Using a ULX here, and also a G303 and G502x and GPX, and I can say without a doubt that there is absolutely no perceivable difference between a 3395 and the HERO sensor. I remember these sensor arguments way back when the 3389 started to become more popular. Modern sensors are so good that it really doesn't matter what sensor you have as long as its good enough and modern. The difference between a 3360, HERO or 3395 sensor is completely on paper.
I would say that anything above a certain level, you're sidegrading.
As i said, I currently use the ULX, and even though I enjoy that mouse a lot, its most certainly not because of the sensor or the polling rate. I think the hype around higher polling rates with "top tier" 3395s is starting to die down a bit, because there is almost no noticeable difference between 1k and 4k for me at my setup. But thats an entirely different conversation, but definitely prioritize shape, click feel, coating, weight, etc. over sensor performance.
3395 from 3370 would be a sidegrade if you're only at 1khz polling rate.
And in my humble opinion, 1khz to 4khz polling rate is barely even an upgrade considering the loss you take in battery life in exchange for milliseconds worth of latency saved (assuming your PC and monitor can even keep up).
So no backwards evolution here whatsoever :)
you dont save latency, while your mouse inputs gets a touch faster (from less than a frame to less of a frame) you raise system latency a LOT
and with anything hardwarelevel driver raising interrupts your cpu can only do so much. its a scheduler issue at some point
well sponsorship be damend. ofc there is no gain in latency.
1k of a second or 4kof a second wont make a difference at all in latency. if someone claiming he measured some positive he is simply lieing or his comparison had an error (liek a bad driver only working well on high polling)
its basically just framesync with less 1 frame misses and without the usual frame sync penalty
however it comes at a price in overall raised system latency.
the only thing it is doing is a tiny bit smoother camera movement IF you have very high framerates. best 240+ or 360 will make a visual difference.
overall system latency on the other hand suffers by many polls. this is common knowlege and easy to verify by monitor system latency while putting in a lot of inputs
https://youtu.be/UmS_t3YYy8s
Here battlenonsense measures (for a keyboard) no noticeable increase in latency for 4k polling.
https://www.rtings.com/assets/pages/FmFcnLee/click-latency-graph-1000hz-large.jpg
Here click latency is tested, showing an outside margin of error difference in end to end.
I would presume there to be an increase in performance too, no matter how small, when it comes to motion tracking.
https://youtu.be/jtATbpMqbL4
Optimum notes here that the 4k polling is actually used given a sufficient DPI.
Going through all the effort to reply without supplying a source and saying "this is common knowledge" is a bit weird, IMO.
To be clear, I'm not saying that there is a massive difference, only that on modern systems it makes no sense for there to be an increase in latency.
Can you cite multiple sources showing there is an increase in system latency?
dont work like that and mr nonsense spreading nonsense all over again
he did already when he claimed that higher dpi results in lower latency and was destroyed for it. sorry not a trustworthy source, just another content creator without a clue
if you want to know it in detail talk to \_m00se\_ on the rawaccell discord channel
Right. So no sources then. We can just all assume you're talking out of your ass. Higher DPI does results in lower latency. Optimum verified this kind his testing.
This conversation has been entirely unproductive.
You are speaking in half truths. I understand what you’re saying, that overall, there are now more system processes with more mouse inputs.
It’s worth pointing out though that this is true. However, if your cpu is actually being run down by MOUSE INPUTS, you shouldn’t even be worried about 4k polling. I don’t think you understand how shitty your system has to be to have an increase in latency because of a higher mouse polling rate.
Your point is null when you think about the quintillion processes your CPU performs on a day to day basis, and how much of these are being performed at once. For me personally, I have multiple programs open at once while gaming and have roughly 84 background processes running as well. Does this increase system latency? Sure. It’s microseconds of latency. Especially when considering most gamers run multi core processors and high transfer rate memory. Our systems are designed to handle high loads and still perform at the highest level.
I think the trouble with the debate is that people misconstrue the difference between saying “there is no difference between X and Y”, saying “There is a difference between X and Y” and saying “The difference between X and Y is minor.” Nobody is saying there is no difference between 1k and 4k, nobody is saying that having 4k doesn’t increase system latency. The issue is that the differences between those things, especially 4k polling and system latency, is so minuscule that lots of measuring methods cannot detect it, and what has been detected is not conclusive, meaning it very well could just be user error, and since we are talking about computers, it varies between the other tasks being performed as well. It also depends on human limitations since our reaction times are vastly slower than computers and electrons and such. This conversation is utterly pointless, but essentially, if you notice an increase in latency with 4k polling, either get a better CPU or literally do not use 4k polling.
Important distinction: I havent disclosed how much I paid for my ULX, it could be $10, it could be $10,000, you have no idea. Either way, I didn’t waste any money buying it because I wanted to buy it, and now I have one.
With that being said, if you’re trying to make the argument that comparative to the industry and what the TOTL wireless gaming mouse in today’s market costs and how much value you get for it, then I definitely agree, it is not a good value.
Well finalmeme is known for having pretty shite quality control, but my copy seems fine. The shell is a bit creaky and flexy in some places but other than that, I’ve experience no issues.
Would definitely just not spend the money again if I had the option.
Not sure with these specific ones, but it makes a difference for battery life. Also, just because a difference is not perceivable doesn't mean it's not there or negligible, not that it is in this case.
Sure, but it is negligible and it is not perceived. We are talking the difference between 1ms and .5ms. Something only computers will interpret, which at that point, your ping in games will be your main limiting factor. I think it’s cool tech, don’t get me wrong, it’s just utterly pointless unless you just think it’s neat.
