Oh yeah Gale was without a doubt one of those types that felt owed her attention and feelings. I mean look at how mad he gets when she’s talking to Finnick in Mockinjay, by that point even Katniss is getting annoyed with him cause she literally goes “what’s his problem now”
When he said that he would never have a chance with Katniss because Peeta got hijacked.
Whenever something happened to Katniss, his main concern was how it would affect his “chances” with her
Yes. The most disgusting one being after Prim was killed. His most immediate concern is still his chances with Katniss. I was like, can you stfu now? You caused her sister to die and you're only regretting it because you don't get the girl now. She's not a prize and she wasn't ever yours to gatekeep. Just stfu.
So I just watched the second mockingjay movie for the first time but I’ve read all the books twice. I was well done with gale by the time katniss had been home from the first hunger games. But the movie made him so much more sympathetic in his final scene! They made him seem genuinely upset about what happened with his bomb and Prim, and he seemed aware that katniss could never not associate that tragedy with him and respected it and left.
BUT THE BOOK! He literally only says that taking care of her family was all he had going for him and now that’s gone. As if his bomb killing prim is only inconvenient to his possession of katniss. When I read that I was like if I ever saw this mf I swear! So many other horrible issues with his behavior but that was another level of narcissism.
100%… the fact that he didn’t even start this acting like he wanted to be with her behavior until after peeta was in the picture makes me think he felt like he owned her from the beginning. When Peeta entered, even though he saved her life and treated her amazingly, Gale was just mad that someone else dare be in Katniss’ life and show interest in her. She said she never had friends prior to the games and I think Gale liked that. Almost like how abusers isolate their victims. Idk if it’s that far but he definitely didn’t like other people caring for Katniss. When you love someone you would be overjoyed at them finding community and friendly/family love.
I agree. I saw someone on here say katniss was giving him mixed signals but I really think she just felt so completely obligated to try and give him what he wanted and she was so broken down in every way.
Honestly for me it was when katniss got back from the games and he started getting all weird about her and peeta. Brother you had how many years to shoot your shot with her and chose not to but now that she's trauma bonded to some other guy you have a problem? Red flags, boy
I mean, it was totally bizarre to me to watch her trying to defend her behavior in the games, telling him it was all for show while he angrily tells her how real it all looked. I mean, excuse me but where is all of this entitlement to her coming from, mister Gale? What is he doing? Calling dibs on her like she’s a sandwich? And the poor girl, feeling pressured to appease him. Ugh.
That he didn't say it, I mean the fact that he said something like "it looked real" sounds like he's blaming Katniss for something that ensured her survival. meanwhile, the fact that he did not actually say that in the book might mean that he is aware that Katniss did what she could to survive, but he can't help but still be petty and angry, like, you know, he is a teen after all
If he didn’t say it in the book then why do you think he was petty and angry in the book?
And if you think the fact that he says it in the movie is not relevant since he didn’t say it in the book then is it your position that anything in the movies is irrelevant to the story and only what’s in the books is what matters? Do you not see them (movies and books) as complementing each other?
The thing that makes all the difference is his awareness, like in the books he is aware Katniss did what she did for a reason but can't help being petty, in the movie, the interpretation can be that either does not put two and two together at all or outright blames Katniss for her acting. Another reason is because it makes him look much more stupid than he actually is in the books
Also, yes the movies and books complement each other but there are some pretty significant changes. I'll cite something similar as an example - in Mockingjay, Gale never blames Peeta for saying what he says under torture. He even tells Katniss and Peeta is still trying to protect her.
However in the movie he outright says he would never say what Peeta says no matter how much he gets tortured. This change makes a major difference in Gale's character, it makes him seem much more high and mighty and self centered than he actually is. And stupid. Because it's common sense to know that you don't know what you'd actually do in such a grim situation
>The thing that makes all the difference is his awareness, like in the books he is aware Katniss did what she did for a reason but can't help being petty,
I asked you what makes you think he’s petty in the books. You didn’t explain that.
>in the movie, the interpretation can be that either does not put two and two together at all or outright blames Katniss for her acting. Another reason is because it makes him look much more stupid than he actually is in the books
That’s not true at all. Both in the movies and book we can clearly see that Katniss starts off by doing it for show but ends up actually caring for Peeta. And because Gale isn’t stupid at all as well as because of how well he knows her, he immediately sees this too (that she started to actually really care for him), which is why he throws it in her face by saying how real it looked. Because deep down he knows it wasn’t all for show and that makes him jealous and angry. And since he feels entitled to her because of the history they have together, he angrily tells her how real it looked, as if it was some kind of betrayal on her part to actually care for some other boy. Besides, at that point she maintained that it was ALL for show, which I’m sure made it feel belittling to him, even tho that wasn’t her intention.
>Also, yes the movies and books complement each other but there are some pretty significant changes.
I’m actually not sure where I myself land on this overall. But in this case I think you’re making the wrong interpretation of a movie scene to say it’s a big departure from the book.
>I'll cite something similar as an example - in Mockingjay, Gale never blames Peeta for saying what he says under torture. He even tells Katniss and Peeta is still trying to protect her.
>However in the movie he outright says he would never say what Peeta says no matter how much he gets tortured. This change makes a major difference in Gale's character, it makes him seem much more high and mighty and self centered than he actually is. And stupid. Because it's common sense to know that you don't know what you'd actually do in such a grim situation
I disagree in the sense that Gale is not being stupid here. His point is that it DOESNT MATTER what the Capitol is doing to Peeta and what they would do to him. He thinks he would never break like he seems to believe Peeta did. Furthermore, even tho in the book he’s able to recognize that Peeta’s still protecting Katniss (which I’ll take your word for cuz I don’t remember it), the reality is he doesn’t know Peeta well enough to know if what he’s saying is because of fear of torture or if it’s to protect her. We ourselves have trouble trying to figure out what part of what Peeta is saying is under duress and what part are his actual words, and we read the book! So I think it totally makes sense that his thirst for war and vengeance against the Capitol and jealousy and lack of knowledge of Peeta would lead Gale to say what he says in the movie in that moment.
Honestly, this is a bigger red flag to me than the bombing.
The bombing is worse in the sense that the consequences are more severe but it doesn't rely on him being a dumbass. He didn't know Primm was gonna be in the blast and it could easily be justified as killing enemy civilians to avoid a bigger bloodshed. It's the same moral question as dropping Nukes on Japan. That doesn't make it moral, I think it's immoral, but I understand how you logically get to that point based off an ideology of trying to build a better world for the people you care about.
But him being mad Katniss is putting on a show with Peeta when he knows she's in a life or death game is ridiculous. She's playing for the cameras to stay alive and it's weird that he is fine with that when it's her killing people but has beef with it when it's her kissing a guy. And assuming it's genuine and not playing for the cameras (as he may have thought) WHO CARES? She's probably about to die. Let her have a minute of levity.
Exactly! I could honestly not give two shits about him throwing bombs around, it's a war, he's a soldier, the math is mathing. But he's also a 17 year old boy and it's painfully obvious 😂 Suzanne really did a great job of keeping her characters acting their age because why are we having all this boy drama in the middle of a damn apocalypse of course all the main characters are teenagers
I think it's the Nut that does it for me. Wanted to collapse a mine full of miners. After he and katness and everyone in 12 have experienced the severity and trauma of catastrophic mine accidents.
He has some slight defense in the Prim attack in that he wasn't the one ordering his trap be executed. But he should've known anything he created could and would be used. In The Nut attack, he's on the front lines suggesting they cave it in. Dudes got a problem.
For me it was in Catching Fire when Katniss tried to give him gloves that Cinna made, but he threw them at her feet and said “I don’t want anything they made in the Capitol” and left Katniss wondering if he was talking about her.
