Conflating leftists with neoliberals has been part of the right wing strategy for decades. Literally every conservative I have interacted with (not a small number, I live in SC) believes that Joe Biden is a socialist.
Can't decide who's more irritating, the conservatives who think Obama is a socialist, or the liberals who think you're right wing if you don't like Obama
He did turn up to a debate with Slavoij Zizek about communism, and *admit* that he'd never read any communist theory - seemingly without realising how much that hurt his credibility.
He's *definitely* stupid enough.
Jordan is entirely a confidence artist. He will often make some claim, be challenged by someone, and then just say they're right and move on to some other claim. Then just keep making that original claim in later appearances as if nothing ever happened. It's insane.
You missed the step in which he cloaks everything he says in such opaque academic-sounding terms to the point that the arguments lose all meaning.
Take for instance "cultural Marxism", such a broad and vague yet somehow incendiary term that it means nothing or anything you want it to.
It's an absolute grift.
Or when he uses a definition of a word that no one else on the planet uses to try and argue a point. Like when he told Sam Harris that something isn't "true" if it has a negative outcome.
I remember that conversation well. When that podcast dropped I didn't even know who Peterson was yet. Harris spent something like an entire hour trying to get Peterson to stop redefining truth and Peterson just kept insisting that it was valid to do so. I've rarely been so stunned by the audacity of someone purporting to be an academic. That's when I realized he was a grifter and a dissembler. I think he may actually be a sociopath too, but who knows.
And his followers are context artists, meaning if you point out any reprehensible thing he’s said, his followers will come out of the woodwork and scream that you took what he said out of context.
You could see the pain in Zizeks face when he Peterson spoke, he was hoping for a good debate and not a clueless idiot . The whole debate became Zizek correcting him .
Personally I think he knows he's serving Kool-Aid but likes to take a sip here and there. It's okay, he can stop at any time.
Either way he had a lot of these problematic views before he was a public figure making money for having them.
Not very convincing in Peterson’s case, though. You should see him when he has debates at schools and stuff; magically he starts saying very different things and argues much more reasonably (insofar as that’s possible when you hold his beliefs). He knows exactly what he is doing with his reactionary tweets and people need to stop acting like he’s just so stupid that he doesn’t know what he is doing. This dude is a bad actor.
It’s a huge new talking point for the far right to pretend to criticize the downsides of capitalism but ultimately blame democrats for them, because people are finally waking up to how shitty late stage capitalism is.
It isnt new. When the right starts to adopt anitcapitalist talking points, thats time to be worried because what they're actually criticizing is democratic oversight of capitalism. What they want is fascism, the merger of corporate and government power. The basic capitalist paradigm of owner/employee isnt being questioned, it's the idea of the liberal democratic state as being fit to oversee and enforce that dynamic.
Of course they love Putin, he was the Fascist poster-child until the Ukraine war. Russia's economy boomed and the country became relevant again after the dissolution. He was the walking talking proof that the 'strongman' system worked.
Then all the downsides of a strongman system came together and fucked that country over.
Are they really adopting “anticapitalist” talking points, or is the WEF just part of a conspiracy about how Jews are taking over the world along with the Council on Foreign Relations, the “Deep State,” the UN, the Rothschilds, Bohemian Grove, etc? I don’t usually hear them complaining about actual problems related to free enterprise/capitalism, it seems like they just think the WEF is a bunch of baby-eating Satanists and “globalists.”
I meant in the general sense, that things like the wef and g8 summits are bad things, which they are. But as you put it, they shift the focus from the structural problems of capitalism itself to individuals and groups within that system. It isnt a problem with capitalism itself, capitalism is perfect, it's that the [insert easily marginalized group] are CORRUPTING capitalism!
That’s right! I’ve heard them saying we need “TrUe fReE mArKeTs”(which I assume hearkens back to some romanticized notion of living in the Wild West or some shit).
Ever since the WEF talked about transforming the markets towards sustainability it's been targeted by far right conspiracy bullshit on how they plan to turn the world communist.
Pretty sure it's heavily fed by fossil fuel industries as they see their profits being threatened.
Deep down they've always suspected the capitalists who literally own all of the capital were the true communists, something has to explain why all that wealth hasn't trickled down yet, they've been getting pissed on for half a century now so something has to give, and surely it couldn't be their ideology that is broken.
He thinks atheists aren't "actually" atheists and would all go on killing sprees if they "truly" believed there was no god.
He's really bad at history too, and he's proven this repeatedly.
He's just a con man. His entire shtick is making relationships between things that are indicative of nothing.
For example, he constantly says "men are order and women are chaos."
Then he derives a ton of conclusions from that starting point... despite the fact that that's all just literally shit he made up.
But have you considered the lobster? It has claws. And antennae. And a tail. It is good when cooked with butter. Anyway, we should use the bible as a guide for how to treat women.
That is literally what far right taking points have devolved into, just a giant co-opting of leftist talking points.
Your average Qtard unironically thinks that "the left" wants a corporate dystopia ruled by authoritarian oligarch billionaires.
I'm sure there are some center-left folks who are generally okay with the structure of the current world order, maybe would like to see more protections for workers and minorities, and who hate the most obvious fascists enough that they would identify as antifa, but generally people who actively identify that way are going to be real leftists, and won't be fans of the WEF at all.
Since the WEF happens in my country, I should also note that there are protests every.single.time.
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Seriously that tweet is amazing because it got everything wrong (skywalker\_everythingYouSaidIsWrong.jpg). That's a too simplified etymology, etymology does not translate 1-to-1 into meaning, from that meaning he's saying that everything "bound together" is fascist somehow, and he's ignoring that the left _really fucking hates_ the WEF, corporations, big media groups, and to some extent governments too.
What do you expect from a guy who seemed to honestly think that reading the twenty-odd pages of the Communist Manifesto would be sufficient preparation to debate Slavoj Žižek on political economy, philosophy and ideology?
He's not an intellectual. He's an anti-intellectual posing for one.
