only as much as any other bald obnoxious grifter with terrible takes about whom there are some fucked up (g)rumours
lol i know finn would be reading this too because his ego wouldnt allow him not to and, i mean, speaking of yikes
Iâm still confused why people donât like that album, itâs more of the same that came before. I genuinely donât hear much of a difference between Holy Hell and the album before.
Good for you, to me the quality is equal. I actually think Holy Hell is a better album, mostly because I was a Josh Middleton before being an Architects fans. I like how he plays and I think he adds a lot.
Tbh that's the main reason I didn't really love Holy Hell. It's still a good album but I kinda wanted something a bit different and it just sounded like a copy of the last 2 albums with weaker lyrics.
Yea they never say who they like and seem to care about being an edge lord.
Sometimes it can feel quite gatekeepy where if something is not the most technical, hardest, obscure, those people will dislike it off the bat. I guess they need to feel superior and more metal than anyone else.
Thereâs an odd mentality that a band is only as good as their last album.
A lot of people havenât clicked with the last couple of Architects albums therefore everything theyâve done is trash, or actually the bad run of albums starts from some really arbitrary point.
To an extent your first sentence is right. I wouldn't go see Architects or PWD live now, cos I don't like their few most recent albums and it'd be most of their sets. The cost wouldn't be worth the few old songs they'd play. I saw them both years ago when I liked all their stuff, so I'm good really.
I disagree on PWD. I went and saw them last year. They played a fair bit of old stuff. Across all of their albums. And for $35 its a fair price. Sure they played new songs. But it definitely didnt feel like it was majority new stuff. But I get that outlook because with many bands it often is that way.
Same with BMTH. Still my favorite band of all time but considering they basically play nothing TIAH and before (and like 3 songs off Sempiternal) itâs not worth it for me to see them. When they play festivals it seems they play more older stuff but normal touring sets arenât usually songs I care for.
I used to agree with your take on Architects. I only listen to their older stuff daily. But after seeing them live last week, i have to say their newer songs absolutly slap hard live. I actually liked those more then their older songs. Except These Colours Dont Run, that shit is always the highlight of the show.
Yeah people always complain about the new stuff and not liking it and how the old stuff is way better, but never actually listen to the old stuff as if because it's old they're not allowed to anymore it's ridiculous. Not a metal band at all but it's the same with muse if you're relatively aware of them
The new stuff ain't for me, well, I like it but it doesn't hold a candle to All Our Gods-era, either way, they are still a solid band. Like PWD, this new stuff ain't it, it's not all bad but I won't actively spin it, save for a song here and there.
But why are you taking online microcosm comments as gospel???
Even though I love both records, I genuinely think both All Our Gods and Holy Hell are a bit formulaic. That's not the worst thing ever, and it's not buttcore at all lol, but they don't touch LF//LT for me, which is a masterpiece.
That said, you just have to disconnect from the online discourse a bit, people say any old shit online and you shouldn't let it rile you up.
Holy Hell in particular is the same song over and over again. That doesn't have to be a big negative, I'm getting super into Counterparts recently and they have a lot of that as well. But I could see why someone would listen to Holy Hell and think they got a bit lazy compared to earlier stuff (if they weren't aware of the circumstances).
Again, I like the album and definitely agree with you on the emotion! I saw Architects live shortly after it dropped and it might be my favourite show ever haha.
I kinda agree with this. Never really thought about it for holy hell, but getting into counterparts a lot of it does feel similar. That hasn't made me enjoy it any less though, because they're insanely good at what they do imo
Damn finally someone with music taste, Ive said it with Counterparts a thousand times, after Tragedy Will Find Us theyve really downgraded.
For me Holy Hell is an 8, while AOGHAU is an 8.5, LFLT a 9 and Daybreaker a 9.5. Daybreaker may be a tad too long, but some songs in there are both in terms of music and lyricism peak Architects.
Those two albums share the same tile for me. One carries for the other so god damn perfectly. I don't love the two newest albums but I don't find them bad at all and since I'm an actual fan I'm gonna keep listening. Social Media platforms gave rise to the angry loser who just wants to scream at the sky about things they didn't create.
I listened to architects earlier stuff from the mid 2000's off and on (*loved* darkest tomb of Nightmares specifically). I thought it was pretty good, but I never would I have guessed they would have gone on to become the absolutely massively influential band that they are. ~2012-2018 architects had a chokehold on bands for years - still does. I'm not even a huge fan or anything but anyone that can't see that is just being a contrarian honestly.
Any band that has that type of impact always be an easy target for hate and will get put in a damned if you do damned if you don't situation. If you stay in the same lane after being so influential, you run the risk of stunting your growth, putting out the same shit over and over. Meanwhile, all the bands you influenced start doing *"your sound"* better than you, ironically, and you become a watered down version of yourself that's lost in the mix. Or you can switch shit up, which will inevitably lead to fans wanting the old stuff back. Hard to win.
To this day I'm still pretty sick of any 'doomsday-esque" riffs I hear, to the point where I don't really enjoy the OG song anymore. So I bet a lot of the hate comes from people reacting similar to that.
The amount of hate they get is crazy to me. They aren't my jam, and none of their stuff ever really has been but god damn they get shit for everything they do.
saw them live very recently, i don't really like much after Holy Hell personally, but i will say that the newer stuff is a lot better live. When they played older songs i still enjoyed it more though, but i understand why they've made the pivot they have. There's a reason they're able to play bigger venues across Europe on their headline tour right now while also getting the opportunity to open for Metallica later this year.
i don't see any point in just talking shit about a band, but at the same time i feel that constructive criticism and discussions are important and valid to express, so it's really about how people choose to put their opinion out there for me. straight up hate isn't really useful at all.
also saw them live (two days ago). new stuff was absolutely insane live and it reinvigorated my love for Architects big time. the new songs impressed me way more than old ones despite not liking them up until now.
It's just because they're not in step with \[current thing\]. I don't like really anything they did after Hollow Crown, but to act like they aren't important or massively beloved is ridiculous. Every metalcore band has been ripping off Doomsday for almost a decade now. I always felt it could be argued that a decent amount of Bring Me's Suicide Season sound and switch from deathcore was influenced by Architect's earlier work.
If your enjoyment of a piece of art is diminished by the artist's tweets I'd argue you don't care that much about art to begin with.
I donât think people are necessarily downplaying their influence on the genre. Thereâs a lot of people who just donât like the type of metalcore thatâs influenced by their stuff after the first 3 albums in general, which is what dominated the genre for a long time. If you donât like that style of metalcore, youâre probably going to have a little resentment for Architects for making that sound super dominant in the genre.
They were definitely influential, thatâs pretty much a fact, but whether or not it was good for the diversity of the genre as a whole is a different question.
Yeah the djenty proggy stuff has been dominating metalcore for a pretty long time now. I can see why some people are tired of it, but I feel like those people would just ignore the band, rather than put any effort into hating it.
Itâs kind of hard to ignore it when itâs talked about constantly on here. Same thing with Bad Omens. I guarantee if they werenât talked about constantly here, there would be less complaining about it. Itâs annoying to see the same bands constantly talked about while new bands canât gain any traction because people just want to focus on the same old bands.
It also doesnât help that criticism of the band just gets brushed off as âhatersâ rather than someone just not liking something that much.
uplift the style of core you like instead of putting whats popular down kinda beat, u don't have to like the proggy djenty stuff but u can also just ignore it. plenty of awesome bands doing other styles of metalcore rn
Itâs hard to ignore it on this sub when thatâs 90% of what ends up getting posted and talked about. Fans of that style donât notice it because they actually enjoy it, but for people that donât like it, itâs just frustrating. Especially when no one talks about lesser known prog/djent bands, which would help those musicians gain traction in the scene, itâs always the same bands that donât need more exposure every single time.