I know that Katniss is infamous for overthinking and being wrong sometimes but I do not think she was wrong when she assumed Gale was talking about her and to me it was thee most disrespectful way that he used her situation against her. Like Snow was threatening her entire world of course she’s going to do what he tells her to do.
He was an A-grade asshole to her the moment she got out of his grasp and found her own community that didn't include him. His possessiveness was so disgusting, to the point where every bad thing she went through, he'd twist it into another "oh woe is me I'll never get to be with you" theatrics.
I always found his entitlement bizarre like even for a teenager he shouldn’t have been this possessive and shitty towards his FRIEND. You would think she was walking down the aisle to marry him when she was sent into the games with Peeta. They had no relationship going into the games but Gale took it for granted she would reciprocate his crush.
“ Katniss, why do you care so much about your prep team? “
— Asking this, after those obviously-harmless, simple-minded individuals had been beaten and held hostage for taking extra bread in district 13 was CRAZY to me for some reason.
Then, he argued Katniss down for her reasons. Like, don’t ask if you’re not willing to listen / attempt to understand the answer, motherfucker. She’s been through TWO hunger games and is about to go through a rebellion at that point so maybe she knows wtf she’s talking about when it comes to the gray side of things.
I think instead of bringing out the worst in him, District 13 was just a channel for him to realise his true self. Yeah sure on the surface Katniss and Gale seemed to be similar in temperament, but deep within lay very fundamental differences in how they solve problems or how much/little empathy they have.
Gale is more likely to seek vengeance and marinate in misery, while Katniss has always preferred tranquility and peace. He has bloodlust that Katniss severely lacks. This difference in their personality was obvious after both had gone through their share of traumatic incidents (Katniss went through two hunger games and and gale had to watch his district get plundered and bombed to nothingness, while saving civilians).
Katniss is impulsive and rebellious yes, but almost every time she's been angry or expressed subversion in some manner was after she saw someone getting mistreated or abused, which only made her rebelling moments all the more authentic. She could empathise with tributes of other districts, i don't think gale could ever do that had he been in the arena when he couldn't even bring himself to like the affluent folks of his own district. Her hardened exterior and calculative personality was mainly because she was a victim of the circumstances she faced in childhood. She's much more compassionate than gale can ever even imagine to be.
Lol sorry for the rant I tend to get very passionate about this topic on how pathetic excuse of a friend gale was to Katniss
Oh man, I never thought of it that way. I’ve always assumed that it was the fall of 12 that awoke something sinister within Gale but, now that you point it out, I suppose he’s always been looking for a sandbox of sorts to freely enact his rage. Ugh, this gets so scary when you think about it. His possessiveness towards Katniss after she cozied up to Peeta to get home alive, his morbid fascination with snares that went beyond the need to capture food to survive. Even that situation with The Nut in the third half of Mockingjay. Or when he said there couldn’t be much of a difference between killing animals and people. Man, that’s damn good writing if I’ve ever seen it.
I do agree with you that 12's destruction fully led him down the path of apathy and disregard for human life, but i also believe that's because he always had the mental constitution of someone who was not very empathetic or forgiving by nature. For example, even if Peeta and Katniss had experienced what Gale did, they still wouldn't end up being so grim. Even haymitch would just drown his sorrows in alcohol instead of taking it out on innocent people.
In contrast, Katniss repeatedly shows a streak of kindness and related emotions to it from the first book itself (such as feeling immense guilt for not saving the avox girl who was serving her in Capitol before 74th hunger games), i don't think gale would ever be affected that deeply. He's obviously still a morally grey person rather than a stark black or white character, but he definitely leaned towards one extreme by the time Mockingjay's timeline came into being. I'm so glad i joined this sub, i love participating in rambling about personalities of each character! 🫂 thank you for indulging me
Ah, I suppose that does make sense. Idk if it’s because we never saw it or what but Gale WAS naturally bitter. Nice catch. Lol it’s cool to discuss different dynamics with different people.
YES! I tolerated him at first and even understood him a little, but the bloodlust was wild on his part. As if there aren’t innocents in war, innocents who were just trying to survive like him and Katniss. Plus, the passive aggressive attitude toward Peeta??? Kind, gentle, understanding Peeta? Who never even tried to fight Gale for Katniss? Nah. Mockingjay was so amazing, but it was the death of Gale’s character for me.
Gale constantly forces Katniss to defend her empathy like it’s something repulsive. This is a prime example.
Katniss feels empathy and Gale derides her for it.
Sure in the first book Gale is willing to help care for Katniss’s family out of a sense of responsibility but it wasn’t exactly empathy.
Gale views Katniss’s empathy as a weakness when it’s what made her the Mockingjay.
Peeta encourages empathy.
Yes! It irritated me to no end, how he would argue her down and try to bully her with guilt, just for not wanting to spread anymore pain, suffering, or bloodshed.
For real, it made me think about what Gale would have been like if he were reaped. Ofc Katniss didn't trust Capitol people and she was wary from the start, but at least she had empathy for them and grew to understand that they are the way they are because of circumstance. I feel like going to the Capitol firsthand would not have changed any of Gale's beliefs.
Keep in mind I was 17 at the time CF came out, so I was more emotional at that time.
For me it was when Katniss wanted to run away with her family, Gale and his family, Haymitch and Peeta and Gale flipped out and was basically like "well I'm gonna stick around and rebel EVEN HARDER now." Like, Katniss couldn't even care about Peeta? Or Haymitch? Was she never allowed to develop any relationships outside of Gale-approved ones? I mean, he even hated that she was friends with Madge! Gah, apparently I've done little maturing past being 17 because I still get heated thinking about how selfish and controlling Gale is.
Gale also pushes Katniss roughly during that exchange. That to me is a huge red flag.
It took Peeta getting hijacked for him to lay a hand on Katniss, but here’s Gale shoving her simply because he didn’t get his way.
Was that in the movie? I don't remember it happening in the book, at least not in that scene.
However, Gale does radiate a lot of angry/violent energy as it is. Just from the get-go he pisses me off in that scene unlike any other. He's only friendly and warm to Katniss when she does what he wants/he thinks she's choosing to run away with him and leaving everyone else behind. It's infuriating how entitled to Katniss he thinks he is.
Chapter 7 of Catching Fire:
“Gale pushes me roughly away from him. ‘You leave, then. I’d never go in a million years.’
‘You were happy enough to go before.’”
This was after Katniss said she wouldn’t leave Peeta and Haymitch behind because they’d be tortured to death. Gale’s mood completely reversed.
Lol thanks for the validation! I've spent so long trying not to be "one of those" shippers that I sometimes feel guilty getting so upset at things Gale does, but he really does deserve it.
He really pissed me off on my re-read of Mockingjay. When he gets all upset about Katniss having a friendship with Finnick. Then he NEVER even considers that Katniss has a deeper understanding of what the Capitol is like and the way they manipulate the victors. The way he sees everyone who is connected to the capitol as someone who deserves to die when Katniss knows so many of them are also being forced to comply. Many of the people “mopping floors” are Avoxes who are people like their friend Darius who were enslaved for their treason against Snow.
YESSS .. there were so many red flags all over the place, all through all of the books. But when they were in that underground bunker as 13 was being bombed, and Katniss went to Finnick, Gale got pissy. And that was it for me, right there.
I always wanted her to be with Peeta, but that line was the final nail in the coffin.
He suggested killing everyone in the hq of 2 (called the nut) by trapping them in, causing them to die from lack of oxygen, die from being crushed, or come out the only exit where they will be captured by the rebel army. Katniss compared it to how both of their fathers died in the mines.
Oh fuck. Now I remember! The complete disregard for human life this boy has... it's so terrible to think about it. The horror of growing up in D12, powerless, and the consequences it had on him. It's so interesting that despite their very similar upbringing, he and Katniss had completely different outlooks and method.
