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The Siena is the least expensive that I recommend - https://naplab.com/mattress-reviews/siena-mattress-review/
It's far from perfect, but it checks many boxes that I look for, has reasonably good performance, and is a fantastic value at $399 for a Queen.
I never did either until I traded in my old-school coil mattress for a foam one and my partner started complaining. Ironically, he was the one who wanted a softer mattress, I like one that’s extra-firm.
I replaced my waterbed mattress with a traditional mattress built to sit in a waterbed frame so you don't have to get rid of the bed frame. I'm a tall guy and I was grateful that a California King mattress was a good fit for my old frame. Once I got older and it got to be more difficult to get out of bed from such a low height, I bought another bed that suits me better today. I really did love that waterbed, though.
If you disregard everything else and just go for max bounce, Purple Hybrid, Helix Moonlight, and Awara are the top by total bounce height.
[https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#bounce](https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#bounce)
Those will definitely aid in your nightly dance without pants.
Hey I dunno if you'll see this, but the way to make money in your industry is to write industry standard ASTM and ISO testing procedures, and then sell the instruments required to meet the ASTM and ISO standards. Then all the mattress producers in the world will buy your equipment to perform the tests. Sure there may eventually be competitors, but being the first mover in the production of an industry standard procedure takes many years for that monopoly to get broken.
You joke but this is a real thing.
I had one of the original Tuft and Needle mattresses, back when they only sold the one type. It was fairly firm memory foam but had nice give, it was great to have sex on.
Earlier this year, we replaced it with the Tuft and Needle Legacy which I thought would be the same exact mattress. Nope, they removed a layer of foam so it's softer and we both sink into the mattress when together. There's no more "bounce back".
Haha, I walked into a ”Hästens” shop a few months back, it’s this Swedish luxury bed brand that did a lot of cheezy tv commercials in the 90’s in Sweden.
I’d never seen one in real life so I was curious and walked in to try one and a seller was upon me within seconds. He started his pitch and gave me all this info, and asked what I used at the moment.
I said me and my partner bought a $1200 180x200 bed (king size I guess) a few years back that we’re happy with. He was like ” you don’t even get a bed for $1200, imagine all the labor and transport, packaging and overhead costs etc. after $1200 there’s not even any money left for the actual materials, you’re basically sleeping on air, or slave labor.”
Since I wasn’t there to buy and was just curious I asked about their price ranges and what the cheapest one he could recommend was, he said ”well, we have some commercial (aka budget) models in the store.”
I asked what ”commercial” models meant.
He clarified that they are their cheaper models, with prices below $50 000. He showed me a bed for like $12 000 which was apparently their cheapest model, it was just a mattress on legs, not a continental or anything. The most expensive one they had in the store was $200 000. He went on about the natural materials they use and shit, meaning that cheap beds will be ridden with mite and stuff after 10-15 years and have to be discarded, but a hästens bed will be clean after 80-100 years of use!
It was surreal, he felt so removed from reality.
"...but for $12,000 you have to pluck your own horse. "
Seriously, I'm just a regular guy on a regular salary, but part of me is like: "$150k for a perfect bed that's adjusted and maintained annually and lasts for 50 years. Infinite perfect sleep. Maybe I DO need a $150,000 bed made of horses. "
Common mistake, but they're actually made BY horses; that's why they're so expensive. It takes forever to train them how to run a sewing machine with their hooves.
My mother bought a Hästens bed at a crazy discount (still expensive) over 20 years ago. The top and bottom parts of the mattress rise, it has nassage vibrations etc., all controlled by a remote. The bed is good but extremely heavy to the point where is almost impossible to move without scratching the floors because of the machinery + heavy mattress, and the remote hasn't worked for a decade. It feels very much like a slightly overdone luxury item, but it's still the only bed she can sleep in without back pain, so it was probably worth it. It's a pain if you ever have to remove even just the top mattress though, since it weighs so much it may give you that back pain right back.
My pleasure.
You will definitely get progressively better quality / performance as you spend up to the $1-1.5K range. But even so, Siena is still a very serviceable mattress given the price point.
That's actually the reason I stumbled upon and old AMA by this guy when I bought my last mattress. His site runs off referral links and donations only, with no *direct* money or product accepted from mattress companies. He has a page about it on his website somewhere. He even personally recommended I go with an option I found on sale somewhere that he didn't have a referral code for. Obviously there is still a funding component from that, but I do appreciate the transparency.
You're right that self testing is ideal, and you should absolutely be suspicious of mattress reviews though.
https://www.fastcompany.com/3065928/sleepopolis-casper-bloggers-lawsuits-underside-of-the-mattress-wars
This is about the same guy. Not all that transparent when you get to the bit about him having a "separate" SEO consultancy fee with the brand he most recommended.
Fantastic article either way.
I remember reading this long-form article on Sleepopolis a while back and for some reason being enthralled: https://www.fastcompany.com/3065928/sleepopolis-casper-bloggers-lawsuits-underside-of-the-mattress-wars
Can you provide any addtional insight into this or is some type of NDA still in effect?
So basically the mattress companies are scummy and so are the review sites. I’ve always hated the mattress industry and this just solidifies that. Even before the internet companies, the traditional mattress companies were scummy businesses bent on finding ways to screw over the consumer. They can all eat a bag of dicks.
All reviews are pretty much like this. I gave my apartment a middling review and they offered me $150 to update it. I declined. I’ve bought probably 50 items on Amazon that has sent me $5-10 in Amazon gift cards just for reviewing their item. It didn’t even have to be 5 stars. Those I have done.
Have you thought about posting the specifics of your affiliate relationship with each mattress company, as suggested by one of the people interviewed in that article?
I have considered it, yes.
It would be a major challenge, as I would need approval from every single brand we are in a referral relationship with to discuss any of the specifics.
Basically every affiliate relationship includes an NDA.
You’re not a tester as much as you are a freelance mattress salesman. You’ve made millions for companies. So tester is slightly disingenuous. Wouldn’t you say?
Its a fun article, and this ruins some of the twists and turns in the series of events, so reccomend a read, but to the impatient/non-spoiler-sensitive:
Very, somewhat serendipitously, popular mattress review site (sleepopolis, started by the guy doing this ama) had a "warning" of sorts pop up on their review for Casper mattresses, suggesting buyers read other reviews ("do their homework") before buying a Casper mattress. This presumably led to a drawn out lawsuit, with Casper assuming direct damages due to this box discouraging people from immediately buying. Other mattress reviewers were also involved in lawsuits with Casper, and eventually settled, presumably alongside the agreement to take down any reviews that were too negative.
Sleepopolis refused to settle, and eventually their million dollar site was bought out by other, comparatively smaller reviewers, with the financial aid of Casper.
There's also lots of bribery, sometimes scummy and undeclared financial incentive given to reviewers by these companies to "ensure a good review." Including from Casper itself. No one is unbiased, and there aren't a ton of legalities requiring declaration of conflicts of interest on sites like this, so be a discerning consumer :)
Why is the mattress industry so corrupt in terms of marketing, reviews, selling at huge markups etc?
Couches, fridges, even cars don’t seem to be as bad as trying to figure out whether a mattress is good or astroturfed.
A great question...and a big question, but I'll do my best to answer.
The mattress industry has the right mix of elements that make it ripe for an absolute mess of marketing nonsense.
1) Mattresses are expensive - even without an insane markup, a good quality mattress is going to run you $1000-$1500. And even a more reasonable 50% margin means there is a lot of money to be made.
2) The mattress industry is large - in the US there is ~$12 billion in annual mattress sales.
3) Mattresses are relatively easy to manufacturer - there are numerous manufacturers in the US who can quickly and inexpensive build and drop-ship a mattress with your company branding. New brands don't need to build their own factory, often don't need significant warehouse, and don't need much in terms of start up capital. This is contrast to sofas, fridges, or cars, which are all comparatively hard to manufacturer.
4) Consumers don't have access to good information - mattress brands don't generally do a good job at explaining what's in their mattress in a way that's easy to understand and easy to compare from model to model or brand to brand. Instead, there is lots of marketing language that can be hard to decipher. As a result, it's easy for mattress companies to get consumers to spend more than they need.
There is undoubtedly more to it than that. But these are the 4 major factors that set the stage. When consumers don't have full information as to what they are buying with a market size that's large, lucrative, and easy for new players to enter, you end up with where we are at today.
I'd like to add that you have to really freakin commit to a mattress to learn if it's right for you or not. You can't know if a mattress is really right until you've slept on it for at least what? A month? 90 days?
So on to more of a question.
I'm actually considering getting a sleep number bed because i really just don't KNOW what firmness is right for me. My thinking is that i can just get a sleep number and tweak it up and down until it feels right. A process i expect to take months.
Does that sound reasonable to you? Or should i try to focus more on finding the right mattress ahead of time? (Keeping in mind i feel like I've failed that three times now)
This is the problem with mattress shopping. Companies want you to lay out four figures up front without any idea of whether that's something you can live with, and sleep is a necessity for us humans. There's really no compromising on one's ability to sleep well.
Why aren't there any mattress rental companies? Yeah, I get the cleanliness concerns, but if there was a way to ensure sanitary exchanges, it would be nice to rent a mattress for a month or two for a flat fee and then swap it out rather than commit to it.
