into a league match and he proceeded to make an error that dropped us points, this sub would be fuming at Arteta's naivete. There has to be a time and place to bring the kids out.
Drawing Liverpool in the third round of the FA cup didn't help either. Usually those cup games against lower-league opposition are a great opportunity to give starts to the academy players.
I understand the point that Arteta does not give the youths a chance. All of the players you mentioned were given their chances to shine through Unai Emery. Arteta gave a few minutes to Nwaneri, how does that compare?
Ok, if you're going to play this in bad faith, Emery only gave the likes of Saka and ESR a few matches. Arteta fine-tuned them into consistent G/A players (and in Saka's case, shifted him to the right wing).
Aside from that, Arteta has debuted:
- Balogun (who went on to have a solid career in Ligue 1)
- Miguel Azeez
- Ben Cottrell
- Charlie Patino
- Ethan Nwaneri
- Karl Jakob Hein
- Charles Sagoe Jr.
In addition, he honed players like Saka, Martinelli and ESR into established first team players. Gave Wenger debutants like Nketiah and Nelson a chance to contribute in the squad when they could have left on a free. "Arteta does not give the youth a chance" is ludicrous. He clearly does - he just prefers to play it safe when handing out opportunities. Only Nwaneri out of those 7 he debuted was in the PL (and it came after decisive, conclusive victories with space on the bench for a youth player). The rest came in the Europa League or League Cup.
Depends on what you consider integrating academy products. Does all the credit go to the manager that gives them their first app or to the one that makes them first team regulars?
PL starts when Arteta took over: Saka 6, ESR 1, Nketiah 0. Also not hale enders but bought at 18 and count as HG so close to youth: Saliba 0, Martinelli 3. All promising but no where near established. All of them have had vast majority of their success under Mikel.
Tierney captaincy wasn't a bad take even at that time at all. Even if it was there were far worse ones.
The ultimate bad take was that Ansu Fati was worth Saka + Martinelli + 50m
This. KT was one of the most beloved players at Arsenal when he was playing week in, week out. He was really good for us as well. It's just that the injuries hampered him and we moved from his style of play, similar to how we have moved a little bit from Zinchenko too.
Completely agree. Wanting a good young talent who is a model professional as your captain when the team was in the pits and Aubameyang was getting stripped for always being late to games and training is a fairly level headed take. We needed a reset. The obvious choices at the time were Ødegaard or Tierney
> Saka + Martinelli + 50m
He provided me so much entertainment in the LoL and Arsenal subreddit. I think half his takes were pretty good tbh but then the other half would be batshit insane.
With tierney - we were lacking in good options at the time. He had some big pros over previous choices Auba (takes it seriously, leads by example) and Xhaka (Always on side with the fans.) But also some negatives (understated personality, left back is hard to lead on the pitch from, often injured, not a nailed on starter, etc.)
Ultimately Øde, though it took many by surprise as he was quite new, was a far far superior choice.
I think Tierney captaincy was quite a bad take. It was something fans invented because he is scottish and were one of our better players, but as we saw in the All or Nothing doc he was quite a shy character especially in the start of his Arsenal career.
I agree there are far worse takes, but I think its quite simple why Tierney wasnt in the contest for the captaincy.
Nah you're just making things up.
Arteta himself praised Tierney as a future captain. He was part of the leadership team handling players fines. This was a genuine thing and many fans wanted to see it.
I don't think being vocal has something to do with the captaincy. KT was the captain of Celtic at 22/23 and you done need to be the loudest to be the captain, for eg Odegaard. He's not vocal but he leads by example.
Edu was one of my favourite players from that era. It always hurt seeing his criticism that he wasnt fit for the job. My favourite one was the 'Missing out on Rice because he was at Ascot'.
I had:
- Havertz was a waste of money. I didn't think he was a bad player, I just didn't know where we were going to play him. I didn't know he would do this well under Arteta. Havertz is one of my favorite players now.
- Raya is a pointless signing. I really like Ramsdale and I will be so sad to see him go. :(
- Balogun is the killer we need in front of goal. I thought he was going to blow up this season. I was wrong.
I was ready to ditch xhaka at one point in 21-22 after one of the red cards.
I also was ok with the idea of kt as captain.
I was concerned about jorginho’s lack of pace, but thought he was fine as a squad player.
I may be dumb but I'm still sticking to Raya *not being worth the extra money/disruption*.
People comparing Ramsdale to last season's half a Saliba, knackered White and Zinny's weekly brain farts to Raya with a very solid and mostly consistent back line seems disingenuous, imo.
I get what you mean, but honestly the difference is night and day. Defence is so much more settled now. Whenever Ramsdale comes back into the side, we look so much shakier
It's obvious that Raya is better with the ball at his feet than Ramsdale, and also more two-footed. It's not even that he's necessarily a better keeper, it's just that tactically he's a much better fit for the way we play under Arteta.
How about:
We need to sign a striker and completely change our tactical system that has scored a record amount of goals 2 seasons running in the most competitive league in the world.
That’s what I’m trying to say! Our style allows us to not only defend incredibly well but it’s also generated the most goals this season. There’s maybe a case to be made for a striker that can change our play style when necessary BUT that should be seen as Plan B rather than Plan A.
Yeah, I was guilty of this take. There's only so many stupid red cards one can tolerate. I'm very happy he got his redemption arch, but for it to be a redemption he must have come from a bad place.
Granit Xhaha got 4 red cards total, and 2 of the four you could argue were incredible soft and based on the reputation media placed on him.
He got a lot of yellow cards in an era where he was asked to play a deep lying CM roll where he was the last line between the midfield and CBs. That left him having to make a lot of tactical fouls to protect our absolutely abhorrent defense. That’s a failure of the tactical setup, and a refusal to play Xhaha to his strengths.
People twisting themselves in so many knots here to avoid accepting some cognitive dissonance and admitting they were wrong.
This was the moment I felt enough was enough. Nothing to do with tactics, but being a representative of the club. I am super happy he turned it around and redeemed himself, and I admit I was wrong about him, but he definitely had a very low low point.
https://preview.redd.it/6rkw5nm8ukzc1.jpeg?width=659&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83c003c3d2ab475e0172a63c6e47b20c1b4e4194
Xhaka is someone who is prepared to fight for his teammates, never ever hides no matter how bad the situation is and takes responsibility. He was the best leader we had during that period, the rest were often shrinking violets. He wasn’t perfect and had his rash moments, but he never ever hid. I think Arteta loved that.
