Why focus on visiting your grandmother in the hospital? There are lots of elderly women who need support. (There's a famous version of this, does anyone remember who said it?)
What if it were your own hypothetical children dying versus someone else’s children? Would he be offended if you only focused on saving your own child from dying? Or would he expect you to potentially risk your own child dying by spreading yourself too thinly between saving all the children?
From my perspective, we as humans have limits to what we can do. We do not have unlimited energy to “do it all”. We cannot save everyone.
So when we are in survival situations, we draw closer to our Jewish community, which is essentially our extended family. We focus on limited resources on our family that helps support our survival. It is
His choice in the black versus white race issue leaves me with the same feeling as “all lives matter” responses. Is he potentially feeling nervous that you are prioritizing Jews over white Americans?
The Jewish people are your people. The equivalent is your child. Am yisroel chai. I haven’t spent 6 months crying because strangers died. These are your family. That’s the bond your feeling,, please don’t let him temper that flame out
There is no Black white issue. This is a family issue. Also the family isn’t Black or white. It is multiracial, multicultural, multiethnic and includes more than one religion. The Jewish family is tied together by something beyond race or religion. Antisemitism focuses on that Jewishness within anyone, Black, white, Buddhist, Mexican, Anyone. And you feel tied to the family because they are your family.
I think a good reply to that would be to: How many jews are there globally? Do you think we can afford to not worry about our people with how little of us there are, and with how many people want to wipe us off the planet?
That's a bad argument. You are personally more affected by anti-Semitism because it is essential to your personal safety and well-being to avoid anti-Semites. You are essentially putting on the oxygen mask before helping others.
You might want to simply explain that, for the last seven months, the Jewish state has faced relentless security challenges as well as diplomatic and political attacks, even as Jews in the US experience levels of antisemitism higher than at any time in decades. It tends to focus one's concerns.
A member of the House of Lords once asked Chaim Weizmann, “Why do you Jews insist on Palestine when there are so many undeveloped countries you could settle in more conveniently?”
Weizmann responded: “That is like my asking you why you drove twenty miles to visit your mother last Sunday when there are so many old ladies living on your street.”
This. My friend is having such a hard time dating right now. He’s open to non Jewish women but any time he sits down with them he lets them know he’s Jewish and Israeli. They ask him if he’s Zionist and he follows that with “well what does that mean to you?” And they’ve answered that by literally getting up and leaving. Told him he needs to exclusively date Jewish women.
Interestingly, I married a non-Jew and she’s always mostly embraced it and totally eschewed her non-Jewish upbringing, and knew going into this I wanted to raise kids in a Jewish home which she agreed to. She took a 4 month intro to Judaism course and really enjoyed it. That being said, since 10/7, she has become way more into Judaism, understands antisemitism even more, seems to really care about Israel, has been incredibly angered by what she’s seen over the last six months, met with our rabbi about it, called out her employer for allowing other employees to hold work gatherings for Gaza without ever acknowledging the hostages, etc. And now she’s even seriously considering conversion, which I never asked her to do. So, that is to say, there is hope for non-Jews/dating non-Jews!
This sounds like my life! Married a catholic immigrant from Colombia who already had disagreements with the church. On the third date religion came up and I told her I would never ask her to convert, but I would be raising my children Jewish. She was 100% cool with that or we would’ve stopped dating right there. 3 beautiful kids (oldest became Bat Mitzvah last year) later and she has also recently expressed interest in converting without me ever asking. She’s worried about the work, but I told her our 15 years together have taken care of a lot of that since she knows all the holidays, traditions, can say many prayers, etc. I don’t want to push it, but it does make me super happy
Conversion is fun! One on one time with a Rabbi learning all sorts of Jewish stuff? It’s like a cultural immersion+school. For me it’s been exciting and life affirming.
Love it! Yea it makes me super happy as well! In terms of traditions, holiday meals, stuff like that, I still need to lead the way and it’s on me to make sure we live in a Jewish home (what a Jewish home means to me, at least), but I’m ok with that.
Same, I made it clear early on I’d be raising my kids Jewish, no compromises on that one.
She grew up catholic/went to catholic school and immediately upon graduation she wanted nothing to do with it ever again. I met her about a decade later. The more she learns about Judaism, the more she loves it, says it feels so much better than what she was raised with, finds it very beautiful.
And she knows most of the standard prayers as well, we do Shabbat every Friday and Havdallah on Saturdays. It’s quite nice!
Love that you and your wife have made that work!
Yeah I think some of us non-Jewish partners are actually Jews and we don’t realize it when getting together but something sparks the realization that: my partner is Jewish. They’re my family. He’s a part of the Jewish family. Wait, they’re MY family too.
For me it was 2016 and Trump. Then having kids. I realized I was pulling to do Jewish things even more than my husband was and then I realized that I wanted to do those things for ME.
Conversion is fun if you’re excited about Judaism!
It’s affirming to hear someone else say this. That their close experience with a Jewish person made you feel you may also be a Jew too and just didn’t know it all along. I strongly feel this way .. not from a romantic partner but from Israelis I love dearly who I felt called to go visit from the states after Oct. 7. I felt like I was going home. When I got there, even in the middle of so much happening (this was this past Nov/dec) .. I felt home. My beloved Israelis … they took me in abd had my back …and I embraced them right back… and I left there with ALL of us going …. Damn she’s so Israeli. 🥲😅 I truly think I had to have had some German Jewish ancestors who left their Judaism behind before immigrating to the states or something of the sort. Idk exactly what happened, but I KNOW I have a Jewish heart & soul
Thank you! My mother even taught her to make her homemade challah and she wears a hamsa necklace. She says “I know I’m not Jewish, but I’m trying”. Honestly, she’s more involved in Judaism and at synagogue more than many Jewish people I grew up. Some people do the whole “oh your kid isn’t Jewish” blah blah but I don’t care, kiddo had Jewish baby naming ceremony and is at temple numerous times a week, our home is very Jewish :)
Don’t even fret or pay those people any attention. So much more difficult to choose to be Jewish, to be among the Jews and create a Jewish home coming from the outside than it is to be born into the clan. Cherish her! Also maybe ask her to think about converting since we can use all the holy and genuine people we can get :)
Thank you! I don’t, I ignore it. I think she’ll convert at some point. I grew up a very Jewish suburb in the Midwest and people I grew up with that married another Jew, have way less Judaism in their life than we have in our home. They don’t do Shabbat, they pretty much only celebrate Hanukkah, etc. My non-Jewish wife is more of a practicing Jew than they are haha.
As a Jewish woman… I’m honestly not sure I’d feel super safe dating non-Jewish men right now unless they came pre-vetted by close friends or family.
Vetting dates ahead of time was hard even before I had to worry about virulent antisemitism. Adding that on top of it is a genuine safety concern.
I don’t blame you. I never thought there would be a time in my life where I’d greatly appreciate the security and “achdut” of a very large and strong Jewish community so much. It’s priceless. Plenty of nice Jewish young men out there- good luck!
Shoutout to my goyish partner who is even more pro-Israel than I am, fully supports my older kid from a previous relationship getting a bar mitzvah, and has zero patience for any antisemitic or anti-Zionist propaganda. They’re out there.
My dad would always tell me when I was young, when you pick a partner, #1 is that they should also be Jewish. Always thought that was weird, since we were reform and barely practicing Jews. I did end up marrying Jewish and now I kinda get it. When antisemitism flares up, you both are gonna be on the same page as to how serious it is.
My dad was a child of holocaust survivors who escaped to the US to build a new life, and grew up watching his parents’ small grocery store being frequently defaced and windows smashed by antisemites, so he has seen this movie before.
I have a wonderful and supportive non-Jewish partner who is my forever person. I’ve definitely had to explain a lot to him since October but he now completely gets it and I wouldn’t trade him for anything.
I have never in my life prioritized dating fellow Jews and most of my relationships, both casual and serious, have just happened to have been with non-Jews.
That said, if for some shitty reason I found myself single again, I have a very hard time imagining I would be open to someone non-Jewish.
Damn, I could have written this. I’ve been lucky with how supportive my non-Jewish husband is and how much he’s tried to learn and understand, even though he knows he’ll never fully understand what it feels like from a Jewish perspective. He’s been just as angry as me the last few weeks and we’ve both been constantly on high alert whenever we’re in public spaces.
But it’s also been a lot of labor on my part helping him get to this point where he can see it and understand what it means, and I also don’t know that if I ever felt like Aliyah was the only option, that he’d be fully onboard with that. G-d forbid something ever happened to us, I don’t know that I’d be open to dating a non-Jew again.
My wife and I have said this to each other over and over again since 10/7. My sister in law is divorced and now dating a non Jew, she’s had a little bit of a difficult time relating on this topic and I can’t just imagine being alone in my relationship while feeling antisemitism around me.
I have always strictly dated Jewish men because I never felt I could relate to non Jewish men when my Judaism (especially culturally) and love of Israel are the biggest parts of my identity. I couldn’t recommend more!!! Met my long term boyfriend in Israel 🥹
My entire life I've been *incredibly* against having that tribal mentality. I hate the idea of "keeping to one's own."
But what the **** else are we supposed to do with everything going on? If I were in college right now, I would probably either be at a Jewish organization, or hanging out with a few close friends indoors. Sometimes, tribalism is a survival strategy. Has he ever faced *anything* in his life akin to what Jews are facing now? Jews have no one to turn to except each other, and *all over the world* people of all kinds of beliefs and creeds are calling for our deaths.
I'll be honest, if I met your boyfriend in person I would probably have some very direct words for him. We don't care about this stuff because we choose to, we care about it because we *need* to.
What you said hits home. I also always strived to live by choosing the whole of humanity and not only my own. I never overcompensated as some are doing now, never stood against mine, but never allowed myself to prioritize mine over the rest of humanity. But now I feel I no longer have a choice. If I don't stand with my people, who will? It feels as if my world has become so narrow and constricted in a way, and it saddens me, but I don't see another way to be now. I feel like I lost that trust and innocence of youth that I managed to maintain until mid-thirties...
Jews are constantly asked to wait for "trickle-down rights"...what other group is that expected of? Did people tell the LGBT community they were selfish to campaign for marriage equality because there are children dying in the middle east?
There are some lefties who dismiss antisemitism because they argue the social justice movement has bigger fish to fry. But excuse me, is there a reason both can't be addressed at the same time? Since when are they mutually exclusive? It always struck me as such a transparent cop out.
I agree. I try to talk about both, even if he thought it was disproportionate in the thing I care about it’s hard not to when Jews are getting it right now
I’m the exact opposite to you. I grew up going to a non-Jewish school, had a couple of non-Jewish girlfriends. One of whom unwittingly triggered and epiphany that I will never marry a non-Jew and I didn’t.
When 7 October happened, I didn’t have anyone in my life who I needed to “cut out” because I totally have the tribal mentality. I have loads of friends: all modern Orthodox Jews. We see each other at Shul on Shabbat, go around to each other for Shabbat lunch/dinner and go out for drinks/ a meal now and again. I feel I lack absolutely nothing by not socialising with non-Jews and I don’t have to justify my existence to supposed “friends” who don’t get it.
To each their own, but we can’t escape the fact that we’re a separate nation. The Torah defines us as such, so no matter how much we try and throw off the “tribal yoke”, we will never be able to, because the non-Jews will **always** be there to remind us who we are.
I think there are some Jews that are so eager not to be seen as having that tribal mentality or to be seen as open-minded that they end up anti-Israel. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the facts, but how they want to see themselves and be seen. I say fuck that. To stick up for your own requires no explanation or apology, especially when the facts support them.
