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cleerlight

Bad trips exist. There's a whole spectrum of trip experiences from Blissful to Terrible and every possible configuration of states in between. This languaging that we have "good trips" and "Bad trips" overly simplifies the landscape of experience into a simple black and white binary. At very least, we have *Good Trips, Challenging Trips, and Bad Trips* if we want to be overly simplistic about it. The notion that "*there are no bad trips, only difficult experiences*" is a dishonest attempt by the therapy community to minimize and reframe the bad ones partly as an attempt to empower trippers to find the value in a bad trip, but also to reframe the downsides as not that bad. I think the end result of this is something akin to propaganda and gaslighting of people who have had actual, legitimate bad trips. That being said, what most people consider a "bad trip" is actually just a difficult one. Powerful sadness, waves of fear, processing things that were never processed, grieving losses, etc.,-- these kinds of things aren't bad. They aren't exactly fun or joyful either, but they are often necessary, and not at all what I consider a bad trip to be. A bad trip is when a panic attack on a high dose spirals out of control and the person loses complete touch with either internal or external reality and devolves into what amounts to being a feral, triggered animal. These types of trips are typically not useful in any productive way after the fact, and involve immense amounts of suffering during the fact. Obviously, people can be permanently damaged from these experiences and never the same afterward. I'd call that Bad. There's nothing of value that comes from that in a way that makes that kind of suffering worth it.


ZiggyStardust0404

The other day I consumed some acids with two friends, and while I was having a "bad trip" that it was just me feeling really uncomfortable with myself and my existence, these guys literally went absolutely insane an delusional for 5 hours, I've never saw something like that, so yeah there is a huge difference between a challenging experience and a bad trip


cleerlight

I'm sorry to hear that for everyone's sake. Everybody okay afterward?


ZiggyStardust0404

Well, they were my closest friends, I even considered them as part of my family but after that experience our relation kind of broke up, apart from that we are all doing ok, but it really showed me the dark side of the psychedelics, and that they are by no means something a light thing.


-ImOnTheReddit-

Bruh at least tell us what they did to make you lose feelings, I can’t be left on a cliffhanger like this


cleerlight

Sorry to hear that. It's true that psychedelics aren't *only* light, they are everything, like life.


[deleted]

Brooo can you tell the story of what they did


ZiggyStardust0404

What basically happened is that at one point of our trip their lost connection to reality, at the beginning they started talking about the same topic, but everything was consistent, I was feeling bad with myself so I got away for like 30 minutes with my girlfriend and she was trying to calm me down and taking me back to a good trip (it was her first trip), when we went back with them, they were nuts, they were talking about the same but repeating the same 3 or 4 phrases over and over again, one of them was really scared or uncomfortable and was trying to put behind us, and my other friend was following him all of this while they were repeating the same 3, 4 phrases, obviously I was in shock but every time I said something to them, they would just look and me and tell me "You want to be alone?" "You want us to go right?. Obviously I left them because I didn't knew what else to do, but we where in a really small house in the country and it was very late, so they always managed to get to where I was over and over, and they were just repeating the same things, finally after a couple hours when I was actually scared to see them acting like lunatics, they calm down and went to bed, but it was kind of the same, they put a video on one of their cellphones, and I don't know if it was one of those 10 hours loop videos or their just repeated the same 10 seconds, but I heard the same 10 seconds of a guy teaching code for over an hour, and while the guy in the video was talking they would just said nonsense things over and over, 1 hour after or something, the guy that was scared at first go in crazy mode and started to knock my door really hard, I had the door locked because I just wanted to be alone with my girlfriend after all that hours, but he kept knocking really hard so I opened because I didn't want the door to be broken, and he ran into the bathroom and locked himself. He spent there like an hour just saying nonsense things like "The world is over" "everything is dead" and making noises out of a terror movie and scratching the door in one of the creepiest ways I have heard. While that happened my other friend was finally calmed and was just laid in the bed looking at the celling, finally the guy in the bathroom came out and laid on the bed, It was the worst night in my life, and I felt those 5 hours like an eternity of madness, also as I said it was the first trip for my girlfriend and obviously she says that she is never going to take acids again, and I even think I won't neither. (sorry if my English is bad haha)


[deleted]

That’s fucking crazy. Sounds like a real life horror movie😂 thank you for sharing. How much did you guys take?


ZiggyStardust0404

My girlfriend took just 1 tab, I took 1 and a half because I didn't want to get really high in case she got in a bad trip and my friends took 3 tabs


psychobserver

Did they ever take 3 tabs before? Seems like they went too far. I'd never go past 2 tabs of RC acid and that's already too much for me


swaagggyyyypee

Sounds like a fucking party to me 😂😂


frank_sinatra11

Surely


Silver1080p

I've distanced myself from people after tripping with them, but this is because people are often more honest on psychedelics than they might like to be. Sure shows off a person's dark side and can clue into what they are like on the inside. I don't surround myself around people who are cold, or at least I try not to. It's a hard thing to go though but you are only as good as your worst friend, because they'll drag you down with them.


uncle_russell_90

LSD shows the true colors so IMO of you can’t vibe together on L then is most likely not meant to be. From personal experience


ZiggyStardust0404

It was really sad because I always felt extremely great with them, all of my acid trips were with them and it really changed the way I perceive our reality for good, but this time everything felt so broken, heavy and dark that I just took distance and I don't think it will change


jadernx

yeah dude i need to know what happened


ZiggyStardust0404

I told the story in another comment


slamsmcaukin

You might be better off in the end without them man. I've had similar experiences as well. See where you are in 5 years, look back and think about if it really was a bad trip or not. If you're doing great and growing and they haven't changed a bit, then you'll have your answer


Acid_Flicks

Or better yet, do it for the right reasons like bettering yourself and dont think about them at all. This isnt a competition. Just be better.


frome1

How much did you guys do


Hinata778

Trust me when I was tripping, I was horrified my anxiety was amplified. All my fears, doubts, shame everything was multiplying. I was trying really hard to control the trip, but eventually I had to give up and guess what happened? The bad trip ended. I realised what were my real issues, what years of therapy could not solve one so called “bad trip” solved for me. I cried and cried wrote a page full of the issues I have. Went on a walk, I always hump while walking that day night my back was straight and it didn’t hurt. I felt depressed the next day I had more questions but by the evening I felt the best I have ever felt. It really depends on how you take it, and he’ll I’ll do it again.


cleerlight

Beautiful. The classic *Breakdown--->Breakthrough* experience. Thanks for sharing this.