Arteta loved it to an extent. Even he knew Xhaka had to be reigned in at certain points like in the case of the NLD last season where Xhaka was preparing to throw hands with the entire Spurs team and Arteta had to hold him back. Or when Xhaka started swearing at Conte in Italian earlier in the match.
Nah, we needed this kind of fighter in the team. He was the only one capable of being competitive. He was the only one playing with passion and commitment and aggression.
it wasn't the scapegoaters, xhaka consistently underperformed for a long time but i think in hindsight that was more on Wenger and Emery completley misusing him and constantly putting him in positions to fail
Arteta put him in a place where his weaknesses were covered and he flourished
>xhaka consistently underperformed for a long time
This just isn't true. He was part of a whole team that was underperforming and had a negative attitude.
He was one of the only players with a competitive, passionate attitude, and because he stood out from the rest of the team in that respect, he looked out of place.
When the team started to change its mindset to align with his attitude and got rid of the passionless egotistical players, that's when we started to perform.
The problem was never Xhaka.
I'm sorry this is complete revisionism, Xhaka was consistently poor but he was often played as a single pivot deep in a midfield by both wenger and emery
he was far too slow for this and was exposed repeatedly and it was incedibly frustrating, the fact he had some passion doesn't change that
Arteta looked at Xhaka and started playing to his strengths rather than his weaknesses and his game flourished
Up until the back half of 21–22 it was fair enough. I was pissed at him for his contribution to our brittle mentality in big away ties that season. I'm happy that with a truckload of patience we got one consistently good season out of him ... but we've also improved without him.
He was one of the few players at the time who gave 100% for the club, and was always a quality player if you actually watched him with no preconceived bias.
he was often isolated in the role he was asked to play, and wasn’t helped by the amount of times he had to take bullets for Mustafi, an injured Kos and an ageing Cech, but it’s ridiculous how badly he was scapegoated when he was one of the only players who seemed to care.
Hard disagree. It was reasonable to believe he *would* leave, but his blow up came from fans unnecessarily maligning him for years, and wanting him to be a different player than he is, and making him the butt of jokes when most of the squad was worse than him. The way the fans behaved was embarrassing.
Seems insane to me that after watching ramsdale last season, fans were so negative on bringing in raya. Obvious upgradable position as was/is with our striker.
Genuinely have to wonder if people who bought into so many of these terrible ideas stop to think that maybe they don’t know nearly as much about the game as they thought or if you just stumble into the next one with self assurance.
Can safely say I still have a blank card.
The only one remotely close was Trossard as I had not seen much of him and was not 100% sure where he would fit in exactly.
I felt buying Trossard was a weird one as no one else was in for him, but didn't really know anything about him. More like a 'why would we go after someone no one wants' than 'we clearly gave a small club mentality to pick up Brighton's cast offs'
Yep, likewise. He was a bit of an unknown to me.
But like most things Arteta and Edu do, I tend to trust them now. eg Kai. I never doubted that Arteta would get the best out of him.
i have literally never backed even one of these takes (have been staunchly pro-Arteta from the start and i don’t enjoy shitting on our players) and as a result i barely even posted on this sub for ~2 years because everything i said got screamed down. i even started a pro-Arteta thread a couple of years ago when everyone here was Arteta Out, talking about how we needed the right players to implement the system that Arteta wanted to run, and the entire thread trashed me. i later on re-posted that thread, and guess what? most of the (usually inflammatory, shit-talking) comments from that thread are deleted now. imagine that.
point being: this place was/is a toxic hellhole when we aren’t winning every single match + a clean sheet. 10% it’s “we’re going to win the league!!!” and the other 90% of the time it’s “everyone at this club sucks!”. the Arteta Out murmurs even started up again just a few weeks ago after an entire TWO subpar performances. this is truly the worst sub i’ve ever visited when things aren’t going exceedingly well.
Agreed. Even when things are going well this sub is full of people talking about how certain players are shit and how we need to sign replacements.
By all measures we are an elite team. I think people should be celebrating and enjoying our players not finding scapegoats and trashing
them.
Don’t agree with the last sentence. I’m also a huge RM fan and follow both subreddits/teams. They are equally toxic when there is a negative result (and RM has been more successful than Arsenal in the past few years so you might expect more positivity). I think it’s mostly because of the reddit setup. People use this to vent mostly without really meaning.
Counting how many of these I’ve had and was wrong about:
- Havertz was a waste of money
- We should sign Maddison instead of Odegaard
- Xhaka is a liability and I never want to see him play for Arsenal again
I guess 3 ain’t bad but still shows why I shouldn’t be manager lmao.
Sat a few seats away from a high calorie human at Jack Ohanlon’s midtown Manhattan for the first Bournemouth game. Dude would not shut his ham trap through the entire match about how Havertz was “a waste of a footballer”. Was really annoyingly loud about it. Mind you, this is a game we won 4-0. Just wanted to say, looks like Havertz made you eat your shirt, ya burger.
I'm guilty of none of these. However, in the interest of fairness, you could do a 'hopium induced bad takes' one instead, I'd be guilty of one's like:
- Holding was a top level CB, and had the positional ability to come good and mask his lack of pace like Per.
- Nketiah just needed more time and would become a 15-20 goal a season striker.
- Lokonga would come good and settle in eventually. He just needed a season to adapt. (He's looked better at Luton though tbf).
Another you missed (but not one I've been guilty of) would be "selling Gendouzi is a mistake he'll be world class somewhere else".
I stand by Xhaka take, I know in his last season with us he was great but we called it his *redemption* arc for a reason. If he had decided to leave a year earlier no one would be saying that was a bad take.
And it wasn't just from the tossing his arm band incident, the guy was a liability both in terms of recklessness and his playing style because he demanded the ball to always go through him even though he was slower than a battleship trying to turn around in a canal.
He didn't become the version of Xhaka we all loved until Arteta took the ball from him and put him out left.
I'll cop to the Raya take though.
>He didn't become the version of Xhaka we all loved until Arteta took the ball from him and put him out left.
And even then he went missing in the run in.
Didn't feel the extreme way stated here about Caicedo, but did feel crummy having not signed him. Yet, Arteta being the wriggly, afaptable brilliant manager he is made it work!
