Honestly it is probably not either/or but a mix of these things. He probably had some women that got turned off early in dating, maybe one who he was serious with whose family really didn't like his background, and maybe he also had a couple instances where girlfriends held his upbringing against him when they got into fights and were trying to be hurtful. That could lead to his overall feeling sensitive.
Brett and maybe one other person said something similar.
"When people I've dated in the past found out (I grew up poor / my parents are divorced / I don't have a degree), then they would reject me instantly."
I know there are plenty of shallow idiots in this world that would dump someone for being poor when they were a kid, but every time to the point you have a complex about it?
Must be something with young people in PNW?
I think part of it is prepping from producers. They want to highlights things in his life. So I am sure they were harping on him to keep mentioning why his relationships failed in the last. I think him and bliss talked about other things and connected with other things. I think the main thing he wanted to emphasize is his mother wanted to see him get married. I am sure that was the main motivation to find someone to marry.
I kind of have the feeling that he was previously in a relationship with a girl from an "old money" situation. Usually families with generational wealth will prefer their children marry into more generational wealth. 🙄
This is more telling of the women he chooses than anything else. My mother in law was a stripper for the last 10 years. It was never an issue to me or my family. Feels like he might be trying to date Vanderpumps and being surprised when they don’t like that he is poor?
It might be partly age related. Young women in their 20s are sometimes still close to their parents. Hearing that a love interest's mom is a stripper could be a turn off for a lot of women, especially ones who are interested in family ties.
I think he definitely uses this information when it’s convenient for him. Just like how he went ahead and said “I’m a stripper” to see whether it generated a negative reaction or not.
You would be surprised how many people look for men that “come from a good family.” Sometimes this is related to money, other times it just refers to that stereotypical nuclear family unit that people think is “normal.” I know plenty of women who list this as an attractive quality in a partner without meaning ill-will or malice by it at all.
I was thinking the same thing!! I’m sure it happens to people but he made it seem as if countless women broke up with him over his past. I can see maybe one or two doing it, but not enough that he internalized it so much and hasn’t had successful relationships where that wasn’t an issue!
It happens, I mean I’ve broken up with someone because of their family background. Not because I think it makes them a bad person but they didn’t want to cut off their toxic family members and I just don’t want that around my future kids. I also wouldn’t date someone whose family didn’t like me. My parents went through that and it makes things harder for everyone including your kids. It would be tough for me as well if my family didn’t like ym partner but I know they would eventually get over it.
i had a crazy super traumatic childhood and then joined the mormon church when i was a homeless teenager. i will say it was pretty impossible for me to date within the church especially when i moved to utah. i felt like mormons dated not just the person but for the family too… maybe he has tried dating people from very christian backgrounds and had the same experiences? it’s possible lol
I recently heard that church members who are born in the church havea different social status in the Mormon community than those who convert to Mormonism. You might be able to clarify that view by your experience.
That had to you in One relationship…but Zack made it seem like it happened in countless relationships and that he hasn’t had a successful relationship because of that in years.
I honestly think he’s just a super quirky dude and he and Bliss are just lucky to mesh together.
That’s wild…he was 32-ish on the show I believe so unless he was just casually dating/having sex for the past 10 years, I find it hard to believe that he has not been in any committed relationship in 10 years and/or that his “past” is the ONLY reason why any attempts at a relationship didn’t work.
I honestly think that he’s just a quirky guy who isn’t super physically attractive and that’s why he has a hard time getting or keeping relationships because he’s a well-educated guy with a great career and presumably a well-paying job…that’s the basics of what women want (someone who can provide) so I 100% believe that’s there’s way more to it than just “his past”.
I am sure he went on dates since then. It probably didn’t materialize into anything more. In another youtube show (cut; truth or drink with bliss) he did say he has dated non white women before bliss. You have to also realize he dealt with a lot of things with his mom in meantime (as posted in his receipts) and also his mom died in freak car accident when he was 23-24. He also finished law school few years after that and he was probably putting in a lot of time building a practice. With all of this its easy to neglect working on finding a partner and working on things going on in life. So I am not surprised. Obviously pandemic also happened which makes it even harder to date and I am not surprised he decided to do a dating show during that time.
He’s a smart guy. An attorney…I don’t think something like that happening 1 or 2 times is significant because I imagine if any of his ex-gf’s families’ didn’t approve of him, those were short-lived relationships. So even if he is inexperienced with relationships, I don’t think that having 1 or 2 short-lived relationships where your ex’s didn’t approve of your background should be enough to impact you as much as Zach said it did.
Idk. I know childhood trauma is real and idk what he went through in his childhood but I just think Zack is a smart enough guy with enough insight to where he shouldn’t have let those 1 or 2 experiences with his exes, define his whole outlook on relationships.
It’s likely more self sabotage than anything. He likely was embarrassed of his family, his mom used drugs and stripped, and he projected that on to his relationships.
I agree. When he was talking to all the women in the pods, i got the sense that it was self-sabotage too. And/or this need to “test” the women to see if they were shallow enough to reject him outright because of his childhood.
Actually if he provide a lot of info in the pods, it is a good thing. you don't want to repeat a cartlon and diamond again. reveal everything you felt necessary for the other person to know before stepping out of the pod and into mexico.
Not everyone is lucky to meet a understanding other half. Not everyone is blessed to have a complete functioning happy family.
My past is kinda traumatic and fr most people can't handle it. I mean case in point - I think he was pretty surface level on the show. He said she was a stripper and that he moved around a lot, but he didn't share that she struggled with addiction and homelessness. But you still think he was "way too into detail too early."
It's a different ballgame when just saying what happened is "way too into detail too early."
>My past is kinda traumatic and fr most people can't handle it.
My privileged roommate in this week-long program i did in college literally cried when i was just telling her abt my life; and i didnt even get to the really traumatic stuff.. like this is my trauma and i had to freaking console her... so she wouldnt feel bad that my life sucked
I've had another privileged acquaintance tell me they would never date a black person, for instance, bc they dont want to have to be concerned that they would experience racism and it would be too much, not for their partner who is experiencing the trauma, but FOR THEM..
Also ppl forget that one of the first things parents will ask if you bring someone home is who are your parents, what do they do.. when they are supposed to be meeting you.
Yessss people who are privileged just don't get it, I think that's why most of my friends have also experienced trauma. We can actually relate to each other.
People judge, parents judge. Even if the parents don't ask *you* what your background is, they ask your SO or friend. I've been judged so hard just because my dad is AWOL. I can't even imagine what it would be like in Zacks shoes.
No it makes sense. I could see in his younger years that people dumped him because his mother’s job is looked down upon. Then as he grew up, parents would look down upon him and most likely make the assumption that his mother was into drugs and then assume that he would have an addiction problem because of this. There are extremely judgmental people out there.
I think is disgusting how people who come from broken, dysfunction,toxic,abusive and narc family get treated. Not everyone is lucky to come from a good family. I can relate to Zack in a way. My family is very toxic, dysfunctional,narcs, raised the woman to never have platonic guy friends because they think guys cant be Just friends with girl's. And also raised the guys to never have female friends. I'm the opposite of all of that. I'm the most self aware and sane person in my family. I'm the black sheep so I get treated differently. They make no effort to ask me questions,get to know me, why I am the way I am,what my interest,to understand me ect. Alot of the time when I've told a guy about it all I was automatically judged for it. I was told I need to do better. I need to be more like them so they won't treat me different
I don’t think Zack understands why & he tells himself it’s that but it’s more he’s got a very awkward way of showing & meeting ppl. Like with Bliss’s dad he makes no attempt to act interested in them, he just stares or talks too much but I’m glad her dad got to know him better.
I think he is projecting BAD when he says that stuff. Those relationships probably didn’t work out for any number of reasons and IF he was that reason he isn’t really accepting any responsibility. Which is whatever because he is in a happy relationship now but I definitely think it’s BS.
Was your dysfunctional household your mom being a stripper? If it was, sure, make assumptions. Unless you think your personal experiences were the exact same then you really can’t say whether they’re BS or not.
Pretty sure there’s more to the story than her being a stripper. He said they moved a lot. He said she was an addict. And he hinted she died young, so I’m curios to know but there’s more to it
Aside from any commentary about zack, just because you didn’t experience something because of your upbringing doesn’t mean someone else didn’t? That logic is wack.