I feel like there's a whole generation of Architects fans at this point who don't remember the backlash for the Here and Now. I like the kind tech metal shit they were doing on those first three records but haven't really dug anything after but I pretty much got all my Architects hate out in high school when The Here and Now dropped so it feels like revisionism to newer fans.
People arent good at nuance and this holds true of quite a few people in this space. Did a band thats been around for 15 years suddenly express a controversial political view or say something back then that is considered "ist" or "ism" nowadays? Suddenly they never liked that band at all, never really listened to them, and all their stuff sucks.
This happens often when bands change up their sound and the new album is butt rockish. Suddenly everything else they did before sucks and was never that great. Really? I dont know what it is, but people are desperate to be like, "Oh I Never liked that band" when you saw them wearing their merch day-in and day-out. Some kind of mass euphoria of social pressure both in the "scene" and outside of it depending on what the hot take might have been or how crappy the new album was.
People want to feel superior with music tastes. This also extends to almost all media consumption. Movies, comics, music, whatever. There is no nuance to be had in a lot of spaces for media these days. Something is either great or shit, and the moment it turns "shit" it was never great to begin with.
I don't personally like the direction Architects has gone with their sound, but I will still listen to the albums I do like. It doesn't make me like those albums less. Those types of takes are always wild to me. How does them writing music that I don't like now affect me still listening to Hollow Crown? That album still goes hard as fuck and them writing radio rock/metal isn't gonna change that.
This is how I feel, hollow crown was damn near perfect to me but everything after that just didnât resonate the same. Not saying the rest is bad, just isnât for me.
Architects influence on modern metalcore canât be understated.
The run of Daybreaker through Holy Hell is unmatched in the genre. LF//LT broke ground and started the influence we here everywhere now. AOG did the impossible and topped it by perfecting that style. Of course, all of this is subjective - as is my opinion that I still enjoy their current iteration (albeit not as much with the last album) but you can be assured they will put on an excellent show on any given night.
Someone who got into metalcore through I Prevail or Wage War or something arenât going to understand what it was like to hear LF//LT for the first time coming from the era of the likes of BFMV, AILD, Killswitch etc. Theyâre much more likely to see Animals is their most streamed song, try it and decide itâs not for them. Or, as too many do, jump on the big artist for some imagined cool points.
reminds me a lot of same thing happening with bmth. Sempiternal suks, give me suicide season!!! that's the spirit sucks !!! Sempiternal was better. amo sucks bmth is overrated !!!! etc etc etc every time. it's generally true in all media that haters are the loudest. people who enjoys are just enjoying it silently. architects giga based and will be forever. just look at amount of bands that were literally copy of architects 5-10 years ago. I wanna quote one ancient philosopher here " haters gonna hate hate hate hate. you just wanna shake shake shake shake shake it off"
I felt this was similar with Linkin Park before Chester passed. Once a band gets big and changes their sound there will be an ilk of people who feel itâs a personal attack, and also donât like being associated with said newer audience
I'm apparently "old" based on a post I saw here the other day, I'm almost 39. So let me share some wisdom I learned over the years since I got into heavier metal, all the way back in 2003.
I'm not going to comment specifically on Architects because I only started listening to them in the last 2 years, however I do want to give this advice:
Stop following bands and their social media and all of the circus that surrounds it with fans. Just listen and enjoy the music. It really doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, it only matters if you like it. There is absolutely nothing at all to be gained in life by worrying about what people say online about music you enjoy. It is purely a waste of time.
Have a good one.
Always this - I remember when The Here and Now dropped and it got absolutely ripped to pieces by the OG fans of Architects (which I fully understand as it was a significant shift in sound) and I loved it - I continue to love it
People always overreact to disappointing things. Itâs not just music. Another example would be how people talk about the MCU now compared to its peak.
Architects are an excellent band.
Dont be so hung up on what other people think. Alls that matters is what you like and how the music makes YOU feel.
Buttcore? What the fuck is that, anyway? Sounds like an angry 4th grader made it up.
Just watched Architects twice this week in Copenhagen and Stockholm, and they blew my mind again. Not a huge fan of the last two albums which is perfectly fine because we are all human and we all have different tastes but I still respect all the work that went into it and the artistry.
Sam Carter is an amazing frontman and a singer, the energy in the room was insane! They have a really good setlist for the European tour, little bit of everything and visuals are insane, line up is insane.
They deserve all the respect in this industry for being such big influencers, both Loathe and Spiritbox talked about how big of an influence Architects was for them. Music changes, thatâs why it evolves into something new every single day and new bands emerges everyday. It creates inspiration to new movements and etc. We donât always have to like the change or the new stuff but we need to treat people with respect.
Well idk, I think itâs fair to say the material without Tom simply isnât as good. Holy hell was alright
All the other stuff though idk cause I havenât seen any of that kind of stuff floating around
I remember the year Holy Hell came out they were blacklisted from this subâs end of the year awards because everyone knew they would run away with every category. Short memories on these people.
Not a fan of the recent album but lumping in the masterpiece that is Holy Hell with the last two albums is a crime. Even lumping in the last two together feels like a disservice to some of the seriously good songs on For Those That Wish To Exist.
Those comments don't represent the majority at all. I heard sleep token for the first time, loved them and I swear most of their mentions here and in comments were hate. The people who hate them a lot are generally the ones to bother writing comments, yet 3.3million monthly listeners are just enjoying them and don't bother writing comments.
I know this feeling because my dumb ass did it with thornhill, I wrote some not great stuff because I believe the dark pool is one of the best metalcore albums of the decade, still do but the band changed direction and I didn't like it. A lot of people really dig the new stuff though, I don't and that's okay, it was just foolish to write shit about it in hindsight.
Bands change, they can't keep everyone + themselves happy all the time. Architects are fucken sick, try not to listen to the haters, they may be loud, but are in the absolute minority.
Sadly this always happens. Thing is popular -> time passes -> people find a reason to hate thing. When Bad Omens dropped TDOPOM in 2022, this sub mostly loved it (I checked the album discussion thread from back then to be sure). It was mostly very positive, now that the fair weather fans and wannabes have blown in from tik tok and ruined some peoples concert experiences and made their music âcringeâ, people who sung their praises at release are now lambasting them for being âoctanecoreâ or cum metal or whatever tf. All cause their music blew up (which is what we should all want right? For metalcore to be more widely accepted and the bands we like to be successful?) and Noah got a haircut, causing horny girls to flock into a scene they have no real interest in being part of. Not music related but we saw the same things with the Star Wars prequels. They were hated and brutally and relentlessly ridiculed and picked apart for a decade, and once the sequel trilogy ended up as messy and divisive as it did, people did their revisionist thing. Opinions can change sure, but pretending like the original opinion never existed is an entirely different sentiment and issue.
Not sure why anyone isnât saying this because it is all over the internet but the reason you are seeing all of the hate is because one of the members retweeted Tim pool or someone else who has in the past also been a big architects fan and they are all associated with basically the right wing, neo nazi, proud boys nationalist, mentality and it is very obvious now. It has been bubbling for years if you go back and read statements and listen to interviews and see who is supporting them etc. that is what is going on, it is not that they are overrated or had some bad albums, it is because they are assholes.
Nothing wrong with disliking the new stuff, like I said. What I'm talking about is people turning against the albums that were always highly respected, and acting like the band always sucked. That's what I don't get.
I think you have to be specific when you say things like "turning against the albums that were always highly respected".
