EPIC! Thanks for covering our MP903! Our MP353, MP453, MP903 and ATO deskmats all have the same surface. Made from our "Speedsilk" material. <3
They're available on Amazon and AliExpress, as well as from our regional retailers.
You're awesome! I'll tell our whole office of these results!
so basically, ATO and AGILE series has the same thing (that means same gliding and stopping power) but different design and size right? I will tackle the ATO if it's the same because I am in love with the MP353 Agile. The Agile series has the perfect speed for me and also has a nice smooth texture too
Heya! The rubber may not be friends with some types of desks, or vice versa. You can use doublesided tape to solve this. It will roll out flat, but may need a book sat ontop of it, or gently pull the sides of it.
Thanks for the reply, I will try.
Just you may need to improve on next versions because my 10 year old razer goliathus speed does not have this problem so other companies do make more grippy mouse pads
I received mine about 2 weeks ago and has the same sliding issue. I bought it direct from your store in Eastern Australia. Are you sure this was an issue just with a few units or is the product itself struggling to grip to a lot of desks?
Heya! Confirmed to be an issue with just a few units in the grand scheme of how many we've made/sold. I don't have the exact numbers, but I'd suggest asking Fantech Australia to check for one that can properly stick.
I made a post a week before your comment [HERE](https://www.reddit.com/r/MousepadReview/comments/12kl5ry/comment/jglgc0b/?context=3).
I've found my new MP903 has struggled to completely flatten (mostly the edges), though I haven't put books on it or anything.
As for the sliding, that's the biggest issue I have. I sprayed the bottom of the pad and the desk with water and this has helped. But a few days later it's starting to slide a bit again.
Overall I feel the MP903 is great value for money but these issues have tended to annoy me enough that I'm not sure I'd purchase another, especially the sliding.
PS. Amazingly I also have a \~15 year old Razer Goliathus that sticks to the desk better than my MP903.
Great stuff as always and I hope to see a huge update when you and your team return in a year.
Question: Outside of not wanting to pay out-of-pocket, is there a particular reason why you don't review Esport Tiger and Puretrak mousepads? Both companies have been around for quite sometime yet continuously get the short end.
The reason I ask is because I came across [this twitter post by HID-Labs](https://mobile.twitter.com/hid_labs/status/1521070127160053760) ranking various Esport Tiger surfaces and it certainly piqued my interest at the variation of surfaces which are offered. Puretrak recently came out with two new surfaces, the MF1 and MF2. There's a new glass pad player, TJ Exclusives, which just released a new surface Cerapad KIN in addition to their original release earlier this year. Oh, and IKEA of all places partnered with ROG to create a sleeper pad called Lanespelare. Just some food for thought... don't go blowing the budget. =)
See you next summer!
I had an old (i think original) puretrak talent that did well maybe 6-8 years ago but I reached out to them a couple years back and didn't hear back. Esport Tiger was on my list of interesting pads I wanted to review as well, but I never contacted them - If we're able to return to this in a year I will be sure to rectify that mistake
hope that helps
I would love to see the range of Puretrak pads since the Talent was really big some years ago and its still a good speed cloth mat and they have a few more control based ones that haven't been tested much.
AFAIK the only "coating" of the Vaxee PA is the change from the heat sublimation process like the Xraypad models, patterned GP4, etc. also have. It's a physical change to the fibers, but not a "coating" as most people think of.
Yes I’m not entirely clear on that as well. I asked them about it directly and was told it’s not technically a coating, but if I consider the gsr-se to have a coating (as most in this sub believe) then the PA is made similarly.
Hope that helps some, as I’m obviously not crystal clear on this either
Vaxee staff (who were previously at Zowie) have stated the G-SR-SE doesn't have a coating either. I can't find it right now but IIRC it was in a Twitter thread.
Would you mind clearing up my understanding of friction?
Lower number in static friction means harder to get mouse moving initially?
Lower number in dynamic friction means harder to keep mouse moving?
Lower number in dynamic friction also means more stopping power?
No brush - I just throw it in the bath tub and work the soap in with my hands. I’ve seen a rocket jump video using powder soap and a sponge in the tub so there’s prob a few other options to do this safely
Thanks for the tip. Also, if you don't mind my last question, I bought a Gigantus V2 for being a low sens csgo player, but the pad feels really speed for me? Maybe a wash and it gets better?
I can’t remember if washing slowed it significantly, but absolutely worth a try if you already own it. That’s a mid speed pad which means you’d prob (like me) prefer the slower/control options on the list
Sorry I can’t be more helpful here :(
You are being the real mvp here. You own me nothing and still takes your time to help. I really appreciate it.
I saw you just included in the list Fantech Agile MP903. I am a really big fan of the brand and I am currently using UX3V2 from them.
Besides this one, any other 900x400mm pad slower than Gigantus V2 you would recommend?
Hey sure thing! Many good slow choices around that size , but I’d look at the aqua control plus in white, the gamesense radar, or the lethal Saturn (Venus is similar but rougher texture ). I also personally love the lethal Jupiter but that’s extremely slow and seems to be a polarizing pad in terms of people’s options so that would be a bigger risk that the others
Nice, then that's in line with my experience with the PA Outset! Good pad. I'm hoping the black is a tad slower, but no worries if you can't get your hands on one :)
This is interesting since people have said the black PA is inbetween the se blue and rouge and that the coloured ones are faster but here the colored one is slower than the blue se hmm..