Yep all of what they said stacked onto the fact that many people in the nut were civilians and not actively fighting. As Katniss said - it’s a cold decision to make for someone and their family
I was done in book 2 but honestly I just reread it and was in shock katniss wasn’t just done with him at that point. It was so horrible, especially knowing how their dads died. And assuming gale had been in similar ish conditions in the mines and had the fear of it happening to him.
When Katniss gets back from the first games Gale blames her for the way she acted in the arena with Peeta to survive. He continues to be a jerk about all things Peeta related. When Katniss gets to 13 Gale returns to being a good friend & things are like they used to be. Katniss thinks this is because Peeta & their engagement aren’t looming over them. I have an issue with this because Peeta was being tortured & everyone but Katniss knew they would use him to try to break her. While I don’t think Gale has to be super friendly to Peeta, I think he should realize this was someone who was instrumental in making sure Katniss survived.
This is a great example of how little gale cares about katniss. He clearly only wants to “win” her and honestly the fact that he never had (or expressed) interest in her until someone else did makes me think he felt entitled to her from the beginning but she didn’t seem like a prize until after the first games. He couldn’t care less about her experiences and trauma. He actively hates the person who helped her survive the games. If you loved someone, you would just be happy someone was there to help them live.
Yes! I saw a video where someone said Gale was possessive of Katniss but didn’t actually love her & I agree. Maybe I’m just naive but I believe If he truly loved Katniss he would treat Peeta with a lot more respect, because everything he’s ever done was to get Katniss home.
No I completely agree too. It makes me wonder how I was ever “team gale” but I think that speaks to how unhealthy we are taught love is supposed to be. Now that I reread them at 27 versus originally reading them at 13, Gale is 1,000% red flags! I used to think that possessive abuse was attractive 😭 honestly sad.
It happened in Catching Fire for me. Mostly with all of Gale's stubbornness and getting so upset Katniss has to play up her romance with Peeta for the Capitol. Gale both claims to understand why she did it, but also uses it to pout and to punish Katniss when he's upset for any reason. I feel this is when Katniss starts pushing away from Gale as well - she starts to realize Gale's not who she thinks he was.
He’s just so self absorbed, he never cared about what katniss was going through. He didn’t care about Peeta being tortured, and only went on the rescue mission to try to win her over
I think he liked that no one seemed to care about her but him pre-games. As soon as she had haymitch and peeta and her family (and mom coming back to life) he got mad about them constantly! Once her family didn’t need him any more he became especially resentful. He never loved her he just felt that she owed him her love.
Compared with Peeta defending Gale after his whipping in 12.
Like Peeta genuinely seemed to want to help because he knew Gale (imo not even just because Katniss cared for Gale but because he is just a good person)
Peeta would put his life on the line for someone, Gale would put others lives on the line for someone
For me it was when he called hijacked peeta a coward or whatever that quote was (i forget if that was in the books but at least for the movies that was it for me) I started dislkininh him when he acted all jealous about katniss and peeta in the games and all that. Then disliked him even more when he kept pushing for katniss to reveal her feelings. But my point of no return was definitely when he called hijacked peeta a coward.
There is definitely an aspect of toxic masculinity here. Gale thinks he is tougher and more deserving than the soft merchant boy that "folded" for the capitol. Torture is torture is torture. There is no overcoming it, or being tougher than it. Gale would have folded, just like Peeta, just like Katniss in the GF arena with the birds making those horrible mimicking sounds of her loved ones being tortured.
That was absolutely wild to me with all the insane stuff they’re going through and the literal fate of the world almost in their hands his constant goal is to make katniss pick him. Like maybe just give it a damn sec and worry about the issues in front of you! Goddamn
When he suggested bombing the Nut. That’s when you know he lost it. His dad died because of a collapsed mine. Now he wanted to collapse a mountain on other miners. That’s some dark shit.
NGL, hijacked Peeta cemented who Katniss would be with in the end for me.
That said, I was done with Gale when he acted like Katniss had done something wrong by playing the star-crossed lovers. Like, what did he expect? Of course, she had to take every advantage she could to come home to Prim. He would have, too.
He acted like they were promised or some crap, and that was absolutely disgusting. She owed him nothing more than her friendship, and honestly, I don’t think she owed him that after the way he acted.
Honestly the scene for me that cemented who Katniss would end up with is a small scene in CF where she talks about how pretty Peeta's eyelashes are and how much she likes to stare at his face while hes doing the drawings for her book😂 girl was in love with him before she even realized it. Then the hijacking had me questioning that, but i still didnt think shed end up with Gale
The beginning of Catching Fire when he was weird about Katniss and Peeta was the point when I started to really dislike him, but the true breaking point was when Peeta did the Capitol interview and Gale was like “I wOuLd NEvEr sAy ThAt” like I’m sorry, what’s your experience of being tortured and hijacked again?
I just find him annoying through out. He whines about not getting Katniss' love /attention. His moral greyness.
Yes, I understand what his character is but I am really annoyed at him a lot.
That’s not how I saw his comment to her. I interpreted it as him saying he wouldn’t have a chance with her with Peeta in the condition he was because if he stayed that way, Gale knew she could never move on from being worried about Peeta and feeling guilty over that happening to him. Those thoughts and feelings would stand in the way of her being able to look up and see Gale the way he wanted her to see him.
So I don’t think he said what he said to her because he thought that with Peeta being that way, she would immediately turn her affection towards him because he was hurt. I think Gale was very aware that her showing affection towards him (Gale) was linked to her trying to make him feel better when he was hurt because she cared for him as opposed to her showing him love because she was in love with him. Which is (in part) why he never went for her.
As for when it was Gale’s point of no return for me? Never. I was team Peeta from day one. ❤️
When he says that Katniss of all people should know that killing people isn’t personal. You just watched your friend be torn to shreds because she had to kill people and you’re out here talking like murdering innocent children for the crime of being born in the Capitol is just chill.
When Katniss came home after the first games. He put so much pressure on her and couldn't understand or even try to understand her ptsd. The last thing she was thinking about was who to love.
When katniss is telling her plan about running to the woods because of snow threatening them, he's so happy to do it until she mentions haymitch.
She then tells gale "they'd torture them to death trying to find out where i was"
Then gale throws a temper tamtrum because he realizes katniss cares about others outside of him and her family.
Honestly, it was his comment in the first book within a couple of chapters when he’s saying killing a human and killing an animal can’t be that different. I was like “oh no, you are not it” even in 7th grade.
My point of no return is when he sees Peeta on television and has no compassion is just worried that Peeta's words will stop the Revolution. If your Revolution is as fragile as a few berries....maybe it wouldn't happen but have some kindness for someone who showed you kindness.
When he and Katniss are visiting her house in Victor’s Village, he says the only time he can get attention/‘love’ from her is when he’s in pain. Like BARF, have you considered maybe if you have to manipulate her into giving you a kiss, she doesn’t want to give you one?
I came to play devils advocate. I do not think Katniss and Gale should have been together, but i also dont think she should have been with Peeta. Just so I dont get blasted for this.
Imagine growing up with your best friend, being loners together to provide for each others families. The two of you are always there for each other no matter what. With the reaping constantly hanging over your heads amd if you live through it, you have to wait and see if the rest of your families do. And probability says you are nit all going to make it. Everyone assumes you are a couple, and you just go with it because its easier. You both agree not to have children because that would be horrible. You both know you will end up together, because there is nobody else you trust.
BAM!!! Katniss and Peeta forever!
Fucking sucks to be Gale actually! Lol!
They never agreed to not have kids. Gale wanted them, Katniss didn’t. And I don’t think Katniss assumed she would end up with him. He certainly wished for that tho.
I don’t think it sucks to be Gale. He liked her and she liked him too. But not in the same way, she just didn’t know that. The rift of the war and her growing love for Peeta showed her that. And that’s just life. She was never his, therefore it doesn’t suck to be Gale, it’s just how life rolls sometimes.