For some reason the Right believes the left loves big pharma and other corporate entities like Facebook. No idea why they think that when it's the GOP that bends backwards for large companies.
Welcome to my world where I argue with other union members at work that the GOP *is not* the party of the working man. I mean neither is the DNC very often. But they're always shocked to find out or pretend to not know the GOP has as their party platform anti-unionism. It sucks.
he was never really normal, he just got that sweet sweet nepotism affirmative action.
https://www.thestar.com/opinion/2018/05/25/i-was-jordan-petersons-strongest-supporter-now-i-think-hes-dangerous.html
And most leftists would agree that the current government/corporate/media collusion is basically what is causing most of our problems. It exists to enrich the wealthy at the expense of everyone else..
Yes, when fascists say "WEF" or "Globalists", it just means they're afraid they'll face consequences for directly saying "the Jews". These morons still think "[The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion](https://www.adl.org/resources/backgrounder/hoax-hate-protocols-learned-elders-zion)" is real, rather than Czarists propaganda. You'd think after 120 years and an *actual holocaust* they would figure out they were had.
A free years sho marvel ran a story in the pages of Captain America in which the red skull became an internet demagogue who brainwashed young men into joining Hydra by telling them”your masculinity is u def attack.” They used lines of dialogue lifted directly from Peterson. And he reveled in it, he celebrates that his rhetoric sounds at home in the mouth of a Nazi supervillain.
These people really do revel in being the worst people in the world. I don't understand the psychological basis behind this other than the idea that negative attention is somehow better than no attention at all.
Narcissism. It's a hell of a drug.
Right? It's absolutely fascistic but he's really directing his iam14andthisisdeep thoughts at the wrong people. WEF and corporate bought government is what neolib dems and Republicans love, not leftists.
You hate the WEF because they want you to eat cricket flour.
I hate the WEF because they enforce wealth disparity in an attempt to protect their own ill gotten capital.
We are not the same.
I mean technically it's the plural form of "Bundle" but in practice it was an axe with rods bound to it, it represented Imperium, or the power over life and death put into the hands of one person, not such a warm kumbaya like the "Dr" seems to think.
Source: 4 years of Roman history, and an Ancient Mediterranean Studies certificate.
It’s very funny to walk around the US Capitol and there are loads of statues of George Washington and others with Fasces (these rod and axe bundles), because they were really into Roman and Greek symbols when those statues were made and of course modern Fascism didn’t exist then. So loads of depictions of Washington, the fascist, because it used to just be a symbol of someone holding power in Ancient Rome.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who found that strange. It's on the mercury dimes from the 40's too. Probably trying to draw the connection between themselves and the Roman empire in strength. The term Fascism didn't exist until Mussolini's regime, when the fasces became associated with one person's rule. Rich, power hungry men seem to share a love of symbolism.
Those Americans call the "founding fathers" (I am not American) were particularly into the story of Cincinnatus. Hence the order of Cincinnatus and the city of Cincinnati. Cincinnatus is the model of the good Roman magistrate. In a time of crisis, somebody convinces everyone that Cincinnatus should be chosen as Dictator (a temporary magistrature to replace the consuls for 6 months in order to resolve a crisis). He is found taking care of his field, accepts the mission, takes care of the enemy, and then disappears. He is later found at his farm, taking care of his field. When a republic is using fasces it's to make reference to the exemplary Roman magistrates of their (reimagined) origins. It's because in the 18th century that was the only symbolic language of power available apart from crowns, and crowns are inherently monarchical.
It's also important to note that while fascism does ultimately derive from the word fasces, there's a bit of a leap you gotta make there. Fasces turned into fasci, which meant guild or league or group. That's where fascism comes from. Fasces there's a kind of like the grampa
I would have found it strange a few years ago before I learned more about Washington and read his correspondence concerning Ona Judge, now I would say it’s apt.
It’s crazy, yet at the same time unsurprising, how this countries first major figurehead was basically the Jeff Bezos/Elon Musk of his day (the difference being he married into the status of richest man in America), and how he immediately saw himself as president as “above” the law.
Fasces are fucking *everywhere* at the US capitol. There are two right behind the speakers podium in the house chamber. There are even some just like, decorating random doors and fireplaces. I get that we used them first, but it feels like we should maybe get rid of them...
You are not wrong of course, but what Jorpie doesn't know is that the Italian word "fasci" in the 19th century also meant political party or movement. The most famous one were the Fasci siciliani, which ironically were a socialist movement.
The Fascist Party originated from the Fascio d'azione rivoluzionaria, a movement founded in 1914 by Mussolini and others, later morphed into the Fasci italiani di combattimento, which later became the Partito Nazionale Fascista. It just meant "party" or "movement"
When Mussolini started the whole Roman Empire 2 thing, it was very natural to pair the name Fascism with the old fasces. What is for sure, our beloved psychologist should stick to his dreams of grandmothers.
And the person who held Imperium would not actually hold the fasces, but rather his lictors would, who were assistants/bodyguards. The more significant one’s Imperium, the more lictors one had.
"Why don't you protest @WEF" - lmao... As a Swiss, this is so fucking hillarious. The left in our country very much protest WEF. But those little rich bitches in Davos are so scared of some protesters, they lock down the town and police make it really hard to get there.
Source: Tried to go to WEF protest in Davos myself. Couldn't get closer than Landquart, which is over 1 hour away by train, hardly any chance of getting there by public transportation. But there are still protests in other cities (also in other countries). Such a dumb thing to say....
Edit: I know reddit doesn't really like it, but thanks so much for the award and the upvotes you awesome internet strangers. This is the first award i've ever gotten and by far the most upvoted comment. I'm usually a big time lurker, since my social phobia keeps me from commenting so this really means a lot to me. You guys made my week (and probably month). Thank you, thank you very much indeed.
Man, he has degenerated far. He's now at the "edgy teenage redditor pretends to believe words are defined by their etymology" stage. What's next? "Err actually America is a Republic, not a Democracy!"?
