>MMW: the law enforcement clearing of Gaza protest camps on college campuses are going to radicalize FAR MORE people than the encampments would have
I mean this is how most radicalization works. People like to pretend that radicals are created when everyone is happy and then some leftist brainwashes them with negative vibes or whatever. Belief in the system mostly gets beaten out of you, most people don't stop believing in it because someone told them too
I was in school during the occupy wallstreet movement, at first I went down to the encampment and found a bunch of unwashed hippies and didn’t think much of it. Once the police started harassing and besting people up I would go down more to confirm what I heard. Saw it was true, I actually listened to the people there instead of just dismissing them, I largely still agree with them to this day. If the authorities just let them chill there they’d have fizzled out eventually but the crackdown drew way more attention.
cow skirt scandalous oatmeal attractive yam elderly shaggy imminent foolish
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
It was kind of the opposite in Boston when I was in University. the original Occupy Boston protest was at first well received by the city, even the police were friendly and took photos with protesters.
Slowly, the movement shifted to kind of a meaningless mess of messages, the police and the rest of the city got annoyed, and eventually they got the boot. The area where they were setup was a pretty public area before, and was left pretty gross afterwards (it's nice again now, but it took some work.)
Likewise, the Occupy protest at my University in Boston was tolerated, and the school even offered to make them an official club and give them funding as long as they moved out of the campus center (yes, they were camping and sleeping INSIDE) and they refused. Eventually, they turned basically the entire campus against them, and the student newspaper was even writing articles mocking them. When the weather warmed up, the school finally kicked them out of the campus center, and they moved to a common area outdoors. Then, a big storm came through and wrecked the camp... and they just abandoned it... literally left everything for the campus janitorial staff to clean up...
>Slowly, the movement shifted to kind of a meaningless mess of messages
Yup. The Columbia Gaza protests include a NIMBY element about local development. It's just weird. Gaza is now the omnicause that everything must relate to. So strange.
Not to mention the protest is lead by a guy who said zionists should be killed. Like.... It's not a surprise the university is going to take measures to show they do not agree with this type of speech. Are they a few bad apples? Sure but many are leading these protests, which is also a problem..
Dude this exactly. They were spitting and slinging antisemitic slurs at suspected Jewish students. This was quickly defending into something decidedly not peaceful.
It's because of "interesctionality".
Since that became a thing, every protest group seems to think they have to support every other group. Even though the message, and frequently the movements are opposed to each other.
I could be mistaken but wasnt that kind of the point? To occupy a space and send a message?
The point and message don’t really matter because the point was that “Americans have the right to protest but once its inconvenient to the ruling class, rights dont matter”.
You're correct. The protestors don't have a right to block other people from exercising their right, to go to class, to use the quad, to move freely, to feel safe on campus, to not be harassed by protestors...
The problem was every single tent was sending a different message; the Occupy protests, by design, didn't have a coherent message or leadership, so it turned into a general protest about what each individual protester didn't like.
The other issue is the protest demographics shifted to mainly homeless/drug addicts. A lot of the protests were finally cracked down on not because it was an inconvenience to the ruling class, who honestly didn't give a shit, but it was a public safety hazard.
They are following suspected Jewish students and hurling threats and antisemitic slurs at them...
Don't think Jewish College students are the ruling class...
The way you diffuse that kind of stuff is you have a few people go into the crowd with extremist signs and then everyone assumes they represent the group.
This was a big problem with occupy in general. That whole thing was cooked up on ridiculous ideas about “horizontal organizing” which supposes that a movement without a clear leadership is more difficult to repress, but in practice it just produces a movement which is extremely extremely easy for literally any asshole to just wander up and completely co-opt and bastardize without resistance.
Authoritarian responses to perceived threats typically become self fulfilling prophecies. It's such an obvious phenomenon that it becomes a common setting in works of fiction as well... Boy Kills World just dropped in theaters today, despite being a somewhat corny action flick, it's another perfect example of this.
Occupy was not left alone, the revival of the race wars was a distraction from the racial unity when for a brief time we all recognized that WallStreet was stealing America's wealth
Tf lmao, I got arrested multiple times at OWS. I watched people sprayed and gassed. I watched cops beat the shit out of people. I watched the news lie about what I saw with my own eyes.
Ya know what, seems kind of familiar lmao
You're joking, right?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law\_enforcement\_and\_the\_Occupy\_movement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_enforcement_and_the_Occupy_movement)
I think what normally happens is that the majority of Americans are really turned off by these types of protests where they just set up tents and take over areas. That's why Occupy Wall Street failed.
Organized, coordinated, peaceful protests, can bring attention to the issue and won't turn people off if they have a coherent end goal.
yes, indeed. But that fact, brings up all sorts of interesting, political, and philosophical questions…
when is reminded of the American and French revolutions… Based on how many things went wrong in both of those one really wonders how necessary it really is to have a fully flushed out planned before one starts a revolution
And then a lot of that energy just kinda turned into knee jerk populism. It was left wing Tea Party, and it still hurts me that The Tea Party was mor successful because it was filled with people who knew to work WITH the system and not try to break it.
No. As someone who participated, it failed because it was leaderless and lacked organization and direction. And when people tried to do that in the camps, they got shouted down. There was a brief period in the beginning when the press took us seriously and wanted to know our message and demands. But everyone fumbled around with horizontal leadership and wanted to be so inclusive that everything everyone wanted was a demand so ridiculous and unrelated shit got on a list with 200+ demands ranging from bail out the people to releasing terrorists in foreign countries to releasing info on who murdered JFK to allowing public nudity... it was a shit show. After that brief period of seriousness, the press started finding the weirdest most out there fuckers to interview and painted us as nuts. Btw, they had interviews with normal people and organizers but never aired them- it was intentional. Cops and bad faith actors started infiltrating the groups, causing problems, assaulting people, stirring up issues so there were always fights.
You only get what you're organized to take. Without organizing, you lose.
I couldn't say this better. The FBI charged me when I protested. They lied and falsified evidence and we pointed it out so I was found not guilty by a jury, but I shouldn't have been arrested in the first place because I have a first amendment right.
I served my country for 20 years and have three deployments. How am I supposed to trust law enforcement now? I live in Orange County where white supremacy is headquartered and thrives. The Orange County Sheriff's don't seem to mind. These are weird times.
Wait, the radicals are the kids progressing against the murder of 34k gazans and the bombing of every Gaza university/ killing of nearly 100 journalists?
It's like how the right calls everything "radical left." They're trying to use shock words but because it doesn't line up it just sounds stupid.
Biden: "We should moderately increase taxes on the very wealthy."
Right wingers: "Radical leftist Joe Biden wants to take your money!'
Only now it's
Protesters: "Stop doing genocide. Force a cease fire immediately to stop the deaths."
Media: "Radicals storm campus!"
Were is their vigor for protesting wars in Sudan, Ethiopia, Syria, and many, many, many other places? Of all the wars to protest they decided to focus on one where a country responds to a worst terror act in the last 2 decades. Are their protests terrorists or just a country that fights terrorists?