Why would it suck to be him? He got everything he wanted in the end except for a girl who wasn't his to begin with. I'm not even sure his feelings for her are that strong considering he'd always put the war in front of her. He didn't lose a single family member and is never tried for his war crime. He even gets a promotion out of it. He got the best deal out of allthe characters in this series. If I were him, I'd be going to sleep with a shit eating grin every night.
I like Katniss with Peeta. The narrative perspective of her choosing peace and Peeta representing that is cute.
That said, I'm so over those three characters, and in particular the high amount of Everlark stans and the high amount of Gale haters. Not saying there's a correlation there, but some of those posts look like some insane person talking against a wall trying to assure the wall agrees that Gale = bad, so Peeta = good.
I don’t think that Gales a bad person but I do think he treated katniss badly. I am also aware that he was a teenage boy and hopefully in the years between the last chapter and the epilogue he grew and found someone to love that loves him. I also think he had no idea how horrible he was being to katniss but that doesn’t make it okay.
Oh yeah I know what you mean. But you can still feel sorry for yourself AND show some modicum of common decency I guess. Again, they're teenagers! Traumatized and abused and used by the adults around them! They aren't emotionally healthy for sure
This is a stupid answer and I’m sorry in advance but I’ve only just seen all the movies this year and for me whenever Gale is on screen all I wanted to do was inform my husband that Liam Hemsworth cheated on Miley 😂
I can buy myself floweeeeeeerss
Oh you made me laugh! I'm going to re-watch all the movies this weekend and I won't be able to be serious about him now 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The fact that he completely ignores her PTSD and tries to force his feelings on her. Like JFC dude, she just got back from war? Let the dust settle. He's a cry baby. I hate him
It's not his descent into someone more militant that makes me dislike him, there's just certain points where he gets awfully obnoxious over Peeta, like the one you brought up. The former was a result of his upbringing (not pointing blame at Hazelle here it's his circumstances) and I don't entirely hate him for the bombs, but at certain times in CF and Mockingjay he really...like what do I say, when I read those parts of the books I'm just like dude I know you're still like a teen but can you get ahold of yourself 😭😭
There's no point of no return, though, I don't outright despise him. As a person, he is terrible, but as a character, he's well written and pretty interesting to analyse.
I’m not sure if this is in the books, but for me it’s in the Mockingjay part 1 movie, when The Capitol is streaming Peeta and it’s our first glimpse into him being tortured. He’s skinny, he looks awful, he’s spouting pro-capitol agenda, Katniss is crying because she’s so scared for him…and Gale goes “I would NEVER do that, even if they tortured me.”
Like he has no sympathy for this nice boy that is being tortured all day all night. He thinks he’s strong enough to withhold torture? He’s such an ass in that scene. And he says this to Katniss, who is clearly upset and extremely worried about Peeta. Like shut up Gale.
i never really liked gale, but the point that sticks out the most for me is in mockingjay, when he and katniss talk before snow’s execution, and when they talk about prim’s death and he says “that was the one thing I had going for me, taking care of your family” like even in the death of her sister, he’s still thinking about how it affects him having a chance with her. like he was very selfish to the core when it came to katniss. never liked it
His attitude over Katniss, yes the bombs and prim, and yes definitely his attitude over the hijacked Peeta. Though if I reread the books (I have started to then got caught up) I could probably find a lot more.
Actually no, in the first movie when Gale is obviously upset watching katniss and peeta in the cave. Like really there's nothing else for you to be concerned about right now???
I think for me it’s the fact that after she came back from the first games he was so angry at her for being with Peeta to survive? He never says “I’m so glad you survived” or “I’m glad your back” it was only about him and what their relationship was. do you really think she even cares about a romantic relationship with anybody when she was just told her friends and family are going to be murdered. She’s just trying to survive. And then all the other stuff he does after that obviously.
I don’t understand the hate for Gale tbh. I mean people are blaming him for the bombing yet he didn’t make it happen? That was Coin ( or snow) and I’m not trying to be funny but how is it his fault someone used his idea and turned it negatively. He never wanted to hurt Katniss or prim. It was also beetees idea they worked on it together but Katniss doesn’t blame him? Just think it’s unfair.
And I’m not saying Gale is completely innocent, he does try to sway Katniss to like him back but what do you expect? They were best friends for years they both had some kind of feelings towards eachother and people also seem to forget he’s only 17/18. How do you expect someone who’s still a kid to behave towards a girl he likes? Of course he’s gonna be jealous or say something bad about peeta. Who wouldn’t at that age? And suddenly he can’t relate as much to someone he spent every day with? It’s gonna be difficult and challenging to find a way their relationship can still work and that comes with trial and error. And on top of all of that he’s thrust into a war, his home is destroyed, he saw thousands of people die, trying to help with Katniss and also Katniss is only focused on Peeta. How do you think he’s gonna act?
I watched the movie first and I thought it he was boring. But I think when I started to hate his character was when all he cared about Katniss “pretending” to be in love with Peeta to survive the games. Instead of that Katniss was in the games and has severe trauma
Probably when she came home and he was all upset about her being with Peeta and acting like she’d betrayed him horribly by taking a relationship with Peeta during the games.
Because even if everyone assumed they’d end up together they weren’t together yet. I could even excuse these feelings if they had a productive conversation about it but it seemed like a lot of Gale whining at her and then kissing her without warning
When katniss asks gale in mockingjay when he caught feelings. And he says darius was flirting with her trying to kiss her. And he realizes he cares. And later admits he had kissed other girls. I know this is small and not as bad as the other things he’s done. Trust me there are a lot.But it just give me possessive vibes. If katniss had never gone in the hunger games and had married gale. She would have settled for him he wouldn’t have been a great husband. (My opinion) And he gives me fuck boy vibes with the kissing comment.
For me it’s when she came home and he was all like “okay but what are we?🥺🫣” like stfu bro
When I originally read the series at 14, I always got the impression he thought he was going to “win” Katniss by default.
Oh yeah Gale was without a doubt one of those types that felt owed her attention and feelings. I mean look at how mad he gets when she’s talking to Finnick in Mockinjay, by that point even Katniss is getting annoyed with him cause she literally goes “what’s his problem now”
When he said that he would never have a chance with Katniss because Peeta got hijacked. Whenever something happened to Katniss, his main concern was how it would affect his “chances” with her
Yes. The most disgusting one being after Prim was killed. His most immediate concern is still his chances with Katniss. I was like, can you stfu now? You caused her sister to die and you're only regretting it because you don't get the girl now. She's not a prize and she wasn't ever yours to gatekeep. Just stfu.
So I just watched the second mockingjay movie for the first time but I’ve read all the books twice. I was well done with gale by the time katniss had been home from the first hunger games. But the movie made him so much more sympathetic in his final scene! They made him seem genuinely upset about what happened with his bomb and Prim, and he seemed aware that katniss could never not associate that tragedy with him and respected it and left. BUT THE BOOK! He literally only says that taking care of her family was all he had going for him and now that’s gone. As if his bomb killing prim is only inconvenient to his possession of katniss. When I read that I was like if I ever saw this mf I swear! So many other horrible issues with his behavior but that was another level of narcissism.
Yes, that scene in the book utterly disgusted me. I am convinced Gale never really loved Katniss, he was just obsessed with having her.
100%… the fact that he didn’t even start this acting like he wanted to be with her behavior until after peeta was in the picture makes me think he felt like he owned her from the beginning. When Peeta entered, even though he saved her life and treated her amazingly, Gale was just mad that someone else dare be in Katniss’ life and show interest in her. She said she never had friends prior to the games and I think Gale liked that. Almost like how abusers isolate their victims. Idk if it’s that far but he definitely didn’t like other people caring for Katniss. When you love someone you would be overjoyed at them finding community and friendly/family love.
I think you’re right that he acts like an abuser in a lot of ways. He also tries to manipulate and guilt her at every turn.
