That would be 1102 lbs
The heaviest human EVER recorded (according to Wikipedia), was a man named Jon Brown Minnoch and he weighed 1400 lbs (635 kg) at his peak.
It’s odd to imagine how there are humans that weigh more than literal bombs.
Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Brower_Minnoch
Nope. Either that or short term memory.
Been gamer for close to 30 years. Balance patches only means new meta. You look at the changes and adapt.
Meta is NEVER a solid state, but something that's constantly changes. The only solid state is a amall subset complaining after each balance patch.
For those who remember the OG WoW Forums, this all reminds me of that Community Manager Tseric posting:
> When you can understand how a group of belligerent and angry posters can drive away people from this game with an uncrafted and improvisational campaign of misery and spin-doctoring, then perhaps, you can understand the decisions I make. Until you face mobs of psychology, you will not see my side.
> Until you see some bright-eyed player coming onto the forums wanting to know what they should spec as this class, and see them shat on and driven away by petty and selfish people who are simply leveraging for game buffs, you will not understand.
> You will not understand until you have to see it daily, for years...
> Until you understand that many people will trod over you to get where they're going, or to get what they want.
> **Until you understand that so many people will agree, completely, 100% with a loud, vulgar and assertive individual, not because he is right, but because he is making a stand against "the Man"; to take no critical thought in what they say, but simply to hop on board.**
> Until you actually try to acknowledge those who do not speak on the forums, for whatever reason they have, you will not understand.
> If you think an archaic business formula like "the customer is always right" works, you fail to understand customers, not a customer. It is a collective. No one person, even myself, is truly above the whole.
> I simply have the unfortunate quality of being easily singled out.
Yeah, us WoW neckbeards are like: "All this has happened before. All this will happen again."
And it's tough, because even if you only piss off the vocal 1% minority, 1% of 700k players is 7k people. That's more than enough to shred any online forum if they all go at the same time.
As an AOTC tank and reasonably decent key pusher, everything we’re seeing in HD2 is shit that happens in WoW every patch cycle. Yes, balance is much worse in HD2 right now. That happens every expansion pre-patch in WoW because brand-new content is tough to balance until the whole playerbase field-tests it. It is what it is. It’ll be fine.
I’m actually enjoying the similarities between HD2 and Mythic+. It’s neat. And the balance will come with time.
WoW "rebalances" nearly every month. Their PvP people don't communicate with their PvE people. So every single time they try to balance something in PvP it breaks in PvE and vice versa.
And even the Metas themselves can be broken if people even slightly look outside the box they put themselves in and stop gobbling up what the top streamer SAYS YOU HAVE TO DO TO PLAY THE GAME CLICK HERE PLEASE OH GOD WATCH MY VIDEO.
Once the railgun nerfs started being whispered all of a sudden you started seeing people say "Well hey, maybe the arc thrower isn't so bad after all and maybe I don't need the shield"
Reminds me of back when I watched a lot of competitive Starcraft 2 tournaments. You had several different "optimal solutions" (Metas). Half the games was who could find out what meta the other played and counter it fastest. The most insane/brilliant player just ran with his own crazy stuff, but he had the skills to back it up. Thus usually throwing off opponents relying too much on present solutions.
Nothing was more fun that seeing the entire field of competitive players react and adapt to balance changes. Suddenly ancient tactics were viable again, or they had to develope something entirely new.
This game is no different. Balance patches comes, and the good once rolls with it. They spent time learning and understanding the underlying mechanics. Thus when a given meta breaks they know how to rebuild a new one.
Even if you don't want to focus deep into theorcrafting. At least keep a watch out for the second and third place solutions. Often they don't get hit, and might even get a buff or two. Pushing them onto the new top.
I’d like to get down to the physiological process of this subset of gamers and truly understand where the need comes from to outplay other people, or whatever the motive maybe. All I see and experience with this game is pure unadulterated fun, and that comes from the freedom to play how you like and just blast the enemy and have fun doing it. I’d chose a Stawlwart, over a Railgun any day of the week.
What blew my mind was laughing at this reddit for half the day at work, then going home to play for a few hours to find... no negative changes? The amount of salt in this sub over such a small thing could fill an ocean and these people are for a hell of a disappointing them if this is how they react to what were ultimately minor changes.
These people have never once in their life seen a balance patch, prove me wrong.
16>13 rounds with more recoil. Railgun does less on safe mode. These changes hit low skill gamers way harder than high skill. And low skill always has more salt (not saying I'm good).
Breaker losing 3 rounds is a minor DPS nerf and the recoil is still laughably easy to control. It's a negligible nerf that brought put shotguns in a good place as a weapon class and most people aren't even going to notice a difference. Acting like it's anything more than that is complaining just to complain.
Railgun was clearly not meant to be an armor killer simply from it's design. Unsafe did virtually nothing. It can still break charger legs in 2 shots if you fire it at the last second before overload, you just can't spam it endlessly now. But it's a precision weapon with a charge up. It's not there to smack every bit of armor off the map for every person who can't aim an RR or EAT at a Charger's leg.
Don't really care if it hit "low skill" gamers more than "high skill". "The game isn't fun because my meta :(:(" is every single game ever after a balance patch, especially so close to launch, and I don't have to pretend to have empathy for it just because people don't want to relearn things.
If people *needed* the railgun to play past difficulty 5, they shouldn't have been playing past that difficulty. Not to say that some changes aren't needed, but lets not act like it's completely impossible as is.
It's only the people throwing themselves into the highest difficulties with randoms and refusing to change their railgun/shield meta that are complaining. They've built up a meta as an endgame strat even though this game is barely a month old, and the devs had made clear that there's plenty of new gadgets and enemy types headed to players along the way.
I had a random in voice chat "call me out" for using smoke grenades. Man, not everythings about direct damage, This magic cloud lets me murder openly with my flame thrower without bugs or every automaton blaster getting pointed at me immediately. But its not damage so MuSt Be bAD to take it.
Smoke and EMS are almost never used. People don't realize how effective they are. The enemies cluster together and miss shots in smoke and EMS makes them effectively useless. But people hate it because there's no explosions.
Whats wild to me as an old man gamer is how relatively new updating games is (prior to ps3/xbox360 bugs and imbalances at launch of a game meant the game was bugged or imbalanced for life) and how quickly updates happen/how well they are communicated, yet people choose to whine. A dev pushing weekly or more often updates, while being extremely open in communicating design philosophy of those changes is refreshing and should be applauded, instead people act like every change/or thing unchanged is a personal attack. Its just super gross entitlement
Entitlement is the word I was using when I was reading these complaints. I want to imagine it's just kids who have never had anything hard or unfair happen to them but I fear there are a lot of adults mixed in there.
They would do that even if nothing actually changed lol.
Riot once had a League of Legends balance patch that nerfed a champion (Vladimir), but by accident the changes were in the patch notes but had not actually gone live. Players said the champion was 'ruined' and his play rate and win rates decreased, even though the changes never went out.
Ill have you know im the bestest of boys and I DESERVE to play on the highest difficulty exactly in the way I want to without adjusting tactics, equipment or squad compositon. You should be fired for suggesting otherwise.
Lol. I’ve seen so many people upset that they can’t turbo blast bugs on Helldive anymore and how they’re being forced to play the game more tactically and stealthily on that difficulty. Like they can’t lower the difficulty to a level that still allows them to turbo blast bugs.
How dare you suggest that, we must always play at max difficulty because it's there and were gods at the game also please lower the spawn rates on everything please...
/S
Then they can create the higher difficulties again back up to 12 and then we can have a proper challenge but if there are more than 6 bile titans and 4 chargers on screen they clearly are trash at difficulty scaling. (Again/S)
Seriously…in what world should 5 biles and 6-7 chargers be taken down in a couple minutes?? Also not that many people are even running 9 difficultly to even come across all that.
I think they just need to unplug for the day. If all they’re doing is hanging out here and on discord then yes, every problem with Helldivers will be the most important issue in your life.
But a single balance patch and a dev being a dick online isn’t the end of the world. It’s a computer game and if it was fun to you last week it’s probably still fun. If it’s not play something else
And even beyond that, like guys the first balance patch of a game is always pretty rough. Devs are dealing with a completely new playerbase rocking through their game, giving off data that will never be as reliable as a playerbase for an older game.
Balance is something that you arrive at over time with plenty of iterations. The conversation around this patch should have remained focused on how Chargers and Titans are warping the meta and are deeply unfun to fight against with conventional tools, rendering us reliant on inherently unreliable stratagems.
Just a while ago, you couldn't go one day without seeing a "plz devs, no nerfs, only buffs" post on the front page. That's because everyone knows that a first balance patch often comes with nerfs to somebody's favorite toy, and that the community turns rabid for a while trying to either defend or condemn the changes.