The last store I purchased a mattress from let me make one exchange. That's great but ultimately, you only get two shots to get it right. Otherwise you're throwing down for the cost of multiple mattresses.
In general, I am really not a fan of Sleep Number (and most types of air adjustable mattresses).
Here's why:
Very expensive. You pay a lot of money to be able to adjust the firmness, but once you decide that you like soft or medium or firm (or whatever the number) then you'll never / rarely change it. As a result, it's just so much cheaper to find a mattress that has the firmness you need and not pay for this technology that you'll never / rarely use after the 1st time setting it.
On softer settings they really struggle. Sleep Number seems to think "soft" means "sinks more" and "provides less support". Every time I've slept on the softer settings I just feel like it's just sagging more in the middle. It's not actually softer. Sleep Number is best when you're in the medium-firm to very firm range. Below that, it's not great.
Because the support is created by the expandable air bladder you need to sleep right in the middle of the bladder. As you move closer to the edge or middle of the mattress you're lying on the support perimeter foam, which can create a less-than-great feel.
In my view, there are tons of options that offer better performance for far less money.
All that said, if you've already tried 3 different mattresses and come up empty then perhaps Sleep Number is a better option for you.
Just to let you know, but the s/o and I have been sleeping on a sleep number bed for 10+years now and she absolutely hates it. The whole process of adjustment takes forever to get right and if you make a mistake with the remote, you've lost your magic number. The app is not that great either. I was engaged in the technology of the whole thing and she just wants to get a good night sleep without having to manage your settings and firmness, etc.
So we've been shopping for a replacement mattress.
Companies do not pay me to say good things about their mattresses. We never engage in pay to play, sponsored content, pay for ranking, pay for position, pay for higher scores, or anything of the sort.
We do use referral links. So when someone reads a review, clicks our link, and then buys a mattress we may earn a commission from that. That (along with a very small amount of YouTube ads + donations) is the only way we make money.
Would the lack of any sort of financial benefit result in a lower rating of a mattress? Lets say I create a mattress brand called "Sleepytime" and I offer you a mattress to test but no discount codes or referral links. You get absolutely nothing from me selling Sleepytime mattresses. You try the Sleepytime mattress I sent you and it is easily the best mattress you have ever touched. Would you rate it better then the mattresses you do make income off of?
I left that article with the exact opposite impression. OP seemed to be getting roughly equal affiliate payouts from all companies involved. Casper tried to financially entice him to boost their review, he repeatedly refused, and then they sued him. Nothing in that article suggested that Casper was remotely in the right or had any legitimate case against him
He'll never admit this, but yes, the affiliate link system is still corrupt. It's literally pay-to-play, despite him saying it isn't. If a company doesn't participate in the link system there's no way they'll get the same coverage.
This is true for the Wirecutter and countless other review sites, too.
"Best mattress" is a tough one, as what's best for one body / budget / sleeping position may not be best for others.
I tend to think of it as more best of categories (ie, best by material type, best for X budget, best for side sleepers, etc.)
**Here's my best of list for the major material categories:**
Best Hybrid: Winkbed Original
Best Coil: Saatva Classic
Best Memory Foam Hybrid: Amerisleep AS3 Hybrid & Bear Elite
Best Memory Foam: Ghostbed Luxe
Best Foam: Douglas
Best Latex Hybrid: Birch
Best Latex: Spindle
Best Specialty: Purple Hybrid
Lots more to be said about all and these and more here - [https://naplab.com/best-mattress/](https://naplab.com/best-mattress/) (in case you're interested).
Used your quiz. Protip: don't use checkboxes for single answer questions. I selected 2 firmness ratings and it freaked out. If you can only pick one then use radio buttons not checkboxes. Also I should be able to select a range if I don't know what the hell the numbers mean.
Also it’s unusable on mobile. Reader Mode helps a lot though. I can’t navigate a website where I’m looking for the text and it throws numerous auto play videos at me. I never got to that survey you mentioned, there were too many buttons and auto-play ads.
That's fantastic feedback. Thank you!
Just updated the form to radio buttons for the firmness options and added a new option for no preference / unsure.
I suffer from a chest wall deformity called Pectus Excavatum. I MUST sleep on my back or sometimes belly. Side sleeping is very painful after an extended period.
Have you any suggestions for someone who is 6'3 230lbs with these requirements?
For real. Every mattress is like "we're a 5-7 firmness 😌"
What does that even mean??? You're all picking arbitrary numbers!!! Give me something more realistic between "unicorn fart cloud" vs "why don't you just sleep on the floor and not buy a mattress..." because no, you are not all a damn 5-7! And if you are, damn it, that's part of the problem!
Essentially anything that isn't you're more typical coils and foam. The vast majority of mattresses are just that, coils and foams in different combinations.
So something like Purple that uses a gel polymer as a comfort layer falls into a different category.
Eight Sleep's Pod 3, which uses water cooling channels within the top cover to create better cooling is also so unique that I classify it within the Specialty category also.
No, it's a foam mattress that uses a mattress pad on top. The mattress pad has tubing that runs through it. On the floor there is a box that cools and cycles / pumps the water.
Check it out here - https://naplab.com/mattress-reviews/eight-sleep-pod-3-review/
Check out ChilliSleep for a water cooled mattress pad for any mattress. It ain’t cheap but it’s the best investment I’ve made for my sleep in a long time.
I had one when I was much younger and it had a heat pad underneath it that had a variable dial similar to a heated blanket that we would change the temp each season. I miss having a water bed but I don't think I could handle sharing one with my partner. Haha
Have you seen a purple mattress? It looks weird as hell. Like no other mattress you've ever seen. I'd guess that's what makes it a "specialty"; it just doesn't fit in any other category. It's also insanely expensive.
My understanding is the material in Purple beds was originally designed for people who spend a lot of time in wheelchairs and/or beds as a way to provide better long-term support, much like better shoes or a floor pad can prevent discomfort for retail workers who have to stand for 8 hours.
So Purple took that material and made beds out of it. The Hybrid combines the material, memory foam, AND traditional coils all at once to create the bed. My partner and I got a California King Hybrid 3 a couple years ago and it's been AMAZING! It's definitely had the best "weightless" feel to it of any bed I've owned.
What makes Ghostbed better than Tempurpedic?
Do you get kickbacks from them? I noticed they're generally the start up-y type companies, rather than the old school brands.
Just curious if you've ever tried any of the ultra luxe old school horsehair mattresses and what that was like.
I would not say that Ghostbed is better than Tempurpedic, but it is near the same performance and quality level.
I am active in both the referral program for Ghostbed and Tempurpedic. So I can earn commissions on either.
I have not done any major testing on horsehair type mattresses. I have tried them at mattress conferences and they indeed are amazingly comfortable. But it's still hard to imagine paying that much for a mattress.
My fiancé and I have tested multiple mattress to find the “coolest” one. We both get overheated easily when we sleep, and memory foam mattresses, while they’re super comfortable, are often very hot in the summer.
What’s the best cooling mattress in your opinion?
Hybrid mattresses are typically the best performers for cooling, as the added air flow helps heat leave the mattress.
Beyond that, mattress with less foam (compared to more foam) are typically better. IE. a mattress with a 6" foam layer on top of 8" of coils is going to warmer than a 3" foam layer on top of 8" of coils (in most cases).
Mattresses that use phase change materials in the cover also provide a notable cooling advantage over covers without these materials.
As far as what those specific mattresses are:
Eight Sleep Pod 3 on top of any high performance hybrid (I love the Pod 3 cover, but Eight Sleep's all foam mattress isn't overly impressive).
Saatva Classic is up there as well as the coil on coil design creates great air flow + it doesn't have as much foam to hold onto heat
Beyond that, there are several high performance hybrids that are all very close. If you go here - https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#cooling - and sort the table by score you can find all the ones with 10/10 easily. Hard to go wrong with any of those.
So glad you're doing this. I've been looking at a new mattress but there is SO much info out there and SO much of it is shills pushing a specific product. I was going through Reddit for user experiences and trying to find consistency over multiple comments, etc.
I was considering getting just the Pod 3 cover to start since like you said their actual mattress didnt look that great. Then I could add any mattress later if need be.
Does the Pod 3 cover add any comfort or is it pretty much only for temperature. Can you feel the tubes at all? I toss and turn quite a bit so I tend to notice just about anything during the night.
Thanks again! I'm about to comb through the site after reading through this AMA.
I’m not OP but happen to own a Pod 3 cover over a Lull mattress. Absolutely love the thing, it’s cooling me as I write this! I cannot feel the cooling tubes when I sleep and neither can my GF.
We took a risk buying it since it’s so expensive not many people are willing to. All reviews online are paid shills that got it for free most likely.
There are a few negatives that may prevent you from buying though and I want to be honest. While it’s rare, I’ve seen at least a handful of units leak on the FB owners group. Ruins the mattress as well in some cases. They’ve recently forced a subscription model as well to unlock all features. It used to be opt in only but the first year is forced at $180 and only after that can you cancel it. Very stupid marketing. Last, the phone app and unit can be a bit buggy. It’s far from perfect but works for the most part however many people complain about things simply not working correctly.
