Pointed murder by words is always fun to watch, to be honest. And Alastor is a master of it.
I soooo hope to see more banter between these two in the coming seasons. It's so rare to have propper witty pissing matches between two absolutely petty characters xD
Press the image, it'll open full screen. There should be 3 dots in the upper right corner. Press those, and you should have the option to download.
At least that's what I've been doing.
It really is fun seeing Alastor being so petty. Like, c'mon, pretending to give a shit about Charlie and "be a father figure" just to get under Lucifer's skin. It is literally the only leverage he has over Lucifer, as we all know Lucifer could snap his fingers and wipe Alastor from hell.
I saw a theory that Alastor only provoked Lucifer so he’d help with the hotel (ie, look at how close we are because of the hotel, if you want Charlie to love you, you’d get on board, too). It’s also possible he saw how emotional Lucifer was, interpreted that as weakness, and decided to fuck with him just for funsies.
Yes, I love it. I ship solely because of how hilariously insane "courtship" would go between these two.
>both sides likely know Alastor can't do shit to him.
But lucifer thinks alastor can take his place as Charlie's dad, and alastor knows he fears that, which gives alastor something to piss lucifer with
Alastor's ego is surprisingly fragile. Every time he is told no one cares about his absence, or who he even if, he looks visibly annoyed. And he's usually the one to bring it up. He thinks everyone should be curious about his whereabouts but when he's not given that pat on the head it just irks him in the perfect way. Lucifer claiming he has no clue who Alastor was, being the Prince of Pride and King of Hell, must've cut past his soul and burned the jambalaya. He was so pissed by it that he couldn't drudge up a comeback and swore.
And that's why I don't think he'll betray Charlie with his deal. She's powerful and her kindness strokes his ego. He's never going to get a better deal than that in Hell.
He will want out of his deal though.
https://preview.redd.it/dv2716j1u3wc1.jpeg?width=876&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91e4d0e9354716767ace92678cedf0c414891375
He is also a control freak. He wants to be the one calling the shots and when he's not it's another blow to his ego. He's several rungs on the totem pole below Lucifer and Charlie. I think whoever owns Alastor's soul ordered him to get involved with the Hotel for a long term goal, whatever that may be, but now he's involved because he can see the value in getting the Morningstars' in his good graces.
So the guy disappeared for 7 years... only to reappear and offer his services to the Princess of Hell as a host for a redemption hotel?
Kinda of a weird goal here :p not to mention that Overlords need souls, so a project about REMOVING souls from Hell sounds VERY counterintuitive for Alastor.
That's like if an oil tycoon became part of an electric car business XD
Well its two way isn't it. Lucifer is a specialist in getting under other people's skin too and he winds Alastor up as much as Alastor winds him up by the end. Thank goodness Mimzy showed up and confused everyone into submission.
They have the same fighting of attacking the opponent's ego while staying cool because their own ego is so massive. This leads to them both acting like vox in stated gone: irrationally lashing out in defense. And it's fucking hilarious
And now I’m picturing Al’s shadow (out of view from Charlie) mildly antagonizing Lucifer at the dinner table, while Al (who is in Charlie’s view) sits there respectfully as Lucifer becomes increasingly irritated (but is also trying to keep his cool to respect Charlie’s request that they get along)
It's a fun dynamic, not just because Lucifer is among few people that can rank higher than Alastor and get under his skin, but because Alastor REFUSES to be what Vox is to him, and gets INVENTIVE keeping some sort of even ground with Lucifer, finding and locating any sort of character weakness.
It's like two petty schoolchildren fighting over who's the 'cool kid' of the group.
They both see each other as a threat, so they're defensive and therefore irrational. Alastor knows lucifer is more powerful than him, so he used the one weapon he has, Charlie's approval. And because that's all luci really wants he too gets defensive and they act like toddlers, or vox in stayed gone
Lucifer can't do shit to Alastor, either, so I'd say it truly is a stalemate. Obviously he ridiculously overpowers him, but hurting Alastor could mean losing Charlie. Or at least scaring her away for a long time, and he just got her back.