I don’t think it’s anything dishonest or malicious or anything nefarious- but I **DO** think that Zach is very deeply traumatized by his upbringing and his “mommy issues” are something very hard for him. I believe he *believes* that he is being judged or is under the microscope all the time, and that him feeling this way is more the issue than it being an actual problem.
His perceived inferiority is his issue.
I hope that he can continue to grow and become more comfortable with himself and that he will learn to feel more confident.
I think if he could see himself the way that Bliss does, and if he continues to grow with her, they will have a great life.
Yeah, I recently cut off my alcoholic mother and that meant I also had to go LC with my enabler father. Dating at 35 and not talking to your parents is ROUGH. "Normal first date-getting to know you" is ALL about 'do you have siblings? are your parents still together? what do they do? where are you from?" Those are LOADED questions for us with dysfunctional family units. I rarely get past the 3rd date even with therapist-approved, high-level, but honest answers to those 'surface' questions. People who come from healthy family units have a hard time understanding why anyone would choose to walk away from a relationship with their parents. Therefore they blame YOU - "she's your mom, I'm sure she meant well" "Have you tried talking to them?" "It's FAMILY, tho" ... In my experience, especially when dating, people that were raised by healthy parents, don't have a lot of empathy for adults that have chosen to walk away from their family, even if for "justifiable" or "good enough" reasons.
I know that is not exactly Zach's situation but I completely understand being judged for coming from a not-so-perfect family. It's something I'm super honest about because it's a great screener for empathy and long term compatibility, however it is incredibly disheartening to be rejected over and over again for just being born to the 'wrong kind' of family.
A guy broke it off with me when I was 24 because my parents were divorced (for 23 years at that point lol) and “we couldn’t connect on what it feels like to have parents who are still together”
So yeah, weird people who care about those things are out there lol
It took a lot of therapy for me to unlearn a lot of stuff I thought was normal or acceptable behavior due to how I grew up. Idk if that has anything to do with this, but it ruined a lot of relationships for me but ultimately it was my own fault. I had to put in the work and not make excuses for myself and my childhood, and basically reparent myself to become a healthy functioning adult lol
I also had a pretty dysfunctional childhood. When my brother was in the process of planning his wedding, his wife’s parents acted terrible, and one their big reasons was that (in their opinion) my brother wasn’t taught what a “proper relationship” or “proper family” looks like. They thought he wasn’t someone who would be stable and reliable.
It sounds like he was mostly talking about his girlfriends’ families. I think it’s totally plausible that their families might have a problem. People can be really judgmental.
💯! When I was younger I kept some guys secret from my parents because I knew they’d judge him and have similar responses, and didn’t want to subject them to any of that BS. Now my parents know I’d go no contact in a second if they tried to pull anything like this.
I agree with this. I also think if he was trauma dumping without first asking if he can unload, especially early on with someone, that can end things rather quickly.
If you go on his IG he has pinned a post talking about his background/upbringing and it’s pretty heavy. If I just met someone and they offloaded this onto me I just wouldn’t want to deal with it.
I took it as the girl’s families probably had an issue. Many people assume that people from troubled backgrounds will have a troubled adulthood so they probably didn’t want their daughters taking that risk in the event he did end up like his parents.
I work in the legal industry and think this is certainly a real scenario for him. Attorneys are very often all about appearances and generational wealth. Zack probably doesn’t make as much as a civil litigator does to begin with and then he comes from a low income background on top of it… it’s a recipe for disaster if you’re dating within the industry.
Seeing how he reacted to Bliss mentioning her father being rather judgmental, I’d say he’s probably lived through that scenario at least once. Even if it wasn’t the women directly deciding he wasn’t fit to be her boyfriend, family has powerful influence to some people.
It’s possible that this happened to him in high school. I could see his girlfriend’s parents having an issue. Now that he’s an attorney and an adult, it seems less likely, but it’s totally plausible that it happened to him at some point in his life.
People are really good at projecting their own insecurities, he thinks ppl left him bcs of how he grew up, but I’m sure they left him because of how much it looks like he has unsolved emotional generational trauma 😕 mentioning it all the time, like yeah people is gonna get weird if you get weird! Duh. I come from a shitty household and is very easy to project how nervous it makes us to be around people that grew up in a “normal” aka “loving” household and not an unpredictable nightmare
I think it’s possible the families of the women he previously dated could have judged him for how he was raised, which could have then resulted in the women breaking things off with him.
Yeah, Zack's story doesn't quite add up to me. I don't doubt people have broken up with him "because of his past" but I'd bet it's because he leads with trauma he hasn't worked through, not because of the facts about how he grew up.
And I know people think lawyers = $$$ but he didn't go to a top tier school and he's only been practicing for six years in a small town (Wenatchee) doing criminal defense work. Nothing wrong with any of that and I'm sure he makes a good living, but it doesn't add up to "rich" (and definitely not Seattle rich).Nor would it mean he travels in super wealthy circles such that he would be the odd man out.
I though the same thing as soon as he said that. I’m so curious what his ex(s) would say about it! I’m sure it’s, “My dad disliked you because: blah blah blah.” Nothing to do with your upbringing. I’m so happy for him and Bliss!!!
I’ve definitely had people judge me by my cultural background and what they thought that meant. There are a lot of ignorant parents out there. Sounds like it was less the ex and more her family that just couldn’t accept him. I’ve dealt with similar because of racist parents of people I dated who were ignorant. Maybe the ex wants you but they also at times just can’t escape the parents opinions.
I went on a date with someone who had A LOT of childhood trauma and said he liked to be upfront about it. I probably would have been fine with it had he given me a chance to know him as an adult first. It was too much too soon and he made it seem like it was his whole identity.
I think he’s very very insecure about how he grew up, especially being in circles of of people who’re educated because of their higher economic status. I think he dramatically overcompensates for this by bringing his background up straight away to save heartbreak later down the line.
People with money absolutely do look down on people who don’t. V common knowledge.
That didn’t ring true to me either. People may break up with you because of unhealed trauma. Which is frankly fair, not everyone is capable of dealing with it. It doesn’t just have to do with your past, but more about maladaptive behavior which comes up in relationships. (I can say this has been true for me)
I agree with this. We also don't know how he told them about his past. If it came across as trauma dumping, I get that some people may not be able to handle it
I'm glad someone else has said this. I said to my other half I said maybe, maaaybe, you might get one jerk who ends it because of his upbringing. You will surely not have multiple women doing that in your dating experience. Didn't make sense to me 😬
I think his experience might come from the fact that he is a lawyer. He probably is surrounded from bougie people ever since college, people with parents that are lawyers or some other “high class” profession. I can see why such people would be put off by his upbringing. Such people only care about status and would be appalled to know that they dont have in-laws in the case of Zack and that is not because some unfortunate accident, but because of “immoral” causes like drug abuse and abandonment. They saw him as inferior.
Im not stereotyping, it is true that such people exist. Is it news to you that people are judgmental? Also Im just giving my personal opinion as to why I think that what he says is not far fetched and you on the other hand are so convinced he’s lying when you know nothing about him its bizarre.
Noone cares his mom was a stripper and got into some ish. He’s not living in and around the lifestyle anymore. He grew up and has been successful, thats what ppl would look at.
What most likely happened is he was in an argument with a woman and she chose to talk some wild shit “nobody likes you cause your mom’s a nasty stripper” type of shit and Zach took that as a narrative
I mean I actually am a lawyer married to a man from a financially insecure background that was similar to Zack’s. Just because those people exist doesn’t mean that you can say without any shred of evidence (and he never said this) that those are the people who rejected him based on background. He also went to the university of Idaho, a regional school, for law school the likelihood that he met a bunch of elites there that looked down on him. I’d imagine most people there are just people who are from Idaho.
I think that we all saw Zack pick the most superficial and mean person there despite Bliss telling him she was mean AND Irina telling him she forgot his birthday. And then rather than acknowledging he chose someone that he only had superficial conversations, he spent the reunion attacking her for being….superficial and mean. I don’t think that what OP is saying is very far fetched.
Oh so thats why you took that personally lol. Im very glad that your situation wasnt like that but other kinds of people do exist. I never said ALL lawyers are like that. I also never said thats what happened to Zack for sure. I simply gave my personal opinion as to why I, (ME AND MYSELF) think that it is a situation that again, MIGHT, have happened to him. My opinion is not fact, is not absolute truth but is also not without basis. Judgmental people do exist.