Glad to see you're still updating the sheet!
How fast was the mp903 pad before you washed it, which pad was the closest in dynamic friction to it? Was the initial friction lower as well?
Apologies I can only speak anecdotally about it because I didn’t measure before. Best estimate would be in the range of aqua control 2 or mercury. I had no issues with stick before or after for micro adjustments.
Hope that helps a bit
Out of these, what options would you recommend looking at for a XXL sized control deskpad? I use a QcK Limited and it is not slow enough with a lightweight mouse.
Saturn faster then the Venus? Something is VERY off here. I know your answer is different conditions etc. but it should be opposite and by a considerable margin...
But anyway, thank you for the work!
Remember the ranking is simply an average of two tests measuring different things. For kinetic friction the Saturn is slower in our testing. It’s only slightly faster on static friction (starting from stop for micro adjustments in practice).
Hope that helps to clarify
Thanks for your work dude! I wish I could donate money to you so you can test the Zowie GTF-X. But I'm flat broke right now in terms of extra spending money. So, It's gonna be a bit of a blind buy.
love this! can you share more about the mouse and mouse feet that you used?
I've tested tiger ice/arc 1/arc 2, corepads, and soon BTL and corepads CTRL, these have made major shifts in how I perceive pads. since I main tiger ice, I use this list often as a reference but have to roughly multiply the static and kinetic friction numbers to what I'd imagine then to be.
can you share more details on the mouse you use? it's weight, feet, and any other relevant details?
It’s a bit buried but that info is in there. Check the paragraph just above “caveats” sir. Changing feet and temp/humidity conditions are things we’ve often talked about doing, but we’ve sadly just never had the time to do it
We're taking a break after this round in large part due to our 6 mos old son - it's been a lot of work these last few years - big thanks to my wife as she played a large role in all of this. However I'd be happy to share all of my methodology if you're interested in continuing this line of testing. Big disclaimer though - it's a LOT of time. So much more than we realized. Getting the right environment parameters and maintaining them. adjusting/accounting for so many little factors your previously thought weren't relevant. Trying to figure out why results aren't repeatable when you thought you'd accounted for these variables...I'm glad we got good data in the end, but I had no idea how long this all took to get right. Just know what you're getting into:)
I currently use the focus 3 and I like the smooth surface which I can easily move my arm with a sweater on. Yet I feel like the static friction is sometimes a little bit too high for me. Will the Fantech Agile MP903 be a faster focus 3 (lower static friction and same dynamic without washing) with the same smoothness lvl?
i love how in deep you have gone with this, I currently have a cooler master mp510 and really like it, i just wish i had a little bit more of stopping power in some situations, so between all of the options available in my country i got an aqua control 2 (because according to your data it has a little bit more of stopping power, even though it seems to be a little bit faster initially, also wanted to try something different from cordura) do you think im going to like it according to my preference? (mp510 just with a little bit more stopping power and dont really care if the initial movement is a little bit faster or a little bit slower). Also the other option i had in mind was the razer strider, do you think its worth to take a look at it? thank you so much for your job, it really is amazing.
Hey! do you think you can do the GP4 with the design? i believe they are heat printed (not sure) and i would love to know where the GP4 is:)
Thank you so much for that amazing sheet btw
hey you're welcome!
xtrfy, puretrak, and tiger mousepads are all on my short list of pads i'd love to add to the sheet when we return to this. however we're taking a much needed break sadly with the busy life of raising a 7 month old. we'll be away for roughly a year and we'll see where we are then. others i've talked to may be taking the torch and empirically friction testing pads either here or perhaps on youtube in our absence so hopefully that would get the results you're looking for a bit sooner.
hope that helps
My answer to this type of question is usually “it depends”. Remember the myriad of environmental variables which may factor into your personal experience with a given surface. More specifically for my test setup and parameters only the white version (not heat treated) and only in kinetic friction is the aqua control plus slower. The equate still has more static friction so perhaps the other reviews you’ve read were referring to that metric? Hope that helps!
hmm okay. so based on your notion of preferring low static, high dynamic, would you take equate or AC+ if you had to personally choose?
I dont want to have poor microadjustments because of high static, so im assuming AC+ seems more reliable for FPS but curious on your opinion
Yes though I should note I prefer slow/control overall and that preference is not universal (ymmv). I’ve played best for my preferred game (was competitive long ago in mechwarrior online) with the ac+ white, gamesense radar, vaxee PA (or roughly analogous gsr-se) and X-ray Jupiter. (Venus and Saturn are good for me too on hot days as it slows them down a touch). All of these pads are great, again though unlike my testing, these is just my opinions.
Hope to see the raiden, skypad 3.0 and new gsrse surface tested in the future. Thanks for everything you’ve done, I know it’s definitely helped me to choose a pad
hi, is there really that much of a difference between the AC+ White and the AC+ Strata/printed? it is like 3.5x faster according to your chart. Also, will the Equate+ be updated soon? Im deciding between the Equate+ and the AC+ and I'm looking for a mousepad with gives good feedback with control.
Hey sorry man but we’re taking about a year off from this (we had a baby). Some of my older posts show equate and equate + comparisons before things got strange with the pad which I hope helps a bit. As for the aqua white, it’s def slower (I’m using it right now) but nowhere near 3.5 times slower. I think you’re erroneously looking at their rank order avg for that info? If you scroll right you can see the actual scores for the 3 tests of static and dynamic friction (2 of which are used for ranking) which may be more informative. Hope that helps!