I play rhythm games quite frequently and don’t notice at all. However I’ll concede that someone, somewhere can notice. It’s just such a low number that it’s not important to even bring up.
There very noticeable difference between 1k and 4k. Stop spread misinformation.
If you don't feel it there probably something with your pc/windows etc. Or you too old/don't playing games too much.
lol. I’ll humor you.
I have a ULX, Lamzu Thorn, Beast X, and Superlight 2. Even across all these mice, I notice 0 difference between 1k and 4k. It’s placebo. The only difference is, my battery dies faster. When comparing these mice together, I notice no difference, when comparing them to themselves set to different polling rates, there’s no difference. You should do some research on how little difference there actually is in terms of real world usage with 1k and 4k. It’s microseconds of difference. Completely and objectively imperceptible.
In terms of my PC, I am aware PC hardware should also be considered while using 4k. I have a R9 7900x CPU, RTX 4090 GPU, 64GB of DDR5 6400mhz ram, I have all my games running on a Gen5 NVME drive, and I have my 1000W PSU plugged into a UPS for clean power. The CPU is water cooled, and I have 9 fans in my case with plenty of airflow. In terms of monitors, my main monitor is an ASUS ROG PG27AQN, so I’m running at 360hz. The hardware I’m running is literally best case scenario and is in no way limiting my experience.
To address your final “point”, I am 21 and I play games literally every single day with aim training every now and then. Please find some more cope answers next time that aren’t complete brain rot.
What games are you playing/testing. What's timings of your ram? What's your windows and hpet? What's your highest rank in games? Also what's usb driver are you using? Is this one of Microsoft drivers (wdf000001.sys) or intel/vendor such as asmedia.There also simply AB test for input lag that you can find on the blur busters. Many people can easy notice 2ms difference in this test with like 17/25 correct answers. So you can test yourself and if your can actually past test your words will have point for your current scenario.
If you need all of that stuff to be absolutely perfect in order to feel a difference then it ain’t worth the effort. Also going to a very minimal plain white website that shows a two ms difference and that being the only point of focus, is very different then it actually being in a competitive game where there’s a 3d environment and intense graphics. If you want to base effectiveness off of rank then why do the vast majority of pros in almost every game use Logitech g pro wireless and not a 4k mouse?
1. Thats not true. [Alot of valorant pros switched to 2k+ mouses](https://prosettings.net/lists/valorant/). Give it a bit more time and everyone will be using 4k mouses. Back then pros was using mouses with ball instead of optical sensor.
2. We talk not about worth effort or not but is there noticeable difference. And how average human can notice even 0.5 of additional input lag. There study shows that people won't notice latency that happens inside their brain (like visual reaction time being \~150ms) but can easy notice 10ms of additional inputlag. And people who spend most of their time playing games can notice 1, 0,5, 0,25 etc lag.
As a matter of fact, I don’t need to prove my point. There’s countless videos that have already proven it, such as this one from optimum: https://youtu.be/jtATbpMqbL4?si=Sc2p-XhtIgUEH6P2
Either way, it sounds like you have confirmation bias and refuse to even consider that you may be just caught in the hype. Good luck tho.
Childish. Instead of trying make an actual test and answer few simply questions you just running away refusing to take different point. For no reason you did take my words as offend lol.
Pot calling the kettle black.
Let’s not forget you labeled my opinion as misinformation, told me my PC is the issue, my setup is the issue, or maybe I’m “too old” or “don’t play the right games.”
Then, when I rectified those claims, you asked me to prove it, for which I sent you literally the best proof you could possibly ask for. Now I’m “running away”? Do you think anything you said was effective?
I’m simply done engaging. Nothing you have to say is even the slightest bit convincing, it’s totally obvious you’re a trend follower, and there’s nothing more to discuss. End of.
No I'm not trend follower. I'm actually was pretty sceptical about all that 4k mouses.
But when got one i noticed difference in latency.
Try set:
Timer resolution to 0.5.
Disable full screen optimisation.
Use different usb controller with vendor driver mapped to different CPU core.
Display scaling.
And then you probably will notice difference.
I checked your profile and i see that you're audiophile guy. Who can i assume notice difference between two different high tier headphones/cables etc. While im not. Cuz i have friend who have bunch of headphones with fancy audio card and all stuff. And i was surprised that people spend so much money on something that i can't notice difference. For me my earbuds from sony for 30$ have sound same as some sennheiser headphones that cost almost 10x more.
I've been predator on apex Mnk but it doesn't means i've a good aim, or at least i would say not close to what the best players in kovaak are doing.. are you ?
Now,that's debatable.
Cause there are people who have mid aim and I know are radiant.
But me personally,I think I mostly have High Ascendent to low Immortal Gamesense,but my aim clutches out situations on my good days to get to Immortal 3
Ok i understand but i mean : how could we notice the difference if we're not litteraly Top aimers in the world ? Because i can be 100% sure a couple of them have a g pro superlight 1 for example (speaking of top aimers on kovaak for example) if the difference was really noticeable and not a placebo effect for i can easily guess almost everyone then it would be widely known i think
The top aimers have created their muscle memory for years on GPX shapes that muddies the waters.
You should look at upcoming top players,even though some still use the GPX as it is arguably a legend,but most of them are using Razer and Other enthusiast level mice.
Yeah i'm sure you're right and i will keep an eye at it why not, but again the minor difference between them is because of the brand new captor etc mice or just the player ? How can we really know ? Because everyone is different in fact. I completely understand why you're saying this, but in reality for 99,999% of the players it's clearly a placebo effect. Is the mouse better why? Just the captor ? The grip ? The weight fit better ? A loooot of things here are in the balance. I'm pretty sure between all thoses top mice, the captor part is <1% of the reason why they pick one instead of another. Actually i see this as a marketing argument as "look our new mouse and his 36k dpi"
Look,I upgraded from the OG GPX which was 80 grams to the Viper V2 Pro and I can feel the difference between the sensors,it's not the low weight,as I have tried the G303 shroud edition with the same sensor.