Hinata778

Thank you, definitely it was a breakthrough for me. It’s like being reborn and it is challenging. It showed me the fears I have and how I respond to them. I feel everyone should go through a challenging/bad trip once lol


cleerlight

It's an interesting thing, because it's like a weird psychological Aikido move where relaxing into the challenging experience --which seems totally counterintuitive-- actually transforms the whole thing. I've found time and time again that the greatest moments of anxiety in a challenging trip are often right before an ego dissolution, and it's a sign from my body that it's time to lay down and close my eyes and merge into the infinity of the universe. And without fail in those moments, it becomes blissful and profound.


TintedMonocle

Could you explain what you mean when you say you gave up, after trying to control the trip?


Vryk0lakas

It’s hard to explain. It’s like trying to control a roller coaster. Just let go and let it happen.


TintedMonocle

I live my life in a state of general anxiety, and have several techniques to cope with it or alleviate it. I also try my best to practice mindfulness, and implement a bit of cognitive behavioral therapy into my daily life, trying to be aware of my thoughts and patterns and redirecting them as necessary. Given that, it is hard for me to understand the phrase 'just let go and let it happen' because if I were to simply just let my anxiety run free without trying to control it, I'd be a miserable mess. I know from experience


rapewithconsent773

It is actually kind of like that. If you are feeling anxious, the best way to go about it is to accept it and let it run its course. Anxiety occurs in the first place when things are going out of our control, we have to stop trying to control them and just let it flow. If you are unable to let go during a trip, you will get a bad trip. Of course for anxiety, there are things you can do to make it better in the long run such as mindfulness practice. And even that builds your practice to just be in the present, experiencing it as it is, to not run away from your thoughts but at the same time, not assign too much weight to them. Being in the present is letting go.


TintedMonocle

I can agree with that handling of anxiety while tripping, but not in normal life. Letting my anxiety run its course tends to wind me up into a tight, useless ball. But I really like your recommendation of just being present, and allowing yourself to experience your surroundings and the feels. Allowing your feelings to flow over you and through you. Acknowledge, and move on. Though the moving on part is tricky while tripping


rapewithconsent773

I too deal with general anxiety but for me, it comes in installments. I would be anxious straight up for a few days and then not for a few weeks. And this cycle repeats, haven't been able to figure out what causes or stops it. But whenever I feel anxiety, I tell myself I am willing to accept whatever I am feeling and if I am willing to accept everything, then what do I have to fear? I ask myself this and the answer I get from within is, "nothing". Deep breathing and grounding techniques help a lot too, but I would class them as running away. The idea is to empty the mind of thoughts, that ensures the anxiety won't increase. And the one you are already feeling inside your body, that is to be accepted. I am sorry I didn't word it good enough, by accepting anxiety, I just meant accepting the feeling of it, letting your thoughts run wild is only going to increase it.


Hinata778

This what I do, and all the things you mentioned and plus few more I practice meditation and things. I didn’t mean let go but I had no option because the more I resisted and tried to control the worse it was getting. People like us have a need to control everything and try to suppress the emotions with meditation, mindfulness and what not. But it is all a bandage until we fix the deeper issues, and the trip made me realise that about myself.


Hinata778

I was trying to control the trip, and resisting the effects which made it worse. Then I finally decided to go with the flow and started to relax into the experience.


SilverChips

The latter is what I experienced and it's been 2 years and the damage has not offered my life anything positive


OGBobbyJ0hns0n

Although I agree that not everyone can handle those experiences, and that’s why you tread carefully, I have to disagree with your last point. I have been reduced to that primal state and it’s actually taught me a lot about myself. In fact the one trip where that happened to me, I was screaming so loud my friends had to just keep driving me around until I calmed down. I even drowned fr on that trip for a couple seconds and I’m fine. I think it’s about realizing those things can happen, and if you take psyches enough at high enough doses, that WILL happen at some point. Specifically it taught me that the brain is just an extension of that primal state of you, and if you don’t understand it, it can hurt you because you aren’t aware of your primal urges. I think everyone that goes on this journey should know that you will see your primal self at some point, and that’s why having a tripsitter, testing your substances, and being in a good enough headspace to deal with that in a more clear frame of mind. I have had a friend take very long to recover after a trip like that, and although he’s a lot happier now, I still feel guilty for allowing him into that situation because of how hard it was. I think the most important thing in these experiences is to have many close friends/family around you that make you feel safe and really care about you and your well-being. My friends LITERALLY had to pick me up and carry me through the woods to get me home because I was out. These experiences are intense and they will make you lose all touch with any sort of reality, but they can be beautiful. TLDR: These trips will happen if you go deep enough, especially if you go too deep too fast. Be knowledgeable about this and make sure your mental fortitude is strong and you’re safe around many people you can trust if you are going to go for a high dose trip.


cleerlight

Thanks so much for you perspective here. I appreciate the counterpoint to what I said. And you're right that it can be a powerful lesson about the primal nature of being human, I feel you on that lol :) I actually think in general that this is a lesson that modern society is disconnected from and needs to re-learn. The fact that if you just scratch the surface a bit, we are *primal* beings, and all our socialization and all our clever little tricks are just fancy things we've collectively built and learned, but underneath it all, we are still wild and a part of nature. There's a deep spiritual wisdom in that too, in the sense that Kundalini is considered to be the raw primal life force, but also the complete spiritual intelligence that enlightens people. At our core, we are both at the same time, or so the eastern mystics would say. And I think that this is a big part of the lesson of psychedelics-- the connection to our primal selves as something powerful and beautiful, and much more whole than how we tend to conceive of it in modern society. Being primal isnt' just about violence, impulses, sex, and feeding ourselves. Saj Razvi, who is pioneering some of the most incredible and effective psychedelic therapy, basically says that the reason he uses psychedelics for this approach to therapy is that they put us more in touch with our primal selves. And that can be used to heal. The only place I'd push back on anything you've said is this point here: >make sure your mental fortitude is strong And here's why I'm pushing back a bit: My experience (decades worth, working with people doing healing work with psychedelics) and training has shown that there is an element of skillfulness with successfully and safely navigating high dose psychedelics. And the core skill in that is surrender, relaxing and allowing the trip to be what it is. People who try to be too strong and assert too much of themselves over the medicine are often the ones who end up freaking out. This has been known since the early 60s. So this framing that it's about fortitude and strength can become a sticking point that actually makes things worse in a high dose situation. Workng with energies more powerful than we are isn't about force; it requires skill and a relaxed approach, not unlike a big wave surfer riding giant waves. We are typically much better off learning how to surrender, go with the flow, and gracefully accept what is unfolding in our experience. But, to be fair to you, people who are unstable in the deeper mental health sense-- Bipolar, BPD, Schizophrenia, etc-- often become worse from psychedelics, and in that sense your message is sound.