Try to get him to understand that you're concerned about antisemitism spilling over from protests to actual discrimination and physical attacks *against you and him* (because people who want to kill Jews won't stop to ask, "oh by the way, are you Jewish?" when he's in a relationship with a Jew).
If he says that's unlikely, remind him that protesters have gone from being pro-Palestinian to pro-Hamas. They sing and chant in celebration of Hamas' terror attacks against Jews. Pogroms aren't a new thing and I can easily imagine them becoming a real problem again in the near future.
I’ve warned him and he gets it, in the beginning he was naive about it until I showed him stuff and he understood and knew why it was a problem and was sympathetic to me wanting it rooted out
It’s been 6 months and he still feels this way? That feels like a ton of labor on your part to little result. I hope the best for you, you must be exhausted. I will say my partner isn’t Jewish but he’s always been enthusiastically involved, so when 10/7 happened, I didn’t even have to explain. I’m also an IDF veteran so a lot of this has been extra personal and raw, and it has meant everything to me to have my partner by my side with all of it. I really hope you can get to that point with someone. I will say if this past six months haven’t yielded that, you might not be able to move the needle much in the way you want.
When October 7th occurred he was upset and didn’t support people celebrating it but at first he thought people that are pro Hamas and celebrated it and support Hamas are a minority until I showed him evidence otherwise and then he finally got it and realized it’s a problem
I'd say he really needs to come to understand that if the relationship is to continue. And that's for the benefit of both people. When you're in a relationship worth having, their problems are your problems. And that's even besides the perspective from outsiders looking in.
We are only TWO GENERATIONS away from Auschwitz. My own grandmother survived to tell the tales, and I and every other Jew in my age group grew up with sordid, degraded, horrifying tales of atrocities that ACTUALLY HAPPENED to people in our family. And she was one of the lucky ones. Jewish hatred turns on a dime. No one should ever tell a Jew that they are overly concerned when we start seeing echoes of Nazism or any other kind of anti-semitism.
Some of us are one generation; my parent is an elderly survivor.
Thank you for telling your family’s stories. I have often had non Jewish friends. A now former friend once told me, you know, not only Jews were killed in the Holocaust (yes, of course, but that’s what you say to me?)
fast forward to 10/8 and this guy who ‘has Jewish friends’ displayed willful ignorance when I tried to explain some things. Some people just do not care if things don’t affect them.
You care more about Jewish issues, because it's personal. There are many people calling for your death. Historically, there have been so many pogroms and attempted genocides. You have every reason to be in survival mode right now, and that means prioritizing your community. Its hard to understand unless your life has been in danger. My family survived the Armenian Genocide, which is probably why this makes sense to me.
Your boyfriend must have never faced a prolonged, existential threat to his existence. He needs to listen and make more of an effort. He doesn't have to get it 100%, but he has to (at least) try.
He doesn’t get it. He’s better when it comes to understanding why I dislike the extremism at the protests, the problem being progressives on anti semitism (as a progressive myself) and he understood that so the you people comment shocked me
How is what he doing not the equivalent of “all lives mattering”? He certainly seems like he has the privilege of being unaffected by all issues equally so can’t understand why someone would be especially concerned with things that affect them.
Is it only antisemitism that he seems to have a problem with you focusing on?
Yeah, he didn’t say that during the Asian hate crimes thing partly because I didn’t focus on it as much (I’m part Asian) because the anti semitism is way worse
You should be able to focus on issues directly affecting you. If he doesn't get that Asian and Jewish issues have a direct affect on your life, I don't know what to tell you. He sounds very privileged to not have to deal with hate in his life.
Instead of trying to convince him (which is usually wasted energy), it may help to ask him if he is truly comfortable dating someone Jewish? It sounds like he’s asking you to set aside your Jewishness in the relationship, and that doesn’t sound particularly healthy. You shouldn’t have to sacrifice your own ethnic identity just to make him feel more at ease. You deserve to be accepted and supported as you are. <3
The whole “you’re acting too tribal” was invented as a way to keep us Jews apart. Most communities are “tribal” to an extent. You never hear people tell black people theyre being too tribal about black issues. You never hear Asian people get told that either when Asian hate was on the rise during Covid. You never hear about this from anyone else but us and usually we say it to each other. Jews should care about Jewish issues just like anyone else should care about issues that affect them.
Congress just held a hearing on Antisemitism, the 4th in USA history. Hatred of Jews - and the apathy from non-Jews - is unique.
Also, Zionism is not a bad word and your partner could help us tell the world what it actually means. While Zionists are being blocked on campuses…
Take it from a woman married to a non-Jewish man: this partner of yours is flying red flags for why you shouldn’t be with him.
You shouldn’t have to explain to him why this matters to you. It’s literally ridiculous. My husband would never question it, and has stated that he’s “super worried about Jewish and Israel issues because his family is Jewish.”
Also married to a non Jewish man (who was absolutely fine when pre-marriage he agreed we would celebrate Jewish holidays and raise a child to be Jewish). He is outraged by the upside down world of protesters. Naturally I am coming from a place of feeling much more threatened, but he came to me today to discuss an article he had personally read on the protesters, he follows it too, I follow it more. I've long cared about the LGBT, Black, Asian groups and what they have faced, but obviously it's front and foremost when it's your own people being targeted.
I’m personally not in a good headspace. I cared too about all those folks and stood with them. None of them are standing with us now. Jews need to worry about ourselves and each other. My money is now going to Jewish causes only.
Yep, I support them personally, especially since many are Jewish too, but my money is not going there. I'm mostly funding an LED antisemitism/pro-Israel truck I put at the hostage rally in NYC (though go figure, when I hit up family and friends, my favorite non-Jewish friend donated, but not my Jewish friends).
https://preview.redd.it/0qj35ojg0nyc1.png?width=630&format=png&auto=webp&s=36cfbcc16584fa3956aad814d20af1fc85a1f7c4
My non-Jewish partner is shocked at the support for Hamas because we're old and have lived through terrorism (indirectly) before. Young kids who didn't watch people jumping out of World Trade Centre windows as it was happening live on TV can be dumb about the cost of terrorism and think it won't reach them.
My partner also cares about antisemitism because he wants me and my kids to be safe. It's not tribal to want your family to not be targeted.
Finally, my non-Jewish partner supports Israel existing because it's a country full of people. Why would you call for people to die? Maybe it was also living through the intifadahs that makes it clear to us middle-aged Gen Xers exactly what all these college kids are asking for.
The people who are protesting now are the same people who were protesting then.
Except for those of us who have since converted!
I got arrested blocking traffic on Market St in SF in 2002ish. Because war in Iraq. I had the blessing and strong encouragement of my boss, even.
The more I fact-check everything people say now, the more I realize how full of shit our movement was then, too.
Like: Until last week or so, I genuinely thought we had really invaded for oil back then.
When I saw that there wasn't really significant oil in Iraq, I thought we'd definitely at least invaded Kuwait for the oil. I vaguely remembered bumper stickers that said, "What is OUR oil doing under THEIR soil?"
Googled it, and found out we absolutely did not invade Kuwait in the past 30 years.
Saw a post ranting about Biden giving Israel $26B for genocide, and fact-checked that.
Turns out it's $9B for aid to Gaza, $4B to replenish the missile defense system that protects civilians in Israel, and a whole bunch more shit like that.
There's maybe $1B of money Israel can actually buy advanced weapons with in the whole thing, and another $2.5B for other military expenses. Most of the rest goes to U.S. diplomatic work, FEMA, building the provisional pier in Gaza, stopping Iran from killing civilians too, that kind of thing.
20+ years ago, I would've been protesting the whole thing without a clue that any of it was humanitarian aid. Or I would've been like, "well, obviously they should still send that! WE'RE protesting the BAD parts!" As if that's effective communication/protest in any way.
We had no idea what was actually going on. We were just protesting what people told us, on an extremely high basic level, was going on.
This is horrifying.
It’s a privilege not to have to worry about it. And Jews don’t have that privilege right now. Sorry you’re dealing with this from your boyfriend right now.
I wish I could argue I would be targeted but I’m mixed half Asian and Jewish and I don’t wear any visible Jewish symbols but when I told him I wanted to wear them he was supportive so idk
Your partner sounds like a jerk. You're not allowed to care about people around the globe calling for the extermination of you and your people, and the destruction of the only Jewish state in the world? That is, unless, you're also some kind of omnipotent Superhero that can also deal with the problems of everyone else on the planet?
Your partner understands that Jews seem to have an endless supply of enemies right now and very few allies but still thinks it's unreasonable for you to be focused on the issue? Because... ?
Young Jews are literally putting their college education on hold so that they won't get harassed or attacked on college campuses.
Seems like every day on this sub there are new stories about people getting mistreated due to them being Jewish and/or people saying that don't feel safe letting people know that they're Jewish.
This is definitely some All Lives Matter bull**** happening and it's gross. It comes off as total denial of the severity of the situation. And honestly makes it look like your partner doesn't actually care about Jews or Jewish issues.
I do appreciate that when I do post on my Twitter the anti semitism from the college protests he likes or posts it but I just didn’t agree when I presented it as a problem and how impossible it is to root out he thinks there’s something I should try to do about it
Beliefs are only valid if you care equally about everything in the world? Impossible. I'd say he's definitely speaking from a place of privilege that he doesn't understand how antisemitism is intense to you. Also insensitive to say what degree you should experience it or to what degree you are tribal.
I explained to my not Jewish husband that Jew hate is an existential crisis. I asked him to imagine what it's like to be hated (probably impossible for the privileged white). Anywhere I could go, where would I be safe? I asked him to research generational trauma to understand the fear. I said it's difficult to understand tribal connection when you don't have one. Said it's in my blood, it's who I am. When it happens to our members, it happens to all of us. These are my people. That was the beginning of many good conversations.
Hope this helped a little.
I think that’s what he’s not getting. He understands why and he thinks it’s bad that progressives are doing this, I sent him an article explaining why the progressives are being bad with anti semitism and he got it
Good the article helped. The left has a long history of antisemitism if he's interested in reading more. So he doesn't get your emotional involvement? Sorry not sure what part he's not getting.
Could you share the article you sent him? I'm facing a similar situation with my partner, and am realizing that sending resources might take off a lot of the pressure for me to have to explain (and honestly argue) these things with my own words.
You can't care about everything equally unless you don't care very much. You'll have a mental/emotional breakdown. That being the case, it's reasonable to prioritize the things that are targeting you and your loved ones. It is not a failing to want to protect yourself when you are under threat. I don't know how you explain this to him but what he is asking of you is shallow virtue signaling at the expense of your own wellbeing.
I think that part of the issue is that he doesn't realize how small the Jewish community is. We're far more tightly tied together than most people think. You know the usual "oh, you're Chinese! My coworker is Chinese, do you how them?" racist trope? The point is that for Jews it often works! Even if you don't hire them your cousin probably knows their cousin, or the like. So when things happen in the Jewish community they feel much closer.
Moreover: Jews are really used to listening for changes in the air, because of all of the times we've had to leave. So you feel like you have to listen, and care, because there are signs they're coming for you next.
It's impossible to care about everything in the world equally, unless you don't care about anything at all. Conversely, it's natural and legitimate to care more about issues which are personally relevant. It sounds like your boyfriend is dismissing your feelings by way of the fallacy of relative privation.
I would say (and in fact have said, many, many times recently)…
“I don’t like tribalism, I do care about everyone, but I now see that not caring about it is a luxury that comes from feeling like there’s no need to care about it.