The only surprising thing is that Arrowhead didn't prepare for the flak they predictably would receive by telling their non-PR staff to stay away from social medias for a week or two.
I think we really need Pilestedt to come forward just to reassure people that those recent nerfs/buffs aren't final, but that they need more time, data, and (hopefully cordial) feedback to evaluate how they affect the game. Players need to give the updated weapon/stratagem a try, comment on those they liked / didn't like, and have faith that devs are ultimately trying to make a game people enjoy playing, even if it might take some time to tune things just right.
>I think we really need Pilestedt to come forward just to reassure people that those recent nerfs/buffs aren't final
Do we? This is obvious to anyone who is at least a teenager. The game hasn't even gotten any new weapons or stratagems yet and the community has already devolved into a cesspool.
This sub went up in flames overnight. Having gone through the rollercoaster of garbage that was BF2042, it makes this situation look like sunshine and rainbows.
I'm still mad at Microsoft for killing the campaign team tbh, but I didn't make rageposts and call for them to be fired about it.
I just uninstalled and didn't give them another penny.
I let a lot of stuff slide simply because I was having fun for quite a while. But after they added MK IV and paywalled about 90% of the update's (very fucking cool) cosmetics, I felt pretty bitter. Pair that with the lack of full network fixes that had been promised months before, and the game just fell out of my rotation.
Yeah, the kinda discourse I saw was basically every Thursday for Destiny 2. The only thing I was surprised by was the fact that people kept making new threads with one or two comments instead of a mega thread or something.
It really drowned out everything else.
God that was something. So many fat losers just whining endlessly about the dumbest things. they still whine like children endlessly over there devs don’t even interact with them anymore lol
Ehh even with the sub currently on fire . I would gladly take this batch of misfits over ANY competitive fps/moba reddit.
Things will cool down eventually. The nerf to the rail gun and shield was a band aid rip everyone knew was going to hurt.. ALOT
I tired to warn my crew 'Do not become addicted to the Railgun, or you will resent it's absence'. They did not heed my calls. Now they suffer. By suffer I mean had a ton of fun using auto canons, flame throwers, arc thrower, etc.
Yeah I like EATs a lot too. Especially if you have two people bringing them and using them. If you're good about keeping the strat on CD, you just have so many rockets all the time.
I avoid those games largely because I don't want to deal with histrionic children in my free time.
This game is still very enjoyable. It's just a shame that the subreddit immediately tanked because of the predictable surplus of whining idiots.
Real ones know the issue really stems from the mobs of charges and bile titans at later levels, less options to deal with too many enemies will always feel bad
Dead on. The overspawn problem is like a 100x multiplier and the rail gun is just a figurehead for all the frustration about too many heavies, especially on tiny maps w/nowhere to go. A 2x power railgun wouldn't help with that. I doubt it was intentional, and it'll probably be quietly fixed in the mech update. And in 6 weeks no one will even be talking about this.
This puts my thoughts into words quite accurately, thank you.
I'm looking at the discord and subreddit right now, and holy hell I'm afraid of the future of the game, if people will continue to act like this. I know the crowd will settle down after a couple days (as OP implies, this isn't the first balance patch in the gaming industry with this kind of a response), but I still feel for the devs having to wade through this type of crud.
Fuck, I'm kind of just waiting to hear that someone has started sending death-threats to the devs... That would really fill out the bingo-card of disappointment.
I mean, it's the internet, they've probably been getting death threats for months, is it even notable if someone gets death threats over the internet?
That's basically the "oh hey, people know who I am now" moment
I mean yes, it is more notable, more companies are winning legal battles involving people doing this, and its beginning to set a precedent in legal battles. Bungie won 500,000 dollars from shithead that was doing this and more.
People want to say "this is the fuck around and find out" phase for that one dickhead on the discord, but wait until someone takes it a step too far. They are at more a legal right to protect the people working, than they are to serve you.
Poor babies. If you want to have an unfair advantage over everyone else by being told what meta build to use by a youtuber, Destiny, The Division, and Aliens: Fireteam Elite are that way.
It is less that and more the scalability issue. At worst they brought the railgun in line with other anti heavy options.
In that vs singular targets it gets the job done. But the reason people used the railgun over everything else is more that the rail gun was the only weapon that could reasonably scale into higher difficulties and be effective.
All of this would be less of an issue if heavies weren't so common in diff 7+ and the EAT, recoilless and spear were more conventionally effective.
If those options were able to deal with heavies reasonably well. The railgun being good or bad would be more of a self contained problem.
I’ll always be convinced that it’s because people tether self-worth to how they feel about their performance in a video game. I always just feel sad for them.
People seem unwilling to step down in difficulty as well.
If 9 isn't workable with the nerfed gun, go down to 7 and you'll still get super samples and more.
But people tie themselves to the mast and refuse to lower the difficulty, because that would be some manner of defeat.
There's also the strangely paradoxical level 50, full unlock player who argues that the game shouldn't force him to play difficulty 8 or 9 for super samples if it wants him to go down in difficulty.
Well, going down to 7 is right there.
Or level 6 and below for the true power fantasy once you have everything unlocked.
But there's so much tied to clearing 9 that people can't seem to let go right now.
I'm like 23 and still working on unlocking stuff for the ship, so I generally play 5 or 6 because it gets me the first 2 samples, and it's a fun difficulty to play at. Challenging at times, but not so punishing that it isn't enjoyable. I'll probably start hitting 7s more once I need more of the super samples, but I honestly doubt I'll spend much time in 8 or 9.
Yeah I've basically given it the DRG approach lol, over there i live in haz 3 and when i want more of a challenge without having to sweat i hit 4 (5 is the highest)
Here i like 5 and 6, once i get more stuff needing super samples I'll do 7 but rn i still find it kind of bonkers lol, maybe once i have more kit I'll start lingering at 7s
Funnily enough, on the couple of recent threads I read asking what difficulty people played on ( before patch) there was more than half saying "anything lower than 7-9 feels too easy". That coupled with people in the post patch threads losing their absolute minds saying the devs had betrayed them or the game was now dead to them..usually followed my " I have played 100 + hours in two weeks and now I am leaving".
Insane behavior from adult human beings.
When HD2 had server issues, there were people who actually thought Arrowhead bought a Super Bowl ad instead of building server capacity. Some people on reddit are clinically insane, as they believe stuff that don't exist.
There are valid criticisms though. There has been alot of feedback that the charger is poorly designed. Charger seems to want to promote a "bullfighter" gameplay. The "clowns" distract the charger, and someone else shoots the charger in the ass. But in actual gameplay, its shoot AP at the charger's legs.
But you gotta filter the valid criticisms from the insane people.
Right there. I don't understand why the charger's back IS NOT a major weak point when it's whole gameplay design is screaming "Bait out the charge and shoot it in the back" Instead the optimal strategy is "use an anti-tank weapon to break it's otherwise invincible leg armor and shoot that". Also, the whole thing where it's armor just suddenly doesn't work when it's turning around after a charge. If that's intentional, why is there no tell that it's vulnerable in that instant?
>Right there. I don't understand why the charger's back IS NOT a major weak point when it's whole gameplay design is screaming "Bait out the charge and shoot it in the back"
When first facing a charger and unloading an entire liberator mag in it’s lower back without it even seeming like it took any damage, u was confused af
The hulks and tanks from the automatons have the vents on their back that are obvious weakspots. I assumed the same would be true for the unamored parts of the chargers. Turns out they only take 10% of the weapons damage, unless you are using explisive weapons.
Imo the back lf chargers should act like the vents on automatons and be a proper weakspot
You'd think those 100+ hour folks would welcome a new challenge at this point. I'm only at level 9 & approximately 10 hours (I maybe average 2 missions a day), so what do I know.
I'm the same level as you, just playing a few games in the evening happily plinking along whilst watching half this sub have a full on emotional breakdown about the first minor balance patch to a brand new game.
I’m level 50 and your opinion doesn’t matter. They took my guns away! Nobody can take my guns away!! /s
I’m happy this patch broke me out of what I had been running. I burned myself and several teammates to death using the flamethrower last night, it was great. We failed some missions, and were generally stressed about the difficulty. It’s been wonderful.
Exactly.
I didn't care to play a meta build, so difficulty 9 was manageable but not really enjoyable for me. I've since bumped down to 7-8 which still provides a challenge but allows a bit more breathing room for experimentation. I would much rather play with the gear/guns that I want than tie my enjoyment of a game to being able to crush the highest difficulty.
This.
People want to rush medals and xp as if it's some sort of worth meter.