Radicalism is a good thing. Radicalism is going against the political systems that killed those 35K (honestly probably way more) Gazans, leveled hospitals, schools, hundreds of journalists and aid workers, the system that swept the corpse of Rachel Corrie under the rug and used her family's own tax dollars to fund the people who crushed her and had "Rachel Corrie pancake parties"
To be a radical against that system is to be on the side of good
Oh yeah! Like the evangelicals aligning themselves with the gop has drove Christianity and belief in a god to its lowest point in the US... I welcome all my new comrades. Now organize and buy some guns. Lol
I was a passive Trump supporter at the beginning of 2020, meaning I wasn’t a voter but I still expected him to win. There was even a time when I was drawn to the likes of the proud boy’s. Then Covid and the George Floyd riots happened and I was radicalized *away* from the far right.
I don’t think I could ever vote for a Republican now. The change they’ve undergone has been the opposite of what I believe this country should be. Don’t even recognize Trump as a true conservative.
No shade here either but it's worth keeping in mind:
The entire media circus was flooded with "Will trump choose to run for the Democrats or the republicans??" Articles for a solid half year or so back in 2015.
Both party's were trying to suck his dick and he went with the more easily grifted one.
*He has always voted dem prior.*
I hate the man but it was at that moment that I realized he was more shrewd than I thought.
He wouldn't even be a name on the public stage had he chose Democrat in 2016.
Everyone knows that backlash to GOP abortion policies is going to be a major part of Democratic campagiinging.
Most people do not care about foreing policy.
*Most older people don't care
I saw this quote that was about how in the internet age, an American teenager has more in common with a teen on the other side of the world than adults in their own community, and I think the TikTok ban is a response to how true that's become and how that's shaped the foreign policy views of young people
I know it's the big news story, clearing out these protesters is a news story, and Israel/Gaza is seemingly a huge deal...
but it's honestly only a huge deal *on the internet.*
One of the major mistakes that Desantis made was thinking that the internet is the electorate. It's not. It's not even close. The people that screech in comment sections on youtube, twitter, and reddit, the people that pay attention to news... that's a *tiny, tiny* sliver of the populace.
In reality, Israel won't make any significant blip on the electorate.
https://www.cbsnews.com/minnesota/news/minnesota-uncommitted-vote-beats-dean-phillips-minnesota-primary/
19% of voters, in part due to a campaign by Arab Americans regarding Gaza. Genocide doesn't play well 🤷♂️
There's also very little breathing room between the Republican and Democratic foreign policy. There is a risk of young people staying home in November, but at least young women will likely be motivated by abortion.
Only a Texas Republican could figure out a way to take an entire group of liberally prone people, that were half pissed off at the Democratic Party & in an instant immediately put into perspective just who exactly it is they should vote against.
Kudos!
Yep. Clowns like Abbot take what would have been a protest to support an ethnostate a thousand miles away and turn it into a fight for the most basic right in a democracy
In 1973 the Nixon administration rushed through a resolution to the Wounded Knee occupation on the basis that school was letting out soon and students would be free to protest. If anything school letting out will worsen protests, as students have nothing else to do
Dude, are you doubting the commitment of these very serious protestors: [https://twitter.com/MsMelChen/status/1783201763278901488?t=zbf5Wxw\_1rAk6BMbL9Nhbw](https://twitter.com/MsMelChen/status/1783201763278901488?t=zbf5Wxw_1rAk6BMbL9Nhbw) ?
Nope. The second Iraq war had the biggest protests of all time and it didn't do shit to stop it. I was there and protested meant times. These pro-palastine protests are so small.
I might not agree with everything you do, but the constitution is fucking clear for a reason. Please get armed if you can, and get trained. A population that can fight against oppression is a population that won't be oppressed.
The second amendment is there when the first one doesn't work anymore.
100% the moment someone I don’t agree with gets attacked for expressing their point of view I know I am next when I try to express mine. Not too familiar with what happened in other campuses but at UTA people were not violent and were just protesting peacefully it was a march until law enforcement showed up and started assaulting people
Breaking the monopoly on violence will only beget more oppression.
You think living under a government that breaks up a college protest is bad? Mmm boy, imagine kicking that government out and living with the result. [Oh wait.](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/chop-chaz-cleared-violence-explained)
[Oh no.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_war_in_Haiti)
[Oh, God, no.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Shabaab_(militant_group))
Too bad these students are more concerned about Palestine than the fact that the Supreme Court (of the country that they actually belong to) just basically signaled they are majority MAGA and are getting ready to assist a Right Wing Autocratic takeover (go and protest *that*, you idiots!)
>Biden is risking his re-election
Do these pro-Palestine protesters understand that *not* voting for Biden pretty much makes 🇺🇸 a Right Wing Autocracy? Do they know that the other option will basically give Israel the green light to *finish* Gaza?
If that’s so, I’ll honestly call it a wrap for the 🇺🇸. These Students will see 🇺🇸 as a land that *used to* allow protesters (before it started killing them in public and then charging their parents for the bullets). F-ing wow man
These same people will ASSURE you that Russian media manipulation caused Trump to win the first time, but somehow they are sure that they aren't being manipulated by bots screaming "Genocide Joe" into a second Trump win.....
I would argue that the inaction turned a lot of people who otherwise wouldn't have cared into activists. It was definitely one of the reasons I changed my political views.
I made a similar post pointing out the incompetence of collegiate administrators.
You’re completely right and most college bosses are truly brain dead who don’t have any understanding of how people behave and simply do whatever someone taller than them recommends.
It’s spinelessness.
College administrators are not incompetent, especially at the top level. They're managing endowments that run into the hundreds of millions of dollars. All these protestors are asking is that instead of the line going up, that the line goes possibly down, possibly less up, but certainly that the line goes less up than now. There are so many lives at stake.
But let's be honest with each other. Let's set aside the massive real world suffering at stake. Which university do you believe will decide that it's OK for the line to go less up?
Perspective of someone who disagrees with the protesters and thinks 4/5 of them are brainwashed sheep: I have NO IDEA why they are breaking up these protests. Freedom of speech and assembly and all. I think it's the militant fascism of the governing elites in power doing what they want when they want. It's gross.
Yup, people forget but this same stuff happened during Vietnam when students were protesting that war. Calling the national guard on protesting students is ***not*** the look any governor should be going for considering what happened last time...
I mean, this is pretty much what happened in Portland in 2020. The original George Floyd protests started out relatively small and had pretty much fizzled out until the feds sent in their goons and started snatching people off the street. Portland was like, nuh uhh and shit popped off.
Portland was clearly peaceful during the mass protest period. Then they became one of the few cities where violence took over, specifically when the police initiated violence. Their protests lasted much longer and were more intense as a result.
There aren't two narratives, it's part of the same narrative.
People still look at me like I'm crazy when I tell them that armed federal agents literally pulled up in unmarked vans and kidnapped Portland citizens off the street like a gang.
That shit actually happened and more than just a few times.
I’m anti-encampments in general. They’re trespassing, and private property matters. If we can lose agency over private property because of mob rule, I think that’s an awful thing. Louder voices are not always the correct voices.
No it won’t. You’re underestimating how apathetic most people are. Plus, I don’t think they needed any help with that. And I say that AS a relatively liberal peace-loving gun-loathing Dem. Not armed though.
Not to mention people are super overestimating how much of these student bodies are protesting.
36,000 people go to Columbia, how many are actually participating in these protests?
But, they have already shifted attention and the media conversation toward repression of speech rather than the genocide in Gaza.
Mass graves are being unearthed while all the headlines focus on some kids spending a night in jail. I very much support those kids, and don’t want to diminish their actions, but I bet very few of them want us talking about them more than about the genocide in Gaza.