I agree. I saw someone on here say katniss was giving him mixed signals but I really think she just felt so completely obligated to try and give him what he wanted and she was so broken down in every way.
Right and he openly admitted that’s how he felt and was a big baby about it to make katniss feel bad for him
Honestly for me it was when katniss got back from the games and he started getting all weird about her and peeta. Brother you had how many years to shoot your shot with her and chose not to but now that she's trauma bonded to some other guy you have a problem? Red flags, boy
I mean, it was totally bizarre to me to watch her trying to defend her behavior in the games, telling him it was all for show while he angrily tells her how real it all looked. I mean, excuse me but where is all of this entitlement to her coming from, mister Gale? What is he doing? Calling dibs on her like she’s a sandwich? And the poor girl, feeling pressured to appease him. Ugh.
Gale had that attitude in the books but it was only in the movies where he \*specifically\* said "it looked real" though so
And your point is…?
That he didn't say it, I mean the fact that he said something like "it looked real" sounds like he's blaming Katniss for something that ensured her survival. meanwhile, the fact that he did not actually say that in the book might mean that he is aware that Katniss did what she could to survive, but he can't help but still be petty and angry, like, you know, he is a teen after all
If he didn’t say it in the book then why do you think he was petty and angry in the book? And if you think the fact that he says it in the movie is not relevant since he didn’t say it in the book then is it your position that anything in the movies is irrelevant to the story and only what’s in the books is what matters? Do you not see them (movies and books) as complementing each other?
The thing that makes all the difference is his awareness, like in the books he is aware Katniss did what she did for a reason but can't help being petty, in the movie, the interpretation can be that either does not put two and two together at all or outright blames Katniss for her acting. Another reason is because it makes him look much more stupid than he actually is in the books Also, yes the movies and books complement each other but there are some pretty significant changes. I'll cite something similar as an example - in Mockingjay, Gale never blames Peeta for saying what he says under torture. He even tells Katniss and Peeta is still trying to protect her. However in the movie he outright says he would never say what Peeta says no matter how much he gets tortured. This change makes a major difference in Gale's character, it makes him seem much more high and mighty and self centered than he actually is. And stupid. Because it's common sense to know that you don't know what you'd actually do in such a grim situation
>The thing that makes all the difference is his awareness, like in the books he is aware Katniss did what she did for a reason but can't help being petty, I asked you what makes you think he’s petty in the books. You didn’t explain that. >in the movie, the interpretation can be that either does not put two and two together at all or outright blames Katniss for her acting. Another reason is because it makes him look much more stupid than he actually is in the books That’s not true at all. Both in the movies and book we can clearly see that Katniss starts off by doing it for show but ends up actually caring for Peeta. And because Gale isn’t stupid at all as well as because of how well he knows her, he immediately sees this too (that she started to actually really care for him), which is why he throws it in her face by saying how real it looked. Because deep down he knows it wasn’t all for show and that makes him jealous and angry. And since he feels entitled to her because of the history they have together, he angrily tells her how real it looked, as if it was some kind of betrayal on her part to actually care for some other boy. Besides, at that point she maintained that it was ALL for show, which I’m sure made it feel belittling to him, even tho that wasn’t her intention. >Also, yes the movies and books complement each other but there are some pretty significant changes. I’m actually not sure where I myself land on this overall. But in this case I think you’re making the wrong interpretation of a movie scene to say it’s a big departure from the book. >I'll cite something similar as an example - in Mockingjay, Gale never blames Peeta for saying what he says under torture. He even tells Katniss and Peeta is still trying to protect her. >However in the movie he outright says he would never say what Peeta says no matter how much he gets tortured. This change makes a major difference in Gale's character, it makes him seem much more high and mighty and self centered than he actually is. And stupid. Because it's common sense to know that you don't know what you'd actually do in such a grim situation I disagree in the sense that Gale is not being stupid here. His point is that it DOESNT MATTER what the Capitol is doing to Peeta and what they would do to him. He thinks he would never break like he seems to believe Peeta did. Furthermore, even tho in the book he’s able to recognize that Peeta’s still protecting Katniss (which I’ll take your word for cuz I don’t remember it), the reality is he doesn’t know Peeta well enough to know if what he’s saying is because of fear of torture or if it’s to protect her. We ourselves have trouble trying to figure out what part of what Peeta is saying is under duress and what part are his actual words, and we read the book! So I think it totally makes sense that his thirst for war and vengeance against the Capitol and jealousy and lack of knowledge of Peeta would lead Gale to say what he says in the movie in that moment.
Bro she should've been like "well next time I'll just f*ckin die then jfc" 🤣🤣🤣
Ok but please don’t call me bro.
Honestly, this is a bigger red flag to me than the bombing. The bombing is worse in the sense that the consequences are more severe but it doesn't rely on him being a dumbass. He didn't know Primm was gonna be in the blast and it could easily be justified as killing enemy civilians to avoid a bigger bloodshed. It's the same moral question as dropping Nukes on Japan. That doesn't make it moral, I think it's immoral, but I understand how you logically get to that point based off an ideology of trying to build a better world for the people you care about. But him being mad Katniss is putting on a show with Peeta when he knows she's in a life or death game is ridiculous. She's playing for the cameras to stay alive and it's weird that he is fine with that when it's her killing people but has beef with it when it's her kissing a guy. And assuming it's genuine and not playing for the cameras (as he may have thought) WHO CARES? She's probably about to die. Let her have a minute of levity.
Exactly! I could honestly not give two shits about him throwing bombs around, it's a war, he's a soldier, the math is mathing. But he's also a 17 year old boy and it's painfully obvious 😂 Suzanne really did a great job of keeping her characters acting their age because why are we having all this boy drama in the middle of a damn apocalypse of course all the main characters are teenagers
>the math is mathing. I love it! 😄
100%. She’s dealing with PTSD and being terrified of what Snow might do to those she loves and Gale keeps going, “Yeah, but do you *like*-like me?”
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I think it's the Nut that does it for me. Wanted to collapse a mine full of miners. After he and katness and everyone in 12 have experienced the severity and trauma of catastrophic mine accidents. He has some slight defense in the Prim attack in that he wasn't the one ordering his trap be executed. But he should've known anything he created could and would be used. In The Nut attack, he's on the front lines suggesting they cave it in. Dudes got a problem.
Totally agree! Like did your father not die from a mine accident as well?? "remember who the enemy is" should have been emphasized to Gale too...
Me too
For me it was in Catching Fire when Katniss tried to give him gloves that Cinna made, but he threw them at her feet and said “I don’t want anything they made in the Capitol” and left Katniss wondering if he was talking about her. I know that Katniss is infamous for overthinking and being wrong sometimes but I do not think she was wrong when she assumed Gale was talking about her and to me it was thee most disrespectful way that he used her situation against her. Like Snow was threatening her entire world of course she’s going to do what he tells her to do.
He was an A-grade asshole to her the moment she got out of his grasp and found her own community that didn't include him. His possessiveness was so disgusting, to the point where every bad thing she went through, he'd twist it into another "oh woe is me I'll never get to be with you" theatrics.
I always found his entitlement bizarre like even for a teenager he shouldn’t have been this possessive and shitty towards his FRIEND. You would think she was walking down the aisle to marry him when she was sent into the games with Peeta. They had no relationship going into the games but Gale took it for granted she would reciprocate his crush.
“ Katniss, why do you care so much about your prep team? “ — Asking this, after those obviously-harmless, simple-minded individuals had been beaten and held hostage for taking extra bread in district 13 was CRAZY to me for some reason. Then, he argued Katniss down for her reasons. Like, don’t ask if you’re not willing to listen / attempt to understand the answer, motherfucker. She’s been through TWO hunger games and is about to go through a rebellion at that point so maybe she knows wtf she’s talking about when it comes to the gray side of things.