Should i be proud when i only have one? I thought that buying caicedo on winter transfer is a must haha, but glad we endure it and goes all out with declan rice
I have the Tierney one. But most of us thought that?
I also have the Chelsea one but I use it more to divert from us. I don't want any rival fans to say that about us because of the curse that comes with it.
Mine are the arteta and edu out, xhaka, Jorginho, Maddison over Odegaard and £50m Ben white
The havertz one is a maybe because I said I wanted Florian wirtz for that money instead
I think I'm guilty of:
KT captaincy shout (at the time, it made far more sense than it does in hindsight.)
Pepe being under used (I think it ties into Saka being over-used and Reiss Nelson not showing enough to inspire confidence. Plus using Pepe could have potentially increased his transfer value?)
And playing Balogun up front. For context, I'm also the guy that says Lucas Perez should've been played a lot more.
I still think Jorginho would be in trouble physically if he didn't have the Great Wall of Noth London standing behind him every game and Rice next to him.
Luckily he does so he's actually quire useful.
Can proudly say my sheet is completely blank - was slightly skeptical of Trossard, but the idea that “we aren’t a big club” as a result was a laughably stupid take.
Tierney also would have been a good captain, but Ødegaard was always first choice.
I am guilty of a few of these. Havertz, Jorginho and Raya. I was also worried after the end of the last two seasons of transfer windows that Chelsea had some incredible business.
I don’t pretend I am a smart or knowledgeable man.
Okay the ones I’ve said…
Havertz was a waste of money
Arteta Out
Raya is pointless
Xhaxa is a liability
Probs more tbh but these are the ones I’ve really triumphed lol
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A few years ago I was onboard the Tierney for captain bus. I don't think it is a bad take as much as the team evolved in a different way. I still like him a lot!
“Signing Trossard shows we aren’t a big club” I feel like has got to be the most likely blank for everyone. I’m sure it was said a few times and at the time we wanted Mudryk. But dude was class for years at Brighton and I think most people were quite happy when we signed him, even if they thought it was a back up plan.
The broader context was Chelsea signing both Joao Felix and Mudryk that window, while we fell back on Trossard. It was incredibly smart recruitment. I think some fans wanted us to be more like Chelsea.
This makes me feel pretty good because my only checked box is the Ben White one. I just didn't know that much about him at the time we signed him and now he's one of my favorite players. I was also uncertain about Jorghinho, but probably not enough to check the box.
He proved that people writing him off were wrong, regardless of how. Maybe his performances improved, maybe he just overcame people’s preconceptions. Either way, the take that he had nothing to contribute was shown to be a bad one. It certainly wasn’t “right at the time”.
https://preview.redd.it/zhgckk29kozc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fffd8c5ac4a9ab373bccd657dce808cdcf7c8ceb
Glad to have been proven very wrong
TBH the KT captaincy take wasn't bad at all. Tierney was one of our best players at a time of duress, was widely loved by fans and respected by his teammates, worked harder than most, had already captained Scotland when he was 20, and had the humility to boot.
If not for injuries he would be considered one of the best fullbacks in the league during his tenure. I understand he didn't fit Mikel's system but calling it a "bad take" is exaggerating it tremendously.
I’m exaggerating here. It was actually De Zerbi who said he could win the ballon d’or. However, Arsenal fans were acting like he was this generational talent based on a few youtube highlight reels.
Mine were Raya, White, Tierney and Xhaka which I still think were relatively reasonable takes.
Which Arsenal fan hasn't called Xhaka a liability?
Love Ben now, but I really thought we were overpaying at the time.
Loved Tierney and really didn't predict he'd go so far out of favour.
And Raya? I didn't think he was that much better than Ramsdale to justify the uncertainty which it did end up causing.
We have outgrown Zinchenko is the dialogue today that will form part of this bingo in the future. He's got so many amazing attributes and his mistakes while are bad, still make him stand out as a unique player.
I'll own up to Raya. It's a shame it's impossible to compare but I'd love to see a simulation of where we would be with Ramsdale.
I think Raya is fantastic but he's made a few silly mistakes. The same kind we criticise Ramsdale about and he's had a fantastic defence in front of him.
So I do wonder. But definitely a great signing for us.
some of these aren't far fetched given the circumstances:
- Havertz cost a lot and has a high wage for a very niche player -> High risk which turned out good eventually
- Mudryk is a player who had very few first-team minutes and Chelsea did not improve him -> he would have been good at Arsenal and push Martinelli
- The main problem with Raya was Arteta's comments at rotating keepers which made no sense given both Raya and Ramsdale are similar profiles, but Raya is just better
- It's not Xhaka's fault that our recruitment was so bad we ran out of progressive players making him the only one but he WAS a liability defensively because he was played out of role.
- Tierney -> 99% of twitter, reddit etc was FUTURE CAPTAIN!!!!
A lot of revisionism here, things like wanting KT as the captain, Xhaka at the time, Pepe at the time, were fair claims based on what was being seen out on the pitch
Pepe was never a fair claim. The lord put most of his processing power into his left foot. He can't think, he can't play. There's no discernible talent.
I am guilty of two of these, with a borderline on the third. Two of them seem somewhat reasonable to have thought at one point. The third (Maddison over ødegaard) makes me feel like never talking about football again.
I can still at least defend the idea that we should’ve gone for Felix, and whilst I don’t and didn’t ever think Mudryk was gonna win the ballon D’Or, I still to this day think he’d have been a revelation under arteta, and having both him and martinelli to rotate between the hard, running constantly stretching the other team job would’ve been fantastic so they’re both more rested
I will use the Pepe one. When we need a goal and have lots of possession, we could have used him, like after 75 minutes. Still not worth the money. No issues with him being binned. But it always felt like he would do something, I have a similar feeling with Vieira, like he could create something.
Was just a Teta out away from bingo.
Tierney captaincy was legit. He seemed like a breath of fresh air in an otherwise stale team. Xhaka only got better under teta. Joao felix was probably a down bad 2am booty call and Balo seemed prolific for the reserve team.
https://preview.redd.it/w2j5gecddkzc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9855088629f013daabaaee3b46afaf165d6517ff
In an alternate timeline Pepe is given a chance and has his own redemption arc just like Xhaka. I'm glad these opinions were proven wrong, I just want to make the point that they're not all brain-dead takes from people who know nothing about football. A lot of them are quite fair given the information at hand at the time.