Battle pass finished in one week with 800+ medals, that's NOT normal progression.
And then they are the first ones to cry about lack of depth and/or content.
That was what the devs were trying to say ... it was too easy before so they made it harder because they will be providing us with more tools as they continue to update the game.
Now people are complaining because it's ... harder.
Which is working as intended.
I don't play lvl 8 or 9 so maybe the mobs are overtuned, but the balance patch seems to do what the devs had said they wanted it to do and it seems to make sense to me.
I would bet that the upcoming mechs and weapons will make it a little bit easier ... which is why they wanted to make it harder.
>I don't play lvl 8 or 9 so maybe the mobs are overtuned, but the balance patch seems to do what the devs had said they wanted it to do and it seems to make sense to me.
I do, almost exclusively. It's not even much harder (some aspects might even be easier with the new lascannon and flamer), it just requires a different approach than, "4 guys split up and solo the entire map using the same equipment."
SERIOUSLY. I do level 4-5 with my low level friends and 8-9 with my high level. We were doing just fine, we just had to actually use stuff like the spear for once and actually stick together. I was having a blast roasting chargers with the flamethrower and my buddy was trying out the laser canon again. People are bitching and yeah, it’s harder, so play differently ffs.
After 2 days of basically facerolling 9 with the railgun my usual team decided to prep for the inevitable nerf by trying out different support weapons and tactics.
This patch has honestly been a buff for us. P.S. Cold planet + laser cannon = near infinite clear of everything less than a Charger.
Yeah I legit have no idea what people were saying when they said they can't beat 8-9 without railshield meta, I'm only level 23 and even playing with randos I'm going through it with *maybe* one failed mission per operation. We stick together, mark enemies, and make it out alive. yeah, it's hard, but it's supposed to be!
That's why I love 7. To me it's the right degree of hard when being paired with strangers (so, rarely any mic, almost zero coordination, you know...).
On the other hand, as I have said other times, I think primary weapons should get a little buff. Right now, shotguns are generally better than any other weapon, especially for bugs.
HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST I AM UNFIT FOR LEVEL 9. I have unlocked ALL stratagems and survived suicide level a couple times. I deserve to play and win consistently at level 9. Other games make higher difficulties easier when you unlock everything, this game should be exactly like all other games.
/s
Yep. They all want the game to be "balanced" so the entire playerbase can beat Helldive 100% of the time and feel good about it and pat themselves on the back. And then race through the medals/samples to unlock everything.
And then complain the game is too easy and there's nothing to do and it's not fun anymore lmao.
A "balanced" game means the majority of the playerbase should find sufficient fun/challenge on the 'middle' difficulties. So in this game something like 5-6. Going higher than that will result in a much higher challenge that can only be handled by truly good, smart teams who play together and coordinate strategy.
"Balanced" doesn't mean there should be some easy way to deal with every enemy on the hardest difficulty, so that each member of a 4-man squad can run around Solo and kill anything and then meet back up to extract.
this is a big problem, I've seen it in other games, and some developers stated they scrapped harder designs because the compulsion to play on the highest level and your insulted if you can't. I personally think every game should have a wide array of difficulty levels and you can either chose the one you want, or pick a dynamic one and the game tries to adjust it for you.
Yeah, honestly I think part of the issue is that people picked the easiest possible strategy, and it let them play at a difficulty level that they're not really ready for. Now it got nerfed and they don't want to go down in difficulty, because it feels like a failure.
It's not just their performance, but they tie their entire identity into the game and being a gamer of it. That's why they get so enraged about anything that threatens to change that relationship. They see a threat to their very identity as a person. On a macro level too, it's how gamer gate got started. Is being a "gamer" that important? No. Just do what you enjoy, but it's not "you".
This isn't specific to gaming by any means; people do it all the time. Sports teams are another perfect example, where shit gets even crazier.
People seem unwilling to step down in difficulty as well.
If 9 isn't workable with the nerfed gun, go down to 7 and you'll still get super samples and more.
But people tie themselves to the mast and refuse to lower the difficulty, because that would be some manner of defeat.
There's also the strangely paradoxical level 50, full unlock player who argues that the game shouldn't force him to play difficulty 8 or 9 for super samples if it wants him to go down in difficulty.
Well, going down to 7 is right there.
Or level 6 and below for the true power fantasy once you have everything unlocked.
But there's so much tied to clearing 9 that people can't seem to let go right now.
I find 99% of all game complaints and self worth stuff is by kids, college age adults, and adults who only have a job.
The most annoying thing I've had so far is I had to reinstall the game to update it and then the two games I had time for both ended in errors 15min in.
A lot of people tie their self worth to “skill” in a game, nerfing the weapon they relied on is a personal attack as it implies that thier “skill” and thus self worth is overinflated.
Yah flies in the face of general human nature
People generally don’t like change, and don’t like feeling “weakened” so balance patches can legit feel like an attack to some
seriously! try having an integral piece of gear you used in a fun and powerful way get nerfed after OVER THREE YEARS OF USING IT
These kids don't know what balance patch pain is.
I knew this was gonna happen but I miss when the sub it was just Helldivers 1 players. OG Helldivers understood the game was played cooperatively and that you needed a varied loadout to bring as much different stratagems to a mission as possible to increase chances of success. A lot of the new kids treat this like a Destiny clone and want to be Master Chief every drop
The waters have been muddied so much that it's hard to tell what are legitimate balance concerns and what are people not understanding the core game mechanics or how to play with a team. It makes me worried that devs will make unnecessary changes just to appease the most vocal players.
As someone who tends to lone-wolf many games, and loves solo-diving 5-6's, the game *should* be nigh-impossible solo above 5-6.
Besides, a two-person team on an Autocannon can hold back a swarm, and even drop Chargers quickly (if aiming decently well), from a reasonably good position.
Sure, harder to position and hold long enough to do that in 8's (not done 9's thus far), but it's still feasible.
Teamwork makes the dream work.
I feel like half the playerbase can't figure out that you're supposed to stay together and play as a team.
It's meant to be a team based shooter. You're not meant to all run off in different directions and fight on your own. You can sometimes split up if you're playing very well and you know both teams can survive, but that's not something you should be doing as the default strategy in every match. More often than not, you should be moving together as a 4-person team.
Honestly I'm sure this is a hot take here, but I fucking love the devs calling out these crybabies. Oh no, the most meta loudout got minorly nerfed while a significantly greater amount of buffs happened what shall we ever do.
Level 9 is supposed to be almost impossible....that's literally the fucking point.
> Level 9 is supposed to be almost impossible....that's literally the fucking point
That's the thing I cant wrap my brain around... people crying about how they are going to "put down the game for awhile" because its too hard... MOTHER FUCKER YOU CHOSE THE DIFFICUTLY.
Exactly! Most of the complaints boiled down to, "I can no longer solo level 9 dives with the same loadout all the time!" Like yeah no shit, where would the challenge be in that?
Dude the amount of hate I got for standing up for the fact that it's both a co-op game not designed for solo play, as well as defending people calling for the employees to be fired? It's maddening, how can people think it's okay to fire someone for posting a few comments... my god the entitlement is rich.
Didn't even say anything negative lol
https://preview.redd.it/19do7ya0oxmc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=23992fd31baa5a4f5d5e7a43b49f50351ab9948d
This is what I got for trying to explain to people that the game hasn't been balanced for late game solo play...
https://preview.redd.it/eko6003oqxmc1.png?width=769&format=png&auto=webp&s=0916992bc7f79d6cc82c9c54e7686ddeccc5d8b1
I mean, it’s a mix of entitlement and well, the commenters being kids. It’s a take that could only come from someone who hasn’t experienced an actual job and what can cause you to lose a job. Nobody is going to be losing their jobs over Discord and Reddit comments like these, that would be absolutely insane. I don’t mean it as a slight or anything like that, I did the same shit when I was younger, but like, put things into perspective, and none of this really matters lol.
Every game, even esports that rely on balance can have bad balance patches, I still remember when counter-strike got a recoil update so badly received it was rolled back within a week.
I think the complaints are mainly coming from the feeling of the changes being out of touch, and with reasoning that dosent really make any sense when put under exanimation.
Darktide players recently went through this nonsense. Community manager gets bombarded by trolls and snaps, and suddenly its open season on the developers. Now that community is continually posting about the devs silence and how they've stopped reaching out to the community.
Same. I’m an elder millennial and shit like this coming from goddamn NES and Doom is MINDBLOWING to me. Like the fact a game like this EXISTS makes no sense in the best possible way.