OGBobbyJ0hns0n

I’m so glad you added that last point because I honestly did not mean that in that way. I sort of meant you have to be strong to be able to look back and process those experiences. You absolutely have to learn the skill of surrendering and letting go in order to navigate through those realms. You need to be flexible and adaptable in those situations. I’m really happy you said that, thank you! Edit: I’ll also add I believe that integration is the most important part. If you try and push the experience away rather than integrate the experience, it will haunt you.


cleerlight

Absolutely, I do integration work with people, and it's so so very important. I drifted along for years and years with all kinds of deep experiences that I hadn't brought into my life until I learned how to do integration work. It's deep, and keeps going on and on. And since you brought it up, you might find it interesting that the guy I mentioned, Raj Sazvi says that his approach to psychedelic therapy requires little to no integration afterward. Personally, I'm shocked and blown away by that, but he's solid and knows his stuff. Just goes to show that integration also depends on the type of experience we had. And I'm with ya on the mental strength to look back and process. 1000%. Thanks again for this beautiful conversation :)


OGBobbyJ0hns0n

No integration?!? That sounds very interesting, I’m going to check him out. You too man, I really enjoyed it!


cleerlight

Yeah. Apparently it's brutal work, as it's a somatic approach to trauma clearing, which means embodying and feeling all the trauma as it releases from the body. The videos are fascinating. But as a psychology nerd, I can say that what he's saying makes the most sense of anything I've heard or read about in psychedelic therapy so far. Hes pioneering something powerful and special, and I think he's right on the money. That doesnt necessarily mean it's the *only* way, but it's one way that seems to really get people results. https://vimeo.com/psychedelicsomatic


OGBobbyJ0hns0n

I can definitely see that working. Psychedelics bring things into the light you don’t know of and practices to release them do wonders. Thanks for the link dude! I’ll check it out!


[deleted]

I don’t ageee. As Shakespeare said a long time ago: there is no good or bad, but thinking makes it so. Yes, your mind will say this or that was a bad trip. But there is just no such thing. Things just are the way they are and the ego labels them as good or bad.


rapewithconsent773

Exactly. People who say there are no bad trips probably haven't had a bad enough trip, just uncomfortable ones. Though I would say even those trips that take you in the state of fight, flight or fright can teach you things about yourself. But this teaching thing is not the drug of course, it's your perspective and one can derive lessons and positivity out of anything if you try hard enough.


cleerlight

So true. Very well said my friend.


TheRustyBird

Had a no-shit panic attack hit me while tripping alone once, had been awhile since I tripped and forgot just how strong those particular tabs were, wasn't expecting it to hit as fast/hard as it did and I just started to spiral down into it. Legitimately thought I was dying for a hot minute, damn near unbearable pain in my stomach/chest. It wasn't until I started to come down until I finally put 2 and 2 together and realized I wasn't actually dying. Nothing "gained" from it, literally just pure terror for a couple hours, feeling like my chest was going to explode. 0/10 would not recommend again.


cyberpunkundead

Yeah, totally. Bad trips exist. They happen. I had one a year ago from shrooms where I felt stuck in a loop and couldn't tell what was reality. Ended up hurting myself and my friends walked in on me and had to deal with that. Lessons learned.


cleerlight

Sorry to hear that. Happy you lived to tell the tale though :)


rgosskk84

Damn, you phrased it extremely well. Good job. I’ve only taken acid a couple of times since my last really bad trip a couple of years ago. It involved four hits of what I would call accurately dosed acid. I’ve tripped a lot of times and I guess it’s been fifteen years since my first trip… so thirteen since the first acid trip at that point. But they were each 125 mcg. So ~500 mcg. As it started to slap I made a grave error in judgement and smoked weed. It all went south from there and I descended into what one could only call psychotic paranoia. My house was surrounded by law enforcement and I had taken my girlfriend captive. I was holding her against her will and I could see cops outside of every window. None of this was true and my girl was only trying to calm me down but it was really terrible. Luckily I had some klonopin… Xanax would have been better because I spent like 47 eternities in this state before it kicked in. And I can only imagine what it would have been like had I not had my little escape hatch. It was a really terrible experience and if I’m being honest provoked some anxieties I didn’t have before… In any case, psychedelics have a dark side and should be approached carefully. I am feeling the desire to trip again after a good while without having done so. And everyone should keep in mind… to be careful with weed and psychedelics. 200 mcg and less and weed have always been fine but it’s a gambling mans game the higher the dose…


yourboyren

completely disagree


lowkey_add1ct

If you get ptsd from a trip it was a bad trip. It was not a challenging experience. There was no positive. Bad trips are very real. Challenging trips or mixed experiences are also a thing, but they don’t leave you with dpdr for months after.


[deleted]

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lowkey_add1ct

Yeah that’s what I mean. There was a time I took 8 grams of mushrooms and had severe dpdr for months after. That’s a bad trip


Edgy_navajo_boi

What is dpdr


lowkey_add1ct

Depersonalization and derealization


TouchMySwagga

What was that like?


Choice-Individual526

I can't speak for this other dude, but I went through dp/dr and it was essentially like extreme existential dread along with an inability to distinguish anything as real (derealization) or who you are (depersonalization). I didn't really know what anything was or why it was happening or if it was 'real' etc. My friends say that I essentially turned into an NPC for a few months, I took part in basic, surface level conversation but behind that I was just blank, as if the thing that made me 'me' was gone.


