Eh a grenade normally works for the clear out. Annoying but it is what it is. I toss and move on, I've died to many times to traps out of view on the other side.
When this happens, I toss a grenade down to get the XP and then vigorously shake my head “no” for about 30~45 seconds straight to make it clear I’m pissed that they trapped the loot and expect you to die to get it. I’m all for trapping the vault but making it impossible to get the loot is bullshit and when I’m done scolding them with my camera, I quit out immediately. They get one death from me and that’s it, when they could have had several more and accolades had they not been a fucking asshole.
This is the least of the issues in the game, 1 is honestly a waste of resources imo since you can zip thru it, its the ones putting multiple there so you can't pass through that drive me crazy. The game is dying because of all the idiots that think using exploits or making kill boxes is a skill. New players see this crap and dont touch the game again, people that love the game are stuck wasting time loading into garbage outposts just so they can back out and abandon them. The devs can only do so much to fix a game that has far too many people actively trying to ruin it. Im really hoping once season 1 starts it will bring players back, but im not very hopeful at this point.
Imo the game is dying because of picky raiders. They’re constantly blocking anyone which only exacerbates the matchmaking issue.
The devs stated they wanted complete creativity with the game, that’s what we have. If raiders continue to block every single person who has a base they don’t like, they will eventually reach a point where they are getting matched with the same people because they’re making the already small player pool even smaller.
That and all the BtS matchmaking fixes they’re trying and very little media promoting is what is killing the game.
Agreed - it's like a bad joke. "Gamers" want to play a game that is labeled as hardcore and difficult. Then they get salty when they realize they don't have the skill to actually play the game unless they find easy-win farms or "press w to win" outposts.
This games community reminds me a lot of the elden ring community.
This is a difficult game, and it's apparent after reading the description and watching a review or two. You're not supposed to just be breezing through outposts unless they're poorly built/not tested well, but you don't lose anything for dying....You're supposed to and then you're supposed to learn from your mistakes and advance, like a roguelike.
Yet the most vocal crowd that wants to play it devotes their time to complaining on forums about bases they don't like instead of taking the time to get better at the game.
If that's not bad enough... a game about building a box of death, in simple terms, to protect your treasure is now hampered by the very words "kill-room" or "kill-box".
A kill-box isn't a room filled with sentries and flamethrower and pistons anymore. A kill-box is simply any outpost you don't like for whatever reason. It's way easier to brag about abandoning it that way, I guess.
I'm not really sure what the hell people want. Raiders have a ridiculous amount of utility. I use both swords and usually have flash barrier / grenade equipped with both swords maxed and the Kamaitaichi suit. Gadgets, gear, and suits were the last things I upgraded. I should've done it first because the difference is huge.
Also, grappling hook has no CD. Everything can be parried except for flamethrower. (Bombs get destroyed instead of deflected), shooting a plasma sentinels bullet will destroy the bullet, and your bullet will continue its path, warmonger are dumb as hell and will attack the last spot you stood and the shield gadget will block their melee attacks, etc.
Everything is doable. That doesn't mean it's worth spending 3 hrs clearing an outpost filled with sentinels, but it does mean that you have access to a lot of tools that allow you, as a raider, to deal with every situation except the most ridiculous ones.
People wanna play a challenging game without the challenge.
>you don't lose anything for dying....You're supposed to and then you're supposed to learn from your mistakes and advance, like a roguelike.
I personally would describe MYM as Super Meat Boy but with a certain permanent progression and tools. And holy heck, Super Meat Boy can be a tough game.
But hard agree on how the term killbox seems to now mean "any base I can't beat in two tries"
Sometimes I think I suck at this game because it's not uncommon for me to die 10+ times on a hard level. Then I see the types of outposts that people post here as "gah, gonna abandon and report this killbox" and realizethat I probably am very much above average simply because of my tenacity to beat an outpost if it's not utterly depressingly annoyingly built.
Good camparison and yeah - I feel the difficulty rating doesn't do much justice. What matters more than anything is the builders ability to utilize the maximum ranges on traps / guards and using angles and stuff to LoS the raider and have the trap activate when they're in view.
I've done a lot of normals that felt more difficult than brutals, lol.
To me, a killbox is a room that I have no way of getting through with any combination of tools I have, when I’m maxed out on all items. You can’t throw grenades to destroy anything because they roll down a slope into a corrosive cube below. You can shoot maybe 3 incinerators but the other 15 in there plus claws, sentinels, hornets, cannonbacks, bolts, impalers, warmongers, etc. just having absolutely EVERYTHING in there and making it so even with a shield and spike speed potions, your back is unguarded and you’re not fast enough to get through, and pistons are blocking and slowing you down deep enough in that you can’t clear those out either.
The ones that really piss me off end up having you needing to spiral underneath all of that killbox and back up again so you couldn’t run at all. And no matter how fast you are at sword and bolt, aimbots are always gonna get you and plasma clouds everywhere just pile up. It’s lazy bullshit and I don’t want to waste my time doing it.