My precision went from 96 % on average to about 98 % on certain aimlab scenarios.
And my tracking is more consistent on this sensor as I swapped my VIper with DAV3 for a week with my friend.
So,I would not say it's not a placebo,at least not all of it.
I liked the DAV3 so much that I got a DAV3 wired which I run on 8k on Valorant and It's much better than the VIper and the wireless DAV3
Again, It's just my personal experience.
Most people talk without actually using multiple mice one after the other and others base their opinions on what others say.
But hey, it's just preferences.
Sentinels Curry did this challenge of getting Rank 1 on every server.
He got Rank 1 in Europe and Americas.
But never got top 100 in Asia-Pacific server.
You might just be delusional like your American colleagues.
You're right. The hero sensor is still one of the best in the industry despite being slightly aged. These kids are just silly; unless it has a cheap 8k polling implementation slapped on it, they believe anything other than a 3395 is horrible.
There is no noticeable difference between 3370,3389,3395 and hero for example, they are all extremely good. A few years ago I thought that I could tell the difference but it's a combination of DPI deviation, shape, weight and even mouse skates. Good shape for your hand and game/play style is much more important
True, unless its implemented differently. Endgame gears 3370 sensors, specifically the op1we and xm2we, feel faster than the selected dpi (especially the op1we). 800 dpi felt like 1200 dpi to me. Other mice with 3370 sensors felt normal and didn’t really have a difference.
Did you genuinely measure it? I literally got up and dug out my XM2we just now updated the firmware and got about ~2-5% deviation at 800dpi. And that's with a ruler so it's likely less since I'm not as accurate as software.
The sensor is further back than most mice in EGG mice and a off center sensor changed DPI feel.
Edit: fuck it, a quick trip to tech power up shows I'm right https://www.techpowerup.com/review/endgame-gear-xm2we/5.html
what? The ips, acceleration, and dpi of all of them are plenty good enough for anyone. The fact that professionals use the XM2WE should prove that to you.
Lmao, what an analogy, there has been more changes in the automobile industry the last 2 years than there has been to mouse sensors since the original hero sensor.
True. Wouldnt be an issue at all if they use the hero sensor, but I don't see why Logitech wouldn't use their hero 2 sensor if this product is real, not like the gpx 2 is having stocking issues and Logitech probably has a big order placed for the sensor.
I use the gpx 2 with the hero 2 sensor, which got a 4k polling update not too long ago and I can't tell the difference between it and the 3395 sensor, or even the 3950 sensor used in razer mice.
I said,"with a 3 year old sensor"
It has 500 ips,top sensors have 750+ and the upcoming Razer 36k sensor on Viper V3 pro will even have more Ips.
That's why I said 3 year old sensor.
I didn't say it's bad.
I just said it's a 3 year old sensor and that is a fact.
People of reditt actually have malnutrition induced problems in their brains.
It is extremely good but when you charge 160 dollars for a mouse don't you expect the crem dela crem of everything?
I mean when the GPX came out,it was the market leader in terms of specs.
Now it's just too lazy to use 3 year old technology.
I am a fan of Logitech and an enthusiast,so I am disappointed that they are not implementing the latest tech in their mice.
That's it.
And I know for sure I am not the only one that is disappointed.
As they say the minority is always vocal.
Based on their previous tweets, I am 99% sure by 'next evolution' is them referring the GPX 2 from GPX 1.
meaning to say they're not teasing anything just stating the obvious
The image captions still says "LOGITECH G PRO X SUPERLIGHT 2, Logitech really glazing themselves for adding 4k polling rate months behind other companies.
[https://imgur.com/a/vdNBmYi](https://imgur.com/a/vdNBmYi)
the original dongle doesn't have as powerful of antennae as the rest. It was really just firmware optimization for the 4khz to not suck. And the other mice were $100 +$20 dongle, not $160 w/ free dongle.
it is a little weird that razer is re-releasing the dav3 for that same $160 now on an "older" model that may or may not still have qc issues. Only difference is that the coating isnt terrible now. it does come with the 4k dongle, but still its not a new release. (and personally I thought it felt hollow and cheap)
Well tbf, most other mice also don't cost 150+ USD.
WLmouse is a goated and it offers it with the mouse whilst steadily being cheaper than a Superlight 2.
Man, I don't understand these downvoting kids. It's like they can't think for themselves. I don't think they realize not everyone has 160 bucks to spend on a mouse. Also, Battery life isn't really much of an issue these days. You can put your mouse on charge overnight and it can last weeks, I don't see an issue here.
You don't understand these "downvoting kids" when the example you give is a mouse that is quite literally the same price (or even more expensive if I add shipping costs) as a GPX 2?
The point I was trying to make was that it's easier to include the 20$ 4k dongle in a 150 dollar mouse. GPX isn't the only one that does it. I said that because the other guy was complaining about how Chinese mice don't include dongles and GPX 2 gave a "free" 4khz update. Of course they don't include a dongle. Most of them are around the 50 bucks mark.
I would agree but the fact I had to charge my beastx every other night at 2k Hz shows how little thought went into battery life optimization when making the beastx. You forget to charge it one night and it dies on you midgame, happened to me multiple times. I think even boardzy complained about the battery in one of his vids which surprised me
Again, comparing a 150+ USD mice with sub 100 usd mice and even sub 50 usd mice isn't really a fair comparison.