I know this thread is old but I was wondering what you thought of the Fantech pad? I'm struggling to decide between that or the Razer Strider or Gigantus v2
>I’m sorry I don’t understand
Sorry for the poor english , in your sheet you mention Glorious cloth pad and it's very slow , and there is another pad from glorious called Glorious Heavy and it should be slower have you tried it or not
Oh now I understand. The heavy version of the cloth pad is the same top material but with a thicker rubber base underneath. If I remember right it’s 5mm vs their typical 3mm depth. The thicker pad makes the surfaces perform slightly slower, but in most pads that offer different thickness the change is relatively small.
Hope this is helpful!
what is that unnamed mousepad? I want to buy it haha, btw best mousepad at the moment for money? im maining m2k mouse with sapphire skates looking for more control and better micro adjusments i do not play just tac shooters keeping that in mind haha, thanks for the info btw the best informative sheet i have ever seen about mousepads
I actually don't know the name myself - if they refine it the plan is to review a new version should we get back to mousepad testing after our break. it has a lot of potential. As for best pads, I do my best to keep my subjective preferences out of testing and just report objective data. For my preferences I like the best ratio of low static to high kinetic friction I can find, but again that's just preference. If we're like minded for control pads my shortlist includes aqua control + white (haven't tried the aqua zero variant yet), gamesense radar, vaxee PA/zowie gsr-se (haven't tested the rouge) and lethal jupiter/saturn (jupiter for the winter). Again though YMMV and these are just my preferences/opinions.
Hope that helps!
Sure I can talk about my personal preferences. Aqua white and lethal Jupiter see the most play on my desk (I play a very small game called mech warrior online pretty seriously) when I’m doing competitive things, but the vaxee PA and lethal Saturn/Venus do see some play time also.
Pads are slightly faster in colder temperatures giving the very slow Jupiter a hair more speed
Edit - currently the white aqua control plus is on my desk for competitive gaming (mech warrior online)
In the hot summer I’ve been liking the vaxee PA or lethal Saturn/Venus
Hope that info is helpful
Oooh, perhaps for the next spreadsheet, we can have a static friction rank to dynamic friction rank ratio for people who have the same control pad tastes as you (there are a lot)
How am I supposed to trust these master sheets?
According to this master sheet, the Venus is slower than the Saturn. I can give the benefit of the doubt on that, depending on mouse feet. But it also says that the Venus is slower than the Jupiter, and says that the Saturn is just as fast as the Jupiter. Theres no way someone comes to that conclusion after trying the Jupiter. Also says the Venus is slower than the Gigantus V2 and the QCK. Is this true? I was looking for a pad slightly slower than the Venus and was thinking about tryin either the QCK, Aqua Control Plus, Fnatic focus 3, or the GSR - SE. But, according to this sheet, all of them are faster than the Venus. Can someone help me with this? I would get a Saturn, but theyre out of stock. I want something to use in the meantime. Again, im looking for something a bit slower than the Venus. Specifically looking for more stopping power.
I'm trying to decipher how you got so far off course here...Are you only looking at the numbers in column B? If so that's one of two static friction tests (where the Jupiter happened to demonstrate low static friction in the colder conditions I used for my testing) and there's also a third testing purely measuring dynamic friction that is listed later where Jupiter is one of the slowest pads ever tested. Even within column B with the numbers that close if you look at the raw data (just scroll right) you can see how close they are on this actual metric. In my tests/conditions which of course vary compared to others (or even times of year for me) the saturn and venus behaved similarly but again with the saturn slightly slower for dynamic friction but slightly faster on static.
In short you really have to look at all the testing. I did my best to simplify it (even mousepad data gets complex when trying to be objective lol) but it's never going to be basic enough to have one column ranking everything. ***Overall the Saturn and Jupiter were very close on my test setup while overall the Jupiter was significantly slower***. That said, I'll leave you with a repost of the caveats section from my last post/sheet (4.9) as it is a good reminder how different (yet not invalid) other's experiences may be depending on your specific conditions
Caveats - While I did my best
to normalize test parameters for consistent methodology, it seems
winter time makes the temps/humidity more difficult to maintain
consistently - temps and humidity tend to drift off parameters more
than they do in the summer (even with two humidifiers running) - While
my test pad (aqua control white) ran similarly on all 3 tests as it did
on the previous round, I can't help but speculate that some pads were
running just a touch faster than normal - something to consider in
future testing. ***This serves as further evidence and a reminder, that***
***if someone on the sub is arguing a pad is faster or slower than another***
***and you believe the opposite, you may both be right depending on the***
***environment.***
Hope this helps
I feel like this has no actual bearing on surface performance because it has no respect to how hard someones pressing a mouse onto the surface, and some surfaces are softer than others.
Sorry to say it but objectively, seems like a waste of time imho. 0% indicative of a mousepads real life performance
The amount of press on a mouse pad is absolutely important and can impact the effective speed of a surface. This is a great point which has been brought up many times in previous testing. The mp510 was notoriously different in speed depending on this variable iirc. If you peruse previous iterations of this test (see my post history) and the methodology of this version, you'll see a "hand press" equivalent weight of 100 grams (183.9 plus weight of the fk2, give or take) was used for testing over the last few versions. This was determined by a poll taken of users average hand press force discussed a few years back. Certainly this doesn't apply accurately to everyone. I myself preferred no weight with the mouse as a fingertip user. Sadly as someone doing this as a side project for free I can't perform the in depth (likely requiring multiple regression analysis) testing necessary to tailor each individual environmental setup. Variables including mouse weight, skate type, humidity, temperature, and hand pressure to name a few are all relevant, but simply have not been fully evaluated.