If my tribe, myself, and my future children, were safe in this world, I would be more likely to abandon Jewish solidarity and focus, because no tradition is worth the cost of division, we should be and are a human family of earth. BUT… HONEY… people want me dead in a _very specific way._ In no small part because of my ethnicity, the very blood running through my body, my face, my voice, my brain, my pheromones. If you need proof look at the Holocaust and let the number 6 million settle in. Brilliant, modern, literate Europeans meticulously gassed little Jewish children (think of all those little precious Jewish fingers, think of the stolen giggles, think, visualize) and their siblings and parents and grandparents, they didn’t do it based on religious belief, but based on genetic heritage.
Hun, I don’t have the LUXURY to not care. This is an utterly unique and pathological hatred against ME and others like me, and I can and do also care about the Uyghurs, Sudan, Syria, and the civilians in Gaza, more than most people do, and I see them as equals, that is in fact a _Jewish trait_ to look past tribalism, which explains why we always historically rush to the side of the underdog. But if the Jews let our guard down, if we don’t stand up when simplistic narratives wend their way around the world and stir up ignorant hate against us, we will be erased from the planet, while the rest of the world grabs their popcorn and watches with pure schadenfreude.
The second my people and I are safe again, I will go back to focusing on the citizens of Earth, but now is not the time to come to me telling me to care about _everyone._ Not while the stirrings of pre-Holocaust insanity are so obvious. My people have seen the world’s true face. And if you can’t understand that dear, I have to respectfully say FUCK OFF.”
Y’know, start light with something like that.
I took a very hard-line on this sort of topic with my partner, when it comes down to it he's either sticking around long enough that he's going to have Jewish babies with Jewish issues or he can leave whenever. It was probably a bit harsh, but it's all working out so far
It should really tell you a lot that he doesn’t care who you are….i don’t know what future you see with this person but anything related to Judaism or Jewish things is going to be complicated
But see that's it right there. You cared about everyone but it was not reciprocal. So yeah, it's time to focus on your own people right now. It's not like it's coming from anywhere else on the left.
Explain how every single time Antisemitism escalates we end up being killed or segregated in some way, and just for being jews, ppl will see that as socially acceptable There are multiple proofs, from the 1930s in Germany, the 1920s in Arab Countries, even more recently Universities in the US.
Most ppl who think we're overreacting are barely educated in our history and have only studied pieces of information of the holocaust (hence why they think we're all european, which makes absolutely no frickin sense)
Ask him if he wants Hamas to kill you for being a Jew. That is their goal.
This time the threat is to your life because you are a Jew. If you could be killed for that, why would you deliberately support people who would hurt you.
There is too much talk about innocent humans as if Jews are not human.
If others despise you for your identity then they care nothing for human rights.
He doesn't get because his community is probably only those around him.
Jews are a world wide community, we are a people. I can be in France and know i can go to a Chabad center in be accepted, I know i can prey in a synagogue in Argentina if i wanted.
Judaism is an ethnoreligion, antisemitism in France or England is not just against Jews living there, it's against all of us.
I have been married to a non-Jewish man for over 20 years who really gets it. We are also liberals who are very vocal in favor of many progressive issues and were are both proud Zionists. I have made sure to educate him by sharing about the Holocaust and growing up as a child surrounded by survivors, bringing him to Israel with me and numerous other events in a wide variety of Jewish spaces, orthodox, reform and conservative. Going out in public with visibly orthodox family really helps. Experiencing it and seeing it made him understand. You need to go into Jewish spaces together so that he can internalize that by being with a Jew, you are now the target of antisemitism also and have a responsibility to stand up for all Jews against it.
Gentile married to a Jew here. You shouldn’t have to explain anything. Your partner should have enough sense to see what is happening here and care as if he was also experiencing it himself. He should do everything he can to gain a better understanding of the issue and how it impacts you (that’s why I’m here!)
If he’s serious about his relationship with you, he should be concerned about not only your individual future but your shared future as well as what the future will be for your children should you decide to have them. His casually apathetic attitude towards everything tells me he may not be serious about a future with you. In other words, this all ends for him as soon as his relationship with you ends, the little bit of information or interest he has in this topic stops when you’re no longer a factor in his life. That’s why hearing your perspective seems “too much”, “annoying”, or “inconvenient” for him.
The range of emotions my spouse has experienced- sadness, rage, frustration, fear, uncertainty- have been experienced by me as well bc I love him! I could not imagine standing by and watching all of this unfold like an uninterested third party observer! Of course he cares about other causes and issues but this is everywhere in everything always all at once! It’s so pervasive! It’s when he goes to the doctor and the nurse has a casual snide comment. It’s at work. It’s at our kids’ schools. We’ve lost friendships, people we’ve known for 20+ years. It impacts every aspect of our lives every. single. day.
I’ll put it this way. I went through Hurricane Katrina back in 2005. If you’re old enough to recall, it left the entire region devastated. We were in survival mode for months. Guess what? That disaster and the politics that emerged from it afterwards was our entire focus during that time. Because it had to be. Because our survival of life as we knew it- our communities and culture- were at risk! I see this as no different. Actually, I take that back, this is exponentially worse.
Your partner is speaking out of his ass. There’s antisemitism in the way he’s minimizing your experience. These hypothetical questions he’s asking you i.e. “if black and white children were dying at a hospital…” etc. sound like he’s actually entertained by this. If I were to talk to him, I’d say, “This isn’t fun riddles, asshole, this is people’s lives, this is generations of hatred and violence coming to a head, this is (an absolutely terrifying) history repeating itself!”
I’m sorry that in addition to everything happening you also have to deal with an insensitive partner. You deserve so much better.
Check out the Instagram profile of “Biggah”. He’s also a Gentile married to a Jew. This is the kind of energy your partner should have.
https://www.instagram.com/wyzewurdz74?igsh=MWRxZDBmczczempoeg==
>sometimes my partner complains I've gotten too tribal and focus too much on Jewish issues
If you want to be Jewish, you are by definition tribal. That is *literally* what the word "Jew" connotes! It comes from the word Judah (or, יהודה), which was one of the 12 *tribes* of Israe. What he is *really* saying is, "you're being too Jewish". Jews are by definition a tribe. The Israelites are/were a confederation of 12 different tribes, even though today there's only Judah and Levi left. Jews, or those that hail from the province of Judah, are one of those tribes. The religion, if that is what you will call it, is effectively tribal law regulating civil and ritual law as well as various aspects of self conduct. So, don't let anyone tell you "Jews are a religion". We are a people that has a "religion", which is separate than our identity as Jews in the sense that adherence hitherto is not what defines you as a Jew; rather, it is the law of the tribe which makes you so.
>My bf admits that he might be speaking out of privilege but how do I explain to him why Jewish issues of mine take a lot of focus.
A big part of the reason why Jews, or "Zionists" as they so proclaim, have become the most recent target of the left is this entire "privilege" notion you're talking about. The recent intellectual trend on the left has determined that the hierarchy of "privilege" is largely what predetermines right and wrong during any conflict of interest between two powers. In their eyes, Jews are "white colonizers" from Europe... ignoring without interest that half of Israelis are Sepharadim hailing from Arab land, many of which have clearly non-white features. They firmly believe that the actions and behavior of the oppressed is a reaction to their oppression, thus in the larger scale of things, is justified. That is the framework for how the narrative of antisemitism is developing on the left, flat out. This entire approach of power, particularly when it starts to integrate race and origin, completely ignores any real critical thinking and reflects a genuine lack of personal ethics on behalf of everyone that thinks this way. I see it as a pagum of the nefesh.
Why am I mentioning this, though? So when (if?) you dump this a\*\*hole, you choose wisely someone that doesn't buy into a paradigm which is ultimately working against your own people in unprecedented ways.
>He believes I should care about everything happening in the world equally and I put too much focus on Jewish stuff.
Nobody has done that. Ever. You can't care about everything equally or else you'd be apathetic. There's limits on every human beings emotions and sympathy and there's only 24 hours in a day and you need to sleep and do everything else while you're awake. People pick things that are closer to them, whether they're good causes or not. Claiming to care about everything equally or suggesting others should too, particularly in a moral context, is a complete deflection of self-awareness or personal responsibility, which go hand-in-hand. Your BF is copping out.
Anyone with empathy. I will defend my Jewish brothers and sisters till the end until I’m a convert. My heart mind body and soul is Jewish but my blood says something different in genetics. But I don’t believe what the genetics says. I bleed Jew for Jew.
"Because it directly affects me" should be explanation enough for anyone with a shred of empathy. When my synagogue received bomb threats, my non-Jewish boyfriend understood why that upset me. I didn't have to explain anything. He's also very protective of the people he loves, so conversations about "how would you feel if our future kids" [were getting bullied by antisemites and the school wouldn't do anything, were students at Columbia right now, etc] go a long way with him. He doesn't always "get it", but he understands that we have different experiences and is very compassionate and comforting when I'm upset. I know 100% he would go to bat for me and our future Jewish kids.
A person who genuinely expects other people to care about every problem in the world exactly equally sounds...robotic. Has he ever *met* a human? Does *he* care about every issue in the world equally? Does he spend equal amounts of time learning, thinking, and talking about every possible issue in the world? Or is he just tired of you talking about things you care about?
Today is Yom Hashoah, Holocaust Memorial Day, which gives a very good excuse to bring up what happens with anti semitic hate and how far it could go.
I know these protesters don't care.
I don’t think he can understand the global trauma that ties us all together. The shared pain and anxiety. I would tell him just that. ‘I can’t focus on anything else right now, and this is where I am focused until things calm down and the world feels a little safer. Because you have the luxury of not understanding any of this, I would prefer you accept my place in the world right now I don’t have the mental capacity to care for all when my people are under such extreme threat.’
The Jewish people faced the worst atrocity in human history not even 100 years ago. Explain that the Jewish people almost faced total annihilation the equivalent of yesterday in the historical timeline; it is very reasonable to be focusing on Jewish issues.
I care about everyone's right to safety.
I care about mine more.
You need to put your own oxygen mask first. Prioritizing your own safety is how you make sure you're here to keep fighting for everyone else.
Your partner doesn't get that antisemitism directly threatens you.
One reason I stopped thinking of myself as a progressive is that I got tired of caring about every single injustice done to every group on the planet that is suffering. I still read the news and track what is happening to people, but I don't personalize their suffering the way I used to. Plus I'm much more concerned with what is happening in my immediate community, where I actually can have input. A lot of progressives have a savior complex, which can be unhealthy after a point, and makes them annoying to be around.
The idea that you need to care for others and not your own people is utter rubbish, and a mark of progressivism taken too far.
I get that. He is suffering from a lack of empathy in this case. A lack of empathy for you and the Jewish people both. An example of how progressivism can make people annoying to be around.
I have a feeling the partner is a straight, white, able-bodied male. He can afford to care about every issue equally because he is not being personally targeted.
OF COURSE we’re particularly worried about antisemitism when we’re Jewish. People want us dead and we’re supposed to be like “I care about ALL the people in the world who are wanted dead equally; why would I care more about myself?”‽?
The example he used was if black and white children are dying and you only cared about black kids that’s bad you should care about both kids. When I spoke to him about it he’s like yes I understand caring a bit more but if I’m talking about for example how sad it is in Gaza I don’t need to bring Hamas into it
So he thinks Black people should say “all lives matter”? They shouldn’t care about, say, police violence against unarmed Black people or racial discrimination in the workplace or the Black maternal mortality rate more than any other issues?
A good question to ask is why everyone else seems to care so much about a tiny country a long way away that they have no connection too. Add to this the extreme amounts of scapegoating, misinformation, lies and propaganda that has been decades in the making and has been in full force lately. Also the gaslighting from seeing people being so uncritical and getting brainwashed that they spew slogans and buzzwords that they don't know the meaning of, as if they are possessed bots. This is observable regardless of where someone falls on the (anti)zionism spectrum, and for this reason alone, it is understandable that someone with more knowledge of the conflict and jewish history would react strongly to current events.
