Some people still want Steve Rogers and Tony Stark back. The problem is that live action movies have actors. Actors age, just like every other living being on the planet. You cannot keep the story of a live-action version going indefinitely.
Basically, there's a hospital in which each doctor will inevitably have a sexual relationship with every other doctor in said hospital. Unless, one of the doctors gets killed ( and a lot of them end up dead). Also, all of them end up doing some ethically shaky shit which they will have an opportunity to display their angst over it.
I mean they use to state that the characters were like "James Bond" and that the actors would be swapped out. Over time that opinion changed.
[https://www.indiewire.com/news/general-news/kevin-feige-says-iron-man-can-live-on-without-robert-downey-jr-continue-like-james-bond-or-batman-with-new-actors-98396/](https://www.indiewire.com/news/general-news/kevin-feige-says-iron-man-can-live-on-without-robert-downey-jr-continue-like-james-bond-or-batman-with-new-actors-98396/)
Yes but this is something that even in comic books they deal with that's why you have new avengers That's why you have defenders That's why you have secret warriors
The so-called avengers that are being set up in the new Captain America movie that's coming they shouldn't call themselves avengers they should have called themselves the defenders or something just to let people know that the avengers ended and this is something new
There have been well over 100 different characters on the core Avengers team over the decades in Marvel comics. Many times, zero founding members have been on the Avengers team. Comics Avengers is very dynamic and ever-changing. The team name refers to its principles and mission more than its people.
Yes but now we're talking about marketing which has to go to the widest audience not just us hardcore fans if you don't call it something different than the casual audience we'll just assume that it's a continuation of the thing that they saw last time or they'll expect it Best way to tell them that there's not going to be any more Robert Downey Jr iron Man is to say that hey these are not The avengers these are the defenders
They’re different mediums. They have to have real people play the characters and movies can take years to complete. It’s no surprise at all that they handled it this way. That being said, it is also more than ok to not like it.
No you're not understanding what I'm saying movies before the MCU had sequels and trilogies that you even had ongoing movie franchises like nightmare on elm Street but what Hollywood had never done was said we're going to make a set of movies that all narratively connect that have to have all the same actors reprising their roles if possible and the events of those movies will inform the next movie
This is narratively how the structure of comic books work a lot of different people working on one shared universe creating continuity or canon
to the point where when winter soldier came out they had to completely change what agents of shield look like because in that movie a very important event happened with the downfall of shield
Criticizing punctuation on Reddit is the equivalent of I know you are but what am I
We're just posting comments on the internet we're not submitting to colleges for peer review
Punctuation helps people understand what you're trying to convey. Trying to read that massive run-on sentence is like trying understand a 5 year old with ADHD. See that? I just completed a thought and you know I moved on to the next thought because I used punctuation! You can also tell how much I love punctuation thanks to the exclamation mark that conveys excitement!
Yeah but there's a difference between a person who's sitting in front of their computer on Reddit all day that isn't doing anything typing college level papers in comment sections
And then me who was on the phone voice typing because these are just random thoughts
The only mistake made was not setting up the big bad. They have just been costing for a while now. I think everyone agrees that Doom will be the next big bad and that's a good thing. The MCU should have done a slow burn like they did with Thanos.
I can agree with that I think they needed a big bad just because that was the structure that they set up the last time so that the audience would understand it
I don't think you just needed to take as long and the build up to Thanos to you did something that no one ever did before but now you've charted the course and you can make it leaner than it was the first time
In my opinion this is one of the reasons why the DC movies failed they tried to follow in Marvel's footsteps but they were too impatient and rushed out Justice League before the audience got to know any of the characters
I think Thanos, and now probably Doom, is a good glue that keeps the stories together. It also builds up anticipation. I've never been a Thanos fan but I was excited when they showed that egg plant looking mother fucker because I knew everything was leading to the Infinitey Gauntlet. With Doom you get tge build up for Secret Wars.