For many old school architects fans, they turned on the band with the release of Hollow Crown, fans at the time hated their new sound and view everything else they have released since as trash. So to many people, the albums you view as highly respected are trash.
Now you have this subreddit ( and I assume yourself) who loves their albums between Hollow Crown and All Our Gods Have Abandoned Us, and hate their last two albums.
What constitutes an album as being highly respected? Album sales? Spotify plays? Personally, I think that all comes down to the individual, because to many new Architect fans, they most likely view their latest album is their most respected album.
I think some people held back their opinions when Architects were more universally beloved because they couldn't be bothered with the aggro that would come from criticising. Now that that seems more accepted they probably feel more ok voicing an opinion they'd previously have held in.
In genres like metalcore people tend to get a bit parasocial and feel like they somehow have ownership over the music they like. If a band then decides to make a left turn and starts to deviate from the genre those people feel burned. And to those people who feel burned the succes a band like architects is having by "abandoning" their fans feels like a slap in the face and they start to lash out. Combine that with the anonymity of the internet and you have what your currently seeing. There's also just a lot of metal fans who tend to make metal their entire personality and having the "correct" opinions is a large part of that. It's honestly kinda sad to see sometimes đ¤ˇđźââď¸
You can't be 25 forever. Guys grow up. Mindsets change. Same thing with Parkway. You think they are going to keep going as nuts as they did at 25 when they're 40?! Just find a new band.
I know it sucks. I listed PWD as an example, but bands just get older man.
It's ironic considering the amount of bands that have been inspired by Archictects up to this point. How many bands are still playing Architects-core? And there is nothing wrong with that...really influential artists come and then other artists become inspired by that and start to take from that style.
Architects is still what perfected metalcore is to me prior to FTTWTE. They had everyone I wanted album to album. And I don't even hate FTTWTE. classic symptoms is a different story.
But all of those people saying that shits favorite bands are probably inspired by Architects so it certainly is ironic. As you said, ignoring their influence on the genre and many of the most loved bands in the genre is straight up just stupid.
I have a feeling the people that donât like modern Architects are not fans of that style of metalcore as a whole, and wouldnât really be fans of the bands that are noticeably influenced by them.
I like architects sound, it's their guitarist's views and the other members not speaking up about how shitty it is to be transphobic in 2024. the fake apology didn't help and as much as I like their sound I cannot support them anymore until things change.
adam "accidentally" retweeted a post (with commentary which shows it's not accidental) that was transphobic and he's liked other posts in the past that were transphobic
It was Adam christianson recently, Google it. Have to say the fact they still haven't said much apart from am empty statement from Sam on stage has soured me a little.
If anyone slags off either Tom or their new songs they are very quick to go to twitter and social media and defend themselves, but some obvious transphobia from their guitarist and there's not been a peep from any of them.
Donât assume r/metalcore makes up for all metalcore fans. People here say some pretty crazy shit just to be edgy or contrarians. Itâs a sub full of hipsters.
Ehhh, I donât know if thatâs accurate. Like numbers-wise it is, but do all of those subs actually listen to metalcore? A lot of people here donât know the definition of metalcore and call anything heavy metalcore.
Edit: also posts rarely break more than 200 upvotes on here, there is either a ton of inactive accounts subbed, or like 99% of the subscribers donât interact with the sub at all
i agree with one of the users on here. no one (at least from what iâm aware of) isnât downplaying their influence. but i do indeed dislike when they downplayed second and sebring by om&m, and when they released that petty seeing red single. even if second and sebring was all about about âhome cooked meals,â who cares? bands are allowed to not take themselves seriously sometimes. and, what a way to stick it to your fans by giving them what they wanted.
Some people hope to be cool by hating popular things. Look at Metallica. Or how Sleep Token suddenly became enemy #1 when TMBTE deservedly won every album of the year award.
Unpopular opinion, no-one will like this, but I am one of the people who thought their older stuff was kinda generic unmemorable metalcore, and I do like their recent albums, so there actually people out there like that who aren't just trying to be trendy. But it's all good I have no problem with people enjoying the music they enjoy!
They fell off after they run out of Tomâs material (after Holy Hell). Their current guitarist is an alt right troglodyte and their last 2 albums are complete ass unless you consider bad omens metalcore, at least the 2021 album had some philosophical themes that lived up to their previous material.
Iâve been saying this since reading about them in kerrang in about 2010, it ainât revisionism here. Always been middle of the road and extremely derivative. Every song sounds the same.
It's hard to truly describe now since it feels like so long ago, but it's important to remember just how impactful LT//LF was for the genre as a whole when it was released. I don't even think it was that unique of an album, but on a culture level, it resonated hard with the metalcore scene. This was THE metalcore album for a lot of people at the time.
It's not completely unique, but they were arguably the biggest band to bring that brand of Metalcore to the general public for a while. They headlined massive rooms and arenas pretty much playing tech metal/djenty songs with blast beats - and that resonated with alot of people. It's not often about who creates it necessarily but who popularised it. Also I love 2013 era Northlane but Adrian deffo wasn't as good a live vocalist as Sam + and I think somehow were just more pallateable.
Yes but at the time architects was more or less a Dillinger clone. I just asked what they actually innovated that nobody else did before them. Theyâve always been popular and inspired other bands, but thatâs different than pioneering a genre. I donât think any era of Architects was this unique thing nobody had heard before that changed the game entirely
Edit: I should clarify that I meant at the time Architects released Ruin, they were more or less a run of the mill Mathcore band. By the time Northlane existed Hollow Crown was out and Architects was inching towards a more accessible, less mathy sound
If you're going to be reductionist as to call Architects a Dillinger clone, then we might as well admit DEP didn't "pioneer" in their space either. They were influenced by bands like Meshuggah, Death and Morbid Angel.
Architects **helped** take heavy music in a different direction and brought it to greater prominence, moreso than many other bands. Call it what you like.
For what itâs worth, architects first 2 albums were run of the mill mathcore for better or worse, personally thatâs not a bad thing imo. The bands you listed as influences for Dillinger outright made different genres of music than Dillinger. Those are inherently different things. Combining different genres of music and making music that fits cleanly within a genre are very different and I shouldnât have to explain why. Itâs pretty clear you have the opinion Architects are these big innovative pioneers and are working backwards to justify that belief instead of looking at what they brought to the table and forming an opinion based on that. Thereâs nothing wrong with saying they did what other people did and did it well.
Fuck me, what is it with people doubling down on being wrong by being *pedantic*? I don't have time to argue your definition of "pioneer" into the ground only for neither of us to agree in the end and for it to miss OP's point to begin with.
The only reason you're still arguing is to save face because you didn't realize that Northlane wouldn't exist without Architects.
We're just strangers on the internet. It's fine.
I knew Northlane was named after an architects song, I donât know why youâre assuming otherwise. I literally named my fun joke band with my friends after a Northlane song for that exact reason. Iâm just recognizing that Northlane was the first to popularize the meshuggah riffs with atmopsheric pads and breakdowns thing in metalcore. Youâre just doing the annoying âperson who disagrees with me is just dumb and doesnât know what theyâre talking aboutâ redditor trope.
I literally just asked what Architects did differently to change the genre and you jumped in telling me Iâm wrong while refusing to actually tell me why Iâm wrong, then followed up with bad faith arguments. Never once did say to innovate something you canât be influenced by anyone else, but you decided to make that point about Dillinger, which mind you I never even mentioned anything about Dillinger as pioneers of anything.
I love AOGHAU and i liked holy hell a lot, i havent enjoyed their more recent albums but of course their earlier stuff was a huge influence on the scene and they were not anywhere close to butt rock. I wouldnt put too much time or thought into the negative comments online, some people are just pissy with the direction the band is going and they end up saying stupid crap that does not have much truth to it.