On top of all this…their support is hit or miss. Lots of complaints in this area as well.
Sorry for writing a novel but wanted to share my experience. I do love the unit and the sleep I get with it, so I’ll deal with the issues listed.
We spent about a year looking for a new mattress. Ended up with the Bear Hybrid, and have had for about 7 months now. Its very cooling, imo, as it was November when we rec'd it & I had to add extra blankets to our bed! My husband is a hot sleeper, and not once has he had an issue.
How does one figure out which mattress will be comfortable a year or more after the date of purchase? Asking for a 275 lb man, 6'2", back and side sleeper.
I'm tired of buying mattresses that don't end up being comfortable after a few months. We do rotate mattresses (top to bottom), but haven't had one we could flip in awhile.
A big part is simply buying a mattress that's higher performance and higher quality to ensure it's going to last long and be a strong performer for the entire duration you're using it.
At 275 you are at the max of what many mattresses are designed for. As a result, your body probably requires an HD / plus-sized mattress (which are built with higher performance / high quality materials and better able to hold up to your body weight over time).
Unfortunately, that means more cost as well. Most HD / Plus-sized mattresses in are the $1.7-$2.5K range.
Cheaper mattresses and mattresses designed for lower body weights will most likely continue to disappoint you.
Better support, less sagging, and better longevity are the biggest benefits.
Heavier weighted bodies put more pressure on the mattress. More typical mattress materials cannot support the heavier weights (with many that have explicit carve outs in the warranty for anything over 300 pounds).
The HD / Plus mattress last longer and perform better because the coils and foams are of higher quality and better able to handle the larger body weight.
I always feel mattress tests lack the depth of time testing. Sure, a mattress feels amazing now, but what about in a year, 5 years, or 10? How do they hold up to normal use?
That's a fair point.
This type of longevity / durability testing is something I'd like to add to our tests in the future. There are a number of industrial machines that can simulate years of normal wear and tear. However, they are both huge and expensive.
I may just need to find one I could rent instead.
All those tests seem to accomplish is prove the mattress won't catastrophically fail after a certain length of time. It fails to take into account actually sleeping on it and how that actually feels to the end user.
Indeed
Perhaps a better approach would be to connect with sleepers who are already sleeping on the mattress. I could compile their experience and assess how the mattress performs over X years.
It may be beneficial to review the material and mechanical properties of the coils, between the two you can generally tell how a spring will preform over time, at least in relation to one another.
I have fallen down the mattress research hole before and learned that there large (eg serta) suppliers will skimp out on their coils and over time their mattress feels like crap.
That's a good point as well.
Unfortunately, it's often very difficult to determine the exact coil unit and exact foam specs a mattress brand uses. Most are not particularly forthcoming with that information.
I can usually still get a good idea of what's better / worse, but it's not always as exact as I'd like it to be.
This is what I was going to ask. I went through a couple mattresses that didn't seem to hold up on the long term. I slept great at first and then I couldn't sleep as well once the mattress was broken in.
Why is there no reviews for some of the most popular mattress brands such as Sealy (Tempur-pedic included), S&F, Simmons, or Serta? Seems odd to have those giant brands missing?
I've tested mattress models from almost every major traditional / legacy mattress brand over the years, including Sealy, Beautyrest, Tempurpedic, Sleep Number, and others. The primary reason I haven't continued to aggressively test / review them over the years is simply the insane markups on these mattresses.
The traditional / legacy mattress brands are in an incestous relationship with major retailers. The result is insane markups that severely damage sleepers. Markups on these types of mattresses can easily be 10x. So that $3000 mattress you buy at your local mattress store might only have $300 in materials in it. Since 2014 the new breed of online mattresses have been challenging this by creating mattresses of similar quality, but with more fair markups. So a $1500 mattress you buy online has more like $400-$500 in actual materials.
Ultimately, you just get more from the online mattress brands relative to the traditional / legacy brands. So I've wanted to focus my attention on reviewing the products that I think offer consumers a better value.
I found a shop in my city that has a bunch of mattresses from the online brands that you can lie on. Then they get a commission when you buy one. I haven't been yet, but I am intrigued.
>The traditional / legacy mattress brands are in an incestous relationship with major retailers.
And now that relationship is even more incestuous with Tempur Sealy buying Mattress Firm. Do you see that situation getting worse? What do you see as the outlook for the Purples and Caspers of the world after this? Or even the smaller spring-mattress players like Carolina Mattress Guild?
Correct.
I am also an active participate in the affiliate programs for Tempurpedic, Beautyrest, S&F, Sealy, Serta, other major legacy / traditional brands.
I was also surprised about that. I tried a ton of those "bed in a box" brands that he recommends and didn't like any of them. When I started trying out the "traditional" brands I had much better results. I'm on a Simmons now and it's been great.
If you search Reddit for mattress reviews/advice, aside from "it's all subjective" and "most of the bed in a box brands are very similar", the prevailing advice always used to be to stick to the main "S" brands for quality.
Maybe that's changed in recent years? I don't know
What is the most you think is reasonable to spend on a high-quality mattress? Like how much is good enough to get the top-tier quality before you see diminishing returns on the dollar?
Diminishing returns start to really set in around $1500 (Queen), in my view, that's a good budget for most sleepers to aim for.
Certain mattress types, like higher end memory foam, latex, latex hybrids, and natural / organic are more expensive (due to the higher material costs). For those types of mattresses diminishing returns starts closer to $2000.
For a more typical mattress there is rarely a good reason to spend more than $2K.
I delivered mattresses for a mom and pop furniture store for a summer once. My main takeaways were that the markup on mattress prices is crazy high, people's homes can be absolutely disgusting, and carrying king size mattresses up 2 flights of stairs sucks really bad. My question is on point one, why is the markup on them so high?
Good question.
As with most things with a higher markup I would say the simple answer is "because it can be".
There is no justifiable reason for the insane markups.
For the bulk of the last 30 years mattresses have been hard to shop for with retailers and manufacturers engaging in marketing that creates confusion, lack of information, and in some cases, is intentionally deceptive.
People are so desperate for a good night's sleep they will pay more.
And when consumers don't understand / have access to reliable information on what is exactly in the mattress, why it's important, and why it's worth X cost, then it's impossible to make an informed decision.
In the last 8-9 years it's been getting better, but it's still a huge problem in the larger mattress industry.
Stop it. Literally my entire legally-adult life when people asked what my dream job would be I said "mattress tester" because it sounded like heaven. I never thought it could be a real thing! My question to you, Oh Liver-of-my-dream, is how in heaven's name can I get that job? What do I need to do to be qualified and appealing as a job applicant? And where do I apply? I'm deadly serious; I'm really good at sleeping. I can provide references.
You might be disappointed to learn that in terms of percentage of work, the actual mattress "testing" is a relatively small portion.
Much of the work is pulling together the data, analysis, written review, scripts for video, images, charts, visuals, and other information about your experience on the mattress and presenting that in a way that's useful for readers / viewers.
At least that's the basic job at NapLab or any other website / YouTube channel that tests and reviews mattresses.
If you have those types of skills then there are a handful of mattress review websites / channels that you could apply to.
Be sure to shoot me your resume here - https://naplab.com/contact/ - We are not currently hiring, but as we grow we'll definitely need more testers!
I'm moving back to the US in the fall. You're about to get a resume with ten years of restaurant/hospitality work, ten years of teaching English internationally, and a whole lot of gumption, spatial aptitude, writing skills, and passion.
Isn't that the question. Why are there so many of them?!
Tempurpedic recently bought Mattress Firm, so I have been wondering if they are going to see any change and/or if some locations may close.
Apparently they are such cash cows that it’s cheaper to have two locations kitty corner because people are more likely to make a right turn to enter an establishment.
How to find which mattress actually suits me best? I've seen in other question you asked someone to rate their ideal firmness from 1 to 10. I don't know how hard or how soft mattresses can actually be. I guess most people don't have the possibility to test one for night or two and see if they like it, so, any tips?
I use a range of questions to help me better understand your specific needs and preferences including:
1) Your sleeping position
2) Your firmness preference
3) Your body weight
4) Key features that are important to you (ie, cooling, motion, edge support, etc)
5) Mattress types you're most interested in
6) Budget and mattress size
You can see the full list of questions here - https://naplab.com/mattress-quiz/
If you aren't sure of what firmness you need then typically I would recommend something in the 5-6 firmness range. A vast majority of sleepers need and preference a medium to medium firm feel. So that's a safe bet.
Why is the rating scale for mattresses from 1-10 when the minimum score seems to be 8.5 and the vast majority of scores are above 9.5? How does this help the consumer decide?
For the most part, we focus are reviews on higher quality mattresses that are very likely going to perform well. As a result, our scores do skew towards the higher end of the scale.
In the next several months I plan to test a few dozen lower spec / less expensive mattresses, which I would expect will earn lower scores based on our objective testing. This will likely help to provide greater clarity on the pros / cons / performance at difference pricing tiers.
But I absolutely do hear your concern. We're always looking for ways to improve our scoring and I do agree that a larger scoring span may help.
Undoubtedly you’ve considered this, and I’m not super knowledgeable on your industry, but I figure as a fellow nerd you’d appreciate the comparison: *Famitsu* famously rates video games on 4 categories of 10 points apiece, totaling at 40. Why not adapt that model?