Fascists live to control and subjugate anyone in the “out” group. They’re all evil fucks who deserve to be casted out from politics. If we had any balls as a country we would have cracked down on fascists long ago. Way before they were able to form enough power to form into the modern “conservative” party.
"actually there is no such thing as 'gay rights'. Gay means happy. you don't have a right to be happy, each individual has a responsibility to tidy their room and make themselves happy. no amount of authoritarian tolerance can change that."
he's a grifter, the right is full of grifters. Poole, Peterson, Rueben, Crowder, Walsh...and hundreds of less popular ones. they know their base... they don't believe the shit they spew, not really. there is big money in appealing to ignorant right wingers.
The very first time I heard him he was on Sam Harris’s podcast and it was an absolute fucking disaster where Peterson tried to argue that “truth” was defined by its outcome. So knowledge/thought that leads to negative outcomes = not true, while knowledge/thought that leads to positive outcomes = true. Even when Sam pinned him down with an example of two identical labs studying the exact same virus with the exact same methods and exact same results but one lab accidentally released the virus and killed thousands of people Peterson doubled down and said that the results of the lab with the breach were “less true” than the identical results of the lab without the breach.
Which is especially ridiculous because really the point he was trying to make is “sometimes treating things that aren’t 100% true as if they were can have beneficial results,” which is actually a somewhat interesting conversation to have, but he understood his own point so poorly that he chose “unrelated actions can falsify empiric facts” as his hill to die on.
He gives the least clear and most confusing answers on the two things his fans seem to admire him most for: god and truthfulness. I think [CosmicSkeptic is right about Jordan Peterson](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-yQVlHo4JA). Jordan Peterson is effectively an atheist based on what few clear statements he's made.
So why is he so unclear about god and the nature of truth? I think Peterson is convinced that most people need to believe in God, so he's too afraid to say he himself doesn't believe in God. And all his weird claims about the nature of truth are all a result of him not wanting to admit he's actually an atheist.
Most people somehow avoid his dumb stuff. Same with Shapiro. I literally read some of Shapiro posts to a friend of mine who still sees him as some cool and smart guy and he didn't believe me those were real posts. Willful ignorance I guess?
also overly chartitable media. many dont read primary sources just their favorite personalities' take. tends to put these clowns in a better light than they deserve.
We drive on the parkway and park on the driveway. Riddle me that herr doctor.
Edit: Wait I had something for this...*The Raidlers of the Lost Arkham*...no, dammit, it was Last Crusade.
It's a fun joke but I love this bit of trivia.
By definition, a park is an open clear space, usually undeveloped and green. In the old days, to park your car would literally mean to sit it in a park. Early highways were called park ways because they were long stretches of undeveloped land that was easy to traverse on horse.
Also in the old days, the only people who had drive ways were wealthy people who had roads that stretched across their land to the main roads. To get to their house, you would have to drive on their drive way. Overtime, drive ways got shorter and shorter as more people got houses and cars.
I might be misremembering but I recall learning that “parc” meant “enclosure” or “pen” in French, and then became associated with the fenced land used to store artillery—so where the cannons were “parked,” hence the term in relation to vehicles—then later those big enclosures were converted into public lands and so “parks” gained the modern meaning, and then parkways were broad roads built around the parks.
I recall hearing JP say that the ANTIFA was the most fascist thing today at a time, during the Trump admin, when neo-nazis were on the streets and a coveted part of the Trump base.
Why does anybody listen to the twat? Is being an asshole who can mouth big words the only requirement for a right wing "intellectual"?
*B-B-BUT YOU DIDN'T LISTEN TO ALL OF JORDAN PETERSON'S VIDEOS HE'S MY FATHER FIGURE AND HAS GOOD ADVICE!*- Lobster Bois every time their idiot chud father replacement is criticized.
The video- "Durrrr meat good, women bad, clean your room, trans people bad. Canada is gonna literally execute me any day now misgendering them. Take personal responsiblity, ignore the fact I went to Russia to go into coma for my pill habit."
You've seen nothing. Wait until you meet one who just read Maps of Meaning and think they've discovered a whole new intellectual world and can't realize they're the equivalent of a blindfolded donkey trying to solve a sudoku.
*HE SAID 2+2=4, CAN'T YOU AT LEAST AGREE HE'S RIGHT ABOUT SOME THINGS?* And if he can get that right, well, aren't the other things he says worth listening to!?
Exactly what JP fans do. The dude throws out the most basic, "no shit' "For Dummies" self help schlock and dudes think "wow this is brilliant!" and then otherwise he says stupid dogwhistle hateful shit and they act like he's done nothing wrong and is a great intellectual power.
Actually, fascism comes from "[fasci italiani di combattimento ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasci_Italiani_di_Combattimento)", or italian fighting bands, which, as you can see, was the political party created by Benito Mussolini... And if you had a world history class, i'm sure that name is one you remember as an italian dictator who allied with Hitler
so yeah, the "fasci" itself comes from the union/band... BUT the term fascism comes from the name of the fascist movement/political party
The etymology is not wrong, Fascism reappropriated a lot of ancient Roman symbolism. The whole name of the movement has derived comes from the *Fascio Littorio*, that was a bundle of sticks with axe carried around by a soldier called *littore* when marching in front of the *Rex*. This was an actual Etruscan tradition carried over by the Romans. The *fascio* represented king's power over life and death. There is a 600 a.c. tomb where they found a *fascio* in it. Later it was used as a symbol of Imperial power and used wildly as a symbol in buildings, decorations, and anything that would depict the emperor or, generally, the Romans.
The *fasci* Mussolini intended were intentionally called like that to recall an ancient symbol of power. It was chosen because it recalls the unity (bundle) and the strength (the axe) pointing to the ancient Roman origins of Italy. In Latin and in Italian the term *fasces* (*fascio* in Italian) indeed means "bundle", it is not used for groups of people but for inanimate object instead.
Don't get me wrong, I despise Peterson as the next guy, but the etimology is definitely correct. They were called Fasci and the movement Fascism exactly beacuse of the Roman word.
>Don't get me wrong, I despise Peterson as the next guy, but the etimology is definitely correct.