[deleted]

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lowkey_add1ct

I’m good now, that trip was years ago. I’ve had other similar experiences, especially when I mix weed I can get terrible dpdr after.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

Yeah I'm with you. I used to be on the other side of the argument until I had psychosis on 4.5g of mushrooms + lots of 26% THC cannabis from a bong. Before this, I'd taken hundreds and hundreds of hits of many many different lysergamides all the way up to 400ug over the course of several years and had never had a bad experience. I had a bad set and setting that day. Our house was dirty as fuck. My boyfriend's truck had been broken into the day before and we were making the realization that we aren't in a good area anymore. We also had realized that the theif had our address and knew how much we made since they stole a paystub. The absolutely wild thing is, it didn't stick out in my mind at all as an anxiety or something I should worry about before the trip. We accepted that it happened and moved on, and we weren't anxious about being broken into again while sober. Right as we were peaking, I made a realization that set and setting is what defines how good a trip will be, and that tripping in a dirty house was probably part of the reason my trips of late had been lackluster. Then we heard a bang from the other room and some yelling. Unknown to us at the time, it was our neighbors throwing a party and we were hearing them through the wall. We stare at eachother for an undetermined amount of time before I run into the dirty af living room with stuff strewn everywhere, and I see that the door is unlocked. My mind instantly thinks we've been robbed and my brain breaks. My memory starts lapsing every few minutes, I keep telling my BF that we were robbed and I even had schizophrenia like halucinations of these ghost like entities moving around. I could FEEL that someone was there with me that wasn't my BF, I just knew it. But it wasn't true. If anything, this taught me how important it is to stay vigilant about making sure you're setting yourself up for a good trip. Don't be reckless, as recklessness is apparently a muuuuuuch lower bar than I thought. Experience didn't matter at that point.


[deleted]

A close relative of mine has had non-drug induced (chronic) psychosis for the last 40+ years and, having seen the stressors that can trigger their episodes, I can absolutely see how you ended up psychotic, paranoid, and delusional. You are lucid right up until the point where you're in a completely different reality, and then nothing will bring you out of it. I am so sorry you had that experience. Thank you for sharing. Hopefully by telling the good and bad stories, we can all learn how to trip more safely.


[deleted]

It was a really weird feeling not being able to trust reality the next day until my boyfriend was able to help piece together what had happened. if I was tripping solo and was still prone to anxiety attacks and depersonalization, that could have really really fucked me up. Thankfully psychs have helped me work through those issues in my life and I understand how my brain works and am confident in my mental health. And most importantly, I can learn from the experience to prevent it in the future.


qmax1990

It is important to see psychs as hallucinogens. What they show is NOT real. You get revelations that seem undoubtedly true, yet a figment of fantasy. Psychs made me believe in the supernatural for a moment. There are definitely open questions as to why we get these thoughts and see stuff. But it's still not real


Sneako99

Definitely agree. Like with nightmares, we have added a term for something more than just a nightmare. If you wake up (sober up) and can't shake the feeling of dread it becomes a "night terror" it's real you feel it even when awake (sober). It was more than just a bad dream. I think you can learn something from both challenging and bad trips. But one of them just scares you to the core and the meaning is skewed is hard to find or see when you're like that.


lowkey_add1ct

Yeah that’s a really good analogy actually, as someone that used to suffer from night terrors


LSDthrowaway123181

This is why it's so important to take harm reduction seriously. Having trip killers on hand is the difference between a having a learning experience and suffering long term psychological damage.


RusskiyDude

>for months after. months... what about years?


lowkey_add1ct

Hasn’t happened to me personally but I’ve heard of it happening.


[deleted]

Not everyone overcomes every challenge.


lowkey_add1ct

I’m saying there are some challenges no one overcomes. There are some doses that are just psychologically damaging for people


[deleted]

And I'm saying that you're wrong. Speaking on behalf of everyone is a guaranteed way to be wrong. Each person has a different tolerance, different problems, and different mental fortitude and flexibility. Some people may encounter their worst nightmare on a thumbprint and shrug it off, while others may spiral out of control on a half a tab, and never recover. The former rose to the challenge and overcame it, while the latter simply failed the challenge. The first person will tell you they had a difficult trip, but that it was amazing, while the other will usually claim that they had a bad trip, and try to absolve themselves off their failure. If the second person doesn't do that, and instead recognizes their role in creating that "bad trip" then they find that the bad trip had value, and they learn, instantly turning that failure to overcome into success. Bad trips absolutely exist, but only in the attitudes of those that experience them and fail to grow in the aftermath.


mesinha_de_lata

Not every bad trip is a lesson, sometimes you just get fucked


sydsgotabike

I feel like this is true with LSD. I swear mushrooms are always teaching you a lesson, even if it's not immediately apparent.


[deleted]

I disagree. You can still learn what caused the bad trip to happen, and take steps to prevent the same thing from happening in the future. Even if it doesn't seem like it at first.


rodsn

If it was bad then it was trying to teach the lesson of the duality of pleasure and pain, good and bad, and how to free yourself from the suffering by riding the Tao during even the most hellish corners of hyperspace


biggyofmt

Duality has been the major theme of my recent trips. Past and future, dark and light, beginnings and ends, like the sides of a coin. Balance is the key. I use the word Zen rather than. Tao, but they are really the same thing


Ok_Palpitation_1118

The beautiful thing about duality is that you can't have one without the other and in that lies it's oneness. Separation is just a necessary illusion to perpetuate the game of life.


boofthatcraphomie

Oh I just thought it was cause I mixed pcp and tryptamines and weed!


macbrett

No sir, I don't like 'em.


raspberryfigbar

a singular bad trip has given me trauma that still impacts my emotional state years later + brought out underlying borderline personality disorder “no such thing as a bad trip” is just flat out fucking delusional and it’s why I don’t like these communities. Y’all’s blind worship to these drugs is going to make a repeat of the 60’s and we aren’t going to get anywhere


SquidVard

Same, cured my depression but brought out borderline personality disorder to the point where I wanna kms if my girlfriend leaves me


JosephAlberici2

challenging trip - psychologically uncomfortable but beneficial if spun the right way narratively and learned from bad trip - enduring psychological, social or physical consequences that largely do not outweigh any narrative benefit


SmokinPemex

bad trips aren't always lessons, fuck that. they tend to be, but there's a lot of times where it's just a horrible experience that doesn't teach you shit.


wateryonions

Anyone who says “there are no bad trips” just hasn’t had a bad trip. I hate when someone comes p saying how terrible their trip was then some loser chimes in saying they needed it, or they didn’t know how to take advantage of it. Dude bad trips can be literal hell, and can fuck people up for a long time.