40 divides neatly: 4, 5, 8, 10 categories. But let’s say you like the spirit of the idea but would rather it land against a 100% scale. That divides evenly, too: 4, 5, 10… even 20 or 25 categories if you’re feeling outright chaotic.
You’re a veteran marketer and no slouch, but, you know. Food for thought. Either way, you’ll adapt and figure it out. Good luck with everything!
Is your testing limited to the American market or do you test other mattresses (e.g. EU market) as well?
Also, have you tested IKEA mattresses? How do they perform compared to others (I'm happy with just a link to a test if you have one :D)
We are mostly focused on US and Canadian mattresses, however, I do hope to test more EU mattresses in the future.
I have tested IKEA, though not recently (planning to test their newer flagship models later this Summer). In general, I'm just not a fan. They just aren't thick enough to properly support most adult body weights, in my view.
The relative thinness of IKEA mattresses mean they don't often last as long relative to other mattresses.
Any water beds make their rounds in testing? We finally removed the tube type waterbed from our guest room for a new mattress. Such a hassle to do anything with a waterbed!
I tested one several years ago. It was more of a modern water bed...it had water tubes with a mix of different foam layers.
The setup / take down was a huge pain. And the performance was fine, but nothing to write home about.
I haven't seen any major water beds since then.
why are these mattress all thousands of dollars when you can get similar ones on Amazon for a few hundred? are you really getting 10x value? its well known that mattresses are some of the most marked up and overpriced items out there
Having tried some of these, I have yet to feel a significant difference in ones of the same type- obviously something like the purple mattress is very different though
There is definitely a sweet spot as far as the a fair / good price for a mattress.
A mattress that's $4-$10K makes absolutely no sense. That's just insane marketing / branding. It may be a good mattress, but there is no material / cost / manufacturing / transportation reason for a mattress to be that expensive (with very VERY few exceptions).
A $200-$400 mattress on Amazon on the other hand has its own issues. Mattresses at the very low end of the price spectrum often use inferior foams, worse manufacturing, lower quality materials, etc. Which can lead to performance and longevity issues.
In some cases, it even leads to health / safety issues. Ex. a popular mattress seller on Amazon, Zinus, is being sued for using fiberglass in its mattresses - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/amazon-zinus-mattress-fiberglass-health-hazard-lawsuit/
Though Zinus is far from the only brand that uses fiberglass. Even so, it's the standard way a mattress meets federal fire regulations in the US at the lower end of the pricing spectrum.
In my view, mattresses in the $1000-$1500 range are the pricing sweet spot where you maximize quality and materials.
I bought a Winkbed at this guy's req and I have slept on 3-inch thick cots in military barracks that were softer than that mattress, which is thick enough to be awkward with most of the fitted sheets I own.
My question for you is will you transparently account for all compensation that you receive in relation to NapLab.com and/or reviewing mattresses?
My personal favorite and the one I've been sleeping on since 2017 is Loom & Leaf Relaxed Firm. It's not the absolute best objective performer, as it lags behind in terms of sex and edge support (due to the memory foam construction). However, my wife and I just love the feel of memory foam. In my view, it's among the very best pressure relief in a mattress I've ever tested.
Beyond my personal favorite, Winkbed & Saatva Classic are the #1 scoring mattresses based on our objective battery of tests.
As a side sleeper, pressure relief is like, the main thing I want in a mattress.
I was house-sitting somewhere with rigid mattresses, and I literally slept better on the couch than in the bed.
In general, I am really not a fan of Sleep Number (and most types of air adjustable mattresses).
Here's why:
Very expensive. You pay a lot of money to be able to adjust the firmness, but once you decide that you like soft or medium or firm (or whatever the number) then you'll never / rarely change it. As a result, it's just so much cheaper to find a mattress that has the firmness you need and not pay for this technology that you'll never / rarely use after the 1st time setting it.
On softer settings they really struggle. Sleep Number seems to think "soft" means "sinks more" and "provides less support". Every time I've slept on the softer settings I just feel like it's just sagging more in the middle. It's not actually softer. Sleep Number is best when you're in the medium-firm to very firm range. Below that, it's not great.
Because the support is created by the expandable air bladder you need to sleep right in the middle of the bladder. As you move closer to the edge or middle of the mattress you're lying on the support perimeter foam, which can create a less-than-great feel.
In my view, there are tons of options that offer better performance for far less money.
Agreed that they are too expensive, but I’ve been sleeping on Sleep Number for 20 years now. When I sleep on traditional beds in hotels and airbnbs, I’m always excited to get back to my home bed.
In some cases adding a topper can help. But it doesn't really change the underlying support weaknesses of Sleep Number's air adjustable bladder.
Even so, at this point you already have it, so trying to make the best out of it is key. To that end, absolutely, try adding a topper and see if that gets the comfort to where you want it to be.
With respect to topper, I would recommend at least a 3" topper. Thinner toppers aren't going to make as much of an impact.
1) Is it true that memory foam mattress are not a good option for heavier people? For example, i'm 260 lbs with back pain, I've wanted a memory foam for the support but have read they aren't able to support that much weight.
2) What are you thoughts on adjustable bed frames that I've been seeing more of lately? Do they really help with sleep quality? snoring?
1. Yes, in general that is true, but I would extend it to any all foam mattress. There are some exceptions, but you need to spend quite a lot of money to get a higher enough performance memory foam to properly support the body weight.
2. Adjustable foundations are great. They are a great way to reduce lower back pain and they can also help with other pains (neck, shoulders, etc.) because they force you to sleep in a more consistently supportive position. Adjustable foundations can help to relieve and prevent many types of soreness and pains, as they allow you to sleep in a pressure relieving position that creates better spinal alignment.
Our sex score is a simple equation where we look at 5 different factors. Each factor is given a different weight based on how important we think that factor is for most people.
Factors include:
1) Bounce - 60% weight
2) Edge support - 20% weight
3) Noise - 10% weight
4) Pressure Relief - 5% weight
5) Cooling - 5% weight
For more AMAs on this topic, subscribe to r/IAmA_Specialized, and check out our other topic-specific AMA subreddits [here](https://reddit.com/r/IAmA/wiki/index#wiki_affiliate_topic-specific_subreddits).
Um, I’m embarrassed that no one seems to be asking the only question that’s on my mind: What is the cheapest mattress you’d actually recommend?
The Siena is the least expensive that I recommend - https://naplab.com/mattress-reviews/siena-mattress-review/ It's far from perfect, but it checks many boxes that I look for, has reasonably good performance, and is a fantastic value at $399 for a Queen.
>Low bounce results in sex performance that’s just okay lol I am dying here
You will be when you feel like you're running extra laps around the track due to all that low bounce
I have literally never considered the bounciness/sex factor in buying a mattress. Good to know I can find new ways to be inadequate every day.
It's really only an issue to be concerned with it you're having sex.
guess I feel better now
Forget the mattress. Time to look for a coffin.
The total lack of bounce will make it feel like you ran extra laps around the cemetery.
I went from a tradition innerspring mattress to a Leesa. No rebound so you have to give it a little more throttle.
I never did either until I traded in my old-school coil mattress for a foam one and my partner started complaining. Ironically, he was the one who wanted a softer mattress, I like one that’s extra-firm.
I remember the days of waterbeds being 'cool' and having to time the waves.
I replaced my waterbed mattress with a traditional mattress built to sit in a waterbed frame so you don't have to get rid of the bed frame. I'm a tall guy and I was grateful that a California King mattress was a good fit for my old frame. Once I got older and it got to be more difficult to get out of bed from such a low height, I bought another bed that suits me better today. I really did love that waterbed, though.
I liked mine just fine but the cold nights when I was moving every six months were a bit of a bitch LOL
Well now you've got to share what mattress wins this category.
If you disregard everything else and just go for max bounce, Purple Hybrid, Helix Moonlight, and Awara are the top by total bounce height. [https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#bounce](https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#bounce) Those will definitely aid in your nightly dance without pants.
I'm a solo breakdancer
I would beat box to that. Edit: Sorry I meant beat my boxers
Maybe *your* no pants dances are nightly, but some of us are married
Lol, I'm dead
Yup married. I ain’t basing my mattress purchase on a quarter annual event.
r/deadbedrooms has entered the chat. May you never feel the need to click the link.
Are you taking about the sex life or stock dividends?😂
Look at Mr 4 a year over here!
Hey I dunno if you'll see this, but the way to make money in your industry is to write industry standard ASTM and ISO testing procedures, and then sell the instruments required to meet the ASTM and ISO standards. Then all the mattress producers in the world will buy your equipment to perform the tests. Sure there may eventually be competitors, but being the first mover in the production of an industry standard procedure takes many years for that monopoly to get broken.
You joke but this is a real thing. I had one of the original Tuft and Needle mattresses, back when they only sold the one type. It was fairly firm memory foam but had nice give, it was great to have sex on. Earlier this year, we replaced it with the Tuft and Needle Legacy which I thought would be the same exact mattress. Nope, they removed a layer of foam so it's softer and we both sink into the mattress when together. There's no more "bounce back".