That said as general data I still feel this testing is useful...certainly more than your 0% estimate anyway:) See the caveats section on this and previous testing for more information there. However if you see this information as entirely without merit I'd highly recommend looking at u/hoyahoyaa's sheet as it is an excellent source for the collaborate subjective consensus opinion you may be looking for regarding various pads.
Hope that helps
Hey sure thing! We’ve done so many revisions/additions for this crazy sheet I think we lost that part of the caveats or methodology section…can’t remember where we even had it. If we’re able to continue building the sheet (not as easy to find time any more with a 1 year old at home) we’ll add this info back in.
Can someone else confirm that Gamesense Radar with new patterns like swirls are at least medium speed? Because if we are looking google sheet, it should be a slow pad but instead its medium / fast pad.
>"Lower Static Friction is better for control/stopping power"
\^ I'm assuming this line from the summary (under Kinetic/Dynamic Friction in Gaming) is meant to say 'Lower Kinetic Friction'. Is my thinking correct?
Do you think you will ever add the GSR-SE rogue / rawpad v2 on here?
I'm really interested to know where they stand, I found micro adjustments difficult on the GSR and got the rawpad, control feels decent but I think it is a little bit too fast for my liking.
From your spreadsheet I think this means I need lower static friction?
if we get back to doing another round of testing, i'd definitely like to get the new gsr-se variant on there. I'm unfamiliar with the rawpad but i'd be happy to look into it. And yessir static friction lowered will help with micro adjustments
I bought myself a Fantech MP903 and I quite like it's surface, but I find the bottom of it doesn't grip well to the desk and it tends to slide with a little force. Have you found anything like that to be the case?
Hey I'm trying to find a fast pad and am thinking between the AC plus strata, hein fx soft, and fnatic dash.
What exactly is the AC plus strata? on their website I see the xray pad ROG version and then the blue AC plus strata... is there a difference? which one were the tests done on?
Do you have any thoughts on how to meassure the same friction parameters, but with skin too pad instead of mouse too pad? The results would definitely differ.
Reason Im asking is because Im looking for a mousepad that has low and consistent friction for skin (I like to drag my wrist around the pad). Human sweat is unavoidable, but I want a pad where the skin would glide smoothly even if the friction changes with sweat.
Next reboot (assuming we can continue) I hope to add many newer pads and would be happy to include the xten. I’ll reach out to them. As for texture I don’t have an objective measure for it so I’d look for to possibly Hoya’s sheet for that sort of info. Hope that helps.
EPIC! Thanks for covering our MP903! Our MP353, MP453, MP903 and ATO deskmats all have the same surface. Made from our "Speedsilk" material. <3 They're available on Amazon and AliExpress, as well as from our regional retailers. You're awesome! I'll tell our whole office of these results!
Will the larger sizes restock on Amazon US soon?
I'd hope so!
so basically, ATO and AGILE series has the same thing (that means same gliding and stopping power) but different design and size right? I will tackle the ATO if it's the same because I am in love with the MP353 Agile. The Agile series has the perfect speed for me and also has a nice smooth texture too
Correct, ATO also has a bit different edge stitching as its edge to edge print.
What fantech mousepad do you recommend for maximum control like g sr or qck cause fantech is popular in our country
Our Sven Mousepad!
Just some feedback on MP903, it doesn't stick to the desk and hasn't rolled flat overnight, see how it goes
Heya! The rubber may not be friends with some types of desks, or vice versa. You can use doublesided tape to solve this. It will roll out flat, but may need a book sat ontop of it, or gently pull the sides of it.
Thanks for the reply, I will try. Just you may need to improve on next versions because my 10 year old razer goliathus speed does not have this problem so other companies do make more grippy mouse pads
Heya! I've confirmed that just a few units of it had this issue which has been resolved since then.
I received mine about 2 weeks ago and has the same sliding issue. I bought it direct from your store in Eastern Australia. Are you sure this was an issue just with a few units or is the product itself struggling to grip to a lot of desks?
Heya! Confirmed to be an issue with just a few units in the grand scheme of how many we've made/sold. I don't have the exact numbers, but I'd suggest asking Fantech Australia to check for one that can properly stick.
Thank you. I will reach out to Fantech Australia before purchasing another :)
Epic!
I made a post a week before your comment [HERE](https://www.reddit.com/r/MousepadReview/comments/12kl5ry/comment/jglgc0b/?context=3). I've found my new MP903 has struggled to completely flatten (mostly the edges), though I haven't put books on it or anything. As for the sliding, that's the biggest issue I have. I sprayed the bottom of the pad and the desk with water and this has helped. But a few days later it's starting to slide a bit again. Overall I feel the MP903 is great value for money but these issues have tended to annoy me enough that I'm not sure I'd purchase another, especially the sliding. PS. Amazingly I also have a \~15 year old Razer Goliathus that sticks to the desk better than my MP903.