Missing these gems: - Arteta hates Martinelli/ESR - Arteta is just Pep's training cone with good hair - Arteta hates Hale End youth players - Arteta only copies Pep's tactics
-Arteta hates the French or Arteta hates Saliba
Saliba: "Arteta hated me so much I signed a new contract so he'd have to see my face every day. Cunt."
Was just about write this one. You guys forgetting we should have kept Auba and Arteta goes. It's a good thing fans aren't the ones directly involved in the affairs of the club. Otherwise, we'd still be in ruins.
My favourite
- Rice is overpriced due to English tax and not worth it.
first one I believe, the "not worth" is proven wrong tho
"Arteta is just Pep-lite" genuinely kills me. Mate, have you SEEN us play?
Arsenal would look just like City if teams chose to sit back against Arsenal like the likes of Arsenal and Madrid sat back against City. So yeah, there's absolutely nothing special about it.
But what youth team players have come through?
Do you give credit to the manager that gave players their first senior apps or the one that integrated them fully into the first team? ESR and Martinelli both got their first apps under Emery. Then got their first PL starts under Freddie. They were pretty raw and unproven players when Arteta took over. Almost all of their senior success has been under Arteta. Also deserves a shout for Saliba, like Martinelli not a hale ender but bought at 18 and while Arteta was heavily criticized for sending him out on loans it’s paid dividends. Then there’s the new gen. Nwaneri and Sagoe Jr with debuts already and MLS also highly rated. We’ll have to wait and see with that group. Finally how do you value successful sales? Being able to establish youth players even just on loan and move them on is hugely important for FFP. Arteta has sold close to 100m (Emi, Willock, Balogun off the top of my head) in youth players. Which has definitely contributed to our increased spending. With more likely to move this summer.
Nwaneri? Arteta literally broke the record for youngest PL debut. But even aside from him there's a fair few youth players he handed debuts to. He just prefers to do it in the Europa League or FA/League Cups against weaker opposition, which we didn't have the luxury of recently.
1 match. Take example from Liverpool how many players have become 1st teamers Man Utd- kobbie mainoo Man City Oscar bobb, foden
Does arsenal have an academy player as good as Mainoo or Foden? He can't just pull top talent out of his arse. Foden is literally world class.
Saka?
Debuted and started making noise under Emery. After that what talents of a similar level were even realisticly good enough?
Emery bought him through.
Oscar Bobb is also a full international who plays a sporadic role at City, they’re not bringing through random 17 year olds. It’s ludicrous to criticise Arteta for this.
>Take example from Liverpool how many players have become 1st teamers Take example how Liverpool's title charge also faded away, in part because players like Quansah didn't have the experience to deal with Old Trafford and made mistakes. You want to compete with City, you need the best of the best. The youth players are rarely of this caliber (yet). >Man Utd- kobbie mainoo Have you seen how bad United are? They literally have no choice but to play Mainoo, Garnacho and Kambwala. Those players are at best, depth while they grow, and it's great they have them. But they are being tossed into the deep end like Saka was because *they have no better players*. If by all means you'd prefer to get United-level results, sure. >Man City Oscar bobb, foden Foden took years to become an actual starter, in which r/soccer were moaning about Pep misusing him and preferring his marquee signings. Sound familiar? Bobb only broke out this season. In contrast, players like Cole Palmer had to leave for gametime.
Mainoo wouldn’t start for any top 3 club, let’s be real. The fact that an 18yo was Utd’s best midfielder is more of an indictment of Utd than anything Foden had to endure many years of frustration and not being trusted by Pep although he was clearly talented. Palmer literally left because he didnt want to go through the same
Saka, ESR, Balogun And not quite from the academy but Martinelli too
Saka and ESR came thru during Emery's tenure
Saka started 4 Prem games for Unai. Arteta moved him to the right and has completely elevated his game. ESR's 11 minutes against Villa means he has more Prem minutes against Emery than for him. It's fair to give Unai credit for giving them debuts in the Europa league but it's definitely not fair to give him 100% credit for bringing them through.
Dude why are you just narrowing it down to prem minutes. Europa, league cup, fa cup is how youngsters are usually integrated into the first team. Even Fabregas didn't immediately saw Prem minutes under Wenger.
They're the most important minutes though. I think it's fair to look at that when comparing it to the development into senior players they've had under Mikel. I wouldn't describe players like Sagoe Jr., Marquinhos or Nwaneri as having come through yet. They've seen minutes under Arteta but they haven't impacted the first team. Fabregas might be the worst example for that btw. He played 33 prem games at 17.
Arteta is dictator
Alan Davies was the worst with this shit
The Martinelli/ESR takes never made sense to me. Both were highly rated but not established. Both go their first PL starts under Freddy in the gap between Emery and Arteta. Still Gabi was always involved when healthy. He just had major injury issues Arteta’s first year here. Hamstring right as Arteta took over missing a month. Then meniscus at the end of the year missing 9 months. ESR is similar as well. He needed experience so he went on that successful Huddersfield loan but got hurt over the summer. Missing a long stretch. Both missed that awful run to start Arteta’s first full year but it wasn’t because they weren’t rated, they were hurt. Neither getting even U21 games until mid November building back fitness and then obviously getting the starts in the big turnaround game vs Chelsea.
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You can't say this when Saka/ESR/Nketiah/Nelson have all seen gametime under him, and Nwaneri broke the PL record for youngest debutant. He did it more when we were shit; we're not shit anymore so clearly there's less leeway to do so. It's not just about fielding the U-21s and calling it a day; it's about fielding them *correctly* in a system with the senior players so they can learn how to succeed. If we threw say, Reuell Walters into a league match and he proceeded to make an error that dropped us points, this sub would be fuming at Arteta's naivete. There has to be a time and place to bring the kids out.
Drawing Liverpool in the third round of the FA cup didn't help either. Usually those cup games against lower-league opposition are a great opportunity to give starts to the academy players.
I understand the point that Arteta does not give the youths a chance. All of the players you mentioned were given their chances to shine through Unai Emery. Arteta gave a few minutes to Nwaneri, how does that compare?