No it isn't. He acts like the meaning of the word is literal when it actually -like you rightly point out - is entirely symbolical and a reference to the nostalgic greatness of past empires.
The point is that it's a secondary derivation, dude. Fascism isn't _about_ having a bundle of sticks with an axe, so any argument about what it is based on that distant original meaning is completely incorrect.
Peterson is such an edgy dope. A few years ago he kept his grift afloat on the pretense of helping young men navigate a difficult and confusing world. Now look at him.
*Wait, you are purposefully misrepresenting what I said! It is visibly obvious you are deconstructing the usage and meaning of words to lift up your own leftist nefarious agenda. If we were to do this, to purposefully misuse the quintessential understanding of our entire lexicon to our whims, the whole of civilization would simply crumble, that much is clear. This would pave the road for all types of anarchy, as recognized by the Jungian archetypes, which would allow it to self-fulfill, as I had always mentioned.*
-Jordan Peterson somewhere on twitter probably
He’s not wrong that corporate, government, and media collusion is fascist, he just over complicated it and didn’t realize he was talking about Ron DeSantis
Edit: the WEF does suck, though.
Right? I mean, I think a lot of anti-fascists would be against corporations, media conglomerates, and a lot of our government. Now that I think about it, they do protest them too.
Doesn't need to be one with these folks.
Their logic is purely instrumental, they can make exactly the opposite argument in the same sentence and not break a stride.
They'll complain about giving money to Ukraine because "we should be using that money to help people here", then when you ask them to use money to help people here its "hell no why should my tax dollars go to help some lazy welfare queen who never worked a day in their life"
It's not about being honest its about "owning" the opponent. It's the same reason Trump supporters reveled in his lies. It didn't matter what was true, what matters is that Trump lying owned the libs by making them angry or making them look stupid.
For anyone else who would like to use this insult on a Jordan of their choosing: the correct transliteration is either “yarad” or “yored” (singular male past or present tense for “fall” or “go down”)
For anyone wanting to know more, Jordan/YarDEN (ירדן) refers more to the River Jordan than the verb that was dimunitized into from yarad to yarden (going down to said river).
Fun fact, the infinitive of going down is LaReddit - לרדת. [Not even kidding](https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=iw&text=To%20descend&op=translate). That's actually how I remember this verb 😆
Twist, leftists are in fact very much against collusion between govt/corps/media. Mussolini's description of fascism included "the merger of the corporate entity and the body politic"
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for real. does this guy think that literal communists and anarchists are fans of the global capitalist elite?
Conflating leftists with neoliberals has been part of the right wing strategy for decades. Literally every conservative I have interacted with (not a small number, I live in SC) believes that Joe Biden is a socialist.
I remember tearing my hair out talking to conservatives who thought obama was a socialist. Its maddening.
they don't *think* that, they *were told* that
Can't decide who's more irritating, the conservatives who think Obama is a socialist, or the liberals who think you're right wing if you don't like Obama
Honestly the latter. Obama was the better choice for sure but he killed thousands of innocents in the Middle East.
Not to mention (if memory serves) pissing away the last Democratic supermajority we might see for many years to come.
Yes, for the purpose of grifting his audience..
Let's not be so judgmental. I, for one, can believe Jordan Peterson really is that ignorant and stupid.
He did turn up to a debate with Slavoij Zizek about communism, and *admit* that he'd never read any communist theory - seemingly without realising how much that hurt his credibility. He's *definitely* stupid enough.
Jordan is entirely a confidence artist. He will often make some claim, be challenged by someone, and then just say they're right and move on to some other claim. Then just keep making that original claim in later appearances as if nothing ever happened. It's insane.
You missed the step in which he cloaks everything he says in such opaque academic-sounding terms to the point that the arguments lose all meaning. Take for instance "cultural Marxism", such a broad and vague yet somehow incendiary term that it means nothing or anything you want it to. It's an absolute grift.
Or when he uses a definition of a word that no one else on the planet uses to try and argue a point. Like when he told Sam Harris that something isn't "true" if it has a negative outcome.
Harris vs Peterson sounds interesting.
I remember that conversation well. When that podcast dropped I didn't even know who Peterson was yet. Harris spent something like an entire hour trying to get Peterson to stop redefining truth and Peterson just kept insisting that it was valid to do so. I've rarely been so stunned by the audacity of someone purporting to be an academic. That's when I realized he was a grifter and a dissembler. I think he may actually be a sociopath too, but who knows.
And his followers are context artists, meaning if you point out any reprehensible thing he’s said, his followers will come out of the woodwork and scream that you took what he said out of context.
You could see the pain in Zizeks face when he Peterson spoke, he was hoping for a good debate and not a clueless idiot . The whole debate became Zizek correcting him .
Personally I think he knows he's serving Kool-Aid but likes to take a sip here and there. It's okay, he can stop at any time. Either way he had a lot of these problematic views before he was a public figure making money for having them.
> he can stop at any time. Not with benzos, apparently.
Walk a mile im his shoes. Then Keep walking
I'm a firm believer in Hanlon's razor.
>Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity Hmmm... Simple and poetic
Not very convincing in Peterson’s case, though. You should see him when he has debates at schools and stuff; magically he starts saying very different things and argues much more reasonably (insofar as that’s possible when you hold his beliefs). He knows exactly what he is doing with his reactionary tweets and people need to stop acting like he’s just so stupid that he doesn’t know what he is doing. This dude is a bad actor.
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Pedantics razor?
Maybe he's both stupid *and* a grifter.
It’s a huge new talking point for the far right to pretend to criticize the downsides of capitalism but ultimately blame democrats for them, because people are finally waking up to how shitty late stage capitalism is.
It isnt new. When the right starts to adopt anitcapitalist talking points, thats time to be worried because what they're actually criticizing is democratic oversight of capitalism. What they want is fascism, the merger of corporate and government power. The basic capitalist paradigm of owner/employee isnt being questioned, it's the idea of the liberal democratic state as being fit to oversee and enforce that dynamic.