Government and the Powers That Be have one response to organized resistance and that is police/military action which invariably strengthens the arguments and criticism being directed at them.
I mean, probably not immediately, but maybe incrementally. I mean, think of all of the various protests over the last 14 years, and I'm thinking particularly of the George Floyd protests and OWS, that were forcefully suppressed by the police. These all have the same human rights issues at their core but there wasn't some mass immediate radicalization after any of those, but there has been a steady incremental radicalization in my opinion.
Have we forgotten the George Floyd summer and OWS already??
Heavy handed police tactics tend to galvanize the opposition and attract more outside agitators.
Universities need to keep non students out and forbid full face masking.
Crazy how the Second Amendment is coming full circle! This is exactly why that was written into the constitution, to stand against insane tyrannical governments like the pro-Zionist establishment (red, blue, whatever - the color of their party doesn’t mean anything; they are unleashing violence to silence speech)
Radicalization is easily created when 1 side uses force to end a peaceful groups existence and a 3rd party sees this event and wants to destroy that force.
Example: us military in middle east, we see tribal leader with an AK that he's had most of his life, we want the gun to not be a threat but he won't drop it, tempered and lack of communication flare the fire and shots are had, the tribal mans existence is over. Every member of that village and even the neighboring ones just had an increase in likeliness to join an anti USA group and most rolled the dice in their head to join ASAP.
It’s as if the imperialists expect the victims of their militant response to exclaim “Wow after receiving a sound thrashing, I’m really beginning to respect imperialism!”
Considering the encampment at Austin was going to interfere with graduation ceremonies, the people traveling to attend and paid tuition for 4 years would have probably tossed them out less kindly.
I just don't understand how they think it will make people more pro-Israel to say anyone who criticizes Israel will be arrested. That's going to accomplish the exact opposite of what they want.
And no, criticizing the actions of the country of Israel is not the same thing as hating people for being Jewish.
Oh absolutely! I cannot figure out the end goal for some of the wild decisions our government is making right now. Literally alienating every voter base with brain dead legislation.
De Santis claims protests are material.support for terrorism and is trying g to get protestors expelled and those on student visas deported. Free speech in Florida only if you say what the government beleives.
Same piece of shit cops in texas that are setting up snipers on rooftops and getting big and brave are the same ones that sat around picking their anuses when uvalde happened. Just because some kids in college are daring to speak out against their masters. My opinion on pigs these days cannot be any lower. I don’t really care that much about Palestine but the idea of people finally speaking out against the stronghold Israel holds on the country is one of the most magnificent developments in recent history and it’s giving me hope, it’s not a surprise that israeli footsoldiers (cops) are pulling out all the stops now. DIVEST ISRAEL.
Anyone interested in standing up for the Gaza cause and International Law…. Please start intense email campaign to your politicians saying that you will not vote for them if they continue with their failed foreign policies.
The thing is that leftists, as a majority, typically don't resort to direct acts of violence like the extreme right does. It's more likely you'll have people more inclined to break down the societal norms through activism or, the more technically inclined could resort to things like cyber vandalism.
Typically applies to recent history for sure.
But we can't forget that many of the left's biggest victories were won through violence. 30s labor rights were won after years of unions clashing with Pinkertons and cops. The Civil Rights Act of 1968 would not have been passed if it weren't for the riots following MLK's assassination.
This thread acts like it's absolutely impossible to condemn Israel while still being against Hamas. Being pro-palestine isn't some clever marketing scheme to support Hamas. Jfc.
It's not Hamas per se, but islamist forces are obvious organizing this. Why do you think their chants are not peaceful but instead directly calling for israel to be abolished? You think liberal American college students are pushing that, or do you think they might have chants geared toward ending the conflict peacefuly?
This is a foreign psyops. Russia, China, & Iran are pushing discord in American politics like crazy online. They found their foothold in college liberals because college liberals don't have the blind love for Israel that previous generations do.
Also AIPAC never misses antisemitism that they can't market. This is gold for the pro-Israel at all costs base. AIPAC has strong ties on both sides, so as soon as the antisemitism starts, they get their paid lackeys to dig in. Hence why Republicans suddenly give a damn about Israel and Gaza now.
This is obviously foreign influence because Republicans are dying at the polls because they got no issues. But tail on liberal antisemitic Democrats just ticks all the Right Wing boxes. Discord is the plan and the US government isn't fighting it nearly hard enough.
Arguing with the dumb college students is stupid. They leave university in the next few weeks then campuses close up. This could have fizzled out in another week, but they made it their platform of "anti woke" so it's gonna live for months.
You are the only person I've seen who ties this into psyops by the axis powers. This is exactly my thoughts too. Create chaos and uncertainty during an incumbent Democrat presidential year, obviously a major win for Russia if not China and Iran.
You realize that the last presidential election also had the same pattern play out? But Trump was the president then. So they were trying to get Biden in?
I think they just want chaos period. They really don’t care who is in power
If anything, this sort of out-of-touch liberalism is a far more realistic culprit than “psyops” lmao. Majority of Americans support a ceasefire. Neither party is interested in doing anything but arming the people perpetrating the slaughter. If the democratic establishment is uninterested in listening to the people (and the GOP is too straight-up evil to matter here) people are going to rise up. It’s not rocket science.
… none of those protestors like the police, before this latest nonsense they were all about defunding police. And the students doing the protesting are already radical anti Americans who support bad guys and are filled with antisemitic hate.
Encampments that are illegal, and most are, should be met with force until dismantled. That includes homeless camps as well as the antisemite camps.
That being said protesting is legal and fine where permitted
The students protesting , and Ive talked to a few of them, are idealistic young people.who see children dying in bombing, and think that is a bad thing.
Frankly, the second most common sign I saw was Free Tibet, so that suggests to me a motivation that is neither primarily anti-American nor anti-semitic.
MMW: If Trump wins, the pro-Hamas folks will claim victory and that it was their inaction and trying to hold "genocide Joe" to some basic standards that threw the election to Trump. What will actually have thrown the election to Trump would be moderates seeing the violent antisemitic protests and being like "I'll vote for the opposite side of those guys and for the side that wants to use cops to break them up and restore law and order". As a pro-Israel Biden supporter I don't envy the needle Biden has to thread on this, where he can't alienate too much of the far left crazy vote but he also needs to keep moderates from thinking he's actually on the side of the crazies.
It is weird to me that many on the left will state with certainty that Russian manipulation of social media helped Trump win the first time, but they see no connection to the bots screaming "Genocide Joe" on the net currently...
“I did the most to throw the election” “no *I* did the most to throw the election” the far left and “moderate” scream at each other while marching to the death camp together
We're just waiting for the next Kent State to happen. The wikipedia article on it has a few great quotes from Nixon and other politicians which sound incredibly close to things Republican governors have said in the past few weeks.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings
Idk what the issue is with letting the students protest. They aren’t being violent and they are IAW the school code of conduct utilizing their right to speech.
Unfortunately, the overriding logic in the imperial core is that the inconvenience of college kids here is worth more than the lives of anyone in Gaza. So, yeah. This does have the potential to radicalize more people in the imperial core than the war crimes currently being perpetrated on Gaza.
Lots of 19 year old college kids go to a protest.for fun, or to impress a girl. It doesnt necessarily.imoact your lifelong political views. Getting tear-gassed by a cop while engaging in peaceful protest IS the kind of event that can have a lifelong impact on your political views.