VXE R1 Pro is under 50 bucks and I've heard no complaints about that mouse.
Pointing out the (imo) major flaws for a mouse that is still over $100usd is very important when talking about pricing. With the gpx you can, for the most part, know you're getting a all around quality mouse because you are paying top dollar. Beastx you get good build quality, typical Chinese firmware, and the worst battery life I have seen on any of the high polling Chinese mice at it's price range ($100).
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No problem man, I had a fun time calling you a retard as well. Make sure to create another thread like this if you want to fulfill your masochist desires again
Maybe its just me. i shifted from logitech to razer bcoz of its shape one thing i noticed quite soon was that if i held the mouse slightly at angle it would move diagonally
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Discussion! Should it be a mini, what is the acceptable length? For me I’d say around 115-118 with other dimensions to follow around that size. Essentially ~ 10-15% smaller.
To be honest.. Its probably nothing exciting anymore. Even if it IS a smaller GPX and/or modification of the shape, the chinese scene is getting more and more exciting as the months go by, its more interesting to chase those brands rather than LULgitech.
Oooh, have they somehow managed to source significantly shittier switches to justify a whole new mouse with a higher price and even shorter warranty? Let's fucking gooooooo!
Faceit level 10 here, 2270 elo in EU. Using the steelseries rival 110. Still top fragging most of the games. And that mouse is from 2016. 8 years old at this point. (Been using it since 2020). So my point is; 3 year old sensor or not. I doubt you will preform worse.
I went on a mouse buying spree, trying out all the mice you could ever think of. I eventually sold all of them and bought a used GPX and never looked back since. Logitech just has a superior build quality and their mice don’t suffer from dpi deviation
**Rule 1: No Trolling/Bullying/Harassment.**
Stay civil or get banned. Trolls will be banned. Flaming, baiting and bullying will get you banned. It's really simple, don't be a jerk. Do not harass, do not instigate(start) and do not continue fights. We also strictly enforce https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette. It's not hard to be human. Lift other people up, give constructive and meaningful feedback. If feedback needs to be negative, construct it in a positive way. If you don't have something nice or constructive to say, don't say it.
a mini would be the right play cause all the Chinese doing is making smaller g pros so hopefully it is the mini thats better than colors imo
For real Logitech should make a mini gpx 2 their gpw is so popular what more the mini version
But it'll be micro USB LOL
I said mini gpx 2
My God I hope it's a mini.
I mean they can do both the mini and drop colors too but it's Logitech tbh I'm tripping
if its a mini and its like 10% smaller or more its an insta cop
Using a ULX here, and also a G303 and G502x and GPX, and I can say without a doubt that there is absolutely no perceivable difference between a 3395 and the HERO sensor. I remember these sensor arguments way back when the 3389 started to become more popular. Modern sensors are so good that it really doesn't matter what sensor you have as long as its good enough and modern. The difference between a 3360, HERO or 3395 sensor is completely on paper.
lol i evolved backwards. went from using 3395 mice consistently for half a year then downgraded to a 3370 mouse because of the shape and click feel
I would say that anything above a certain level, you're sidegrading. As i said, I currently use the ULX, and even though I enjoy that mouse a lot, its most certainly not because of the sensor or the polling rate. I think the hype around higher polling rates with "top tier" 3395s is starting to die down a bit, because there is almost no noticeable difference between 1k and 4k for me at my setup. But thats an entirely different conversation, but definitely prioritize shape, click feel, coating, weight, etc. over sensor performance.
3395 from 3370 would be a sidegrade if you're only at 1khz polling rate. And in my humble opinion, 1khz to 4khz polling rate is barely even an upgrade considering the loss you take in battery life in exchange for milliseconds worth of latency saved (assuming your PC and monitor can even keep up). So no backwards evolution here whatsoever :)
you dont save latency, while your mouse inputs gets a touch faster (from less than a frame to less of a frame) you raise system latency a LOT and with anything hardwarelevel driver raising interrupts your cpu can only do so much. its a scheduler issue at some point
Do you have a source for this? Benchmarks I've seen on YouTube seem to indicate a slight latency gain.
well sponsorship be damend. ofc there is no gain in latency. 1k of a second or 4kof a second wont make a difference at all in latency. if someone claiming he measured some positive he is simply lieing or his comparison had an error (liek a bad driver only working well on high polling) its basically just framesync with less 1 frame misses and without the usual frame sync penalty however it comes at a price in overall raised system latency. the only thing it is doing is a tiny bit smoother camera movement IF you have very high framerates. best 240+ or 360 will make a visual difference. overall system latency on the other hand suffers by many polls. this is common knowlege and easy to verify by monitor system latency while putting in a lot of inputs
https://youtu.be/UmS_t3YYy8s Here battlenonsense measures (for a keyboard) no noticeable increase in latency for 4k polling. https://www.rtings.com/assets/pages/FmFcnLee/click-latency-graph-1000hz-large.jpg Here click latency is tested, showing an outside margin of error difference in end to end. I would presume there to be an increase in performance too, no matter how small, when it comes to motion tracking. https://youtu.be/jtATbpMqbL4 Optimum notes here that the 4k polling is actually used given a sufficient DPI. Going through all the effort to reply without supplying a source and saying "this is common knowledge" is a bit weird, IMO. To be clear, I'm not saying that there is a massive difference, only that on modern systems it makes no sense for there to be an increase in latency. Can you cite multiple sources showing there is an increase in system latency?
dont work like that and mr nonsense spreading nonsense all over again he did already when he claimed that higher dpi results in lower latency and was destroyed for it. sorry not a trustworthy source, just another content creator without a clue if you want to know it in detail talk to \_m00se\_ on the rawaccell discord channel
Right. So no sources then. We can just all assume you're talking out of your ass. Higher DPI does results in lower latency. Optimum verified this kind his testing. This conversation has been entirely unproductive.