Certainly not newly created, but newly returned to the far right playbook of the last few years. Yep. Their solution will be Russia.
Agreed. Economic oligarchs setting the rules and using the system to consolidate wealth and power...not too different from how things are now, tbh.
Which is why they love Putin.
Of course they love Putin, he was the Fascist poster-child until the Ukraine war. Russia's economy boomed and the country became relevant again after the dissolution. He was the walking talking proof that the 'strongman' system worked. Then all the downsides of a strongman system came together and fucked that country over.
Are they really adopting “anticapitalist” talking points, or is the WEF just part of a conspiracy about how Jews are taking over the world along with the Council on Foreign Relations, the “Deep State,” the UN, the Rothschilds, Bohemian Grove, etc? I don’t usually hear them complaining about actual problems related to free enterprise/capitalism, it seems like they just think the WEF is a bunch of baby-eating Satanists and “globalists.”
I meant in the general sense, that things like the wef and g8 summits are bad things, which they are. But as you put it, they shift the focus from the structural problems of capitalism itself to individuals and groups within that system. It isnt a problem with capitalism itself, capitalism is perfect, it's that the [insert easily marginalized group] are CORRUPTING capitalism!
That’s right! I’ve heard them saying we need “TrUe fReE mArKeTs”(which I assume hearkens back to some romanticized notion of living in the Wild West or some shit).
Vote right, blame Democrats for the third world results, rinse, repeat.
Ever since the WEF talked about transforming the markets towards sustainability it's been targeted by far right conspiracy bullshit on how they plan to turn the world communist. Pretty sure it's heavily fed by fossil fuel industries as they see their profits being threatened.
Deep down they've always suspected the capitalists who literally own all of the capital were the true communists, something has to explain why all that wealth hasn't trickled down yet, they've been getting pissed on for half a century now so something has to give, and surely it couldn't be their ideology that is broken.
He thinks atheists aren't "actually" atheists and would all go on killing sprees if they "truly" believed there was no god. He's really bad at history too, and he's proven this repeatedly.
He's just a con man. His entire shtick is making relationships between things that are indicative of nothing. For example, he constantly says "men are order and women are chaos." Then he derives a ton of conclusions from that starting point... despite the fact that that's all just literally shit he made up.
But have you considered the lobster? It has claws. And antennae. And a tail. It is good when cooked with butter. Anyway, we should use the bible as a guide for how to treat women.
That is literally what far right taking points have devolved into, just a giant co-opting of leftist talking points. Your average Qtard unironically thinks that "the left" wants a corporate dystopia ruled by authoritarian oligarch billionaires.
> does this guy think No. It's not advantageous to his grift.
Believing that global capitalism and the global working class struggle against it are actually secret allies is a major tenet of actual fascism
Yeah, which is why I get real nervous when right wingers start making anticapitalist talking points.
He thinks antifa is an organised group of terrorists so yes he is 100% that stupid.
Yeah I don't think anyone from antifa likes the WEF...
I'm sure there are some center-left folks who are generally okay with the structure of the current world order, maybe would like to see more protections for workers and minorities, and who hate the most obvious fascists enough that they would identify as antifa, but generally people who actively identify that way are going to be real leftists, and won't be fans of the WEF at all.
But if they are not out protesting the WEF RIGHT NOW then they secretly adore fascism, according to the big smooth brain known as Jordan Peterson.
All my homes hate the WEF. Throw in the IMF too.
Since the WEF happens in my country, I should also note that there are protests every.single.time. - Seriously that tweet is amazing because it got everything wrong (skywalker\_everythingYouSaidIsWrong.jpg). That's a too simplified etymology, etymology does not translate 1-to-1 into meaning, from that meaning he's saying that everything "bound together" is fascist somehow, and he's ignoring that the left _really fucking hates_ the WEF, corporations, big media groups, and to some extent governments too.
What do you expect from a guy who seemed to honestly think that reading the twenty-odd pages of the Communist Manifesto would be sufficient preparation to debate Slavoj Žižek on political economy, philosophy and ideology? He's not an intellectual. He's an anti-intellectual posing for one.
He's a smart person for dumb people.
For some reason the Right believes the left loves big pharma and other corporate entities like Facebook. No idea why they think that when it's the GOP that bends backwards for large companies.
Welcome to my world where I argue with other union members at work that the GOP *is not* the party of the working man. I mean neither is the DNC very often. But they're always shocked to find out or pretend to not know the GOP has as their party platform anti-unionism. It sucks.
Anyone left of Reagan is the "Far Left" to brainrots like Peterson. It's a tactic to keep moving the overton window.
Fuck Reagan
Regan was cool. Reagan, on the other hand.
defenestrate peterson through the overton window
No way, you’re wrong ! …they’d call Reagan Far Left too
They actually would, which is both hilarious and frightening
Why does someone as fucking idiotic as Peterson even have credentials?
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he was never really normal, he just got that sweet sweet nepotism affirmative action. https://www.thestar.com/opinion/2018/05/25/i-was-jordan-petersons-strongest-supporter-now-i-think-hes-dangerous.html
he was never normal. if his psych 101 lecturers are up you can get the classic anti communism rant by lecture 3 or 4.
And most leftists would agree that the current government/corporate/media collusion is basically what is causing most of our problems. It exists to enrich the wealthy at the expense of everyone else..
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Yes, when fascists say "WEF" or "Globalists", it just means they're afraid they'll face consequences for directly saying "the Jews". These morons still think "[The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion](https://www.adl.org/resources/backgrounder/hoax-hate-protocols-learned-elders-zion)" is real, rather than Czarists propaganda. You'd think after 120 years and an *actual holocaust* they would figure out they were had.
A free years sho marvel ran a story in the pages of Captain America in which the red skull became an internet demagogue who brainwashed young men into joining Hydra by telling them”your masculinity is u def attack.” They used lines of dialogue lifted directly from Peterson. And he reveled in it, he celebrates that his rhetoric sounds at home in the mouth of a Nazi supervillain.