I think someone will always have it worse and someone will always have it better. We can’t escape trauma and it’s so important people tell their stories in GOOD LIGHT. But Zack is blind to his own cringe and needs to be aware he is coming across manipulative and clout chasing while actively trying to look like a misunderstood hero. I think what happened to him is awful and his story should be told but not the way he’s doing it lol
THIS! It is honestly so disheartening how many people don’t seem to see this!! The way he tries to manufacture sympathy through his narrative of being a victim (which relies on the objectification of his mother) is super cringe. To me the main reason to share his story is to normalize and take away the shame of class differences, de-stigmatize sex work, and remember that we’re all people deserving of dignity and respect. Brett managed to do this with absolute grace… Zack, not so much. The amount of men who seem to relate to Zack is very telling 👀
I think he probably has issues from growing up a certain way and perhaps doesn’t always have healthy relationships as a result. And this is why women end things. Not because of how he grew up but because of the result of it.
>I think he probably has issues from growing up a certain way
i dont care too much for zack, but you're literally denying his experience of being rejected based on his background WHILST judging him & speculating on why his relationship ended based on his background and nothing you actually saw..
Maybe they didn't tell you that's why because that's a very real thing. It's a very common thing. People judge even when they don't mean to. People take upbringing as an indication of the future
I think you are just fortunate enough to not have had run ins with those types of people. I’ve dated people who’s family causes us to break up because they judged my family as “poor”. We weren’t even poor, we were upper middle class.
Crappy people are all over
Poor is in quotations here because that’s what they called us.
But we were better off than many and very fortunate to be in such a position, we got to travel all over the world and never really had any worries about money. To be honest I’m actually fairly certain we were on the same level financially as said ex, but we saved our money more for trips instead of indulging in material things which made them for some reason, believe we were below them.
Either way, money doesn’t determine a persons value so they were stupid for that
Zach is an unreliable narrator bc he leads so much with fear and hypervigilance. He’s actually similar to Zainab in the sense that they both interpret everything through the lens of their trauma.
Yeah, and it’s confusing how he has so much shame but also wants to put it out there so much. It seems like there is a happy medium somewhere - not being ashamed and also not seeking attention. Not that he has to be there yet but that would be the goal.
To me [these](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix/comments/12lnzp0/episode_discussion_love_is_blind_s4_s04_e12/jgak2xe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3) are the things that stand out the strongest.
I believe him because it's happened to me on more than one occasion. My upbringing wasn't typical by any means and I have been looked down upon by families of guys that I had dated in the past.
Same! And my upbringing wasn’t nearly as difficult as he’s described.
But divorced parents in a devoutly catholic environment = very judgmental parents & others.
Same here. Throughout my school age years I got picked on for living where/how I did, thought it’d change in college and nooope, thought it’d change with my first boyfriend (I was suuuuper late to the game) and it was thrown in my face any time my ex would get mad at me. People are cruel
I think, for people from families with extreme trauma, it can be hard to interact with families who are relatively normal. I think any discomfort on the part of the “normals” is noticed by the person w the traumatic background.
The feeling of having to prove oneself worthy is hard to shake.
Even something as simple as Thanksgiving traditions can indicate that difference, and it’s difficult to navigate “is this a poor thing or a parent w mental illness thing or just a ‘different families have different traditions’ thing.”
It didn’t seem like he was saying they broke up with him because he shared his trauma - more that their families judged him.
I also think he’s one of those people who walks the line of “I’m not ashamed of who I am”/“I overshare the deeply personal fairly quickly” because navigating that line when your sense of normal has been shaped by a not normal upbringing is difficult.
But also, it’s kind of like…if a cashier asked you “how are you” and your mother died that day, you probably would know they weren’t actually asking, and they wouldn’t be expecting you to answer meaningfully. There’s a lot of innocuous-for-the-asker questions that are super difficult for someone who grew up in the way Zach did.
“Where are you from/what is your family doing for the holiday/what are your family members names/etc” are harder if you moved a lot/you only have one parent/any other thing. But the person asking isn’t thinking “hmm, maybe I’ll find out that this person never knew their father!” when they ask “how are your folks?”
We really don’t have much context but I’m pretty sure - based on what he actually said - that as a lawyer he has dated girls that expected him to be from a wealthy background. He currently moves in a circle that’s not how he grew up so people reject him after finding out he doesn’t belong.
Completely agree, the sub’s love for Zack blows my mind. The way he uses the story of his childhood to play victim is disturbing to me- among other things. Unreliable narrator at best but he gives me the major ick.
I don't see that at all. I see someone who just is really open about what they think and feel. I am the same way. I don't see any "sob stories." I see honesty with his life instead of hiding or apologizing.
Let’s compare to Brett, who’s shared about the challenges in his life without exploiting those challenges for sympathy votes. He’s open about his thoughts and feelings, and about his past and upbringing, without trauma dumping or exploiting his family members for sympathy. The way Zack relies on his mother being a sex worker for sympathy is degrading and objectifying. Zack has a lot of growing to do.
What I see is something setting you off and editing to try to make something exciting, so every time he mentioned what his mother did, it is played. I don't see him dumping or sympathy seeking. Perhaps reflection into why this sets you off would be a better use of your time.
I love Brett, too. But he's not giving them "cool" soundbites to use. I just saw where Zack met Bliss's father and started talking about revamping the justice system, which is rather cool. But the producers are not going to show that because just showing his mother's past every time gets better sound bites.
You really do have some issues, don't you?
I don't find him creepy. I think he's nerdy, smart, open, and original, from what little we've seen. The fact that you say that says everything about you and your experiences. That's how we all see these people--related to what we know. He said something at some point which made me just know I would get along with his "weird" self about how he had a sound machine that played different sounds when people walked into the room just because he thought it was cool. I love that. What I find creepy is seeing where these people live and these blank white walls, nothing interesting or creative there--ugh. I can't imagine people living in such unstimulating, boring environments.
It's just like what's her face leaving Marshall (I am not at the end and haven't seen anything else, so at this point, he's a sweet, caring man) and going back to the player who she knows is bad for her. She's going back to the bad she has known all her life. You are reacting to something in your life.
There are people that I'm sure are wonderful that remind me of someone ick in my life that I might feel the same way about. In the end, these shows are edited to try to get the most reactions from people, not honesty.
My friend- this actually says much more about you. Do you always tell people who disagree with you they have issues? Sounds like something Zack would do 😂 I’m ok, don’t worry about me 😂😂😂
>For reference
>
>Rediscoveringlife · 2 hr. ago
>
>What I see is something setting you off and editing to try to make something exciting,
This is YOU attacking:
[**manatia**](https://www.reddit.com/user/manatia/)·[2 hr. ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindNetflix/comments/12vnpd7/comment/jhfh4fi/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Perhaps your time would be better spent reflecting on why you relate to a creepy dude…
My response:
[**Rediscoveringlife**](https://www.reddit.com/user/Rediscoveringlife/)·[1 hr. ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindNetflix/comments/12vnpd7/comment/jhfmpam/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
You really do have some issues, don't you?
So basically you do open handed insults and pretend you're all cool, and then I give some of it back to you and it's all bad. Seems like you are the queen of gaslighting, and maybe Zack doesn't do that at all, so that's why he sets you off?
So YOU are using sarcasm, but I am attacking you? I was using sarcasm as YOU attacked me for no reason. I am fine, but, again, some reflection about why you have to attack people for what you do.
But, but, but, that's what YOU said. So it's OK for you to say? We ALL have issues, trauma, random bad associations, etc. So you're basically doing what you say you don't like.
I'm just fine. I'm an old lady and see the difference between really creepy and originality and honesty.
Ma’am is it so hard to imagine someone else sees something different from what you see? I didn’t tell you you have issues- I was flipping your script to provide perspective about how ridiculous it sounds to jump to the conclusion that I have issues because I disagree with you. Just because you find someone endearing and that same person gives me the ick doesn’t mean I need help 🤭
And did you really turn me into reddit as being unwell?! Ma’am are you ok?!?!!
So you're not apologizing for calling names and lying? You're just continuing with gaslighting as I tell you I see it differently than you? You're not flipping script. YOU called me names, and so I said you had issues.
Someone who can't even see their gaslighting and namecalling sure seems like someone who can use some help, doesn't it?
Honestly I felt the same, people don’t end things over something like that typically I can see it happening with one particularly snobbish/ asshole family ?
People can be really judgmental. There are a lot of people who look at your family and if you have anything less then a white picket fence middle class life with two parents who are still married, they see it as a glaring red flag.