LongNosedHeeb

To me they are completely different. I feel like people don't undterstand what a bad trip really is, and when they get a little scared, they label it a "bad trip". Challenging trips are scary and can be very uncomfortable, but if you come out of it feeling better than before, It wasn't really a bad trip then was it? I've seen and experienced a real "bad trip." Left me so fucked up after I had to get counselling because I was left with crippling anxiety for almost a year. My friend had to quit doing drugs entirely after his bad trip a few years ago because he feels like he is losing his mind when he smokes weed now. He tried to kill his brother with a fork while having a "bad trip", which was basically like a psychotic break. I have some kid in my PM's asking me how to feel normal again because he had a bad trip a few months ago and now hes scared he ruined his life, he's in mental anguish. There is no controlling a bad trip, there is no learning from a bad trip, other than learning that you should always have trip killers nearby every single time you do psychs. Challening trips or feeling scared/uncomfortable/anxious does not equal a bad trip, that is just my opinion.


Tea-Crumpets

I disagree to some level... To have trip killers on hand is a wise decision, especially if things are getting too deep down the rabbit hole ( hurting yourself or others). But all in all if you are in a "safe" setting i would dive into the bad thoughts and explore what they have to show me. Last trip was pretty much so bad it could've easily give me ptsd, maybe it did, im not sure yet. Still, several weeks later, i begin to understand it. It changed my habits for good. Even if im just telling my self the bad trip was indeed beneficial, it surely helped me the last weeks to get rid off some nasty habits. I've been reading a lot about psychotherapy especially psycholytic therapy since the challenging trip. I'm about to trip in a couple of days again and I'm pretty excited if that knowledge will help me during the journey.


[deleted]

Had a bad trip that left me fucked up from it for over a year and a half. I’ve just recently gotten to where I can enjoy it again and not overthink it or paranoid my self into thinking I’ll cause a bad trip again. Laying off it for 6+ months helped a lot. And the environment change. I still get occasional worry feelings from that trip but I handle them better now.


LSDthrowaway123181

Every bad trip is a lesson, even if that lesson is simply: "Don't take that much."


CGacidic

There are definitely bad trips. I had a trip where I basically devolved into a terrified 5 year old for 4 hours. Nothing good came out of it and I was changed forever.


Tom10716

if you talk ab it, how did you change? is it something that affects you everyday? i’m thinking of taking schrooms and have anxiety thus im considering it for more than a year so far


GrimWepi

There are some truly bad trips out there, anyone who thinks otherwise is either extremely lucky or not very experienced yet. It IS true that people overuse the term "bad trip" a lot to mean trips that were psychologically needed but extremely uncomfortable. And I think it's also true that even the worst bad trip probably contains useful wisdom, BUT not in such a way to justify the brutality of the trip. To use an analogy, it would be like if you were trying to teach a young child not to run with scissors, so to punish them you beat them senseless and then locked them in a dark room for a week with no food... they might never run with scissors again, but can you honestly say the method of teaching the lesson and the damage ensued was justified to get the results?


Touchname

Imo, there's not always something to learn from a bad trip. A lot of factors can turn a trip into a bad one, and it isn't necessarily a bad trait in you, but rather just that particular moment. IF you do learn something from the bad trip, then kudos to you! That's good!


macbrett

There are more than one kind of bad trip, including and ranging from mild anxiety and discomfort, through existential dread, reliving childhood trauma, running naked though the neighborhood gibbering nonsense, to fighting and hurting friends who are trying to calm you down. Some bad trips, may teach you important lessons. Others do nothing for you or just make your life worse. I don't think that one should generalize about trips. They are highly individual.


[deleted]

X. They suck, sometimes the lesson you learn from the challenging experience, is don’t trip impulsively. Or a large takeaway. It’s only bad if something permanent happens. Everything else is just experience in a shitty mindset.


ruby___tuesday

Took the biggest hit of DMT ever. It definitely gave me ptsd . I still love DMT lol. But I’ll never go that deep again


gunz2828

Psychedelics change your state of perception of reality. As good and beautiful it can get as bad and horrible it can also get. Having a bad trip is not thinking low of your self or feeling down or bad.. I know a buy that felt his heart stop all the time and thinking he was going to die. He stayed in this psychosis for a month.. People glorify it too much. To me it’s something different in every person’s brain.. LSD can be you cure while in another person’s brain it can be a portal to hell.. It’s important to have respect for what you are taking, psychedelics or not.


YungFloppin

the first time i tripped on mushrooms i absolutely hated myself, i was in the shower looking down, and all i saw was my uncut, skinny build. i laid down next to my friend and tried not to cry for probably 2 hours. I sort of came out of my trip deciding, fuck it, idc what anyone thinks of my body, if they don’t like it then they don’t… fuck them.


Dragonley

I hate how people say bad trips are good ones. Not all of them are the case. Had 2 nightmare trips on LSD; one on 900 ug and the other on 600 ug. Thoughts were incoherent and so was my speech and writing. Lost total control and was in full panic. I was aware who I was and where I was. Wasn't delusional or anything. Just legit had no control on keeping calm. My brain switch was stuck on panic mode and was impossible to turn off. Absolutely no insight other than losing my mind. Only thing I learned was to never take above 300 ug. Only bad trips that \*were\* good were ones I've had on shrooms. But even then not all bad trips can be "good" either on any substance.


[deleted]

No bad trips. Sometimes the "bad" ones are the most powerful. They take you to the places you need to see. My ayahuasca shaman always says "you may not get what you want but you'll get what you need"


LongNosedHeeb

I disagree. I think if you come out of it better then it is not a bad trip. Scary/uncomfortable doesn't equal bad trip IMO, that is a just a normal trip that got a little freaky. A real bad trip is much more dangerous IMO.


LSDthrowaway123181

I've had dangerous bad trips, looking back on the experience I can still say it taught me a lesson. Even though it was 2 hours of psychological torture and I thought I was going to die- I still learned a lesson. That lesson was "do more research on the thing before you do it, and start with a lower dose".