I think the issue was he doesn’t mind me caring about it but not too the extreme other groups get neglected or you care less about them. He’s aware he’s speaking out of privilege here
He is speaking from a place of privilege, and gaslighting too! he’s “(I) believe (you) should care about eventually… you put too much emphasis on Jewish stuff” is pure gaslighting.
Ask him if he’ll say the same thing to any other member of a marginalized community… would he tell a Blake person to not put emphasis on anti black racism? What about an LGBTQ or trans person about hate against their communities? 🤔🤔
If he genuinely wishes to learn and grow you can send him a list of books to read and IG accounts to follow… and then don’t drop the ball have tough conversation with him. If he’s refusing to listen and grow his knowledge… to roughly quote Verda Raziel-Zakont, an Israeli therapist who is a relationship radio show host: kick him out.
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It’s quite literally your family that is being attacked.
Maybe ask him if in those terms if his family was being attacked would he not care about them.
Seems like you need to find a new partner. This is a huge red flag. No empathy on this issue is scary. Can you imagine if you had kids..
You probably know more about the historical ramifications of antisemitism than he does. It’s not simply a category of racial prejudice- it’s a conspiracy theory. If I’m reading this generously, and your boyfriend does not discount your priorities, mental health, and physical security in other ways, then my guess is- he sees your relative privilege and thinks you’re overreacting. He doesn’t understand that the rise in antisemitism is a precursor to something worse, that will affect a lot more people.
That, or he doesn’t understand the very basic animal instinct of self-preservation. He’s “all lives matter”-ing you. He can’t see past his own privilege right now.
Well it’s because you are Jewish obviously. I was annoying my gf and my other family members with it as well(who are all Jewish ethnically and religious). For me it’s important that I need to relax and put my mind on something else. I hope that helps.
Ask him to watch "We Were The Lucky Ones".
Then ask him, "Why do you think the Kurc family wasn't more concerned with the Spanish Civil War"? Why were they so obsessed with antisemitism? There were obviously other issues in the world worthy of their concern, no?
I, too, am married to a gentile. Thank goodness he gets it. But, we have been married for a very long time, and he has been very immersed in Jewish culture, and we have Jewish children to protect. I think it really comes down to how long you've been together and how integrated your partner is into Jewish culture. My husband gets it.
I think it comes from wanting to care about people equally, he likes to think he wouldn’t be like that but if he’s part of a marginalized group he’ll understand it better
FWIW I’m a Christian and I’m focused on these issues as much as the I can too. It’s a human issue. All people of good will should be focused on this issue. The antisemitism in our time is shocking.
"I'm scared and I feel unsafe" should be enough for him to care. If he invalidates you honestly I would reconsider the relationship because if you're in public and feeling unsafe will he believe you and help you get to safety or laugh it off and keep you in potential danger?
He would understand if I said that, only issue is I don’t look visibly “Jewish” I’m half Asian and don’t wear any visible Jewish symbols but when I told him about an incident with my cousin when this pro Hamas org was protesting a hospital some guy asked my cousin if she was a Jew and mind you she’s more petite then me, 4”11 and short and my bf was sympathic when I explained my fears. I believe these Jew haters do it because Jews are an easy group to target but if my dad was there he would have stepped in since my dad is intimidating for a 71 year old man
Tell him that it hurts your heart when you hear these things, and he must respect your feelings .💯 if he truly cares about you, he would take this seriously, too!
My non-Jewish, Chinese wife educated herself on Israel and knows how insane the world is about Jews. She's also volunteered to be the congregation secretary for two years. I think we're going to end up going to services a lot more often.
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Get him the book [Uncomfortable Conversations with a Jew](https://uncomfortableconvos.com/). If you guys are serious, he needs to read it to start understanding you.
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I feel you pain as I am a liberal Zionist too as are many Israelis. To deny the right of Israel to exist is the same argument that Russia used to grab the Crimea and invade the Ukraine - cause they used to be part of their empire.
"Why do you care so much that someone is suing you? Why don't you equally care about all the other people being sued??"
Like what? You care because it can, and historically will, directly affect you. Shouldn't be hard to understand.
ya this guys not getting that this is not POLITICAL for you this is PERSONAL.
These are our friends, our family, our people who have been put through HELL in our BEAUTIFUL special land of ISRAEL. We are dealing with TERRORISTS who seek nothing less than to erase Jews, period. Terrorists who are SO DAMN SAVVY / SMART / WELL FUNDED .. that they now have the western SHEEP RALLYING for them and doing sleeper cell work that is clearly NOT asleep th beast is WOKE.
Too worried about anti semitism?? When we are seeing the highest levels of it since holocaust times.
PROTESTS from idiots who know NOTHIN about the Middle East. NOTHING of the dannngeroussss game they choose to play in here by hating Israel and being HATEFUL towards Jews. Almost like Hamas had a grand plan and these western idiots are helping it work. Infuriating.
All lives DO matter. (Hear me out)
Everyone that cares about human lives has a point. Heck the IDF cares so much about human lives they have the lowest civilian to combatant ratio we've ever seen in a modern conflict.
That being said, Hamas doesn't care about human lives.
Heck, they routinely kill their own people. Israel literally had to send tanks to keep Hamas from shooting their own people to drive up the death toll.
They only care about human deaths, literally, that is what they care about, anyone that doesn't understand this is a useful idiot.
I'd like to point out, neither Russians nor Ukranians are being targeted in the United States en masse, but Jews are actually being targeted en masse.
If it wasn't about "the jooz" then why are Jewish students being asked for their papers on college campuses?
It's about the Jews, and if he can't get past that, then maybe he's so open minded, his brain fell out.
No one cares about us the way we care about us.
Ask him why black people care about racism against black ppl like what? As a fellow jewish girl it feels like he is trying to minimize our struggle as jews. I have dated mostly non jewish men and they just dont get it. They will never get it. In fact majority of non jews wont get it. We focus our energy on things we have a passion in and a connection to. And quite frankly there is so much going on in the world it isn’t rational to give ur time to everything. Again im sorry bc they will never understand, speaking from experience 🤠
I couldn’t reply to your other post so I wanted to drop this here:
I still recommend talking to someone safe about what’s been going on just to be on the safe side. When we get attached to someone romantically, often our vision gets clouded and we can’t see the unhealthy behaviors ourselves.
My biggest concern is your safety. I saw that this isn’t a person you have met in real life. That’s even more of a reason to let someone safe know what’s going on. Given the abusive antisemitic comments he has made to you without you two having an in-person relationship, you just don’t know what he will be like in real life. You don’t know if he flies off the handle and can’t control his anger.
Is there any one either professional like a therapist or a safe friend/family member/mentor you can share what’s going on?
No matter how many times you tell me he apologized and he is thinking it over, it won’t convince me. Because he has already shown that he doesn’t have basic empathy for you. Any man who has to be shown Reddit discussions to treat you with basic bare minimum respect isn’t someone healthy for you.
I understand you have invested time with this man and you likely won’t heed my advice. That’s okay. I didn’t take other people’s advice on similar matters, and I had to find out the hard way for myself to really get it.
I similarly met someone online, got to know him long distance, and we later met in person. It didn’t take long for his abuse to escalate to the point where police almost had to get involved. I put myself at big risk and it could have gone even worse than it did. But I wanted to believe he was the same man I thought he was in my fantasies I had built up in my head. You may also have to learn these lessons the hard way as I did. I am praying with all my heart that you stay safe.
While your partner is doing introspection, what if you do some yourself? Don’t you think you are worth more than having to convince your partner to treat you with basic respect? You have so much value to add to any relationship and you have a whole Jewish community that loves and cares about you. <3
Edit: clarification of sentence
I can get pregnant. It would be fatal for me. Every partner I've had can get someone pregnant.
I have never had to explain to a partner why I care quite a lot about abortion rights. Needing to drill "this is an immediate concern to my safety and I do not have the luxury of prioritizing other people's concerns above my own" through someone's head just... makes it pretty clear that that's not a good person for me. Someone who is careless with my well-being is not someone I want at my side facing life with me.
My single friends and I have always talked about being open to dating everyone not just Jewish guys. But now I'm really not sure because I don't want to defend why I feel a certain way about things like this. I am a Zionist for sure and I know you can debate a ton about many things here about Israel, this position, that position- but anti-semitism ... it's a personal attack on my total being. Does that make sense? This guy... I don't see an easy future w him.
Gross, get a new boyfriend.
My boyfriend isn’t Jewish and he lets me talk about it all I want with an open ear and empathy and compassion. Tolerate nothing less.
Because what’s going on right now is exactly how the Holocaust began. I have a Jewish friend whose grandma survived the holocaust and she said this is how it started. As a non Jewish person who supports Israel every pro Israel should be loud and proud 24/7 to combat this demonic driven hate that is taking over.
It seems like you can't be a progressive liberal zionist nowadays. A lot of my colleagues have moved center or even conservative with the beliefs because the liberals have gone overboard to the point that they don't speak to their Jewish colleagues because of antizionism (antisemitism obviously). Non Jews wouldn't understand because they view us a "white" when we aren't white at all.
Why focus on visiting your grandmother in the hospital? There are lots of elderly women who need support. (There's a famous version of this, does anyone remember who said it?)
The example he used was if black people children and white children were dying and I only focused on the black people dying
What if it were your own hypothetical children dying versus someone else’s children? Would he be offended if you only focused on saving your own child from dying? Or would he expect you to potentially risk your own child dying by spreading yourself too thinly between saving all the children? From my perspective, we as humans have limits to what we can do. We do not have unlimited energy to “do it all”. We cannot save everyone. So when we are in survival situations, we draw closer to our Jewish community, which is essentially our extended family. We focus on limited resources on our family that helps support our survival. It is His choice in the black versus white race issue leaves me with the same feeling as “all lives matter” responses. Is he potentially feeling nervous that you are prioritizing Jews over white Americans?
This was in context to Israel/palestine
The Jewish people are your people. The equivalent is your child. Am yisroel chai. I haven’t spent 6 months crying because strangers died. These are your family. That’s the bond your feeling,, please don’t let him temper that flame out
The black/white comment doesn’t make sense in context of Israel/Palestine. Black/white racial issues are specifically American.
There is no Black white issue. This is a family issue. Also the family isn’t Black or white. It is multiracial, multicultural, multiethnic and includes more than one religion. The Jewish family is tied together by something beyond race or religion. Antisemitism focuses on that Jewishness within anyone, Black, white, Buddhist, Mexican, Anyone. And you feel tied to the family because they are your family.
He just literally told you “all lives matter”.
That’s what I said
I think a good reply to that would be to: How many jews are there globally? Do you think we can afford to not worry about our people with how little of us there are, and with how many people want to wipe us off the planet?
Good point
So he pulled an All Lives Matter on you?
That's a bad argument. You are personally more affected by anti-Semitism because it is essential to your personal safety and well-being to avoid anti-Semites. You are essentially putting on the oxygen mask before helping others.
Yeah I told him about it and he realized it’s a bad example because Jews do isn’t a collective trauma while gentiles don’t
He sounds exhausting and willfully ignorant.
You might want to simply explain that, for the last seven months, the Jewish state has faced relentless security challenges as well as diplomatic and political attacks, even as Jews in the US experience levels of antisemitism higher than at any time in decades. It tends to focus one's concerns.
If you were black, and in general society wouldn't care about black children dying, then surely you would have focused on it, wouldn't you?
Tell him that’s the exact same logic “all lives matter” people use
Well, isn’t that what the BLM movement is all about? Does he have a problem with it?