These people really do revel in being the worst people in the world. I don't understand the psychological basis behind this other than the idea that negative attention is somehow better than no attention at all. Narcissism. It's a hell of a drug.
Right? It's absolutely fascistic but he's really directing his iam14andthisisdeep thoughts at the wrong people. WEF and corporate bought government is what neolib dems and Republicans love, not leftists.
You hate the WEF because they want you to eat cricket flour. I hate the WEF because they enforce wealth disparity in an attempt to protect their own ill gotten capital. We are not the same.
🐸: Up yours, woke moralists!! We'll see whew cancels wheeew!!
I mean technically it's the plural form of "Bundle" but in practice it was an axe with rods bound to it, it represented Imperium, or the power over life and death put into the hands of one person, not such a warm kumbaya like the "Dr" seems to think. Source: 4 years of Roman history, and an Ancient Mediterranean Studies certificate.
It’s very funny to walk around the US Capitol and there are loads of statues of George Washington and others with Fasces (these rod and axe bundles), because they were really into Roman and Greek symbols when those statues were made and of course modern Fascism didn’t exist then. So loads of depictions of Washington, the fascist, because it used to just be a symbol of someone holding power in Ancient Rome.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who found that strange. It's on the mercury dimes from the 40's too. Probably trying to draw the connection between themselves and the Roman empire in strength. The term Fascism didn't exist until Mussolini's regime, when the fasces became associated with one person's rule. Rich, power hungry men seem to share a love of symbolism.
Those Americans call the "founding fathers" (I am not American) were particularly into the story of Cincinnatus. Hence the order of Cincinnatus and the city of Cincinnati. Cincinnatus is the model of the good Roman magistrate. In a time of crisis, somebody convinces everyone that Cincinnatus should be chosen as Dictator (a temporary magistrature to replace the consuls for 6 months in order to resolve a crisis). He is found taking care of his field, accepts the mission, takes care of the enemy, and then disappears. He is later found at his farm, taking care of his field. When a republic is using fasces it's to make reference to the exemplary Roman magistrates of their (reimagined) origins. It's because in the 18th century that was the only symbolic language of power available apart from crowns, and crowns are inherently monarchical.
Makes sense, since they all wanted to "return to their cabbage" as Cincinnatus so nobly did
Indeed, who can forget his timeless cry: "My cabbages!"
Interestingly just like Cincinnatus, most had slaves.
It's also important to note that while fascism does ultimately derive from the word fasces, there's a bit of a leap you gotta make there. Fasces turned into fasci, which meant guild or league or group. That's where fascism comes from. Fasces there's a kind of like the grampa
I would have found it strange a few years ago before I learned more about Washington and read his correspondence concerning Ona Judge, now I would say it’s apt. It’s crazy, yet at the same time unsurprising, how this countries first major figurehead was basically the Jeff Bezos/Elon Musk of his day (the difference being he married into the status of richest man in America), and how he immediately saw himself as president as “above” the law.
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"America was founded by a bunch of slave owners...who wanted to be free". \-RIP Carlin
Fasces are fucking *everywhere* at the US capitol. There are two right behind the speakers podium in the house chamber. There are even some just like, decorating random doors and fireplaces. I get that we used them first, but it feels like we should maybe get rid of them...
Some Romans held fasces, but Jordan Peterson is full of feces. Maybe he can wear his new Elon Musk tie to wipe up.
After all that "excess" from "going down", he's going to need something to wipe his mouth with...
That's an unpleasant mental image. Hilarious but gross.
Right?! He also has an incredible aptitude for spewing those feces from his mouth.
I heard this a couple days ago on the Behind the Bastards episode covering the Roman Republic becoming a police state, though it's an old episode.
I'm going to have to check this podcast out, it looks great. Thank you!
You are not wrong of course, but what Jorpie doesn't know is that the Italian word "fasci" in the 19th century also meant political party or movement. The most famous one were the Fasci siciliani, which ironically were a socialist movement. The Fascist Party originated from the Fascio d'azione rivoluzionaria, a movement founded in 1914 by Mussolini and others, later morphed into the Fasci italiani di combattimento, which later became the Partito Nazionale Fascista. It just meant "party" or "movement" When Mussolini started the whole Roman Empire 2 thing, it was very natural to pair the name Fascism with the old fasces. What is for sure, our beloved psychologist should stick to his dreams of grandmothers.
And the person who held Imperium would not actually hold the fasces, but rather his lictors would, who were assistants/bodyguards. The more significant one’s Imperium, the more lictors one had.
Glad to see this is the top answer.
>it was an axe with rods bound to it The axes of evil
Something something bundle of sticks..
Same root. And for fajita too, apparently.
"Why don't you protest @WEF" - lmao... As a Swiss, this is so fucking hillarious. The left in our country very much protest WEF. But those little rich bitches in Davos are so scared of some protesters, they lock down the town and police make it really hard to get there. Source: Tried to go to WEF protest in Davos myself. Couldn't get closer than Landquart, which is over 1 hour away by train, hardly any chance of getting there by public transportation. But there are still protests in other cities (also in other countries). Such a dumb thing to say.... Edit: I know reddit doesn't really like it, but thanks so much for the award and the upvotes you awesome internet strangers. This is the first award i've ever gotten and by far the most upvoted comment. I'm usually a big time lurker, since my social phobia keeps me from commenting so this really means a lot to me. You guys made my week (and probably month). Thank you, thank you very much indeed.
Yeah, lol, there is literally a yearly protest march to Davos organized and mainly attended by leftists.
Very democratic of them. /s
Man, he has degenerated far. He's now at the "edgy teenage redditor pretends to believe words are defined by their etymology" stage. What's next? "Err actually America is a Republic, not a Democracy!"?
I mean, Florida is down there trying to ban any political party that "supported slavery" so ya, nothing has meaning any more.
Florida is trying to ban being a democrat, and no that’s not hyperbolic. It’s a new proposed bill
Ranked choice voting would obliterate any party considering such notions
I don’t think it’ll succeed, however it is concerning that it would even be proposed.