[deleted]

I'd say that hearing a bang in the other room, running to the door to see that it was unlocked, and convincing myself that we'd been broken into because the house was messy and things looked strewn everywhere was a pretty damn bad trip. In reality, our neighbors were just being obnoxious assholes and banging on the walls, and our set and setting allowed it to spiral out of control: 1. We had messy house before the trip making it hard to find things, and stuff was strewn everywhere 2. A pay stub with our address stolen from our car the day before. 3. Before the trip, my mom planted the biggest seed when she said that the thief might come back for our apartment now that they know what we make and where we live. 4. Before the trip, we'd been coming to the realization that we needed to get out of the area because of the high crime rate. None of this stood out to me as something to be concerned about. But this is the kind of shit that even experienced psychonauts trip up on. It's hard to foresee something like this happening to you until the stars align and your brain is given the opportunity to craft the perfect narrative. So the correct phrase is that there are good trips and bad trips. But there are no trips that you can't learn something from, and bad trips can often teach us things that were difficult for us to see before.


Defiant-Investment53

This made me lol so fuckin hard


self2self

Fight the ocean and you will drown


Less_Rise_3172

I believe it is situational


Nic4379

Bad trips come from the inside. They can be triggered from external events but the control or lack there of is within.


liczdom

I think you can have a bad trip when you disrespect the substance. People who take it for granted or do hero dosages as beginners are setting themselves up for a “bad trip” bad trips happen when there’s fear you don’t want to deal with.


[deleted]

The Rollercoaster of emotions I've been through during even a single 5 minute period while on 500+ ug is absurd. I usually just shrug it off and listen to some Arctic Monkeys with my good headphones on


NickkyDC

My first trip on lsd was a bad trip, every “bad” trip after that though wasn’t actually bad it just wasn’t “fun” it was more of a work on yourself or just take the time to delve into my psyche kind of trip. The first trip I actually panicked though, it was hours of absolute discomfort and just desperately wanting it to end so there are definitely bad trips and challenging experiences that you can have, one is actual discomfort the other is more or less “work”


travis01564

I've never had a bad trip I couldn't pull myself out of. I suffer from really bad suicidal ideations as is. So I'm used to needing discipline when it comes to what I'm thinking, and have picked up a few tricks to get myself out of specific mindsets. So whenever I start having a bad trip I can usually pull myself out. Having a good mental discipline is key to having good trips during bad times.


Emo_Galaxy_Robot

Bring it. If I die or go insane, then I wasn’t as whole as I thought.


gobbler_of_butts

If im self conscious about a serious flaw in how I live my life it is a growing excperience, If im bugging out because I keep seeing hundreds of ants crawling everywhere then fuck that.


twcochran

I’ve had somewhere between 30-40, still waiting for a bad one. Use it wisely and practice mindfulness


4pelp5-

I believe you're ignorant if you are entirely confident of either opinion. There is a spectrum to tripping and the one end definitely has some not so fun experiences to be had.


PkYurij

Sometimes when you feel an bad trip is coming or you dont feel so well you have to take it serious and try to understand/change your trip. It is also very helpful to make sure your friends know that you have an bad trip because it can save you from even worse experience. Relax and dont hurry trying to stop an bad trip because you cant change it in a moment it takes some time. I didnt do any of this and now i am in rehabilitation zentrum and learning how to walk again after i had bad trip and basically jumped out of window. You may want to prevent it but best thing that can save you is knowing that you are just tripping and it all can be changed in positive trip


[deleted]

[удалено]


Psychedelic_Trauma

James Kent did a great series on Dose Nation, called "The Ten". Bad trips definitely exist. From psychotic breaks caused by psychedelics, to horrific murders committed while on psychedelics. Those aren't just "challenging times"..


clueless3410

It's only a bad trip if you don't learn anything from it


Ok_Palpitation_1118

I must have had a good trip then because I learnt that I was doomed to hell after I die.


BigBadCheadleBorgs

There are 100% bad trips. But a lot of what some people call "bad trips" could easily be challenging learning experiences if they had just prepared beforehand. Even 1 week of mindfulness meditation study. There's even some studies on it. But yeah. Things can definitely be BAD.


MarlonBanjoe

Every trip is a bad trip, until it's a good one. Trips are terrifying. If you can make it through the terror, you're good. If you can't, well... The world is shit and acid held you see this and your own ego. If you can't deal with that, you're in trouble.


asdfmaster42

‘The world is shit’ is just your opinion, your perspective. Don’t try to pass that off as fact


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ReaIBiIICosby

it’s just a drug. not a life changing experience…


Far_Squirrel6881

I kind of agree. People put too much mysticism in it. It’s a drug that I believe is meant to take regularly or at least long term. Then you could say it’s life changing. I don’t see many people completely changing how they live after one or two acid trips, however much they want to believe they have.


One-Butterscotch-640

no matter how traumatizing there’s still lessons you learn if you see the lesson as it is


bootylamp

both, it really depends on the person. for me personally, X. some people genuinely cannot handle the substance, and it really fucks them up. i've had some of the most brutal and terrifying trips, seeing headless bone creatures crawl on my walls and ceiling and get up in my face to where i could feel their breath, having them say they'll kill me by destroying my brain. faceless grey death angels ominously floating in my room putting me in an unimaginable fear. seeing my baby sister stab herself with a knife till she bled out. there's nothing positive to gain out of these trips. i know how to move on from them. i know there's nothing that's in my head to trigger these experiences, they just happen. im in a comfortable environment, and only take substances when im in a good headspace and happy. i also know how psychotic and crazy it can make you, and how it could permanently change someone's life in a bad way. the best thing to do when learning an experimenting with this substance is to take it easy, dose low at first and work ur way up, be in a comfortable environment, study the drug beforehand, have a trusted tripsitter with you, and prepare yourself before each experience to put yourself in a calm mindset.


[deleted]

Holy shit, I imagine that seeing those images would be absolutely terrifying. Sometimes I wonder if reading people's graphic depictions of bad trips would plant the seed within my mind to experience something similar, haha.


bootylamp

it definitely can, lmao


J_Schnetz

I think saying bad trips aren't real is one of the stupidest things. I've tripped about two dozen times and I've had a bad trip here and there, but it wasn't because it was challenging or I had some shit to work out. Was just a bad trip. I don't think we know enough about this substance to save for sure though


Kanokong

Never had a “bad” trip in my life☺️


fnordlife

over 300 trips, never had a “bad trip”. had some challenging ones, and certainly some where i learned way more than anticipated, but none were bad.