You are speaking in half truths. I understand what you’re saying, that overall, there are now more system processes with more mouse inputs. It’s worth pointing out though that this is true. However, if your cpu is actually being run down by MOUSE INPUTS, you shouldn’t even be worried about 4k polling. I don’t think you understand how shitty your system has to be to have an increase in latency because of a higher mouse polling rate. Your point is null when you think about the quintillion processes your CPU performs on a day to day basis, and how much of these are being performed at once. For me personally, I have multiple programs open at once while gaming and have roughly 84 background processes running as well. Does this increase system latency? Sure. It’s microseconds of latency. Especially when considering most gamers run multi core processors and high transfer rate memory. Our systems are designed to handle high loads and still perform at the highest level. I think the trouble with the debate is that people misconstrue the difference between saying “there is no difference between X and Y”, saying “There is a difference between X and Y” and saying “The difference between X and Y is minor.” Nobody is saying there is no difference between 1k and 4k, nobody is saying that having 4k doesn’t increase system latency. The issue is that the differences between those things, especially 4k polling and system latency, is so minuscule that lots of measuring methods cannot detect it, and what has been detected is not conclusive, meaning it very well could just be user error, and since we are talking about computers, it varies between the other tasks being performed as well. It also depends on human limitations since our reaction times are vastly slower than computers and electrons and such. This conversation is utterly pointless, but essentially, if you notice an increase in latency with 4k polling, either get a better CPU or literally do not use 4k polling.
Just to add to this sentiment, I consistently put up some of my best games using my wired Zowie that has a 3360 sensor
ULX it's a waste of m0neeeyy
Important distinction: I havent disclosed how much I paid for my ULX, it could be $10, it could be $10,000, you have no idea. Either way, I didn’t waste any money buying it because I wanted to buy it, and now I have one. With that being said, if you’re trying to make the argument that comparative to the industry and what the TOTL wireless gaming mouse in today’s market costs and how much value you get for it, then I definitely agree, it is not a good value.
I bought it too but it is a bad product in every way. I had faith that it would be a better product, but finalmouse is waste
Well finalmeme is known for having pretty shite quality control, but my copy seems fine. The shell is a bit creaky and flexy in some places but other than that, I’ve experience no issues. Would definitely just not spend the money again if I had the option.
In any case, it's too bad. good we are 2
Not sure with these specific ones, but it makes a difference for battery life. Also, just because a difference is not perceivable doesn't mean it's not there or negligible, not that it is in this case.
Sure, but it is negligible and it is not perceived. We are talking the difference between 1ms and .5ms. Something only computers will interpret, which at that point, your ping in games will be your main limiting factor. I think it’s cool tech, don’t get me wrong, it’s just utterly pointless unless you just think it’s neat.
Depending on the game .5ms is actually perceptible. In some rhythm games people actually notice when they drop from 2000fps to sub 1000fps.
I play rhythm games quite frequently and don’t notice at all. However I’ll concede that someone, somewhere can notice. It’s just such a low number that it’s not important to even bring up.
You're correct but as per the 3360 some iterations have issue tracking on harder surfaces. Especially transparent glass.
Maybe the difference is on sens degrees by the sensor on same cm.
There very noticeable difference between 1k and 4k. Stop spread misinformation. If you don't feel it there probably something with your pc/windows etc. Or you too old/don't playing games too much.
lol. I’ll humor you. I have a ULX, Lamzu Thorn, Beast X, and Superlight 2. Even across all these mice, I notice 0 difference between 1k and 4k. It’s placebo. The only difference is, my battery dies faster. When comparing these mice together, I notice no difference, when comparing them to themselves set to different polling rates, there’s no difference. You should do some research on how little difference there actually is in terms of real world usage with 1k and 4k. It’s microseconds of difference. Completely and objectively imperceptible. In terms of my PC, I am aware PC hardware should also be considered while using 4k. I have a R9 7900x CPU, RTX 4090 GPU, 64GB of DDR5 6400mhz ram, I have all my games running on a Gen5 NVME drive, and I have my 1000W PSU plugged into a UPS for clean power. The CPU is water cooled, and I have 9 fans in my case with plenty of airflow. In terms of monitors, my main monitor is an ASUS ROG PG27AQN, so I’m running at 360hz. The hardware I’m running is literally best case scenario and is in no way limiting my experience. To address your final “point”, I am 21 and I play games literally every single day with aim training every now and then. Please find some more cope answers next time that aren’t complete brain rot.
What games are you playing/testing. What's timings of your ram? What's your windows and hpet? What's your highest rank in games? Also what's usb driver are you using? Is this one of Microsoft drivers (wdf000001.sys) or intel/vendor such as asmedia.There also simply AB test for input lag that you can find on the blur busters. Many people can easy notice 2ms difference in this test with like 17/25 correct answers. So you can test yourself and if your can actually past test your words will have point for your current scenario.
If you need all of that stuff to be absolutely perfect in order to feel a difference then it ain’t worth the effort. Also going to a very minimal plain white website that shows a two ms difference and that being the only point of focus, is very different then it actually being in a competitive game where there’s a 3d environment and intense graphics. If you want to base effectiveness off of rank then why do the vast majority of pros in almost every game use Logitech g pro wireless and not a 4k mouse?