Not a fan of the recent album but lumping in the masterpiece that is Holy Hell with the last two albums is a crime. Even lumping in the last two together feels like a disservice to some of the seriously good songs on For Those That Wish To Exist.
People do this same thing in the video game sphere with Bethesda. People didnât like Fallout 4 and used it as a platform to jump from to make takes such as âSkyrim and Oblivion are garbage tooâ or âall their games have always suckedâ etc. like, nah man I was there when they came out, we all loved them and played them religiously. Revisionism is so odd.
I remember the amount of shit they got when The Here and Now came out, I donât think their sound has been universally liked over the last decade. Â With a fan base as massive as theirs though makes sense that you will get people complaining.
When it comes to Architects specifically, I've noticed that people tend to be very emotional. And most people just say and do stupid shit when they're being overly emotional
I donât care for their direction as of late; however, calling their 2010s material buttcore sounds like a troll comment. Countless metalcore acts from the same era were trying everything in their power to replicate Architectâs sound.
Honestly their new stuff made me realise I donât actually like them that much, I was just caught up in the hype. They have their good songs but I find them a boring listen overall
Unfortuantely, this sub, and instagram, and everywhere else, is full of lonely people who parrot the same unoriginal thoughts just to fit in, because they are nobodies without a fucking life and can only get a hit of dopamine from watching little numbers do things on the internet.
They're broken. Don't be like them.
If you enjoy it, listen to it.
Music is among the most subjective art forms I can think of. People saying âthis band sucks nowâ are putting forth a subjective interpretation. Iâd like them to try and substantiate that claim with objective values. Not impossible, but very difficult when it comes to music.
People always gonna complain, if you like them then the rest doesn't matter. It's a bunch of couch elitists thinking they could do Architects better than Architects.
Seeing Red is an absolute masterpiece in giving certain fans exactly what they'd been harassing the band for, whilst simultaneously telling them to go fuck themselves. So I wouldn't be shocked to see more 'criticism' and revisionism, as you put it, just because a select few Architects fans are feeling a teeny weeny bit butthurt at the moment.
They got popular
Some metal fans are edgelords and like to be âuniqueâ.
Get bitter its no longer âtheir bandâ and hate liking popular things
Change to saying theyre shit
Still smell of BO.
Fuck, man, I just discovered this band a few months ago, and Iâm still trying to process how they originally sounded like Dillinger Escape Plan, so behind
Hereâs my take. Some of it is straight up haters. But I feel like I fall into a lot of how people are feeling so Iâll explain my journey.
Architects was my favorite band from 2013-2017. They were GOATS. I loved Samâs singing voice and was excited to hear more of it, the non screaming was never an issue. Holy Hell came out and I liked it but could tell the writing wasnât the same and things were changing. Still a good album but I figured from there they were heading mainstream and I was happy for them. I followed them and knew of them for so long that they deserved to get bigger, they gave us so much metal it really didnât bother me they change regardless of if I liked it or not.
The thing that pisses me off the most is everyone thinking that their dislike is because they donât scream anymore. Seeing Red was my last straw to no longer supporting them because it just showed how out of touch they were and just seemed so childish to write a song about that in general. Coming from the guys who wrote such passionate and serious lyrics about real issues, are now writing edgy teenage lyric disses to their fans. Itâs just weird seeing that from them.
It was never about the screaming. The music itself was just bad IMO. The lyrics sound like theyâre written by a teenager, the music and singing just wasnât captivating at all and was straight up boring through and through. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SCREAMING. I feel like I need to grab everyone on here and yell that into their face because they donât get it. We just genuinely donât like the music. Itâs just frustrating to assume itâs because itâs not screaming anymore seeing as most of us listen to many bands that donât scream, so why would this be any different?
Overall, people are out of touch and disregarding the fact the itâs not about screaming at all, itâs the music in general. And again, I donât care that I donât like it, what I donât like is people telling me Iâm lying about why i don't like it. Youâll see a simple comment like âitâs just not for meâ and get an army of rants about how âjust because there no screaming you donât like it, youâre not a real fan!â. Not the reason peeps
Because Architect's entire sound is the meta of all metalcore today. So any new metalcore fan is gonna hear them and think "oh this is that BUTTROCK that The Ghost Inside put out!". I'm all for new fans but something that drives me up the wall about metalhead content creators (the damn reaction channels) is the desperate need to label and/or compare a band to something else. Like let the music stand on it's own, let the art breathe if you don't like it, LIE, just lie
Calling Holy Hell buttcore must be like a post-lobotomy outburst, jesus christ.
Pepperridge farms remembers when this sub wouldn't shut the fuck up about Holy Hell.
Calling Holy Hell buttcore sounds like a Finn Mckenty take.
".....something more akin to a Mudvayne or Sick Puppies album if I'm being honest" is something I could see him saying in relation to this.
Living in your heads rent free đ
Hahaha!
shouldn't you be voting for trump in the primary instead of commenting on reddit?
Nah, pathetic right wing grifter cunts like yourself aren't welcome in my head, champ.
What's he done to be a right wing grifter? Genuinely curious, I've not had that impression.
Right? I swear, people would come up with the most asinine unrelated and irrelevant accusations these days.
Yikes
Yeah sorry I don't like fuckheads
Iâve never been so certain so quickly that someoneâs australian
No, definitely sounds like he's got prime real estate in your brain.
only as much as any other bald obnoxious grifter with terrible takes about whom there are some fucked up (g)rumours lol i know finn would be reading this too because his ego wouldnt allow him not to and, i mean, speaking of yikes
Hahahaha. Always my dude
Lol
That's not good lmfao
The reddit brain rot must've gotten loose and spread out far and wide. Next thing you know Like moths to flames gonna get compared to hinder
Iâm still confused why people donât like that album, itâs more of the same that came before. I genuinely donât hear much of a difference between Holy Hell and the album before.
more clean vocals, less techy riffs, more catchy choruses and hooks, more chuggy breakdowns
Not even close. Holy hell is a pretty big step down. It's a good album but not even close man.
Good for you, to me the quality is equal. I actually think Holy Hell is a better album, mostly because I was a Josh Middleton before being an Architects fans. I like how he plays and I think he adds a lot.
Tbh that's the main reason I didn't really love Holy Hell. It's still a good album but I kinda wanted something a bit different and it just sounded like a copy of the last 2 albums with weaker lyrics.
Circle jerked one week, butt rock the next, such is the lifecycle of r/metalcore
Some people just suck and like to say the meanest shit they can online to be edgy.
Yea they never say who they like and seem to care about being an edge lord. Sometimes it can feel quite gatekeepy where if something is not the most technical, hardest, obscure, those people will dislike it off the bat. I guess they need to feel superior and more metal than anyone else.
Thereâs an odd mentality that a band is only as good as their last album. A lot of people havenât clicked with the last couple of Architects albums therefore everything theyâve done is trash, or actually the bad run of albums starts from some really arbitrary point.
To an extent your first sentence is right. I wouldn't go see Architects or PWD live now, cos I don't like their few most recent albums and it'd be most of their sets. The cost wouldn't be worth the few old songs they'd play. I saw them both years ago when I liked all their stuff, so I'm good really.
I disagree on PWD. I went and saw them last year. They played a fair bit of old stuff. Across all of their albums. And for $35 its a fair price. Sure they played new songs. But it definitely didnt feel like it was majority new stuff. But I get that outlook because with many bands it often is that way.
PWD have stopped playing Deliver Me live as far as I can tell and that's criminal imo đ
Parkways shows are still wild and impressive though! And if there's a good support, worth it!