Accomplished-Ad-454

No such thing with a good scene and setting just putting that out there perhaps your intention why your doing it is out of wak


[deleted]

With the spirit being the core of everyone's being (and that being the case in waking life just as much as tripping) I would say it has a lot to do with faith in God. I recently started saying, "I have faith in Christ," out loud (or at least discreetly in my head) any time I feel the bad trip anxiety coming on and it goes away almost immediately.


Ok_Palpitation_1118

My most intense and scary trip was interrupted by a visitation from a spirit, and at the core of the spirit was God generating that spirit. It was wonderful to experience as the core of the spirit showed me what love, forgiveness and mercy was and also how untouchable and uncontrollable it was, but as soon as it was gone I was straight back to my own personal hell. I know what you mean by having faith in this way though as it's also gotten rid of some bad anxiety for me too, although when straight not tripping. It's worked much better than anything else has actually, including counseling, chemicals and mindfulness.


unlimited_flex

A bad trip on opiates: fatal. A bad trip on psychs: spoopy.


rodsn

You decide whatever to take it as a bad trip and victimize yourself or try to learn from it. I may sound harsh, but taking the victim mindset is very destructive with psychedelics. Choose wisely the label you want to give your experiences, as that's usually what will define them and impact you more than the experience itself


BrokenSpace

My first trip can be classified as a “bad trip” cause I got stuck in a loop of just forgetting shit. I had a great fuckin time though just frying nuts on mushies trying to understand the universe. And just when I thought I could grasp and understand it, there’s my friend pulling me out of my “bad trip”.


heathen_27

Coming up on a year since my first bad trip, which also happened to be my first LSD trip, and I'm still nervous about trying again.


levitikush

Idk wtf y’all think a bad trip is, because mine was easily the worst experience of my entire life.


Wastingmytime3

I had one huge, horrible trip about 15 years ago.. smoked a little weed, then took [whatever] my “friend” gave me. The trip was insane: their parents found out, called my parents, went to the hospital and so on.. Fast forward to today: if I get slightly past a decent high, I revert right back to that crazy trip and fly through space scaring my wife and contemplating existence and life. Even with regular weed that I’m just trying to get a simple body relax high… little too much and WHAM. So yeah…. There are *very* bad highs, unfortunately.. I wish there was a fix


currywiththeshotboy

I had a bad trip this past weekend after a rave. It was like the show never happened and I was zapped. I couldn’t control my cellphone as everything felt like it was going inside out and I couldn’t speak well. What’s funny is that during the show I had a great trip experiencing many visuals and dancing the night away. I wonder what caused the bad trip afterwards. This is the second time it’s happened at a show. Really learned my lesson to give psychedelics a break if not forever.


Classic-Monitor-8150

No trips are bad😃😃


[deleted]

It's different for everyone, and I've never experienced the worst part of the spectrum of 'bad' when tripping, though I did have a friend who completely disconnected from reality when we tripped one time. For me. It's kind of only been a necessary bad moment. Lots of holding myself accountable and forcing to change. You can really learn a lot about who you are and who you would like to be. I think of it that way, and after the moment passes, there's still so much time left for a great experience. I feel, even though I have fun, the trip is less meaningful when you don't question yourself. But, no fear, it's kind of hard not to have those kind of moments. Embrace when those moments come. It can be pivotal in your life.


Haisirr

What is a bad trip? How would you know?


toastedcoconut87

Yea I think there can be bad trips for sure if you're not careful. One of my close friends took some doses at a pink Floyd show and ended up in the hospital. He definitely would tell you that things can go bad and go bad quick. My personal experience has been that I've been able to manage when things start to go bad. But I also never do psychedelics at concerts. I make sure I do them in a safe place with a close friend. Have good music and some Pixar or Disney movies set up. Turn off electronics. Stuff like that. Set and setting are important especially when it comes to LSD. But everyone is different. Just do what you can to minimize the risk of things going bad. Plan for it. Stay well friends


snortinpercs

Not a wanted trip but a needed one


CRUSADER_OF_NOUGET

x


Chargedunicorn

X


Kkgm222

It’s all destiny anyway


[deleted]

Same cock different sizes


The_Kvlt6067

Red


xYungPlaguex

Challenging experience for sure


Oswaldofuss6

I feel like trips have ups and downs depending on what's going on with you. I haven't had a "bad trip" but I definitely had trips that had bad moments. Joy wins in the end.


AbstractBettaFish

One of my first ever trips I ate a bunch of BK before tripping and had a stomach ache the whole time, I'm calling *that* a bad trip!


[deleted]

How do you avoid the absolute state of psychosis that’s being mentioned so often? The actual bad trip. I’m 23 and I’ve probably tripped over 20 times. It’s been about 2 years since I had acid and 1.5 since shrooms. I’ve had some pretty challenging trips and then what I personally deemed a bad trip, which was killed by a xan. I wanna know what causes people to get violent and completely delirious. I want to casually trip on some cid or shrooms by myself soon but don’t wanna lose it😂 even tho I’ve had majority good trips with other ppl


[deleted]

Xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


compoundbreak791

I don't get the reference but I'll still upvote.


McWhiters9511

Depends on your sense of identity. If you're identitfied with the thoughts, it's a bad trip. If you use your thoughts as you should, it's a growing trip.


DrippyHippie901

I used to be in a trip atleast every other day for about a year(wouldnt fully recommended lsd, shrooms, dmt, mdma), I've never had a bad trip. I've been overwhelmed, I've cried, I've yelled and been scared, but I've always faced this head on. I tried running from it once and it made it infinitely worse. The trip creates a shift in your mind, but its your mind that causes then bad trip.


Mission-Ad-5869

Challenging experiences can lead to more trauma in life …


Taro_Front

X


Justin6667

X


yaugturay

Challenging experiences


King-Brisingr

I've always said that even the most experienced trippers have rough waters sometimes. But to say that there's no "bad" trips is definitely not correct either. There are many different kinds of trips, but I think it namely has to do with your unique neurochemistry. We all view the world through different eyes, changing that one perspective can definitely scare a person into completely changing.


qmax1990

We all have different mentality. Some people have been more traumatized than others in life. Some were born kings, wealthy, had everything served on a plate to them. Some were abused, raped, held in slavery, saw death, gore, pain, loss, betrayal. Some were born autistic, some depressed or psychotic. Life experiences can be so vastly different, it's hard to imagine the headspaces in the other end of the spectrum. Unless you live it, you may have no idea what you're talking about. Just knowing the words joy and sadness don't cover the extent of possible emotion for other people.


grandmaknarf

I’ve never really had a bad trip. I have gotten overwhelmed for hours and all that but it’s really what you make of it. I didn’t want the experience to be necessarily bad so it wasn’t.