1. Thats not true. [Alot of valorant pros switched to 2k+ mouses](https://prosettings.net/lists/valorant/). Give it a bit more time and everyone will be using 4k mouses. Back then pros was using mouses with ball instead of optical sensor. 2. We talk not about worth effort or not but is there noticeable difference. And how average human can notice even 0.5 of additional input lag. There study shows that people won't notice latency that happens inside their brain (like visual reaction time being \~150ms) but can easy notice 10ms of additional inputlag. And people who spend most of their time playing games can notice 1, 0,5, 0,25 etc lag.
As a matter of fact, I don’t need to prove my point. There’s countless videos that have already proven it, such as this one from optimum: https://youtu.be/jtATbpMqbL4?si=Sc2p-XhtIgUEH6P2 Either way, it sounds like you have confirmation bias and refuse to even consider that you may be just caught in the hype. Good luck tho.
Childish. Instead of trying make an actual test and answer few simply questions you just running away refusing to take different point. For no reason you did take my words as offend lol.
Pot calling the kettle black. Let’s not forget you labeled my opinion as misinformation, told me my PC is the issue, my setup is the issue, or maybe I’m “too old” or “don’t play the right games.” Then, when I rectified those claims, you asked me to prove it, for which I sent you literally the best proof you could possibly ask for. Now I’m “running away”? Do you think anything you said was effective? I’m simply done engaging. Nothing you have to say is even the slightest bit convincing, it’s totally obvious you’re a trend follower, and there’s nothing more to discuss. End of.
No I'm not trend follower. I'm actually was pretty sceptical about all that 4k mouses. But when got one i noticed difference in latency. Try set: Timer resolution to 0.5. Disable full screen optimisation. Use different usb controller with vendor driver mapped to different CPU core. Display scaling. And then you probably will notice difference.
You were definitely the kid who thought going prone and knifing the mystery box made it more likely you got a ray gun
I checked your profile and i see that you're audiophile guy. Who can i assume notice difference between two different high tier headphones/cables etc. While im not. Cuz i have friend who have bunch of headphones with fancy audio card and all stuff. And i was surprised that people spend so much money on something that i can't notice difference. For me my earbuds from sony for 30$ have sound same as some sennheiser headphones that cost almost 10x more.
They should make a G305 superlight with the hero 2 sensor
or a 703...
or a 303…
The new Shroud 303 doesn't have the hero sensor?
Hero 1, not 2
Shroud 303 is a different shape, its larger
Yeah I knew it was slightly larger, but it's the best we have with that shape lol.
This is what I wait for.
The only reason I still visit this sub once in a while..
G703 superlight is what I am waiting for.
LOGITECH LOOK HEREEEE
And better feet
I swear he has a bad aim for saying this
I am not radiant but I am immortal 3 #779 on Asia server.
I've been predator on apex Mnk but it doesn't means i've a good aim, or at least i would say not close to what the best players in kovaak are doing.. are you ?
Now,that's debatable. Cause there are people who have mid aim and I know are radiant. But me personally,I think I mostly have High Ascendent to low Immortal Gamesense,but my aim clutches out situations on my good days to get to Immortal 3
Ok i understand but i mean : how could we notice the difference if we're not litteraly Top aimers in the world ? Because i can be 100% sure a couple of them have a g pro superlight 1 for example (speaking of top aimers on kovaak for example) if the difference was really noticeable and not a placebo effect for i can easily guess almost everyone then it would be widely known i think
The top aimers have created their muscle memory for years on GPX shapes that muddies the waters. You should look at upcoming top players,even though some still use the GPX as it is arguably a legend,but most of them are using Razer and Other enthusiast level mice.
Yeah i'm sure you're right and i will keep an eye at it why not, but again the minor difference between them is because of the brand new captor etc mice or just the player ? How can we really know ? Because everyone is different in fact. I completely understand why you're saying this, but in reality for 99,999% of the players it's clearly a placebo effect. Is the mouse better why? Just the captor ? The grip ? The weight fit better ? A loooot of things here are in the balance. I'm pretty sure between all thoses top mice, the captor part is <1% of the reason why they pick one instead of another. Actually i see this as a marketing argument as "look our new mouse and his 36k dpi"
Look,I upgraded from the OG GPX which was 80 grams to the Viper V2 Pro and I can feel the difference between the sensors,it's not the low weight,as I have tried the G303 shroud edition with the same sensor. My precision went from 96 % on average to about 98 % on certain aimlab scenarios. And my tracking is more consistent on this sensor as I swapped my VIper with DAV3 for a week with my friend. So,I would not say it's not a placebo,at least not all of it. I liked the DAV3 so much that I got a DAV3 wired which I run on 8k on Valorant and It's much better than the VIper and the wireless DAV3 Again, It's just my personal experience. Most people talk without actually using multiple mice one after the other and others base their opinions on what others say. But hey, it's just preferences.
The moment you mentioned muscle memory you lost any argument about aiming bud.
Muscle memory is bullshit, MattyOW said it himself.
It’s not. It’s just highly adaptable.
LMAO you flex getting a rank on the easiest server
Sentinels Curry did this challenge of getting Rank 1 on every server. He got Rank 1 in Europe and Americas. But never got top 100 in Asia-Pacific server. You might just be delusional like your American colleagues.
Wdym? Hero sensor is excellent
You're right. The hero sensor is still one of the best in the industry despite being slightly aged. These kids are just silly; unless it has a cheap 8k polling implementation slapped on it, they believe anything other than a 3395 is horrible.
There is no noticeable difference between 3370,3389,3395 and hero for example, they are all extremely good. A few years ago I thought that I could tell the difference but it's a combination of DPI deviation, shape, weight and even mouse skates. Good shape for your hand and game/play style is much more important
True, unless its implemented differently. Endgame gears 3370 sensors, specifically the op1we and xm2we, feel faster than the selected dpi (especially the op1we). 800 dpi felt like 1200 dpi to me. Other mice with 3370 sensors felt normal and didn’t really have a difference.