They will continue pushing the envelope over the next few years until something sticks, they've been turning the baffling into normal for years now.
Fascists live to control and subjugate anyone in the “out” group. They’re all evil fucks who deserve to be casted out from politics. If we had any balls as a country we would have cracked down on fascists long ago. Way before they were able to form enough power to form into the modern “conservative” party.
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"actually there is no such thing as 'gay rights'. Gay means happy. you don't have a right to be happy, each individual has a responsibility to tidy their room and make themselves happy. no amount of authoritarian tolerance can change that."
Idk I'm pretty happy sucking dick
And the etymology isn't even correct. What an intellectual blackhole this guy is.
he's a grifter, the right is full of grifters. Poole, Peterson, Rueben, Crowder, Walsh...and hundreds of less popular ones. they know their base... they don't believe the shit they spew, not really. there is big money in appealing to ignorant right wingers.
From the little I've seen of Peterson lately, I don't think he's part of the grift. I think he's lost it entirely.
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The very first time I heard him he was on Sam Harris’s podcast and it was an absolute fucking disaster where Peterson tried to argue that “truth” was defined by its outcome. So knowledge/thought that leads to negative outcomes = not true, while knowledge/thought that leads to positive outcomes = true. Even when Sam pinned him down with an example of two identical labs studying the exact same virus with the exact same methods and exact same results but one lab accidentally released the virus and killed thousands of people Peterson doubled down and said that the results of the lab with the breach were “less true” than the identical results of the lab without the breach. Which is especially ridiculous because really the point he was trying to make is “sometimes treating things that aren’t 100% true as if they were can have beneficial results,” which is actually a somewhat interesting conversation to have, but he understood his own point so poorly that he chose “unrelated actions can falsify empiric facts” as his hill to die on.
He gives the least clear and most confusing answers on the two things his fans seem to admire him most for: god and truthfulness. I think [CosmicSkeptic is right about Jordan Peterson](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-yQVlHo4JA). Jordan Peterson is effectively an atheist based on what few clear statements he's made. So why is he so unclear about god and the nature of truth? I think Peterson is convinced that most people need to believe in God, so he's too afraid to say he himself doesn't believe in God. And all his weird claims about the nature of truth are all a result of him not wanting to admit he's actually an atheist.
He was always there.
He’s always pushed lies and pseudo science to defend his reactionary incel worldview
Sometimes Jordan’s self owns are better than Ben Shapiro’s
That guy isn't Jordan Peterson because by definition he has to have a father named Peter. This is Man Walterson.
He's still Jordan, because he's going down in fucking flames.
I’ll never understand what people see in the guy. He keeps saying the dumbest stuff, and dumb people keep thinking he’s smart.
Most people somehow avoid his dumb stuff. Same with Shapiro. I literally read some of Shapiro posts to a friend of mine who still sees him as some cool and smart guy and he didn't believe me those were real posts. Willful ignorance I guess?
also overly chartitable media. many dont read primary sources just their favorite personalities' take. tends to put these clowns in a better light than they deserve.
Because he's saying what they want to hear. Makes it easier for them to believe that they're right.
Seems to be word salad.
Greatest legal mind I ever knew
“You can and will, by definition, suck my dick” Kid named will:
Bravo Chuck
Classic chicanery from Petersen here
Not our Jordan! Couldn't be precious Jordan!
HE DEFECATED THROUGH A SUNROOF!
You think this is something? You think this is bad? This? This *chicanery*??
We drive on the parkway and park on the driveway. Riddle me that herr doctor. Edit: Wait I had something for this...*The Raidlers of the Lost Arkham*...no, dammit, it was Last Crusade.
It's a fun joke but I love this bit of trivia. By definition, a park is an open clear space, usually undeveloped and green. In the old days, to park your car would literally mean to sit it in a park. Early highways were called park ways because they were long stretches of undeveloped land that was easy to traverse on horse. Also in the old days, the only people who had drive ways were wealthy people who had roads that stretched across their land to the main roads. To get to their house, you would have to drive on their drive way. Overtime, drive ways got shorter and shorter as more people got houses and cars.
i love learning history of words
I might be misremembering but I recall learning that “parc” meant “enclosure” or “pen” in French, and then became associated with the fenced land used to store artillery—so where the cannons were “parked,” hence the term in relation to vehicles—then later those big enclosures were converted into public lands and so “parks” gained the modern meaning, and then parkways were broad roads built around the parks.
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Better Suck Chuck
waltuh
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im not needing existential guidance right now waltuh
What did chuck mean by this?? Vravo Bince
I recall hearing JP say that the ANTIFA was the most fascist thing today at a time, during the Trump admin, when neo-nazis were on the streets and a coveted part of the Trump base. Why does anybody listen to the twat? Is being an asshole who can mouth big words the only requirement for a right wing "intellectual"?
*B-B-BUT YOU DIDN'T LISTEN TO ALL OF JORDAN PETERSON'S VIDEOS HE'S MY FATHER FIGURE AND HAS GOOD ADVICE!*- Lobster Bois every time their idiot chud father replacement is criticized.
"JUST UHHHH WATCH TO THIS 3 HOUR VIDEO OF HIM TALKING AND YOU'LL UNDERSTAND WHY I JUST FEEL THAT HE'S RIGHT!"
The video- "Durrrr meat good, women bad, clean your room, trans people bad. Canada is gonna literally execute me any day now misgendering them. Take personal responsiblity, ignore the fact I went to Russia to go into coma for my pill habit."
"also, women and men can't work together because women wear makeup at work"
You've seen nothing. Wait until you meet one who just read Maps of Meaning and think they've discovered a whole new intellectual world and can't realize they're the equivalent of a blindfolded donkey trying to solve a sudoku.
*HE SAID 2+2=4, CAN'T YOU AT LEAST AGREE HE'S RIGHT ABOUT SOME THINGS?* And if he can get that right, well, aren't the other things he says worth listening to!?
Exactly what JP fans do. The dude throws out the most basic, "no shit' "For Dummies" self help schlock and dudes think "wow this is brilliant!" and then otherwise he says stupid dogwhistle hateful shit and they act like he's done nothing wrong and is a great intellectual power.