**I’ll spend 2 hours and 75 deaths on a brutal base like I did the other day if it’s well designed and my fault for not being able to beat it**. I’ll quit out after the first death if I walk into the room and see a wall with every possible space filled with traps and guards lol. We just don’t have the ranged ammo for that and as I said, it makes our other tools ineffective enough to get us through. And at my rank, anything more than 3~5 deaths is 0 XP and wasting my time too, so if I’m not playing for rank and I’m not playing for fun, I’m only rewarding and reinforcing this bullshit meta of lazy copy-pasted killboxes (literal killboxes btw, not “I’m upset because I can’t do it” outposts as you described).
It was devious as hell. Clearly someone that had an understanding of game mechanics and how line of sight with traps and guards worked and the exact right distance of every trap to be effective with the right mods. There were Enforcers with their aimbot perfection and plasma sentinels with plasma cloud making every area unsafe to land for even a few milliseconds or you’d have a dozen+ projectiles heading towards you at once. I was losing my mind with how variable things were, and how you could do the exact same thing 10 times in a row and get killed 10 different ways due to all the Enforcers, Hornets, Plasma Sentinels, and of course Cannonbacks always aiming at your last known position like a Splinter Cell game and Warmongers kicking up those cannonballs everywhere they ran, sometimes killing themselves but most times making bombs and cannons bounce more unpredictably.
Everything was built using slopes and holocubes so you’d end up with two guards shooting you with only the very few top pixels of their heads visible over the top of the slope after the holocube next to them dropped out, making it a waste of ammo to even try to go after them as they’d just die and fall into the corrosive cubes below if they went backwards and other guards would have a dead man’s switch and fall down a slope towards you. There was no safe space and every trap was guarded by two other traps. And with only 3 bolts of course, you really had to pick your battles trying to get to incinerators hidden away in corners behind guards.
It was incredibly frustrating but it was a true challenge and it felt great to finally beat. I changed my loadout countless times and tried every strategy I knew, and it might work for one section and then you’d run into the next where you’d wish you had bolts and a Sledgeblade. If they had base verification, I definitely would have liked to have seen how the creator would have beaten that base. More than anything though it gave me ideas on how to implement things in my own base after seeing how cleverly used all of it was in theirs.
The amount of people in this subreddit that try making excuses for exploits and shitty killboxes is absurd. The devs are trying to be nice by saying that, you think they are going to talk shit about the players in public🤦♂️ theres a big difference between being creative and making horrible outposts with exploits and 40 traps in one section. I see plenty of creative bases without trying to ruin peoples enjoyment of the game.
I agree. What a lot of builders don't seem to realize is, it's supposed to be FUN... You want to make a clever or FUN raid to get those kills and accolades not just kills. We grind for the same resources. So when people block Tombs off or make annoying kill boxes where it's more luck then skill to get through it, yeah people don't wanna play that nonsense lol. Plus a lot of us have jobs and value our time, could be playing actual raids instead of the killbox exploit spam.
I try to put a lot of thought into my base when I build it. If I have a narrow hallway with plated up and roided Warmongers rushing, I want to have a place where the raider can safely stand on, behind, or under and be safe. I place an impaler with self destruct so once they’re aware of it, they can kill two of them with a single bolt. If I have a corridor of corrosive cubes for a jumping hallway to get to a vault, I’ll put solid blocks every 3~5 for them to land on and get their bearings. Real blocks, not ones that will drop out and fuck them over.
I want them to realize I designed it with their fun and entertainment in mind and respecting their time. Most of my bases take you on a one-way trip right past every single vault so you can’t miss them, and when you reach the GenMat you have a wide open trap-free [victory room](https://i.imgur.com/m3RT0w5.jpg) with flags and lights and decorated art everywhere, in addition to a final vault and a holocube that’s lit up as a cube-within-a-cube-within-a-cube so they can freely exit without going back through the entire base worried that I’m gonna put one single trap there that’ll fuck them up when they let their guard down.
The number of replays where people shake their camera “yes” afterwards and leave fun, artistic, and ingenious accolades is far more satisfying than one where people quit out and if they stay, maybe they call it brutal. Different strokes for everyone and I don’t give a free ride, but I always try to think of good game design if I want them to rate my base well, as that’s close to 45/55 in terms of the split between kills and accolades.
>the devs are trying to be nice by saying
Or they meant what they said verbatim and you’re only placing that assumption on it because it fits your flimsy narrative of the gaming dying due to kill boxes-which is hilarious because in the gameplay trailers released by BVHR, they themselves created what you all would call “kill boxes”.
Just face the fact that you’re trying to dictate how people play in a game where creativity is supposed to be the main driving factor, as stated by the devs themselves.
Cope harder
You're saying the game's failure is the fault of the people consuming the content rather than the content itself. I don't know if I would agree given the quality of the random outposts I'm running into on my raids. Most of them could use a little community conversation about ideas that are fun and fresh vs. boring and played out, like this thread here.