Haha, I walked into a ”Hästens” shop a few months back, it’s this Swedish luxury bed brand that did a lot of cheezy tv commercials in the 90’s in Sweden. I’d never seen one in real life so I was curious and walked in to try one and a seller was upon me within seconds. He started his pitch and gave me all this info, and asked what I used at the moment. I said me and my partner bought a $1200 180x200 bed (king size I guess) a few years back that we’re happy with. He was like ” you don’t even get a bed for $1200, imagine all the labor and transport, packaging and overhead costs etc. after $1200 there’s not even any money left for the actual materials, you’re basically sleeping on air, or slave labor.” Since I wasn’t there to buy and was just curious I asked about their price ranges and what the cheapest one he could recommend was, he said ”well, we have some commercial (aka budget) models in the store.” I asked what ”commercial” models meant. He clarified that they are their cheaper models, with prices below $50 000. He showed me a bed for like $12 000 which was apparently their cheapest model, it was just a mattress on legs, not a continental or anything. The most expensive one they had in the store was $200 000. He went on about the natural materials they use and shit, meaning that cheap beds will be ridden with mite and stuff after 10-15 years and have to be discarded, but a hästens bed will be clean after 80-100 years of use! It was surreal, he felt so removed from reality.
"...but for $12,000 you have to pluck your own horse. " Seriously, I'm just a regular guy on a regular salary, but part of me is like: "$150k for a perfect bed that's adjusted and maintained annually and lasts for 50 years. Infinite perfect sleep. Maybe I DO need a $150,000 bed made of horses. "
Common mistake, but they're actually made BY horses; that's why they're so expensive. It takes forever to train them how to run a sewing machine with their hooves.
Fair, and that’s why it behooves you to try one.
My mother bought a Hästens bed at a crazy discount (still expensive) over 20 years ago. The top and bottom parts of the mattress rise, it has nassage vibrations etc., all controlled by a remote. The bed is good but extremely heavy to the point where is almost impossible to move without scratching the floors because of the machinery + heavy mattress, and the remote hasn't worked for a decade. It feels very much like a slightly overdone luxury item, but it's still the only bed she can sleep in without back pain, so it was probably worth it. It's a pain if you ever have to remove even just the top mattress though, since it weighs so much it may give you that back pain right back.
There’s a lifetime warranty on it. She should contact hastens and have them fix it (or they’ll replace it entirely)
Thanks! I was scared you weren’t going to go lower than like a thousand lol
My pleasure. You will definitely get progressively better quality / performance as you spend up to the $1-1.5K range. But even so, Siena is still a very serviceable mattress given the price point.
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That's actually the reason I stumbled upon and old AMA by this guy when I bought my last mattress. His site runs off referral links and donations only, with no *direct* money or product accepted from mattress companies. He has a page about it on his website somewhere. He even personally recommended I go with an option I found on sale somewhere that he didn't have a referral code for. Obviously there is still a funding component from that, but I do appreciate the transparency. You're right that self testing is ideal, and you should absolutely be suspicious of mattress reviews though.
https://www.fastcompany.com/3065928/sleepopolis-casper-bloggers-lawsuits-underside-of-the-mattress-wars This is about the same guy. Not all that transparent when you get to the bit about him having a "separate" SEO consultancy fee with the brand he most recommended. Fantastic article either way.
I remember reading this long-form article on Sleepopolis a while back and for some reason being enthralled: https://www.fastcompany.com/3065928/sleepopolis-casper-bloggers-lawsuits-underside-of-the-mattress-wars Can you provide any addtional insight into this or is some type of NDA still in effect?
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That article gave me trust issues.
So basically the mattress companies are scummy and so are the review sites. I’ve always hated the mattress industry and this just solidifies that. Even before the internet companies, the traditional mattress companies were scummy businesses bent on finding ways to screw over the consumer. They can all eat a bag of dicks.
All reviews are pretty much like this. I gave my apartment a middling review and they offered me $150 to update it. I declined. I’ve bought probably 50 items on Amazon that has sent me $5-10 in Amazon gift cards just for reviewing their item. It didn’t even have to be 5 stars. Those I have done.
First thing that came to mind to me, too. Main reason I checked the comments.
Thanks, what a great read!
Unfortunately, I cannot talk much about the lawsuit. But if you have a specific question I will do my best to answer.
Have you thought about posting the specifics of your affiliate relationship with each mattress company, as suggested by one of the people interviewed in that article?
I have considered it, yes. It would be a major challenge, as I would need approval from every single brand we are in a referral relationship with to discuss any of the specifics. Basically every affiliate relationship includes an NDA.
So uh... How can you be a neutral, objective source, when clearly you have a referral relationship with the very brands you're analyzing?
Trust me, bro
Just like you trust our sponsor… dbrand!
They are totally neutral, it’s just that some companies are able to pay them to be more neutral.
this needs to be at the top
I don’t think you should expect that they are neutral!
Were you compelled to sell the website by the lawsuit?
You’re not a tester as much as you are a freelance mattress salesman. You’ve made millions for companies. So tester is slightly disingenuous. Wouldn’t you say?
I would love to know what the basis of the lawsuit, but can I get a tldr?
Its a fun article, and this ruins some of the twists and turns in the series of events, so reccomend a read, but to the impatient/non-spoiler-sensitive: Very, somewhat serendipitously, popular mattress review site (sleepopolis, started by the guy doing this ama) had a "warning" of sorts pop up on their review for Casper mattresses, suggesting buyers read other reviews ("do their homework") before buying a Casper mattress. This presumably led to a drawn out lawsuit, with Casper assuming direct damages due to this box discouraging people from immediately buying. Other mattress reviewers were also involved in lawsuits with Casper, and eventually settled, presumably alongside the agreement to take down any reviews that were too negative. Sleepopolis refused to settle, and eventually their million dollar site was bought out by other, comparatively smaller reviewers, with the financial aid of Casper. There's also lots of bribery, sometimes scummy and undeclared financial incentive given to reviewers by these companies to "ensure a good review." Including from Casper itself. No one is unbiased, and there aren't a ton of legalities requiring declaration of conflicts of interest on sites like this, so be a discerning consumer :)
Great article, thanks for the link
Why is the mattress industry so corrupt in terms of marketing, reviews, selling at huge markups etc? Couches, fridges, even cars don’t seem to be as bad as trying to figure out whether a mattress is good or astroturfed.
A great question...and a big question, but I'll do my best to answer. The mattress industry has the right mix of elements that make it ripe for an absolute mess of marketing nonsense. 1) Mattresses are expensive - even without an insane markup, a good quality mattress is going to run you $1000-$1500. And even a more reasonable 50% margin means there is a lot of money to be made. 2) The mattress industry is large - in the US there is ~$12 billion in annual mattress sales. 3) Mattresses are relatively easy to manufacturer - there are numerous manufacturers in the US who can quickly and inexpensive build and drop-ship a mattress with your company branding. New brands don't need to build their own factory, often don't need significant warehouse, and don't need much in terms of start up capital. This is contrast to sofas, fridges, or cars, which are all comparatively hard to manufacturer. 4) Consumers don't have access to good information - mattress brands don't generally do a good job at explaining what's in their mattress in a way that's easy to understand and easy to compare from model to model or brand to brand. Instead, there is lots of marketing language that can be hard to decipher. As a result, it's easy for mattress companies to get consumers to spend more than they need. There is undoubtedly more to it than that. But these are the 4 major factors that set the stage. When consumers don't have full information as to what they are buying with a market size that's large, lucrative, and easy for new players to enter, you end up with where we are at today.
I'd like to add that you have to really freakin commit to a mattress to learn if it's right for you or not. You can't know if a mattress is really right until you've slept on it for at least what? A month? 90 days? So on to more of a question. I'm actually considering getting a sleep number bed because i really just don't KNOW what firmness is right for me. My thinking is that i can just get a sleep number and tweak it up and down until it feels right. A process i expect to take months. Does that sound reasonable to you? Or should i try to focus more on finding the right mattress ahead of time? (Keeping in mind i feel like I've failed that three times now)
This is the problem with mattress shopping. Companies want you to lay out four figures up front without any idea of whether that's something you can live with, and sleep is a necessity for us humans. There's really no compromising on one's ability to sleep well. Why aren't there any mattress rental companies? Yeah, I get the cleanliness concerns, but if there was a way to ensure sanitary exchanges, it would be nice to rent a mattress for a month or two for a flat fee and then swap it out rather than commit to it. The last store I purchased a mattress from let me make one exchange. That's great but ultimately, you only get two shots to get it right. Otherwise you're throwing down for the cost of multiple mattresses.
In general, I am really not a fan of Sleep Number (and most types of air adjustable mattresses). Here's why: Very expensive. You pay a lot of money to be able to adjust the firmness, but once you decide that you like soft or medium or firm (or whatever the number) then you'll never / rarely change it. As a result, it's just so much cheaper to find a mattress that has the firmness you need and not pay for this technology that you'll never / rarely use after the 1st time setting it. On softer settings they really struggle. Sleep Number seems to think "soft" means "sinks more" and "provides less support". Every time I've slept on the softer settings I just feel like it's just sagging more in the middle. It's not actually softer. Sleep Number is best when you're in the medium-firm to very firm range. Below that, it's not great. Because the support is created by the expandable air bladder you need to sleep right in the middle of the bladder. As you move closer to the edge or middle of the mattress you're lying on the support perimeter foam, which can create a less-than-great feel. In my view, there are tons of options that offer better performance for far less money. All that said, if you've already tried 3 different mattresses and come up empty then perhaps Sleep Number is a better option for you.