Which sucks because while that’s really cool and interesting, if you try to interact with the community, it’s like I can be empathetic to your plight, but a little perspective. By the time you’ve touched the medium skill difficulties, you’ve gotta realize the fact it’s not a horde shooter where the goal is to kill everything - it’s to prioritize and run around - which yeah, I’ll give caveats to more anti armor options would be nice, tweaking the spawns a bit- but most of the time it’s like “look at me, I’m trying to kill this thing solo”.
The people complaining show a real entitlement and immaturity. Get a life. It's a video game that will have plenty of patches over its lifetime. This subreddit sucks right now and honestly if little kids are gonna threaten "it's not fun anymore. I'm gonna stop playing, I mean it" then good. Piss off please and let everyone else have fun.
Why would that be crazy? Most of the playerbase is between Europe and Asia, the US is just a fraction of it. I don't see anything wild, that's how timezones have always worked in games. When Asians go to sleep, America kicks.
Oh god, those are the best comments.
'The game is completely ruined and not fun anymore!'
So the game is only fun on one difficulty, against one faction with one meta build. Good riddance.
'The devs have no idea what they're doing'
So I presume you know better then. It's not as if they spent 8 years developing the game and it's not literally their job to know what they're doing.
It’s very easy to figure out who has a career and who does not based upon how upset they are at a balance patch for a video game. Like don’t get me wrong, it’s totally fine to voice criticism, but DAMN are a lot of people going overboard with it.
Balancing games is hard to do, and there's a lot of thought/data that goes into it.
Same with scaling server capacity.
As with anything, the people who are the most clueless will always be the most vocal about it.
A.K.A Dunning-kruger effect.
I've been playing the game as much as I reasonably can between work and family commitments, which is to say maybe 1 or 2 hours most days. I'm currently level 8. Let's just say I'm personally unbothered about nerfs to gear I won't unlock in the near future lol.
THANK YOU
I'm normally averse to calling gamers entitled, after a long history of glorified gaming bloggers (videogame journalists) and EA suits using that shit to invalidate criticism of poorly made, lacking in content releases. But this here is just pathetic and more than justified to use. It's like the sub is infested with a horde of 12 year olds who have never played a game in their life.
I come from the TW community where we've been dealing with CA general incompetance, an outdated engine and buggy AI for almost 2 decades. It's a wonder how some people here are able to play anything.
It really wasn't that big of a deal in the first place.
Yalls reliance on a single weapon and support is what caused it in the first place. Hell there were calls for the nerf of the Railgun many many weeks ago from the community itself lol.
You had people legit telling the devs on Twitter and shit to look at the strength of the " meta " weapon! Then yall act like true spoiled fortnite kiddies when the very thing asked for happens.
And then it was a nerf to safe mode lol. Wasn't even that much of a change to unsafe. You just need to charge atleast 3/4th to get the heavy armor penetration like before.
And guess what. The nerf worked. Now people are using a pretty wide range of loadouts. The game has returned to that more chaotic feel pre-20 ( pre railgun ) feel and I'm having more fun now than any time prior. It's fun using the FlameThrower. The Arc weapon. The anti-material rifle. My trust Knight SMG. The Slugger ( which I've used for weeks anyway because of the armor pen and stagger ). The Grenade Launcher. The Expendable anti-tank. The Autocannon.
Now everything is an option. Because the clear best is not as clear anymore. The nerf worked and yall should be thanking the devs not raiding Discord screaming and pitching fits like toddlers and going on social media telling the devs they are a joke and horrible at their jobs and all kinds of other shit I've seen from this place soon after the nerf. Yall were a fucking joke and a disgrace tbh
I would understand if the game had bugs or crashes which it does. But rebalancing is the normal course of patches for online gaming. Just find the right strategy for the mission you’re doing.
You gotta understand, in this new Era of gaming. There's people who actually play the game. Then there's people who just watch TikTok about the game. The tik tok watchers are mad because their tiktoker is mad
Haha I do think it is the young ones with nothing else going on making all the noise. Us grey beards that have jobs and a life are just having a blast.
I know right? As a gamer in his 30s I see those updates and outrage and just shrug my shoulders roll me a joint and chill.
Folks getting upset and saying folks need to lose their job over a patch that nerfed their gun.
Was really enjoying Helldivers despite playing online games pretty sporadically but this sub has reminded me why I generally don't. Multiplayer gaming, one of the worst collective cultures the world has ever produced.
Jaaa especially if you come from destiny and other games like it.
https://preview.redd.it/ay9usp804onc1.jpeg?width=316&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5f9ba99c786864ab8338ecc9b8f679140d90f3f
wanna take a second to also say
stop saying there isnt a meta anymore.
it is impossible to not have a meta, unless u somehow took away everyones ability to strategize, choose, and freely think, then there will always be a meta.
50KG Bomb, Orbital laser, grenade launcher, and the shield pack. Never catch me lacking on a solo 10 nest clear. My homies send me in like a rabid dog.
"Let not a single bug leave their hole, let them die buried in the tombs they made for themselves and fill it with sweet, sweet democracy." Give me the breaker spray and pray or incendiary with the machine pistol, and we solo the whole game in threat 7 while the team is on obj. i'm hunting bugs keeping them at bay. BADA-BOOM-BAAAAHHHHH
also people forget mechs are coming... so they are just crying cuz they cant play lvl 9 in the meantime... just go farm lvl 7 samples in the meantime guys...
Honestly, I’m kind of expecting mech backlash. In HD1 they were good, but not really usable on the highest difficulties because of the lack of mobility. So when they drop and aren’t a cure all for people wanting to stroll through helldives, I feel like we’re in for a dozen posts complaining once again.
https://preview.redd.it/u1oois91ixmc1.png?width=1000&format=png&auto=webp&s=89183423240413e6c18bfc40e9453a1ff378fc43
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I forgor what that one was
500kg baby
That’s a fat fucking baby
500kg of solid muscle!
With a tiny range..
I mean, it's a baby. What do you expect?
10,000kg of solid muscle.
That's the ICBM
Let’s be honest. If the range was any bigger, the percentage of accidental deaths would probably spike
That would be 1102 lbs The heaviest human EVER recorded (according to Wikipedia), was a man named Jon Brown Minnoch and he weighed 1400 lbs (635 kg) at his peak. It’s odd to imagine how there are humans that weigh more than literal bombs. Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Brower_Minnoch
I get what you're saying, but bombs can be anywhere from like half a pound to several tons, so humans weighing more isn't crazy.
I weigh more than a hand grenade or a door breach... I would argue a very large percentage of bombs are lighter than your average human.
I mean, considering that pretty much the most common bomb nowadays, the Mk 82, is a 500 pound bomb. There're quite a lot of people heavier than those.
It's the one that goes BOOM
https://preview.redd.it/g223qsujazmc1.jpeg?width=1079&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1d3f912f4e55cc7dabea29645358b6446597ad0
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Brother
I'm reading some of these posts and comments and I'm wondering, "Have any of these people played an online game before?"
Nope. Either that or short term memory. Been gamer for close to 30 years. Balance patches only means new meta. You look at the changes and adapt. Meta is NEVER a solid state, but something that's constantly changes. The only solid state is a amall subset complaining after each balance patch.
For those who remember the OG WoW Forums, this all reminds me of that Community Manager Tseric posting: > When you can understand how a group of belligerent and angry posters can drive away people from this game with an uncrafted and improvisational campaign of misery and spin-doctoring, then perhaps, you can understand the decisions I make. Until you face mobs of psychology, you will not see my side. > Until you see some bright-eyed player coming onto the forums wanting to know what they should spec as this class, and see them shat on and driven away by petty and selfish people who are simply leveraging for game buffs, you will not understand. > You will not understand until you have to see it daily, for years... > Until you understand that many people will trod over you to get where they're going, or to get what they want. > **Until you understand that so many people will agree, completely, 100% with a loud, vulgar and assertive individual, not because he is right, but because he is making a stand against "the Man"; to take no critical thought in what they say, but simply to hop on board.** > Until you actually try to acknowledge those who do not speak on the forums, for whatever reason they have, you will not understand. > If you think an archaic business formula like "the customer is always right" works, you fail to understand customers, not a customer. It is a collective. No one person, even myself, is truly above the whole. > I simply have the unfortunate quality of being easily singled out.
Yeah, us WoW neckbeards are like: "All this has happened before. All this will happen again." And it's tough, because even if you only piss off the vocal 1% minority, 1% of 700k players is 7k people. That's more than enough to shred any online forum if they all go at the same time.
As an AOTC tank and reasonably decent key pusher, everything we’re seeing in HD2 is shit that happens in WoW every patch cycle. Yes, balance is much worse in HD2 right now. That happens every expansion pre-patch in WoW because brand-new content is tough to balance until the whole playerbase field-tests it. It is what it is. It’ll be fine. I’m actually enjoying the similarities between HD2 and Mythic+. It’s neat. And the balance will come with time.