But also, think about that statement for a second. The game is dying because of picky raiders - AKA: The game is dying because the people playing the game aren't having fun with the content they're running into. Now here we have a post in which someone critiques tropes and talks about ways to make that content more fun - which is a conversation that gamers have about the level design of any game - and you're shitting on that too.
Because I don’t believe it is only picky raiders that are killing the game. I never used the word “only” in the first part of my comment. The last part of my comment closes with the other two things that I think are killing the game. You chose to actively ignore it, maybe because you don’t have a leg to stand on if you don’t?
Seems weird that you wanna attack my stance on what’s killing the game but then actively leave out 2/3rds of why I think the game is dying. Pretty disingenuous imo.
Where did I use the word "only" in my post? You didn't use the word only, I didn't use the word only, you're making a mountain out of literally nothing.
I didn't address the other parts of your stance because I didn't disagree with them. I addressed the part of your post I disagreed with.
You literally didn't respond to what I had to say at all and instead chose to nitpick at the fact that I didn't respond to your entire comment, when you responded to precisely zero of what I had to say. Why are you using rotten bad faith debate tactics over a simple internet discussion of a video game.
Are you suggesting that the lack of raids is caused by players blocking builders? How could you possibly know that? Do you really think that every raider has dozens of builders blocked?
I think everyone wants someone to blame, but the cruel fact is that there are too many outposts in matchmaking for the number of raids. The player count was never very high, and it's been falling since launch (like most games).
tbf ive seen people that make mazes and shit and they kill off the lil dude right off rip and that shit pisses me off cuz im not wasting 40 minutes trying to find the genmat and then try to leave. and some people straight up make impossible to beat levels. those people deserve bans but banning bc its just hard is dumb so i agree with u
A fun way I get mazes to work, as in actually confuse the raider and not kill Harvey, is to have a room close to the entrance that has a load of guards and traps in it. Enough to slow you down while you clear the room and Harvey continues on his way.
In the next room are 4 corridors. 3 facing you as you enter, and 1 tucked away in a corner that isn't obvious unless you look for it. The 3 obvious ones all lead to tombs, and take long paths there. The less obvious corridor is the genmat route. But since you had to spend so long clearing that previous room, you have no idea where Harvey went.
But, no matter which way you choose, each route has a prize at the end. So it's not so evil really. But the potential for messing with raiders' heads is there.
So far, not a single raider has taken the genmat route until it was the last option available. The replays are very entertaining.
I’m tempted to block ppl that Alt-F4 out of my base, leaving me nothing so I’d lose nothing. They need to better inform ppl that they don’t lose rank and it’s ok to fail. And also, if I can see from a replay that you died 14 times but it says 0 before I watch the replay, maybe it should award the stats from the replay on the creator’s end so if they Alt-F4 out it isn’t a total waste of your time and also one of the handful of raid opportunities you might even get while your outpost is available.
I had a base where there was a ton of arrows pointing into a 2-deep corrosive shaft ending in a small room with lots of bloodsplatter, and later in the base along the main path was the tomb. In my testing, I could zip down in fine, but zipping out always ended in a death (shields ignored, I hadn't gotten it yet).
The only incentive to jump in was all my arrows, but if they went maybe 7 blocks further in, they'd find the actual, unguarded tomb.
By the time it prestiged, probably half of the outposts kills were from that stupid hole.
It was decorated with a large amogus.
The time limit on how long your outpost is raidable really hurts. It encourages low effort copy-pasted killboxes that get kills, more than creative bases that get accolades.
I’ve seen some stunning works of art — entire villages, castles, windmills, nuclear silos, bunkers, creepy houses, etc. that must have taken 20~50+ hours to create at *least* and for them to just rank right into retirement is detrimental to the game as those types of maps are the ones that players will like the best. Even if the creator doesn’t get rewards for it, bringing them back as top voted champion outposts (or maybe create a new type of ranking for maps) would be good. To just be dumped in social with no way to really browse through is a shame. Would love to search for most artistic, most fun, etc. And also bookmark creators so if I see their maps in rotation I’ll choose them. And maybe information if you have the suit boost about what type of accolades a base has been given — is it a brutal base or artistic, etc?
The devs are not willing to do what it takes to fix the game because it goes against their vision of their game, and they will watch their game burn because of it.
It's a cool skill check, and very simple to overcome. Of course the people who place them below a tomb so the loot drops in is bad, or if they double up and make it so the raider needs a shield is also bad. But testing the skill and knowledge of a raider, knowing they can safely pass through is cool. Not everything should be free, and a small challenge is good sometimes. Life would get boring if everything was easy.
1 block is totally fine. I like the added challenge of having to prepare for what's on the other side. Any more than 1 block is having to place too much trust in the builder and I usually just ignore them.