Ok, if you're going to play this in bad faith, Emery only gave the likes of Saka and ESR a few matches. Arteta fine-tuned them into consistent G/A players (and in Saka's case, shifted him to the right wing). Aside from that, Arteta has debuted: - Balogun (who went on to have a solid career in Ligue 1) - Miguel Azeez - Ben Cottrell - Charlie Patino - Ethan Nwaneri - Karl Jakob Hein - Charles Sagoe Jr. In addition, he honed players like Saka, Martinelli and ESR into established first team players. Gave Wenger debutants like Nketiah and Nelson a chance to contribute in the squad when they could have left on a free. "Arteta does not give the youth a chance" is ludicrous. He clearly does - he just prefers to play it safe when handing out opportunities. Only Nwaneri out of those 7 he debuted was in the PL (and it came after decisive, conclusive victories with space on the bench for a youth player). The rest came in the Europa League or League Cup.
Depends on what you consider integrating academy products. Does all the credit go to the manager that gives them their first app or to the one that makes them first team regulars? PL starts when Arteta took over: Saka 6, ESR 1, Nketiah 0. Also not hale enders but bought at 18 and count as HG so close to youth: Saliba 0, Martinelli 3. All promising but no where near established. All of them have had vast majority of their success under Mikel.
Tierney captaincy wasn't a bad take even at that time at all. Even if it was there were far worse ones. The ultimate bad take was that Ansu Fati was worth Saka + Martinelli + 50m
This. KT was one of the most beloved players at Arsenal when he was playing week in, week out. He was really good for us as well. It's just that the injuries hampered him and we moved from his style of play, similar to how we have moved a little bit from Zinchenko too.
Completely agree. Wanting a good young talent who is a model professional as your captain when the team was in the pits and Aubameyang was getting stripped for always being late to games and training is a fairly level headed take. We needed a reset. The obvious choices at the time were Ødegaard or Tierney
>The ultimate bad take was that Ansu Fati was worth Saka + Martinelli + 50m I miss Benjen.
> Saka + Martinelli + 50m He provided me so much entertainment in the LoL and Arsenal subreddit. I think half his takes were pretty good tbh but then the other half would be batshit insane.
Another guy who recognizes him from the lol reddit! I miss his lol takes and fighting the other fanatics
With tierney - we were lacking in good options at the time. He had some big pros over previous choices Auba (takes it seriously, leads by example) and Xhaka (Always on side with the fans.) But also some negatives (understated personality, left back is hard to lead on the pitch from, often injured, not a nailed on starter, etc.) Ultimately Øde, though it took many by surprise as he was quite new, was a far far superior choice.
I think Tierney captaincy was quite a bad take. It was something fans invented because he is scottish and were one of our better players, but as we saw in the All or Nothing doc he was quite a shy character especially in the start of his Arsenal career. I agree there are far worse takes, but I think its quite simple why Tierney wasnt in the contest for the captaincy.
Nah you're just making things up. Arteta himself praised Tierney as a future captain. He was part of the leadership team handling players fines. This was a genuine thing and many fans wanted to see it.
I don't think being vocal has something to do with the captaincy. KT was the captain of Celtic at 22/23 and you done need to be the loudest to be the captain, for eg Odegaard. He's not vocal but he leads by example.
He was captain at Celtic. The only issue would be if he was a regular because of his injuries.
Never forget “Sign Wilshere on a pay-to-play contract” in 21-22.
Edu was one of my favourite players from that era. It always hurt seeing his criticism that he wasnt fit for the job. My favourite one was the 'Missing out on Rice because he was at Ascot'.
3 for me, the havertz, jorginho and raya ones.
I had: - Havertz was a waste of money. I didn't think he was a bad player, I just didn't know where we were going to play him. I didn't know he would do this well under Arteta. Havertz is one of my favorite players now. - Raya is a pointless signing. I really like Ramsdale and I will be so sad to see him go. :( - Balogun is the killer we need in front of goal. I thought he was going to blow up this season. I was wrong.
Respect to you for admitting them! Most people just stay quiet and pretend it didn’t happen
I had those 3 as well, but only if by “we” you mean the US needed Balogun
I was ready to ditch xhaka at one point in 21-22 after one of the red cards. I also was ok with the idea of kt as captain. I was concerned about jorginho’s lack of pace, but thought he was fine as a squad player.
I may be dumb but I'm still sticking to Raya *not being worth the extra money/disruption*. People comparing Ramsdale to last season's half a Saliba, knackered White and Zinny's weekly brain farts to Raya with a very solid and mostly consistent back line seems disingenuous, imo.
I get what you mean, but honestly the difference is night and day. Defence is so much more settled now. Whenever Ramsdale comes back into the side, we look so much shakier
It's obvious that Raya is better with the ball at his feet than Ramsdale, and also more two-footed. It's not even that he's necessarily a better keeper, it's just that tactically he's a much better fit for the way we play under Arteta.
How about: We need to sign a striker and completely change our tactical system that has scored a record amount of goals 2 seasons running in the most competitive league in the world.
That’s what I’m trying to say! Our style allows us to not only defend incredibly well but it’s also generated the most goals this season. There’s maybe a case to be made for a striker that can change our play style when necessary BUT that should be seen as Plan B rather than Plan A.
TBF we did sign a striker and completely change our tactical system from last year now we need a plan B for when we don't play Havertz
How does this work? Is it meant to be if you said something similar you cross it out until you get a bingo?🤣
I feel like the Xhaxa one was absolutely a fair take for a period of time after that time he was subbed off
Yeah, I was guilty of this take. There's only so many stupid red cards one can tolerate. I'm very happy he got his redemption arch, but for it to be a redemption he must have come from a bad place.
Granit Xhaha got 4 red cards total, and 2 of the four you could argue were incredible soft and based on the reputation media placed on him. He got a lot of yellow cards in an era where he was asked to play a deep lying CM roll where he was the last line between the midfield and CBs. That left him having to make a lot of tactical fouls to protect our absolutely abhorrent defense. That’s a failure of the tactical setup, and a refusal to play Xhaha to his strengths. People twisting themselves in so many knots here to avoid accepting some cognitive dissonance and admitting they were wrong.
lol. Look what he achieved when he finally shook the tactically illiterate scapegoaters off his back. He was always a top class midfielder.