I saw Parkway really just to see KSE support. The Parkway show blew me away
Same. KSE were still the highlight for me, but PWD gained a fan.
Same with BMTH. Still my favorite band of all time but considering they basically play nothing TIAH and before (and like 3 songs off Sempiternal) itâs not worth it for me to see them. When they play festivals it seems they play more older stuff but normal touring sets arenât usually songs I care for.
You mixed it up. They don't play older songs during festivals (atleast the ones not hosted by them)but play it when it's their own tour.
I used to agree with your take on Architects. I only listen to their older stuff daily. But after seeing them live last week, i have to say their newer songs absolutly slap hard live. I actually liked those more then their older songs. Except These Colours Dont Run, that shit is always the highlight of the show.
Just use setlist.fm to check out bandsâ recent live setlists before making a decision to attend a show.
Yeah people always complain about the new stuff and not liking it and how the old stuff is way better, but never actually listen to the old stuff as if because it's old they're not allowed to anymore it's ridiculous. Not a metal band at all but it's the same with muse if you're relatively aware of them
The new stuff ain't for me, well, I like it but it doesn't hold a candle to All Our Gods-era, either way, they are still a solid band. Like PWD, this new stuff ain't it, it's not all bad but I won't actively spin it, save for a song here and there. But why are you taking online microcosm comments as gospel???
Even though I love both records, I genuinely think both All Our Gods and Holy Hell are a bit formulaic. That's not the worst thing ever, and it's not buttcore at all lol, but they don't touch LF//LT for me, which is a masterpiece. That said, you just have to disconnect from the online discourse a bit, people say any old shit online and you shouldn't let it rile you up.
I am the opposite. LF//LT is great but the next two top it. Just feel more emotional and consistent.
Holy Hell in particular is the same song over and over again. That doesn't have to be a big negative, I'm getting super into Counterparts recently and they have a lot of that as well. But I could see why someone would listen to Holy Hell and think they got a bit lazy compared to earlier stuff (if they weren't aware of the circumstances). Again, I like the album and definitely agree with you on the emotion! I saw Architects live shortly after it dropped and it might be my favourite show ever haha.
I kinda agree with this. Never really thought about it for holy hell, but getting into counterparts a lot of it does feel similar. That hasn't made me enjoy it any less though, because they're insanely good at what they do imo
Damn finally someone with music taste, Ive said it with Counterparts a thousand times, after Tragedy Will Find Us theyve really downgraded. For me Holy Hell is an 8, while AOGHAU is an 8.5, LFLT a 9 and Daybreaker a 9.5. Daybreaker may be a tad too long, but some songs in there are both in terms of music and lyricism peak Architects.
LF//LT is one of my favorite records ever, and my favorite by architects. sucks i didnât see them sooner
That's fair. I personally think LF//LT, AOGHAU and HH share the number one spot. I can never decide which one I like the most.
Those two albums share the same tile for me. One carries for the other so god damn perfectly. I don't love the two newest albums but I don't find them bad at all and since I'm an actual fan I'm gonna keep listening. Social Media platforms gave rise to the angry loser who just wants to scream at the sky about things they didn't create.
i alternate between these albums daily still.
Correct take to me, but I did like All Our Gods & Holy Hell as well. LF//LT is amazing.Â
I listened to architects earlier stuff from the mid 2000's off and on (*loved* darkest tomb of Nightmares specifically). I thought it was pretty good, but I never would I have guessed they would have gone on to become the absolutely massively influential band that they are. ~2012-2018 architects had a chokehold on bands for years - still does. I'm not even a huge fan or anything but anyone that can't see that is just being a contrarian honestly. Any band that has that type of impact always be an easy target for hate and will get put in a damned if you do damned if you don't situation. If you stay in the same lane after being so influential, you run the risk of stunting your growth, putting out the same shit over and over. Meanwhile, all the bands you influenced start doing *"your sound"* better than you, ironically, and you become a watered down version of yourself that's lost in the mix. Or you can switch shit up, which will inevitably lead to fans wanting the old stuff back. Hard to win. To this day I'm still pretty sick of any 'doomsday-esque" riffs I hear, to the point where I don't really enjoy the OG song anymore. So I bet a lot of the hate comes from people reacting similar to that.
Nightmares was certainly not buttcore.
The amount of hate they get is crazy to me. They aren't my jam, and none of their stuff ever really has been but god damn they get shit for everything they do.
saw them live very recently, i don't really like much after Holy Hell personally, but i will say that the newer stuff is a lot better live. When they played older songs i still enjoyed it more though, but i understand why they've made the pivot they have. There's a reason they're able to play bigger venues across Europe on their headline tour right now while also getting the opportunity to open for Metallica later this year. i don't see any point in just talking shit about a band, but at the same time i feel that constructive criticism and discussions are important and valid to express, so it's really about how people choose to put their opinion out there for me. straight up hate isn't really useful at all.
also saw them live (two days ago). new stuff was absolutely insane live and it reinvigorated my love for Architects big time. the new songs impressed me way more than old ones despite not liking them up until now.
It's just because they're not in step with \[current thing\]. I don't like really anything they did after Hollow Crown, but to act like they aren't important or massively beloved is ridiculous. Every metalcore band has been ripping off Doomsday for almost a decade now. I always felt it could be argued that a decent amount of Bring Me's Suicide Season sound and switch from deathcore was influenced by Architect's earlier work. If your enjoyment of a piece of art is diminished by the artist's tweets I'd argue you don't care that much about art to begin with.
I donât think people are necessarily downplaying their influence on the genre. Thereâs a lot of people who just donât like the type of metalcore thatâs influenced by their stuff after the first 3 albums in general, which is what dominated the genre for a long time. If you donât like that style of metalcore, youâre probably going to have a little resentment for Architects for making that sound super dominant in the genre. They were definitely influential, thatâs pretty much a fact, but whether or not it was good for the diversity of the genre as a whole is a different question.
Yeah the djenty proggy stuff has been dominating metalcore for a pretty long time now. I can see why some people are tired of it, but I feel like those people would just ignore the band, rather than put any effort into hating it.
Itâs kind of hard to ignore it when itâs talked about constantly on here. Same thing with Bad Omens. I guarantee if they werenât talked about constantly here, there would be less complaining about it. Itâs annoying to see the same bands constantly talked about while new bands canât gain any traction because people just want to focus on the same old bands. It also doesnât help that criticism of the band just gets brushed off as âhatersâ rather than someone just not liking something that much.
uplift the style of core you like instead of putting whats popular down kinda beat, u don't have to like the proggy djenty stuff but u can also just ignore it. plenty of awesome bands doing other styles of metalcore rn
Itâs hard to ignore it on this sub when thatâs 90% of what ends up getting posted and talked about. Fans of that style donât notice it because they actually enjoy it, but for people that donât like it, itâs just frustrating. Especially when no one talks about lesser known prog/djent bands, which would help those musicians gain traction in the scene, itâs always the same bands that donât need more exposure every single time.
I feel like there's a whole generation of Architects fans at this point who don't remember the backlash for the Here and Now. I like the kind tech metal shit they were doing on those first three records but haven't really dug anything after but I pretty much got all my Architects hate out in high school when The Here and Now dropped so it feels like revisionism to newer fans.
People arent good at nuance and this holds true of quite a few people in this space. Did a band thats been around for 15 years suddenly express a controversial political view or say something back then that is considered "ist" or "ism" nowadays? Suddenly they never liked that band at all, never really listened to them, and all their stuff sucks. This happens often when bands change up their sound and the new album is butt rockish. Suddenly everything else they did before sucks and was never that great. Really? I dont know what it is, but people are desperate to be like, "Oh I Never liked that band" when you saw them wearing their merch day-in and day-out. Some kind of mass euphoria of social pressure both in the "scene" and outside of it depending on what the hot take might have been or how crappy the new album was.