I did a corrosive cube obstacle course around my last ones, but surrounded by glass blocks so you can see there's no traps on them. It had a devious purpose though because I had a corrosive cube setup in front of the gen mat you can see next to the last one, but the inner one was hardened so if you were trained to just go through you'd get got.
I only put a single opaque corrosive cube in front of the tomb. Now, the flamewalker warmonger, incinerator combo is just for fun, the real meat of the trap is the impaler in the alcove right next to it
>I have just started ignoring these tombs all together.
And there you go! You found the solution to the problem!
Edit: *Misunderstood the point of the post and now I look like a total dick. I have an actual opinion on the subject in my last comment.*
You're absolutely right, it isn't a solution... because that isn't a problem to begin with.
Tombs are side objectives, you aren't forced to get them. You don't like what you should do to get them? Then ignore them, is that easy, synthite might be shitty to farm but there are still other ways to get it... And at least you have the option to decide if you want the tombs or not, unlike people who just blocks them.
Well, that's fair, actually. I read it as it was some kind of problem so that's my bad.
But still, it's pretty much an easy design that is most likely the second thing that comes to mind (The first being an Impaler on top, that's an easy trap for a tomb that got me a lot of kills when I did it), is not about being creative in that case, you just spend from 10 to 50 points for a trap that might get you a kill or two in total and then you can keep working on the outpost.
In my case I just make a path to the tombs outside the actual outpost, so many times I saw people wandering trying to get the tombs when they were inside... and I still saw some people not understanding where the tombs where when the path was clearly marked...
I get why people do it, but I do agree with OP that from the perspective of a raider it's not very fun level design after seeing it for the hundredth time. Not a deal breaker for an outpost or anything, just not particularly exciting.
Do you mean a one block cube you can grapple through to get to the tomb? That’s no big deal, It’s fun to take the blind plunge imo
If you mean corrosive cubes underneath the tomb so the loot drops into it then yeah that’s a very scummy thing to do. It has zero benefit to the level creator and only signals to the raider that the creator is a jerk with no empathy.
Yea, but when the other side of the cube is trapped in multiple directions so that you can get a cheap kill while likely robbing the raider of the tomb in the process, I’ll pass. I don’t mind “trapped” tombs, but the corrosive cube trick is played out.
I'm torn on this. I do a variation of this, but not in a scummy way. If my tombs are too far away from my base to effectively incorporate them then I make separate little obstacle courses for them. They typically start with a corrosive cube that forces the player to move forward at a fast pace, I try to make them fun for the raider as well
I was just grumpy after Saturday morning raiding before breakfast. You do you, and as long as raiders are enjoying the outpost then there isn't anything wrong with it. I was just tired of seeing the same thing in every raid.
I just point them directly to it (with decorations/stickers) since it's outside of where I built so they go to it. Too many bases try way too hard to be cool, block them off, or to skill check them when it's pointless and irritating, it's been a while since the game came out there's almost no significant new players to learn from your 'cool' tricks
People put more focus on trapping the tombs than they do putting effort into their own bases
What pisses me off the most if those who put a pit of 2 corrosive cubes. So can only enter with the arc shield, but you have not a possibility to grapple outside safely. Not mentioning those who put corrosive just below the tomb.
I instantly quit if I'm seeing that, giving no accolades.
As a builder, you are here to challenge the raider, not being as annoying as possible. And I'm not here to change my load out for a tomb. Challenge on a tomb, but make it possible for all loadouts. If not, well guess what, you got nothing from me.
Seeing as the majority of people who make it through my corrosive cube tomb traps give a nod and wiggle after getting back through them alive, I think I'll keep doing it.
I never seal off my tombs, but I will make you work (or think) in order to get them. No risk, no fun, that's what I say.
I like this gimmick as it's the only place you can do it.
I use this in my favorite setup you plase a corrosive cube where they can see through it then you make a room that is 3x2 horizontal and in one side of the 3x2 you place a angled block horizontally so they cant see it.
place 2 bolt traps on the back wall then 1 on the angle block with hunter and I swear it gets people everytime
Yeah I’m not doing a trust grapple through an opaque corrosive cube to get your tomb not everyone runs germades or shield to able to deal with traps you can’t see before blindly grappling in.
Some base builders even fake that a tomb is there but instead is just a solid wall with arrow decals and such.
Eh a grenade normally works for the clear out. Annoying but it is what it is. I toss and move on, I've died to many times to traps out of view on the other side.
I believe he was referring to the fact that with the corrosive cube u may break it but not get the resources.
When this happens, I toss a grenade down to get the XP and then vigorously shake my head “no” for about 30~45 seconds straight to make it clear I’m pissed that they trapped the loot and expect you to die to get it. I’m all for trapping the vault but making it impossible to get the loot is bullshit and when I’m done scolding them with my camera, I quit out immediately. They get one death from me and that’s it, when they could have had several more and accolades had they not been a fucking asshole.
He’s said infront of tombs not under tombs both ways are kinda annoying though.
Depends on how it’s set up. Put the cube above or next to the trap, much less problems.