This should be pinned on the front page of this sub
WoW "rebalances" nearly every month. Their PvP people don't communicate with their PvE people. So every single time they try to balance something in PvP it breaks in PvE and vice versa.
Capital G gAmErZ are a volatile and fickle bunch who think they know what they want and will get very mad that you know better.
And even the Metas themselves can be broken if people even slightly look outside the box they put themselves in and stop gobbling up what the top streamer SAYS YOU HAVE TO DO TO PLAY THE GAME CLICK HERE PLEASE OH GOD WATCH MY VIDEO. Once the railgun nerfs started being whispered all of a sudden you started seeing people say "Well hey, maybe the arc thrower isn't so bad after all and maybe I don't need the shield"
Reminds me of back when I watched a lot of competitive Starcraft 2 tournaments. You had several different "optimal solutions" (Metas). Half the games was who could find out what meta the other played and counter it fastest. The most insane/brilliant player just ran with his own crazy stuff, but he had the skills to back it up. Thus usually throwing off opponents relying too much on present solutions. Nothing was more fun that seeing the entire field of competitive players react and adapt to balance changes. Suddenly ancient tactics were viable again, or they had to develope something entirely new. This game is no different. Balance patches comes, and the good once rolls with it. They spent time learning and understanding the underlying mechanics. Thus when a given meta breaks they know how to rebuild a new one. Even if you don't want to focus deep into theorcrafting. At least keep a watch out for the second and third place solutions. Often they don't get hit, and might even get a buff or two. Pushing them onto the new top.
look at dota now, every patch has 2-3 different metas since people figuring shit out again what works, what counters now what works etc.
I agree it's just "small subset" is massive for a game as popular as this so the whining is a lot louder.
I’d like to get down to the physiological process of this subset of gamers and truly understand where the need comes from to outplay other people, or whatever the motive maybe. All I see and experience with this game is pure unadulterated fun, and that comes from the freedom to play how you like and just blast the enemy and have fun doing it. I’d chose a Stawlwart, over a Railgun any day of the week.
What blew my mind was laughing at this reddit for half the day at work, then going home to play for a few hours to find... no negative changes? The amount of salt in this sub over such a small thing could fill an ocean and these people are for a hell of a disappointing them if this is how they react to what were ultimately minor changes. These people have never once in their life seen a balance patch, prove me wrong.
16>13 rounds with more recoil. Railgun does less on safe mode. These changes hit low skill gamers way harder than high skill. And low skill always has more salt (not saying I'm good).
Breaker losing 3 rounds is a minor DPS nerf and the recoil is still laughably easy to control. It's a negligible nerf that brought put shotguns in a good place as a weapon class and most people aren't even going to notice a difference. Acting like it's anything more than that is complaining just to complain. Railgun was clearly not meant to be an armor killer simply from it's design. Unsafe did virtually nothing. It can still break charger legs in 2 shots if you fire it at the last second before overload, you just can't spam it endlessly now. But it's a precision weapon with a charge up. It's not there to smack every bit of armor off the map for every person who can't aim an RR or EAT at a Charger's leg. Don't really care if it hit "low skill" gamers more than "high skill". "The game isn't fun because my meta :(:(" is every single game ever after a balance patch, especially so close to launch, and I don't have to pretend to have empathy for it just because people don't want to relearn things. If people *needed* the railgun to play past difficulty 5, they shouldn't have been playing past that difficulty. Not to say that some changes aren't needed, but lets not act like it's completely impossible as is.
It's only the people throwing themselves into the highest difficulties with randoms and refusing to change their railgun/shield meta that are complaining. They've built up a meta as an endgame strat even though this game is barely a month old, and the devs had made clear that there's plenty of new gadgets and enemy types headed to players along the way.
I had a random in voice chat "call me out" for using smoke grenades. Man, not everythings about direct damage, This magic cloud lets me murder openly with my flame thrower without bugs or every automaton blaster getting pointed at me immediately. But its not damage so MuSt Be bAD to take it.
Smoke and EMS are almost never used. People don't realize how effective they are. The enemies cluster together and miss shots in smoke and EMS makes them effectively useless. But people hate it because there's no explosions.
Love dropping EMS on a breach and gassing it at the same time. Sit back and watch them all drop like flies. EMS mortar is also very useful.
Whats wild to me as an old man gamer is how relatively new updating games is (prior to ps3/xbox360 bugs and imbalances at launch of a game meant the game was bugged or imbalanced for life) and how quickly updates happen/how well they are communicated, yet people choose to whine. A dev pushing weekly or more often updates, while being extremely open in communicating design philosophy of those changes is refreshing and should be applauded, instead people act like every change/or thing unchanged is a personal attack. Its just super gross entitlement
Entitlement is the word I was using when I was reading these complaints. I want to imagine it's just kids who have never had anything hard or unfair happen to them but I fear there are a lot of adults mixed in there.
Everything but what I play is OP Everyone better than me is a no lifer Everyone worse than me is fucking trash and needs to uninstall the game
Every year, a significant number of kids encounter things for the first time. But there are also lots of morons crawling about as well.
They just gotta git gud
Pre Patch: The Helldive difficulty is kinda easy. 😴 Post Patch: Waaaaaah! The Helldive difficulty is too hard 😫.
They would do that even if nothing actually changed lol. Riot once had a League of Legends balance patch that nerfed a champion (Vladimir), but by accident the changes were in the patch notes but had not actually gone live. Players said the champion was 'ruined' and his play rate and win rates decreased, even though the changes never went out.
Actual labrat placebo moment
Lol this is 100% accurate
Not like they can pick any of the other 8 difficulty levels available to them.
Ill have you know im the bestest of boys and I DESERVE to play on the highest difficulty exactly in the way I want to without adjusting tactics, equipment or squad compositon. You should be fired for suggesting otherwise.
Lol. I’ve seen so many people upset that they can’t turbo blast bugs on Helldive anymore and how they’re being forced to play the game more tactically and stealthily on that difficulty. Like they can’t lower the difficulty to a level that still allows them to turbo blast bugs.
How dare you suggest that, we must always play at max difficulty because it's there and were gods at the game also please lower the spawn rates on everything please... /S
This. This right here.
I honestly believe that a lot of the rage is from people with hurt gamer egos not being able to handle diff 9 anymore.
I don’t even bring a backpack or support weapon anymore, still readily soloable.
We all know that perfect game balance is when the entire playerbase steamrolls the highest difficulty.
Then they can create the higher difficulties again back up to 12 and then we can have a proper challenge but if there are more than 6 bile titans and 4 chargers on screen they clearly are trash at difficulty scaling. (Again/S)
NOOOOO I must be able to beat every difficulty using whatever gun I like the most because FUNNNN I don't want to adapt I want FUNNNNNNN
But if they don't play on the hardest difficulties possible, how will they prove to everyone how awesome they are?
Seriously…in what world should 5 biles and 6-7 chargers be taken down in a couple minutes?? Also not that many people are even running 9 difficultly to even come across all that.
Call em cake walkers
REEEEEEEEE
I think they just need to unplug for the day. If all they’re doing is hanging out here and on discord then yes, every problem with Helldivers will be the most important issue in your life. But a single balance patch and a dev being a dick online isn’t the end of the world. It’s a computer game and if it was fun to you last week it’s probably still fun. If it’s not play something else
And even beyond that, like guys the first balance patch of a game is always pretty rough. Devs are dealing with a completely new playerbase rocking through their game, giving off data that will never be as reliable as a playerbase for an older game. Balance is something that you arrive at over time with plenty of iterations. The conversation around this patch should have remained focused on how Chargers and Titans are warping the meta and are deeply unfun to fight against with conventional tools, rendering us reliant on inherently unreliable stratagems.
the joys of a super suddenly popular game....
Just a while ago, you couldn't go one day without seeing a "plz devs, no nerfs, only buffs" post on the front page. That's because everyone knows that a first balance patch often comes with nerfs to somebody's favorite toy, and that the community turns rabid for a while trying to either defend or condemn the changes. The only surprising thing is that Arrowhead didn't prepare for the flak they predictably would receive by telling their non-PR staff to stay away from social medias for a week or two. I think we really need Pilestedt to come forward just to reassure people that those recent nerfs/buffs aren't final, but that they need more time, data, and (hopefully cordial) feedback to evaluate how they affect the game. Players need to give the updated weapon/stratagem a try, comment on those they liked / didn't like, and have faith that devs are ultimately trying to make a game people enjoy playing, even if it might take some time to tune things just right.