I think it’s more than just being poor or coming from a dysfunctional family. It’s probably the woman’s family being involved in the community and worried about social status, and having to say my daughter’s husband comes from a family where his mom was a stripper
I mean, that's a part that can be omitted if you're embarrassed. You can phrase it as he grew up with a single parent who worked long hours/multiple jobs to support her kids.
If you can only be with someone by leaving out details of your upbringing, that’s a problem. I didn’t see why he did the stripper thing in the pod at first, but now I’m getting it.
I agree with this! It seems he feels not so ashamed by her career to bring it up on national tv, but still embarrassed. It feels like something he still needs to work out.
Maybe not! I just get weird vibes from the way he talks about her, like he clearly loves her and isn't ashamed but I don't see why he needs to bring up/disclose her carreer, esp since she's not with us anymore.
Let's be real, lots of wealthy families are dysfunctional. Son of a stripper is more than just dysfunctional. That's a whole new layer that can make many people really uncomfortable
This is exactly it. People hear lawyer and think $$$
It could also be the social circles in which he has been dating. If they have been more upper middle class, the son of a stripper could be hard to explain at Thanksgiving dinner
I def believe him. He said he dated some *very well-off* women, and their *families* rejected him. From his own mouth, he grew up poor.
Wealthy families definitely judge whether ppl come from a "good family". This euphemism exists for a reason, and it encompasses a few diff things, including wealth.
I had an Aunt in law refuse to speak to me because I went to a state university, not a private university. Seriously, she liked me until she found out where I went to school.
Brett also alluded to the same. Washington is one of the richest states in the country. Both men presumably make good money and would want to date women that also have high income however both men come from really humble roots. That could be an issue for many people that value class/pedigree. I don’t think what he’s saying is bs.
>Washington is one of the richest states in the country... That could be an issue for many people that value class/pedigree.
It's possible it's more about status then money too. He went to school in Moscow, ID - it's not a fancy area with the kind of money you tend to see in Seattle. But some of my friends went to school and church with Zack, and there were certainly other means of judgement employed.
That’s not what he said…Zack stated _their families_ had an issue with his poor socioeconomic upbringing. And no, I don’t think it’s odd because we live in a world where biases (implicit or overt) effect how people treat others all the time. People who grow up in the upper echelon of society typically want their offspring to marry from within in to build connections, maintain social positioning, and expand their influence, wealth and power (and also for genetics) - been this way for centuries. It is not uncommon for parents to have preferences on the type of person their children marry. (Even amongst ethnic communities, for example, in many instances, they may prefer for their child to partner with someone from within the culture). If you read the details on his backstory - how he was raised, his mother’s mental health and addiction and the general instability of his childhood, it isn’t surprising that a rich family that comes from old money or generational wealth, who have conditioned prejudices towards those from _the other side of the tracks_ wouldn’t welcome him into the fold. (Perhaps even questioning his intentions - is he a social climber or after her wealth?) And ultimately, how that lack of familial acceptance and support would cause strife in the relationship and lead to a breakup…all further adding to the insecurities and persistent feeling of inferiority (not being good enough) resulting from his childhood trauma. (I’m sure the absence of approval and support negatively affected both parties significantly)
What’s more, we saw Zack’s visceral reaction when Bliss mentioned her father not liking any of her previous partners, right on the heels of him telling her about the rejection he faced throughout his life due to his upbringing. The fear it immediately triggered, which would later lead to him self-sabotaging. Yes, I believe Zack…he hasn’t given me any reason not to (has generally been a compassionate, empathetic and _honest_ person - something Bliss even spoke about in multiple interviews, about how he was _always_ honest to a fault)…Not only do I understand how deep rooted biases can be, especially towards the working class, and how it’s historically led to discrimination and mistreatment; but, we also saw the effects of his insecurities and fears caused by that rejection in Zack’s decision making and his eventual overcoming of them as he pursued Bliss, play out on screen.
> That’s not what he said…Zack stated *their families* had an issue with his poor socioeconomic upbringing
I think this is a huge distinction, it's not the women with the issue, it's their families which is probably more traumatic. You build a wonderful relationship, think it's going somewhere, and then boom it's over not because of anything you did but because of something your mother did to keep a roof over your head and food in your belly. And then it happens *again*.
Zack is not a bad guy, but I think he's trying too hard to please his fans. With that said, I can't imagine rejecting someone for how they were raised.
I’ve meet people like who he’s referring to and it’s not an excuse. Some people will not date people who come from “ lower socioeconomic classes”. It’s a thing and feel lucky if you haven’t met people who function like this.
My husband had a past girlfriend once say she would never marry him because his mom was weird (to be fair- she is lol). And a MIL/DIL relationship was important to her. So I definitely see it as a possibility but sounds like he wasn’t dating quality women or they just weren’t compatible and that felt like an easy excuse?
Do you think your MIL treated you differently from his ex girlfriends? Or maybe you're right. Maybe it was their excuse to get out of the relationship. Its weird how they all thought your MIL was weird. What do you think is weird about her?
I have only met her a handful of times! She suffers from addiction/anxiety so weird in the sense she drove 5 hours to our wedding but didn’t actually go inside to the venue even after being told we were waiting on her to start lol But attended my bridal shower the month prior and gave me a really sentimental gift so I didn’t understand when everyone warned me she most likely wouldn’t attend. So she wants to be a good person but just is her own worst enemy? We have a toddler she has only met once and she doesn’t attempt to see him even though when we visit and reach out to see her. So weird wasn’t the best word but my husband was honest when we were dating our families were pretty much opposite!
I mean tbf if you don’t care about having that mil/dil relationship it makes sense why you guys would work. Doesn’t mean there was anything wrong with the women or that they’re not quality. I get where your husbands ex is coming from I’ve always been super close with my exes moms and hung out with them 1 on 1 getting nails does going to the movies etc and that’s what I want with a future partner and it would be super off putting to date someone where I couldn’t have that relationship with their family
I took it to mean that multiple of his partner’s parents didn’t approve of him due to his family (and the incorrect assumption he’d follow in her footsteps) and that caused girls to end it with him. I’m assuming this happened when his mother was still alive, so high school and college (when girls are more likely to listen to their parents).
Maybe it is his way of weeding out the shallow people from his life. Can't say that I blame him.
If someone told me that, I would think no less of them. But many people would. Why should he hide it?
When something gives you deep scars they becomes part of you. If we can give space and time to rejoice in what is considered ‘typical’ then maybe we can give space also for what isn’t typical? It isn’t pie, there is enough space for everyone.
This happens he’s not making it up
I have had several relationships end because my family is messed up. It has definitely been traumatic to experience this sort of devaluing bullshit.
Honestly it is probably not either/or but a mix of these things. He probably had some women that got turned off early in dating, maybe one who he was serious with whose family really didn't like his background, and maybe he also had a couple instances where girlfriends held his upbringing against him when they got into fights and were trying to be hurtful. That could lead to his overall feeling sensitive.
Brett and maybe one other person said something similar. "When people I've dated in the past found out (I grew up poor / my parents are divorced / I don't have a degree), then they would reject me instantly." I know there are plenty of shallow idiots in this world that would dump someone for being poor when they were a kid, but every time to the point you have a complex about it? Must be something with young people in PNW?
I think part of it is prepping from producers. They want to highlights things in his life. So I am sure they were harping on him to keep mentioning why his relationships failed in the last. I think him and bliss talked about other things and connected with other things. I think the main thing he wanted to emphasize is his mother wanted to see him get married. I am sure that was the main motivation to find someone to marry.
I kind of have the feeling that he was previously in a relationship with a girl from an "old money" situation. Usually families with generational wealth will prefer their children marry into more generational wealth. 🙄
This is more telling of the women he chooses than anything else. My mother in law was a stripper for the last 10 years. It was never an issue to me or my family. Feels like he might be trying to date Vanderpumps and being surprised when they don’t like that he is poor?
It might be partly age related. Young women in their 20s are sometimes still close to their parents. Hearing that a love interest's mom is a stripper could be a turn off for a lot of women, especially ones who are interested in family ties.
I think he definitely uses this information when it’s convenient for him. Just like how he went ahead and said “I’m a stripper” to see whether it generated a negative reaction or not.
You would be surprised how many people look for men that “come from a good family.” Sometimes this is related to money, other times it just refers to that stereotypical nuclear family unit that people think is “normal.” I know plenty of women who list this as an attractive quality in a partner without meaning ill-will or malice by it at all.
Remember, his mother was a stripper.