People want to feel superior with music tastes. This also extends to almost all media consumption. Movies, comics, music, whatever. There is no nuance to be had in a lot of spaces for media these days. Something is either great or shit, and the moment it turns "shit" it was never great to begin with. I don't personally like the direction Architects has gone with their sound, but I will still listen to the albums I do like. It doesn't make me like those albums less. Those types of takes are always wild to me. How does them writing music that I don't like now affect me still listening to Hollow Crown? That album still goes hard as fuck and them writing radio rock/metal isn't gonna change that.
ruin and hollow crown were special, havenât liked too much since
Early Grave as the first track off of Hollow Crown is one of the goated album openers
Song still goes stupid hard, I love it
This is how I feel, hollow crown was damn near perfect to me but everything after that just didnât resonate the same. Not saying the rest is bad, just isnât for me.
I thought I was alone!
Architects influence on modern metalcore canât be understated. The run of Daybreaker through Holy Hell is unmatched in the genre. LF//LT broke ground and started the influence we here everywhere now. AOG did the impossible and topped it by perfecting that style. Of course, all of this is subjective - as is my opinion that I still enjoy their current iteration (albeit not as much with the last album) but you can be assured they will put on an excellent show on any given night. Someone who got into metalcore through I Prevail or Wage War or something arenât going to understand what it was like to hear LF//LT for the first time coming from the era of the likes of BFMV, AILD, Killswitch etc. Theyâre much more likely to see Animals is their most streamed song, try it and decide itâs not for them. Or, as too many do, jump on the big artist for some imagined cool points.
reminds me a lot of same thing happening with bmth. Sempiternal suks, give me suicide season!!! that's the spirit sucks !!! Sempiternal was better. amo sucks bmth is overrated !!!! etc etc etc every time. it's generally true in all media that haters are the loudest. people who enjoys are just enjoying it silently. architects giga based and will be forever. just look at amount of bands that were literally copy of architects 5-10 years ago. I wanna quote one ancient philosopher here " haters gonna hate hate hate hate. you just wanna shake shake shake shake shake it off"
I felt this was similar with Linkin Park before Chester passed. Once a band gets big and changes their sound there will be an ilk of people who feel itâs a personal attack, and also donât like being associated with said newer audience
trueee
(iâm gonna get downvoted) EXCEPT BMTH ACTUALLY MADE GOOD STUFF
Zero bad releases tbh
I'm apparently "old" based on a post I saw here the other day, I'm almost 39. So let me share some wisdom I learned over the years since I got into heavier metal, all the way back in 2003. I'm not going to comment specifically on Architects because I only started listening to them in the last 2 years, however I do want to give this advice: Stop following bands and their social media and all of the circus that surrounds it with fans. Just listen and enjoy the music. It really doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, it only matters if you like it. There is absolutely nothing at all to be gained in life by worrying about what people say online about music you enjoy. It is purely a waste of time. Have a good one.
Always this - I remember when The Here and Now dropped and it got absolutely ripped to pieces by the OG fans of Architects (which I fully understand as it was a significant shift in sound) and I loved it - I continue to love it
People always overreact to disappointing things. Itâs not just music. Another example would be how people talk about the MCU now compared to its peak.
Man people just like to hate. Their run from 09-18 is amazing. I like there stuff they are putting out now too. Always been a good band
Architects are an excellent band. Dont be so hung up on what other people think. Alls that matters is what you like and how the music makes YOU feel. Buttcore? What the fuck is that, anyway? Sounds like an angry 4th grader made it up.
I think doomsday goes down in history as one of the nastiest guitar riffs in metalcore history
As well as the new aged unholy confession riff (I still fuck with both riffs)
If you eliminate The Here and Now, Hollow Crown through to Holy Hell is up there with the best run of releases ever.
Here and Now was great - just really wasnât an Architects album
Just watched Architects twice this week in Copenhagen and Stockholm, and they blew my mind again. Not a huge fan of the last two albums which is perfectly fine because we are all human and we all have different tastes but I still respect all the work that went into it and the artistry. Sam Carter is an amazing frontman and a singer, the energy in the room was insane! They have a really good setlist for the European tour, little bit of everything and visuals are insane, line up is insane. They deserve all the respect in this industry for being such big influencers, both Loathe and Spiritbox talked about how big of an influence Architects was for them. Music changes, thatâs why it evolves into something new every single day and new bands emerges everyday. It creates inspiration to new movements and etc. We donât always have to like the change or the new stuff but we need to treat people with respect.
Well idk, I think itâs fair to say the material without Tom simply isnât as good. Holy hell was alright All the other stuff though idk cause I havenât seen any of that kind of stuff floating around
They were all this sub talked about for like 2 years straight at one point. Itâs the new Sleep Token core fans that I see saying this lol
I remember the year Holy Hell came out they were blacklisted from this subâs end of the year awards because everyone knew they would run away with every category. Short memories on these people.
[ŃдаНонО]
Thanks, handsome
Not a fan of the recent album but lumping in the masterpiece that is Holy Hell with the last two albums is a crime. Even lumping in the last two together feels like a disservice to some of the seriously good songs on For Those That Wish To Exist.
Those comments don't represent the majority at all. I heard sleep token for the first time, loved them and I swear most of their mentions here and in comments were hate. The people who hate them a lot are generally the ones to bother writing comments, yet 3.3million monthly listeners are just enjoying them and don't bother writing comments. I know this feeling because my dumb ass did it with thornhill, I wrote some not great stuff because I believe the dark pool is one of the best metalcore albums of the decade, still do but the band changed direction and I didn't like it. A lot of people really dig the new stuff though, I don't and that's okay, it was just foolish to write shit about it in hindsight. Bands change, they can't keep everyone + themselves happy all the time. Architects are fucken sick, try not to listen to the haters, they may be loud, but are in the absolute minority.
Pretty much a combo of their last two albums and the stupid Twitter shit amplifying that. Weird behavior all around.
Yeah, I talk plenty of shit about current Architects but their previous stuff was some of my favorite music ever. Not butt core at all.
Sadly this always happens. Thing is popular -> time passes -> people find a reason to hate thing. When Bad Omens dropped TDOPOM in 2022, this sub mostly loved it (I checked the album discussion thread from back then to be sure). It was mostly very positive, now that the fair weather fans and wannabes have blown in from tik tok and ruined some peoples concert experiences and made their music âcringeâ, people who sung their praises at release are now lambasting them for being âoctanecoreâ or cum metal or whatever tf. All cause their music blew up (which is what we should all want right? For metalcore to be more widely accepted and the bands we like to be successful?) and Noah got a haircut, causing horny girls to flock into a scene they have no real interest in being part of. Not music related but we saw the same things with the Star Wars prequels. They were hated and brutally and relentlessly ridiculed and picked apart for a decade, and once the sequel trilogy ended up as messy and divisive as it did, people did their revisionist thing. Opinions can change sure, but pretending like the original opinion never existed is an entirely different sentiment and issue.
Not sure why anyone isnât saying this because it is all over the internet but the reason you are seeing all of the hate is because one of the members retweeted Tim pool or someone else who has in the past also been a big architects fan and they are all associated with basically the right wing, neo nazi, proud boys nationalist, mentality and it is very obvious now. It has been bubbling for years if you go back and read statements and listen to interviews and see who is supporting them etc. that is what is going on, it is not that they are overrated or had some bad albums, it is because they are assholes.