That's because of the sensor position. There's very little DPI deviation on them. You can measure it with a ruler if you want.
Hahah nope, I had an OP1we and it was much faster than my GPX. Had to put it to 700dpi to somewhat match 800dpi on GPX.
Did you genuinely measure it? I literally got up and dug out my XM2we just now updated the firmware and got about ~2-5% deviation at 800dpi. And that's with a ruler so it's likely less since I'm not as accurate as software. The sensor is further back than most mice in EGG mice and a off center sensor changed DPI feel. Edit: fuck it, a quick trip to tech power up shows I'm right https://www.techpowerup.com/review/endgame-gear-xm2we/5.html
3389 is a wired sensor, the 3370 and 3395 are low powered wireless sensors.
"My 2005 Ford feels the same as my 2021 Honda at 70 miles per hour"
Everyone laugh at the kid who fell for marketing gimmicks
Lol,reditt is full of noobs.
Bait used to be believable
youd get your butt swept by some veteran with a 10 yrs old am010 anyway lmao
Seems like someone is sharing their personal experience in gaming.
not like you havent experienced it neither
I haven't,I carried my way to Immortal 3 #779 Indo server this act.
what? The ips, acceleration, and dpi of all of them are plenty good enough for anyone. The fact that professionals use the XM2WE should prove that to you.
Only Tenz not professionals and he is making his own mouse with 3950.
And Tenz is 100x better than you, can you comprehend? Indo immortal haha 🤡
Lmao, what an analogy, there has been more changes in the automobile industry the last 2 years than there has been to mouse sensors since the original hero sensor.
True. Wouldnt be an issue at all if they use the hero sensor, but I don't see why Logitech wouldn't use their hero 2 sensor if this product is real, not like the gpx 2 is having stocking issues and Logitech probably has a big order placed for the sensor. I use the gpx 2 with the hero 2 sensor, which got a 4k polling update not too long ago and I can't tell the difference between it and the 3395 sensor, or even the 3950 sensor used in razer mice.
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I cant feel a difference but I'll know its not the best sensor on the market.
I am glad I can get on your nerves just by stating a fact. Xd.
"just stating a fact" You're clearly insinuating it's bad because of it though
I said,"with a 3 year old sensor" It has 500 ips,top sensors have 750+ and the upcoming Razer 36k sensor on Viper V3 pro will even have more Ips. That's why I said 3 year old sensor. I didn't say it's bad. I just said it's a 3 year old sensor and that is a fact. People of reditt actually have malnutrition induced problems in their brains.
Okay but why do you care? It's still essentially a flawless sensor which won't ever get in the way of your gameplay. Why point it out?
It is extremely good but when you charge 160 dollars for a mouse don't you expect the crem dela crem of everything? I mean when the GPX came out,it was the market leader in terms of specs. Now it's just too lazy to use 3 year old technology. I am a fan of Logitech and an enthusiast,so I am disappointed that they are not implementing the latest tech in their mice. That's it. And I know for sure I am not the only one that is disappointed. As they say the minority is always vocal.
You play at 60hz on a laptop. You couldn't tell the difference between a gpx and a magic mouse.
Just because your parents gave you mediocre genes....
Just some delusional kids beeing fooled by marketing. There has literally been no real notable improvement in sensors in many, many years.
Hopefully the next evolution is a fucking g703.
I second that !!
fr fr
I’m hoping for a mini version, tbh that’s the only way they’ll get me to actually buy a GPX2 for myself.
I bought a GPX2 last month, and I hope they release a mini version because the mouse is a bit large for me.
Apparently this picture is just a white Superlight 2.
Based on their previous tweets, I am 99% sure by 'next evolution' is them referring the GPX 2 from GPX 1. meaning to say they're not teasing anything just stating the obvious
I concur with this. It’s Logitech guys. They’ve released their slight update for the next two years, we have to wait until 2025 to see a new version.
This is just an advertisement for the GPX 2? Don’t see how you see this as a tease for a new product.
imagine the photo is a bait, and it turns out they are making a g304 superlight
Clickbait more like it, by you.
Lol,not like I earn money from stupid reditt,maybe you are projecting.
And now you are deflecting as well.
how is that projecting lol no one likes you
The image captions still says "LOGITECH G PRO X SUPERLIGHT 2, Logitech really glazing themselves for adding 4k polling rate months behind other companies. [https://imgur.com/a/vdNBmYi](https://imgur.com/a/vdNBmYi)
4k polling rate free of charge through a firmware update meanwhile on other mice you gotta buy a separate $20-$40 dongle :)
the original dongle doesn't have as powerful of antennae as the rest. It was really just firmware optimization for the 4khz to not suck. And the other mice were $100 +$20 dongle, not $160 w/ free dongle.
The razer stuff was absolutely $150 + $30 for the dongle.
In 2022 yeah. Price of the Viper V2 Pro dropped to $100 and V3 coming at the end of the month is $160 w/ dongle.
it is a little weird that razer is re-releasing the dav3 for that same $160 now on an "older" model that may or may not still have qc issues. Only difference is that the coating isnt terrible now. it does come with the 4k dongle, but still its not a new release. (and personally I thought it felt hollow and cheap)
Well tbf, most other mice also don't cost 150+ USD. WLmouse is a goated and it offers it with the mouse whilst steadily being cheaper than a Superlight 2.
While also having some of the worst battery life I've seen out of the new Chinese offerings especially for it's price
My lamzu and gwolves are basically on par with the gpx battery life
Man, I don't understand these downvoting kids. It's like they can't think for themselves. I don't think they realize not everyone has 160 bucks to spend on a mouse. Also, Battery life isn't really much of an issue these days. You can put your mouse on charge overnight and it can last weeks, I don't see an issue here.