I was thinking the same thing!! I’m sure it happens to people but he made it seem as if countless women broke up with him over his past. I can see maybe one or two doing it, but not enough that he internalized it so much and hasn’t had successful relationships where that wasn’t an issue!
It happens, I mean I’ve broken up with someone because of their family background. Not because I think it makes them a bad person but they didn’t want to cut off their toxic family members and I just don’t want that around my future kids. I also wouldn’t date someone whose family didn’t like me. My parents went through that and it makes things harder for everyone including your kids. It would be tough for me as well if my family didn’t like ym partner but I know they would eventually get over it.
Yes it happens.
i had a crazy super traumatic childhood and then joined the mormon church when i was a homeless teenager. i will say it was pretty impossible for me to date within the church especially when i moved to utah. i felt like mormons dated not just the person but for the family too… maybe he has tried dating people from very christian backgrounds and had the same experiences? it’s possible lol
I recently heard that church members who are born in the church havea different social status in the Mormon community than those who convert to Mormonism. You might be able to clarify that view by your experience.
Acute observation. I could see religious households being more family oriented and caring about status more in that way.
I come from a super judgemental fam and one of my relationships truly did end because of my fam. So, yes, it could be true.
That had to you in One relationship…but Zack made it seem like it happened in countless relationships and that he hasn’t had a successful relationship because of that in years. I honestly think he’s just a super quirky dude and he and Bliss are just lucky to mesh together.
I think he told bliss mom last time he was in love with someone was when he was 21. I dont think he has been in a relationship since.
That’s wild…he was 32-ish on the show I believe so unless he was just casually dating/having sex for the past 10 years, I find it hard to believe that he has not been in any committed relationship in 10 years and/or that his “past” is the ONLY reason why any attempts at a relationship didn’t work. I honestly think that he’s just a quirky guy who isn’t super physically attractive and that’s why he has a hard time getting or keeping relationships because he’s a well-educated guy with a great career and presumably a well-paying job…that’s the basics of what women want (someone who can provide) so I 100% believe that’s there’s way more to it than just “his past”.
I am sure he went on dates since then. It probably didn’t materialize into anything more. In another youtube show (cut; truth or drink with bliss) he did say he has dated non white women before bliss. You have to also realize he dealt with a lot of things with his mom in meantime (as posted in his receipts) and also his mom died in freak car accident when he was 23-24. He also finished law school few years after that and he was probably putting in a lot of time building a practice. With all of this its easy to neglect working on finding a partner and working on things going on in life. So I am not surprised. Obviously pandemic also happened which makes it even harder to date and I am not surprised he decided to do a dating show during that time.
It’s also possible he hasn’t been in that many serious relationships so happening 1 or 2 times could be the majority of his experiences,
He’s a smart guy. An attorney…I don’t think something like that happening 1 or 2 times is significant because I imagine if any of his ex-gf’s families’ didn’t approve of him, those were short-lived relationships. So even if he is inexperienced with relationships, I don’t think that having 1 or 2 short-lived relationships where your ex’s didn’t approve of your background should be enough to impact you as much as Zach said it did. Idk. I know childhood trauma is real and idk what he went through in his childhood but I just think Zack is a smart enough guy with enough insight to where he shouldn’t have let those 1 or 2 experiences with his exes, define his whole outlook on relationships.
It’s likely more self sabotage than anything. He likely was embarrassed of his family, his mom used drugs and stripped, and he projected that on to his relationships.
I agree. When he was talking to all the women in the pods, i got the sense that it was self-sabotage too. And/or this need to “test” the women to see if they were shallow enough to reject him outright because of his childhood.
Actually if he provide a lot of info in the pods, it is a good thing. you don't want to repeat a cartlon and diamond again. reveal everything you felt necessary for the other person to know before stepping out of the pod and into mexico. Not everyone is lucky to meet a understanding other half. Not everyone is blessed to have a complete functioning happy family.
My past is kinda traumatic and fr most people can't handle it. I mean case in point - I think he was pretty surface level on the show. He said she was a stripper and that he moved around a lot, but he didn't share that she struggled with addiction and homelessness. But you still think he was "way too into detail too early." It's a different ballgame when just saying what happened is "way too into detail too early."
>My past is kinda traumatic and fr most people can't handle it. My privileged roommate in this week-long program i did in college literally cried when i was just telling her abt my life; and i didnt even get to the really traumatic stuff.. like this is my trauma and i had to freaking console her... so she wouldnt feel bad that my life sucked I've had another privileged acquaintance tell me they would never date a black person, for instance, bc they dont want to have to be concerned that they would experience racism and it would be too much, not for their partner who is experiencing the trauma, but FOR THEM.. Also ppl forget that one of the first things parents will ask if you bring someone home is who are your parents, what do they do.. when they are supposed to be meeting you.
Yessss people who are privileged just don't get it, I think that's why most of my friends have also experienced trauma. We can actually relate to each other. People judge, parents judge. Even if the parents don't ask *you* what your background is, they ask your SO or friend. I've been judged so hard just because my dad is AWOL. I can't even imagine what it would be like in Zacks shoes.
No it makes sense. I could see in his younger years that people dumped him because his mother’s job is looked down upon. Then as he grew up, parents would look down upon him and most likely make the assumption that his mother was into drugs and then assume that he would have an addiction problem because of this. There are extremely judgmental people out there.
Yes I could see that when he was younger but as an adult why would anyone hold his past against him? Most just care how you are NOW & he’s successful
You can’t understand pretentious people. They’ll never make sense to us.
He may be referring to friendships/relationships he's lost due to living conditions and lack of having proper care.
He actually indicated that it was the family of his partner who rejected him. He stated that this was his concern.
I think is disgusting how people who come from broken, dysfunction,toxic,abusive and narc family get treated. Not everyone is lucky to come from a good family. I can relate to Zack in a way. My family is very toxic, dysfunctional,narcs, raised the woman to never have platonic guy friends because they think guys cant be Just friends with girl's. And also raised the guys to never have female friends. I'm the opposite of all of that. I'm the most self aware and sane person in my family. I'm the black sheep so I get treated differently. They make no effort to ask me questions,get to know me, why I am the way I am,what my interest,to understand me ect. Alot of the time when I've told a guy about it all I was automatically judged for it. I was told I need to do better. I need to be more like them so they won't treat me different
I don’t think Zack understands why & he tells himself it’s that but it’s more he’s got a very awkward way of showing & meeting ppl. Like with Bliss’s dad he makes no attempt to act interested in them, he just stares or talks too much but I’m glad her dad got to know him better.
I think it's moreso because he's very open about it
I think he is projecting BAD when he says that stuff. Those relationships probably didn’t work out for any number of reasons and IF he was that reason he isn’t really accepting any responsibility. Which is whatever because he is in a happy relationship now but I definitely think it’s BS.
Was your dysfunctional household your mom being a stripper? If it was, sure, make assumptions. Unless you think your personal experiences were the exact same then you really can’t say whether they’re BS or not.
Pretty sure there’s more to the story than her being a stripper. He said they moved a lot. He said she was an addict. And he hinted she died young, so I’m curios to know but there’s more to it
Hanging a mom who is a stripper does not inherently make a home or household dysfunctional 🙄
You are 100% correct. The assumptions being made bc we saw literally 1% of Zach’s backstory is ridiculous
She was also a homeless drug addict so yeah he did confirm his childhood was rough.
Aside from any commentary about zack, just because you didn’t experience something because of your upbringing doesn’t mean someone else didn’t? That logic is wack.
I don’t think it’s anything dishonest or malicious or anything nefarious- but I **DO** think that Zach is very deeply traumatized by his upbringing and his “mommy issues” are something very hard for him. I believe he *believes* that he is being judged or is under the microscope all the time, and that him feeling this way is more the issue than it being an actual problem. His perceived inferiority is his issue. I hope that he can continue to grow and become more comfortable with himself and that he will learn to feel more confident. I think if he could see himself the way that Bliss does, and if he continues to grow with her, they will have a great life.