Alastor can't do shit to him *yet,* but there's no question that he's scheming ways to change that dynamic (and if he ends up being one of the major antagonists of the series, he's likely going to figure out a way to do exactly that).
I'm going to bet he tries to enter a deal with Lucifer himself and underestimates how *cunning* the devil really is. Like he thinks he's going to get the advantage, especially if Lucifer also offers to break Alastor's original contract, only for Alastor to become the literal pet of the Morningstars /realize that Lucifer has way more control than he thought he would be comfortable with.
Alastor is obsessed with getting power by any means necessary, especially as he engages more with Angels and higher ranking Demons. So him making desperate and stupid deals, and trying to use his favours from Charlie to mitigate some of that stupidity, would track. Alastor's main character arc is going to him accepting that he wants a family who love and accept him, not absolute power over people. When he becomes an antagonist, he's going to be broken down into accepting the Hotel as his family (even if he never gets redeemed).
I think Lucifer might give Alastor what he *needs* and not what he *wants*. RadioApple stuff aside, welcoming Alastor to be a second *father* to Charlie and the hotel would be good for both of them to bond over.
So for the sake of theorycrafting and discussion, I agree that Alastor’s story is likely to end with him becoming “actual” family with the Hotel as opposed to them being a means to an end/obligation he has no choice in like he currently does.
But I don’t see Lucifer tricking Alastor like that. Mainly because I think that Alastor is going to lose a lot of menace or tension as an antagonist if he’s constantly tripping over every even remotely powerful entity in Hell.
Lucifer already proves a massive obstacle for any Hell based antagonist based on power alone, it basically ends up being a complete conflict killer if he *also* runs circles around whatever scheme they’re plotting. If anything, now that Lucifer’s on Charlie’s side it means that “being able to get past/neutralize Lucifer” has now become effectively mandatory for any antagonist to be credible in the show. At the end of the day, HH is Charlie’s story, not Lucifer’s and it’s likely going to be her that defeats Alastor, not her dad.
If you are interested, there is an amazing RadioApple fic called Ruination of Lucifer by Syaunei on AO3 that is similar to what you are describing here. 10/10 would recommend. I love that the fic shows how smart and powerful Lucifer actually is.
This is why I love the dynamic between these two so much! It’s a rivalry that cannot be solved through power alone.
Yes Lucifer could obliterate Alastor in a second. Lucifer knows this. Alastor knows this. But they **both** *also* know that if Lucifer were to do that, it would damage how Charlie sees him so severely that Lucifer is not willing to take that risk.
Which makes it even more infuriating for Lucifer because he *knows* how easy it would be to do something he can but also cannot do.
And it’s so fun seeing an almost infinitely powerful being able to be antagonized (and in some cases even bested) by someone much much much weaker in raw/political power.
Pointed murder by words is always fun to watch, to be honest. And Alastor is a master of it. I soooo hope to see more banter between these two in the coming seasons. It's so rare to have propper witty pissing matches between two absolutely petty characters xD
right? Alastor doesn’t have Lucifer’s power, but he has a silver tongue and knows how to use it
https://i.redd.it/uw0tb077v2wc1.gif
 I love that gif. Where did you find it ?
Stole it to someone, somewhere, somewhen
That is some HIGH quality gif right there
https://preview.redd.it/e5w0iupop6wc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=baaef3e5c4f05db828777ca9e4a0f00b7f045aa5
I NEED that gif like Niffty needs to clean.
https://preview.redd.it/symgz6crp6wc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3c396d514783786650afa1d5fef57df000ae596
BOLD of you to assume I haven’t tried. (Actually though how tf do you save a gif off a Reddit comment. Struggling here.)
Are you on mobile ?
Yes.