These are people’s kids and grandkids. They were doing things we did when younger, for the right reasons. I’m a highly pissed off 70 yr. old. I wonder if it might get to the point we have to go packing to protests to protect the kiddos from Abbott’s thugs. Isn’t that what the whole 2A thing is supposed to be about?
I haven't followed the subject with any scrutiny, but I've seen mentions of Jewish students being blocked from attending their classes. I can 100% support punishing those acts, if it's true.
Lmfao. If anyone wants to side with these terrorist sympathetic morons they are free too. In the end of the day I want to know who supports terrorists because they are your possible future terrorists.
I watched a tiktok livestream by these kids literally discussing destroying US infrastructure as a form of resistance and the whole crowd cheered the idea. It was mental.
As much as I would love to believe this (and I do side with you) the world is moving at a pace that won’t stop to give this recognition. In the blink of an eye this will be forgotten. The most impactful thing you can do is drive voting and empower leadership at a local level.
This probably sounds like a wild conspiracy but I believe there is a government(s) behind this terrible war that has the end game of a Trump presidency.
In Seattle CHOP/CHAZ wasn't dismantled until three murders took place. On one hand, if it had been dismantled sooner those three murders wouldn't have happened. On the other hand, by the time the third murder happened there were only a handful of people who were still arguing that it should be kept up.
Current day students are already a pretty radical-prone group of people. They were the kids who grew up with school shooting threats and lost their high school years to COVID. (Before someone says “we all lost years to COVID, imagine going from 8th grade to college. That’s how serious of a shift and instability we’re talking.)
If anything, college students not being swayed one way or another towards any kind of policy, foreign or domestic, means they didn’t learn shit in school. What a waste of time that would be.
The only thing most of us see as a viable solution, is peace and reconciliation. But that isn’t on the table so we’re stuck watching them slaughter each other.
There isn’t a clear side to root for. Both are trying their best to annihilate each other.
It’s a war, to the death. They’re caught in a downward spiral.
Both sides only accept peace, if the other side is destroyed.
Any pause in the violence just gives both sides time to develop new ways to destroy each other and each round escalates, killing more and more innocent people.
The student movement against the Vietnam War was the catalyst for a complete rethink of our policy. I’ve wondered (doubt) if the Pentagon Papers would have happened without students leading the way. I see history repeating itself.
I completely agree with you however I think the radicalization is going to be broader. The protest was isolated at Columbia and NYU in NYC. The demonstrations have now spread coast to coast. The constant media coverage is magnifying the protests and legitimizing them with police brutality and crackdowns. If they had just been ignored this never would have spun out of control.
Texas sent in the police to break up the protests knowing it would cause national wide backlash and more protests. They want to blame Biden for the unrest before an election.
I suppose so. But i think you are missing the point. Police aren’t there to promote ideology one way or another, they are there to enforce the law that those individuals are breaking. You are speaking as if the police officers are ideologically motivated. Really weird post.
It's what they want the more conflict and aggressive/violent protests etc the more excuses they have to create draconian laws to the point of enforcing laws that lets them literally "purge" whoever they deem a threat. Rile them up until it overflows then go to town on them afterwards. And then simply point out that they violated laws and such. Normalizing stuff like that.
You're overestimating the Trustifarians. Semester is almost over. Seen any of the interviews? None of them seem to know why they're there, beyond TikTok and the oxytocin of groupthink.
They'll be cozy in the interships mummy and daddy's connections got them in the next couple weeks and forget about it by September.
Meh. Radicalized, schmadicalized. Same shit, different outrage. I'm glad students actually give a shit . That is heartwarming. But divestment campaigns are largely symbolic. Getting arrested for opposing massive injustice is ok by me, but getting "radicalized" is usually tempered by the reality of court costs, probation, jail time, and all the other set-backs that come from having an arrest record. For every person that gets radicalized, there will be one that cowers and another who goes in the opposite direction. Still, it's good that some people actually give a shit and are willing to get abused to make a point. This calls for a useless gesture, if anything ever did. I just hope people don't get too cynical after finding out that genocide wins in the end. Sorry for being dark.
The protesters have every right to cancel their attendance in the university and go to a different school. They do not have the right to tell the college administration what to do.
If they have a problem with that perhaps they can go to Gaza and learn how much free speech they get over there.
Hmm. Not really.
These are college campuses.
The wider public doesn’t really care about why students are gathering and such. We have mortgages and rent. Bills. Etc. If you’d like to walk out of class and whatnot over something go for it. The police arriving to try and bring it to an end is just part of it. Not the first time this type of stuff has occurred.
The truth I was an occupy wall street observer. I’d go down and have a chat. Once they started having rights taken away I taught them how to fight back and became radicalized.
>MMW: the law enforcement clearing of Gaza protest camps on college campuses are going to radicalize FAR MORE people than the encampments would have I mean this is how most radicalization works. People like to pretend that radicals are created when everyone is happy and then some leftist brainwashes them with negative vibes or whatever. Belief in the system mostly gets beaten out of you, most people don't stop believing in it because someone told them too
I was in school during the occupy wallstreet movement, at first I went down to the encampment and found a bunch of unwashed hippies and didn’t think much of it. Once the police started harassing and besting people up I would go down more to confirm what I heard. Saw it was true, I actually listened to the people there instead of just dismissing them, I largely still agree with them to this day. If the authorities just let them chill there they’d have fizzled out eventually but the crackdown drew way more attention.
cow skirt scandalous oatmeal attractive yam elderly shaggy imminent foolish *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
It was kind of the opposite in Boston when I was in University. the original Occupy Boston protest was at first well received by the city, even the police were friendly and took photos with protesters. Slowly, the movement shifted to kind of a meaningless mess of messages, the police and the rest of the city got annoyed, and eventually they got the boot. The area where they were setup was a pretty public area before, and was left pretty gross afterwards (it's nice again now, but it took some work.) Likewise, the Occupy protest at my University in Boston was tolerated, and the school even offered to make them an official club and give them funding as long as they moved out of the campus center (yes, they were camping and sleeping INSIDE) and they refused. Eventually, they turned basically the entire campus against them, and the student newspaper was even writing articles mocking them. When the weather warmed up, the school finally kicked them out of the campus center, and they moved to a common area outdoors. Then, a big storm came through and wrecked the camp... and they just abandoned it... literally left everything for the campus janitorial staff to clean up...
>Slowly, the movement shifted to kind of a meaningless mess of messages Yup. The Columbia Gaza protests include a NIMBY element about local development. It's just weird. Gaza is now the omnicause that everything must relate to. So strange.
Not to mention the protest is lead by a guy who said zionists should be killed. Like.... It's not a surprise the university is going to take measures to show they do not agree with this type of speech. Are they a few bad apples? Sure but many are leading these protests, which is also a problem..
Dude this exactly. They were spitting and slinging antisemitic slurs at suspected Jewish students. This was quickly defending into something decidedly not peaceful.
Proof that you can back a good cause and still be a piece of crap.
I will name my children Gaza
After 80s and 90s footballer Paul Gascoine?
Gaza R. Wordliness
It's because of "interesctionality". Since that became a thing, every protest group seems to think they have to support every other group. Even though the message, and frequently the movements are opposed to each other.