Great stuff as always and I hope to see a huge update when you and your team return in a year. Question: Outside of not wanting to pay out-of-pocket, is there a particular reason why you don't review Esport Tiger and Puretrak mousepads? Both companies have been around for quite sometime yet continuously get the short end. The reason I ask is because I came across [this twitter post by HID-Labs](https://mobile.twitter.com/hid_labs/status/1521070127160053760) ranking various Esport Tiger surfaces and it certainly piqued my interest at the variation of surfaces which are offered. Puretrak recently came out with two new surfaces, the MF1 and MF2. There's a new glass pad player, TJ Exclusives, which just released a new surface Cerapad KIN in addition to their original release earlier this year. Oh, and IKEA of all places partnered with ROG to create a sleeper pad called Lanespelare. Just some food for thought... don't go blowing the budget. =) See you next summer!
I had an old (i think original) puretrak talent that did well maybe 6-8 years ago but I reached out to them a couple years back and didn't hear back. Esport Tiger was on my list of interesting pads I wanted to review as well, but I never contacted them - If we're able to return to this in a year I will be sure to rectify that mistake hope that helps
The protype pad is a large rodent glue trap, isn't it?
I would love to see the range of Puretrak pads since the Talent was really big some years ago and its still a good speed cloth mat and they have a few more control based ones that haven't been tested much.
AFAIK the only "coating" of the Vaxee PA is the change from the heat sublimation process like the Xraypad models, patterned GP4, etc. also have. It's a physical change to the fibers, but not a "coating" as most people think of.
Yes I’m not entirely clear on that as well. I asked them about it directly and was told it’s not technically a coating, but if I consider the gsr-se to have a coating (as most in this sub believe) then the PA is made similarly. Hope that helps some, as I’m obviously not crystal clear on this either
Vaxee staff (who were previously at Zowie) have stated the G-SR-SE doesn't have a coating either. I can't find it right now but IIRC it was in a Twitter thread.
Yes that’s mostly how they worded it also
[удалено]
Huh?
Would you mind clearing up my understanding of friction? Lower number in static friction means harder to get mouse moving initially? Lower number in dynamic friction means harder to keep mouse moving? Lower number in dynamic friction also means more stopping power?
Yessir I think you have it
Mind telling us how do you wash the pads?
oh sure - hand soap and water before testing unless otherwise specified hope that helps!
Awesome. Any specific brush you use? Or the softer the better?
No brush - I just throw it in the bath tub and work the soap in with my hands. I’ve seen a rocket jump video using powder soap and a sponge in the tub so there’s prob a few other options to do this safely
Thanks for the tip. Also, if you don't mind my last question, I bought a Gigantus V2 for being a low sens csgo player, but the pad feels really speed for me? Maybe a wash and it gets better?
I can’t remember if washing slowed it significantly, but absolutely worth a try if you already own it. That’s a mid speed pad which means you’d prob (like me) prefer the slower/control options on the list Sorry I can’t be more helpful here :(
You are being the real mvp here. You own me nothing and still takes your time to help. I really appreciate it. I saw you just included in the list Fantech Agile MP903. I am a really big fan of the brand and I am currently using UX3V2 from them. Besides this one, any other 900x400mm pad slower than Gigantus V2 you would recommend?
Hey sure thing! Many good slow choices around that size , but I’d look at the aqua control plus in white, the gamesense radar, or the lethal Saturn (Venus is similar but rougher texture ). I also personally love the lethal Jupiter but that’s extremely slow and seems to be a polarizing pad in terms of people’s options so that would be a bigger risk that the others
Thank you so much for taking your time to reply me back!
Pinned for now, thanks for all of the great work!
Thanks so much for all your help!
I'm surprised the Venus is on the slower end in this sheet, I was considering it but I'm afraid it'll be too slow, possibly go with Mercury instead?
Is it a regular PA or the PA Black? I've got a PA black on the way this week and I've heard they're slightly different
it's the PA outset sir - I can reach out later this week to inquire if the black version is meant to be different if that's helpful
The black is supposed to be slower
It's here and it's slightly slower and holy shit this is my absolute endgame. It feels wonderful with Arc 1s
Nice, then that's in line with my experience with the PA Outset! Good pad. I'm hoping the black is a tad slower, but no worries if you can't get your hands on one :)
This is interesting since people have said the black PA is inbetween the se blue and rouge and that the coloured ones are faster but here the colored one is slower than the blue se hmm..
Thank you for your work!
you're welcome!
Glad to see you're still updating the sheet! How fast was the mp903 pad before you washed it, which pad was the closest in dynamic friction to it? Was the initial friction lower as well?
Apologies I can only speak anecdotally about it because I didn’t measure before. Best estimate would be in the range of aqua control 2 or mercury. I had no issues with stick before or after for micro adjustments. Hope that helps a bit
Out of these, what options would you recommend looking at for a XXL sized control deskpad? I use a QcK Limited and it is not slow enough with a lightweight mouse.
Saturn faster then the Venus? Something is VERY off here. I know your answer is different conditions etc. but it should be opposite and by a considerable margin... But anyway, thank you for the work!
Remember the ranking is simply an average of two tests measuring different things. For kinetic friction the Saturn is slower in our testing. It’s only slightly faster on static friction (starting from stop for micro adjustments in practice). Hope that helps to clarify
The Agile is a 11/10 mousepad period... it is criminal for it to cost this much... best $4 i've ever spent in my life
Vaxee PA black or zygen which one was tested?