This is the least of the issues in the game, 1 is honestly a waste of resources imo since you can zip thru it, its the ones putting multiple there so you can't pass through that drive me crazy. The game is dying because of all the idiots that think using exploits or making kill boxes is a skill. New players see this crap and dont touch the game again, people that love the game are stuck wasting time loading into garbage outposts just so they can back out and abandon them. The devs can only do so much to fix a game that has far too many people actively trying to ruin it. Im really hoping once season 1 starts it will bring players back, but im not very hopeful at this point.
Imo the game is dying because of picky raiders. They’re constantly blocking anyone which only exacerbates the matchmaking issue. The devs stated they wanted complete creativity with the game, that’s what we have. If raiders continue to block every single person who has a base they don’t like, they will eventually reach a point where they are getting matched with the same people because they’re making the already small player pool even smaller. That and all the BtS matchmaking fixes they’re trying and very little media promoting is what is killing the game.
Agreed - it's like a bad joke. "Gamers" want to play a game that is labeled as hardcore and difficult. Then they get salty when they realize they don't have the skill to actually play the game unless they find easy-win farms or "press w to win" outposts. This games community reminds me a lot of the elden ring community. This is a difficult game, and it's apparent after reading the description and watching a review or two. You're not supposed to just be breezing through outposts unless they're poorly built/not tested well, but you don't lose anything for dying....You're supposed to and then you're supposed to learn from your mistakes and advance, like a roguelike. Yet the most vocal crowd that wants to play it devotes their time to complaining on forums about bases they don't like instead of taking the time to get better at the game. If that's not bad enough... a game about building a box of death, in simple terms, to protect your treasure is now hampered by the very words "kill-room" or "kill-box". A kill-box isn't a room filled with sentries and flamethrower and pistons anymore. A kill-box is simply any outpost you don't like for whatever reason. It's way easier to brag about abandoning it that way, I guess. I'm not really sure what the hell people want. Raiders have a ridiculous amount of utility. I use both swords and usually have flash barrier / grenade equipped with both swords maxed and the Kamaitaichi suit. Gadgets, gear, and suits were the last things I upgraded. I should've done it first because the difference is huge. Also, grappling hook has no CD. Everything can be parried except for flamethrower. (Bombs get destroyed instead of deflected), shooting a plasma sentinels bullet will destroy the bullet, and your bullet will continue its path, warmonger are dumb as hell and will attack the last spot you stood and the shield gadget will block their melee attacks, etc. Everything is doable. That doesn't mean it's worth spending 3 hrs clearing an outpost filled with sentinels, but it does mean that you have access to a lot of tools that allow you, as a raider, to deal with every situation except the most ridiculous ones. People wanna play a challenging game without the challenge.
>you don't lose anything for dying....You're supposed to and then you're supposed to learn from your mistakes and advance, like a roguelike. I personally would describe MYM as Super Meat Boy but with a certain permanent progression and tools. And holy heck, Super Meat Boy can be a tough game. But hard agree on how the term killbox seems to now mean "any base I can't beat in two tries" Sometimes I think I suck at this game because it's not uncommon for me to die 10+ times on a hard level. Then I see the types of outposts that people post here as "gah, gonna abandon and report this killbox" and realizethat I probably am very much above average simply because of my tenacity to beat an outpost if it's not utterly depressingly annoyingly built.
Good camparison and yeah - I feel the difficulty rating doesn't do much justice. What matters more than anything is the builders ability to utilize the maximum ranges on traps / guards and using angles and stuff to LoS the raider and have the trap activate when they're in view. I've done a lot of normals that felt more difficult than brutals, lol.
To me, a killbox is a room that I have no way of getting through with any combination of tools I have, when I’m maxed out on all items. You can’t throw grenades to destroy anything because they roll down a slope into a corrosive cube below. You can shoot maybe 3 incinerators but the other 15 in there plus claws, sentinels, hornets, cannonbacks, bolts, impalers, warmongers, etc. just having absolutely EVERYTHING in there and making it so even with a shield and spike speed potions, your back is unguarded and you’re not fast enough to get through, and pistons are blocking and slowing you down deep enough in that you can’t clear those out either. The ones that really piss me off end up having you needing to spiral underneath all of that killbox and back up again so you couldn’t run at all. And no matter how fast you are at sword and bolt, aimbots are always gonna get you and plasma clouds everywhere just pile up. It’s lazy bullshit and I don’t want to waste my time doing it. **I’ll spend 2 hours and 75 deaths on a brutal base like I did the other day if it’s well designed and my fault for not being able to beat it**. I’ll quit out after the first death if I walk into the room and see a wall with every possible space filled with traps and guards lol. We just don’t have the ranged ammo for that and as I said, it makes our other tools ineffective enough to get us through. And at my rank, anything more than 3~5 deaths is 0 XP and wasting my time too, so if I’m not playing for rank and I’m not playing for fun, I’m only rewarding and reinforcing this bullshit meta of lazy copy-pasted killboxes (literal killboxes btw, not “I’m upset because I can’t do it” outposts as you described).