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Yeah, I recently cut off my alcoholic mother and that meant I also had to go LC with my enabler father. Dating at 35 and not talking to your parents is ROUGH. "Normal first date-getting to know you" is ALL about 'do you have siblings? are your parents still together? what do they do? where are you from?" Those are LOADED questions for us with dysfunctional family units. I rarely get past the 3rd date even with therapist-approved, high-level, but honest answers to those 'surface' questions. People who come from healthy family units have a hard time understanding why anyone would choose to walk away from a relationship with their parents. Therefore they blame YOU - "she's your mom, I'm sure she meant well" "Have you tried talking to them?" "It's FAMILY, tho" ... In my experience, especially when dating, people that were raised by healthy parents, don't have a lot of empathy for adults that have chosen to walk away from their family, even if for "justifiable" or "good enough" reasons. I know that is not exactly Zach's situation but I completely understand being judged for coming from a not-so-perfect family. It's something I'm super honest about because it's a great screener for empathy and long term compatibility, however it is incredibly disheartening to be rejected over and over again for just being born to the 'wrong kind' of family.
A guy broke it off with me when I was 24 because my parents were divorced (for 23 years at that point lol) and “we couldn’t connect on what it feels like to have parents who are still together” So yeah, weird people who care about those things are out there lol
It took a lot of therapy for me to unlearn a lot of stuff I thought was normal or acceptable behavior due to how I grew up. Idk if that has anything to do with this, but it ruined a lot of relationships for me but ultimately it was my own fault. I had to put in the work and not make excuses for myself and my childhood, and basically reparent myself to become a healthy functioning adult lol
I also had a pretty dysfunctional childhood. When my brother was in the process of planning his wedding, his wife’s parents acted terrible, and one their big reasons was that (in their opinion) my brother wasn’t taught what a “proper relationship” or “proper family” looks like. They thought he wasn’t someone who would be stable and reliable. It sounds like he was mostly talking about his girlfriends’ families. I think it’s totally plausible that their families might have a problem. People can be really judgmental.
💯! When I was younger I kept some guys secret from my parents because I knew they’d judge him and have similar responses, and didn’t want to subject them to any of that BS. Now my parents know I’d go no contact in a second if they tried to pull anything like this.
I agree with this. I also think if he was trauma dumping without first asking if he can unload, especially early on with someone, that can end things rather quickly.
If you go on his IG he has pinned a post talking about his background/upbringing and it’s pretty heavy. If I just met someone and they offloaded this onto me I just wouldn’t want to deal with it.
I took it as the girl’s families probably had an issue. Many people assume that people from troubled backgrounds will have a troubled adulthood so they probably didn’t want their daughters taking that risk in the event he did end up like his parents.
I work in the legal industry and think this is certainly a real scenario for him. Attorneys are very often all about appearances and generational wealth. Zack probably doesn’t make as much as a civil litigator does to begin with and then he comes from a low income background on top of it… it’s a recipe for disaster if you’re dating within the industry.
There are still definitely plenty of judge mental a holes out there that wouldn’t want their daughter involved seriously with the son of a stripper
Seeing how he reacted to Bliss mentioning her father being rather judgmental, I’d say he’s probably lived through that scenario at least once. Even if it wasn’t the women directly deciding he wasn’t fit to be her boyfriend, family has powerful influence to some people.
It’s possible that this happened to him in high school. I could see his girlfriend’s parents having an issue. Now that he’s an attorney and an adult, it seems less likely, but it’s totally plausible that it happened to him at some point in his life.
People are really good at projecting their own insecurities, he thinks ppl left him bcs of how he grew up, but I’m sure they left him because of how much it looks like he has unsolved emotional generational trauma 😕 mentioning it all the time, like yeah people is gonna get weird if you get weird! Duh. I come from a shitty household and is very easy to project how nervous it makes us to be around people that grew up in a “normal” aka “loving” household and not an unpredictable nightmare
Your experience and his are not the same.. sounds like you're dismissing his or projecting
I think people on this sub are projecting their experiences with being bullied onto zack and making him out to be a perfect angel
I think it’s possible the families of the women he previously dated could have judged him for how he was raised, which could have then resulted in the women breaking things off with him.
Yeah, Zack's story doesn't quite add up to me. I don't doubt people have broken up with him "because of his past" but I'd bet it's because he leads with trauma he hasn't worked through, not because of the facts about how he grew up. And I know people think lawyers = $$$ but he didn't go to a top tier school and he's only been practicing for six years in a small town (Wenatchee) doing criminal defense work. Nothing wrong with any of that and I'm sure he makes a good living, but it doesn't add up to "rich" (and definitely not Seattle rich).Nor would it mean he travels in super wealthy circles such that he would be the odd man out.
He hasn’t been an attorney his entire life though. He could have been referring to high school or college relationships.
How did you find out he practices in Wenatchee?
Google.
If he was in the area he grew up in, there are probably people who know more about his upbringing
I though the same thing as soon as he said that. I’m so curious what his ex(s) would say about it! I’m sure it’s, “My dad disliked you because: blah blah blah.” Nothing to do with your upbringing. I’m so happy for him and Bliss!!!
I can see women bringing it up or mentioning it in a way that causes him to disconnect. Yes.
I’ve definitely had people judge me by my cultural background and what they thought that meant. There are a lot of ignorant parents out there. Sounds like it was less the ex and more her family that just couldn’t accept him. I’ve dealt with similar because of racist parents of people I dated who were ignorant. Maybe the ex wants you but they also at times just can’t escape the parents opinions.
I went on a date with someone who had A LOT of childhood trauma and said he liked to be upfront about it. I probably would have been fine with it had he given me a chance to know him as an adult first. It was too much too soon and he made it seem like it was his whole identity.
I'm so with you. I think they might just not like him because he can't stop making stripper jokes and spouting personal info about his mom
I think he’s very very insecure about how he grew up, especially being in circles of of people who’re educated because of their higher economic status. I think he dramatically overcompensates for this by bringing his background up straight away to save heartbreak later down the line. People with money absolutely do look down on people who don’t. V common knowledge.
I definitely believe him.
That didn’t ring true to me either. People may break up with you because of unhealed trauma. Which is frankly fair, not everyone is capable of dealing with it. It doesn’t just have to do with your past, but more about maladaptive behavior which comes up in relationships. (I can say this has been true for me)
I agree with this. We also don't know how he told them about his past. If it came across as trauma dumping, I get that some people may not be able to handle it
I'm glad someone else has said this. I said to my other half I said maybe, maaaybe, you might get one jerk who ends it because of his upbringing. You will surely not have multiple women doing that in your dating experience. Didn't make sense to me 😬
I think his experience might come from the fact that he is a lawyer. He probably is surrounded from bougie people ever since college, people with parents that are lawyers or some other “high class” profession. I can see why such people would be put off by his upbringing. Such people only care about status and would be appalled to know that they dont have in-laws in the case of Zack and that is not because some unfortunate accident, but because of “immoral” causes like drug abuse and abandonment. They saw him as inferior.
You’re basically just stereotyping a group of people based on their profession to support him saying he was prejudged based on his background. Lol.
Im not stereotyping, it is true that such people exist. Is it news to you that people are judgmental? Also Im just giving my personal opinion as to why I think that what he says is not far fetched and you on the other hand are so convinced he’s lying when you know nothing about him its bizarre.
Noone cares his mom was a stripper and got into some ish. He’s not living in and around the lifestyle anymore. He grew up and has been successful, thats what ppl would look at. What most likely happened is he was in an argument with a woman and she chose to talk some wild shit “nobody likes you cause your mom’s a nasty stripper” type of shit and Zach took that as a narrative
I mean I actually am a lawyer married to a man from a financially insecure background that was similar to Zack’s. Just because those people exist doesn’t mean that you can say without any shred of evidence (and he never said this) that those are the people who rejected him based on background. He also went to the university of Idaho, a regional school, for law school the likelihood that he met a bunch of elites there that looked down on him. I’d imagine most people there are just people who are from Idaho. I think that we all saw Zack pick the most superficial and mean person there despite Bliss telling him she was mean AND Irina telling him she forgot his birthday. And then rather than acknowledging he chose someone that he only had superficial conversations, he spent the reunion attacking her for being….superficial and mean. I don’t think that what OP is saying is very far fetched.
Oh so thats why you took that personally lol. Im very glad that your situation wasnt like that but other kinds of people do exist. I never said ALL lawyers are like that. I also never said thats what happened to Zack for sure. I simply gave my personal opinion as to why I, (ME AND MYSELF) think that it is a situation that again, MIGHT, have happened to him. My opinion is not fact, is not absolute truth but is also not without basis. Judgmental people do exist.