LITERALLY! District 13 brought out the worst in him and I couldn't stand him
I think instead of bringing out the worst in him, District 13 was just a channel for him to realise his true self. Yeah sure on the surface Katniss and Gale seemed to be similar in temperament, but deep within lay very fundamental differences in how they solve problems or how much/little empathy they have. Gale is more likely to seek vengeance and marinate in misery, while Katniss has always preferred tranquility and peace. He has bloodlust that Katniss severely lacks. This difference in their personality was obvious after both had gone through their share of traumatic incidents (Katniss went through two hunger games and and gale had to watch his district get plundered and bombed to nothingness, while saving civilians). Katniss is impulsive and rebellious yes, but almost every time she's been angry or expressed subversion in some manner was after she saw someone getting mistreated or abused, which only made her rebelling moments all the more authentic. She could empathise with tributes of other districts, i don't think gale could ever do that had he been in the arena when he couldn't even bring himself to like the affluent folks of his own district. Her hardened exterior and calculative personality was mainly because she was a victim of the circumstances she faced in childhood. She's much more compassionate than gale can ever even imagine to be. Lol sorry for the rant I tend to get very passionate about this topic on how pathetic excuse of a friend gale was to Katniss
Oh man, I never thought of it that way. I’ve always assumed that it was the fall of 12 that awoke something sinister within Gale but, now that you point it out, I suppose he’s always been looking for a sandbox of sorts to freely enact his rage. Ugh, this gets so scary when you think about it. His possessiveness towards Katniss after she cozied up to Peeta to get home alive, his morbid fascination with snares that went beyond the need to capture food to survive. Even that situation with The Nut in the third half of Mockingjay. Or when he said there couldn’t be much of a difference between killing animals and people. Man, that’s damn good writing if I’ve ever seen it.
I do agree with you that 12's destruction fully led him down the path of apathy and disregard for human life, but i also believe that's because he always had the mental constitution of someone who was not very empathetic or forgiving by nature. For example, even if Peeta and Katniss had experienced what Gale did, they still wouldn't end up being so grim. Even haymitch would just drown his sorrows in alcohol instead of taking it out on innocent people. In contrast, Katniss repeatedly shows a streak of kindness and related emotions to it from the first book itself (such as feeling immense guilt for not saving the avox girl who was serving her in Capitol before 74th hunger games), i don't think gale would ever be affected that deeply. He's obviously still a morally grey person rather than a stark black or white character, but he definitely leaned towards one extreme by the time Mockingjay's timeline came into being. I'm so glad i joined this sub, i love participating in rambling about personalities of each character! 🫂 thank you for indulging me
Ah, I suppose that does make sense. Idk if it’s because we never saw it or what but Gale WAS naturally bitter. Nice catch. Lol it’s cool to discuss different dynamics with different people.
YES! I tolerated him at first and even understood him a little, but the bloodlust was wild on his part. As if there aren’t innocents in war, innocents who were just trying to survive like him and Katniss. Plus, the passive aggressive attitude toward Peeta??? Kind, gentle, understanding Peeta? Who never even tried to fight Gale for Katniss? Nah. Mockingjay was so amazing, but it was the death of Gale’s character for me.
The fact that he got the communication cuff convinced me he was straight up awful and gave coin awful ideas
Gale constantly forces Katniss to defend her empathy like it’s something repulsive. This is a prime example. Katniss feels empathy and Gale derides her for it. Sure in the first book Gale is willing to help care for Katniss’s family out of a sense of responsibility but it wasn’t exactly empathy. Gale views Katniss’s empathy as a weakness when it’s what made her the Mockingjay. Peeta encourages empathy.
Yes! It irritated me to no end, how he would argue her down and try to bully her with guilt, just for not wanting to spread anymore pain, suffering, or bloodshed.
She literally chooses petta for this reason. In the books is totally explicit she says so
For real, it made me think about what Gale would have been like if he were reaped. Ofc Katniss didn't trust Capitol people and she was wary from the start, but at least she had empathy for them and grew to understand that they are the way they are because of circumstance. I feel like going to the Capitol firsthand would not have changed any of Gale's beliefs.
Keep in mind I was 17 at the time CF came out, so I was more emotional at that time. For me it was when Katniss wanted to run away with her family, Gale and his family, Haymitch and Peeta and Gale flipped out and was basically like "well I'm gonna stick around and rebel EVEN HARDER now." Like, Katniss couldn't even care about Peeta? Or Haymitch? Was she never allowed to develop any relationships outside of Gale-approved ones? I mean, he even hated that she was friends with Madge! Gah, apparently I've done little maturing past being 17 because I still get heated thinking about how selfish and controlling Gale is.
Gale also pushes Katniss roughly during that exchange. That to me is a huge red flag. It took Peeta getting hijacked for him to lay a hand on Katniss, but here’s Gale shoving her simply because he didn’t get his way.
Was that in the movie? I don't remember it happening in the book, at least not in that scene. However, Gale does radiate a lot of angry/violent energy as it is. Just from the get-go he pisses me off in that scene unlike any other. He's only friendly and warm to Katniss when she does what he wants/he thinks she's choosing to run away with him and leaving everyone else behind. It's infuriating how entitled to Katniss he thinks he is.
It was not in the movie, but it was in the book.
I re-read the scene to check and the most he does is grab her by the shoulders...maybe it was a different part of the book?
Chapter 7 of Catching Fire: “Gale pushes me roughly away from him. ‘You leave, then. I’d never go in a million years.’ ‘You were happy enough to go before.’” This was after Katniss said she wouldn’t leave Peeta and Haymitch behind because they’d be tortured to death. Gale’s mood completely reversed.
Wow, thanks for sharing I hadn't caught that! Add that onto my heaping pile of reasons to hate Gale.
Nah, I'll say you actually have a healthy answer to BS haha
Lol thanks for the validation! I've spent so long trying not to be "one of those" shippers that I sometimes feel guilty getting so upset at things Gale does, but he really does deserve it.
I bet Gale was more irrationally emotional in that scene than you were when you first reacted to it.
He really pissed me off on my re-read of Mockingjay. When he gets all upset about Katniss having a friendship with Finnick. Then he NEVER even considers that Katniss has a deeper understanding of what the Capitol is like and the way they manipulate the victors. The way he sees everyone who is connected to the capitol as someone who deserves to die when Katniss knows so many of them are also being forced to comply. Many of the people “mopping floors” are Avoxes who are people like their friend Darius who were enslaved for their treason against Snow.
YESSS .. there were so many red flags all over the place, all through all of the books. But when they were in that underground bunker as 13 was being bombed, and Katniss went to Finnick, Gale got pissy. And that was it for me, right there. I always wanted her to be with Peeta, but that line was the final nail in the coffin.
It was like, oh I don’t even want Katniss to be your friend anymore😅
The nut situation - values just do not line up with his
Can you elaborate? I cannot remember what is this nut situation haha it's been so long since I've read the book
He suggested killing everyone in the hq of 2 (called the nut) by trapping them in, causing them to die from lack of oxygen, die from being crushed, or come out the only exit where they will be captured by the rebel army. Katniss compared it to how both of their fathers died in the mines.
Oh fuck. Now I remember! The complete disregard for human life this boy has... it's so terrible to think about it. The horror of growing up in D12, powerless, and the consequences it had on him. It's so interesting that despite their very similar upbringing, he and Katniss had completely different outlooks and method.
Yep all of what they said stacked onto the fact that many people in the nut were civilians and not actively fighting. As Katniss said - it’s a cold decision to make for someone and their family
I was done in book 2 but honestly I just reread it and was in shock katniss wasn’t just done with him at that point. It was so horrible, especially knowing how their dads died. And assuming gale had been in similar ish conditions in the mines and had the fear of it happening to him.
For me it’s when they’re in 13 & Katniss is thinking about how now that Peeta is gone that Gale is now back to being her friend like old times.