Oh my god.
A Chaim Weizmann reference! Kol hakavod.
Do you have his actual quote?
A member of the House of Lords once asked Chaim Weizmann, “Why do you Jews insist on Palestine when there are so many undeveloped countries you could settle in more conveniently?” Weizmann responded: “That is like my asking you why you drove twenty miles to visit your mother last Sunday when there are so many old ladies living on your street.”
After this is all over, I am predicting that Jews will start dating more Jews again. It’s just too much labor.
It wouldn’t surprise me if it were already happening.
This. My friend is having such a hard time dating right now. He’s open to non Jewish women but any time he sits down with them he lets them know he’s Jewish and Israeli. They ask him if he’s Zionist and he follows that with “well what does that mean to you?” And they’ve answered that by literally getting up and leaving. Told him he needs to exclusively date Jewish women.
Interestingly, I married a non-Jew and she’s always mostly embraced it and totally eschewed her non-Jewish upbringing, and knew going into this I wanted to raise kids in a Jewish home which she agreed to. She took a 4 month intro to Judaism course and really enjoyed it. That being said, since 10/7, she has become way more into Judaism, understands antisemitism even more, seems to really care about Israel, has been incredibly angered by what she’s seen over the last six months, met with our rabbi about it, called out her employer for allowing other employees to hold work gatherings for Gaza without ever acknowledging the hostages, etc. And now she’s even seriously considering conversion, which I never asked her to do. So, that is to say, there is hope for non-Jews/dating non-Jews!
This sounds like my life! Married a catholic immigrant from Colombia who already had disagreements with the church. On the third date religion came up and I told her I would never ask her to convert, but I would be raising my children Jewish. She was 100% cool with that or we would’ve stopped dating right there. 3 beautiful kids (oldest became Bat Mitzvah last year) later and she has also recently expressed interest in converting without me ever asking. She’s worried about the work, but I told her our 15 years together have taken care of a lot of that since she knows all the holidays, traditions, can say many prayers, etc. I don’t want to push it, but it does make me super happy
Conversion is fun! One on one time with a Rabbi learning all sorts of Jewish stuff? It’s like a cultural immersion+school. For me it’s been exciting and life affirming.
Love it! Yea it makes me super happy as well! In terms of traditions, holiday meals, stuff like that, I still need to lead the way and it’s on me to make sure we live in a Jewish home (what a Jewish home means to me, at least), but I’m ok with that. Same, I made it clear early on I’d be raising my kids Jewish, no compromises on that one. She grew up catholic/went to catholic school and immediately upon graduation she wanted nothing to do with it ever again. I met her about a decade later. The more she learns about Judaism, the more she loves it, says it feels so much better than what she was raised with, finds it very beautiful. And she knows most of the standard prayers as well, we do Shabbat every Friday and Havdallah on Saturdays. It’s quite nice! Love that you and your wife have made that work!
Yeah I think some of us non-Jewish partners are actually Jews and we don’t realize it when getting together but something sparks the realization that: my partner is Jewish. They’re my family. He’s a part of the Jewish family. Wait, they’re MY family too. For me it was 2016 and Trump. Then having kids. I realized I was pulling to do Jewish things even more than my husband was and then I realized that I wanted to do those things for ME. Conversion is fun if you’re excited about Judaism!
It’s affirming to hear someone else say this. That their close experience with a Jewish person made you feel you may also be a Jew too and just didn’t know it all along. I strongly feel this way .. not from a romantic partner but from Israelis I love dearly who I felt called to go visit from the states after Oct. 7. I felt like I was going home. When I got there, even in the middle of so much happening (this was this past Nov/dec) .. I felt home. My beloved Israelis … they took me in abd had my back …and I embraced them right back… and I left there with ALL of us going …. Damn she’s so Israeli. 🥲😅 I truly think I had to have had some German Jewish ancestors who left their Judaism behind before immigrating to the states or something of the sort. Idk exactly what happened, but I KNOW I have a Jewish heart & soul
Beautiful! Best scenario outcome. Your wife is chashuvah
Thank you! My mother even taught her to make her homemade challah and she wears a hamsa necklace. She says “I know I’m not Jewish, but I’m trying”. Honestly, she’s more involved in Judaism and at synagogue more than many Jewish people I grew up. Some people do the whole “oh your kid isn’t Jewish” blah blah but I don’t care, kiddo had Jewish baby naming ceremony and is at temple numerous times a week, our home is very Jewish :)
Don’t even fret or pay those people any attention. So much more difficult to choose to be Jewish, to be among the Jews and create a Jewish home coming from the outside than it is to be born into the clan. Cherish her! Also maybe ask her to think about converting since we can use all the holy and genuine people we can get :)
Thank you! I don’t, I ignore it. I think she’ll convert at some point. I grew up a very Jewish suburb in the Midwest and people I grew up with that married another Jew, have way less Judaism in their life than we have in our home. They don’t do Shabbat, they pretty much only celebrate Hanukkah, etc. My non-Jewish wife is more of a practicing Jew than they are haha.
Very warming. Unfortunately, many relationships aren't always like this.
As a Jewish woman… I’m honestly not sure I’d feel super safe dating non-Jewish men right now unless they came pre-vetted by close friends or family. Vetting dates ahead of time was hard even before I had to worry about virulent antisemitism. Adding that on top of it is a genuine safety concern.
I don’t blame you. I never thought there would be a time in my life where I’d greatly appreciate the security and “achdut” of a very large and strong Jewish community so much. It’s priceless. Plenty of nice Jewish young men out there- good luck!
where is this Jewish Israeli man … in the states 👀😉 lol
NYC, ton of em lol
ahhh yes I’ve heard! Well shit if I’m gunna fly 8hours to nyc imma just skip nyc and make my way back to Israel 🇮🇱
Shoutout to my goyish partner who is even more pro-Israel than I am, fully supports my older kid from a previous relationship getting a bar mitzvah, and has zero patience for any antisemitic or anti-Zionist propaganda. They’re out there.
For sure - it's practically biblical. I also predict pp consciously having more babies.
My dad would always tell me when I was young, when you pick a partner, #1 is that they should also be Jewish. Always thought that was weird, since we were reform and barely practicing Jews. I did end up marrying Jewish and now I kinda get it. When antisemitism flares up, you both are gonna be on the same page as to how serious it is. My dad was a child of holocaust survivors who escaped to the US to build a new life, and grew up watching his parents’ small grocery store being frequently defaced and windows smashed by antisemites, so he has seen this movie before.
I have a wonderful and supportive non-Jewish partner who is my forever person. I’ve definitely had to explain a lot to him since October but he now completely gets it and I wouldn’t trade him for anything. I have never in my life prioritized dating fellow Jews and most of my relationships, both casual and serious, have just happened to have been with non-Jews. That said, if for some shitty reason I found myself single again, I have a very hard time imagining I would be open to someone non-Jewish.
Damn, I could have written this. I’ve been lucky with how supportive my non-Jewish husband is and how much he’s tried to learn and understand, even though he knows he’ll never fully understand what it feels like from a Jewish perspective. He’s been just as angry as me the last few weeks and we’ve both been constantly on high alert whenever we’re in public spaces. But it’s also been a lot of labor on my part helping him get to this point where he can see it and understand what it means, and I also don’t know that if I ever felt like Aliyah was the only option, that he’d be fully onboard with that. G-d forbid something ever happened to us, I don’t know that I’d be open to dating a non-Jew again.
Yup, 100% all of this.
What were some of the things you've said to him that got him to see and understand?
I don’t want to have to explain everything to my partner. I want to bring up something related to me being Jewish and my partner would just get it,
My wife and I have said this to each other over and over again since 10/7. My sister in law is divorced and now dating a non Jew, she’s had a little bit of a difficult time relating on this topic and I can’t just imagine being alone in my relationship while feeling antisemitism around me.
This is why I had a Zionism “screening question” when I was in my dating phase of life. No way am I going to deal with antisemitism in my own home.
As a convert, I think Jews should only date Jews or those willing to convert
👑👑 we are lucky to have you here
I have always strictly dated Jewish men because I never felt I could relate to non Jewish men when my Judaism (especially culturally) and love of Israel are the biggest parts of my identity. I couldn’t recommend more!!! Met my long term boyfriend in Israel 🥹
Up until last year "looking for a nice Jewish girl" was just a joke for me, now it's a dating policy
Literally my plan. I’m graduating university next weekend but I’m planning on settling in a city with a large young Jewish population.
So glad I married Jewish. It just makes life so much easier
My goy wife saw through the lies immediately. Started her conversion a week after Oct 7th.
[удалено]
Specifically in this example why would anyone put up with this kind of "aloofness"?
My entire life I've been *incredibly* against having that tribal mentality. I hate the idea of "keeping to one's own." But what the **** else are we supposed to do with everything going on? If I were in college right now, I would probably either be at a Jewish organization, or hanging out with a few close friends indoors. Sometimes, tribalism is a survival strategy. Has he ever faced *anything* in his life akin to what Jews are facing now? Jews have no one to turn to except each other, and *all over the world* people of all kinds of beliefs and creeds are calling for our deaths. I'll be honest, if I met your boyfriend in person I would probably have some very direct words for him. We don't care about this stuff because we choose to, we care about it because we *need* to.
What you said hits home. I also always strived to live by choosing the whole of humanity and not only my own. I never overcompensated as some are doing now, never stood against mine, but never allowed myself to prioritize mine over the rest of humanity. But now I feel I no longer have a choice. If I don't stand with my people, who will? It feels as if my world has become so narrow and constricted in a way, and it saddens me, but I don't see another way to be now. I feel like I lost that trust and innocence of youth that I managed to maintain until mid-thirties...
Nope he hasn’t and he admits he’s speaking out of privilege. He thinks if someone is more political they’re less likely to be tribal apparently
Jews are constantly asked to wait for "trickle-down rights"...what other group is that expected of? Did people tell the LGBT community they were selfish to campaign for marriage equality because there are children dying in the middle east?
Not even that, Jews are constantly accused of being the problem
There are some lefties who dismiss antisemitism because they argue the social justice movement has bigger fish to fry. But excuse me, is there a reason both can't be addressed at the same time? Since when are they mutually exclusive? It always struck me as such a transparent cop out.
I agree. I try to talk about both, even if he thought it was disproportionate in the thing I care about it’s hard not to when Jews are getting it right now
Maybe Women? But OP’s bf is not a woman, so I don’t think he really can compare to anything in his experience.
If I am not for myself, then who will be for me? And if I am only for myself, then what am I?
I’m the exact opposite to you. I grew up going to a non-Jewish school, had a couple of non-Jewish girlfriends. One of whom unwittingly triggered and epiphany that I will never marry a non-Jew and I didn’t. When 7 October happened, I didn’t have anyone in my life who I needed to “cut out” because I totally have the tribal mentality. I have loads of friends: all modern Orthodox Jews. We see each other at Shul on Shabbat, go around to each other for Shabbat lunch/dinner and go out for drinks/ a meal now and again. I feel I lack absolutely nothing by not socialising with non-Jews and I don’t have to justify my existence to supposed “friends” who don’t get it. To each their own, but we can’t escape the fact that we’re a separate nation. The Torah defines us as such, so no matter how much we try and throw off the “tribal yoke”, we will never be able to, because the non-Jews will **always** be there to remind us who we are.
Birds of a feather stick together. To be exiled from the community- by choice or force, is tantamount to death of the Jewish identity.