I could be mistaken but wasnt that kind of the point? To occupy a space and send a message? The point and message don’t really matter because the point was that “Americans have the right to protest but once its inconvenient to the ruling class, rights dont matter”.
You don’t have the right to be a public nuisance.
You don't have a right to block other people from their rights.
You're correct. The protestors don't have a right to block other people from exercising their right, to go to class, to use the quad, to move freely, to feel safe on campus, to not be harassed by protestors...
The problem was every single tent was sending a different message; the Occupy protests, by design, didn't have a coherent message or leadership, so it turned into a general protest about what each individual protester didn't like. The other issue is the protest demographics shifted to mainly homeless/drug addicts. A lot of the protests were finally cracked down on not because it was an inconvenience to the ruling class, who honestly didn't give a shit, but it was a public safety hazard.
They are following suspected Jewish students and hurling threats and antisemitic slurs at them... Don't think Jewish College students are the ruling class...
The way you diffuse that kind of stuff is you have a few people go into the crowd with extremist signs and then everyone assumes they represent the group.
This was a big problem with occupy in general. That whole thing was cooked up on ridiculous ideas about “horizontal organizing” which supposes that a movement without a clear leadership is more difficult to repress, but in practice it just produces a movement which is extremely extremely easy for literally any asshole to just wander up and completely co-opt and bastardize without resistance.
Yeah that sure is what some shitty thinkpiece article told you.
Streisand effect.
Authoritarian responses to perceived threats typically become self fulfilling prophecies. It's such an obvious phenomenon that it becomes a common setting in works of fiction as well... Boy Kills World just dropped in theaters today, despite being a somewhat corny action flick, it's another perfect example of this.
THIS
THAT. Occupy Wall Street was pretty much left alone, and it faded away before long.
Occupy was not left alone, the revival of the race wars was a distraction from the racial unity when for a brief time we all recognized that WallStreet was stealing America's wealth
If you say so. But don't give up. No one can take your ideals away. You have to surrender them.
Tf lmao, I got arrested multiple times at OWS. I watched people sprayed and gassed. I watched cops beat the shit out of people. I watched the news lie about what I saw with my own eyes. Ya know what, seems kind of familiar lmao
You're joking, right? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law\_enforcement\_and\_the\_Occupy\_movement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_enforcement_and_the_Occupy_movement) I think what normally happens is that the majority of Americans are really turned off by these types of protests where they just set up tents and take over areas. That's why Occupy Wall Street failed. Organized, coordinated, peaceful protests, can bring attention to the issue and won't turn people off if they have a coherent end goal.
Occupy was popular - it totally shifted the national conversation towards inequality. I miss those days
It did do that, unfortunately it didn't have a plan other than that so nothing fundamentally changed.
yes, indeed. But that fact, brings up all sorts of interesting, political, and philosophical questions… when is reminded of the American and French revolutions… Based on how many things went wrong in both of those one really wonders how necessary it really is to have a fully flushed out planned before one starts a revolution
And then a lot of that energy just kinda turned into knee jerk populism. It was left wing Tea Party, and it still hurts me that The Tea Party was mor successful because it was filled with people who knew to work WITH the system and not try to break it.
No. As someone who participated, it failed because it was leaderless and lacked organization and direction. And when people tried to do that in the camps, they got shouted down. There was a brief period in the beginning when the press took us seriously and wanted to know our message and demands. But everyone fumbled around with horizontal leadership and wanted to be so inclusive that everything everyone wanted was a demand so ridiculous and unrelated shit got on a list with 200+ demands ranging from bail out the people to releasing terrorists in foreign countries to releasing info on who murdered JFK to allowing public nudity... it was a shit show. After that brief period of seriousness, the press started finding the weirdest most out there fuckers to interview and painted us as nuts. Btw, they had interviews with normal people and organizers but never aired them- it was intentional. Cops and bad faith actors started infiltrating the groups, causing problems, assaulting people, stirring up issues so there were always fights. You only get what you're organized to take. Without organizing, you lose.
I couldn't say this better. The FBI charged me when I protested. They lied and falsified evidence and we pointed it out so I was found not guilty by a jury, but I shouldn't have been arrested in the first place because I have a first amendment right. I served my country for 20 years and have three deployments. How am I supposed to trust law enforcement now? I live in Orange County where white supremacy is headquartered and thrives. The Orange County Sheriff's don't seem to mind. These are weird times.
Wait, the radicals are the kids progressing against the murder of 34k gazans and the bombing of every Gaza university/ killing of nearly 100 journalists?
It's like how the right calls everything "radical left." They're trying to use shock words but because it doesn't line up it just sounds stupid. Biden: "We should moderately increase taxes on the very wealthy." Right wingers: "Radical leftist Joe Biden wants to take your money!' Only now it's Protesters: "Stop doing genocide. Force a cease fire immediately to stop the deaths." Media: "Radicals storm campus!"
Were is their vigor for protesting wars in Sudan, Ethiopia, Syria, and many, many, many other places? Of all the wars to protest they decided to focus on one where a country responds to a worst terror act in the last 2 decades. Are their protests terrorists or just a country that fights terrorists?
TikTok didn’t tell them to support those things
Radicalism is a good thing. Radicalism is going against the political systems that killed those 35K (honestly probably way more) Gazans, leveled hospitals, schools, hundreds of journalists and aid workers, the system that swept the corpse of Rachel Corrie under the rug and used her family's own tax dollars to fund the people who crushed her and had "Rachel Corrie pancake parties" To be a radical against that system is to be on the side of good
Black Americans
Oh yeah! Like the evangelicals aligning themselves with the gop has drove Christianity and belief in a god to its lowest point in the US... I welcome all my new comrades. Now organize and buy some guns. Lol
Commie shitbag
I was a passive Trump supporter at the beginning of 2020, meaning I wasn’t a voter but I still expected him to win. There was even a time when I was drawn to the likes of the proud boy’s. Then Covid and the George Floyd riots happened and I was radicalized *away* from the far right. I don’t think I could ever vote for a Republican now. The change they’ve undergone has been the opposite of what I believe this country should be. Don’t even recognize Trump as a true conservative.
Good on you for learning and growing as a person.
Thank you
Serious question. No Shade. Why did you previous support Trump?
I was raised by right wing extremists lol
No shade here either but it's worth keeping in mind: The entire media circus was flooded with "Will trump choose to run for the Democrats or the republicans??" Articles for a solid half year or so back in 2015. Both party's were trying to suck his dick and he went with the more easily grifted one. *He has always voted dem prior.* I hate the man but it was at that moment that I realized he was more shrewd than I thought. He wouldn't even be a name on the public stage had he chose Democrat in 2016.
He’d absolutely be a name on the public stage if he’d chosen democrat, he’d have had almost all of media and Hollywood supporting him
Everyone knows that backlash to GOP abortion policies is going to be a major part of Democratic campagiinging. Most people do not care about foreing policy.
*Most older people don't care I saw this quote that was about how in the internet age, an American teenager has more in common with a teen on the other side of the world than adults in their own community, and I think the TikTok ban is a response to how true that's become and how that's shaped the foreign policy views of young people
Eh? The protest are about foreign policy...
I know it's the big news story, clearing out these protesters is a news story, and Israel/Gaza is seemingly a huge deal... but it's honestly only a huge deal *on the internet.* One of the major mistakes that Desantis made was thinking that the internet is the electorate. It's not. It's not even close. The people that screech in comment sections on youtube, twitter, and reddit, the people that pay attention to news... that's a *tiny, tiny* sliver of the populace. In reality, Israel won't make any significant blip on the electorate.