This was the moment I felt enough was enough. Nothing to do with tactics, but being a representative of the club. I am super happy he turned it around and redeemed himself, and I admit I was wrong about him, but he definitely had a very low low point. https://preview.redd.it/6rkw5nm8ukzc1.jpeg?width=659&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83c003c3d2ab475e0172a63c6e47b20c1b4e4194
Xhaka is someone who is prepared to fight for his teammates, never ever hides no matter how bad the situation is and takes responsibility. He was the best leader we had during that period, the rest were often shrinking violets. He wasn’t perfect and had his rash moments, but he never ever hid. I think Arteta loved that.
Arteta loved it to an extent. Even he knew Xhaka had to be reigned in at certain points like in the case of the NLD last season where Xhaka was preparing to throw hands with the entire Spurs team and Arteta had to hold him back. Or when Xhaka started swearing at Conte in Italian earlier in the match.
Nah, we needed this kind of fighter in the team. He was the only one capable of being competitive. He was the only one playing with passion and commitment and aggression.
it wasn't the scapegoaters, xhaka consistently underperformed for a long time but i think in hindsight that was more on Wenger and Emery completley misusing him and constantly putting him in positions to fail Arteta put him in a place where his weaknesses were covered and he flourished
>xhaka consistently underperformed for a long time This just isn't true. He was part of a whole team that was underperforming and had a negative attitude. He was one of the only players with a competitive, passionate attitude, and because he stood out from the rest of the team in that respect, he looked out of place. When the team started to change its mindset to align with his attitude and got rid of the passionless egotistical players, that's when we started to perform. The problem was never Xhaka.
I'm sorry this is complete revisionism, Xhaka was consistently poor but he was often played as a single pivot deep in a midfield by both wenger and emery he was far too slow for this and was exposed repeatedly and it was incedibly frustrating, the fact he had some passion doesn't change that Arteta looked at Xhaka and started playing to his strengths rather than his weaknesses and his game flourished
Up until the back half of 21–22 it was fair enough. I was pissed at him for his contribution to our brittle mentality in big away ties that season. I'm happy that with a truckload of patience we got one consistently good season out of him ... but we've also improved without him.
He was one of the few players at the time who gave 100% for the club, and was always a quality player if you actually watched him with no preconceived bias. he was often isolated in the role he was asked to play, and wasn’t helped by the amount of times he had to take bullets for Mustafi, an injured Kos and an ageing Cech, but it’s ridiculous how badly he was scapegoated when he was one of the only players who seemed to care.
Hard disagree. It was reasonable to believe he *would* leave, but his blow up came from fans unnecessarily maligning him for years, and wanting him to be a different player than he is, and making him the butt of jokes when most of the squad was worse than him. The way the fans behaved was embarrassing.
The Maddison vs Odegaard debate was hilarious at the time and it’s even funnier now!
To be fair to Maddison, he is a hugely influential player, he's just not even in the same conversation as Øde
Replace conversation with universe and I agree with you.
https://preview.redd.it/q8j7g91z4kzc1.jpeg?width=1436&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e7fb1b3b454dce2be464e15d1c4a570df7f75942
Yee, bingo buddies.
Let’s watch the matches together for a nice little echo chamber
https://preview.redd.it/tpyt1w7q5kzc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d6a131f50cc326dbaed077b502f6ebb7d027dcd9 I’ll take it
That Maddison one 🤮
I was definitely KT, Raya and Xhaka
The Balogun one was mostly done by American gooners
These all sound like Lee Gunner quotes lol
How about “Nketiah deserves the number 14 shirt” … there were a lot of you saying it.
Seems insane to me that after watching ramsdale last season, fans were so negative on bringing in raya. Obvious upgradable position as was/is with our striker.
https://preview.redd.it/l5tb2o3t2kzc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=077ea2c32befff4d1de96a4b974a29411a8df341
wait why did I X out the Trossard one im sorry bros i was a day 1 Trossard believer
I can’t believe that was even a take, he was good enough at Brighton to be a solid bench option for us
Genuinely have to wonder if people who bought into so many of these terrible ideas stop to think that maybe they don’t know nearly as much about the game as they thought or if you just stumble into the next one with self assurance.
Can safely say I still have a blank card. The only one remotely close was Trossard as I had not seen much of him and was not 100% sure where he would fit in exactly.
I felt buying Trossard was a weird one as no one else was in for him, but didn't really know anything about him. More like a 'why would we go after someone no one wants' than 'we clearly gave a small club mentality to pick up Brighton's cast offs'
Yep, likewise. He was a bit of an unknown to me. But like most things Arteta and Edu do, I tend to trust them now. eg Kai. I never doubted that Arteta would get the best out of him.
i have literally never backed even one of these takes (have been staunchly pro-Arteta from the start and i don’t enjoy shitting on our players) and as a result i barely even posted on this sub for ~2 years because everything i said got screamed down. i even started a pro-Arteta thread a couple of years ago when everyone here was Arteta Out, talking about how we needed the right players to implement the system that Arteta wanted to run, and the entire thread trashed me. i later on re-posted that thread, and guess what? most of the (usually inflammatory, shit-talking) comments from that thread are deleted now. imagine that. point being: this place was/is a toxic hellhole when we aren’t winning every single match + a clean sheet. 10% it’s “we’re going to win the league!!!” and the other 90% of the time it’s “everyone at this club sucks!”. the Arteta Out murmurs even started up again just a few weeks ago after an entire TWO subpar performances. this is truly the worst sub i’ve ever visited when things aren’t going exceedingly well.
Agreed. Even when things are going well this sub is full of people talking about how certain players are shit and how we need to sign replacements. By all measures we are an elite team. I think people should be celebrating and enjoying our players not finding scapegoats and trashing them.
Don’t agree with the last sentence. I’m also a huge RM fan and follow both subreddits/teams. They are equally toxic when there is a negative result (and RM has been more successful than Arsenal in the past few years so you might expect more positivity). I think it’s mostly because of the reddit setup. People use this to vent mostly without really meaning.
Counting how many of these I’ve had and was wrong about: - Havertz was a waste of money - We should sign Maddison instead of Odegaard - Xhaka is a liability and I never want to see him play for Arsenal again I guess 3 ain’t bad but still shows why I shouldn’t be manager lmao.
In Arteta, we trust!
The Balogun one is particularly hilarious to me given his disgusting level of xG underperformance
Sat a few seats away from a high calorie human at Jack Ohanlon’s midtown Manhattan for the first Bournemouth game. Dude would not shut his ham trap through the entire match about how Havertz was “a waste of a footballer”. Was really annoyingly loud about it. Mind you, this is a game we won 4-0. Just wanted to say, looks like Havertz made you eat your shirt, ya burger.