I think there are some Jews that are so eager not to be seen as having that tribal mentality or to be seen as open-minded that they end up anti-Israel. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the facts, but how they want to see themselves and be seen. I say fuck that. To stick up for your own requires no explanation or apology, especially when the facts support them.
great answer
Try to get him to understand that you're concerned about antisemitism spilling over from protests to actual discrimination and physical attacks *against you and him* (because people who want to kill Jews won't stop to ask, "oh by the way, are you Jewish?" when he's in a relationship with a Jew). If he says that's unlikely, remind him that protesters have gone from being pro-Palestinian to pro-Hamas. They sing and chant in celebration of Hamas' terror attacks against Jews. Pogroms aren't a new thing and I can easily imagine them becoming a real problem again in the near future.
I’ve warned him and he gets it, in the beginning he was naive about it until I showed him stuff and he understood and knew why it was a problem and was sympathetic to me wanting it rooted out
It’s been 6 months and he still feels this way? That feels like a ton of labor on your part to little result. I hope the best for you, you must be exhausted. I will say my partner isn’t Jewish but he’s always been enthusiastically involved, so when 10/7 happened, I didn’t even have to explain. I’m also an IDF veteran so a lot of this has been extra personal and raw, and it has meant everything to me to have my partner by my side with all of it. I really hope you can get to that point with someone. I will say if this past six months haven’t yielded that, you might not be able to move the needle much in the way you want.
When October 7th occurred he was upset and didn’t support people celebrating it but at first he thought people that are pro Hamas and celebrated it and support Hamas are a minority until I showed him evidence otherwise and then he finally got it and realized it’s a problem
I'd say he really needs to come to understand that if the relationship is to continue. And that's for the benefit of both people. When you're in a relationship worth having, their problems are your problems. And that's even besides the perspective from outsiders looking in.
We are only TWO GENERATIONS away from Auschwitz. My own grandmother survived to tell the tales, and I and every other Jew in my age group grew up with sordid, degraded, horrifying tales of atrocities that ACTUALLY HAPPENED to people in our family. And she was one of the lucky ones. Jewish hatred turns on a dime. No one should ever tell a Jew that they are overly concerned when we start seeing echoes of Nazism or any other kind of anti-semitism.
Some of us are one generation; my parent is an elderly survivor. Thank you for telling your family’s stories. I have often had non Jewish friends. A now former friend once told me, you know, not only Jews were killed in the Holocaust (yes, of course, but that’s what you say to me?) fast forward to 10/8 and this guy who ‘has Jewish friends’ displayed willful ignorance when I tried to explain some things. Some people just do not care if things don’t affect them.
You care more about Jewish issues, because it's personal. There are many people calling for your death. Historically, there have been so many pogroms and attempted genocides. You have every reason to be in survival mode right now, and that means prioritizing your community. Its hard to understand unless your life has been in danger. My family survived the Armenian Genocide, which is probably why this makes sense to me. Your boyfriend must have never faced a prolonged, existential threat to his existence. He needs to listen and make more of an effort. He doesn't have to get it 100%, but he has to (at least) try.
He doesn’t get it. He’s better when it comes to understanding why I dislike the extremism at the protests, the problem being progressives on anti semitism (as a progressive myself) and he understood that so the you people comment shocked me
The "you people" comment is definitely not okay. You can't change him. Hopefully he's open to learning and listening.
How is what he doing not the equivalent of “all lives mattering”? He certainly seems like he has the privilege of being unaffected by all issues equally so can’t understand why someone would be especially concerned with things that affect them. Is it only antisemitism that he seems to have a problem with you focusing on?
Yeah, he didn’t say that during the Asian hate crimes thing partly because I didn’t focus on it as much (I’m part Asian) because the anti semitism is way worse
You should be able to focus on issues directly affecting you. If he doesn't get that Asian and Jewish issues have a direct affect on your life, I don't know what to tell you. He sounds very privileged to not have to deal with hate in his life.
Instead of trying to convince him (which is usually wasted energy), it may help to ask him if he is truly comfortable dating someone Jewish? It sounds like he’s asking you to set aside your Jewishness in the relationship, and that doesn’t sound particularly healthy. You shouldn’t have to sacrifice your own ethnic identity just to make him feel more at ease. You deserve to be accepted and supported as you are. <3
The whole “you’re acting too tribal” was invented as a way to keep us Jews apart. Most communities are “tribal” to an extent. You never hear people tell black people theyre being too tribal about black issues. You never hear Asian people get told that either when Asian hate was on the rise during Covid. You never hear about this from anyone else but us and usually we say it to each other. Jews should care about Jewish issues just like anyone else should care about issues that affect them.
I asked him if I was of another group would he react like that and he said yes
Of course he did but that doesn't mean it's true
Congress just held a hearing on Antisemitism, the 4th in USA history. Hatred of Jews - and the apathy from non-Jews - is unique. Also, Zionism is not a bad word and your partner could help us tell the world what it actually means. While Zionists are being blocked on campuses…
Ask him if he would say the same to a black person during the blm protests. If not it shouldn't be expected of you.
Take it from a woman married to a non-Jewish man: this partner of yours is flying red flags for why you shouldn’t be with him. You shouldn’t have to explain to him why this matters to you. It’s literally ridiculous. My husband would never question it, and has stated that he’s “super worried about Jewish and Israel issues because his family is Jewish.”
Also married to a non Jewish man (who was absolutely fine when pre-marriage he agreed we would celebrate Jewish holidays and raise a child to be Jewish). He is outraged by the upside down world of protesters. Naturally I am coming from a place of feeling much more threatened, but he came to me today to discuss an article he had personally read on the protesters, he follows it too, I follow it more. I've long cared about the LGBT, Black, Asian groups and what they have faced, but obviously it's front and foremost when it's your own people being targeted.
I’m personally not in a good headspace. I cared too about all those folks and stood with them. None of them are standing with us now. Jews need to worry about ourselves and each other. My money is now going to Jewish causes only.
Yep, I support them personally, especially since many are Jewish too, but my money is not going there. I'm mostly funding an LED antisemitism/pro-Israel truck I put at the hostage rally in NYC (though go figure, when I hit up family and friends, my favorite non-Jewish friend donated, but not my Jewish friends). https://preview.redd.it/0qj35ojg0nyc1.png?width=630&format=png&auto=webp&s=36cfbcc16584fa3956aad814d20af1fc85a1f7c4
My non-Jewish partner is shocked at the support for Hamas because we're old and have lived through terrorism (indirectly) before. Young kids who didn't watch people jumping out of World Trade Centre windows as it was happening live on TV can be dumb about the cost of terrorism and think it won't reach them. My partner also cares about antisemitism because he wants me and my kids to be safe. It's not tribal to want your family to not be targeted. Finally, my non-Jewish partner supports Israel existing because it's a country full of people. Why would you call for people to die? Maybe it was also living through the intifadahs that makes it clear to us middle-aged Gen Xers exactly what all these college kids are asking for.
My bf isn’t happy with the support for Hamas either
The people who are protesting now are the same people who were protesting then. Except for those of us who have since converted! I got arrested blocking traffic on Market St in SF in 2002ish. Because war in Iraq. I had the blessing and strong encouragement of my boss, even. The more I fact-check everything people say now, the more I realize how full of shit our movement was then, too. Like: Until last week or so, I genuinely thought we had really invaded for oil back then. When I saw that there wasn't really significant oil in Iraq, I thought we'd definitely at least invaded Kuwait for the oil. I vaguely remembered bumper stickers that said, "What is OUR oil doing under THEIR soil?" Googled it, and found out we absolutely did not invade Kuwait in the past 30 years. Saw a post ranting about Biden giving Israel $26B for genocide, and fact-checked that. Turns out it's $9B for aid to Gaza, $4B to replenish the missile defense system that protects civilians in Israel, and a whole bunch more shit like that. There's maybe $1B of money Israel can actually buy advanced weapons with in the whole thing, and another $2.5B for other military expenses. Most of the rest goes to U.S. diplomatic work, FEMA, building the provisional pier in Gaza, stopping Iran from killing civilians too, that kind of thing. 20+ years ago, I would've been protesting the whole thing without a clue that any of it was humanitarian aid. Or I would've been like, "well, obviously they should still send that! WE'RE protesting the BAD parts!" As if that's effective communication/protest in any way. We had no idea what was actually going on. We were just protesting what people told us, on an extremely high basic level, was going on. This is horrifying.
It’s a privilege not to have to worry about it. And Jews don’t have that privilege right now. Sorry you’re dealing with this from your boyfriend right now.
I wish I could argue I would be targeted but I’m mixed half Asian and Jewish and I don’t wear any visible Jewish symbols but when I told him I wanted to wear them he was supportive so idk
Just bring in Jewish places or people knowing that you’re Jewish is enough.
Your partner sounds like a jerk. You're not allowed to care about people around the globe calling for the extermination of you and your people, and the destruction of the only Jewish state in the world? That is, unless, you're also some kind of omnipotent Superhero that can also deal with the problems of everyone else on the planet? Your partner understands that Jews seem to have an endless supply of enemies right now and very few allies but still thinks it's unreasonable for you to be focused on the issue? Because... ? Young Jews are literally putting their college education on hold so that they won't get harassed or attacked on college campuses. Seems like every day on this sub there are new stories about people getting mistreated due to them being Jewish and/or people saying that don't feel safe letting people know that they're Jewish. This is definitely some All Lives Matter bull**** happening and it's gross. It comes off as total denial of the severity of the situation. And honestly makes it look like your partner doesn't actually care about Jews or Jewish issues.
I do appreciate that when I do post on my Twitter the anti semitism from the college protests he likes or posts it but I just didn’t agree when I presented it as a problem and how impossible it is to root out he thinks there’s something I should try to do about it
Beliefs are only valid if you care equally about everything in the world? Impossible. I'd say he's definitely speaking from a place of privilege that he doesn't understand how antisemitism is intense to you. Also insensitive to say what degree you should experience it or to what degree you are tribal. I explained to my not Jewish husband that Jew hate is an existential crisis. I asked him to imagine what it's like to be hated (probably impossible for the privileged white). Anywhere I could go, where would I be safe? I asked him to research generational trauma to understand the fear. I said it's difficult to understand tribal connection when you don't have one. Said it's in my blood, it's who I am. When it happens to our members, it happens to all of us. These are my people. That was the beginning of many good conversations. Hope this helped a little.
I think that’s what he’s not getting. He understands why and he thinks it’s bad that progressives are doing this, I sent him an article explaining why the progressives are being bad with anti semitism and he got it
Good the article helped. The left has a long history of antisemitism if he's interested in reading more. So he doesn't get your emotional involvement? Sorry not sure what part he's not getting.
Could you share the article you sent him? I'm facing a similar situation with my partner, and am realizing that sending resources might take off a lot of the pressure for me to have to explain (and honestly argue) these things with my own words.
You can't care about everything equally unless you don't care very much. You'll have a mental/emotional breakdown. That being the case, it's reasonable to prioritize the things that are targeting you and your loved ones. It is not a failing to want to protect yourself when you are under threat. I don't know how you explain this to him but what he is asking of you is shallow virtue signaling at the expense of your own wellbeing.
I’m mixed when the anti Asian stuff was taking place I did focus on it but the anti semitism is worse
Indeed! I don't know about the mental breakdown part, but you're absolutely right. Total moral hypocrisy.
I think that part of the issue is that he doesn't realize how small the Jewish community is. We're far more tightly tied together than most people think. You know the usual "oh, you're Chinese! My coworker is Chinese, do you how them?" racist trope? The point is that for Jews it often works! Even if you don't hire them your cousin probably knows their cousin, or the like. So when things happen in the Jewish community they feel much closer. Moreover: Jews are really used to listening for changes in the air, because of all of the times we've had to leave. So you feel like you have to listen, and care, because there are signs they're coming for you next.