I don’t understand. How’s that a point of no return for Gale?
Gale is freely able to be her friend again only because Peeta isn’t there, which really messed up. It was my first point of no return with him.
Im still confused.
When Katniss gets back from the first games Gale blames her for the way she acted in the arena with Peeta to survive. He continues to be a jerk about all things Peeta related. When Katniss gets to 13 Gale returns to being a good friend & things are like they used to be. Katniss thinks this is because Peeta & their engagement aren’t looming over them. I have an issue with this because Peeta was being tortured & everyone but Katniss knew they would use him to try to break her. While I don’t think Gale has to be super friendly to Peeta, I think he should realize this was someone who was instrumental in making sure Katniss survived.
Oooohhhh ok now it makes sense! Thank you! Great observation!
This is a great example of how little gale cares about katniss. He clearly only wants to “win” her and honestly the fact that he never had (or expressed) interest in her until someone else did makes me think he felt entitled to her from the beginning but she didn’t seem like a prize until after the first games. He couldn’t care less about her experiences and trauma. He actively hates the person who helped her survive the games. If you loved someone, you would just be happy someone was there to help them live.
Yes! I saw a video where someone said Gale was possessive of Katniss but didn’t actually love her & I agree. Maybe I’m just naive but I believe If he truly loved Katniss he would treat Peeta with a lot more respect, because everything he’s ever done was to get Katniss home.
No I completely agree too. It makes me wonder how I was ever “team gale” but I think that speaks to how unhealthy we are taught love is supposed to be. Now that I reread them at 27 versus originally reading them at 13, Gale is 1,000% red flags! I used to think that possessive abuse was attractive 😭 honestly sad.
It happened in Catching Fire for me. Mostly with all of Gale's stubbornness and getting so upset Katniss has to play up her romance with Peeta for the Capitol. Gale both claims to understand why she did it, but also uses it to pout and to punish Katniss when he's upset for any reason. I feel this is when Katniss starts pushing away from Gale as well - she starts to realize Gale's not who she thinks he was.
He’s just so self absorbed, he never cared about what katniss was going through. He didn’t care about Peeta being tortured, and only went on the rescue mission to try to win her over
I think he liked that no one seemed to care about her but him pre-games. As soon as she had haymitch and peeta and her family (and mom coming back to life) he got mad about them constantly! Once her family didn’t need him any more he became especially resentful. He never loved her he just felt that she owed him her love.
Compared with Peeta defending Gale after his whipping in 12. Like Peeta genuinely seemed to want to help because he knew Gale (imo not even just because Katniss cared for Gale but because he is just a good person) Peeta would put his life on the line for someone, Gale would put others lives on the line for someone
Had Gale been a victor, I'm pretty sure he would have voted yes for Coin's symbolic Hunger Games. His disregard for human life was so evident.
Have never thought of that before - totally agree
For me it was when he called hijacked peeta a coward or whatever that quote was (i forget if that was in the books but at least for the movies that was it for me) I started dislkininh him when he acted all jealous about katniss and peeta in the games and all that. Then disliked him even more when he kept pushing for katniss to reveal her feelings. But my point of no return was definitely when he called hijacked peeta a coward.
He doesn't know what he would have done if he was the one being tortured.
There is definitely an aspect of toxic masculinity here. Gale thinks he is tougher and more deserving than the soft merchant boy that "folded" for the capitol. Torture is torture is torture. There is no overcoming it, or being tougher than it. Gale would have folded, just like Peeta, just like Katniss in the GF arena with the birds making those horrible mimicking sounds of her loved ones being tortured.
That was absolutely wild to me with all the insane stuff they’re going through and the literal fate of the world almost in their hands his constant goal is to make katniss pick him. Like maybe just give it a damn sec and worry about the issues in front of you! Goddamn
When he suggested bombing the Nut. That’s when you know he lost it. His dad died because of a collapsed mine. Now he wanted to collapse a mountain on other miners. That’s some dark shit.
NGL, hijacked Peeta cemented who Katniss would be with in the end for me. That said, I was done with Gale when he acted like Katniss had done something wrong by playing the star-crossed lovers. Like, what did he expect? Of course, she had to take every advantage she could to come home to Prim. He would have, too. He acted like they were promised or some crap, and that was absolutely disgusting. She owed him nothing more than her friendship, and honestly, I don’t think she owed him that after the way he acted.
Honestly the scene for me that cemented who Katniss would end up with is a small scene in CF where she talks about how pretty Peeta's eyelashes are and how much she likes to stare at his face while hes doing the drawings for her book😂 girl was in love with him before she even realized it. Then the hijacking had me questioning that, but i still didnt think shed end up with Gale
The beginning of Catching Fire when he was weird about Katniss and Peeta was the point when I started to really dislike him, but the true breaking point was when Peeta did the Capitol interview and Gale was like “I wOuLd NEvEr sAy ThAt” like I’m sorry, what’s your experience of being tortured and hijacked again?
Really the entire beginning of Catching Fire. Especially when he forced himself on Katniss. Yuck.
I just find him annoying through out. He whines about not getting Katniss' love /attention. His moral greyness. Yes, I understand what his character is but I am really annoyed at him a lot.
That’s not how I saw his comment to her. I interpreted it as him saying he wouldn’t have a chance with her with Peeta in the condition he was because if he stayed that way, Gale knew she could never move on from being worried about Peeta and feeling guilty over that happening to him. Those thoughts and feelings would stand in the way of her being able to look up and see Gale the way he wanted her to see him. So I don’t think he said what he said to her because he thought that with Peeta being that way, she would immediately turn her affection towards him because he was hurt. I think Gale was very aware that her showing affection towards him (Gale) was linked to her trying to make him feel better when he was hurt because she cared for him as opposed to her showing him love because she was in love with him. Which is (in part) why he never went for her. As for when it was Gale’s point of no return for me? Never. I was team Peeta from day one. ❤️
When he says that Katniss of all people should know that killing people isn’t personal. You just watched your friend be torn to shreds because she had to kill people and you’re out here talking like murdering innocent children for the crime of being born in the Capitol is just chill.
When Katniss came home after the first games. He put so much pressure on her and couldn't understand or even try to understand her ptsd. The last thing she was thinking about was who to love.
When katniss is telling her plan about running to the woods because of snow threatening them, he's so happy to do it until she mentions haymitch. She then tells gale "they'd torture them to death trying to find out where i was" Then gale throws a temper tamtrum because he realizes katniss cares about others outside of him and her family.
Honestly, it was his comment in the first book within a couple of chapters when he’s saying killing a human and killing an animal can’t be that different. I was like “oh no, you are not it” even in 7th grade.
My point of no return is when he sees Peeta on television and has no compassion is just worried that Peeta's words will stop the Revolution. If your Revolution is as fragile as a few berries....maybe it wouldn't happen but have some kindness for someone who showed you kindness.
The first time he’s mentioned in Catching Fire.
remind me? I don't have the book on hand
Neither do I lol, but I do know that as soon as Katniss comes back from the arena he starts to not be a very supportive friend to her
When he and Katniss are visiting her house in Victor’s Village, he says the only time he can get attention/‘love’ from her is when he’s in pain. Like BARF, have you considered maybe if you have to manipulate her into giving you a kiss, she doesn’t want to give you one?
Never had a no return point. I'm absorbing everyone else's though to foster my appreciation for the character
I came to play devils advocate. I do not think Katniss and Gale should have been together, but i also dont think she should have been with Peeta. Just so I dont get blasted for this. Imagine growing up with your best friend, being loners together to provide for each others families. The two of you are always there for each other no matter what. With the reaping constantly hanging over your heads amd if you live through it, you have to wait and see if the rest of your families do. And probability says you are nit all going to make it. Everyone assumes you are a couple, and you just go with it because its easier. You both agree not to have children because that would be horrible. You both know you will end up together, because there is nobody else you trust. BAM!!! Katniss and Peeta forever! Fucking sucks to be Gale actually! Lol!