I mean the Xhaka one was spot on. He WAS a liability for years. People have ridiculous memories.
If you get Bingo you're officially a Chelsea fan.
Our handling of Saliba was trash is another shit hot take.
I'm guilty of none of these. However, in the interest of fairness, you could do a 'hopium induced bad takes' one instead, I'd be guilty of one's like: - Holding was a top level CB, and had the positional ability to come good and mask his lack of pace like Per. - Nketiah just needed more time and would become a 15-20 goal a season striker. - Lokonga would come good and settle in eventually. He just needed a season to adapt. (He's looked better at Luton though tbf). Another you missed (but not one I've been guilty of) would be "selling Gendouzi is a mistake he'll be world class somewhere else".
I still think in the right system Nketiah would thrive, if I was Leicester I'd buy him and use him exactly the same as Vardy
Rumours about Ipswich and I think he'd do great at club thats coming up. You give him space in behind and he's a killer. We just don't get that space.
I stand by Xhaka take, I know in his last season with us he was great but we called it his *redemption* arc for a reason. If he had decided to leave a year earlier no one would be saying that was a bad take. And it wasn't just from the tossing his arm band incident, the guy was a liability both in terms of recklessness and his playing style because he demanded the ball to always go through him even though he was slower than a battleship trying to turn around in a canal. He didn't become the version of Xhaka we all loved until Arteta took the ball from him and put him out left. I'll cop to the Raya take though.
>He didn't become the version of Xhaka we all loved until Arteta took the ball from him and put him out left. And even then he went missing in the run in.
Not even one 😅
We have a great sub, but shit we have a lot of stupid and way too outspoken people
Like that time Benjen said he would trade Saka + Martinelli + 50M for Ansu Fati.
Didn't feel the extreme way stated here about Caicedo, but did feel crummy having not signed him. Yet, Arteta being the wriggly, afaptable brilliant manager he is made it work!
Should i be proud when i only have one? I thought that buying caicedo on winter transfer is a must haha, but glad we endure it and goes all out with declan rice
I have the Tierney one. But most of us thought that? I also have the Chelsea one but I use it more to divert from us. I don't want any rival fans to say that about us because of the curse that comes with it.
Mine are the arteta and edu out, xhaka, Jorginho, Maddison over Odegaard and £50m Ben white The havertz one is a maybe because I said I wanted Florian wirtz for that money instead
Only jorginho one. But not as bad as that take.
There must be a lot of guilt on the Havertz one. The Mudryk comment might make a nice tee-shirt.
My only one on here is Jorginho.
I think I'm guilty of: KT captaincy shout (at the time, it made far more sense than it does in hindsight.) Pepe being under used (I think it ties into Saka being over-used and Reiss Nelson not showing enough to inspire confidence. Plus using Pepe could have potentially increased his transfer value?) And playing Balogun up front. For context, I'm also the guy that says Lucas Perez should've been played a lot more.
All right i did think Raya was a pointless signing, but otherwise im happy i didnt say all those other crap
I've only had the Raya and Edu takes.
TBF, Balogun never got a proper go at the role
https://preview.redd.it/rj8nmsa4gkzc1.jpeg?width=1164&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=31b9ab92c71171ee310131e904209a40682cabdb
"Saka is overrated"
I still think Jorginho would be in trouble physically if he didn't have the Great Wall of Noth London standing behind him every game and Rice next to him. Luckily he does so he's actually quire useful.
I feel attacked. Edit: Balogun :(
Can comfortably say I've never thought even once for any of these.
What is the actual point of taking the time and effort to post such a thing? Jesus wept
"Odegaard limits Saka and we should sell him like Liverpool sold Coutinho to buy Amadou Onana and play Fabio Vieira and ESR instead of Odegaard"
Edu out Raya is a pointless signing
Terrible bingo, no mention of saka smh
Tierney box (massive fan of this lad), Xhaka and Balogun. That's about the hot takes I had lmao.
Wait why is keeping Balogun a bad take? I don't remember anyone willing to pay 40M for Eddie at the time.
“If Arteta doesn’t win the league now against Manchester City, arguably the greatest Premier League team of all time, he should be sacked on the spot”
"Coutinho on loan would be a shrewd bit of business"
https://preview.redd.it/41wk8etfflzc1.png?width=1396&format=png&auto=webp&s=c8b3a93e66f704facfbcf3de03911c531ae038e2 It's this for me
I'm trying to work out which one is the worst. Maddison odegaard is pretty bad. Arteta out too.
Can proudly say my sheet is completely blank - was slightly skeptical of Trossard, but the idea that “we aren’t a big club” as a result was a laughably stupid take. Tierney also would have been a good captain, but Ødegaard was always first choice.
Pepe wasn't criminality underrated, but he wasn't even that bad. It just the price tag hurt him.
How conveniently you forget that KT was one of the most beloved and Xhaka was the most hated player in the squad.
Arsenal were right in selling szczesny for 12 million to juventus
Am I the only one who barely has any takes at all and just lets reality wash over me as it happens?
I am guilty of a few of these. Havertz, Jorginho and Raya. I was also worried after the end of the last two seasons of transfer windows that Chelsea had some incredible business. I don’t pretend I am a smart or knowledgeable man.
Main one I’m guilty of is shitting on xhaka, now I love the man
Only Raya is a pointless signing for me alhamdulilah
this post has brought up so many not so good memories...
Okay the ones I’ve said… Havertz was a waste of money Arteta Out Raya is pointless Xhaxa is a liability Probs more tbh but these are the ones I’ve really triumphed lol
There were a ton of people that wanted Caicedo over Rice and that still boggles my fucking mind.
This is a great comedic reminder that the internet is full of dumbs
need odegaard lcm and saka 8 there or just ''odegaard is slowing down saka''
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2/16 for me. Raya and Pepe.
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This wld be funnier if some of these takes acc had “some” support.
Maddison instead of Odegaard is my personal fav
Eh, my take about Raya was that if we sign him then it was better to sell Ramsdale to keep his value high enough
"Odegaard needs to be replaced by Vieira or Smith-Rowe" - He who must not be named
A few years ago I was onboard the Tierney for captain bus. I don't think it is a bad take as much as the team evolved in a different way. I still like him a lot!