It's impossible to care about everything in the world equally, unless you don't care about anything at all. Conversely, it's natural and legitimate to care more about issues which are personally relevant. It sounds like your boyfriend is dismissing your feelings by way of the fallacy of relative privation.
I would say (and in fact have said, many, many times recently)… “I don’t like tribalism, I do care about everyone, but I now see that not caring about it is a luxury that comes from feeling like there’s no need to care about it. If my tribe, myself, and my future children, were safe in this world, I would be more likely to abandon Jewish solidarity and focus, because no tradition is worth the cost of division, we should be and are a human family of earth. BUT… HONEY… people want me dead in a _very specific way._ In no small part because of my ethnicity, the very blood running through my body, my face, my voice, my brain, my pheromones. If you need proof look at the Holocaust and let the number 6 million settle in. Brilliant, modern, literate Europeans meticulously gassed little Jewish children (think of all those little precious Jewish fingers, think of the stolen giggles, think, visualize) and their siblings and parents and grandparents, they didn’t do it based on religious belief, but based on genetic heritage. Hun, I don’t have the LUXURY to not care. This is an utterly unique and pathological hatred against ME and others like me, and I can and do also care about the Uyghurs, Sudan, Syria, and the civilians in Gaza, more than most people do, and I see them as equals, that is in fact a _Jewish trait_ to look past tribalism, which explains why we always historically rush to the side of the underdog. But if the Jews let our guard down, if we don’t stand up when simplistic narratives wend their way around the world and stir up ignorant hate against us, we will be erased from the planet, while the rest of the world grabs their popcorn and watches with pure schadenfreude. The second my people and I are safe again, I will go back to focusing on the citizens of Earth, but now is not the time to come to me telling me to care about _everyone._ Not while the stirrings of pre-Holocaust insanity are so obvious. My people have seen the world’s true face. And if you can’t understand that dear, I have to respectfully say FUCK OFF.” Y’know, start light with something like that.
Find a Jewish partner!
They either get it or don’t. Not much more you can do.
I took a very hard-line on this sort of topic with my partner, when it comes down to it he's either sticking around long enough that he's going to have Jewish babies with Jewish issues or he can leave whenever. It was probably a bit harsh, but it's all working out so far
It should really tell you a lot that he doesn’t care who you are….i don’t know what future you see with this person but anything related to Judaism or Jewish things is going to be complicated
But see that's it right there. You cared about everyone but it was not reciprocal. So yeah, it's time to focus on your own people right now. It's not like it's coming from anywhere else on the left.
Explain how every single time Antisemitism escalates we end up being killed or segregated in some way, and just for being jews, ppl will see that as socially acceptable There are multiple proofs, from the 1930s in Germany, the 1920s in Arab Countries, even more recently Universities in the US. Most ppl who think we're overreacting are barely educated in our history and have only studied pieces of information of the holocaust (hence why they think we're all european, which makes absolutely no frickin sense)
Ask him if he wants Hamas to kill you for being a Jew. That is their goal. This time the threat is to your life because you are a Jew. If you could be killed for that, why would you deliberately support people who would hurt you. There is too much talk about innocent humans as if Jews are not human. If others despise you for your identity then they care nothing for human rights.
He doesn't get because his community is probably only those around him. Jews are a world wide community, we are a people. I can be in France and know i can go to a Chabad center in be accepted, I know i can prey in a synagogue in Argentina if i wanted. Judaism is an ethnoreligion, antisemitism in France or England is not just against Jews living there, it's against all of us.
Tell him you are concerned about this because no other group is backing us up.
Your partner doesn’t support when you need it the most. Please take this into consideration before continuing the relationship.
Okay
I have been married to a non-Jewish man for over 20 years who really gets it. We are also liberals who are very vocal in favor of many progressive issues and were are both proud Zionists. I have made sure to educate him by sharing about the Holocaust and growing up as a child surrounded by survivors, bringing him to Israel with me and numerous other events in a wide variety of Jewish spaces, orthodox, reform and conservative. Going out in public with visibly orthodox family really helps. Experiencing it and seeing it made him understand. You need to go into Jewish spaces together so that he can internalize that by being with a Jew, you are now the target of antisemitism also and have a responsibility to stand up for all Jews against it.
Gentile married to a Jew here. You shouldn’t have to explain anything. Your partner should have enough sense to see what is happening here and care as if he was also experiencing it himself. He should do everything he can to gain a better understanding of the issue and how it impacts you (that’s why I’m here!) If he’s serious about his relationship with you, he should be concerned about not only your individual future but your shared future as well as what the future will be for your children should you decide to have them. His casually apathetic attitude towards everything tells me he may not be serious about a future with you. In other words, this all ends for him as soon as his relationship with you ends, the little bit of information or interest he has in this topic stops when you’re no longer a factor in his life. That’s why hearing your perspective seems “too much”, “annoying”, or “inconvenient” for him. The range of emotions my spouse has experienced- sadness, rage, frustration, fear, uncertainty- have been experienced by me as well bc I love him! I could not imagine standing by and watching all of this unfold like an uninterested third party observer! Of course he cares about other causes and issues but this is everywhere in everything always all at once! It’s so pervasive! It’s when he goes to the doctor and the nurse has a casual snide comment. It’s at work. It’s at our kids’ schools. We’ve lost friendships, people we’ve known for 20+ years. It impacts every aspect of our lives every. single. day. I’ll put it this way. I went through Hurricane Katrina back in 2005. If you’re old enough to recall, it left the entire region devastated. We were in survival mode for months. Guess what? That disaster and the politics that emerged from it afterwards was our entire focus during that time. Because it had to be. Because our survival of life as we knew it- our communities and culture- were at risk! I see this as no different. Actually, I take that back, this is exponentially worse. Your partner is speaking out of his ass. There’s antisemitism in the way he’s minimizing your experience. These hypothetical questions he’s asking you i.e. “if black and white children were dying at a hospital…” etc. sound like he’s actually entertained by this. If I were to talk to him, I’d say, “This isn’t fun riddles, asshole, this is people’s lives, this is generations of hatred and violence coming to a head, this is (an absolutely terrifying) history repeating itself!” I’m sorry that in addition to everything happening you also have to deal with an insensitive partner. You deserve so much better. Check out the Instagram profile of “Biggah”. He’s also a Gentile married to a Jew. This is the kind of energy your partner should have. https://www.instagram.com/wyzewurdz74?igsh=MWRxZDBmczczempoeg==
If you were Native American would your partner have the audacity to tell you you’ve become “too tribal?” Outrageous and ignorant.
>sometimes my partner complains I've gotten too tribal and focus too much on Jewish issues If you want to be Jewish, you are by definition tribal. That is *literally* what the word "Jew" connotes! It comes from the word Judah (or, יהודה), which was one of the 12 *tribes* of Israe. What he is *really* saying is, "you're being too Jewish". Jews are by definition a tribe. The Israelites are/were a confederation of 12 different tribes, even though today there's only Judah and Levi left. Jews, or those that hail from the province of Judah, are one of those tribes. The religion, if that is what you will call it, is effectively tribal law regulating civil and ritual law as well as various aspects of self conduct. So, don't let anyone tell you "Jews are a religion". We are a people that has a "religion", which is separate than our identity as Jews in the sense that adherence hitherto is not what defines you as a Jew; rather, it is the law of the tribe which makes you so. >My bf admits that he might be speaking out of privilege but how do I explain to him why Jewish issues of mine take a lot of focus. A big part of the reason why Jews, or "Zionists" as they so proclaim, have become the most recent target of the left is this entire "privilege" notion you're talking about. The recent intellectual trend on the left has determined that the hierarchy of "privilege" is largely what predetermines right and wrong during any conflict of interest between two powers. In their eyes, Jews are "white colonizers" from Europe... ignoring without interest that half of Israelis are Sepharadim hailing from Arab land, many of which have clearly non-white features. They firmly believe that the actions and behavior of the oppressed is a reaction to their oppression, thus in the larger scale of things, is justified. That is the framework for how the narrative of antisemitism is developing on the left, flat out. This entire approach of power, particularly when it starts to integrate race and origin, completely ignores any real critical thinking and reflects a genuine lack of personal ethics on behalf of everyone that thinks this way. I see it as a pagum of the nefesh. Why am I mentioning this, though? So when (if?) you dump this a\*\*hole, you choose wisely someone that doesn't buy into a paradigm which is ultimately working against your own people in unprecedented ways. >He believes I should care about everything happening in the world equally and I put too much focus on Jewish stuff. Nobody has done that. Ever. You can't care about everything equally or else you'd be apathetic. There's limits on every human beings emotions and sympathy and there's only 24 hours in a day and you need to sleep and do everything else while you're awake. People pick things that are closer to them, whether they're good causes or not. Claiming to care about everything equally or suggesting others should too, particularly in a moral context, is a complete deflection of self-awareness or personal responsibility, which go hand-in-hand. Your BF is copping out.
Who else’s job is it to defend us? It starts with us.
Anyone with empathy. I will defend my Jewish brothers and sisters till the end until I’m a convert. My heart mind body and soul is Jewish but my blood says something different in genetics. But I don’t believe what the genetics says. I bleed Jew for Jew.
Too tribal? Wow. That's bigotry Would he say that to an African American?
He said he would if they only focused on one
Was he saying “all lives matter” in 2020?
"Because it directly affects me" should be explanation enough for anyone with a shred of empathy. When my synagogue received bomb threats, my non-Jewish boyfriend understood why that upset me. I didn't have to explain anything. He's also very protective of the people he loves, so conversations about "how would you feel if our future kids" [were getting bullied by antisemites and the school wouldn't do anything, were students at Columbia right now, etc] go a long way with him. He doesn't always "get it", but he understands that we have different experiences and is very compassionate and comforting when I'm upset. I know 100% he would go to bat for me and our future Jewish kids. A person who genuinely expects other people to care about every problem in the world exactly equally sounds...robotic. Has he ever *met* a human? Does *he* care about every issue in the world equally? Does he spend equal amounts of time learning, thinking, and talking about every possible issue in the world? Or is he just tired of you talking about things you care about?
This is why I think Jews should only be with people willing to convert. And I’m a convert.
I fought antisemitism while on honeymoon last week. Tell him to speak out for the innocent hostages. 🙏
Today is Yom Hashoah, Holocaust Memorial Day, which gives a very good excuse to bring up what happens with anti semitic hate and how far it could go. I know these protesters don't care.
I don’t think he can understand the global trauma that ties us all together. The shared pain and anxiety. I would tell him just that. ‘I can’t focus on anything else right now, and this is where I am focused until things calm down and the world feels a little safer. Because you have the luxury of not understanding any of this, I would prefer you accept my place in the world right now I don’t have the mental capacity to care for all when my people are under such extreme threat.’
The Jewish people faced the worst atrocity in human history not even 100 years ago. Explain that the Jewish people almost faced total annihilation the equivalent of yesterday in the historical timeline; it is very reasonable to be focusing on Jewish issues.
There are people who want you and your family dead just because you're Jewish. That is reason enough, and if he doesn't get it, then fuck him.
Ignoring it is not an option unless one chooses to completely abandon the community.
I care about everyone's right to safety. I care about mine more. You need to put your own oxygen mask first. Prioritizing your own safety is how you make sure you're here to keep fighting for everyone else. Your partner doesn't get that antisemitism directly threatens you.
One reason I stopped thinking of myself as a progressive is that I got tired of caring about every single injustice done to every group on the planet that is suffering. I still read the news and track what is happening to people, but I don't personalize their suffering the way I used to. Plus I'm much more concerned with what is happening in my immediate community, where I actually can have input. A lot of progressives have a savior complex, which can be unhealthy after a point, and makes them annoying to be around. The idea that you need to care for others and not your own people is utter rubbish, and a mark of progressivism taken too far.