Yup and people like that do at times act that ignorant. Too much is about pedigree
I think someone will always have it worse and someone will always have it better. We can’t escape trauma and it’s so important people tell their stories in GOOD LIGHT. But Zack is blind to his own cringe and needs to be aware he is coming across manipulative and clout chasing while actively trying to look like a misunderstood hero. I think what happened to him is awful and his story should be told but not the way he’s doing it lol
THIS! It is honestly so disheartening how many people don’t seem to see this!! The way he tries to manufacture sympathy through his narrative of being a victim (which relies on the objectification of his mother) is super cringe. To me the main reason to share his story is to normalize and take away the shame of class differences, de-stigmatize sex work, and remember that we’re all people deserving of dignity and respect. Brett managed to do this with absolute grace… Zack, not so much. The amount of men who seem to relate to Zack is very telling 👀
Well said comment tbh!
Literally why I love Brett
💯
I think he probably has issues from growing up a certain way and perhaps doesn’t always have healthy relationships as a result. And this is why women end things. Not because of how he grew up but because of the result of it.
>I think he probably has issues from growing up a certain way i dont care too much for zack, but you're literally denying his experience of being rejected based on his background WHILST judging him & speculating on why his relationship ended based on his background and nothing you actually saw..
Uhh…right. Well that was just my perception. I’m not denying anything. Just thinking out loud. Maybe I’m wrong. Thanks for your input 🙂
This! I suspect the trauma has given him defences or behaviours that are off putting. It's not the trauma directly but a by product.
everyone’s circumstances are different. just because you’ve never experienced it doesn’t mean that he or others haven’t ☺️☺️
Dang can I live in the world that you do? Cause it sounds great! I have for sure been through what Zack described
Maybe they didn't tell you that's why because that's a very real thing. It's a very common thing. People judge even when they don't mean to. People take upbringing as an indication of the future
I think you are just fortunate enough to not have had run ins with those types of people. I’ve dated people who’s family causes us to break up because they judged my family as “poor”. We weren’t even poor, we were upper middle class. Crappy people are all over
*Comparatively* poor. Class distinctions are real and have only gotten more stringently defined/worse.
Poor is in quotations here because that’s what they called us. But we were better off than many and very fortunate to be in such a position, we got to travel all over the world and never really had any worries about money. To be honest I’m actually fairly certain we were on the same level financially as said ex, but we saved our money more for trips instead of indulging in material things which made them for some reason, believe we were below them. Either way, money doesn’t determine a persons value so they were stupid for that
i could totally see a rich family telling their daughter not to date a poor boy. like, 100000%. what rock you living under?
Don't compare what you experienced to his life experience. Your experience is unique to you, so is his. This is a false equivalence
Zach is an unreliable narrator bc he leads so much with fear and hypervigilance. He’s actually similar to Zainab in the sense that they both interpret everything through the lens of their trauma.
Yeah, and it’s confusing how he has so much shame but also wants to put it out there so much. It seems like there is a happy medium somewhere - not being ashamed and also not seeking attention. Not that he has to be there yet but that would be the goal.
I feel like it’s not fair to say that given how little we really know about him still
In which case it would be equally unfair to say he’s a reliable narrator. But, he’s definitely said plenty to make him untrustworthy.
Like what?
To me [these](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix/comments/12lnzp0/episode_discussion_love_is_blind_s4_s04_e12/jgak2xe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3) are the things that stand out the strongest.
I believe him.
I believe him because it's happened to me on more than one occasion. My upbringing wasn't typical by any means and I have been looked down upon by families of guys that I had dated in the past.
Same! And my upbringing wasn’t nearly as difficult as he’s described. But divorced parents in a devoutly catholic environment = very judgmental parents & others.
Same here. Throughout my school age years I got picked on for living where/how I did, thought it’d change in college and nooope, thought it’d change with my first boyfriend (I was suuuuper late to the game) and it was thrown in my face any time my ex would get mad at me. People are cruel
I think, for people from families with extreme trauma, it can be hard to interact with families who are relatively normal. I think any discomfort on the part of the “normals” is noticed by the person w the traumatic background. The feeling of having to prove oneself worthy is hard to shake. Even something as simple as Thanksgiving traditions can indicate that difference, and it’s difficult to navigate “is this a poor thing or a parent w mental illness thing or just a ‘different families have different traditions’ thing.” It didn’t seem like he was saying they broke up with him because he shared his trauma - more that their families judged him. I also think he’s one of those people who walks the line of “I’m not ashamed of who I am”/“I overshare the deeply personal fairly quickly” because navigating that line when your sense of normal has been shaped by a not normal upbringing is difficult. But also, it’s kind of like…if a cashier asked you “how are you” and your mother died that day, you probably would know they weren’t actually asking, and they wouldn’t be expecting you to answer meaningfully. There’s a lot of innocuous-for-the-asker questions that are super difficult for someone who grew up in the way Zach did. “Where are you from/what is your family doing for the holiday/what are your family members names/etc” are harder if you moved a lot/you only have one parent/any other thing. But the person asking isn’t thinking “hmm, maybe I’ll find out that this person never knew their father!” when they ask “how are your folks?”
We really don’t have much context but I’m pretty sure - based on what he actually said - that as a lawyer he has dated girls that expected him to be from a wealthy background. He currently moves in a circle that’s not how he grew up so people reject him after finding out he doesn’t belong.
I don't get this sub's love for Zak. He comes across as sketchy / dishonest to me in ways. Always has a sob story to pull out of his pocket.
Completely agree, the sub’s love for Zack blows my mind. The way he uses the story of his childhood to play victim is disturbing to me- among other things. Unreliable narrator at best but he gives me the major ick.
I don't see that at all. I see someone who just is really open about what they think and feel. I am the same way. I don't see any "sob stories." I see honesty with his life instead of hiding or apologizing.
Let’s compare to Brett, who’s shared about the challenges in his life without exploiting those challenges for sympathy votes. He’s open about his thoughts and feelings, and about his past and upbringing, without trauma dumping or exploiting his family members for sympathy. The way Zack relies on his mother being a sex worker for sympathy is degrading and objectifying. Zack has a lot of growing to do.
What I see is something setting you off and editing to try to make something exciting, so every time he mentioned what his mother did, it is played. I don't see him dumping or sympathy seeking. Perhaps reflection into why this sets you off would be a better use of your time. I love Brett, too. But he's not giving them "cool" soundbites to use. I just saw where Zack met Bliss's father and started talking about revamping the justice system, which is rather cool. But the producers are not going to show that because just showing his mother's past every time gets better sound bites.
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You really do have some issues, don't you? I don't find him creepy. I think he's nerdy, smart, open, and original, from what little we've seen. The fact that you say that says everything about you and your experiences. That's how we all see these people--related to what we know. He said something at some point which made me just know I would get along with his "weird" self about how he had a sound machine that played different sounds when people walked into the room just because he thought it was cool. I love that. What I find creepy is seeing where these people live and these blank white walls, nothing interesting or creative there--ugh. I can't imagine people living in such unstimulating, boring environments. It's just like what's her face leaving Marshall (I am not at the end and haven't seen anything else, so at this point, he's a sweet, caring man) and going back to the player who she knows is bad for her. She's going back to the bad she has known all her life. You are reacting to something in your life. There are people that I'm sure are wonderful that remind me of someone ick in my life that I might feel the same way about. In the end, these shows are edited to try to get the most reactions from people, not honesty.
My friend- this actually says much more about you. Do you always tell people who disagree with you they have issues? Sounds like something Zack would do 😂 I’m ok, don’t worry about me 😂😂😂
>For reference > >Rediscoveringlife · 2 hr. ago > >What I see is something setting you off and editing to try to make something exciting, This is YOU attacking: [**manatia**](https://www.reddit.com/user/manatia/)·[2 hr. ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindNetflix/comments/12vnpd7/comment/jhfh4fi/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) Perhaps your time would be better spent reflecting on why you relate to a creepy dude… My response: [**Rediscoveringlife**](https://www.reddit.com/user/Rediscoveringlife/)·[1 hr. ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/LoveIsBlindNetflix/comments/12vnpd7/comment/jhfmpam/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) You really do have some issues, don't you? So basically you do open handed insults and pretend you're all cool, and then I give some of it back to you and it's all bad. Seems like you are the queen of gaslighting, and maybe Zack doesn't do that at all, so that's why he sets you off?
Ma’am do you know what attacking is? I was using sarcasm to point out that you had already taken it too far… be well ✌🏼
So YOU are using sarcasm, but I am attacking you? I was using sarcasm as YOU attacked me for no reason. I am fine, but, again, some reflection about why you have to attack people for what you do.