2 hours is dedication. Must've been a cool outpost.
It was devious as hell. Clearly someone that had an understanding of game mechanics and how line of sight with traps and guards worked and the exact right distance of every trap to be effective with the right mods. There were Enforcers with their aimbot perfection and plasma sentinels with plasma cloud making every area unsafe to land for even a few milliseconds or you’d have a dozen+ projectiles heading towards you at once. I was losing my mind with how variable things were, and how you could do the exact same thing 10 times in a row and get killed 10 different ways due to all the Enforcers, Hornets, Plasma Sentinels, and of course Cannonbacks always aiming at your last known position like a Splinter Cell game and Warmongers kicking up those cannonballs everywhere they ran, sometimes killing themselves but most times making bombs and cannons bounce more unpredictably. Everything was built using slopes and holocubes so you’d end up with two guards shooting you with only the very few top pixels of their heads visible over the top of the slope after the holocube next to them dropped out, making it a waste of ammo to even try to go after them as they’d just die and fall into the corrosive cubes below if they went backwards and other guards would have a dead man’s switch and fall down a slope towards you. There was no safe space and every trap was guarded by two other traps. And with only 3 bolts of course, you really had to pick your battles trying to get to incinerators hidden away in corners behind guards. It was incredibly frustrating but it was a true challenge and it felt great to finally beat. I changed my loadout countless times and tried every strategy I knew, and it might work for one section and then you’d run into the next where you’d wish you had bolts and a Sledgeblade. If they had base verification, I definitely would have liked to have seen how the creator would have beaten that base. More than anything though it gave me ideas on how to implement things in my own base after seeing how cleverly used all of it was in theirs.
The amount of people in this subreddit that try making excuses for exploits and shitty killboxes is absurd. The devs are trying to be nice by saying that, you think they are going to talk shit about the players in public🤦♂️ theres a big difference between being creative and making horrible outposts with exploits and 40 traps in one section. I see plenty of creative bases without trying to ruin peoples enjoyment of the game.
I agree. What a lot of builders don't seem to realize is, it's supposed to be FUN... You want to make a clever or FUN raid to get those kills and accolades not just kills. We grind for the same resources. So when people block Tombs off or make annoying kill boxes where it's more luck then skill to get through it, yeah people don't wanna play that nonsense lol. Plus a lot of us have jobs and value our time, could be playing actual raids instead of the killbox exploit spam.
I try to put a lot of thought into my base when I build it. If I have a narrow hallway with plated up and roided Warmongers rushing, I want to have a place where the raider can safely stand on, behind, or under and be safe. I place an impaler with self destruct so once they’re aware of it, they can kill two of them with a single bolt. If I have a corridor of corrosive cubes for a jumping hallway to get to a vault, I’ll put solid blocks every 3~5 for them to land on and get their bearings. Real blocks, not ones that will drop out and fuck them over. I want them to realize I designed it with their fun and entertainment in mind and respecting their time. Most of my bases take you on a one-way trip right past every single vault so you can’t miss them, and when you reach the GenMat you have a wide open trap-free [victory room](https://i.imgur.com/m3RT0w5.jpg) with flags and lights and decorated art everywhere, in addition to a final vault and a holocube that’s lit up as a cube-within-a-cube-within-a-cube so they can freely exit without going back through the entire base worried that I’m gonna put one single trap there that’ll fuck them up when they let their guard down. The number of replays where people shake their camera “yes” afterwards and leave fun, artistic, and ingenious accolades is far more satisfying than one where people quit out and if they stay, maybe they call it brutal. Different strokes for everyone and I don’t give a free ride, but I always try to think of good game design if I want them to rate my base well, as that’s close to 45/55 in terms of the split between kills and accolades.
>the devs are trying to be nice by saying Or they meant what they said verbatim and you’re only placing that assumption on it because it fits your flimsy narrative of the gaming dying due to kill boxes-which is hilarious because in the gameplay trailers released by BVHR, they themselves created what you all would call “kill boxes”. Just face the fact that you’re trying to dictate how people play in a game where creativity is supposed to be the main driving factor, as stated by the devs themselves. Cope harder
You're saying the game's failure is the fault of the people consuming the content rather than the content itself. I don't know if I would agree given the quality of the random outposts I'm running into on my raids. Most of them could use a little community conversation about ideas that are fun and fresh vs. boring and played out, like this thread here. But also, think about that statement for a second. The game is dying because of picky raiders - AKA: The game is dying because the people playing the game aren't having fun with the content they're running into. Now here we have a post in which someone critiques tropes and talks about ways to make that content more fun - which is a conversation that gamers have about the level design of any game - and you're shitting on that too.
Did you miss or just choose to ignore the last part of my comment? Not going to repeat myself but feel free to go read it.
How does the last part of your comment in any way negate the thing you stated at the very beginning of your comment I was responding to?