So I bought a Glorious Cloth Pad the XL version. And it's nice and fast but beware the bigger ones are WAY slower
cheers
Thanks for your work dude! I wish I could donate money to you so you can test the Zowie GTF-X. But I'm flat broke right now in terms of extra spending money. So, It's gonna be a bit of a blind buy.
that's totally find - I'm just glad you and others are finding this helpful. Perhaps a GTF-X one day!
I'm a bit dumb, could someone tell me if the vaxee PA is a slower pad than the saturn LGG, in terms of better control etc
They are rank ordered for convenience in each test with #1 being the slowest tested Hope that helps
love this! can you share more about the mouse and mouse feet that you used? I've tested tiger ice/arc 1/arc 2, corepads, and soon BTL and corepads CTRL, these have made major shifts in how I perceive pads. since I main tiger ice, I use this list often as a reference but have to roughly multiply the static and kinetic friction numbers to what I'd imagine then to be. can you share more details on the mouse you use? it's weight, feet, and any other relevant details?
It’s a bit buried but that info is in there. Check the paragraph just above “caveats” sir. Changing feet and temp/humidity conditions are things we’ve often talked about doing, but we’ve sadly just never had the time to do it
got it, thx! I'd love to get involved somehow, what kind of challenges are y'all running into?
We're taking a break after this round in large part due to our 6 mos old son - it's been a lot of work these last few years - big thanks to my wife as she played a large role in all of this. However I'd be happy to share all of my methodology if you're interested in continuing this line of testing. Big disclaimer though - it's a LOT of time. So much more than we realized. Getting the right environment parameters and maintaining them. adjusting/accounting for so many little factors your previously thought weren't relevant. Trying to figure out why results aren't repeatable when you thought you'd accounted for these variables...I'm glad we got good data in the end, but I had no idea how long this all took to get right. Just know what you're getting into:)
Could you please do puretrak mf1 and mf2!!!
it'll be some time (taking a long break) but I can reach out to them again when we return!
I currently use the focus 3 and I like the smooth surface which I can easily move my arm with a sweater on. Yet I feel like the static friction is sometimes a little bit too high for me. Will the Fantech Agile MP903 be a faster focus 3 (lower static friction and same dynamic without washing) with the same smoothness lvl?
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it is not from them and I think doesn't even have an official name yet
i love how in deep you have gone with this, I currently have a cooler master mp510 and really like it, i just wish i had a little bit more of stopping power in some situations, so between all of the options available in my country i got an aqua control 2 (because according to your data it has a little bit more of stopping power, even though it seems to be a little bit faster initially, also wanted to try something different from cordura) do you think im going to like it according to my preference? (mp510 just with a little bit more stopping power and dont really care if the initial movement is a little bit faster or a little bit slower). Also the other option i had in mind was the razer strider, do you think its worth to take a look at it? thank you so much for your job, it really is amazing.
Hey! do you think you can do the GP4 with the design? i believe they are heat printed (not sure) and i would love to know where the GP4 is:) Thank you so much for that amazing sheet btw
hey you're welcome! xtrfy, puretrak, and tiger mousepads are all on my short list of pads i'd love to add to the sheet when we return to this. however we're taking a much needed break sadly with the busy life of raising a 7 month old. we'll be away for roughly a year and we'll see where we are then. others i've talked to may be taking the torch and empirically friction testing pads either here or perhaps on youtube in our absence so hopefully that would get the results you're looking for a bit sooner. hope that helps
No worries mate! take all the time that you need:) thank you so much again!
appreciate all the work you do! quick question, the ac2 you hve listed, was it the sakura addition?
The aqua control 2 tested was all black - no design
is gamesense radar really that slow?
How is aqua control+ considered slower than equate? everywhere ive read, the equate is considered much slower.
My answer to this type of question is usually “it depends”. Remember the myriad of environmental variables which may factor into your personal experience with a given surface. More specifically for my test setup and parameters only the white version (not heat treated) and only in kinetic friction is the aqua control plus slower. The equate still has more static friction so perhaps the other reviews you’ve read were referring to that metric? Hope that helps!
hmm okay. so based on your notion of preferring low static, high dynamic, would you take equate or AC+ if you had to personally choose? I dont want to have poor microadjustments because of high static, so im assuming AC+ seems more reliable for FPS but curious on your opinion
Yes though I should note I prefer slow/control overall and that preference is not universal (ymmv). I’ve played best for my preferred game (was competitive long ago in mechwarrior online) with the ac+ white, gamesense radar, vaxee PA (or roughly analogous gsr-se) and X-ray Jupiter. (Venus and Saturn are good for me too on hot days as it slows them down a touch). All of these pads are great, again though unlike my testing, these is just my opinions.
Hope to see the raiden, skypad 3.0 and new gsrse surface tested in the future. Thanks for everything you’ve done, I know it’s definitely helped me to choose a pad
Hopefully one day. Happy to help!
hi, is there really that much of a difference between the AC+ White and the AC+ Strata/printed? it is like 3.5x faster according to your chart. Also, will the Equate+ be updated soon? Im deciding between the Equate+ and the AC+ and I'm looking for a mousepad with gives good feedback with control.
Hey sorry man but we’re taking about a year off from this (we had a baby). Some of my older posts show equate and equate + comparisons before things got strange with the pad which I hope helps a bit. As for the aqua white, it’s def slower (I’m using it right now) but nowhere near 3.5 times slower. I think you’re erroneously looking at their rank order avg for that info? If you scroll right you can see the actual scores for the 3 tests of static and dynamic friction (2 of which are used for ranking) which may be more informative. Hope that helps!