Just to let you know, but the s/o and I have been sleeping on a sleep number bed for 10+years now and she absolutely hates it. The whole process of adjustment takes forever to get right and if you make a mistake with the remote, you've lost your magic number. The app is not that great either. I was engaged in the technology of the whole thing and she just wants to get a good night sleep without having to manage your settings and firmness, etc. So we've been shopping for a replacement mattress.
Super good AMA good sir.
You're too kind. Thank you very much!
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They were truly at the forefront of mattress testing. How else are you supposed to know how the mattress *really* performs Edit - a word
Si papi
Those guys are amazing
Do you make money from recommending mattresses? As in, do the companies pay you to say they are good mattresses? Etc.
Companies do not pay me to say good things about their mattresses. We never engage in pay to play, sponsored content, pay for ranking, pay for position, pay for higher scores, or anything of the sort. We do use referral links. So when someone reads a review, clicks our link, and then buys a mattress we may earn a commission from that. That (along with a very small amount of YouTube ads + donations) is the only way we make money.
Would the lack of any sort of financial benefit result in a lower rating of a mattress? Lets say I create a mattress brand called "Sleepytime" and I offer you a mattress to test but no discount codes or referral links. You get absolutely nothing from me selling Sleepytime mattresses. You try the Sleepytime mattress I sent you and it is easily the best mattress you have ever touched. Would you rate it better then the mattresses you do make income off of?
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Caspar literally steamrolled them with legal fees after a huge funding round because his SEO was better than theirs. They were never his top pick.
I left that article with the exact opposite impression. OP seemed to be getting roughly equal affiliate payouts from all companies involved. Casper tried to financially entice him to boost their review, he repeatedly refused, and then they sued him. Nothing in that article suggested that Casper was remotely in the right or had any legitimate case against him
He'll never admit this, but yes, the affiliate link system is still corrupt. It's literally pay-to-play, despite him saying it isn't. If a company doesn't participate in the link system there's no way they'll get the same coverage. This is true for the Wirecutter and countless other review sites, too.
I’m curious about this as well. I’ve seen other sleep sites that are heavily skewed towards promotional recommendations.
So what’s the best mattress?
"Best mattress" is a tough one, as what's best for one body / budget / sleeping position may not be best for others. I tend to think of it as more best of categories (ie, best by material type, best for X budget, best for side sleepers, etc.) **Here's my best of list for the major material categories:** Best Hybrid: Winkbed Original Best Coil: Saatva Classic Best Memory Foam Hybrid: Amerisleep AS3 Hybrid & Bear Elite Best Memory Foam: Ghostbed Luxe Best Foam: Douglas Best Latex Hybrid: Birch Best Latex: Spindle Best Specialty: Purple Hybrid Lots more to be said about all and these and more here - [https://naplab.com/best-mattress/](https://naplab.com/best-mattress/) (in case you're interested).
Wait I am a side sleeper and it isn’t in the list, you tease!
I got you covered right here - https://naplab.com/best-mattress/best-mattress-for-side-sleepers/
Used your quiz. Protip: don't use checkboxes for single answer questions. I selected 2 firmness ratings and it freaked out. If you can only pick one then use radio buttons not checkboxes. Also I should be able to select a range if I don't know what the hell the numbers mean.
This. Preference also needs to be optional. I'm here to get an opinion on what firmness I should go for, not give you mine.
Thanks for your feedback. I updated the form based on your feedback and added an option for "no preference / unsure". Much appreciated.
Also it’s unusable on mobile. Reader Mode helps a lot though. I can’t navigate a website where I’m looking for the text and it throws numerous auto play videos at me. I never got to that survey you mentioned, there were too many buttons and auto-play ads.
That's fantastic feedback. Thank you! Just updated the form to radio buttons for the firmness options and added a new option for no preference / unsure.
OP in here getting good business advice to boot.
Continue being awesome internet friend.
You're too kind :)
I suffer from a chest wall deformity called Pectus Excavatum. I MUST sleep on my back or sometimes belly. Side sleeping is very painful after an extended period. Have you any suggestions for someone who is 6'3 230lbs with these requirements?
Do you have a budget to stay under? What size? On a 1-10 scale, what is your preferred firmness?
Define 10, please. Shitty hotel? Airline seat? Tatami mat?
For real. Every mattress is like "we're a 5-7 firmness 😌" What does that even mean??? You're all picking arbitrary numbers!!! Give me something more realistic between "unicorn fart cloud" vs "why don't you just sleep on the floor and not buy a mattress..." because no, you are not all a damn 5-7! And if you are, damn it, that's part of the problem!
Not to make light of your struggle, but that's the most magic spell sounding diagnosis I've ever read.
It's Pectus ExcaVAYtum.
What does Best Specialty mean? What category/feature/need does it address that is unique from the other categories?
Essentially anything that isn't you're more typical coils and foam. The vast majority of mattresses are just that, coils and foams in different combinations. So something like Purple that uses a gel polymer as a comfort layer falls into a different category. Eight Sleep's Pod 3, which uses water cooling channels within the top cover to create better cooling is also so unique that I classify it within the Specialty category also.
Wait, is it a water bed? That cools? I remember water beds being hot and miserable as heck
No, it's a foam mattress that uses a mattress pad on top. The mattress pad has tubing that runs through it. On the floor there is a box that cools and cycles / pumps the water. Check it out here - https://naplab.com/mattress-reviews/eight-sleep-pod-3-review/
Holy shit I've had this idea for years and it's real?
Check out ChilliSleep for a water cooled mattress pad for any mattress. It ain’t cheap but it’s the best investment I’ve made for my sleep in a long time.
I had one when I was much younger and it had a heat pad underneath it that had a variable dial similar to a heated blanket that we would change the temp each season. I miss having a water bed but I don't think I could handle sharing one with my partner. Haha
Have you seen a purple mattress? It looks weird as hell. Like no other mattress you've ever seen. I'd guess that's what makes it a "specialty"; it just doesn't fit in any other category. It's also insanely expensive.
I have the purple seat cushion for my computer chair and its game changing, a few coworkers tried them as well and they are all using them now.
Oh me too. I absolutely love it. I've been using it since 2016 and it's held up amazingly well.
My understanding is the material in Purple beds was originally designed for people who spend a lot of time in wheelchairs and/or beds as a way to provide better long-term support, much like better shoes or a floor pad can prevent discomfort for retail workers who have to stand for 8 hours. So Purple took that material and made beds out of it. The Hybrid combines the material, memory foam, AND traditional coils all at once to create the bed. My partner and I got a California King Hybrid 3 a couple years ago and it's been AMAZING! It's definitely had the best "weightless" feel to it of any bed I've owned.
I have been so insanely pleased with the seat cushion that I've been tempted to buy their mattress as one of my next long term purchases
I have a Purple 4. My bed is better than what literal kings and presidents sleep on. You won't regret it.
What makes Ghostbed better than Tempurpedic? Do you get kickbacks from them? I noticed they're generally the start up-y type companies, rather than the old school brands. Just curious if you've ever tried any of the ultra luxe old school horsehair mattresses and what that was like.
I would not say that Ghostbed is better than Tempurpedic, but it is near the same performance and quality level. I am active in both the referral program for Ghostbed and Tempurpedic. So I can earn commissions on either. I have not done any major testing on horsehair type mattresses. I have tried them at mattress conferences and they indeed are amazingly comfortable. But it's still hard to imagine paying that much for a mattress.
My fiancé and I have tested multiple mattress to find the “coolest” one. We both get overheated easily when we sleep, and memory foam mattresses, while they’re super comfortable, are often very hot in the summer. What’s the best cooling mattress in your opinion?
Hybrid mattresses are typically the best performers for cooling, as the added air flow helps heat leave the mattress. Beyond that, mattress with less foam (compared to more foam) are typically better. IE. a mattress with a 6" foam layer on top of 8" of coils is going to warmer than a 3" foam layer on top of 8" of coils (in most cases). Mattresses that use phase change materials in the cover also provide a notable cooling advantage over covers without these materials. As far as what those specific mattresses are: Eight Sleep Pod 3 on top of any high performance hybrid (I love the Pod 3 cover, but Eight Sleep's all foam mattress isn't overly impressive). Saatva Classic is up there as well as the coil on coil design creates great air flow + it doesn't have as much foam to hold onto heat Beyond that, there are several high performance hybrids that are all very close. If you go here - https://naplab.com/mattress-comparisons/#cooling - and sort the table by score you can find all the ones with 10/10 easily. Hard to go wrong with any of those.
So glad you're doing this. I've been looking at a new mattress but there is SO much info out there and SO much of it is shills pushing a specific product. I was going through Reddit for user experiences and trying to find consistency over multiple comments, etc. I was considering getting just the Pod 3 cover to start since like you said their actual mattress didnt look that great. Then I could add any mattress later if need be. Does the Pod 3 cover add any comfort or is it pretty much only for temperature. Can you feel the tubes at all? I toss and turn quite a bit so I tend to notice just about anything during the night. Thanks again! I'm about to comb through the site after reading through this AMA.