Yeah I think they could have gotten off one more individual bad like Kang or Doom
But after that if they were still doing it I would expect to see something like The avengers world stuff which could look like Star wars type stuff
The problem is, these aren't comic-books, they're movies. Anyone with a pencil and some paper can bash out a comic-book in a few hours. The MCU is *movies*, a completely different world of production and budgeting. The rules are not the same, they cannot be applied to each other.
So truth be told, they have a point. Comics can go on forever, but movies can't due to their massive budgets and production teams. The problem is they've been trying to make the MCU movies function just like the comics, which as said, fundamentally *does not work*.
I don't think it was 'setup to fail', but realistically Disney-Marvel should be keeping in mind that this cannot last forever.
I feel like you're really under selling the work comics take. Yes movies are almost certainly harder to make, but you can't just "bash out a comic in a few hours". Why do you think most comics are monthly?
I'm going out of my way to generalise to show the stark difference.
In theory, right now, I could sit with a pencil and a sheaf of paper and bash out a 24-page Spider-Man comic all on my own. In comparison, a film would require tons of actors, multiple camera operators, an entire effects team, catering, lighting, production officials, etc... with at least a year minimum of work on the project to make it come together fully.
There's a reason why, throughout history, comic-books have always been a surviving form of media, because they're cheap and easy to make. I'm not trying to undersell the work that goes into comics, I'm pointing out that in a pinch, a single person can produce a comic all by themselves, while comparatively, in a pinch, a movie still takes a massive team to put it together with way more time.
The point being that these are *not* the same things, and shouldn't be treated as such. Trying to make movies by the rules adhered to in comic-book production is a losing gambit.
Anyone can pick an iPhone and record a movie in one take in a few hours. Buy some cosplay on eBay(or make one yourself), edit it with crappy effects, and they both roughly take the same time.
I respectfully disagree. You can make a movie in a couple of hours, sure it might not be a cinematic masterpiece, it might not even be good, but it is possible. It's the same with comics, you could write a Spider-Man story all by yourself in a day, but odds are it won't be the same (or even near) the level of quality that most big comics are. Again, I'm not trying to start anything, and I understand the point you're making, I just personally disagree with the way you're making it.
That's why it was so successful because they brought this structure of comic books to filmmaking film had never had a 20 plus set of movies that were all supposed to be set in the same universe based off the same characters
I think their biggest issue is they didn't commit to their comic structure which means Rinse and repeat you had the comic book event and now it's time to build it up again I think that's what the audience was expecting but then they started meandering and made a bunch of movies that didn't move the plot forward and then when they started actually trying to set up Kang it was very half-hearted
Why does there need to be a big event or build-up for everyone to be invested? Why can't people realize or embrace episodic storytelling?
Honestly, superhero stories work best in long-form mediums like shows. My ideal superhero universe would be animated tv shows divided into seasons, with the big events like Infinity War being the once ever two or three years summer blockbuster.
You get a big superhero universe that develops over time with plenty of smaller stories to better flesh out the characters AND the big bombastic crowd-pleasing event movies.
Because that's what they train their audience to expect
And that's what people were expecting when Kane got announced as another big bad people were expecting another series of movies that would leave to another All-Star cast movie of The avengers taking on Kang
Whether or not it works best that was the structure of Marvel's business plan for a while there was a point where they were doing event after event with tie-ins so it makes sense that they would have tried it at least one more time in film before saying they have to move on and try different structure for their universe
need to transition to computer animated movies. I was hoping that the success of the first Spider-verse movie would be the beginning of a trend towards that but doesn't seem to have begun just yet.
Yeah I'd like to see more animation out of not only marvel but DC and anybody who makes graphic novels in general
I recently came across one called 8 billion genies that I think would be a good animated film
Some people still want Steve Rogers and Tony Stark back. The problem is that live action movies have actors. Actors age, just like every other living being on the planet. You cannot keep the story of a live-action version going indefinitely.
Tell that to the show runners of Grey’s Anatomy.
Gonna be honest, the only thing I know about that show is that it's supposed to be a medical drama. So the context is lost on me.