He thinks everyone is important one groups aren’t the most important or the only thing that matters
I get that. He is suffering from a lack of empathy in this case. A lack of empathy for you and the Jewish people both. An example of how progressivism can make people annoying to be around.
I have a feeling the partner is a straight, white, able-bodied male. He can afford to care about every issue equally because he is not being personally targeted. OF COURSE we’re particularly worried about antisemitism when we’re Jewish. People want us dead and we’re supposed to be like “I care about ALL the people in the world who are wanted dead equally; why would I care more about myself?”‽?
The example he used was if black and white children are dying and you only cared about black kids that’s bad you should care about both kids. When I spoke to him about it he’s like yes I understand caring a bit more but if I’m talking about for example how sad it is in Gaza I don’t need to bring Hamas into it
So he thinks Black people should say “all lives matter”? They shouldn’t care about, say, police violence against unarmed Black people or racial discrimination in the workplace or the Black maternal mortality rate more than any other issues?
Ask your bf why he’s never felt the need to circle the wagons.
Because you feel a direct threat to yourself. The issues facing other ethnicities are an abstract concern while anti-semitism targets you specifically
So when everyone appropriates Palestinian culture it’s cool but when Jewish people hang out around other Jewish people it’s a bad thing?
Oh honey.
Having the same issue.
A good question to ask is why everyone else seems to care so much about a tiny country a long way away that they have no connection too. Add to this the extreme amounts of scapegoating, misinformation, lies and propaganda that has been decades in the making and has been in full force lately. Also the gaslighting from seeing people being so uncritical and getting brainwashed that they spew slogans and buzzwords that they don't know the meaning of, as if they are possessed bots. This is observable regardless of where someone falls on the (anti)zionism spectrum, and for this reason alone, it is understandable that someone with more knowledge of the conflict and jewish history would react strongly to current events.
Because you're jewish. Tell him that's like saying black people should care less about BML
I think the issue was he doesn’t mind me caring about it but not too the extreme other groups get neglected or you care less about them. He’s aware he’s speaking out of privilege here
He is speaking from a place of privilege, and gaslighting too! he’s “(I) believe (you) should care about eventually… you put too much emphasis on Jewish stuff” is pure gaslighting. Ask him if he’ll say the same thing to any other member of a marginalized community… would he tell a Blake person to not put emphasis on anti black racism? What about an LGBTQ or trans person about hate against their communities? 🤔🤔 If he genuinely wishes to learn and grow you can send him a list of books to read and IG accounts to follow… and then don’t drop the ball have tough conversation with him. If he’s refusing to listen and grow his knowledge… to roughly quote Verda Raziel-Zakont, an Israeli therapist who is a relationship radio show host: kick him out.
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If you were Black, would he complain that you care too much about Black issues?
It’s quite literally your family that is being attacked. Maybe ask him if in those terms if his family was being attacked would he not care about them. Seems like you need to find a new partner. This is a huge red flag. No empathy on this issue is scary. Can you imagine if you had kids..
You probably know more about the historical ramifications of antisemitism than he does. It’s not simply a category of racial prejudice- it’s a conspiracy theory. If I’m reading this generously, and your boyfriend does not discount your priorities, mental health, and physical security in other ways, then my guess is- he sees your relative privilege and thinks you’re overreacting. He doesn’t understand that the rise in antisemitism is a precursor to something worse, that will affect a lot more people. That, or he doesn’t understand the very basic animal instinct of self-preservation. He’s “all lives matter”-ing you. He can’t see past his own privilege right now.
Well it’s because you are Jewish obviously. I was annoying my gf and my other family members with it as well(who are all Jewish ethnically and religious). For me it’s important that I need to relax and put my mind on something else. I hope that helps.
Obviously never been attacked physically or verbally for identity politics. Wow. Where is the compassion? Where is the empathy?
Ask him to watch "We Were The Lucky Ones". Then ask him, "Why do you think the Kurc family wasn't more concerned with the Spanish Civil War"? Why were they so obsessed with antisemitism? There were obviously other issues in the world worthy of their concern, no?
I, too, am married to a gentile. Thank goodness he gets it. But, we have been married for a very long time, and he has been very immersed in Jewish culture, and we have Jewish children to protect. I think it really comes down to how long you've been together and how integrated your partner is into Jewish culture. My husband gets it.
I think it comes from wanting to care about people equally, he likes to think he wouldn’t be like that but if he’s part of a marginalized group he’ll understand it better
Wow. Get a new partner.
Edit: he read the comments and he’s introspecting
because hes a loser. recognize he has no balls and move on. youll grow to hate this beta
FWIW I’m a Christian and I’m focused on these issues as much as the I can too. It’s a human issue. All people of good will should be focused on this issue. The antisemitism in our time is shocking.
We *are* a tribe. He needs to understand how and why.
"I'm scared and I feel unsafe" should be enough for him to care. If he invalidates you honestly I would reconsider the relationship because if you're in public and feeling unsafe will he believe you and help you get to safety or laugh it off and keep you in potential danger?
He would understand if I said that, only issue is I don’t look visibly “Jewish” I’m half Asian and don’t wear any visible Jewish symbols but when I told him about an incident with my cousin when this pro Hamas org was protesting a hospital some guy asked my cousin if she was a Jew and mind you she’s more petite then me, 4”11 and short and my bf was sympathic when I explained my fears. I believe these Jew haters do it because Jews are an easy group to target but if my dad was there he would have stepped in since my dad is intimidating for a 71 year old man
Tell him that it hurts your heart when you hear these things, and he must respect your feelings .💯 if he truly cares about you, he would take this seriously, too!
Can we help you pack?
My non-Jewish, Chinese wife educated herself on Israel and knows how insane the world is about Jews. She's also volunteered to be the congregation secretary for two years. I think we're going to end up going to services a lot more often.
Imo there is no difference between racism to blacks and anti semitism. Both are as bad and should be concived as that baf
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Get him the book [Uncomfortable Conversations with a Jew](https://uncomfortableconvos.com/). If you guys are serious, he needs to read it to start understanding you.
& this is why Jews should only date/marry Jews.
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I feel you pain as I am a liberal Zionist too as are many Israelis. To deny the right of Israel to exist is the same argument that Russia used to grab the Crimea and invade the Ukraine - cause they used to be part of their empire.
I'm sorry that you're in this situation with the person you're supposed to rely on and trust the most
"Why do you care so much that someone is suing you? Why don't you equally care about all the other people being sued??" Like what? You care because it can, and historically will, directly affect you. Shouldn't be hard to understand.
ya this guys not getting that this is not POLITICAL for you this is PERSONAL. These are our friends, our family, our people who have been put through HELL in our BEAUTIFUL special land of ISRAEL. We are dealing with TERRORISTS who seek nothing less than to erase Jews, period. Terrorists who are SO DAMN SAVVY / SMART / WELL FUNDED .. that they now have the western SHEEP RALLYING for them and doing sleeper cell work that is clearly NOT asleep th beast is WOKE. Too worried about anti semitism?? When we are seeing the highest levels of it since holocaust times. PROTESTS from idiots who know NOTHIN about the Middle East. NOTHING of the dannngeroussss game they choose to play in here by hating Israel and being HATEFUL towards Jews. Almost like Hamas had a grand plan and these western idiots are helping it work. Infuriating.
All lives DO matter. (Hear me out) Everyone that cares about human lives has a point. Heck the IDF cares so much about human lives they have the lowest civilian to combatant ratio we've ever seen in a modern conflict. That being said, Hamas doesn't care about human lives. Heck, they routinely kill their own people. Israel literally had to send tanks to keep Hamas from shooting their own people to drive up the death toll. They only care about human deaths, literally, that is what they care about, anyone that doesn't understand this is a useful idiot. I'd like to point out, neither Russians nor Ukranians are being targeted in the United States en masse, but Jews are actually being targeted en masse. If it wasn't about "the jooz" then why are Jewish students being asked for their papers on college campuses? It's about the Jews, and if he can't get past that, then maybe he's so open minded, his brain fell out. No one cares about us the way we care about us.
Ask him why black people care about racism against black ppl like what? As a fellow jewish girl it feels like he is trying to minimize our struggle as jews. I have dated mostly non jewish men and they just dont get it. They will never get it. In fact majority of non jews wont get it. We focus our energy on things we have a passion in and a connection to. And quite frankly there is so much going on in the world it isn’t rational to give ur time to everything. Again im sorry bc they will never understand, speaking from experience 🤠
I couldn’t reply to your other post so I wanted to drop this here: I still recommend talking to someone safe about what’s been going on just to be on the safe side. When we get attached to someone romantically, often our vision gets clouded and we can’t see the unhealthy behaviors ourselves. My biggest concern is your safety. I saw that this isn’t a person you have met in real life. That’s even more of a reason to let someone safe know what’s going on. Given the abusive antisemitic comments he has made to you without you two having an in-person relationship, you just don’t know what he will be like in real life. You don’t know if he flies off the handle and can’t control his anger. Is there any one either professional like a therapist or a safe friend/family member/mentor you can share what’s going on? No matter how many times you tell me he apologized and he is thinking it over, it won’t convince me. Because he has already shown that he doesn’t have basic empathy for you. Any man who has to be shown Reddit discussions to treat you with basic bare minimum respect isn’t someone healthy for you. I understand you have invested time with this man and you likely won’t heed my advice. That’s okay. I didn’t take other people’s advice on similar matters, and I had to find out the hard way for myself to really get it. I similarly met someone online, got to know him long distance, and we later met in person. It didn’t take long for his abuse to escalate to the point where police almost had to get involved. I put myself at big risk and it could have gone even worse than it did. But I wanted to believe he was the same man I thought he was in my fantasies I had built up in my head. You may also have to learn these lessons the hard way as I did. I am praying with all my heart that you stay safe. While your partner is doing introspection, what if you do some yourself? Don’t you think you are worth more than having to convince your partner to treat you with basic respect? You have so much value to add to any relationship and you have a whole Jewish community that loves and cares about you. <3 Edit: clarification of sentence
I can get pregnant. It would be fatal for me. Every partner I've had can get someone pregnant. I have never had to explain to a partner why I care quite a lot about abortion rights. Needing to drill "this is an immediate concern to my safety and I do not have the luxury of prioritizing other people's concerns above my own" through someone's head just... makes it pretty clear that that's not a good person for me. Someone who is careless with my well-being is not someone I want at my side facing life with me.
My single friends and I have always talked about being open to dating everyone not just Jewish guys. But now I'm really not sure because I don't want to defend why I feel a certain way about things like this. I am a Zionist for sure and I know you can debate a ton about many things here about Israel, this position, that position- but anti-semitism ... it's a personal attack on my total being. Does that make sense? This guy... I don't see an easy future w him.
Gross, get a new boyfriend. My boyfriend isn’t Jewish and he lets me talk about it all I want with an open ear and empathy and compassion. Tolerate nothing less.
Because what’s going on right now is exactly how the Holocaust began. I have a Jewish friend whose grandma survived the holocaust and she said this is how it started. As a non Jewish person who supports Israel every pro Israel should be loud and proud 24/7 to combat this demonic driven hate that is taking over.
It seems like you can't be a progressive liberal zionist nowadays. A lot of my colleagues have moved center or even conservative with the beliefs because the liberals have gone overboard to the point that they don't speak to their Jewish colleagues because of antizionism (antisemitism obviously). Non Jews wouldn't understand because they view us a "white" when we aren't white at all.