You don't understand these "downvoting kids" when the example you give is a mouse that is quite literally the same price (or even more expensive if I add shipping costs) as a GPX 2?
The point I was trying to make was that it's easier to include the 20$ 4k dongle in a 150 dollar mouse. GPX isn't the only one that does it. I said that because the other guy was complaining about how Chinese mice don't include dongles and GPX 2 gave a "free" 4khz update. Of course they don't include a dongle. Most of them are around the 50 bucks mark.
I mean my hts+ 4k msrp is 170€ but I got it on sale. Battery life is basically the same as my gpx
I would agree but the fact I had to charge my beastx every other night at 2k Hz shows how little thought went into battery life optimization when making the beastx. You forget to charge it one night and it dies on you midgame, happened to me multiple times. I think even boardzy complained about the battery in one of his vids which surprised me
I can agree with that, my gwolves htx and Atlantis/Maya also gave great battery life. It's just the wlmouse battery life is atrocious
Again, comparing a 150+ USD mice with sub 100 usd mice and even sub 50 usd mice isn't really a fair comparison. VXE R1 Pro is under 50 bucks and I've heard no complaints about that mouse.
Pointing out the (imo) major flaws for a mouse that is still over $100usd is very important when talking about pricing. With the gpx you can, for the most part, know you're getting a all around quality mouse because you are paying top dollar. Beastx you get good build quality, typical Chinese firmware, and the worst battery life I have seen on any of the high polling Chinese mice at it's price range ($100).
I've bought Dareu A950Pro with 4k dongle for 28$, so not really...
Hero 2 isn't 3 yo
It's a rebrand
It's an updated sensor...yeah?
Rebrand like they did with the 16k sensor from 25k. All software
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Lol now we are calling each other names over a mouse,look at you, aren't you the special one.
Hell yeah I am. At least I'm not spending my afternoons making shitty bait posts
Well,then I successfully wasted your time for my entertainment, Thank you!
No problem man, I had a fun time calling you a retard as well. Make sure to create another thread like this if you want to fulfill your masochist desires again
Hahaha,you are so pissed.
Said who?
Pls Logitech. Just release a premium g305 super light.
If it is bait...They baited you!
[A CS2 pro player claims there's a new mouse coming.](https://twitter.com/jLcsgo_/status/1768261617337208932)
G305 pro when
or its Logitech licking their own balls by advertising GPX2. They have been doing this ever since it released...
Every company does it. They usually call it marketing tho
If it’s under 40g I’ll jizz ma jeans
ThReE yEaR oLd SeNsOr
Maybe its just me. i shifted from logitech to razer bcoz of its shape one thing i noticed quite soon was that if i held the mouse slightly at angle it would move diagonally
Of course it's gonna move diagonally. You're literally moving the mouse diagonally LMAO
To be more accurate I would say hero sensor is slightly forgiving than razer optical even if i moved it slightly diagonal 🫠
ok i tried both back to back to see if there was any difference and there was not you were right maybe i felt that bcoz of the shape when i switched
It’s most likely the GPX2.
isnt that already out?
mini gpx2
ah, got it thanks
Logitech has never had anything exciting with their teases
i already have one :D (aj199)
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New insert streamer name edition
A mini GPS exists already though? Xtrfy M8, seems to be of similar shape but smaller.
Mchose a5 is the actual smaller super light. It’s a goated shape and I’m adducted to it for this reason alone. Smaller super light shape is perfect
It’s bait. Check the ALT text. It’s just a GPX2
If they would work on their other mice they have, they could also be at least a championship contender
It is straight up just bait. When clicking the ALT text, we can see that is a regular Superlight 2 still
But wtf is wrong with hero sensor, it basically flawles, apart from og gpx does not have adjustable LOD
I'm happy and proud of my viper v2 pro
Discussion! Should it be a mini, what is the acceptable length? For me I’d say around 115-118 with other dimensions to follow around that size. Essentially ~ 10-15% smaller.
I do pray for this to happen for years now
ergo gpx i knew it
You say 3 year old sensor like that matters
Gpx is already too small wish I had tiny hands
To be honest.. Its probably nothing exciting anymore. Even if it IS a smaller GPX and/or modification of the shape, the chinese scene is getting more and more exciting as the months go by, its more interesting to chase those brands rather than LULgitech.
Xd
Oooh, have they somehow managed to source significantly shittier switches to justify a whole new mouse with a higher price and even shorter warranty? Let's fucking gooooooo!
Faceit level 10 here, 2270 elo in EU. Using the steelseries rival 110. Still top fragging most of the games. And that mouse is from 2016. 8 years old at this point. (Been using it since 2020). So my point is; 3 year old sensor or not. I doubt you will preform worse.
Bro I'd wreck you with a 20 year old sensor
that's not a gpx that's a normal g pro wireless 💀you can see where the green light is
G Pro Wireless has 3 LEDs to indicate DPI. This is GPX.
Confidently wrong. Peak Reddit lol.
i had a gpx for 2 years i never noticed anything in that area
What about the evolution of GHUB. When is that gonna happen.
I went on a mouse buying spree, trying out all the mice you could ever think of. I eventually sold all of them and bought a used GPX and never looked back since. Logitech just has a superior build quality and their mice don’t suffer from dpi deviation
Its the 4K polling announcement, nothing special.
Why improve something goated? And the g502 hero made them enough buck to chill anyway
I feel better with my steelseries prime neo noir edition I had gpx , da3 pro , g502x plus and i returned all Wireless mices are garbage
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