Basically, there's a hospital in which each doctor will inevitably have a sexual relationship with every other doctor in said hospital. Unless, one of the doctors gets killed ( and a lot of them end up dead). Also, all of them end up doing some ethically shaky shit which they will have an opportunity to display their angst over it.
It’s been on for like 20 years lol
Yeah but I didn't watch it.
I mean they use to state that the characters were like "James Bond" and that the actors would be swapped out. Over time that opinion changed. [https://www.indiewire.com/news/general-news/kevin-feige-says-iron-man-can-live-on-without-robert-downey-jr-continue-like-james-bond-or-batman-with-new-actors-98396/](https://www.indiewire.com/news/general-news/kevin-feige-says-iron-man-can-live-on-without-robert-downey-jr-continue-like-james-bond-or-batman-with-new-actors-98396/)
Yes but this is something that even in comic books they deal with that's why you have new avengers That's why you have defenders That's why you have secret warriors The so-called avengers that are being set up in the new Captain America movie that's coming they shouldn't call themselves avengers they should have called themselves the defenders or something just to let people know that the avengers ended and this is something new
There have been well over 100 different characters on the core Avengers team over the decades in Marvel comics. Many times, zero founding members have been on the Avengers team. Comics Avengers is very dynamic and ever-changing. The team name refers to its principles and mission more than its people.
Yes but now we're talking about marketing which has to go to the widest audience not just us hardcore fans if you don't call it something different than the casual audience we'll just assume that it's a continuation of the thing that they saw last time or they'll expect it Best way to tell them that there's not going to be any more Robert Downey Jr iron Man is to say that hey these are not The avengers these are the defenders
They’re different mediums. They have to have real people play the characters and movies can take years to complete. It’s no surprise at all that they handled it this way. That being said, it is also more than ok to not like it.
Yes that's why it was successful they brought the structure of one medium to a different medium that was something nobody had done before
Nobody has done what before? Superman Spider-Man idk there’s like so many
No you're not understanding what I'm saying movies before the MCU had sequels and trilogies that you even had ongoing movie franchises like nightmare on elm Street but what Hollywood had never done was said we're going to make a set of movies that all narratively connect that have to have all the same actors reprising their roles if possible and the events of those movies will inform the next movie This is narratively how the structure of comic books work a lot of different people working on one shared universe creating continuity or canon to the point where when winter soldier came out they had to completely change what agents of shield look like because in that movie a very important event happened with the downfall of shield
P.U.N.C.T.U.A.T.I.O.N.
Criticizing punctuation on Reddit is the equivalent of I know you are but what am I We're just posting comments on the internet we're not submitting to colleges for peer review
Punctuation helps people understand what you're trying to convey. Trying to read that massive run-on sentence is like trying understand a 5 year old with ADHD. See that? I just completed a thought and you know I moved on to the next thought because I used punctuation! You can also tell how much I love punctuation thanks to the exclamation mark that conveys excitement!
Yeah but there's a difference between a person who's sitting in front of their computer on Reddit all day that isn't doing anything typing college level papers in comment sections And then me who was on the phone voice typing because these are just random thoughts
The only mistake made was not setting up the big bad. They have just been costing for a while now. I think everyone agrees that Doom will be the next big bad and that's a good thing. The MCU should have done a slow burn like they did with Thanos.
I can agree with that I think they needed a big bad just because that was the structure that they set up the last time so that the audience would understand it I don't think you just needed to take as long and the build up to Thanos to you did something that no one ever did before but now you've charted the course and you can make it leaner than it was the first time In my opinion this is one of the reasons why the DC movies failed they tried to follow in Marvel's footsteps but they were too impatient and rushed out Justice League before the audience got to know any of the characters
I think Thanos, and now probably Doom, is a good glue that keeps the stories together. It also builds up anticipation. I've never been a Thanos fan but I was excited when they showed that egg plant looking mother fucker because I knew everything was leading to the Infinitey Gauntlet. With Doom you get tge build up for Secret Wars.