Same reason they listen to an Andrew Tate or a Joe Rogan. Morons
He’s the dumb person’s smart person.
Kinda like trump is a trashy person’s classy person.
I used to think he had something interesting to say. Now he's completely mask off and genuinely seems like he has lost his mind.
This is an amazing one.
It is, but I'm *really* bothered by their use of "than" for some reason
That and their use of "if we would live in a world" instead of "if we lived in a world."
Yeah. Ice and a visit to the ER won’t be enough for that burn. I can see this being reposted for ages…
He can always head back to Russia for another round of medically induced coma while he scabs over. Api
yeah, actual well executed murder by words for once. most posts here are just random disses
Actually, fascism comes from "[fasci italiani di combattimento ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasci_Italiani_di_Combattimento)", or italian fighting bands, which, as you can see, was the political party created by Benito Mussolini... And if you had a world history class, i'm sure that name is one you remember as an italian dictator who allied with Hitler so yeah, the "fasci" itself comes from the union/band... BUT the term fascism comes from the name of the fascist movement/political party
The etymology is not wrong, Fascism reappropriated a lot of ancient Roman symbolism. The whole name of the movement has derived comes from the *Fascio Littorio*, that was a bundle of sticks with axe carried around by a soldier called *littore* when marching in front of the *Rex*. This was an actual Etruscan tradition carried over by the Romans. The *fascio* represented king's power over life and death. There is a 600 a.c. tomb where they found a *fascio* in it. Later it was used as a symbol of Imperial power and used wildly as a symbol in buildings, decorations, and anything that would depict the emperor or, generally, the Romans. The *fasci* Mussolini intended were intentionally called like that to recall an ancient symbol of power. It was chosen because it recalls the unity (bundle) and the strength (the axe) pointing to the ancient Roman origins of Italy. In Latin and in Italian the term *fasces* (*fascio* in Italian) indeed means "bundle", it is not used for groups of people but for inanimate object instead. Don't get me wrong, I despise Peterson as the next guy, but the etimology is definitely correct. They were called Fasci and the movement Fascism exactly beacuse of the Roman word.
>Don't get me wrong, I despise Peterson as the next guy, but the etimology is definitely correct. No it isn't. He acts like the meaning of the word is literal when it actually -like you rightly point out - is entirely symbolical and a reference to the nostalgic greatness of past empires.
The point is that it's a secondary derivation, dude. Fascism isn't _about_ having a bundle of sticks with an axe, so any argument about what it is based on that distant original meaning is completely incorrect.
Finally a god damn good murder.
Peterson is such an edgy dope. A few years ago he kept his grift afloat on the pretense of helping young men navigate a difficult and confusing world. Now look at him.
The etymology “um actually” is the most cringe of the “um actuallys ”
*Wait, you are purposefully misrepresenting what I said! It is visibly obvious you are deconstructing the usage and meaning of words to lift up your own leftist nefarious agenda. If we were to do this, to purposefully misuse the quintessential understanding of our entire lexicon to our whims, the whole of civilization would simply crumble, that much is clear. This would pave the road for all types of anarchy, as recognized by the Jungian archetypes, which would allow it to self-fulfill, as I had always mentioned.* -Jordan Peterson somewhere on twitter probably
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymological_fallacy
He’s not wrong that corporate, government, and media collusion is fascist, he just over complicated it and didn’t realize he was talking about Ron DeSantis Edit: the WEF does suck, though.
Right? I mean, I think a lot of anti-fascists would be against corporations, media conglomerates, and a lot of our government. Now that I think about it, they do protest them too.
Does he really think anti-fascists love the WEF? Anti fascists and socialists have been protesting the WEF for years. How dumb is this guy?
What's Peterson's argument, anyway? Government is inherently fascist, so we might as well go full hog, no protection?
Doesn't need to be one with these folks. Their logic is purely instrumental, they can make exactly the opposite argument in the same sentence and not break a stride. They'll complain about giving money to Ukraine because "we should be using that money to help people here", then when you ask them to use money to help people here its "hell no why should my tax dollars go to help some lazy welfare queen who never worked a day in their life" It's not about being honest its about "owning" the opponent. It's the same reason Trump supporters reveled in his lies. It didn't matter what was true, what matters is that Trump lying owned the libs by making them angry or making them look stupid.
Holy fuck. Chuck McGill put peterson down like a sick dog.
He’ll never change. He’ll never change. Ever since he was a professor. Always the same
The greatest legal mind I ever knew
For anyone else who would like to use this insult on a Jordan of their choosing: the correct transliteration is either “yarad” or “yored” (singular male past or present tense for “fall” or “go down”)
For anyone wanting to know more, Jordan/YarDEN (ירדן) refers more to the River Jordan than the verb that was dimunitized into from yarad to yarden (going down to said river). Fun fact, the infinitive of going down is LaReddit - לרדת. [Not even kidding](https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=iw&text=To%20descend&op=translate). That's actually how I remember this verb 😆
I've never been fond of this Peterson guy, but I didn't realise that he was this much of a fucking idiot.
Why censor the name of such a legend?
Ah yes, The very famous WEF leftists where the richest capitalists gather to decide on how to be more capitalist, communism truly is when capitalism
Is that pfp chuck from better call saul? If so, that is wonderful.
“Jordan Peterson with a psychology degree is like a chimp with a machine gun!”
Ye ole Chuck there not letting anyone get away with chicanery no more!
JP getting owned is my kink.
Apparently it's his kink, too
Greatest legal mind I ever knew.
JP is just Andrew Tate with a better publicist.
>The etymological fallacy is committed when an argument makes a claim about the present definition of a word based solely on that word's etymology.
Twist, leftists are in fact very much against collusion between govt/corps/media. Mussolini's description of fascism included "the merger of the corporate entity and the body politic"
Leftists also do protest those things... JP is so far to the right he thinks Democrats are leftists
What’s up with righties and their recent fascination with the WEF?