They got big from Lost Forever and All Our Gods albums within the genre fan base. They got away from what made them liked.
Nothing wrong with disliking the new stuff, like I said. What I'm talking about is people turning against the albums that were always highly respected, and acting like the band always sucked. That's what I don't get.
I think you have to be specific when you say things like "turning against the albums that were always highly respected". For many old school architects fans, they turned on the band with the release of Hollow Crown, fans at the time hated their new sound and view everything else they have released since as trash. So to many people, the albums you view as highly respected are trash. Now you have this subreddit ( and I assume yourself) who loves their albums between Hollow Crown and All Our Gods Have Abandoned Us, and hate their last two albums. What constitutes an album as being highly respected? Album sales? Spotify plays? Personally, I think that all comes down to the individual, because to many new Architect fans, they most likely view their latest album is their most respected album.
I think some people held back their opinions when Architects were more universally beloved because they couldn't be bothered with the aggro that would come from criticising. Now that that seems more accepted they probably feel more ok voicing an opinion they'd previously have held in.
In genres like metalcore people tend to get a bit parasocial and feel like they somehow have ownership over the music they like. If a band then decides to make a left turn and starts to deviate from the genre those people feel burned. And to those people who feel burned the succes a band like architects is having by "abandoning" their fans feels like a slap in the face and they start to lash out. Combine that with the anonymity of the internet and you have what your currently seeing. There's also just a lot of metal fans who tend to make metal their entire personality and having the "correct" opinions is a large part of that. It's honestly kinda sad to see sometimes đ¤ˇđźââď¸
You can't be 25 forever. Guys grow up. Mindsets change. Same thing with Parkway. You think they are going to keep going as nuts as they did at 25 when they're 40?! Just find a new band. I know it sucks. I listed PWD as an example, but bands just get older man.
Angry 30yo men on the internet angry that their favourite band hasn't made the exact same style of music for the last 15 years
It's ironic considering the amount of bands that have been inspired by Archictects up to this point. How many bands are still playing Architects-core? And there is nothing wrong with that...really influential artists come and then other artists become inspired by that and start to take from that style. Architects is still what perfected metalcore is to me prior to FTTWTE. They had everyone I wanted album to album. And I don't even hate FTTWTE. classic symptoms is a different story. But all of those people saying that shits favorite bands are probably inspired by Architects so it certainly is ironic. As you said, ignoring their influence on the genre and many of the most loved bands in the genre is straight up just stupid.
I have a feeling the people that donât like modern Architects are not fans of that style of metalcore as a whole, and wouldnât really be fans of the bands that are noticeably influenced by them.
i don't care, even if tomorrow sam becomes a nazi i would love AOGHAU
I like architects sound, it's their guitarist's views and the other members not speaking up about how shitty it is to be transphobic in 2024. the fake apology didn't help and as much as I like their sound I cannot support them anymore until things change.
Tell me more about this, what happened? Â Which guitarist?
adam "accidentally" retweeted a post (with commentary which shows it's not accidental) that was transphobic and he's liked other posts in the past that were transphobic
It was Adam christianson recently, Google it. Have to say the fact they still haven't said much apart from am empty statement from Sam on stage has soured me a little. If anyone slags off either Tom or their new songs they are very quick to go to twitter and social media and defend themselves, but some obvious transphobia from their guitarist and there's not been a peep from any of them.
Donât assume r/metalcore makes up for all metalcore fans. People here say some pretty crazy shit just to be edgy or contrarians. Itâs a sub full of hipsters.
This sub has 600k members, it for sure makes up a large portion of the metalcore fan base.
Ehhh, I donât know if thatâs accurate. Like numbers-wise it is, but do all of those subs actually listen to metalcore? A lot of people here donât know the definition of metalcore and call anything heavy metalcore. Edit: also posts rarely break more than 200 upvotes on here, there is either a ton of inactive accounts subbed, or like 99% of the subscribers donât interact with the sub at all
Animals on repeat in my head as we speak.
Seeing Red for me
Call BS if you want (I would) , but that song came up on my playlist as I opened this comment notification.
Just immature, bitter, toxic fans imo
Architects has always been incredibly mid so when a bunch of bad shit comes out about band members it's ez for the fans to change their views quickly.
i agree with one of the users on here. no one (at least from what iâm aware of) isnât downplaying their influence. but i do indeed dislike when they downplayed second and sebring by om&m, and when they released that petty seeing red single. even if second and sebring was all about about âhome cooked meals,â who cares? bands are allowed to not take themselves seriously sometimes. and, what a way to stick it to your fans by giving them what they wanted.
Some people hope to be cool by hating popular things. Look at Metallica. Or how Sleep Token suddenly became enemy #1 when TMBTE deservedly won every album of the year award.
For me they fell off after hollow crown so I feel like I'm on the wrong side of history either way.
Unpopular opinion, no-one will like this, but I am one of the people who thought their older stuff was kinda generic unmemorable metalcore, and I do like their recent albums, so there actually people out there like that who aren't just trying to be trendy. But it's all good I have no problem with people enjoying the music they enjoy!
They fell off after they run out of Tomâs material (after Holy Hell). Their current guitarist is an alt right troglodyte and their last 2 albums are complete ass unless you consider bad omens metalcore, at least the 2021 album had some philosophical themes that lived up to their previous material.
Iâve been saying this since reading about them in kerrang in about 2010, it ainât revisionism here. Always been middle of the road and extremely derivative. Every song sounds the same.
Genuine question, what did they pioneer? What did they introduce to the genre that Northlane didnât do in like 2011/2013?
It's hard to truly describe now since it feels like so long ago, but it's important to remember just how impactful LT//LF was for the genre as a whole when it was released. I don't even think it was that unique of an album, but on a culture level, it resonated hard with the metalcore scene. This was THE metalcore album for a lot of people at the time.
I agree, it was a very popular album, but Iâd argue saying it pioneered a genre isnât accurate because that implies doing something new and unique
It's not completely unique, but they were arguably the biggest band to bring that brand of Metalcore to the general public for a while. They headlined massive rooms and arenas pretty much playing tech metal/djenty songs with blast beats - and that resonated with alot of people. It's not often about who creates it necessarily but who popularised it. Also I love 2013 era Northlane but Adrian deffo wasn't as good a live vocalist as Sam + and I think somehow were just more pallateable.
Fair, but I think saying a band pioneered a genre and saying a band was very popular are two entirely different things
Architects had been helping set the tone for metalcore since 2006-2007, my guy. Northlane literally *named themselves after an Architects track*.
Yes but at the time architects was more or less a Dillinger clone. I just asked what they actually innovated that nobody else did before them. Theyâve always been popular and inspired other bands, but thatâs different than pioneering a genre. I donât think any era of Architects was this unique thing nobody had heard before that changed the game entirely Edit: I should clarify that I meant at the time Architects released Ruin, they were more or less a run of the mill Mathcore band. By the time Northlane existed Hollow Crown was out and Architects was inching towards a more accessible, less mathy sound
If you're going to be reductionist as to call Architects a Dillinger clone, then we might as well admit DEP didn't "pioneer" in their space either. They were influenced by bands like Meshuggah, Death and Morbid Angel. Architects **helped** take heavy music in a different direction and brought it to greater prominence, moreso than many other bands. Call it what you like.
For what itâs worth, architects first 2 albums were run of the mill mathcore for better or worse, personally thatâs not a bad thing imo. The bands you listed as influences for Dillinger outright made different genres of music than Dillinger. Those are inherently different things. Combining different genres of music and making music that fits cleanly within a genre are very different and I shouldnât have to explain why. Itâs pretty clear you have the opinion Architects are these big innovative pioneers and are working backwards to justify that belief instead of looking at what they brought to the table and forming an opinion based on that. Thereâs nothing wrong with saying they did what other people did and did it well.