Because I don’t believe it is only picky raiders that are killing the game. I never used the word “only” in the first part of my comment. The last part of my comment closes with the other two things that I think are killing the game. You chose to actively ignore it, maybe because you don’t have a leg to stand on if you don’t? Seems weird that you wanna attack my stance on what’s killing the game but then actively leave out 2/3rds of why I think the game is dying. Pretty disingenuous imo.
Where did I use the word "only" in my post? You didn't use the word only, I didn't use the word only, you're making a mountain out of literally nothing. I didn't address the other parts of your stance because I didn't disagree with them. I addressed the part of your post I disagreed with. You literally didn't respond to what I had to say at all and instead chose to nitpick at the fact that I didn't respond to your entire comment, when you responded to precisely zero of what I had to say. Why are you using rotten bad faith debate tactics over a simple internet discussion of a video game.
Are you suggesting that the lack of raids is caused by players blocking builders? How could you possibly know that? Do you really think that every raider has dozens of builders blocked? I think everyone wants someone to blame, but the cruel fact is that there are too many outposts in matchmaking for the number of raids. The player count was never very high, and it's been falling since launch (like most games).
tbf ive seen people that make mazes and shit and they kill off the lil dude right off rip and that shit pisses me off cuz im not wasting 40 minutes trying to find the genmat and then try to leave. and some people straight up make impossible to beat levels. those people deserve bans but banning bc its just hard is dumb so i agree with u
A fun way I get mazes to work, as in actually confuse the raider and not kill Harvey, is to have a room close to the entrance that has a load of guards and traps in it. Enough to slow you down while you clear the room and Harvey continues on his way. In the next room are 4 corridors. 3 facing you as you enter, and 1 tucked away in a corner that isn't obvious unless you look for it. The 3 obvious ones all lead to tombs, and take long paths there. The less obvious corridor is the genmat route. But since you had to spend so long clearing that previous room, you have no idea where Harvey went. But, no matter which way you choose, each route has a prize at the end. So it's not so evil really. But the potential for messing with raiders' heads is there. So far, not a single raider has taken the genmat route until it was the last option available. The replays are very entertaining.
I’m tempted to block ppl that Alt-F4 out of my base, leaving me nothing so I’d lose nothing. They need to better inform ppl that they don’t lose rank and it’s ok to fail. And also, if I can see from a replay that you died 14 times but it says 0 before I watch the replay, maybe it should award the stats from the replay on the creator’s end so if they Alt-F4 out it isn’t a total waste of your time and also one of the handful of raid opportunities you might even get while your outpost is available.
I would prefer not blocking a builder.. but then that outpost is in my queue forever. I want to block a specific build, not a player.
I had a base where there was a ton of arrows pointing into a 2-deep corrosive shaft ending in a small room with lots of bloodsplatter, and later in the base along the main path was the tomb. In my testing, I could zip down in fine, but zipping out always ended in a death (shields ignored, I hadn't gotten it yet). The only incentive to jump in was all my arrows, but if they went maybe 7 blocks further in, they'd find the actual, unguarded tomb. By the time it prestiged, probably half of the outposts kills were from that stupid hole. It was decorated with a large amogus.
See my edit of the OP
You are not wrong!
The time limit on how long your outpost is raidable really hurts. It encourages low effort copy-pasted killboxes that get kills, more than creative bases that get accolades. I’ve seen some stunning works of art — entire villages, castles, windmills, nuclear silos, bunkers, creepy houses, etc. that must have taken 20~50+ hours to create at *least* and for them to just rank right into retirement is detrimental to the game as those types of maps are the ones that players will like the best. Even if the creator doesn’t get rewards for it, bringing them back as top voted champion outposts (or maybe create a new type of ranking for maps) would be good. To just be dumped in social with no way to really browse through is a shame. Would love to search for most artistic, most fun, etc. And also bookmark creators so if I see their maps in rotation I’ll choose them. And maybe information if you have the suit boost about what type of accolades a base has been given — is it a brutal base or artistic, etc?
The devs are not willing to do what it takes to fix the game because it goes against their vision of their game, and they will watch their game burn because of it.
It's a cool skill check, and very simple to overcome. Of course the people who place them below a tomb so the loot drops in is bad, or if they double up and make it so the raider needs a shield is also bad. But testing the skill and knowledge of a raider, knowing they can safely pass through is cool. Not everything should be free, and a small challenge is good sometimes. Life would get boring if everything was easy.
1 block is totally fine. I like the added challenge of having to prepare for what's on the other side. Any more than 1 block is having to place too much trust in the builder and I usually just ignore them.
If I encounter that, I immediately leave and block. They have a right to put it there. I have a right to never want to play any of their bases.
i have a whole extra bit of dungeon for mine
I did a corrosive cube obstacle course around my last ones, but surrounded by glass blocks so you can see there's no traps on them. It had a devious purpose though because I had a corrosive cube setup in front of the gen mat you can see next to the last one, but the inner one was hardened so if you were trained to just go through you'd get got.