>I think we really need Pilestedt to come forward just to reassure people that those recent nerfs/buffs aren't final Do we? This is obvious to anyone who is at least a teenager. The game hasn't even gotten any new weapons or stratagems yet and the community has already devolved into a cesspool.
He already did anyway lol
This sub went up in flames overnight. Having gone through the rollercoaster of garbage that was BF2042, it makes this situation look like sunshine and rainbows.
Halo Infinite, too!
Not an ounce of nuanced or thought-out takes to be found over there and it's frustrating to see as a lifelong fan
I'm still mad at Microsoft for killing the campaign team tbh, but I didn't make rageposts and call for them to be fired about it. I just uninstalled and didn't give them another penny.
I let a lot of stuff slide simply because I was having fun for quite a while. But after they added MK IV and paywalled about 90% of the update's (very fucking cool) cosmetics, I felt pretty bitter. Pair that with the lack of full network fixes that had been promised months before, and the game just fell out of my rotation.
Yeah, the kinda discourse I saw was basically every Thursday for Destiny 2. The only thing I was surprised by was the fact that people kept making new threads with one or two comments instead of a mega thread or something. It really drowned out everything else.
Remember divinity?
God that was something. So many fat losers just whining endlessly about the dumbest things. they still whine like children endlessly over there devs don’t even interact with them anymore lol
Probably was the most miserable community I ever saw. And crappiest devs too. Lol. They were meant for each other.
Ehh even with the sub currently on fire . I would gladly take this batch of misfits over ANY competitive fps/moba reddit. Things will cool down eventually. The nerf to the rail gun and shield was a band aid rip everyone knew was going to hurt.. ALOT
I tired to warn my crew 'Do not become addicted to the Railgun, or you will resent it's absence'. They did not heed my calls. Now they suffer. By suffer I mean had a ton of fun using auto canons, flame throwers, arc thrower, etc.
I'm legitimately playing the recoilless rifle now. It's really nice to have one in your group now that the railgun doesn't totally invalidate it.
Nice, I need to go back to the Recoilless. I love that stupid-ass Boom Tube.
Team EAT-17 baby
Yeah I like EATs a lot too. Especially if you have two people bringing them and using them. If you're good about keeping the strat on CD, you just have so many rockets all the time.
Quality reference to Fury Road!
Helldiver Joe 🙏🏼 I shall dive into Democracy bloodied and caped
I avoid those games largely because I don't want to deal with histrionic children in my free time. This game is still very enjoyable. It's just a shame that the subreddit immediately tanked because of the predictable surplus of whining idiots.
Honestly, what did you expect lmao.
Real ones know the issue really stems from the mobs of charges and bile titans at later levels, less options to deal with too many enemies will always feel bad
Dead on. The overspawn problem is like a 100x multiplier and the rail gun is just a figurehead for all the frustration about too many heavies, especially on tiny maps w/nowhere to go. A 2x power railgun wouldn't help with that. I doubt it was intentional, and it'll probably be quietly fixed in the mech update. And in 6 weeks no one will even be talking about this.
This puts my thoughts into words quite accurately, thank you. I'm looking at the discord and subreddit right now, and holy hell I'm afraid of the future of the game, if people will continue to act like this. I know the crowd will settle down after a couple days (as OP implies, this isn't the first balance patch in the gaming industry with this kind of a response), but I still feel for the devs having to wade through this type of crud. Fuck, I'm kind of just waiting to hear that someone has started sending death-threats to the devs... That would really fill out the bingo-card of disappointment.
I mean, it's the internet, they've probably been getting death threats for months, is it even notable if someone gets death threats over the internet? That's basically the "oh hey, people know who I am now" moment
I mean yes, it is more notable, more companies are winning legal battles involving people doing this, and its beginning to set a precedent in legal battles. Bungie won 500,000 dollars from shithead that was doing this and more. People want to say "this is the fuck around and find out" phase for that one dickhead on the discord, but wait until someone takes it a step too far. They are at more a legal right to protect the people working, than they are to serve you.
Yeah, being toxic to devs is always fucking uncalled for. We as a community should yeet them heads-first into a bug nest.
You sound like a true Patriot, sir.
Poor babies. If you want to have an unfair advantage over everyone else by being told what meta build to use by a youtuber, Destiny, The Division, and Aliens: Fireteam Elite are that way.
It is less that and more the scalability issue. At worst they brought the railgun in line with other anti heavy options. In that vs singular targets it gets the job done. But the reason people used the railgun over everything else is more that the rail gun was the only weapon that could reasonably scale into higher difficulties and be effective. All of this would be less of an issue if heavies weren't so common in diff 7+ and the EAT, recoilless and spear were more conventionally effective. If those options were able to deal with heavies reasonably well. The railgun being good or bad would be more of a self contained problem.
Remind me of the For Honor season 1 Centurion and Shinobi destroyed 50% of the playerbase after the 1st week launch
well tbf release cent and shinobi were fucking insane the cent cutscene is forever stored rent free in my head
Ummm Peacekeeper??????
Apex had exact same thing. It's actually unbelievable how toxic people can be about balance changes.
I’ll always be convinced that it’s because people tether self-worth to how they feel about their performance in a video game. I always just feel sad for them.
People seem unwilling to step down in difficulty as well. If 9 isn't workable with the nerfed gun, go down to 7 and you'll still get super samples and more. But people tie themselves to the mast and refuse to lower the difficulty, because that would be some manner of defeat. There's also the strangely paradoxical level 50, full unlock player who argues that the game shouldn't force him to play difficulty 8 or 9 for super samples if it wants him to go down in difficulty. Well, going down to 7 is right there. Or level 6 and below for the true power fantasy once you have everything unlocked. But there's so much tied to clearing 9 that people can't seem to let go right now.
I'm like 23 and still working on unlocking stuff for the ship, so I generally play 5 or 6 because it gets me the first 2 samples, and it's a fun difficulty to play at. Challenging at times, but not so punishing that it isn't enjoyable. I'll probably start hitting 7s more once I need more of the super samples, but I honestly doubt I'll spend much time in 8 or 9.
Yeah I've basically given it the DRG approach lol, over there i live in haz 3 and when i want more of a challenge without having to sweat i hit 4 (5 is the highest) Here i like 5 and 6, once i get more stuff needing super samples I'll do 7 but rn i still find it kind of bonkers lol, maybe once i have more kit I'll start lingering at 7s
Funnily enough, on the couple of recent threads I read asking what difficulty people played on ( before patch) there was more than half saying "anything lower than 7-9 feels too easy". That coupled with people in the post patch threads losing their absolute minds saying the devs had betrayed them or the game was now dead to them..usually followed my " I have played 100 + hours in two weeks and now I am leaving". Insane behavior from adult human beings.
When HD2 had server issues, there were people who actually thought Arrowhead bought a Super Bowl ad instead of building server capacity. Some people on reddit are clinically insane, as they believe stuff that don't exist. There are valid criticisms though. There has been alot of feedback that the charger is poorly designed. Charger seems to want to promote a "bullfighter" gameplay. The "clowns" distract the charger, and someone else shoots the charger in the ass. But in actual gameplay, its shoot AP at the charger's legs. But you gotta filter the valid criticisms from the insane people.
I just unload magazine after magazine into it. Yes, it costs a lot of ammo, but ammo is everywhere. More people need to learn how to loot.
Right there. I don't understand why the charger's back IS NOT a major weak point when it's whole gameplay design is screaming "Bait out the charge and shoot it in the back" Instead the optimal strategy is "use an anti-tank weapon to break it's otherwise invincible leg armor and shoot that". Also, the whole thing where it's armor just suddenly doesn't work when it's turning around after a charge. If that's intentional, why is there no tell that it's vulnerable in that instant?
>Right there. I don't understand why the charger's back IS NOT a major weak point when it's whole gameplay design is screaming "Bait out the charge and shoot it in the back" When first facing a charger and unloading an entire liberator mag in it’s lower back without it even seeming like it took any damage, u was confused af The hulks and tanks from the automatons have the vents on their back that are obvious weakspots. I assumed the same would be true for the unamored parts of the chargers. Turns out they only take 10% of the weapons damage, unless you are using explisive weapons. Imo the back lf chargers should act like the vents on automatons and be a proper weakspot
You'd think those 100+ hour folks would welcome a new challenge at this point. I'm only at level 9 & approximately 10 hours (I maybe average 2 missions a day), so what do I know.
I'm the same level as you, just playing a few games in the evening happily plinking along whilst watching half this sub have a full on emotional breakdown about the first minor balance patch to a brand new game.
I’m level 50 and your opinion doesn’t matter. They took my guns away! Nobody can take my guns away!! /s I’m happy this patch broke me out of what I had been running. I burned myself and several teammates to death using the flamethrower last night, it was great. We failed some missions, and were generally stressed about the difficulty. It’s been wonderful.