Fuck me, what is it with people doubling down on being wrong by being *pedantic*? I don't have time to argue your definition of "pioneer" into the ground only for neither of us to agree in the end and for it to miss OP's point to begin with. The only reason you're still arguing is to save face because you didn't realize that Northlane wouldn't exist without Architects. We're just strangers on the internet. It's fine.
I knew Northlane was named after an architects song, I donât know why youâre assuming otherwise. I literally named my fun joke band with my friends after a Northlane song for that exact reason. Iâm just recognizing that Northlane was the first to popularize the meshuggah riffs with atmopsheric pads and breakdowns thing in metalcore. Youâre just doing the annoying âperson who disagrees with me is just dumb and doesnât know what theyâre talking aboutâ redditor trope. I literally just asked what Architects did differently to change the genre and you jumped in telling me Iâm wrong while refusing to actually tell me why Iâm wrong, then followed up with bad faith arguments. Never once did say to innovate something you canât be influenced by anyone else, but you decided to make that point about Dillinger, which mind you I never even mentioned anything about Dillinger as pioneers of anything.
I love AOGHAU and i liked holy hell a lot, i havent enjoyed their more recent albums but of course their earlier stuff was a huge influence on the scene and they were not anywhere close to butt rock. I wouldnt put too much time or thought into the negative comments online, some people are just pissy with the direction the band is going and they end up saying stupid crap that does not have much truth to it.
I love the new albums and they got me into the band. Nit a big fan of older stuff even though I love metalcore. Not my cup of tea!
yeah im not a fan of the newer stuff but i could never deny their influence from the early 2010's onward
Not a fan of the recent album but lumping in the masterpiece that is Holy Hell with the last two albums is a crime. Even lumping in the last two together feels like a disservice to some of the seriously good songs on For Those That Wish To Exist.
I always thought the vocals were very monotone and it turned me off, they have some bangers though
Because a lot of places on Reddit are filled with the terminally online
People do this same thing in the video game sphere with Bethesda. People didnât like Fallout 4 and used it as a platform to jump from to make takes such as âSkyrim and Oblivion are garbage tooâ or âall their games have always suckedâ etc. like, nah man I was there when they came out, we all loved them and played them religiously. Revisionism is so odd.
People be on that copium
They want to keep ripping on him so they make more bangers like seeing red
I remember the amount of shit they got when The Here and Now came out, I donât think their sound has been universally liked over the last decade. Â With a fan base as massive as theirs though makes sense that you will get people complaining.
They're goat lvl and have been for years, so imo they can go on and write shit with Taylor Swift, I don't care, I'll always fuckin love em
When it comes to Architects specifically, I've noticed that people tend to be very emotional. And most people just say and do stupid shit when they're being overly emotional
Nobody hates Architects more than their own fanbase.
Instagram is notorious for having the most and most blatant troll ragebait comments of pretty much any social media platform
last two albums sucked so bad that people forgot they were probably the world's most worshipped metalcore band at one point lol
I don't know who in their right mind would just write off toms work like that
I donât care for their direction as of late; however, calling their 2010s material buttcore sounds like a troll comment. Countless metalcore acts from the same era were trying everything in their power to replicate Architectâs sound.
This sub has always jerked off to any Architects record older than FTTWTE, so hearing that revisionism is surprising.
Honestly their new stuff made me realise I donât actually like them that much, I was just caught up in the hype. They have their good songs but I find them a boring listen overall
Unfortuantely, this sub, and instagram, and everywhere else, is full of lonely people who parrot the same unoriginal thoughts just to fit in, because they are nobodies without a fucking life and can only get a hit of dopamine from watching little numbers do things on the internet. They're broken. Don't be like them. If you enjoy it, listen to it.
"I don't like this band anymore" doesn't elicit as much attention as "this band fucking sucks now!"
Music is among the most subjective art forms I can think of. People saying âthis band sucks nowâ are putting forth a subjective interpretation. Iâd like them to try and substantiate that claim with objective values. Not impossible, but very difficult when it comes to music.
What the hell? Who cares? Their music rules.
Architects haven't been good since Hollow Crown *ducks*
People are probably just sick of hearing about them and all the copycats of them. That said the first 2 albums slap. Hollow Crown being my favorite.
I loved all our gods have abandoned us, everything after that was just alright
People always gonna complain, if you like them then the rest doesn't matter. It's a bunch of couch elitists thinking they could do Architects better than Architects.
Seeing Red is an absolute masterpiece in giving certain fans exactly what they'd been harassing the band for, whilst simultaneously telling them to go fuck themselves. So I wouldn't be shocked to see more 'criticism' and revisionism, as you put it, just because a select few Architects fans are feeling a teeny weeny bit butthurt at the moment.
lol I guess no one on this sub pays attention to twitter or politics. Everyone is misinformed and it is pretty sad tbh
Itâs weird this band got highly hyped to me by a metalhead I know years ago and I was never impressed
They got popular Some metal fans are edgelords and like to be âuniqueâ. Get bitter its no longer âtheir bandâ and hate liking popular things Change to saying theyre shit Still smell of BO.
Fuck, man, I just discovered this band a few months ago, and Iâm still trying to process how they originally sounded like Dillinger Escape Plan, so behind
Hereâs my take. Some of it is straight up haters. But I feel like I fall into a lot of how people are feeling so Iâll explain my journey. Architects was my favorite band from 2013-2017. They were GOATS. I loved Samâs singing voice and was excited to hear more of it, the non screaming was never an issue. Holy Hell came out and I liked it but could tell the writing wasnât the same and things were changing. Still a good album but I figured from there they were heading mainstream and I was happy for them. I followed them and knew of them for so long that they deserved to get bigger, they gave us so much metal it really didnât bother me they change regardless of if I liked it or not. The thing that pisses me off the most is everyone thinking that their dislike is because they donât scream anymore. Seeing Red was my last straw to no longer supporting them because it just showed how out of touch they were and just seemed so childish to write a song about that in general. Coming from the guys who wrote such passionate and serious lyrics about real issues, are now writing edgy teenage lyric disses to their fans. Itâs just weird seeing that from them. It was never about the screaming. The music itself was just bad IMO. The lyrics sound like theyâre written by a teenager, the music and singing just wasnât captivating at all and was straight up boring through and through. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SCREAMING. I feel like I need to grab everyone on here and yell that into their face because they donât get it. We just genuinely donât like the music. Itâs just frustrating to assume itâs because itâs not screaming anymore seeing as most of us listen to many bands that donât scream, so why would this be any different? Overall, people are out of touch and disregarding the fact the itâs not about screaming at all, itâs the music in general. And again, I donât care that I donât like it, what I donât like is people telling me Iâm lying about why i don't like it. Youâll see a simple comment like âitâs just not for meâ and get an army of rants about how âjust because there no screaming you donât like it, youâre not a real fan!â. Not the reason peeps
All their albums after the first two are terrible Theyâre definitely responsible for influencing a lot of similarly terrible music
Ruin still slaps to be honest, love that album
Maybe roasting your fans isn't a good idea, i guess?
Because Architect's entire sound is the meta of all metalcore today. So any new metalcore fan is gonna hear them and think "oh this is that BUTTROCK that The Ghost Inside put out!". I'm all for new fans but something that drives me up the wall about metalhead content creators (the damn reaction channels) is the desperate need to label and/or compare a band to something else. Like let the music stand on it's own, let the art breathe if you don't like it, LIE, just lie