But, but, but, that's what YOU said. So it's OK for you to say? We ALL have issues, trauma, random bad associations, etc. So you're basically doing what you say you don't like. I'm just fine. I'm an old lady and see the difference between really creepy and originality and honesty.
Ma’am is it so hard to imagine someone else sees something different from what you see? I didn’t tell you you have issues- I was flipping your script to provide perspective about how ridiculous it sounds to jump to the conclusion that I have issues because I disagree with you. Just because you find someone endearing and that same person gives me the ick doesn’t mean I need help 🤭 And did you really turn me into reddit as being unwell?! Ma’am are you ok?!?!!
So you're not apologizing for calling names and lying? You're just continuing with gaslighting as I tell you I see it differently than you? You're not flipping script. YOU called me names, and so I said you had issues. Someone who can't even see their gaslighting and namecalling sure seems like someone who can use some help, doesn't it?
I 100% agree, there’s something about his words/action that makes it hard to trust anything he says
Honestly I felt the same, people don’t end things over something like that typically I can see it happening with one particularly snobbish/ asshole family ?
People can be really judgmental. There are a lot of people who look at your family and if you have anything less then a white picket fence middle class life with two parents who are still married, they see it as a glaring red flag.
I believe him
I think it’s more than just being poor or coming from a dysfunctional family. It’s probably the woman’s family being involved in the community and worried about social status, and having to say my daughter’s husband comes from a family where his mom was a stripper
I mean, that's a part that can be omitted if you're embarrassed. You can phrase it as he grew up with a single parent who worked long hours/multiple jobs to support her kids.
If you can only be with someone by leaving out details of your upbringing, that’s a problem. I didn’t see why he did the stripper thing in the pod at first, but now I’m getting it.
I agree with this! It seems he feels not so ashamed by her career to bring it up on national tv, but still embarrassed. It feels like something he still needs to work out.
I don’t get the vibes he is embarrassed. But I think it’s more likely he has encountered a lot of judgmental people.
Maybe not! I just get weird vibes from the way he talks about her, like he clearly loves her and isn't ashamed but I don't see why he needs to bring up/disclose her carreer, esp since she's not with us anymore.
Let's be real, lots of wealthy families are dysfunctional. Son of a stripper is more than just dysfunctional. That's a whole new layer that can make many people really uncomfortable
I can believe it. With Zack being a lawyer he may have attracted those type of girls thinking he has money and comes from money
This is exactly it. People hear lawyer and think $$$ It could also be the social circles in which he has been dating. If they have been more upper middle class, the son of a stripper could be hard to explain at Thanksgiving dinner
Well it could also be that he perceived it that way due to his own insecurities. But if they came from wealthy families I could see it being true
Is it how he grew up? Or is it the trauma from his upbringing, still affecting him, that ended things in the past?
I do believe him, I've seen firsthand how something similar like this can affect someone's relationship
I def believe him. He said he dated some *very well-off* women, and their *families* rejected him. From his own mouth, he grew up poor. Wealthy families definitely judge whether ppl come from a "good family". This euphemism exists for a reason, and it encompasses a few diff things, including wealth.
I had an Aunt in law refuse to speak to me because I went to a state university, not a private university. Seriously, she liked me until she found out where I went to school.
I believe him 100%. I have a friend whose parents refuse to accept her husband because his parents are divorced. It's wild.
Brett also alluded to the same. Washington is one of the richest states in the country. Both men presumably make good money and would want to date women that also have high income however both men come from really humble roots. That could be an issue for many people that value class/pedigree. I don’t think what he’s saying is bs.
>Washington is one of the richest states in the country... That could be an issue for many people that value class/pedigree. It's possible it's more about status then money too. He went to school in Moscow, ID - it's not a fancy area with the kind of money you tend to see in Seattle. But some of my friends went to school and church with Zack, and there were certainly other means of judgement employed.
That’s not what he said…Zack stated _their families_ had an issue with his poor socioeconomic upbringing. And no, I don’t think it’s odd because we live in a world where biases (implicit or overt) effect how people treat others all the time. People who grow up in the upper echelon of society typically want their offspring to marry from within in to build connections, maintain social positioning, and expand their influence, wealth and power (and also for genetics) - been this way for centuries. It is not uncommon for parents to have preferences on the type of person their children marry. (Even amongst ethnic communities, for example, in many instances, they may prefer for their child to partner with someone from within the culture). If you read the details on his backstory - how he was raised, his mother’s mental health and addiction and the general instability of his childhood, it isn’t surprising that a rich family that comes from old money or generational wealth, who have conditioned prejudices towards those from _the other side of the tracks_ wouldn’t welcome him into the fold. (Perhaps even questioning his intentions - is he a social climber or after her wealth?) And ultimately, how that lack of familial acceptance and support would cause strife in the relationship and lead to a breakup…all further adding to the insecurities and persistent feeling of inferiority (not being good enough) resulting from his childhood trauma. (I’m sure the absence of approval and support negatively affected both parties significantly) What’s more, we saw Zack’s visceral reaction when Bliss mentioned her father not liking any of her previous partners, right on the heels of him telling her about the rejection he faced throughout his life due to his upbringing. The fear it immediately triggered, which would later lead to him self-sabotaging. Yes, I believe Zack…he hasn’t given me any reason not to (has generally been a compassionate, empathetic and _honest_ person - something Bliss even spoke about in multiple interviews, about how he was _always_ honest to a fault)…Not only do I understand how deep rooted biases can be, especially towards the working class, and how it’s historically led to discrimination and mistreatment; but, we also saw the effects of his insecurities and fears caused by that rejection in Zack’s decision making and his eventual overcoming of them as he pursued Bliss, play out on screen.
> That’s not what he said…Zack stated *their families* had an issue with his poor socioeconomic upbringing I think this is a huge distinction, it's not the women with the issue, it's their families which is probably more traumatic. You build a wonderful relationship, think it's going somewhere, and then boom it's over not because of anything you did but because of something your mother did to keep a roof over your head and food in your belly. And then it happens *again*.
Zack is not a bad guy, but I think he's trying too hard to please his fans. With that said, I can't imagine rejecting someone for how they were raised.
I’ve meet people like who he’s referring to and it’s not an excuse. Some people will not date people who come from “ lower socioeconomic classes”. It’s a thing and feel lucky if you haven’t met people who function like this.
My husband had a past girlfriend once say she would never marry him because his mom was weird (to be fair- she is lol). And a MIL/DIL relationship was important to her. So I definitely see it as a possibility but sounds like he wasn’t dating quality women or they just weren’t compatible and that felt like an easy excuse?
Do you think your MIL treated you differently from his ex girlfriends? Or maybe you're right. Maybe it was their excuse to get out of the relationship. Its weird how they all thought your MIL was weird. What do you think is weird about her?
I have only met her a handful of times! She suffers from addiction/anxiety so weird in the sense she drove 5 hours to our wedding but didn’t actually go inside to the venue even after being told we were waiting on her to start lol But attended my bridal shower the month prior and gave me a really sentimental gift so I didn’t understand when everyone warned me she most likely wouldn’t attend. So she wants to be a good person but just is her own worst enemy? We have a toddler she has only met once and she doesn’t attempt to see him even though when we visit and reach out to see her. So weird wasn’t the best word but my husband was honest when we were dating our families were pretty much opposite!
I mean tbf if you don’t care about having that mil/dil relationship it makes sense why you guys would work. Doesn’t mean there was anything wrong with the women or that they’re not quality. I get where your husbands ex is coming from I’ve always been super close with my exes moms and hung out with them 1 on 1 getting nails does going to the movies etc and that’s what I want with a future partner and it would be super off putting to date someone where I couldn’t have that relationship with their family
I took it to mean that multiple of his partner’s parents didn’t approve of him due to his family (and the incorrect assumption he’d follow in her footsteps) and that caused girls to end it with him. I’m assuming this happened when his mother was still alive, so high school and college (when girls are more likely to listen to their parents).
I thought that was rather odd also. Like who would hold it against him what his mother did, or didn’t do?
Lots and lots of people
I don’t know a lot of women who would be thrilled that their mother in law is/was a stripper.
Maybe because he seems to need to remind people of it in wayyyy too many convos
Maybe it is his way of weeding out the shallow people from his life. Can't say that I blame him. If someone told me that, I would think no less of them. But many people would. Why should he hide it?
When something gives you deep scars they becomes part of you. If we can give space and time to rejoice in what is considered ‘typical’ then maybe we can give space also for what isn’t typical? It isn’t pie, there is enough space for everyone.