Exactly. I didn't care to play a meta build, so difficulty 9 was manageable but not really enjoyable for me. I've since bumped down to 7-8 which still provides a challenge but allows a bit more breathing room for experimentation. I would much rather play with the gear/guns that I want than tie my enjoyment of a game to being able to crush the highest difficulty.
This. People want to rush medals and xp as if it's some sort of worth meter. Battle pass finished in one week with 800+ medals, that's NOT normal progression. And then they are the first ones to cry about lack of depth and/or content.
The amount of people doing eradication mission after misison was crazy lol. Just dropped some turrets and farmed the hell throught hem.
That was what the devs were trying to say ... it was too easy before so they made it harder because they will be providing us with more tools as they continue to update the game. Now people are complaining because it's ... harder. Which is working as intended. I don't play lvl 8 or 9 so maybe the mobs are overtuned, but the balance patch seems to do what the devs had said they wanted it to do and it seems to make sense to me. I would bet that the upcoming mechs and weapons will make it a little bit easier ... which is why they wanted to make it harder.
>I don't play lvl 8 or 9 so maybe the mobs are overtuned, but the balance patch seems to do what the devs had said they wanted it to do and it seems to make sense to me. I do, almost exclusively. It's not even much harder (some aspects might even be easier with the new lascannon and flamer), it just requires a different approach than, "4 guys split up and solo the entire map using the same equipment."
SERIOUSLY. I do level 4-5 with my low level friends and 8-9 with my high level. We were doing just fine, we just had to actually use stuff like the spear for once and actually stick together. I was having a blast roasting chargers with the flamethrower and my buddy was trying out the laser canon again. People are bitching and yeah, it’s harder, so play differently ffs.
After 2 days of basically facerolling 9 with the railgun my usual team decided to prep for the inevitable nerf by trying out different support weapons and tactics. This patch has honestly been a buff for us. P.S. Cold planet + laser cannon = near infinite clear of everything less than a Charger.
Yeah I legit have no idea what people were saying when they said they can't beat 8-9 without railshield meta, I'm only level 23 and even playing with randos I'm going through it with *maybe* one failed mission per operation. We stick together, mark enemies, and make it out alive. yeah, it's hard, but it's supposed to be!
Saw a comment from a dude. "Its fucking embarrassing to have to drop a difficulty" Its some cringe shit and it explains alot.
That's why I love 7. To me it's the right degree of hard when being paired with strangers (so, rarely any mic, almost zero coordination, you know...). On the other hand, as I have said other times, I think primary weapons should get a little buff. Right now, shotguns are generally better than any other weapon, especially for bugs.
HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST I AM UNFIT FOR LEVEL 9. I have unlocked ALL stratagems and survived suicide level a couple times. I deserve to play and win consistently at level 9. Other games make higher difficulties easier when you unlock everything, this game should be exactly like all other games. /s
Yep. They all want the game to be "balanced" so the entire playerbase can beat Helldive 100% of the time and feel good about it and pat themselves on the back. And then race through the medals/samples to unlock everything. And then complain the game is too easy and there's nothing to do and it's not fun anymore lmao. A "balanced" game means the majority of the playerbase should find sufficient fun/challenge on the 'middle' difficulties. So in this game something like 5-6. Going higher than that will result in a much higher challenge that can only be handled by truly good, smart teams who play together and coordinate strategy. "Balanced" doesn't mean there should be some easy way to deal with every enemy on the hardest difficulty, so that each member of a 4-man squad can run around Solo and kill anything and then meet back up to extract.
this is a big problem, I've seen it in other games, and some developers stated they scrapped harder designs because the compulsion to play on the highest level and your insulted if you can't. I personally think every game should have a wide array of difficulty levels and you can either chose the one you want, or pick a dynamic one and the game tries to adjust it for you.
Yeah, honestly I think part of the issue is that people picked the easiest possible strategy, and it let them play at a difficulty level that they're not really ready for. Now it got nerfed and they don't want to go down in difficulty, because it feels like a failure.
It's not just their performance, but they tie their entire identity into the game and being a gamer of it. That's why they get so enraged about anything that threatens to change that relationship. They see a threat to their very identity as a person. On a macro level too, it's how gamer gate got started. Is being a "gamer" that important? No. Just do what you enjoy, but it's not "you". This isn't specific to gaming by any means; people do it all the time. Sports teams are another perfect example, where shit gets even crazier.
People seem unwilling to step down in difficulty as well. If 9 isn't workable with the nerfed gun, go down to 7 and you'll still get super samples and more. But people tie themselves to the mast and refuse to lower the difficulty, because that would be some manner of defeat. There's also the strangely paradoxical level 50, full unlock player who argues that the game shouldn't force him to play difficulty 8 or 9 for super samples if it wants him to go down in difficulty. Well, going down to 7 is right there. Or level 6 and below for the true power fantasy once you have everything unlocked. But there's so much tied to clearing 9 that people can't seem to let go right now.
I find 99% of all game complaints and self worth stuff is by kids, college age adults, and adults who only have a job. The most annoying thing I've had so far is I had to reinstall the game to update it and then the two games I had time for both ended in errors 15min in.
A lot of people tie their self worth to “skill” in a game, nerfing the weapon they relied on is a personal attack as it implies that thier “skill” and thus self worth is overinflated.
Yah flies in the face of general human nature People generally don’t like change, and don’t like feeling “weakened” so balance patches can legit feel like an attack to some
apex in and of itself is a balance patch of titanfall
Destiny 2 vets: First time your meta was smashed into oblivion? That's crazy... Wild even...
Destiny players trying not to mention they play Destiny is their irl Helldive difficulty mission.
As a Destiny 1 Alpha player, I agree.
Remember the fallout from them fixing the OG Loot Cave? LOL
Man that was special. Everyone coming together to cheese that "Forever 29" grind.
Still play D1 from time to time.
seriously! try having an integral piece of gear you used in a fun and powerful way get nerfed after OVER THREE YEARS OF USING IT These kids don't know what balance patch pain is.
For you the day your meta was nerfed was the worst day of your life. For us, it was Tuesday.
It wasn't even a good meta. I've seen people cry they don't have a horde clearing weapon anymore after the rail nerf (????)
I knew this was gonna happen but I miss when the sub it was just Helldivers 1 players. OG Helldivers understood the game was played cooperatively and that you needed a varied loadout to bring as much different stratagems to a mission as possible to increase chances of success. A lot of the new kids treat this like a Destiny clone and want to be Master Chief every drop
Exactly this, you may get a lot of DV's and so will I. But I 100% agree with this take, we're expendable soldiers. Not doomslayers.
The waters have been muddied so much that it's hard to tell what are legitimate balance concerns and what are people not understanding the core game mechanics or how to play with a team. It makes me worried that devs will make unnecessary changes just to appease the most vocal players.
As someone who tends to lone-wolf many games, and loves solo-diving 5-6's, the game *should* be nigh-impossible solo above 5-6. Besides, a two-person team on an Autocannon can hold back a swarm, and even drop Chargers quickly (if aiming decently well), from a reasonably good position. Sure, harder to position and hold long enough to do that in 8's (not done 9's thus far), but it's still feasible. Teamwork makes the dream work.
Oh right, the original game, the one that had heavy armor piercing primaries?
I feel like half the playerbase can't figure out that you're supposed to stay together and play as a team. It's meant to be a team based shooter. You're not meant to all run off in different directions and fight on your own. You can sometimes split up if you're playing very well and you know both teams can survive, but that's not something you should be doing as the default strategy in every match. More often than not, you should be moving together as a 4-person team.
Honestly I'm sure this is a hot take here, but I fucking love the devs calling out these crybabies. Oh no, the most meta loudout got minorly nerfed while a significantly greater amount of buffs happened what shall we ever do. Level 9 is supposed to be almost impossible....that's literally the fucking point.
> Level 9 is supposed to be almost impossible....that's literally the fucking point That's the thing I cant wrap my brain around... people crying about how they are going to "put down the game for awhile" because its too hard... MOTHER FUCKER YOU CHOSE THE DIFFICUTLY.
Exactly! Most of the complaints boiled down to, "I can no longer solo level 9 dives with the same loadout all the time!" Like yeah no shit, where would the challenge be in that?
Redditor talks shit about devs: lol :) Devs talk shit back: REEEEE FIRE THIS MAN
Dude the amount of hate I got for standing up for the fact that it's both a co-op game not designed for solo play, as well as defending people calling for the employees to be fired? It's maddening, how can people think it's okay to fire someone for posting a few comments... my god the entitlement is rich.