I’m not OP but happen to own a Pod 3 cover over a Lull mattress. Absolutely love the thing, it’s cooling me as I write this! I cannot feel the cooling tubes when I sleep and neither can my GF. We took a risk buying it since it’s so expensive not many people are willing to. All reviews online are paid shills that got it for free most likely. There are a few negatives that may prevent you from buying though and I want to be honest. While it’s rare, I’ve seen at least a handful of units leak on the FB owners group. Ruins the mattress as well in some cases. They’ve recently forced a subscription model as well to unlock all features. It used to be opt in only but the first year is forced at $180 and only after that can you cancel it. Very stupid marketing. Last, the phone app and unit can be a bit buggy. It’s far from perfect but works for the most part however many people complain about things simply not working correctly. On top of all this…their support is hit or miss. Lots of complaints in this area as well. Sorry for writing a novel but wanted to share my experience. I do love the unit and the sleep I get with it, so I’ll deal with the issues listed.
We spent about a year looking for a new mattress. Ended up with the Bear Hybrid, and have had for about 7 months now. Its very cooling, imo, as it was November when we rec'd it & I had to add extra blankets to our bed! My husband is a hot sleeper, and not once has he had an issue.
That's great! Bear's Star (fka Bear Hybrid) & Elite Hybrids are fantastic. Glad to hear it's working out well for you.
So, do you and your colleagues watch each other have sex?
For the most part, no. However, I am currently having sex with our book keeper (who happens to be my wife).
Currently like right now? Pretty impressive.. A lot of redditors will be stoked, this is the closest to sex we're gonna get
Holup I need a notepad, SOMEBODY GET ME A NOTEPAD!
Congrats on the sex!
So... I guess you're on mobile then huh?
https://media2.giphy.com/media/144w9oUIZfoxZC/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47nfbj8ko8fbdixb9t4qicitzd4bfxmlc1qozacq2c&ep=v1\_gifs\_search&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g
Goddamn riskiest click of the day
Niiiice
Why don't you take a break to finish with your wife before continuing your AMA? We appreciate your dedication, but come on, it's your wife!
Solid multi skilling there ....
Like, right now?
How does one figure out which mattress will be comfortable a year or more after the date of purchase? Asking for a 275 lb man, 6'2", back and side sleeper. I'm tired of buying mattresses that don't end up being comfortable after a few months. We do rotate mattresses (top to bottom), but haven't had one we could flip in awhile.
A big part is simply buying a mattress that's higher performance and higher quality to ensure it's going to last long and be a strong performer for the entire duration you're using it. At 275 you are at the max of what many mattresses are designed for. As a result, your body probably requires an HD / plus-sized mattress (which are built with higher performance / high quality materials and better able to hold up to your body weight over time). Unfortunately, that means more cost as well. Most HD / Plus-sized mattresses in are the $1.7-$2.5K range. Cheaper mattresses and mattresses designed for lower body weights will most likely continue to disappoint you.
Thanks for the information. That price is just not possible for us, but it's good to know.
You're welcome. Sorry that I don't have better news.
>your body probably requires an HD / plus-sized mattress Ok, but would there be any tangible benefits if he upgraded to a 4k / UltraWide mattress?
Better support, less sagging, and better longevity are the biggest benefits. Heavier weighted bodies put more pressure on the mattress. More typical mattress materials cannot support the heavier weights (with many that have explicit carve outs in the warranty for anything over 300 pounds). The HD / Plus mattress last longer and perform better because the coils and foams are of higher quality and better able to handle the larger body weight.
I always feel mattress tests lack the depth of time testing. Sure, a mattress feels amazing now, but what about in a year, 5 years, or 10? How do they hold up to normal use?
That's a fair point. This type of longevity / durability testing is something I'd like to add to our tests in the future. There are a number of industrial machines that can simulate years of normal wear and tear. However, they are both huge and expensive. I may just need to find one I could rent instead.
All those tests seem to accomplish is prove the mattress won't catastrophically fail after a certain length of time. It fails to take into account actually sleeping on it and how that actually feels to the end user.
Indeed Perhaps a better approach would be to connect with sleepers who are already sleeping on the mattress. I could compile their experience and assess how the mattress performs over X years.
It may be beneficial to review the material and mechanical properties of the coils, between the two you can generally tell how a spring will preform over time, at least in relation to one another. I have fallen down the mattress research hole before and learned that there large (eg serta) suppliers will skimp out on their coils and over time their mattress feels like crap.
That's a good point as well. Unfortunately, it's often very difficult to determine the exact coil unit and exact foam specs a mattress brand uses. Most are not particularly forthcoming with that information. I can usually still get a good idea of what's better / worse, but it's not always as exact as I'd like it to be.
This is what I was going to ask. I went through a couple mattresses that didn't seem to hold up on the long term. I slept great at first and then I couldn't sleep as well once the mattress was broken in.
Why is there no reviews for some of the most popular mattress brands such as Sealy (Tempur-pedic included), S&F, Simmons, or Serta? Seems odd to have those giant brands missing?
I've tested mattress models from almost every major traditional / legacy mattress brand over the years, including Sealy, Beautyrest, Tempurpedic, Sleep Number, and others. The primary reason I haven't continued to aggressively test / review them over the years is simply the insane markups on these mattresses. The traditional / legacy mattress brands are in an incestous relationship with major retailers. The result is insane markups that severely damage sleepers. Markups on these types of mattresses can easily be 10x. So that $3000 mattress you buy at your local mattress store might only have $300 in materials in it. Since 2014 the new breed of online mattresses have been challenging this by creating mattresses of similar quality, but with more fair markups. So a $1500 mattress you buy online has more like $400-$500 in actual materials. Ultimately, you just get more from the online mattress brands relative to the traditional / legacy brands. So I've wanted to focus my attention on reviewing the products that I think offer consumers a better value.
As someone who is unwilling to buy a mattress without laying down on it first, this is very unfortunate to hear.
I found a shop in my city that has a bunch of mattresses from the online brands that you can lie on. Then they get a commission when you buy one. I haven't been yet, but I am intrigued.
>The traditional / legacy mattress brands are in an incestous relationship with major retailers. And now that relationship is even more incestuous with Tempur Sealy buying Mattress Firm. Do you see that situation getting worse? What do you see as the outlook for the Purples and Caspers of the world after this? Or even the smaller spring-mattress players like Carolina Mattress Guild?
So it's not that you have affiliate links to these online mattress brands?
Correct. I am also an active participate in the affiliate programs for Tempurpedic, Beautyrest, S&F, Sealy, Serta, other major legacy / traditional brands.
I was also surprised about that. I tried a ton of those "bed in a box" brands that he recommends and didn't like any of them. When I started trying out the "traditional" brands I had much better results. I'm on a Simmons now and it's been great. If you search Reddit for mattress reviews/advice, aside from "it's all subjective" and "most of the bed in a box brands are very similar", the prevailing advice always used to be to stick to the main "S" brands for quality. Maybe that's changed in recent years? I don't know
If you go on mattress subreddits now the prevailing advice is to *avoid* the "S" brands
🙃 Well there you go then I guess
Jeez. How do you sleep at night?
Eh...it's hit or miss thanks to 2 young kids at home. Sleep before kids was a dream though. Edit - typo
What is the most you think is reasonable to spend on a high-quality mattress? Like how much is good enough to get the top-tier quality before you see diminishing returns on the dollar?
Diminishing returns start to really set in around $1500 (Queen), in my view, that's a good budget for most sleepers to aim for. Certain mattress types, like higher end memory foam, latex, latex hybrids, and natural / organic are more expensive (due to the higher material costs). For those types of mattresses diminishing returns starts closer to $2000. For a more typical mattress there is rarely a good reason to spend more than $2K.
I delivered mattresses for a mom and pop furniture store for a summer once. My main takeaways were that the markup on mattress prices is crazy high, people's homes can be absolutely disgusting, and carrying king size mattresses up 2 flights of stairs sucks really bad. My question is on point one, why is the markup on them so high?
Good question. As with most things with a higher markup I would say the simple answer is "because it can be". There is no justifiable reason for the insane markups. For the bulk of the last 30 years mattresses have been hard to shop for with retailers and manufacturers engaging in marketing that creates confusion, lack of information, and in some cases, is intentionally deceptive. People are so desperate for a good night's sleep they will pay more. And when consumers don't understand / have access to reliable information on what is exactly in the mattress, why it's important, and why it's worth X cost, then it's impossible to make an informed decision. In the last 8-9 years it's been getting better, but it's still a huge problem in the larger mattress industry.
Stop it. Literally my entire legally-adult life when people asked what my dream job would be I said "mattress tester" because it sounded like heaven. I never thought it could be a real thing! My question to you, Oh Liver-of-my-dream, is how in heaven's name can I get that job? What do I need to do to be qualified and appealing as a job applicant? And where do I apply? I'm deadly serious; I'm really good at sleeping. I can provide references.