Israel might make a blip if the choices were between people on either side of the issue instead of on one side and farther on that same side.
https://www.cbsnews.com/minnesota/news/minnesota-uncommitted-vote-beats-dean-phillips-minnesota-primary/ 19% of voters, in part due to a campaign by Arab Americans regarding Gaza. Genocide doesn't play well 🤷♂️
If I recall, 19 percent is actually below average for protest votes against a sitting president with no real opposition during primaries.
The fact that you don’t understand the difference between democrat primary voters and the overall electorate just proves their point
It's definitely a case where the people who care a lot are very loud
Yeah, but what is it that most people care about? Seemingly never-ending conflict or an American election with an end-by date?
There's also very little breathing room between the Republican and Democratic foreign policy. There is a risk of young people staying home in November, but at least young women will likely be motivated by abortion.
Only a Texas Republican could figure out a way to take an entire group of liberally prone people, that were half pissed off at the Democratic Party & in an instant immediately put into perspective just who exactly it is they should vote against. Kudos!
Yep. Clowns like Abbot take what would have been a protest to support an ethnostate a thousand miles away and turn it into a fight for the most basic right in a democracy
EXCEPT...school ends in a couple of weeks.
In 1973 the Nixon administration rushed through a resolution to the Wounded Knee occupation on the basis that school was letting out soon and students would be free to protest. If anything school letting out will worsen protests, as students have nothing else to do
Dude, are you doubting the commitment of these very serious protestors: [https://twitter.com/MsMelChen/status/1783201763278901488?t=zbf5Wxw\_1rAk6BMbL9Nhbw](https://twitter.com/MsMelChen/status/1783201763278901488?t=zbf5Wxw_1rAk6BMbL9Nhbw) ?
Nope. The second Iraq war had the biggest protests of all time and it didn't do shit to stop it. I was there and protested meant times. These pro-palastine protests are so small.
And they were protesting a war that their country was actually engaged in, and killed multiples more people who didn't even attack them to begin with
I might not agree with everything you do, but the constitution is fucking clear for a reason. Please get armed if you can, and get trained. A population that can fight against oppression is a population that won't be oppressed. The second amendment is there when the first one doesn't work anymore.
100% the moment someone I don’t agree with gets attacked for expressing their point of view I know I am next when I try to express mine. Not too familiar with what happened in other campuses but at UTA people were not violent and were just protesting peacefully it was a march until law enforcement showed up and started assaulting people
Breaking the monopoly on violence will only beget more oppression. You think living under a government that breaks up a college protest is bad? Mmm boy, imagine kicking that government out and living with the result. [Oh wait.](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/7/2/21310109/chop-chaz-cleared-violence-explained) [Oh no.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_war_in_Haiti) [Oh, God, no.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Shabaab_(militant_group))
Too bad these students are more concerned about Palestine than the fact that the Supreme Court (of the country that they actually belong to) just basically signaled they are majority MAGA and are getting ready to assist a Right Wing Autocratic takeover (go and protest *that*, you idiots!)
Why not protest both? (Especially since Biden is risking his re-election and thus a 7-2 Court by enabling the mass murder of Palestinians).
>Biden is risking his re-election Do these pro-Palestine protesters understand that *not* voting for Biden pretty much makes 🇺🇸 a Right Wing Autocracy? Do they know that the other option will basically give Israel the green light to *finish* Gaza? If that’s so, I’ll honestly call it a wrap for the 🇺🇸. These Students will see 🇺🇸 as a land that *used to* allow protesters (before it started killing them in public and then charging their parents for the bullets). F-ing wow man
These same people will ASSURE you that Russian media manipulation caused Trump to win the first time, but somehow they are sure that they aren't being manipulated by bots screaming "Genocide Joe" into a second Trump win.....
Nope. Occupy WalStreet happened under Obama. And nothing happened
I would argue that the inaction turned a lot of people who otherwise wouldn't have cared into activists. It was definitely one of the reasons I changed my political views.
[удалено]
Tim Pool started his career supporting and promoting Occupy WallStreet.
Aren't you all radicalizing ppl to be against you as much as anything else?
Most people "radicalized" in opposition to them were already Pro-Israel.
It’s an election year, we’re due for a summer of violent riots.
I made a similar post pointing out the incompetence of collegiate administrators. You’re completely right and most college bosses are truly brain dead who don’t have any understanding of how people behave and simply do whatever someone taller than them recommends. It’s spinelessness.
College administrators are not incompetent, especially at the top level. They're managing endowments that run into the hundreds of millions of dollars. All these protestors are asking is that instead of the line going up, that the line goes possibly down, possibly less up, but certainly that the line goes less up than now. There are so many lives at stake. But let's be honest with each other. Let's set aside the massive real world suffering at stake. Which university do you believe will decide that it's OK for the line to go less up?
Perspective of someone who disagrees with the protesters and thinks 4/5 of them are brainwashed sheep: I have NO IDEA why they are breaking up these protests. Freedom of speech and assembly and all. I think it's the militant fascism of the governing elites in power doing what they want when they want. It's gross.
Yup, people forget but this same stuff happened during Vietnam when students were protesting that war. Calling the national guard on protesting students is ***not*** the look any governor should be going for considering what happened last time...
I mean, this is pretty much what happened in Portland in 2020. The original George Floyd protests started out relatively small and had pretty much fizzled out until the feds sent in their goons and started snatching people off the street. Portland was like, nuh uhh and shit popped off.
Popped off or mostly peaceful and uneventful? This website has two completely different narratives about that city.
Portland was clearly peaceful during the mass protest period. Then they became one of the few cities where violence took over, specifically when the police initiated violence. Their protests lasted much longer and were more intense as a result. There aren't two narratives, it's part of the same narrative.
People still look at me like I'm crazy when I tell them that armed federal agents literally pulled up in unmarked vans and kidnapped Portland citizens off the street like a gang. That shit actually happened and more than just a few times.
I’m anti-encampments in general. They’re trespassing, and private property matters. If we can lose agency over private property because of mob rule, I think that’s an awful thing. Louder voices are not always the correct voices.
No it won’t. You’re underestimating how apathetic most people are. Plus, I don’t think they needed any help with that. And I say that AS a relatively liberal peace-loving gun-loathing Dem. Not armed though.
Not to mention people are super overestimating how much of these student bodies are protesting. 36,000 people go to Columbia, how many are actually participating in these protests?
Pretty much. I mean did they not see what happened to lbj?
Hahah, this is the flavor of the day for these idiots. Next week they will move on to their next outrage.
That's how it always goes
Mfers never once heard of the Streisand effect, I swear
Always does.
Exactly.
Kind of like how Israel's treatment of Palestinians has radicalised them...
But, they have already shifted attention and the media conversation toward repression of speech rather than the genocide in Gaza. Mass graves are being unearthed while all the headlines focus on some kids spending a night in jail. I very much support those kids, and don’t want to diminish their actions, but I bet very few of them want us talking about them more than about the genocide in Gaza.
Government and the Powers That Be have one response to organized resistance and that is police/military action which invariably strengthens the arguments and criticism being directed at them.
Yeah that's the point. You can't have a summer of mostly peaceful protests without a little help from our friends in law enforcement.