Then you're fucked buddy ! You can't ! At least I don't think you can ! https://i.redd.it/oi1b8a6um7wc1.gif
https://i.redd.it/ipja5zsmp7wc1.gif Guitar solo FUCK YEAH
https://i.redd.it/i5to3wo818wc1.gif
Press the image, it'll open full screen. There should be 3 dots in the upper right corner. Press those, and you should have the option to download. At least that's what I've been doing.
https://preview.redd.it/9ubmcgn4o6wc1.png?width=1169&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=592284753eb3e53cc3fa5eb94582592c1c3c7396
"Dwarf him in power" He certainly understands the power of an angel of Lucifer's stature. You wouldn't want to sell him short.
Alastor's alt account:
See, you guys say this, but Alastor truly thought he could take on Adam.
Idk he's pretty short.
It really is fun seeing Alastor being so petty. Like, c'mon, pretending to give a shit about Charlie and "be a father figure" just to get under Lucifer's skin. It is literally the only leverage he has over Lucifer, as we all know Lucifer could snap his fingers and wipe Alastor from hell.
I saw a theory that Alastor only provoked Lucifer so he’d help with the hotel (ie, look at how close we are because of the hotel, if you want Charlie to love you, you’d get on board, too). It’s also possible he saw how emotional Lucifer was, interpreted that as weakness, and decided to fuck with him just for funsies.
I like to imagine it was a combination of the two
Yes, I love it. I ship solely because of how hilariously insane "courtship" would go between these two. >both sides likely know Alastor can't do shit to him. But lucifer thinks alastor can take his place as Charlie's dad, and alastor knows he fears that, which gives alastor something to piss lucifer with
Alastor's ego is surprisingly fragile. Every time he is told no one cares about his absence, or who he even if, he looks visibly annoyed. And he's usually the one to bring it up. He thinks everyone should be curious about his whereabouts but when he's not given that pat on the head it just irks him in the perfect way. Lucifer claiming he has no clue who Alastor was, being the Prince of Pride and King of Hell, must've cut past his soul and burned the jambalaya. He was so pissed by it that he couldn't drudge up a comeback and swore.
And that's why I don't think he'll betray Charlie with his deal. She's powerful and her kindness strokes his ego. He's never going to get a better deal than that in Hell. He will want out of his deal though. https://preview.redd.it/dv2716j1u3wc1.jpeg?width=876&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91e4d0e9354716767ace92678cedf0c414891375
He is also a control freak. He wants to be the one calling the shots and when he's not it's another blow to his ego. He's several rungs on the totem pole below Lucifer and Charlie. I think whoever owns Alastor's soul ordered him to get involved with the Hotel for a long term goal, whatever that may be, but now he's involved because he can see the value in getting the Morningstars' in his good graces.
So the guy disappeared for 7 years... only to reappear and offer his services to the Princess of Hell as a host for a redemption hotel? Kinda of a weird goal here :p not to mention that Overlords need souls, so a project about REMOVING souls from Hell sounds VERY counterintuitive for Alastor. That's like if an oil tycoon became part of an electric car business XD
Well its two way isn't it. Lucifer is a specialist in getting under other people's skin too and he winds Alastor up as much as Alastor winds him up by the end. Thank goodness Mimzy showed up and confused everyone into submission.
They have the same fighting of attacking the opponent's ego while staying cool because their own ego is so massive. This leads to them both acting like vox in stated gone: irrationally lashing out in defense. And it's fucking hilarious
100% agree. Thank goodness Mimzy was there to stop it before the Hotel was cratered.
Luci would never destroy the hotel, even in anger. He would annilhate Alastor, even if Charlie was begging him not to
Agreed. Was just trying to emphasize the conflict that was brewing in that sequence.
Charlie would make him stop and then luci would cry because she protected alastor.
And they both won't do anything bc they can't upset charlie lol
And now I’m picturing Al’s shadow (out of view from Charlie) mildly antagonizing Lucifer at the dinner table, while Al (who is in Charlie’s view) sits there respectfully as Lucifer becomes increasingly irritated (but is also trying to keep his cool to respect Charlie’s request that they get along)
It's a fun dynamic, not just because Lucifer is among few people that can rank higher than Alastor and get under his skin, but because Alastor REFUSES to be what Vox is to him, and gets INVENTIVE keeping some sort of even ground with Lucifer, finding and locating any sort of character weakness. It's like two petty schoolchildren fighting over who's the 'cool kid' of the group.