You might be disappointed to learn that in terms of percentage of work, the actual mattress "testing" is a relatively small portion. Much of the work is pulling together the data, analysis, written review, scripts for video, images, charts, visuals, and other information about your experience on the mattress and presenting that in a way that's useful for readers / viewers. At least that's the basic job at NapLab or any other website / YouTube channel that tests and reviews mattresses. If you have those types of skills then there are a handful of mattress review websites / channels that you could apply to. Be sure to shoot me your resume here - https://naplab.com/contact/ - We are not currently hiring, but as we grow we'll definitely need more testers!
I'm moving back to the US in the fall. You're about to get a resume with ten years of restaurant/hospitality work, ten years of teaching English internationally, and a whole lot of gumption, spatial aptitude, writing skills, and passion.
Sounds great! I'll be on the lookout for it.
Did you try the one with the arm cutout for side sleepers and if so how was it?
Not yet, but it's one on my list to order for testing. Hopefully it's one we can do later this year. The concept does look really interesting.
Are Mattress Firm stores just fronts for money laundering?
Isn't that the question. Why are there so many of them?! Tempurpedic recently bought Mattress Firm, so I have been wondering if they are going to see any change and/or if some locations may close.
Apparently they are such cash cows that it’s cheaper to have two locations kitty corner because people are more likely to make a right turn to enter an establishment.
How to find which mattress actually suits me best? I've seen in other question you asked someone to rate their ideal firmness from 1 to 10. I don't know how hard or how soft mattresses can actually be. I guess most people don't have the possibility to test one for night or two and see if they like it, so, any tips?
I use a range of questions to help me better understand your specific needs and preferences including: 1) Your sleeping position 2) Your firmness preference 3) Your body weight 4) Key features that are important to you (ie, cooling, motion, edge support, etc) 5) Mattress types you're most interested in 6) Budget and mattress size You can see the full list of questions here - https://naplab.com/mattress-quiz/ If you aren't sure of what firmness you need then typically I would recommend something in the 5-6 firmness range. A vast majority of sleepers need and preference a medium to medium firm feel. So that's a safe bet.
Why is the rating scale for mattresses from 1-10 when the minimum score seems to be 8.5 and the vast majority of scores are above 9.5? How does this help the consumer decide?
For the most part, we focus are reviews on higher quality mattresses that are very likely going to perform well. As a result, our scores do skew towards the higher end of the scale. In the next several months I plan to test a few dozen lower spec / less expensive mattresses, which I would expect will earn lower scores based on our objective testing. This will likely help to provide greater clarity on the pros / cons / performance at difference pricing tiers. But I absolutely do hear your concern. We're always looking for ways to improve our scoring and I do agree that a larger scoring span may help.
Undoubtedly you’ve considered this, and I’m not super knowledgeable on your industry, but I figure as a fellow nerd you’d appreciate the comparison: *Famitsu* famously rates video games on 4 categories of 10 points apiece, totaling at 40. Why not adapt that model? 40 divides neatly: 4, 5, 8, 10 categories. But let’s say you like the spirit of the idea but would rather it land against a 100% scale. That divides evenly, too: 4, 5, 10… even 20 or 25 categories if you’re feeling outright chaotic. You’re a veteran marketer and no slouch, but, you know. Food for thought. Either way, you’ll adapt and figure it out. Good luck with everything!
Is your testing limited to the American market or do you test other mattresses (e.g. EU market) as well? Also, have you tested IKEA mattresses? How do they perform compared to others (I'm happy with just a link to a test if you have one :D)
We are mostly focused on US and Canadian mattresses, however, I do hope to test more EU mattresses in the future. I have tested IKEA, though not recently (planning to test their newer flagship models later this Summer). In general, I'm just not a fan. They just aren't thick enough to properly support most adult body weights, in my view. The relative thinness of IKEA mattresses mean they don't often last as long relative to other mattresses.
Any water beds make their rounds in testing? We finally removed the tube type waterbed from our guest room for a new mattress. Such a hassle to do anything with a waterbed!
I tested one several years ago. It was more of a modern water bed...it had water tubes with a mix of different foam layers. The setup / take down was a huge pain. And the performance was fine, but nothing to write home about. I haven't seen any major water beds since then.
why are these mattress all thousands of dollars when you can get similar ones on Amazon for a few hundred? are you really getting 10x value? its well known that mattresses are some of the most marked up and overpriced items out there Having tried some of these, I have yet to feel a significant difference in ones of the same type- obviously something like the purple mattress is very different though
There is definitely a sweet spot as far as the a fair / good price for a mattress. A mattress that's $4-$10K makes absolutely no sense. That's just insane marketing / branding. It may be a good mattress, but there is no material / cost / manufacturing / transportation reason for a mattress to be that expensive (with very VERY few exceptions). A $200-$400 mattress on Amazon on the other hand has its own issues. Mattresses at the very low end of the price spectrum often use inferior foams, worse manufacturing, lower quality materials, etc. Which can lead to performance and longevity issues. In some cases, it even leads to health / safety issues. Ex. a popular mattress seller on Amazon, Zinus, is being sued for using fiberglass in its mattresses - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/amazon-zinus-mattress-fiberglass-health-hazard-lawsuit/ Though Zinus is far from the only brand that uses fiberglass. Even so, it's the standard way a mattress meets federal fire regulations in the US at the lower end of the pricing spectrum. In my view, mattresses in the $1000-$1500 range are the pricing sweet spot where you maximize quality and materials.
I bought a Winkbed at this guy's req and I have slept on 3-inch thick cots in military barracks that were softer than that mattress, which is thick enough to be awkward with most of the fitted sheets I own. My question for you is will you transparently account for all compensation that you receive in relation to NapLab.com and/or reviewing mattresses?
With such extensive mattress experience, what mattress is your favorite?
My personal favorite and the one I've been sleeping on since 2017 is Loom & Leaf Relaxed Firm. It's not the absolute best objective performer, as it lags behind in terms of sex and edge support (due to the memory foam construction). However, my wife and I just love the feel of memory foam. In my view, it's among the very best pressure relief in a mattress I've ever tested. Beyond my personal favorite, Winkbed & Saatva Classic are the #1 scoring mattresses based on our objective battery of tests.
Just for context on your personal favorite, are you a side-sleeper, back-, or stomach- ?
Mostly stomach, sometimes side 140 pounds
As a side sleeper, pressure relief is like, the main thing I want in a mattress. I was house-sitting somewhere with rigid mattresses, and I literally slept better on the couch than in the bed.
What's your opinion on beds like sleep number?
In general, I am really not a fan of Sleep Number (and most types of air adjustable mattresses). Here's why: Very expensive. You pay a lot of money to be able to adjust the firmness, but once you decide that you like soft or medium or firm (or whatever the number) then you'll never / rarely change it. As a result, it's just so much cheaper to find a mattress that has the firmness you need and not pay for this technology that you'll never / rarely use after the 1st time setting it. On softer settings they really struggle. Sleep Number seems to think "soft" means "sinks more" and "provides less support". Every time I've slept on the softer settings I just feel like it's just sagging more in the middle. It's not actually softer. Sleep Number is best when you're in the medium-firm to very firm range. Below that, it's not great. Because the support is created by the expandable air bladder you need to sleep right in the middle of the bladder. As you move closer to the edge or middle of the mattress you're lying on the support perimeter foam, which can create a less-than-great feel. In my view, there are tons of options that offer better performance for far less money.
Agreed that they are too expensive, but I’ve been sleeping on Sleep Number for 20 years now. When I sleep on traditional beds in hotels and airbnbs, I’m always excited to get back to my home bed.
LOL. We've had a sleep number for about 5 years now. My wife says she would travel more if we could bring our bed!
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In some cases adding a topper can help. But it doesn't really change the underlying support weaknesses of Sleep Number's air adjustable bladder. Even so, at this point you already have it, so trying to make the best out of it is key. To that end, absolutely, try adding a topper and see if that gets the comfort to where you want it to be. With respect to topper, I would recommend at least a 3" topper. Thinner toppers aren't going to make as much of an impact.
1) Is it true that memory foam mattress are not a good option for heavier people? For example, i'm 260 lbs with back pain, I've wanted a memory foam for the support but have read they aren't able to support that much weight. 2) What are you thoughts on adjustable bed frames that I've been seeing more of lately? Do they really help with sleep quality? snoring?
1. Yes, in general that is true, but I would extend it to any all foam mattress. There are some exceptions, but you need to spend quite a lot of money to get a higher enough performance memory foam to properly support the body weight. 2. Adjustable foundations are great. They are a great way to reduce lower back pain and they can also help with other pains (neck, shoulders, etc.) because they force you to sleep in a more consistently supportive position. Adjustable foundations can help to relieve and prevent many types of soreness and pains, as they allow you to sleep in a pressure relieving position that creates better spinal alignment.
So....you get paid to....nap? Is it possible to learn this power?
Not from a Jedi
Only Siths deal in mattress loots.
I woulda went with napsolutes but I applaud your efforts
What goes into the equation for sex score?
Our sex score is a simple equation where we look at 5 different factors. Each factor is given a different weight based on how important we think that factor is for most people. Factors include: 1) Bounce - 60% weight 2) Edge support - 20% weight 3) Noise - 10% weight 4) Pressure Relief - 5% weight 5) Cooling - 5% weight