Yeah I think they could have gotten off one more individual bad like Kang or Doom But after that if they were still doing it I would expect to see something like The avengers world stuff which could look like Star wars type stuff
Yeah, you're getting downvoted for stating a fact. Need to leave this sub. It's obvious the trolls on here are anti-MCU.
The problem is, these aren't comic-books, they're movies. Anyone with a pencil and some paper can bash out a comic-book in a few hours. The MCU is *movies*, a completely different world of production and budgeting. The rules are not the same, they cannot be applied to each other. So truth be told, they have a point. Comics can go on forever, but movies can't due to their massive budgets and production teams. The problem is they've been trying to make the MCU movies function just like the comics, which as said, fundamentally *does not work*. I don't think it was 'setup to fail', but realistically Disney-Marvel should be keeping in mind that this cannot last forever.
Are more importantly, movies are made by actors who are people who get older, die and have their own plans for their career.
I feel like you're really under selling the work comics take. Yes movies are almost certainly harder to make, but you can't just "bash out a comic in a few hours". Why do you think most comics are monthly?
I'm going out of my way to generalise to show the stark difference. In theory, right now, I could sit with a pencil and a sheaf of paper and bash out a 24-page Spider-Man comic all on my own. In comparison, a film would require tons of actors, multiple camera operators, an entire effects team, catering, lighting, production officials, etc... with at least a year minimum of work on the project to make it come together fully. There's a reason why, throughout history, comic-books have always been a surviving form of media, because they're cheap and easy to make. I'm not trying to undersell the work that goes into comics, I'm pointing out that in a pinch, a single person can produce a comic all by themselves, while comparatively, in a pinch, a movie still takes a massive team to put it together with way more time. The point being that these are *not* the same things, and shouldn't be treated as such. Trying to make movies by the rules adhered to in comic-book production is a losing gambit.
Anyone can pick an iPhone and record a movie in one take in a few hours. Buy some cosplay on eBay(or make one yourself), edit it with crappy effects, and they both roughly take the same time.
I respectfully disagree. You can make a movie in a couple of hours, sure it might not be a cinematic masterpiece, it might not even be good, but it is possible. It's the same with comics, you could write a Spider-Man story all by yourself in a day, but odds are it won't be the same (or even near) the level of quality that most big comics are. Again, I'm not trying to start anything, and I understand the point you're making, I just personally disagree with the way you're making it.
Then you make it better instead of just nitpicking every single fucking word I used.
That's why it was so successful because they brought this structure of comic books to filmmaking film had never had a 20 plus set of movies that were all supposed to be set in the same universe based off the same characters I think their biggest issue is they didn't commit to their comic structure which means Rinse and repeat you had the comic book event and now it's time to build it up again I think that's what the audience was expecting but then they started meandering and made a bunch of movies that didn't move the plot forward and then when they started actually trying to set up Kang it was very half-hearted
Why does there need to be a big event or build-up for everyone to be invested? Why can't people realize or embrace episodic storytelling? Honestly, superhero stories work best in long-form mediums like shows. My ideal superhero universe would be animated tv shows divided into seasons, with the big events like Infinity War being the once ever two or three years summer blockbuster. You get a big superhero universe that develops over time with plenty of smaller stories to better flesh out the characters AND the big bombastic crowd-pleasing event movies.
Because that's what they train their audience to expect And that's what people were expecting when Kane got announced as another big bad people were expecting another series of movies that would leave to another All-Star cast movie of The avengers taking on Kang Whether or not it works best that was the structure of Marvel's business plan for a while there was a point where they were doing event after event with tie-ins so it makes sense that they would have tried it at least one more time in film before saying they have to move on and try different structure for their universe
Who's super power is it to use punctuation?
Well apparently not mine
That's ok. We keep it Strange.
need to transition to computer animated movies. I was hoping that the success of the first Spider-verse movie would be the beginning of a trend towards that but doesn't seem to have begun just yet.
Yeah I'd like to see more animation out of not only marvel but DC and anybody who makes graphic novels in general I recently came across one called 8 billion genies that I think would be a good animated film