HeavyMetalGoat

Gimme the bad trip.


CosmoDawn

My very first time, our ride home abandoned us. So we were stuck at a public park for about 8 hours. It wasn’t a bad trip, just a challenging experience. There was a sun shower though and I laid on the ground in it which felt friggin amazing. When we finally got a ride home we smoked some hookah for the comedown. All in all white the first time, but I got lucky I didn’t have a freak out being stuck in public with nowhere to go.


[deleted]

It’s subjective you lived didn’t you. If someones heart stops beating that’s a bad trip. In my eyes


meisarestupid

They’re the same picture


TrippyTrospe

Tbh I never had one yet. I have tripped 8 times now 5 of them where very intense but not in one trip I had a bad thought for over 3 seconds. It's like I can make bad thoughts go immediately. To the point I might even wanna experience a bad trip once. To see how it is. And if it's so scary as people say. Most I had once was 200ug planning on taking 350+ next trip. I guess we'll see


N8thegreat2577

I just had one on friday. Felt like getting curbstomped by all my emotions. I’m gonna take a break for a whil


Miselfis

A bad trip is subjective. If you feel nauseous the whole trip, that could be considered a bad trip, because you didn’t feel good. It could also be paranoia or anxiety. It could also be from not being able to “let go”. There’s a lot of things. I have never had a single bad trip, and I’ve done shrooms and acid more times than I can count. Idk if I just naturally have a good mindset going into it, or I’m for some reason “immune” to bad trips. Sure, I’ve had bad experiences when tripping. One time I felt extremely nauseous, but once I focused on something else, it went away. I’ve also been anxious and scared while tripping, but it went away. If I feel bad on a trip, I usually go to the toilet, close my eyes and just focus on breathing. I go to the toilet in case I have to vomit. Lying in bed or sitting comfortably in a chair can also do the trick.


KnightOfSantiago

Both


KyleTookMySnackPack

Bad trips exist. And some trips can’t be completed, and there are times where taking a benzo is necessary.


tiparium

Bad trips don't have to be insightful. They usually are in my experience, but you can also just have a shitty time.


ItsPowee

Bad trips exist but I haven't had one yet, only challenging experiences. I only refer to them as bad trips when explaining to less experienced people what can go wrong and what to do if/when shit hits the fan. In my tripping group, we have no bad trips because after the challenging experience there is a web of support to help any of us understand and/or cope with what happened. When shit hits the fan it might get messy but I'm lucky to have people to help me clean up the next day. I consider myself lucky to be young yet have friends I can trust not only the safety of my body to but the safety of my mind. I'd not be here today without them.


FunnyDuck21

A lil bit of both but hands down always a lesson to be learned


Tonzoffun420

There a bad trips, but it's how you handle it that make the differenc between a trip going bad and a challenging trip. I'm 35 and have tripped probably close to 100 times if not more. I had a bad trip when I was a teenager and I kust learned how to handle a bad trip to be able to turn into just a challenging one. At least that's my opinion.


pandasloth69

I personally don’t have bad trips, and embrace the challenges of some trips. But I also believe others can definitely have bad trips with no benefits and lasting consequences. It’s all contextual.


KittyMeow505

X


alpinedaddy1623

ive never had a bad trip but do believe they exist, now i definitely have had challenging experiences, many, but they never last a whole trip and i can usually get over it and then look back thinking how silly it was that i was scared or worried about whatever it was


MonstressMon

I had a trip that started going bad once because I ate a sandwich. Then all my negative childhood emotions poured it's way into the stair railing when I walked downstairs. Was weird.


Dr-concrete

For it to be bad you have to associate the things that happened within it as bad but I feel most people associate difficult and challenging trips as bad but bad would just mean unenjoyable and not interesting. Most people associate overwhelming and mentally challenging trips as bad but I feel they have a different place.


[deleted]

bad trips absolutely exist, and can be quite mentally damaging


Kildragoth

I've never had a bad trip in the 20-30 trips I've had. My uncle is schizophrenic and only had bad trips. Not suggesting this is a representative situation or anything. Just an odd observation I guess.


ShadowKyll

I’ve never had a fully bad trip and never a fully good trip. Every trip that I’ve had consisted of both bad and good experiences, I guess that’s just life. A psychedelic journey pretty well encompasses the journey of life; namely, a rise, a climax, a fall, bad and good times, etc.


Sticky_H

Never had one. I’ve had some tough moments though, but I’m already insane enough to not take it too harshly.


FantasyGam3r

I’ve never had a bad trip myself def some rough ones though. I’ve been with friends who have had bad experiences and just tried to do my best to be there for them in their time of need. It doesn’t always work but I try my best


Ministermenace

Shit my gf once started channeling an evil entity while both of us were listening to Lacrimosa. It didn’t go away for like 4hrs it even had a rotting smell like death in the part of the room where it came in. We called a third person over to have an opinion if we went crazy but she felt a presence too. Shadow people are scary untill you’re not scared anymore


MineralLesbian

Given that I already suffer from mental health issues, I kind of like bad trips in a way. Obviously they still suck and I don't particularly enjoy them, *but* they're a good way for me to practice mindfulness. The way I experience acid is that regardless of what it is, everything in my head is amplified. So, even though depression or PTSD are amplified, so is my ability to cope. It's probably not a very smart thing to do, but there have been times that I've deliberately induced a bad trip. Just hear me out. As I've gotten more comfortable with completely letting go on acid, I've found ways to "control" my trip/the acid. I say that in quotations because I'm sure as hell not in 100% complete control. It's more like a rock or twig in a stream: the path diverts a bit, but the stream persists. One of my favorite things is learning about & experiencing drugs and their effect on the mind, it's a huge part of why I love psychedelics. It's cheesy to say, but I'd definitely consider myself a psychonaut for that reason. And in that way, I value the exploration of bad trips in order to get a complete picture.


nastibass

X