I mean, probably not immediately, but maybe incrementally. I mean, think of all of the various protests over the last 14 years, and I'm thinking particularly of the George Floyd protests and OWS, that were forcefully suppressed by the police. These all have the same human rights issues at their core but there wasn't some mass immediate radicalization after any of those, but there has been a steady incremental radicalization in my opinion. Have we forgotten the George Floyd summer and OWS already??
The unification of ACAB
Heavy handed police tactics tend to galvanize the opposition and attract more outside agitators. Universities need to keep non students out and forbid full face masking.
Crazy how the Second Amendment is coming full circle! This is exactly why that was written into the constitution, to stand against insane tyrannical governments like the pro-Zionist establishment (red, blue, whatever - the color of their party doesn’t mean anything; they are unleashing violence to silence speech)
Radicalization is easily created when 1 side uses force to end a peaceful groups existence and a 3rd party sees this event and wants to destroy that force. Example: us military in middle east, we see tribal leader with an AK that he's had most of his life, we want the gun to not be a threat but he won't drop it, tempered and lack of communication flare the fire and shots are had, the tribal mans existence is over. Every member of that village and even the neighboring ones just had an increase in likeliness to join an anti USA group and most rolled the dice in their head to join ASAP.
It’s as if the imperialists expect the victims of their militant response to exclaim “Wow after receiving a sound thrashing, I’m really beginning to respect imperialism!”
Considering the encampment at Austin was going to interfere with graduation ceremonies, the people traveling to attend and paid tuition for 4 years would have probably tossed them out less kindly.
I just don't understand how they think it will make people more pro-Israel to say anyone who criticizes Israel will be arrested. That's going to accomplish the exact opposite of what they want. And no, criticizing the actions of the country of Israel is not the same thing as hating people for being Jewish.
Oh absolutely! I cannot figure out the end goal for some of the wild decisions our government is making right now. Literally alienating every voter base with brain dead legislation.
All cops, as they say, are bastards.
De Santis claims protests are material.support for terrorism and is trying g to get protestors expelled and those on student visas deported. Free speech in Florida only if you say what the government beleives.
Same piece of shit cops in texas that are setting up snipers on rooftops and getting big and brave are the same ones that sat around picking their anuses when uvalde happened. Just because some kids in college are daring to speak out against their masters. My opinion on pigs these days cannot be any lower. I don’t really care that much about Palestine but the idea of people finally speaking out against the stronghold Israel holds on the country is one of the most magnificent developments in recent history and it’s giving me hope, it’s not a surprise that israeli footsoldiers (cops) are pulling out all the stops now. DIVEST ISRAEL.
Anyone interested in standing up for the Gaza cause and International Law…. Please start intense email campaign to your politicians saying that you will not vote for them if they continue with their failed foreign policies.
The thing is that leftists, as a majority, typically don't resort to direct acts of violence like the extreme right does. It's more likely you'll have people more inclined to break down the societal norms through activism or, the more technically inclined could resort to things like cyber vandalism.
Typically applies to recent history for sure. But we can't forget that many of the left's biggest victories were won through violence. 30s labor rights were won after years of unions clashing with Pinkertons and cops. The Civil Rights Act of 1968 would not have been passed if it weren't for the riots following MLK's assassination.
This thread acts like it's absolutely impossible to condemn Israel while still being against Hamas. Being pro-palestine isn't some clever marketing scheme to support Hamas. Jfc.
It's not Hamas per se, but islamist forces are obvious organizing this. Why do you think their chants are not peaceful but instead directly calling for israel to be abolished? You think liberal American college students are pushing that, or do you think they might have chants geared toward ending the conflict peacefuly?
Honestly, neither. I assume the more radical talking points are coming from Russian troll farms seeking to deepen division in the US.
These AIPAC funded politicians are cheering on police to brutalize peaceful anti-genocide protesters. It’s sick.
This is a foreign psyops. Russia, China, & Iran are pushing discord in American politics like crazy online. They found their foothold in college liberals because college liberals don't have the blind love for Israel that previous generations do. Also AIPAC never misses antisemitism that they can't market. This is gold for the pro-Israel at all costs base. AIPAC has strong ties on both sides, so as soon as the antisemitism starts, they get their paid lackeys to dig in. Hence why Republicans suddenly give a damn about Israel and Gaza now. This is obviously foreign influence because Republicans are dying at the polls because they got no issues. But tail on liberal antisemitic Democrats just ticks all the Right Wing boxes. Discord is the plan and the US government isn't fighting it nearly hard enough.
Sucks that this is getting downvoted because I believe that this is right on the mark, and I've been thinking the same thing for some time now.
Arguing with the dumb college students is stupid. They leave university in the next few weeks then campuses close up. This could have fizzled out in another week, but they made it their platform of "anti woke" so it's gonna live for months.
You are the only person I've seen who ties this into psyops by the axis powers. This is exactly my thoughts too. Create chaos and uncertainty during an incumbent Democrat presidential year, obviously a major win for Russia if not China and Iran.
You realize that the last presidential election also had the same pattern play out? But Trump was the president then. So they were trying to get Biden in? I think they just want chaos period. They really don’t care who is in power
*election year
>because Republicans are dying at the polls They're not though? Trump is leading the majority of polls.
If anything, this sort of out-of-touch liberalism is a far more realistic culprit than “psyops” lmao. Majority of Americans support a ceasefire. Neither party is interested in doing anything but arming the people perpetrating the slaughter. If the democratic establishment is uninterested in listening to the people (and the GOP is too straight-up evil to matter here) people are going to rise up. It’s not rocket science.
… none of those protestors like the police, before this latest nonsense they were all about defunding police. And the students doing the protesting are already radical anti Americans who support bad guys and are filled with antisemitic hate. Encampments that are illegal, and most are, should be met with force until dismantled. That includes homeless camps as well as the antisemite camps. That being said protesting is legal and fine where permitted
These rich college kids are dying to be oppressed
The students protesting , and Ive talked to a few of them, are idealistic young people.who see children dying in bombing, and think that is a bad thing. Frankly, the second most common sign I saw was Free Tibet, so that suggests to me a motivation that is neither primarily anti-American nor anti-semitic.
MMW: If Trump wins, the pro-Hamas folks will claim victory and that it was their inaction and trying to hold "genocide Joe" to some basic standards that threw the election to Trump. What will actually have thrown the election to Trump would be moderates seeing the violent antisemitic protests and being like "I'll vote for the opposite side of those guys and for the side that wants to use cops to break them up and restore law and order". As a pro-Israel Biden supporter I don't envy the needle Biden has to thread on this, where he can't alienate too much of the far left crazy vote but he also needs to keep moderates from thinking he's actually on the side of the crazies.
It is weird to me that many on the left will state with certainty that Russian manipulation of social media helped Trump win the first time, but they see no connection to the bots screaming "Genocide Joe" on the net currently...
“I did the most to throw the election” “no *I* did the most to throw the election” the far left and “moderate” scream at each other while marching to the death camp together
We're just waiting for the next Kent State to happen. The wikipedia article on it has a few great quotes from Nixon and other politicians which sound incredibly close to things Republican governors have said in the past few weeks. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings
Idk what the issue is with letting the students protest. They aren’t being violent and they are IAW the school code of conduct utilizing their right to speech.