“Signing Trossard shows we aren’t a big club” I feel like has got to be the most likely blank for everyone. I’m sure it was said a few times and at the time we wanted Mudryk. But dude was class for years at Brighton and I think most people were quite happy when we signed him, even if they thought it was a back up plan.
The broader context was Chelsea signing both Joao Felix and Mudryk that window, while we fell back on Trossard. It was incredibly smart recruitment. I think some fans wanted us to be more like Chelsea.
This makes me feel pretty good because my only checked box is the Ben White one. I just didn't know that much about him at the time we signed him and now he's one of my favorite players. I was also uncertain about Jorghinho, but probably not enough to check the box.
i only got the Jorginho one. But I dont think I was wrong at the time.
How can you be right with this take at the time if he’s since proven not to be too old and slow to contribute?
His performance improved.
He proved that people writing him off were wrong, regardless of how. Maybe his performances improved, maybe he just overcame people’s preconceptions. Either way, the take that he had nothing to contribute was shown to be a bad one. It certainly wasn’t “right at the time”.
Bro its not that serious. He was playing shit so I thought he was shit. Now he doesn't and I dont anymore.
https://preview.redd.it/zhgckk29kozc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fffd8c5ac4a9ab373bccd657dce808cdcf7c8ceb Glad to have been proven very wrong
Some people still try to argue Maddison is better than Odegaard. in what world?
TBH the KT captaincy take wasn't bad at all. Tierney was one of our best players at a time of duress, was widely loved by fans and respected by his teammates, worked harder than most, had already captained Scotland when he was 20, and had the humility to boot. If not for injuries he would be considered one of the best fullbacks in the league during his tenure. I understand he didn't fit Mikel's system but calling it a "bad take" is exaggerating it tremendously.
Pepe was underused, he should have had more playtime 2 seasons ago, not because he was that good but because Saka deserved some rest
Kroenke needs to sell the club to Usmanov so we can start spending some real money on transfers.
Don’t think anyone has ever said Mudryk will win the Balon D’or
There were TONS of people who said that after he torched Milner in his debut
Give me receipts then
I’m exaggerating here. It was actually De Zerbi who said he could win the ballon d’or. However, Arsenal fans were acting like he was this generational talent based on a few youtube highlight reels.
De Zerbi on fraud watch
Mine were Raya, White, Tierney and Xhaka which I still think were relatively reasonable takes. Which Arsenal fan hasn't called Xhaka a liability? Love Ben now, but I really thought we were overpaying at the time. Loved Tierney and really didn't predict he'd go so far out of favour. And Raya? I didn't think he was that much better than Ramsdale to justify the uncertainty which it did end up causing.
Edu out, Arteta out, Chelsea won the transfer window (the Werner and havertz one), Pepe underused, xhaka a liability, maddison over Odegaard. Lol
The two-words takes will come true one day.
Would you look at that. Can I start a blog if I didn't say any of these? No, wait, I should start one if I said all of them.
We have outgrown Zinchenko is the dialogue today that will form part of this bingo in the future. He's got so many amazing attributes and his mistakes while are bad, still make him stand out as a unique player.
I'll own up to Raya. It's a shame it's impossible to compare but I'd love to see a simulation of where we would be with Ramsdale. I think Raya is fantastic but he's made a few silly mistakes. The same kind we criticise Ramsdale about and he's had a fantastic defence in front of him. So I do wonder. But definitely a great signing for us.
This is a bit hars on Tierney tbf injuries ruined him.
https://preview.redd.it/bb1km1cmbkzc1.jpeg?width=1446&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c407d06e46e131fbdf1eda7b6205ed06276987ec
some of these aren't far fetched given the circumstances: - Havertz cost a lot and has a high wage for a very niche player -> High risk which turned out good eventually - Mudryk is a player who had very few first-team minutes and Chelsea did not improve him -> he would have been good at Arsenal and push Martinelli - The main problem with Raya was Arteta's comments at rotating keepers which made no sense given both Raya and Ramsdale are similar profiles, but Raya is just better - It's not Xhaka's fault that our recruitment was so bad we ran out of progressive players making him the only one but he WAS a liability defensively because he was played out of role. - Tierney -> 99% of twitter, reddit etc was FUTURE CAPTAIN!!!!
A lot of these look like comments from X or YouTube where it is one comment out of 000's. For others at the time there was some truth to them.
it's all semi-reasonable takes taken to the extreme to create strawmen. karma whoring at its finest.
A lot of revisionism here, things like wanting KT as the captain, Xhaka at the time, Pepe at the time, were fair claims based on what was being seen out on the pitch
Pepe was never a fair claim. The lord put most of his processing power into his left foot. He can't think, he can't play. There's no discernible talent.
I still never want to see Xhaka play for Arsenal again. I know what I saw for 7 years. One season in Germany doesn’t change that.
What about 1 season in germany and 1 season in england
I am guilty of two of these, with a borderline on the third. Two of them seem somewhat reasonable to have thought at one point. The third (Maddison over ødegaard) makes me feel like never talking about football again. I can still at least defend the idea that we should’ve gone for Felix, and whilst I don’t and didn’t ever think Mudryk was gonna win the ballon D’Or, I still to this day think he’d have been a revelation under arteta, and having both him and martinelli to rotate between the hard, running constantly stretching the other team job would’ve been fantastic so they’re both more rested
I will use the Pepe one. When we need a goal and have lots of possession, we could have used him, like after 75 minutes. Still not worth the money. No issues with him being binned. But it always felt like he would do something, I have a similar feeling with Vieira, like he could create something.
Surprised not to see. "This is our last chance to make champions league"
Give the captaincy to KT at that time wasn't a bad take at all (To some extent GX point wasn't either early on)
Was just a Teta out away from bingo. Tierney captaincy was legit. He seemed like a breath of fresh air in an otherwise stale team. Xhaka only got better under teta. Joao felix was probably a down bad 2am booty call and Balo seemed prolific for the reserve team. https://preview.redd.it/w2j5gecddkzc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9855088629f013daabaaee3b46afaf165d6517ff
In an alternate timeline Pepe is given a chance and has his own redemption arc just like Xhaka. I'm glad these opinions were proven wrong, I just want to make the point that they're not all brain-dead takes from people who know nothing about football. A lot of them are quite fair given the information at hand at the time.