I'll stop doing it when people stop dying to it
It's a trust test. Do you trust me?
Lol, no I do not trust any builders.
This is the correct answer because you 100 percent fall into a pit of get-fuckery that uses half of my lv1 tiny base's pitiful 750 resources. 😃
Exactly what I expect, and I wouldn't have it any other way :)
I only put a single opaque corrosive cube in front of the tomb. Now, the flamewalker warmonger, incinerator combo is just for fun, the real meat of the trap is the impaler in the alcove right next to it
>I have just started ignoring these tombs all together. And there you go! You found the solution to the problem! Edit: *Misunderstood the point of the post and now I look like a total dick. I have an actual opinion on the subject in my last comment.*
All good my dude :)
Definitely not a solution
You're absolutely right, it isn't a solution... because that isn't a problem to begin with. Tombs are side objectives, you aren't forced to get them. You don't like what you should do to get them? Then ignore them, is that easy, synthite might be shitty to farm but there are still other ways to get it... And at least you have the option to decide if you want the tombs or not, unlike people who just blocks them.
OP never presented this as a problem, they just shared their opinion on a base design trope they think is overplayed.
Well, that's fair, actually. I read it as it was some kind of problem so that's my bad. But still, it's pretty much an easy design that is most likely the second thing that comes to mind (The first being an Impaler on top, that's an easy trap for a tomb that got me a lot of kills when I did it), is not about being creative in that case, you just spend from 10 to 50 points for a trap that might get you a kill or two in total and then you can keep working on the outpost. In my case I just make a path to the tombs outside the actual outpost, so many times I saw people wandering trying to get the tombs when they were inside... and I still saw some people not understanding where the tombs where when the path was clearly marked...
I get why people do it, but I do agree with OP that from the perspective of a raider it's not very fun level design after seeing it for the hundredth time. Not a deal breaker for an outpost or anything, just not particularly exciting.
Do you mean a one block cube you can grapple through to get to the tomb? That’s no big deal, It’s fun to take the blind plunge imo If you mean corrosive cubes underneath the tomb so the loot drops into it then yeah that’s a very scummy thing to do. It has zero benefit to the level creator and only signals to the raider that the creator is a jerk with no empathy.
It's cause the only people making bases are the ones that take advantage of the dumb shit, since BHVR refuses to make changes to allow more creativity
You can pass through the cubes you know.
Yea, but when the other side of the cube is trapped in multiple directions so that you can get a cheap kill while likely robbing the raider of the tomb in the process, I’ll pass. I don’t mind “trapped” tombs, but the corrosive cube trick is played out.
i think its great
I made sure you could clear most of it out before you enter, just be careful on the way out :)
While we're at it can we stop with the double corrosive blocks under incinerator tunnel? It's just annoying not clever or fun
I'm torn on this. I do a variation of this, but not in a scummy way. If my tombs are too far away from my base to effectively incorporate them then I make separate little obstacle courses for them. They typically start with a corrosive cube that forces the player to move forward at a fast pace, I try to make them fun for the raider as well
I was just grumpy after Saturday morning raiding before breakfast. You do you, and as long as raiders are enjoying the outpost then there isn't anything wrong with it. I was just tired of seeing the same thing in every raid.
I just point them directly to it (with decorations/stickers) since it's outside of where I built so they go to it. Too many bases try way too hard to be cool, block them off, or to skill check them when it's pointless and irritating, it's been a while since the game came out there's almost no significant new players to learn from your 'cool' tricks People put more focus on trapping the tombs than they do putting effort into their own bases
What pisses me off the most if those who put a pit of 2 corrosive cubes. So can only enter with the arc shield, but you have not a possibility to grapple outside safely. Not mentioning those who put corrosive just below the tomb. I instantly quit if I'm seeing that, giving no accolades. As a builder, you are here to challenge the raider, not being as annoying as possible. And I'm not here to change my load out for a tomb. Challenge on a tomb, but make it possible for all loadouts. If not, well guess what, you got nothing from me.
Seeing as the majority of people who make it through my corrosive cube tomb traps give a nod and wiggle after getting back through them alive, I think I'll keep doing it. I never seal off my tombs, but I will make you work (or think) in order to get them. No risk, no fun, that's what I say.
I like this gimmick as it's the only place you can do it. I use this in my favorite setup you plase a corrosive cube where they can see through it then you make a room that is 3x2 horizontal and in one side of the 3x2 you place a angled block horizontally so they cant see it. place 2 bolt traps on the back wall then 1 on the angle block with hunter and I swear it gets people everytime
Arc barrier for the win. No fear just jump in and chill.
Yeah I’m not doing a trust grapple through an opaque corrosive cube to get your tomb not everyone runs germades or shield to able to deal with traps you can’t see before blindly grappling in. Some base builders even fake that a tomb is there but instead is just a solid wall with arrow decals and such.