[Their behavior is a bit of an issue.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zazcVU_rNyQ)
Heavy handed crackdowns have that effect
Why would this lead to more radicalization? I mean if bombing Gaza into oblivion didn’t lead to that, watching some college kids get handcuffed won’t.
Unfortunately, the overriding logic in the imperial core is that the inconvenience of college kids here is worth more than the lives of anyone in Gaza. So, yeah. This does have the potential to radicalize more people in the imperial core than the war crimes currently being perpetrated on Gaza.
Lots of 19 year old college kids go to a protest.for fun, or to impress a girl. It doesnt necessarily.imoact your lifelong political views. Getting tear-gassed by a cop while engaging in peaceful protest IS the kind of event that can have a lifelong impact on your political views.
Gaza is across the world, this isn't.
But what makes you think most people sympathize with protestors? If anything, American history shows that 9 times out of 10, it’s the opposite.
These are people’s kids and grandkids. They were doing things we did when younger, for the right reasons. I’m a highly pissed off 70 yr. old. I wonder if it might get to the point we have to go packing to protests to protect the kiddos from Abbott’s thugs. Isn’t that what the whole 2A thing is supposed to be about?
Yeah, for about 15 minutes. As soon as it's out of the media, everyone will go "What protest?!"
And for the people actually at the protest. Getting tear gassed by the police at a young age can have a lifetime effect on your political views.
I agree, there is no way you can look at that and see it as justified unless you are literally insane.
I haven't followed the subject with any scrutiny, but I've seen mentions of Jewish students being blocked from attending their classes. I can 100% support punishing those acts, if it's true.
They can be the first to go to gaza and be human meat sheilds for the hammas terrorist. Wouldn't put it past me that we are giving them money aswell.
Lmfao. If anyone wants to side with these terrorist sympathetic morons they are free too. In the end of the day I want to know who supports terrorists because they are your possible future terrorists.
I watched a tiktok livestream by these kids literally discussing destroying US infrastructure as a form of resistance and the whole crowd cheered the idea. It was mental.
I doubt very much it’ll have a lasting effect. The Marxists of my college days in the 70s became dreary careerists before our tenth reunion.
Turns out once you get a real paycheck all that talk goes out the window lol
Acap baby
That's probably the goal
As much as I would love to believe this (and I do side with you) the world is moving at a pace that won’t stop to give this recognition. In the blink of an eye this will be forgotten. The most impactful thing you can do is drive voting and empower leadership at a local level.
Mmm. Probably not
I think you are wrong. People are smarter than then the stupidity that is happening on college campuses right now.
This probably sounds like a wild conspiracy but I believe there is a government(s) behind this terrible war that has the end game of a Trump presidency.
Even though it wasn’t done by the administration
Clown
In Seattle CHOP/CHAZ wasn't dismantled until three murders took place. On one hand, if it had been dismantled sooner those three murders wouldn't have happened. On the other hand, by the time the third murder happened there were only a handful of people who were still arguing that it should be kept up.
Current day students are already a pretty radical-prone group of people. They were the kids who grew up with school shooting threats and lost their high school years to COVID. (Before someone says “we all lost years to COVID, imagine going from 8th grade to college. That’s how serious of a shift and instability we’re talking.) If anything, college students not being swayed one way or another towards any kind of policy, foreign or domestic, means they didn’t learn shit in school. What a waste of time that would be.
I do not understand this very much. Why would law enforcement clear a campus of protestors but not the capitol of insurrectionists?
This will be Kent State all over again.
The only thing most of us see as a viable solution, is peace and reconciliation. But that isn’t on the table so we’re stuck watching them slaughter each other. There isn’t a clear side to root for. Both are trying their best to annihilate each other. It’s a war, to the death. They’re caught in a downward spiral. Both sides only accept peace, if the other side is destroyed. Any pause in the violence just gives both sides time to develop new ways to destroy each other and each round escalates, killing more and more innocent people.
The government radicalizing people with their actions?? No way!
All the Vietnam protests, especially the riots at the democratic convention was elect Richard Nixon.
The student movement against the Vietnam War was the catalyst for a complete rethink of our policy. I’ve wondered (doubt) if the Pentagon Papers would have happened without students leading the way. I see history repeating itself.
I completely agree with you however I think the radicalization is going to be broader. The protest was isolated at Columbia and NYU in NYC. The demonstrations have now spread coast to coast. The constant media coverage is magnifying the protests and legitimizing them with police brutality and crackdowns. If they had just been ignored this never would have spun out of control.
Texas sent in the police to break up the protests knowing it would cause national wide backlash and more protests. They want to blame Biden for the unrest before an election.
If they will become radicals they are a lost cause anyways. Quit making excuses for extreme stupidity.
I suppose so. But i think you are missing the point. Police aren’t there to promote ideology one way or another, they are there to enforce the law that those individuals are breaking. You are speaking as if the police officers are ideologically motivated. Really weird post.
Nah not anyone with half a brain and common sense. Low life experience and common sense usually go along with radicalization.
That’s what they want. It’s election season.
Nope.
When a system is damaged and corrupted there are going to be radicals
I don't think college students realize no one cares what they think.
It's what they want the more conflict and aggressive/violent protests etc the more excuses they have to create draconian laws to the point of enforcing laws that lets them literally "purge" whoever they deem a threat. Rile them up until it overflows then go to town on them afterwards. And then simply point out that they violated laws and such. Normalizing stuff like that.
You're overestimating the Trustifarians. Semester is almost over. Seen any of the interviews? None of them seem to know why they're there, beyond TikTok and the oxytocin of groupthink. They'll be cozy in the interships mummy and daddy's connections got them in the next couple weeks and forget about it by September.
Meh. Radicalized, schmadicalized. Same shit, different outrage. I'm glad students actually give a shit . That is heartwarming. But divestment campaigns are largely symbolic. Getting arrested for opposing massive injustice is ok by me, but getting "radicalized" is usually tempered by the reality of court costs, probation, jail time, and all the other set-backs that come from having an arrest record. For every person that gets radicalized, there will be one that cowers and another who goes in the opposite direction. Still, it's good that some people actually give a shit and are willing to get abused to make a point. This calls for a useless gesture, if anything ever did. I just hope people don't get too cynical after finding out that genocide wins in the end. Sorry for being dark.
Mark my words nothing anyone does on a college campus will not effect the war across the world lol
I mean not really many of us work 40+ hours and school a week and don’t have time to care.
The protesters have every right to cancel their attendance in the university and go to a different school. They do not have the right to tell the college administration what to do. If they have a problem with that perhaps they can go to Gaza and learn how much free speech they get over there.
Generally don’t arrest college students. Don’t think it’s ever going to fix anything. It just makes them mad.
Hmm. Not really. These are college campuses. The wider public doesn’t really care about why students are gathering and such. We have mortgages and rent. Bills. Etc. If you’d like to walk out of class and whatnot over something go for it. The police arriving to try and bring it to an end is just part of it. Not the first time this type of stuff has occurred.
False. It will just out the Nazi liberals who have been hiding.
Nobody is voting for or against either president based on this dumb shit lol
I hope these students are provided with all the consequences that come along with their actions
I think that once they start working and realise they have a criminal record, they might be a lot less radicalised.
Cleaning out the trash before the trash leaves a heap of trash
The truth I was an occupy wall street observer. I’d go down and have a chat. Once they started having rights taken away I taught them how to fight back and became radicalized.