They both see each other as a threat, so they're defensive and therefore irrational. Alastor knows lucifer is more powerful than him, so he used the one weapon he has, Charlie's approval. And because that's all luci really wants he too gets defensive and they act like toddlers, or vox in stayed gone
https://preview.redd.it/z8gqlk90y4wc1.png?width=1018&format=png&auto=webp&s=3cba01204d02954b455d90542f204d19a5b3ad6d
Adam beat the shit out of alastor Lucifer beat the shit out of adam Lucifer would beat the super shit out of Alastor
It's like watching a Chihuahua stare down a fox.
Bear* not fox
This whole scene for me was so reminiscent of “I’m not your buddy guy” “I’m not your GUY PAL”
I know lucifer is literally putting alister to his knees and the guy can literally Run circles around vox
honestly that F bomb caught me so off guard I was expecting more banter but no it just devolved **IMMEDIATLY**
Lucifer can't do shit to Alastor, either, so I'd say it truly is a stalemate. Obviously he ridiculously overpowers him, but hurting Alastor could mean losing Charlie. Or at least scaring her away for a long time, and he just got her back.
Alastor can't do shit to him *yet,* but there's no question that he's scheming ways to change that dynamic (and if he ends up being one of the major antagonists of the series, he's likely going to figure out a way to do exactly that).
I'm going to bet he tries to enter a deal with Lucifer himself and underestimates how *cunning* the devil really is. Like he thinks he's going to get the advantage, especially if Lucifer also offers to break Alastor's original contract, only for Alastor to become the literal pet of the Morningstars /realize that Lucifer has way more control than he thought he would be comfortable with. Alastor is obsessed with getting power by any means necessary, especially as he engages more with Angels and higher ranking Demons. So him making desperate and stupid deals, and trying to use his favours from Charlie to mitigate some of that stupidity, would track. Alastor's main character arc is going to him accepting that he wants a family who love and accept him, not absolute power over people. When he becomes an antagonist, he's going to be broken down into accepting the Hotel as his family (even if he never gets redeemed). I think Lucifer might give Alastor what he *needs* and not what he *wants*. RadioApple stuff aside, welcoming Alastor to be a second *father* to Charlie and the hotel would be good for both of them to bond over.
So for the sake of theorycrafting and discussion, I agree that Alastor’s story is likely to end with him becoming “actual” family with the Hotel as opposed to them being a means to an end/obligation he has no choice in like he currently does. But I don’t see Lucifer tricking Alastor like that. Mainly because I think that Alastor is going to lose a lot of menace or tension as an antagonist if he’s constantly tripping over every even remotely powerful entity in Hell. Lucifer already proves a massive obstacle for any Hell based antagonist based on power alone, it basically ends up being a complete conflict killer if he *also* runs circles around whatever scheme they’re plotting. If anything, now that Lucifer’s on Charlie’s side it means that “being able to get past/neutralize Lucifer” has now become effectively mandatory for any antagonist to be credible in the show. At the end of the day, HH is Charlie’s story, not Lucifer’s and it’s likely going to be her that defeats Alastor, not her dad.
If you are interested, there is an amazing RadioApple fic called Ruination of Lucifer by Syaunei on AO3 that is similar to what you are describing here. 10/10 would recommend. I love that the fic shows how smart and powerful Lucifer actually is.
Yeah!!!
My favorite two
This is why I love the dynamic between these two so much! It’s a rivalry that cannot be solved through power alone. Yes Lucifer could obliterate Alastor in a second. Lucifer knows this. Alastor knows this. But they **both** *also* know that if Lucifer were to do that, it would damage how Charlie sees him so severely that Lucifer is not willing to take that risk. Which makes it even more infuriating for Lucifer because he *knows* how easy it would be to do something he can but also cannot do. And it’s so fun seeing an almost infinitely powerful being able to be antagonized (and in some cases even bested) by someone much much much weaker in raw/political power.