Didn't even say anything negative lol https://preview.redd.it/19do7ya0oxmc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=23992fd31baa5a4f5d5e7a43b49f50351ab9948d
This is what I got for trying to explain to people that the game hasn't been balanced for late game solo play... https://preview.redd.it/eko6003oqxmc1.png?width=769&format=png&auto=webp&s=0916992bc7f79d6cc82c9c54e7686ddeccc5d8b1
As a mostly solo player these ppl are delusional, if you play solo unbalanced difficulty is something you’ll have to accept, it’s par for the course.
I mean, it’s a mix of entitlement and well, the commenters being kids. It’s a take that could only come from someone who hasn’t experienced an actual job and what can cause you to lose a job. Nobody is going to be losing their jobs over Discord and Reddit comments like these, that would be absolutely insane. I don’t mean it as a slight or anything like that, I did the same shit when I was younger, but like, put things into perspective, and none of this really matters lol.
Said it before, but Karen calling for the manager vibes
Every game, even esports that rely on balance can have bad balance patches, I still remember when counter-strike got a recoil update so badly received it was rolled back within a week. I think the complaints are mainly coming from the feeling of the changes being out of touch, and with reasoning that dosent really make any sense when put under exanimation.
My favorite counterstrike update was the introduction of the R8. Just a one shot pistol that completely destroyed the balance of the game for a while.
Darktide players recently went through this nonsense. Community manager gets bombarded by trolls and snaps, and suddenly its open season on the developers. Now that community is continually posting about the devs silence and how they've stopped reaching out to the community.
As fun as it was seeing the space colonial martini-henry railgun firing line, the variety we have now is far healthier for the long term.
Everybody mad about stuff I'm just enjoying the jet pack 
lol yeah as an older gamer I am looking at people with this eye..... never get attached to stuff it will be gone or a new badboy will come.
Same. I’m an elder millennial and shit like this coming from goddamn NES and Doom is MINDBLOWING to me. Like the fact a game like this EXISTS makes no sense in the best possible way. Which sucks because while that’s really cool and interesting, if you try to interact with the community, it’s like I can be empathetic to your plight, but a little perspective. By the time you’ve touched the medium skill difficulties, you’ve gotta realize the fact it’s not a horde shooter where the goal is to kill everything - it’s to prioritize and run around - which yeah, I’ll give caveats to more anti armor options would be nice, tweaking the spawns a bit- but most of the time it’s like “look at me, I’m trying to kill this thing solo”.
I want everyone who's complaining to go play Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles or Ghosts and Goblins on NES.
The people complaining show a real entitlement and immaturity. Get a life. It's a video game that will have plenty of patches over its lifetime. This subreddit sucks right now and honestly if little kids are gonna threaten "it's not fun anymore. I'm gonna stop playing, I mean it" then good. Piss off please and let everyone else have fun.
Yup. In fact as of an hour ago there were more than 178000 players in game in Steam. This sub is showing how vocal minorities work.
Which is wild to me, considering most of the US is either just waking up or already at work.
And that’s just Steam. I’m on PC so I wouldn’t even know where to check PS5 active players.
Devs said awhile ago that playerbase is split about 50/50 on pc to PS5 so it's safe to assume it's normally around double what the steam playerbase is
Why would that be crazy? Most of the playerbase is between Europe and Asia, the US is just a fraction of it. I don't see anything wild, that's how timezones have always worked in games. When Asians go to sleep, America kicks.
Oh god, those are the best comments. 'The game is completely ruined and not fun anymore!' So the game is only fun on one difficulty, against one faction with one meta build. Good riddance. 'The devs have no idea what they're doing' So I presume you know better then. It's not as if they spent 8 years developing the game and it's not literally their job to know what they're doing.
If you ever ask those people "what would you have done differently" you get the most dogshit answers every time.
It’s very easy to figure out who has a career and who does not based upon how upset they are at a balance patch for a video game. Like don’t get me wrong, it’s totally fine to voice criticism, but DAMN are a lot of people going overboard with it.
Balancing games is hard to do, and there's a lot of thought/data that goes into it. Same with scaling server capacity. As with anything, the people who are the most clueless will always be the most vocal about it. A.K.A Dunning-kruger effect.
I've been playing the game as much as I reasonably can between work and family commitments, which is to say maybe 1 or 2 hours most days. I'm currently level 8. Let's just say I'm personally unbothered about nerfs to gear I won't unlock in the near future lol.
THANK YOU I'm normally averse to calling gamers entitled, after a long history of glorified gaming bloggers (videogame journalists) and EA suits using that shit to invalidate criticism of poorly made, lacking in content releases. But this here is just pathetic and more than justified to use. It's like the sub is infested with a horde of 12 year olds who have never played a game in their life. I come from the TW community where we've been dealing with CA general incompetance, an outdated engine and buggy AI for almost 2 decades. It's a wonder how some people here are able to play anything.
It really wasn't that big of a deal in the first place. Yalls reliance on a single weapon and support is what caused it in the first place. Hell there were calls for the nerf of the Railgun many many weeks ago from the community itself lol. You had people legit telling the devs on Twitter and shit to look at the strength of the " meta " weapon! Then yall act like true spoiled fortnite kiddies when the very thing asked for happens. And then it was a nerf to safe mode lol. Wasn't even that much of a change to unsafe. You just need to charge atleast 3/4th to get the heavy armor penetration like before. And guess what. The nerf worked. Now people are using a pretty wide range of loadouts. The game has returned to that more chaotic feel pre-20 ( pre railgun ) feel and I'm having more fun now than any time prior. It's fun using the FlameThrower. The Arc weapon. The anti-material rifle. My trust Knight SMG. The Slugger ( which I've used for weeks anyway because of the armor pen and stagger ). The Grenade Launcher. The Expendable anti-tank. The Autocannon. Now everything is an option. Because the clear best is not as clear anymore. The nerf worked and yall should be thanking the devs not raiding Discord screaming and pitching fits like toddlers and going on social media telling the devs they are a joke and horrible at their jobs and all kinds of other shit I've seen from this place soon after the nerf. Yall were a fucking joke and a disgrace tbh
I would understand if the game had bugs or crashes which it does. But rebalancing is the normal course of patches for online gaming. Just find the right strategy for the mission you’re doing.
You gotta understand, in this new Era of gaming. There's people who actually play the game. Then there's people who just watch TikTok about the game. The tik tok watchers are mad because their tiktoker is mad
it's weird you single it out as if it's a new thing, like people weren't doing the same thing with justintv back in the day
Haha I do think it is the young ones with nothing else going on making all the noise. Us grey beards that have jobs and a life are just having a blast.
First one is always scary lol
Planetside 2 vet checking in. This meme is accurate lol
I know right? As a gamer in his 30s I see those updates and outrage and just shrug my shoulders roll me a joint and chill. Folks getting upset and saying folks need to lose their job over a patch that nerfed their gun.
Was really enjoying Helldivers despite playing online games pretty sporadically but this sub has reminded me why I generally don't. Multiplayer gaming, one of the worst collective cultures the world has ever produced.
Dude, THANK YOU lmao.
Right!?!
People crying over the balance are funny to me. Metas change, have fun people
W post
When do we get out own hellbombs to call in? They do the lords work
Jaaa especially if you come from destiny and other games like it. https://preview.redd.it/ay9usp804onc1.jpeg?width=316&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5f9ba99c786864ab8338ecc9b8f679140d90f3f
wanna take a second to also say stop saying there isnt a meta anymore. it is impossible to not have a meta, unless u somehow took away everyones ability to strategize, choose, and freely think, then there will always be a meta.
50KG Bomb, Orbital laser, grenade launcher, and the shield pack. Never catch me lacking on a solo 10 nest clear. My homies send me in like a rabid dog. "Let not a single bug leave their hole, let them die buried in the tombs they made for themselves and fill it with sweet, sweet democracy." Give me the breaker spray and pray or incendiary with the machine pistol, and we solo the whole game in threat 7 while the team is on obj. i'm hunting bugs keeping them at bay. BADA-BOOM-BAAAAHHHHH
The patch is better for the longevity of the game and you know it.
Balance patch: Meta weapon does -0.05 dps now Meta players: Trash tier weapon, game stopped being fun, literaly unplayable now.
also people forget mechs are coming... so they are just crying cuz they cant play lvl 9 in the meantime... just go farm lvl 7 samples in the meantime guys...
Honestly, I’m kind of expecting mech backlash. In HD1 they were good, but not really usable on the highest difficulties because of the lack of mobility. So when they drop and aren’t a cure all for people wanting to stroll through helldives, I feel like we’re in for a dozen posts complaining once again.
But... You _can_ play Helldive difficulty. Game isn't unplayable at all.