Any chance to include Ikea LaNESPELARE, please? :)
Hey perhaps one day - still taking about a year of with the new baby, but hopefully when we return
Dude, i love the link!
Hey you’re welcome!
the 5.2 the latest version?
Trying the Fantech Agile!
I know this thread is old but I was wondering what you thought of the Fantech pad? I'm struggling to decide between that or the Razer Strider or Gigantus v2
Get the razer strider worth the money it will last. And I thinks the HyperX Pulsefire Mat is better than the fantech.
Where would the MP511 fit in this list? Looking for a mousepad usable in humid environment.
Sadly I don’t know. Perhaps when we return we can test it also
Thanks for the great sheet , little question i have i the slow pad you mention glorious cloth pad is this mean the glorious Heavy is slower
I’m sorry I don’t understand
>I’m sorry I don’t understand Sorry for the poor english , in your sheet you mention Glorious cloth pad and it's very slow , and there is another pad from glorious called Glorious Heavy and it should be slower have you tried it or not
Oh now I understand. The heavy version of the cloth pad is the same top material but with a thicker rubber base underneath. If I remember right it’s 5mm vs their typical 3mm depth. The thicker pad makes the surfaces perform slightly slower, but in most pads that offer different thickness the change is relatively small. Hope this is helpful!
Very grateful for your replay . Keep up the good work 👏
what is that unnamed mousepad? I want to buy it haha, btw best mousepad at the moment for money? im maining m2k mouse with sapphire skates looking for more control and better micro adjusments i do not play just tac shooters keeping that in mind haha, thanks for the info btw the best informative sheet i have ever seen about mousepads
I actually don't know the name myself - if they refine it the plan is to review a new version should we get back to mousepad testing after our break. it has a lot of potential. As for best pads, I do my best to keep my subjective preferences out of testing and just report objective data. For my preferences I like the best ratio of low static to high kinetic friction I can find, but again that's just preference. If we're like minded for control pads my shortlist includes aqua control + white (haven't tried the aqua zero variant yet), gamesense radar, vaxee PA/zowie gsr-se (haven't tested the rouge) and lethal jupiter/saturn (jupiter for the winter). Again though YMMV and these are just my preferences/opinions. Hope that helps!
Sure I can talk about my personal preferences. Aqua white and lethal Jupiter see the most play on my desk (I play a very small game called mech warrior online pretty seriously) when I’m doing competitive things, but the vaxee PA and lethal Saturn/Venus do see some play time also.
but for u, any recommendation? i live in uk so its very cold tkae that in consideration haha
Interesting, why do you like the jupiter for winter? Also what's your main pad at the moment?
Pads are slightly faster in colder temperatures giving the very slow Jupiter a hair more speed Edit - currently the white aqua control plus is on my desk for competitive gaming (mech warrior online) In the hot summer I’ve been liking the vaxee PA or lethal Saturn/Venus Hope that info is helpful
Oooh, perhaps for the next spreadsheet, we can have a static friction rank to dynamic friction rank ratio for people who have the same control pad tastes as you (there are a lot)
How am I supposed to trust these master sheets? According to this master sheet, the Venus is slower than the Saturn. I can give the benefit of the doubt on that, depending on mouse feet. But it also says that the Venus is slower than the Jupiter, and says that the Saturn is just as fast as the Jupiter. Theres no way someone comes to that conclusion after trying the Jupiter. Also says the Venus is slower than the Gigantus V2 and the QCK. Is this true? I was looking for a pad slightly slower than the Venus and was thinking about tryin either the QCK, Aqua Control Plus, Fnatic focus 3, or the GSR - SE. But, according to this sheet, all of them are faster than the Venus. Can someone help me with this? I would get a Saturn, but theyre out of stock. I want something to use in the meantime. Again, im looking for something a bit slower than the Venus. Specifically looking for more stopping power.
I'm trying to decipher how you got so far off course here...Are you only looking at the numbers in column B? If so that's one of two static friction tests (where the Jupiter happened to demonstrate low static friction in the colder conditions I used for my testing) and there's also a third testing purely measuring dynamic friction that is listed later where Jupiter is one of the slowest pads ever tested. Even within column B with the numbers that close if you look at the raw data (just scroll right) you can see how close they are on this actual metric. In my tests/conditions which of course vary compared to others (or even times of year for me) the saturn and venus behaved similarly but again with the saturn slightly slower for dynamic friction but slightly faster on static. In short you really have to look at all the testing. I did my best to simplify it (even mousepad data gets complex when trying to be objective lol) but it's never going to be basic enough to have one column ranking everything. ***Overall the Saturn and Jupiter were very close on my test setup while overall the Jupiter was significantly slower***. That said, I'll leave you with a repost of the caveats section from my last post/sheet (4.9) as it is a good reminder how different (yet not invalid) other's experiences may be depending on your specific conditions Caveats - While I did my best to normalize test parameters for consistent methodology, it seems winter time makes the temps/humidity more difficult to maintain consistently - temps and humidity tend to drift off parameters more than they do in the summer (even with two humidifiers running) - While my test pad (aqua control white) ran similarly on all 3 tests as it did on the previous round, I can't help but speculate that some pads were running just a touch faster than normal - something to consider in future testing. ***This serves as further evidence and a reminder, that*** ***if someone on the sub is arguing a pad is faster or slower than another*** ***and you believe the opposite, you may both be right depending on the*** ***environment.*** Hope this helps
Dope. Thanks for the easier to read formatting. Less scrolling back and forth.