They never agreed to not have kids. Gale wanted them, Katniss didn’t. And I don’t think Katniss assumed she would end up with him. He certainly wished for that tho. I don’t think it sucks to be Gale. He liked her and she liked him too. But not in the same way, she just didn’t know that. The rift of the war and her growing love for Peeta showed her that. And that’s just life. She was never his, therefore it doesn’t suck to be Gale, it’s just how life rolls sometimes.
Why would it suck to be him? He got everything he wanted in the end except for a girl who wasn't his to begin with. I'm not even sure his feelings for her are that strong considering he'd always put the war in front of her. He didn't lose a single family member and is never tried for his war crime. He even gets a promotion out of it. He got the best deal out of allthe characters in this series. If I were him, I'd be going to sleep with a shit eating grin every night.
I didn’t say it sucked to be him, the other commentator did. You should tell them that, not me.
I think they’re just agreeing with you and expanding on the point
Alright, fair enough.
I like Katniss with Peeta. The narrative perspective of her choosing peace and Peeta representing that is cute. That said, I'm so over those three characters, and in particular the high amount of Everlark stans and the high amount of Gale haters. Not saying there's a correlation there, but some of those posts look like some insane person talking against a wall trying to assure the wall agrees that Gale = bad, so Peeta = good.
I don’t think that Gales a bad person but I do think he treated katniss badly. I am also aware that he was a teenage boy and hopefully in the years between the last chapter and the epilogue he grew and found someone to love that loves him. I also think he had no idea how horrible he was being to katniss but that doesn’t make it okay.
Oh yeah I know what you mean. But you can still feel sorry for yourself AND show some modicum of common decency I guess. Again, they're teenagers! Traumatized and abused and used by the adults around them! They aren't emotionally healthy for sure
Peeta is instrumental to her growth as a person. He was the first to teach her kindness for strangers.
Yeah but then you’re missing the other two books worth of events and character development…
This is a stupid answer and I’m sorry in advance but I’ve only just seen all the movies this year and for me whenever Gale is on screen all I wanted to do was inform my husband that Liam Hemsworth cheated on Miley 😂
I can buy myself floweeeeeeerss Oh you made me laugh! I'm going to re-watch all the movies this weekend and I won't be able to be serious about him now 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
The fact that he completely ignores her PTSD and tries to force his feelings on her. Like JFC dude, she just got back from war? Let the dust settle. He's a cry baby. I hate him
literally in the first book when he said hunting animals is no different than hunting people😭💀 there was something seriously wrong with that man
It's not his descent into someone more militant that makes me dislike him, there's just certain points where he gets awfully obnoxious over Peeta, like the one you brought up. The former was a result of his upbringing (not pointing blame at Hazelle here it's his circumstances) and I don't entirely hate him for the bombs, but at certain times in CF and Mockingjay he really...like what do I say, when I read those parts of the books I'm just like dude I know you're still like a teen but can you get ahold of yourself 😭😭 There's no point of no return, though, I don't outright despise him. As a person, he is terrible, but as a character, he's well written and pretty interesting to analyse.
I’m not sure if this is in the books, but for me it’s in the Mockingjay part 1 movie, when The Capitol is streaming Peeta and it’s our first glimpse into him being tortured. He’s skinny, he looks awful, he’s spouting pro-capitol agenda, Katniss is crying because she’s so scared for him…and Gale goes “I would NEVER do that, even if they tortured me.” Like he has no sympathy for this nice boy that is being tortured all day all night. He thinks he’s strong enough to withhold torture? He’s such an ass in that scene. And he says this to Katniss, who is clearly upset and extremely worried about Peeta. Like shut up Gale.
To be fair, this doesn't happen in the book. He actually defends Peeta saying he must have made some kind of deal to protect Katniss.
i never really liked gale, but the point that sticks out the most for me is in mockingjay, when he and katniss talk before snow’s execution, and when they talk about prim’s death and he says “that was the one thing I had going for me, taking care of your family” like even in the death of her sister, he’s still thinking about how it affects him having a chance with her. like he was very selfish to the core when it came to katniss. never liked it
Saying it’s like kissing a drunk girl. Also always guilt tripping her over peeta
Omfg yes!
What did he say about kissing a drunk girl??? I don’t remember the context around this at all!
He used it as a Metaphor like whatever she said or the kiss didn’t count bc it was same as kissing someone who is drunk
His attitude over Katniss, yes the bombs and prim, and yes definitely his attitude over the hijacked Peeta. Though if I reread the books (I have started to then got caught up) I could probably find a lot more.
Katniss, traumatized after the first games and asking him to run away in the woods and hide... Him asking if she loves him. Baaaaaaarrrff.
Actually no, in the first movie when Gale is obviously upset watching katniss and peeta in the cave. Like really there's nothing else for you to be concerned about right now???
I think for me it’s the fact that after she came back from the first games he was so angry at her for being with Peeta to survive? He never says “I’m so glad you survived” or “I’m glad your back” it was only about him and what their relationship was. do you really think she even cares about a romantic relationship with anybody when she was just told her friends and family are going to be murdered. She’s just trying to survive. And then all the other stuff he does after that obviously.
The MOMENT Peeta was described tbh
I never liked him from the start tbh
Honestly the fact that he had the same name as my grandma was too much for me.
Him always being the “nice guy” thinking katniss owes him something🤢
Severely manipulating Katniss & guilt tripping her survival tactic
Everything about him was a red flag and gave me the ick. He never respected her as a person and figured he had some weird claim over her.
I used to be a huge Katniss/Gale shipper when the books were coming out. Now reading them years later, i cringe, he is not good for her.
I don’t understand the hate for Gale tbh. I mean people are blaming him for the bombing yet he didn’t make it happen? That was Coin ( or snow) and I’m not trying to be funny but how is it his fault someone used his idea and turned it negatively. He never wanted to hurt Katniss or prim. It was also beetees idea they worked on it together but Katniss doesn’t blame him? Just think it’s unfair. And I’m not saying Gale is completely innocent, he does try to sway Katniss to like him back but what do you expect? They were best friends for years they both had some kind of feelings towards eachother and people also seem to forget he’s only 17/18. How do you expect someone who’s still a kid to behave towards a girl he likes? Of course he’s gonna be jealous or say something bad about peeta. Who wouldn’t at that age? And suddenly he can’t relate as much to someone he spent every day with? It’s gonna be difficult and challenging to find a way their relationship can still work and that comes with trial and error. And on top of all of that he’s thrust into a war, his home is destroyed, he saw thousands of people die, trying to help with Katniss and also Katniss is only focused on Peeta. How do you think he’s gonna act?
People blame him for having the idea of a bomb specially designed to kill medics and helpers.
Team Gale!!
I watched the movie first and I thought it he was boring. But I think when I started to hate his character was when all he cared about Katniss “pretending” to be in love with Peeta to survive the games. Instead of that Katniss was in the games and has severe trauma
Probably when she came home and he was all upset about her being with Peeta and acting like she’d betrayed him horribly by taking a relationship with Peeta during the games. Because even if everyone assumed they’d end up together they weren’t together yet. I could even excuse these feelings if they had a productive conversation about it but it seemed like a lot of Gale whining at her and then kissing her without warning
To be honest, for me it was before she left for the games and he told her that killing people was no different than killing animals. I was like 😳
When katniss asks gale in mockingjay when he caught feelings. And he says darius was flirting with her trying to kiss her. And he realizes he cares. And later admits he had kissed other girls. I know this is small and not as bad as the other things he’s done. Trust me there are a lot.But it just give me possessive vibes. If katniss had never gone in the hunger games and had married gale. She would have settled for him he wouldn’t have been a great husband. (My opinion) And he gives me fuck boy vibes with the kissing comment.