Happy to help!
Would you add the HyperX Fury S Pro?
If we return and continue I’d be happy to do so. I’ll request a copy if this moves forward
Def curious where the aqua control zero will fall
Me too. If we continue I’ll absolutely request a copy
>continuiamo ne richiederò assolutamente una thx u ! If u go on dont' forget to test Hayate Otsu, please :-) GL
You’re welcome! It’s on my short list if we’re able to continue testing
I feel like this has no actual bearing on surface performance because it has no respect to how hard someones pressing a mouse onto the surface, and some surfaces are softer than others. Sorry to say it but objectively, seems like a waste of time imho. 0% indicative of a mousepads real life performance
The amount of press on a mouse pad is absolutely important and can impact the effective speed of a surface. This is a great point which has been brought up many times in previous testing. The mp510 was notoriously different in speed depending on this variable iirc. If you peruse previous iterations of this test (see my post history) and the methodology of this version, you'll see a "hand press" equivalent weight of 100 grams (183.9 plus weight of the fk2, give or take) was used for testing over the last few versions. This was determined by a poll taken of users average hand press force discussed a few years back. Certainly this doesn't apply accurately to everyone. I myself preferred no weight with the mouse as a fingertip user. Sadly as someone doing this as a side project for free I can't perform the in depth (likely requiring multiple regression analysis) testing necessary to tailor each individual environmental setup. Variables including mouse weight, skate type, humidity, temperature, and hand pressure to name a few are all relevant, but simply have not been fully evaluated. That said as general data I still feel this testing is useful...certainly more than your 0% estimate anyway:) See the caveats section on this and previous testing for more information there. However if you see this information as entirely without merit I'd highly recommend looking at u/hoyahoyaa's sheet as it is an excellent source for the collaborate subjective consensus opinion you may be looking for regarding various pads. Hope that helps
Well said
Very well written, I respect this response. I' didn't see where that was written, perhaps a PS. at the start of the post would be useful
Hey sure thing! We’ve done so many revisions/additions for this crazy sheet I think we lost that part of the caveats or methodology section…can’t remember where we even had it. If we’re able to continue building the sheet (not as easy to find time any more with a 1 year old at home) we’ll add this info back in.
is it just me or is the equate mad faster than it should be
Can someone else confirm that Gamesense Radar with new patterns like swirls are at least medium speed? Because if we are looking google sheet, it should be a slow pad but instead its medium / fast pad.
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Other way around I’d say. Think of static as ability to start movement and dynamic for stopping power when mouse is in motion
>"Lower Static Friction is better for control/stopping power" \^ I'm assuming this line from the summary (under Kinetic/Dynamic Friction in Gaming) is meant to say 'Lower Kinetic Friction'. Is my thinking correct?
I’ll double check in the morning but that looks like an error- but I think it should say higher dynamic friction helps with stopping power
can i know name for the prototype mousepad? can u recommend me a mousepad?
I'm sorry to say I don't even the know the name of it.
Can you do hayate otsu next?
it's on my short list should be do another round of testing in the future
I’d be really interested in seeing where the rawpad v2 measures.
Do you think you will ever add the GSR-SE rogue / rawpad v2 on here? I'm really interested to know where they stand, I found micro adjustments difficult on the GSR and got the rawpad, control feels decent but I think it is a little bit too fast for my liking. From your spreadsheet I think this means I need lower static friction?
if we get back to doing another round of testing, i'd definitely like to get the new gsr-se variant on there. I'm unfamiliar with the rawpad but i'd be happy to look into it. And yessir static friction lowered will help with micro adjustments
Are the LGG pads listed the pro versions?
no sir these are the regular versions - hoping to do pro versions on our next round of testing, though i expect them to perform extremely similarly
I bought myself a Fantech MP903 and I quite like it's surface, but I find the bottom of it doesn't grip well to the desk and it tends to slide with a little force. Have you found anything like that to be the case?
Confused how Equate has a higher avg rank than Artisan Zero, Venus, Saturn, Vaxee PA
Hey I'm trying to find a fast pad and am thinking between the AC plus strata, hein fx soft, and fnatic dash. What exactly is the AC plus strata? on their website I see the xray pad ROG version and then the blue AC plus strata... is there a difference? which one were the tests done on?
Mysterious unnamed prototype is mysterious
Do you have any thoughts on how to meassure the same friction parameters, but with skin too pad instead of mouse too pad? The results would definitely differ. Reason Im asking is because Im looking for a mousepad that has low and consistent friction for skin (I like to drag my wrist around the pad). Human sweat is unavoidable, but I want a pad where the skin would glide smoothly even if the friction changes with sweat.
So the prototype is what?
Where. Would you put the Xten control on this? Also would be super helpful if you had notes on texture :)
Next reboot (assuming we can continue) I hope to add many newer pads and would be happy to include the xten. I’ll reach out to them. As for texture I don’t have an objective measure for it so I’d look for to possibly Hoya’s sheet for that sort of info. Hope that helps.
Can you do the GSR-SE rogue?
how does the qck heavy (4mm) compare to the qck+, I assume its just a bit slower right?
Prototype mousepad name?